1 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:11,560 Speaker 1: Welcome back to Bachelor Happy Hours Golden Hour. Thanks so 2 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:14,880 Speaker 1: much for joining us today. As always, we are so 3 00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:17,119 Speaker 1: excited to be back. And Susan, you know I'm going 4 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:18,599 Speaker 1: to ask, how are you doing today? 5 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:22,880 Speaker 2: I'm fabulous, I'm in a happy place and I'm really 6 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 2: psyched about today. You know, it gives it gives me 7 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 2: pleasure to read from our fans. They quote like everything 8 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,640 Speaker 2: we said on the podcast. There's people out there really 9 00:00:34,680 --> 00:00:36,720 Speaker 2: paying attention, and I love it. 10 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 1: Love yeah people. We never disagree, Susan. Sometimes sometimes you're 11 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 1: wrong and you have to you have to understand. No, 12 00:00:48,040 --> 00:00:51,879 Speaker 1: I do this today. We love it. It's what are 13 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 1: we doing today? Again? What are you doing? What are 14 00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:54,960 Speaker 1: we doing here today? 15 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:58,640 Speaker 2: We have a lot of fan questions today. So today 16 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 2: not only are we answering more of the fan questions, 17 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:05,839 Speaker 2: but these ones are a bit different than the ones 18 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 2: we usually get. Kathy, Okay, we're seeing more of the 19 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:12,920 Speaker 2: women being potentially. 20 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:17,480 Speaker 1: In the you know what, wait a second, let's see 21 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:20,199 Speaker 1: about that. I'm just gonna say, soon as you're gonna 22 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:22,800 Speaker 1: go after him, we are. You're gonna say they're not wrong. 23 00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:26,840 Speaker 2: I could be, or I might say maybe we shouldn't 24 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:27,639 Speaker 2: do those things. 25 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,559 Speaker 1: I gotta say. I think you and I are both 26 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 1: equal opportunity offenders, offenders, like we're both willing to stand 27 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 1: up and say, oh, yeah, we're wrong. I mean, it 28 00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:44,960 Speaker 1: hasn't happened yet, but if it did, I've admitted. 29 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 2: It makes me sick to my stomach, and then I 30 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 2: feel so badly. I want to forgive this right away 31 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 2: because we didn't mean it. 32 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 1: That is so funny you say that, because when I'm wrong, 33 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:03,400 Speaker 1: I am perfectly willing and able to say, have you 34 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: ever been wrong? Many times? 35 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 2: I've never witnessed it myself that you admit it. 36 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:13,960 Speaker 1: Oh that's not true. I've called you and apologized when 37 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:18,239 Speaker 1: I've done things wrong. I have Well, I can't really, 38 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. Okay, Well, I'm sorry you don't remember. 39 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 2: Here we go. 40 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 1: We're gonna we're just gonna get started with the question 41 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 1: the day, and I'm going to start us off and 42 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: see if you can remember that answer. Okay, how do 43 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:35,600 Speaker 1: you think? Oh this is gonna be a tough one, Susan, 44 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:38,960 Speaker 1: But here we go. How do you think the patriarchy 45 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 1: and sexism makes its way into dating and relationships for 46 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 1: straight people? All? 47 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 2: Right, Cat, you go first, on this one because I'm 48 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:48,239 Speaker 2: a little lost. 49 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 1: Okay. So, really, patriarchy generally means the male being the 50 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 1: family head of culture, so men make the rules. Okay, 51 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:03,480 Speaker 1: So and sexism can be the same. It's men are better, 52 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:07,360 Speaker 1: men are smarter, Men earn more because they deserve to 53 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:10,800 Speaker 1: earn more. Women can't have jobs, can't be on television 54 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:13,720 Speaker 1: reporters because they get old, but men can pull up 55 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:16,800 Speaker 1: in there. You get it. So that's sexism. You're denied 56 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:21,519 Speaker 1: something because of your sex, or diminished because of your sex, 57 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: or ruled determined that you are inferior in some way 58 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: because a male is superior. So given all that, I 59 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:38,120 Speaker 1: think that it's culture. I think our culture. I mean, 60 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 1: do we really have to need a history lesson here? 61 00:03:40,160 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 1: But it goes back two monarchies too. 62 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 2: It's always it's saying makes its way into dating. 63 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 1: And so let's think about this. 64 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 2: If you have two professionals, is that what you're saying. 65 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I'm saying the man is usually the one 66 00:03:56,200 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: that asks the woman out. And it's changing a little bit, 67 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: but men typically ask the woman out first. In it 68 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,560 Speaker 1: on a date, men tend to control or try to 69 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 1: control how the date's going. To go how the relationship 70 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: is going to be because they haven't dated me. Well, 71 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: that's where we're saying. We should have said, how do 72 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 1: you think the patriarchy and sex and makes it way 73 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 1: into dating a relationship except for Susan Knowles, but that 74 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 1: was not the question of the day. So but I 75 00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: do think, I do think it makes its way in 76 00:04:31,160 --> 00:04:36,200 Speaker 1: because historically, you know, the monarchy, it's always been killing 77 00:04:36,320 --> 00:04:39,320 Speaker 1: then but so well that but that's the point it 78 00:04:39,360 --> 00:04:43,359 Speaker 1: brings it. It's come through our culture. It's been you know, 79 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: ironed into the fabric of our society how. 80 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 2: We were raised. Well, no, but daddy did this, and 81 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 2: daddy does. 82 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 1: And in the fifties ever, you know, Donna Reid with 83 00:04:54,480 --> 00:04:56,719 Speaker 1: the apron around her or it's changing. 84 00:04:56,760 --> 00:04:57,839 Speaker 2: It's a woman's place. 85 00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:00,600 Speaker 1: It's a woman's place is in the home, you know, 86 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: and that was the way. So I think though that 87 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: people modern women today are saying, screw the patriarchy, forget it. 88 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:14,119 Speaker 2: You know a lot of times women make more money 89 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 2: than some of the men. 90 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's not just about that. It's that, you know, 91 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 1: men determine the roles. So historically women have taken care 92 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 1: of the children. You got a sick kid who's staying 93 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:30,560 Speaker 1: home the mommy. So, but that is changing, and in 94 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:34,800 Speaker 1: the glass ceiling, women have tried for years to break 95 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 1: the glass ceiling. In terms of income, in terms of promotions, 96 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 1: all those things. It has changed dramatically, I would say, 97 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:45,479 Speaker 1: in the last twenty or thirty years. But I think 98 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:51,280 Speaker 1: it still exists. I do. I think it's still. 99 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 2: To answer the question, how do you think patriarchy and 100 00:05:55,720 --> 00:06:00,840 Speaker 2: sexism makes its way into dating and relationship hips? How 101 00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 2: does it make its way in from Because it's learned 102 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:05,120 Speaker 2: because of the history. 103 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 1: That's what I think. I think it's just always been accepted, 104 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 1: and I think I think, thank you for how many 105 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: how many times have we heard Susan boys will be boys? 106 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:19,800 Speaker 1: You know a man, yes, but a man can cheat 107 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: because you know the. 108 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:26,039 Speaker 2: Woman accept it more so than not in my sphere either. 109 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:28,280 Speaker 2: But if a woman did, it's taboo. 110 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:30,240 Speaker 1: That's patriarchy right there. 111 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:32,440 Speaker 2: Oh my god. How about like the woman that had 112 00:06:32,520 --> 00:06:36,480 Speaker 2: sex in high school or whatever and your your refutation. 113 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 2: But a guy, it's a not to on the belt. 114 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: That's patriarchy. Yes, that's sexism. You got it right there. 115 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 1: So I think it makes its way into dating and 116 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: relationships because it's been so it's it's been ingrained in 117 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:53,679 Speaker 1: the fabric of our society. But I do think it's changing. 118 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 1: My daughter, My daughter and her husband, they have one 119 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 1: child right now and they both have very big jobs. 120 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 1: They share the cooking, they share childcare when that child's sick. Well, 121 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:10,280 Speaker 1: that patriarchy is. 122 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 2: Is that it wasn't you know what? I like you said, 123 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:15,400 Speaker 2: there's two professionals in the house. 124 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:22,520 Speaker 1: But that's the point. Patriarchy suggests that the male is 125 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 1: not only dominant, but more important. His decisions way more. 126 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 1: They have more weight because a male made the decision. 127 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 1: I say, screwed the patriarchy. But maybe that's why I'm single. 128 00:07:34,840 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 2: Maybe the sexism part. I think they still should take 129 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:38,200 Speaker 2: out some trush. 130 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:43,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I will say, Susan, you actually do, but 131 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,960 Speaker 1: and it's not wrong, But I would say you buy 132 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:52,920 Speaker 1: into male dominant and female dominant accepted roles that traditional 133 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 1: I should say traditional roles. I when my husband was alive, 134 00:07:57,040 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 1: I took out the trash, he took out. I loved 135 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: to mow the grash. I like the grass too, So yes, 136 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 1: my husband more than tools. 137 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:09,680 Speaker 2: And certain things that I just think men are better 138 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 2: at than me. 139 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: That's all because that's only because Susan that you want me. 140 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 1: It's because you didn't learn it if someone told you. 141 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:21,840 Speaker 1: You learned it subconsciously from a very young age. That 142 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 1: men have tools tool belts, and men are better with 143 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:28,600 Speaker 1: hammers and women are better with a sewing machine. It's 144 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 1: not true. 145 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 2: It's just I'm better with a hammer than I am 146 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 2: with the sewing machine because I do try. I'm a 147 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 2: frustrated seamstress and heart. But all right, let's get it's 148 00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 2: time to answer some. 149 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:40,720 Speaker 1: Of our fans. Where we go? 150 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:43,600 Speaker 2: All right, I'll go to start us off. You ready can. 151 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:51,120 Speaker 1: Knock yourself out? Got Hi? 152 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 2: Please keep this anonymous. I have been with my husband 153 00:08:55,800 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 2: for thirteen years, married for five. Through our dating years, 154 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:04,640 Speaker 2: we had our ups and downs of lying and cheating 155 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:09,320 Speaker 2: on both ends. I had a hard time committing due 156 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 2: to our issues. During one of the times we were off, 157 00:09:13,559 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 2: I met a guy at work and dated him for 158 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:20,320 Speaker 2: about eight months. We broke up because I was twenty 159 00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 2: three and he was going through a custody battle with 160 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:26,640 Speaker 2: his ex girlfriend and it all felt like too much 161 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:30,840 Speaker 2: to handle. To this day, I regret it. He was 162 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 2: the best and I loved him. He treated me like 163 00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 2: a princess and would do anything for me. I have 164 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 2: often thought about him through the years and wondered if 165 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:48,160 Speaker 2: I made a mistake. This is getting juicy. I always 166 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 2: went back, partially because I did love him and because 167 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 2: I loved his family. 168 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,480 Speaker 1: Wait, I have to interrupt, I have to interrupt. She 169 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:00,559 Speaker 1: went back with her husband, I know. I think that's 170 00:10:00,559 --> 00:10:03,319 Speaker 1: where it is. She went back to her husband because. 171 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,079 Speaker 2: They were doing this when they were off in twenty sixteen, 172 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:08,760 Speaker 2: so they weren't together. Yeah, okay, and she started dating 173 00:10:08,760 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 2: this guy, okay. And I always went back, partially because 174 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:16,080 Speaker 2: I did love him and because I loved his family. 175 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:20,000 Speaker 2: I lost my father young and his parents always treated 176 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:23,160 Speaker 2: me like their own. We got engaged shortly after my 177 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 2: mother passed away. Since being married to my husband and 178 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 2: having two kids, four and two years old, I always 179 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 2: think about this guy and still have feelings for him 180 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,760 Speaker 2: deep down. We still work together. Boy, he is married 181 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:42,200 Speaker 2: and has kids too, and still feels the same way 182 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 2: about me. He is not happy in his marriage, and 183 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 2: the last two years I haven't been either. We worked 184 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 2: from home during COVID till about two and a half 185 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:58,959 Speaker 2: years ago. Today we go into the office a few 186 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 2: days a week and we talk more. My marriage currently 187 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:05,640 Speaker 2: has been on the rocks. He doesn't show me affection. 188 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:08,560 Speaker 2: He works so much. I feel like a single parent, 189 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:12,959 Speaker 2: doesn't do much around the house, doesn't engage in conversation, 190 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 2: et cetera. I kept this all in for so long 191 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 2: that I had a breaking point, and now my husband 192 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 2: and I are in counseling. I have resentment towards him 193 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 2: and just don't know what to do. My ex wants 194 00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 2: to get divorced. I know I would be happy with 195 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 2: him without a doubt. I feel so guilty about all 196 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:38,640 Speaker 2: this and don't know what to do. Did I marry 197 00:11:38,679 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 2: my husband for the wrong reasons? And he thoughts on 198 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 2: what to do? 199 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 1: Oh, Susan take it? What do you think? Whah, it's 200 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 1: a lot, It's a lot. So I'm curious what. 201 00:11:51,559 --> 00:11:56,559 Speaker 2: She used the word resentment, And to me, that's the 202 00:11:56,600 --> 00:12:01,720 Speaker 2: biggest because you can't go back ever feel the same again. 203 00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 2: Once you resent somebody, you can forgive them and you 204 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 2: can try and make the marriage work. But deep down 205 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:15,280 Speaker 2: inside I hear this woman. She resents him, and she 206 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:19,079 Speaker 2: knows she thinks that that other man. First of all, 207 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 2: she says we both feel the same. So they're obviously 208 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:24,319 Speaker 2: chit chat. They're still holking up. I think. So you're 209 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:25,439 Speaker 2: both unhappy. 210 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:27,719 Speaker 1: They're hooking up. You mean they're having sex. You think 211 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: they are? 212 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:31,440 Speaker 2: Oh that's see, there you go again without hooking up. 213 00:12:33,440 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 2: I didn't. Yeah, I guess, I guess. But they're still 214 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:41,320 Speaker 2: into each other, was what I'm thinking. So what I'm 215 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:45,640 Speaker 2: hearing is they're both not happy in their marriages. They 216 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 2: both have something that they want about each other. However, 217 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,640 Speaker 2: that was the good part, just dating him for the 218 00:12:54,679 --> 00:12:57,720 Speaker 2: eight months, and you know, he rarely wasn't yours. Yet 219 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 2: the same damned thing could happen if you both get 220 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,200 Speaker 2: divorced and your kids go through all the hell and 221 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 2: you finally get together and you find out he does 222 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 2: the same damn thing, or you know, you know. 223 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:15,080 Speaker 1: Okay, so did she before I jump in here? Did 224 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:18,680 Speaker 1: do you think when she says to marry her husband 225 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 1: for the wrong reasons? Do you think she did? 226 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 2: I think she liked the family and feeling a part 227 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 2: of it since she lost hers. Maybe maybe, But it's okay, 228 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:32,360 Speaker 2: you did it, and you have two beautiful kids and 229 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 2: you're both going to love them forever. But be true 230 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:39,360 Speaker 2: to yourself because you won't be happy and to stay 231 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 2: miserable and unhappy. The other partner feels it too. 232 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:48,320 Speaker 1: Okay, so I'm gonna take a little bit different tact, Shopper. 233 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:55,120 Speaker 1: At this point, it doesn't matter if she married her 234 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,959 Speaker 1: husband for the wrong reason. I have a philosophy, and 235 00:13:57,960 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 1: I've told you this before, Susan. I think oftentimes when 236 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:06,240 Speaker 1: marriages quote unquote go on the rocks, both parties go 237 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 1: into counseling because they which they are, because they see 238 00:14:11,679 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 1: it as a required step to take before you and 239 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,640 Speaker 1: many of my friends did this, and they admit to 240 00:14:21,680 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: me later, I knew I would. At the time, I 241 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 1: thought I would work, but I really knew deep down 242 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 1: I was going to counseling so that I could say 243 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 1: post facto, I tried, we tried, I went to counseling. 244 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 1: I think that's where this falls in. I think this 245 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:41,160 Speaker 1: falls into that category. I don't really care, Anonymous, if 246 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 1: you married your husband for the wrong reasons. As Susan said, 247 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:48,000 Speaker 1: you have two children. I don't think I'm not reading 248 00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: that you have the impetus that you have the desire 249 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 1: to really do the work to bring your marriage back 250 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 1: from the rocks obviously if you can do that, and 251 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 1: I disagree with you, Susan, I think you can let 252 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: go of resentment. I think it takes a lot of work. 253 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 1: I don't know whether she's willing to do it. I 254 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:12,400 Speaker 1: think it's also very difficult to work in the workplace 255 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 1: with the guy you have the hots for you and 256 00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 1: you're chit chatting with him, so you are continuing the 257 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 1: behavior that got you where you are. So if you 258 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 1: really want my thought is when you say, what should 259 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: you do? If you really want to make a go 260 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: of the marriage, I would tell you cut it off 261 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:36,400 Speaker 1: with him, change jobs, delete him from your phone, change jobs, 262 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 1: don't see him, don't talk to him, because there can 263 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:43,440 Speaker 1: never be three in a marriage, and right now you 264 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 1: have three in a marriage. And it's immaterial to me 265 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: whether the other guy wants to divorce his wife. Immaterial 266 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 1: if you want your marriage, if you want to give 267 00:15:57,280 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 1: it a go. But I don't send she does, But 268 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: if you do, you got to take some hard steps here. 269 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 2: I'm a little confused, and she says, I have resentment 270 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 2: towards him and just don't know what to do. My 271 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 2: ex wants to get divorced. 272 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: The ex is the guy that she had the affair with. 273 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:16,640 Speaker 1: I believe. Oh yes, the guy that she had the 274 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 1: affair with wants to divorce his wife. I think that's 275 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 1: who she's says. 276 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 2: I know I would be happy with. 277 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:24,760 Speaker 1: That with him, But she goes to your point, Susan, 278 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 1: she doesn't know. With all due respect, Anonymous, I know 279 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:30,400 Speaker 1: you're in a tough spot, and my heart goes out 280 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 1: to you. But Susan's right. All you know is the infatuation, 281 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:40,400 Speaker 1: the great sex, the fabulous late night phone calls. You 282 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: don't know what it's going to be with the kids, 283 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: your kids, the conversations when he starts doing nothing around 284 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 1: the house, or whatever the issues are in your current marriage, Susan, 285 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 1: and I can safely assure you you will have issues 286 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:57,080 Speaker 1: with this second guy. Is it going to be a 287 00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 1: fairy tale? No? You may love him and it could 288 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 1: work out of you get together. But what should you do? 289 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 1: It's up to you, sweetie. You either want to really 290 00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:12,040 Speaker 1: work on your marriage that you have, in which case, 291 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: don't just say I'm in counseling. You have to change 292 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 1: jobs and delete this man from your life, because, as 293 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: I just said, there are never three in a marriage. 294 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 2: And also do yourself a favor. If this marriage is 295 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 2: at work and you don't jump into another man's arms, 296 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 2: you got to be alone. You got to figure out. 297 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 2: I don't you know what, I don't go from the 298 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:38,000 Speaker 2: pot to the fire. 299 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:41,359 Speaker 1: Well, I think it can work. That's why I'm saying 300 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:44,320 Speaker 1: she might have This might be the love story of 301 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: the ages with this other. My father and stepmother had 302 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 1: the love story of the ages. When my father was divorced, 303 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:54,080 Speaker 1: he met my step mom. They were married within a year, 304 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 1: and they had forty years of bliss. 305 00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 2: Then maybe she should go with it. 306 00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:01,480 Speaker 1: Then only she knows. Only she knows. 307 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 2: Anonymous, Thank you so much for sharing. Let us know 308 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 2: what happens now. I really I understand the word resentment, 309 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,800 Speaker 2: and I know where you're coming from. I mean, and 310 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:17,239 Speaker 2: like Kathy said, she says it is possible. Maybe it is. 311 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:18,399 Speaker 2: I just never found that. 312 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:22,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and I didn't have to live so And 313 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:25,480 Speaker 1: one other thing I want to say before we move on, Anonymous, 314 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:31,240 Speaker 1: whatever you decide, please be cognizant of your children and 315 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:33,680 Speaker 1: what they're going to go through. Because kids didn't ask 316 00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:37,200 Speaker 1: to be born, and they didn't ask for this Michigan 317 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: as So, whatever it is, you can. 318 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,960 Speaker 2: Work the same breath. Don't stay because. 319 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 1: Of the fair Absolutely well, let us know, we want. 320 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:46,880 Speaker 2: To make you, we wish you the best. 321 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,000 Speaker 1: We really, let us know what happens, and we wish 322 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:57,159 Speaker 1: you all the best. Okay, so ready to move on 323 00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: to the next question. Here we go. The second question 324 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: is from Renee. She's sixty five years old. Hi, ladies, 325 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 1: I need to know if I was in the wrong 326 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 1: for this post breakup move. I was dating a guy 327 00:19:11,080 --> 00:19:15,440 Speaker 1: for eleven months. He was very generous to me while dating. I, however, 328 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 1: always struggled through this relationship. It was like I wasn't 329 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:23,200 Speaker 1: feeling how I was supposed to during the relationship. Unfortunately, 330 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:26,720 Speaker 1: we ended up breaking up, and here's how it sort 331 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:30,160 Speaker 1: of played out. He had shoulder surgery on my birthday 332 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,480 Speaker 1: and I went over to take care of him. While 333 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: I was there, he ended up giving me a check 334 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: for my birthday gift. I won't get into the details, 335 00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:40,359 Speaker 1: but one thing led to another and we ended up 336 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:43,480 Speaker 1: breaking up before I even got home that night. Once 337 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: I did get home, he messaged me asking for things 338 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 1: he gave me back. I sent them, thinking he was 339 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:52,480 Speaker 1: a bit out of line, but wanted to just be 340 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 1: done with it. I then decided to deposit the check 341 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 1: that he had given me for my birthday. He came 342 00:19:58,840 --> 00:20:02,119 Speaker 1: on glued asking for money back, calling me a gold 343 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 1: digger and many other horrible names. I did not return 344 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,680 Speaker 1: the money. Needless to say, I have no contact with 345 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:14,679 Speaker 1: him anymore. His true colors came out. Oh, I forgot 346 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,159 Speaker 1: to mention he had lied about his age from the 347 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:19,679 Speaker 1: get go, saying he was sixty four when he was 348 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:23,880 Speaker 1: really sixty nine. I'm sixty five. What are your thoughts? 349 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:26,119 Speaker 1: Was I in the wrong, Susan. I'm gonna let you 350 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:29,440 Speaker 1: handle this first. I just have to say nothing about 351 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,919 Speaker 1: his age matters. Who cares sixty five sixty nine? So 352 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:34,919 Speaker 1: let's just leave that out of the mix, because to me, 353 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:35,640 Speaker 1: that doesn't work. 354 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 2: First of all, I'm wondering what she wasn't feeling like 355 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:43,760 Speaker 2: in the beginning when she said something was missing. Obviously, 356 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 2: he decides to get surgery on her birthday, and she 357 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,159 Speaker 2: gives up that day to celebrate herself and goes and 358 00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:53,120 Speaker 2: takes care of him. 359 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:54,920 Speaker 1: That's what you do for the person or in a 360 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:55,879 Speaker 1: relationships with. 361 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,359 Speaker 2: And that's great. But he gives her a check, so 362 00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 2: he had no thought what can I give her for 363 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:05,400 Speaker 2: the birthday? You write a check last minute because you're 364 00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 2: not prepared, You had nothing, and now he wants it back. 365 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:13,399 Speaker 1: Go screw yourself, now, Susan, what do you really think? 366 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:15,600 Speaker 2: I think he's shit, That's what I think. 367 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:18,880 Speaker 1: And he whoa, whoa. This is hitting close to home. 368 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 2: And I hope that's surgery hurt. 369 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 1: So so here's what I think. Here's what I think, Susan. 370 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:29,879 Speaker 1: You and I both know people who have been given 371 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 1: gifts early on in a relationship who returned the gift, 372 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:36,680 Speaker 1: and you know, we both had different thoughts on it. 373 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:39,680 Speaker 1: I thought you did the right thing. Whatever. Here, this 374 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 1: is a different situation, Renee. You were with this man 375 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:47,600 Speaker 1: for eleven months. Whatever you were feeling or not feeling, 376 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 1: if you were giving it a go, you weren't giving 377 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 1: it a go. I don't know. You didn't know how 378 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,919 Speaker 1: you were supposed to be feeling. All that said, you 379 00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:58,320 Speaker 1: stayed with him for eleven months. At least that's the 380 00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:01,679 Speaker 1: way this reads. So you were with him eleven months. 381 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: You did go over on your birthday. We don't know, Susan. 382 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 1: Maybe he was an excruciating pain, maybe he'd fallen. 383 00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:12,520 Speaker 2: Was in the house, face coming the same day before surgery, 384 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 2: you plan that. 385 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:16,359 Speaker 1: Hold on, I'm just saying I'm trying to give the 386 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 1: guy some grace here. Maybe it was an emergency surgery. 387 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,480 Speaker 1: I don't know. Here's where I will go. Maybe you're right, 388 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: maybe he gave no thought. Okay, not great, but I 389 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:32,439 Speaker 1: believe it or not. I would absolutely have kept the 390 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:37,720 Speaker 1: birthday check and called it nursing ours fees. But secondly, 391 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 1: I would not have sent back the things he had 392 00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: given me. When you give someone gifts and you've been dating, 393 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: and I will tell you, Susan, you don't know another 394 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:49,880 Speaker 1: Kathy story that you don't know. You know the guy 395 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:53,160 Speaker 1: who shall remain nameless, that I dated for ten months, 396 00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 1: the guy that wanted me to move in with him. Yes, 397 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:03,440 Speaker 1: he gave me an incredibly expense SIV tennis racket because 398 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:05,720 Speaker 1: he knew I had played tennis. He wanted to start 399 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:09,439 Speaker 1: playing again. He gave me this really, really nice racket. 400 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,119 Speaker 1: And when we broke up, he asked me for the 401 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:14,560 Speaker 1: racket back, and you know what I said? He did? 402 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 1: And do you know what? What do you think? I said? 403 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:21,320 Speaker 2: Why? Why it's a gift. Now, why would I give 404 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 2: it back to you? You gave it to me as 405 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:23,400 Speaker 2: a gift. 406 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:25,879 Speaker 1: And oh my god, I love you. It's exactly what 407 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,920 Speaker 1: I said to him. I said, I'm sorry, so and. 408 00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:31,120 Speaker 2: So, you give it somebody else. 409 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: I mean, you know what, I gave it to my daughter. 410 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:37,639 Speaker 1: She plays with it because I because he and I 411 00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:39,719 Speaker 1: were going to take back up tennis. But that's not 412 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,840 Speaker 1: the point. The point was he gave me a gift, 413 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 1: and I gave him some gifts. And when I broke 414 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:49,680 Speaker 1: up with him, which is what happened, I didn't say, 415 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:51,880 Speaker 1: by the way, I want back these pillows, I gave 416 00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 1: you these. 417 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 2: Vertic I would say. Women, when they're asked that they're 418 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 2: so angry or upset they don't want things that remind 419 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 2: them of him. 420 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,399 Speaker 1: Then, but don't give it back to him. Listen, I 421 00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 1: have a friend who I have a friend who dated 422 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:08,919 Speaker 1: and again no names mentioned because you know this person. 423 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:13,480 Speaker 1: She lives here. She dated a very wealthy guy. He 424 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,160 Speaker 1: bought her Louis Vaton handbags, Chloe handbags, you know, very 425 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:23,480 Speaker 1: expensive designer stuff, jewelry from Tiffany's, really nice things. She 426 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:26,640 Speaker 1: sold it. She sold every bit of it and pocketed 427 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:29,119 Speaker 1: the money. She didn't give it back to him. So 428 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 1: I think, Renee, I don't care about. 429 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 2: Give me it back. Obviously he's hurting, he's angry. Yeah, 430 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:42,359 Speaker 2: you're showing your true colors, just like Renee said. 431 00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:46,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, so, Renee, here's Susan's and my advice. Move on 432 00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 1: and go find yourself a nice guy. I don't care 433 00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:51,120 Speaker 1: what age he is. Would you agree, Susan. 434 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 2: Yes, most definitely, most definitely. 435 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. Wait do you think? 436 00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 2: But I'm upset about the birthday? Okay, dare you write 437 00:24:58,320 --> 00:24:59,119 Speaker 2: me at shack? 438 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: But what do you But here's the thing. We started 439 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 1: this whole podcast, this episode talking about women potentially in 440 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 1: the wrong. She's not in the wrong. 441 00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:11,200 Speaker 2: I don't think she is either. 442 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 1: I don't think so. And I think. 443 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 2: Although she said they broke up before she even got 444 00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:18,880 Speaker 2: to the house. 445 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:25,119 Speaker 1: No, no, no, while they were there, they broke up 446 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,000 Speaker 1: at the house. One thing led to another. Watch she 447 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,440 Speaker 1: was at the house taking care of him, and they 448 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 1: broke up, So he'd obviously. 449 00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:34,880 Speaker 2: Think maybe she perhaps said you're writing me a chet 450 00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 2: for my birthday. Do you think that was part of it? 451 00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 2: I mean, we're guessing. 452 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:42,840 Speaker 1: I mean I would say to you, doesn't matter, I mean, 453 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: really doesn't matter. That whatever it was, she didn't. 454 00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 2: Was it over the birthday Jack? 455 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 1: Maybe, But I'm saying, does it matter how or why 456 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 1: they broke up. I'm saying I don't think that Renee 457 00:25:57,560 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 1: is in the wrong here at all, And in fact, 458 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,200 Speaker 1: I would kept all the things, So I think she's 459 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,159 Speaker 1: in the wrong for not keeping them, for sending them. 460 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:09,720 Speaker 2: Back in like I Like I said, you don't want 461 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,080 Speaker 2: any parts of him, so give it, so give. 462 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: It donated, don't give it to him, And then the 463 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 1: other the other, the other anonymous question. You know, we've 464 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:23,080 Speaker 1: talked about that. I don't think necessarily, Uh, it's I 465 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:26,160 Speaker 1: don't think it's our job to judge right and wrong 466 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 1: as much as it is to have people reflect and 467 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: see what is the best way in or out of 468 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:34,200 Speaker 1: the situation they're. 469 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:35,439 Speaker 2: In and how to handle it. 470 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:37,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's what I think. 471 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:41,440 Speaker 2: And keeping your grace, you know, you just you respect yourself. 472 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 2: You don't want to act out in a fit of 473 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 2: whatever that moment is. Always just breathe always and think. 474 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 1: Always, Always forget the patriarchy. Always go out as a 475 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 1: lady that has nothing to do with male domination. Always, 476 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:03,840 Speaker 1: whatever you do, do it with grace. 477 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:09,160 Speaker 2: Yes, right, God, Yes, I mean I've learned the hard way. 478 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:15,520 Speaker 2: What do you mean, I've been angry and I raise 479 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:18,399 Speaker 2: my voice, you know, I'm Italian. I scream and holler, 480 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 2: and I start thinking about all the things that hurt me, 481 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:24,199 Speaker 2: and they all came out at once. I don't know 482 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 2: if maybe it was a treat that my dad would 483 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,000 Speaker 2: hold things in for like six months, and when we 484 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,520 Speaker 2: were in trouble, you'd bring up everything you did for 485 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 2: the last six months. 486 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 1: Oh, I'm gonna cut that's where you go to your 487 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,119 Speaker 1: room and hide yourself under the bed. But I will say, 488 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:43,160 Speaker 1: I will say I think there's one back to our 489 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,920 Speaker 1: questions from today, m H. I think there is one 490 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:55,040 Speaker 1: common denominator here, and that is the emotional What do 491 00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:58,200 Speaker 1: I want to say, the the emotional value, the emotional 492 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:03,680 Speaker 1: quotient of a relationship, and the physical. In our first question, 493 00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 1: the emotional turmoil she's going through, she clearly has cheated, 494 00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: or I shouldn't say clearly, but it suggests that she 495 00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 1: is when they were broken up, when she was separated, whatever, 496 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:22,919 Speaker 1: And I think that is a whole different kind of relationship. 497 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:25,640 Speaker 2: Do you still think it's cheating if it was an 498 00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 2: emotional reason. 499 00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:27,520 Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. 500 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:29,200 Speaker 2: Some people argue that point. 501 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:33,000 Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. I don't think it is the 502 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:37,040 Speaker 1: same as physical cheating, but I think the results often 503 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,160 Speaker 1: can be the same. I think you leave, many people 504 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 1: leave a relationship, they get into an emotional relationship with someone, 505 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 1: or they even if it's imagined, you know, and. 506 00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 2: So so. 507 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:55,520 Speaker 1: They sort of maybe inadvertently maybe consciously depart from the 508 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,280 Speaker 1: from the other relationship they're in. So I think the 509 00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:00,200 Speaker 1: I think the fall can be the same. 510 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 2: I think I know so many people that I've read 511 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:09,840 Speaker 2: or stories that the man gets caught cheating, but he 512 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:13,479 Speaker 2: never slept with them, but it was more of an 513 00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:17,640 Speaker 2: emotional thing and they kissed once. The wife still thinks 514 00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:21,080 Speaker 2: that's cheating, but he was more relying on her and 515 00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 2: talking with her and. 516 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 1: Imo, but that's but again it suggests that he that 517 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 1: he and his partner. 518 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 2: Are missing something, are. 519 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:35,440 Speaker 1: Missing something in there. And that's what I think Renee 520 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:40,040 Speaker 1: was getting at with him, that there was a lot 521 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,920 Speaker 1: missing and she couldn't quite feel it. In the first 522 00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 1: one U in the anonymous question, I think there's more. 523 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,840 Speaker 1: I think there's physical and emotional something not being met 524 00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:53,880 Speaker 1: in her marriage, and I think it's pretty far down 525 00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 1: the road. And as I said earlier in this episode, 526 00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 1: it is going to take a lot of work too 527 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:02,360 Speaker 1: if she he wants to, so you know what, Emai. 528 00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:05,400 Speaker 2: Doesn't want to either, So. 529 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,160 Speaker 1: So you know what I say that, don't you one? 530 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 2: I hope that the other guy, if he's not happy either, 531 00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 2: that those two can get together and it's a fairy 532 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 2: tale love. Oh we all hope that now, all right, 533 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:18,200 Speaker 2: even fairy dad. 534 00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:22,280 Speaker 1: Oh Susan the fairytale queen. All right, move along, move along? 535 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:23,120 Speaker 1: What's next here? 536 00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:27,960 Speaker 2: All right? Before we end this episode, Kathy, we're gonna 537 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 2: switch off given you guys some of our dating and 538 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 2: relationship hot takes. Boy, we'll give you our hot take 539 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 2: and discuss it, and you're. 540 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:41,360 Speaker 1: Going to start it all. Oh no, you are a 541 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 1: good big girl, and gop for it. What's your first one? 542 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:54,880 Speaker 2: Uh, the very first date? If you know you don't 543 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 2: want to see him again? I don't expect him to 544 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 2: pay for the bill. I would always. 545 00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 1: I actually agree with you totally, one hundred percent. See, 546 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: you know. 547 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:13,720 Speaker 2: You're not going to and the man that demands absolutely 548 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:15,440 Speaker 2: no way. I admire that. 549 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: Okay, what about that? All right, I agree. All right, 550 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,480 Speaker 1: moving on, I got I've got one for you. You 551 00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:25,400 Speaker 1: agree or disagree. My hot take is women should feel 552 00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:27,880 Speaker 1: free to text back right away if they've had a 553 00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 1: great date or you've met some. 554 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:32,680 Speaker 2: And don't be afraid to be the first one. 555 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean it's hard for me, but I think 556 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 1: you should feel free to do it. 557 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 2: I just have to know when to not, you know, 558 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,280 Speaker 2: because I'm like, oh, yeah, it's my new friend. There's 559 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 2: a little blowing them up, and it's like, oh no, 560 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 2: forget If it's not answering right away, there's a reason. 561 00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:51,720 Speaker 1: I love it. All right, I got another one I want. 562 00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 1: I want your opinion on this one. 563 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 2: Uh. 564 00:31:56,120 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: Men should always pick up the date at or wherever. 565 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 1: In other words, it shouldn't be hey, I'd like to 566 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 1: go out with you, meet me at Joe's Bar at 567 00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:09,760 Speaker 1: six pm. I think a man should always offer to 568 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:10,600 Speaker 1: pick a woman up. 569 00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:13,320 Speaker 2: What do you think I do as well? Except for 570 00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 2: certain circumstances. If you're just meeting, I prefer to drive 571 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:19,760 Speaker 2: myself so I know I could leave. 572 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:20,959 Speaker 1: Do you mean a first meeting? 573 00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 2: Yes? 574 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: No, No, No, I agree with that. No, I'm saying, 575 00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 1: in general, how do you. 576 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 2: Think perhaps they work in the city and you know 577 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,200 Speaker 2: it'll be eight o'clock by the time you could get out. 578 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,480 Speaker 2: There's moments that will say you want to just meet 579 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:36,120 Speaker 2: me there, baby? 580 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,520 Speaker 1: Yes, But as a rule, as a rule. 581 00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,360 Speaker 2: A rule, a man should pick you up for you. 582 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:41,920 Speaker 1: Okay, Yes, you got another one? 583 00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:42,800 Speaker 2: When dating? 584 00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:43,959 Speaker 1: Yes, okay. 585 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:50,280 Speaker 2: I think that a man should respect the people waiting 586 00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:51,160 Speaker 2: on them. 587 00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:54,840 Speaker 1: Do you mean servers at a restaurant, yes, ma'am. Oh, honey, money, 588 00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:59,800 Speaker 1: whether man and women. Yes, well, oh that goes. 589 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:04,680 Speaker 2: A lot people that will allow. That's a red flag 590 00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:07,160 Speaker 2: all the way. Also, I think a man should open 591 00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:11,400 Speaker 2: the car door always, always, and if you're a perfect 592 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,200 Speaker 2: lady and you like him a lot, you reach over 593 00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 2: after he shuts your door and try to get his 594 00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 2: open for it. Can I just tie for Fred and 595 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 2: he noticed? 596 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 1: Can I tell you that Ned my friend who lives 597 00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:28,280 Speaker 1: out in California, who you're going to meet, Actually he 598 00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:31,560 Speaker 1: always opens the and we're not dating, but he always 599 00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:33,400 Speaker 1: opens the car door for me. I'm thinking that man 600 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:35,600 Speaker 1: was trained. Well, it means a lot to me, even 601 00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:39,040 Speaker 1: though we're not da Okay, I got one more, I 602 00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:39,720 Speaker 1: got one more. 603 00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 2: I got one to go ahead? 604 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:45,080 Speaker 1: All right, women, I don't think this, but I have 605 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,120 Speaker 1: heard it said by men and women. How do you 606 00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:54,880 Speaker 1: feel about man? Sorry, women should plan most of the dates. 607 00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 2: No, but we have to. If you want to do 608 00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:00,680 Speaker 2: stuff that you want to do, good at it. 609 00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:04,719 Speaker 1: Some men, I disagree that is a cop out. Men 610 00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,399 Speaker 1: can plan great dates if they want to. They I 611 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:11,279 Speaker 1: think men just think women will do it so they 612 00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:14,919 Speaker 1: don't spend the time. To me, a man that will 613 00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:19,279 Speaker 1: plan an exciting date, and I don't mean yeah not 614 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:21,880 Speaker 1: you know, not a jet to Paris for dinner. I 615 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 1: don't mean that. I mean just a guides it doesn't 616 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:28,560 Speaker 1: have to be expensive. Oh my god, that is the 617 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 1: man that I want right there, who will play with 618 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:31,319 Speaker 1: you that. 619 00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:34,880 Speaker 2: I also think a man should always walk on the 620 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,320 Speaker 2: street side and keeping women on the always to protect. 621 00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:40,680 Speaker 2: Forget about that always always. 622 00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,480 Speaker 1: You know one thing you and I are both saying, 623 00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:47,680 Speaker 1: even though we're at a certain age, being a gentleman 624 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:50,960 Speaker 1: and being courteous is a turn on for women and 625 00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:53,560 Speaker 1: it never goes out of style ever. 626 00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:55,719 Speaker 2: So yes, men are hearing that. 627 00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean really, there's some things that just never 628 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: ever quo. And that's I'm not thinking. If I have 629 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,880 Speaker 1: any other ones I had them mentioned always open doors, 630 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:08,879 Speaker 1: but you had that one as well. Uh oh one more. 631 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:12,760 Speaker 1: I know we got to go, but just real quickly. Okay, women, 632 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:15,799 Speaker 1: I don't agree with this, but but I've heard and 633 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:20,000 Speaker 1: people have criticized me for it. Women in the dating 634 00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:28,200 Speaker 1: world should not show their strength both physically financially. They 635 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:33,480 Speaker 1: should be demure and diminutive in stature. They should make 636 00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:38,880 Speaker 1: themselves be small, whether it's financially, physically, sexually, all of them. 637 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 1: What do you think? 638 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:41,680 Speaker 2: I am not that girl. I don't think I could 639 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 2: follow those rules. I haven't read that actually, like dating advice, 640 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:48,520 Speaker 2: and you're dating like I don't think the first night 641 00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:51,879 Speaker 2: you gotta show power. But yeah, I am who I am. 642 00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,719 Speaker 2: I can't pretend to be anybody else. So I need 643 00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:57,600 Speaker 2: to be who I am. And if you like me, 644 00:35:57,719 --> 00:35:59,880 Speaker 2: that's great. And if you don't, I understand. 645 00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:02,400 Speaker 1: I find that a lot of men who I'm friends 646 00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:05,719 Speaker 1: with say, you know, Kathy, you're just so strong. But 647 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 1: I guess what you know what said to me the 648 00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:11,680 Speaker 1: other day close c k He said, Kathy, if men 649 00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 1: would just take the time to get to know you, 650 00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:16,000 Speaker 1: they would see what a terrific woman you are and 651 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:19,000 Speaker 1: I thought it was a lovely compliment. But I thought, yeah, yeah, 652 00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:20,879 Speaker 1: but they don't take the time. So you know, I guess, 653 00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:23,799 Speaker 1: I guess I need to be diminutive and demure the 654 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:26,399 Speaker 1: two d's. I don't know. I can tell you how. 655 00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,200 Speaker 1: I could tell you how we're a short spurt and 656 00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:30,480 Speaker 1: put tape over my mouth. 657 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:33,000 Speaker 2: I have a lot of. 658 00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,719 Speaker 1: I'm that happy note we're done here, that is going 659 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,759 Speaker 1: to do it. This was fun for today's episode. This 660 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:44,680 Speaker 1: was a fun episode, and thank you to everyone for 661 00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:47,560 Speaker 1: for listening. We had so much fun. We hopeully you 662 00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:50,359 Speaker 1: enjoyed hearing our hot takes and our advice to. 663 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:55,640 Speaker 2: Our those questions coming, because without them we'd. 664 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,680 Speaker 1: Have to make stuff up and we could do that too, 665 00:36:59,000 --> 00:36:59,520 Speaker 1: and you know. 666 00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,280 Speaker 2: How to do it. Thank you so much for everybody listening. 667 00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:07,200 Speaker 2: Just go to Bachelor nation dot com slash Golden Hour 668 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:09,360 Speaker 2: and submit those questions. 669 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:11,600 Speaker 1: That can't ware for I hope we get some great 670 00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:14,920 Speaker 1: comments on this episode. I can and some more questions. Okay, 671 00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:18,640 Speaker 1: listen to bout our Happy Hours Golden Hour on the 672 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:22,520 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Until 673 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,160 Speaker 1: next time, have a great week.