Speaker 1: Topics featured in this episode may be disturbing to some listeners.
Speaker 1: Please take care while listening. Hi all, we have some
Speaker 1: exciting news to share. ABC Studios has turned Betrayal Season
Speaker 1: one into a documentary. You will get to meet the
Speaker 1: people involved in season one, and you'll hear from people
Speaker 1: who have never spoken before, and you get to see
Speaker 1: where the whole story took place. We are so proud
Speaker 1: and excited to share it with you all. You can
Speaker 1: start streaming it on Hulu on July eleventh. But now
Speaker 1: let's jump into the episode. Do an Internet search any
Speaker 1: day of the week for people who were arrested for possessing, producing,
Speaker 1: or downloading child sexual abuse material. You'll find something like this.
Speaker 1: Homeland Security investigators say they arrested this Walt Disney World
Speaker 1: employee on child pornography.
Speaker 2: Charges Forty one year olds facing three counts of distributing
Speaker 2: child pornography.
Speaker 3: Elementary school teachers also a youth past so accused of
Speaker 3: using a cell phone sex crimes involving children.
Speaker 4: Police officers behind bars this morning charges possession of child pornography.
Speaker 3: A stunning turn for a mayor in his second term
Speaker 3: in office.
Speaker 5: We'll lease say he both possessed and distributed.
Speaker 4: Images and videos of hens or while discributing child pornography
Speaker 4: on various those films, admitted I can take her that.
Speaker 1: Knock that it translates reveal multiple child phenomopy filed.
Speaker 6: You never know what kind of person is like how
Speaker 6: a person behaves on the closed doors.
Speaker 1: I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal Episode eight, One
Speaker 1: Step at a Time. It's been about a year since
Speaker 1: Ashley Lynton first wrote into us at Betrayalpod at gmail
Speaker 1: dot com. That's how this all started. One email, then
Speaker 1: another and another that opened my eyes to the crime
Speaker 1: of sexual exploitation of children that's happening everywhere, and the
Speaker 1: shocking reality that those involved are community leaders, friends, neighbors,
Speaker 1: loved ones and partners. Three courageous women, Ashley, Mandy and
Speaker 1: Erin told us their story so that we might better
Speaker 1: understand the reality of what our families and our kids
Speaker 1: are facing. Now here's something I haven't told you. A
Speaker 1: lot of people urged us not to tell this story.
Speaker 1: They said, nobody wants to hear about this topic. It's
Speaker 1: a loser for a podcast. Some were friends and some
Speaker 1: are in the business. But you've proved them wrong. You
Speaker 1: stayed with us, My boss backed us, and iHeart said yes,
Speaker 1: we believe in this. Thank you all from the bottom
Speaker 1: of my heart. This is the last episode of the
Speaker 1: regular season, so I wanted to go back to the
Speaker 1: women who made this whole thing happen. I spoke with Ashley,
Speaker 1: who lives outside Salt Lake City, Utah, and Erin, who
Speaker 1: is near Fresno, California. Both took the bold step of
Speaker 1: turning their husbands into law enforcement upon finding seesam in
Speaker 1: their homes, knowing they were ending life as they knew it.
Speaker 1: Erin lived with her husband, Joel, and her two kids
Speaker 1: outside of a military base in Texas. She fled to
Speaker 1: California after her discovery. Ashley's husband, Jason, was also filming
Speaker 1: her daughter a Veya and was ultimately charged with voyeurism.
Speaker 1: Now that they have been a part of the series
Speaker 1: and have gone public, we wanted to reconnect. So guys,
Speaker 1: I wanted us to get together today to talk about
Speaker 1: the season and see how you guys are doing. After
Speaker 1: hearing the majority of the episodes, I mean, you both
Speaker 1: kind of had very similar experiences, like even down to
Speaker 1: calling your brother in laws that are in law enforcement.
Speaker 1: So I guess I'll start with erin aarin. What was
Speaker 1: it like hearing Ashley's story?
Speaker 6: It felt super validating to hear such a similar experience.
Speaker 6: But one thing that really really blew me away was
Speaker 6: our origin story, like having a sick mother and I
Speaker 6: don't know how ash would describe her father, but like
Speaker 6: mine was emotionally unavailable, you know, and just like having
Speaker 6: that dynamic and then seeing how that led to our
Speaker 6: attachment style and potentially some codependence there.
Speaker 7: It kind of felt like a belonging.
Speaker 4: I was like, I have somebody that's met me in
Speaker 4: the same crossroads, So it felt really validating for me.
Speaker 8: Also, it's not a tribe you want to be a
Speaker 8: part of, but you also don't want to be alone
Speaker 8: in either, And so, like you said, we're not the
Speaker 8: victims according to see Sam, So I found little support there.
Speaker 6: Other divorces and even people on dating apps they don't
Speaker 6: understand how I feel or that I feel like I
Speaker 6: did nothing wrong in my marriage, So it's just really
Speaker 6: really alienating. But then to find somebody else in those
Speaker 6: crassroads is like, oh, thank god, I'm relatable to somebody.
Speaker 1: Yeah, with everything you've both been through, can you even
Speaker 1: imagine or be open to allowing yourself to be vulnerable
Speaker 1: to be in a relationship again. Would you even consider
Speaker 1: a new relationship.
Speaker 4: I knew for sure that I never wanted to date again.
Speaker 4: I couldn't reconcile how I would bring somebody into my
Speaker 4: safe circle that I've built over this last year, especially
Speaker 4: with the children. However, there is a good friend of
Speaker 4: mine that has been really supportive and really patient and
Speaker 4: really kind. I had known this particular person from years before,
Speaker 4: and he'd reached out just to see how I was doing,
Speaker 4: and then asked if we could go get coffee. At
Speaker 4: that point, I still couln't even leave my home. I
Speaker 4: didn't feel safe enough to even go to the grocery store.
Speaker 4: So to think about going in public, not even just
Speaker 4: with me, but with another mail by myself, I physically
Speaker 4: couldn't do it. So after a couple of weeks, I
Speaker 4: agreed to go to dinner with him, you know, as
Speaker 4: a platonic thing. We'd kind of talked here and there,
Speaker 4: and we got to the dinner place and I was like,
Speaker 4: I can't go in, and then he's like, well, do
Speaker 4: you want to get drive through? Like what's your favorite food?
Speaker 4: And I was like, Okay, French fries. He's really had
Speaker 4: to endure quite a bit to stay involved in my life,
Speaker 4: because there's plenty of times if I were him, i'd
Speaker 4: be like, this is a lot.
Speaker 7: But he's been really cool.
Speaker 3: For me.
Speaker 1: When I heard you actually say he has to deal
Speaker 1: with a lot because of me or whatever. If he
Speaker 1: wants to be in your life, he's going to have to.
Speaker 1: I just want you to speak highly of your life
Speaker 1: because you've done so much to get to where you are,
Speaker 1: and I don't want you to talk about what your
Speaker 1: experience is in any shame or put that down because
Speaker 1: you didn't put yourself in this situation Jason did.
Speaker 4: I think you're totally right, and I think it might
Speaker 4: be something that Aaron's already processed through that I haven't
Speaker 4: because it's been in stages. I don't feel like I
Speaker 4: have a big banner above my head that says, Hey,
Speaker 4: my name's Ashley, I have three kids, I have a
Speaker 4: great career. Oh and guess what, my husband, Jason was
Speaker 4: arrested for child pornography.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: So it's not like that anymore, but I feel like
Speaker 4: I'm still hiding it behind my back, you know, like
Speaker 4: it's still there right. It defines every single day in
Speaker 4: my life, anything that goes wrong or not as planned.
Speaker 4: I still am like, fuck you, Jason, That's really what
Speaker 4: I think right now. What he did still define so
Speaker 4: much of the kids and I in our days and
Speaker 4: how we move forward.
Speaker 7: But you know, slowly going away. Yeah, well, thanks for
Speaker 7: sharing that.
Speaker 1: What about you, Erin, How has this affected your ability
Speaker 1: to trust and your openness to relationships?
Speaker 6: Initially I felt similar. It was really scary and it
Speaker 6: took me some time to open up to people. But
Speaker 6: over the course of time, I kind of swung the
Speaker 6: other way. I'm hyper independent as far as attachment styles,
Speaker 6: I'm more love avoidant, where I can cut somebody off quickly. Also,
Speaker 6: being a therapist, I'm working on myself and I'm thinking
Speaker 6: about thoughts and feelings and systemic behavior all day long,
Speaker 6: every day of the week.
Speaker 5: So I'm not ready in a position to not be
Speaker 5: relatable to most men. The emotional IQ just isn't there
Speaker 5: for me. So I do try to online date, I
Speaker 5: do try to connect with people, but if it doesn't
Speaker 5: work out for me, I'm quick to shut that down
Speaker 5: and move another way because my life is.
Speaker 6: Good I've done a lot of work to clean up
Speaker 6: that part. We don't have baggage moving forward. I have
Speaker 6: the custody of my kids. My kids were young when
Speaker 6: this all happened, so the only person I have to
Speaker 6: blame for their behavior is myself, because I'm the only
Speaker 6: one who's been raising them and has this attachment to them.
Speaker 6: I'd like to think as far as the package that
Speaker 6: I put out moving forward is HI, I'm Aaron, I
Speaker 6: have a great job, I run my own business, I
Speaker 6: have two wonderful kids. This is us and the rest
Speaker 6: of it is just background noise at this point.
Speaker 7: Wow, you're amazing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you had a chance, Ash, would you go
Speaker 1: back to your old life before you found out everything.
Speaker 7: Wow, I'm gonna be super honest. I miss how naive
Speaker 7: I was to all of this, ugly.
Speaker 4: I miss the mother I was. I miss the routine.
Speaker 4: I just missed that boring, mundane life that many people
Speaker 4: when they're married for a decade or whatever however long.
Speaker 4: You're like, this is fucking boring.
Speaker 3: I miss that.
Speaker 7: I miss that with every single ounce of my soul.
Speaker 7: So I don't know. I can't fully one answer.
Speaker 4: That I totally understand that, But through my therapy with Jess,
Speaker 4: I also know that I would have never been able
Speaker 4: to deal with some of my core wounds that have
Speaker 4: led me to some of the choices that I made,
Speaker 4: or not valuing myself and not trusting myself. Maybe me
Speaker 4: being who I was then would have made it worse
Speaker 4: for the children than actually dealing with how we got
Speaker 4: to this spot. So for the first time in my life,
Speaker 4: I feel joy that I've never felt. It's like living
Speaker 4: in a black and white world my whole life, and
Speaker 4: then all of a sudden, I see color, and I
Speaker 4: know what I like and I know what I want.
Speaker 4: But I'm like, you are smart, and you're beautiful, and
Speaker 4: you are worthy, and you are a good mother, and
Speaker 4: this is a good choice.
Speaker 7: I have to actually have that self dialogue now.
Speaker 1: Arin, you first found out that your husband Joel was
Speaker 1: consuming CCM in twenty seventeen, so it's been considerably longer.
Speaker 1: You seem to be able to separate what happened from
Speaker 1: the life you have with your kids.
Speaker 5: Now. I was a wife because I liked that role
Speaker 5: I was playing. I liked the dynamic that we had,
Speaker 5: but it really had nothing to do with him. I
Speaker 5: didn't like being his wife. But I liked having those.
Speaker 6: Family values, you know, having the potential to have children
Speaker 6: and go to soccer games and make breakfast in the morning.
Speaker 6: I love doing all of that stuff. And that's because
Speaker 6: that's my character. It has nothing to do with what
Speaker 6: he deserves or what he didn't deserve. I would have
Speaker 6: done that stuff anyway. You know, it was free, it
Speaker 6: was unconditional. Would I want to go back to that life?
Speaker 6: Fuck No, that was a lie.
Speaker 5: That was a hile fa Yeah.
Speaker 6: A total facade. Now I think I actually have the
Speaker 6: chance at being unchained and real and authentic with someone,
Speaker 6: and like, what a blessing.
Speaker 5: And we're young, We've got tons of time to do this. Right,
Speaker 5: listening to you talk makes me emotional on such a crier.
Speaker 5: I just wouldn't want to go. I feel like you're
Speaker 5: a past version of me.
Speaker 7: I hope you're a future version of me.
Speaker 5: That's such a supreme prompliment. But I just want to
Speaker 5: say it's gonna be okay, it's gonna be better. I
Speaker 5: wish that people that we interacted with or tried to
Speaker 5: date understood what a fucking blessing it is to be
Speaker 5: with someone like us. Because we stepped up and we
Speaker 5: did the right thing.
Speaker 2: We have integrity, we have strength, We know what we want,
Speaker 2: we know how to deal with difficult situations. And sometimes
Speaker 2: that just gets me when people maybe misunderstand me as
Speaker 2: a burden because I think.
Speaker 5: I'm plucking awesome.
Speaker 6: You are and you're gonna be awesome too.
Speaker 1: Are Our goal was to unearth a betrayal going on
Speaker 1: in homes across the country. A new friendship between these
Speaker 1: women is an extra gift. Another gift is hearing from
Speaker 1: our audience. We set up an email Betrayal Pod at
Speaker 1: gmail dot com so you can send us anything, your
Speaker 1: own story of betrayal, thoughts about the podcast, even complaints.
Speaker 1: We get a few of those, but mostly we've seen
Speaker 1: letters of support or similar experiences.
Speaker 7: We asked Ashley and.
Speaker 1: Her teenage daughter Avea, who was the victim of her
Speaker 1: stepfather Jason's voyeurism, sit with us and read some how's
Speaker 1: been everything Since we launched the show, I've been thinking
Speaker 1: about you.
Speaker 7: Good, really good.
Speaker 3: I've had a lot of girls reach out to me
Speaker 3: and about the podcast, which is super cool.
Speaker 1: So this one says Aveya, Hi, I'm sure Avea has heard.
Speaker 1: She's an inspiration. I'm sure she's heard, she's strong, that
Speaker 1: she's persevered through the worst thing imaginable as someone who
Speaker 1: was abused by their mother's fiance at twelve years old.
Speaker 1: Avea is more than that. She's a role model. I'm
Speaker 1: twenty four now. I never told my mother what happened,
Speaker 1: even though she knows. I was groomed and abused by
Speaker 1: my father till I was fifteen, and I never told
Speaker 1: anyone about it until I met my husband. Avea's strength
Speaker 1: to come forward and give the biggest middle finger to
Speaker 1: Jason felt so cathartic to hear she's laying stones for healing,
Speaker 1: helping pave the way for the kids who are going
Speaker 1: through all of this and will unfortunately go through this
Speaker 1: in the future. I hope Avea knows how inspirational her
Speaker 1: bravery and strength is. I wish Evea, Ashley and the
Speaker 1: whole betrayal crew the best. Thank you for telling the
Speaker 1: story and bringing awareness to a dangerous oversight in the
Speaker 1: criminal justice system.
Speaker 7: Thank you so much. Jay Oh.
Speaker 3: It's really awesome to hear other people's stories and like
Speaker 3: them have the strength to come forward and talk about it,
Speaker 3: even them writing that email is such a big thing too.
Speaker 1: Right because even putting together in an email could be
Speaker 1: scary to somebody.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, colicking send could be the hardest thing that
Speaker 3: they've ever done, you.
Speaker 5: Know, right.
Speaker 1: Hello, I just started season two today and my heart
Speaker 1: is pounding. I was also a victim of a partner
Speaker 1: who committed a crime with child pornography. He worked with
Speaker 1: underage girls as a youth wellness coordinator and access the
Speaker 1: internal records at his work to track down his victims
Speaker 1: on Facebook and groomed them. It makes me sick to
Speaker 1: my stomach to think about it still, but hearing others
Speaker 1: on the podcast talk about going through the same thing
Speaker 1: has been really helpful in the process and processing my trauma.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for making this podcasts.
Speaker 7: Just mind blowing to me.
Speaker 3: I never would have imagined people from across the world
Speaker 3: reaching out to us telling us their stories and how
Speaker 3: they feel.
Speaker 4: When she had said the way that her partner had
Speaker 4: groomed his victims, it made me remember like the shame
Speaker 4: that I felt and how terrible it was. And when
Speaker 4: she said that she was able to work through some
Speaker 4: of the trauma by hearing the stories. It's another one
Speaker 4: of those things where I was like, Okay, this is
Speaker 4: exactly where I am supposed to be right now because
Speaker 4: of women like her.
Speaker 7: The next one.
Speaker 1: I just want to say to Ashley, thank you for
Speaker 1: being there for your kids. I went through something like
Speaker 1: your daughter went through, but it turned out differently. My
Speaker 1: grandfather violated me, my sister, and my cousin for years.
Speaker 7: It started when I was four and only.
Speaker 1: Stopped when I was six, and it's because my cousin
Speaker 1: told the police. My grandfather first started out with Sea
Speaker 1: Sam and then all the way up to what he
Speaker 1: did to us.
Speaker 7: When my mom found out.
Speaker 1: What had happened and the things he did, she couldn't
Speaker 1: believe that her father would do such terrible things, so
Speaker 1: she didn't believe any of it. She refused to face
Speaker 1: reality to protect her children, and it's why I haven't
Speaker 1: spoken to her in years. Ashley, you have saved countless
Speaker 1: little girls from being severely traumatized and hurt by Jason.
Speaker 1: I can never ever thank you enough for that. You
Speaker 1: are an amazing mom, and I just wish my younger
Speaker 1: self had a mom that was even half as brave
Speaker 1: as you are. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 4: I think my biggest fair through all of this was
Speaker 4: exactly what this woman has wrote in I always thought
Speaker 4: that there's a possibility that someday my children will be
Speaker 4: upset with maybe the way that I originally handled Jason
Speaker 4: being caught, and one day they choose not to have
Speaker 4: a relationship with me because of the way that I
Speaker 4: initially reacted.
Speaker 1: You mean, when you went back into wifey mode and
Speaker 1: supporting him after he got out of jail the first time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I also know that once, you know, I
Speaker 4: kind of went through that brief and really got over
Speaker 4: some of the denial and really.
Speaker 7: Looked at it straight in the face. I realized a
Speaker 7: couple things.
Speaker 4: One of them was, in my opinion, the criminal justice
Speaker 4: system isn't there for the victims. I'm so grateful that
Speaker 4: this woman hurt us, and I'm grateful that in ten years,
Speaker 4: twenty years, that my children and other children and other
Speaker 4: women can look back and they'll know that this was
Speaker 4: my fight. This was the only way I knew how
Speaker 4: to fight for them. Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1: When we first went out to Utah, here's what Avea
Speaker 1: told us about the podcast.
Speaker 3: So when my mother had first told me about this project,
Speaker 3: I kind of was like, what is she like? She's crazy,
Speaker 3: Like she has lost her mind, like something is wrong
Speaker 3: with her, Like she is here, she batshit crazy. She
Speaker 3: thinks that she's getting on a damn podcast.
Speaker 1: Avea, Do you think your mom's so bad shit crazy
Speaker 1: for getting on a damn podcast?
Speaker 7: No?
Speaker 3: No, I definitely don't think so. Now this has changed
Speaker 3: my mom's life. It has made her a completely different person.
Speaker 3: And I am beyond grateful for this podcast. And I
Speaker 3: guess I didn't really understand it as much at first,
Speaker 3: but now that it's really like in action and going on,
Speaker 3: I really understand the help that it's brought to my mom.
Speaker 3: And I definitely don't think she's batshit crazy anymore. I
Speaker 3: definitely am beyond proud of her.
Speaker 1: At the beginning of the series, I told you about
Speaker 1: flying into Salt Lake City and the inviting, shadowy mountains
Speaker 1: that welcomed us late at night when we arrived. We
Speaker 1: had come here to meet Ashley Lynton and learn about
Speaker 1: what happened to her family. I told you about the
Speaker 1: sinister things that had happened in her home, all of
Speaker 1: the conflicting feelings of grappling with the beauty and the darkness.
Speaker 1: Before we left Salt Lake City, we drove up to
Speaker 1: the Utah State Capital one afternoon. The building sits at
Speaker 1: a high elevation overlooking downtown Salt Lake City. A grand
Speaker 1: staircase sits up front, with symmetrical Corinthian columns along the
Speaker 1: width of the building in signe Peak, a hill with
Speaker 1: religious significance to latter day Saints peaks from behind. The
Speaker 1: building reminds you of a mini version of the Capitol
Speaker 1: in DC.
Speaker 7: It was cold, but.
Speaker 1: There was a clear blue sky when we arrived. We
Speaker 1: entered through a side door. There was security there, a
Speaker 1: few police officers, and we stood there. We were waiting
Speaker 1: for a metal detector, maybe someone to go through our bag,
Speaker 1: something to happen. It was a little awkward, to be honest. Finally,
Speaker 1: my producer said, with all the authorities she could muster,
Speaker 1: we're here to see the Attorney General. The cops looked
Speaker 1: at us, amused and said, well, what did you do?
Speaker 1: Okay from Philly? This was so different from what we'd expect. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's the people's house, sure, but we're still checking your bag.
Speaker 7: Not here.
Speaker 1: Nobody was checking anything. Third floor was all they said,
Speaker 1: with a wave. We had some extra time, so we
Speaker 1: roamed around the building. Built in nineteen sixteen. The Utah
Speaker 1: Capitol building has a dome supported by striking marblestones dotted
Speaker 1: with skylights and murals depicting early pioneers. We walked around
Speaker 1: and peeked into the chambers where the State Senate and
Speaker 1: State House meet, and then we met up with Attorney
Speaker 1: General Reys's chiefest staff for a cantrell. O.
Speaker 3: Hey, there is one thing you should see, but it's
Speaker 3: on the other side of the stereo going down behind
Speaker 3: Christmas Tree.
Speaker 7: Okay.
Speaker 1: Rick led us to a staircase on the west side
Speaker 1: of the Capitol leading up to the second floor.
Speaker 7: Okay, so my favorite sculpture of the democracy and freedom
Speaker 7: is not like.
Speaker 3: George Washington or something like that. It's these stereo works
Speaker 3: you can see on each side.
Speaker 4: It kind of dips down the end.
Speaker 1: At first I couldn't tell what Rick was talking about.
Speaker 1: They looked like normal steps, but then it became clear.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I noticed on the right side you
Speaker 1: can see an indentation in the marble worn down, created
Speaker 1: by one hundred years of footsteps. That's literally just like
Speaker 1: hard work, wearing tear of people that just going to work.
Speaker 7: It's a statue of democracy carved by literal democracy.
Speaker 1: Negotiating, working, evolving to make change change for the better.
Speaker 1: During the project, I thought about the staircase often. Sometimes
Speaker 1: it can be frustrating, wondering well things ever change, But
Speaker 1: these stairs reminded me it just starts with one step
Speaker 1: and dedication to keep moving forward and upward.
Speaker 7: We can make laws.
Speaker 1: We can tell our representatives what matters to us and
Speaker 1: what we expect of them they don't hear us. We
Speaker 1: can find new representatives. We can hold people accountable when
Speaker 1: they hurt our children. Betrayal starts with the people brave
Speaker 1: enough to share what's wrong in their relationships and in
Speaker 1: our greater society. My hope is we'll all do something
Speaker 1: to make it better. I'm Andrea Gunning and you'll hear
Speaker 1: from me on a bonus episode soon. If you would
Speaker 1: like to reach out to the Betrayal Team, email us
Speaker 1: at Betrayalpod at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal Pod at
Speaker 1: gmail dot com. To report a case of child sexual exploitation,
Speaker 1: called the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children's cyber
Speaker 1: Tipline at one eight hundred the Lost. If you or
Speaker 1: someone you know is worried about their sexual thoughts and feelings,
Speaker 1: towards children. Reach out to Stop it Now dot org.
Speaker 1: In the United Kingdom go to stop it now dot
Speaker 1: org dot UK. These organizations can help. We're grateful for
Speaker 1: your support and one way to show up it is
Speaker 1: by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts and don't
Speaker 1: forget to rate and review Betrayal five star reviews go
Speaker 1: a long way, A big thank you to all of
Speaker 1: our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a
Speaker 1: division of Glass Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 1: The show was executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason,
Speaker 1: hosted and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced
Speaker 1: by Kerry Hartman, also produced by Ben Fetterman and associate
Speaker 1: producer Chris and Melcurrie. Our iHeart team is Ali Perry
Speaker 1: and Jessica Krincheck. Special thanks to our talent Ashley Linton,
Speaker 1: Aveya and Erin. Thank you to production assistant Tessa Shields.
Speaker 1: Audio editing and mixing by Matt Dovechio. Betrayal's theme composed
Speaker 1: by Oliver Bains. Music library provided by my Music and
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app Apple podcasts,
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts