WEBVTT - DAVID YARROW: EVERY PICTURE HAS A STORY 0:00:01.639 --> 0:00:05.199 Snapping pictures. We do a lot of that, pictures of everything. 0:00:05.480 --> 0:00:08.479 The world is awash in images. My cloud is crowded 0:00:08.480 --> 0:00:11.760 like yours. Probably some of the pictures were really proud of. 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:15.800 Most we forget about or delete. I've taken a thousand sunsets, 0:00:15.840 --> 0:00:19.040 maybe five thousands of animals in Africa. I've been a 0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:21.520 photo of hobbyist since the days of film. I got 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:25.440 dozens of little plastic boxes filled with snapshots sitting in storage. 0:00:26.320 --> 0:00:28.960 But I've always had a real passion for what true 0:00:29.080 --> 0:00:32.600 artists can capture through a lens. Like my friend and guest, 0:00:32.720 --> 0:00:40.360 world renowned fine art photographer David Yarrow. His work is spectacular, intimate, immersive, visceral, 0:00:40.560 --> 0:00:45.400 whether he's capturing wildlife, landscapes, or humans. Tom Brady is 0:00:45.440 --> 0:00:48.479 a huge Yarrow fan. He wrote the foreword to David's 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:52.440 book of Breathtaking Pictures. Brady says David's work makes him 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:57.240 feel awe, humility, reverence for how beautiful the world is. 0:00:58.400 --> 0:01:01.800 David is a gifted storyteller through his art, but he's 0:01:01.840 --> 0:01:05.080 also a great storyteller about how the pictures were created. 0:01:05.520 --> 0:01:07.280 So I've got an idea to help you enjoy the 0:01:07.280 --> 0:01:11.960 conversation even more. Go to David Yarrow dot photography A 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:15.920 spells It Why a r r ow. You can use 0:01:15.959 --> 0:01:18.959 your phone or ideally a bigger screen and you'll be 0:01:19.000 --> 0:01:22.119 blown away by the quality and breadth of his work. 0:01:22.360 --> 0:01:24.360 And David's going to share stories about how some of 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:26.600 his best pictures were made. They're all on the site 0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:31.160 and you can search titles like Dexter of a Hippo, Hello, 0:01:31.360 --> 0:01:36.800 a polar Bear, Shot, the Killers, and others. David also 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:39.760 tells stories about working with Russell Wilson and cr in 0:01:39.800 --> 0:01:43.559 a wild West setting, Cindy Crawford, recreating an iconic Super 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:46.720 Bowl commercial, and paying tribute to classic scenes in The 0:01:46.760 --> 0:01:49.120 Wolf of Wall Street and You're the end of the 0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:53.160 episode as a story about a man, the sea and 0:01:53.240 --> 0:01:56.800 an orca that takes the most surprising turn of any 0:01:56.840 --> 0:02:00.400 story ever told on this podcast. We out of our 0:02:00.440 --> 0:02:04.640 conversation where David started in sports photography as a twenty 0:02:04.720 --> 0:02:06.880 year old straight out of Scotland. He took one of 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:10.720 the most powerful pictures of sports celebration ever, one that 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:15.400 launched his career, Diego Maradonna raising the World Cup trophy 0:02:15.400 --> 0:02:19.720 in Mexico City. Six. Yeah, I mean I looked back. 0:02:19.919 --> 0:02:24.880 I never thought then that um My Guinness, fifty five 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:29.240 years on from there, I'd be having this conversation about it. 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:34.000 Um I hadn't taken many good pictures in the World Cup. 0:02:34.000 --> 0:02:37.200 I was too young. I hadn't had enough experience. It 0:02:37.240 --> 0:02:40.079 was the days when cameras didn't have ato focus. He 0:02:40.120 --> 0:02:43.280 had followed focus and I was just a bit green. 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:48.320 But raw couldn't cope with the high sun, which I loved. 0:02:48.360 --> 0:02:51.400 The games were at twelve o'clock Mexican time or three o'clock, 0:02:52.400 --> 0:02:54.519 but I got lucky at the final whist, so I 0:02:55.040 --> 0:02:57.000 thought the only way I was going to get a 0:02:57.000 --> 0:02:59.520 picture was to leave all my other cameras behind the 0:02:59.560 --> 0:03:02.560 goal and just go with a very small, wide angle. 0:03:03.040 --> 0:03:05.800 I was slimmer, fitter that I am now, and I 0:03:05.800 --> 0:03:09.080 could get very close to Maridonna, and just at the 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:12.560 key moment he looked right at me. He was on 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:17.360 the shoulders of another player. Tons of argentineans on the pitch. 0:03:17.440 --> 0:03:20.720 It was total chaos. You'll never have something like that 0:03:20.800 --> 0:03:24.079 again after any six because fans won't be allowed onto 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:27.200 the pitch. It's a bit like in the Gulf. You 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:29.760 remember when they finished an open when the players went 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:32.160 through the played their second shot to the eighteenth. There 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:35.520 was a massive charge of spectators, and then the winning 0:03:35.520 --> 0:03:39.120 player would make his way rather biblically through the first 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:42.160 row of the crowd. And I think that still goes 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:44.320 on a little bit, but it's more orderly than it 0:03:44.400 --> 0:03:48.800 used to be. This was total disorder, chaos, and I 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:51.720 just got lucky. But I was in the position to 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:54.520 take the picture, and I had the right lens, which 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:56.600 was a wide angle, I think a thirty five mill 0:03:57.040 --> 0:03:59.720 so I had the contextual narrative of the stadium behind 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:03.880 and Maradonna. Um, if it was just Maradonna in the Cup, 0:04:04.240 --> 0:04:07.120 there wouldn't be a picture. If it was just the stadium, 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:10.600 the biggest stadium in the world, I think then without Maredonna, 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:13.520 there wouldn't be a picture. It's the coalescing of those 0:04:13.560 --> 0:04:16.120 two variables, the two layers put it together, and the 0:04:16.120 --> 0:04:18.320 fact that he was looking right at here. You said biblical, 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:21.359 that's a perfect description. He's standing there, arms raised like 0:04:21.400 --> 0:04:24.280 a god, the World Cup trophies in one hand, just 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:27.359 at the same level as I think the flags that 0:04:27.360 --> 0:04:29.159 are ringing the top of the stadium, and it's just 0:04:29.560 --> 0:04:32.560 it's a composition. You couldn't have have stage any better 0:04:32.600 --> 0:04:36.000 than that. And yeah, above this massive humanity, there's his 0:04:36.080 --> 0:04:38.680 face and your lens and it's directly in front. And 0:04:38.720 --> 0:04:41.160 I would encourage people to seek that out because now 0:04:41.200 --> 0:04:44.200 that he's passed um, his legend has only grown. But 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:46.359 to have that moment a pinnacle of one of the 0:04:46.400 --> 0:04:49.120 great soccer careers ever and be able to capture that 0:04:49.400 --> 0:04:52.200 and you're right. Decades later, people still refer to that picture. 0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:56.000 I was on a plane the other day before COVID 0:04:56.440 --> 0:04:59.279 and in the Maradonna movie they use that picture and 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:01.080 I had no idea here that they used it in 0:05:01.120 --> 0:05:03.840 the movie. And I was I get more emotional on 0:05:03.960 --> 0:05:06.000 planes and I do on land like a lot of people. 0:05:06.680 --> 0:05:08.880 And I started to get a little bit emotional scene 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:11.320 my picture. So I have no one to tell. And 0:05:11.360 --> 0:05:14.120 I called the stewardess over with the bustom and she 0:05:14.200 --> 0:05:15.960 thought I wanted a whiskey or whatever, and I was 0:05:15.960 --> 0:05:19.919 getting that's my picture, and there's a lunatic and see 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:23.040 B sixty one or whatever, and you're allowed to brag, 0:05:23.080 --> 0:05:27.360 that's beautiful. One other sports photograph that is very different 0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:33.400 from the chaos and the confusion of Azteca two. The 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:36.560 Gentility of a porch at Augusta National. Gary Player was 0:05:36.560 --> 0:05:39.479 a dear friend of yours. There's a photograph with Arnold Palmer, 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:44.040 Jack Nicholas and Gary Player in their Master's Champion green 0:05:44.120 --> 0:05:47.120 jackets on this very elegant looking porch and I think 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:50.240 they're in rocking chairs maybe, And and that was pretty 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:53.000 close to the time when Arnold Palmer passed. It is 0:05:53.040 --> 0:05:56.440 one of the last pictures captured of him. So what 0:05:56.520 --> 0:05:59.800 an incredible moment that must have been. It was. I'm 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:04.240 not prone to nerves. I've been very fortunate to me 0:06:04.360 --> 0:06:07.120 to let you a lot of extraordinary people in my 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:10.960 life and and through my art sit down and have 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:14.200 conversations with people that I would never expect it. And 0:06:14.240 --> 0:06:16.120 I think that was one of the few occasions that 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:19.120 I've been a little bit nervous because you had the 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:23.120 kind of Mount Rushmore of golf, you know, that area 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:27.480 of Augusta behind the eighteen well, and there must have 0:06:27.520 --> 0:06:31.400 been five people watching me take the picture. Um, but 0:06:31.520 --> 0:06:34.240 typical of Gary, he only told me about forty five 0:06:34.279 --> 0:06:37.800 minutes beforehand that I was going to be taking the picture, 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:40.040 and I had the wrong lens and I had no 0:06:40.160 --> 0:06:43.520 time to go and change my lens, so I couldn't 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:46.800 get them to move backwards. You can't tell Arnold Palmer 0:06:47.040 --> 0:06:49.839 to move his seat back. So I was stepping further 0:06:49.880 --> 0:06:52.520 and further back, and then I fell into the hedge, 0:06:53.240 --> 0:06:57.080 and because I didn't see what was behind me. And 0:06:58.320 --> 0:07:01.040 I think it's fair to say that, and I mean 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:04.640 this with the hugest amount of respect to Jack Nicholas, 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:07.560 but he's had his picture taken enough and I can't 0:07:07.600 --> 0:07:11.400 understand why another picture by another photographer might know fill 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:13.920 in with the joys of spring. But that's why he's 0:07:13.920 --> 0:07:16.320 that's why he's smiling. It's because he's just seen me 0:07:16.360 --> 0:07:19.840 fall into the back of the hadge, because whatever it 0:07:19.880 --> 0:07:21.280 takes me. But if you have to take a prat 0:07:21.320 --> 0:07:24.280 fall to get your subject to loosen up. What's amazing 0:07:24.280 --> 0:07:25.800 about that picture, and it's true of a lot of 0:07:25.800 --> 0:07:29.840 your work, is that there's such intimacy in that image, 0:07:29.880 --> 0:07:32.240 even if it's hastily taken in less than ideal lends. 0:07:32.440 --> 0:07:36.040 There's such an intimate connection to the subject. And yet 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:38.920 you'd never know there were five hundred people breathing down 0:07:38.920 --> 0:07:41.440 your neck as you took it, And and That's what's 0:07:42.240 --> 0:07:44.360 so remarkable about a lot of your great images that 0:07:44.400 --> 0:07:47.400 will get into the wildlife is just the intimacy that 0:07:47.400 --> 0:07:53.040 that absolute visceral connection between the person looking at it 0:07:53.080 --> 0:07:57.400 and the subject. Yeah, I mean you're kind to say that. 0:07:57.880 --> 0:08:02.800 If if someone asked me who is my favorite film director, 0:08:04.160 --> 0:08:07.760 was it's quite easy in the Spielberg And then there'll 0:08:07.800 --> 0:08:10.920 be so many others would come after Spielberg. And why 0:08:11.080 --> 0:08:15.440 because he's the most emotionally invested film director, um, And 0:08:15.520 --> 0:08:17.880 there's a lot of others that are very emotionally invested. 0:08:18.840 --> 0:08:22.520 Photography is all about emotion, and in order to elicit 0:08:22.520 --> 0:08:25.320 emotion in others, I think you have to have a 0:08:25.400 --> 0:08:30.320 degree of immersion um and that tends to often come 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:36.720 from proximity. It's quite difficult to make people emotional about 0:08:36.800 --> 0:08:41.720 things if the distance between the camera and the subject 0:08:41.760 --> 0:08:46.080 matter is a long way. There are there are the 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:49.600 examples that disproved that rule. When when Jack Nicholas himself, 0:08:50.520 --> 0:08:52.920 You'll remember when when he won his last Masters and 0:08:52.920 --> 0:08:56.000 he sunk that big part at seventeen and he raised 0:08:56.120 --> 0:08:59.320 his putter and his head wearing the yellow shirt. That's 0:08:59.360 --> 0:09:02.240 quite an emotion shoot picture. And I know if you 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:03.800 the you know a few of the people that got 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:07.760 that picture. Um, but I was taking with a long lens. 0:09:08.080 --> 0:09:12.840 It's quite difficult generally when you're far away to to 0:09:12.920 --> 0:09:15.440 be able to convey that. And that's why I don't 0:09:15.440 --> 0:09:18.760 tend to work with low lens is too much. Yeah, 0:09:18.920 --> 0:09:21.840 I could geek out on the photography aspect of this 0:09:21.880 --> 0:09:24.920 because I'm a hack hobbyist, but I do love it. 0:09:25.120 --> 0:09:28.000 I will indulge myself on that and and and risk 0:09:28.240 --> 0:09:30.480 losing the attention of other people. But that is the 0:09:30.480 --> 0:09:34.440 problem when you when you shoot pictures of dangerous, large 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:37.760 wild animals, it's tough to get close. And we do 0:09:37.880 --> 0:09:40.240 tend to take the pictures from far away, and that's 0:09:40.240 --> 0:09:43.520 what sets apart the shots you take on vacation versus 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:45.760 the beautiful ones that sell for a lot of money 0:09:46.000 --> 0:09:48.480 that you take. But yeah, we'll get into some of 0:09:48.520 --> 0:09:52.080 the stories because to get close, to get low, to 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:56.160 get eye level, to get access not only takes a 0:09:56.160 --> 0:09:58.240 hell of a lot of preparation and planning and money. 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:00.120 In some cases, it takes a lot of balls to 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:02.360 put yourself in a harm's way, in your cameras in 0:10:02.360 --> 0:10:06.760 a harm's way to do it yeah. I mean, I've 0:10:06.760 --> 0:10:10.920 been doing it a long time, and what I do 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:15.360 know is that it's become harder now to do some 0:10:15.400 --> 0:10:17.160 of the things that I've done over the last six 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:20.560 or seven years. Not because I was in any way 0:10:21.080 --> 0:10:24.800 doing things that are unethical, but the whole issue of 0:10:24.960 --> 0:10:31.439 invading animal space and there their way of life is 0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:34.200 an issue that's being brought up in the very same 0:10:34.200 --> 0:10:36.040 way that so many issues we never thought about three 0:10:36.120 --> 0:10:40.040 or four years ago are being brought up. Um and 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:44.880 um I am. I've got mixed feelings about it. I 0:10:44.880 --> 0:10:47.680 think it's gonna be tougher for other people going forward 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:52.280 to use remote controls in case the animal steps on 0:10:52.320 --> 0:10:54.679 the remote control. Forget about the camera, what happens if 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:57.640 it hurts its foot, What happens if an animal charges 0:10:57.679 --> 0:10:59.920 a jeep. Don't worry about the people in the jeep, 0:11:00.240 --> 0:11:03.560 but if the animal does damage to himself by charging 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:09.559 the GM um. So I'm very conscious, increasingly conscious these days, 0:11:10.200 --> 0:11:14.280 of setting a standard, and I guess I'm there to 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:19.880 be shot at metaphorically because people rightly or wrongly see 0:11:20.320 --> 0:11:24.480 what our brand and maybe maybe I'm there to set 0:11:24.800 --> 0:11:29.440 set standards. Um. But if you work with the right 0:11:29.480 --> 0:11:33.239 people on the ground, and we do tend to um. 0:11:33.280 --> 0:11:36.320 You can get close legally, you can get on the ground. 0:11:36.520 --> 0:11:40.120 It's all about homework and and if you work with 0:11:40.160 --> 0:11:43.560 the right people, everything is possible. I in in in 0:11:43.679 --> 0:11:48.800 fifteen years. All my dangerous moments, Chris, have always been 0:11:48.840 --> 0:11:53.760 with people, never with animals. The moments I've felt for 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:57.760 my life have always been with people, because people can 0:11:57.800 --> 0:12:01.120 do three things that animals can't do. They can get drunk, 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:04.240 they can get high, and they can buy a gun. 0:12:05.160 --> 0:12:07.719 And it's the best of my knowledge, animals can't do 0:12:08.120 --> 0:12:11.120 any of those three things. So when people ask me 0:12:11.240 --> 0:12:14.160 you're you, You've you've been cavalier, You've you've put you 0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:17.040 put yourself in harm's way. I can't think of an 0:12:17.040 --> 0:12:21.360 occasion with an animal um I've had. I've had bears 0:12:21.640 --> 0:12:25.080 standing over me in Alaska in the summer, but they've 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:29.640 eaten salmon over the last twenty four hours. They're not 0:12:29.679 --> 0:12:33.959 in the least bit interested in me. UM. But if 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:37.400 you had that same situation before that, before the salmon run, 0:12:38.040 --> 0:12:41.040 you'd be in a different maybe a different dynamic. So 0:12:41.160 --> 0:12:43.760 just go during the salmon run. For sure, you have 0:12:43.840 --> 0:12:45.760 to have the knowledge you have to have local experts. 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:48.120 You have to have the ability to figure out when 0:12:48.120 --> 0:12:50.319 an animal is the most dangerous and not dangerous. I 0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:52.120 don't know, I might take issue with that. Have you 0:12:52.200 --> 0:12:54.840 seen some of your videos. Um, You're in a tiny, 0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:57.640 shitty little canoe in this Embasie River, which is a 0:12:57.640 --> 0:12:59.840 beautiful river to raft in, but it was also filled 0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:03.000 with crocks and hippos, and you're going after Dexter the hippo, 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:07.000 and it's very difficult to shoot hippos. They're kind of shy, 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:10.760 their their ornery. They're these big, dark animals that spend 0:13:10.760 --> 0:13:16.400 most of the time underwater, and canoeing around hippo laden 0:13:16.480 --> 0:13:19.560 waters seems pretty damn dangerous to me. He ended up 0:13:19.559 --> 0:13:22.680 getting this amazing shot by laying on the bank and 0:13:22.720 --> 0:13:25.600 getting kind of an eye level shot as he takes 0:13:25.640 --> 0:13:28.840 his big giant head out of the water, but it 0:13:28.880 --> 0:13:32.960 seemed a little dicey to get. I have to confess 0:13:33.800 --> 0:13:37.520 the animal that scares me the most is the hippo. Um. 0:13:37.640 --> 0:13:42.160 I am petrified of hippo's So I got charged a 0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:45.200 few times in Tanzania, and they can't run quicker than you, 0:13:45.679 --> 0:13:48.160 and I think they do kill more people than any 0:13:48.160 --> 0:13:53.320 other animal in Africa. Um, but Dexter, he doesn't know 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:56.280 he's called Dexter. But Dexter is a bit of a bluffer. 0:13:56.760 --> 0:13:59.760 He gives you a couple of chances. And it's like 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:02.960 if you know, if you're playing poker with Dexter, you 0:14:03.040 --> 0:14:05.040 know what cards he's got in his hand to begin with. 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:06.920 How do you know what's in the mind of a hip. 0:14:06.920 --> 0:14:08.960 I mean, yes, you're with the guy that is familiar 0:14:09.000 --> 0:14:12.040 with him. But ultimately, humans we always think we can 0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:14.120 read this animal, we know how he's going to behave 0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:16.280 because we we have an acquaintance with him. I mean, 0:14:16.640 --> 0:14:19.000 and that's you're playing their percentages, right. I mean, ultimately 0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:22.040 you don't know what a particular lion or tiger or 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.680 hippo is going to do when you get pretty damn 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:28.480 close to him. Trust isn't It is such a short word, 0:14:29.080 --> 0:14:32.520 but trust is the foundation on which I've built so 0:14:32.560 --> 0:14:35.960 many of our assignment. Trust in humans or animals are both. 0:14:37.240 --> 0:14:42.000 You're trusting the human that in his understanding of the 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:46.120 animal in question, and we I could get I could 0:14:46.120 --> 0:14:49.520 cite so many examples, Polar bears up in Alaska, where 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:52.480 the Innuit would say, don't worry about this one. I 0:14:52.520 --> 0:14:55.280 know his parents, you know, and you're going, really, do 0:14:55.400 --> 0:14:58.360 you really know this Polar bears parents? Is he really 0:14:58.400 --> 0:15:00.840 not going to go for me? Well, there's a shot 0:15:00.840 --> 0:15:02.680 you took. I mean, people can go find this shot 0:15:02.760 --> 0:15:06.280 on your website where it looks like you are nose 0:15:06.400 --> 0:15:08.560 to nose with the polar bear. It looks like he 0:15:08.640 --> 0:15:10.320 is so close. I know that's not that's not a 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:12.960 long lens and his nose is right in the camera. 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:15.880 That was a picture called hello. We managed to call 0:15:15.920 --> 0:15:19.120 it hello just before Adele called her song Hello. So 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:22.120 it shows how long ago this picture was taken. But 0:15:22.440 --> 0:15:25.920 I actually managed to take a selfie of myself in 0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:28.880 the polar bears eyes. But so I think it was 0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:32.480 taken with the standard lens. UM. What people don't know 0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:36.040 about that was between me and the polar bear. I'm 0:15:36.080 --> 0:15:42.000 in a tiny canoe and there isn't much evidence of 0:15:42.560 --> 0:15:48.840 polar bears jumping onto canoes. Um and my innunate guide 0:15:49.720 --> 0:15:52.960 who's the boss up there, felt reasonably comfortable with the 0:15:52.960 --> 0:15:54.760 whole thing. He was a he was a four year 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:58.120 old bear as well, um and more inquisitive than anything else. 0:15:59.440 --> 0:16:01.720 But at the sure works because he's looking head on me. 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:05.000 You've been on the water taking pictures of sharks as 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:08.680 another iconic image which is sought after because it is 0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:12.520 appeals to anyone that believes they have a predator inside 0:16:12.520 --> 0:16:15.000 of them. And it's this great white shark with his 0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:18.560 jagged teeth, white open and he's got a seal, a 0:16:18.640 --> 0:16:21.280 fin of his seal actually about to be clamped onto it. 0:16:21.720 --> 0:16:23.960 What watch the story behind that having to get down 0:16:23.960 --> 0:16:27.120 in in the water to to grab that. But that 0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:29.920 was actually take That was in a boat in full spay, 0:16:30.040 --> 0:16:35.200 just around the corner from Cape Town. And from about 0:16:35.200 --> 0:16:39.040 two thousand, two thousand and five to two thousand and twelve, 0:16:40.680 --> 0:16:44.600 I got fascinated with great white behavior in this bay 0:16:44.680 --> 0:16:48.280 where the sharks would come in to attack the seal pups. 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:52.680 They'd only do it in June July, their winter, and 0:16:52.720 --> 0:16:56.640 then only attack attack breach in the first hour of 0:16:56.720 --> 0:17:00.440 sunrise for reasons none of us know. We we don't 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:02.720 know why that it's the case. Maybe the lighting makes 0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:06.960 it easier for them to identify the seals. Um And 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:11.919 I spent about thirty hours in the water waiting for 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:15.040 this to happen, and every time I took a trip 0:17:15.080 --> 0:17:20.000 down to Cape Town. It might have been about of course, 0:17:20.760 --> 0:17:22.639 and I got nothing. I was coming back with nothing. 0:17:23.040 --> 0:17:25.840 And it's one of the we hear so many of 0:17:25.920 --> 0:17:31.120 these maxims in sports and business about success being failure 0:17:31.560 --> 0:17:34.879 and never quit. But that's my never quit story because 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:38.879 I think I was probably done, maybe about dollars and 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:42.520 I haven't got anything. And then my final time that 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:46.159 I really had an opportunity and it happened. Um. And 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:49.280 I tell that to people now as the stories. That's 0:17:49.320 --> 0:17:52.960 why a you start off with a lot of failure, 0:17:53.720 --> 0:17:58.840 you must never quit, almost believe in yourself and it 0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:01.760 can be tough, but you've just go to persevere. And 0:18:01.800 --> 0:18:06.600 then about three years ago an Orca killer whale came 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:11.080 into that area and killed a great white shark. Um 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:14.200 and the sharks of all god that never appeared there again. 0:18:14.359 --> 0:18:17.320 So I had that one moment in time and then 0:18:17.359 --> 0:18:21.360 wonder whether that will that moment, that decisive moment, will 0:18:21.400 --> 0:18:23.680 ever be captured again because the sharks of all gold 0:18:23.680 --> 0:18:26.479 there used to be about thirty or forty great whites 0:18:26.560 --> 0:18:31.639 around that island. Um uh, but what are from Cape Town? 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:36.280 And now they're none? Wow. Well, you talked about the 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:39.600 frustration the patients that it takes. These images and we'll 0:18:39.600 --> 0:18:41.960 get back into your connection with film. They're very cinematic. 0:18:42.320 --> 0:18:44.719 There's a there's a glamour in many of the shots, 0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:47.320 but there's the unglamorous part that goes into it, and 0:18:47.359 --> 0:18:49.439 we won't well on that because people won't rather focus 0:18:49.440 --> 0:18:52.840 on the glamour. But what goes into the getting it 0:18:52.920 --> 0:18:54.679 that kind of image you said, the access being in 0:18:54.680 --> 0:18:56.160 the right place at the right time. You use luck, 0:18:56.240 --> 0:18:57.960 but you have to you have to make your own 0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:03.080 luck and talk about that, but just the the work 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:06.159 that goes into being ready for that moment when all 0:19:06.200 --> 0:19:10.639 of a sudden you can press them the shudow. Yeah, 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:14.280 you know, I'm I'm a photographer. I'm not a wildlife photographer. 0:19:14.280 --> 0:19:19.080 I'm just a photographer. Wildlife photography is a very crowded space. 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:24.840 Anyone can go in non COVID years to Tanzania, to Kenya. 0:19:25.080 --> 0:19:27.399 They can buy a long lens, they can work with 0:19:27.480 --> 0:19:30.600 the right guide. They can be in the right place 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:34.199 at the right time to capture a decisive moment of 0:19:34.280 --> 0:19:38.080 predation or whatever. And there are a lot of these 0:19:38.080 --> 0:19:41.359 pictures circling the world right now of those kind of 0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:45.360 things and I want to be as far away from 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:47.960 that as possible. I want to try and do things 0:19:48.000 --> 0:19:51.760 that are authentic, that are different that the world hasn't 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:55.760 really seen before, or perhaps not in the way that 0:19:55.840 --> 0:19:58.800 I'm photographing it. That's quite a hard task if you 0:19:58.880 --> 0:20:02.840 set the bar that I um to try and transcend. 0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:05.800 That's why I was in Antarctica last week for forty 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:09.320 five minutes to try and transcend. I failed because of 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:12.280 things beyond my control. But we'll go back to Antarctica 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:17.080 next month because it's the Extra Mile. And it's a 0:20:17.080 --> 0:20:18.879 bit of a cliche, but you know, they're saying that 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:21.960 there are no traffic jams on the Extra Mile. And 0:20:22.280 --> 0:20:25.680 if I go to somewhere where I see ten other photographers, 0:20:26.640 --> 0:20:29.240 it goes back to my days of sports photography. You 0:20:29.280 --> 0:20:32.679 know Center Cord at Wimbledon very very well. It is 0:20:32.760 --> 0:20:36.440 incredibly difficult, no matter how talented those sports photographers are, 0:20:36.760 --> 0:20:40.520 to get a picture of Djokovic or Nadal or Federer 0:20:40.560 --> 0:20:44.479 that the world hasn't seen. The world is swamped with 0:20:44.520 --> 0:20:47.479 those kind of pictures, which is slightly unfair on the 0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:51.160 great sports photographers that they're not seen to be pieces 0:20:51.160 --> 0:20:54.480 of art because you see so many of them knocking around. 0:20:55.560 --> 0:20:58.679 I'm I am. For you to be art has to 0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:01.000 stand out. It can't be common, can have been seen before, 0:21:01.960 --> 0:21:04.800 no matter how well executed. A beautiful wildlife shoine is 0:21:04.880 --> 0:21:07.520 You're you're not interested in that because it's been done before. 0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:12.080 You're looking for something different. Of course, it's not. It's 0:21:12.119 --> 0:21:14.800 not for me to determine what's art or not. Is 0:21:14.800 --> 0:21:17.080 for the viewer to is for the ultimately for the 0:21:17.080 --> 0:21:20.719 collector of the viewer to determine what is art. Um. 0:21:20.800 --> 0:21:28.120 But at the margin um East Africa. Peter Beard does 0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:31.399 some extraordinary work in East Africa. But it was it 0:21:31.520 --> 0:21:34.720 was art, It wasn't too literal. He threw pictures of 0:21:34.800 --> 0:21:38.080 naked girls and threw blood onto He was high blessed 0:21:38.119 --> 0:21:40.120 a lot of the time, which is where his genius 0:21:40.119 --> 0:21:43.399 came from. Um. But I think there has to be 0:21:43.480 --> 0:21:46.320 something that transcends. There has to be something that allows. 0:21:47.119 --> 0:21:49.720 I remember remember speaking to the chairman of the Tape 0:21:49.760 --> 0:21:52.439 Modern in London, and he said, of all the forms 0:21:52.480 --> 0:21:54.080 of arts in the world, the one that leads me 0:21:54.160 --> 0:21:57.920 the most cold is wildlife photography. And I said, why 0:21:58.000 --> 0:22:00.679 is that? He said, I don't don't need to be 0:22:00.720 --> 0:22:03.159 told what a giraffe looks like. I know what a 0:22:03.200 --> 0:22:07.000 giraffe looks like. And there is a danger that wildlife 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:11.119 photography has become too literal. The only other way you 0:22:11.160 --> 0:22:13.760 get around that is you go, as you were suggesting, 0:22:13.800 --> 0:22:17.200 to places that other people just don't go to. And 0:22:17.200 --> 0:22:20.520 and we do try to go to some places that 0:22:20.640 --> 0:22:24.439 involve a commitment of time money. If we do a 0:22:24.520 --> 0:22:30.120 stage shot working with famous people, are average days production 0:22:30.200 --> 0:22:34.919 cost is a hundred thousand dollars. If we do um 0:22:35.240 --> 0:22:38.480 a shot in the wild, the average production costs is 0:22:38.520 --> 0:22:41.159 maybe a twentieth of that. And what we're trying to 0:22:41.200 --> 0:22:45.000 do is move that second number up to go to 0:22:45.119 --> 0:22:49.000 places that are just a bit more extreme. Uh and 0:22:49.000 --> 0:22:52.360 and involve a little bit more hardship as well. Well. 0:22:52.400 --> 0:22:55.760 Your pictures are not about what a giraffe or any 0:22:55.800 --> 0:22:59.800 animal looks like. The intimacy gives you a near what 0:22:59.800 --> 0:23:03.680 they are like inside. I mean, you can see into 0:23:04.200 --> 0:23:06.480