WEBVTT - How much electricity does the Internet use? 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:02.880 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 0:00:03.240 --> 0:00:08.960 It's ready. Are you get in touch with technology? With 0:00:09.119 --> 0:00:17.720 tech Stuff from how stuff works dot com. Hellove everybody, 0:00:17.760 --> 0:00:20.320 and welcome to tech Stuff. My name is Chris Poulette 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:23.200 and I'm an editor here at how stuff works dot com. 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.400 Sitting next to me, as always, is the sunny and 0:00:26.560 --> 0:00:35.720 genial senior writer Jonathan Strickland. Hey there, build up, I 0:00:35.800 --> 0:00:38.319 just you know, yeah, I couldn't. I couldn't follow that. 0:00:38.440 --> 0:00:41.120 I love it. So today we're going to talk a 0:00:41.120 --> 0:00:44.040 little bit. You know, you might remember several podcasts ago 0:00:44.080 --> 0:00:47.919 we we kind of compared the paper technology world and 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:52.840 the computer technology world. Uh well, we started thinking about 0:00:53.400 --> 0:00:55.560 other topics we could talk about. They're kind of related 0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:58.680 to that. And one of those is an interesting question 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:01.600 that a couple of people have asked, not just us, 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:06.240 but in general, and that question is how much electricity 0:01:06.400 --> 0:01:12.160 does the Internet require to work? Lots? Yeah, but if 0:01:12.160 --> 0:01:15.840 you wanted to get a little more specific, actually nobody knows. Yeah, 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:18.360 we we can. We can get that out of the way. 0:01:18.400 --> 0:01:21.679 First thing, We're going to go ahead and be completely 0:01:21.720 --> 0:01:27.679 straight with you guys. It is practically impossible to say 0:01:27.760 --> 0:01:31.319 with any degree of certainty how much electricity the Internet 0:01:31.360 --> 0:01:33.880 requires to work. Part of the reason for that is 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:37.399 that you're talking about such a massive machine, really the 0:01:37.400 --> 0:01:42.240 biggest machine in the in the world, and it's constantly changing. 0:01:42.319 --> 0:01:46.360 It's growing all the time. Uh, the components are changing 0:01:46.400 --> 0:01:50.080 all the time. So what might be true today could 0:01:50.160 --> 0:01:53.960 be completely false in a year from now. It may 0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:58.120 be that perhaps eighteen more data centers go online in 0:01:58.280 --> 0:02:01.600 every region in the United States, and that could change things. 0:02:01.680 --> 0:02:05.120 It could be that some sort of massive energy saving 0:02:06.080 --> 0:02:09.000 technology comes out and that could that could impact it. 0:02:09.480 --> 0:02:13.360 So when we talk about how much electricity the Internet uses, 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:19.040 keep in mind we're talking about estimates and vague ones 0:02:19.200 --> 0:02:21.919 at that, because a lot of the data that exists 0:02:22.040 --> 0:02:24.760 out there that people basically these sort of estimates on 0:02:25.560 --> 0:02:30.240 is more than a decade old. Yeah, And um, it's 0:02:30.240 --> 0:02:32.920 one of those things too where people are sort of 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:37.600 extrapolating based on numbers that they do know. So, I mean, 0:02:37.600 --> 0:02:40.000 they're educated guesses when we we do have an idea 0:02:40.000 --> 0:02:41.680 of what's going on. Yeah, I mean, think of it 0:02:41.720 --> 0:02:44.679 this way. Even if we knew down to the very 0:02:44.800 --> 0:02:49.160 last device, how many computers and smartphones and everything else 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:52.720 were connected to the Internet, including servers. Even if we 0:02:52.800 --> 0:02:56.720 knew all that, we don't necessarily know how often they're 0:02:56.720 --> 0:03:00.280 connected to the Internet. So just because a computer years 0:03:00.280 --> 0:03:03.080 on doesn't necessarily mean it's actually making use of the Internet, 0:03:03.360 --> 0:03:06.960 so it's not putting a drain on any resources. So 0:03:07.200 --> 0:03:09.440 then you're talking about all right, well, now we have 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:12.600 to estimate not only how many devices are out there, 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:17.040 but how how much time they're spending on the Internet. Right, 0:03:17.120 --> 0:03:21.239 so this is really about as fast and loose as 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:25.560 you can possibly get and still have something to talk about. Well, 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:28.320 we do know that the machines that are using the 0:03:28.400 --> 0:03:32.280 most electricity on the Internet are the servers, the data centers, 0:03:32.520 --> 0:03:35.560 which are sort of little internets in a way. Yeah, 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:38.680 you could, you could say that the data centers on 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:42.080 a on an individual basis, the server and a data 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:46.240 center is using more electricity than any person's computer really, 0:03:47.000 --> 0:03:49.320 unless you're talking about I guess a supercomputer, in which 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:52.600 case that's a little different. But if you're talking about 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:56.840 sheer numbers. There are so many computers out there that 0:03:56.880 --> 0:03:58.320 if you were to look at at least some of 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.720 the figures that I looked at, the biggest drain on 0:04:01.920 --> 0:04:06.120 the the electric grid of the the world, really, not 0:04:06.200 --> 0:04:10.720 just the United States, comes from consumer and corporate computers, 0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:13.440 not from data centers. And that's because just from a 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:18.640 sheer scale, you're talking about just a huge, uh difference 0:04:18.680 --> 0:04:21.080 in numbers. So data centers, yeah, there are a lot 0:04:21.120 --> 0:04:22.880 of them, and there are thousands of servers in these 0:04:22.920 --> 0:04:25.920 data centers, but we're talking millions and millions of computers, 0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:33.040 or even perhaps one billion computers. But I think that 0:04:33.120 --> 0:04:35.600 was a figure that was arrived at maybe a year 0:04:35.720 --> 0:04:39.160 or two ago, and so again not necessarily accurate. Now 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:42.760 they're probably even more. And also then we get into 0:04:42.920 --> 0:04:45.719 what is a computer. Before we get too far into 0:04:45.800 --> 0:04:49.120 all of these kind of vague discussions that are going 0:04:49.160 --> 0:04:52.200 to take up our next twenty minutes, I think it 0:04:52.279 --> 0:04:55.760 might help to kind of talk about energy and electricity 0:04:55.800 --> 0:04:59.800 in general, about how that's measured. So we generally talk 0:05:00.000 --> 0:05:03.920 about electricity in a term called kill a watt hours, 0:05:04.640 --> 0:05:08.240 which is a unit of energy, and it's essentially the 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:12.920 equivalent to one kill a lot of power expended over 0:05:12.960 --> 0:05:16.640 the course of one hour. All right. So the reason 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:18.839 why we do this is because energy is essentially a 0:05:18.839 --> 0:05:23.159 measurement of power times time. So it's the amount of 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:25.919 power times the amount of time that that power is expended. 0:05:26.400 --> 0:05:29.919 That's how you get energy and kill what hour unit 0:05:29.960 --> 0:05:34.640 of energy? Now, when we're talking about global electricity use 0:05:34.960 --> 0:05:37.440 as far as the Internet goes, we're talking in the 0:05:37.600 --> 0:05:42.120 tarole wat range tarra watt hour range. And to give 0:05:42.160 --> 0:05:43.760 you guys an idea, Okay, so I kill a what 0:05:44.320 --> 0:05:47.000 is a thousand watts? A mega watt is a thousand 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:49.960 kill a watts? A giga what is a thousand megawatts? 0:05:50.560 --> 0:05:55.960 And a tara lot is a thousand giga watts? So 0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:02.240 huge number here, enormous number. It's too big for me 0:06:02.279 --> 0:06:05.640 to actually imagine. I know what, I know it exists, 0:06:05.680 --> 0:06:08.440 but I can't fit it into my head, right right. 0:06:08.480 --> 0:06:11.040 It's nice of them to use these terms that we 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:15.440 would probably be familiar with from things like bites. Yeah, 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:19.680 it's it's nice that it's not you know, a jot 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:24.160 and then a bit tool and then four handspans and 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:27.920 then a furlong. Yeah, that would be really confusing. Yeah, 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:33.120 thank you for the metric system. Um, So here's a 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:38.800 here's a study that was done back in and it 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:43.480 was done by Berkeley Labs Environmental Energy Technologies Division, the 0:06:43.640 --> 0:06:47.440 End Use Energy Forecasting group led by Dr Jonathan kumi 0:06:47.839 --> 0:06:52.080 who I have I've seen his notes on several different 0:06:52.160 --> 0:06:56.480 message boards about this subject. Dr Kumy is still very 0:06:56.520 --> 0:07:02.480 much active in this kind of study. Now back in 0:07:02.520 --> 0:07:06.160 the Berkeley group actually had money to conduct this study. 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:08.120 I think he said that it costs somewhere around the 0:07:08.240 --> 0:07:11.840 three dollar range to do the study because you're you're 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:14.080 you're compiling lots and lots of data. You have to 0:07:14.120 --> 0:07:16.000 gather all this information and then you have to make 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:18.920 sense of it and um and then actually does take 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:20.880 a lot of time and money. It sounds like it 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:22.760 shouldn't you know. It sounds like something you could plug 0:07:22.760 --> 0:07:26.000 into Wolf from ALFA and get an answer immediately. It's 0:07:26.040 --> 0:07:30.640 not the way this works. So their analysis said that 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:35.320 the total electricity used by office and network equipment is 0:07:35.360 --> 0:07:39.880 about seventy four tara watt hours per year, which was 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:43.040 about two percent of the total electricity use in the 0:07:43.120 --> 0:07:46.160 United States. And then if you were to throw in 0:07:46.240 --> 0:07:51.600 telephone switching equipment and manufacturing energy for semiconductors and computers, uh, 0:07:51.600 --> 0:07:55.200 it knocked it up to about three of all electricity 0:07:55.360 --> 0:07:57.800 in use in the United States. So why would you 0:07:57.920 --> 0:08:02.560 throw in the telephone switching. Well, because modems. The studies 0:08:02.600 --> 0:08:07.600 done in it was based on figures from ninety and 0:08:07.640 --> 0:08:10.800 we didn't all have DSL lines and cable modems at 0:08:10.800 --> 0:08:14.960 that point, right, and so we're talking seventy four Tara 0:08:15.040 --> 0:08:18.080 Lott hours at that time. That's a huge amount. Uh. 0:08:18.320 --> 0:08:20.240 And this was just for the United States to this 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:23.320 was not a global study, so we're really talking about 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:26.720 just one nation. But the other problem that we have 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:29.480 here is that if you're talking about figures that are 0:08:29.480 --> 0:08:33.839 based off of n equipment, a lot has changed in 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:39.559 the years between and now we are using computers that 0:08:39.679 --> 0:08:44.080 have much more efficient monitors. Were using a lot more laptops, 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:49.200 which in general consume less energy than a desktop computer would, 0:08:49.679 --> 0:08:51.880 but there are also lots and lots more of them. 0:08:52.440 --> 0:08:55.360 So you have to figure, all right, well, the energy 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:59.079 efficiency angle, how much does that impact this equation the 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:02.760 number of computer is, how has that impacted? Uh? The 0:09:04.280 --> 0:09:07.280 and you start to see where the problem is here. 0:09:07.320 --> 0:09:09.720 You can't just easily adjust these numbers and say, oh, well, 0:09:09.760 --> 0:09:11.560 let's just you know, we'll fudge this one a little 0:09:11.559 --> 0:09:13.720 bit and we'll switch this one a little bit. Um 0:09:13.800 --> 0:09:17.080 without a full study. You can't say for sure how 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:23.560 much energy is being consumed. True enough, UM, I actually uh, 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:26.160 I did a blog post on the tech stuff blog 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:30.120 not too long ago, um that uh, in which I 0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:33.839 quoted Bobby Johnson who published in the Guardian, the paper 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:39.240 from the United Kingdom, and UM, basically uh the information 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:41.400 I had read. And there are actually a couple of 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:45.600 articles in the Guardian about UH these topics. So apparently 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:49.040 they are among those who are interested in finding out more. Um. 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:50.680 But there are a lot of people who are starting 0:09:50.720 --> 0:09:54.959 to become concerned by the uh energy usage from the Internet. 0:09:55.000 --> 0:09:58.960 I mean, UM, from from what I can tell, experts 0:09:59.040 --> 0:10:01.679 believe that data centers on the Internet U use about 0:10:01.679 --> 0:10:05.880 a hundred fifty two billion kilowatt hours of electricity per year, 0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:10.640 and that's two percent of the world's carbon dioxide emissions 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:14.319 as well. UM. As a matter of fact, uh, a 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:18.760 thousand searches apparently create about the same uh CEO two 0:10:18.800 --> 0:10:23.160 emissions as an average European car going one kilometer according 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:26.839 to the Guardian. So UM, you know that's just I 0:10:26.960 --> 0:10:30.240 figure a thousand searches in Google that's you know, probably 0:10:30.320 --> 0:10:32.360 as much as we do in a day at how 0:10:32.440 --> 0:10:39.960 stuff works with the editorial staff. Maybe Lamborghini one kilometer average. Yeah, 0:10:40.000 --> 0:10:43.559 I don't think Lamborghini is an average European car. Don't 0:10:43.559 --> 0:10:47.800 get destroy my fantasies of how people live in Europe. Oh, 0:10:47.920 --> 0:10:50.360 you could ask the guys at high Speed stuff if 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:54.360 that's accurate. I'll stop in next time they're recording. But 0:10:54.520 --> 0:10:58.840 the thing is um the Climate Group says emissions related 0:10:58.880 --> 0:11:03.439 to computers are probably going to go up around that's 0:11:03.440 --> 0:11:07.160 a hundred one point for gigatons of carbon dioxide by 0:11:09.160 --> 0:11:11.400 because the Internet is just growing at that sort of 0:11:11.480 --> 0:11:17.000 a rate. That's pretty significant. Yeah, and back in two 0:11:17.080 --> 0:11:19.880 thousand seven, there were some people who attempted to take 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:25.040 another stab at guestimating. Essentially. I mean, I'm it sounds 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:28.920 like I'm I'm slapping them for their their efforts, But really, 0:11:28.960 --> 0:11:30.480 when you get down to it, when you don't have 0:11:30.559 --> 0:11:32.520 the data in front of you, it is a guestimation. 0:11:32.840 --> 0:11:35.640 It's hard to quantify something like this too, because it's 0:11:35.760 --> 0:11:38.400 so you know, how would you break down the energy 0:11:38.720 --> 0:11:42.440 from somebody's electric meter on the side of their house 0:11:42.480 --> 0:11:44.760 and say, oh, well, you know your fridge used you 0:11:44.800 --> 0:11:47.120 know an eight to this, Yeah, and you have to 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.760 figure out as well. Even with servers. I mean there 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:52.600 there's a difference between the amount of energy a server 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:58.920 will consume at a peak time versus a trough um. 0:11:59.600 --> 0:12:03.120 That's all that's called your your load differential. There, you 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:05.959 know your difference and load and the uh if you 0:12:06.120 --> 0:12:09.480 if you have a really efficient server, um, the difference 0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:13.040 is going to be minor, like within the five to 0:12:13.160 --> 0:12:18.280 ten percent range where your your server will be consistent 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:23.400 and it's not gonna very wildly from full use to 0:12:23.600 --> 0:12:26.240 trough use. And that's just meaning that it's very efficient, 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:29.920 not that it's not that it's the all underpowered or 0:12:29.920 --> 0:12:33.640 anything like that. Um, you know, before we go on, 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:37.679 just going to say too that I think that I'm 0:12:37.679 --> 0:12:40.880 just guessing, but I'm betting that the data centers, the 0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:43.400 facts and figures that we're seeing from the data centers, 0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:46.040 probably don't take into account the massive amount of air 0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:50.600 conditioning needed to keep those machines cool. Right, So you're 0:12:50.640 --> 0:12:52.800 not breaking down the different you're you're breaking down the 0:12:52.840 --> 0:12:55.120 building as a whole. You know, say well, this Google 0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:58.520 data center uses x amount of electricity per year, Well 0:12:58.600 --> 0:13:01.760 it doesn't say well, part of that the lighting for 0:13:02.160 --> 0:13:03.760 the people who work in the building, and part of 0:13:03.800 --> 0:13:07.240 that is the you know, fifty three air conditioning units 0:13:07.240 --> 0:13:09.760 sitting on the roof and all that stuff. It doesn't 0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:12.240 it doesn't go any further than that. Yeah, well there's 0:13:12.400 --> 0:13:16.199 and there are some studies that specify whether or not 0:13:16.320 --> 0:13:18.120 they take that kind of thing into account. And of 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:20.520 course not all data centers use air conditioning. Some use 0:13:20.600 --> 0:13:24.240 water cooling systems instead. And I was going to mention 0:13:24.320 --> 0:13:26.360 something along those lines in a minute. All right, well, 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:29.599 then I'll leave that for then. But the actually I 0:13:29.600 --> 0:13:31.640 should say that when I said a load differential, that's 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:35.280 that's actually my brain throwing a wrong word, and it 0:13:35.320 --> 0:13:37.520 should have been load factor. I'm just gonna say that 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:43.319 now because I'm sure people are already emailing me. But 0:13:43.400 --> 0:13:45.880 now that you've hit send, just know that I did 0:13:45.960 --> 0:13:49.439 eventually get around to getting it right. Um so the 0:13:49.800 --> 0:13:52.559 uh but no, Back in two thousand seven, this other 0:13:52.640 --> 0:13:54.520 study that I was talking about, it's not even really 0:13:54.679 --> 0:13:59.680 a full study. Uh, there was a question online about well, 0:14:00.000 --> 0:14:02.520 how much electricity does the internet use? And people were 0:14:02.520 --> 0:14:06.640 talking about this study and trying to extrapolate from that 0:14:06.840 --> 0:14:09.920 how much energy was being used at that time At 0:14:09.960 --> 0:14:14.360 two thousand and two thousand seven. So the person who 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:19.080 tackled this came up with some interesting numbers. Uh. He 0:14:19.240 --> 0:14:22.520 decided that, UM, once he studied this carefully, said that 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:27.960 the world consumption in billions of kilowatt hours for a 0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:31.000 for data centers was a hundred and twelve point five 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:35.640 billion kilowatt hours. All right, the PCs and monitors five 0:14:36.120 --> 0:14:40.280 eight billion kilowatt hours, bodem's routers and that sort of 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:44.600 thing hundreds or hundred sixty seven billion kilowatt hours, and 0:14:44.640 --> 0:14:47.640 then phone network one billion kilowatt hours for a grand 0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:52.640 total of approximately eight hundred sixty eight billion kilowatt hours. 0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:56.840 And that was in two thousand seven. But here's the 0:14:56.960 --> 0:14:59.680 thing was that he was basing this off of figures 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:03.640 for um, these older computers, So he's looking at power 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:07.360 consumption figures from years and years ago. So we're talking 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:10.600 about old CRT monitors which were not as efficient necessarily 0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:13.240 as some of the l C D and plasma monitors 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:15.560 that we have today. Yeah, you know, I saw a 0:15:15.680 --> 0:15:19.640 number on NPR that was interesting. Um. Their website said that, uh, 0:15:19.920 --> 0:15:22.240 this is not kill a lot hours, but um, they 0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:24.720 say that in the United States, more than one billion 0:15:24.760 --> 0:15:28.520 dollars has spent every year keeping on computer monitors that 0:15:28.640 --> 0:15:34.080 are not really in use. Right, that's you know how 0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:36.480 accurate that is, But that's you know, I would I 0:15:36.760 --> 0:15:39.280 believe it. People leave their computers on and screens are 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:44.080 are pretty they're pretty energy and hungry, and uh yeah, 0:15:44.160 --> 0:15:46.240 so put your computers to sleep, or at least your 0:15:46.280 --> 0:15:51.160 monitors the So yeah, the this eight h sixty eight billion. 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:53.560 It's one of those figures that some people like to 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:57.480 to say that's how much energy the Internet consumes per year, 0:15:57.800 --> 0:16:01.000 and other people point out, well, that's not really true 0:16:01.000 --> 0:16:04.000 because we don't have enough information. We don't you know 0:16:04.120 --> 0:16:06.920 this this is taking into account old equipment. And yeah, 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:10.000 while monitors have gotten better over the years, we've also 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:14.600 had faster processors, which consume more powers. So as monitors 0:16:14.640 --> 0:16:18.680 have become more efficient, processors have demanded more energy. So 0:16:19.240 --> 0:16:21.440 it's again one of these sort of seesaw things. You 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:23.960 have to look at all the different factors and there's 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:27.720 no easy way to say, all, right, well, how many 0:16:28.040 --> 0:16:30.760 high end computers are out there, how often are they 0:16:30.840 --> 0:16:33.600 accessing the Internet. How many low end computers are there, 0:16:33.680 --> 0:16:36.960 like netbooks, how many netbooks those are accessing the Internet 0:16:37.000 --> 0:16:40.160 all the time because they don't have the native capabilities 0:16:40.200 --> 0:16:42.120 to really do everything you need to do on the 0:16:42.400 --> 0:16:46.880 computer itself. So that's why this this conversation is a 0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:49.600 difficult one to have, but sixty eight billion, it's good 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:51.320 number to kind of keep in the back of your mind. 0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:55.560 That's sort of a best guess right now. But we're 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:57.560 gonna talk a little bit more about energy, I assume 0:16:57.680 --> 0:17:00.280 because you had some stuff about water coolings the THEMS 0:17:00.280 --> 0:17:04.600 at least. Yeah, one of the uh, they're talking about supercomputers. 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:08.440 I ran across some information about IBMS Power five seven 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:13.479 five supercomputer UM, which actually was linked to from one 0:17:13.520 --> 0:17:15.600 of the other posts, and I thought this was pretty 0:17:15.640 --> 0:17:19.159 cool because it's got it uses water chilled copper plates 0:17:19.560 --> 0:17:22.639 over each of its microprocessors UM and that's a lot 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:25.840 because they're four processor course on each rack of the 0:17:25.920 --> 0:17:31.840 supercomputer UM. But the water cooling uses less electricity than 0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:35.479 you would using traditional cooling methods, so that's also much 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:38.800 more efficient. Yeah, because you know, if you think things 0:17:38.880 --> 0:17:40.760 like that could help us cut down Yeah, when you 0:17:40.840 --> 0:17:44.360 think about it, UM, water is just it's a it's 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:49.000 a better cooling system because it as a fluid. It 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:52.760 is more efficient at carrying heat away, and you can 0:17:53.119 --> 0:17:56.960 just run water across, uh, you know, using some sort 0:17:56.960 --> 0:17:58.960 of tube system. Obviously you're not just you're not just 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:02.159 dousing serves and water necessarily. You know, I tried that. 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:04.320 I just turned a hose on my computer in it. 0:18:04.800 --> 0:18:08.760 It's it doesn't run that way at all. Why, Yeah, 0:18:08.800 --> 0:18:11.280 that's probably a bad way to do a water cooling system. 0:18:11.320 --> 0:18:13.520 But if you're doing it correctly, and the fire department 0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:16.720 was upset too, sure the water, the water will carry 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:19.000 the heat away much more efficiently than air will. And 0:18:19.240 --> 0:18:21.920 you can then reclaim the water, you know, you you 0:18:22.320 --> 0:18:24.600 just cycle it exactly. You just you know, move it 0:18:24.680 --> 0:18:26.920 through so that it can release the heat, and you 0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:29.760 reclaim the water. You cycle it back through, so it's 0:18:29.800 --> 0:18:32.920 not like you're using tons and tons of water and 0:18:33.000 --> 0:18:35.200 it's just going to waste. You're using the same water 0:18:35.840 --> 0:18:38.399 in the system, and then occasionally, I'm sure, replenishing it, 0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:42.200 but not like not like you just turned the tap 0:18:42.320 --> 0:18:44.879 on and let it go. You know, I wish I 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:47.080 had made the turning the hose on the computer joke 0:18:47.080 --> 0:18:48.760 because I was going to say, yeah, and if you 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:50.720 put the fish in there, that the heat kind of 0:18:50.800 --> 0:18:52.919 cooks the fish. But yeah, I've already made a joke, 0:18:53.000 --> 0:18:56.600 so I won't make um. You know, one of the 0:18:56.680 --> 0:18:59.800 things that I found that was funny was and the 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:02.400 reason I find it funny is because it's so contested. 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:07.960 But um blogger and author Nicholas carr Uh said he 0:19:08.119 --> 0:19:09.880 he did a blog post that a lot of people 0:19:09.920 --> 0:19:12.199 disagree with a few months ago, but it said, um, 0:19:12.560 --> 0:19:16.600 the Second Life avatars themselves, just keeping the avatars running 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:20.280 use one thousand, seven or fifty two kilowatt hours per year. 0:19:20.840 --> 0:19:24.239 The average human uses two thousand four and thirty six 0:19:24.320 --> 0:19:27.800 kilowte hours per year. But uh, about the person the 0:19:27.880 --> 0:19:30.600 average person in Brazil, The average Brazilian uses one thousand 0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:35.920 four kilo one hours, So basically Second Life people in 0:19:36.040 --> 0:19:41.000 Second Life use almost as much electricity as the average Brazilian. 0:19:41.080 --> 0:19:43.320 He says, Now he's you know a lot of people 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:46.520 disagree with him, but if it's even close to that, 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:49.080 now they do they leave the company that that runs 0:19:49.160 --> 0:19:51.840 Second Life, leaves the servers running and the avatars are 0:19:51.920 --> 0:19:54.760 on for as long as that's the thing they got in. 0:19:54.840 --> 0:19:56.919 They broke it down and said, well, you know, if 0:19:56.960 --> 0:20:00.560 the avatar is only on for two hours there. You know, 0:20:00.880 --> 0:20:03.640 such and such average people online, and it's not all 0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:07.840 the people on Second Life versus the average Brazilian who 0:20:08.119 --> 0:20:12.440 you know runs twenty four hours a day. Uh so, Yeah. 0:20:12.560 --> 0:20:16.200 I just think it's funny though, to compare a virtual 0:20:16.680 --> 0:20:20.480 person to a human being. Um, you know, I would 0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:23.840 imagine that they're probably I don't know how accurate it is, 0:20:23.880 --> 0:20:26.280 but I would imagine that it's got to to run 0:20:26.320 --> 0:20:29.159 all those those data centers to keep the world of 0:20:29.200 --> 0:20:32.840 Second Life going. Um, you know, it would be at 0:20:32.920 --> 0:20:39.600 least reasonably comparable to what happening been in Second Life. See, 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:42.840 they just need to hit that switch. They just need 0:20:42.920 --> 0:20:49.960 to hit that switch. I mean, you know, it's no 0:20:50.160 --> 0:20:53.280 reason to keep that going, is all I'm saying. Alright, alright, 0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:55.920 so I've got nothing more to say about Second Life. 0:20:55.920 --> 0:20:59.600 I've never tried it. Yeah, well, you value your sanity, 0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:02.040 you just keep it that way. There are some cute 0:21:02.080 --> 0:21:04.359 things about Second Life. I wrote how Second Life works, 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:07.040 all right, and it's there are some people who are 0:21:07.480 --> 0:21:10.000 legitimately using that as a way to make friends and 0:21:10.600 --> 0:21:13.879 and have fun conversations and chat about all sorts of stuff, 0:21:13.880 --> 0:21:16.920 and they enjoy being able to modify their avatars, and 0:21:17.119 --> 0:21:19.080 so I guess they're the ones who are chalking up 0:21:19.160 --> 0:21:20.919 these kill of one hours because they're the ones who 0:21:20.960 --> 0:21:24.760 are going back over and over again. But then there's 0:21:24.840 --> 0:21:30.560 everything else, and there's a lot of everything else. Yeah, 0:21:30.800 --> 0:21:37.040 and everything else. I mean like some pretty hardcore porn stuff. 0:21:38.200 --> 0:21:41.920 Yeah it's special, right. I didn't write too much about 0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:48.560 that in the article, but yeah, wow yeah, okay, alright, 0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:53.719 so moving on, So do you have anything else about electricity? No? No, Um, 0:21:54.119 --> 0:21:56.200 I just wish that we were able to deliver a 0:21:56.320 --> 0:22:00.879 hard and definitive numbers, and this is absolutely it. But 0:22:01.040 --> 0:22:03.480 I feel the same way. So if there are any 0:22:03.640 --> 0:22:07.120 research institutions out there who wish to grant us three 0:22:07.240 --> 0:22:10.879 to four hundred thousand dollars to do a study, we 0:22:11.000 --> 0:22:14.240 will happily accept that money and we will see you 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:17.760 in our research center, which happens to be on the 0:22:17.840 --> 0:22:21.200 big Island of Hawaii. Um. It's just that was the 0:22:21.240 --> 0:22:23.880 best place we could put it. So if you want 0:22:23.880 --> 0:22:26.520 to give us that, we will report back to you 0:22:26.640 --> 0:22:29.960 in ten maybe fifteen years. Okay, then sounds good to me. 0:22:30.280 --> 0:22:35.560 So I guess that just brings us round two. Listener man, 0:22:40.960 --> 0:22:45.480 Oh no, today's listener mail comes from Chad from Montana, 0:22:46.600 --> 0:22:50.080 a Big Sky. Hello. First off, love the podcast. You 0:22:50.160 --> 0:22:52.480 guys do an excellent job of explaining things in a 0:22:52.560 --> 0:22:56.800 way easily understood. You make tech stuff interesting and not overwhelming. 0:22:57.000 --> 0:23:01.280 Thanks you're welcome. I have a question for you. I 0:23:01.359 --> 0:23:04.600 don't really recall hearing too much about bits and PCs 0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:07.399 until Windows Vista came out, and it seemed like it 0:23:07.560 --> 0:23:10.320 was front and center, and how software hardware wouldn't be 0:23:10.359 --> 0:23:12.760 compatible anymore because one was on a thirty two bit 0:23:12.840 --> 0:23:15.040 and the other was on the sixty four bit. I'll 0:23:15.080 --> 0:23:18.359 be honest, I really don't even understand what they mean 0:23:18.440 --> 0:23:20.360 when they say thirty two bit or sixty four bit, 0:23:20.600 --> 0:23:22.600 And when I tried to ask a computer salesman what 0:23:22.760 --> 0:23:25.439 it meant, he couldn't even give me an easy answer. 0:23:25.680 --> 0:23:27.920 So this seemed like an excellent question for the fab 0:23:28.000 --> 0:23:31.679 tech duo. How do bits work? And how is sixty 0:23:31.800 --> 0:23:34.720 four different from thirty two? Trying to fit it into 0:23:34.760 --> 0:23:39.240 the how theme? If possible, please address Mac users and 0:23:39.320 --> 0:23:43.560 also snow Leopard and Windows XP Vista and seven. Thanks well, Chad. 0:23:43.640 --> 0:23:46.680 Here's the nice thing is, once you understand how this works, 0:23:46.840 --> 0:23:50.000 it applies to everything across the board. It's it's not 0:23:50.280 --> 0:23:54.000 something where it's different for Windows versus snow Leopard versus 0:23:54.200 --> 0:23:57.879