Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to Woke f Daily with
Speaker 1: Me your Girl Danielle Moody, recording not So live from
Speaker 1: our Podstream Studios. Folks, I am taking one more quick day.
Speaker 1: I will be back live on Tuesday, but I'm hoping
Speaker 1: that you will get in to this really important conversation
Speaker 1: with trans actress Alexandra Gray about what it means to
Speaker 1: be both black and trans in Hollywood, to be pursuing
Speaker 1: a career in an industry that doesn't oftentimes see you
Speaker 1: or appreciate you. And it's particularly in a society that
Speaker 1: doesn't want to see trans people or appreciate trans people
Speaker 1: and instead creates policies to shrink them. And so in
Speaker 1: this conversation, Alexandra and I unpack a lot of recent
Speaker 1: news around homophobia and transphobia within hip hop culture that
Speaker 1: we have seen, and we talk about the responsibility that
Speaker 1: you have as an activist to uphold and hold an
Speaker 1: entire community and how that presents both a burden but
Speaker 1: also a privilege to be able to do that work.
Speaker 1: So I hope that you enjoy my conversation with the
Speaker 1: fabulous and beautiful and brilliant Alexandra Gray. I am so
Speaker 1: excited to welcome to okay A for the first time
Speaker 1: actress activists, just amazing all around person. Alexandra Gray, who
Speaker 1: I had the pleasure. What feels like girl, Oh, I
Speaker 1: don't know, it feels like a hundred years ago. When
Speaker 1: we met at Sundance, I guess it was it twenty twenty. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was January twenty twenty. So we yeah, yeah, we
Speaker 1: we were the start. We were the Petrie Dish is
Speaker 1: what everybody says. You know, we were the one that
Speaker 1: you know, got her body inspected. We literally had no
Speaker 1: idea that in but two months the world would be
Speaker 1: turned upside down. And it was so wonderful to get
Speaker 1: to meet you, um in that panel discussing you know
Speaker 1: what it's like to be young black queer um and
Speaker 1: navigating you know, this this industry, this this this work,
Speaker 1: doing this work. Um, you have been doing so much.
Speaker 1: I don't even know where to begin, but I actually
Speaker 1: just want to start off with Alexandra, how have you
Speaker 1: been feeling these days? You know, like there has been
Speaker 1: I mean in the midst of living in this health pandemic.
Speaker 1: You know, they haven't stopped killing black people, haven't stopped
Speaker 1: killing black trans women, Um, you know, there is so
Speaker 1: much good that I have seen through this pandemic, so
Speaker 1: much I have gratitude for, but then so much that
Speaker 1: makes me so deeply grief stricken, and so I just
Speaker 1: want to, you know, start off by saying, like, how
Speaker 1: have you been managing during this time? You know, I
Speaker 1: was doing okay for a minute, like after we got
Speaker 1: the vaccines, are thought things that we're going to get better.
Speaker 1: And then now and just in terms of COVID now
Speaker 1: with the delta variant coming around, it's been it's been
Speaker 1: a lot because it's it feels like things are not
Speaker 1: progressing and we haven't really learned from our mistakes and
Speaker 1: so that has that made me feel uneasy. But in
Speaker 1: terms of the social issues that are continuing to plague
Speaker 1: our country, UM, yeah, it's just it's trash at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, and I can't. I mean, just
Speaker 1: today I saw another black trans woman murdered, Um, you
Speaker 1: know and bye bye by man, and it just you know,
Speaker 1: it feels like it's hard to kind of stay hopeful,
Speaker 1: but I mean you have to. But when you see
Speaker 1: stuff like that, you know that's someone that's just like me.
Speaker 1: So it just it's scary. You know, I can't. I
Speaker 1: can't live my life and here. But it's it's it's
Speaker 1: tough because every time I feel like I'm always looking
Speaker 1: over my shoulder because I'm like, well, I'm Alexandre Gray.
Speaker 1: You know, people may know that I'm trans, right, and
Speaker 1: if they decide to have an issue with me for
Speaker 1: whatever reason, that could that be me. It's like so
Speaker 1: a lot of anxiety, um, but just really trying to
Speaker 1: stay positive and hopeful that you know, we're gonna keep
Speaker 1: talking about these issues. We're gonna keep calling people out
Speaker 1: on this stuff homophobia and transphobia, and that it will
Speaker 1: change and get better. You know, how has it been
Speaker 1: because you have been gracing covers of magazine, We have
Speaker 1: seen you know, beautiful trans women of color, black trans
Speaker 1: women in Hollywood really rising? Right? What is it like
Speaker 1: to kind of be at this moment where there is
Speaker 1: both more of a positive right. I mean, I don't
Speaker 1: want to put words in your mouth. I see it
Speaker 1: as more of a positive reflection of where society is trending.
Speaker 1: When we can celebrate artists like yourself and actresses like
Speaker 1: yourself as well as Angelica Ross as well as Laverne Cox,
Speaker 1: as well as Janet Mock and others that are creating
Speaker 1: such beautiful work right and and paving a pathway where
Speaker 1: I would argue five years ago, ten years ago was
Speaker 1: non existent right in in a lot of ways. And
Speaker 1: so what does it feel like to be part of this,
Speaker 1: this incredible movement and moment. Well, I definitely, I'm obviously
Speaker 1: very blessed. I'm so every day I wake up. And
Speaker 1: two words that I live by our gracing gratitude. There
Speaker 1: was something an actress taught me on the set was
Speaker 1: to always have gracing gratitude. And so of course they're politics, right,
Speaker 1: So just because I am trans and I'm working in
Speaker 1: trans Hollywood, if you will, I'd be foolish to think
Speaker 1: that there wouldn't be politics, and there would be colorism, racism,
Speaker 1: you know, agism, all those things. And so I will
Speaker 1: say that there are days where it's tough. I feel
Speaker 1: like Dorothy Dandred and Hattie McDaniel, like trying to do
Speaker 1: the impossibles. And then some days I am very much like, Wow,
Speaker 1: we're making a lot of progress. But I will say
Speaker 1: too that I'm honored. Right, I remember ten years ago
Speaker 1: when I got disowned from my family and I was homeless,
Speaker 1: and I remember seeing Laverne Cox, you know, out there
Speaker 1: grinding and really trying to make it as an actress,
Speaker 1: and I said, I'm gonna be like her. And so
Speaker 1: I think to even be sitting here in this moment
Speaker 1: with you and for you to mention my name with
Speaker 1: the likes of her, it's like, wow, you know, full
Speaker 1: circle moment, Like that's really cool. But I will say
Speaker 1: that I'm very humbled and grateful. I know, even just
Speaker 1: five years ago when I really got started do start
Speaker 1: TV that you know, there weren't an abundance of trans
Speaker 1: characters like there are, and now we're starting to see
Speaker 1: trans characters in series regular roles, leading roles, more recurring roles.
Speaker 1: And when I started, I can count on the time
Speaker 1: that I was the only trans person on time. So
Speaker 1: now it's a blessing to see that we're making so
Speaker 1: much progress. So I'm super honored to I mean, you
Speaker 1: have been a series of regular on Empire, you have been,
Speaker 1: you know, on leading shows on CBS. Do you feel
Speaker 1: like there is a um a lot more character development
Speaker 1: around what you're being offered, meaning that it's not just
Speaker 1: these you know, stereotypical roles like when we you know
Speaker 1: that it is You're able to really show the breath
Speaker 1: and depth of your talent now or do you still
Speaker 1: feel like you're breaking out of what the perceived notions
Speaker 1: and boxes are when people do know that you are
Speaker 1: obviously black and trans you know, do you feel limited
Speaker 1: or do you feel like that kind of barrier is
Speaker 1: being released a bit? You know, I'll say, well, I've
Speaker 1: never been a series of regular yet, but I appreciate
Speaker 1: the foreshadowing. Okay, let me foresiate I did it. You
Speaker 1: know what. I did the same thing to lean Away
Speaker 1: and I said that. I said, oh, Emmy before she
Speaker 1: had anything, and She's like, I'm not there yet, Danielle,
Speaker 1: And I said, okay, so just say that. I appreciate
Speaker 1: that you are speaking that to me. Um, but I
Speaker 1: have had significant recurring roles, like I've recurred on many
Speaker 1: many shows, so I know that it's coming, and so
Speaker 1: I really appreciate you saying that. UM, but I do
Speaker 1: feel I will say, the last show that I worked on,
Speaker 1: The Giver, which is an action adventure series. I'm like,
Speaker 1: what is this black girl doing in the middle of
Speaker 1: this action show on CBS? But I really that that
Speaker 1: was the closest that I felt, and for the first
Speaker 1: time in any of the roles that I've done where
Speaker 1: I felt like an intricate part of the story, meaning
Speaker 1: that if I wasn't in the episode, that you couldn't
Speaker 1: tell the episode. Usually like on Empire. I loved it
Speaker 1: because I got to play a superstar, but my storyline
Speaker 1: was kind of working in conjunction with like the main storyline.
Speaker 1: So it's like all the main characters have this world
Speaker 1: they're in and I'm kind of have my own trans
Speaker 1: black story over here. Got it. And with mcgeiver, it
Speaker 1: was great because it was like I was a part
Speaker 1: of main cast. Baby, Okay, she was in the war
Speaker 1: room solving the case. Come on, it was like you
Speaker 1: needed her. And so I love that because it gave
Speaker 1: the spread my wings as an actor and artist and
Speaker 1: so I and so I feel like that's progress. You
Speaker 1: know that I shot that during during the pandemic um
Speaker 1: and I think we're making just more progress. So I'm
Speaker 1: excited to see the roles that continue to come because
Speaker 1: I don't mind plan trans roles. Okay, So that's that's
Speaker 1: what's gonna be that this is going to be my
Speaker 1: next question to you, though, is you know do you
Speaker 1: know you say that you don't mind? Do you is
Speaker 1: the do you want to mix right of just being
Speaker 1: able to to not also play your play your identity
Speaker 1: but just also just play a part. Or does it
Speaker 1: or or or do you enjoy it? Do you enjoy both?
Speaker 1: I would enjoy both. I've only haven't played a non
Speaker 1: trans character once on How to Get Away with Murder
Speaker 1: shout out to Viola Day because it was her birthday yesterday.
Speaker 1: Okay home grass I now my goodness. Um. But so
Speaker 1: I've played a non trans character for the first time
Speaker 1: on that show, first and only time out of my
Speaker 1: entire television career. So faro um. And so I feel
Speaker 1: like we are trying. Me and my team are trying
Speaker 1: to cross that kind of threshold of like getting people
Speaker 1: to be like, hey, she can place this, like cast her.
Speaker 1: But also I'm not dying to place this world's Like.
Speaker 1: I love playing trans characters. I think trans people are
Speaker 1: like unicorns, and they're beautiful humans, and um, we're so
Speaker 1: unique and different and I love telling those stories. I
Speaker 1: just don't necessarily want to always play the murderer or
Speaker 1: the junkie of the prostitute of the horror, But I
Speaker 1: would love to play a trans doctor or a trans lawyer,
Speaker 1: you know, and you know, but we have to. I
Speaker 1: don't mind playing the Nazo glammorous role, so I appreciate
Speaker 1: that I've done that, but I also would like to
Speaker 1: go further and show trans people in all aspects of
Speaker 1: the world, because we exist in all aspects, you know.
Speaker 1: I was watching a really amazing interview recently that went viral,
Speaker 1: and I don't know if I think I got it.
Speaker 1: I saw it initially on Angelica Ross's page on Instagram,
Speaker 1: and it was the writer and the activists alack men
Speaker 1: one and they were talking about just exactly what you
Speaker 1: mentioned about trans people being a reflection right of the
Speaker 1: freedoms that other people do not think that they have
Speaker 1: to show up as they as their truth right. And
Speaker 1: what makes people feel those that are anti, those that
Speaker 1: are that are that are transphobic, and what have you
Speaker 1: feel a certain way is that you have the audacity
Speaker 1: to live in your truth right, to show up and
Speaker 1: be a reflection of the absence of that for the
Speaker 1: larger quote unquote mainstream community. Do you feel that way?
Speaker 1: Do you like the way in which there are so
Speaker 1: much transphobia and even within the lgbt Q plus community
Speaker 1: that there still remains. And I tell people that because
Speaker 1: they're like, oh no, that can't possibly be. And I
Speaker 1: was just like, oh, well, clearly you haven't done any
Speaker 1: movement work um with the community, because I'm like, because
Speaker 1: I have, and I remember I found it absolutely shocking.
Speaker 1: I'm like, so we're gonna like either our own neglect
Speaker 1: our own, Like I just didn't understand that. But do
Speaker 1: you feel that way, like about people who are still
Speaker 1: so phobic right that it is about what they are
Speaker 1: missing as opposed to what you need to be elevating. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've been to lunch with like I was got lunch
Speaker 1: with the game and he was like, you know, I
Speaker 1: just don't really understand the whole trance thing, like and
Speaker 1: it was almost like he was reposed by I basically
Speaker 1: said to him, I was like dealing with a man
Speaker 1: that's not exactly cute either, if you want to try
Speaker 1: to get all me died, but you know, I mean
Speaker 1: I was a little bit more graphic, but I say,
Speaker 1: I don't like, you don't get it. It's like we're
Speaker 1: both problematic at the end of you want to if
Speaker 1: you if you're gonna say that I'm problematic, but people
Speaker 1: look at us the same. But anyways, I think at
Speaker 1: the end of the DA day, I think there are
Speaker 1: some people that do this for like attention, all these
Speaker 1: Karen videos or people saying the N word and all
Speaker 1: these people trying to keep chance people. I feel like
Speaker 1: some of these people, and it's a very small percentage
Speaker 1: of people are doing this because I think of the attention,
Speaker 1: they just want to bring attention. I don't think that
Speaker 1: some of these people are like actually like real racist.
Speaker 1: I think that some of these people are like, oh,
Speaker 1: I know that the like I think some people perform
Speaker 1: it and it's like I don't know if it's to
Speaker 1: go viral or if it's just like I have nothing
Speaker 1: else better to do with my life, so I'm gonna
Speaker 1: go to Trader Joe's and like, call you the INN word,
Speaker 1: like I just wish somebody. I wish somebody would. But
Speaker 1: than that, I think exactly I can't remember that person's name,
Speaker 1: but I saw those videos that they posted, and I
Speaker 1: thought that they laid it out so beautifully. I'm like
Speaker 1: kind of like disclosure, Like you need to watch that
Speaker 1: video in order to understand because the fact that people
Speaker 1: have a problem with Little nas X. Yeah, and all
Speaker 1: of this. It's like, to me, this is just a
Speaker 1: reflection of you, you know what I mean. The men
Speaker 1: that I've ever met that were repulsed by me or
Speaker 1: try to this gender me or make me feel bad
Speaker 1: ended up trying to get in my bed later on.
Speaker 1: So it's like the day, it's probably a reflection of you.
Speaker 1: And to see people living in their truth and then
Speaker 1: their authenticity. To walk out our doors every single day.
Speaker 1: To see Little nas X on the b EC Awards
Speaker 1: stage saying, f you, I'm going to kiss a man
Speaker 1: because that's my rights and I deserve to. It's like,
Speaker 1: of course that's gonna bother people because it's like, how
Speaker 1: dare you? You know, live your truth? That is it
Speaker 1: for Today's Woke, a f daily podcast to hear more
Speaker 1: from today's show, including my full interview with Alexandre Gray.
Speaker 1: Support me on Patreonton dot com, Slash Woke. Power to
Speaker 1: the people and to all the people. Power, get woke
Speaker 1: and stay woke as fuck. I'm back live tomorrow, folks,
Speaker 1: so buckle up.