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Speaker 1: This is the Colts Free Agent Tracker, a look at

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Speaker 1: some key in house free agents this offseason in the

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Speaker 1: Indiana Union Construction Industry Radio studio. Here's the voice of

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Speaker 1: the Colts, Matt Taylor. Hello, Welcome to the Free Agent

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Speaker 1: Tracker podcast series so Oncolts dot Com, the Colts Marble app,

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Speaker 1: and the Colts Audio Network. This is our offseason look

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Speaker 1: at some of the Colts in house free agent signed

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Speaker 1: Matt Taylor. An NFL free agency will begin at four

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Speaker 1: o'clock on Wednesday, March fifteenth, and seventeen. Colts players will

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Speaker 1: become free agents, either unrestricted or restricted unless they are

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Speaker 1: resigned first, and we're gonna take a close look at

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Speaker 1: a few players each week leading into mid March. And

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Speaker 1: we're starting this week with wide receiver Ashton Duan and

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Speaker 1: linebacker Bobby Ocak. The deep dive into o'cake that'll come

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Speaker 1: out later this week, but right now we're leading off

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Speaker 1: with Ashton due And there's no one better to talk

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Speaker 1: wide receiver play than the wide receiver for the Indianapolis

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Speaker 1: Colts former cult Bill Brooks, and the Ring of Honor

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Speaker 1: Casey Valier is here as well, and none of those

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Speaker 1: criteria I meet. None of you do not, nor do

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Speaker 1: I nor do why that's why Bill is here. Guys.

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Speaker 1: Yes you guys. High tide lifts all boats, Casey. Right,

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Speaker 1: isn't that what they say? So let's break it down here. Uh,

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Speaker 1: first of all, how is your off season going, Bill?

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Speaker 1: Because these last couple of weekends, I guess three to

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Speaker 1: four weekends now since the end of the season prior

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Speaker 1: to the super Bowl being played this Sunday, these weekends

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Speaker 1: feel like weeks because we have nowhere to be for

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Speaker 1: twelve hours on a Sunday. It's it's weird having this

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Speaker 1: much time to ourselves, I think so far. Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: been a little different from me right now. You know,

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Speaker 1: my wife says she sees me home now. She says, no,

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Speaker 1: you have a lot of time, so let's get to work.

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Speaker 1: He pos. So, there's a lot of work going on

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Speaker 1: around the house, um, at the Brooks residence right now

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Speaker 1: because I have some time. So yeah, it's been a

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Speaker 1: little slow, but um, you know, I had an opportunity

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Speaker 1: to do some stuff around the house and got some

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Speaker 1: things done at a boy even Ring of Honor members.

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Speaker 1: Casey still have a Honeydoo list. He's a normal he's

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Speaker 1: a normal guy. Oh yes, oh yes, Well, let's get

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Speaker 1: into it Ashton Dulin today. We'll talk more free agents

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Speaker 1: later this week, and then obviously a couple of per

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Speaker 1: week heading into the middle of March. Like we talked about,

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Speaker 1: but Ashton Dulin came back last season as a restricted

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Speaker 1: free agent. In twenty twenty two, Fellas twelve games, had

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Speaker 1: fifteen catches, two hundred and seven yards and a touchdown.

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Speaker 1: Suffered a foot injury in the middle of the season

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Speaker 1: that cost him four games. He also missed a game

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Speaker 1: late in the season with a concussion. So I want

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Speaker 1: to start bill with at the beginning of the year,

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Speaker 1: Dueling was having a really hot start. He had fifteen

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Speaker 1: catches on the season, as we said, eight of them, though,

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Speaker 1: came in the first two weeks of the year. What

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Speaker 1: did you make of Dulan's overall involvement in the offense

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Speaker 1: this past season, you know, going on to trning camp

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Speaker 1: and watching training camp and watching Ashton performing training camp,

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Speaker 1: I thought that, you know, he would be involved in

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Speaker 1: the offense. I know how much he would be involved,

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Speaker 1: because of course you had Pitt, you have Alec, and

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Speaker 1: you have Paris. You know, hopefully everyone stays healthy and

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Speaker 1: going to play, but didn't know exactly what he how

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Speaker 1: much he would be involved. But I thought he would

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Speaker 1: play about maybe fifteen twenty percent of the offensive snaps,

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Speaker 1: help some guys out. Guys could when didn't come in,

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Speaker 1: help out, maybe have some special plays for Ashton. Could

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Speaker 1: Ashton have some speed, could use his speed out there,

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Speaker 1: and also ask him is pretty big for blocking, so

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Speaker 1: I thought he would play a little bit more. But

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Speaker 1: unfortunately the injury. I think the rail some of it.

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Speaker 1: But I was wanting to see a little bit more

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Speaker 1: from Ashton. I like what he did in training camp.

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Speaker 1: He showed that he can't go out there catch some

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Speaker 1: balls and play. And I thought when he did have

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Speaker 1: an opportunity to play, especially in the Jacksonville game when

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Speaker 1: when Pittman and Pears were out, he did some nice thing.

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Speaker 1: He made some nice catches out there. So he was

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Speaker 1: productive when he had opportunity to play. Yeah, Casey, if

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Speaker 1: you go back to the start of training, can't remember

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Speaker 1: all the way back in August right, the different movers

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Speaker 1: and shakers within this offense. Matt Ryan. One of Matt

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Speaker 1: Ryan's favorite targets was doin. We just didn't see that

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Speaker 1: consistently obviously throughout the year. I think a big part

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Speaker 1: of that was just everything else around it. I mean

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Speaker 1: Bill brought up the injury. I mean you mentioned how

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Speaker 1: he missed a couple different times here and there. Also,

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Speaker 1: I think where he was stacked up on the depth chart,

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Speaker 1: you look at the guys in front of him, I

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Speaker 1: think you know, Pittman had a typical, you know, workload

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Speaker 1: of what you expected for him. I thought Alec Pierce

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Speaker 1: maybe earlier than people thought, kind of you know, found

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Speaker 1: a nice niche inside the offense. And then with Paris

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Speaker 1: you weren't really sure what you were going to get

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Speaker 1: prior to the season because of that injury bug that

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Speaker 1: he's had, but him being able to stay healthy and

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Speaker 1: consistent inside what this offense was. You kind of had

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Speaker 1: three guys that were already ahead of Ashton. I know

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Speaker 1: he had a good he had a good camp and

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Speaker 1: all of that, but ultimately you kind of knew where

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Speaker 1: he was going to stack up. Then you had the

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Speaker 1: injury concerns and also kind of the up and down

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Speaker 1: play at the quarterback spot. I think all of that

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Speaker 1: kind of played into it. I don't think prior to

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Speaker 1: the year I expected Ashton to have huge numbers because

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Speaker 1: ultimately I looked at him as that third or fourth guy,

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Speaker 1: and that third one based on the injury concerns we'd

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Speaker 1: seen through Paris through his first part of his career.

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Speaker 1: So ultimately I wasn't expecting huge numbers out of Ashton.

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Speaker 1: I didn't expect a little bit more than what we saw,

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Speaker 1: but I think there were a lot of things that

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Speaker 1: played into that. Yeah, I agree with you. I didn't

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Speaker 1: expect huge numbers from Ashton. Also going into the season,

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Speaker 1: we also heard a lot about Nahem Hines at the time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: playing some wide receive it being out there, So no,

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Speaker 1: he was going to take some numbers. If Ashton wasn't

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Speaker 1: going to get some playing time, he would probably take

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Speaker 1: some numbers away from Ashton him being out there. So

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Speaker 1: we didn't see Ashon out there a lot. So, like

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Speaker 1: you said, Casey, I didn't expect huge numbers, but I

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Speaker 1: expect a little bit more from him this year. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you guys just kind of hit on it a little bit.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Dulan in terms of progress coming back, as

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Speaker 1: we said, restricted free agent last year, but then you

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Speaker 1: had Paris Campbell staying healthy for seventeen games for the

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Speaker 1: first time in his career, really kind of took the

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Speaker 1: next step as far as availability and production. Alec Pierce

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Speaker 1: as a rookie obviously hit the rookie roll a wall

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Speaker 1: towards the end of the season, but I think the

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Speaker 1: Colts probably got more out of him than some had expected.

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Speaker 1: With that in mind, Bill, I mean, those two guys,

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Speaker 1: how much did they sort of roadblock what Ashton duling

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Speaker 1: could have been and what he can be within the offense,

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Speaker 1: if that's fair to say, Yeah, I think they did,

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Speaker 1: you know, play a part in Ashton not getting on

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Speaker 1: the field as much, definitely, because I think we all

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Speaker 1: were wondering is Paras gonna be able to play seventeen

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Speaker 1: weeks this year? And thank god he did play seventeen weeks.

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Speaker 1: I'm happy for the young man that he had an

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Speaker 1: opportunity to play seventeen weeks this season and contribute to

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Speaker 1: the offense. And then Alec coming in as a as

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Speaker 1: a rookie, not knowing how he was going to develop,

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Speaker 1: So he came into camp and showed that he can

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Speaker 1: play the National Football League, that he can be productive

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Speaker 1: out there. So him playing and him growing as a

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Speaker 1: wide receiver also had an effect on Aston not getting

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Speaker 1: out there on the football field, And as as long

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Speaker 1: as those two were developing, it was going to hold

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Speaker 1: somebody back, and Ashton was a guy that I think

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Speaker 1: it held back. So I'm happy for the guys that

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Speaker 1: you know, helped out as far as like Alec and Paris,

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Speaker 1: but for Ashton had held him back a little bit.

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Speaker 1: And when you're a young receiver, tryumph to develop. And

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Speaker 1: he want this year to be his kind of his

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Speaker 1: stepping stone to you know, go out there and be

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Speaker 1: able to produce as a wide receiver. But when you

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Speaker 1: don't have the opportunity to do it, and you have

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Speaker 1: guys in front of you that are playing and playing well,

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Speaker 1: and then also with the injuries, as we talked about earlier,

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Speaker 1: that's going to hold you back a little bit. All right,

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Speaker 1: let's go a different way. How much of Doolan's involvement

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Speaker 1: in the third phase of the game special teams, Casey,

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Speaker 1: how much should that be considered in his free agency profile?

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Speaker 1: Because two years ago in twenty twenty one, he was

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Speaker 1: named second team All Pro. That season, he had stints

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Speaker 1: as a kickoff returner. He was a great gunner, but

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Speaker 1: those responsibilities in terms of the returns, they they've gone

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Speaker 1: primarily to Isaiah Rodgers and Dallas Flowers, and you would think,

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Speaker 1: based on what Dallas did last year, he's gonna be

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Speaker 1: in two twenty three the Colts kickoff returner. So how

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Speaker 1: much should special teams weigh into the Colts possibly bringing

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Speaker 1: him back in free agent? See, I think it's huge

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Speaker 1: because when we get to that point in training camp

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Speaker 1: when you're looking at numbers, you're looking at who's going

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Speaker 1: to make that final fifty three, and you're looking at

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Speaker 1: it just based off of a number standpoint, a lot

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Speaker 1: of times those fourth and fifth receivers, if you happen

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Speaker 1: to keep him more six. A big part of that

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Speaker 1: is playing special teams and Ashton Dulan is a guy

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Speaker 1: who has proven it time and time again that he

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Speaker 1: is a core special team and I think that's part

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Speaker 1: of what you saw this year too. It was a

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Speaker 1: very young special teams group. So having a guy like

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Speaker 1: Dulan who can give you that veteran, you know, leadership

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Speaker 1: inside that room also does limit his ability on the

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Speaker 1: offensive side of the football. So I think that is

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Speaker 1: a key that when you look at those guys on

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Speaker 1: that back end of the roster where you know, let's

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Speaker 1: say the Colts resign Ashton Duelan and you get to

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Speaker 1: that point in camp where you're like, all right, we're

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Speaker 1: we're looking at numbers and you gotta keep Let's say

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Speaker 1: it's five and Ashton Dulan's one of those guys. It's

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Speaker 1: really hard to say we can't, we don't want him

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Speaker 1: because he does have that other aspect of his game,

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Speaker 1: which he plays in special teams that has mad mentioned it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this guy was an All Pro as a

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Speaker 1: special teamer. He contributes and it's not in just as

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Speaker 1: a returner. I mean he does all of the other

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Speaker 1: work and that is so key when you're looking at

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Speaker 1: breaking down your roster because those are a very important part.

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Speaker 1: I mean we have seen it here in the Colts

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Speaker 1: last handful of years. This is a team that is

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Speaker 1: near the top and special teams and part of that

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Speaker 1: is having guys who can play multiple areas. In Ashton

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Speaker 1: Dulan is definitely one of those. Yeah, you know you

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Speaker 1: want to you know how this team emphasized special team,

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Speaker 1: so you want guys that are going to contribute on

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Speaker 1: special teams and contribute at a high level. Right Aston's

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Speaker 1: one of those guys that can do that. He is.

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Speaker 1: He has a talent to go out there and contribute.

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Speaker 1: As you mentioned, Casey, when you're at one of those

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Speaker 1: guys in the roster where you're you know, maybe fourth

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Speaker 1: third or fourth fifth as far as a wide receivers concerned,

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Speaker 1: you want to be able to do something else out

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Speaker 1: there on football field to show that, hey, I'm I

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Speaker 1: should be a part of this football team. And Ashton

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Speaker 1: can do that. As far as special teams, you guy,

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Speaker 1: he's a guy that has returned kickoff as well, so

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Speaker 1: he can returning kickoffs. Of course, he plays on the

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Speaker 1: positions on special teams that can help this team. So

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Speaker 1: I think that that helps Ashton's case when he's talking about, hey,

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Speaker 1: who's gonna beyond this team? When you go out there

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Speaker 1: and can play a bunch of teams. The more you

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Speaker 1: can do, the ads we have in the locker room

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Speaker 1: and say, the more you can do when you can

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Speaker 1: do more things and give you a better opportunity to

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Speaker 1: make a football team. I mean, just think about a

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Speaker 1: guy that we saw go through that whole you know,

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Speaker 1: that step by step process in Zach Pascal. And he's

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Speaker 1: a guy who's you know, he's with the Eagles playing

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Speaker 1: for a Super Bowl here, and one of the things

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Speaker 1: that he continued to look at his Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: look at his value because he can do so many

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Speaker 1: different things. And it's also one of the things that

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Speaker 1: I think Ashton proved over the last couple of years

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Speaker 1: that if he is like let's say there's an injury too,

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Speaker 1: you know, a a Michael Pittman or Alec Pierce where

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Speaker 1: you have to slide him in there, you're comfortable in

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Speaker 1: him playing in that spot too. So I think that

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Speaker 1: is so important as well, is you know what he

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Speaker 1: gives you on special teams, which you're also comfortable with

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Speaker 1: him inside the framework of the offense, no question about it.

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Speaker 1: Well said, Well, put right there. And then looking big

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Speaker 1: picture again, we're going to talk about all all of

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Speaker 1: these free agents coming up down the pike here as

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Speaker 1: we get closer to the middle of March. But Paris

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Speaker 1: Campbell is also a free agent. He'll have his own vignette,

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Speaker 1: his own podcast, just like we're doing here with Ashton Dulan,

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Speaker 1: but looking ahead a little bit bill with with Paris Campbell.

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Speaker 1: Also in that you know, free agency portal, that's the

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Speaker 1: right word, you know, we've kind of throw that around now,

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Speaker 1: and but I mean, did the Colts need to ensure

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Speaker 1: they sign at least one of their in house free

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Speaker 1: agent wide receivers, whether they be Paris Campbell or Ashton

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Speaker 1: Dulon or can you really look at it like that

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Speaker 1: if you're the GM, well, I think you're a gym,

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Speaker 1: and if you look at the gym's track record, he

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Speaker 1: likes to sign Chris Ballot, that is, likes to sign

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Speaker 1: his own. He likes to keep his own in house.

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Speaker 1: So he knows what he's getting with those individuals. He

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Speaker 1: knows Paris Cambell very well. He's seen him how he practices,

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Speaker 1: what he does on the football field. Now, he had

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Speaker 1: a whole season to see what Paris did last year,

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Speaker 1: and you played the whole season, played well, did a

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Speaker 1: nice job. He knows what Ashton Dolon can do as

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Speaker 1: far as special teams and at wide receiver, and he's developing.

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Speaker 1: So I think that helps, hopefully helps Christ to make

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Speaker 1: a decision on what he wants to do moving forward

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Speaker 1: with those guys. I think what's gonna be the ultimate

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Speaker 1: choice of whoever's going to be the head coach is

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Speaker 1: who's going to be the head coach and what type

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Speaker 1: offensive system they're gonna have. So I think that plays

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Speaker 1: a big partner on who's gonna return, who's gonna come back,

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Speaker 1: because I think, you know, do these guys fit into

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Speaker 1: the system in the scheme that the offensive coordinator, the

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Speaker 1: head coach wants to run here. So I think that's

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Speaker 1: gonna play a big part going forward for these two individuals. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I completely agree with that. And my biggest thing with

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Speaker 1: both of these guys your Paris Campbell's you'r Ashton Duelan's

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Speaker 1: you know what you have and I don't think you know,

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Speaker 1: this is not a stavity, but they're not guys that

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Speaker 1: are going to break the bank. So I think ultimately

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Speaker 1: you look at this and you go, yeah, you can

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Speaker 1: bring one or two of those guys back, But I

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Speaker 1: also think you're going to be bringing multiple guys in,

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Speaker 1: And I think part of that goes into what you

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Speaker 1: get as the head coach. He might have a couple

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Speaker 1: of guys that he really likes to target for it

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Speaker 1: for the way that they do certain things that he's

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Speaker 1: had experience with as well. I wouldn't be shocked to

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Speaker 1: see multiple guys brought back. I mean I'm acting honestly.

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Speaker 1: I expect both Dulan and Campbell and then also a

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Speaker 1: couple additional guys. Wide receiver is always one of those

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Speaker 1: things that it's very fluid. You're always trying to figure

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Speaker 1: out who those guys that can step in and who's

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Speaker 1: those guys that can grow into a certain spot, and

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Speaker 1: you're always trying to get better. And I think that's

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Speaker 1: one area that you look at the way this receiver

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Speaker 1: group played this year. I think you look at it

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Speaker 1: and go, you know what we got. We got a

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Speaker 1: pretty good amount out of it, but you still want more.

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Speaker 1: So I don't think that it's gonna be one of

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Speaker 1: those things where you bring one or two of these

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Speaker 1: guys back and that's it. I think there's gonna be

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Speaker 1: a handful of guys they bring in. All right, one

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Speaker 1: final one, Casey, stay right there, because you just hit

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Speaker 1: on it. You look at Dulan in his career fifty

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Speaker 1: five games over five seasons, thirty three catches, four hundred

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Speaker 1: and fifty yards, three touchdowns for his career. Do we

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Speaker 1: know what the book is on Ashton Dulan in the NFL? Yet?

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Speaker 1: I mean, how much bigger is his ceiling and is

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Speaker 1: that worth exploring and free agency for the Colts. That's

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Speaker 1: a great question because I think we don't know what

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Speaker 1: we have yet. There has been so many lashes and

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Speaker 1: quarterbacks and quarterback and you can say that for everybody's

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Speaker 1: skill player one hundred. I think that is a really

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Speaker 1: good point because you just don't know. I think once

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Speaker 1: you get the stability there, you can really start to

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Speaker 1: evaluate your talent. And with a guy like Dulan, he's

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Speaker 1: got a lot of traits that you just you don't

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Speaker 1: see in every single receiver. He has got explosive speed,

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Speaker 1: he's got good size. There's a lot there that you saw.

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Speaker 1: I mean we saw it when Carson Wentz was here.

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Speaker 1: There were a handful of designed plays for go routes

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Speaker 1: for Ashton Dulan, and that was one area you're like, Wow,

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Speaker 1: this is your big play guy. And then you saw

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Speaker 1: a little bit more, you know as maybe even more

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Speaker 1: possession receiver, a little bit you know here and there.

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Speaker 1: So there is a lot to his game we don't know.

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Speaker 1: And you meet Ashton Dulin, there's a lot there that

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Speaker 1: you like about the guy as a person. You see

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Speaker 1: his work habits and how much he has you know,

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Speaker 1: a guy from Malone who you know, you never even

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Speaker 1: heard of Malone, it doesn't even have a football program anymore.

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Speaker 1: He's worked his way up from an undrafted guy to

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Speaker 1: a guy that last year we were talking about you.

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Speaker 1: He's definitely on the team. So that's one of the

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Speaker 1: things you like to see in a player. So there's

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Speaker 1: a lot there. He's still young, so there's a lot

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Speaker 1: that I like to see. There's some untapped potential, So

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Speaker 1: it's one of those things that for me, there is

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Speaker 1: definitely more I want to uncover from Ashton Dowland. I

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Speaker 1: think you can find more at And the reason I

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Speaker 1: say that is because, as you said, he's twenty five

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Speaker 1: years old now, he'll be twenty six in May. Young

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Speaker 1: guy that's played in the National Football League. Unfortunately, last year,

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Speaker 1: as we talked about earlier, had the injury was placed

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Speaker 1: on injured reserve, was an act of four game, so

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Speaker 1: he missed five games, so that hurt his development. And

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Speaker 1: I think if he can continue to develop and work

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Speaker 1: on his skill as a wide receiver, I think you'll

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Speaker 1: see the talent really come out. Because as you say, Casey,

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Speaker 1: he's six to two, two hundred and fifteen pounds a

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Speaker 1: big guy does a good job blocking down field for

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Speaker 1: the running backs. I remember watching a game, the Houston

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Speaker 1: game last year at Houston when he led kind of

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Speaker 1: led JT on a run that JT got a lot

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Speaker 1: of a lot of you are, but he got a

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Speaker 1: quality run out of the play because Ashton Dulane led

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Speaker 1: into blocking there. So he can block downfield some of

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Speaker 1: the things you look for in a wide receiver outside

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Speaker 1: just going out there running the house and catching ball,

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Speaker 1: blocking downfield, and he can do that because he has

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Speaker 1: that size. So I think there's a lot more Ashton

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Speaker 1: Duling can bring to a team, And hopefully we'll see

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Speaker 1: what happens going forward for the young man. There you go,

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Speaker 1: that's Bill Brooks right there, breaking down wide receiver play.

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Speaker 1: I got a hunch, Bill, you're gonna be back talking

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Speaker 1: about Paris Campbell in a few weeks. We'll see you

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Speaker 1: might be doing. We'll see what happens. I mean, he's

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Speaker 1: the one. Look you're gonna be the one that determines

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Speaker 1: that you're gonna be bad. It's final. There you go,

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Speaker 1: Bill Brooks right there, Casey Valie. Our first installments of

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Speaker 1: the Free Agent Tracker Quick Digestible looks at free agents

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Speaker 1: for the Indianapolis Colts. Guys, have a great rest of

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Speaker 1: the week. Bill continue on that Honey du list man

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Speaker 1: chip away one at a time, and it's long too.

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Speaker 1: I will there you go. We'll find hired up soon again.

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Speaker 1: I'm Matt Taylor for Bill Brooks, Casey Valia. We'll do

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Speaker 1: it again later this week with a look at Bobby Okarakay,

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Speaker 1: we'll switch over to the defensive side of the ball.

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Speaker 1: The free agent linebacker might be in line for a

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Speaker 1: big payday. We'll break it down next time here on

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Speaker 1: the Free Agent Tracker podcast, Colts dot com, the Colts

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Speaker 1: Mobile app, and the Colts Audio Network. So long, everybody,