Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Welcome to Greatest Escapes, a show bringing you
Speaker 1: the wildest true escape stories of all time. This is
Speaker 1: our first episode and we are kicking it off in style.
Speaker 1: I'm Arturo Gastro. I'm an actor. Not that one. No, no,
Speaker 1: not the one you're thinking about. The other one. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's me. So you might not be shocked to hear that.
Speaker 1: I love to stir the pot. When I was younger,
Speaker 1: you know, and I've escaped some pretty crazy, life threatening situations.
Speaker 1: I've always been drawn to the ingenuity that it takes
Speaker 1: to escape. So when I heard about some of the
Speaker 1: craziest escapes in history, I don't know, I wanted to
Speaker 1: explore them in a deeper format, also having fun and
Speaker 1: maybe some laughs along the way. Also, I don't make
Speaker 1: the show on my own right. No man is an island,
Speaker 1: So throughout the episodes you'll hear my producers aka my overlords,
Speaker 1: please help me, Carl, Ben and Toy. For our story.
Speaker 1: We're revisiting an early escape by one of the most
Speaker 1: infamous jailbreakers of the twenty first century, and I'm joined
Speaker 1: by the powerful voice of the activist, the actress, the
Speaker 1: wonderful human being Diane Guerrero. Hey, so listener, what a
Speaker 1: treat we have for you today, our very own Colombian sensation,
Speaker 1: Miss Diane Guerrero on the podcast.
Speaker 2: I love that and I love that sound.
Speaker 1: Diane, Tell me, what do you consider to be your
Speaker 1: greatest escape?
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Well this was actually really PG compared
Speaker 2: to something that I wanted to tell you about.
Speaker 1: Tell me all about it.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll tell you. I don't consider myself a bad kid,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. But I was heavily influenced
Speaker 2: by movies like Home Alone or like basically where any
Speaker 2: little white kid was like doing mischief. I was like,
Speaker 2: it's exactly what I want to do for my career. Yes,
Speaker 2: And my mom would take me to the mall a lot.
Speaker 2: This was like during Christmas time, and so like the
Speaker 2: mall is really decorated. This is in New Jersey, this
Speaker 2: is in Boston. And so I was with my friend
Speaker 2: and we had drinks and we the drinks were over,
Speaker 2: and then all we had was ice. So we were
Speaker 2: like sucking on the ice and then we were kind
Speaker 2: of like on the balcony.
Speaker 1: And so like, how old are you at this point? Sorry?
Speaker 2: Maybe like seven eight?
Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, so child child, Sorry.
Speaker 2: I was a child, Yeah, but I had ice in
Speaker 2: my mouth and I just I happened to drop it
Speaker 2: and it landed on someone's head and we were like,
Speaker 2: oh shit, and we went we went back and we
Speaker 2: just thought it was so funny. We just we just
Speaker 2: kept doing it and but we didn't get in trouble.
Speaker 2: It was like innocent, it was fine. It was multiple
Speaker 2: days in the shopping mall, not just that day. So
Speaker 2: the next day we went. I thought it was a
Speaker 2: really great idea. Hey, what do you think about instead
Speaker 2: of ice? I bring this bucket of toys. And here's
Speaker 2: the thing. Toys back in the day, these were like
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty six toys geatre made of steel. Dude, this
Speaker 2: is like this is like big bird on a car
Speaker 2: and that shit is heavy. And so we're like, what
Speaker 2: if we throw these off of the second floor or whatever.
Speaker 2: And so we went and we started doing this and
Speaker 2: like it would hit people in the head, and we
Speaker 2: thought it was hilarious and we're like whaa whatever. All
Speaker 2: of a sudden we turn around and this guy goes,
Speaker 2: is this yours? This man shows me my big bird
Speaker 2: on a fire truck and I just a freaking grab it,
Speaker 2: and I was like run. We didn't know where our
Speaker 2: parents were. Thank god we passed by the Talbots. It's
Speaker 2: a store that my mom was in. Anyway, I tell
Speaker 2: her the situation and she goes, you're on your own.
Speaker 2: You have to run.
Speaker 1: Thing to do is like I didn't throw the thing.
Speaker 2: She was like exactly, and so yeah, and then we
Speaker 2: just booked it. But the guy did say he was
Speaker 2: going to call the cops.
Speaker 1: Guess what, Dane, you have the guy here today, Come motherfucker,
Speaker 1: come on out, let's do this. No, we definitely played
Speaker 1: with like asbestos, like fucking rubber duckies when we were
Speaker 1: chilling anyone, like you knowitas were like, yeah, that'll be fine.
Speaker 1: It built character.
Speaker 2: Those things hurt ye, your weapons, I know, well you.
Speaker 1: Know, and that's and I think some of that will
Speaker 1: be relevant to our story today. So if you're ready, Diane,
Speaker 1: I'm ready, let's escape. Hey, Benja, can you give me
Speaker 1: some escape music?
Speaker 2: There we go, Oh my god.
Speaker 1: As a minute hand on the wall climbed towards nine,
Speaker 1: Joaquin tapped on his cell gate. The year was two
Speaker 1: thousand and one, and Joaquin was locked inside the maximum
Speaker 1: security prison in Jalisco. But it was finally that they
Speaker 1: had planned for. It was his kin Sannea hey even
Speaker 1: got everybody else just kidding, just kidding, It was not
Speaker 1: It was more dramatic than that.
Speaker 2: Oh.
Speaker 1: He ran through all the steps in his head, the
Speaker 1: upcoming maneuvers necessary. The rives handed off. The clock ticked
Speaker 1: and ticked and ticked. All of Joaquin's tedious calculations for
Speaker 1: a grand escape accounted to this laundry day. Today's story
Speaker 1: is about a truly infamous character.
Speaker 2: Uh huh.
Speaker 1: We'll get to laundry day in a second, but to start,
Speaker 1: let's go back to the beginning. He was born in
Speaker 1: the spring of nineteen fifty seven into a poor family
Speaker 1: in the rural community of Latuna, a little town in
Speaker 1: the mountains of western Mexico, which was incidentally famous for
Speaker 1: it's salma. Now it's salmon, goddamn it. It was like, I
Speaker 1: m doing the pilgrims and be like, do you guys
Speaker 1: have tuna?
Speaker 2: They're like, sorry, it's just a salmon, just because.
Speaker 1: Our name is Tuna, sir, Just not mean so.
Speaker 2: So.
Speaker 1: The nearest school to his home was about sixty miles away,
Speaker 1: and he was taught by traveling teachers during the early years. Okay,
Speaker 1: they would come stay for months for a few months
Speaker 1: before moving on to other areas. So school was never
Speaker 1: that important to Joaquin and he quit after elementary school. Okay,
Speaker 1: but this did lead to stories about how bad his
Speaker 1: handwriting was. Were you were you a good student? Then
Speaker 1: what was the subject that most tripped you out?
Speaker 2: Math?
Speaker 1: MATHA.
Speaker 2: It wasn't a good math student, it really, I mean
Speaker 2: it got my armpits real.
Speaker 1: Drink, Yeah, it got my arm pits are flowing.
Speaker 2: It scared me. I would hide. I would hide under
Speaker 2: the desk, like every time we had to do problems
Speaker 2: on the on the pisa, whatever it is on the blackboard. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was very scary for me.
Speaker 1: There is very little dread, similar to that pit in
Speaker 1: your stomach when you don't have your homework right, but
Speaker 1: when you know you can't fucking do it whatever it is,
Speaker 1: it's just like you don't have it and they're gonna
Speaker 1: ask for it and it's today, and your like mouth
Speaker 1: is dry and like it's just like there's very little
Speaker 1: feelings like that.
Speaker 2: You're like peeing your pants. Your mouth is dry, but
Speaker 2: you're very wet and others.
Speaker 1: I was like, can you figure out the moisture, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: the distribution is not working for me. My handwriting is
Speaker 1: embarrassingly bad, though, so I just tell people that it's
Speaker 1: ase I imitated my doctor father's writing, which is not true.
Speaker 1: It's just my hands have always shaken for some reason.
Speaker 1: You're shaking now, I'm a shaky guys, shall Yeah, Jimmy
Speaker 1: shakes over here. So for Joaquin, penmanship didn't really matter
Speaker 1: that much. No, no, because he had other work to do.
Speaker 1: So it's not like there were a lot of jobs
Speaker 1: in his hometown, right. Latuna was a farming community, so
Speaker 1: that's what Joaquin did. He would go up into the
Speaker 1: mountains and work on raising the area's cash crops opium,
Speaker 1: poppies and marijuana plans. Okay, yeah, oh boy.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So during harvest season, Joaquin and all of his brothers
Speaker 1: were busy hiking from farm to farm cutting buds of
Speaker 1: one kind or another.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Now, his past is a little hazy, but as the
Speaker 1: legend goes, Joaquin's dad worked as a driver and the
Speaker 1: boys would cut in stack and then their father would
Speaker 1: drive the harvest to suppliers in Juliakan and Juan Muchil. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but there is one major problem with his arrangement. So
Speaker 1: Joaquin's dad was supposed to sell the crops and then
Speaker 1: come back home with the money, but instance he would
Speaker 1: collect the money and immediately go on a fucking bender dude,
Speaker 1: like drink sex, whatever, crazy shit he felt like he was.
Speaker 2: He dipped into the stash.
Speaker 1: She dipped into the set. You never go into your
Speaker 1: o stash, the number one rule. You don't go into
Speaker 1: the set. Bro. You're never talk about my club, and
Speaker 1: you don't go into your own stash. Right, that's such
Speaker 1: a classic story of the fields sometimes where the father's
Speaker 1: just like, h I could use this not all the
Speaker 1: time I knew, but like I could use this to
Speaker 1: you my family. Or there's a saloon over here. I
Speaker 1: don't know why.
Speaker 2: This is like the West saloon.
Speaker 1: Yeah that's right, it's.
Speaker 2: Okay, very western.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you never know. It's not like it's the eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 1: For fuck it. We'll suspend in this belief. So obviously,
Speaker 1: Joaquin was extremely tired of this year after year, Right,
Speaker 1: He wanted more than just grinding poverty for himself and
Speaker 1: his family, which, to be honest, fare, so he saved
Speaker 1: up balloon money until he could move away from home
Speaker 1: and to start his own marijuana plantation. Oh he's an
Speaker 1: industrial list. Good for him, Good for him, he said,
Speaker 1: up his spot close to the bigger town of Baddi
Speaker 1: ra Wato. It's not like I can ask my producers
Speaker 1: if I'm pronouncing this correctly. Buddy got what they got
Speaker 1: Buddy Baddy okay, which sounds like a name of a
Speaker 1: sexy regged tone dance, doesn't it?
Speaker 2: Like for sure?
Speaker 1: Uh, Baddy got Thank you for indulging me. I love that.
Speaker 1: But the crazy thing was that this whole start my
Speaker 1: own farm thing when he was only fifteen, that's when
Speaker 1: it happened. And he brung brought along people in his
Speaker 1: family to help him. Brung, he brung along people in
Speaker 1: his family to help and get the mistake number one rule.
Speaker 2: You don't talk about fight club, you don't go into
Speaker 2: your own stash, and you don't bring your own family
Speaker 2: to your business.
Speaker 1: It's a big misry the business. So by twenty he
Speaker 1: was married and he was starting to make some real
Speaker 1: money enough to support all of them. Wow, And and
Speaker 1: everybody's like, oh my god, I knew he was always
Speaker 1: going to make something of himself, And like, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: you didn't know you didn't, but okay, one thing to
Speaker 1: know about Howking is he was pretty short. Okay, he
Speaker 1: only grew up to be five foot six. It had
Speaker 1: kind of a stock if you sik. And that's what
Speaker 1: gave him his nickname. It was slang for shorty. Do
Speaker 1: you know who we're talking about? Chapel You got it?
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, shivers down my spine.
Speaker 1: I know that. I don't know who that whose voice
Speaker 1: that was, but it was really into my soul.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, can you believe so? In one of all the
Speaker 1: nickname for for short people is chaparros. What is it
Speaker 1: in Columbia? Do you guys have one? Okay?
Speaker 2: That's like like like no, like what is it?
Speaker 1: Like little gnome?
Speaker 2: Little like little gnome?
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so fucked up that we are like it's
Speaker 1: like that's what you'll be known for your entire life.
Speaker 1: If you're growing up in Latin America, you get one nickname, and.
Speaker 2: That's one nickname. It's and it's attributed to your physical whatever, always.
Speaker 1: With what you can see.
Speaker 2: They're like, that's rude, and it's like now we're like
Speaker 2: in this phase of like, oh we're starting to to
Speaker 2: it's like, don't comment on my body, don't like talk
Speaker 2: about my physical attributes. But Latin America don't care.
Speaker 1: But in Americas you're like, yeah, yeah, if you're dark,
Speaker 1: you're the dark one. If you're like light, you're the
Speaker 1: light one.
Speaker 2: You know, you're like machete. If you killed somebody one
Speaker 2: time with a machete.
Speaker 1: Can you believe you kill somebody one time and they
Speaker 1: call you machette forever? Like that's unfair. They give me
Speaker 1: a chance. So yes, you got him. And Chapel's full
Speaker 1: name was Juaquin Archivaldo Guzman nomine like a soap opera star,
Speaker 1: and you know, and by the seventies he had caught
Speaker 1: the attention of some really big players in Mexican cartels.
Speaker 1: I want to say his name one more time, just
Speaker 1: for the fuck of it. Ja. I feel like that's
Speaker 1: like there's a certain university in Guatemala where where if
Speaker 1: you're from there, you tend to announce every one of
Speaker 1: your names, and it's like my name number seven. You're like,
Speaker 1: I get it, I know where you went to school, NDA,
Speaker 1: but and like, okay, well what's your full name? Josserturo
Speaker 1: Castro rees.
Speaker 2: You also have like five names Yeah, what is your name,
Speaker 2: Diane Guerrero. No, there's I don't have a second name.
Speaker 2: I guess my mom. My mom's name is Bessera.
Speaker 1: Okay, Dian Gerrero Beserra.
Speaker 2: Diane Gerrero Beerra.
Speaker 1: See. I expect you by the end of this podcast
Speaker 1: to start hyphenating that ship. I know, I do want
Speaker 1: to unpack something. Did you ever consider changing your name
Speaker 1: to something less Latino when you were starting out?
Speaker 2: No, you know what, I was always really proud of
Speaker 2: the name Guerrero, and it was my dad's name.
Speaker 1: By the way, it means warrior in Spanish.
Speaker 2: You guys, Yeah, it's really what like I felt inside
Speaker 2: of like who I was, and I really wanted to
Speaker 2: honor my.
Speaker 1: Father one hundred percent. I considered it for a brief second,
Speaker 1: just because I'm jos Erturo Castro, you know, and like
Speaker 1: I got like the first when I first moved to
Speaker 1: the States, people couldn't really pronounce Arturo, and I was like,
Speaker 1: fuck that, I have to change it. And then I
Speaker 1: met this director called Angei Karkowski's and he's like, He's like, kids,
Speaker 1: if they can say name, they gonna say.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: And I've been this ever since.
Speaker 2: You know, what name did you What name did you consider?
Speaker 1: You don't want to know. Please make me do don't
Speaker 1: make me do this in front of my Film Nation buddies,
Speaker 1: you know what, they get them, get them down by.
Speaker 1: So it was gonna be it was going to be
Speaker 1: Joe Descant, Joseph Descent with an apostrophe. Let me walk
Speaker 1: you through this, Yes, let me walk you through this. Okay.
Speaker 1: So my first name and I was like, Joseph fucking easy.
Speaker 1: And then my mother's maid enim name is Ruis Santiso,
Speaker 1: and I was like, that's it. I'm just instead of
Speaker 1: they like d E, I'm going to do like hyphenated
Speaker 1: D and then it's going to be descent. No, I'm
Speaker 1: going to leave now. But thank you guys so much
Speaker 1: for having me. Oh my god, Film Nation. This is great. Diane,
Speaker 1: you're the new host of the podcast.
Speaker 2: This is my podcast. Now get used to it. Joseph,
Speaker 2: you call me out, Ben Wow, I'm glad you kept
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Joe Dessant is leaving the building. So after a little while,
Speaker 1: he wasn't working for himself anymore. No, no, no, Instead,
Speaker 1: old Chapel was employed by the drug lord Ecto Eluero Bama,
Speaker 1: and the chapel was trusted with the difficult stuff. Right.
Speaker 1: He transported drugs and supervised shipments from the Sierra Made
Speaker 1: region to cities on the US and Mexico border, and
Speaker 1: the chapel was super ambitious. The little guy, oh my god,
Speaker 1: you know, little a pinch him if it wasn't such
Speaker 1: a fucking psycho. The story goes that he was always
Speaker 1: pushing for more responsibility. Over and over. He tried to
Speaker 1: get his bosses to give him more responsibility, bigger shipments,
Speaker 1: and a bigger share of their business.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: In fact, one story says that he basically never talked
Speaker 1: about anything else. That Chapo. He's always talking about drug business.
Speaker 1: Wherever he is, with whatever people he's with, he's talking
Speaker 1: about drugs. Is this an Italian Mexican dude, Toria? Or
Speaker 1: where's he? Where's he from? A fucking COMI Tori, I
Speaker 1: produced everybody. Have you ever gotten so obsessed with one
Speaker 1: particular thing that you start to annoy your family and
Speaker 1: friends because you can't talk about anything else?
Speaker 2: The Fresh Prince of Balat song, I just couldn't stop
Speaker 2: singing it. No, yeah, yeah, for a while.
Speaker 1: I just I worked for ten years.
Speaker 2: I don't. Yeah, exactly exactly. I still do to this day.
Speaker 2: But there was like definitely a one week where I
Speaker 2: just kind of like just became obsessed. I just was like, yo,
Speaker 2: I can rap now.
Speaker 1: Yeah No, So like, you know, you got in one
Speaker 1: little little fight and your mom got scared.
Speaker 2: You know, Yeah, moving with you, Auntie and uncle and ballet.
Speaker 1: Do it, don't do it.
Speaker 2: Georgia's song is gonna come so for a cab and
Speaker 2: when it came near. Sorry, but Chapa was like this,
Speaker 2: he was like, you couldn't stop talking about the business.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's go back to a chapel. So in November
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four brought a little shake up to the business.
Speaker 1: So the Mexican military got a hot tip from an
Speaker 1: inside man. He got the hot goss right that cheese
Speaker 1: me and they rated a large marijuana plantation owned by
Speaker 1: the Wild Hata cartel known as Francho Buffalo. So in
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five, the cortel figured who the snitch was
Speaker 1: and killed them because that's what these mass murdering fuck
Speaker 1: heads tend to do. So after that raid, Mexico responded
Speaker 1: by carrying out a massive manhunt for those involved in
Speaker 1: the incident and they swept out tons of cartel players.
Speaker 1: So with the leaders in the business arrested or on
Speaker 1: the run, CHAPO saw an opportunity. The FEDS were smashing
Speaker 1: off cartel operations and they were leaving a vacuum behind
Speaker 1: a space that ol CHAPO could fill, a very tiny,
Speaker 1: tiny Chapel filled space. So one of the imprisoned cartel
Speaker 1: leaders called for a summit in a Capulco a few
Speaker 1: years later, and at the meeting, Chapel and others who
Speaker 1: had daunched the raid discussed the future of Mexico drug trafficking.
Speaker 1: They agreed to divide up the territories.
Speaker 2: They rented like a huge spa, like like a whole
Speaker 2: like hotel.
Speaker 1: They're like, don't come in here until your cheese. The line, guys,
Speaker 1: your cheese, not fucking a ligne. I Hey, hey, Chapel,
Speaker 1: a little more margerite up on the chapel, please, thank
Speaker 1: you so much. Find your voice, find your inside voice,
Speaker 1: and then talk to me.
Speaker 2: We had like group games trying to like, you know,
Speaker 2: get to know each other and everything. Trustful icebreakers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not your fault. It's just a bunch of
Speaker 1: fucking rounds. Being like it's not your fault, and like
Speaker 1: crying into each other like uh, goodwill hunting. It was
Speaker 1: really actually yeah, the most emotionally connected moment for all cartels.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: So after this peaceful retreat, they all agreed to divide
Speaker 1: up the territories previously controlled by the Wada Lajarak. So
Speaker 1: that's when the scene la cartel was formed under three traffickers, right,
Speaker 1: including a chapel but he was really the one in charge.
Speaker 1: But the meeting didn't really set up a happy split
Speaker 1: between the groups. It was less like cutting the cake
Speaker 1: so that everybody got a slice, and more like drawing
Speaker 1: the battle lines just to see what side everyone was on.
Speaker 1: But imagine if it really was about cake though, Like
Speaker 1: what like if everybody just resolved things with a bakeof style, Like,
Speaker 1: come listen to me, I don't agree with your business practice,
Speaker 1: but this chocolate Fuondon is absolutely heavily No, that's not
Speaker 1: the chapter. No, that's not the chapter. Sound give me
Speaker 1: the chapter. Sound there we go, that's the chapter. Sound
Speaker 1: give me a little mariachi yell. Thank you very much.
Speaker 1: God Benchuk is on it. Wow, that's not a bad one.
Speaker 1: I got I got one. I got hi hi hi no, No,
Speaker 1: that was not very good.
Speaker 2: That's a good one. I've been practicing now.
Speaker 1: And for a little while it seemed like life was
Speaker 1: good for the chapel. He started raking in millions and
Speaker 1: he knew what to do with it. As the story goes,
Speaker 1: he bought himself four jets, and he had ranches in
Speaker 1: every state of Mexico, not to mention houses on every beach.
Speaker 1: Oh and yeah, he built his mom a little church
Speaker 1: right by their house. It's is that a Heavenly give
Speaker 1: me that again? He built a church right by his house.
Speaker 2: Good for you because he might have been on Tapa.
Speaker 2: But he's like he still like loves his believes in
Speaker 2: the first community.
Speaker 1: But it's exactly, it seems like it's always intertwined, right,
Speaker 1: Like these absolute lunatics always seem to consider themselves religious.
Speaker 1: It must be part of our culture, I guess, Like,
Speaker 1: I don't know, it's your family religious.
Speaker 2: Not intensely so, but I mean it's they still, yeah,
Speaker 2: believe in God, and everything is cudio skid it? You know,
Speaker 2: everything is it sudio skid it this or that? And
Speaker 2: I think that those guys they have to believe in
Speaker 2: God because their survival has dependent really on that, like
Speaker 2: on the fact that like God is with them, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, And the way that they repent
Speaker 2: is by giving money to the church.
Speaker 1: It seems like these psychopaths or like people, murders, tyrants,
Speaker 1: they always a line themselves to the church in order
Speaker 1: to try to pay their way out of their sin
Speaker 1: or their guilt, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean, church is kind of like the original kind
Speaker 2: of sin. Yeah, right, I mean, no, they're but they're
Speaker 2: like bad folks, right, I mean, if we think about
Speaker 2: the Christian Church and everything that they did.
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean legally, I can't say that out
Speaker 1: loud because they own the rights of my career. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I am, I'm I'm not nodding, but I'm nodding. Yeah.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: You know, if if Chapel had a church, it was
Speaker 1: probably his ranch in Guadalajada, and that's where he built
Speaker 1: his own zou full of panthers and tigers and lions
Speaker 1: and deer. Plus thank you for this, so yeah, very nice.
Speaker 1: Plus there was a little train that you could ride
Speaker 1: around to see.
Speaker 2: It all much never Land. He had like a never
Speaker 2: Land situation.
Speaker 1: Kind of like never Land, but way less dangerous. Oh
Speaker 1: oh by the way. Chapel had also had four wives.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure how that worked out, but maybe each
Speaker 1: of them stayed in a different jet I don't know.
Speaker 1: Or he went to Bernie Man and pitched like ethical
Speaker 1: non monogamy.
Speaker 2: You know, he's like, we all.
Speaker 1: Love each other, but we don't want to be with
Speaker 1: each other that way. Chapel was making friends outside of
Speaker 1: Mexico two for instance, the Million and in Colombia, they
Speaker 1: found that he was the most efficient of the Mexican operators. Yeah. Wow,
Speaker 1: no one could smuggle north across the US board as
Speaker 1: fast as Chapel. To the Colombians, he was less a
Speaker 1: Chapel and more rapid.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: Do you have a favorite nickname that somebody has ever
Speaker 1: called you?
Speaker 2: I mean it's really offensive.
Speaker 1: Ship, Like, you don't have to like go deep that
Speaker 1: way if you don't want.
Speaker 2: People called me Shrimpo Shrimpo. Okay, if you must know.
Speaker 1: Because you were tiny, Yeah, Chapel was taken, so people
Speaker 1: called you Shrimpo.
Speaker 2: Chapa was taken, so people call me Shrimpo.
Speaker 1: They called me Joe Dessant. It was weird.
Speaker 2: One day I was like going into like you know,
Speaker 2: Sunday school or whatever. We were practicing for like a
Speaker 2: big play or whatever, and I come in and these
Speaker 2: kids are laughing, and I was like, what's so funny?
Speaker 2: And then somebody starts saying shrimpo son so bitches, and
Speaker 2: I was like, what's happening? And They're like, they're calling
Speaker 2: you shrimpo and I was like, why are they calling
Speaker 2: you shrimpo?
Speaker 1: And I'm going to need you to write down their
Speaker 1: social Security numbers and their names. We're going to get
Speaker 1: Film Nation to fucking publicly cut off their their access
Speaker 1: to any Film Nation. Films.
Speaker 2: Film Nation have this much power.
Speaker 1: You don't know. You know, we do them straight. We
Speaker 1: got this, don't worry that yet. We got this.
Speaker 2: I got it joint to sign that's.
Speaker 1: Showing the sun. So anyway, of course, a chap point
Speaker 1: Is cartel were also making enemies, right, for instance, with
Speaker 1: the other Mexican cartels. In the spring of nineteen ninety three,
Speaker 1: and Chapel pulled up to the Wada La Airport in
Speaker 1: a white Mercury Grand Marquee. As his driver parked the car,
Speaker 1: a group of men rushed forward and blasted the car
Speaker 1: with a hill of bullets. Right normal shit in Mexican.
Speaker 1: Dirk cartels, right, But El Chapel ran for the terminal,
Speaker 1: dodging the gunfire with his bodyguards. He climbed onto the
Speaker 1: baggage carousel and dove thlew the opening into the back
Speaker 1: of the airport. Now, the sad as part of these
Speaker 1: cartel wars are all the innocent people that are killed
Speaker 1: and effected by it, right, Like, literally, no one nowhere
Speaker 1: was safe during this time. Right. But once they were
Speaker 1: thought to be on the other side, a Chapoint his
Speaker 1: souldiers ran across the runway and into the forest behind.
Speaker 1: It was an escape of swords. But at Chapel wasn't
Speaker 1: the only one who arrived at the airport in a
Speaker 1: white mercury. The other one was the archbishop of the
Speaker 1: Catholic Church in Mexico, Cardinal Ocampo, who by all accounts
Speaker 1: was a really sweet man. And the assassin said hit
Speaker 1: his car as well because of the confusion, and the
Speaker 1: Cardinal had been shot and killed in broad daylight. I
Speaker 1: didn't know this, but anyway, at first the murder was
Speaker 1: spinned on the chapel, but the shooters were hitmen in
Speaker 1: from the Tijuana cartel. Apparently, a Chapel was devastated by
Speaker 1: the cardinal's death. As we you know already, he's a
Speaker 1: religious he's got a church, he's got a church. And
Speaker 1: he blamed the Tijuana cartel double right, first for the
Speaker 1: hit itself and second for letting him take the blame
Speaker 1: for the Cardinal Ocampo's murder. Now, regardless of the blame game,
Speaker 1: a cardinal had still been killed, and this put a
Speaker 1: Chapel in the international crosshairs.
Speaker 2: International crosshairs. What do you mean? Like that means like
Speaker 2: Italy called and was like, you killed one of us.
Speaker 2: He's done.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Italy was a was a mechanic from the
Speaker 1: pre hold, New Jersey. But yeah, exactly. So cardinals are
Speaker 1: like one step down from the pope. So anytime one
Speaker 1: of them dies, it's a huge deal. And even more
Speaker 1: if it was a murder, Chapel now had the attention
Speaker 1: of the world, right, and now he also had the
Speaker 1: attention of the Mexican government.
Speaker 2: This is nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 1: Nineteen eighty five, yeah, okay, okay, the year I was born.
Speaker 1: Where ye wear were you were born?
Speaker 2: Eighty six babies?
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm old man than you.
Speaker 2: Is he still alive, by the way, yes, okay, good, good, good.
Speaker 1: But so so feel good. So as a fence closed in,
Speaker 1: Chapel decided he would rather try to slip away from
Speaker 1: the scrap than try and deal with the authorities. So
Speaker 1: to get out from the limelight, hwalking and his girlfriend
Speaker 1: decided to take a trip to Guatemala. Why the fuck
Speaker 1: was he in Watemala?
Speaker 2: Get out of Guatemala, Get on.
Speaker 1: Actually Chapel was apparently trying to drive to Elsa to
Speaker 1: try to start a business connection.
Speaker 2: There, but you know he was he ended up in Guatemala.
Speaker 1: He was driving through Watemala because it was just on
Speaker 1: the way, and he was like, actually, this is kind
Speaker 1: of nice. And I don't blame him because the waterm
Speaker 1: that's the shit.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I've actually been seeing more of Guatemala on
Speaker 2: your trips. I'm like, I'm online stalking you and I'm like,
Speaker 2: what is he doing it? And that's right, guatemalaks gorgeous.
Speaker 1: The whole point in my career is to take tourism
Speaker 1: away from Costa Rica. That's all. There is one big
Speaker 1: long play from the Watermelon Tourism Board to just make
Speaker 1: sure that I get more than one person there a year.
Speaker 1: I'm going I'll give you all the good spot I
Speaker 1: got something that will take care of you. It's our
Speaker 1: producer from a film nation.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 1: We got you, Kevi. Don't worry, don't worry.
Speaker 2: Thanks guys.
Speaker 1: So, to make sure that this trip was totally under
Speaker 1: the radar, and Chapel paid a Wanmalan military official one
Speaker 1: point two million dollars to allow him to hide south
Speaker 1: of the Mexican border. Yeah, so the guy took the money,
Speaker 1: but he would also passed on the information about El Chapels.
Speaker 1: Whereabout the law force? The fuck them both. But also,
Speaker 1: you can't trust the guy who's already corrupt, buddy boy. Right.
Speaker 1: In June nineteen ninety three, when Chapel was on his
Speaker 1: way back from he set up a meeting with a
Speaker 1: watermelon cut But when he showed up for his meeting
Speaker 1: at hotel near Tapachula instead of this guy, he was
Speaker 1: actually greeted by the watermelon army. Yes, they loaded him
Speaker 1: into what No, are you on his side?
Speaker 2: I get scared?
Speaker 1: Who saw you on?
Speaker 2: I don't like authority? Okay, well, not that I'm not
Speaker 2: on the Chapel side, but I gotta say I'm not
Speaker 2: on the fucking military side either.
Speaker 1: Okay, fair enough, fair enough, So They loaded him on
Speaker 1: a military plane and flew him back to Mexico. But
Speaker 1: on the ride, Chapel was interrogated and he confessed to
Speaker 1: a ton of crimes. Apparently he could still only talk
Speaker 1: about one thing. Like everybody's like, you need to tell
Speaker 1: us all about this. No, no, no, no way, wait till
Speaker 1: you hear this one. So when he landed, a Chapel
Speaker 1: was taken to Federal Social Readaptation Center number one, a
Speaker 1: maximum security prison in Alas. It needs a new fucking name.
Speaker 1: That's too long, I'll tell you what. Not very catchy,
Speaker 1: is it?
Speaker 2: No? It snow Alcatraz.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it needs a name like El Spot or whatever
Speaker 1: the fuck you know. So the Chapel was sending to
Speaker 1: twenty years and he was transferred to a different maximum
Speaker 1: security person in Halley School, Federal Social Readaptation Center number two. So, uh,
Speaker 1: this one, this, this one went by a much catcher name.
Speaker 1: Apparently it was called Puente. Oh it was a big bridge,
Speaker 1: good for you guys. But by putting a Chapel in
Speaker 1: a cell that wasn't gonna be enough to shut that down.
Speaker 1: Why does it suddenly turn into an a SMR session? Now?
Speaker 1: While he was in prison, at Chapel's drug empire, and
Speaker 1: the cartel continued to operate unabated. His brother was known
Speaker 1: as the chicken Stock. Yeah, I started got it wasn't
Speaker 1: the most fierce emine. I feel like everyone in want
Speaker 1: of moll In Center America had a nickname too. Mine
Speaker 1: was it Poopies, by the.
Speaker 2: Way, you just like pooped your pants.
Speaker 1: Well that no, because I was a pupilio by the way,
Speaker 1: because my friends are. When I was thirteen, I met
Speaker 1: the high schoo kids. They were older, and they taught
Speaker 1: me all my fucked up ways, Like they taught me
Speaker 1: how to smoke cigarettes and like, and I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm thirteen be doing this, but I.
Speaker 2: Want to, but you were like really cool. So they're
Speaker 2: like Poopies.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they called me, oh man, that's like our little mascot.
Speaker 1: That's like our little paddaw on the Poopies. But the
Speaker 1: problem with that nickname is that everybody assumes immediately like
Speaker 1: just to shat myself.
Speaker 2: You know, uncontrollably all the time.
Speaker 1: It didn't come on until later on in life. And
Speaker 1: that's how I got this podcast. Anyway. So during his
Speaker 1: time in the Clink, and Chapel even met his longtime
Speaker 1: mistress former police officer a name Sulima. She was serving
Speaker 1: time for arm robbery.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, fucking yeah, Hey, hey jinks, hey jings, buddy boy.
Speaker 1: Apparently Chapel spotted her during a family visitation time and
Speaker 1: started sending her flowers, love letters, and even a bottle
Speaker 1: of whiskey that the guards brought to her. Oh my god.
Speaker 1: They say romance is dead, you guys, But no, not
Speaker 1: for a family visitation means that his family aka his wife,
Speaker 1: was fucking visiting him and he's like, who's that over there?
Speaker 1: He seems like trouble. But while Chapel was carrying on
Speaker 1: with his prison romance, he was indicted in San Diego
Speaker 1: on US charges of money laundering and importing tons of
Speaker 1: cocaine into California. At first, he seemed fine to a Chapel.
Speaker 1: You know, he was in Mexico and not the US.
Speaker 1: He was already in prison, so what can they do
Speaker 1: to him? But then the Supreme Court in Mexico handed
Speaker 1: down a ruling that made extradition between Mexico and the
Speaker 1: United States much easier.
Speaker 2: So the United States basically brought him.
Speaker 1: By fucking accent, So they brought him, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: not yet no, but a ruling from the Supreme Court
Speaker 1: made it easier. Right, So before that it was kind
Speaker 1: of like, you know, you could stall it forever. But
Speaker 1: now it was basically in the works, and the Chapel
Speaker 1: didn't intend to get shipped to the United States, so
Speaker 1: he set a plan into motion.
Speaker 2: Wait a minute, so he got extradited to the United States.
Speaker 1: Yet, but the threat was imminent, right, and suddenly became
Speaker 1: a real possibility. So he started the plan to get
Speaker 1: the fuck out of prison, which brings us to the
Speaker 1: year two thousand and one and the escape the first
Speaker 1: and made El Chapel famous as an escape artist. Or
Speaker 1: in other words, we're finally back till laundry day, Diana,
Speaker 1: Are you ready for this? Yes, that's rock and roll.
Speaker 1: So the plan starts with a prison guard nicknamed El
Speaker 1: Chito or the silent one. All right, so he was
Speaker 1: the one in charge of the prison laundry. So when
Speaker 1: laundry day came it, Chito was a man who hit
Speaker 1: the switch that opened Il Chapel cell door. Once a
Speaker 1: Chapel cell door was opened, Ichito rolled the laundry cart
Speaker 1: inside El Chapel, popped in. Come on you little munchkin
Speaker 1: nestling down into the dirty clothes. I've never been tempted
Speaker 1: to jump into a pile of dirty clothes, but clean clothes. Fuck, yeah, man,
Speaker 1: I get the impulse.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah for sure.
Speaker 1: Okay. From there on, the route was simple but strewn
Speaker 1: with obstacles, and Chito would have to roll the laundry
Speaker 1: cart through multiple security checkpoints where a guard could look
Speaker 1: down through the glass and see who was waiting at
Speaker 1: the door. But of course it Chito was a familiar
Speaker 1: figure doing a familiar job, so the guards let him
Speaker 1: pass through the doors one by one, pushing the cart
Speaker 1: the way he always did. At one point, as the
Speaker 1: story goes, and Chito stopped to talk to one of
Speaker 1: the guards and he let go of the cart and
Speaker 1: it started to roll away, And he should have known
Speaker 1: something was up because the cart started going w so
Speaker 1: e Chito had to jump forward and grab it, but
Speaker 1: eventually he pushed the cart right out the front door.
Speaker 1: Whoa As a maximum security prison, the JLISKO facility was
Speaker 1: supposedly equipped with heat sensors and surveillance camera, all kinds
Speaker 1: of locked doors and other stuff that should have caught
Speaker 1: a chapel on his way out, but he slipped past
Speaker 1: all of them undetected. As a Chito rolled the cart
Speaker 1: through the electronic doors. One by one, the sensors that
Speaker 1: should have detected Chapel never went off. Wow, he left
Speaker 1: without trace all. The most one thing he did leave
Speaker 1: was a love note for Suleima. Oh my gosh, I
Speaker 1: say goodbye, sending all my greatest sentiments that the man
Speaker 1: can feel for a woman that he loves loves. And
Speaker 1: she was like, you left me, You fucking left me,
Speaker 1: your fucking bastard. Soon there may be an excellent surprise surprise.
Speaker 1: I love you, signed J g L.
Speaker 2: Goose you say j g L, also known as with
Speaker 2: the actor's name j g L.
Speaker 1: Joseph Gordon love it.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, dude, he's L Chappo. I knew it.
Speaker 1: You are the fucking Chappo. I knew it. His career
Speaker 1: started around the same time that fucking escape happened. That's wild,
Speaker 1: that's right. And remember though his handwriting was so terrible,
Speaker 1: right and chappos so she probably didn't know what the
Speaker 1: fuck he was saying. It was just like, I don't
Speaker 1: like this is just a bunch of scratches.
Speaker 2: Was he like, I'll be back for you.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, he was just like he was
Speaker 1: just like, it's been fun, see you later. Hey, let
Speaker 1: me ask you something. Has ever has anyone ever made
Speaker 1: a love gesture to you that was like that really
Speaker 1: turned you off because it was so grading?
Speaker 2: Yes, names okay, so let me tell you something. It
Speaker 2: was I was dating this guy and like I went
Speaker 2: over his house. He like made dinner. It was like
Speaker 2: really nice, and then you know we're we're like kind
Speaker 2: of like laying on his bed and I like look
Speaker 2: over and on his nightstand is a picture of me
Speaker 2: with my prom date. It was a picture of me
Speaker 2: and my prom date, like a prom picture of me.
Speaker 2: He had it framed, and I was like, what.
Speaker 1: Do you He didn't go to high school with you? No,
Speaker 1: from your Facebook or whatever.
Speaker 2: I don't know where he got it from, but yeah,
Speaker 2: he took a picture of me with another guy and
Speaker 2: it was on his nightstand and I thought, I was like,
Speaker 2: what is this?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's so fucking creepy.
Speaker 2: It was so creepy.
Speaker 1: But you're still together to this date, which is always happened.
Speaker 1: Now we're it and now we're check it out.
Speaker 2: No, and then check it out. His ex girlfriend came later.
Speaker 1: That day to could like to start to start some
Speaker 1: ruckus at the apartment to.
Speaker 2: Start some ship ready, and this kid sticks me in
Speaker 2: the closet. Dude, I felt very unsafe, very you know.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I'm so sorry that happened to you.
Speaker 1: So my biggest turn off is when I when I
Speaker 1: was when I was single, and I would go to
Speaker 1: a girls house and she didn't have fucking pictures of
Speaker 1: me and my promp printed on her fucking night side.
Speaker 1: I'm like, how do you do? You not give a
Speaker 1: fuck about me? Done? Done? You're done to me, kidd.
Speaker 1: So back to the Chapo. So once his tender Little
Speaker 1: Love No. Was delivered, he was on his way. Once
Speaker 1: he was outside at Tapao, jumped from the laundry into
Speaker 1: a trunk of a car that was waiting for them,
Speaker 1: and Chito jumped into the driver's seat and chauffeured them
Speaker 1: out of town. Now, one story says that Chapel was
Speaker 1: dressed as a prison guard by the time they got outside.
Speaker 1: That sounds a little too much to be honest. When
Speaker 1: I Chito had to stop the getaway car for gas,
Speaker 1: he pulled over at a station and he went inside
Speaker 1: to pay and he went back out and chapel was gone.
Speaker 1: What yeah, man, you got left at the author by
Speaker 1: because you're a fucking dumbass. Maybe you should have shouted
Speaker 1: after him, but you're too quiet because we took out
Speaker 1: on he had taken off into the night on foot
Speaker 1: apparently damn So police launched in nationwide search the warden
Speaker 1: and over seventy prison workers were detained and question this
Speaker 1: potential accomplices, I mean, of course, like what the fuck? Man?
Speaker 1: Of course, regardless when all the bribes on record were
Speaker 1: taled up. The escape supposedly cost a chapel two point
Speaker 1: five million dollars. Like that's a lot of money, I guess,
Speaker 1: but like not doing chapel right now, Like it's a
Speaker 1: fucking dropping a bucket. And besides, he went on to
Speaker 1: have a successful Hollywood career and eventually do a show
Speaker 1: with me as Joseph Goordon Levitt, so at all it
Speaker 1: was worth it. In addition to the prison employee accomplices,
Speaker 1: there's a story that police in Hallis School were paid
Speaker 1: off to ensure that the chapel had at least twenty
Speaker 1: four hours to get out of the state, and say
Speaker 1: ahead of the military manhunt that followed founded a Chapel
Speaker 1: sometimes strolled into restaurants as his body guard confiscated people's
Speaker 1: cell phones, and he would eat his meal and then
Speaker 1: leave after paying everyone's tap. Imagine he's just one of
Speaker 1: those customers at a restaurant, but like, there's nothing anyone
Speaker 1: can do, right, You're like right, You're like, I don't know.
Speaker 1: As long as we're ordering, Can I get the nacho
Speaker 1: cheese please?
Speaker 2: He paid for our job.
Speaker 1: So for more than thirteen years, Mexican security forces coordinating
Speaker 1: many operations to re arrest El Chapel, but their efforts
Speaker 1: were largely in vain. He appeared to be always a
Speaker 1: few steps ahead of his captors, like in his early days,
Speaker 1: when a Chapel moved away from Natuna to fire up
Speaker 1: his business. He wouldn't stay hidden in the boondogs forever.
Speaker 1: But that's another story for another day. That's our story.
Speaker 2: What, oh my gosh, I actually didn't know much about
Speaker 2: a Chapel.
Speaker 1: I didn't know about this. This, I didn't know about
Speaker 1: his first escape. I knew about the second one that
Speaker 1: we'll cover at a later date.
Speaker 2: I never knew. I didn't know he was such a romantic.
Speaker 2: But I should have known because of the whole cape
Speaker 2: they I mean to go down because you were like
Speaker 2: this much in love with someone is.
Speaker 1: Being a hornball listen. So so in order to wrap up,
Speaker 1: wrap up the show, I want Benchuk to play that
Speaker 1: romantic music again. I mean, I'm a terrible singer, but
Speaker 1: you're such a wonderful singer. Maybe we'll like sing back,
Speaker 1: like we'll invent what Sulema's response was to him, and
Speaker 1: we'll just a little back and forth once once, once
Speaker 1: or twice back what do you think?
Speaker 2: Okay, that's soulem Chaito?
Speaker 1: Is that you.
Speaker 2: See?
Speaker 1: Because I have to go meet Okay del Castillo. See
Speaker 1: did you leave.
Speaker 2: A big fat bag for me?
Speaker 1: I have nowhere else to go. Poo poo when I
Speaker 1: was hiding in the laundry. Back, but I love you.
Speaker 1: I will be back, Pito.
Speaker 2: Miquel.
Speaker 1: No, I just have to go make a film career
Speaker 1: and work with Jonathan Nolan, with Chris Nolan.
Speaker 2: But I'm pregnant. I have your child.
Speaker 1: His name is Chuckie. Oh my god, what a fucking
Speaker 1: pleasure to have you come back anytime? Will we come
Speaker 1: back and visit it sometime? Please?
Speaker 2: Absolutely, Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1: Hey, so listeners can find you on the socials, of course,
Speaker 1: but also catch you in the upcoming film The Whistler
Speaker 1: and the final season of Doom Patrol.
Speaker 2: Final season of Doom Patrol.
Speaker 1: Yes, you can catch that in HBO Max.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, HBO Max first season. If you haven't
Speaker 2: watched Ganto and heard me sing.
Speaker 1: I mean, god, you're so good in that. I can't
Speaker 1: I can't believe that. You know what, I was so
Speaker 1: proud of I watch you performing the fucking Oscars, Diane.
Speaker 2: That I was really really nervous. I mean, of course,
Speaker 2: I was just like I don't know, I don't even
Speaker 2: have words for it, but it was a really beautiful
Speaker 2: experience just to like I've watched that show every year,
Speaker 2: it just kind of like made me feel closer to
Speaker 2: the possibility of like ever I just I mean, I
Speaker 2: was just kind of like, I can't believe that I'm
Speaker 2: in a film that is being recognized, and not only that,
Speaker 2: but a film that has that has such close ties
Speaker 2: to my my family and my culture and my country.
Speaker 2: And so it was really.
Speaker 1: Latino joy and to Latino that that it's not about
Speaker 1: the tragedy of being Latin.
Speaker 2: But ABI ex actually I'm just like, yeah, I'm like,
Speaker 2: I'm like happy. You know, it was, it was a
Speaker 2: beautiful experience. It was.
Speaker 1: It was wonderful to see you there. Thank you, Thank
Speaker 1: you so much for being here. This is great as
Speaker 1: Escapes guys, and until next time, make sure to not
Speaker 1: leave a love letter behind.
Speaker 3: Goodbye, everybody.
Speaker 1: Grace Escapes is a production IF I Heard Radio and
Speaker 1: Film Nation Entertainment in association with Gilded Audio. Our executive
Speaker 1: producers are me are Turo Castro, Alyssa Martino and Milan
Speaker 1: Papelka from Film Nation Entertainment, Andrew Chug and Witning Donaldson
Speaker 1: from Gilded Audio, and Dylan Fagan from iHeartRadio. The show
Speaker 1: is produced and edited by Carl Nellis and Ben Chubb,
Speaker 1: who are also, respectively, our research overlord and music overlord.
Speaker 1: Our associate producer is Tory Smith, who's our other overlord.
Speaker 1: Nick Dooley is our technical director. Additional editing by Whitney Donaldson.
Speaker 1: Special thanks to Alison Cohen, Dan Welsh, Ben Riizek, Sarah Joyner,
Speaker 1: nicki Stein, Olivia Canny and Kelsey Albright. Hey, thank you
Speaker 1: so much for listening, and if you're enjoying the show,
Speaker 1: please drop a rating or review. My mom will call
Speaker 1: you each personally and thank you, and we'll see you
Speaker 1: all next week.