1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:07,680 Speaker 1: LinkedIn News. Do you think like someone should stay in 2 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:09,920 Speaker 1: a role for a certain amount of time before they 3 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: should be asking for a promotion or should it just 4 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 1: be like all hands on deck, baby, like day two, 5 00:00:14,800 --> 00:00:16,520 Speaker 1: you want to give me that promotion, go ahead, let's 6 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:17,200 Speaker 1: do it. 7 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:20,079 Speaker 2: It really depends on your industry. If you're an investment maker, babe, 8 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:21,680 Speaker 2: and you walk in five months in and you go 9 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:23,759 Speaker 2: give me that promotion, they're going to be like, take 10 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 2: your booty back outside. I'm not interested. It's not going 11 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:28,720 Speaker 2: to work. Be thoughtful. If you're in tech, they might 12 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 2: be like, you know what, thank you for asking. Here's 13 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 2: a sweatshirt you start Monday. Thoughtful about your industry. If 14 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 2: you're in a. 15 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:36,959 Speaker 3: Structure slutcher, literally. 16 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:38,600 Speaker 2: Like, give give me a tech fleece. And I'm in. 17 00:00:40,120 --> 00:00:43,839 Speaker 4: From LinkedIn News and iHeart podcasts. This is Let's Talk Offline, 18 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:46,400 Speaker 4: a show about what it takes to thrive in the 19 00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:50,440 Speaker 4: early years of your career without sacrificing your values, sanity, 20 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:51,200 Speaker 4: or sleep. 21 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:55,800 Speaker 1: I'm Gianna Bredenti and I'm Jamaie Jackson Gatson. Take a 22 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 1: journey with me. Let's say you've been working at your 23 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:01,000 Speaker 1: company for a year or so. Now You've been pretty 24 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 1: good at your job, coworkers are constantly praising your work, 25 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:06,600 Speaker 1: and now you're at a point where you're like itching 26 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 1: for a new challenge. So you think, hmm, maybe it's 27 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:15,399 Speaker 1: time to get a promotion. Yeah, confetti balloons, cupcakes, yum 28 00:01:15,480 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 1: yum yum. Well just kidding, because guess what your work 29 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:22,880 Speaker 1: Bestijma is here to tell you. Getting promoted is so 30 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 1: much more than just being really good at your job. 31 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:28,800 Speaker 3: No cupcakes, No, it's true. 32 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,280 Speaker 4: You know, getting promoted is honestly a marathon, not a sprint. 33 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 4: It's about tracking your successes, talking with your manager, and 34 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 4: having lots of patience, which it's not good for me 35 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 4: because I have no patients. 36 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:40,959 Speaker 1: Don't know her, don't know her. 37 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:43,759 Speaker 4: When you're early in your career and navigating that first 38 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 4: possible promotion, you probably have a lot of questions. I 39 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 4: know I did, so we want to set you up 40 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 4: for success. Today we're talking all about promotions and how 41 00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 4: you should be creating your game plan to move on up. 42 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: So today we're talking all about promotions. Gian and I 43 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: are bringing in someone very exciting. Later on, we're going 44 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 1: to have career coach Emily Durham, who's going to help 45 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 1: us position ourselves for success with those promotions. But before 46 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 1: Emily pops up, gee, let me ask you what's been 47 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:21,639 Speaker 1: your experience with promotions in your work life. 48 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 4: You know, promotions are something that you really have to 49 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 4: figure out when you join a company. It's something I 50 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 4: was unsure of when I started my corporate job. And 51 00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:34,160 Speaker 4: depending on the company where you work or the industry 52 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 4: that you work in, you know, promotions work differently. So 53 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 4: the truth is, and this is something that I've learned 54 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 4: since starting out, is that promotions are not. 55 00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:45,079 Speaker 3: Based only on performance. 56 00:02:45,240 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, I kind of naively believed that, but there's so 57 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:50,919 Speaker 4: many things that go into the decision whether to promote 58 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 4: somebody to the next level. Economic conditions come into play. 59 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:56,399 Speaker 4: We've seen that a lot over the last few years. 60 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,200 Speaker 4: The economy wasn't doing well, so maybe like the business 61 00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:01,640 Speaker 4: isn't doing so well and that impacts how many people 62 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 4: are getting promoted or you know, what those promotions look 63 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 4: like when it comes to a pay bump. And also 64 00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 4: business need is another aspect, so sometimes like the business 65 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 4: case or scope of work just isn't there for the promotion. 66 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:16,640 Speaker 4: So that's something I had to figure out. I had 67 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:20,000 Speaker 4: to figure out how promotions worked here and the company 68 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 4: shared information. We had a presentation on it at one point, 69 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:24,640 Speaker 4: which was helpful. But a lot of what I learned 70 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 4: was through having conversations with my manager and trusted colleagues, 71 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 4: just figuring out, like from their experience, how they've you know, 72 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 4: gone through promotions, what I should know because I'll say 73 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 4: it a million times, you don't know what you don't know, 74 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 4: So you got to be asking those questions of people 75 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 4: you can trust. 76 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 3: And also you have an hr REP. 77 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 4: So if you are like I need the big guns 78 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 4: pulling your hr rep for help when it comes to promotions. 79 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 4: But those conversations that I had really set me up 80 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 4: for success because they taught me one about the promotion 81 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 4: process at LinkedIn, but also helped me figure out like 82 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:02,520 Speaker 4: what I need to do to position myself for that promotion. 83 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 4: And so last year I moved up from associate news 84 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 4: editor to news editor. 85 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:09,520 Speaker 3: So I got promoted. 86 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:12,680 Speaker 4: And at the time, I was two years into my 87 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 4: full time role because I had started on the contract 88 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 4: and then went full time, and I definitely felt ready 89 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,159 Speaker 4: for the next challenge and something that I was encouraged 90 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 4: to do. It was kind of track myself against our 91 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:27,679 Speaker 4: career like performance profile. So look at our career ladder 92 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 4: and say, Okay, as an associate, these are my responsibilities, 93 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 4: but as a news editor, this is the work I'll 94 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:36,159 Speaker 4: be taking on. And I was functioning at the level 95 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,600 Speaker 4: of a news editor for some time, so I was like, Okay, 96 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 4: you know, I'm ready for the next challenge. I'm doing 97 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 4: the next level at this point. But I was really 98 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 4: having those conversations with my manager like a year in advance, 99 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 4: I think, to kind of set myself up because I 100 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 4: also didn't realize like they got to put a whole 101 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 4: promotion package together for you. So yeah, I definitely was 102 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,839 Speaker 4: like playing kind of the long game with the promotion, 103 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:03,239 Speaker 4: and in that year lead up, I was having regular 104 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:06,120 Speaker 4: conversations with my manager to say, you know, am I 105 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:10,520 Speaker 4: on track for the promotion at annual review? And in 106 00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 4: those conversations he would say, well, like, here's a growth 107 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:15,000 Speaker 4: area that I think you can like double down on. 108 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:17,120 Speaker 4: And then that's how I knew what to focus on 109 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 4: to make sure that I was ready when the time came. 110 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 1: Smart smart. Well, Also that goes to show that, like, 111 00:05:22,720 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 1: you know, your manager should be a really good partner 112 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 1: in this and like setting you up for success because 113 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:31,039 Speaker 1: they're identifying, you know, blind spots for you as you're developing, 114 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 1: but also having those conversations early, not waiting until it 115 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 1: happens right then and there. 116 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, I also didn't know. Is it like something that 117 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:40,880 Speaker 4: you bring up? Is it something they bring up and 118 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:43,120 Speaker 4: I don't even remember from my experience because I have 119 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 4: like the worst recall of life. But yeah, I didn't know, 120 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 4: Like are you supposed to ask? Right? 121 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:50,600 Speaker 1: I think a lot of times we don't know, And 122 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:53,480 Speaker 1: it may be different for different industries. Right, So people 123 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 1: they might go to their annual review and then that's 124 00:05:56,160 --> 00:05:57,920 Speaker 1: the first time they found out that their manager even 125 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 1: put them up for promotion. Yeah, I've seen that happened 126 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: before for people, right, they're like, hey, got you bumped up? 127 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 1: But then other people they're like, no, I'm bringing that 128 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 1: up first. What's your experience been like? So my situation 129 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:11,920 Speaker 1: has been a little different, you know. I like to 130 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: always preface this by first saying, like, you know, there 131 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: are a ton of studies in different data points out 132 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 1: there that that discussed predominantly people of color, upward mobility, 133 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:26,360 Speaker 1: and corporate America, And it's not really a happy talking point. 134 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 1: But I say that because sometimes I like to take 135 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:31,599 Speaker 1: a step back and realize that my experience is not 136 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: like unique to me. So, as you all know, I've 137 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:37,719 Speaker 1: done a lot of like contract and freelance work, and 138 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,760 Speaker 1: so particularly when I was early in my career, I 139 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:43,239 Speaker 1: wasn't really thinking about promotions. I was just thinking about 140 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:45,960 Speaker 1: getting hired full time right and getting a job and 141 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,720 Speaker 1: sustaining my life. Particularly once I moved to New York 142 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:53,320 Speaker 1: and when I finally started working at like traditional like 143 00:06:53,440 --> 00:06:55,839 Speaker 1: nine to fives and stuff like that, I was so excited. 144 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 1: I was finally learning how to negotiate and all these things. 145 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 1: And it almost would be like a rint and repeat 146 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:06,320 Speaker 1: of Okay, do good work. You get the accolades, the 147 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: coworkers shout you out, your managed shots you out, then 148 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:13,240 Speaker 1: you get up into annual review and the only reward 149 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:18,840 Speaker 1: you get is more work, no money to tote. I 150 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: have talked about this idea of like you said, mentioned 151 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 1: like business case and you know, making sure that the 152 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:25,960 Speaker 1: scope of work that you're working on is what the 153 00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:29,680 Speaker 1: company needs. But I also have been able to acknowledge 154 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,119 Speaker 1: that it's hurtful when you constantly feel like you're getting 155 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 1: passed over or not seen, particularly when I think some 156 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:42,280 Speaker 1: corporations or employers use the oh we care about you, 157 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:44,720 Speaker 1: we want to invest in you trope to just keep 158 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 1: you trapped, but they don't want to compensate you for 159 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:50,320 Speaker 1: the work. So for me, promotions have not always been 160 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:53,239 Speaker 1: like the most glamorous or fun thing. I am very 161 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 1: thankful that I've always had a growth mindset. So I 162 00:07:56,720 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 1: say that in two senses. Whenever I go into conversations 163 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:03,000 Speaker 1: or whenever I get feedback, I always like to take 164 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:04,920 Speaker 1: that and try to apply it because I think that 165 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: there's so much value in being able to grow. But 166 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: also I do see that your career or your job 167 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 1: should not just be growing vertically. I think sometimes we 168 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: make the mistake of wanting to get into companies and 169 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:19,440 Speaker 1: we want to immediately get promoted our first year in 170 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:23,840 Speaker 1: and sometimes there's opportunity for that. But also like knowing 171 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: that your job doesn't just grow vertically, it grows horizontally. 172 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:29,840 Speaker 1: There are other skill sets that you can learn how 173 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 1: to do, you know, and like other things that you 174 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 1: can do that kind of build to this body of work. 175 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:36,199 Speaker 1: I've always had that mindset where I like that, and 176 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: I think that's kind of the entrepreneur ending. It comes 177 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,720 Speaker 1: out a lot. But with that being said, there also 178 00:08:41,880 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 1: are a lot of conversations in times where I've left 179 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 1: because I'm like, okay, it's again going back to this 180 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: dating idea. I will give you a chance. But the 181 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:55,479 Speaker 1: minute I feel like that energy is not being reciprocated, 182 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:59,320 Speaker 1: I'm not being valued. I'm not being treasured, like nah, 183 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:03,319 Speaker 1: I'm out, And I'm the type of person I peep it, 184 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 1: I clock it all right, cool and in one day, 185 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: that's it. That's it. Yeah, And I mean, you know, 186 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:12,920 Speaker 1: some people have probably said, oh, that's a bad thing 187 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 1: or a bad way to be. Like now a little older, 188 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 1: I do try to, like, you know, work it out, 189 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 1: like how I won't just leave after the first fight. 190 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:24,440 Speaker 1: But what I will say is that doing that, being 191 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:28,079 Speaker 1: bullish about my boundaries, especially early in my career, allowed 192 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: me to jump where I was almost like for a 193 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: period of time, almost doubling my salary every job I took. 194 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: So I say that, you know, walking away from places 195 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 1: that don't serve you only helps serve you. You just 196 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,320 Speaker 1: don't see it in the moment, but you know what 197 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 1: I would like to learn and hopefully Emily can share 198 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: later on are tips that like what happens when you 199 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 1: do like the employer or you want to stay but 200 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: you still feel like okay, something is not right or 201 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 1: something is amiss, Like how do you sort of navigate that? 202 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 1: Because I'm a book it, I'm like, gee, love you bye. 203 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:08,960 Speaker 4: So promotions are more than just letting your manager know 204 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:13,199 Speaker 4: head I want a promotion. Getting that promotion can be work, 205 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 4: but don't worry. We're bringing in career coach Emily Durham 206 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:18,840 Speaker 4: to break down everything you need to do to get 207 00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 4: that promotion. 208 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:20,520 Speaker 3: That's next. 209 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:32,960 Speaker 1: So we're back guys, and we are talking all about promotions, 210 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:36,440 Speaker 1: navigating them, asking for them, preparing yourself for them. Going 211 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 1: to war. Okay, gian and I are going to equip 212 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: you with everything. But two soldiers on the battlefield are 213 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 1: just two soldiers. We had to bring in the general, Gianna, 214 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:47,320 Speaker 1: who if we bring done. 215 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 4: On our own, we need help, we need all right, 216 00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 4: We're bringing in Emily Durham. She's a talent acquisition expert 217 00:10:54,559 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 4: and career coach. Online she's known as Emily the Recruiter, 218 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:00,400 Speaker 4: where she shares work and career advice to her community 219 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 4: of over three million followers. She's also the host of 220 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 4: the podcast The Straight Shooter Recruiter, a show focused on 221 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:10,960 Speaker 4: career development and professional growth. Hey Emily, I love Emily. 222 00:11:10,960 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 2: Oh my goshka, I have you following me everywhere? That 223 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:15,199 Speaker 2: was the introduction I would like from now until the 224 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:15,680 Speaker 2: end of time. 225 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 4: Personally, Tomay always kills it with the analogy. 226 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:20,599 Speaker 1: I was like, let's go. I was just about to 227 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 1: drop another one. I was literally thinking, The straight Shooter 228 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 1: Recruiter sounds like a good drink for a happy hour. 229 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:27,560 Speaker 2: All I'm going to say is, when you get that promotion, 230 00:11:27,679 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 2: you have to celebrate. I don't know what that looks 231 00:11:29,559 --> 00:11:31,599 Speaker 2: like for you, but I support. 232 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 3: I suppor you. Yes, I love that. 233 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. 234 00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 3: We're so excited to have you. 235 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 4: And we want to kick it off with this idea 236 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 4: of when is it time to ask for a promotion, Like, 237 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 4: how do you know, Okay, maybe I'm up. It's time 238 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:47,600 Speaker 4: for me to, you know, climb to that next rung 239 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:49,959 Speaker 4: on the ladder, and what are some steps you should 240 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 4: be taking to get toward that goal. 241 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 2: It's a really good question. I think the biggest misconception 242 00:11:54,160 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 2: about promotions is that it's a thing we ask for 243 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 2: the best way to actually get promoted is to make 244 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:00,960 Speaker 2: your boss feel like they're doing you a favor, like 245 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 2: it's a joint venture. You're going to get so much 246 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:06,400 Speaker 2: more reward if you're having ongoing career conversations with your 247 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 2: boss or your manager, whoever it is, and having those 248 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:12,200 Speaker 2: conversations that are timestamped. What I mean by that is 249 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:14,559 Speaker 2: if your promotion season for the company you work at 250 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 2: is in December, girl, you're not going to start conversations 251 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 2: the first week of December like baby ship is sales 252 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:21,800 Speaker 2: to you next year. You need to be having active, 253 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:25,200 Speaker 2: regular check ins on your performance, and in every single 254 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:28,040 Speaker 2: conversation you have with your manager, ask how am I 255 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 2: tracking to get to that next level? What am I missing? 256 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 2: And suddenly you're going to notice at a certain point 257 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:34,440 Speaker 2: they're going to be like, yeah, I think you're there. 258 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 2: I'm not seeing these big gaps. That gives you the 259 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:39,599 Speaker 2: opportunity to say, okay, great, now let's talk about that 260 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:42,439 Speaker 2: promotion babes, like let's put pen to paper. So when 261 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,439 Speaker 2: it's an ongoing conversation, it's a team effort. Your boss 262 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 2: is in your corner and you're not coming in with 263 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 2: an empty bowl saying can I have some porridge? It's 264 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 2: a team decision. 265 00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 4: I love that because I think a lot of people 266 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:54,960 Speaker 4: don't realize the value of one on ones. Like I 267 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:57,080 Speaker 4: have weekly one on ones with my manager and sometimes 268 00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 4: I'm just like hey, like what's going on? And then 269 00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 4: I was like, no, I need to be more serious, 270 00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:03,640 Speaker 4: come in with an agenda. You know, have these career 271 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 4: goal setting conversations week to week. But I'm wondering, like, 272 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 4: let's say you and your manager are having those conversations, 273 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:12,080 Speaker 4: but you're the one who needs to bring it up. 274 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 4: Like you're like, Okay, he has in or she hasn't 275 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 4: said it's time for you to get promoted. You feel 276 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:19,400 Speaker 4: like I need to, you know, bring up that conversation. 277 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:21,079 Speaker 4: So what's the best way to go about that? 278 00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, first thing is mindset. You need to go in 279 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 2: there with the mindset that I ask for the things 280 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 2: that I want and that's why I get them. So 281 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 2: you need to eliminate the guilt when it comes to 282 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:32,720 Speaker 2: the conversation. The idea isn't that you're going in with 283 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 2: a laundry list of here's why I'm fantastic, But internally, 284 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 2: you know, you deliver, you know, you're tracking because you've 285 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 2: had these career conversations. So when it's time to really 286 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:44,520 Speaker 2: initiate that discussion, you sit down with your leader. You 287 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:47,200 Speaker 2: thank them for the opportunities that you've had so far. 288 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:50,240 Speaker 2: You ask if they still feel like you're tracking from 289 00:13:50,280 --> 00:13:53,120 Speaker 2: a performance perspective, and if the answer is yes, it's 290 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:55,920 Speaker 2: okay to say, I'm excited to keep growing on this team. 291 00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 2: How can we start partnering to think about getting me 292 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 2: to that senior position or to that manager position. Leave 293 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,640 Speaker 2: the ball in their court, let them guide the conversation. 294 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:05,600 Speaker 2: If you have the kind of manager who's not going 295 00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:08,080 Speaker 2: to lean in and support you, you might have to 296 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:10,160 Speaker 2: get more aggressive. But nine times out of ten, if 297 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 2: you're making it a joint venture and asking for their help, 298 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:13,680 Speaker 2: they've got way more buy in. 299 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:16,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I appreciate you mentioning it about being a 300 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 1: partnership as well. I mean, you have to own your career, 301 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:21,640 Speaker 1: but you also can see them as a partner in 302 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: helping you get to that next level. So what are 303 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:27,920 Speaker 1: some ways people can track their progress and their achievements 304 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:30,440 Speaker 1: throughout the year. Knowing that you know you'll have to 305 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: probably write a performance review. Maybe your manager has to 306 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: prepare a promotion package at some point. Are there ways 307 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: you can help your manager notice your progress and achievements 308 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 1: as well? 309 00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 2: Oh, such a good question. I'm a big fan of 310 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,120 Speaker 2: an I Love myself or I did that list, And 311 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:48,200 Speaker 2: it's literally a list you make on whatever your preferred 312 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 2: platform is where you're keeping active track of all of 313 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,120 Speaker 2: your accomplishments, big and small. Maybe it's that really nice 314 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 2: email you got from a customer. Save that into a folder, 315 00:14:56,920 --> 00:14:59,440 Speaker 2: link it into that sheet that you have. Maybe it's 316 00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:01,520 Speaker 2: like a big accomplishment that you had with the team 317 00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 2: where you delivered this great presentation. At the end of 318 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 2: every Friday, I want you to write down a couple 319 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 2: of things that went really well. A that is an 320 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,400 Speaker 2: imposter syndrome, crushing combination. That is going to eliminate that 321 00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 2: voice in your head saying that you shouldn't be asking 322 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 2: for the raise. But all of that means nothing if 323 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:19,760 Speaker 2: you don't have visibility. So how you get visibility is 324 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 2: going back to those one on ones with your manager. 325 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:23,880 Speaker 2: You start off with a small talk and then you say, 326 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:25,840 Speaker 2: I just wanted to give you an update on last week. 327 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 2: He were some of the key wins. It's another way 328 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 2: to share those accomplishments. Another great way to give yourself 329 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:34,920 Speaker 2: space to highlight your experience is actually to compliment other people. 330 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,320 Speaker 2: So in your Slack group with your team, say Susie 331 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 2: did such a good job on that presentation. That was fantastic. 332 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 2: Susie suddenly is going to be like, well, talk about 333 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:45,360 Speaker 2: that presentation. The data you pulled was ten out of ten, 334 00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:48,960 Speaker 2: and suddenly there's visibility for everybody, and everybody starts winning. 335 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 2: But I cannot underscore the importance keep an active tracker 336 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:54,800 Speaker 2: of why you're fantastic, and when you're having a down date, 337 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:56,160 Speaker 2: it's not bad to go in there and. 338 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 1: Look at how much people love you. 339 00:15:57,280 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 3: It's a nice feeling. 340 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 4: Something I also do is I have a reminder go 341 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 4: off every Friday to track my wins, and I have 342 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:06,800 Speaker 4: a channel just for myself on Slack where I put 343 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:09,880 Speaker 4: my wins because the first time I wrote my performance review, 344 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 4: I was like, oh God, what have I done in 345 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:15,560 Speaker 4: the last year, and it's super overwhelming. So I love 346 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 4: that advice. All right, I want to bring up a 347 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 4: question from one of our listeners. 348 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 3: Next. 349 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:21,800 Speaker 4: This is our fun segment called Dear Work, Bestie, where 350 00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:24,040 Speaker 4: we answer questions from people who listen to the show. 351 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:26,720 Speaker 4: This week's comes from Chloe and New York. 352 00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 3: I work bestie is. 353 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 5: My question is how do you transition from an entry 354 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 5: level position to mid and senior level roles without standing 355 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 5: out as the youngster? I found myself in the situation before, 356 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 5: and I find that people don't always believe that I'm 357 00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 5: an expert because of my age. So what do I do. 358 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:46,440 Speaker 3: To remedy this? 359 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 4: Ooh, I totally feel that, Chloe, what do you think? Emily? 360 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 2: First of all, Ta Chloe, thank you so much. And 361 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:54,840 Speaker 2: I think that's something a lot of people, especially young 362 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 2: women face, and it's very dependent as well in the 363 00:16:57,840 --> 00:17:01,880 Speaker 2: industry that you're in. Different intersections of identity are always 364 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,680 Speaker 2: going to change what our work experience looks like. I'm 365 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 2: going to say a couple of things. The first is 366 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 2: people can't dispute facts, babes, and I think if we 367 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:13,800 Speaker 2: go in with data when we're delivering our weekly impact 368 00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 2: results to our team, when we're showing up to team 369 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 2: meetings with the I increase the click through rate by 370 00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:20,719 Speaker 2: one hundred and twenty percent this week. Pretty hard for 371 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 2: you to cute little girl me when I've got numbers 372 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:24,719 Speaker 2: in your face you haven't hit in your entire career. 373 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:28,880 Speaker 2: Go in big, put that on T shirt. Bring the receipts. 374 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: It's received. I told you guys, we were bringing the 375 00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 1: general app guys, and baby, we're hitting Emily. Come in 376 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:35,600 Speaker 1: and swinging. 377 00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 2: You drop it at the end of the day. If 378 00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:40,399 Speaker 2: you come in with a data backed approach to sharing 379 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:44,479 Speaker 2: wins and collaborating with your team, you cannot dispute data. 380 00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 2: So lead with data when you are asking for things. 381 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:49,680 Speaker 2: Lead with data when you present updates. Be firm in 382 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 2: the data that you present if you are finding authentically 383 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:55,960 Speaker 2: that even as you push for data, you're having opportunities 384 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:59,520 Speaker 2: taken away and given to people who objectively have worse results. 385 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 2: But maybe we have those five ten plus years of experience. 386 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 2: I'm going to ask you a hard question. Do you 387 00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 2: want a company that doesn't value you because of your age? 388 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 2: Is that the kind of company you want to work at? 389 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 2: Job market's tough. It's also tough being in a job 390 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 2: that makes you feel lousy for showing up as you are. 391 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:16,240 Speaker 2: So do what you can be data backed. Never feel 392 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:18,200 Speaker 2: guilt for looking at that company the same way you 393 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:19,960 Speaker 2: can look at your man and say I can do better. 394 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 1: Did Emily and I talk before this podcast y'all because 395 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 1: you know, my two favorite things to talk about our 396 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,120 Speaker 1: food and dating, and Emily and the brought up both, 397 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 1: so I appreciate those analogies. 398 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:34,359 Speaker 4: I'm wondering, what if that person who is viewing you 399 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:36,399 Speaker 4: as the youngster and doesn't believe that you kind of 400 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 4: have the expertise to level up is your manager? Like, 401 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:40,360 Speaker 4: how do you go about that in that situation? 402 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:41,360 Speaker 1: Ooh, spicy. 403 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 2: It's really hard and oftentimes it can be our managers 404 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:47,800 Speaker 2: there are biggest supporter. They're also the biggest gatekeeper of 405 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:51,000 Speaker 2: our career development. If you're having those regular check ins, 406 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:53,840 Speaker 2: you're data backed in those conversations, and you're still feeling 407 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:56,600 Speaker 2: like you're being blocked, it's okay to ask your manager. 408 00:18:56,880 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 2: I'm feeling like I'm not seeing the career growth that 409 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:01,159 Speaker 2: I'm hoping for. Is there any feedback on how I 410 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 2: can improve so I can get to that next level? 411 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 2: If we play the right amount of stupid like I 412 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 2: don't understand what's going on here? Can you help me 413 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,080 Speaker 2: see it? And how can I get better so you 414 00:19:10,119 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 2: see my worth, they may actually come back and say, yeah, 415 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:14,439 Speaker 2: I've noticed this is a skill gap and that might 416 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 2: level up your career. That might also be the question 417 00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 2: that makes them realize they don't have a data backed 418 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,240 Speaker 2: reason for holding back opportunity for you. That might be 419 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 2: the game changer. And if they dance around that question, 420 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 2: if they dance around that conversation, they're showing you their 421 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 2: true colors. 422 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 1: You just need to. 423 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 2: Decide what you will and won't accept in the stage 424 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:33,680 Speaker 2: of your career. And it's okay to stand a job 425 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:34,480 Speaker 2: you're not going to grow in. 426 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: That's okay. 427 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:37,399 Speaker 2: You just need to have that information to make the 428 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 2: decision that feels right for you. 429 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:42,159 Speaker 1: Yeah. So, Emily, you've mentioned a number of things that 430 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:44,920 Speaker 1: people can be doing, such as, you know, documenting their 431 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:49,200 Speaker 1: wins throughout the year, having frequent check ins with their manager, 432 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 1: backing it up with data. But are there any other 433 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 1: common mistakes you find that people make when it comes 434 00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:56,959 Speaker 1: to asking for a promotion. 435 00:19:57,359 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 2: The first is timing. Every company, for the most part, 436 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,120 Speaker 2: has promotion cycles. If you're asking for a promotion outside 437 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:05,640 Speaker 2: of those cycles, not only is it unlikely that you're 438 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:07,920 Speaker 2: gonna get it, you might actually get side eyed because 439 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:09,359 Speaker 2: it's like, what do you mean? You don't know when 440 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:12,080 Speaker 2: our promotions are Clearly this isn't something that's on your radar, 441 00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:15,359 Speaker 2: So be thoughtful about when you ask. Building off of that, 442 00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:18,760 Speaker 2: you cannot ask a week before, two weeks before. This 443 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 2: is a six month before your promotion cycle at a minimum, 444 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 2: because it takes time to build the case the documentation. 445 00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:27,600 Speaker 2: What if you do have a performance gap that you 446 00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:30,400 Speaker 2: need to work on to get there, give yourself the runway. 447 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 2: The other thing I'll say is you never want the 448 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:34,840 Speaker 2: ask for a promotion to be a demand. It's never 449 00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 2: going to work. What you need to do is make 450 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:38,840 Speaker 2: it a collaborative effort. You don't want to come in 451 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:41,399 Speaker 2: with a presentation, a pitch. That's not what's going to 452 00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:44,400 Speaker 2: get you the results. It's a conversation. And a good 453 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:46,639 Speaker 2: boss and a good leader knows when you shine and 454 00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:48,920 Speaker 2: get promoted, they look good. Do you know how good 455 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:51,560 Speaker 2: that looks on your own performance review? That they've had 456 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:54,320 Speaker 2: this employee for three years and they're already promoted. Clearly 457 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:57,720 Speaker 2: they're a good leader. So set your relationship up with 458 00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:00,920 Speaker 2: your leader up for success when you're being thoughtful about 459 00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:01,359 Speaker 2: the timing. 460 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:04,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, quick follow up to that, do you think like 461 00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:06,439 Speaker 1: someone should stay in a role for a certain amount 462 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:09,119 Speaker 1: of time before they should be asking for a promotion, 463 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: or should it just be like all hands on deck, baby, 464 00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:13,439 Speaker 1: like day two, you want to give me that promotion, 465 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: go ahead, let's do it. 466 00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 3: I love that. 467 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:16,639 Speaker 2: Okay, I'm going to give you my Emily answer, and 468 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:19,280 Speaker 2: then I'm going to give you like the unfortunate Reality answer. 469 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 2: It really depends on your industry. If you're an investment maker, babe, 470 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:24,080 Speaker 2: and you walk in five months in and you go 471 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:26,160 Speaker 2: give me that promotion, they're going to be like, take 472 00:21:26,200 --> 00:21:28,240 Speaker 2: your booty back outside. I'm not interested. 473 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 1: It's not going to work. 474 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:31,359 Speaker 2: Be thought But if you're in tech, they might be like, 475 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 2: you know what, thank you for asking. Here's a sweatshirt 476 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:36,520 Speaker 2: you start Monday. Be thoughtful about your industry. If you're 477 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:39,199 Speaker 2: in a structure, so literally like give give me a 478 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 2: tech fleece and I'm in. If you have to be 479 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:43,679 Speaker 2: thoughtful about your industry, what are the industry norms for 480 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:45,879 Speaker 2: the space that you're working in? What are the team norms. 481 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:48,199 Speaker 2: With that being said, you need to pay attention to 482 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:51,280 Speaker 2: when you've been quietly promoted. And quiet promotions are sneaky 483 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:53,200 Speaker 2: because you don't always see them coming. But that's when 484 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:55,240 Speaker 2: you're getting more and more work for the same pay, 485 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 2: same title. Sometimes there's short periods of that, and we 486 00:21:58,040 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 2: can accept it. If you've been a role in a 487 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:03,160 Speaker 2: role for six months, let's say month seven, eight, nine, ten, 488 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:05,720 Speaker 2: Suddenly the next five months you've been doing the job 489 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 2: of two people and you've only been in the role 490 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:10,360 Speaker 2: for a year. Yeah, it's time to ask, and it's 491 00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:12,560 Speaker 2: appropriate to do that, even if it is early in 492 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:14,520 Speaker 2: your career. You just need to be thoughtful about the 493 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:16,280 Speaker 2: amount of work you're doing for the amount that you're 494 00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:19,159 Speaker 2: getting paid, and if those aren't aligning, absolutely go in 495 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:20,040 Speaker 2: there and ask for more. 496 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 1: Oh so good. 497 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 4: So let's say you get that promotion, right, you had 498 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:27,760 Speaker 4: to talk with your manager, you lay that plan six 499 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 4: months out, and you earn it, but it's not exactly 500 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,600 Speaker 4: what you were expecting. So let's say the pay raise 501 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 4: that comes with the promotion is just not as high 502 00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:40,080 Speaker 4: as you were hoping it would be. Can you negotiate 503 00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:43,000 Speaker 4: that or is that something that you should have done preemptively? 504 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:43,639 Speaker 3: Like when they. 505 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:47,120 Speaker 4: Hand you that award letter with your promotion and potentially 506 00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 4: a raise, is that set in stone? 507 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:49,640 Speaker 3: Like what's the deal there? 508 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,040 Speaker 2: It's kind of a tricky one. I would say nine 509 00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 2: times out of ten, it is set in stone because 510 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:57,640 Speaker 2: most companies that are going through these promotion cycles, it's standardized. 511 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 2: So this year, everyone who's getting this level of promotion 512 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:02,720 Speaker 2: is getting a three percent raise or whatever that raise 513 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 2: might be. It's a great idea when you're having that 514 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:07,919 Speaker 2: more formal conversation. So that chat we spoke about, when 515 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:10,640 Speaker 2: you tell your manager, you're telling me my performance is there. 516 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:13,880 Speaker 2: Let's talk about that next step. It's okay to lean 517 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:15,880 Speaker 2: into the playing Oh, I don't know, this is new 518 00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 2: to me and say, do you know approximately how much 519 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,919 Speaker 2: people play with in terms of salary increases. That's not 520 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,280 Speaker 2: super important to me. I just want to set my expectations. 521 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:25,919 Speaker 2: It's okay to have that conversation and come at it 522 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,919 Speaker 2: from a I'm just learning and exploring lens versus that 523 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 2: kind of direct, pointed conversation. If you are hearing numbers 524 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,360 Speaker 2: that don't feel good to you, it's okay to take 525 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 2: that job and only take it for a couple of months. 526 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 2: Just because you get a promotion doesn't mean you're locking 527 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 2: key with this company for the rest of your life. 528 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 2: But if you do feel the need to negotiate, try 529 00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:46,040 Speaker 2: to do it before you get that piece of paper. 530 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:48,320 Speaker 2: When you get it, it's okay to push. I would 531 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 2: just say, be prepared to be disappointed, because I have 532 00:23:51,359 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 2: very rarely seen them come back with any flexibility. 533 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:57,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, So, Emily, I want to bring up something that's 534 00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:59,160 Speaker 1: a little uncomfortable for a lot of people to talk about. 535 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:02,439 Speaker 1: But again, these are conversations that I'm often having with 536 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:05,919 Speaker 1: a lot of my friends, particularly like professionals of color. 537 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:08,360 Speaker 1: You know, there are so many studies that we are 538 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,080 Speaker 1: constantly talking about that have shown that, you know, black 539 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:14,960 Speaker 1: women in particular, but also just women across the board, 540 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 1: women of color particularly are usually less likely to be promoted. 541 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 1: And I also find that it's ironic because some of 542 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,159 Speaker 1: these same studies also have shown that black women on 543 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,040 Speaker 1: white teams also have higher turnover rates, and there have 544 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 1: been a number of studies that have tried to see 545 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 1: if there's a correlation. And then, you know, I often 546 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:33,679 Speaker 1: reflect on this idea that when I was growing up, 547 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,119 Speaker 1: my mother always said, you're gonna have to work at 548 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 1: least two three times as hard as everybody else to 549 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 1: get even a portion of what others have. And so 550 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: these are things that are always front of mine for me, 551 00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:46,600 Speaker 1: at what point do you think someone should stay and 552 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:50,159 Speaker 1: pivot and advocate for themselves, and at what point do 553 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 1: you feel like it could be gaslighting and that they 554 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:53,879 Speaker 1: should reconsider employment. 555 00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 2: That's an exceptional question. I think it's going to be 556 00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 2: personal for everyone. It would be entirely too privileged to 557 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 2: say we just get to walk away every single time, 558 00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:05,680 Speaker 2: because sometimes financially that's not on the table for any 559 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:08,440 Speaker 2: of us. I think first, it's so important to understand 560 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:10,520 Speaker 2: the context of why, because I think some people hear 561 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:13,760 Speaker 2: things like the wage gap and the different intersections of 562 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 2: identity and how that impacts promotions performance, even salary negotiations. 563 00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,080 Speaker 2: It isn't as explicit as people think it is. People 564 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:23,199 Speaker 2: aren't saying out loud, this person is a part of 565 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,399 Speaker 2: X group, so I'm paying them less. You have to 566 00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 2: look at historically who the key decision makers are, and 567 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,800 Speaker 2: a lot of major industries it's predominantly folks who don't 568 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:35,119 Speaker 2: have super diverse backgrounds that they're coming from. You also 569 00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 2: have to look at what the promotions process is. We 570 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:40,400 Speaker 2: know white women and white men get rewarded for being assertive. 571 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:43,440 Speaker 2: We know black women unequivocally get punished every single time. 572 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 2: And fundamentally, how you negotiate is by being assertive. So 573 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 2: no matter what, if you are not coming from a 574 00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,760 Speaker 2: CIS white background, you're going to be three steps behind, 575 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 2: and it's going to be pushy coming from the wrong audience. 576 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 2: Here's where I think we need to be thoughtful about 577 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 2: the companies. A lot of companies on their career website 578 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:01,920 Speaker 2: are going to tell you, oh, we care a lot 579 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:06,000 Speaker 2: in that interview, even in those promotion conversations. Take a 580 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:08,159 Speaker 2: hard look at what your senior leadership team looks like, 581 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 2: not your middle management, not your individual contributors. How many 582 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 2: black women are in leadership at that company. That's going 583 00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:15,640 Speaker 2: to tell you a lot. Going back to your question, 584 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,240 Speaker 2: because I feel as though I've rambled, I could speak 585 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,679 Speaker 2: about this for thirty years, is the first thing you 586 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:21,280 Speaker 2: need to do is look at the true culture of 587 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 2: that company by way of who those leaders are. If 588 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,000 Speaker 2: there are people who are going to advocate for you 589 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:28,480 Speaker 2: at that company, and a culture of action, not a 590 00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:32,480 Speaker 2: culture of posting on social media, for actually keeping track 591 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:35,359 Speaker 2: of what different promotion rates, different compensation rates look like 592 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,240 Speaker 2: across different groups at that organization. That's a good sign 593 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,360 Speaker 2: that company maybe may not have the best outcome all 594 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,120 Speaker 2: the time, but the intention is there. You can work 595 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 2: with that. If this is the kind of company that's 596 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:47,320 Speaker 2: going to shut you down and then slap your face 597 00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:49,640 Speaker 2: on that career's website, get the heck out of there. 598 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 2: You need to get out of there. What you need 599 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 2: to look at is how transparent a company is with 600 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:56,680 Speaker 2: data in terms of employment and promotion, what they do 601 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,119 Speaker 2: in terms of salary equity and wage equity internally, and 602 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,439 Speaker 2: how many leaders are there to truly advocate for you. 603 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,720 Speaker 2: If you don't have those four things, you have a 604 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 2: company that is going to consistently punish you for showing 605 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 2: up for yourself. And I guarantee there's an organization out 606 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 2: there who may not have all four, but at least 607 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,879 Speaker 2: have a combination that's going to keep you paid and 608 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 2: keep your mental in check. 609 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, so often people will say, you know, 610 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 1: if a job is stressing you out, leave baby. Do 611 00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:25,719 Speaker 1: you know I have bills like you know? So I 612 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:28,400 Speaker 1: appreciate that it's not just so black and white as 613 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:31,360 Speaker 1: far as just leave right. But what I'm hearing from 614 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:33,880 Speaker 1: you is make a game plan, make an action plan 615 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:36,960 Speaker 1: and evaluate both before you get there as well as 616 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 1: while you're in what your next steps are. And don't 617 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,879 Speaker 1: be afraid to advocate for yourself. Emily, I feel like 618 00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: we could talk to you all day, but I want 619 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: to round this convo out by, you know, equipping people 620 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,760 Speaker 1: who are listening who may have asked for the promotion 621 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:55,680 Speaker 1: and didn't get it. So let's say you don't receive 622 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: the promotion you're hoping for. What are some questions that 623 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:03,840 Speaker 1: you should ask your manager so that you can understand 624 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:06,040 Speaker 1: what steps will get you to that next level. 625 00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 2: Really good question. I'm a big believer and don't do 626 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,639 Speaker 2: anything until you felt the feelings. You're allowed to be sad. 627 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 2: Everyone's going to tell you rejection is redirection, it's a blessing. 628 00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:17,919 Speaker 2: That's true, but you're not going to feel that for 629 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,120 Speaker 2: the first little bit. So sit in the ad sit 630 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 2: in the disappointment. You're allowed to feel those things. After 631 00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,560 Speaker 2: you've felt those things, book a follow up meeting with 632 00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:28,680 Speaker 2: your boss, ideally in person or zoom. Have a list 633 00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,640 Speaker 2: of questions, and here's what I would recommend saying. Number One, 634 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 2: you start off with thanking them, thank them in advance 635 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 2: for their investment in your career. Thank them for their 636 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 2: honesty because that does create that foundation of trust. Next, 637 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:43,400 Speaker 2: I think you should also share here's how I perceived 638 00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 2: my performance. Can you help me understand where the gaps 639 00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:49,240 Speaker 2: were and where my areas of opportunity were. Your boss 640 00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:51,480 Speaker 2: should pretty easily be able to say here are the 641 00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 2: three or four things. What you're going to say is 642 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:55,600 Speaker 2: thank you so much. Can I come back to you 643 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 2: in a week with my action plan and maybe you 644 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 2: and I can work together on how we can create 645 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 2: a game plan for the next twelve months. So this 646 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:04,920 Speaker 2: time next year, I get that promotion, take it away. 647 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:08,240 Speaker 2: Create the game plan. For example, if it was presentation skills, 648 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 2: maybe you're going to join a toastmasters club. Maybe you're 649 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:12,680 Speaker 2: going to network with one new person a week to 650 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:16,200 Speaker 2: help build up those communication skills. Create a specific plan, 651 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 2: run it by your boss, and then in every single 652 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:20,719 Speaker 2: one on one recap and go through that to make 653 00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:22,960 Speaker 2: sure you're tracking those goals. So this time next year, 654 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 2: you know there's no disappointing surprises. 655 00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:25,760 Speaker 1: I love that, and it. 656 00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:27,880 Speaker 2: Doesn't make you a failure like it does not make 657 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:30,520 Speaker 2: you a weirdo, a loser. You're going to feel down 658 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:32,560 Speaker 2: for a little bit for not getting that promotion or 659 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:34,320 Speaker 2: not getting that dream job. But at the end of 660 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 2: the day, the need to feel like our worth is 661 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:39,719 Speaker 2: tied to our work isn't a real thing. You're never 662 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 2: going to look back on your life and wish you 663 00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:44,360 Speaker 2: worked more. So let yourself be sad, but also recognize 664 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 2: your job is a ten to say, right, I retired 665 00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 2: by forty. 666 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 1: Look now, my soft life is getting a little too 667 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: hard right now. No, no, no. 668 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:57,480 Speaker 2: The lottery is looking fantastic. And that's coming from someone 669 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 2: whose careers careers. I think it's I think it's normal 670 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:03,040 Speaker 2: for us to feel disappointed and feel sad, But you 671 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:05,800 Speaker 2: cannot let your self, identity, and your worth is a 672 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:08,000 Speaker 2: person be tied to whether or not you got that promotion. 673 00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 2: Your job should be the least interesting thing about you 674 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:11,200 Speaker 2: as a person. It really should. 675 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 3: I love that. 676 00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:15,920 Speaker 1: Can you expound on that, because I know for career 677 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:19,760 Speaker 1: driven women in people in general, there's a tendency to 678 00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,360 Speaker 1: tie identity to our achievements. Like I don't know about 679 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: anyone else, I feel like a personal failure when I've 680 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: worked hard for something and then it doesn't happen. So 681 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 1: how do you get out of that funk, because that's 682 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,520 Speaker 1: a that it almost feels like a personal dep ego 683 00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 1: blow my humanity. Yeah, exactly, it does. 684 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:42,760 Speaker 2: And I think one of the core things, especially women 685 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 2: have to dismantle is that our worth comes from what 686 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 2: we offer and what we provide. But our worth is 687 00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:51,360 Speaker 2: inherent us existing is our worth. One of the best 688 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,440 Speaker 2: ways you can untie that is after work, don't talk 689 00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 2: about it. Stop asking people the first time you meet them, 690 00:30:57,520 --> 00:30:58,480 Speaker 2: what do you do for work? 691 00:30:58,560 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 1: Why not? 692 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 2: What do you do for fun? Do we have hobbies 693 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,560 Speaker 2: that make us feel fulfilled? Are we investing as much 694 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:05,920 Speaker 2: time in our careers as we're investing in our mental 695 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:09,480 Speaker 2: health and in our relationships? Hit a point by practicing 696 00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:13,080 Speaker 2: those things and slowly untying the relationship to I'm worthy 697 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:16,080 Speaker 2: because to just I am worthy, and you will see 698 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:18,640 Speaker 2: that work no longer stresses you out quite as badly 699 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 2: or at least as often, Because if you got laid off, 700 00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 2: which happens all the time, do you still love yourself 701 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,440 Speaker 2: the same? And if the answers know too much of 702 00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 2: your worth and validation is coming from someone in a 703 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,120 Speaker 2: cubicle telling you that they liked your PowerPoint presentation and 704 00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:34,240 Speaker 2: even saying that out loud as nuts. That should not 705 00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:35,920 Speaker 2: be why we feel good about ourselves. 706 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,440 Speaker 1: Wow, did we just have therapy? Yeah? I'm feeling a 707 00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 1: lot of things right now. Should we all cry the 708 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 1: collective point? 709 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 4: And that'd be the first time I've cried at work, so. 710 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:48,719 Speaker 2: And it won't be the last. Let me tell you, 711 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,120 Speaker 2: I'm a work cryer, babe. I take no apology. 712 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:54,120 Speaker 1: Sometimes. 713 00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:59,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, right, Emily, this was literally when like the best conversation. 714 00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:02,600 Speaker 4: I mean, the way that you are approaching promotions is 715 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,720 Speaker 4: really refreshing, and I feel like, similar to negotiations, a 716 00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:09,240 Speaker 4: conversation can be so uncomfortable, especially when you're early in 717 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 4: your career. You feel like, I'm just like grateful to 718 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 4: have this job. Maybe I don't feel so deserving, but 719 00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 4: it really comes back to like recognizing your worth and 720 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 4: approaching that conversation with your manager well in advance, like 721 00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 4: as to equals and presenting your case rather than feel 722 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 4: like you need to beg for a promotion. 723 00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:27,160 Speaker 2: Right one percent, I cannot thank you enough. This was 724 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,200 Speaker 2: so much fun. But if there's one takeaway, it's that 725 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:31,920 Speaker 2: you are in the room because you deserve to be 726 00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 2: and your boss is not doing you a favor by 727 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 2: them paying you for services that you provide. 728 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:38,640 Speaker 4: Well, I love that, all right, tell everybody where they 729 00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 4: can find you before we let you go. 730 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: Absolutely so. 731 00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 2: You can find me on Instagram and TikTok at Emily 732 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 2: dot the Dot recruiter, or you can listen to my 733 00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:48,720 Speaker 2: podcast We're live every Sunday and Wednesday, the Straight Shooter 734 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:50,440 Speaker 2: Recruiter on all streaming platforms. 735 00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:54,080 Speaker 3: Yay, Thanks Emily, Awesome. 736 00:32:54,120 --> 00:33:02,360 Speaker 1: Thank you all who knew there was so much to 737 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: say about promotions. Emily dropped so many awesome tips that 738 00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,960 Speaker 1: we hope will help you move. Ona coming up. How 739 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 1: important is coffee in your life? You think he can 740 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:13,240 Speaker 1: give it up? 741 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:27,160 Speaker 3: That's next. So I'm obsessed with Emily. I think we're 742 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:27,800 Speaker 3: the best friends. 743 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:31,120 Speaker 1: That's the power to make me like emotionally cry like that, Like, 744 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:31,880 Speaker 1: but she's so. 745 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:33,800 Speaker 3: Amazing, She's amazing. I love it. Okay. 746 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 4: Something I'm really taking away from that conversation is the 747 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,360 Speaker 4: value of regular check ins with your manager and the 748 00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 4: importance of making the most of your one on ones. 749 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 4: Like she said, you should be having promotion conversations at 750 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:49,480 Speaker 4: least six months in advance. And I would even argue, 751 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:51,280 Speaker 4: like I feel like from my own experience, it's like 752 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,920 Speaker 4: a year in advance, right, So it's going into those 753 00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,000 Speaker 4: one on ones with a clear agenda of what you 754 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:58,360 Speaker 4: want to accomplish, and then serving up your wins to 755 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,840 Speaker 4: your manager in whatever way is best for them, whether 756 00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 4: it's like recapping after you know you're one on one 757 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:06,000 Speaker 4: with a quick note and be like, here's what we 758 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 4: talked about, and here where the key wins, like giving 759 00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,040 Speaker 4: them the ammunition they need to then go to bat 760 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 4: for you go to battle ye like we were saying before, Yeah. 761 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,720 Speaker 1: Everyone, this is an army. Now I love it. I 762 00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: agree one thousand percent. I think for me, a couple 763 00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:21,880 Speaker 1: of things I'm taking away is to approach everything as 764 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 1: a conversation. You know, I love that she gave us 765 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,359 Speaker 1: so much language on how you can talk to whether 766 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 1: you have a supportive manager or you don't, whether you've 767 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:32,920 Speaker 1: gotten the promotion or you didn't, like you can continue 768 00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,920 Speaker 1: to have this active conversation and getting the feedback to 769 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 1: equip you with everything that you need. But what I 770 00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:41,760 Speaker 1: also appreciated is that you have so much more worth 771 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:43,799 Speaker 1: than just the title. And I know, like it can 772 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:46,759 Speaker 1: feel like such a personal blow to yourself, right, when 773 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,000 Speaker 1: you don't get it, but you have the power to 774 00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:51,759 Speaker 1: choose what are the next steps in this whether it's 775 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:53,520 Speaker 1: you know, we didn't even talk about it, but maybe 776 00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,480 Speaker 1: that's even thinking about internal mobility and how you can 777 00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,160 Speaker 1: transfer to other teams or take on new roles. But 778 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 1: also at the end of the day, if you have 779 00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:03,040 Speaker 1: to walk away, go out with your head hell high 780 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:04,720 Speaker 1: and know that you fought for what you deserve. 781 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel like shed dropped so many amazing piece 782 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:10,040 Speaker 4: of advice. So I'm curious for those listening, what did 783 00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:12,600 Speaker 4: you really take away from this conversation, Jamay and I 784 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,000 Speaker 4: want to know, so at mention us on LinkedIn, put 785 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:17,680 Speaker 4: a post up with all your takeaways from this conversation. 786 00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:18,279 Speaker 3: We'd love to know. 787 00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:22,680 Speaker 1: Yes, please, Okay, So now it's time for show the receipts. Now, 788 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:24,719 Speaker 1: this is a segment, y'all where we take a look 789 00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:27,480 Speaker 1: at some of the headlines or workplace trends, maybe even 790 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:30,719 Speaker 1: some office myths and see if there's any truth to them. Now, 791 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: usually Gianna and I are like on the same page 792 00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:35,520 Speaker 1: about these and so I'm really excited. Gee, what do 793 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:36,640 Speaker 1: you have in the bad this week? 794 00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 4: I already know we're going to be on the same 795 00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:41,440 Speaker 4: page for this one. Okay, Okay, Like, listen when I 796 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,600 Speaker 4: say this, but don't overreact because I just know her. 797 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:46,880 Speaker 1: Telling me not to overreact beforehand now makes me feel 798 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:48,960 Speaker 1: like I'm about to go to war. What's happening? 799 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,520 Speaker 4: People don't want to drink coffee anymore, and they're finding 800 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 4: alternative ways to maintain her energy and focus. What we 801 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:02,840 Speaker 4: have to pry the coffee out of Jamay's hands before 802 00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:03,760 Speaker 4: we start recording. 803 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:08,040 Speaker 1: You will take it from my cold dead fingers. Okay, what, Yeah, 804 00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:09,600 Speaker 1: they're okay, let. 805 00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:11,000 Speaker 3: Me explain, Let me explain. Okay. 806 00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:13,359 Speaker 4: So the Wall Street Journal had published an article this 807 00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:17,520 Speaker 4: year titled Skipping Coffee is the Latest Humble Brag, and 808 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:21,640 Speaker 4: it talks about how company executives and celebrities. Of course, 809 00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:24,640 Speaker 4: celebrities are quitting coffee culture to be part of this 810 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 4: wellness trend. Yeah, I have thoughts. 811 00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:30,800 Speaker 1: I mean, what are your thoughts? Gmna. 812 00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 3: I literally have. 813 00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:35,440 Speaker 4: Been drinking coffee since I was like able to talk, 814 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 4: which is so unhealthy. But I was having some milky 815 00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:40,439 Speaker 4: coffee back in the day. 816 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,320 Speaker 1: Well least they had milk so you can develop bones. 817 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:44,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, at. 818 00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:48,160 Speaker 4: This point, like I want to enjoy the taste of coffee, 819 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:51,759 Speaker 4: and I do feel like I am now reliant on 820 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:54,080 Speaker 4: it to function, Like I will have a headache. You know, 821 00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 4: it's always at like three pm, I have a headache. 822 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:58,400 Speaker 4: Is it because I'm dehydrated or any coffee? And I 823 00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,319 Speaker 4: will always choose coffee. Coffee for me at least does 824 00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:04,359 Speaker 4: sometimes peak the anxiety. You know, it makes you feel 825 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:07,560 Speaker 4: jittery obviously. You know it can affect your sleep, depending 826 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:10,440 Speaker 4: on when you have it and alternate ways. People are 827 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:13,080 Speaker 4: caffeinating now or you know, team or water. 828 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,439 Speaker 3: Macha. You know you're Macha girl. I am, but it's 829 00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 3: just not the same. 830 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,160 Speaker 1: No, she's not the star of the show. 831 00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:22,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, so how are you feeling about this? Are you okay? 832 00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:23,120 Speaker 2: No? 833 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:25,880 Speaker 1: I mean I'm like you. I've been drinking coffee since 834 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:27,560 Speaker 1: I could remember. I mean, I was pulling all nighters 835 00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:30,000 Speaker 1: in middle school. Oh damn, So the coffee you me. 836 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:31,879 Speaker 1: We have known each other for a very long time. 837 00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:35,239 Speaker 1: We will find it out. We will find ourselves in 838 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:40,120 Speaker 1: every lifetime. No, I mean, there's no substitute for coffee. 839 00:37:40,160 --> 00:37:41,280 Speaker 1: She is that girl. 840 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:44,640 Speaker 4: Listen, like if it's a humble brag, not us, and 841 00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:46,160 Speaker 4: we're not bragging. 842 00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:48,359 Speaker 1: And you know what, one thing I will say because 843 00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:50,160 Speaker 1: I want to bring this back also into work. I 844 00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:54,520 Speaker 1: think that the problem I have is that a lot 845 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,320 Speaker 1: of like maybe high functioning people, particularly in the workforce. 846 00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:01,400 Speaker 1: You know, you get some CEOs or corporate execs, maybe 847 00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:04,880 Speaker 1: even celebrities. What they're not telling you is that they're 848 00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,000 Speaker 1: outsourcing a lot of their work to their team members. 849 00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:10,719 Speaker 1: So guess what you're bringing down that stress? Maybe you 850 00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:12,480 Speaker 1: don't need coffee because guess what, maybe you don't have 851 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:14,279 Speaker 1: to go to the eight am. Now there are some 852 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,839 Speaker 1: you know, people who are like whatever, but maybe they 853 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:18,600 Speaker 1: do other things that we will not say on this 854 00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:20,799 Speaker 1: podcast because I don't want to get deemed well. 855 00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:25,800 Speaker 4: Speaking of I have some examples. I brought the receipts. 856 00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:29,480 Speaker 4: Let's bring up Mark Zuckerberg. He doesn't drink coffee at all. 857 00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:32,719 Speaker 4: He says, mixed martial arts, training, protein and sleep help 858 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:34,280 Speaker 4: him maintain his energy and focus. 859 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:35,879 Speaker 3: Cat must be a nice Mark. 860 00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:38,759 Speaker 4: Giselle Bunchin I hope I'm saying her name right. The 861 00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:42,120 Speaker 4: Victoria's Secrets X model says she starts her morning with 862 00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:44,800 Speaker 4: room temperature water, lemon and Celtic salt. 863 00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:45,839 Speaker 3: Yeah, that checks out. 864 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,720 Speaker 1: I've done that. I've done warm water with some lemon 865 00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:52,320 Speaker 1: and the saw also helps a little. 866 00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 3: Bit, but it's not caffeinating me. 867 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 1: I think people are lying or they're waking up and 868 00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:59,600 Speaker 1: then they're going right back to sleep. Something is something 869 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:02,120 Speaker 1: is a I love coffee so much. I have a 870 00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:05,440 Speaker 1: perfume that smells like like coffee fish coffee. I have 871 00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:08,000 Speaker 1: one too, and it's called the coffee break though. Oh 872 00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:15,000 Speaker 1: my god, me too. Yeah, okay, so the coffee. We 873 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:18,319 Speaker 1: are not the demographic here, but I mean again, if 874 00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:21,759 Speaker 1: you want to find other alternatives, or if coffee or 875 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:25,719 Speaker 1: caffeine particularly you know, gives you the jitters, you know, 876 00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:29,759 Speaker 1: try something else. And for anyone listening, if you have 877 00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:32,279 Speaker 1: found other ways to be productive and you've been able 878 00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,000 Speaker 1: to ditch the caffeine, please let Gianna and I know 879 00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,399 Speaker 1: we would love to maybe try this out. I will 880 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:40,240 Speaker 1: go back to the coffee because we are enjoying relationship. 881 00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:41,880 Speaker 3: Let me enjoy it. But yeah, we need to s 882 00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:44,000 Speaker 3: us with this coffee addiction, so let us know. 883 00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:49,160 Speaker 1: Wild Well, guys, you know where I stand as I 884 00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:51,520 Speaker 1: literally take a sip of coffee to close us out 885 00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:56,800 Speaker 1: and more to come. Thank you so much, guys for listening. 886 00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:58,240 Speaker 3: Yes, thanks guys for listening. 887 00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,279 Speaker 4: Let us know your take on this coffee culture cancelation 888 00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:05,360 Speaker 4: in the newsletter this week, it's called Let's Talk Offline. 889 00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:07,600 Speaker 3: You guys already know. Make sure you're subscribed. 890 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,040 Speaker 4: The link is in the show description and also in 891 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:10,879 Speaker 4: my LinkedIn bio. 892 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,200 Speaker 1: Yes, and also we've got to give a huge shout 893 00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:18,120 Speaker 1: out to Chloe. Chloe girl, thank you so much for 894 00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:20,839 Speaker 1: sending a new question. Now the rest of you, Yes, 895 00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:25,000 Speaker 1: I'm looking right at you. You can be just like Chloe. Okay, 896 00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:28,200 Speaker 1: send us your questions. Look, we need we want them, 897 00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:31,440 Speaker 1: we want them. Everything on how to do that is 898 00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:32,960 Speaker 1: in the show description. 899 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 4: Please look, Please, one last thing, make sure you guys 900 00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:38,760 Speaker 4: are following the show. 901 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:41,120 Speaker 3: Leave a rating and a review. We'd love to hear 902 00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:41,520 Speaker 3: from you. 903 00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:43,920 Speaker 4: All Right, that's it for today, But before you go, 904 00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,120 Speaker 4: remember we've always got your back. 905 00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:49,960 Speaker 3: So something comes up, Let's Talk Offline. I'm Gianna Predente. 906 00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:52,880 Speaker 1: I'm writing to get coffee, but I'm Jamaie Jackson Gaston, 907 00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:53,760 Speaker 1: stay thriving. 908 00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 4: Let's Talk Offline is a production of LinkedIn News and 909 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:01,320 Speaker 4: I Heart Podcasts. The show is produced by Western Sound. 910 00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,480 Speaker 4: Our producer is Sabrina Fang. The show is edited by 911 00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:08,440 Speaker 4: Savannah Wright. Our associate producer is Sarah Dilley. Alex mckinnis 912 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,520 Speaker 4: is our engineer, and Ben Adair is the executive producer. 913 00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:16,560 Speaker 1: Executive producers at iHeart Podcasts are Katrina Norvel and Nikki E. Tour. 914 00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,879 Speaker 1: We got support from LinkedIn's Jesse Umple, Sarah Storm and 915 00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:25,600 Speaker 1: Ayana Angel. Maya Pope Chappelle is director of Content, Dave 916 00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:28,799 Speaker 1: Pond is Head of News Production, Courtney Coop is Head 917 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:32,120 Speaker 1: of Original Programming, and Dan Roth is the editor in 918 00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:33,080 Speaker 1: chief of LinkedIn