Speaker 1: It's Wednesday, March six. I'm Oscar Ramires from the Daily
Speaker 1: Dive podcast in Los Angeles, and this is reopening America.
Speaker 1: The workplace has gone through drastic changes as a result
Speaker 1: of the pandemic, and even attitudes about work have changed.
Speaker 1: With more job openings than people looking for work, Employees
Speaker 1: feel like they have all the power. But how long
Speaker 1: can that last? Test Viglin, host of the new Wall
Speaker 1: Street Journal podcast As We Work, joins us to talk
Speaker 1: about the changing dynamics of the workplace. Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 1: Tests delighted to be here, Oscar. Well the new podcast.
Speaker 1: I'm really enjoying it right now. I've had the pleasure
Speaker 1: of having a lot of your guests and fellow Wall
Speaker 1: Street Journal journalists there on my podcast to talk about
Speaker 1: all this stuff. The pandemic came and disrupted all our
Speaker 1: lives in a number of different ways, especially with the
Speaker 1: way we work, our attitudes towards work, and it's been
Speaker 1: one of the most interesting things that I have just
Speaker 1: been covering as part of my podcast. So the new
Speaker 1: podcast As We Work tell us a little bit about
Speaker 1: it overall, and then we'll get into uh some of
Speaker 1: the episodes, because there's two episodes out so far, so
Speaker 1: just give us an overview of what we can expect
Speaker 1: on the podcast. So it's really kind of what you've
Speaker 1: just been talking about, which is that there has been
Speaker 1: this sea change in not just how we work, but
Speaker 1: even how we feel about work itself. Right, I mean,
Speaker 1: you have millions of people who basically up and left
Speaker 1: their jobs over the last year year and a half,
Speaker 1: the quits rate reached a record and that has to
Speaker 1: tell you something about what the pandemic did too, really
Speaker 1: prompt people to take another look at their lives and
Speaker 1: the role that work was playing in it. And so
Speaker 1: that's really our main focus question for the podcast is
Speaker 1: how has the role of work changed in our lives
Speaker 1: and how has that changed in the workplace, How has
Speaker 1: it changed between us and our colleagues, between us and
Speaker 1: our bosses. That there's almost nothing about our workplaces and
Speaker 1: our work lives that did not change over the last
Speaker 1: two years. So that's we're delving deep into all kinds
Speaker 1: of issues surrounding that, and it's you know, it's so important.
Speaker 1: Right when the pandemic first hit and we were going
Speaker 1: into lockdowns and everybody was very scared, nobody really knew
Speaker 1: what was happening. And on the work side of things,
Speaker 1: it did two things. It really made us reevaluate that
Speaker 1: work life balance. Life became so much more important than
Speaker 1: work because we were scared of getting sick and dying
Speaker 1: and things. And then the other part of it, for
Speaker 1: a lot of people, not everyone, right, we always have
Speaker 1: to put that caveat on there. We were able to
Speaker 1: prove that we could do remote work, we could make
Speaker 1: that sharp right turn and do it all of it
Speaker 1: from work, and that's where a lot of people really said, well,
Speaker 1: this is what I want to do going forward. So
Speaker 1: getting into the first two episodes that have been out
Speaker 1: so far, the first episode really deals with kind of
Speaker 1: this overall changes at work, and one of the things
Speaker 1: you talked about was this power dynam You know, there's
Speaker 1: countless articles that say the workers have all the power
Speaker 1: right now, that's why they're quitting, that's why they're demanding
Speaker 1: remote work, all that stuff. The question is how long
Speaker 1: will that last though, because maybe this is a sea
Speaker 1: change in attitudes, but will that last forever? I think
Speaker 1: that is the key question that everyone is looking at
Speaker 1: right now, both employees and employers and you know, governments.
Speaker 1: That's policies where we are in completely uncharted territory here
Speaker 1: and so right now, yes, workers are completely feeling their oats.
Speaker 1: They saved some money perhaps over the span of the
Speaker 1: pandemic by not commuting, not having lunches, you know that
Speaker 1: to go out. They perhaps were able to save some
Speaker 1: of the stimulus money. And so you have that aspect
Speaker 1: of it. And then you know, as you said, people
Speaker 1: really taking a look at their life and their work
Speaker 1: and where those two intersect. And so with the workers
Speaker 1: feeling their oats, they're feeling like they have more options
Speaker 1: now the type job market, there are more jobs than
Speaker 1: people to fill them. But if the economy turns around
Speaker 1: and starts doing not quite as well and employers start
Speaker 1: having you know, the market to themselves, then we possibly
Speaker 1: could see a change. So that really, as you said,
Speaker 1: the really big question is how long this is going
Speaker 1: to last. How long will workers be feeling more powerful,
Speaker 1: how long will the economy allow them to do so?
Speaker 1: And at some point, how long will we have the
Speaker 1: memories of the pandemic with us. Ultimately, after trauma, things
Speaker 1: do start to subside. So will we start thinking back
Speaker 1: to the olden days of two years ago when we
Speaker 1: just did everything that our employers told us to. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a it's an open question. I think it's going
Speaker 1: to be a fascinating thing to follow. I agree definitely.
Speaker 1: The second episode focused on salary transparency and how the
Speaker 1: paper performance model is a little more of a myth
Speaker 1: going on right now. Everything has changed. And the question
Speaker 1: I had based off of that was paid transparency does
Speaker 1: seem like a really good notion. Let's know what our
Speaker 1: colleagues are being paid, so we all are feel appreciated.
Speaker 1: I guess that's part of the episode two. You know
Speaker 1: how closely we associated with ourselves with our salary and
Speaker 1: feel good about that, But it could also have the
Speaker 1: potential to, you know, make others feel bad that they
Speaker 1: don't because much. And and my question is is that
Speaker 1: something that's going to cause an employer to all of
Speaker 1: a sudden bump everybody's pay up. I don't think that
Speaker 1: would happen, you know. So it's it's a difficult another
Speaker 1: another difficult thing to tackle there in the workplace. It
Speaker 1: is absolutely and this is something that I think a
Speaker 1: lot of employers are struggling with right now, in part
Speaker 1: because there are several cities and states that are mandating
Speaker 1: some form of paid transparency in New York and may
Speaker 1: employers there are going to have to give a full
Speaker 1: range of salaries and job listenings. And so, yes, for
Speaker 1: one thing, this is not a subject that in general
Speaker 1: Americans talk about, right, we don't talk about money at all,
Speaker 1: and we certainly don't share what we're paid. The only
Speaker 1: time I remember talking about money was back, you know,
Speaker 1: in the late two thousand's before the housing crash, and
Speaker 1: everybody talked about what their house is worth. But beyond that,
Speaker 1: with just this is like a remoting topic. But there
Speaker 1: is a generation coming up, gen Z millennials who have
Speaker 1: a bit of a different notion about this. Some of
Speaker 1: them are literally going on social media and saying this
Speaker 1: is what I make. I want you to know this
Speaker 1: for either if you want my job after I leave it,
Speaker 1: or be like if you work with me, I want
Speaker 1: you to know what this is so that there is
Speaker 1: some equity involved, so that people of color can have
Speaker 1: some measure of equality, so that women can have some
Speaker 1: measure of equality. So yes, it's something that a lot
Speaker 1: of people don't want to happen because I don't know,
Speaker 1: do you want to tell me what you make Oscar,
Speaker 1: I do not hear that question around throughout the podcast,
Speaker 1: and either yeah, I mean so you know, we'll see
Speaker 1: if that becomes a permanent change or not. Um, it's
Speaker 1: it's hard to imagine. There's so much going on right now.
Speaker 1: As We Work is the new podcast from the Wall
Speaker 1: Street Journal about the changing dynamics of the workplace. Test Viglin,
Speaker 1: host and senior producer for the podcast As We Work.
Speaker 1: Thank you very much for joining us, and it drops
Speaker 1: every Tuesday so everybody can check it out. Terrific. Thanks
Speaker 1: so much, Oscar. I'm Oscar roomers, and this has been
Speaker 1: reopening America. Don't forget that. For today's big news stories,
Speaker 1: you can check me out in the Daily Dive podcast
Speaker 1: Everybody Good Friday. They'll follow us and I Heart Radio
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcast.