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Speaker 1: We are talking now, we've been talking. Look who's talking to?

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Speaker 1: Look who's talking? Also? It was just a great a

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Speaker 1: great sequel. Title is one of the finest switches of

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Speaker 1: the word to for a hominem, you know what I mean,

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Speaker 1: because like they do that all the time. But who's

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Speaker 1: talking to? Look who's talking? Also? Because also Roseanne is

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Speaker 1: here now, Yeah, it ain't just Bruce Willis anymore. Honestly,

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Speaker 1: Look Who's Talking to is a good movie. It's funny,

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Speaker 1: it's a great movie. Uh, fresh content. Yeah, fresh shot

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Speaker 1: takes on movies from but hey, speaking of anonymous people

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Speaker 1: like Roseanne, we're on collect he could bring it on

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Speaker 1: the connection there, you saw the thread and you pulled it, pulled,

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Speaker 1: that threat, unraveled, that whole sweater totally unraveled. A. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I want to see what year Lucus Talking Too came out?

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Speaker 1: B Yeah, I thought Luca's talking was like okay, okay, Um,

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Speaker 1: nine and nineties they were back to back Lucas talking

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Speaker 1: now and we're still on it was. This movie was

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Speaker 1: ninety three, um, which is a great year from movies,

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Speaker 1: I must say so. Mononyms. Yeah, anyway, Rodan to Collette,

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Speaker 1: that's what we're doing. Rosanne to Collette, I love it.

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Speaker 1: I love it. That's going to get us into this episode.

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Speaker 1: Very excited to come back with part two of the

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Speaker 1: Collette Saga, which is shaping up to really be something special.

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Speaker 1: When we last left Collette, she had taken the Paris

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Speaker 1: literary world by storm with her Claudine series That's Right,

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Speaker 1: which was sort of sort of based on her own

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Speaker 1: life sort of experiences. Remember, she would write local, local,

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Speaker 1: other people into the story. They had that that girlfriend

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Speaker 1: together that got written in. Who got really upset about it? Georgie, George, Georgie.

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Speaker 1: That's why you don't date authors, they will mind their lives.

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Speaker 1: For a plot point, she had separated from her first husband,

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Speaker 1: En Rigoutier Villars, better known as Willie, another mononym the

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Speaker 1: World's Worst Willie, the world's worst Willie. He's like not

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Speaker 1: every lady will agree. Well. Um and Colette had also

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Speaker 1: decided to tread the boards with George Waggs Pantomime Company.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, what a shift from from being a famous

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Speaker 1: author straight to pantomime. Right, but still sexy pantomime. Sexy pantomimes, pantomime?

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Speaker 1: Is there any other pantomime? Because you pull on that

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Speaker 1: invisible rope and I am interested. Oh, no, ZERI an

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Speaker 1: invisible wall between us. However would we break through. I'm

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Speaker 1: very I'm very turned on this. I'm seeing you doing

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Speaker 1: like invisible wall turned boobs Hong Kong. Oh, we need

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Speaker 1: to get this show on video because she just did it.

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Speaker 1: Seeing my hand motions. Where that beret come from? That's

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Speaker 1: the real question. I'm always ready for my situations. Well, anyway,

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Speaker 1: during this period of her life, Collette was really put

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Speaker 1: in the Gay and Gay Perry. So let's learn about

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Speaker 1: her life on the stage and her love affairs with

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Speaker 1: the self proclaimed Queen of the Lesbians, Napoleon, the third

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Speaker 1: gender bending niece, the heir to a department store, and

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Speaker 1: what a collection. Let's go the French condition. Well, Eli

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Speaker 1: and Diana got some stories to tell. There's no matchmaking,

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Speaker 1: a romantic tips. It's just about pardiculous relationships. I love

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Speaker 1: my be any type of person at all, and that's

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Speaker 1: draped cons that a concrete ball. But if there's a

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Speaker 1: story with a second glance, ridiculous, roll a production of

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Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. First off, I just want to ask,

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Speaker 1: did you ever see the movie Gay Puri. It's like

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Speaker 1: the Arista Cats. It's about it's a it's a cartoon.

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Speaker 1: I want to say. It was probably the sixties or seventies,

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Speaker 1: not Disney, but you know some parallel company that was

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Speaker 1: making animated movies back then, and it's very similar. I

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Speaker 1: mean I don't know about plot for plot, but similar

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Speaker 1: style movie about some cats and they all lived in Paris.

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Speaker 1: And it was called gay PERI p u r r e.

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Speaker 1: Maybe gape purree. Where's the cooking show gay Puree? I

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Speaker 1: would watch it. Hello, I am heterosexually. Can I still

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Speaker 1: make this pure? You may not know. It's a gap.

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Speaker 1: So Collette made her stage debut just a few months

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Speaker 1: before she left Willie for good, at a house party

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Speaker 1: thrown by Natalie Clifford Barney. Collette had a brief affair

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Speaker 1: with Natalie, but this was far from unusual because Natalie

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Speaker 1: is the self proclaimed queen of the lesbians in Paris.

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Speaker 1: So she's having affairs all kinds of wives. Oh my goodness,

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Speaker 1: very much so. And they're all from our previous episode.

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Speaker 1: They're all like, oh my god, this is what he's

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Speaker 1: supposed to feel like or amazing in uh. Natalie was

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Speaker 1: an American writer. She knew she was a lesbian by

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Speaker 1: the time she was twelve, and she decided to be

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Speaker 1: as out and proud as possible. In fact, she welcomed

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Speaker 1: the scandal that came along withouting herself because it meant

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Speaker 1: that boys would stop bothering her. She's like, they never

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Speaker 1: believe me when I tell him I'm a lesbian until

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Speaker 1: it's in the newspapers. She was also a non monogamous.

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Speaker 1: She did not believe in fidelity, even when her partners

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Speaker 1: did so. She had so many affairs and lovers, famous

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Speaker 1: and not famous. She definitely needs her own episode at

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Speaker 1: something because it's just too many wonderful, wonderful relationships going on.

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Speaker 1: With Natalie Barney, I'm interested, but we want to tell

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Speaker 1: you about just one of them today. Yes, because in eight,

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Speaker 1: which I can never say in eight, all my Newsies

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Speaker 1: fans out there you know what I'm talking about, because

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Speaker 1: the opening line of Newsies, at least the movie I

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Speaker 1: haven't seen the stage show is Max Casell. In eighteen

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Speaker 1: nine nine, the streets in New York City echoed with

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Speaker 1: the voices and without here and that, well, you should

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Speaker 1: do that line in that way. In eighteen nine nine,

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Speaker 1: one of the most famous look in one of the

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Speaker 1: most famous beautiful and sought after courtesan's in Paris was

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Speaker 1: named Lean Depugi, who got offers from wealthy and titled

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Speaker 1: men all the time. In fact, this woman was so

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Speaker 1: famous that the eight nineties female impersonator Herbert Charles Polite

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Speaker 1: named his drag character Deane de Lugie after Lean Depuge.

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Speaker 1: Dean Druggie is pretty good able name. Yeah, alright. So

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Speaker 1: one night Natalie Are, American lesbian party host, saw Leande

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Speaker 1: de Puggie dance, and she was so struck by her

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Speaker 1: beauty that she dressed up like a page and presented

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Speaker 1: herself at Depuggee's dressing room doors, saying, I am a

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Speaker 1: messenger of love straight from Sappho herself Sappho famously lesbian poet,

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Speaker 1: and Puggie was so charmed by the audacity of this approach,

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Speaker 1: she's like, damn, that's good. You know, like when somebody

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Speaker 1: comes in which just like such an elaborate pickup line,

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Speaker 1: there's a costume involved, and you're like, I wouldn't even

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Speaker 1: be interested, but I just am, like, I gotta give

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Speaker 1: you credit for this exactly. And so they started an affair,

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Speaker 1: and Natalie inspired characters for a number of novels, including

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Speaker 1: Leander Puggi's novel Ideal and also Natalie inspired British writer

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Speaker 1: Radcliff Hall, who based one of the characters in her

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Speaker 1: book The Well of Loneliness on Natalie. Whould just considered

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Speaker 1: to be the most famous lesbian novel of the twentieth century.

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Speaker 1: And I will say that separate from this story, Like

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Speaker 1: three weeks ago, I added radcliff Hall to our list

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Speaker 1: because she's got so many stories to tell. All these

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Speaker 1: lesbians were piled up on top of each other around

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Speaker 1: the literally and figuratively exactly exactly because they all crossed paths.

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Speaker 1: It's just because I was so interesting to be in

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Speaker 1: this period of time, because it just it spans so

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Speaker 1: long that like, yeah, all this turn of the century

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Speaker 1: cool stuff going on, they all met each other at

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Speaker 1: some point. Do you think, like non famous lesbians or

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Speaker 1: non artist lesbians, we're seeing them and being like, I

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Speaker 1: wish I could be part of the cool group. You know,

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Speaker 1: like you see movie stars all hang out now, and

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Speaker 1: you're like, whatever, they're so cool and they get to

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Speaker 1: hang out and do rich people stuff together. You know, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I could. I could be friends with them if they

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Speaker 1: just noticed me. Yeah, you don't even know what you're missing.

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Speaker 1: Them hanging out with me, the common lesbians of France

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Speaker 1: at the time, we're the common lesbians. Little jealousy. But

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Speaker 1: anyway back to Collette. By five, Natalie and Colette are

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Speaker 1: having their physical relationship and it helped usher Collette onto

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Speaker 1: the stage, and that's when she decided to train with

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Speaker 1: the famous pantomime George Wag and realized that Willie wanted

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Speaker 1: out of their marriage just as much as she did,

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Speaker 1: which is nice when it's mutual. But it wasn't that easy.

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Speaker 1: As Collette wrote in her nineteen seventy nine memoir My Apprenticeships,

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Speaker 1: she wrote, quote to desert the domestic hearth was to

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Speaker 1: us provincial girls of nineteen hundred or so, a formidable

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Speaker 1: and unwieldy notion, encumbered with policemen and barrel topped trunks

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Speaker 1: and thick veils. Not to mention railway timetables, which is

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Speaker 1: so true. It's really important too. It's kind of hard

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Speaker 1: to grasp how little information a lot of women had

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Speaker 1: about how the world worked because men were so much

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Speaker 1: in charge of like arranging shit, Like they literally didn't

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Speaker 1: know when the train came or where it went to

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Speaker 1: or how much the ticket was, like, you really had

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Speaker 1: to get a lot of help to leave your husband.

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Speaker 1: It's not easy. Um. For example, when Leanne Depugie escaped

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Speaker 1: from her abusive husband in the eighteen nineties, she had

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Speaker 1: to sell her piano behind his back and flee in

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Speaker 1: secret to Paris. And once she got there, you know,

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Speaker 1: she had to support herself and what industry cannot nobly

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Speaker 1: born woman support herself in but acting in prostitution. So

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Speaker 1: she started training in those industries, I guess, and she

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Speaker 1: quickly became dependent on cocaine and opium throughout her life.

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Speaker 1: So when you decided to leave your husband, and not

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Speaker 1: only meant you were leaving you know, the safety of

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Speaker 1: your home, any children you may have had with that man,

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Speaker 1: any money or property you owned was all his, So

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Speaker 1: you were leaving all that behind. But you also knew

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Speaker 1: that you had to support yourself by hook or by crook,

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Speaker 1: and so it was a lot to do it. Fortunately,

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Speaker 1: Collette had help with her escape in the form of

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Speaker 1: Matilde de Morny. She was the Marquise de bell Buff

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Speaker 1: and Colette met her through Natalie Barney, Queen of Lesbians,

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Speaker 1: Queen Lesbians. All she's like let me five. Mattild who

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Speaker 1: was better known as Missy, was born in eighteen sixty

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Speaker 1: three and she was the daughter of Napoleon the Third's

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Speaker 1: half brother Charles and his wife Sophie. Now Charles was

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Speaker 1: the illegitimate son of the Queen of Holland, and Sophie

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Speaker 1: was the illegitimate daughter of Czar Nicholas the First of Russia. Hey, yea,

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Speaker 1: So it was a lot of like illegitimate children, but

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Speaker 1: they were still high born, so it wasn't It wasn't

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Speaker 1: for nothing, um, but probably couldn't inherit power, No not,

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Speaker 1: but it's given me like a neest Castro Peter Portugal vibes.

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Speaker 1: All these highly born, very well connected, you know, but

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Speaker 1: illegitimate people run around right like we gotta get married

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Speaker 1: to somebody good. Also, Napoleon the Third, his whole family

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Speaker 1: always causing trouble, was such a fast I want to

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Speaker 1: learn more about him specifically, because of course we just

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Speaker 1: got a pretty deep taste of his involvement in the

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Speaker 1: Maximilian and carlottis ory. But he's been popping up all

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Speaker 1: over the place. I mean, I guess when you're an emperor,

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Speaker 1: you know, do involve yourself your fingers in a few pies. True,

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Speaker 1: the pies of a nation, global pies. But don't worry

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Speaker 1: about all those extra names. We're here talking about Missy.

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Speaker 1: After her father, Charles de Morny, died when Missy was

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Speaker 1: only two, her mother remarried a Spanish nobleman, so Missy's

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Speaker 1: childhood was mostly spent in Spain. Missy didn't have a

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Speaker 1: great relationship with her mother. Her mother called her tape

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Speaker 1: beer because she had a long nose, like that's like

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Speaker 1: that ant eater kind of animal. Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's rude, very rude. Um. But Missy and her stepfather,

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Speaker 1: the Spanish nobleman, got along great and they would go

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Speaker 1: hunting together in the Castile countryside. Missy also loved bullfighting,

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Speaker 1: and she had kind of a childhood crush on one

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Speaker 1: of these bullfighters named Dolores Sanchez, who was called La Fragosa,

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Speaker 1: which means the rough. It's a great name for female bullfighter. Uh.

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Speaker 1: La Fargosa was also the first female bullfighter to wear

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Speaker 1: the male costume. Yeah, there were apparently a few. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't It was rare to have a female bullfighters, but

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Speaker 1: there were a few. They just wore lady, lady clothes,

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Speaker 1: and she was like, funk that there's a whole outfit.

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Speaker 1: I'm wearing outfit, which I admire. You need to write

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Speaker 1: clothes for the right job. Well, La Farragosa told Missy

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Speaker 1: once that a woman could do anything a man could do.

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Speaker 1: So I'm out here fighting bulls in pants, in pants,

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Speaker 1: and look, the sun still rises in the morning. I'm

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Speaker 1: out here fighting bulls and pants, and the thing people

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Speaker 1: are shocked by is the pants. So it ain't that heart.

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Speaker 1: This is just a period of time where women wearing

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Speaker 1: pants was like, I mean, people were goings. You could

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Speaker 1: send someone to an asylum by walking up walking by

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Speaker 1: bio wearing some trousers. Sheeps like insane. Well this he

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Speaker 1: took this lesson to heart. Spain is also where Missy

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Speaker 1: had her first lesbian affair with a servant girl. But

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Speaker 1: that sneaky little servant girl blackmailed Missy afterwards to keep

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Speaker 1: her quiet. Okay, now this is a pretty common story.

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Speaker 1: Well do you have the servants aint got nothing to lose,

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Speaker 1: that's true, and everything to gain. That's true. In fact,

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Speaker 1: around eight just a few years after this, in eighteen

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Speaker 1: eighty six, is when Magnus Hirshfield, our favorite and scientist,

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Speaker 1: was run around Germany and saying, hey, we should legalize

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Speaker 1: homosexuality because it's really just letting people get blackmailed all

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Speaker 1: day long. That's the only thing you're doing. Um, And

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Speaker 1: that's that's how common that show was. It was literally

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Speaker 1: his entire in argument. Wow. So when she was eighteen

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Speaker 1: years old in eighteen eighty one, Missy married Jack Goodar,

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Speaker 1: the Marquis de bille Buff and moved to Normandy. This

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Speaker 1: sounds like kind of a conventional marriage, right, It's just

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Speaker 1: like Marquis or Mayory. You're young, you're married a guy.

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Speaker 1: Power marriage, great job everyone. But it was anything but

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Speaker 1: conventional because Jacques Godard was well known as a homosexual man.

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Speaker 1: Everybody knew it um, and Missy herself was becoming more

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Speaker 1: and more open about her preference for women. So they

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Speaker 1: were kind of each other's beards, I guess the lack

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Speaker 1: of a better word, if you're unfamiliar with the term

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Speaker 1: a beard, of course, like if you're trying to hide

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Speaker 1: the fact that you're gay, you have sort of like

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Speaker 1: a fake heterosexual partner who they would call your beard,

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Speaker 1: your disguise. Yeah, it's making me think of local playwright

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Speaker 1: tofor Payne wrote a play called Perfect Arrangements that in

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Speaker 1: the fifties, and I think it's similar. It's like two

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Speaker 1: gay men and two gay women and they marry each

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Speaker 1: other so that they can be together, you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean. So it's like a perfect arrangement. So this

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Speaker 1: was like their perfect arrangement. And some sources say that

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Speaker 1: Missy and Jacques disliked each other. Other sources say that

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Speaker 1: they really appreciated each other because their marriage afforded them

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Speaker 1: a lot of freedom to kind of like do their

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Speaker 1: own things, um, and that they stayed on good terms

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Speaker 1: even after they divorced in nineteen o three. So maybe

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Speaker 1: they disliked each other's like personal company, but they were like, hey,

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Speaker 1: thanks a lot for being my my shelter, you know,

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Speaker 1: in this horrible place where I can't be myself. Who knows.

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Speaker 1: But whether Missy liked Jacque or not, she's rich, she's unfettered,

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Speaker 1: She's able to pursue any romantic relationship she wanted, and

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Speaker 1: one of those relationships was with the famous courtesan Liane Dapucci.

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Speaker 1: The story goes that Leane was already seeing a rich

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Speaker 1: nobleman at the time. So Missy, dressed as a man,

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Speaker 1: challenged the guy to a duel for the ain's affections

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Speaker 1: Missy one, and then, to add insult to injury, ripped

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Speaker 1: her shirt open to expose her breast so that he

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Speaker 1: would know he lost to a woman. Which I kind

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Speaker 1: of take two ways, Like I'm like, one way, I'm like, ha,

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Speaker 1: fuck you. But on the other way, I'm like, but

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Speaker 1: you're better, right, why are you do being a woman

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Speaker 1: even relevant? If you're better, you're better. Well, just showing him,

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Speaker 1: like maybe you should think it about what women can do. Buddy,

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Speaker 1: you don't know. You don't know me. I'm missy bitch.

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Speaker 1: So Missy dressed mostly like a woman in public traditionally,

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Speaker 1: though she would do it as sort of manish as

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Speaker 1: she could get away with. When she was with more

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Speaker 1: like minded people, she preferred to wear men's clothes, so

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Speaker 1: she had a garment made with this detachable skirt that

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Speaker 1: she could wear pants underneath. Yeah, it's like a velcro

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Speaker 1: rip off in pants today. I'm clear, where are my

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Speaker 1: smelling salts? I know? Right? This is apparently a time

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Speaker 1: to when women like to be daring, very daring fashion

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Speaker 1: for women to wear a really short tie, like a

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Speaker 1: man's short time that was like the Mannish dress. I

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Speaker 1: guess I don't think it's just so funny again, like

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Speaker 1: these things that were so like people and it's like

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Speaker 1: a fucking tie, okay. And then after Missy's mother died

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Speaker 1: in eight nine, Missy shed all the pretense. She cut

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Speaker 1: her hair short. She began dressing exclusively in men's three

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Speaker 1: piece suits that she ordered from Severe Row, even though

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Speaker 1: at the time it was technically illegal for women to

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Speaker 1: cross dress. They had to go get special permission from

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Speaker 1: the police just to wear pants. That's right, but Missy

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Speaker 1: was a marquees so she got away with it. Missy

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Speaker 1: was always checking her privilege about that sort of thing.

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Speaker 1: She would frequently say, thanks to my position in society,

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Speaker 1: I'm able to do things like walking around in suits.

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Speaker 1: A chambermaid could not do that. So she knew. She

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Speaker 1: knew that her she she had privileges. She understood. Good

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Speaker 1: for you, Missy. Now sources diverge here. Some say Missy

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Speaker 1: either strapped down her breasts or had them removed altogether,

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Speaker 1: and that she may have undergone a hysterect to me

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Speaker 1: as well, which was at the time the closest thing

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Speaker 1: you could get to a gender confirmation surgery. It's also

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Speaker 1: said that she was one of the first people to

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Speaker 1: install fitness equipment in her home in Paris, and she

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Speaker 1: would invite people over to watch her workout naked. And

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Speaker 1: I just got to say, that is a nightmare. I

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Speaker 1: would wake up from a cold sweat in the idea

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Speaker 1: of people watching me a exercise and be exercise naked. Horrible.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely not first fitness influencer, Like, I don't like going

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Speaker 1: to the gym fully clothed, you know the other people

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Speaker 1: around it takes. Yeah, are good enough that she's like coming,

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Speaker 1: come see me work out naked? Yeah? No, I'm good

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Speaker 1: for her for her confidence. I mean, whether no matter

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Speaker 1: how she liked, she felt good about it, right, do it? Missy.

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Speaker 1: Missy also started going by Max or Uncle acts and

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Speaker 1: called herself a marquis instead of a marquise, which is

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Speaker 1: of course the differentiation between the masculine and feminine form

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Speaker 1: of the word in French um. Although when she started

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Speaker 1: sculpting and writing, her artist name was Y sim or

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Speaker 1: Missy backwards. So all this gender bending and max this

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Speaker 1: and marquis that it has some scholars feeling that Missy

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Speaker 1: would be a transman today and that we should refer

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Speaker 1: to her with he him pronounce. However, an article by

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Speaker 1: Julia Diana Robertson on the Velvet Chronicle dot com argues

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Speaker 1: against rewriting gender bending people like Missy as transgender because

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Speaker 1: it basically erases butch lesbians from history. Interesting. Okay, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: she heard the art. The author herself is a butch lesbian.

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Speaker 1: So she's like, you're basically telling me that I did

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Speaker 1: not exist in the past, and I would be a

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Speaker 1: man rewritten as a man, like people will look back

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Speaker 1: at my life and say, well, she must have been

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Speaker 1: she must have considered herself to be a man, you know.

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Speaker 1: And she's like, no, that's not what I'm saying here. True.

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Speaker 1: I'm very proud of my femininity. It's I present it

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Speaker 1: in a different way. So she points out many lesbians

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Speaker 1: and history wore men's clothes or had male nicknames. But

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Speaker 1: it was really more about defying gender norms, redefining what

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Speaker 1: women could be and what they could do and what

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Speaker 1: they could look like and all that stuff than it

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Speaker 1: was about feeling like you're in the wrong body, which, again,

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Speaker 1: when it comes to being transgender, it's literally like I

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Speaker 1: feel wrong, not just I like to wear pants, So

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Speaker 1: it's it is a really important distinction. Um Julia also

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Speaker 1: mentions the rumor about Missy having her breasts and ovaries

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Speaker 1: surgically removed is based on a single rumor. It was

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Speaker 1: never substantiated anywhere else. Dr kaji Amin, who is one

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Speaker 1: of the most well respected scholars on the Morning, is

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Speaker 1: quoted in Julia's article is saying that the rumor is

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Speaker 1: quote based on a single, unverified and never duplicated claim

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Speaker 1: by philosopher and activists Simone Veal, who moreover, was not

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Speaker 1: one of de Morny's intimates. It's not likely that someone

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Speaker 1: has a notorious and subject to gossip could have had

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Speaker 1: her ovaries and breast tissue surgically removed, as Veal claims

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Speaker 1: without anyone else having taken notes. So an interesting point.

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Speaker 1: And I that's true that I saw that claim a

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Speaker 1: couple of times that she had surgery, and none of

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Speaker 1: them had a source for m So that's very important.

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Speaker 1: I just want to throw that out there. No, it

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Speaker 1: is important, and it's important in the conversation when we

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Speaker 1: do talk about historical figures that you know we're bending

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Speaker 1: gender uh, and experimenting with gender or redefining their own gender.

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Speaker 1: Before this sort of modern conversation that we're having about

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Speaker 1: gender was ever even really happening in the in the

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Speaker 1: larger culture. Because even now, again keep going back to this,

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Speaker 1: we are living inside that conversation right now that we're

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Speaker 1: still figuring it out, um, and and definitions are going

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Speaker 1: to change, and just listen and just go with it.

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Speaker 1: You know, who's who's out here pushing back. But it

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Speaker 1: does mean that historically when we talk about these people

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Speaker 1: until we get a time machine, all of these I

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Speaker 1: mean from Ella Gabalus uh to um to Paully Murray, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, to even now talking about Missy, it's all

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Speaker 1: where is it. It's in speculation station. It's the best

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Speaker 1: we can do. But you know, just listen to people,

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Speaker 1: take for what it's worth and do what you can exactly.

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Speaker 1: So by nineteen o six, Missy was well known for

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Speaker 1: her dashing suits, and after Natalie introduced her to Collette, oh,

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Speaker 1: she was just wild for her. Well, this lady you

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Speaker 1: probably read some of those books and was like, yes,

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Speaker 1: please hot, can I be Claudine please in this story?

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00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:44,199
Speaker 1: Can you imagine maybe she read Claudine and was like,

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Speaker 1: maybe one day a lady like that, and then she

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Speaker 1: actually meets college. Don't let me have sex with you now.

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Speaker 1: In November of that year, nineteen o six, Missy helped

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Speaker 1: Collette move out of Willie's house into a flat her own,

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Speaker 1: and she was helping financially support her. Like we said,

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Speaker 1: this would have been really difficult for Collette to do

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Speaker 1: on her own, but she had some help from some

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Speaker 1: wealthy friends. But she also followed Collette to the stage

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Speaker 1: and between the two of them, they caused a riot

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Speaker 1: with a single kiss. And we're gonna hear more about that.

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Speaker 1: Right after this we all venue back to the show.

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Speaker 1: I should learn that entire phrase lingo. I see yes,

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Speaker 1: duo lingo. Literally it's two languages, two words in one English.

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00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:45,440
Speaker 1: So Colette was doing stage shows with George Wogg from

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Speaker 1: nineteen o six to nineteen eleven throughout France and Belgium,

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Speaker 1: and they gained a lot of notoriety for their scandalous nature.

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00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,919
Speaker 1: You know, mimes of the day, a lot of a

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00:25:55,960 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: lot of hands stuff. Um. They part cantally scandalized people

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00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:06,920
Speaker 1: with a show called La Chair La Share, in which

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Speaker 1: Collette ready for this cover your children's ears? Why did

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00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 1: she do? She bared abreast a nipple no On whistling

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00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 1: Shade dot com. In the article titled the Endearing Collette,

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Speaker 1: the writer Joel van Valen says that this caused scandal praise, cartoon,

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Speaker 1: caricatures and even humorous poems in the press. And that's

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00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 1: going to take us down to poetry corner, where we'll

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00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 1: hear this short little gem from a Marseille newspaper I

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Speaker 1: saw la share. Now it might not be fine art,

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00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:50,000
Speaker 1: but I admit Collette certainly has nice tits. And anyone

419
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: who likes snuckers would agree, Oh my goodness. Well wait, man,

420
00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: is that you I love the A B B A uncommon? Yeah,

421
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:07,800
Speaker 1: this person was really pushing boundaries. So Collette had already

422
00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,400
Speaker 1: done a number of these performances, so she's getting real

423
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 1: famous for like licentious behave Like Colette's name is, you know,

424
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:19,400
Speaker 1: and means something shady and sexy and everything. So all

425
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 1: this came to a head when she and Missy performed

426
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:26,679
Speaker 1: a pantomime together in nineteen o seven called Red or

427
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 1: Egyptian Dream. We found a great write up about the

428
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:33,920
Speaker 1: pantomime and the riot that ensued on a website called

429
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:39,200
Speaker 1: Best France Forever dot com. Brilliant this Best France, Best

430
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 1: France Forever, that's my new favorite. You are ill home

431
00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 1: page bookmarked now. Even though Collette is the writer and

432
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:51,239
Speaker 1: entertainer in this relationship, it was Missy who wrote this

433
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 1: piece under her pseudonym Ya sim And it's about fifteen

434
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,399
Speaker 1: minutes long. And what happens in the pantomime is a

435
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:02,200
Speaker 1: male Egyptologist played by Missy, was flicking through a book

436
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 1: and kind of like falls asleep, and then he's overcome

437
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:10,359
Speaker 1: with phantasmagorical visions, statues and paintings in the room coming

438
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 1: to life. It's like night at the museum or something.

439
00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,119
Speaker 1: And from the corner, a sarcophagus opens to reveal a

440
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:21,920
Speaker 1: mummy played by Colette, who dances seductively towards the scholar

441
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:25,360
Speaker 1: and putting kind of putting him under her spell. He

442
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 1: begins to remove her bandages to reveal the woman underneath,

443
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 1: and she comes closer to receive his kiss that will

444
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,400
Speaker 1: bring her back to life. But at the moment of embrace,

445
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,640
Speaker 1: the Egyptologists kind of wakes up and realizes it was

446
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 1: all a dream. I swear to you, I've had this

447
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 1: dream sexy mummy comes out of a sarcophagus and slowly

448
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: takes all her bandages off, comes in for a kiss,

449
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,360
Speaker 1: and then I wake up. Every time, damn it. It's

450
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 1: like the alarm going off, or like Hobbes is licking

451
00:28:55,240 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 1: my face. Classic classic, Like the mummy just turned my

452
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 1: head and started licking my cheeks. This mummy is like

453
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 1: just licking my ear over and over again. It was

454
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 1: kind of hot, but now it's a bit like, oh,

455
00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 1: it's the dog. Although I bet Hobbs's breath kind of

456
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: is comparable to a thousands zero mummies breath. Definitely. Oh god.

457
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 1: So miss and Collette were all set to perform this

458
00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:30,479
Speaker 1: pantomime at the Moulin Rouge on January three of nineteen

459
00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 1: o seven, which is a time when I really want

460
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 1: to go to a Mulan Rouge show. Absolutely, that's on

461
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 1: the time Travel Yes, time Travel wish List, time Travel

462
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 1: Itinerary with Mulan Ruge. Absolutely. Now the house was packed

463
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 1: for this show. Everybody's ready to see it. Been a

464
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 1: lot of buzz. One of the people excited for this

465
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 1: Sexy Mummy dance. Missy had tried to keep her involvement

466
00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 1: on the d L because of course, you know, I'm

467
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:03,120
Speaker 1: gonna know it's Missy. You're gonna be looking for something, right, um.

468
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: But the Mulan Rouge thought that it would be good

469
00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: advertising to use her and her ex husband's family crests

470
00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 1: on their marketing materials. This really piste her off, so

471
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:18,840
Speaker 1: much so that she later sued the Mulan Rouge and

472
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 1: one that's right, she was like, I never said you

473
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:23,520
Speaker 1: could do that. I was trying not to let my

474
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 1: family know that I was a part of this whole thing. Yeah. Oh,

475
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 1: not only did they know, but it looks like they

476
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:32,760
Speaker 1: co signed it. But Paris was also rife with curiosity

477
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 1: about the exact nature of the relationship between these two women.

478
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 1: They knew that Colette was a famous author and a

479
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: scandalous performer, and they knew Missy was a cross dressing

480
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 1: aristocrat connected to some of the highest society. So tongues

481
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,040
Speaker 1: began to wag about what they were doing together, and

482
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:54,120
Speaker 1: when about about what their tongues were doing? Where is

483
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 1: their tongue wagon. One reporter even broke into Colette's house

484
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,600
Speaker 1: and started asking probing questions about the show and Missy,

485
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,560
Speaker 1: and I gotta ask, did you think that was gonna

486
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,200
Speaker 1: work likes. Is Collette just going to be like, oh, well,

487
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: you broke into my house, so I guess I have

488
00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 1: to answer your questions. Now, I'll draw a little diagram

489
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 1: for you about how we do it. Hell out of here. Yeah,

490
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,400
Speaker 1: she was like, Missy's fine and cool, get the funk out,

491
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:27,440
Speaker 1: and he's like Collette describes Missy and two words you

492
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 1: won't believe the second one, Yes, find this one weird

493
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 1: word that Collette called Missy. Doctors hate it. Did your

494
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 1: ad blocker to find out. So with all this hype

495
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 1: and hullabaloo and everything, it's really not surprising that a

496
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 1: huge crowd turned out for this pantomime. Now, some were

497
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 1: there to support, including Collette's estranged husband Willie Willy's like,

498
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 1: I'm a supporter of the arts and lesbians. I was

499
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:58,480
Speaker 1: married to one, matter of fact. But just as many,

500
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:02,120
Speaker 1: if not more, we're there too just to show their disapproval. Okay,

501
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 1: we've got like Westboro Baptist styles, like they're like we're

502
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:09,040
Speaker 1: going best friends forever. Said they quote came prepared to

503
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:13,120
Speaker 1: disrupt the performance, carrying objects to throw and whistles too

504
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:17,360
Speaker 1: below and whistling and jeering started right away. Just as

505
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:19,280
Speaker 1: soon as they saw like lights came up and they

506
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:22,000
Speaker 1: saw Missy in a man's suit, they were like, let's

507
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,480
Speaker 1: start making noise. Um. They threw oranges and apples and

508
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: old vegetables and lit cigars onto the stage. Very dangerous.

509
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 1: When Collette emerged from the sarcophagus, they threw a bunch

510
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 1: of old turnips at her feet. Um. Just so rude

511
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 1: and bravely. I in my opinion, it would be very

512
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 1: hard to perform with people screaming throughout the entire thing

513
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 1: that they hate you and you're dead, right, But like,

514
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not sure they were staying that, but

515
00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: basically that's the energy you're getting. But they kept going.

516
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 1: The crowd starts chanting at them to get off stage,

517
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:01,400
Speaker 1: like thumping canes and stamping their feet and just being crazy.

518
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 1: When Missy started to unravel Collett's bandages, the items they

519
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 1: threw got larger and larger, Like they started throwing cushions

520
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 1: and even small benches. Oh my god, Like the you

521
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 1: can knock someone out for life, Yeah, for real, knock

522
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 1: someone out for life, by which I mean murder. I

523
00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 1: was permanently rendered unconscious. I mean I suppose that could

524
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 1: be a coma. Well, yeah, at any rate, dangerous. It's

525
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: a dangerous thing to do. Please do not throw benches

526
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:35,960
Speaker 1: at performers, or turnips for that matter. Turnips are hard, true,

527
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: But the crowd was not able to derail the performance

528
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:43,520
Speaker 1: enough before it reached its climax, and Missy and Collette

529
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 1: locked lips in front of everyone. Oh my god, mon dieu.

530
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:56,840
Speaker 1: It was pandemonium. People were up on their feet, shouting

531
00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 1: and jeering, and they start just it's like a soccer riot.

532
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,240
Speaker 1: People to start punching someone next to them for no

533
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 1: reason at all. They just seriously just said riot breakout.

534
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 1: Willie stood up to chastise that, He's like, you are

535
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 1: our ridiculous, these are perfectly lovely women, just has his art.

536
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: But he was surrounded and he was attacked by the

537
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:22,279
Speaker 1: angry mob with fists and sticks. The action spilled out

538
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:25,400
Speaker 1: into the streets where a bunch of windows were smashed,

539
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 1: and there's just chaos going on, like cat Dela before,

540
00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:34,280
Speaker 1: just losing their minds, just ship being thrown everywhere, boards

541
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,320
Speaker 1: being ripped off the side of the building and smacking

542
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 1: people with them. You know, somebody throws a lantern and

543
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:44,400
Speaker 1: it probably bursting certain person to flame. Somewhere, there's cats

544
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 1: and dogs screaming running around that cats running around, screaming

545
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:55,800
Speaker 1: and howling, just absolute chaos. Eventually the police come screaming

546
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,720
Speaker 1: in and they start breaking up this riot. At the time,

547
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 1: this police was led by Louis Lepine, who would go

548
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,520
Speaker 1: on to reform the police by introducing forensic techniques and

549
00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 1: more formal procedures and trying to restore public faith in policing.

550
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 1: It's like people don't like cops for some reason. He

551
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:18,080
Speaker 1: actually earned the nickname the little Man with the Big

552
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 1: Stick for his skill in breaking up large crowds. Tells

553
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:26,239
Speaker 1: you how he broke up the crowds out of me. Yes.

554
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 1: After it was shut down, Louis allowed the show to

555
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 1: go back up the next night provided a man play

556
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:37,399
Speaker 1: the Egyptologists. He's like, I can't do this again, guy,

557
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:42,600
Speaker 1: so George Wog took over the role. But the next

558
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 1: night was also a disaster, with the crowd shouting and

559
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 1: whistling throughout the show, and after that it was completely

560
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 1: banned from Paris. Two months later, Collette and George performed

561
00:35:56,120 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 1: the show in Niece for three nights with no problem,

562
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 1: zero issues, no problem, could not handle. Yeah, Niece was like,

563
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:09,799
Speaker 1: let's show those Parisians how we do it. We are

564
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:14,799
Speaker 1: much nicer than them. I was waiting for it. But

565
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:20,160
Speaker 1: it's so so good. Lesbians. Come have a nice time

566
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:24,880
Speaker 1: in Nie. Okay, I bet you could have a nice

567
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:28,320
Speaker 1: time in Niece. Now Collet is still writing novels. Okay.

568
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 1: So her eight book, Tendrils of the Vine is about

569
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: her relationship with Missy, and then in ten she published

570
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:37,440
Speaker 1: The Vagabond, about her life on the stage, and that

571
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,239
Speaker 1: same year she and Missy purchased a house together on

572
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: the coast in Brittany, France. Or more accurately, Missy bought

573
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 1: the house for them to live in together. Um. But

574
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,359
Speaker 1: even though Missy was the one with the money, the

575
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,880
Speaker 1: owner refused to let her sign the lease because she

576
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:58,080
Speaker 1: was dressed like a man and not a woman. Um.

577
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:01,800
Speaker 1: So that changes her signature somehow or something, I guess.

578
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,240
Speaker 1: So Colette had to sign instead, which just a little

579
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:09,680
Speaker 1: little humiliation for Misty probably presumably still had to sign

580
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 1: the check and he took that just fine. Um. On

581
00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:16,920
Speaker 1: the same day that they signed that least, uh, Colette's

582
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 1: divorced from Willie was made official, So big day for them,

583
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 1: probably popped a bottle of champagne. Meanwhile, plenty of men,

584
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:26,560
Speaker 1: you know, we're still trying to get with Colette because

585
00:37:26,560 --> 00:37:29,360
Speaker 1: she's this hot lady who's showing off her titties on

586
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:31,799
Speaker 1: stage and there I want a pizza that right, So

587
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 1: they would like steal backstage to give her flowers and

588
00:37:34,719 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 1: invite her to exclusive gatherings and try to take her

589
00:37:37,239 --> 00:37:39,840
Speaker 1: to dinner and all this stuff. And Joel Van Vallen

590
00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: writes on Whistling Shade that quote. Once, to discourage a

591
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,319
Speaker 1: would be suitor who had been hanging about Colette, had

592
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 1: the maid conduct him to her bedroom. Then she got

593
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 1: out of bed naked, ignoring her would be lover, and

594
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:57,960
Speaker 1: going behind her dressing screen, began farming until the shocked

595
00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: gentleman left. What a move it get him out. Now

596
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:07,080
Speaker 1: She's lucky it wasn't James Joyce, because that would have

597
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,920
Speaker 1: been even more. He would have been like, I'm more

598
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 1: into it than ever all I've ever wanted. She's like,

599
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 1: my backside has backfired, My backfires have backfired. True. I

600
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 1: also love who who was writing this down? Like? Was

601
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,839
Speaker 1: the maid? Like, oh my god, today Collette farted until

602
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:34,120
Speaker 1: this guy sucked up. I bet Collette wrote it down.

603
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 1: I found the trick, ladies, you're trying to scare a

604
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:48,240
Speaker 1: man off beans. I'm just amazed by the control dedicated farts.

605
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: She's ready, all right, but not everyone got the fart treatment.

606
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 1: Collette very much like this fellow August Area, who was

607
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 1: this rich and some air to a department store fortune,

608
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:07,160
Speaker 1: who was thirteen years younger than she was. And August

609
00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:11,239
Speaker 1: followed her around like a puppy, and he just like

610
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:15,839
Speaker 1: just spoiled her. He bestowed every luxury on her. He's like,

611
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 1: I am the heir to a department store. So if

612
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:21,880
Speaker 1: you want perfumes or fresh socks, or probably lack a

613
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 1: little one of those gift baskets, you know, with the

614
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 1: cheese and a jelly jar and deodorant stick, a little

615
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:38,880
Speaker 1: nice h I've got it for you, baby, hul. He

616
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:41,520
Speaker 1: also took her to Italy, which should win me over.

617
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:45,960
Speaker 1: That's all I need. You got me um, and he

618
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:49,640
Speaker 1: drove her around in his fancy motor cars. I mean,

619
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: he must have been incredibly rich to have a motor

620
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:54,920
Speaker 1: car at this period of time, because that show was

621
00:39:55,560 --> 00:40:01,839
Speaker 1: wildly expensive, absolutely and maybe the most appealing to Collette.

622
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 1: In Judith Thurman's book Secrets of the Flesh, she says

623
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 1: they even shared a lover named Lily Darem when they

624
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 1: were in niece together. Yeah, said, niece his niece for lesbians. Niece,

625
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:19,920
Speaker 1: his niece, very welcoming. Apparently Lily dream is also she based.

626
00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:22,880
Speaker 1: Collette based a character in one of her books on Lily,

627
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 1: and she's kind of like the original manic pixie dream

628
00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 1: girl type trope. Sort of interesting, what a trio. So

629
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:35,879
Speaker 1: Collette and August stayed together for two years, and during

630
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: this time, Collette was still living with Missy by the way,

631
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 1: in the house that Missy bought Colette signed for. But

632
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,319
Speaker 1: soon Missy and Collett's relationship kind of started to fall

633
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:52,680
Speaker 1: apart because Collette, despite all her other relationships with August,

634
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:56,440
Speaker 1: with Missy, with Lily Darem, with whoever was coming along,

635
00:40:57,040 --> 00:41:01,560
Speaker 1: she fell madly in love with a journalist named Ride

636
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:04,680
Speaker 1: de Jouvenel. And Missy saw this guy and she was like,

637
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 1: this ain't no side piece, this is a real threat

638
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: to our relationship. She even tried tempting Colette away from

639
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:16,759
Speaker 1: him by letting the department store air August Harriott come

640
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,440
Speaker 1: live at their house, like telling Collette like, hey, you

641
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 1: stick with me and you can have the best of

642
00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:23,920
Speaker 1: both worlds. Yeah, we can both be you know, we

643
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:27,960
Speaker 1: can live in a manage together, right, But that just

644
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:30,840
Speaker 1: offended Collette. She was like, that's not what I'm looking

645
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 1: for here. I'm looking for a connection. Maybe she wanted

646
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:35,920
Speaker 1: on re or No One. So at the end of

647
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:40,080
Speaker 1: nineteen eleven, Missy and Collette parted ways, and Missy was

648
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: definitely broken up about Collette dumping her until, as Collette wrote,

649
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 1: she quote took up with a pretty fat woman who

650
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 1: sings her praises to this guy's little jealousy. I think

651
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 1: little jealousy. But would we all could find a pretty

652
00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:59,120
Speaker 1: fat woman to sing our praises to the guy? Thank

653
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:02,759
Speaker 1: you very much. But Colette and Henri had to untangle

654
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,759
Speaker 1: some of their personal affairs in order to get their

655
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:09,520
Speaker 1: own affair going. And it's kind of farcical. So let's

656
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,359
Speaker 1: just take a quick break and come back for more

657
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:18,560
Speaker 1: of this crazy Yes, all right, welcome back to the show.

658
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 1: Near the end of Collette had decided to subsidized her

659
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:27,000
Speaker 1: theater income with some journalism, and thanks to the success

660
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 1: of The Vagabond, she was hired by one of the

661
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:35,320
Speaker 1: more respected papers in Paris, Lama him the Morning, the Morning.

662
00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 1: That's a nice refreshing title for a paper. I think.

663
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 1: I think the morning paper is more widely read than

664
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:43,680
Speaker 1: the afternoon paper, but I could be wrong, I would think.

665
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:48,319
Speaker 1: So I'm busy in the afternoon. I go, yeah, you know,

666
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 1: these parisans and there get up and go out of

667
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 1: business to take care. They don't linger over lunch anything.

668
00:42:54,960 --> 00:43:00,200
Speaker 1: I love that Colette went from you know, basically his

669
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:06,640
Speaker 1: wife to author, well to ghostwriter to author, to mime

670
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:11,319
Speaker 1: to journalist, the true vagabond lifestyle. She's doing it with

671
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:14,640
Speaker 1: like in high society, which is great. Yeah, and it

672
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:16,920
Speaker 1: must be said, you know, she's really broke at this

673
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:20,399
Speaker 1: time because Willie owns the copyright to Claudine, so he's

674
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,840
Speaker 1: still breaking it in. They're still selling really well, but

675
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 1: she can't make any money off of that. But they're

676
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:28,160
Speaker 1: like close kind of right. I mean, he came to

677
00:43:28,200 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: her play, but he won't get any he won't give

678
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:33,400
Speaker 1: any money. Oh, Willie the worst, Willie, the worst Willie.

679
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:37,239
Speaker 1: So anyway, she started writing a weekly column for Limitan

680
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:40,879
Speaker 1: called Le journeal de Collette, and it was like her

681
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: personal views on the day I guess what was going

682
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:47,240
Speaker 1: on in the world. And her colleague and the editor

683
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 1: in chief of this paper was on Red Juvenel, and

684
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 1: it wasn't long before these two were falling hard for

685
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 1: each other. On Re was a handsome, proud man. He's

686
00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 1: three years Collett's junr. She likes him young, young, she says,

687
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 1: like it's a little old for me, but you can

688
00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: make this work. He was smart and eloquent. He was

689
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:11,359
Speaker 1: also a bit of a spendthrift and a womanizer. She

690
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,840
Speaker 1: also like those guys he loves that um. But to

691
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:18,800
Speaker 1: do to Thurman, his attraction for Colette is obvious, beyond

692
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 1: any physical charm or financial charm that he had, she writes.

693
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 1: Quote for once Colette had met a peer, not a

694
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 1: parent or a child, Henri did more than desire her.

695
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:34,680
Speaker 1: He recognized her. And one of the most revealing statements

696
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:37,000
Speaker 1: she would ever make about their romance was this one

697
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:40,880
Speaker 1: to sdo her mother, where she wrote, I received letters

698
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 1: from d Juvenel that are truly worthy of me, if

699
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,879
Speaker 1: I dare to say so, oh wow, which I think

700
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,880
Speaker 1: is a good point because Collette's, of course, Willie's Willie

701
00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:53,040
Speaker 1: was way older than her when they got married. Then

702
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:57,000
Speaker 1: she was with August who's way younger than her. Um.

703
00:44:57,040 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 1: And between that she's with women who were her peers. UM.

704
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:03,560
Speaker 1: So she was connecting in different ways with these women.

705
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 1: So now she's finally found a man who's like on

706
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:09,759
Speaker 1: the same level as her intellectually in his life and

707
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:13,640
Speaker 1: all that stuff. Now it is interesting though, um, because

708
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:16,480
Speaker 1: well it just sounds like this guy like was not

709
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:19,520
Speaker 1: just her age peer, but maybe an intellectual peer in

710
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 1: ways that Willie certainly wasn't that A Goose probably wasn't.

711
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:25,879
Speaker 1: We can assume, you know, she's just like, here's he's

712
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:28,600
Speaker 1: a writer. You know, he's a journalist. He's he knows

713
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 1: how to read. Smarty pants know how to read. I

714
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:39,680
Speaker 1: also do love the the thisussault of arrogance in that

715
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 1: claim the truly worthy of me? If I dare say so,

716
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:46,440
Speaker 1: can you believe someone wrote a letter worthy of me?

717
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 1: Usually I'm, you know, very generous in accepting letters from

718
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,799
Speaker 1: these losers. But I think this guy might actually I

719
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:59,839
Speaker 1: might read this one. I actually like his letters. Now

720
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:04,279
Speaker 1: it wasn't perfect. Enrid de Juvenal was married with a son,

721
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:08,319
Speaker 1: but he was living with his mistress. Anyway, This was

722
00:46:08,360 --> 00:46:12,719
Speaker 1: a fiery redhead named Isabel de Comminge. She was known

723
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:17,279
Speaker 1: as the Panther, and he had been living with her

724
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:22,200
Speaker 1: since nineteen o six. Isabel's family had a title but

725
00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 1: not much money, so she had been married off to

726
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:29,120
Speaker 1: some rich Parisian banker named Count play Will. But according

727
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 1: to Judith Thurman's book, Count play Will had a psychotic breakdown.

728
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 1: She writes, quote, he thought he was a dog. He

729
00:46:38,120 --> 00:46:42,000
Speaker 1: shot his wife's great Dane. His family committed him to

730
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:48,880
Speaker 1: an asylum, where he spent the remainder of his life barking. Okay,

731
00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 1: this is like an insane thing to just throw out

732
00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 1: and then have zero follow up on, right, But there

733
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 1: isn't much follow up on this guy, unfortunately. I want

734
00:46:59,640 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: to know why he thinks the dog uses a gun.

735
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,239
Speaker 1: I want to know why he shot the great Dane.

736
00:47:04,239 --> 00:47:09,560
Speaker 1: Did he say something like I don't, I just anyway,

737
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:12,719
Speaker 1: it's just a overly weird story, sad because you know

738
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 1: they didn't really have any way to treat him in

739
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:18,239
Speaker 1: nineteen o seven. Is he like there could only be

740
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:22,840
Speaker 1: one dog in this house, Scooby, he scoots and he

741
00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:28,399
Speaker 1: shoots the great Dane. Fuck? Maybe and maybe I don't know,

742
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:30,680
Speaker 1: but it's a sad a little bit of a sad

743
00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:34,120
Speaker 1: story for Count p They will. Yeah, Well, after Count

744
00:47:34,120 --> 00:47:37,560
Speaker 1: Pila Will was sent to this asylum where he just

745
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,799
Speaker 1: spent the rest of his life barking. Isabel took back

746
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:43,680
Speaker 1: her maiden name and moved in with her lover, Enrid

747
00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:46,920
Speaker 1: de Juvenel, and they had a kid together in nineteen

748
00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:49,000
Speaker 1: o seven. This is just a couple of years before

749
00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:52,279
Speaker 1: Collette was going to meet him, and neither of them

750
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 1: were very interested in this kid that they had bad parents,

751
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:58,520
Speaker 1: had parents, a lot of bad parents in this story, true,

752
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:04,000
Speaker 1: but Henri at least was very interested in the sexy, sensual,

753
00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 1: and talented Collette that he would meet a few years later,

754
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:10,960
Speaker 1: and after a torrid affair they had together, he told

755
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:16,960
Speaker 1: her he quote couldn't and wouldn't live without her. He

756
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:20,480
Speaker 1: went home to Paris to tell Isabel that he was

757
00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:26,359
Speaker 1: leaving her for Collette, and Isabel surely was like, well,

758
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:30,720
Speaker 1: I am shocked that this man's fidelity would come into question.

759
00:48:31,520 --> 00:48:35,680
Speaker 1: This man who's who was having an affair with me, uh,

760
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:38,839
Speaker 1: you know, is now having an affair on me with

761
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:42,960
Speaker 1: someone else who could have suggested such a thing. I

762
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:45,320
Speaker 1: guess he also was like, and I guess I'll finally

763
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:50,080
Speaker 1: divorce my wife. Oh wow, okay he still married. Well

764
00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:53,000
Speaker 1: that would best would Isabel off too? Maybe she's like, oh,

765
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:55,920
Speaker 1: you'll divorce your wife for her, but not for me.

766
00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:59,200
Speaker 1: Well I wondered that, but I don't think so, because

767
00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: Isabel probably could not get divorced from because he was

768
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:08,239
Speaker 1: not sane enough to consent to. Yeah, she was kind

769
00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:11,400
Speaker 1: of a chained woman at that in that point. I

770
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:13,680
Speaker 1: think there was something about that where you couldn't you

771
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:16,600
Speaker 1: can't divorce on the basis of insanity or something like that,

772
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:20,359
Speaker 1: So she couldn't get divorced, so she didn't care. So

773
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:21,759
Speaker 1: she was like, I know we were never going to

774
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:23,799
Speaker 1: get married, but we were kind of living together as

775
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,120
Speaker 1: a married couple for years. We have a kid, like,

776
00:49:26,239 --> 00:49:28,279
Speaker 1: we kind of had a committed relationship going. So she

777
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,960
Speaker 1: probably still was pretty pissed yea, And yeah, she did

778
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:38,879
Speaker 1: not take it. Well, the panther was riled up. People

779
00:49:38,880 --> 00:49:40,560
Speaker 1: want to rile up a panther. You really don't want

780
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:43,839
Speaker 1: to piss off a panther. And uh, first she went

781
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:46,440
Speaker 1: straight to Missy and told her all about coletting and

782
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:49,359
Speaker 1: Henri run around behind Missy's back. That's how Missy found

783
00:49:49,400 --> 00:49:52,240
Speaker 1: out about their relationship and started talking to a goost

784
00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:55,360
Speaker 1: about moving in and stuff. Isabel came to Paris tracked

785
00:49:55,400 --> 00:50:05,000
Speaker 1: down her illicit lover's illicit lover lover. It's like I'm

786
00:50:05,080 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 1: picturing the Charlie Day conspiracy board that is Paris right now. Okay,

787
00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:14,680
Speaker 1: everyone's fucking everybody. So after she told Missy and got

788
00:50:14,680 --> 00:50:18,040
Speaker 1: Missy all upset, she then swore to Henri that she

789
00:50:18,120 --> 00:50:22,600
Speaker 1: would kill Colette oh my god, and literally started prowling

790
00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 1: around Paris with her revolver looking for Colette. In fact,

791
00:50:27,120 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 1: Colette had to sequester herself in her Paris apartment with

792
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:36,320
Speaker 1: like several of the investigative reporters from Lament like standing

793
00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 1: guard around her. Oh yeah, if there's one, If there's

794
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:40,759
Speaker 1: one group of people I want protecting me from a

795
00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 1: violent threat, it's journalists. Yeah, they're so brave. Well, journalists

796
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:47,200
Speaker 1: are very brave, but I don't know if they get

797
00:50:47,239 --> 00:50:50,080
Speaker 1: a lot of time to spend at the gym. Also true,

798
00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:53,520
Speaker 1: are they fast and they fight? Maybe they were like

799
00:50:53,560 --> 00:50:55,920
Speaker 1: partly boxers so they could go out to investigate with

800
00:50:55,920 --> 00:51:01,800
Speaker 1: their then you know a story. Yeah, break any caps

801
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:04,840
Speaker 1: for the story. All right, maybe I get some investigative journalists.

802
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:11,320
Speaker 1: Have you protect me? Uh? Anderson Cooper Anderson Cooper, don Lemon.

803
00:51:15,960 --> 00:51:19,640
Speaker 1: I don't think that those two are really I'd be

804
00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:27,600
Speaker 1: like Suze Orman, she would be so anyway, this is

805
00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:30,919
Speaker 1: a dangerous period of time. Colette literally has a woman

806
00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:34,160
Speaker 1: like calling for her blood in the streets of Paris

807
00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:36,319
Speaker 1: and like carrying a gun around trying to jump out

808
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:38,960
Speaker 1: at her. And she's got people standing outside her door

809
00:51:39,080 --> 00:51:42,880
Speaker 1: and all this stuff. But then suddenly one day the

810
00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:45,920
Speaker 1: danger had passed and Colette was able to emerge and

811
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:49,240
Speaker 1: be free. And why do you think that is? Well,

812
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:53,480
Speaker 1: that's because Isabelle and our department store air August Harry

813
00:51:53,520 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 1: all decided to rebound together what they've She's like, these

814
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 1: two pieces of yarn just got crossed in the conspiracy board.

815
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:09,799
Speaker 1: That's the ending to this story. They embarked on a

816
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:14,400
Speaker 1: six week cruise on his yacht together, after, as Collette

817
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:18,239
Speaker 1: wrote in a letter quote, having shocked Lahove their home

818
00:52:18,320 --> 00:52:22,719
Speaker 1: port with their drunken orgies. Isn't it nice? Isn't it

819
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:29,120
Speaker 1: theater a bit too much? No, wrote exactly what I'm thinking,

820
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:32,400
Speaker 1: just like this is if this was in a movie,

821
00:52:32,560 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 1: i'd be like, that's unbelievable, but those two got too

822
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:41,240
Speaker 1: ridiculous romance. But exactly these two side characters just happened

823
00:52:41,239 --> 00:52:43,160
Speaker 1: to pair off. Well, I guess that's a nice, clean,

824
00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:45,319
Speaker 1: tidy ending. I'm like, did they meet each other? Like

825
00:52:45,360 --> 00:52:48,719
Speaker 1: she's prowling around, like drops her revolver and kicks it

826
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 1: by accus, oh, madam, you'd be returnial property. And she's like,

827
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:58,120
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. I'm just so pissed. My basically husband

828
00:52:58,719 --> 00:53:02,000
Speaker 1: is run around on me with this other lady, Collette,

829
00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 1: like she's so special, and August is like, Collette, that's

830
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 1: my girlfriend, and I'm mad at her for right around

831
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:10,839
Speaker 1: on me with some journalists. And they're like, let's get

832
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:13,759
Speaker 1: back at him by sleeping together. And it actually just

833
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:18,040
Speaker 1: solved other problems where he's like, you know, you seem

834
00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:21,360
Speaker 1: so upset. Let me let me try you on a

835
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:25,040
Speaker 1: new pair of shoes. Come by my store a gift

836
00:53:25,120 --> 00:53:34,120
Speaker 1: basket perfumes. L So with that threat gone, with that

837
00:53:34,239 --> 00:53:39,920
Speaker 1: lover handled neutralized, I guess Collette and Henri settled in.

838
00:53:39,960 --> 00:53:43,320
Speaker 1: They both were still working on the Batan. Collette was

839
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:45,839
Speaker 1: still working in the music halls and theaters as well,

840
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:49,880
Speaker 1: and then she got pregnant, so she and Henrid the

841
00:53:49,960 --> 00:53:53,759
Speaker 1: Juvenel married in nineteen twelve, and six months later she

842
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:57,600
Speaker 1: gave birth to their daughter, also named Collette, who was

843
00:53:57,680 --> 00:54:02,600
Speaker 1: nicknamed Belle Gazoo I mean beautiful gazelle. So I guess

844
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:06,960
Speaker 1: she had long legs maybe sure, or horns twist horns.

845
00:54:07,880 --> 00:54:14,160
Speaker 1: History doesn't say, speculation station this girl had long, curly horns,

846
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 1: like the corkscrew kind, you know, like an impaulas well.

847
00:54:21,680 --> 00:54:24,640
Speaker 1: After Collette gave birth, she left the theater and became

848
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:28,560
Speaker 1: an editor of Lamentin, which by was one of the

849
00:54:28,600 --> 00:54:33,120
Speaker 1: biggest papers in Paris, and she was madly in love

850
00:54:33,160 --> 00:54:36,400
Speaker 1: with Henri, who she called c D, which means lord

851
00:54:36,560 --> 00:54:42,279
Speaker 1: in Arabic. But CD here was another womanizer who was

852
00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:47,160
Speaker 1: frequently absent. He worked long hours and saw lots of ladies,

853
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:52,720
Speaker 1: just like Willie had. Natalie Barney wrote of Colette, quote,

854
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:56,719
Speaker 1: torn between the desires of her two contrary natures to

855
00:54:57,000 --> 00:55:00,400
Speaker 1: have a master and to not have one, she always

856
00:55:00,400 --> 00:55:04,720
Speaker 1: opted for the first solution, so she was usually going

857
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:06,520
Speaker 1: with the idea of like, well, let me just get

858
00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:10,000
Speaker 1: that classic husband, you know, even though part of me

859
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:14,800
Speaker 1: wants to live this kind of more libertine lifestyle. Yeah,

860
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 1: she well, we talked a little bit about in the

861
00:55:16,600 --> 00:55:20,160
Speaker 1: first episode about how she felt like marriage was a

862
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:23,520
Speaker 1: shackle in a way, and like it took away your

863
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:28,040
Speaker 1: sense of sovereignty over yourself. So she was really divided.

864
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:29,920
Speaker 1: But she I think she did want to be loved

865
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:32,480
Speaker 1: and taken care of and felt like she was the

866
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:35,440
Speaker 1: main the main character, you know, in that person's life

867
00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:39,040
Speaker 1: and all that. So she was kind of torn between

868
00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:41,800
Speaker 1: these this sense of I would rather be single forever

869
00:55:42,320 --> 00:55:45,360
Speaker 1: and be able to just call my own shots. Um,

870
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:48,239
Speaker 1: But in the world she lived in, women didn't really

871
00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:51,160
Speaker 1: get to call their own shots, especially if they're not

872
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:55,359
Speaker 1: independently wealthy. So maybe if she lived in a world

873
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:58,279
Speaker 1: where she could be independently wealthy and really legitimately run

874
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:00,560
Speaker 1: around do whatever she wants, she would never have gotten married.

875
00:56:00,640 --> 00:56:04,279
Speaker 1: But because marriage was also a bit of freedom for

876
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:07,160
Speaker 1: a woman, you know, it was just a weird I

877
00:56:07,160 --> 00:56:09,239
Speaker 1: think it's just a weird dichotomy as she had within

878
00:56:09,280 --> 00:56:11,719
Speaker 1: herself about whether or not marriage was freedom or not

879
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:14,720
Speaker 1: right not to mention, she probably had the same struggle

880
00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:18,520
Speaker 1: between like I really love someone and that means I

881
00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:22,440
Speaker 1: should be exclusively with them versus, uh, I really like

882
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:25,280
Speaker 1: sex with people, and I want to go have fun

883
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:28,480
Speaker 1: and stuff. And this was certainly a long time before,

884
00:56:28,960 --> 00:56:32,520
Speaker 1: but there was a general conversation culture about polyamory and

885
00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:35,800
Speaker 1: the idea that you can really love someone and also

886
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:39,280
Speaker 1: really love someone else and also want to have sex

887
00:56:39,280 --> 00:56:42,680
Speaker 1: with someone else, you know, like that's obviously she was

888
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:44,520
Speaker 1: kind of living that life, but I don't think she

889
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:49,560
Speaker 1: fully probably even accepted it of herself, as she must

890
00:56:49,600 --> 00:56:52,279
Speaker 1: have certainly had that struggle in her mind, like, but

891
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:55,560
Speaker 1: at some point and I got to settle down with somebody,

892
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:58,640
Speaker 1: and don't I really like Henri right well, and again,

893
00:56:58,680 --> 00:57:02,600
Speaker 1: like Natalie Barney is run around saying, don't be fidelious,

894
00:57:03,080 --> 00:57:06,400
Speaker 1: be polyamorous and have as many relationships as possible, and

895
00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:09,359
Speaker 1: that's not a natural state of things. Um. But there

896
00:57:09,440 --> 00:57:12,799
Speaker 1: was also some kind of talk about whether Collette, when

897
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:17,200
Speaker 1: especially when she was married, preferred affairs with women because

898
00:57:17,280 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 1: she couldn't get pregnant. So it was also kind of

899
00:57:20,080 --> 00:57:23,680
Speaker 1: like this is a you know, all the fear that

900
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:26,320
Speaker 1: you can have from an affair is gone if it's

901
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:28,919
Speaker 1: another woman. But also we talked a little bit about

902
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:31,840
Speaker 1: how she had never really intellectually connected with any of

903
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:34,760
Speaker 1: these men in her life, only the women. So she

904
00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 1: was getting just a totally different, you know, need fulfilled

905
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:43,000
Speaker 1: by these ladies. Besides a totally separate from sex. She

906
00:57:43,120 --> 00:57:46,880
Speaker 1: probably also preferred to have affairs with women because women

907
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:53,040
Speaker 1: are hot, women are hot, are gross. I'm the first

908
00:57:53,040 --> 00:57:59,880
Speaker 1: person to ever say that all men are gross. Grows sweet.

909
00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 1: Now hang on now, look, it's very untrue. Everyone's hot,

910
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:13,920
Speaker 1: quite frankly, quite frankly, everyone's hot. Everyone's hot. Yeah. So

911
00:58:13,960 --> 00:58:15,960
Speaker 1: that brings us to the end of this episode. But

912
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:20,480
Speaker 1: Collette's story is far from over because she still has

913
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:24,000
Speaker 1: Andre's first wife to deal with. Oh no, she's coming back,

914
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:28,920
Speaker 1: oh yeah, as well as his teenage steps on Bertram

915
00:58:28,920 --> 00:58:33,240
Speaker 1: more along. But first there's a tiny little world war

916
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:37,400
Speaker 1: that she has to get through, So we will save

917
00:58:37,440 --> 00:58:39,840
Speaker 1: all that for next time in Part three of our

918
00:58:40,000 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 1: Collette series. Yes, I'm loving it, Isn't it great? There's

919
00:58:43,600 --> 00:58:45,800
Speaker 1: so many affairs in this one. I was like, I

920
00:58:45,800 --> 00:58:48,600
Speaker 1: almost I was going to try to get through get

921
00:58:48,600 --> 00:58:51,200
Speaker 1: through her marriage with Andri, but it was just too

922
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:55,200
Speaker 1: many good, ridiculous romance much coming up in this single era.

923
00:58:55,320 --> 00:58:57,760
Speaker 1: It's perfect because we're out of time anyway, that's true.

924
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:02,120
Speaker 1: We packed it in. This lady lived a life. We're

925
00:59:02,120 --> 00:59:04,480
Speaker 1: only in the middle of it. She's got so much

926
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:08,160
Speaker 1: going on, man, I tell you, if we get to

927
00:59:08,160 --> 00:59:13,200
Speaker 1: go back and relive people's lives afterwards, I'm getting in

928
00:59:13,200 --> 00:59:15,520
Speaker 1: line for this one. There's a pretty good one. I mean, she,

929
00:59:15,840 --> 00:59:22,840
Speaker 1: you know, downs having some fun to our point about

930
00:59:23,120 --> 00:59:26,280
Speaker 1: whether or not she felt more free as a single

931
00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:29,200
Speaker 1: person or free in marriage, or how she felt about

932
00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:32,840
Speaker 1: that dichotomy. Um. There's a really great passage in The

933
00:59:32,920 --> 00:59:36,880
Speaker 1: Guardian where they talk about the Vagabonds, the book The

934
00:59:36,960 --> 00:59:39,440
Speaker 1: Vagabond she wrote, which, of course very much based on

935
00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 1: her own life and feelings. It ends with her character Renee,

936
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:47,120
Speaker 1: touring the south of France, having accepted an insistent, wealthy

937
00:59:47,200 --> 00:59:50,439
Speaker 1: young fan as a lover and knowing that he wants

938
00:59:50,480 --> 00:59:53,800
Speaker 1: to marry her, and she's tempted to marry him, but quote,

939
00:59:54,040 --> 00:59:56,760
Speaker 1: of course, she would love to be loved, to be safe,

940
00:59:56,960 --> 01:00:00,440
Speaker 1: to escape the drudgery of touring. Collette once did thirty

941
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:05,960
Speaker 1: two performances on consecutive nights in thirty two different towns. Exhausting,

942
01:00:06,840 --> 01:00:10,040
Speaker 1: but the drudgery is also the price of independence. How

943
01:00:10,080 --> 01:00:13,320
Speaker 1: to hold onto that and also be what society understands

944
01:00:13,320 --> 01:00:16,400
Speaker 1: a woman to be. For days, she weighs it up

945
01:00:16,520 --> 01:00:20,160
Speaker 1: until a moment comes when she realizes Missy has not

946
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:23,520
Speaker 1: been in her thoughts at all. Instead, she has been

947
01:00:23,560 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 1: looking for words. And here they quote collect words to

948
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:30,560
Speaker 1: express how yellow the sun is, how blue the sea,

949
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:35,520
Speaker 1: and how brilliant the salt, like a fringe of white jet. Yes,

950
01:00:35,600 --> 01:00:38,240
Speaker 1: I have forgotten him, as if the only urgent thing

951
01:00:38,320 --> 01:00:41,120
Speaker 1: in the world were my desire to possess through my

952
01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:44,919
Speaker 1: eyes the marvels of the earth. In that same hour,

953
01:00:45,080 --> 01:00:48,640
Speaker 1: an insidious spirit whispered to me, and if indeed that

954
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:52,840
Speaker 1: were the only urgent thing, if everything save that, we're

955
01:00:52,920 --> 01:00:57,680
Speaker 1: merely ashes, which is like her whole thing was that

956
01:00:57,880 --> 01:01:01,360
Speaker 1: the whole purpose of life is to just marvel at

957
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:04,000
Speaker 1: everything you can, grab as much of it and experience

958
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:07,600
Speaker 1: as much of it as you can. And I agree

959
01:01:07,640 --> 01:01:10,160
Speaker 1: with that philosophy on many made her very selfish. I

960
01:01:10,160 --> 01:01:12,480
Speaker 1: think a lot of people in this time period felt

961
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:14,600
Speaker 1: that way, and that's why they were bad parents, because

962
01:01:14,600 --> 01:01:15,800
Speaker 1: they were like, I don't want to be a parent.

963
01:01:15,840 --> 01:01:19,120
Speaker 1: You're tying me down, you know, which is like, well,

964
01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:21,440
Speaker 1: you're you shouldn't had a kid. Well, and that's the

965
01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:23,560
Speaker 1: difference to now where people are sort of having that

966
01:01:23,640 --> 01:01:26,800
Speaker 1: same feeling, and so they're opting out of having children

967
01:01:27,200 --> 01:01:30,480
Speaker 1: opposed to having one and ignoring them. Yeah. Yeah, and

968
01:01:30,520 --> 01:01:33,520
Speaker 1: these kids were fucked up by how shitty their parents were,

969
01:01:33,680 --> 01:01:38,960
Speaker 1: so they definitely were not people. Um, but I think

970
01:01:39,000 --> 01:01:40,960
Speaker 1: that's so interesting that she was sort of like what

971
01:01:41,040 --> 01:01:44,040
Speaker 1: she really wanted was to see and experience as much

972
01:01:44,040 --> 01:01:47,600
Speaker 1: of the world as she could, and she simply could

973
01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:51,800
Speaker 1: not do that as a again, not independently wealthy woman

974
01:01:52,640 --> 01:01:55,600
Speaker 1: in the world, since it's not how society let you be.

975
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:58,200
Speaker 1: And so she was like, well, I guess I should

976
01:01:58,280 --> 01:02:00,840
Speaker 1: get married, partly because I love the person, of course,

977
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:03,840
Speaker 1: but also because I can't just enjoy them and enjoy

978
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:05,800
Speaker 1: my life the same way that, Like maybe she's a

979
01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:08,280
Speaker 1: little jealous of Willie and Henri who could be married

980
01:02:08,320 --> 01:02:10,560
Speaker 1: and also run around and do whatever they wanted. Well,

981
01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:14,480
Speaker 1: and doesn't it remind you of just today, like just

982
01:02:14,560 --> 01:02:17,640
Speaker 1: the idea of a job at all from like all

983
01:02:17,680 --> 01:02:20,520
Speaker 1: I want to do is travel and explore and see

984
01:02:20,520 --> 01:02:24,080
Speaker 1: ship and meet people and eat food and all kinds

985
01:02:24,120 --> 01:02:26,400
Speaker 1: of crazy things like that, and just experience as much

986
01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:29,720
Speaker 1: as I can, But I can't do that if I

987
01:02:29,760 --> 01:02:34,200
Speaker 1: don't attach myself to a job. But if I attached

988
01:02:34,240 --> 01:02:36,360
Speaker 1: myself to a job, I can't do that as much,

989
01:02:36,720 --> 01:02:39,040
Speaker 1: you know. So that's the closest I can relate to

990
01:02:39,080 --> 01:02:41,439
Speaker 1: this notion of like, well, yeah, I can get married,

991
01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:44,200
Speaker 1: but then I'm a wife. But at least as a wife,

992
01:02:44,200 --> 01:02:48,000
Speaker 1: I'll have more opportunities to be free than if I

993
01:02:48,040 --> 01:02:52,080
Speaker 1: were free from being a wife. It's very frustrating. It's

994
01:02:52,120 --> 01:02:54,800
Speaker 1: two different which constriction am I willing to live under?

995
01:02:55,000 --> 01:02:58,880
Speaker 1: Because it's either societies or societies and just two different things,

996
01:02:59,000 --> 01:03:01,880
Speaker 1: which one nets me a greater life experience. And aren't

997
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:04,480
Speaker 1: we all asking that question every day? It's true, you know,

998
01:03:04,680 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 1: it's very true. I love it. I hope y'all are

999
01:03:07,080 --> 01:03:10,960
Speaker 1: loving it as well. We've got more for Collette next week.

1000
01:03:11,880 --> 01:03:14,640
Speaker 1: It just keeps on. She's a gift that keeps on

1001
01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:16,600
Speaker 1: getting she really is, And we'll break it up with

1002
01:03:16,640 --> 01:03:19,640
Speaker 1: another episode this at the end of this week with

1003
01:03:19,680 --> 01:03:21,960
Speaker 1: some other cool things. But please let us know your

1004
01:03:21,960 --> 01:03:25,400
Speaker 1: thoughts about Collette, your suggestions for other stories. Yeah, keep

1005
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:28,880
Speaker 1: those segment ideas. Yes, we've gotten a couple of good

1006
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:32,439
Speaker 1: ones already, so keep them coming um and we would

1007
01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:35,480
Speaker 1: love to hear from you. Please email us ridic Romance

1008
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:38,160
Speaker 1: at gmail dot com right or you can find us

1009
01:03:38,200 --> 01:03:41,480
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Instagram. I'm at Dianamite Boom and I'm

1010
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,480
Speaker 1: at Oh Great, It's Eli. The show is at riddic Romance.

1011
01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:46,920
Speaker 1: Don't forget to drop us a review on Apple Podcasts,

1012
01:03:47,160 --> 01:03:49,919
Speaker 1: rate us on Spotify wherever you else see a rating,

1013
01:03:49,960 --> 01:03:51,640
Speaker 1: Throw one down and we will catch you all the

1014
01:03:51,680 --> 01:03:54,320
Speaker 1: next episode. Thanks for spending your time with us today.

1015
01:03:54,400 --> 01:03:58,520
Speaker 1: We love you By solo friends, It's time to go.

1016
01:03:59,040 --> 01:04:03,040
Speaker 1: Thanks solos listening into our show. Tell your friends neighbor's

1017
01:04:03,120 --> 01:04:06,160
Speaker 1: uncles in dance to listen to a show ridiculous roll

1018
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:09,800
Speaker 1: dance m hm