WEBVTT - No Winners in the Long Lines 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:03.960 I'm off my game today. No, you're not. People are 0:00:03.960 --> 0:00:05.800 going to have to start making better content. I think 0:00:05.800 --> 0:00:07.320 we're gonna be talking about this for a long time. 0:00:07.400 --> 0:00:10.360 When you program for everyone, you program for no one. 0:00:10.400 --> 0:00:12.440 I think it's that we're purpose driven platform, like we're 0:00:12.480 --> 0:00:15.800 trying to get to substance. How was that? Are you 0:00:15.840 --> 0:00:19.320 happy with that? This is marketing therapy right now? And 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:24.040 it really is? What's up? I'm Laura Currency and I'm 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:28.639 Alexa Kristin. Welcome back to Atlantia. Episode five. We have 0:00:28.840 --> 0:00:31.840 an interesting guest on the show. In fact, his tagline 0:00:31.880 --> 0:00:34.680 is stay interesting. We're excited to bring to CEO and 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:39.199 founder of Azzy dot Com, Carlos Watson. We've known Carlos 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:41.879 for I don't know a few years now, and he 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:44.240 is truly one of those people that walks in the 0:00:44.360 --> 0:00:48.400 room and you just want to hang out with him. Enamored, infectious, 0:00:48.760 --> 0:00:53.120 his laugh, He's charismatic, and he's charming and smart um 0:00:53.159 --> 0:00:57.480 and what he's done with AZZI is a total reflection. 0:00:57.600 --> 0:01:00.640 I think of him as a person and total So 0:01:01.000 --> 0:01:04.080 we're going to talk to him about AZZI, where they're going, 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:06.679 what they're thinking, and how to be different in a 0:01:06.760 --> 0:01:11.240 world of news media where everybody is chasing the cliffs 0:01:11.280 --> 0:01:14.720 bait and the lowest common denominator, right, And and Carlos, 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:16.759 I think has carved out his own niche and there's 0:01:16.800 --> 0:01:19.280 a tone that's reflective that you go, oh, that's Auzzy. 0:01:19.920 --> 0:01:25.080 So happy to have Carlos on later. Yeah, but first first, 0:01:25.360 --> 0:01:28.039 what a week we went to the Twitter verse. We 0:01:28.120 --> 0:01:31.680 had so much fun talking with some of our loyal listeners. 0:01:31.800 --> 0:01:34.399 Thank you at Landia and thank you for staying up 0:01:34.400 --> 0:01:36.720 with us to have a little bit of a late 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:41.120 night banter was Yeah, and one of our favorite followers 0:01:41.360 --> 0:01:46.080 at go Crisco or go Crisco or not Crisco, not 0:01:46.319 --> 0:01:50.160 c r I s c O. Yeah. He really engaged 0:01:50.240 --> 0:01:53.880 us in this interesting debate about influence, and it's something 0:01:53.920 --> 0:01:57.240 we've talked a bit about in different spheres. We've breached 0:01:57.520 --> 0:02:01.480 political borders, we've gone into media and talent. But he 0:02:01.520 --> 0:02:05.880 was talking just a straight up question about influencers. What's 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:09.280 happening marketers, Yeah, influencer marketing? Is it going away? What's 0:02:09.320 --> 0:02:12.520 the future of it? Can we talk about that? And 0:02:12.800 --> 0:02:15.480 Laura and I said, yeah, absolutely, we'll talk about it 0:02:15.680 --> 0:02:18.040 because it's actually something that I think is a really 0:02:18.280 --> 0:02:23.480 um prevalent topic right now. What's happened with YouTube and 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:27.600 a lot of the stars um talking about advertising and 0:02:27.639 --> 0:02:30.040 how important it is and the support and how important 0:02:30.040 --> 0:02:35.639 their voices are. I think marketers know instinctually that influencers 0:02:35.800 --> 0:02:39.800 command more of an audience and more audience stickiness, like 0:02:39.840 --> 0:02:44.480 they stay with you and they become fans better than 0:02:44.760 --> 0:02:48.240 any brand in some ways can do just you know, 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:52.800 by advertising. Yeah, and a go Chris go Um shared 0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:55.880 an article that he had read on Forbes which talks 0:02:55.919 --> 0:03:02.440 about our influencers the idea of personalities more effective than partnering. 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:05.560 And this is for brands with media companies. And our 0:03:05.560 --> 0:03:08.799 answer is yes, that is absolutely something that is in 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:13.120 most cases. I mean, I think it's yes, done correctly, correctly. 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:15.400 And you bring up an interesting point because one of 0:03:15.440 --> 0:03:18.560 the things that you know, we talk about being really 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:22.520 important when you start dabbling in this space is oftentimes, 0:03:22.560 --> 0:03:24.799 and we said this on our our Twitter handle, it's 0:03:25.000 --> 0:03:29.960 not necessarily about um getting or aligning yourself with the 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:33.080 influencer who has the most followers or who is the 0:03:33.120 --> 0:03:36.000 most popular. It's about getting with the right influencer who 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:39.320 buys into And it was authentically reflective of your brand. 0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:41.640 That is a huge difference. Well, it has to be 0:03:41.680 --> 0:03:46.240 someone who I think it goes back to like sharing values, 0:03:46.560 --> 0:03:50.200 like shares values with the brand, right shares what's episode 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:52.440 one with Ben Cooley talking about you know, when a 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:57.360 brand and a media company or influence or personality come together, 0:03:58.320 --> 0:04:01.680 where the magic happens is when they share a certain 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:06.480 ethos ethos or a certain value or for certain perspective 0:04:07.080 --> 0:04:09.640 and that it benefits the audience. Yeah. And one of 0:04:09.680 --> 0:04:11.920 the things for brands to pay attention to when they 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:16.040 get into this space is not necessarily lining yourself up 0:04:16.080 --> 0:04:20.000 with somebody who's going to promote your product one day 0:04:20.040 --> 0:04:22.560 and then the next day they've got somebody else's clothes on. 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:26.039 It's really understanding how do you cultivate a relationship where 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:33.320 that influencer inherently believes in those values, promotes such values 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:36.000 and I think in their social profile or in their 0:04:36.040 --> 0:04:38.480 their brand ecosystem. Yeah. And I think that brands in 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:42.039 a lot of ways could think of influencers and talent 0:04:42.320 --> 0:04:46.359 as people who they want to actually invest in for 0:04:46.440 --> 0:04:49.960 the long haul or whatever the long haul is. Um 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:52.480 you can do, you know, short term programs, but something 0:04:52.480 --> 0:04:54.800 where you say, I want to go in work with 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:59.480 this influence er on these things in a really meaningful way, 0:05:00.080 --> 0:05:02.880 not just to do something that's maybe a little bit 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:07.039 more ephemeral and just you know, leans into culture for 0:05:07.120 --> 0:05:09.520 culture's sake, but as something that could stand the test 0:05:09.560 --> 0:05:12.120 of time. And I think what's interesting about that is 0:05:12.560 --> 0:05:16.640 when those two things come together, the earned value happens, right, 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:19.000 and an influencer who believes in your brand is more 0:05:19.080 --> 0:05:22.799 likely to put more into and amplify on their own, 0:05:23.000 --> 0:05:26.520 on their own time or dollar or platform, in a 0:05:26.560 --> 0:05:29.080 way that brands could never set themselves up to do 0:05:29.279 --> 0:05:31.839 with an actual transaction. I think if you have an 0:05:31.880 --> 0:05:37.039 influencer who is you know, working with lots of different people, 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:39.960 and their values are changing based on whoever they're working 0:05:40.000 --> 0:05:43.120 with or who's paying them area, they're probably not going 0:05:43.160 --> 0:05:46.120 to survive very long, right Right, I've got an idea, 0:05:46.560 --> 0:05:49.479 tell us, what if we stop calling them influencers and 0:05:49.520 --> 0:05:53.760 we start buying perspectives that because when you can line 0:05:53.880 --> 0:05:59.720 up perspective, these questions don't become questions, they become givens. 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:02.560 Right there. There are things that if you know what 0:06:02.680 --> 0:06:08.520 that person stands for, like Arianna Huffington's Sleep, Sleep Well, 0:06:08.600 --> 0:06:13.520 Sleep and Balance, and I think there's no mistaking what 0:06:13.640 --> 0:06:16.400 you're going to get out of that conversation. And because 0:06:16.440 --> 0:06:19.520 she's so passionate, it's so authentic. That brings us to 0:06:19.880 --> 0:06:22.360 the next kind of topic that we've been talking about, 0:06:22.400 --> 0:06:24.440 and everyone's talking about it. And in fact, when when 0:06:24.480 --> 0:06:27.360 we talked about talking about this, I kind of rolled 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:29.320 my eyes and I said, I'm so done with the 0:06:29.320 --> 0:06:33.719 pepsi conversation. But it's an important conversation to have because 0:06:33.720 --> 0:06:35.640 we want to put our spin on it because we 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:40.440 don't want to add to the noise. I think everybody's 0:06:40.520 --> 0:06:44.599 for points for why they shouldn't have done it, how 0:06:44.680 --> 0:06:48.200 tone deaf like, we agree it was a mistake. But 0:06:48.279 --> 0:06:49.800 the thing that we thought, there are a couple of 0:06:49.800 --> 0:06:52.120 things that we were like, oh but why, but why 0:06:52.160 --> 0:06:54.039 are people saying this? So one of the things that 0:06:54.080 --> 0:06:58.440 really got under my skin, got my real panties in 0:06:58.440 --> 0:07:04.159 a bunch, so to speak, was around um people kept 0:07:04.279 --> 0:07:07.400 pointing at the in house agency and saying, well, if 0:07:07.400 --> 0:07:11.320 they hadn't used it in ouce agency, and as a marketer, 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:14.840 I actually took total offense to that. When we were 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:17.600 it was hilarious, Lauren, I were texting and I was 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:19.800 like starting to text this and she was like, oh, 0:07:19.920 --> 0:07:22.240 I am, I can't even talk about it makes me 0:07:22.280 --> 0:07:26.000 so frustrated. And so why does that frustrate us? One? 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:31.520 I think that marketers in house should be totally responsible 0:07:31.880 --> 0:07:35.960 as much as their agency for making great work, actually 0:07:36.280 --> 0:07:39.000 more responsible, because they should be close with the brand 0:07:39.000 --> 0:07:42.400 and understand the brand values and making sure that those 0:07:42.440 --> 0:07:44.680 things are reflected. I think one of the things that 0:07:44.720 --> 0:07:49.280 we got frustrated with was why should a marketer in 0:07:49.440 --> 0:07:52.680 house be any less accountable than an agency than an 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:55.360 agency would if at the end of the day, we're 0:07:55.400 --> 0:07:58.720 all marketers accountable and capable. Right, those were the two things. 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:00.960 It was like accountable and capable. Well, and what it 0:08:01.000 --> 0:08:05.240 was funny? I said to Laura, have we as marketers, 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:09.040 like have we become expected to outsource our brain to agencies? 0:08:09.760 --> 0:08:12.000 That that kind of bothers me, So are we like 0:08:12.560 --> 0:08:15.640 brainless bodies and jobs? Saying sure, just show me the 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:18.840 media flow, like what is that? What does that mean? 0:08:18.920 --> 0:08:21.320 And it and it actually reflects some of the things 0:08:21.360 --> 0:08:25.440 that are happening in data, which was point number two. Right, 0:08:26.040 --> 0:08:30.480 That really kind of like got our goat, which was, well, 0:08:30.600 --> 0:08:34.240 I don't know, I'm Greek, we like goats, Yeah, I 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:37.439 mean the interpretation of it right, And I to me, 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:40.839 it wasn't necessarily that they were any less tone deaf. 0:08:40.920 --> 0:08:44.520 It was that everybody who is a part of culture 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:46.680 at this moment in time, or has been for the 0:08:46.760 --> 0:08:51.200 last I don't know, six months, should have recognized many 0:08:51.280 --> 0:08:54.840 red flags on the field. And so whether you're somebody 0:08:54.880 --> 0:08:58.440 who is sitting internally close to the brand, to me, 0:08:58.559 --> 0:09:01.600 that actually heightens the respond instability and accountability by saying 0:09:01.720 --> 0:09:05.480 I've got to protect this house. And if my brand 0:09:05.559 --> 0:09:09.480 ethos is meant to be joy in this case or 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:13.719 you know something for another brand, that might mean X, 0:09:14.520 --> 0:09:17.240 how am I showing up in the world. And that 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:23.520 litmus test should not be uh solely the responsibility of agencies. 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:27.760 It should be the responsibility of the marketer, and it 0:09:27.840 --> 0:09:31.640 should be the responsibility of partners, right. I mean, there 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:34.840 were obviously a lot of people involved. There are always 0:09:34.920 --> 0:09:39.640 many people involved when making UM a cultural piece of 0:09:39.640 --> 0:09:43.680 that magnitude. And this is also why I believe comm's planning, 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:50.080 which quite frankly has been stripped away, automated, diluted, complements 0:09:50.080 --> 0:09:54.000 of things like data and algorithms, where you know, some 0:09:54.480 --> 0:09:59.360 person somewhere said this is a very um pervasive trend 0:09:59.520 --> 0:10:01.800 or or cultural moment, and this is an opportunity for 0:10:01.880 --> 0:10:05.679 us to seize an our way instead of really paying 0:10:05.679 --> 0:10:10.400 attention to cultural context and what audiences have to say. 0:10:10.840 --> 0:10:13.120 And this is where the idea of I'm not so 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:15.640 sure tests and learn is really at this day and 0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:17.880 age where we need to be starting. I think it's 0:10:17.880 --> 0:10:20.400 more about listening and building and like using your gut. 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:22.640 But the thing that like, so I used to work 0:10:23.000 --> 0:10:25.280 for Pepsi. They were my client early in my career. 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:28.520 It's actually the first client I ever had was Pepsi. 0:10:28.920 --> 0:10:31.520 I have a love for Pepsi. I actually have a 0:10:31.559 --> 0:10:36.280 love for Pepsi and coke. But Pepsi is totally built 0:10:36.440 --> 0:10:39.000 on being a reflection of pop culture. Whether it was 0:10:39.040 --> 0:10:41.959 in Russia, whether it's with Michael Jackson and Britney Spears. 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:44.480 They've been this amazing reflection of pop culture. And when 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:47.920 I think we saw here, which made me really sad, 0:10:48.600 --> 0:10:52.360 was a brand not knowing where they fit in anymore, 0:10:52.920 --> 0:10:57.600 like pop culture, we're reflecting it. Hey, here it is, guys, 0:10:57.679 --> 0:11:00.640 this is what pop culture looks like and not doing 0:11:00.640 --> 0:11:05.400 more evaluation. To your point around like, Okay, we understand 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:07.640 that millennials want to stand for something, that they want 0:11:07.640 --> 0:11:09.880 to be involved, that they want to do good and 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:12.200 yes this is a global as we can't be specific 0:11:12.240 --> 0:11:16.040 about anything, but we want to reflect those are universal 0:11:16.080 --> 0:11:18.080 themes what you just went through. But there are many 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:21.400 ways to show up in culture if you're paying attention 0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:24.400 to audience and your consumer has to say the brand 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:28.400 to me was in an emergency of self identity, and 0:11:28.440 --> 0:11:30.680 that's what we're seeing is like this an emergency of 0:11:30.720 --> 0:11:34.560 self identity. But and to your point around comms planning, 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:38.439 like data ain't a strategy, folks, And in this case, 0:11:38.440 --> 0:11:41.200 the strategy showed. I I love this line and I've 0:11:41.400 --> 0:11:43.439 heard a couple of people use it lately, like your 0:11:43.480 --> 0:11:47.080 strategy is showing. I mean, their strategy was all out 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:50.640 there for us strategy. But I think where this brand 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:53.040 struggled the most in the last five eight years has 0:11:53.120 --> 0:11:56.480 been again there this mirror on pop culture. They've never 0:11:56.480 --> 0:11:58.599 been a Pepsi. You never look at Pepsi and be like, 0:11:58.640 --> 0:12:02.600 Pepsi's a leader of culture. No, Pepsi is a reflection 0:12:02.679 --> 0:12:04.760 of culture, and now I think that they've been in 0:12:04.760 --> 0:12:09.960 this like almost like you know, emergency of self right 0:12:10.760 --> 0:12:13.199 of who are we? What would have been the right tone? 0:12:13.240 --> 0:12:16.520 I mean, what would have been to strike a balance 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:19.920 to lean into millennial culture. How would we have done 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:23.280 it differently? I mean, I think that I would have 0:12:23.320 --> 0:12:27.120 gone down maybe more of an influencer route. I would 0:12:27.160 --> 0:12:30.080 have if I really, if I really wanted to rally 0:12:30.200 --> 0:12:37.319 people around the idea and the zeitgeist of social unrest, 0:12:37.760 --> 0:12:41.800 but people coming together in social unrest to form new communities, 0:12:42.679 --> 0:12:46.160 um new dialogues, those types of things, and that PEPSI 0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:51.200 somehow was like the universal connector. I would have probably 0:12:51.200 --> 0:12:54.280 gone down a route of going really local and doing 0:12:54.320 --> 0:12:58.280 it globally all over the world, and not probably with 0:12:58.440 --> 0:13:01.520 giant pop stars, but probably investing in up and coming 0:13:01.559 --> 0:13:05.320 talent that I wanted to have a longer term again 0:13:05.480 --> 0:13:07.480 relationship with. So going back to what we were talking 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:11.400 about earlier, so I think what we've talked a bit 0:13:11.440 --> 0:13:14.120 about over the course of our first few episodes is 0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:17.960 getting back to community and grassroots, and there were undertones 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:22.160 of that reflect But if you extract the grassroots and 0:13:22.160 --> 0:13:27.280 you extract subcultures, and passion points, and you start to say, 0:13:27.360 --> 0:13:30.880 what are the things if I'm listening truly to the 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:35.200 millennial pepsi consumer, who are those subcultures? Not the generic 0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:37.880 ones we've come to expect, but who truly are they 0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:43.280 sneaker heads? Are they collaborative artists? Are they interpretive dancers? 0:13:43.400 --> 0:13:46.160 You know, you get the point, and then understand to 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:49.360 your point, if I put a pepsi in their hand, 0:13:49.760 --> 0:13:54.920 which presumably stands for joy, what does that community galvanize around? 0:13:55.840 --> 0:13:59.560 And there's your content series because the product is reflective 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:04.080 of an ocean and that emotion has been joy, but 0:14:04.160 --> 0:14:08.480 put in the wrong context, here we are. Yeah, hey, 0:14:08.480 --> 0:14:11.640 can I ask a question? Sure, cam our producer, you 0:14:11.640 --> 0:14:14.280 can ask a question. The thing that you guys didn't 0:14:14.320 --> 0:14:16.080 bring up. But the thing that I thought of as 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:20.360 a consumer was like the second a commercial is political 0:14:20.560 --> 0:14:25.840 at all, I'm extremely skeptical because they're using something really 0:14:25.880 --> 0:14:29.200 serious to sell something. And then in this case, they 0:14:29.560 --> 0:14:33.120 suggested that a can of pepsi can beat the solution 0:14:33.240 --> 0:14:37.400 to police brutality, which which no one's gonna buy. But 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:41.000 I mean, how do brands, even you know, touch on 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:46.360 political topics if people like me kind of like are 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:49.560 averse to that to begin with because they think they 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:51.560 have to talk about it from like, so, okay, how 0:14:51.560 --> 0:14:56.880 do brands touch on political topics without being I think 0:14:57.000 --> 0:14:58.840 like they have. You have to go back to it's 0:14:58.880 --> 0:15:03.840 not funny, I say money because one of our Twitter 0:15:03.880 --> 0:15:09.080 followers asked us, you know, how do you think about 0:15:09.080 --> 0:15:12.640 advising your clients around politics? And we talked a bit 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:18.240 about it on our first episode with Ja and I'll 0:15:18.280 --> 0:15:20.960 go back to what the core theme of that show was, 0:15:21.080 --> 0:15:25.680 core values, core values, and like Bend talked a lot 0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:28.840 about um, if there's five things that are on your 0:15:28.880 --> 0:15:30.840 front wall when you walk in the door, like if 0:15:30.840 --> 0:15:34.880 the if the company actually, if the people do not 0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:37.480 feel like that is actually who the brand is, then 0:15:37.520 --> 0:15:39.720 you shouldn't even be talking about externally, I think is 0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:43.000 what you're thinking. I doubt PEPSI has a big Black 0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:46.400 Lives Matter sign in their lobby. It shouldn't have been 0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:50.360 about politics. It should have been about people and the news, right, 0:15:50.600 --> 0:15:53.920 and that's what they were trying. And then you know, 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:58.400 having some weird policeman basically, which was like the modern 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:02.360 Tianamen Square thing right with PEPSI, Like I didn't really 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:05.760 totally like, I don't know why they did that, and 0:16:05.840 --> 0:16:10.280 it made it definitely more political. Yeah, I mean, I 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:13.000 feel like they even and I don't know because I'm 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:16.520 not part of the world, and you guys might disagree, 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:19.360 but I feel like the ad would have been fairly 0:16:19.400 --> 0:16:22.800 successful if Pepsi hadn't even appeared in the commercial. Total 0:16:24.240 --> 0:16:27.120 totally agree with that, like banner at the end, because 0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:28.840 commercials do that all the time. You're like, what the 0:16:28.840 --> 0:16:31.360 hell is this about? It's not about the product, and 0:16:31.360 --> 0:16:34.160 then you see the what if the flash and you're like, well, okay, yeah, 0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:36.800 what if they had said something like you know, now 0:16:36.880 --> 0:16:39.200 is the time where we need more joy? That commercial 0:16:39.320 --> 0:16:42.240 is completely different, right, So anyway, we could go on 0:16:42.240 --> 0:16:44.880 about every I mean everyone has and everyone's talked about it, 0:16:44.920 --> 0:16:48.080 and I think like the reason we decided to talk 0:16:48.080 --> 0:16:50.200 about it was because those things were kind of just 0:16:50.520 --> 0:16:53.880 really rubbing us. So we did and we hope you 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.360 enjoy and you'll always get that from us at Landia. 0:16:56.480 --> 0:16:58.880 So we'll be right back with Carlos Watson from Ozzie 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:12.800 Stay with Welcome back, everybody. We are excited to have 0:17:12.920 --> 0:17:15.639 Carlos Watson from Azzi dot Com in the studio with 0:17:15.760 --> 0:17:20.040 us today Carlos Watson, co founder of Azzy dot Com, 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:23.720 this breakout media company that we've been watching for a 0:17:23.720 --> 0:17:26.960 few years now. Carlos, thanks so much for joining us. 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:29.240 It is really fun to be with you guys. As 0:17:29.240 --> 0:17:31.800 we were saying before, when last I saw you, you 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:34.880 were carrying a beautiful baby girl to be thank you, 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:37.880 thank you very much. I'm slightly smaller, but I can't 0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:41.000 say all the way. Well, you know what, she she 0:17:41.160 --> 0:17:43.879 did her part, and I assume she's healthy and happy. 0:17:43.920 --> 0:17:46.720 She's very healthy, happy and a lot of fun. Good 0:17:46.960 --> 0:17:55.760 Thank you. She has Alex as many may so. Carlos, 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:58.320 thanks for coming to Atlantia. I mean we were talking 0:17:58.359 --> 0:18:00.479 a little bit before we came back on year, and 0:18:00.760 --> 0:18:02.880 I'm really excited to see the tremendous growth you've had 0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:07.919 in the last three years or so, breakout growth, you know, 0:18:08.000 --> 0:18:11.640 it has been. It's funny because before we started, I 0:18:11.640 --> 0:18:14.040 was lucky enough to get to have some conversations with 0:18:14.480 --> 0:18:16.800 Arianna Huffington, and I got to talk to the folks 0:18:16.800 --> 0:18:19.719 that started Politico and the folks who started Slate, BuzzFeed, 0:18:19.720 --> 0:18:21.600 and the folks from Bleacher Report, and so we tried 0:18:21.600 --> 0:18:23.960 to do our homework even as we tried to prepare 0:18:23.960 --> 0:18:26.720 our plan, and we ended up coming to learn a 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:28.760 couple of things. One, we didn't realize how old a 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:31.200 lot of the well known digital media companies were, and 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:33.399 so Shane Smith made it clear to me that he 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:35.719 wasn't a four to five year old company. Year old. 0:18:35.720 --> 0:18:38.400 We were just talking. We were literally just talking about 0:18:38.760 --> 0:18:43.199 right craziness early nineties and Vox there was various incarnations, 0:18:43.280 --> 0:18:46.639 is almost fourteen fifteen years old, buzz Feed twelve thirteen 0:18:46.680 --> 0:18:49.119 years old, Refinery twenty nine has been around twelve thirteen 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:51.840 years old. Thrillist. Ben was just telling me, I mean, 0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:55.520 they've passed a decade, and so we still relatively young Bucks. 0:18:55.600 --> 0:18:58.600 And what I really have come to appreciate is how 0:18:58.640 --> 0:19:01.760 long it often takes to get any kind of meaningful momentument. 0:19:01.800 --> 0:19:04.320 So I'm even more appreciative that in our first three years, 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:07.119 I feel like we've offered something really good to our audience, 0:19:07.119 --> 0:19:09.480 whether it's our presidential daily brief for our daily features. 0:19:09.520 --> 0:19:11.720 And I feel really good about the kind of audience 0:19:11.760 --> 0:19:13.760 that we built. There's a lot of what we call 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:18.080 a and ees, addicts and evangelists, you know, and then 0:19:18.119 --> 0:19:20.159 there are a lot of new opportunities, like events and 0:19:20.200 --> 0:19:23.200 like television. One of the things that Alexa and I 0:19:23.280 --> 0:19:26.479 really have enjoyed watching, and maybe you've just studied the 0:19:26.520 --> 0:19:29.280 industry really well, is that when it seemed like everybody 0:19:29.359 --> 0:19:32.800 started to go right in chasing the lowest common denominator, 0:19:32.920 --> 0:19:36.840 looking for scale, in some instances almost replicating the model 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:40.040 in terms of coverage. In terms of format, Ozzie seemed 0:19:40.080 --> 0:19:43.480 to veer left. Ozzie was always actually built for people 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:46.639 who think of the word different as a positive right, 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:48.600 Because there are people whom you can say, hey, this 0:19:48.640 --> 0:19:50.199 food is gonna be a little bit different, and they 0:19:50.200 --> 0:19:52.960 actually get more excited. Or you have people say hey, 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:54.960 it's kind of a different kind of dude and they go, okay, 0:19:55.000 --> 0:19:57.560 I actually will meet him that right. What about the 0:19:57.560 --> 0:20:01.080 people who are scared of different food but love different people. Oh, 0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:04.719 you know what, we liked this type of left and right, 0:20:06.160 --> 0:20:07.719 but I'll hang out with you. Is that like an 0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:12.000 ambidexterous We like those because I think Alexa and I 0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:16.080 are that well, you know what, then come on down 0:20:16.040 --> 0:20:19.520 and spend some more time with uh. We from the 0:20:19.600 --> 0:20:22.240 very beginning wanted to be different. There's a thing on 0:20:22.320 --> 0:20:24.800 a sesame street. Some of these things are not like 0:20:26.560 --> 0:20:28.439 and we wanted to be different because there are no 0:20:28.520 --> 0:20:31.200 winners in the long lines. You know, the short lines 0:20:31.440 --> 0:20:34.280 are where the winning is right. And so we were 0:20:34.320 --> 0:20:37.080 comfortable being in a different place. We were comfortable not going, 0:20:37.160 --> 0:20:39.480 as you said, for the lowest common denominator. We really 0:20:39.520 --> 0:20:42.679 admired what HBO didn't said. You know what, I'm not 0:20:42.720 --> 0:20:44.560 going to do a million different shows. I'm gonna do 0:20:44.640 --> 0:20:48.320 a handful, but really really well, they're gonna be monsters 0:20:48.320 --> 0:20:50.480 and you're gonna be excited about and so and our 0:20:50.520 --> 0:20:53.919 mind was always Apple, HBO Tesla do a few things 0:20:54.040 --> 0:20:56.719 really well and and don't just have people like you 0:20:56.760 --> 0:20:59.080 have see if you could have people fall in love 0:20:59.160 --> 0:21:02.119 with you was at The impetus to be in the 0:21:02.240 --> 0:21:07.080 Valley was because you admire and want to exemplify certain 0:21:07.119 --> 0:21:12.119 things that Apple Tesla have done. The biggest part of 0:21:12.119 --> 0:21:14.439 the reason was unfortunately my mom was really sick, and 0:21:14.480 --> 0:21:17.359 so I moved out there. But I love the valley 0:21:17.440 --> 0:21:21.040 and I stayed because I think it's a place where 0:21:21.040 --> 0:21:24.120 people have seeing crazy things happen, and where they can 0:21:24.200 --> 0:21:29.360 indulge your idea and not immediately skeptically push it aside 0:21:29.359 --> 0:21:31.480 that no, they can see it actually come to light 0:21:31.560 --> 0:21:34.239 because enough of their neighbors went to go join some 0:21:34.320 --> 0:21:39.560 crazy sounding thing called Uber or Google or Snapchat and one, 0:21:39.760 --> 0:21:41.560 and so in New York they're always like, get the 0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:44.000 am I allowed to say something like the funk out 0:21:44.000 --> 0:21:48.240 of here, and uh, I'll let lower do the Jersey access. 0:21:48.320 --> 0:21:53.240 But but but it was pretty good. But out in 0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:56.359 the Bay they'll say, like, tell me more. Now, they 0:21:56.400 --> 0:21:59.200 still may walk away from it, but they'll say tell 0:21:59.240 --> 0:22:01.560 me more. And so I thought there was power. And 0:22:01.760 --> 0:22:03.919 then the other piece of it is I wanted my 0:22:04.000 --> 0:22:05.840 team even when we had the chance. We had investors 0:22:05.840 --> 0:22:08.120 who were pushing us, even after we started to move 0:22:08.160 --> 0:22:10.280 to New York, And I said, you know what, if 0:22:10.320 --> 0:22:13.240 my guys moved to New York, they will fundamentally compare 0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:16.800 themselves to the New York Times, to BuzzFeed interesting and 0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:19.800 no disrespect. I want my guys comparing themselves to Apple, 0:22:20.040 --> 0:22:25.240 to Uber, to Tesla. Why are media companies like Ozzie right, 0:22:25.359 --> 0:22:27.639 like some of the smaller players, but some of the 0:22:27.680 --> 0:22:30.439 newer players on the scene. Why can't they be the 0:22:30.480 --> 0:22:35.639 ones who are creating technologies and architectures for new products 0:22:35.680 --> 0:22:38.280 in ways that we're not thinking about. So everyone looks 0:22:38.320 --> 0:22:40.520 at like the A, T and T s right, or 0:22:40.560 --> 0:22:43.280 the Googles or the Apples and says, oh, they're going 0:22:43.359 --> 0:22:46.720 to be the ones, right, Why why can't media companies 0:22:46.840 --> 0:22:49.520 be the disrupter? And even like media companies that are 0:22:49.680 --> 0:22:52.440 what I would say are more niche like in some 0:22:52.480 --> 0:22:55.400 ways because you're creating the a in the ease right 0:22:55.520 --> 0:22:58.199 in audio things, dropping on our meetings last week? Do 0:22:58.240 --> 0:23:00.720