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Speaker 1: Welcome into the official Jests podcast. Eric Allen here at

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Speaker 1: one Tetch Drive, joined by a busy man these days

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Speaker 1: especially that's Phil Savage. Thanks for coming to the studio

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Speaker 1: here just a couple of days prior to the draft.

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Speaker 2: You're welcome, Erica. Good to be here, and you know

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Speaker 2: this marks the end of our draft journey, so to speak,

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Speaker 2: So looking forward to the weekend.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So when you're in the city and people are

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Speaker 1: asking you about your job, what do you tell them

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Speaker 1: about that journey?

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Speaker 2: When people ask about the draft and like, okay, how

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Speaker 2: do you where do you fit into all of this?

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Speaker 2: I usually describe it as eleven month research project. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and of course the draft weekend is the culmination of

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Speaker 2: that project. But you know, I started obviously last summer.

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Speaker 2: I want to say that I grated about one hundred

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Speaker 2: players going into the fall, and then August first hit

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Speaker 2: the road and went to probably forty schools. During the fall.

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Speaker 2: I know I went to specifically twenty two live games.

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Speaker 2: I did keep track of that. And then of course

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Speaker 2: the season ends, and then that's when I call what

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Speaker 2: I call the fog of confusion sets in. From early

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Speaker 2: January until this week, there's just so much noise and

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Speaker 2: so much information out there, and you know, you really

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Speaker 2: try to stay true to what you did during the fall,

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Speaker 2: your background, research what you saw in a practice or

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Speaker 2: a game, and then marry that up with actually meeting

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Speaker 2: the players at the All Star Games. The combine. Then

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Speaker 2: of course there are visits here to Florham Park and ultimately,

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Speaker 2: you know, put it together, and you know, I talk

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Speaker 2: a little bit sometimes about how the evaluation of the

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Speaker 2: players is one piece of this, but the actual selection

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Speaker 2: of the players is the other part, and that really

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Speaker 2: is what last week and this week is all about

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Speaker 2: the actual strategy of how we're going to get in

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Speaker 2: position to get some of the player that we really want.

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Speaker 1: What is actually happening over these final couple days until

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Speaker 1: this thing commences in Detroit Thursday night, Well, we'll.

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Speaker 2: Have our final medical meetings in terms of, you know,

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Speaker 2: whether the players are healthy, what the expectations would be

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Speaker 2: when they come to us, you know, in the next

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Speaker 2: couple of weeks. You know, what's their forecast for training

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Speaker 2: camp if they were coming off of an injury as

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Speaker 2: an example, then our security background, those are all finalized

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Speaker 2: in terms of you know, if anything has cropped up

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Speaker 2: this spring or anything was discovered on a player that

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Speaker 2: maybe we missed during the fall. So those are sort

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Speaker 2: of the administrative pieces of it. And then of course

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Speaker 2: with the actual player rankings and you know, our what

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Speaker 2: I call the strategy, the game plan. You know, we

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Speaker 2: go through that quite a bit in terms of, okay,

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Speaker 2: which players would we move up for, and if there

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Speaker 2: are a handful of players, you know, at ten, would

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Speaker 2: we consider moving back? How far back would we go?

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Speaker 2: What's the range of movement that we're willing to operate within,

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Speaker 2: say at the tenth pick. And then of course after

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Speaker 2: that we really try to put it on paper and

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Speaker 2: stay true to it because you know, as Jody calls it,

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Speaker 2: it is our it's our playshet, and the coaches would

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Speaker 2: never go into a game and just try to wing it.

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Speaker 2: You know, they're going to have a play sheet, and

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Speaker 2: so this is our playshet, and we've tried to simplify it.

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Speaker 2: I mean, going back, you know, twenty five years to

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Speaker 2: my days at the Ravens, you know, we just tried

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Speaker 2: to narrow it down so that on draft weekend it

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Speaker 2: would be a calm draft room and one that we've

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Speaker 2: done all of our homework and We've already made a

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Speaker 2: lot of decisions before we actually get to the draft weekend,

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Speaker 2: so that when the clock starts, you know, we're ready.

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Speaker 2: We're ready to turn a name in or at least

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Speaker 2: move down and say, okay, well turn in another name

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Speaker 2: here in fifteen or twenty more minutes.

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Speaker 1: You're such a wily vet as season pro. How much

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Speaker 1: do you enjoy going over the potential scenarios as far

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Speaker 1: as hey, if there's a run of quarterbacks here, Hey,

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Speaker 1: if these top receivers go off the board, whatever, whatever

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Speaker 1: the case may be. But just going through all those things.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I love the meetings. I love the

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Speaker 2: evaluation meetings when we're reading our reports and going through

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Speaker 2: like where they should be ranked, you know, on our

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Speaker 2: vertical list, and you know, it's a bit like I'm

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Speaker 2: obviously not an attorney, didn't go to law school. But

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Speaker 2: at times you're trying to fight for a player, and

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Speaker 2: then other times you're trying to defend that player, and

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Speaker 2: other times you're trying to prosecute a player and try

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Speaker 2: to get them down. And so I love the give

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Speaker 2: and take, you know, amongst the scouts and between the

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Speaker 2: coaches and the scouts, and sometimes we all see it

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Speaker 2: the same way, and other times, you know, there's a

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Speaker 2: lot of diversity of opinion, so to speak. But I

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Speaker 2: really enjoy that week of meetings, both in February and

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Speaker 2: in early April, and then of course these strategy meetings

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Speaker 2: they're fun too, because you're really trying to take that

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Speaker 2: full three hundred and sixty three degree vision of Okay,

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Speaker 2: how is this going to play out? And you know,

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Speaker 2: we all talk to people, and so there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of different opinions, a lot of mock drafts out there,

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Speaker 2: and so that's when that's when that information can at

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Speaker 2: least contribute to the conversation of like, hey, I think

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Speaker 2: so and so is going to make it right to

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Speaker 2: pick ten, or you know, this player has no shot

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Speaker 2: of being there at ten. Every person I've talked to

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Speaker 2: out there says that when they've talked to this nine

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Speaker 2: teams or the eight teams in front of us, because

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Speaker 2: the Bears are going twice, Hey there's this guy, he's

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Speaker 2: going to get picked by somebody.

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Speaker 1: How much information sharing is it is going on throughout

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Speaker 1: the National Football League because you got to protect your

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Speaker 1: own endure. But at the same time, like you just mentioned,

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Speaker 1: you have peers in the business who have different interest

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Speaker 1: as far as what they want to do for their

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Speaker 1: team to improve it. But there has to be some

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Speaker 1: of that going on prior to the draft.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think everybody is trying to, you know, glean

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Speaker 2: some level of information, but it also sort of expands

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Speaker 2: your thoughts. Like you know, for a certain name, you

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Speaker 2: start hearing a certain name in the top ten that

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Speaker 2: you know two weeks ago wasn't up there, then okay,

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Speaker 2: so let's let's talk about this player for a moment

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Speaker 2: in terms of, you know, if he's interesting to us, well, wow,

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Speaker 2: we thought he would be there, Now he's not going

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Speaker 2: to be there, and so that can definitely impact the

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Speaker 2: conversation as you're trying to map it all out. But

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Speaker 2: you know, I think that probably, you know, certain members

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Speaker 2: of the media are reliable in terms of what they're

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Speaker 2: getting from other teams, and so I think they kind

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Speaker 2: of end up being the conduit between you know, it's

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Speaker 2: not like we're picking up the phone calling the Titans

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Speaker 2: or you know, calling the Commanders, Hey, what are you

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Speaker 2: guys doing in the draft, But between these different intermediaries,

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Speaker 2: I think that there's probably some of that information sharing

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Speaker 2: that goes on.

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Speaker 1: Phil, you just mentioned it before. You're talking about verticals,

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Speaker 1: so help us with the big board, the draft board,

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Speaker 1: as far as verticals are concerned and horizontals.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you know, there's really two different rankings

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Speaker 2: going on simultaneously. You have the within the position, you know,

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Speaker 2: all the quarterbacks, all the running backs in a column,

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Speaker 2: so to speak. And then as you start building out

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Speaker 2: your board, now you have to start doing that horizontal assessment. Okay,

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Speaker 2: is this running back better than this linebacker who's got

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Speaker 2: the same grade? And you know, what are the what

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Speaker 2: are the tie breakers to separate those players, And that's

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Speaker 2: where that that master list so to speak, comes comes

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Speaker 2: to pass. And you know it's once you get into

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Speaker 2: the draft and you pick a certain position, sometimes you're

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Speaker 2: not going to double up on the same position. So,

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Speaker 2: you know, the beautiful part about the draft now with

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Speaker 2: it being spread over three days, is that you can

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Speaker 2: reassess at the end of the first round, you can

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Speaker 2: reassess after the end of the second, third rounds and

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Speaker 2: so in the old days, you had to have everything

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Speaker 2: planned out for the first three rounds and everything planned out,

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Speaker 2: you know, for the fourth through the twelfth round. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 2: showing my age here. But you know, nowadays you get

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Speaker 2: that chance to it's almost like having a quarter break,

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Speaker 2: so to speak. Between each of the three days.

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Speaker 1: Can you speak to the thirty visits as far as

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Speaker 1: who you actually bring in the building, because I think

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of misnomers out there that that ultimately

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Speaker 1: means that Jet's are going to pick from a group

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Speaker 1: of these thirty for each guy. I got to imagine

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Speaker 1: it's a different case. But when you guys are going

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Speaker 1: about selecting that list, how do you determine it?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely a case by case. You know, sometimes

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Speaker 2: there are non combine prospects that are brought in because

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Speaker 2: they have not had a medical examination. So if you're

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Speaker 2: serious about really considering them, you don't want to pick

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Speaker 2: somebody that's never had a physical. So that kind of

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Speaker 2: is that bucket of players. And then you know there

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Speaker 2: are other guys that you know, maybe there's something in

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Speaker 2: their background that is somewhat concerning, could be off the field,

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Speaker 2: you know, could be on the field. You know, it

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Speaker 2: could be a matter of sitting with the coaches and

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Speaker 2: going through, you know, our offensive or defensive scheme, or

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Speaker 2: talking to the special teams coordinator and you know, figuring out, okay,

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Speaker 2: how much football does this player really know? And then

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Speaker 2: of course there's other situations where there's some sort of

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Speaker 2: character misstep that may have happened in the past. Hey,

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Speaker 2: we want to really delve into that. Explain from your

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Speaker 2: standpoint what happened, and see if it matches up with

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Speaker 2: what our own people have said. So there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of there's a variety of reasons why certain players are

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Speaker 2: brought in, and you know, we can only bring third

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Speaker 2: So I would say that that's where a lot of

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Speaker 2: the value comes in from the All Star Games, right

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Speaker 2: and the Combine. You know, we interview virtually every player

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Speaker 2: that's at the All Star Games, so that's hundreds of players.

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Speaker 2: And then that gives you the leeway to now, you know,

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Speaker 2: be a little bit more flexible with your thirty visits

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Speaker 2: because hey, we touched that we talked to him at

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Speaker 2: the Hula Bowl, or we had a good sit down

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Speaker 2: discussion with him at the Senior Bowl. And then of

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Speaker 2: course you've get the forty five at the Combine, plus

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Speaker 2: the non formal, the informal interviews rather that they call

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Speaker 2: them where the coaches and some of our scouts are

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Speaker 2: grabbing those guys. So we have hundreds of interviews and

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Speaker 2: hundreds of contacts, you know, through this process, and then

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Speaker 2: ultimately those thirty there's some usual specific reason why we're

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Speaker 2: bringing them in.

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Speaker 1: Can you speak to the work the personnel staff you

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Speaker 1: said the eleven months is going into the draft, but

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Speaker 1: like the area of scouts and everybody involved, and also

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Speaker 1: getting the coaches in late because during the season you'll

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Speaker 1: be concentrating on game thing and these guys ready to

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Speaker 1: play on Sundays. But you bring those guys in here

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Speaker 1: in the spring as well. And do they present in

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Speaker 1: terms of their thoughts on some of these draftable players.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk about the coaches first, and then I'll

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Speaker 2: go back eleven months ago. But you know, with the coaches, uh,

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Speaker 2: they'll come in and they'll rank their players, you know,

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Speaker 2: within their position, and then you know, we'll have a

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Speaker 2: discussion with them. Okay, well why do you like this player?

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Speaker 2: You know, why do you think he fits what we're doing,

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Speaker 2: or why is he not a fit for this game

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Speaker 2: that we're trying to run, what have you. So you know,

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Speaker 2: those can those conversations can be difficult at times, and

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Speaker 2: you know, sometimes it just flows, and then other times

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Speaker 2: it can get a little you know, a little touch

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Speaker 2: and go right. The thing that that I enjoy about,

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Speaker 2: you know, Joe and our staff is I think everybody

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Speaker 2: wants to get it right for the Jets, and at

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Speaker 2: some point you have to let go of your own

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Speaker 2: pride and your own ego and you don't say, you

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Speaker 2: know what, I was probably too high on that player,

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Speaker 2: or you know, I was maybe a little low on aymore.

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Speaker 2: You know what, I agree with it, And then other

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Speaker 2: times you say, look, I disagree with what you're saying,

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Speaker 2: but if this is who we pick, I'm on board

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Speaker 2: with it because this is for the Jets. And you know,

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Speaker 2: I have to admit that. You know, as a when

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Speaker 2: you're in it as a younger scout, you're wanting to

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Speaker 2: prove yourself sure, and so a lot of times that's

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Speaker 2: a lot it was more difficult to let go of

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Speaker 2: that at a younger age than it is now. You know,

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Speaker 2: I feel great about the chance of getting an opportunity

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Speaker 2: to speak about a player in the meeting amongst my

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Speaker 2: peers and say this is what I think, this is

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Speaker 2: what you're paying us for. And so I've tried to

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Speaker 2: be an example in a lot of ways. So for

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Speaker 2: our guys to realize that, hey, you know, this is

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Speaker 2: what scouting is all about. It's all about the the

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Speaker 2: you know, it's your opinion, it's what you think. And

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Speaker 2: you know, I've seen a lot of different situations where

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Speaker 2: you know, a player was being driven from the airport

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Speaker 2: to the facility and the guy driving the van brought

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Speaker 2: some piece of information to the table that impacted whether

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Speaker 2: we pushed the guy up or pushed him down, you know,

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Speaker 2: in terms of his personality, and it made a difference,

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Speaker 2: you know, in the overall picture of things. So, yeah,

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Speaker 2: the coaches come into it, you know, during the springtime

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Speaker 2: and then just going back, you know, it's one thing

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Speaker 2: to watch the tapes and evaluate the player. It's a

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Speaker 2: whole another for our people to go to the school

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Speaker 2: and you know, the way college football is now. In

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Speaker 2: the old days, you go to school and have ten

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Speaker 2: names and there would be six or seven of them

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Speaker 2: you'd actually write up and you could put it to

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Speaker 2: bed and be done with it in October. Nowadays, because

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Speaker 2: you've got COVID seniors, regular seniors, fourth year juniors, third

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Speaker 2: year junior's, red shirt sophomores, there are certain schools you

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Speaker 2: will go to, they'll give you twenty five thirty thirty

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Speaker 2: five names, and so our guys are having to monitor

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Speaker 2: those thirty five names from August all the way through

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Speaker 2: until the declaration date because the schools themselves, Hey, we

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Speaker 2: don't know if he's going or staying. He could transfer,

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Speaker 2: or he could go to the league, or he could

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Speaker 2: come back. And so the volume of the volume, the

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Speaker 2: number of prospects that are out there, has really changed

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Speaker 2: through the years. And I think that's our most difficult

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Speaker 2: task when you're actually on the road walking into USC

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Speaker 2: or Tennessee or wherever it is, and then to go

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Speaker 2: get the background information and hit three or four, sometimes

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Speaker 2: five or six contacts at the school to get that

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Speaker 2: background and the personality and the you know, the personal

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Speaker 2: character of the individual at know entered into the machine,

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Speaker 2: so to speak. Our people are extremely diligent, you know,

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Speaker 2: in that regard, and it's time consuming and it's tedious,

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Speaker 2: and it takes a lot of patience to do it.

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Speaker 2: And I think our guys do it well. You know,

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Speaker 2: in the springtime, John Carr, myself, even Joe, even the coaches,

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Speaker 2: you know, we're doing players that, like I didn't necessarily

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Speaker 2: go to the school or see them in a game,

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Speaker 2: so it's what's considered a cross check. But I'll go

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Speaker 2: back and read about the background. I won't read the

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Speaker 2: football report. I'll read the background because I don't want

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Speaker 2: to be influenced by what they said, you know, in

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Speaker 2: terms of their evaluation. I want to have my own.

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Speaker 2: But the background work that's done is unlike anything I've

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Speaker 2: been a part of. I mean, it's very detailed, and

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Speaker 2: you know, our guys do a lot of a lot

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Speaker 2: of work to get that done.

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Speaker 1: I could talk to you for hours and then you

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Speaker 1: get a hurt out. So we got on with a

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Speaker 1: couple quick ones. With what you just said about the

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Speaker 1: college landscape. Do you anticipate the underclassmen continuing to be

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Speaker 1: a fewer number because of the nil right now?

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Speaker 2: Yes, I mean that's definitely been the trend as we're

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Speaker 2: moving forward. And you know, I made the point in

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Speaker 2: one of our meetings. I'm like, Wow, this draft is

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Speaker 2: really composed of the five star, three year juniors that

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Speaker 2: we're going to play three seasons of college and I'm

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Speaker 2: going to the NFL no matter what, and then fifth

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Speaker 2: and six year seniors who are like I might be

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Speaker 2: a third day guy. I may as well stay in

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Speaker 2: school and get paid. I'm kind of a local hero

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Speaker 2: and I'm making a lot of money and then I'll

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Speaker 2: be a six or seventh rounder anyway. And so there

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Speaker 2: is emerging of these two worlds. I mean, we're having

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Speaker 2: to evaluate players who have played three years of college

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Speaker 2: versus guys that have been in college.

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Speaker 1: For six years, and that.

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Speaker 2: A lot can happen in three years, so you know,

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Speaker 2: we have to keep be mindful of that, so to speak.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I think absolutely, and I think it's probably

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Speaker 2: a good thing because I think we would rather get

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Speaker 2: a more closer to finished product in the NFL than

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Speaker 2: someone who has a wafer thin resume.

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Speaker 1: All Right, kudos to Ethan Greenberg for this topic. He

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Speaker 1: wants to know about the red Star. What does the

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Speaker 1: red star mean in the scouting community and what does

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Speaker 1: it mean here at the Jets.

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Speaker 2: Well, the background on it quickly is we had an

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Speaker 2: older scout named Ron Marsinak. He was part of the

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Speaker 2: Cowboys staff under Tom Landry and Gilbrant back in the

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Speaker 2: nineteen seventies, late seventies and nineteen eighties. He came to

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Speaker 2: the Browns turned Ravens in the nineties and he had

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Speaker 2: a player named Scott Frost who was a quarterback at Nebraska.

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Speaker 2: But you know, his parents had been like Olympian level athletes.

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Speaker 2: His brother was a football player. He was a straight

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Speaker 2: A student, he was a winner, and you know, coach

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Speaker 2: Ron just blurted out, he goes, you know, hey, Ozzie

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Speaker 2: meeting Ozzie Newsom or GM, Hey Ozzy, this guy would

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Speaker 2: be my Red Star. And so that really resonated because

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Speaker 2: Scott Frost wasn't a first round pick. You know, he

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Speaker 2: ended up being like a third round pick. And so

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Speaker 2: we came up with the idea of, Okay, every scout

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Speaker 2: should be able to nominate a red Star from their

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Speaker 2: area or their respective schools. That's not necessarily the most

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Speaker 2: talented or best player, but is maybe the best person

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Speaker 2: in terms of when he comes in. He's going to

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Speaker 2: be at every practice, he's going to make every lift,

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Speaker 2: he's going to be on the front row of the meetings.

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Speaker 2: You know, he's going to be he's going to be

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Speaker 2: a coach on the field, if you will, and he's

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Speaker 2: just going to check every box from an intangible standpoint. Internally,

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Speaker 2: he's going to bring a lot to the organization and

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Speaker 2: so that was where the Red Star started and we've

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Speaker 2: done it ever since and now it's spread to several

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Speaker 2: different organizations and you know, we're going to do it

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Speaker 2: Wednesday at two thirty.

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Speaker 1: Guys will give you their Red Stars and also do

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Speaker 1: you have a favorite red Star story?

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Speaker 2: Well, yeah, you know, all of our all of our

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Speaker 2: road scouts will have a Red Star, and now it's

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Speaker 2: sort of expanded to each coordinator it's a red Star

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Speaker 2: and uh so it ends up and Analytics gets a

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Speaker 2: Red Star. So it's a it's a good number of

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Speaker 2: red Stars that'll be in there, and uh yeah, wow,

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Speaker 2: you know there there have been there have been a

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Speaker 2: lot of them, you know, over the years that have

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Speaker 2: have actually done well. And you know, also a lot

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Speaker 2: of Red Stars will go to other teams and then

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Speaker 2: it's like I told you that he's gonna be a

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Speaker 2: he was gonna be a you know, a real value

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Speaker 2: in the in the fifth round or what have you.

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Speaker 2: But wow, there's uh, you know, we give we give

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Speaker 2: awards for the previous year, so we'll give a Red

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Speaker 2: Star award winner. My committee, our committee is going through

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Speaker 2: that now and uh yeah, they get a nice gift

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Speaker 2: certificate if they dominate a red star who goes on

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Speaker 2: do great things.

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Speaker 1: Very cool. So get you out with this one. Do

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Speaker 1: you like where this roster is at in terms of

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Speaker 1: the way you guys approach free agency? Because Joe spoke

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Speaker 1: to the media the other day, Hey, you never want

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Speaker 1: to go into the draft with a glaring need and

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Speaker 1: the flexibility maybe that you guys have. Can you speak

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Speaker 1: to that with the tenth overall selection and seven pixel

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Speaker 1: for yeah.

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Speaker 2: I think it's played out well in terms of, Hey,

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Speaker 2: at least on paper, we can go out here and

383
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:33,679
Speaker 2: line up if we didn't do anything right, and so

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Speaker 2: that's giving us You use the word flexibility. Do we

385
00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:39,080
Speaker 2: need to move up, should we slide back, should we

386
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,680
Speaker 2: try to grab an extra pick by moving back, or

387
00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:44,040
Speaker 2: we just take a player at ten and move on

388
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Speaker 2: to the third round. And so I think that, you know,

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Speaker 2: we're not married to any certain position, We're not married

390
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:52,879
Speaker 2: to any certain player. You know, we have a pool

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00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,919
Speaker 2: of players at virtually every level of the draft. So

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Speaker 2: I think it's played out well. I think the hard

393
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Speaker 2: part it's just, you know, how do you forecast? Okay,

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00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:06,640
Speaker 2: where will our need be six months from now? And

395
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Speaker 2: so you know, I've always advocated let's take players that

396
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Speaker 2: are you know, are a universal fit. You know, let's

397
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Speaker 2: take players that have some versatility amongst you know, in

398
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:21,600
Speaker 2: terms of their you know, position, Wherewithal can move around

399
00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:24,320
Speaker 2: some and you know, I think that, uh, I think

400
00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:27,720
Speaker 2: we're we're in a good spot going into the draft.

401
00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:30,240
Speaker 2: You know, people are always saying, well, you know, you

402
00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,680
Speaker 2: could have been you know, top six, No, we ended

403
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Speaker 2: up tenth, and you know what we're going to make

404
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:38,439
Speaker 2: that we're gonna make. We're going to maximize that to

405
00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:41,600
Speaker 2: its potential, whether we move up, move back, or stay

406
00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:41,960
Speaker 2: the same.

407
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Speaker 1: Thanks Phil, We're all looking forward to it, and I'm

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Speaker 1: sure we'll be talking this WEEKND.

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Speaker 2: Okay, good enough, Thank you,