1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:03,720 Speaker 1: If you look at what major league managers make, there 2 00:00:03,720 --> 00:00:08,160 Speaker 1: are some college baseball coaches that make more than some 3 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:09,760 Speaker 1: major league managers. 4 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:15,040 Speaker 2: Hey, we've got Scott Miller joining us right now. New 5 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:18,279 Speaker 2: York Times contributor and Fresh Book appreciate it. 6 00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:22,960 Speaker 1: Uh yesterday, it actually hit the shelves yesterday. It became available, 7 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: So Eddie, as they say wherever books are sold, or 8 00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:32,840 Speaker 1: as we say today, Amazon dot com, Target dot com, 9 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:34,680 Speaker 1: Barnesandoble dot com, whatever. 10 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:38,240 Speaker 3: Or Scott Miller's gonna send me a free one because 11 00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:40,280 Speaker 3: all those damn interviews I did, for all those years 12 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:42,760 Speaker 3: of them. So at some point I'm expecting an autograph 13 00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 3: copy to show up at my house. 14 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:48,720 Speaker 1: AJ, I'll be happy to I. Yeah, I knew AJ 15 00:00:48,880 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: when he was a young up and comer with the 16 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:52,880 Speaker 1: Minnesota Twins when I was covering them. 17 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 3: And your hair is a little different. What's our hair 18 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 3: was a little diff Your hair was a little different, 19 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 3: Scot back then. 20 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:04,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. And I don't know if you had a beard 21 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:06,520 Speaker 1: back then, but you know Tom. 22 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 3: Kelly, Tom Kelly, there was no beards being allowed to 23 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 3: Tom Kelly's world. You were no sunglasses, You weren't allowed 24 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 3: to wear sunglasses. You weren't you had to wear your jersey. 25 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 3: There was no like pullovers. 26 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:19,399 Speaker 1: Twins didn't pay for shaving cream. 27 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 3: We had to buy our own fleeces. At one point, 28 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 3: man Terry Ryan had to buy his own shorts. I mean, 29 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 3: God knows all these story that's the best. 30 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 1: I talked to TK for a while. He's in the 31 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:36,040 Speaker 1: book about managing during his time. AJ, you'll get a 32 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:38,960 Speaker 1: kick out of this. I wanted to talk to TK 33 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 1: for many reasons. Tom Kelly managed the Twins back in 34 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 1: the eighties and nineties, in eighty seven and ninety one 35 00:01:47,560 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 1: or two World Series wins. So anyway, I covered TK 36 00:01:52,280 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: and the Twins from ninety four to ninety nine. AJ 37 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:56,960 Speaker 1: came up during that time and we got to know 38 00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:00,760 Speaker 1: each other a little bit. But anyway, one of the 39 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: things I wanted to do in the book, among other things, 40 00:02:02,920 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 1: shows how managing used to be and how it is now, 41 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:10,240 Speaker 1: was kind of comparing contrast the famous John Smoltz Game 42 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:13,919 Speaker 1: seven in nineteen ninety one World Series, the ten inning 43 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: you know strong complete game performance against you know in 44 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 1: twenty twenty, when Kevin Cash famously hooked Blake Snell early 45 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 1: before he faced the Dodgers, lineup the third time and 46 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:30,400 Speaker 1: Kevin Cash, God bless him. He was great. I know 47 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:34,400 Speaker 1: he's tired of talking about the topic, but anyway, two 48 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: extremes of how baseball used to be. Anyway, ajack back 49 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:41,400 Speaker 1: to the Tom Kelly things. So that's one thing I 50 00:02:41,440 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: wanted to do in the book. So I called t K, 51 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:45,960 Speaker 1: and I thought, I haven't been through Minnesota in a while. 52 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 1: I always preferred doing interviews in person because it's just 53 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 1: better than you know, on the phone. So I called 54 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 1: TK a couple of years, you know, when I started 55 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 1: this project, and he answers and he and I ended up. 56 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 1: We had a good relationship, even though he could be cantankerous. 57 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:05,400 Speaker 1: So I tell TK what the issue is or what 58 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 1: I'm looking for to try to talk to him. I said, 59 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 1: I'd love to come to the Twin Cities, you know, 60 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,520 Speaker 1: sit down over lunch, maybe spend some time with you 61 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:19,639 Speaker 1: talking about managing. And Tom Kelly says, Scottie, I don't 62 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:22,200 Speaker 1: even talk to my wife that much. I don't want 63 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:23,919 Speaker 1: to have lunch. You don't need to come to the 64 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:27,119 Speaker 1: Twins City. Now I'm like, oh, man, I really want 65 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: to tell you. So we keep talking and he says Finally, 66 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 1: he says, I don't even know why i'd want to 67 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: help somebody write a book anyway. Oh my god, I'm 68 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:40,320 Speaker 1: losing it, you know. I'm like, oh, and so I 69 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: give him my best pitch. I'm like, Tom, you won 70 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: two World Series in nineteen eighty seven and nineteen ninety one. 71 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: You were a great manager. But you know, all the publicity, 72 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:52,240 Speaker 1: all the pub comes out of the East coast New 73 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 1: York or the West coast. I said, I really would 74 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 1: like to have you in my book. So we talked 75 00:03:56,760 --> 00:04:01,600 Speaker 1: a little bit more. Finally he says, all right, I 76 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:03,400 Speaker 1: don't know why I'm gonna say it. I'll help you, 77 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 1: he said, but I can give you a few minutes 78 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: if you want to call me next week. So we 79 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 1: agree on Monday, he's golfing in the morning. I'll call 80 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 1: around noon. Okay, great. I call him three and a 81 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:19,799 Speaker 1: half hours on the phone. He was superb. 82 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 3: Oh boy, of course, that's it's such TK. I mean, 83 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:27,679 Speaker 3: I could tell you I told the story before. 84 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:27,960 Speaker 4: TK. 85 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 3: I never knew I made the major leagues until Tom 86 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 3: Kelly had a conversation with me where he wasn't like 87 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:32,920 Speaker 3: telling me how I'm crappy. 88 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 4: I was he just came up to you one day. 89 00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 3: In my locker. He was like, Hey, you're gonna be 90 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:38,119 Speaker 3: in the fantasy football league. 91 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 4: This is like. 92 00:04:38,800 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 3: June, and I was like, I made it. 93 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 4: He actually talked to me like a normal human. 94 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:46,200 Speaker 1: Yes, if you're there, I'm doing okay. 95 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:46,760 Speaker 4: Wow. 96 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 3: Oh yeah. 97 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 1: And that's how managing used to be. Though. I told 98 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 1: to Dan Peatree, who played He was the number two 99 00:04:55,880 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 1: pitcher Jack Morris's number one for the nineteen eighty four 100 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:03,359 Speaker 1: Tigers World CERTA his team and Sparky Anderson was similar. 101 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:06,359 Speaker 1: I mean, we all know Sparky either by reputation or 102 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,039 Speaker 1: dealing with him as being this affable guy, but he 103 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: didn't want to get to know his players. Partly, he 104 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 1: used to say, because I know one day I'm going 105 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 1: to have to release them or trade them, and it's 106 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:19,560 Speaker 1: going to be too painful, so I don't want to 107 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 1: know them. And anyway, Dan Petrie told me he pitched 108 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:26,240 Speaker 1: for Sparky. He said when he first came up, he said, 109 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 1: we were scared the death of Sparky. He said. The 110 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 1: only time you ever went into Sparky's office was a 111 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 1: if he's going to send you down to the minor 112 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:39,479 Speaker 1: leagues or b if he was going to chew your 113 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 1: ass over something that happened in the game. He said 114 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 1: he never stopped by to say good job, and he said, 115 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,480 Speaker 1: I never wanted to talk to Sparky. I just wanted 116 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 1: to keep letting him do my job. And you know 117 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:56,520 Speaker 1: that's where you know, managing back then versus managing today 118 00:05:56,640 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 1: is all about communicating with your players. 119 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 2: Hey, for the card collectors out there, you need to 120 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 2: know about Arena Club. You can check out our showrooms. 121 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 2: We've all got cards in there. You can buy, you 122 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,720 Speaker 2: can sell, you can trade, and you can rip packs. 123 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 2: They're called slab packs crafts. And then what happens If 124 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 2: you don't like what you pulled. 125 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 4: You get an instant offer, you get an insidt offer. 126 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 4: But before you get that insid offer, you can show 127 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:23,479 Speaker 4: your showroom around, kind of like when I used to 128 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 4: put the cards in the sleeves and my buddies will 129 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:28,760 Speaker 4: come over and show them. Now, bang, show them on 130 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 4: the phone. Instant offers right there if I need. 131 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 2: It, Yep, that instant offer is for the estimated fair 132 00:06:35,160 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 2: market value. Accept it on the spot. 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Like 142 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 2: Scott said, everywhere skipper, why baseball managers matter and always will. 143 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 2: So let's fast forward to now, did you get into 144 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 2: the state of managers in today's game, the psychology game, 145 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 2: the way that they have to work with the front 146 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 2: office on setting the lineup and any other kind of 147 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 2: prep and why the manager still matters so much now 148 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 2: even though they essentially have less power or have to 149 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 2: spread the power around amongst the organization. 150 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:37,559 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely kind of in a nutshell, Scott, the book 151 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 1: is it starts in the late seventies when managers had 152 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 1: all the power, you know, Billy Martin, Earl Weaver, Sparky Anderson. 153 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: And also it starts in late seventies because that's when 154 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: the very first rudimentary computers were available to the public. 155 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:56,240 Speaker 1: So I kind of that's why I picked them to 156 00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:59,400 Speaker 1: start to kind of move from then to now as 157 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 1: manager and the game change as computers moved into all 158 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,240 Speaker 1: of our lives and changed every aspect of it. So 159 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:09,280 Speaker 1: the book kind of goes looks at managing from the 160 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 1: late seventies to now, what the job was like then, 161 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: what it's like now, how we got from then to now, 162 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 1: and why we got from then to now, and yeah, 163 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:24,320 Speaker 1: today's job. It's interesting what the job Aaron Boone is 164 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: doing today in New York. If you just look at 165 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 1: a list of Yankees managers, you know you'll see whatever 166 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:36,960 Speaker 1: Billy Martin, Bob Lemon, Joe Torrey, and on paper, that's 167 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 1: the lineage. But the job Aaron Boone is doing in 168 00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 1: New York today as a manager is completely different than 169 00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:52,040 Speaker 1: the job Joe Tory did or any other manager did 170 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:55,000 Speaker 1: back in the day. And that's true for all organizations. 171 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 4: Did you find any crossovers. Did you find any manager 172 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 4: like like Aaron Boone is now from back in the 173 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 4: seventies and eighties, more of that like player kind of happy, 174 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:11,840 Speaker 4: go lucky, not as much of a hard ass or 175 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 4: did you find anybody that's currently more like a Sparky 176 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 4: Anderson or a Tom Kelly in the game dealing with 177 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 4: a bunch of snowflake players. 178 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: You know, I would say Jim Leland's a little bit 179 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:30,000 Speaker 1: like Sparky and Casey Stango from the standpoint of of 180 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 1: remember famously in the early nineties when he and Barry 181 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 1: Bonds got into it in spring training very publicly. And 182 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:39,959 Speaker 1: you know, for Jim Leland doesn't take any guff. Also, 183 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:43,920 Speaker 1: he's got that philosophical side where the way he speaks 184 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:48,000 Speaker 1: it just sounds like a wise philosopher. But you know 185 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: that that would be one I would say, Eric. You know, 186 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:56,160 Speaker 1: the interesting thing is the question keeps coming up, could 187 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: a guy managing today and name any one of the 188 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: thirty man going right now, could he have managed back then? 189 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 1: Or could like Earl Weaver manage today? And I think 190 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 1: there are a handful of guys today probably could manage 191 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:13,199 Speaker 1: back then. I mean, you know, Bruce Bouchie obviously has 192 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:17,760 Speaker 1: proven his stripes. You know that that's that's a guy 193 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 1: that that could manage. I think in any era, probably 194 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:25,439 Speaker 1: Dusty Baker, you know, Leland they're a handful of guys, 195 00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:27,920 Speaker 1: but not a ton of them. And you know, Bochie 196 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 1: told me in the book, you know, I asked him 197 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:35,000 Speaker 1: he kind of crosses a couple of different generations, and 198 00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: he said, the biggest change in his job is when 199 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:43,079 Speaker 1: he first started managing. He said, I used to when 200 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:46,840 Speaker 1: I first started managing the job, I would tell players 201 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:50,880 Speaker 1: what to do. He said, Now, as I manage it, 202 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:54,120 Speaker 1: you can't just tell players what to do. Now it 203 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 1: requires an explanation. You know, Hey, I need you to 204 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: do this for this reason, or hey, this is this 205 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 1: is why we're we're wanting you to do this. Uh, 206 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:06,319 Speaker 1: you know, kind of got to come. You know, I 207 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:08,959 Speaker 1: don't know if Eric you I love I love you, 208 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: said snowflake players. And there are different different different feelings there. 209 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 1: But yeah, managers today have to be so much more 210 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 1: better at communicating with their players and relationships than old 211 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 1: school managers did. And you know, I think, you know, 212 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:32,440 Speaker 1: you look at managing today and Sandy Alderson, I talked 213 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:35,199 Speaker 1: to executives as well as managers as well as players 214 00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 1: and ex players, you know, trying to get a handle 215 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:42,280 Speaker 1: on all of it. And Sandy Alderson said, managing today 216 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: in your tool bag. You've got to have a handful 217 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 1: of skill set that guys forty years ago didn't need, 218 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 1: you know. And that's where the difference has come in 219 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:58,080 Speaker 1: about why the job is different today then back then. 220 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 4: Big news was made when Craig Council got his forty 221 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:08,880 Speaker 4: million dollar contract to leave a division rival and go 222 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 4: manage the Cubs. Dave Roberts has since eclipsed his annual value. 223 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 4: But should they be paid more? Should they be paid 224 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 4: With the way the player's salary is going up, managerial 225 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:23,000 Speaker 4: salaries have not kept up. 226 00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 1: No, you're right. That's a great point. And I did 227 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 1: talk to Craig Counsel in the book about that. And 228 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:34,920 Speaker 1: if you look at what major league managers make compared 229 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:41,079 Speaker 1: to NBA coaches, NFL coaches, even college football and basketball coaches, 230 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,280 Speaker 1: and believe it or not, there are some college baseball 231 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:48,360 Speaker 1: coaches like Tim Corbin, the great coach at Vanderbilt, that 232 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:53,920 Speaker 1: make more than some major league managers do. Major league 233 00:12:53,920 --> 00:13:00,320 Speaker 1: manager salaries have been depressed for years, and it's amazing 234 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:02,440 Speaker 1: because you all know, I don't have to tell you 235 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 1: what a long season it is and almost required, you know, 236 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:11,680 Speaker 1: not just managing. Obviously, the games and the obvious things 237 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:14,079 Speaker 1: that go with it. But you know these guys today, 238 00:13:14,679 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 1: especially take Dave Roberts in Los Angeles. I mean, you know, 239 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 1: he gets pulled as if he's made of taffy. He's 240 00:13:21,320 --> 00:13:24,600 Speaker 1: got to deal with the players, he's got to work 241 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 1: with a baseball front baseball operations department that wants him 242 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: to do certain things. One day, the marketing department of 243 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:35,240 Speaker 1: the Dodgers may come in and said, hey, we need 244 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:39,079 Speaker 1: you to speak at a statue dedication ceremony. Or when 245 00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:42,480 Speaker 1: Vin Scully retired, after Vin's last game, there's Dave out 246 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,840 Speaker 1: on the field kind of being mc is they lead 247 00:13:45,840 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: a ceremony for Vin Scully. And there's so much today 248 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 1: that goes into it. And yet you're right, they don't 249 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 1: get paid very much relatively speaking. And you know Craig 250 00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: Council said, among other things, you know when he was 251 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 1: in Milwaukee, he said, yeah, he said, every single day 252 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 1: we got to do as baseball managers. We got to 253 00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 1: meet the press before the game, after the game. I mean, 254 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 1: you talk one hundred and sixty two game season that 255 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 1: my math isn't good. AJ may need to help me here. 256 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 1: One hundred and sixty two games, pre and postgame. That's 257 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,800 Speaker 1: what that's. That's you know, three hundred and twenty some 258 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:25,600 Speaker 1: press conferences a year, let alone off days, spring training, 259 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 1: on and on and on special when breaking news happens. 260 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 1: And Consol said, whenever I bump into in the offseason, 261 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: like the Green Bay Packers coach or the Milwaukee Bucks coach, 262 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:40,280 Speaker 1: he said that was that would be the one thing 263 00:14:40,320 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: that would leave them shaking their heads. They're like, I 264 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:44,280 Speaker 1: don't know how you meet with the media that much. 265 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:45,600 Speaker 1: It's nuts. 266 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 3: Agreed, agreed, But this is this is all to me, 267 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 3: the declining power of a major league manager. He used 268 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:54,000 Speaker 3: to be the manager had all the power. I mean, 269 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:57,080 Speaker 3: manager Tom Kelly, Like we had Terry Ryan as our GM. 270 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 3: Terry Ryan, honestly, yeah, he had power to make player moves. 271 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:04,440 Speaker 3: But Tom Kelly'd be like, I don't want him to 272 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 3: come up, and I want I need a guy this, 273 00:15:06,720 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 3: and Terry would say, all right, I'm gonna bring up 274 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:12,000 Speaker 3: Praszinski and Tom Kelly say, Nope, not him, I want 275 00:15:12,200 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 3: anybody else, right, And that was a difference. 276 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:15,280 Speaker 4: It's changed. 277 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:17,920 Speaker 3: That's why the roles have kind of reversed, Like now 278 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:18,920 Speaker 3: it's GM has power. 279 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,040 Speaker 4: Managers a little bit. But it used to be. 280 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 3: I mean, the manager was the end all be all 281 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 3: of the baseball organization and they got paid like it 282 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 3: Now it's kind of flip flop. 283 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 4: I don't know if it's good or bad. 284 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 3: God, I'll let you tell me the answer to this question. 285 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:33,360 Speaker 4: Is it good or bad? 286 00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 1: You know, probably like anything else, not to give you 287 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 1: a wishy washy answer. Ajay, it's probably. You know, there 288 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 1: are probably some good aspects and some bad aspects. I mean, 289 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 1: you know, one thing going way back, and I don't 290 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: mean to date myself, and this actually was when I 291 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 1: was a kid, but say, in nineteen seventy six, Mark 292 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:57,120 Speaker 1: the bird Fiedrich came up to the Tigers as a rookie, 293 00:15:57,520 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 1: famously just took the game by storm. He is a rookie. 294 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,960 Speaker 1: He started the All Star Game that year, and he 295 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 1: ended up getting hurt the next spring and he never 296 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:11,120 Speaker 1: reached those heights again. And I bring him up because 297 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 1: that rookie year in nineteen seventy six, he threw like 298 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty four innings. I mean it was nuts. 299 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:20,040 Speaker 1: You talk about innings limits and how that we watched 300 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 1: pitchers like hawks today and so on. One hand. You know, 301 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 1: Ralph Howell kept running him out there. It's probably good 302 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 1: to have some guardrails on managers today in that you know, 303 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: the front office steps into a degree and says, hey, 304 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: we got to really take care. We don't want this 305 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: guy throwing too many innings. If he goes from pitching 306 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: seventy innings last year to two hundred and fifty innings 307 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 1: this year, he's going to blow his arm out, which 308 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 1: is what happened to Mark Fiederich's way back when. So 309 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,240 Speaker 1: it's to a degree probably good that there are some 310 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 1: checks and balances on managers today. But on the flip side, yeah, 311 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: it can be we create a dicey situation because you 312 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 1: know right now, as fans, as media people like us, 313 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 1: you know so many people. And that's why I ended 314 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:13,159 Speaker 1: up being interested in writing the books. So many people 315 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: look and say, do managers even matter anymore? They're more 316 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:21,040 Speaker 1: like middle managers. You know, they've been neutered, and you 317 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:25,320 Speaker 1: know most of their influence now is in We hear 318 00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:28,920 Speaker 1: so much about building a culture, a team culture, and 319 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:34,200 Speaker 1: communicating with players and kind of selling the front office's 320 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:37,200 Speaker 1: vision of the team. Manager has to kind of sell 321 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:41,880 Speaker 1: that to the players individually. You know, certainly a lot 322 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:44,120 Speaker 1: of the passion has taken out of the game. I think, 323 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:47,159 Speaker 1: you know, I mean, who didn't love Earl Weaver or 324 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:51,040 Speaker 1: Sparky Anderson or Billy Martin just going nuts on an umpire. 325 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:53,879 Speaker 1: I mean that would fire up a whole stadium, and 326 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,199 Speaker 1: you know, it kept the game interesting, and you know, 327 00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 1: with managing not being what it was, certainly I think 328 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 1: it removes some of the soul and humanity from the game. 329 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:10,640 Speaker 2: Scott, we appreciate the time. The book sounds awesome, cannot 330 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 2: wait to dive into it. I'm just going to give 331 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:15,119 Speaker 2: you a yes or no because we're at a time. 332 00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 2: Do you think that Pete Rose will be voted into 333 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:22,160 Speaker 2: the Hall? Would you have voted him into the Hall? 334 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 2: So give me a yes or no on each one. 335 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:29,639 Speaker 1: I'm gonna say no. I don't think he will be 336 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:33,480 Speaker 1: I think it may take a while because I don't 337 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:37,880 Speaker 1: think executives and Hall of Famers that are voting will 338 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 1: be ready right away to vote him. Man, and I 339 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 1: would I think yesterday's ruling diminishes the integrity of the 340 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:47,040 Speaker 1: game to a degree. 341 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:51,680 Speaker 2: Nice Okay, obviously, AJ's on the same page. We spent 342 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:53,679 Speaker 2: a lot of time on that earlier Scott. Great to 343 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:55,720 Speaker 2: have you on. We'll have you back soon. Good luck 344 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:57,200 Speaker 2: with the book and we'll pump it again. 345 00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:57,879 Speaker 4: I'll be waiting. 346 00:18:58,040 --> 00:19:00,919 Speaker 3: I'll be waiting for my autograph cup, the best interview. 347 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:04,760 Speaker 1: A thank you, text me your address will be We'll 348 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 1: be in touch. Thank you guys. Really enjoyed being with you.