WEBVTT - One Step At A Time | Ashley's Story 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:03.720 Topics featured in this episode may be disturbing to some listeners. 0:00:04.440 --> 0:00:08.880 Please take care while listening. Hi all, we have some 0:00:09.000 --> 0:00:13.200 exciting news to share. ABC Studios has turned Betrayal Season 0:00:13.240 --> 0:00:17.000 one into a documentary. You will get to meet the 0:00:17.040 --> 0:00:19.840 people involved in season one, and you'll hear from people 0:00:19.880 --> 0:00:23.160 who have never spoken before, and you get to see 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.360 where the whole story took place. We are so proud 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:29.000 and excited to share it with you all. You can 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:32.760 start streaming it on Hulu on July eleventh. But now 0:00:33.159 --> 0:00:37.240 let's jump into the episode. Do an Internet search any 0:00:37.280 --> 0:00:40.640 day of the week for people who were arrested for possessing, producing, 0:00:40.760 --> 0:00:44.559 or downloading child sexual abuse material. You'll find something like this. 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:49.320 Homeland Security investigators say they arrested this Walt Disney World 0:00:49.360 --> 0:00:51.120 employee on child pornography. 0:00:51.200 --> 0:00:55.000 Charges Forty one year olds facing three counts of distributing 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:55.960 child pornography. 0:00:56.040 --> 0:00:58.720 Elementary school teachers also a youth past so accused of 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:01.360 using a cell phone sex crimes involving children. 0:01:01.400 --> 0:01:04.919 Police officers behind bars this morning charges possession of child pornography. 0:01:05.040 --> 0:01:07.560 A stunning turn for a mayor in his second term 0:01:07.560 --> 0:01:08.000 in office. 0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:11.360 We'll lease say he both possessed and distributed. 0:01:10.760 --> 0:01:14.520 Images and videos of hens or while discributing child pornography 0:01:14.520 --> 0:01:17.520 on various those films, admitted I can take her that. 0:01:19.720 --> 0:01:23.679 Knock that it translates reveal multiple child phenomopy filed. 0:01:24.120 --> 0:01:26.280 You never know what kind of person is like how 0:01:26.319 --> 0:01:28.120 a person behaves on the closed doors. 0:01:28.560 --> 0:01:33.920 I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal Episode eight, One 0:01:33.959 --> 0:01:39.600 Step at a Time. It's been about a year since 0:01:39.600 --> 0:01:42.759 Ashley Lynton first wrote into us at Betrayalpod at gmail 0:01:42.840 --> 0:01:47.400 dot com. That's how this all started. One email, then 0:01:47.440 --> 0:01:51.360 another and another that opened my eyes to the crime 0:01:51.480 --> 0:01:55.440 of sexual exploitation of children that's happening everywhere, and the 0:01:55.520 --> 0:02:01.640 shocking reality that those involved are community leaders, friends, neighbors, 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:06.880 loved ones and partners. Three courageous women, Ashley, Mandy and 0:02:07.080 --> 0:02:10.239 Erin told us their story so that we might better 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:13.680 understand the reality of what our families and our kids 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:19.280 are facing. Now here's something I haven't told you. A 0:02:19.360 --> 0:02:22.280 lot of people urged us not to tell this story. 0:02:23.000 --> 0:02:25.960 They said, nobody wants to hear about this topic. It's 0:02:26.000 --> 0:02:29.880 a loser for a podcast. Some were friends and some 0:02:30.160 --> 0:02:34.120 are in the business. But you've proved them wrong. You 0:02:34.320 --> 0:02:39.000 stayed with us, My boss backed us, and iHeart said yes, 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:43.040 we believe in this. Thank you all from the bottom 0:02:43.080 --> 0:02:46.400 of my heart. This is the last episode of the 0:02:46.480 --> 0:02:49.239 regular season, so I wanted to go back to the 0:02:49.280 --> 0:02:52.560 women who made this whole thing happen. I spoke with Ashley, 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:55.400 who lives outside Salt Lake City, Utah, and Erin, who 0:02:55.480 --> 0:02:58.880 is near Fresno, California. Both took the bold step of 0:02:59.000 --> 0:03:02.679 turning their husbands into law enforcement upon finding seesam in 0:03:02.760 --> 0:03:05.799 their homes, knowing they were ending life as they knew it. 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:09.480 Erin lived with her husband, Joel, and her two kids 0:03:09.560 --> 0:03:12.560 outside of a military base in Texas. She fled to 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:17.760 California after her discovery. Ashley's husband, Jason, was also filming 0:03:17.800 --> 0:03:21.000 her daughter a Veya and was ultimately charged with voyeurism. 0:03:23.360 --> 0:03:25.240 Now that they have been a part of the series 0:03:25.440 --> 0:03:30.160 and have gone public, we wanted to reconnect. So guys, 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:33.040 I wanted us to get together today to talk about 0:03:33.040 --> 0:03:35.080 the season and see how you guys are doing. After 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:38.040 hearing the majority of the episodes, I mean, you both 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:42.000 kind of had very similar experiences, like even down to 0:03:42.080 --> 0:03:44.480 calling your brother in laws that are in law enforcement. 0:03:45.080 --> 0:03:47.920 So I guess I'll start with erin aarin. What was 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:49.320 it like hearing Ashley's story? 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:55.040 It felt super validating to hear such a similar experience. 0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:58.680 But one thing that really really blew me away was 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:05.080 our origin story, like having a sick mother and I 0:04:05.120 --> 0:04:07.120 don't know how ash would describe her father, but like 0:04:07.520 --> 0:04:11.440 mine was emotionally unavailable, you know, and just like having 0:04:11.560 --> 0:04:14.680 that dynamic and then seeing how that led to our 0:04:14.960 --> 0:04:19.039 attachment style and potentially some codependence there. 0:04:19.560 --> 0:04:23.479 It kind of felt like a belonging. 0:04:23.839 --> 0:04:26.440 I was like, I have somebody that's met me in 0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:31.080 the same crossroads, So it felt really validating for me. 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:33.600 Also, it's not a tribe you want to be a 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:36.200 part of, but you also don't want to be alone 0:04:36.279 --> 0:04:40.080 in either, And so, like you said, we're not the 0:04:40.240 --> 0:04:46.320 victims according to see Sam, So I found little support there. 0:04:47.200 --> 0:04:51.719 Other divorces and even people on dating apps they don't 0:04:51.800 --> 0:04:54.760 understand how I feel or that I feel like I 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:58.040 did nothing wrong in my marriage, So it's just really 0:04:58.120 --> 0:05:01.680 really alienating. But then to find somebody else in those 0:05:01.760 --> 0:05:05.600 crassroads is like, oh, thank god, I'm relatable to somebody. 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:09.719 Yeah, with everything you've both been through, can you even 0:05:09.800 --> 0:05:13.360 imagine or be open to allowing yourself to be vulnerable 0:05:13.760 --> 0:05:16.640 to be in a relationship again. Would you even consider 0:05:16.880 --> 0:05:17.800 a new relationship. 0:05:18.240 --> 0:05:22.080 I knew for sure that I never wanted to date again. 0:05:24.200 --> 0:05:28.360 I couldn't reconcile how I would bring somebody into my 0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:31.760 safe circle that I've built over this last year, especially 0:05:31.960 --> 0:05:36.160 with the children. However, there is a good friend of 0:05:36.320 --> 0:05:42.840 mine that has been really supportive and really patient and 0:05:42.960 --> 0:05:49.040 really kind. I had known this particular person from years before, 0:05:49.080 --> 0:05:51.400 and he'd reached out just to see how I was doing, 0:05:51.640 --> 0:05:54.840 and then asked if we could go get coffee. At 0:05:54.880 --> 0:05:57.160 that point, I still couln't even leave my home. I 0:05:57.200 --> 0:05:59.640 didn't feel safe enough to even go to the grocery store. 0:06:00.080 --> 0:06:02.760 So to think about going in public, not even just 0:06:02.880 --> 0:06:07.080 with me, but with another mail by myself, I physically 0:06:07.120 --> 0:06:10.680 couldn't do it. So after a couple of weeks, I 0:06:10.800 --> 0:06:14.840 agreed to go to dinner with him, you know, as 0:06:14.920 --> 0:06:17.480 a platonic thing. We'd kind of talked here and there, 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:21.360 and we got to the dinner place and I was like, 0:06:21.440 --> 0:06:24.200 I can't go in, and then he's like, well, do 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:26.719 you want to get drive through? Like what's your favorite food? 0:06:27.279 --> 0:06:31.039 And I was like, Okay, French fries. He's really had 0:06:31.080 --> 0:06:36.360 to endure quite a bit to stay involved in my life, 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:38.840 because there's plenty of times if I were him, i'd 0:06:38.920 --> 0:06:40.240 be like, this is a lot. 0:06:41.760 --> 0:06:43.160 But he's been really cool. 0:06:44.680 --> 0:06:44.960 For me. 0:06:45.200 --> 0:06:47.800 When I heard you actually say he has to deal 0:06:47.880 --> 0:06:51.240 with a lot because of me or whatever. If he 0:06:51.279 --> 0:06:52.720 wants to be in your life, he's going to have to. 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:56.680 I just want you to speak highly of your life 0:06:56.680 --> 0:06:58.840 because you've done so much to get to where you are, 0:06:59.200 --> 0:07:02.640 and I don't want you to talk about what your 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:07.120 experience is in any shame or put that down because 0:07:07.160 --> 0:07:09.560 you didn't put yourself in this situation Jason did. 0:07:10.840 --> 0:07:13.200 I think you're totally right, and I think it might 0:07:13.240 --> 0:07:16.560 be something that Aaron's already processed through that I haven't 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:20.360 because it's been in stages. I don't feel like I 0:07:20.440 --> 0:07:23.200 have a big banner above my head that says, Hey, 0:07:23.680 --> 0:07:26.720 my name's Ashley, I have three kids, I have a 0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:30.880 great career. Oh and guess what, my husband, Jason was 0:07:31.000 --> 0:07:32.640 arrested for child pornography. 0:07:33.360 --> 0:07:33.520 You know. 0:07:33.920 --> 0:07:36.320 So it's not like that anymore, but I feel like 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:39.240 I'm still hiding it behind my back, you know, like 0:07:39.360 --> 0:07:43.400 it's still there right. It defines every single day in 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:50.440 my life, anything that goes wrong or not as planned. 0:07:50.840 --> 0:07:55.360 I still am like, fuck you, Jason, That's really what 0:07:55.520 --> 0:07:59.040 I think right now. What he did still define so 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:02.080 much of the kids and I in our days and 0:08:02.200 --> 0:08:03.120 how we move forward. 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:07.720 But you know, slowly going away. Yeah, well, thanks for 0:08:07.840 --> 0:08:08.280 sharing that. 0:08:08.960 --> 0:08:11.840 What about you, Erin, How has this affected your ability 0:08:11.920 --> 0:08:14.200 to trust and your openness to relationships? 0:08:14.800 --> 0:08:18.080 Initially I felt similar. It was really scary and it 0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:21.600 took me some time to open up to people. But 0:08:21.760 --> 0:08:24.880 over the course of time, I kind of swung the 0:08:25.080 --> 0:08:30.240 other way. I'm hyper independent as far as attachment styles, 0:08:31.720 --> 0:08:37.480 I'm more love avoidant, where I can cut somebody off quickly. Also, 0:08:37.600 --> 0:08:42.000 being a therapist, I'm working on myself and I'm thinking 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:46.840 about thoughts and feelings and systemic behavior all day long, 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:47.840 every day of the week. 0:08:47.960 --> 0:08:51.120 So I'm not ready in a position to not be 0:08:51.280 --> 0:08:57.400 relatable to most men. The emotional IQ just isn't there 0:08:57.520 --> 0:09:01.520 for me. So I do try to online date, I 0:09:01.640 --> 0:09:05.360 do try to connect with people, but if it doesn't 0:09:05.400 --> 0:09:08.440 work out for me, I'm quick to shut that down 0:09:08.520 --> 0:09:11.600 and move another way because my life is. 0:09:11.640 --> 0:09:14.520 Good I've done a lot of work to clean up 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:18.920 that part. We don't have baggage moving forward. I have 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:22.200 the custody of my kids. My kids were young when 0:09:22.559 --> 0:09:26.040 this all happened, so the only person I have to 0:09:26.120 --> 0:09:29.520 blame for their behavior is myself, because I'm the only 0:09:29.600 --> 0:09:33.679 one who's been raising them and has this attachment to them. 0:09:34.440 --> 0:09:37.160 I'd like to think as far as the package that 0:09:37.280 --> 0:09:41.719 I put out moving forward is HI, I'm Aaron, I 0:09:41.840 --> 0:09:44.000 have a great job, I run my own business, I 0:09:44.040 --> 0:09:47.640 have two wonderful kids. This is us and the rest 0:09:47.720 --> 0:09:50.080 of it is just background noise at this point. 0:09:50.920 --> 0:09:52.319 Wow, you're amazing. 0:09:52.880 --> 0:09:59.079 Yeah, if you had a chance, Ash, would you go 0:09:59.200 --> 0:10:01.640 back to your old life before you found out everything. 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:12.320 Wow, I'm gonna be super honest. I miss how naive 0:10:12.400 --> 0:10:16.240 I was to all of this, ugly. 0:10:16.880 --> 0:10:21.760 I miss the mother I was. I miss the routine. 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:26.720 I just missed that boring, mundane life that many people 0:10:27.679 --> 0:10:31.079 when they're married for a decade or whatever however long. 0:10:31.160 --> 0:10:32.680 You're like, this is fucking boring. 0:10:33.559 --> 0:10:34.120 I miss that. 0:10:35.520 --> 0:10:37.960 I miss that with every single ounce of my soul. 0:10:39.080 --> 0:10:42.920 So I don't know. I can't fully one answer. 0:10:42.760 --> 0:10:48.120 That I totally understand that, But through my therapy with Jess, 0:10:49.200 --> 0:10:53.280 I also know that I would have never been able 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:56.480 to deal with some of my core wounds that have 0:10:56.679 --> 0:10:59.160 led me to some of the choices that I made, 0:10:59.679 --> 0:11:06.199 or not valuing myself and not trusting myself. Maybe me 0:11:06.400 --> 0:11:09.120 being who I was then would have made it worse 0:11:09.240 --> 0:11:12.640 for the children than actually dealing with how we got 0:11:12.720 --> 0:11:15.720 to this spot. So for the first time in my life, 0:11:15.800 --> 0:11:19.560 I feel joy that I've never felt. It's like living 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:21.679 in a black and white world my whole life, and 0:11:21.760 --> 0:11:24.679 then all of a sudden, I see color, and I 0:11:24.840 --> 0:11:26.920 know what I like and I know what I want. 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:30.760 But I'm like, you are smart, and you're beautiful, and 0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:33.760 you are worthy, and you are a good mother, and 0:11:34.880 --> 0:11:36.240 this is a good choice. 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.120 I have to actually have that self dialogue now. 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:42.360 Arin, you first found out that your husband Joel was 0:11:42.400 --> 0:11:46.000 consuming CCM in twenty seventeen, so it's been considerably longer. 0:11:47.559 --> 0:11:50.040 You seem to be able to separate what happened from 0:11:50.080 --> 0:11:51.240 the life you have with your kids. 0:11:51.280 --> 0:11:57.760 Now. I was a wife because I liked that role 0:11:58.240 --> 0:12:02.560 I was playing. I liked the dynamic that we had, 0:12:03.320 --> 0:12:06.160 but it really had nothing to do with him. I 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:11.199 didn't like being his wife. But I liked having those. 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:15.120 Family values, you know, having the potential to have children 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:18.600 and go to soccer games and make breakfast in the morning. 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:22.600 I love doing all of that stuff. And that's because 0:12:22.640 --> 0:12:24.679 that's my character. It has nothing to do with what 0:12:24.840 --> 0:12:27.559 he deserves or what he didn't deserve. I would have 0:12:27.679 --> 0:12:31.800 done that stuff anyway. You know, it was free, it 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:35.360 was unconditional. Would I want to go back to that life? 0:12:35.559 --> 0:12:38.600 Fuck No, that was a lie. 0:12:39.240 --> 0:12:43.200 That was a hile fa Yeah. 0:12:43.200 --> 0:12:46.640 A total facade. Now I think I actually have the 0:12:46.800 --> 0:12:51.720 chance at being unchained and real and authentic with someone, 0:12:51.960 --> 0:12:53.280 and like, what a blessing. 0:12:54.440 --> 0:12:58.160 And we're young, We've got tons of time to do this. Right, 0:12:59.160 --> 0:13:02.240 listening to you talk makes me emotional on such a crier. 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:06.199 I just wouldn't want to go. I feel like you're 0:13:06.240 --> 0:13:07.559 a past version of me. 0:13:08.840 --> 0:13:10.360 I hope you're a future version of me. 0:13:11.520 --> 0:13:15.040 That's such a supreme prompliment. But I just want to 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:21.800 say it's gonna be okay, it's gonna be better. I 0:13:21.960 --> 0:13:26.160 wish that people that we interacted with or tried to 0:13:26.280 --> 0:13:30.079 date understood what a fucking blessing it is to be 0:13:30.240 --> 0:13:33.800 with someone like us. Because we stepped up and we 0:13:33.920 --> 0:13:34.760 did the right thing. 0:13:35.679 --> 0:13:39.800 We have integrity, we have strength, We know what we want, 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:44.280 we know how to deal with difficult situations. And sometimes 0:13:44.400 --> 0:13:49.400 that just gets me when people maybe misunderstand me as 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:53.200 a burden because I think. 0:13:53.080 --> 0:13:54.160 I'm plucking awesome. 0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:56.920 You are and you're gonna be awesome too. 0:13:59.800 --> 0:14:02.559 Are Our goal was to unearth a betrayal going on 0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:06.040 in homes across the country. A new friendship between these 0:14:06.080 --> 0:14:10.240 women is an extra gift. Another gift is hearing from 0:14:10.280 --> 0:14:13.480 our audience. We set up an email Betrayal Pod at 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:16.360 gmail dot com so you can send us anything, your 0:14:16.400 --> 0:14:20.320 own story of betrayal, thoughts about the podcast, even complaints. 0:14:20.720 --> 0:14:23.480 We get a few of those, but mostly we've seen 0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:25.800 letters of support or similar experiences. 0:14:26.560 --> 0:14:27.560 We asked Ashley and. 0:14:27.600 --> 0:14:30.000 Her teenage daughter Avea, who was the victim of her 0:14:30.000 --> 0:14:34.440 stepfather Jason's voyeurism, sit with us and read some how's 0:14:34.440 --> 0:14:37.240 been everything Since we launched the show, I've been thinking 0:14:37.280 --> 0:14:37.640 about you. 0:14:38.240 --> 0:14:39.240 Good, really good. 0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:40.840 I've had a lot of girls reach out to me 0:14:40.960 --> 0:14:43.000 and about the podcast, which is super cool. 0:14:45.480 --> 0:14:49.280 So this one says Aveya, Hi, I'm sure Avea has heard. 0:14:49.400 --> 0:14:52.760 She's an inspiration. I'm sure she's heard, she's strong, that 0:14:52.880 --> 0:14:57.000 she's persevered through the worst thing imaginable as someone who 0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.280 was abused by their mother's fiance at twelve years old. 0:15:00.840 --> 0:15:04.360 Avea is more than that. She's a role model. I'm 0:15:04.400 --> 0:15:07.040 twenty four now. I never told my mother what happened, 0:15:07.680 --> 0:15:10.760 even though she knows. I was groomed and abused by 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:13.560 my father till I was fifteen, and I never told 0:15:13.600 --> 0:15:17.240 anyone about it until I met my husband. Avea's strength 0:15:17.320 --> 0:15:20.040 to come forward and give the biggest middle finger to 0:15:20.200 --> 0:15:24.680 Jason felt so cathartic to hear she's laying stones for healing, 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:27.080 helping pave the way for the kids who are going 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:30.080 through all of this and will unfortunately go through this 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:33.680 in the future. I hope Avea knows how inspirational her 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:37.040 bravery and strength is. I wish Evea, Ashley and the 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:39.960 whole betrayal crew the best. Thank you for telling the 0:15:40.000 --> 0:15:43.080 story and bringing awareness to a dangerous oversight in the 0:15:43.160 --> 0:15:44.240 criminal justice system. 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:47.280 Thank you so much. Jay Oh. 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:50.800 It's really awesome to hear other people's stories and like 0:15:51.000 --> 0:15:53.920 them have the strength to come forward and talk about it, 0:15:54.480 --> 0:15:57.120 even them writing that email is such a big thing too. 0:15:57.640 --> 0:15:59.920 Right because even putting together in an email could be 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:00.920 scary to somebody. 0:16:01.560 --> 0:16:04.480 Yeah yeah, colicking send could be the hardest thing that 0:16:04.560 --> 0:16:05.520 they've ever done, you. 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:06.240 Know, right. 0:16:07.920 --> 0:16:10.600 Hello, I just started season two today and my heart 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:14.000 is pounding. I was also a victim of a partner 0:16:14.040 --> 0:16:17.320 who committed a crime with child pornography. He worked with 0:16:17.480 --> 0:16:21.000 underage girls as a youth wellness coordinator and access the 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:24.240 internal records at his work to track down his victims 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:27.720 on Facebook and groomed them. It makes me sick to 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:30.760 my stomach to think about it still, but hearing others 0:16:30.840 --> 0:16:33.080 on the podcast talk about going through the same thing 0:16:33.480 --> 0:16:36.880 has been really helpful in the process and processing my trauma. 0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:41.880 Thank you so much for making this podcasts. 0:16:40.440 --> 0:16:41.640 Just mind blowing to me. 0:16:42.320 --> 0:16:46.040 I never would have imagined people from across the world 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:49.440 reaching out to us telling us their stories and how 0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:49.880 they feel. 0:16:50.160 --> 0:16:52.480 When she had said the way that her partner had 0:16:52.520 --> 0:16:56.920 groomed his victims, it made me remember like the shame 0:16:57.000 --> 0:17:00.960 that I felt and how terrible it was. And when 0:17:01.080 --> 0:17:03.280 she said that she was able to work through some 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.840 of the trauma by hearing the stories. It's another one 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:09.240 of those things where I was like, Okay, this is 0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:13.479 exactly where I am supposed to be right now because 0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:14.879 of women like her. 0:17:20.000 --> 0:17:20.680 The next one. 0:17:21.760 --> 0:17:23.600 I just want to say to Ashley, thank you for 0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:26.800 being there for your kids. I went through something like 0:17:27.000 --> 0:17:30.320 your daughter went through, but it turned out differently. My 0:17:30.400 --> 0:17:33.440 grandfather violated me, my sister, and my cousin for years. 0:17:34.000 --> 0:17:35.840 It started when I was four and only. 0:17:35.720 --> 0:17:38.400 Stopped when I was six, and it's because my cousin 0:17:38.480 --> 0:17:42.160 told the police. My grandfather first started out with Sea 0:17:42.200 --> 0:17:44.480 Sam and then all the way up to what he 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:45.000 did to us. 0:17:45.760 --> 0:17:46.879 When my mom found out. 0:17:46.800 --> 0:17:49.520 What had happened and the things he did, she couldn't 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:53.119 believe that her father would do such terrible things, so 0:17:53.240 --> 0:17:56.720 she didn't believe any of it. She refused to face 0:17:56.800 --> 0:17:59.600 reality to protect her children, and it's why I haven't 0:17:59.640 --> 0:18:03.520 spoken to her in years. Ashley, you have saved countless 0:18:03.520 --> 0:18:06.719 little girls from being severely traumatized and hurt by Jason. 0:18:07.200 --> 0:18:09.720 I can never ever thank you enough for that. You 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:12.399 are an amazing mom, and I just wish my younger 0:18:12.480 --> 0:18:15.040 self had a mom that was even half as brave 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:18.159 as you are. Thank you, thank you, thank you. 0:18:18.720 --> 0:18:18.920 Wow. 0:18:20.440 --> 0:18:22.560 I think my biggest fair through all of this was 0:18:23.000 --> 0:18:28.359 exactly what this woman has wrote in I always thought 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:31.040 that there's a possibility that someday my children will be 0:18:31.160 --> 0:18:35.199 upset with maybe the way that I originally handled Jason 0:18:35.320 --> 0:18:37.639 being caught, and one day they choose not to have 0:18:37.680 --> 0:18:40.119 a relationship with me because of the way that I 0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:41.400 initially reacted. 0:18:41.920 --> 0:18:44.440 You mean, when you went back into wifey mode and 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:46.800 supporting him after he got out of jail the first time. 0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:52.720 Yeah, but I also know that once, you know, I 0:18:53.200 --> 0:18:55.600 kind of went through that brief and really got over 0:18:55.680 --> 0:18:57.120 some of the denial and really. 0:18:57.000 --> 0:18:59.760 Looked at it straight in the face. I realized a 0:18:59.800 --> 0:19:00.440 couple things. 0:19:00.960 --> 0:19:04.480 One of them was, in my opinion, the criminal justice 0:19:04.520 --> 0:19:09.879 system isn't there for the victims. I'm so grateful that 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:14.600 this woman hurt us, and I'm grateful that in ten years, 0:19:14.720 --> 0:19:18.360 twenty years, that my children and other children and other 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:21.800 women can look back and they'll know that this was 0:19:21.880 --> 0:19:24.119 my fight. This was the only way I knew how 0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:27.159 to fight for them. Yeah, thank you. 0:19:29.080 --> 0:19:31.359 When we first went out to Utah, here's what Avea 0:19:31.480 --> 0:19:32.840 told us about the podcast. 0:19:33.560 --> 0:19:36.560 So when my mother had first told me about this project, 0:19:36.640 --> 0:19:39.800 I kind of was like, what is she like? She's crazy, 0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:42.280 Like she has lost her mind, like something is wrong 0:19:42.320 --> 0:19:45.159 with her, Like she is here, she batshit crazy. She 0:19:45.280 --> 0:19:47.120 thinks that she's getting on a damn podcast. 0:19:48.119 --> 0:19:50.080 Avea, Do you think your mom's so bad shit crazy 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:51.440 for getting on a damn podcast? 0:19:55.600 --> 0:19:55.639 No? 0:19:56.280 --> 0:20:02.280 No, I definitely don't think so. Now this has changed 0:20:02.359 --> 0:20:06.800 my mom's life. It has made her a completely different person. 0:20:06.920 --> 0:20:10.760 And I am beyond grateful for this podcast. And I 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:12.920 guess I didn't really understand it as much at first, 0:20:13.720 --> 0:20:17.000 but now that it's really like in action and going on, 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:20.400 I really understand the help that it's brought to my mom. 0:20:20.560 --> 0:20:23.879 And I definitely don't think she's batshit crazy anymore. I 0:20:24.040 --> 0:20:26.159 definitely am beyond proud of her. 0:20:33.119 --> 0:20:35.399 At the beginning of the series, I told you about 0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:38.880 flying into Salt Lake City and the inviting, shadowy mountains 0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:41.960 that welcomed us late at night when we arrived. We 0:20:42.080 --> 0:20:44.480 had come here to meet Ashley Lynton and learn about 0:20:44.520 --> 0:20:47.200 what happened to her family. I told you about the 0:20:47.280 --> 0:20:50.280 sinister things that had happened in her home, all of 0:20:50.359 --> 0:20:54.040 the conflicting feelings of grappling with the beauty and the darkness. 0:20:55.560 --> 0:20:58.080 Before we left Salt Lake City, we drove up to 0:20:58.080 --> 0:21:01.919 the Utah State Capital one afternoon. The building sits at 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:05.879 a high elevation overlooking downtown Salt Lake City. A grand 0:21:05.920 --> 0:21:10.080 staircase sits up front, with symmetrical Corinthian columns along the 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:13.600 width of the building in signe Peak, a hill with 0:21:13.760 --> 0:21:18.840 religious significance to latter day Saints peaks from behind. The 0:21:18.960 --> 0:21:21.920 building reminds you of a mini version of the Capitol 0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:22.400 in DC. 0:21:24.640 --> 0:21:25.840 It was cold, but. 0:21:25.880 --> 0:21:31.520 There was a clear blue sky when we arrived. We 0:21:31.760 --> 0:21:34.520 entered through a side door. There was security there, a 0:21:34.560 --> 0:21:39.119 few police officers, and we stood there. We were waiting 0:21:39.240 --> 0:21:42.160 for a metal detector, maybe someone to go through our bag, 0:21:43.119 --> 0:21:49.320 something to happen. It was a little awkward, to be honest. Finally, 0:21:49.480 --> 0:21:51.920 my producer said, with all the authorities she could muster, 0:21:52.359 --> 0:21:55.400 we're here to see the Attorney General. The cops looked 0:21:55.440 --> 0:21:58.000 at us, amused and said, well, what did you do? 0:21:59.359 --> 0:22:03.800 Okay from Philly? This was so different from what we'd expect. Yeah, 0:22:03.880 --> 0:22:06.360 it's the people's house, sure, but we're still checking your bag. 0:22:07.160 --> 0:22:07.560 Not here. 0:22:08.240 --> 0:22:11.720 Nobody was checking anything. Third floor was all they said, 0:22:11.760 --> 0:22:14.560 with a wave. We had some extra time, so we 0:22:14.720 --> 0:22:19.040 roamed around the building. Built in nineteen sixteen. The Utah 0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:23.280 Capitol building has a dome supported by striking marblestones dotted 0:22:23.320 --> 0:22:27.480 with skylights and murals depicting early pioneers. We walked around 0:22:27.560 --> 0:22:30.320 and peeked into the chambers where the State Senate and 0:22:30.359 --> 0:22:33.280 State House meet, and then we met up with Attorney 0:22:33.359 --> 0:22:36.080 General Reys's chiefest staff for a cantrell. O. 0:22:36.119 --> 0:22:38.800 Hey, there is one thing you should see, but it's 0:22:38.920 --> 0:22:40.640 on the other side of the stereo going down behind 0:22:40.760 --> 0:22:41.280 Christmas Tree. 0:22:41.440 --> 0:22:41.680 Okay. 0:22:42.720 --> 0:22:44.720 Rick led us to a staircase on the west side 0:22:44.720 --> 0:22:47.080 of the Capitol leading up to the second floor. 0:22:47.359 --> 0:22:50.560 Okay, so my favorite sculpture of the democracy and freedom 0:22:50.840 --> 0:22:51.960 is not like. 0:22:52.000 --> 0:22:55.439 George Washington or something like that. It's these stereo works 0:22:56.119 --> 0:22:57.399 you can see on each side. 0:22:57.680 --> 0:22:59.800