WEBVTT - Kiana: Redefining Life with Chronic Illness

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<v Speaker 1>It's an invisible disability you can't tell from the outside.

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<v Speaker 1>And so many people who we see walking around are

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<v Speaker 1>going through these things that we have no idea, And

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like just giving people like a blank slate

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<v Speaker 1>and never judging them in that way. Why would I

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<v Speaker 1>be making this up? Why would I be spending such

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<v Speaker 1>so much energy like trying to get help.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to When You're Invisible. My name is Maria Fernanda Diez,

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<v Speaker 2>and I know not everyone can roll there are so

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<v Speaker 2>it's fine to call me Maria. When You're Invisible is

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<v Speaker 2>my love letter to the working class and others who

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<v Speaker 2>are seemingly invisible in our society. I hope to build

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<v Speaker 2>a community here that will inspire you to have generous

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<v Speaker 2>conversations with others that are different from you, conversations that

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<v Speaker 2>might help you see life in an entirely different way.

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<v Speaker 2>It was in ragtime you could do these bait like

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<v Speaker 2>these beautiful like twists and whatnot, and you would do

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<v Speaker 2>that in rehearsal, and it's just like, how do you

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<v Speaker 2>move your body?

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<v Speaker 1>That was the last performance where I felt where I

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<v Speaker 1>felt like I could use one hundred percent of my

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<v Speaker 1>body and my energy. That was like the last time

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<v Speaker 1>I could really perform, and I remember it being exhilarating.

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<v Speaker 2>This is Keana. We first got to know each other

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<v Speaker 2>during Ragtime the Musical, which was a show that we

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<v Speaker 2>were both a part of. Our sophomore year of high school.

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<v Speaker 1>We went to an arts high school and we were

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<v Speaker 1>both in the same acting track.

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<v Speaker 2>Our high school was in downtown Saint Paul. There are

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<v Speaker 2>different kinds of arts you could focus on, whether it

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<v Speaker 2>was visual art, dance, music, musical feeder. I transferred to

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<v Speaker 2>the school in tenth grade. Kids came from all over

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<v Speaker 2>the state, and we also got students who maybe didn't

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<v Speaker 2>care about the arts but had hated or been kicked

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<v Speaker 2>out of other schools. Overall, we were a group of outspoken, cool,

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<v Speaker 2>sweet and weird kids. Our school days were extra long,

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<v Speaker 2>partially because we had extra arts classes and it was

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<v Speaker 2>a small school, so we all got pretty close. Also,

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<v Speaker 2>it was a fairly new school, which meant students could

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<v Speaker 2>get away with some extra shenanigans, whether it was coming

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<v Speaker 2>in late, bringing in Starbucks. Oh, and it was normal

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<v Speaker 2>to see students stretching in the back of class and

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<v Speaker 2>doing pure wets down the hallway. There were parts of

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<v Speaker 2>my high school experience that actually was high school musical.

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<v Speaker 2>When music came on in the hallway or in a

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<v Speaker 2>classroom right before class started, it was normal for people

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<v Speaker 2>to break out in choreography and harmonies. High school is

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<v Speaker 2>always weird, but looking back at this time, there's a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of good memories and I was happy to reconnect

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<v Speaker 2>with Kana. Can you introduce yourself? Let's start it off

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<v Speaker 2>with that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, my name is Keana Adams, thirty years old. What

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<v Speaker 1>else should I say to introduce myself?

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<v Speaker 2>Where are you from?

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<v Speaker 1>I'm from Minneapolis. I lived in Paul growing up and

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<v Speaker 1>then moved to Minneapolis. But yeah, I've been in Minnesota

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<v Speaker 1>my whole life.

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<v Speaker 2>Being a lifelong Minnesota was true of almost everyone I

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<v Speaker 2>met in Minnesota. It was something I noticed a lot

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<v Speaker 2>as an outsider and as a teenager. It really seemed

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<v Speaker 2>like Yanna had this deep sense of community in her life.

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<v Speaker 2>She was one of the cool girls. She always was

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<v Speaker 2>dressed in leggings and a scarf with a cool haircut.

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<v Speaker 2>She was edgy, talented, a badass, and unafraid to express

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<v Speaker 2>her emotions, whether it was to other students or to teachers.

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<v Speaker 2>She came from artist's parents, so discipline and art were

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<v Speaker 2>second nature to her. And then we sang in the

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<v Speaker 2>Minnesota Opera together.

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<v Speaker 1>And we sang in Minnesota Opera together that I love

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<v Speaker 1>Pussure Joffre.

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<v Speaker 2>That was so fun.

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<v Speaker 1>It was one of my favorite experiences, and I'm so

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<v Speaker 1>glad that I got to do that. I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>if I could have done something like that like later

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<v Speaker 1>in life. So it was really special experience. I hold

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<v Speaker 1>it very dear to my heart.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you are and were an incredible singer.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 2>Keana's voice ugh has its own flexibility and unique tambre.

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<v Speaker 2>From what I can remember, she could go from a

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<v Speaker 2>classical operatic sound to pop belt within the same breath.

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<v Speaker 2>Keana and I wanted theater to be something that wasn't

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<v Speaker 2>just confined to high school. But unfortunately, the reason that

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<v Speaker 2>Ragtime performance that we were both in when we were

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<v Speaker 2>sixteen was one of her last is because Keana has

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<v Speaker 2>a chronic illness and things took a turn for the

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<v Speaker 2>worse around that time.

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<v Speaker 1>And it just it's so hard for me to go

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<v Speaker 1>on stage and not be one hundred percent. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>I can't go on stage and be fifty percent.

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<v Speaker 3>I just can't. And so then I hurt myself.

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<v Speaker 1>I would hurt myself often on stage, and so I

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<v Speaker 1>had to stop.

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<v Speaker 3>Eventually, I was just starting to sing again.

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<v Speaker 2>Actually, it's been about fifteen years since Ragtime, and I'm

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<v Speaker 2>so happy to hear she's finally singing again. The reason

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<v Speaker 2>it took such a long time to come back is

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<v Speaker 2>something called EDS. First, can you tell us what EDS is?

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<v Speaker 1>Of course, yes, Taylor's Donlo syndrome is a genetic connective

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<v Speaker 1>tissue disorder. Connective tissue is everywhere in your body. It's

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<v Speaker 1>the glue that holds you together. So when that glue

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<v Speaker 1>isn't there, you have to manually do it. You have

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<v Speaker 1>to manually scrunch up all of your muscles so much

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<v Speaker 1>that it stretches out the ligaments enough to keep you

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<v Speaker 1>in place.

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<v Speaker 3>And that is just.

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<v Speaker 1>So tiring in itself. Yeah, that I don't have any

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<v Speaker 1>any room for anything else.

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<v Speaker 2>We don't think about connective tissue very much, but it's

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<v Speaker 2>everything from our ligaments to the cartilage and our joints,

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<v Speaker 2>our skin, even our blood is considered connective tissue. Everything

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<v Speaker 2>that helps holds us together into the human shape that

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<v Speaker 2>you see can play a part in connective tissue. And

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<v Speaker 2>if that system isn't working properly. Suddenly, gravity and your

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<v Speaker 2>muscles are in this war with each other. Because your

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<v Speaker 2>muscles aren't getting extra help from the rest of your

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<v Speaker 2>system to uphold you. It takes a lot of effort

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<v Speaker 2>to keep your body in place.

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<v Speaker 1>I have the hypermobile type three, which is often recognized

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<v Speaker 1>by stretchy skin and just hyper mobile.

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<v Speaker 3>I have dislocations daily.

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<v Speaker 2>That hyper flexibility makes me highly aware of that fact

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<v Speaker 2>that throughout the entire interview, she's actually wearing a brace

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<v Speaker 2>on her neck to help her.

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<v Speaker 1>And like, when I'm not wearing my neck brace, like my.

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<v Speaker 3>Head feels just so heavy.

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<v Speaker 1>It feels like a bibble hit and it's so hard

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<v Speaker 1>to keep.

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<v Speaker 3>It upright and to use all these muscles.

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<v Speaker 1>It feels like gravity's turned up like ten times, like

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<v Speaker 1>you're on a different planet, the g forces. If I'm

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<v Speaker 1>not really holding tight, move the vertebrae, and wow, it's

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<v Speaker 1>just scary and my whole I just you know, all

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<v Speaker 1>my muscles over, you know, trying to just keep things

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<v Speaker 1>in place, and like say, you're.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, You're okay, You're not gonna move.

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<v Speaker 1>And like I hate the way I look with it on,

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<v Speaker 1>Like I like it so much. I don't have a

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<v Speaker 1>double chin when I don't wear my neck brace. But

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<v Speaker 1>I have to just let that go and like let

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<v Speaker 1>that superficial part of it go. And see now I'm

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<v Speaker 1>talking with my neck too much and it's it's dangerous

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<v Speaker 1>for me. I have to put my neck brace back

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<v Speaker 1>because oh it's so hard.

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<v Speaker 2>This is one of those things that isn't worth pushing

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<v Speaker 2>because it could just make things worse.

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<v Speaker 1>It's not a degenerative disease, but it is in the

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<v Speaker 1>way that like when my ligaments stretch, they don't stretch back,

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<v Speaker 1>they will only continue to stretch, Like when you get

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<v Speaker 1>a new sock and it's elasticity is really good at first,

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<v Speaker 1>but eventually it's going to stretch and it's never going

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<v Speaker 1>to get back to that original elasticity.

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<v Speaker 2>Can you describe what you experience physically, like, how would

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<v Speaker 2>you describe it?

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<v Speaker 1>It's I'd say sometime when it's really bad, it feels

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<v Speaker 1>like a migraine in your whole body. And so much

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<v Speaker 1>of it is like when you have a really bad

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<v Speaker 1>knot in your shoulder, except it's in every muscle, like

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<v Speaker 1>it's in all of the muscles. It's often just like

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<v Speaker 1>this feeling of malaise. But it's just like this nausea

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<v Speaker 1>from be from over exerting and not being able to

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<v Speaker 1>hold your body together, but your brain is literally forcing

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<v Speaker 1>you to you can't relax.

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<v Speaker 2>This is why I wanted to interview Kana. She's dealing

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<v Speaker 2>with this thing that's not visible and the only thing

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<v Speaker 2>that is is the neck brace. But I think, in

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<v Speaker 2>all honesty, I think a lot of us would assume

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<v Speaker 2>that it was a temporary injury or accident. This takes

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<v Speaker 2>a toll on the person's body, mind, energy, and relationships.

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<v Speaker 2>Everything is being affected by a battle that no one

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<v Speaker 2>else can really see.

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<v Speaker 1>We call it the spoon theory and chronic illness. So

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<v Speaker 1>if you get so many spoons per day, and each

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<v Speaker 1>thing that you do cost a spoon. When I shower,

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<v Speaker 1>that costs a spoon. When I empty the dishwasher, that

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<v Speaker 1>costs a spoon. When I'm sitting up for an hour

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<v Speaker 1>class that costs a spoon, and even small things like

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<v Speaker 1>in between they cost spoons when you wouldn't really think

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<v Speaker 1>that they would. But for somebody who's chronically ill, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>we're called spoonies, and we call it the spoon theory.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, It has kind of a silly name, but

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<v Speaker 2>this concept really clicks for me. It isn't an easy

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<v Speaker 2>experience to describe or to get across to people, and

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<v Speaker 2>I know that from personal experience. My mom has had

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<v Speaker 2>rheumatoid arthritis since I was a freshman in college, and

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<v Speaker 2>this means a lot of the time she needs naps

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<v Speaker 2>through it the day when she walks far, her feet

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<v Speaker 2>will swell for the rest of the day. Preparing for

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<v Speaker 2>a gathering at her house used to take a day

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<v Speaker 2>or two, and now it requires three to four days

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<v Speaker 2>or else she's going to lose days after the event

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<v Speaker 2>from exhaustion and pain. Every day looks different, so help

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<v Speaker 2>and emotions shift around daily and personally, the learning curve

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<v Speaker 2>for communication was hard, and so I love this spoon

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<v Speaker 2>theory because I think it's a way I can understand

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<v Speaker 2>how my mom might be going through the day in

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<v Speaker 2>a way that maybe she doesn't have the language to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about yet. It's like, this is like a lovely

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<v Speaker 2>analogy of spoons, but you're like, oh, every spoon that

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<v Speaker 2>it costs is built on a lot of like pain, fatigue, focus.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure like so much buttuy energy goes to that

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<v Speaker 2>just managing that.

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<v Speaker 1>And even like when I wake up in the morning,

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<v Speaker 1>they don't always start with the same amount of spoons.

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<v Speaker 1>They don't sleep well because of pain and because of how.

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<v Speaker 3>Comfortable I can get at night.

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<v Speaker 1>I can only lay in one position that can keep

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<v Speaker 1>me safe, so that's.

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<v Speaker 3>Not comfortable a lot of the time.

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<v Speaker 1>So I wake up not having slept, and I never

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<v Speaker 1>can sleep in because my body is so afraid to

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<v Speaker 1>shut down that it's so used to getting injured that

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<v Speaker 1>it won't completely shut down.

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<v Speaker 3>And just let you know, trust gravity.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, okay, let's start at the beginning of this story

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<v Speaker 2>real quick. Keana was diagnosed when she was eight. Her

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<v Speaker 2>dad was actually diagnosed at the same time, after retiring

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<v Speaker 2>from a full career as a violinist with the Minnesota Orchestra.

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<v Speaker 2>So Keana was showing signs earlier, but at first her

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<v Speaker 2>symptoms were just being hyper mobile.

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<v Speaker 1>Some people have DS and don't have any pain and

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<v Speaker 1>they're fine do many different things. We thought it was

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<v Speaker 1>a plus because I was very flexible. I did circus,

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<v Speaker 1>they put me into contortion.

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<v Speaker 3>We just thought of it as it was a superhero trait.

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<v Speaker 2>It was when Keana hit puberty that the condition developed.

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<v Speaker 2>Into something more painful.

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<v Speaker 1>And with the female horn, you know, estrogen, it gives

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<v Speaker 1>you mix, you more lax in the joints and in

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<v Speaker 1>your college in itself. And so every month when in

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<v Speaker 1>my cycle, yeah, I get more discilocations because your hips

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<v Speaker 1>have to be able to trage God be able to

0:12:10.480 --> 0:12:11.040
<v Speaker 1>have a baby.

0:12:11.160 --> 0:12:12.920
<v Speaker 3>Right. So it got really.

0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:15.320
<v Speaker 1>Bad during the time of when I was growing to

0:12:15.400 --> 0:12:18.640
<v Speaker 1>be a young woman. Yeah, and then it evened out,

0:12:19.120 --> 0:12:23.400
<v Speaker 1>and once I got the right medication regimen, can I

0:12:23.440 --> 0:12:23.840
<v Speaker 1>can live.

0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:25.199
<v Speaker 3>I can work with my symptoms.

0:12:25.320 --> 0:12:27.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm so happy that Keana's on the right meds and

0:12:28.040 --> 0:12:31.319
<v Speaker 2>in a good place today. But there were some hard

0:12:31.400 --> 0:12:34.880
<v Speaker 2>years in there. I didn't know everything that was going

0:12:34.920 --> 0:12:37.840
<v Speaker 2>on in high school, but even I remember standout moments

0:12:37.880 --> 0:12:41.800
<v Speaker 2>when she was starting to experience more painful symptoms. I

0:12:41.880 --> 0:12:45.680
<v Speaker 2>remember in school one time, like when I feel like

0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:49.079
<v Speaker 2>it was Paul who was teaching class, and you were

0:12:49.280 --> 0:12:51.000
<v Speaker 2>in a lot of pain that day, and you were

0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:54.600
<v Speaker 2>laying on the ground and you're like I don't You're

0:12:54.640 --> 0:12:56.920
<v Speaker 2>like I can't get up, like I'm not feeling well.

0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:01.080
<v Speaker 2>And I remember Paul being like, Keana, it's fine, just

0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:04.760
<v Speaker 2>get up, and like completely disregarding you for a minute.

0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:06.520
<v Speaker 2>That's like part of the thing that I was like,

0:13:06.559 --> 0:13:09.400
<v Speaker 2>Oh my gosh. This stayed with me so vividly that

0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:13.480
<v Speaker 2>this young girl like woman growing up was not believed

0:13:13.559 --> 0:13:15.240
<v Speaker 2>or heard by her teacher.

0:13:15.720 --> 0:13:20.760
<v Speaker 1>In high school up until sophomore year. Even the beginning

0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:23.800
<v Speaker 1>of junior year, you couldn't tell, and even my friends,

0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:26.240
<v Speaker 1>there was no I didn't have big enough symptoms that

0:13:26.280 --> 0:13:28.360
<v Speaker 1>they were really impacting my life, so I would never

0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:30.600
<v Speaker 1>talk about it. I never talked about the fact that

0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:34.119
<v Speaker 1>I had the EDS diagnosis and I was just flexible

0:13:34.160 --> 0:13:37.440
<v Speaker 1>and I was weak, but I try to keep up

0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:42.479
<v Speaker 1>with everybody else, And when then I started showing symptoms,

0:13:43.040 --> 0:13:46.040
<v Speaker 1>I was labeled as a lot of different things, attention seeker,

0:13:46.240 --> 0:13:51.520
<v Speaker 1>drug seeker. Sometimes I got a member being accused of

0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:54.600
<v Speaker 1>having an eating disorder because they didn't think that I

0:13:54.640 --> 0:13:57.600
<v Speaker 1>really had this and that it was impacting my eating

0:13:57.600 --> 0:14:01.120
<v Speaker 1>because I was nauseous all the time. I felt that

0:14:01.240 --> 0:14:04.360
<v Speaker 1>people were labeling me, especially because I was smoking a

0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:08.520
<v Speaker 1>lot of weed my senior year, and honestly, I felt

0:14:08.920 --> 0:14:10.920
<v Speaker 1>like I would do anything to escape what I was

0:14:10.960 --> 0:14:11.480
<v Speaker 1>going through.

0:14:11.559 --> 0:14:14.920
<v Speaker 2>I remember hearing whispers of the speculation of what people

0:14:14.960 --> 0:14:18.559
<v Speaker 2>thought she was going through the way people were viewing

0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:22.920
<v Speaker 2>her was shifting, and sometimes she was seen as a

0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:27.160
<v Speaker 2>problem kid. I'm really sad that I didn't understand fully

0:14:27.240 --> 0:14:29.960
<v Speaker 2>what was happening in the moment, and how lonely it

0:14:30.040 --> 0:14:30.560
<v Speaker 2>must have been.

0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:34.520
<v Speaker 1>I wasn't getting help from any doctors. I was too young.

0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:36.160
<v Speaker 1>No one was going to help me by putting me

0:14:36.200 --> 0:14:39.280
<v Speaker 1>on painkillers. For so long, doctors would just say this

0:14:39.400 --> 0:14:42.080
<v Speaker 1>is too much, I can't take your case, too difficult, whatever,

0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:44.440
<v Speaker 1>and I'll get passed on to another referral and.

0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:45.640
<v Speaker 2>Referral, referral, referral.

0:14:45.680 --> 0:14:48.080
<v Speaker 1>Later they're like, why haven't you had a doctor and

0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:50.960
<v Speaker 1>so long? Why are you doctor shopping? Nobody was going

0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:54.360
<v Speaker 1>to take that leap, especially with somebody who had substance

0:14:54.440 --> 0:14:57.600
<v Speaker 1>use issues, to give me the medicine that I've needed.

0:14:58.400 --> 0:15:02.080
<v Speaker 1>Like yeah, when I in my junior especially senior year,

0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:06.280
<v Speaker 1>just sitting up was so difficult. It was like my

0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:09.040
<v Speaker 1>middle could not hold me up and I would get

0:15:09.080 --> 0:15:12.320
<v Speaker 1>this ring of pain that like then my ribs would

0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:15.320
<v Speaker 1>come dislocated a lot of the time, and so I

0:15:15.360 --> 0:15:17.920
<v Speaker 1>had to lay flat on my back and I was

0:15:17.920 --> 0:15:20.800
<v Speaker 1>stuck on my back for like four years of my adulthood.

0:15:20.840 --> 0:15:23.920
<v Speaker 1>Holy cow, I had a TV installed in my ceiling

0:15:24.480 --> 0:15:27.000
<v Speaker 1>because I couldn't even turn my neck to like look

0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:28.080
<v Speaker 1>at the TV on the wall.

0:15:28.400 --> 0:15:30.280
<v Speaker 3>Like it was that bad.

0:15:30.560 --> 0:15:33.960
<v Speaker 2>This period in Keana's life is four years of her adulthood,

0:15:34.360 --> 0:15:37.640
<v Speaker 2>of her young adulthood. The years you think about where

0:15:37.680 --> 0:15:41.400
<v Speaker 2>you're going to bars, partying, meeting random people. Were years

0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:42.840
<v Speaker 2>Kiana spent immobile.

0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:47.880
<v Speaker 1>And it was only five years ago that I finally

0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:51.120
<v Speaker 1>got on the right medication. And once that started, I

0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:54.040
<v Speaker 1>started to be able to work. I went back to school.

0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:55.960
<v Speaker 1>I can do the things and that's all I was

0:15:56.000 --> 0:15:58.600
<v Speaker 1>asking for before. It just blows my mind.

0:15:58.680 --> 0:16:03.120
<v Speaker 2>This is an amazing moment, literally changed her life after

0:16:03.160 --> 0:16:09.600
<v Speaker 2>dealing with years of red tape disbelief, doctors being hesitant

0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:14.200
<v Speaker 2>to work with her. But I wish that this didn't

0:16:14.280 --> 0:16:19.120
<v Speaker 2>have to be exceptional, that it didn't feel miraculous or magical.

0:16:19.800 --> 0:16:22.840
<v Speaker 2>This is something that she and so many others deserve,

0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:25.960
<v Speaker 2>but not everyone gets. It's hard to find the right

0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:29.720
<v Speaker 2>treatment or diagnosis still today, and it's a journey. Not

0:16:29.840 --> 0:16:30.840
<v Speaker 2>everyone is afforded.

0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:36.360
<v Speaker 1>Aayler Donald's syndrome is just starting to be known more

0:16:36.440 --> 0:16:40.560
<v Speaker 1>about in the medical community and that it, and patients

0:16:40.560 --> 0:16:43.200
<v Speaker 1>are now believed that when they say that, it causes

0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:46.720
<v Speaker 1>extreme pain and extreme disability.

0:16:46.240 --> 0:16:47.160
<v Speaker 3>Right in many people.

0:16:47.720 --> 0:16:52.080
<v Speaker 1>And it's just crazy how much success I've had since

0:16:52.280 --> 0:16:56.520
<v Speaker 1>I've gotten on the right regimen of medications.

0:16:56.800 --> 0:16:59.920
<v Speaker 2>Over time, Keana has found relief and she's found a

0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:05.320
<v Speaker 2>sense of freedom through art. She's also found supportive, loving relationships.

0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:09.080
<v Speaker 2>But that delay and care came at a cost, feeling

0:17:09.119 --> 0:17:12.480
<v Speaker 2>like her friends were slipping away and her childhood dreams

0:17:12.520 --> 0:17:19.920
<v Speaker 2>were no longer reachable. That's coming after the break, welcome back.

0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:22.439
<v Speaker 2>When I think back to senior year of high school,

0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:26.240
<v Speaker 2>it was buzzing as our whole class was figuring out

0:17:26.359 --> 0:17:29.679
<v Speaker 2>what our futures would look like, going into the professional world,

0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:33.840
<v Speaker 2>going to college, going to performing art school. All of

0:17:33.920 --> 0:17:38.160
<v Speaker 2>us were busy with applications, interviews, auditions, and so was Keana.

0:17:38.720 --> 0:17:41.639
<v Speaker 2>But eventually she would have to face a shadow that

0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:42.680
<v Speaker 2>was hanging over her.

0:17:43.840 --> 0:17:46.600
<v Speaker 1>The biggest thing about the EDS for me was that

0:17:47.000 --> 0:17:49.479
<v Speaker 1>I really lost my sense of I mean, before I

0:17:49.520 --> 0:17:51.920
<v Speaker 1>was a performer, I was an actor. I knew that's

0:17:51.960 --> 0:17:54.119
<v Speaker 1>what I wanted to do for the rest of my life.

0:17:54.600 --> 0:17:58.359
<v Speaker 1>And I lost my instrument, I lost my ability to

0:17:58.520 --> 0:18:00.240
<v Speaker 1>express myself in that way.

0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:03.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Keana got into an amazing school, but realized it

0:18:04.000 --> 0:18:05.640
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't be possible for her to go.

0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:09.280
<v Speaker 1>It felt like I wouldn't have that chance again to

0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:11.920
<v Speaker 1>go to a college like that and get that kind

0:18:11.960 --> 0:18:12.600
<v Speaker 1>of an education.

0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:12.960
<v Speaker 2>Right.

0:18:13.240 --> 0:18:16.480
<v Speaker 1>I really grieved the life that I wanted, the girl

0:18:16.480 --> 0:18:19.000
<v Speaker 1>that I had always seen growing into the future, and

0:18:19.040 --> 0:18:22.040
<v Speaker 1>then what was actually happening and how they were not

0:18:22.200 --> 0:18:25.520
<v Speaker 1>fitting together, and I was really angry and I had

0:18:25.520 --> 0:18:27.200
<v Speaker 1>some bad depression for a while.

0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:30.920
<v Speaker 2>On top of all of this, the people she'd always

0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:34.680
<v Speaker 2>surrounded herself with turned out to be people she couldn't

0:18:34.680 --> 0:18:37.560
<v Speaker 2>really rely on. It was just too much for them

0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:40.240
<v Speaker 2>to have to deal with. Once I wasn't fun anymore.

0:18:40.320 --> 0:18:43.960
<v Speaker 2>Once all I was was bad news. Once they had

0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:46.399
<v Speaker 2>to come visit me and do work and I wouldn't

0:18:46.440 --> 0:18:50.080
<v Speaker 2>give anything back. They just left and I didn't really

0:18:50.119 --> 0:18:54.240
<v Speaker 2>see them much again. I won't name specific names, but

0:18:54.560 --> 0:18:56.840
<v Speaker 2>it broke my heart because I thought those people were

0:18:56.920 --> 0:19:01.000
<v Speaker 2>my rock, but then as soon as I needed to

0:19:01.000 --> 0:19:05.320
<v Speaker 2>ask anything of them, it was too much to ask.

0:19:09.359 --> 0:19:11.880
<v Speaker 3>That's heartbreaking.

0:19:12.560 --> 0:19:15.960
<v Speaker 2>I can feel that heartbreak of being like, hey, I'm

0:19:16.000 --> 0:19:18.600
<v Speaker 2>not funny anymore, or I'm going through something and I

0:19:18.640 --> 0:19:23.040
<v Speaker 2>can't and I don't feel like people are supportive. What

0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:24.959
<v Speaker 2>did you feel like was the threshold?

0:19:25.280 --> 0:19:25.920
<v Speaker 3>Oh my god.

0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:29.280
<v Speaker 1>At first, it was like there was like a little

0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:30.119
<v Speaker 1>bit of tolerance.

0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:31.760
<v Speaker 3>They would show up a little bit, but it was

0:19:31.800 --> 0:19:32.800
<v Speaker 3>like small things.

0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:36.199
<v Speaker 1>When we were like out and about, I was always

0:19:36.240 --> 0:19:39.080
<v Speaker 1>in the passenger seat, or if we were out somewhere

0:19:39.080 --> 0:19:41.119
<v Speaker 1>at a house and there was the choice between a

0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:43.320
<v Speaker 1>chair and sitting on the ground, I would always need

0:19:43.359 --> 0:19:46.359
<v Speaker 1>the comfy chair, or the fact that I wouldn't share

0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:49.119
<v Speaker 1>my reed with them, or I was like, this is

0:19:49.160 --> 0:19:51.720
<v Speaker 1>my medicine now. My parents started providing it for me

0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:54.919
<v Speaker 1>after a while, once they saw how much it helped me.

0:19:55.720 --> 0:19:59.679
<v Speaker 1>And it really keeps eating. Yeah, and so it's like

0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:03.240
<v Speaker 1>really important. And once I couldn't give it away anymore,

0:20:03.320 --> 0:20:04.640
<v Speaker 1>people stopped showing up.

0:20:05.119 --> 0:20:12.880
<v Speaker 3>Wow, And it was.

0:20:09.600 --> 0:20:11.720
<v Speaker 2>It was It was the worst. My heart goes out

0:20:11.760 --> 0:20:15.400
<v Speaker 2>to Kana in this moment because I can relate to that,

0:20:15.680 --> 0:20:17.840
<v Speaker 2>and I think all of us can in some way,

0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:20.560
<v Speaker 2>shape or form. I think we've all been through time

0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:26.280
<v Speaker 2>where we're going through a lot and we want the

0:20:26.280 --> 0:20:29.280
<v Speaker 2>people we love to be able to support us and

0:20:29.359 --> 0:20:31.680
<v Speaker 2>to be able to go through it with us, and

0:20:31.720 --> 0:20:38.040
<v Speaker 2>not everybody can, and the difficulty of understanding and going

0:20:38.080 --> 0:20:41.560
<v Speaker 2>through that reality it becomes a new layer of heartbreak.

0:20:42.600 --> 0:20:45.200
<v Speaker 1>I was in denial about it for a really long time.

0:20:45.640 --> 0:20:47.480
<v Speaker 1>I didn't want to to see it. I didn't want

0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:50.399
<v Speaker 1>to think that I was real and I was calling,

0:20:50.520 --> 0:20:52.480
<v Speaker 1>leaving voicemails, crying.

0:20:52.200 --> 0:20:53.720
<v Speaker 3>Like where are you?

0:20:53.800 --> 0:20:56.560
<v Speaker 1>Like they were like the only people in my life

0:20:56.560 --> 0:20:59.679
<v Speaker 1>and I just wasn't ready to give that up. And

0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:02.479
<v Speaker 1>I didn't and think that I was that different, just

0:21:02.600 --> 0:21:07.080
<v Speaker 1>my body was. And it's really sad that I wasn't

0:21:07.400 --> 0:21:10.920
<v Speaker 1>more honest with myself because I think I would have

0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:13.359
<v Speaker 1>been able to get over it faster and be like,

0:21:13.440 --> 0:21:15.320
<v Speaker 1>why do I care about these people if they don't

0:21:15.320 --> 0:21:15.919
<v Speaker 1>care about me.

0:21:16.280 --> 0:21:21.040
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, that's it's hard one. When you're young and

0:21:21.080 --> 0:21:24.360
<v Speaker 2>you feel connected to people. I feel like there's an

0:21:24.359 --> 0:21:27.560
<v Speaker 2>element of like in kindness, in our humanity and our

0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:32.240
<v Speaker 2>desire to connect. Of course we try hard. There must

0:21:32.280 --> 0:21:34.200
<v Speaker 2>be a way to fix it, And I think, how

0:21:34.280 --> 0:21:37.520
<v Speaker 2>could you know to let go sooner? To me, it

0:21:37.560 --> 0:21:41.679
<v Speaker 2>speaks to the beauty of you in your ability to

0:21:41.720 --> 0:21:43.680
<v Speaker 2>be like, I want to connect, I want to give

0:21:43.720 --> 0:21:44.840
<v Speaker 2>this a chance.

0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:47.879
<v Speaker 1>Of so many chances, and I was suddenly in this

0:21:48.000 --> 0:21:50.600
<v Speaker 1>box and I felt like I couldn't live up to

0:21:50.760 --> 0:21:53.240
<v Speaker 1>like the person I used to be anymore. And even

0:21:53.240 --> 0:21:55.359
<v Speaker 1>though I feel like I've found myself again and I've

0:21:55.480 --> 0:21:59.320
<v Speaker 1>found my personality again, for a long time like things

0:21:59.359 --> 0:22:02.000
<v Speaker 1>were just law because I felt such a big part

0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:03.280
<v Speaker 1>of my identity was lost.

0:22:03.400 --> 0:22:08.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and yeah, it took wild to find it again.

0:22:09.160 --> 0:22:12.159
<v Speaker 2>Especially when we're young, we define ourselves based off the

0:22:12.200 --> 0:22:15.639
<v Speaker 2>friendships that we form. As we get older, we ground

0:22:15.680 --> 0:22:18.720
<v Speaker 2>ourselves in a lot of different aspects, and our friendships,

0:22:18.720 --> 0:22:21.920
<v Speaker 2>while important, become just a piece of who we are.

0:22:22.680 --> 0:22:26.719
<v Speaker 2>I think when we're young, it's all encompassing, but no

0:22:26.760 --> 0:22:29.199
<v Speaker 2>matter what stage and life we're in, that grief and

0:22:29.280 --> 0:22:31.760
<v Speaker 2>loss of a friend is something we should hold space

0:22:31.840 --> 0:22:38.560
<v Speaker 2>for and we don't often do. And I think heartbreak, pain, fear, sadness,

0:22:38.640 --> 0:22:42.320
<v Speaker 2>and disappointment can be things that keep people from connecting

0:22:42.359 --> 0:22:46.680
<v Speaker 2>and reaching out. And Keana doesn't let this happen to her.

0:22:47.480 --> 0:22:50.879
<v Speaker 2>She's willing to open herself back up eventually, whether she

0:22:51.000 --> 0:22:53.520
<v Speaker 2>realized it or not while it was happening. I think

0:22:53.520 --> 0:22:57.679
<v Speaker 2>it's something that's beautiful about Keana's resilient spirits. What was

0:22:57.720 --> 0:23:00.159
<v Speaker 2>a moment where you're like, oh, this person is in

0:23:00.200 --> 0:23:02.840
<v Speaker 2>it from the long haul. This is something and someone

0:23:02.960 --> 0:23:03.720
<v Speaker 2>I can trust.

0:23:04.320 --> 0:23:07.640
<v Speaker 1>I do have one friend that when things got really bad,

0:23:07.760 --> 0:23:09.680
<v Speaker 1>like when I was during that time that I could

0:23:09.680 --> 0:23:14.360
<v Speaker 1>barely sit up and I was using substances and I

0:23:14.400 --> 0:23:18.760
<v Speaker 1>was depressed and I was even My parents sent me

0:23:18.800 --> 0:23:21.560
<v Speaker 1>to the psych board a couple of times, and when

0:23:21.600 --> 0:23:24.920
<v Speaker 1>I was there, the doctors wouldn't believe my pain. I mean,

0:23:24.960 --> 0:23:27.320
<v Speaker 1>it was ridiculous because I was in a psych ward.

0:23:27.720 --> 0:23:30.680
<v Speaker 1>Of course, they thought I was not being serious about

0:23:30.720 --> 0:23:34.800
<v Speaker 1>it and that it was exaggerated, but it wasn't and

0:23:34.960 --> 0:23:37.439
<v Speaker 1>that sucked. But there's where I met one of my

0:23:37.520 --> 0:23:41.320
<v Speaker 1>best friends to this day. And it's crazy that we

0:23:41.400 --> 0:23:43.800
<v Speaker 1>met each other in one of the lowest lows of

0:23:43.840 --> 0:23:48.360
<v Speaker 1>our life and we have both grown, allowed each other

0:23:48.480 --> 0:23:51.680
<v Speaker 1>to grow together and been there to like push each

0:23:51.680 --> 0:23:57.080
<v Speaker 1>other up. And it's ten years later and she is

0:23:57.160 --> 0:24:00.280
<v Speaker 1>my person, like my one friend that I do trust,

0:24:01.080 --> 0:24:04.520
<v Speaker 1>And if it weren't for her, I probably still wouldn't

0:24:04.520 --> 0:24:05.240
<v Speaker 1>trust people.

0:24:05.400 --> 0:24:10.520
<v Speaker 2>Wow. Yeah, Trusting this one friend and expanding this friendship

0:24:10.640 --> 0:24:13.840
<v Speaker 2>allowed Keana to look at how she wanted to build

0:24:13.880 --> 0:24:18.760
<v Speaker 2>relationships in the rest of her life, and that includes romantically.

0:24:18.880 --> 0:24:22.720
<v Speaker 1>Even trusting my boyfriend was really it took a long

0:24:22.760 --> 0:24:25.000
<v Speaker 1>time for me to like even be able to fall

0:24:25.040 --> 0:24:27.879
<v Speaker 1>asleep next to him, because I was scared he was,

0:24:28.680 --> 0:24:30.560
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, going to wrestle through my things or

0:24:30.600 --> 0:24:35.199
<v Speaker 1>find some way to find me less than or not

0:24:35.400 --> 0:24:38.960
<v Speaker 1>enough or inadequate. But he didn't think that, and that

0:24:39.080 --> 0:24:43.760
<v Speaker 1>was all just internalized from past experiences, and he was

0:24:43.800 --> 0:24:46.240
<v Speaker 1>so accepting of the fact that I had to lay

0:24:46.280 --> 0:24:48.080
<v Speaker 1>down for a lot of it, and that I couldn't

0:24:48.080 --> 0:24:50.760
<v Speaker 1>physically engage as much as I used to be able to,

0:24:50.960 --> 0:24:53.560
<v Speaker 1>or other girls could, or things like that.

0:24:54.000 --> 0:24:55.520
<v Speaker 3>How long have you been with your boo?

0:24:56.520 --> 0:25:00.000
<v Speaker 1>Oh uh, I think it's almost it's like seven years.

0:25:00.480 --> 0:25:03.359
<v Speaker 2>WHOA. What was like the first date or the first

0:25:03.440 --> 0:25:06.360
<v Speaker 2>realization of hey, I like you?

0:25:07.040 --> 0:25:09.760
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh. Our families knew each other growing up,

0:25:09.840 --> 0:25:13.280
<v Speaker 1>and like his family's from Finland, and his dad got

0:25:13.320 --> 0:25:15.080
<v Speaker 1>a job in the Minnesota Orchestra when they were he and

0:25:15.119 --> 0:25:18.040
<v Speaker 1>I were three years old. He's an orchestra baby too,

0:25:18.680 --> 0:25:23.520
<v Speaker 1>and we had them over for their very first American Thanksgiving. Yes,

0:25:23.680 --> 0:25:26.879
<v Speaker 1>and I remember that and we walked down the street

0:25:26.920 --> 0:25:30.040
<v Speaker 1>holding hands and he kissed my arm. There was just

0:25:30.200 --> 0:25:33.600
<v Speaker 1>always a little kid crush, you know. And then once

0:25:33.840 --> 0:25:36.600
<v Speaker 1>we once we grew up, and it was this is

0:25:36.640 --> 0:25:40.119
<v Speaker 1>actually funny. My dad was looking for a place to

0:25:40.119 --> 0:25:42.520
<v Speaker 1>get marijuana for me, like back in the day when

0:25:42.520 --> 0:25:44.800
<v Speaker 1>they were supplying it for me. Yeah, is when I

0:25:44.840 --> 0:25:48.160
<v Speaker 1>lived with them still one of Yona that's my boyfriend's name,

0:25:48.680 --> 0:25:51.280
<v Speaker 1>his roommates. We were getting it from his roommates, and

0:25:51.320 --> 0:25:53.320
<v Speaker 1>so I would go over there and bother him and

0:25:53.359 --> 0:25:56.440
<v Speaker 1>then we would just we just started flirting and then

0:25:56.480 --> 0:25:59.760
<v Speaker 1>we just started hanging out and watching ceiling TV together

0:26:00.080 --> 0:26:02.080
<v Speaker 1>and it was like that was enough for him. Oh

0:26:02.119 --> 0:26:05.399
<v Speaker 1>my god, that's amazing, and like it just ugh and

0:26:05.520 --> 0:26:09.480
<v Speaker 1>I was enough And I still feel like I'm enough.

0:26:09.600 --> 0:26:15.040
<v Speaker 2>I think in this specific American society, the concept of

0:26:15.080 --> 0:26:19.480
<v Speaker 2>being enough and being worthy is something we are constantly

0:26:19.640 --> 0:26:24.480
<v Speaker 2>fighting with. And this is a moment where I am

0:26:24.600 --> 0:26:28.240
<v Speaker 2>in awe of how Keana accepted it. Learning how to

0:26:28.280 --> 0:26:32.359
<v Speaker 2>accept that you can be and you are enough for

0:26:32.480 --> 0:26:37.760
<v Speaker 2>yourself and for a partner, no matter what version of

0:26:37.800 --> 0:26:42.119
<v Speaker 2>yourself that is is so beautiful and like a beautiful

0:26:42.200 --> 0:26:49.679
<v Speaker 2>example of how simple and uncomplicated. Just being present with

0:26:49.800 --> 0:26:50.840
<v Speaker 2>another human.

0:26:50.600 --> 0:26:54.800
<v Speaker 1>Being is where I feel like a lot of people

0:26:55.320 --> 0:26:58.480
<v Speaker 1>would resent the fact that I can't do as much physically,

0:26:58.680 --> 0:27:02.160
<v Speaker 1>like cleaning the house, in doing things like they'll always

0:27:02.200 --> 0:27:03.680
<v Speaker 1>have to carry the heavy groceries.

0:27:03.840 --> 0:27:05.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, where other people would.

0:27:05.920 --> 0:27:10.000
<v Speaker 1>Resent that, I feel like he has taken responsibility and

0:27:10.320 --> 0:27:12.119
<v Speaker 1>shown me that he is not going to leave for

0:27:12.200 --> 0:27:12.920
<v Speaker 1>those reasons.

0:27:13.440 --> 0:27:15.760
<v Speaker 3>That sounds beautiful. I love him.

0:27:16.640 --> 0:27:20.639
<v Speaker 2>This relationship has helped Kiana relate to herself in a

0:27:20.680 --> 0:27:24.080
<v Speaker 2>new way. And there's other ways that Keana has learned

0:27:24.240 --> 0:27:29.040
<v Speaker 2>to express herself, accept herself, and redefine who she is.

0:27:30.119 --> 0:27:32.440
<v Speaker 2>Art has played a huge role in that, and we'll

0:27:32.440 --> 0:27:39.080
<v Speaker 2>hear more after this break. Welcome back. As Keana has

0:27:39.119 --> 0:27:41.240
<v Speaker 2>grown and gotten to a better place, there's a lot

0:27:41.320 --> 0:27:45.280
<v Speaker 2>she's navigating and looking forward to today. Keana lived with

0:27:45.320 --> 0:27:48.920
<v Speaker 2>her parents for a long time and is so thankful

0:27:48.960 --> 0:27:51.439
<v Speaker 2>for the support. She moved out when she was twenty

0:27:51.480 --> 0:27:56.880
<v Speaker 2>five and has established her own routines and a new

0:27:56.960 --> 0:28:00.240
<v Speaker 2>chapter in her adulthood. She works part time as a

0:28:00.240 --> 0:28:03.679
<v Speaker 2>receptionist at a church and is in school getting a

0:28:03.680 --> 0:28:04.720
<v Speaker 2>bachelor's degree.

0:28:05.200 --> 0:28:08.639
<v Speaker 1>I think I want to teach art, so wow, you know,

0:28:08.680 --> 0:28:11.000
<v Speaker 1>and have a studio career on the side, and so

0:28:11.080 --> 0:28:13.200
<v Speaker 1>that's like what I'm going to school for right now,

0:28:13.240 --> 0:28:18.159
<v Speaker 1>to get my bachelor's degree and then an education minor

0:28:18.240 --> 0:28:20.640
<v Speaker 1>at the same time, so that I can at least

0:28:20.680 --> 0:28:23.439
<v Speaker 1>teach elementary school or maybe high school. What brought you

0:28:23.520 --> 0:28:27.920
<v Speaker 1>to teaching, I guess it changed my life so much

0:28:28.200 --> 0:28:33.000
<v Speaker 1>when I started to understand how to express myself through art,

0:28:33.960 --> 0:28:36.760
<v Speaker 1>and it gave me such an outlet that I just

0:28:37.640 --> 0:28:42.200
<v Speaker 1>I never got that teaching from schools, from art class

0:28:42.200 --> 0:28:46.000
<v Speaker 1>and schools, and so I guess that's where it came from.

0:28:46.160 --> 0:28:48.360
<v Speaker 1>Is I just want people to be able to have

0:28:48.440 --> 0:28:51.760
<v Speaker 1>the same experience that I had, having an outlet and

0:28:52.000 --> 0:28:55.960
<v Speaker 1>a place for my emotions to go when I didn't

0:28:55.960 --> 0:28:57.880
<v Speaker 1>know how else to let it out.

0:28:58.960 --> 0:29:01.920
<v Speaker 2>Keana has been an art artist as long as I've

0:29:01.960 --> 0:29:04.880
<v Speaker 2>known her. Of course, in high school her focus was

0:29:04.920 --> 0:29:08.240
<v Speaker 2>singing in theater, but when she lost the ability to sing,

0:29:08.320 --> 0:29:11.800
<v Speaker 2>she turned to visual art. I've been following Keana's art

0:29:12.040 --> 0:29:16.360
<v Speaker 2>on Instagram, and I really love how her art is

0:29:16.560 --> 0:29:23.040
<v Speaker 2>very human, colorful, pensive, and always honest to what she

0:29:23.160 --> 0:29:26.280
<v Speaker 2>needs and is going through. I think she has such

0:29:26.280 --> 0:29:29.920
<v Speaker 2>a beautiful, clear perspective of self. And I think it's

0:29:30.280 --> 0:29:36.680
<v Speaker 2>the sense of freedom to be your full, flawed self.

0:29:37.680 --> 0:29:42.760
<v Speaker 2>When do you feel seen people look at my art?

0:29:43.200 --> 0:29:46.160
<v Speaker 1>I feel totally seen when I look at all of

0:29:46.160 --> 0:29:48.600
<v Speaker 1>my artworks up on a wall or like pictures of

0:29:48.640 --> 0:29:51.240
<v Speaker 1>them together, and I'm just like, this is my story,

0:29:51.320 --> 0:29:57.400
<v Speaker 1>this is the inside of my brain. And it feels

0:29:57.440 --> 0:29:59.360
<v Speaker 1>so good to not have to say any words and

0:29:59.400 --> 0:30:01.760
<v Speaker 1>to just be ab to show people, and people can

0:30:01.840 --> 0:30:05.200
<v Speaker 1>just exist in this painting and understand kind of a

0:30:05.240 --> 0:30:07.080
<v Speaker 1>flash of where I was at some point.

0:30:07.280 --> 0:30:09.760
<v Speaker 2>Honestly, I think of your journey reminds me of free

0:30:09.840 --> 0:30:13.840
<v Speaker 2>to Gallo such an inspiration for me. Really love. I

0:30:13.880 --> 0:30:17.480
<v Speaker 2>love whether it's her crown of braids or her famous unibrow.

0:30:17.800 --> 0:30:20.320
<v Speaker 2>I think a lot of us would recognize Mexican painter

0:30:20.480 --> 0:30:23.960
<v Speaker 2>Frieda Gailo because of her portraits. There are a couple

0:30:24.080 --> 0:30:27.040
<v Speaker 2>things we don't often hear about in terms of FREEDA

0:30:27.320 --> 0:30:29.960
<v Speaker 2>one is that at a young age she had polio,

0:30:30.360 --> 0:30:32.840
<v Speaker 2>which affected her legs throughout the rest of her life,

0:30:33.280 --> 0:30:36.920
<v Speaker 2>and then when she was older, unfortunately, she got in

0:30:36.960 --> 0:30:40.640
<v Speaker 2>a really bad accident and broke her spinal column, her collarbone,

0:30:40.720 --> 0:30:44.560
<v Speaker 2>her ribs and fractured her legs, and yet the whole time,

0:30:45.240 --> 0:30:49.680
<v Speaker 2>even through the pain, even being bedridden, she was still painting.

0:30:50.320 --> 0:30:53.920
<v Speaker 2>And that force of will and process reminded me of

0:30:54.000 --> 0:30:58.560
<v Speaker 2>Kiana and her strength. Listening to Kiana's story, I made

0:30:58.600 --> 0:31:02.560
<v Speaker 2>the connection immediately because both of them painted despite their circumstances,

0:31:03.320 --> 0:31:06.480
<v Speaker 2>but they also were painting as a way to process

0:31:06.640 --> 0:31:10.680
<v Speaker 2>their circumstances. I was like, this, Kana keeps bringing this

0:31:10.800 --> 0:31:13.959
<v Speaker 2>vibe to me the way she paints in bed flat

0:31:14.000 --> 0:31:16.080
<v Speaker 2>on her back, yep, using a mirror.

0:31:16.520 --> 0:31:19.160
<v Speaker 1>If she can do that, yeah, I can do I

0:31:19.160 --> 0:31:21.080
<v Speaker 1>can use this shit. Like if she did this with

0:31:21.120 --> 0:31:23.640
<v Speaker 1>all these broken bones, I can do that too.

0:31:23.960 --> 0:31:25.120
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:31:25.160 --> 0:31:27.440
<v Speaker 2>And like, the ability to find a way and to

0:31:27.560 --> 0:31:31.040
<v Speaker 2>have the will to discover and to create is huge

0:31:31.560 --> 0:31:35.840
<v Speaker 2>and so beautiful and like often creates some of the

0:31:35.880 --> 0:31:39.160
<v Speaker 2>most incredible and depths of art, like to.

0:31:39.160 --> 0:31:44.760
<v Speaker 1>Me, totally yeah, yeah. Her portraits are just absolutely stunning.

0:31:44.760 --> 0:31:48.080
<v Speaker 1>They tell such amazing stories in the way that she's

0:31:48.120 --> 0:31:51.880
<v Speaker 1>comfortable with herself. That's another reason I love painting myself

0:31:52.040 --> 0:31:55.000
<v Speaker 1>is it's made me really be comfortable and love myself

0:31:55.040 --> 0:31:58.280
<v Speaker 1>because I have to paint every insecurity, I have to

0:31:58.320 --> 0:32:00.120
<v Speaker 1>paint every wrinkle.

0:31:59.720 --> 0:32:01.640
<v Speaker 3>That I see, even if I may not like.

0:32:01.640 --> 0:32:05.520
<v Speaker 1>It, but yeah, looking and being able to see those

0:32:05.800 --> 0:32:09.040
<v Speaker 1>flaws and still being able to put them on the

0:32:09.080 --> 0:32:11.840
<v Speaker 1>page and say, this is a part of me, and

0:32:12.040 --> 0:32:17.280
<v Speaker 1>I still am amazing no matter the flaw, these flaws

0:32:17.400 --> 0:32:18.720
<v Speaker 1>right I see in quotations.

0:32:19.160 --> 0:32:23.320
<v Speaker 2>Although Keana now has visual arts, music still holds a

0:32:23.320 --> 0:32:27.720
<v Speaker 2>special magic for her. So it's extra special that she

0:32:27.960 --> 0:32:31.200
<v Speaker 2>found her way back to singing. Now she sings in

0:32:31.240 --> 0:32:33.880
<v Speaker 2>the chamber choir at the church where she works part time.

0:32:34.480 --> 0:32:35.760
<v Speaker 3>It gives me endorphins.

0:32:36.200 --> 0:32:40.400
<v Speaker 1>It is like taking a xanax literally, when I'm have anxiety,

0:32:40.600 --> 0:32:45.760
<v Speaker 1>it just it grounds me and it makes all of

0:32:45.800 --> 0:32:49.320
<v Speaker 1>those feelings go away. And so sometimes when I was

0:32:49.360 --> 0:32:51.440
<v Speaker 1>in the worst of the worst places and I couldn't

0:32:51.480 --> 0:32:54.680
<v Speaker 1>get my mind to settle my body to sell, I

0:32:54.720 --> 0:32:56.280
<v Speaker 1>would just I would sing.

0:32:56.480 --> 0:32:59.000
<v Speaker 2>That feeling that singing is like taking a xanax or

0:32:59.000 --> 0:33:02.200
<v Speaker 2>grounding yourself as thing I highly relate to. For me,

0:33:02.360 --> 0:33:05.840
<v Speaker 2>singing has always been a way of self soothing and

0:33:05.880 --> 0:33:10.800
<v Speaker 2>connecting with myself, whether it's because I'd gotten anxious because

0:33:10.800 --> 0:33:14.520
<v Speaker 2>of my own life uncertainty, trying to figure out what's next,

0:33:14.800 --> 0:33:18.320
<v Speaker 2>or going through a loss or a breakup. One of

0:33:18.320 --> 0:33:22.000
<v Speaker 2>the ways I've always processed is through singing, and I

0:33:22.080 --> 0:33:24.200
<v Speaker 2>used to do it as a kid on the swings

0:33:24.240 --> 0:33:29.480
<v Speaker 2>at Recess processing my day. That's how it started. When

0:33:29.560 --> 0:33:32.600
<v Speaker 2>music and performance have such a profound effect on you,

0:33:32.880 --> 0:33:35.320
<v Speaker 2>it's really hard not to be able to do that often.

0:33:36.320 --> 0:33:38.880
<v Speaker 2>It's hard to want to hold back, and yet it's

0:33:38.920 --> 0:33:42.600
<v Speaker 2>something that Keana has to constantly think about as she sings.

0:33:43.160 --> 0:33:45.800
<v Speaker 1>Now, I just know what parameters I need to be

0:33:45.880 --> 0:33:49.160
<v Speaker 1>able to be safe, especially like what I'm singing now,

0:33:49.280 --> 0:33:51.800
<v Speaker 1>and I have to take my neck brace off and write.

0:33:51.880 --> 0:33:53.720
<v Speaker 1>It's good in the sense that it makes me gain

0:33:53.760 --> 0:33:55.680
<v Speaker 1>more muscle. But I also just have to make sure

0:33:55.680 --> 0:33:57.720
<v Speaker 1>that I'm sitting in a chair that it has armrests

0:33:57.880 --> 0:34:01.160
<v Speaker 1>because or else my shoulders just locate very easily during

0:34:01.200 --> 0:34:03.840
<v Speaker 1>a lot of things, and that when people are standing,

0:34:03.880 --> 0:34:05.959
<v Speaker 1>I don't have to be standing. I can be sitting

0:34:06.040 --> 0:34:08.680
<v Speaker 1>and you can just do it at my pace, but

0:34:08.800 --> 0:34:10.640
<v Speaker 1>don't have to keep up with anyone else.

0:34:11.000 --> 0:34:13.719
<v Speaker 2>People with chronic illness are always having to listen to

0:34:13.760 --> 0:34:16.200
<v Speaker 2>their bodies to know how many spoons they have, what

0:34:16.280 --> 0:34:19.879
<v Speaker 2>their limitations are on any given day. And being able

0:34:19.920 --> 0:34:22.480
<v Speaker 2>to do that is something I really admire. It's not

0:34:22.520 --> 0:34:24.760
<v Speaker 2>always easy to be in touch with yourself or listen

0:34:24.800 --> 0:34:27.440
<v Speaker 2>to yourself, no matter where your body is at, because

0:34:27.440 --> 0:34:30.480
<v Speaker 2>you're always going to come up against our society's expectations

0:34:30.560 --> 0:34:37.279
<v Speaker 2>around productivity, work, and capitalism. People with chronic illness are

0:34:37.400 --> 0:34:41.560
<v Speaker 2>always dealing with being underestimated because we don't see how

0:34:41.640 --> 0:34:45.680
<v Speaker 2>much work they're already putting in to the day every day.

0:34:46.200 --> 0:34:49.000
<v Speaker 2>Guilt and shame around all of this is so real.

0:34:49.800 --> 0:34:53.360
<v Speaker 2>No matter how much self compassion she has, Kean is

0:34:53.400 --> 0:34:56.759
<v Speaker 2>still not immune from feeling that. One way we can

0:34:56.840 --> 0:35:01.040
<v Speaker 2>start redefining these expectations is by thinking about how we

0:35:01.080 --> 0:35:03.360
<v Speaker 2>take care of each other and ourselves.

0:35:03.680 --> 0:35:08.480
<v Speaker 1>I'm just happy being able to be in a community,

0:35:08.560 --> 0:35:12.680
<v Speaker 1>being able to show up, and because for so long,

0:35:12.960 --> 0:35:15.640
<v Speaker 1>even in the things that like in my responsibilities in

0:35:15.680 --> 0:35:19.040
<v Speaker 1>my jobs, I couldn't always be there, I couldn't always

0:35:19.040 --> 0:35:21.120
<v Speaker 1>do it, and I felt like people saw me as.

0:35:21.040 --> 0:35:22.880
<v Speaker 3>Such a slacker.

0:35:23.200 --> 0:35:25.920
<v Speaker 1>So just being able to show up when I say

0:35:25.960 --> 0:35:28.839
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to show up and knowing the pace, knowing

0:35:28.880 --> 0:35:31.839
<v Speaker 1>how much I can show up without doing it, like

0:35:31.880 --> 0:35:35.279
<v Speaker 1>it's taken ten years to get here, but man, the

0:35:35.320 --> 0:35:39.399
<v Speaker 1>stability is all I've wanted Right now.

0:35:39.400 --> 0:35:41.600
<v Speaker 2>She has enough spoons to go to school and work

0:35:41.640 --> 0:35:44.480
<v Speaker 2>fifteen hours a week. One trip to go out of

0:35:44.520 --> 0:35:48.239
<v Speaker 2>the house a day works well for her. Luckily, there's

0:35:48.280 --> 0:35:51.560
<v Speaker 2>grocery deliveries and things like that that can help save

0:35:51.600 --> 0:35:54.080
<v Speaker 2>her some extra spoons to let her paint and sing.

0:35:55.160 --> 0:35:57.879
<v Speaker 2>One thing I want to acknowledge is that Keana used

0:35:57.880 --> 0:36:00.640
<v Speaker 2>a spoon to sit upright and do this interview for

0:36:00.840 --> 0:36:05.759
<v Speaker 2>close to two hours. Even though Keana does and has

0:36:05.880 --> 0:36:09.720
<v Speaker 2>done so much to navigate and establish emotional and physical

0:36:09.719 --> 0:36:12.680
<v Speaker 2>stability in her life, there are still things out of

0:36:12.719 --> 0:36:16.600
<v Speaker 2>her control. One of those things are the financial aspects

0:36:16.600 --> 0:36:19.759
<v Speaker 2>of her condition. This is something that her and her

0:36:19.800 --> 0:36:22.400
<v Speaker 2>boyfriend Yona have been juggling together.

0:36:23.080 --> 0:36:26.279
<v Speaker 1>We've always been like stuck under the poverty line. We

0:36:26.320 --> 0:36:29.040
<v Speaker 1>can't get married because if we got married, I would

0:36:29.080 --> 0:36:30.480
<v Speaker 1>lose my disability benefits.

0:36:30.640 --> 0:36:34.520
<v Speaker 2>Wait elaborate on that place. How does that work.

0:36:35.040 --> 0:36:37.520
<v Speaker 1>I can't have more than two thousand dollars in my

0:36:37.560 --> 0:36:41.720
<v Speaker 1>bank account or else I can't get monthly disability benefits,

0:36:41.760 --> 0:36:43.719
<v Speaker 1>so I have not There's no way for me to

0:36:43.760 --> 0:36:46.239
<v Speaker 1>have any savings. So that is in the process of

0:36:46.280 --> 0:36:48.719
<v Speaker 1>being changed to ten thousand dollars right now, and we're

0:36:48.760 --> 0:36:51.279
<v Speaker 1>trying to like push it through the court system right now.

0:36:51.440 --> 0:36:54.000
<v Speaker 1>But it's been like that for a very long time.

0:36:54.200 --> 0:36:58.960
<v Speaker 1>And if we got married, then our incomes then both

0:36:59.120 --> 0:37:02.000
<v Speaker 1>then it turns to three thousand dollars, three thousand dollars

0:37:02.080 --> 0:37:02.680
<v Speaker 1>in both of.

0:37:02.640 --> 0:37:04.719
<v Speaker 3>Our accounts at one time.

0:37:05.160 --> 0:37:10.480
<v Speaker 1>And because of his income, I wouldn't then qualify anymore

0:37:10.800 --> 0:37:14.880
<v Speaker 1>because he makes a normal amount and I wouldn't qualify

0:37:14.880 --> 0:37:18.279
<v Speaker 1>it anymore. There's no way to set up someone for

0:37:18.360 --> 0:37:22.279
<v Speaker 1>success in this program because you can't save. And I'm

0:37:22.280 --> 0:37:24.160
<v Speaker 1>trying to get my de grease so that I can

0:37:24.239 --> 0:37:27.360
<v Speaker 1>eventually get off of this and then save some money

0:37:27.480 --> 0:37:29.600
<v Speaker 1>and get a retirement account and all those things.

0:37:30.719 --> 0:37:32.480
<v Speaker 2>But it's ridiculous.

0:37:32.560 --> 0:37:34.480
<v Speaker 3>It's they won't let you succeed.

0:37:34.760 --> 0:37:37.799
<v Speaker 2>It's crazy that we're linked to give someone benefits to

0:37:37.880 --> 0:37:40.080
<v Speaker 2>help them because we know they need it, and yet

0:37:40.120 --> 0:37:43.640
<v Speaker 2>it's only enough, like only just enough, and it keeps

0:37:43.680 --> 0:37:47.240
<v Speaker 2>you under the poverty line. We all have these beautiful

0:37:47.320 --> 0:37:49.719
<v Speaker 2>hopes and dreams, and it's hard when you're like, oh,

0:37:49.800 --> 0:37:53.000
<v Speaker 2>I can't plan for the future. I can't save any money,

0:37:53.080 --> 0:37:56.279
<v Speaker 2>whether it's for a medical emergency, a rainy day, if

0:37:56.320 --> 0:37:58.399
<v Speaker 2>you lose your job, or if you want to move,

0:37:58.600 --> 0:38:02.920
<v Speaker 2>any additional life cost you can't prepare for if you

0:38:02.960 --> 0:38:05.880
<v Speaker 2>want to claim these benefits, And that's a catch twenty

0:38:05.920 --> 0:38:08.640
<v Speaker 2>two that feels like we're not actually helping people out

0:38:08.920 --> 0:38:12.120
<v Speaker 2>and ends up creating a crazy burden on people who

0:38:12.120 --> 0:38:15.480
<v Speaker 2>shouldn't have to deal with that. It's one way to

0:38:15.560 --> 0:38:19.480
<v Speaker 2>make people's needs invisible. I know we've talked about the

0:38:19.520 --> 0:38:22.799
<v Speaker 2>topic like a little bit, but just to ask the

0:38:22.920 --> 0:38:25.480
<v Speaker 2>question out right, when do you feel invisible?

0:38:27.000 --> 0:38:29.360
<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

0:38:29.760 --> 0:38:35.680
<v Speaker 1>I felt invisible for a long time before really trusting

0:38:35.680 --> 0:38:41.800
<v Speaker 1>my own instincts and believing myself first and then having

0:38:42.239 --> 0:38:45.239
<v Speaker 1>the courage to tell other people what I needed and

0:38:45.280 --> 0:38:48.000
<v Speaker 1>things like that. And for a while I wasn't seen

0:38:48.040 --> 0:38:51.520
<v Speaker 1>and I wasn't heard by my friends, people around me,

0:38:51.640 --> 0:38:55.439
<v Speaker 1>by my parents, by the medical system, and that hurt

0:38:55.520 --> 0:38:55.839
<v Speaker 1>a lot.

0:38:55.960 --> 0:38:56.879
<v Speaker 3>It really made me.

0:38:56.960 --> 0:39:00.000
<v Speaker 1>Very discouraged for a very long time because I felt

0:39:00.239 --> 0:39:03.319
<v Speaker 1>so desperate and there was nothing I could do about it,

0:39:05.080 --> 0:39:08.480
<v Speaker 1>and it just felt like my desperation was just invisible,

0:39:08.560 --> 0:39:10.600
<v Speaker 1>Like no matter how much I kicked and screamed, no

0:39:10.640 --> 0:39:13.520
<v Speaker 1>matter how much I cried, I would get gro out

0:39:13.520 --> 0:39:16.120
<v Speaker 1>to the emergency room and then get sent home without

0:39:16.600 --> 0:39:19.880
<v Speaker 1>anything having been done. And I finally found an amazing

0:39:19.920 --> 0:39:23.399
<v Speaker 1>general practitioner and I've been with her ever since. If

0:39:23.400 --> 0:39:26.120
<v Speaker 1>it weren't for somebody taking that chance on me and

0:39:26.160 --> 0:39:29.080
<v Speaker 1>that doctor saying you should try this option, like, I

0:39:29.080 --> 0:39:33.880
<v Speaker 1>don't know where I would be today without it, that's beautiful.

0:39:34.400 --> 0:39:37.360
<v Speaker 2>So much of this conversation has been about Keana's personal

0:39:37.440 --> 0:39:41.000
<v Speaker 2>journey and her inner strength, and this moment reminds me

0:39:41.320 --> 0:39:45.200
<v Speaker 2>that the people around us, our community, can help us

0:39:45.239 --> 0:39:48.719
<v Speaker 2>be seen and to be strong. What would you tell

0:39:48.760 --> 0:39:52.640
<v Speaker 2>someone who's just starting off or experiencing the beginning of

0:39:52.760 --> 0:39:53.879
<v Speaker 2>chronic illness or pain.

0:39:54.080 --> 0:39:58.520
<v Speaker 1>Don't give up on yourself, and there's always a way

0:39:58.600 --> 0:40:01.880
<v Speaker 1>to still do what you like and to incorporate you

0:40:02.280 --> 0:40:06.520
<v Speaker 1>into your new body. My body, I was so I

0:40:06.600 --> 0:40:09.200
<v Speaker 1>used my body all the time. I talked with my hands,

0:40:09.280 --> 0:40:12.680
<v Speaker 1>I fling my head around. I'm flamboyant as hell, But

0:40:13.080 --> 0:40:15.040
<v Speaker 1>all of a sudden I had to bring it in

0:40:15.080 --> 0:40:17.280
<v Speaker 1>and I couldn't move when I talked, and I felt

0:40:17.320 --> 0:40:19.720
<v Speaker 1>like fifty percent of my personality was gone.

0:40:19.840 --> 0:40:21.120
<v Speaker 3>But that's just not true.

0:40:21.920 --> 0:40:25.680
<v Speaker 1>It's all in here and the people who are patient

0:40:25.760 --> 0:40:27.560
<v Speaker 1>enough to sit with you and see it are the

0:40:27.560 --> 0:40:31.880
<v Speaker 1>people that you want to stick with you. And I

0:40:31.920 --> 0:40:35.040
<v Speaker 1>would say, don't conquertize on anything. You do not know

0:40:35.400 --> 0:40:39.520
<v Speaker 1>what's going to happen, and something that happens that is

0:40:39.880 --> 0:40:44.600
<v Speaker 1>seemingly negative may end up being something that is a

0:40:44.680 --> 0:40:47.719
<v Speaker 1>positive later in life. And I would say that I'm

0:40:47.760 --> 0:40:50.720
<v Speaker 1>a better person because of all of this. I feel

0:40:50.719 --> 0:40:51.480
<v Speaker 1>like there's more.

0:40:51.360 --> 0:40:53.320
<v Speaker 3>Meaning now in my life.

0:40:53.440 --> 0:40:56.200
<v Speaker 1>I have a higher power that I've found through all

0:40:56.280 --> 0:40:59.920
<v Speaker 1>of this. I like the person who I am and

0:41:00.800 --> 0:41:03.000
<v Speaker 1>like because of all these things that I've been through.

0:41:03.120 --> 0:41:07.759
<v Speaker 2>And who do you feel like you are or who

0:41:07.800 --> 0:41:09.600
<v Speaker 2>is this person you've come to really like?

0:41:10.560 --> 0:41:19.000
<v Speaker 1>I'm empathetic, I'm kind, I'm charismatic, I'm silly, and I

0:41:19.080 --> 0:41:22.520
<v Speaker 1>am the best version and the happiest version of my

0:41:22.640 --> 0:41:26.040
<v Speaker 1>childhood self. Feels like I've finally been able to bring

0:41:26.080 --> 0:41:28.240
<v Speaker 1>all the things that I used to feel self conscious

0:41:28.280 --> 0:41:30.560
<v Speaker 1>about and the person that I would try to be

0:41:30.640 --> 0:41:33.800
<v Speaker 1>that I really wasn't. And it feels really good to

0:41:35.040 --> 0:41:38.279
<v Speaker 1>be able to be an adult that I really like

0:41:38.400 --> 0:41:40.799
<v Speaker 1>and that I respect and that I know that I'm

0:41:40.840 --> 0:41:41.879
<v Speaker 1>doing the best that I can.

0:41:42.400 --> 0:41:44.560
<v Speaker 3>That's why I like myself.

0:41:44.760 --> 0:41:47.759
<v Speaker 1>I know for a fact that I am doing the

0:41:47.920 --> 0:41:51.000
<v Speaker 1>best that I can, and I'm pushing myself in places

0:41:51.040 --> 0:41:54.560
<v Speaker 1>that other people would probably not. Who knows, I don't

0:41:54.640 --> 0:41:58.319
<v Speaker 1>know that, but I work hard, and though it may

0:41:58.360 --> 0:42:00.759
<v Speaker 1>not look like that on the outside, with how much

0:42:00.800 --> 0:42:04.120
<v Speaker 1>work I make or how much my schedule is filled,

0:42:04.800 --> 0:42:08.359
<v Speaker 1>I know how much I'm putting my body through and

0:42:09.120 --> 0:42:12.560
<v Speaker 1>how much willpower I have, and I'm proud of that.

0:42:13.000 --> 0:42:14.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm proud of it, and I'm proud of the fact

0:42:14.800 --> 0:42:18.000
<v Speaker 1>that I'm bringing that. I'm singing again, even though I

0:42:18.040 --> 0:42:20.280
<v Speaker 1>have to take my neck brace off and it's scary.

0:42:22.000 --> 0:42:26.920
<v Speaker 1>So I'm proud of doing the things that are scary

0:42:27.520 --> 0:42:31.439
<v Speaker 1>and trudging forward even though I don't know if I'll

0:42:31.440 --> 0:42:33.840
<v Speaker 1>be able to have a career, a successful career. I

0:42:33.840 --> 0:42:35.879
<v Speaker 1>don't know if my body will hold up, but right

0:42:35.920 --> 0:42:38.080
<v Speaker 1>now it's doing it, so I'm going to do as

0:42:38.160 --> 0:42:39.359
<v Speaker 1>much as I can to get there.

0:42:40.400 --> 0:42:43.160
<v Speaker 2>Keiana's light and kindness have always been a part of her,

0:42:43.360 --> 0:42:46.080
<v Speaker 2>and it's so beautiful to see how she's carried herself

0:42:46.120 --> 0:42:49.560
<v Speaker 2>through dark times and how she's vulnerable about sharing her

0:42:49.600 --> 0:42:53.799
<v Speaker 2>experience to help others in so many ways. Dealing with

0:42:53.840 --> 0:42:57.800
<v Speaker 2>something so massive yet invisible, Kiana still is able to

0:42:57.840 --> 0:43:00.640
<v Speaker 2>shape a life that she wants for herself, something that's

0:43:00.719 --> 0:43:04.920
<v Speaker 2>based in community. I think it reminded me that I

0:43:05.000 --> 0:43:08.360
<v Speaker 2>need to lead with grace and kindness and try and

0:43:08.440 --> 0:43:14.480
<v Speaker 2>be as understanding as possible, and that the only way

0:43:14.560 --> 0:43:16.719
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to know how to treat someone better is

0:43:16.760 --> 0:43:21.080
<v Speaker 2>by asking. Next week, we'll meet a teacher in Baltimore

0:43:21.080 --> 0:43:23.839
<v Speaker 2>who shows up for black young people in his community

0:43:23.880 --> 0:43:27.360
<v Speaker 2>every single day. Mister j teaches at the high school

0:43:27.400 --> 0:43:29.440
<v Speaker 2>he once went to, and I wanted to know what

0:43:29.480 --> 0:43:31.960
<v Speaker 2>it's really like to be in the classroom day in

0:43:32.239 --> 0:43:33.440
<v Speaker 2>and day out.

0:43:34.120 --> 0:43:37.400
<v Speaker 3>It's rare to have black male teachers. Every lesson doesn't

0:43:37.400 --> 0:43:38.480
<v Speaker 3>have to be on a front board.

0:43:38.520 --> 0:43:41.480
<v Speaker 2>Sometimes I am the lesson and I'm also the testament.

0:43:41.960 --> 0:43:47.480
<v Speaker 2>More on mister Jay's journey next week. Thank you so

0:43:47.640 --> 0:43:50.759
<v Speaker 2>much for listening to When You're Invisible. Please leave us

0:43:50.760 --> 0:43:52.640
<v Speaker 2>a rating and a review to let us know what

0:43:52.680 --> 0:43:55.680
<v Speaker 2>you think. You can find this episode and future ones

0:43:55.719 --> 0:43:59.080
<v Speaker 2>on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get

0:43:59.120 --> 0:44:02.960
<v Speaker 2>your podcasts. When You're Invisible is a production of iHeart

0:44:02.960 --> 0:44:07.319
<v Speaker 2>Podcasts and Mike Purdura Podcast Network. I'm Your creator and

0:44:07.400 --> 0:44:12.080
<v Speaker 2>host Maria Fernanda Vies. Our story editor is Dylan Hoyer.

0:44:12.719 --> 0:44:16.000
<v Speaker 2>This season was produced by Me with additional production from

0:44:16.080 --> 0:44:19.360
<v Speaker 2>Dylan Hoyer. Sound designed by Laurence Stump and Me with

0:44:19.400 --> 0:44:23.680
<v Speaker 2>additional support from Dylan Hoyer, Mixing and mastering by Laurence Stump.

0:44:24.000 --> 0:44:28.440
<v Speaker 2>Original theme music by Tony Bruno. Our executive producers are

0:44:28.480 --> 0:44:32.520
<v Speaker 2>Anna Stump and Gisell Banzes, and special thanks to our

0:44:32.600 --> 0:44:41.400
<v Speaker 2>Lean Santana