WEBVTT - Elliott Takes $2.5 Billion Aim at Texas Instruments’ Cash Flow 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:10.719 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. This is Bloomberg Business 0:00:10.720 --> 0:00:13.960 Wait inside from the reporters and editors who bring you 0:00:14.000 --> 0:00:18.360 America's most trusted business magazine, plus global business finance and 0:00:18.400 --> 0:00:22.880 tech news. The Bloomberg Business Week Podcast with Carol Messer 0:00:23.040 --> 0:00:25.800 and Tim Stenebeck from Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:27.480 --> 0:00:31.160 When you think of what's needed in phones, a lot 0:00:31.160 --> 0:00:35.120 of stuff, including semiconductors, which gets us to our next story. 0:00:35.159 --> 0:00:37.559 Elliott Investment Management investing more than two and a half 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:40.519 billion dollars in Texas Instruments, pushing the chip maker to 0:00:40.560 --> 0:00:43.879 improve free cash flow, setting the stage for another campaign 0:00:43.880 --> 0:00:47.000 by the influential activist investor. I should point out that 0:00:47.040 --> 0:00:49.680 shares of Texas Instruments, we're up about three and a 0:00:49.720 --> 0:00:52.080 half percent earlier in the session. They're now down just 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:53.840 a little bit, just to hair down two tenths of 0:00:53.880 --> 0:00:56.040 a percent. So Linn is sticking with us. But we 0:00:56.080 --> 0:00:58.840 want to add to the conversation our own Ian King, 0:00:58.960 --> 0:01:01.400 US semi conductor networ working reporter here at Bloomberg News. 0:01:01.440 --> 0:01:07.360 He's out there in San Francisco, TI, Texas instrument activist 0:01:07.440 --> 0:01:10.240 investor pushing for some change. Talk to us about the 0:01:10.280 --> 0:01:13.240 significance of this move and what might happen to TI 0:01:13.280 --> 0:01:13.920 as a result. 0:01:16.200 --> 0:01:18.120 So this is a little bit of a head scratcher, 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:22.640 if I'm honest. They normally, you know, they normally go 0:01:22.680 --> 0:01:25.360 after management teams that are seen as being sleepy or 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:29.240 a little bit unaware. TI has been explicit about what 0:01:29.280 --> 0:01:31.920 it's going to do, it's spending plans, and how it's 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:35.600 going to deploy cash. What Elliott is doing, which is 0:01:35.640 --> 0:01:39.520 a little bit unusual, is actually challenging a semiconductor company's 0:01:39.600 --> 0:01:42.440 view of the semiconductor market. So this is a bit 0:01:42.480 --> 0:01:44.880 of an unusual move for them, And I have to say, 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:47.560 this is not a management team that really a lot 0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:51.840 of investors or analysts for that matter, dislike. They're widely 0:01:51.920 --> 0:01:53.160 viewed as being pretty competent. 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:57.240 And take a step back here and remind everybody Texas Instruments, 0:01:57.720 --> 0:02:02.640 a storied company with a huge that makes semiconductors that 0:02:02.720 --> 0:02:05.640 go into pretty much everything. I was looking at their 0:02:06.080 --> 0:02:08.880 customers on the SPLC function, the supply chain function, on 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:13.519 the Bloomberg terminal, everybody's their customer. Remind us what TI's 0:02:13.520 --> 0:02:14.440 specialty is. 0:02:15.280 --> 0:02:19.760 Yeah, it's an analog, an embedded chip. So basically we're 0:02:19.800 --> 0:02:23.880 not talking about the most advanced in terms of process technology, 0:02:24.280 --> 0:02:27.640 but we are talking about things like a chip that 0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:29.760 goes behind the button when you press it to switch 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:32.840 the power on and off, something that moderates power insider device. 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:36.959 So they are pretty much everywhere, and their pitch is that, like, look, 0:02:37.080 --> 0:02:42.760 over time, everything becomes more and more technology enabled, everything 0:02:42.800 --> 0:02:45.280 gets electronic functions, So our chips have a bigger and 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:48.400 bigger role into that. And that's been the case. But 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:50.760 we're going through one of the cycles that the chip 0:02:50.800 --> 0:02:53.160 industry goes through that we've talked about, and that's where 0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:55.440 they are right now. So it's not like they don't 0:02:55.440 --> 0:02:59.919 have cash, but they are prioritizing spending on manufacturing and 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:02.640 bringing the manufacturing back into this country. 0:03:02.680 --> 0:03:05.160 Way go figure, Ian, They're actually running their business and 0:03:05.200 --> 0:03:07.040 you know, thinking about the future and what they need 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:10.000 to do. Link come on in on this conversation in 0:03:10.080 --> 0:03:14.040 terms of TI and what they are doing, and you 0:03:14.080 --> 0:03:15.320 know kind of what happens next to you. 0:03:15.440 --> 0:03:17.760 Yeah, I'll just build on what Ian was saying. He 0:03:17.919 --> 0:03:22.840 was referencing this broader, very ambitious plan that Texas Instruments 0:03:22.960 --> 0:03:26.360 has to basically overhaul its business. It's going to bring 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:30.560 all manufacturing back in house and have virtually no like 0:03:30.720 --> 0:03:34.400 contractors to help make its ship support. That is a 0:03:34.480 --> 0:03:37.720 bet on short term pain for long term gain, and 0:03:37.760 --> 0:03:42.400 that's what they've been saying for in recent months. Ian 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:45.360 and I were exchanging messages this morning about it, thinking 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:49.440 they have been telegraphing this squeeze on free cash flow 0:03:49.720 --> 0:03:51.800 for quite some time now, so it is a little 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:55.680 puzzling that Elliott is coming into it and starting to 0:03:55.760 --> 0:03:59.760 raise concerns after the executive management team has been spending 0:03:59.840 --> 0:04:03.120 a lot of time proactively laying out these concerns themselves 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:05.240 and saying, but don't worry. At the end of the day, 0:04:05.360 --> 0:04:09.080 free free cash flow per share is still our main focus. 0:04:09.080 --> 0:04:11.200 It's just longer term and not short term. 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:14.080 The last, you know, the last point that Ian made 0:04:14.080 --> 0:04:16.920 about how we're in this AI cycle to be sure, 0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:20.320 it's not in video, right, It's not Micron, it's not 0:04:20.400 --> 0:04:24.560 one of the big AI super semiconductor stocks, and you 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:26.760 know that they don't have that going for it. 0:04:26.880 --> 0:04:29.840 So but it's chips that go in like everything that 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:33.280 go into everything. I'm thinking Monday and like everything has 0:04:33.320 --> 0:04:35.359 an on and off switch here, I don't know So 0:04:36.320 --> 0:04:39.360 that's what I find interesting. I like, it's not like surprise, 0:04:39.480 --> 0:04:41.479 we're doing this right, They've laid it out, so I 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:44.600 don't know what's next. Are there other investors that are 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:46.760 going to be like, knock it off? Like how? I 0:04:46.760 --> 0:04:48.760 don't know, how do you see this playing out? 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:51.279 I mean that there is a theme here which obviously 0:04:51.320 --> 0:04:53.920 Eliot is tapping into, which is this is a company which, 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:57.840 over the last few years, aside from its strategy for 0:04:58.360 --> 0:05:01.080 which markets is in, has been really heavily focused on 0:05:01.120 --> 0:05:04.960 investor returns. It has I think the second highest dividend 0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:08.880 yield of any chip company out there, and it's spent 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:11.240 a lot on buybacks. So what's happening here is that 0:05:11.240 --> 0:05:15.080 that pool of cash for buybacks is going away in 0:05:15.160 --> 0:05:18.440 the short term, very very clear. So that's an investor 0:05:18.680 --> 0:05:22.120 class that's perhaps going to be slightly alienated. But you know, 0:05:22.160 --> 0:05:24.919 this is literally the first that we've heard about any 0:05:25.240 --> 0:05:28.359 long term real kind of unhappiness with it. And the 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:31.159 stock of course, it's lagged a rally that Lynda just 0:05:31.200 --> 0:05:32.920 alluded to, but it's still up. 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:37.280 And you cover chips, you don't cover activism, And I'm 0:05:37.320 --> 0:05:41.000 wondering if this is something that happens in your world 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:43.200 quite a bit, or if it's pretty rare to see 0:05:43.200 --> 0:05:45.040 an activist take a stake in a company like this. 0:05:45.760 --> 0:05:48.280 No, it has happened. I mean, you remember what happened 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:51.000 with Qualcomm and when they were trying to fend off 0:05:51.000 --> 0:05:53.919 the Broadcom takeover and what they were going to do. 0:05:53.960 --> 0:05:57.240 And in general, TI has actually led one trend in 0:05:57.279 --> 0:06:00.760 the chip industry, which is to give dividend to pay 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:04.520 you know, to use that cash more and more, less 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:07.880 for R and D and more and more for investor payouts. 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:10.120 And that's become a thing over the last decade that 0:06:10.240 --> 0:06:12.839 chip companies never did, but they really do now and 0:06:12.880 --> 0:06:15.200 they have to do it. TI has been a leader 0:06:15.240 --> 0:06:17.640 in that, if anything, All right, So. 0:06:17.560 --> 0:06:19.680 What do we watch out for Lynn, you know, kind 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:20.800 of what's next year? 0:06:21.040 --> 0:06:21.440 Yeah? 0:06:21.480 --> 0:06:23.640 I think the big question is whether Elliott will go 0:06:23.680 --> 0:06:26.760 after board seats. Okay, I think you know there are 0:06:26.760 --> 0:06:29.360 two paths that this could take. One they could sit 0:06:29.360 --> 0:06:32.279 there and negotiate some kind of change in capital plan 0:06:32.839 --> 0:06:36.760 with TI specifically and hammer out agreement there. Or they 0:06:36.760 --> 0:06:39.760 can make a more aggressive play for some board representation 0:06:39.839 --> 0:06:40.719 and force change. 0:06:40.760 --> 0:06:43.080 Well, Ian, would that be a mistake? If they kind 0:06:43.080 --> 0:06:46.120 of push back and TI has to kind of rethink 0:06:46.200 --> 0:06:48.600 its plans or do something different because of this this 0:06:48.680 --> 0:06:52.360 activist investor, Is that a bad thing in your view? 0:06:53.279 --> 0:06:56.640 Well, do you believe Elliott Management's view of the semi 0:06:56.680 --> 0:07:01.320 conductor industry or Texas Instruments management view of this semiconduction industry. 0:07:01.520 --> 0:07:04.240 What's underpinning what TI is doing is what's happening in 0:07:04.360 --> 0:07:07.159 China where there's a lot of production coming online of 0:07:07.279 --> 0:07:10.240 this type of chip. What TI is saying, Hey, we 0:07:10.280 --> 0:07:12.440 can do this ourselves. We can shift to a new 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:15.560 level of technology for this, so that even when all 0:07:15.560 --> 0:07:18.560 of these Chinese factories come online, will be in a 0:07:18.640 --> 0:07:21.840 very strong position. That's the future bet that they're making. 0:07:22.240 --> 0:07:25.240 Whether Elliott understands out or whether they've decided to ignore 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:27.600 that is another matter, And I guess we'll see how 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:30.680 that plays out when they have to argue their cases 0:07:30.720 --> 0:07:32.640 in front of the shareholders to see if they can 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:33.400 gain momentum. 0:07:33.480 --> 0:07:35.600 Yeah, these aren't the chips land that are protected by 0:07:35.920 --> 0:07:38.520 the US government. We put on controls and stuff. These 0:07:38.520 --> 0:07:39.600 aren't protected, right. 0:07:39.480 --> 0:07:41.200 And that's the other shit to drop here. You know, 0:07:41.880 --> 0:07:45.120 it's been widely expected that Texas Instruments will be among 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:48.400 the companies in America that benefits from the chip sack 0:07:48.720 --> 0:07:52.680 and get some funding. Whether Elliott has baked that kind 0:07:52.680 --> 0:07:57.120 of subsidy into their strategy that they're pushing with the 0:07:57.160 --> 0:07:58.640 company is unclear. 0:07:59.040 --> 0:08:01.160 I feel like it's a scratch your head kind of Tuesday. 0:08:01.200 --> 0:08:02.880 Can I just put that out there? I think you 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:05.200 said it really well. It's like, I don't know, people 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:07.040 just like woke up, had a long weekend, and we're like, 0:08:07.040 --> 0:08:07.760 we got to do something. 0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:09.200 I've got to go after tea I today it's a 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:09.800 little lucky. 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:13.200 Buy some of your cellular a couple of billion dollars 0:08:13.200 --> 0:08:14.400 plus some into TI. 0:08:14.600 --> 0:08:15.440 What's wrong with people? 0:08:15.520 --> 0:08:16.040 Long weekend? 0:08:16.320 --> 0:08:18.200 Just go and make some more burgers and hot dogs 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:20.960 and just like extend that weekend. Listen to both of you. 0:08:21.000 --> 0:08:22.679 We really appreciate it. We covered a lot of ground 0:08:22.840 --> 0:08:26.400 and so appreciate it. Ian King, US semiconductor and networking 0:08:26.400 --> 0:08:29.920 reporter at Bloomberg News right there in our San Francisco bureau, 0:08:29.920 --> 0:08:32.199 and Linda Wan thank you as well, imagining editor of 0:08:32.280 --> 0:08:37.320 Technology and Global Cybersecurity at Bloomberg News. Here in studio, you're. 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:40.680 Listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Can't Us Live 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:43.760 weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern Listen on 0:08:43.840 --> 0:08:46.360 Apple car Play and then Brout Auto with a Bloomberg 0:08:46.400 --> 0:08:49.559 Business app, or watch us live on YouTube. 0:08:50.160 --> 0:08:53.240 Bloomberg's will Wait He follows climate change for us and more, 0:08:53.800 --> 0:08:56.400 really kind of just what's going on in the energy space, 0:08:56.520 --> 0:08:59.800 all the energy space in particular, recently wrote the battle 0:09:00.160 --> 0:09:02.679 in climate change has become more urgent, and people are 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:06.040 realizing that carbon free nuclear power will play an important part. 0:09:06.400 --> 0:09:09.240 A twenty twenty three p Research Center survey found that 0:09:09.360 --> 0:09:12.320 fifty seven percent of Americans so they support the use 0:09:12.360 --> 0:09:15.240 of more nuclear power. That's up from forty three percent 0:09:15.679 --> 0:09:19.240 in twenty twenty. Young activists, including last year's Miss America, 0:09:19.280 --> 0:09:23.160 are flooding TikTok and Instagram with quirky videos extolling the 0:09:23.240 --> 0:09:26.480 virtues of fission. It's a sharp shift, needless to say, 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:29.640 from the anti nuke protesters marching in the streets in 0:09:29.679 --> 0:09:31.640 decades past. It's definitely a different tone. 0:09:31.679 --> 0:09:33.520 It feels like, yeah, it certainly does well. Here with 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:35.640 an update on the industry and back with us is 0:09:35.720 --> 0:09:39.319 Maria Korsnik, President and CEO of the Nuclear Energy Institute. 0:09:39.480 --> 0:09:41.880 She joins us from Washington at DC. Maria, good to 0:09:41.920 --> 0:09:45.000 see you again. How do you explain the shift in 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:47.600 what we've seen in recent years that Carol just mentioned 0:09:47.880 --> 0:09:51.000 In past decades people marching to stop nuclear power plants 0:09:51.000 --> 0:09:54.560 from being built, to now people extolling the value of fission. 0:09:56.520 --> 0:09:59.400 Yes, well, hi, and it's great to be with you again. 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.640 The landscape is really changing for nuclear. It's a confluence 0:10:03.760 --> 0:10:09.640 of events. There's energy security concerns, there's climate security concerns, 0:10:09.920 --> 0:10:14.360 there's the need for clean energy jobs. We have bipartisans 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:18.240 support and sort of all these events are coming together 0:10:18.679 --> 0:10:21.719 to really put nuclear in a great new light. 0:10:22.400 --> 0:10:26.000 Well, speaking of that, Southern Company added two more reactors 0:10:26.040 --> 0:10:29.520 to its Vogel power plant, Unit three and Unit four. 0:10:29.760 --> 0:10:31.920 It's now the biggest NW plant in the United States. 0:10:32.160 --> 0:10:35.000 The project, though, finished seven years behind schedule in about 0:10:35.040 --> 0:10:38.400 fifteen billion dollars over budget. So how do you quantify 0:10:38.520 --> 0:10:41.080 that or qualify that a success story or a failure. 0:10:42.280 --> 0:10:45.120 So I'd call it a success story, but not hiding 0:10:45.200 --> 0:10:47.560 from some of the items that you brought up. But 0:10:47.640 --> 0:10:51.240 they built two units, Unit three and Unit four because 0:10:51.240 --> 0:10:54.440 they already had two units on that property. So I 0:10:54.440 --> 0:10:57.000 think the success story is that you look at unit 0:10:57.000 --> 0:10:59.360 three and unit four and how long did it take 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:01.520 some things to happen on three because that was the 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:03.920 first of a kind, And then how much better did 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:07.840 it get on unit four? For example, that testing was 0:11:07.920 --> 0:11:11.920 completed and half the time on unit four than unit three. 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:16.199 Another one was a thirty five percent faster from let's 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:20.040 call it the initial start to when it was actually 0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:24.600 generating and connected to the grid. So, just like any 0:11:24.640 --> 0:11:27.760 sort of new startup company, you know, you start to 0:11:27.880 --> 0:11:31.960 work down and get more efficient and costs less. So 0:11:32.080 --> 0:11:34.679 these are two examples. What do we think that next 0:11:34.760 --> 0:11:36.360 out of point will be? And what do we think 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:37.240 that next out of. 0:11:37.200 --> 0:11:37.800 Point would be. 0:11:38.120 --> 0:11:40.920 It was excellent learning from units three to four, and 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:43.160 it puts us in great position to build more. 0:11:43.360 --> 0:11:45.280 I think some person my listening right now say, wait 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:47.959 a second, this is not a startup because nuclear power 0:11:47.960 --> 0:11:49.960 plants have been in operation in the United States and 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:52.960 being been built in the United States for decades. Shouldn't 0:11:52.960 --> 0:11:55.520 we know by now how to bring them in within 0:11:55.559 --> 0:11:57.120 a timeline and within a budget. 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:01.560 Yeah, you're absolutely right. We have a wonderful operating fleet 0:12:01.640 --> 0:12:05.320 that we have today. Ninety four reactors now. But when 0:12:05.320 --> 0:12:09.440 I say startup, it's because this particular type of reactor 0:12:09.520 --> 0:12:10.800 had not yet been built. 0:12:11.000 --> 0:12:14.760 This is an advanced reactor. There's a lot more passive. 0:12:14.520 --> 0:12:18.680 Features than what had been in the previous designs. And so, 0:12:19.280 --> 0:12:21.559 like anything, you can say, well, we all drive cars, 0:12:21.840 --> 0:12:23.920 well we do, but that doesn't mean all the cars 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:24.480 are the same. 0:12:24.840 --> 0:12:26.680 And so it's the same way with nuclear. 0:12:26.800 --> 0:12:30.040 Absolutely we know how these operate, but this particular model 0:12:30.080 --> 0:12:31.319 hadn't been constructed. 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:34.760 And yet we'll be more built in the future. 0:12:34.800 --> 0:12:38.240 There's already more that the people are interested in building, 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:40.760 and so we look forward to see how. 0:12:40.640 --> 0:12:43.360 Much even more efficient that we can get. You know, 0:12:43.400 --> 0:12:44.600 if we had continued to. 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:48.240 Build nuclear, we would be better and more efficient at it. 0:12:48.440 --> 0:12:50.720 Like anything else you do, you don't do it for 0:12:50.760 --> 0:12:52.360 a while, you're not as efficient. 0:12:52.800 --> 0:12:57.080 You know, if nuclear was the answer to so much, Mario, 0:12:57.520 --> 0:13:02.040 wouldn't we see it much more around? If you will, 0:13:02.080 --> 0:13:04.880 wouldn't it be kind of more ubiquitous than it really is? 0:13:06.800 --> 0:13:11.120 Well, it's twenty percent of our energy grid today, and 0:13:11.200 --> 0:13:12.960 so I would say, in a lot of cases, it 0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:14.640 sort of is everywhere. 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:16.640 And I think as you. 0:13:16.559 --> 0:13:20.000 Look ahead to the future, My gosh, demand, demand, demand. 0:13:20.120 --> 0:13:22.640 I think we're all hearing it about how much clean 0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:26.360 energy is needed, whether it's for AI or machine learning 0:13:26.559 --> 0:13:29.880 or just reshoring the manufacturing sector, which we're all very 0:13:29.920 --> 0:13:30.800 interested to do. 0:13:31.240 --> 0:13:33.520 The demand on the grid is really. 0:13:33.240 --> 0:13:37.880 Increasing, and for that you're going to need reliable, resilient. 0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:40.719 Twenty four to seven power. That's what nuclear is good at. 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:44.240 It's clean, it's there when you need it, and it's 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:45.319 very reliable. 0:13:45.440 --> 0:13:47.559 And we've proven that urine. 0:13:47.360 --> 0:13:47.920 And eure out. 0:13:50.040 --> 0:13:51.800 You know where I'm going to go here. I mean 0:13:52.200 --> 0:13:55.760 to worry about concerns. I think while more Americans seem 0:13:55.760 --> 0:13:57.720 to be behind it. If you said, Okay, we're going 0:13:57.800 --> 0:14:00.600 to put the nuclear facility or a nuclear plant plant 0:14:00.880 --> 0:14:04.320 in your backyard, they'd say, maybe not so much. So 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:08.280 why should we believe it will be safe? And the 0:14:08.320 --> 0:14:10.679 waste is still an issue in terms of you know, 0:14:10.720 --> 0:14:12.679 what you do with at the disposal of it. 0:14:13.840 --> 0:14:15.040 So let's talk about that. 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:18.160 Because out in Wyoming they're talking about building a new 0:14:18.240 --> 0:14:23.240 plant and there were four different communities that fought to 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:25.840 have the nuclear plant in their backyard. 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:29.000 And so I think the narrative is very much changing. 0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:31.120 I think people are taking a hard look at what 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:34.280 it's really going to take to power our grid with 0:14:34.400 --> 0:14:38.200 clean energy, and they realize that nuclear is in fact 0:14:38.320 --> 0:14:39.360 a very good option. 0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:42.480 And so I think the conversation. 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:45.760 Is really, you know, very much changing around nuclear in 0:14:45.800 --> 0:14:48.640 a very positive way. If you look at the States, 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:52.600 for example, there's been over two hundred bills in support 0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:57.040 of bringing nuclear to the States. That was nothing that 0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.000 we saw a decade ago, even five or six years. 0:15:00.640 --> 0:15:03.840 We're getting bipartisan support here at the federal level. 0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:07.480 And it's not just in the United States. Canada one's nuclear. 0:15:07.760 --> 0:15:11.040 Countries across Europe are interested in nuclear. I was just 0:15:11.080 --> 0:15:13.920 in Ghana a few months ago, Ghana on's nuclear. So 0:15:14.360 --> 0:15:17.480 it's really not just a US thing, it's really a 0:15:17.520 --> 0:15:18.400 worldwide thing. 0:15:18.800 --> 0:15:20.720 I was at the yeah top twenty eight. 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:22.360 Yeah, we spoke to you. We spoke to you just 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:24.080 after that. I remember that just a few months ago. 0:15:24.160 --> 0:15:24.440 Maria. 0:15:24.520 --> 0:15:29.000 Actually right, everybody wants nuclear, nobody wants nuclear waste. You 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:32.480 literally cannot sell this stuff to anyone where do we 0:15:32.520 --> 0:15:33.840 put it? What's the answer. 0:15:35.000 --> 0:15:36.760 So the answer to that is, what don't we call 0:15:36.800 --> 0:15:38.160 it future nuclear fuel? 0:15:39.080 --> 0:15:42.480 In fact, you know, it's not just something that can't 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:44.920 be used again, and so you have a lot of 0:15:44.960 --> 0:15:49.400 those conversations happening today about potentially recycling. 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:52.440 And at the end of the day, the fuel is. 0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:55.960 Very safely stored where it's at Finland, in fact, which 0:15:55.960 --> 0:15:59.160 I head to next week. Just open there deep geologic 0:15:59.200 --> 0:16:03.280 repository and like that. We will find one of those 0:16:03.440 --> 0:16:06.960 here in the United States. In the meantime, we'll collect 0:16:07.000 --> 0:16:09.680 it in fewer places. Right now, it's stored at whatever 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:12.640 plant that it was used at, and we can consolidate 0:16:12.720 --> 0:16:16.200 that fuel as we're looking for the long term fuel 0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:18.760 storage answer save one. At the end of the day, 0:16:20.040 --> 0:16:22.600 it's not nearly the high volume that many people. 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:24.840 Safe to say, though there are concerns. I mean Germany, 0:16:24.920 --> 0:16:28.000 what they just switched off the last three nuclear power 0:16:28.000 --> 0:16:31.280 stations last year. It's never there are concerns that you 0:16:31.400 --> 0:16:35.360 see movement forward, movement backward, because there are legitimate concerns. 0:16:35.360 --> 0:16:37.040 It just got about thirty seconds left here. 0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:40.760 Yeah, and Germany is one of the few places and honestly, 0:16:41.400 --> 0:16:44.520 I think that we'll see Germany lift to regret that 0:16:44.640 --> 0:16:47.920 Japan is restarting their plans. Most of every country in 0:16:47.960 --> 0:16:51.480 Europe that has nuclear today is extending those plants and 0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:55.680 looking to build new You know again, it's really a 0:16:55.800 --> 0:17:00.280 worldwide consensus that more nuclear is needed in our future. 0:17:00.760 --> 0:17:02.400 All right, going to leave it there, Hey, listen, Thanks, 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:04.720 We always appreciate some time with you. Over your course, 0:17:04.800 --> 0:17:09.040 Net President, CEO of the Nuclear Energy Institute, joining us. 0:17:09.920 --> 0:17:13.800 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Podcast. Listen live 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:17.040 each weekday starting at two pm Easter on applecar Play 0:17:17.119 --> 0:17:19.919 and Androyd Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can 0:17:20.000 --> 0:17:23.240 also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New 0:17:23.320 --> 0:17:28.200 York station, Just say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 0:17:28.400 --> 0:17:31.000 Well, it plays a critical role in New York's food system, 0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:33.640 and yet it's got some pretty serious problems. We're talking 0:17:33.680 --> 0:17:37.200 about the Hunts Point Produce Market, which is a combination 0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:41.320 rail yard, truck depot trading floor that quietly supplies about 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:44.560 sixty percent of the city's fresh groceries two billion dollars 0:17:44.600 --> 0:17:48.120 worth of fruit and vegetables each year. Organized as a cooperative, 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:51.640 the market offers an entry point for both suppliers and buyers, 0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:54.800 who would otherwise struggle to compete with national chains and 0:17:54.800 --> 0:17:58.640 distributors such as Cisco Walmart and Whole Foods. It also 0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:02.120 keeps the many neighborhood the big chains ignore from becoming 0:18:02.200 --> 0:18:05.879 food deserts. So it sounds pretty terrific, right There is 0:18:05.920 --> 0:18:09.199 a hitch. Turns out, it's also a major polluter. This 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:11.920 Bloomberg BusinessWeek story will be featured in the forthcoming issue 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:14.439 of Bloomberg BusinessWeek magazine. You can read it now on 0:18:14.440 --> 0:18:16.919 the Bloomberg and at Bloomberg dot com. Slash BusinessWeek with 0:18:16.960 --> 0:18:21.800 more Bloomberg News City Lab reporter Fulla a Kinemby excuse me, 0:18:22.280 --> 0:18:26.080 just joining us here in studio Fulla a chinnyby Fula. 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:29.040 First of all, for those not from New York City, 0:18:29.359 --> 0:18:32.400 lay out what HUDs Point Produce Market is all about. 0:18:32.680 --> 0:18:36.200 Thanks Hails. It's a huge part of the city's food system. 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:39.960 What's unique about the city, the city's food system, I 0:18:40.000 --> 0:18:41.720 guess when you compare it to other American cities, is 0:18:41.760 --> 0:18:45.119 that we have this huge ecosystem of small grocers and 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:49.000 you know, ethnic grocery stores and just fruit stands and 0:18:49.000 --> 0:18:51.040 and so all these all these stories that you could 0:18:51.040 --> 0:18:53.560 just pop into when you're sort of walking around the city. 0:18:53.440 --> 0:18:56.240 They're also applied by the hunts Point Market and so it, 0:18:56.600 --> 0:18:59.679 like you said, supplies sixty percent of the city's fresh produce. 0:18:59.800 --> 0:19:01.880 I went to school uptown in New York City and 0:19:01.960 --> 0:19:04.760 everywhere like one hundred and sixteen Street, one tenth Street, 0:19:04.800 --> 0:19:06.960 like that was such a part of it, and that's 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:09.159 such a big part of the city's fabric. I feel like, 0:19:10.320 --> 0:19:13.359 take us to you went and you visit it and 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:15.520 talk about some of the like main hours where you're 0:19:15.520 --> 0:19:17.320 seeing so much activity at the market. 0:19:17.520 --> 0:19:20.800 So the interesting part about the market is the way 0:19:20.800 --> 0:19:22.960 we shop grocery stores, you know, during the day or 0:19:22.960 --> 0:19:26.600 after work. Yeah, normal hos right, grocery stores and these 0:19:26.680 --> 0:19:30.280 chains they shop the market after hours, so they between 0:19:30.320 --> 0:19:33.680 ten ten pm and you know, around three, four or 0:19:33.720 --> 0:19:36.840 five am, they're there shopping for their product for the 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:39.520 next day. Because in a lot of ways, the Hunts 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:41.600 Point Market serves as sort of the warehouse space for 0:19:41.680 --> 0:19:44.240 these tiny groceries. You know, like in New York we 0:19:44.280 --> 0:19:47.520 all have we're all looking for more space, more real estate, 0:19:47.560 --> 0:19:49.919 and these grocery searches don't have it, and so the 0:19:49.960 --> 0:19:53.679 market sort of serves as their warehouses. So anyway, when 0:19:53.720 --> 0:19:57.080 you go at night, it's it's sort of this bustling 0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:00.880 kind of trading floor. Right, you see people with cash 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.880 in hand, sort of buying, buying palaces and fruit, buying 0:20:03.880 --> 0:20:06.639 palaces and vegetables. You see like the create the hand cards. 0:20:07.080 --> 0:20:08.639 Old fashion, yeah, pretty old fashion. 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:08.920 Yeah. 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:09.200 Yeah. 0:20:09.200 --> 0:20:10.400 So they're negotiating back and. 0:20:10.280 --> 0:20:14.440 Forth, negotiating back and forth, filling up trucks with boxes, 0:20:14.520 --> 0:20:18.359