1 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,639 Speaker 1: Welcome back to another edition of All the Smoke Jack. 2 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:30,360 Speaker 1: What's going on? Nothing? Just feeling old man, Just feeling 3 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:33,160 Speaker 1: old from he's got down basketball, working out and ship 4 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 1: and it's killing me right now, killing me. Man. Let's 5 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:40,280 Speaker 1: welcome to the show. Uh Man, someone I grew up 6 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:43,400 Speaker 1: watching a big fan of defining all the odds to 7 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 1: be able to play fourteen years uh in the NBA 8 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:51,640 Speaker 1: and really make it possible for people like Nate Robinson 9 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: and uh I t and some of the smaller players 10 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 1: to kind of find their lane in the big band's game. Man. 11 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: Welcome to the show. Muggsy Bogues, what's our fellas? Appreciate 12 00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: how's life going? We know you got your new book, 13 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 1: Muggs in My Life from the Kid in the Projects 14 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 1: to the Gulfather's small Ball. How's life going for you? 15 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:12,720 Speaker 1: Right now? It's going well. Man. I cannot complain, not 16 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:15,320 Speaker 1: one bit. You know, people won't listen to it anyway, 17 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:18,480 Speaker 1: But yeah, I'm doing well man. Things are going great. Um. 18 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,720 Speaker 1: This is my second memoir that I'm putting out. My 19 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 1: very first one was in nineteen four. It was called 20 00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 1: the End of the the Land of Jihnts and that was 21 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:30,679 Speaker 1: kind of you know, when they came to me to 22 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 1: but they presented to me, and when I decided to 23 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 1: do that book, Um, it was mainly when my father 24 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 1: had just passed away and my best friend, one of 25 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,240 Speaker 1: my best friend, Reggie Lewis, had passed away a week 26 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:44,639 Speaker 1: right afterwards. So um, and it was kind of mainly 27 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 1: talking about me making the NBA and that sort of stuff. 28 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 1: But this one has a lot more substance. Um, it's 29 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 1: a lot more information in terms of, you know, some 30 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 1: of the players that I had impacted in the league, 31 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 1: guys like the longso Marti, Larry Johnson, I got Stephen 32 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 1: or doing my forwarding the impact that I had on 33 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 1: him growing up. It's more of a passionate book as well. Um, 34 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,959 Speaker 1: Relationships and men. My wife, you know, which is kind 35 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 1: of unheard of. We got divorce and we was divorced 36 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,280 Speaker 1: for ten years and then all of a sudden, you know, 37 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:18,680 Speaker 1: we found ourselves back to one another that we remarried 38 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 1: in which was unheard of. So it's about you know, 39 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,919 Speaker 1: relationships is about getting back to the community as well 40 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: as some of the impact that I had on some 41 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 1: of the players that I played with. I'm looking forward 42 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 1: to to to read and also tell us about your 43 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 1: Doctor that was released on the NBA TV. Oh, they 44 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:37,680 Speaker 1: always believe that that was special. Man. I was really 45 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: appreciate the NBA uh taking that time and going behind 46 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: the scenes and and giving some attention to you know, 47 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: my career. Um of course, you know, being the smallest 48 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:52,359 Speaker 1: to ever do it, and people not really believing you know, 49 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 1: a guy my side was capable doing it. But you know, 50 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 1: and for me, you know, it was just the game 51 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:01,880 Speaker 1: and um and I never looked at anything different. You know, 52 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: people don't realize, you know, I was a starter most 53 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,560 Speaker 1: of my career. It wasn't you know. I came off 54 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: the bench when I landed part of my career, especially 55 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,920 Speaker 1: when I got hurt. And but I had, you know, 56 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 1: opportunity to put my stamp on this, on this game, 57 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: and and and give some inspiration to a lot of 58 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: guys who now playing the game who didn't believe the 59 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:23,680 Speaker 1: day possibly you know, could play at that level. And 60 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: I'm just grateful that we was able to break down 61 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 1: the barriers, not only just myself, to Michael Adams, to 62 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:31,840 Speaker 1: Spud Webs and Charlie Chris as well. The money tell 63 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: those guys, so you know, you gotta get probs talk 64 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,360 Speaker 1: to us about your upbringing. We've had a few Baltimore 65 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 1: guys on the show that the common theme is it's 66 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: you know, it's it's tough out there, you know what 67 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: I mean. Your brother was addicted to drugs, pops uh 68 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 1: served some time. What was your childhood in in in 69 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:51,040 Speaker 1: teenage years like in Baltimore. Well, it was challenging. You know, 70 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 1: there was challenging growing up in the city of Baltimore. 71 00:03:53,240 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 1: You know, at the age of five, I got shot 72 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: you no man at the wrong place at the wrong time. 73 00:03:57,240 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: And you know, that's the type of environment that we 74 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:03,160 Speaker 1: we grew up and but for us, you know, as kids, 75 00:04:03,160 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: you don't know any differences like normal It's like normalcy 76 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: in terms of trying to just adjust to the environment 77 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:10,440 Speaker 1: and to the atmosphere that you you know, you raised 78 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 1: them um playing you know, trying to pursue that game 79 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 1: as well as trying to grow up. You know again, 80 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 1: you know, you have to look over your shoulders quite 81 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 1: a bit. But at the same time, you know, we 82 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:25,839 Speaker 1: had a dream that was floating around in my head myself, 83 00:04:25,880 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 1: Reggie Wams, you know, Reggid Whims, and I was like Mutton, 84 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:31,279 Speaker 1: Jeff uh He and I grew up together in the 85 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: inter steady of Baltimore, and being here and I was 86 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:35,719 Speaker 1: able to push one another and keep each other on 87 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,719 Speaker 1: the on the on the same path, motivate one another 88 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:42,800 Speaker 1: and take that journey and understand that we had an 89 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:46,039 Speaker 1: opportunity to not only do something for ourselves, but do 90 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:49,040 Speaker 1: something for our families and um, you know, so we 91 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 1: had to try to, you know, keep out nose cleaned, 92 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 1: if you will, make sure that we understood how the 93 00:04:55,880 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 1: importance of what the education was back then, because growing up, 94 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:02,919 Speaker 1: you know, big terminology that was floating around was dump jocks, 95 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: dumb jocks and having players that came before us and 96 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,720 Speaker 1: you know, the guys like the skit Wise, the Ernie Grahams, 97 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:15,000 Speaker 1: Dwayne Wood and Kevin Bush, those guys befause having the 98 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 1: opportunity to witness those guys play the game and taking 99 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 1: it as far as they could, but not even to 100 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 1: ticket to the highest level, which was the NBA. It 101 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:25,599 Speaker 1: just gave us, you know, that that that inspiration that 102 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 1: we can you know, change the directory not only for 103 00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: our our families, but for our community as well. In 104 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 1: terms of the brand of basketball we have plating out. 105 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 1: I want to back put the rook kid, because you 106 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 1: kind of just slid over like it was nothing. You 107 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:40,160 Speaker 1: said you got shot at five, and you talked to 108 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:45,040 Speaker 1: us about that. Well, yeah, you know, as I said, 109 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,280 Speaker 1: the neighborhood where we grew up, I mean, growing up 110 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:49,960 Speaker 1: in the inter city. You grew up a lot quicker 111 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:52,680 Speaker 1: than probably in some of the suburbs, and you're exposed 112 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 1: to things that you didn't realize as a kid that 113 00:05:55,720 --> 00:06:01,320 Speaker 1: you would be witnesses at that early age. And outside 114 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 1: of our apartment building a fight had broken out and 115 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,720 Speaker 1: coursed me inquisitive mine wanted to see what was going on. 116 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 1: I snuck out the house and one of the kids 117 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 1: took a rock and broke one of the store owners windows, 118 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:15,560 Speaker 1: and the store that came out went straight to his 119 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 1: shed and grabbed his double burrow shotgun and just start 120 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 1: shooting in the neighborhood. And fortunate enough for myself, the 121 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: bullet went over my head, but then all the buckshots 122 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: went through my arms and then my legs, which I 123 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 1: still carry one in my arm to keep me up 124 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 1: and remind us where I've coming from. Um, And you know, 125 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: those are the things that for me I think I 126 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 1: look at it to to two with two folds because 127 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:42,720 Speaker 1: at that same time, early on, you know, I used 128 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 1: to go try to put through the game of basketball, 129 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:47,880 Speaker 1: and a lot of kids used to make fun of me, 130 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:50,039 Speaker 1: you know, if the butt of everybody jokes because of 131 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:52,039 Speaker 1: my height and the ball was so big and I 132 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 1: didn't know how to control it. But after that incident, 133 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:58,040 Speaker 1: in terms of being shot, going through that dramatic experience, 134 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:02,680 Speaker 1: I think it shines it changed my mindset because, you know, 135 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:05,160 Speaker 1: once again when I went back on that basketball court 136 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 1: and heard the kids, you know, hurling all the little 137 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: small jokes they could possibly come out of their mouth 138 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,240 Speaker 1: and didn't have the same impact that it once did. 139 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,240 Speaker 1: And probably I'm quite sure that the dramatic experience that 140 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: I just alluded to what I went through by being shot, 141 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: you know, the least of my words was their words. 142 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 1: You know. I was just still frustrated that I didn't 143 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: know how to play the game of basketball at the time, 144 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 1: and that I didn't have anything to come back them 145 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:33,640 Speaker 1: with in terms of being able to compete and shut 146 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: them down in that regard, when did you feel like 147 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 1: you kind of got a grasp of the game and 148 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: really start to fall in love with the game of basketball. 149 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 1: Well at the age of seven, that's when I met 150 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 1: my blessing, Mr Leon Howard. I think me and REDG. 151 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:46,960 Speaker 1: Maggie when we both met him at the same time, 152 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 1: because we was at our recreation center and while we 153 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:52,920 Speaker 1: was down there playing with this ball. Here it is. 154 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:56,280 Speaker 1: I just met REDG that day and this little young 155 00:07:56,440 --> 00:07:59,960 Speaker 1: man come walking up in approaches. He's about five seven. Uh. 156 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 1: He was a former collegiate basketball player. He happened to 157 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: be the director of our recreations and at the time, 158 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 1: and he saw us playing with the ball and he 159 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: asked us where we're interested in learning the game of basketball? 160 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 1: A little that we knew we was meeting out blessing 161 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 1: the guy that had all the information that we possibly 162 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:22,280 Speaker 1: that we needed to change our whole perspective of life. 163 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 1: And with Mr Howell did for us, not only did 164 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 1: he drilled us shopping up our skills and still the 165 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,560 Speaker 1: knowledge in terms of the game of basketball, but he 166 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: gave kids vision that we didn't think that existed growing 167 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,839 Speaker 1: up in that inner city. And by him taking that 168 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 1: you know, mentorship and that role in terms of kiding 169 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 1: for those individuals in the neighborhood. It changed so many 170 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,079 Speaker 1: of kids lives and I'm so thankful that we had 171 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:53,960 Speaker 1: a guy of his caliber being able to change us 172 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,680 Speaker 1: and give us a means of what life could be. 173 00:08:56,960 --> 00:09:00,320 Speaker 1: You know where the nickname mugs he comes from come 174 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 1: from playing the game of basketball at the age of 175 00:09:02,520 --> 00:09:06,200 Speaker 1: seven years. Oh, I'm out there still on the ball. 176 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 1: And I'll tell you before, at the beginning, guys didn't 177 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:12,680 Speaker 1: want to pick me because of my size and everything 178 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 1: and so forth, and because you know, they thought that 179 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:17,719 Speaker 1: they was getting a kid that couldn't compete with all 180 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:20,680 Speaker 1: the other kids. And um and one giving morning, I 181 00:09:20,679 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 1: mean one one day, one of the kids couldn't play 182 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 1: because they saw me down their plan on the on 183 00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 1: these milk crates. I you know, because when I didn't 184 00:09:29,280 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 1: get picked, I got a little creative. I just cut 185 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 1: to cut the bottom out of milk crates and I 186 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,439 Speaker 1: tied it on each end of defense. And I gather 187 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: a couple of little kids around who wasn't playing, and 188 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 1: we had something with great milk Creek basketball that I 189 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:46,520 Speaker 1: can never imagine. And then from that, playing milk Creek basketball, 190 00:09:46,559 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 1: one of the kids on the basketball could on a 191 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:50,760 Speaker 1: big goal. I should say he had to leave. So 192 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 1: one of the kids holler, hey, you little shrimp, you 193 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:56,479 Speaker 1: want to play. Of course, this was my moment, my opportunity, 194 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: because I already felt like I had the skill set 195 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 1: now because with Mr Howe had instilled in me. And 196 00:10:02,760 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 1: then once I played against my first opponent, of course 197 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 1: he dribbled the ball. I stole it from it right away, 198 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 1: he laid it up, and then he tried to do 199 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: it the second time. I stole it from him again, 200 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 1: gave it to my teammate and he scored. And the 201 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:16,120 Speaker 1: third time he tried to get a little more aggressive 202 00:10:16,160 --> 00:10:18,760 Speaker 1: because he was much bigger than myself, and of course 203 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 1: I gave him a fake one way and went around 204 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 1: the other, stole it from him again and laid it up. 205 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:25,719 Speaker 1: And then of course this guy got holly man hold 206 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 1: on this through the kid out. He had mugging you, man, 207 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 1: mugging you all over the place. And it was a 208 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:32,640 Speaker 1: show we used to come on every Saturday called the 209 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 1: Botary Boys, and one of the characters he was a 210 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 1: small guy. His name was Buggy, and they kind of 211 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:43,080 Speaker 1: tied my aggressively for playing basketball. And I've been Muggy 212 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 1: ever since. I was seven years old. You know, no one, 213 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:49,319 Speaker 1: no my mom and named me Tyrone Curtis. Your high 214 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: school career arguably one of the greatest high school teams 215 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:57,440 Speaker 1: of all time at Dunbar had yourself, Reggie Williams, David 216 00:10:57,480 --> 00:11:01,520 Speaker 1: Wingate in the late great Reggie low Us, your junior 217 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:05,200 Speaker 1: and senior year fifty nine and oh talk to us 218 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: about that team, in the relationships you developed and just 219 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 1: how fun it was. Uh played high school with all 220 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:12,439 Speaker 1: those guys that ended up being in the NBA long 221 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:15,400 Speaker 1: with yourself. Oh man, that was special time back then. 222 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 1: I mean here it is. It's well before these guys 223 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 1: now you do. You know, you do a lot of 224 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:22,679 Speaker 1: recruiting where they got these prep schools, they got these 225 00:11:22,679 --> 00:11:25,600 Speaker 1: guys trying to build this dominant program. We all just 226 00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 1: looked in the neighborhood, you know, the discrete the school 227 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:30,880 Speaker 1: with just right across the street. For myself and my mom, 228 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,800 Speaker 1: everybody went to dumb By everybody in my family. Um, 229 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:38,439 Speaker 1: same with Redge and wing Gate and all those guys. Um. 230 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:40,200 Speaker 1: And when we all got there, I mean we knew 231 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: that we were we had something special because we compete 232 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:45,600 Speaker 1: against one another during the summer, you know, we lived 233 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: in Lawfare projects wing Gating them lived up to see Sekirk. 234 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:50,560 Speaker 1: So we used to play number all the time and 235 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 1: compete against them, you know, and I always I always 236 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 1: get on them. How we used to get the better 237 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 1: them all the time when we played against them. But 238 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: when we had the opportunity to play with each other, 239 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 1: I mean that was really special. People don't understand that 240 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:06,839 Speaker 1: we had eleven guys. Actually it's just a fifteen of 241 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:11,079 Speaker 1: those players all got Division one scholarship, all got Division 242 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:14,240 Speaker 1: one scholarships. And Reggie William I mean Reggie Loris, the 243 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,199 Speaker 1: late Reggie Loss I should say Rager was out six man. 244 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,480 Speaker 1: He didn't even start. He came off the bench. And uh, 245 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:22,480 Speaker 1: but you know it was a special time. It was 246 00:12:22,559 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 1: all credit to Coach Wade. You know, Coach Wade was 247 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:27,960 Speaker 1: the ultimate leader. You know, he was the one that 248 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: understood who we were. He was empathetic, He knew what 249 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 1: made his tick, he knew what where we came from. 250 00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 1: He knew how much talent we have. So we made 251 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 1: each and everybody accountable and but more and and also 252 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:42,200 Speaker 1: he gave us vision. You know, we had clarity. We 253 00:12:42,280 --> 00:12:46,719 Speaker 1: understood what the mission was at had but more importantly gratitude. 254 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:49,960 Speaker 1: We was grateful, you know, we was really grateful to 255 00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 1: be with one another. But we also understood the importance 256 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 1: of how to win and how to lose. And fortunate 257 00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:57,439 Speaker 1: enough for us with enough experienced the losing side, you know, 258 00:12:57,559 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 1: because he was a former professional football player who really 259 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:04,560 Speaker 1: was a disciplinary and he really stressed how to conduct 260 00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: yourself one and office was important. Talked to us a 261 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:09,959 Speaker 1: little bit because I don't think he has talked about 262 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:13,559 Speaker 1: enough the late great Reggie Lewis who lost his life. 263 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:16,800 Speaker 1: Uh why playing for the Boston Celtics. Um. You know, 264 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:18,959 Speaker 1: you touched on growing up with him and get a 265 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: chance to play with him. But what kind of person 266 00:13:21,320 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: was he? Off the court? Rag was unbelievable. Him and 267 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:29,320 Speaker 1: Reggie Williams, they were too mirrors. They were identical. Both 268 00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 1: were quiet, didn't talk much. There was assassin when they 269 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:36,760 Speaker 1: got on the floor. Their game was kind of similar 270 00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:39,040 Speaker 1: to one another. The only thing with Red was that, 271 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:44,120 Speaker 1: you know, Rad was more of a slasher. And when 272 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:46,920 Speaker 1: he became the first All Star amongst all of us, 273 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:52,800 Speaker 1: and he took Boston to Heights where nobody thought they 274 00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 1: would go. After Lyve Bird every time redg became that guy, 275 00:13:57,040 --> 00:13:59,640 Speaker 1: and who knew would have happened if Lenny Bos been 276 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:03,200 Speaker 1: that him. I mean, that's how special Redd was in 277 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: terms of his ability to gavinate all the guys around him. 278 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: I mean rag, I mean he gave m J troubles. 279 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 1: That's how difficult gradual was his length. Um, it was 280 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 1: hard for him him in ters because he played both 281 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 1: ends of the floor. People didn't understand that Ras played 282 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,360 Speaker 1: both ends of the floor. He had the total package 283 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 1: mid range, he could shoot the three ball, and you 284 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 1: never sped him up in terms of wanting to play 285 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 1: him at a certain speed. He played his speed every 286 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:34,200 Speaker 1: time that he stepped up. Obviously, mental health is something 287 00:14:34,240 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 1: that's kind of new to our community um as black folks, 288 00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:40,000 Speaker 1: and new to sports overall. But how hard was it 289 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,080 Speaker 1: for you when you heard the news that your brother 290 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 1: had passed during the game. Well, you know, people don't 291 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 1: understand that he collapsed while we was playing in the playoffs, 292 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 1: and while we was playing, you know, we just thought 293 00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 1: that he tripped over Johnny knew his foot and then 294 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:02,120 Speaker 1: came to find out it was a little more severe 295 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 1: than that. And even when he was growing up, we 296 00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: didn't have no indication that Rudge Ranch had any type 297 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: of heart heart problems. I mean, that was always kept 298 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,520 Speaker 1: within the family. I'm as summing um. We found out 299 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 1: like everybody else, when the news came out when he 300 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:20,760 Speaker 1: couldn't finish the series when we played against them in Boston, 301 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: and then here it is. I just left. I just 302 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 1: lost my father that week, and then a week and 303 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 1: we just lost to the New York Nicks in the 304 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: playoffs and come to find out Ranch had just passed away. 305 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 1: And I was in Phoenix, Arizona when I got the news, 306 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: and I had spoken to him probably a week before 307 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 1: that because he was now I don't see it was clear, 308 00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:48,440 Speaker 1: but he was feeling better in the you know, I 309 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 1: didn't know he had the permission to work out, to 310 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 1: start his you know, conditioning, but that's what he was doing. 311 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 1: And it was devastating, you know, its devastate. It was 312 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 1: too young, twenty seven years old. I mean, even though 313 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:04,000 Speaker 1: we grew up with life expectancy, we didn't think it 314 00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:06,920 Speaker 1: was past twenty. But you know, once we was able 315 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:11,520 Speaker 1: to overcome that and we was going to prosperous things 316 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: and to have him at the pinnacle of his career, 317 00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 1: I mean, it was hotbreak condolences man for the loss 318 00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 1: of your father and your brother Baltimore and even extending 319 00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:23,800 Speaker 1: to the d n V region. Why has there been 320 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:28,080 Speaker 1: so much talent to come out of those areas? You think, Well, 321 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 1: it's there's a lot of kids who came from there 322 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 1: that they look up to, and it's became, I don't 323 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 1: want to say as the mecca of the game of basketball, 324 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:41,560 Speaker 1: but it's a hub. It's definitely hub. And it's anytime 325 00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:46,760 Speaker 1: you got uh kids Now these days, you know, as 326 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 1: the tension that the NBA has been receiving, I mean 327 00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:54,080 Speaker 1: it's overwhelming, and they see guys like themselves out of 328 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:57,120 Speaker 1: that neighborhoods out there on that on that dance floor, 329 00:16:57,240 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: and that's something that they believe that they want as well. 330 00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: I mean, now we've got this thing is we're as 331 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: global where we got so many kids that's dreaming, not 332 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:09,000 Speaker 1: just the people does in the United States. So the 333 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:12,120 Speaker 1: game has broughtened, the game has grew and having those 334 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:15,400 Speaker 1: guys back home and that's why I always tell them 335 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 1: guards as a dimond doesn't. So you know, we always 336 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:21,600 Speaker 1: got to conduct ourselves the best way on and off 337 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 1: the court because we never know who's watching. Body language 338 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: is a key as well as your skill set, and 339 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 1: we got to put ourselves and separate ourselves in order 340 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,400 Speaker 1: to get the detention that we definitely deserve. And these 341 00:17:35,440 --> 00:17:39,640 Speaker 1: guys understand that. We got now programs that giving these 342 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 1: guys a platform to be able to operate from. You 343 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:46,920 Speaker 1: got Durant, the Mellows, you know, of course in other 344 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:49,480 Speaker 1: states with CP and all these other guys. But now 345 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 1: we have those platforms where these guys can go to 346 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:57,160 Speaker 1: these organizations, these establishments to work on their skill set. 347 00:17:57,240 --> 00:17:59,080 Speaker 1: You know, we didn't have that growing up. We just 348 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 1: had we just had recreation centers. You know, we didn't 349 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 1: have trainers, guys that trained us and skilled. I had 350 00:18:06,560 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 1: a recreation director who happened to knew the game of 351 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 1: basketball who just gave us that information, you know, which 352 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 1: is still they different today, and that's the way the 353 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: world is now. So you chose to go to wait 354 00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:19,120 Speaker 1: for us. Whether what other schools were recruiting you knowing 355 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:21,320 Speaker 1: that she was a five three guard. Oh well, you know, 356 00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:24,760 Speaker 1: I had quite a few schools recruitment. Virginia had Seaton Hall. 357 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: It really came down to wait for us and seating Hall. 358 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:29,800 Speaker 1: You gotta keep in mind, we was the number one 359 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,639 Speaker 1: team in the country, so we had slew of coaches 360 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:37,920 Speaker 1: coming in trying to pursue us in terms of trying 361 00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:40,720 Speaker 1: to get us to go to their university. But for me, 362 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,920 Speaker 1: you know, I always used and people don't understand our practice. 363 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,919 Speaker 1: A lot of the college coaches, they came to our 364 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:51,880 Speaker 1: practice more so that they came to our games. People 365 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:54,840 Speaker 1: don't understand that they came to our practice more than 366 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:58,679 Speaker 1: they came to our games. And my motto was they 367 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 1: whoever they came to watch, I want to make sure 368 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,120 Speaker 1: they talked about me. Going out and practice was something 369 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:09,159 Speaker 1: that was even tougher than the games. People don't realize 370 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 1: we might have had the second best team in the 371 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:15,920 Speaker 1: country on the bench. I mean, that's how telling you 372 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 1: how guys were. I mean, people don't hear about him today, 373 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 1: but back then, these guys had talent, and they were skillful, 374 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:26,280 Speaker 1: and they understood the game, and you know, we had 375 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:30,160 Speaker 1: that type of chemistry that bond with one another where 376 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: you know, I had the understanding that if these coaches 377 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 1: come in here the Georgetown the current line is I 378 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:40,640 Speaker 1: want to make sure they talked about me. Even though 379 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:44,679 Speaker 1: they didn't pursue me as hard as they did, especially Georgetown, 380 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:47,880 Speaker 1: which coach Thomas say that he regretted that he didn't 381 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:50,680 Speaker 1: pursue me as hard as he once did. Um. You know, 382 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: I didn't have any rests because it was all up 383 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 1: to me in terms of what I felt comfortable for 384 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 1: me and what I felt was best for me and 385 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: my family. And this was the very first time that 386 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:04,000 Speaker 1: me and Reggie Williams had to decide to go to 387 00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 1: separate ways. Because keep in mind, we've been playing with 388 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,400 Speaker 1: each other since we were seven years old. From elementary 389 00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 1: school junior high school we didn't have we didn't have 390 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 1: middle school back then, junior high school, and then to 391 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 1: high school. You know, in the summertime we played in 392 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:23,480 Speaker 1: Now Recreations Summer League teams. Um, we traveled all the time, 393 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:25,680 Speaker 1: the five Stars. So he and I was connected with 394 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:27,640 Speaker 1: each other from seven all way up till we wasa 395 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,680 Speaker 1: eighteen years old. And then of course the decision for 396 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: me to go to Wake for US was based on 397 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: a SEC was the toughest conference back then. My mom, 398 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:40,200 Speaker 1: you know, she couldn't afford to travel. My dad was 399 00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:42,120 Speaker 1: in prison, so they can just turn on the TV 400 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:45,159 Speaker 1: every Saturday and watch their little fellow play. So that 401 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: came down to me in terms of the best decision 402 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 1: and seat hall. P J. Collissimo was a little disappointed. 403 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:52,919 Speaker 1: I decided to go up there with him because they 404 00:20:53,040 --> 00:20:54,879 Speaker 1: was really coming at me really hard. They had the 405 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:58,360 Speaker 1: kid Audrey McLeod and those guys. But I felt weight 406 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 1: academically as well as uh the basketball rams, I think 407 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 1: that was the best spot for what's some of your 408 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 1: best memories? You overlapped You talked about the a c C. 409 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,119 Speaker 1: You overlapped m J. H Lynn Bias in the a 410 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:11,719 Speaker 1: c C. What was that like? Oh, that was awesome. 411 00:21:12,040 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 1: I mean again, I felt that was the best conference 412 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 1: at the time in terms of the competition. I mean 413 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,160 Speaker 1: we was going to every night. She had to face 414 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 1: the Mark Price one night, Kenny Smith, the next night, 415 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:27,640 Speaker 1: a Spud Waves and Nate McMillan another night Vince Hamilton 416 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:30,360 Speaker 1: and next night and then you go down and face 417 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: Johnny Darkers and you got uh, Tommy Amic and Keith Kalen. 418 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,120 Speaker 1: I mean, the a CEC was loaded, and then that's 419 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,159 Speaker 1: only the point guards, the two guards you got m J. 420 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 1: And then you're all of a sudden you got Lynn 421 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 1: Bays and people don't realize Adrian Branch and those guys. 422 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 1: I mean we had Braddaughty. I mean, you keep going 423 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:51,520 Speaker 1: down the list. The a CEC was was tough, and 424 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 1: that's one of the reason why I felt that, Um, 425 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:58,280 Speaker 1: I wanted to play there because for me, the recognition 426 00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: is the key. And I felt like I played against 427 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:04,119 Speaker 1: I played on one of the best hostel teams that 428 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: people say that has never been a symbol UM. And 429 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:09,240 Speaker 1: I felt comfortable with my skill set and what I 430 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 1: was capable of down I just wanted the opportunity and 431 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 1: I knew getting that national attention in the a c 432 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 1: C will allow me to have that s you was 433 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:28,480 Speaker 1: able to win the goal in the Fever Championships with 434 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:31,680 Speaker 1: David Robson, Steve Criss some other guys. How was that experience? 435 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:34,640 Speaker 1: It was unbelieable experience. You know, we was the last 436 00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:36,960 Speaker 1: collegiate team to win the gold medal before they send 437 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: the Dream team over there in ninety two because David 438 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 1: never lost in eight and that year in Olympics, it 439 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: was unbelievable. I mean back then, you know, you guys 440 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:49,200 Speaker 1: gotta I don't know, y'all, just a little too young. 441 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: It was you know, it was a tervism going on 442 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:54,679 Speaker 1: back then. You know, it was outside of that hotel 443 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,200 Speaker 1: and with machine guns. Um protected us. And I remember, 444 00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:02,280 Speaker 1: man Kenny. We was eight uh one game in Spain 445 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 1: and because of our activity that we decided to do 446 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 1: the night before and we had to run to the 447 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:16,000 Speaker 1: to the to the gym and we were start us 448 00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: back there. And when we ran to the gym, of 449 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 1: course Kate Ludoson was out coach at the time, and 450 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 1: you know he decided we was playing this he was 451 00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: playing the Germany Tame Germany team and they looked, I 452 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:31,200 Speaker 1: mean so all the shape he's got a look like 453 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 1: him about forty years old here this week early in 454 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 1: the early nineteen and eighteen years old and these guys 455 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:41,200 Speaker 1: and looked like they're in the forties and um, but 456 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 1: they had us and Kenny, like I said, Kenny and 457 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 1: always start us. But we was late to that game, 458 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,240 Speaker 1: so he told us to move on the bench. We 459 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:50,719 Speaker 1: sit on the end of the bench. By halftime they 460 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 1: had us. And you know how in those type of 461 00:23:56,320 --> 00:24:00,400 Speaker 1: settings it's all about qualifications and you can't these years 462 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:05,120 Speaker 1: into certain teams. So of course he put us back 463 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 1: in the game. The second half we come back. We 464 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:13,560 Speaker 1: all probably by about nine and ten or whatever it is. 465 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:17,320 Speaker 1: He took it right back out and put put timmy 466 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 1: am couldn't come back in the game. I guess he 467 00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 1: was trying to make a poet. But that was a 468 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 1: great experience man, playing against the USSR and the Russians 469 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,959 Speaker 1: Uh Sa Bonus, the truth Sa Bonus back then, um 470 00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 1: and playing against the Drives and Patrick Vicks of the world, 471 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: the late Drives and pastor bit. I mean, that was 472 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,600 Speaker 1: a great experience man, because they was considered professional players. 473 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:37,920 Speaker 1: Don't that time we were just collegiate players and being 474 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,160 Speaker 1: able to accomplish their goal to win the gold medal 475 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:42,920 Speaker 1: and stand on that podium, to hold that cut put 476 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: the gold medal around your net. Us a little bit 477 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 1: about how good first Sa Bonus was because we got 478 00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: you know that he got to the league at a 479 00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:53,680 Speaker 1: later age and they said he was incredible at a 480 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 1: young age. And then we got to see how special 481 00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 1: Drajan Petrovitch was. So talk to us about both those 482 00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:00,399 Speaker 1: players at that time when you got the chance to 483 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:03,400 Speaker 1: play against something, how good they were. Well, of course, 484 00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:06,200 Speaker 1: the bonnet was like MJ Over in the States. I 485 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,080 Speaker 1: mean he was over he was that type of talent 486 00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:12,240 Speaker 1: as well as that had that type of recognition for 487 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:15,120 Speaker 1: a big guy to have that type of skill set, 488 00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,920 Speaker 1: to be able to pass, to be able to shoot it, 489 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:19,680 Speaker 1: to be able to play with your back towards the 490 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,280 Speaker 1: basket as well as face the basket, that was something 491 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:24,960 Speaker 1: that we haven't seen over and even in the States. 492 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:28,359 Speaker 1: So he really, you know, drew a lot of tension 493 00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 1: in that regards and being able to have that type 494 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 1: of you know, ability to now translated into the m 495 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 1: day was unbelievable and the tribes and Pastrick it's I mean, 496 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: people don't understand how great Patrick was. I mean I 497 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 1: had the fortunate enough to be able to play him 498 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 1: over there when he was playing with Yugoslavia and I 499 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 1: had to fortunate enough to shut him down. And he 500 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:55,960 Speaker 1: was asking about thirty seven forty points before we before 501 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,159 Speaker 1: we played them. The night before we played the Russian 502 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 1: team and that was a very big game. Kenny Smith 503 00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:04,200 Speaker 1: was supposed to have that assignment that night. But I 504 00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:06,680 Speaker 1: went over to Kenny and told Kenny as we was 505 00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:09,600 Speaker 1: getting on the floor, let me start off on drive. 506 00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,159 Speaker 1: And if he had, you know, he started to have 507 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 1: his little way or something, then you can get on him. 508 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: Of course, Kenny never had Ourtune get that to him, 509 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 1: because Patrick did. He only have about twelve points that 510 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,639 Speaker 1: game average and at the averaging round thirty during that tournament, 511 00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 1: and that was allowed us to you know, to prevail 512 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:32,879 Speaker 1: through that game. But those guys Man him and another 513 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,080 Speaker 1: guy over there, o Scott Smith. You know he was 514 00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:38,680 Speaker 1: in the Hall of Fame. O Scott was another talented 515 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 1: player during that time, during that era. You know, those 516 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,960 Speaker 1: three guys really stood out some bowling stretch Patrivick as 517 00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,679 Speaker 1: well as Oscar Smith. Remember hearing something about him, uh, 518 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:52,560 Speaker 1: twelfth overall pick in the nineteen seven draft to the Bullets. 519 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: What was your draft process like in kind of the 520 00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,080 Speaker 1: culmination of you know, starting at seven years old and 521 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:03,000 Speaker 1: and and everything kind of year dream teams finally materializing, uh, 522 00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,040 Speaker 1: to allow you to be drafted uh in the NBA. Well, 523 00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:08,400 Speaker 1: of course that was very special, man. I mean here 524 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,160 Speaker 1: it is. You wanted to do it, just like everybody else, 525 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 1: Just like all the big guys have done it. You know, 526 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 1: none of us small guys at that time didn't have 527 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,439 Speaker 1: that opportunity. My boy Spud didn't get that opportunity. Michael 528 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,720 Speaker 1: Adams and those guys, you know, they didn't never experience that. 529 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:25,920 Speaker 1: And for me to be able to experience that and 530 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,159 Speaker 1: be able to go through that process and put myself 531 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,240 Speaker 1: in that situation, you know, and we was coming up 532 00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:36,080 Speaker 1: at the time, I was already projected to go late first, 533 00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:39,200 Speaker 1: early second, as well as Scottie Pippott and myself. And 534 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:46,240 Speaker 1: then after that Chicago Port Smith at the Chicago camps. Yeah, 535 00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 1: after those two camps, man, that's where the NBA, you know, 536 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:54,280 Speaker 1: the coaches as well as the GM they get opportunity 537 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:56,920 Speaker 1: to go see you as opposed to the Scots and 538 00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:00,280 Speaker 1: here and I was able to you know, showcase self 539 00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:03,359 Speaker 1: skills and and and raised our stock to where I 540 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:06,160 Speaker 1: became the twelve player. He became the fifth player chosen. 541 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 1: So it was a surreal moment, man, the way that 542 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,760 Speaker 1: the world was lifted off my shows that night. Being 543 00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,520 Speaker 1: able to go up shape the commission David Strnhand and 544 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:17,440 Speaker 1: put your head on was like I said, it was 545 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:19,960 Speaker 1: a surreal. At that point the journey had just really begun. 546 00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:21,880 Speaker 1: But your rookie year, you got a chance to play 547 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 1: with the late great Moses Malone. Rest in Peace and 548 00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 1: Bernard King two bucket getters. What was that experience? Like? 549 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,639 Speaker 1: Oh man, it was having Mo was my guy. MO 550 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:35,000 Speaker 1: took MO was my I was most rookie. He took 551 00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 1: me on his wing and uh just taught me all 552 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 1: the dudes and dumps about this game and about the NBA, 553 00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: which um I credit him for me allowing to play 554 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 1: fourteen years and get paid for seventeen Moses was some special. 555 00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 1: Having the opportunity to to to play with him and 556 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: throw that ball to him and run that flow with 557 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: him was breathtaking. But not only that, but we became 558 00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:00,160 Speaker 1: so close off the flo. I mean when I gree earn. 559 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:06,000 Speaker 1: Course he was at the wedding, and that was devastating 560 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:08,640 Speaker 1: because things happened right afterwards, you know, not too far, 561 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:13,720 Speaker 1: not too many months afterwards. But so but anyway, playing 562 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: with him, man was special. He was my guy. He 563 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 1: called me the Baltomore pimp, you know, because of where 564 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,320 Speaker 1: I came from, Baltimore, and the type is you know, 565 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 1: always coming with all types of color skins, pink skins, 566 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,800 Speaker 1: grain skins, you know, in terms of shoes. And he 567 00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:30,920 Speaker 1: used to call me the Baltimore Pimp. But I missed 568 00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 1: him dearly and b K men. B K was a 569 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 1: walking bucket, as you said. You know, he was coming 570 00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:37,720 Speaker 1: off of that injury off his one leg. And he 571 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,640 Speaker 1: always say, moth soon as I get crossed half court, 572 00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:44,720 Speaker 1: I need to I need to get I said, I be, 573 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 1: But I always tell I said, well be, you can't 574 00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,280 Speaker 1: take no more than two dribbles, damn it. You know 575 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,800 Speaker 1: I want my sis. So uh. He always understood that 576 00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:54,520 Speaker 1: it was a great playing with those guys men I'm 577 00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 1: hall of famous, and allowed me to be who I was. 578 00:29:57,720 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 1: So I was grateful to be able to you know, 579 00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:01,880 Speaker 1: have at that time with him too. Greats. But what 580 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 1: do you feel like your personal welcome to the NBA. 581 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:08,040 Speaker 1: My personal welcome to the NBA moments was when when 582 00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:12,760 Speaker 1: Buck Williams gave me eight stitches. You know, I went 583 00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:16,680 Speaker 1: down and we play in New Jersey and he am 584 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:19,920 Speaker 1: going down trying to get this little loose rebound and 585 00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: in the lane should say and he let me know 586 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,120 Speaker 1: that this is not where God belongs. And I caught 587 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: a big elbow right across my eye from that moment. 588 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 1: So that was my introduction to the women's You also 589 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:36,880 Speaker 1: got a chance to play with and everybody was fascinated 590 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,320 Speaker 1: at the time that obviously he was the tallest player 591 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,400 Speaker 1: and you were the shortest player. What was it like 592 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,200 Speaker 1: playing with him? It was my guy, I mean met 593 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:48,360 Speaker 1: him and mo man, God almighty, we was like everywhere. 594 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,200 Speaker 1: You've seen through two of them, you've seen me if 595 00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 1: you had a little down. Um. But I tell you, man, 596 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: that Nudy was funny. He was so funny man that 597 00:30:59,840 --> 00:31:01,400 Speaker 1: you know, he got to keep in mind that we 598 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: didn't have uh proudly planes back then. We all flew commercial. 599 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 1: You know that's been back in the A eight We 600 00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:11,120 Speaker 1: you know, teams didn't have those type of situations. So 601 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 1: and when we go fly, you know, it's only eight 602 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:17,240 Speaker 1: first class seats, so they went by seniority. So of 603 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,880 Speaker 1: course Newton I got bumped in the back and we 604 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 1: in the back end. You could imagine his knees all 605 00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 1: up in his chest because the seats stuff. So dad 606 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,880 Speaker 1: on small and he back there trying to tell me 607 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,960 Speaker 1: how he killed lions with a spell. I'm like, what 608 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,880 Speaker 1: what kind of line you guys got the new teeth 609 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:37,120 Speaker 1: in them out talking about you killing lines with a spear. 610 00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:39,920 Speaker 1: But he was funny, man. He was such a treat 611 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 1: to be with. And I'm so happy and so proud 612 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 1: of bo bo Um because he's such a slight image 613 00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 1: of his daddy, even though the skill set is totally different. 614 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:51,440 Speaker 1: You know, new always, you know, I would he just 615 00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: one story minute and I was playing one on one 616 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 1: and Moses was just geeking it up. It was geeking 617 00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:00,640 Speaker 1: it so, I mean knew, like shoot his a little 618 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 1: sling shot like by his ear, you know. You know, 619 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,840 Speaker 1: I had a forty four vertical chump. So he went 620 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,840 Speaker 1: to go shoot it and I blocked the shot. Boy, 621 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: that pissed him off, and Moti just all over. He 622 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 1: changed me around that damn Jim about fifteen minutes he 623 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 1: couldn't catch and you know, and then when he tried 624 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:23,280 Speaker 1: to catch me. You know, I was a wrestler, you know, 625 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 1: wrastler back in my day, so I kind of grabbed 626 00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:28,920 Speaker 1: his little lags, put him up, and the threw him 627 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,880 Speaker 1: up a little bit of egg walking. I could slam 628 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,040 Speaker 1: me any moment now, you know. So that was one 629 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,200 Speaker 1: of them. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that was one of 630 00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:38,080 Speaker 1: those things I had to you know, you know, wrastling 631 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:40,920 Speaker 1: was my thing before basketball. So you blocked this shot, 632 00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:47,800 Speaker 1: anyonemost dipped him, that's all bad for big fella. NBA 633 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 1: Expansion Draft. They had the two teams Sharlts in Miami Heat. Yeah, yeah, man, 634 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 1: that was I'll tell you what. That was another opportunity 635 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: where I got another with the with the that that 636 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 1: ugly head the NBA shows this ulf because I just 637 00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 1: the season had just ended. We just lost to Detroit 638 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 1: in the playoffs, and we had I had my exit 639 00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,080 Speaker 1: meeting with West umself. You know, Ma and West. We're 640 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:13,840 Speaker 1: sitting there in West was telling me, you know, all 641 00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:16,840 Speaker 1: the positive things and what we're gonna try to get 642 00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:18,640 Speaker 1: to next year. You know, we had a bunch of 643 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 1: older guys on Washington, you know, Moses and Burn, our 644 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 1: kids and those guys. You know, they were stepped to 645 00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:27,080 Speaker 1: the end of their careers and I had tered Catlins 646 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,600 Speaker 1: and I had the young John Williams at the time. 647 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 1: So West I said, well, you know, mothers, we're gonna 648 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 1: bring in a lot of up a lot of up 649 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 1: Temple guys. You know, we want to play fast page 650 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: who want to do this and that? And I felt excited. 651 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:44,560 Speaker 1: I thought that, you know, we always on the same page. 652 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,640 Speaker 1: But as soon as I got home to my town home, 653 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,040 Speaker 1: I got a call from my agent, David Falk and 654 00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 1: David David Ashman, you know, how do I feel about 655 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,959 Speaker 1: going to Charlotte? And I'm like, Shalott, who what is Charlotte? 656 00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,040 Speaker 1: I didn't realize the special team was coming at the time. 657 00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:01,120 Speaker 1: He said, it was a new team Charotte harn is 658 00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:03,560 Speaker 1: about to come in and it's a possibility that they're 659 00:34:03,600 --> 00:34:05,400 Speaker 1: really interested in and they might and they want to 660 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:08,000 Speaker 1: take you. I said, what I just left my exit 661 00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 1: meeter with West and West was you know, talking about 662 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:12,640 Speaker 1: who they you know, they're going to bring in some 663 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,399 Speaker 1: guys that more or less up Temple style of play. 664 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 1: He said, well, they just told me that they wasn't 665 00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:22,880 Speaker 1: gonna protect you and you're gonna go to Charlotte and 666 00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:28,320 Speaker 1: so so, m f this is some bold man. You 667 00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:30,200 Speaker 1: just kind of just sitting there and told me. Yeah. 668 00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,480 Speaker 1: And that's when I learned the neglehead that that up 669 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,840 Speaker 1: the head of the business. And but it was a 670 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,360 Speaker 1: match made in heaven for me, you know, coming to Charlotte. 671 00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:41,359 Speaker 1: Uh even playing here for four years in the Carolinas, 672 00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:44,520 Speaker 1: so the people was aware of who I was, and 673 00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:48,680 Speaker 1: you know, playing with guys like Dell Curry and Rex 674 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:52,520 Speaker 1: Chapman at early on Kirk Rams and Kelly Trapruka. You know, 675 00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,640 Speaker 1: I was just hungry, you know, I felt, what, this 676 00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:56,759 Speaker 1: is an opportunity for me to go down here and 677 00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:59,480 Speaker 1: make something of my career and try to make the 678 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,120 Speaker 1: best stuff it regardless of this situation, you know, look 679 00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:04,800 Speaker 1: at the positivity and try to, you know, get what 680 00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 1: you want out of it and see, you know, if 681 00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:09,000 Speaker 1: he if he worked out in your favor, which it 682 00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 1: actually did. What was the energy like with an expansion team? 683 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,359 Speaker 1: Obviously it being new, they knew you from Wake four, 684 00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:17,680 Speaker 1: so it made sense, But what was the energy? How 685 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,600 Speaker 1: big were the crowds? You know, obviously expansion is new, 686 00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 1: so your first season, what was it like with with 687 00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:28,440 Speaker 1: with with all those uh things? Man, this crowd was unreal. 688 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:32,759 Speaker 1: Do they realized Charlotte was? I mean, when we I 689 00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 1: was surprised because I just I knew they knew college basketball. 690 00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:39,399 Speaker 1: I didn't think they was. They didn't know anything about 691 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:42,399 Speaker 1: the professional sports. But we had the very first night 692 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,440 Speaker 1: we had twenty four thousand and attended. The men had 693 00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,600 Speaker 1: tuch seeds on and then women had their gowns, so 694 00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:52,080 Speaker 1: it was a formal affair for them and of course, 695 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:57,040 Speaker 1: we lost the Cleveland about forty points that night, but 696 00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 1: believe it or not, as we walked off the floor, 697 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:02,759 Speaker 1: they stood up and gave us a standard ovation. We 698 00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:04,840 Speaker 1: knew we we knew that was something we knew. We 699 00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:07,520 Speaker 1: was in a special place and uh and we just 700 00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 1: couldn't wait to you know, to get the season going, 701 00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:12,759 Speaker 1: to try to win as money games as we possibly can. 702 00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,320 Speaker 1: You know that very first year we only won twenty games. 703 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: Didn't come back. The year after that we won nineteen games, 704 00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,680 Speaker 1: and then from that moment on we started climbing the 705 00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:23,759 Speaker 1: ladder with thirty one, forty four and fifty five and 706 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 1: fifty five and so forth. So but we started getting 707 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,320 Speaker 1: good draft picks. But it had to do, you know, 708 00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:33,000 Speaker 1: with the great selection of bringing the Lonzo Mornings, the 709 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:36,440 Speaker 1: Laria Johnson, the Kendall Gills and other worlds for us 710 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:38,640 Speaker 1: to get over that hunt. But at the beginning of 711 00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,960 Speaker 1: the town support us, we broke attendant rectors for nine 712 00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,520 Speaker 1: straight years. That was the Colosseum, right, it was the 713 00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,759 Speaker 1: cons sum that was over on Tavola Road was as 714 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 1: opposed to the one that is uptown. Yeah, because my 715 00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:52,520 Speaker 1: my first year I played, I played one year that 716 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,840 Speaker 1: My first year is two thousands and thousand one. I 717 00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:58,400 Speaker 1: played uh in the Colors. Um okay, yeah, yeah, because 718 00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:01,879 Speaker 1: two thousand and two that's when they left. Yeah, yeah, 719 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:05,319 Speaker 1: they left in two thousand two. Actually, so your first 720 00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:07,120 Speaker 1: year in the league was when you I thint you 721 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:10,280 Speaker 1: came in. He said, I got drafted. I got drafted 722 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:12,799 Speaker 1: at ninety seven, but I bounced around overseason, came back 723 00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:15,080 Speaker 1: in in two thousand two thousand one. Talked to us 724 00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 1: a little bit. You touched on them, but but what 725 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,880 Speaker 1: it meant to add people to the roster like Larry 726 00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:23,560 Speaker 1: Johnson and Alonzo Morning As you said, you guys continue 727 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:26,239 Speaker 1: to get better as a franchise and and started making 728 00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:28,839 Speaker 1: your playoff appearances. But how how how talented with those 729 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:31,000 Speaker 1: young guys, and how much did they help uh you 730 00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:35,600 Speaker 1: and your team? Yeah, I mean that was I tell you, 731 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 1: that was the beginning. I mean our first major draft 732 00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:42,120 Speaker 1: pick with j R. I mean, well, rat Shat was 733 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:45,080 Speaker 1: the first, but then we got JR. Re we started climbing. 734 00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:48,960 Speaker 1: Then when we got well, we got Kendall Gill and 735 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:53,320 Speaker 1: then we got LJ. You know that that was the beginning. 736 00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:56,400 Speaker 1: That was the beginning because we came off for thirty 737 00:37:56,600 --> 00:38:01,680 Speaker 1: one uh winning season that year, and then when LJ came, 738 00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:04,279 Speaker 1: you know, we was able to elevate all way up 739 00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:06,840 Speaker 1: to forty four wins his first game, I mean his 740 00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:10,320 Speaker 1: first year, and then the next year with qua Alonzo, 741 00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:14,759 Speaker 1: and then you know the history from there was. I mean, 742 00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: that's from now on, that's where we started to really 743 00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 1: elevate our franchise, even though it was over was with 744 00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:24,560 Speaker 1: us for just three years. Within those three years and 745 00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:28,520 Speaker 1: l J fifty five, I think I've been his fifth year. Um. 746 00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:31,719 Speaker 1: I mean, we put ourselves on the national level. I mean, 747 00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,400 Speaker 1: we was one of the young, hot upcoming teams at 748 00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:38,479 Speaker 1: the time, along with Miami and Orlando. UM, because Shock 749 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:41,759 Speaker 1: and Penny was over there, we was, we was right 750 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,040 Speaker 1: there amongst all of them. You know that during that time, 751 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:48,600 Speaker 1: these guys at this, especially Larry, you know, his rookie year. 752 00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:52,600 Speaker 1: I recalled telling him, you know, right at the midpoint, 753 00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:54,359 Speaker 1: did you want to win the Rookie of the Year, 754 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,879 Speaker 1: Because at the time, Matumbo had a little slight edge 755 00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:00,680 Speaker 1: of him and he caused a lot come a little fellows, 756 00:39:01,440 --> 00:39:02,759 Speaker 1: I don't want to win the book at a year. 757 00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:04,840 Speaker 1: So I told him, Okay, Well, we're gonna get you 758 00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:08,440 Speaker 1: every over the year, and I specifically kind of focused 759 00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:11,840 Speaker 1: on l a lot during that time. Um, but it 760 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:15,400 Speaker 1: was easy because he created the opportunities. I mean, we're running, 761 00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:18,640 Speaker 1: you know, you can kind of have the means of 762 00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:22,240 Speaker 1: looking one way and making a guy follow that direction, 763 00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:24,160 Speaker 1: and you know, you get the ball the other direction. 764 00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 1: So have him win that award was special because that's 765 00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:30,719 Speaker 1: the bond that he now always had developed with the 766 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:35,279 Speaker 1: relationship with one another, the trust with him, Alonzo del Rights, 767 00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:37,000 Speaker 1: all the guys men. The bonds that we built with 768 00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:39,799 Speaker 1: one another is second another. Take us back a little bit. 769 00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:44,880 Speaker 1: The East in the late eighties early nineties was I 770 00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:47,560 Speaker 1: mean you could punch people, you could take him out 771 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:48,960 Speaker 1: of the air. You could do all that and not 772 00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:51,520 Speaker 1: get kicked out of the game. Fast forward by the 773 00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:53,200 Speaker 1: time me and Jack played, if you push someone, you 774 00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:56,439 Speaker 1: get suspended for two games. What was the physicality back 775 00:39:56,560 --> 00:39:59,280 Speaker 1: I like back then with the bad boy pistons, Riley's 776 00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:02,440 Speaker 1: knicks in Jay's bulls were on the rise. What were 777 00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:04,520 Speaker 1: those battles like for you personally? Well, it was great 778 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:06,800 Speaker 1: for me. I mean I didn't have any problems. But 779 00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:09,640 Speaker 1: the probably people think because you're small that you had 780 00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:11,279 Speaker 1: some kind of issue with. Now, I mean that was 781 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:13,040 Speaker 1: the are that we played, and that's how I grew up, 782 00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:15,799 Speaker 1: you know, And that's why, I mean we had big 783 00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:18,400 Speaker 1: guys camping in the lane. You know, we had that 784 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:20,920 Speaker 1: three seconds or you had to dip in and dip out. 785 00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:23,680 Speaker 1: Now they're big answer was just standing there where you 786 00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:26,040 Speaker 1: couldn't go down there and sort of you know, just 787 00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,400 Speaker 1: do what you want you hand no free lane, But 788 00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:30,160 Speaker 1: that's the game, man, That's what the game was. You 789 00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:32,279 Speaker 1: can hand check you, you know, kind of kind of 790 00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,719 Speaker 1: guide you where you wanted you to go. You can 791 00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:40,600 Speaker 1: come across lane for and that's me. And you know, 792 00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:43,600 Speaker 1: you get hit in forms of just you know, delaying 793 00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:46,520 Speaker 1: your player. Whish that wasn't a foul um. And you 794 00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:48,839 Speaker 1: can curl guys, you can hung. I mean, you can 795 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:50,839 Speaker 1: do a lot more physically. You can be a lot 796 00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:53,759 Speaker 1: more physical with the guys. But that's why people kind 797 00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:56,560 Speaker 1: of talk about the game in that regards, because I 798 00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,120 Speaker 1: mean it was real. I mean, you just couldn't get 799 00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,319 Speaker 1: to your place that you wanted to go just as 800 00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:03,400 Speaker 1: easy as you wanted to, you know, And that's one 801 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:05,640 Speaker 1: of the reasons why they created some of these rules 802 00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:08,800 Speaker 1: and trying to make the game faster for the fans 803 00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,840 Speaker 1: and more you know, entertaining and that sort of stuff 804 00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:15,080 Speaker 1: where the lane is wide open. Um, you don't have 805 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:17,719 Speaker 1: nobody camping in the lane, you can't hand check, you 806 00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:22,080 Speaker 1: can't touch, um, you can't improve in one progress. So 807 00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:24,239 Speaker 1: it's it's all those type of things that coming to 808 00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,920 Speaker 1: play today to where guys of our always feel like, 809 00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,640 Speaker 1: you know, they can play in this era. And I 810 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:33,200 Speaker 1: always say, any NBA player for like a planning you know, 811 00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:35,840 Speaker 1: you know that's just the conference within themselves. You know, 812 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:39,840 Speaker 1: that's why they became NBA. Uh yeah, but all and 813 00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:42,839 Speaker 1: actually they can't because there's some soft motherfucker's out there, 814 00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 1: you know, just as well as I know a lot 815 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:51,200 Speaker 1: of new motherfuckers would not be nowhere around well looking 816 00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:54,440 Speaker 1: at this, looking at this right here, I can tell 817 00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:57,680 Speaker 1: you it's a lot of guys won't be able to 818 00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:00,600 Speaker 1: play in our era. I mean, because we're looking at 819 00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 1: skill sets in terms of how they want to justify 820 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:06,360 Speaker 1: the games. You know, we had seven ftags playing with 821 00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:09,239 Speaker 1: the back towards the back. You know, we got seven 822 00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:12,080 Speaker 1: foot is now bring the ball up the court. So 823 00:42:12,360 --> 00:42:15,640 Speaker 1: the game was totally different. And in that regards and 824 00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:19,359 Speaker 1: looking at these guys how they dribble, man, I feel 825 00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:23,440 Speaker 1: like I would have to feel that stand in the basketball. 826 00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:27,000 Speaker 1: I mean, I mean just looking at it in terms of, 827 00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:29,440 Speaker 1: you know, with the way they teach the game now 828 00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:31,920 Speaker 1: and you know with you know, I can get it 829 00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:33,200 Speaker 1: to a lot of stuff with the fund of me, 830 00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:35,800 Speaker 1: with the two balls and all that type of stuff. 831 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:37,880 Speaker 1: But I don't want to go there. You know, the 832 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:40,279 Speaker 1: people how they feel like they need to shop in 833 00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:43,000 Speaker 1: their skills that let them go do that. Right. You 834 00:42:43,080 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 1: got a chance to play against m T. MJ in college. Uh, 835 00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:48,239 Speaker 1: you guys are in the league at the same time 836 00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,319 Speaker 1: you're you start to see him build his legend. Any 837 00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:55,839 Speaker 1: great memorable matchups or stories against MJ you could share, Well, 838 00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:59,719 Speaker 1: you know, MJ. He always like like what I would say. 839 00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:02,360 Speaker 1: You know, we like the funk with you. You know 840 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:04,520 Speaker 1: you know that, you know he just that's just who 841 00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:06,960 Speaker 1: we are with one another when we come in contact. 842 00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:09,640 Speaker 1: I mean even off the court to this to this day, 843 00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:12,319 Speaker 1: you know, walking around, he'll put his hand up high 844 00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:14,400 Speaker 1: trying to you know, for me to give him a 845 00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:17,600 Speaker 1: high fire and I'll put my hand down low and 846 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:19,200 Speaker 1: then you come down and give me a low fire. 847 00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:23,000 Speaker 1: So it's just it's just not compete, I mean, compete 848 00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:26,840 Speaker 1: against one another. But but but m man, you know 849 00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:29,080 Speaker 1: he always tell you, you know, especially with me and 850 00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:33,600 Speaker 1: playing the game, you know, Lois. It was some stuff 851 00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:35,440 Speaker 1: that's going on in the internet way. They say that 852 00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,879 Speaker 1: he called me a midget, which is not true. Um, 853 00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:41,760 Speaker 1: and they felt like he had some kind of impact, 854 00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:44,000 Speaker 1: which is not true. He always called me short, low fella. 855 00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:47,240 Speaker 1: Yeah you need lower assays, low ass and that short stuff. 856 00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:51,799 Speaker 1: So we're playing against them. Of course, he got the ball. 857 00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:56,040 Speaker 1: He just came back from from retirement. He got the 858 00:43:56,120 --> 00:43:58,719 Speaker 1: ball up in the air, and I'm like him, I'm 859 00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:02,080 Speaker 1: playing him on the one on one. Of course, everybody 860 00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:04,839 Speaker 1: in my team know that I don't like help. Don't 861 00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:08,880 Speaker 1: come and help me where the guys don't come in 862 00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:12,840 Speaker 1: because yeah no, no back and try to back me 863 00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:14,840 Speaker 1: down because guys didn't used to playing that back to 864 00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:17,680 Speaker 1: the back anyway. But anyway, this particular moment, and I 865 00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:21,120 Speaker 1: guess it became infamous because he got it as a card. 866 00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:23,279 Speaker 1: As I were holding the ball up and I'm looking 867 00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:28,080 Speaker 1: right at him and I'm talking and I'm talking ship 868 00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:29,719 Speaker 1: to him. I'm telling to come on, what you're gonna do. 869 00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:31,719 Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden he starts to try 870 00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:34,080 Speaker 1: to back me in, and try to back me in 871 00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:35,600 Speaker 1: and try to back men. And then all of a 872 00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:37,680 Speaker 1: sudden he tried to turn around shoot this little jumper. 873 00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:42,080 Speaker 1: I smacked it down, but they called illegal defense on 874 00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,160 Speaker 1: somebody because they wasn't then they was gonna across the line. 875 00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:47,440 Speaker 1: But I always working with that, tellim to you know, 876 00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:51,319 Speaker 1: you know that was still don't you know that back 877 00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:53,640 Speaker 1: and forth? That's what I do. You know that ball, 878 00:44:53,760 --> 00:44:55,600 Speaker 1: that ball defender, I'm gonna make you think about that 879 00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:58,719 Speaker 1: when you got that ball in your hand. You make 880 00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:02,239 Speaker 1: your first playoff of parents, you beat Boston in the 881 00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:04,200 Speaker 1: first round and lose to the next in the second round. 882 00:45:04,239 --> 00:45:06,319 Speaker 1: What's the memories of those of your playoff experience, your 883 00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:10,120 Speaker 1: first pltoff experience. Well, for one, that was a great 884 00:45:10,160 --> 00:45:12,960 Speaker 1: stepping stone for the franchise at the first year that 885 00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,480 Speaker 1: we made the playoffs, that was the laws Overy first year. 886 00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:18,960 Speaker 1: And for him to be able to close it out 887 00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:22,360 Speaker 1: hitting that shot and being able to you know, prevail 888 00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:25,360 Speaker 1: against that Boston series was a great moment. For the 889 00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:28,080 Speaker 1: for the city, for the organization, and for each of 890 00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:31,520 Speaker 1: us individually, you know, because that was the beginning of 891 00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:34,839 Speaker 1: our careers in terms of post play, in terms being 892 00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:37,520 Speaker 1: are to you know, play after the regular season. So 893 00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:39,800 Speaker 1: that was a big step stepping stone for us, and 894 00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:42,319 Speaker 1: we really felt like we was on our way after 895 00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:44,880 Speaker 1: that moment. And the following years, you make the playoffs, 896 00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:46,920 Speaker 1: you make two more playoff appearances, but don't make it 897 00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:50,200 Speaker 1: out the first round. Knee injuries in your time in Charlotte, 898 00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:54,200 Speaker 1: how was that feeling, knowing that the the injuries stopped 899 00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:57,600 Speaker 1: you from continue to be great in Charlotte. Well, yeah, 900 00:45:57,680 --> 00:45:59,239 Speaker 1: well I didn't think he was gonna come to end 901 00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:02,759 Speaker 1: because I was, UMIs that was gonna be tired as 902 00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:07,120 Speaker 1: a horned uh Me and Dell in terms of what 903 00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:10,840 Speaker 1: our involvement was with the organization. But people don't understand 904 00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:13,239 Speaker 1: during that time, I have given so much, not on 905 00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:16,440 Speaker 1: to the organization but for the city and sacrifice a lot, 906 00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:20,040 Speaker 1: restructed my contract and so forth, and all that um 907 00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:24,600 Speaker 1: from the from nine four, I mean, you go back, look, 908 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:28,120 Speaker 1: you know I was top three and it says you 909 00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:30,960 Speaker 1: know it was abster double double one of me. It 910 00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:33,800 Speaker 1: was close to having to double double UH throughout the 911 00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:38,200 Speaker 1: years UM where I was one one point short of 912 00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:44,920 Speaker 1: it UH several times, but I was had one when 913 00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:47,440 Speaker 1: I had my knee issue. People don't realize I was 914 00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:51,359 Speaker 1: playing on one knee, you know. Here it is they 915 00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:53,520 Speaker 1: questioned about your five three and this and that. But 916 00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:56,080 Speaker 1: I was out there playing on one knee. Still was 917 00:46:56,239 --> 00:47:00,799 Speaker 1: able to be productive and run my team and so forth. 918 00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:04,880 Speaker 1: And I was bad to come back because I I 919 00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:09,040 Speaker 1: missed the entire season the year before UM due to 920 00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:12,880 Speaker 1: my bone bruise. And when I discovered actual puncture, you know, 921 00:47:12,960 --> 00:47:14,719 Speaker 1: I was able to down to get strength back in 922 00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,560 Speaker 1: my cause and pull that pressure off my knee. And 923 00:47:17,680 --> 00:47:21,759 Speaker 1: then they was talking about, well we need you. We 924 00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:24,680 Speaker 1: would you wind up playing on one day. I don't understand. 925 00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:26,359 Speaker 1: You don't have to play in the back to back 926 00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:29,759 Speaker 1: games and this and that. So I accommodated them and 927 00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:34,680 Speaker 1: doing so, and we won fifty six games that year. 928 00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:37,880 Speaker 1: All right, we lost to New York in the playoffs, 929 00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:43,000 Speaker 1: and now there's time to give me my extension, and 930 00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:47,960 Speaker 1: it is they bring in a new gym. So all 931 00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:50,000 Speaker 1: of a sudden, I don't even gonna ain't gonna mention names. 932 00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:51,560 Speaker 1: I don't wanna mention names because I don't want to 933 00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:53,560 Speaker 1: go there. They bring new gyms and all this and that. 934 00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,160 Speaker 1: Of course, you know, coach Jorge and of it and 935 00:47:56,239 --> 00:48:00,560 Speaker 1: them had promised me that I would retired there. So 936 00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:03,200 Speaker 1: they bring in a new gym. They decided to not 937 00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:07,480 Speaker 1: give me my extention, and they created all this chaos 938 00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:10,600 Speaker 1: and come back the next year. They weren't gonna let 939 00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:13,920 Speaker 1: me practice, you know. They so I had to file grievous. 940 00:48:14,320 --> 00:48:16,400 Speaker 1: They weren't gonna let me practice, not even because they 941 00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:18,879 Speaker 1: made a trade. They brought someone in. I ain't gonna 942 00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:20,960 Speaker 1: say no names, and they didn't want me to compete 943 00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:27,319 Speaker 1: against them after we just finished playing against him, beating him, 944 00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:30,719 Speaker 1: all sources, you know, having all sorts of success on 945 00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:36,360 Speaker 1: who they bring in. We need a name, Come on, 946 00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,000 Speaker 1: I know, I knew it was coming. That's why I 947 00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:46,520 Speaker 1: set it up that way. That's here. But here did 948 00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:48,640 Speaker 1: they put up there? Wesley? All right? So they had 949 00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:53,960 Speaker 1: they had Dave Cole had Dave Kyle was down there, 950 00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:57,239 Speaker 1: and they had Paul Paul Silas with assistant coach. So 951 00:48:57,680 --> 00:49:00,319 Speaker 1: here it is come back to practice. That filed a year. 952 00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:03,520 Speaker 1: They try to lock me out. And they locked me out, 953 00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:06,200 Speaker 1: They locked me out of practice. And what year is this? 954 00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:12,200 Speaker 1: Is this five? This is ninety seven? This is nothing. Yeah, 955 00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:15,399 Speaker 1: I got traded. Uh, this is ninety seven when Jack 956 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,480 Speaker 1: was asked me that my year was coming to an end. 957 00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:20,040 Speaker 1: So right after we lose in the playoffs to New 958 00:49:20,120 --> 00:49:23,000 Speaker 1: York and all this and that and come back and 959 00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:26,760 Speaker 1: I think I probably had one of the best series 960 00:49:27,239 --> 00:49:31,800 Speaker 1: throughout everybody, but that's here there. So they bring him in. 961 00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:33,799 Speaker 1: They didn't want me to practice. They try to hold 962 00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:36,680 Speaker 1: me out. So I'm like, we damn, I mean, you 963 00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:40,359 Speaker 1: brought somebody in. Woll I can't compete against him? I mean, 964 00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:43,319 Speaker 1: this is what y'all want to m so forth a bit. 965 00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:46,520 Speaker 1: So they didn't let me come. They didn't let me practice, 966 00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:50,719 Speaker 1: so I had to file for a grievance. And then 967 00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:53,279 Speaker 1: they brought they let me come to practice. Now while 968 00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,920 Speaker 1: I'm in practice, so they're leaving me off for all 969 00:49:57,040 --> 00:49:59,759 Speaker 1: the teams, the first team, the second team, even if 970 00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:03,239 Speaker 1: they're a team. So I can't even get on the 971 00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:06,319 Speaker 1: floor to practice with any of the guys. And Paul 972 00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:08,600 Speaker 1: Sot at the time, Paul si was the since coach 973 00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:11,439 Speaker 1: and I'm like, Paul, this is some bullshit, man. I mean, really, 974 00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:13,080 Speaker 1: this is how y'all gonna treat me. This is how 975 00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:15,359 Speaker 1: this is y'all treat me. Now in terms of all 976 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:18,319 Speaker 1: of this, after I just came off with one leg 977 00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:21,239 Speaker 1: playing with you guys, you begged me to come back 978 00:50:21,320 --> 00:50:24,680 Speaker 1: and play, and y'all gonna treat me like this. Anybody 979 00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:26,640 Speaker 1: in the organization knew it was going It was wrong 980 00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:30,319 Speaker 1: what they was doing, but anyway, it came to UH 981 00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:32,160 Speaker 1: doing a regular season when they came to me and 982 00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:35,080 Speaker 1: asked me, well, Muggs, we gotta treat well. Before that happened, 983 00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:39,560 Speaker 1: we played against New York a preseason game in our arena, 984 00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:42,799 Speaker 1: which in our arena everybody used to see me as 985 00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:45,799 Speaker 1: a starter, playing all these minutes and so forth. Here 986 00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:47,880 Speaker 1: it is, I'm on the bench. I didn't get in 987 00:50:48,239 --> 00:50:50,359 Speaker 1: one minute of the game. Here it is, We're down 988 00:50:50,440 --> 00:50:54,200 Speaker 1: by twenty five to New York, and the crowd was 989 00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:58,239 Speaker 1: going crazy, We want Muggsy, we want Muggs. So that 990 00:50:58,440 --> 00:51:01,680 Speaker 1: just got under Dave Collins again and he felt like 991 00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:03,360 Speaker 1: he didn't want to go on the rest of the 992 00:51:03,440 --> 00:51:07,400 Speaker 1: season under those conditions. So they made a trade for 993 00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:10,520 Speaker 1: me and Golden State with b. J. Armstrong. Of course 994 00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:13,319 Speaker 1: I could have blocked the trade. And I asked Tony Delp, 995 00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:15,000 Speaker 1: you know, how was he comfortable? Did you want to 996 00:51:15,040 --> 00:51:17,239 Speaker 1: move on because they was treating him wrong? And t 997 00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:20,640 Speaker 1: D said, must I go? Man? Matter me, they ain't 998 00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:23,200 Speaker 1: playing me anyway? The business as you say, I want 999 00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:26,160 Speaker 1: to rewind real quick. Ninety six, you guys draft Kobe 1000 00:51:26,239 --> 00:51:30,239 Speaker 1: Bryant and obviously we all know he's traded to the 1001 00:51:30,360 --> 00:51:33,520 Speaker 1: Lakers for vlade. What was that experience like? Obviously no 1002 00:51:33,560 --> 00:51:35,959 Speaker 1: one really knew he was gonna turn into the player 1003 00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:38,960 Speaker 1: he was, But what could have been you know, you 1004 00:51:39,040 --> 00:51:41,399 Speaker 1: got would have had a year with him at least. Uh, 1005 00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:45,719 Speaker 1: what was that like during that time? Yeah, yeah, it 1006 00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:48,759 Speaker 1: would have been special. But we understood Coke didn't want 1007 00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:50,320 Speaker 1: to come to Charlotte. He wanted to play in the 1008 00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:53,520 Speaker 1: bigger market. And once because once we came to find 1009 00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:56,200 Speaker 1: out that that the Horns were just taking them based 1010 00:51:56,280 --> 00:51:59,320 Speaker 1: on the request of the Lakers. Of course, you know, 1011 00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:02,120 Speaker 1: because he was a high school player, getting a lot 1012 00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:05,080 Speaker 1: of height, and you know, at the time we wasn't 1013 00:52:05,120 --> 00:52:07,920 Speaker 1: really found much, but we was hearing so much about him, 1014 00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:11,960 Speaker 1: and I personally start to watch a little bit highlights 1015 00:52:12,000 --> 00:52:14,400 Speaker 1: of them and was getting a little excited, like, this 1016 00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:17,080 Speaker 1: is the possibility of this, you know, Jumper, come in 1017 00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:20,080 Speaker 1: and do something special. But then we found out that, 1018 00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:22,239 Speaker 1: you know, it was a means of him wanting to 1019 00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:25,360 Speaker 1: play in that bigger market, and so we just realized 1020 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,920 Speaker 1: that who was gonna be the next available player that 1021 00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,680 Speaker 1: we was gonna be able to talk quiet You shared 1022 00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:34,000 Speaker 1: the court with Del and obviously it's well documented. Uh 1023 00:52:34,560 --> 00:52:38,160 Speaker 1: the kind of big brother if you want to call it, 1024 00:52:38,520 --> 00:52:41,440 Speaker 1: or second dad, you were the Steph and Seth. Uh, 1025 00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:43,960 Speaker 1: you know, not knowing who obviously Steph was going to 1026 00:52:44,080 --> 00:52:47,680 Speaker 1: turn into years later. What do you recall most about 1027 00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:50,319 Speaker 1: seeing them run around? Uh, all over the locker room 1028 00:52:50,360 --> 00:52:53,440 Speaker 1: in the gym, Yeah, man with special man if our 1029 00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:56,839 Speaker 1: kids and his kids are very close, and just having 1030 00:52:56,880 --> 00:52:59,279 Speaker 1: the kids in the locker room. Man, that's what this 1031 00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,799 Speaker 1: is what it was all about. Family, you know, having 1032 00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:03,719 Speaker 1: them around, being able to be part of the things 1033 00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:07,160 Speaker 1: that we was doing. Then enjoy playing basketball, and uh, 1034 00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:09,840 Speaker 1: you know, Dell and I played leven years together, you know, 1035 00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:12,840 Speaker 1: all of my fourteen years. We played nine here and 1036 00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:16,719 Speaker 1: in Charlotte and two in Toronto and having the opportunity 1037 00:53:16,760 --> 00:53:20,279 Speaker 1: to you know, be with Steph and Steth and play 1038 00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:23,640 Speaker 1: with them and have an opportunity to have an input 1039 00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:26,719 Speaker 1: on their masturation in terms of the game of basketball. 1040 00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:29,960 Speaker 1: I mean, it's priceless for me. It's a self rewarding 1041 00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:32,320 Speaker 1: Um saying he was able to carry the game to 1042 00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,200 Speaker 1: the host level, which is the NBA, and the saying 1043 00:53:35,239 --> 00:53:39,960 Speaker 1: Steph now ship become known as one of the greatest 1044 00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:43,840 Speaker 1: shoots ever to lace up in the NBA. That's mind boggling. 1045 00:53:44,080 --> 00:53:46,320 Speaker 1: That's my emboggling for me, you know, giving them a 1046 00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:50,120 Speaker 1: lower they're playing around and he four years old and 1047 00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:52,839 Speaker 1: of a setting down, he up there shooting the lights out. Man, 1048 00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:56,080 Speaker 1: It's surreal. But I'm so happy and blessed for those guys, 1049 00:53:56,160 --> 00:53:59,080 Speaker 1: for his family because they deserved him, you know, because 1050 00:53:59,120 --> 00:54:02,360 Speaker 1: they worked extremely hard. No, Steph as a kid, he 1051 00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:04,520 Speaker 1: wished he you know, he was a dream to get 1052 00:54:04,600 --> 00:54:06,759 Speaker 1: the five three because he felt like I got five three, 1053 00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:09,560 Speaker 1: I could play in the NBA. Yeah, yeah, yeah, So 1054 00:54:09,680 --> 00:54:11,960 Speaker 1: that was special, man, saying them guys being able to 1055 00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:14,520 Speaker 1: fulfill their dreams. You mentioned the trade to go to 1056 00:54:14,560 --> 00:54:17,640 Speaker 1: the state. Uh, you spent some time in Toronto with 1057 00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:20,760 Speaker 1: a young Vince Carter who out the gate was a monster, 1058 00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:23,520 Speaker 1: but also T Mac talked to us about both those 1059 00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:25,880 Speaker 1: guys and did you see again Vince was hit the 1060 00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:29,959 Speaker 1: scene going crazy, but did you see T Mac had 1061 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:32,200 Speaker 1: what he had in him to become the star he 1062 00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:36,800 Speaker 1: became absolutely. I mean I looked at those two guys 1063 00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:39,319 Speaker 1: like that. I looked at LJ and SOO when they 1064 00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:42,080 Speaker 1: first came into league. You know, they was hungry so 1065 00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:46,200 Speaker 1: much talent. And I always remember with Mode had always 1066 00:54:46,239 --> 00:54:48,400 Speaker 1: told me in terms of being able to have that 1067 00:54:48,560 --> 00:54:51,840 Speaker 1: longevity career, understand the importance of how to conduct yourself 1068 00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:54,040 Speaker 1: on and off the court. And I personally took those 1069 00:54:54,080 --> 00:54:56,640 Speaker 1: guys under my wing because I wanted to make sure 1070 00:54:56,760 --> 00:55:00,439 Speaker 1: that they had that opportunity to be the best, best 1071 00:55:00,560 --> 00:55:04,000 Speaker 1: version of themselves because this league can be so cruisier, 1072 00:55:04,080 --> 00:55:06,279 Speaker 1: especially to people that's out there coming after you. And 1073 00:55:06,360 --> 00:55:08,080 Speaker 1: when I got the opportunity to play with Vince and 1074 00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:11,400 Speaker 1: T Matt, I mean my eyes lit up because they 1075 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:13,279 Speaker 1: was a little totally different from L G. Z Oh, 1076 00:55:13,560 --> 00:55:17,120 Speaker 1: these with guards to where they had this ability to 1077 00:55:17,360 --> 00:55:19,960 Speaker 1: create and to be able to, you know, in the 1078 00:55:20,080 --> 00:55:23,360 Speaker 1: highlight realms, the realms that they had was was you know, 1079 00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:28,200 Speaker 1: it was amazing and just listening having having their air, 1080 00:55:28,960 --> 00:55:31,759 Speaker 1: being able to have their air because they was hungry. Um, 1081 00:55:32,440 --> 00:55:35,719 Speaker 1: they was willing to listen and just telling them and 1082 00:55:35,800 --> 00:55:37,960 Speaker 1: teaching them. And you know how the dudes and dumps 1083 00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:40,799 Speaker 1: to go about yourself and go about to be professionals, 1084 00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:43,839 Speaker 1: I mean, and saying how they're able to put their 1085 00:55:43,920 --> 00:55:47,040 Speaker 1: career together. It's priceless, man, It is priceless. That's what 1086 00:55:47,120 --> 00:55:49,480 Speaker 1: it's all about. I know. Sometimes, I mean, we get 1087 00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:51,800 Speaker 1: used to seeing such amazing stuff all the time that 1088 00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:54,759 Speaker 1: it doesn't really a us anymore. But with those two 1089 00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:57,520 Speaker 1: in particular, when you, like I said, when you saw 1090 00:55:57,640 --> 00:55:59,600 Speaker 1: them playing some of the stuff they were doing, did 1091 00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:01,719 Speaker 1: you ever catch yourself in a moment like, oh ship, 1092 00:56:01,840 --> 00:56:04,120 Speaker 1: I gotta snap out of this because I'm still playing, 1093 00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:05,920 Speaker 1: or or anything like that, Because I mean, you know, 1094 00:56:06,040 --> 00:56:08,560 Speaker 1: Vince was making every highlight. Really you can imagine Team 1095 00:56:08,600 --> 00:56:10,640 Speaker 1: Mack when he got his opportunity, he was doing his thing. 1096 00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:12,520 Speaker 1: Were there any times where they just kind of caught 1097 00:56:12,560 --> 00:56:17,879 Speaker 1: you in in all situations? Oh yeah, in practice every time, 1098 00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:20,840 Speaker 1: I mean in practice they'd be doing some real stuff. 1099 00:56:20,880 --> 00:56:23,439 Speaker 1: But then in the game. I mean I gave vincel pass. 1100 00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:24,800 Speaker 1: I didn't think he was going to catch him. We 1101 00:56:24,840 --> 00:56:27,239 Speaker 1: was playing to Charlotte Horns. Believe it or not. I 1102 00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:29,160 Speaker 1: threw it and I thought I threw it too high, 1103 00:56:29,360 --> 00:56:34,799 Speaker 1: Like damn, it was exactly right, and no such thing. 1104 00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:37,360 Speaker 1: This kid caught it. And not only did he catch it, 1105 00:56:37,920 --> 00:56:40,160 Speaker 1: he was aimed to carry it to the basket. And 1106 00:56:40,239 --> 00:56:44,680 Speaker 1: I would like stopped me saying, like my name, you know, 1107 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:47,799 Speaker 1: I just man, that was that I'm telling you, man. 1108 00:56:48,960 --> 00:56:52,320 Speaker 1: I mean it was effortless too. I mean his little 1109 00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:55,200 Speaker 1: routine warm up, just go up and just touch the 1110 00:56:55,280 --> 00:56:58,040 Speaker 1: top of the box on the backboard, you know, and 1111 00:56:58,080 --> 00:57:00,319 Speaker 1: it just feel. It's not like a run to jump, 1112 00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:03,320 Speaker 1: just a one lott a little one up jump. And 1113 00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:05,920 Speaker 1: I'm looking at man, where these kids get bats like that? 1114 00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:08,600 Speaker 1: You know? And this thing is natural bounced. But the 1115 00:57:08,719 --> 00:57:12,000 Speaker 1: skill set was something that I was kind of impressed with, 1116 00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:15,080 Speaker 1: you know. The jumping ability was one thing, but the 1117 00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:17,640 Speaker 1: skill set. And I didn't realize that Vinska shoot the 1118 00:57:17,680 --> 00:57:20,040 Speaker 1: ball as well as he did, as well as Team 1119 00:57:20,080 --> 00:57:22,120 Speaker 1: Mat as well as Team Mac. I didn't realize those 1120 00:57:22,160 --> 00:57:24,680 Speaker 1: guys was can shoot the ball as well as they did. 1121 00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:35,080 Speaker 1: You step away from the game in two thousand one, 1122 00:57:35,920 --> 00:57:39,360 Speaker 1: the shortest player ever top twenty five, top twenty five 1123 00:57:39,520 --> 00:57:41,520 Speaker 1: career and assists, played four two years and had a 1124 00:57:41,600 --> 00:57:44,200 Speaker 1: hell of a resume. Bro, Do you have any regrets? 1125 00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:48,040 Speaker 1: No regrets. You know, I was sixteen on the list 1126 00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,280 Speaker 1: before I left. When I first retired, and the reason 1127 00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:54,160 Speaker 1: I retired was mainly because my mom. You know, my 1128 00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:58,920 Speaker 1: mom was batting cancer canceled at the time. UM, I 1129 00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:01,400 Speaker 1: had three years left my contract. I would have played 1130 00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:04,200 Speaker 1: seventeen years. I got paid for seventeen, but I only 1131 00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:06,920 Speaker 1: played for four team. I'm thankful for Mark Cuban for 1132 00:58:07,040 --> 00:58:10,640 Speaker 1: allowing me to come off the books and not allowed 1133 00:58:10,680 --> 00:58:12,400 Speaker 1: them to go with the luxury tax, and he just 1134 00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:14,840 Speaker 1: paid me all the way through to two thousand four, 1135 00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:18,280 Speaker 1: So I truly appreciate that. UM. But MYMS was going 1136 00:58:18,320 --> 00:58:22,600 Speaker 1: through her her challenges and for me, she meant everything. 1137 00:58:23,120 --> 00:58:27,440 Speaker 1: She meant everything for me, and I just didn't want 1138 00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:29,320 Speaker 1: to go out there and play no more. You know, 1139 00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:35,520 Speaker 1: once she once she no longer it was part of this. 1140 00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:37,240 Speaker 1: I didn't want to be part of it no more. 1141 00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:39,760 Speaker 1: So I felt like I did enough. I did not 1142 00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:42,479 Speaker 1: did well enough. For my money. You know, I wasn't 1143 00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:46,280 Speaker 1: in no situation, so I just couldn't. I felt like 1144 00:58:46,360 --> 00:58:48,240 Speaker 1: she saw my last game and it won't need to 1145 00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:50,640 Speaker 1: me go play no more control, says I lost. I 1146 00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:52,760 Speaker 1: lost my mom to cancer too, and that's how Jack 1147 00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:55,040 Speaker 1: and I came so close. My mom was diagnosed with 1148 00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:58,480 Speaker 1: stage four cancer November twenty one, two thousand seven, and 1149 00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:02,000 Speaker 1: died the seven, so twenty six days. So I know 1150 00:59:02,160 --> 00:59:05,600 Speaker 1: what kind of monster um cancer can be. So again, 1151 00:59:05,640 --> 00:59:10,040 Speaker 1: condolences man, that ship is That ship is never easy. Yeah, 1152 00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:12,480 Speaker 1: it's been ship. It's been twenty one years and it 1153 00:59:12,560 --> 00:59:15,920 Speaker 1: felt like it still feel like yesterday, that's mine, But 1154 00:59:16,320 --> 00:59:19,840 Speaker 1: it seems like it just happened. Without basketball in your 1155 00:59:19,920 --> 00:59:23,320 Speaker 1: life these days? How do you satisfy your competitive drive? 1156 00:59:23,720 --> 00:59:25,840 Speaker 1: I know it's still in. You'll never leave us. What 1157 00:59:25,960 --> 00:59:28,080 Speaker 1: do you mean to kind of get that out? Well, 1158 00:59:30,120 --> 00:59:32,160 Speaker 1: because I got my kids. My kids keep me on 1159 00:59:32,240 --> 00:59:34,360 Speaker 1: my toes. That got gray babies, They keep me on 1160 00:59:34,440 --> 00:59:37,880 Speaker 1: my toes. My foundation. I got a nonprofit foundation where 1161 00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:42,440 Speaker 1: we provide scholarship for trade bound students. A lot of 1162 00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:46,240 Speaker 1: folks focus on the four year university students. You know, 1163 00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:49,320 Speaker 1: I really want to kind of give a platform to 1164 00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:53,720 Speaker 1: those kids who have ambitions of going to trade skill 1165 00:59:53,760 --> 00:59:56,720 Speaker 1: schools because I believe they can come right out and 1166 00:59:57,360 --> 01:00:00,080 Speaker 1: be productive and get a job right away and be 1167 01:00:00,200 --> 01:00:04,320 Speaker 1: skillful in those positions. And we also we feed the community. 1168 01:00:04,680 --> 01:00:07,760 Speaker 1: You know, we got a Label Love program where we 1169 01:00:07,880 --> 01:00:14,919 Speaker 1: got and feed the community on Thanksgiving, Christmas, uh Labor Day, 1170 01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:17,000 Speaker 1: so all the holidays we go to the community and 1171 01:00:17,040 --> 01:00:21,320 Speaker 1: we feed feed the community um thousand families per time 1172 01:00:21,400 --> 01:00:23,960 Speaker 1: at a time to where they can come out and 1173 01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:28,360 Speaker 1: not have to make a sacrifice whether you got gasling 1174 01:00:28,560 --> 01:00:31,040 Speaker 1: your car as opposed to food on your table. So 1175 01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:33,720 Speaker 1: you know, none of my times in that regards, and 1176 01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:36,320 Speaker 1: you know, serving as the basketor for the NBA as 1177 01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:39,560 Speaker 1: well as the Charlotte Haunets, and you know it's a 1178 01:00:39,600 --> 01:00:42,240 Speaker 1: lot of speaking engagements and those in those regards. So 1179 01:00:43,040 --> 01:00:46,320 Speaker 1: keeps me do anything athletically still, you still play pick up, 1180 01:00:46,400 --> 01:00:49,240 Speaker 1: you golf, you do anything like that. Yeah, I'm golfing 1181 01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:51,120 Speaker 1: all the time. I ain't. Don't no more running up 1182 01:00:51,120 --> 01:00:53,120 Speaker 1: and down New Court, no more run up and down 1183 01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:55,560 Speaker 1: the core ft me. You heard Jack talking. That's when 1184 01:00:55,600 --> 01:00:57,800 Speaker 1: you first got on Jack. Jack has had a new founder. 1185 01:00:57,840 --> 01:00:59,560 Speaker 1: Let me get back and start playing in this body 1186 01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:02,160 Speaker 1: feels like it's gonna crash every time he's done. I 1187 01:01:02,160 --> 01:01:04,520 Speaker 1: don't know what je Jack, Jack, you need to stop 1188 01:01:04,640 --> 01:01:07,040 Speaker 1: that man and tell you you don't need to put 1189 01:01:07,120 --> 01:01:10,080 Speaker 1: that notion in your head because you know, those little 1190 01:01:10,120 --> 01:01:13,120 Speaker 1: toe injuries take a long time to heal. You can 1191 01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:16,000 Speaker 1: get it caught and you did sheet and you can 1192 01:01:16,040 --> 01:01:21,120 Speaker 1: be hurt. That's what we did. Now. Thank God, all right, 1193 01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:25,680 Speaker 1: thank God for the tree Man, for cannabis. I be 1194 01:01:25,720 --> 01:01:30,400 Speaker 1: in the hospital right now. They take us back to 1195 01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,480 Speaker 1: nineteen six. You were part of, to me, one of 1196 01:01:33,560 --> 01:01:37,440 Speaker 1: the greatest basketball movies of all time. Space Jim, Um, 1197 01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:41,760 Speaker 1: how did that opportunity uh come about? Well, my agent 1198 01:01:41,920 --> 01:01:46,960 Speaker 1: was David Falk and Michael sut mean, Michael Patrick. We 1199 01:01:47,080 --> 01:01:50,080 Speaker 1: all had the same agent, and David Falk Warner brothers. 1200 01:01:50,120 --> 01:01:53,560 Speaker 1: I guess they called them and they was interested in 1201 01:01:53,880 --> 01:01:56,480 Speaker 1: some guys that pursuit this movie, which you just a 1202 01:01:56,560 --> 01:01:59,360 Speaker 1: little to Space Sham. And at the time I just 1203 01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:01,960 Speaker 1: had certain you know, I had surgery on my knee 1204 01:02:02,080 --> 01:02:04,160 Speaker 1: and I couldn't even walk, you know, I was on 1205 01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:07,440 Speaker 1: crutches and so forth, and they had Tim Hardaway come 1206 01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:11,160 Speaker 1: out there and and read my lines, and they told me, well, 1207 01:02:11,480 --> 01:02:13,320 Speaker 1: you know, moy just come on out anyway. You know, 1208 01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:15,440 Speaker 1: we just we're just trying to find a way to 1209 01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:18,440 Speaker 1: make it work. If not, then we're gonna just go 1210 01:02:18,600 --> 01:02:20,600 Speaker 1: another out. So I just decided to go out there 1211 01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:23,560 Speaker 1: and read my lines, and they kind of created an 1212 01:02:23,560 --> 01:02:26,960 Speaker 1: opportunity where instead of me walking, it was pulling me 1213 01:02:27,040 --> 01:02:29,400 Speaker 1: on the on the trolley, so act like I was 1214 01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:31,600 Speaker 1: kind of walking when moving my shoulders on one of 1215 01:02:31,680 --> 01:02:35,600 Speaker 1: the scenes. Um, but you know, it worked out. It 1216 01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:38,760 Speaker 1: worked out. They they used me, you know, and we 1217 01:02:38,880 --> 01:02:41,000 Speaker 1: had a I mean, damn, we had so much fun 1218 01:02:41,080 --> 01:02:43,280 Speaker 1: on that set. We was there for about three weeks. 1219 01:02:43,680 --> 01:02:45,920 Speaker 1: That was the same time when they created the basketball 1220 01:02:46,280 --> 01:02:49,440 Speaker 1: Jim for m J, which I couldn't play because I 1221 01:02:49,520 --> 01:02:51,200 Speaker 1: had surgery on my knee. But there was some great 1222 01:02:51,240 --> 01:02:55,480 Speaker 1: pickup games over there, you know set. I remember one 1223 01:02:55,560 --> 01:02:59,840 Speaker 1: morning we were supposed to have a shoot and l 1224 01:03:00,080 --> 01:03:02,560 Speaker 1: J decided to get it. He wanted to get a 1225 01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:05,720 Speaker 1: lotrd trim a lord hack up before the shoot, and 1226 01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:07,640 Speaker 1: he let this white dude cut his head who never 1227 01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:11,960 Speaker 1: cut a black guy head before. So long story short, 1228 01:03:12,160 --> 01:03:15,520 Speaker 1: he gave him a fucked up cut. So we had 1229 01:03:15,560 --> 01:03:17,560 Speaker 1: to counsel to shoot that morning, and they had to 1230 01:03:18,080 --> 01:03:21,040 Speaker 1: have some life from l A to kind of tighten 1231 01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:23,360 Speaker 1: him up to where he felt comfortable to going back 1232 01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:26,160 Speaker 1: on cameras. But man, there was some good days back there. 1233 01:03:26,160 --> 01:03:29,240 Speaker 1: A lot of card playing, a lot of cards. If 1234 01:03:29,280 --> 01:03:32,240 Speaker 1: they were gonna be a bio pick of your life, 1235 01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:40,040 Speaker 1: who would play you? Oh ship? Who's gonna play? Damn? Yeah? 1236 01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:43,400 Speaker 1: I mean, ain't too many five ft three guys out 1237 01:03:43,440 --> 01:03:48,040 Speaker 1: there that they kind of said, I main, God, who 1238 01:03:48,080 --> 01:03:52,800 Speaker 1: would I'm trying to think of an active man. I 1239 01:03:52,920 --> 01:03:55,040 Speaker 1: can't think of to anybody out there. May not have 1240 01:03:55,120 --> 01:03:58,560 Speaker 1: to be five free any Kevin kep you Kevin Hart 1241 01:03:58,600 --> 01:04:08,400 Speaker 1: to day you know, care you done? Calf could probably 1242 01:04:08,440 --> 01:04:11,160 Speaker 1: play keV got I did I think like a man 1243 01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:13,080 Speaker 1: with Kevin. I just thought he was a funny guy 1244 01:04:13,160 --> 01:04:14,600 Speaker 1: that he could he could hoop a little bit. He 1245 01:04:14,720 --> 01:04:16,360 Speaker 1: was out there kind of showing that ship Calm might 1246 01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:17,760 Speaker 1: be a good one. We just have to put some 1247 01:04:17,840 --> 01:04:21,800 Speaker 1: makeup on them, lightening them up a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. 1248 01:04:21,840 --> 01:04:24,920 Speaker 1: He played in the Celebrity Game with up as you 1249 01:04:25,040 --> 01:04:27,080 Speaker 1: know for the NBA. You know when I played in 1250 01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:30,640 Speaker 1: that Celefty game, but yeah, I don't know. Man, that's 1251 01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:34,200 Speaker 1: that's a hard one. That the kind of spell up 1252 01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:39,520 Speaker 1: trying to think of, Man, you you got we come 1253 01:04:39,560 --> 01:04:43,360 Speaker 1: back to LaMelo ball. How is he taking the city 1254 01:04:43,400 --> 01:04:45,920 Speaker 1: of Charlotte in that organization by storm? No, dont fit 1255 01:04:46,000 --> 01:04:49,400 Speaker 1: in perfect. I mean he's a great kid. He understands 1256 01:04:49,400 --> 01:04:52,120 Speaker 1: where it is I think, you know, and meaning by 1257 01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:54,800 Speaker 1: it's a small market, you know, it's not in l 1258 01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:57,560 Speaker 1: A or New York. Uh. He embraced the town to 1259 01:04:57,760 --> 01:05:01,200 Speaker 1: this town as open arms with embraced him with long 1260 01:05:01,320 --> 01:05:04,680 Speaker 1: sources of hospitality. Um. I just think he really gets it, 1261 01:05:04,880 --> 01:05:06,880 Speaker 1: you know, be so young, he really gets it and 1262 01:05:07,040 --> 01:05:09,680 Speaker 1: he really electrified the crowd. I mean he's a guy 1263 01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:15,040 Speaker 1: kid that uh, bringing his teammates and getting them gavnized 1264 01:05:15,120 --> 01:05:17,760 Speaker 1: and believing enough in the city is following right behind him. 1265 01:05:18,000 --> 01:05:20,400 Speaker 1: So I really think that the feature is bright. I 1266 01:05:20,560 --> 01:05:23,160 Speaker 1: really believe that bringing in I T. Was a big 1267 01:05:23,480 --> 01:05:26,560 Speaker 1: push for him. And I told Mitch cup shut that. Um. 1268 01:05:26,760 --> 01:05:29,480 Speaker 1: But people don't on the under estimate what I T 1269 01:05:30,520 --> 01:05:33,280 Speaker 1: can mean for a guy like Melow, not just on 1270 01:05:33,400 --> 01:05:36,120 Speaker 1: the basketball court, but off the court as well, in 1271 01:05:36,280 --> 01:05:39,320 Speaker 1: terms of the way this kid was and how you 1272 01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:41,120 Speaker 1: can tuck them, and you never realized he was an 1273 01:05:41,160 --> 01:05:44,520 Speaker 1: All Star, you know, so and they ain't have nobody 1274 01:05:44,560 --> 01:05:47,320 Speaker 1: else on that bench who can give him that type 1275 01:05:47,360 --> 01:05:50,440 Speaker 1: of information, especially at that point guard position, and not 1276 01:05:50,600 --> 01:05:53,360 Speaker 1: only that he can play alongside of them too. So 1277 01:05:53,520 --> 01:05:55,560 Speaker 1: I was really happy and grateful that he got his 1278 01:05:55,640 --> 01:05:57,800 Speaker 1: opportunity here in Charlotte, even though he even you know, 1279 01:05:57,840 --> 01:06:00,640 Speaker 1: getting opportunities in Dallas and that and the and so forth. 1280 01:06:00,720 --> 01:06:02,760 Speaker 1: But I told him this is the place that he 1281 01:06:02,840 --> 01:06:06,640 Speaker 1: can kind of we you know, we used in his career, 1282 01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:09,880 Speaker 1: especially if this organization look at him the way that 1283 01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:12,600 Speaker 1: I'm looking at him, and how he can impact, you know, 1284 01:06:13,040 --> 01:06:15,400 Speaker 1: the young fellas on that team. I think you touched 1285 01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:17,439 Speaker 1: on something that Jack and I talked about all the time, 1286 01:06:17,600 --> 01:06:19,680 Speaker 1: is the league is so young now, there's no veteran 1287 01:06:19,760 --> 01:06:22,840 Speaker 1: leadership and how important that really is. Like you said, 1288 01:06:22,880 --> 01:06:24,840 Speaker 1: obviously he can still give you something on the court, 1289 01:06:24,880 --> 01:06:27,480 Speaker 1: but off the court could possibly be even be more 1290 01:06:27,640 --> 01:06:30,520 Speaker 1: valuable at this point, you know, helping guide young players 1291 01:06:30,560 --> 01:06:32,720 Speaker 1: like LaMelo and and some of the other guys on 1292 01:06:32,760 --> 01:06:34,760 Speaker 1: the roster. But it's something we talked about all the time. 1293 01:06:34,800 --> 01:06:36,600 Speaker 1: I mean, now, I mean when we came in the league, 1294 01:06:37,040 --> 01:06:39,720 Speaker 1: there was always vets thirty seven thirty thirty nine year 1295 01:06:39,720 --> 01:06:41,320 Speaker 1: old guys that can kind of you know, R O 1296 01:06:41,480 --> 01:06:44,439 Speaker 1: G s now that it's the young leading the young. 1297 01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:47,160 Speaker 1: So I think that's a great situation for I T. 1298 01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:50,280 Speaker 1: Obviously a friend of our show, a friend of the program, 1299 01:06:50,360 --> 01:06:52,440 Speaker 1: but but happy to see he landed on his feet there. 1300 01:06:52,480 --> 01:06:54,600 Speaker 1: But I love what you touched on because I think 1301 01:06:54,640 --> 01:06:56,600 Speaker 1: it's so undervalue these days that they don't you know, 1302 01:06:56,800 --> 01:06:59,800 Speaker 1: as soon as you get past Ship thirty three, thirty 1303 01:06:59,840 --> 01:07:02,920 Speaker 1: three thirty four, that window was shutting, and and and 1304 01:07:03,280 --> 01:07:06,120 Speaker 1: and how important veterans are to help, especially young teams. 1305 01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:08,400 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you know Ship when you as soon you 1306 01:07:08,520 --> 01:07:12,200 Speaker 1: hit thirty, they're looking at you old. You know, I 1307 01:07:12,280 --> 01:07:14,720 Speaker 1: remember going and let's I said it and they're talking 1308 01:07:15,080 --> 01:07:17,800 Speaker 1: and when you're talking about renegotiation, they really bring that up. 1309 01:07:18,280 --> 01:07:21,680 Speaker 1: So um, I mean, I'm just so happy for I T. Man. 1310 01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:24,040 Speaker 1: He's a great kid. He's a great kid man that 1311 01:07:24,200 --> 01:07:27,720 Speaker 1: deserves this opportunity, you know, with all he went through 1312 01:07:27,760 --> 01:07:30,040 Speaker 1: it and he had to endure that be back in 1313 01:07:30,120 --> 01:07:32,800 Speaker 1: this position because he got a lot to give, and 1314 01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:35,280 Speaker 1: I'm just happy that he's here. Being able to give 1315 01:07:35,320 --> 01:07:38,160 Speaker 1: it to this organization, which I got a great fond 1316 01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:41,920 Speaker 1: memory of. Outside of the guys on your the Hornets, 1317 01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:46,560 Speaker 1: are there any players you enjoy watching today? Oh? Of 1318 01:07:46,640 --> 01:07:48,760 Speaker 1: course it was of course step You know a little 1319 01:07:48,800 --> 01:07:51,800 Speaker 1: watching steph CP. You know, not just because he went 1320 01:07:51,880 --> 01:07:55,840 Speaker 1: to wake Fas, but you know, because he's still that general, 1321 01:07:56,240 --> 01:08:00,600 Speaker 1: that guy that really elevates his teammates and people understand 1322 01:08:01,280 --> 01:08:04,520 Speaker 1: the importance of his brilliancy in terms of running the team. 1323 01:08:04,880 --> 01:08:06,919 Speaker 1: You know, running the team is something that is being 1324 01:08:07,640 --> 01:08:11,040 Speaker 1: so underappreciated that people don't really look at that. That's 1325 01:08:11,640 --> 01:08:14,200 Speaker 1: the beginning start of how you being able to be 1326 01:08:14,720 --> 01:08:17,240 Speaker 1: really successful amongst that team. So I'm happy for that, 1327 01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:19,400 Speaker 1: And I mean I just love the game, you know, 1328 01:08:19,439 --> 01:08:21,840 Speaker 1: I love watching the game k d A Cave, IRV 1329 01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:24,840 Speaker 1: and all the greats that's out there doing that thing 1330 01:08:25,280 --> 01:08:27,840 Speaker 1: from the job Iran, and I know that that's another 1331 01:08:27,920 --> 01:08:31,600 Speaker 1: special kid right there. You know, johjis really putting his 1332 01:08:31,720 --> 01:08:35,519 Speaker 1: lead on notice and people don't understand that. They're looking 1333 01:08:35,560 --> 01:08:40,360 Speaker 1: at the the athleticism, but the i Q level. It's 1334 01:08:40,400 --> 01:08:42,960 Speaker 1: the i Q level for me in terms of his 1335 01:08:43,080 --> 01:08:45,600 Speaker 1: masturation on that floor, being able to to get his 1336 01:08:45,680 --> 01:08:48,240 Speaker 1: teammates involved at the same time being able to do 1337 01:08:48,479 --> 01:08:50,599 Speaker 1: his I'm gonna put you on the spot right here. 1338 01:08:51,320 --> 01:08:54,080 Speaker 1: Who do you see We're about a few weeks away 1339 01:08:54,120 --> 01:08:56,160 Speaker 1: from the playoffs. Who do you see in the finals? 1340 01:08:56,200 --> 01:08:58,400 Speaker 1: Who do you think is going to represent the East? Well, 1341 01:08:58,479 --> 01:09:01,120 Speaker 1: it's hard to go for me. People keep talking about, 1342 01:09:01,920 --> 01:09:06,360 Speaker 1: you know, the Heat and for me, just Milwaukee. You 1343 01:09:06,360 --> 01:09:09,639 Speaker 1: gotta go through Milwaukee. You know, Milwaukee is the complete 1344 01:09:09,680 --> 01:09:11,880 Speaker 1: team for me in terms of what they have and 1345 01:09:12,000 --> 01:09:13,880 Speaker 1: what they was able to do. And you still gotta 1346 01:09:13,920 --> 01:09:16,559 Speaker 1: beat the defensive champ in order to become the champs. 1347 01:09:16,640 --> 01:09:21,240 Speaker 1: And the East right now, there's too many unnoticed for me. 1348 01:09:21,280 --> 01:09:24,000 Speaker 1: It's too many concerns with Brooklyn. You never know what's 1349 01:09:24,040 --> 01:09:26,439 Speaker 1: going on with this situation with Kyrie and so forth. 1350 01:09:26,520 --> 01:09:28,400 Speaker 1: How many more games you're gonna be to participate in, 1351 01:09:28,960 --> 01:09:31,720 Speaker 1: you know, and and with the Heat, you know, they 1352 01:09:31,840 --> 01:09:36,479 Speaker 1: just for me, is something missing. It's just something missing. 1353 01:09:36,560 --> 01:09:39,240 Speaker 1: Even though they got some dogs over there, it's just 1354 01:09:39,479 --> 01:09:43,160 Speaker 1: something missing. Even though with the addition of Kyle Lowry, 1355 01:09:43,640 --> 01:09:46,879 Speaker 1: it's still is something missing to where they're not jelling 1356 01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:49,400 Speaker 1: like they even though they got the best record. But 1357 01:09:49,520 --> 01:09:51,519 Speaker 1: it's something that they're not jelling the way I think 1358 01:09:51,560 --> 01:09:54,519 Speaker 1: they would have like they did in the past when 1359 01:09:54,560 --> 01:09:58,360 Speaker 1: they wanted So um, in the east is Milwaukee and 1360 01:09:58,439 --> 01:10:02,240 Speaker 1: then in the West it's Phoenix. You know, go to State. 1361 01:10:02,320 --> 01:10:05,920 Speaker 1: Got too many inconsistency things going on. Phoenix has been 1362 01:10:05,960 --> 01:10:08,760 Speaker 1: steady even though CP has been out, but he'll be back. 1363 01:10:09,080 --> 01:10:14,400 Speaker 1: So I got those two and yeah, man, I think 1364 01:10:14,439 --> 01:10:16,920 Speaker 1: Phoenix is too. I agree with you. I mean, I like, 1365 01:10:17,080 --> 01:10:19,240 Speaker 1: I like Golden State, but you know, with steps injury 1366 01:10:19,280 --> 01:10:21,280 Speaker 1: and like you said, too many unknowns, it's gonna be 1367 01:10:21,320 --> 01:10:24,160 Speaker 1: hard to get that rhythm. But Phoenix is state consistent. 1368 01:10:24,200 --> 01:10:25,880 Speaker 1: They got a taste of it last year. Everyone thought 1369 01:10:25,880 --> 01:10:27,960 Speaker 1: it was luck that they got there. They took that 1370 01:10:28,040 --> 01:10:29,759 Speaker 1: ship to heart and had a chip on their shoulder 1371 01:10:29,800 --> 01:10:32,760 Speaker 1: all year. Got better shout out Money Williams and them boys. 1372 01:10:32,760 --> 01:10:35,519 Speaker 1: So I definitely think, you know, Phoenix, it's gonna be 1373 01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:38,200 Speaker 1: a good year for Phoenix. And you guys know, it 1374 01:10:38,320 --> 01:10:40,960 Speaker 1: takes a lot, a lot to go right in order 1375 01:10:41,000 --> 01:10:43,600 Speaker 1: to win that ship. You know, it just it just 1376 01:10:43,720 --> 01:10:46,519 Speaker 1: takes a lot, you know, and everything just gotta line up. 1377 01:10:46,560 --> 01:10:48,519 Speaker 1: A little luck gotta happen for you as well. I mean, 1378 01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:51,400 Speaker 1: you just gotta line up and with these other teams 1379 01:10:51,479 --> 01:10:54,320 Speaker 1: with you know, with Golden State, you know, not knowing 1380 01:10:54,400 --> 01:10:57,360 Speaker 1: the situation with Steph and Clay going through his situation 1381 01:10:57,439 --> 01:11:01,200 Speaker 1: and Draymon just coming back. You know, Finish just been steady. 1382 01:11:01,280 --> 01:11:03,360 Speaker 1: They just had an injury with CP, but they've just 1383 01:11:03,479 --> 01:11:06,760 Speaker 1: been steady and they've been playing steady basketball without him. 1384 01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:09,200 Speaker 1: So it's gonna be hard. I think it's gonna be 1385 01:11:09,240 --> 01:11:11,320 Speaker 1: hard to get them out. And I'm still rival Golden State, 1386 01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:13,120 Speaker 1: but I would love to see CP when the chip 1387 01:11:13,680 --> 01:11:18,960 Speaker 1: go ahead. Jack. Yeah, coming from Baltimore, Like you talk 1388 01:11:18,960 --> 01:11:22,920 Speaker 1: about Javonte Davis and what he means to boxing in Baltimore, Well, 1389 01:11:23,000 --> 01:11:29,080 Speaker 1: you know, we call him Tank, you know he yeah, yeah, Yeah, 1390 01:11:29,439 --> 01:11:32,960 Speaker 1: He's mean everything to be More. I mean that's representation. 1391 01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:35,559 Speaker 1: You know, anybody comes from be More, man, we're gonna 1392 01:11:36,080 --> 01:11:39,280 Speaker 1: we're gonna represent the city the way we where it's 1393 01:11:39,280 --> 01:11:42,960 Speaker 1: supposed to be represented. You know. And he's a blue collar. 1394 01:11:43,320 --> 01:11:45,840 Speaker 1: I mean, he's a kid that understands where he is 1395 01:11:46,000 --> 01:11:50,400 Speaker 1: and where he comes from, and he lived his life 1396 01:11:50,439 --> 01:11:53,000 Speaker 1: in that in in that way you know, he's been 1397 01:11:53,479 --> 01:11:56,479 Speaker 1: Now he's being very smart and in terms of keeping 1398 01:11:56,520 --> 01:12:01,479 Speaker 1: himself out of the lime life and negative situations. He's 1399 01:12:01,520 --> 01:12:04,360 Speaker 1: all about his business, he's about his family, you know, 1400 01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:08,040 Speaker 1: his little girl. I'm just loving everything about the Tank 1401 01:12:08,080 --> 01:12:11,000 Speaker 1: and I'm just so proud that he's able to, you know, 1402 01:12:11,160 --> 01:12:15,040 Speaker 1: be able to make it through those situations. It's growing 1403 01:12:15,120 --> 01:12:17,400 Speaker 1: up in the inner city of Bmo. But because people, 1404 01:12:17,520 --> 01:12:20,519 Speaker 1: you know, we all have stories. Everybody have challenges, you know, 1405 01:12:20,720 --> 01:12:23,880 Speaker 1: but when you're able to, you know, overcome those adversities 1406 01:12:24,280 --> 01:12:27,000 Speaker 1: and see them guys man being able to reach the 1407 01:12:27,040 --> 01:12:31,600 Speaker 1: pinnacle of success, you know, it's it's self rewarting. For me, 1408 01:12:32,120 --> 01:12:36,360 Speaker 1: I'm a big Take fan and I've seen it changed 1409 01:12:36,479 --> 01:12:38,559 Speaker 1: with my own eyes. You know. We go to all 1410 01:12:38,640 --> 01:12:43,000 Speaker 1: his fights and is af there's one fight he was 1411 01:12:43,080 --> 01:12:46,439 Speaker 1: early on how flashy he was, you know, and how 1412 01:12:46,479 --> 01:12:50,920 Speaker 1: he kind of now it's true professional, true professional. Yeah, 1413 01:12:51,000 --> 01:12:53,360 Speaker 1: he's preparing and a lot of stuff that he was 1414 01:12:53,400 --> 01:12:55,599 Speaker 1: doing off the court. I think he got away from 1415 01:12:56,040 --> 01:12:58,559 Speaker 1: and locked into being a pro. And and it's definitely showed. 1416 01:12:58,600 --> 01:13:01,200 Speaker 1: And all his performances up from from that last perform 1417 01:13:01,320 --> 01:13:03,599 Speaker 1: but three fights ago they had where he didn't prepass. 1418 01:13:03,720 --> 01:13:06,000 Speaker 1: So I'm a big time Take fan. You do is 1419 01:13:06,040 --> 01:13:08,320 Speaker 1: there any other boxes that you like to watch or 1420 01:13:08,400 --> 01:13:09,880 Speaker 1: in any other fights that you want to see in 1421 01:13:10,560 --> 01:13:16,320 Speaker 1: two well fights, man, I'll tell you what they the 1422 01:13:16,400 --> 01:13:19,320 Speaker 1: fights that's out there. You got special out there. We 1423 01:13:20,080 --> 01:13:23,360 Speaker 1: we got who else we got out there? We got 1424 01:13:23,880 --> 01:13:25,960 Speaker 1: we got goog y'all, we got Fermin firm and coming 1425 01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:30,040 Speaker 1: back right. Yeah. We gotta see we gotta say. We 1426 01:13:30,080 --> 01:13:33,719 Speaker 1: gotta see Thurman. Thurman been up and down. Yeah, and Carnello. 1427 01:13:33,800 --> 01:13:35,800 Speaker 1: You know what I gotta I need. I need to 1428 01:13:35,840 --> 01:13:38,720 Speaker 1: see Carnello. I need to see Cannello fight somebody. Man. 1429 01:13:38,960 --> 01:13:40,720 Speaker 1: He need to fight a real now, that's what he 1430 01:13:40,800 --> 01:13:43,960 Speaker 1: needs to do. I need Yeah, yeah, I need to 1431 01:13:43,960 --> 01:13:48,800 Speaker 1: see him fight. You know, uh uh? Who we got 1432 01:13:48,920 --> 01:13:51,519 Speaker 1: that I'm missing? I'm missing one listening one, not not 1433 01:13:51,720 --> 01:14:02,800 Speaker 1: Porter Charlo, not not Challos, not Challos. I'm missing one. Crawford. Crawford, Yeah, Crawford, Yes, yes, him, 1434 01:14:03,640 --> 01:14:07,719 Speaker 1: That's what I was missing. Crawford. Yeah. But Cannello gotta 1435 01:14:07,760 --> 01:14:12,200 Speaker 1: fight somebody. You know, he's been dancing around and on 1436 01:14:12,280 --> 01:14:15,320 Speaker 1: the first year I believe he for was was Mayweather, 1437 01:14:15,360 --> 01:14:17,080 Speaker 1: and that was too early for him to be fighting 1438 01:14:17,160 --> 01:14:20,479 Speaker 1: Mayweather when he for them, and and he's still arguing 1439 01:14:20,520 --> 01:14:23,479 Speaker 1: with Triple G and Triple and now he's still arguing 1440 01:14:23,520 --> 01:14:25,400 Speaker 1: with Triple G, trying to fight Triple G again. He 1441 01:14:25,479 --> 01:14:27,839 Speaker 1: needs to move on. You to one of them Charlotte 1442 01:14:27,840 --> 01:14:30,160 Speaker 1: boys and fight fight being to beat as I think 1443 01:14:30,200 --> 01:14:32,960 Speaker 1: being to be has to beat him, that's possibility. I 1444 01:14:33,120 --> 01:14:35,360 Speaker 1: like to see it though. I'd like to see that one. 1445 01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:37,640 Speaker 1: But that Triple G. Yeah, you he hit it, you 1446 01:14:37,760 --> 01:14:40,439 Speaker 1: hit on. You hit a good note there about Triple G, 1447 01:14:41,960 --> 01:14:45,680 Speaker 1: you know, but he Uh. I don't know who's out 1448 01:14:45,720 --> 01:14:47,519 Speaker 1: there for Tank though, I'm trying to think who would 1449 01:14:47,560 --> 01:14:50,320 Speaker 1: be a good fight for Tank that that way class 1450 01:14:50,439 --> 01:14:54,759 Speaker 1: he I'm happy fighting Roll. I'm happy he's he's getting 1451 01:14:54,760 --> 01:14:58,559 Speaker 1: a chance to fight. Has some trouble. But Ronnie talks 1452 01:14:58,600 --> 01:15:01,120 Speaker 1: a lot and ROLI think he he just the best 1453 01:15:01,240 --> 01:15:04,120 Speaker 1: things then boxing since boxing started. But he's one of 1454 01:15:04,160 --> 01:15:07,599 Speaker 1: those guys that take me to knock his face off. Tink. 1455 01:15:07,600 --> 01:15:11,680 Speaker 1: He's gonna shut him up real quick. He ta, he 1456 01:15:12,000 --> 01:15:14,320 Speaker 1: really that. I don't even know why I really put it. 1457 01:15:14,479 --> 01:15:16,760 Speaker 1: But he want that But he want that bag. He 1458 01:15:16,840 --> 01:15:20,439 Speaker 1: want that bag. Yeah, he want that bag. Yeah, he 1459 01:15:20,520 --> 01:15:23,480 Speaker 1: definitely wanted that bag. But let's since you on our podcasts, 1460 01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:26,040 Speaker 1: which we're happy that you came on. Let's talk about 1461 01:15:26,080 --> 01:15:28,519 Speaker 1: your podcast. How did you get into the space. Oh, 1462 01:15:28,720 --> 01:15:34,120 Speaker 1: she's just messing around with Oak Tree and Twirl, you know, 1463 01:15:34,680 --> 01:15:37,600 Speaker 1: and and just talking the game man, and well, you know, 1464 01:15:37,840 --> 01:15:40,519 Speaker 1: especially when you get around Oak and bringing all source 1465 01:15:40,600 --> 01:15:44,439 Speaker 1: of toppers up into where it's gonna go. It starts 1466 01:15:44,479 --> 01:15:47,519 Speaker 1: off one way and it's gonna be off another, you know, 1467 01:15:48,920 --> 01:15:51,639 Speaker 1: just just the way my man operate. And I love 1468 01:15:51,720 --> 01:15:54,040 Speaker 1: him for it, man, But you know, just talking to Game, 1469 01:15:54,120 --> 01:15:56,680 Speaker 1: and I felt like, you know, we had something to 1470 01:15:56,760 --> 01:16:00,759 Speaker 1: offer based on where we came from and our journeys. 1471 01:16:01,120 --> 01:16:04,280 Speaker 1: And Earl. Earl got so many damn stories, you know, 1472 01:16:04,640 --> 01:16:07,000 Speaker 1: him playing with the Doctor, Jay's or the world and 1473 01:16:07,160 --> 01:16:10,560 Speaker 1: Isaiah and so forth. I mean, he he's a storyteller. 1474 01:16:10,880 --> 01:16:13,479 Speaker 1: But you know, Tree, oh Tree got so much too. 1475 01:16:14,000 --> 01:16:16,160 Speaker 1: Where I just need to just sit back and listen, 1476 01:16:20,520 --> 01:16:22,519 Speaker 1: you know. All right, we're coming down to the home stretch. 1477 01:16:22,640 --> 01:16:24,880 Speaker 1: Quick hitters. First thing to come to mind. Let us 1478 01:16:24,960 --> 01:16:29,200 Speaker 1: know you plus four any players that have ever played 1479 01:16:29,240 --> 01:16:31,599 Speaker 1: in the NBA. Who are you bringing with you? Oh? 1480 01:16:31,960 --> 01:16:35,320 Speaker 1: Ship me plus four? Well, I'm gonna gona just stay 1481 01:16:35,400 --> 01:16:37,960 Speaker 1: with my boys that you know I'm gonna bring with me. 1482 01:16:38,000 --> 01:16:40,519 Speaker 1: I got del carry with me, I got Oak with me, 1483 01:16:41,120 --> 01:16:43,400 Speaker 1: I got l J with me, and I guys Zoe 1484 01:16:43,439 --> 01:16:48,680 Speaker 1: with me. That's a mob. That's a mob. Stuck on 1485 01:16:48,760 --> 01:16:53,400 Speaker 1: the island. Which three shows are movies? You're watching, oh, 1486 01:16:53,720 --> 01:16:58,000 Speaker 1: stuck on the island. I'm watching Space Game. I'm watching 1487 01:16:58,920 --> 01:17:06,439 Speaker 1: Caribbean through Seasm. That's a good that's a good basketball 1488 01:17:06,479 --> 01:17:09,920 Speaker 1: movie too. Yeah, all the movies that I was in, 1489 01:17:10,240 --> 01:17:12,760 Speaker 1: all the scenes that you were known as obviously one 1490 01:17:12,800 --> 01:17:16,200 Speaker 1: of the toughest defenders. Your top three toughest matchups, you 1491 01:17:16,320 --> 01:17:23,000 Speaker 1: felt like magic was one Penny and GP. I just 1492 01:17:23,240 --> 01:17:27,120 Speaker 1: I just watched uh hardbook Classes Class night. It was 1493 01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:33,599 Speaker 1: ninety three Phoenix versus Seattle in the playoffs, Charles Barkley's 1494 01:17:33,680 --> 01:17:36,040 Speaker 1: MVP year Verse Shawn Kemp and GP. That ship was 1495 01:17:36,120 --> 01:17:38,280 Speaker 1: a battle boy. The game was so different back then. 1496 01:17:38,320 --> 01:17:40,519 Speaker 1: The absolutely sat and watched the whole entire game and 1497 01:17:40,640 --> 01:17:43,439 Speaker 1: just saw, like you said, back to the basket, the 1498 01:17:43,600 --> 01:17:46,840 Speaker 1: tight curls, that the guiding the hand, how GP would 1499 01:17:46,880 --> 01:17:49,040 Speaker 1: try to and they started double teaming Kevin Johnson because 1500 01:17:49,040 --> 01:17:53,800 Speaker 1: he was too fast that it was dope forgot about 1501 01:17:53,880 --> 01:17:58,280 Speaker 1: kJ well, kJ was special boy Kje five Dinner Guests, 1502 01:17:58,560 --> 01:18:03,360 Speaker 1: Dad are Live? Five dinner guess. Oh, Michael Jackson's one. 1503 01:18:04,840 --> 01:18:09,200 Speaker 1: I got Martin Luther King is too, I got Mandela 1504 01:18:09,640 --> 01:18:14,360 Speaker 1: is three. Yeah. And then of course I would love 1505 01:18:14,760 --> 01:18:16,880 Speaker 1: had the opportunity to sit down with Mom and gay, 1506 01:18:18,840 --> 01:18:23,879 Speaker 1: you know, and for me, I did have an opportunity 1507 01:18:23,920 --> 01:18:26,640 Speaker 1: to sit down with her. But I would love to 1508 01:18:26,680 --> 01:18:29,960 Speaker 1: have a back at my identitable was my ms My answer? 1509 01:18:31,280 --> 01:18:35,120 Speaker 1: Very nice? Nice, nice favorite artists from the eighties and nineties, 1510 01:18:35,160 --> 01:18:37,679 Speaker 1: like who did you used to listen to? Uh preparing 1511 01:18:37,720 --> 01:18:40,120 Speaker 1: for games? Oh? Man? You know back then, that's when 1512 01:18:40,200 --> 01:18:42,439 Speaker 1: hip hop was just getting the beginning. You know what 1513 01:18:42,479 --> 01:18:44,360 Speaker 1: I mean? But you know, I gotta go with my 1514 01:18:44,479 --> 01:18:47,639 Speaker 1: man trial called quest because I was in this song, 1515 01:18:48,080 --> 01:18:50,320 Speaker 1: you know, to tip, I gotta get tipped some a 1516 01:18:50,360 --> 01:18:52,920 Speaker 1: little love. What guests would you like to see on 1517 01:18:53,080 --> 01:18:56,400 Speaker 1: our show? But before you answer this question, you asked 1518 01:18:56,479 --> 01:18:59,679 Speaker 1: you have to help us get your answer on our show? 1519 01:19:04,640 --> 01:19:06,880 Speaker 1: What guests I'd like to see you guys have on 1520 01:19:07,000 --> 01:19:11,240 Speaker 1: the show, And let me see what kiss? Who will be? 1521 01:19:11,560 --> 01:19:16,800 Speaker 1: Somebody that's really you said? You guys have everybody on 1522 01:19:19,200 --> 01:19:21,200 Speaker 1: dying to get on the show because I'm a Texas boy. 1523 01:19:21,840 --> 01:19:25,560 Speaker 1: Oh you're talking about l j J. Grandma, Ma that 1524 01:19:26,080 --> 01:19:35,519 Speaker 1: we need a show. We need I have a show. Okay, yes, yes, 1525 01:19:36,880 --> 01:19:40,160 Speaker 1: I work it. Well man, that's a rap, Buggy. We 1526 01:19:40,280 --> 01:19:42,800 Speaker 1: appreciate your time and everything you've done for this game, 1527 01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:45,880 Speaker 1: the inspiration you've been and continuing to take care of 1528 01:19:45,960 --> 01:19:48,680 Speaker 1: your community. We love, We appreciate you, man, and thank 1529 01:19:48,720 --> 01:19:51,800 Speaker 1: you for your time today. I appreciate you guys. Man. 1530 01:19:52,280 --> 01:19:53,920 Speaker 1: I've been a big fan of both of you guys 1531 01:19:54,000 --> 01:19:56,919 Speaker 1: for quite some time. I just really appreciate the platform 1532 01:19:57,000 --> 01:19:59,519 Speaker 1: that you guys created now, but more so what you 1533 01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:02,720 Speaker 1: gotta for your careers, with your family's and so forth. Man, 1534 01:20:02,880 --> 01:20:05,599 Speaker 1: keep spreading that love and keep doing that positive work 1535 01:20:05,640 --> 01:20:09,840 Speaker 1: out there. Well, that's a rap. Muggsy Bogus. Appreciate your 1536 01:20:09,880 --> 01:20:13,839 Speaker 1: basketball on YouTube and the I heart platform, Black Effects. 1537 01:20:14,160 --> 01:20:15,160 Speaker 1: We'll see y'all next week.