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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel

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Speaker 1: one thirty two. A family whose daughter died on a

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Speaker 1: trip overseas looking for answers and pushing for her case

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Speaker 1: to be reopened. Twenty four year old of Jackie Castornellis

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Speaker 1: mysteriously died a February of two thousand thirteen. She was

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Speaker 1: working on board the seven Seas of Voyager off the

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Speaker 1: Northern coast of Australia. Twenty four year old girl and

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Speaker 1: good health, active, doesn't just fall asleep in the wake up.

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Speaker 1: Authorities in the Northern Territory investigated Jackie's death ruined she

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Speaker 1: died of a sudden unexpected death syndrome, but her parents

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Speaker 1: weren't convinced and asked for a second review. It's been

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Speaker 1: a constant fight and struggle to get information. A beautiful

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Speaker 1: young girl, absolutely gorgeous and talented, described as glamorous, and

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Speaker 1: when I look at her photos, I can see why

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Speaker 1: why she's described as a glamorous cruise ship singer. You know,

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Speaker 1: when you say a glamorous cruise ship singer, it sounds

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Speaker 1: like a grown lady. That this was a two year

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Speaker 1: old girl. A University of Hartford grad student who had

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Speaker 1: been working for a cruise line for two years and

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Speaker 1: her dream was to audition for Broadway when she got

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Speaker 1: home from the cruise ship. That's her big dream, and

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Speaker 1: she was making it. She was absolutely making it. I'm

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Speaker 1: talking about Jackie castrone Ellis from Groveland, Massachusetts. Jackie died

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Speaker 1: on the Seven Seas Voyager, a cruise ship, an upscale

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Speaker 1: cruise ship. I Nancy Grace, this is crime stories, and

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Speaker 1: I want answers every quote story we talk about. It's

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Speaker 1: not a story, it's real. These are real people and

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Speaker 1: during real hardship, and the least we can do is

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Speaker 1: try our best to investigate and shine a light on

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Speaker 1: what's happening and bring them justice if nothing else. I'm

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Speaker 1: talking about the mystery death of a glamorous cruise ship singer,

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Speaker 1: a young American girl just graduated from college and really

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Speaker 1: headed to Broadway. What happened on this cruise ship? Joining

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Speaker 1: me right now are her parents, the parents of Jackie

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Speaker 1: castron Ellis, Kathy and Mike castrin Ellis. Also with me,

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Speaker 1: Michelle Barton, the mother of a just the most handsome

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Speaker 1: young college student's son who mysteriously passed away, Dave mac

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Speaker 1: syndicated talk show host Lee Egan, crime online investigative reporter,

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Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan forensics investigator, and Karen Stark psychologists joining

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Speaker 1: us out of New York, and of course my buddy

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Speaker 1: Alan Duke from l A. I first want to go

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Speaker 1: to Kathy and Mike Castornellis. First of all, thank you

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Speaker 1: for being with us. So many parents deal with the

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Speaker 1: loss of their child. And I've got to tell you,

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Speaker 1: Kathy and Mike, when my fiance was murdered, I thought

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Speaker 1: I knew everything there was about grief and pain. I

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Speaker 1: thought I knew it all. But now, all these years later,

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Speaker 1: that I have a son and a daughter, I just

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Speaker 1: don't know how you keep going, Kathy, What keeps you

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Speaker 1: going every day? How do you get the strength to

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Speaker 1: put one ft in front of the other. It's it's

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Speaker 1: sort of hard to explain. I guess the best way

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Speaker 1: to say it is, Uh, you you realize really quickly

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Speaker 1: that you're you're in a really deep hole and that

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Speaker 1: it's it's really going to be difficult. And our family

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Speaker 1: has always been really close, UM, and I think we

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Speaker 1: just we just drew together even closer UM during those

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Speaker 1: first few months. UM. One of our sons was at

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Speaker 1: the time finishing his senior year in college, and and

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Speaker 1: he he came home after college and spent some time

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Speaker 1: living at home for a while for a few months

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Speaker 1: as he started his first job. I think just to

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Speaker 1: just for us all to be together more, and it

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Speaker 1: really helped um. You know, obviously you don't just sit

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Speaker 1: at home and figure it out. We you know, I thought,

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Speaker 1: I thought a therapist. I talked to people, I I

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Speaker 1: exercised a ton. I think that was what kept me

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Speaker 1: sleeping at night. And I think that we just we

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Speaker 1: lead on each other, and we just had an incredible

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Speaker 1: amount of support from our families and our friends and

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Speaker 1: our community. And just all of that support meant more

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Speaker 1: than we can ever express in a card or thank

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Speaker 1: you note. It just it just meant everything. You know.

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Speaker 1: I'm looking at Jackie's photo right now, and she's absolutely beautiful.

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Speaker 1: Mike castan Ellis and Kathy Kathleen Kathy is what are

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Speaker 1: both with us? Jackie's parents, Mike, I know it must

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Speaker 1: have been hard, Like I dread the day that my

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Speaker 1: children go off to college. I mean, God willing they

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Speaker 1: go to college? Okay? Number one and number two, Yes, Mike,

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Speaker 1: I know it's healthy that they grow up and move away.

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Speaker 1: Not healthy for me, healthy for them. But I dread

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Speaker 1: it when your daughter announced that she was going to

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Speaker 1: get a job as a I just have to keep

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Speaker 1: saying it glamorous, because she is glamorous when she's got

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Speaker 1: on her performing outfits and she's singing up on the stage,

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Speaker 1: just like wow. But she told you that she was

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Speaker 1: going to go on a cruise ship and entertained for

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Speaker 1: a living and will be gone most of the time.

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Speaker 1: What did you think? Well? Uh? I actually, uh, I

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Speaker 1: travel the world a great deal with my profession, and

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Speaker 1: I thought initially I had the reservations of her going

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Speaker 1: out in her own like that, but she was, she

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Speaker 1: was living her dream, and I really I think we

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Speaker 1: both felt that this was really an opportunity for not

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Speaker 1: just to see the world, but to pursue her dream

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Speaker 1: uh as a singer, actor, dancer. Um, what is your business, Mike?

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Speaker 1: Why do you have to travel somehom an airline pilot? Uh? Okay,

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Speaker 1: Well that makes sense. Um okay. So I'm looking at

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Speaker 1: the photos of her singing right now, and she's got

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Speaker 1: on this beautiful gold dress, shiny long dress. And here's

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Speaker 1: one of her black long sequence dress, singing with this

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Speaker 1: big smile on her face. Kathleen, did you feel the

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Speaker 1: same when Jackie announced that she was taking a job

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Speaker 1: with a cruise line. Um, we were excited for her.

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Speaker 1: I mean, she she had it together. You know, she

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Speaker 1: knew what she needed to do. She had down to

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Speaker 1: New York City. She had gotten a job, as all

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Speaker 1: actresses do, waitressing, um, in order to audition during the daytime.

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Speaker 1: And within six months she said this was the opportunity

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Speaker 1: she wanted. Um. She thought this would get her out

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Speaker 1: there and Albert and she was making contacts on her

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Speaker 1: first cruise and it was difficult having her away so much,

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Speaker 1: but UM, thank god for the Internet. We skyped with

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Speaker 1: her all the time, so we were in touch with

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Speaker 1: her on a really a lot. We were in touch

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Speaker 1: with her a lot. She kept in touch with us

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Speaker 1: on a very very frequent basis. What we know right now,

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Speaker 1: Dave matt joining a syndicated talk show host, is that

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Speaker 1: seemingly the investigation into her surprise death was completely bungled.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you've got three men on board that I'm

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Speaker 1: interested in. Once she used to date, I was very

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Speaker 1: jealous of her when she was dating and there was

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Speaker 1: a third guy, and and this is a nice young girl.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know the backgrounds of these guys. You're right,

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Speaker 1: question that, Nancy. Look, this idiot who did the investigation

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Speaker 1: to start with, bungled it forever, messed with it for

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Speaker 1: fourteen months and came up with sudden Unexpected death syndrome

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Speaker 1: without bothering you were just wait a minute, Wait a minute.

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Speaker 1: Joe's Goot Morgan, death investigator and professor of forensics at

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Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University. I've never heard of that applied to

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Speaker 1: an adult. It sounds like sid's sudden infant death syndrome.

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Speaker 1: When there's an unexplained death. That's that's not working for

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Speaker 1: me with a twenty four year old girl that was

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Speaker 1: absolutely imperfect health. Yeah, it's it's a it's kind of

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Speaker 1: a diagnosis of last resort. I've I've worked, you know,

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Speaker 1: having worked at the Corners office in New Orleans and

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Speaker 1: with the medical Examiner in Atlanta over the years. I

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Speaker 1: am aware of this diagnosis. But it is a diagnosis

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Speaker 1: of elimination when every everything else fails. And they did

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Speaker 1: wait for an extended period of time. And just so

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Speaker 1: that you know, I'll break this down in very simplistic

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Speaker 1: terms for the audience. This is characterized by what's referred

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Speaker 1: to as a cardiac arrhythmia, and essentially what that means

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Speaker 1: is that the heart will go into a dys rhythmic

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Speaker 1: event where the electronic uh impulses if you will, that

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Speaker 1: are causing the heart to beat begin to beat irregularly.

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Speaker 1: And that's simply what they're saying that the heart simply

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Speaker 1: in Layman's terms, pray stop, okay, because I'm not buying

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Speaker 1: that this. Let me confirm, Kathy and Mike, did she

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Speaker 1: have a heart condition that you know of? So Joe Scott.

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Speaker 1: Bottom line, it sounds to me like they buggled the

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Speaker 1: investigation and so they said she had a bad heart.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's a cold agen h e double l

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Speaker 1: that a healthy two year old girl just suddenly dies

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Speaker 1: in her sleep. I'm not buying that. What what? What

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Speaker 1: more do we know? First of all, I want to

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Speaker 1: go back to Kathy castor Ellis, this is Jackie's mom.

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Speaker 1: When did you learn that Jackie had passed away? We

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Speaker 1: learned from Gene and Ryan Productions, the talent scalp that

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Speaker 1: had high that had found her and we received a

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Speaker 1: call about eleven PM, so that would have been in

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Speaker 1: their time. It would have been maybe I think three

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Speaker 1: or four in the afternoon in Australia, which means they

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Speaker 1: knew about it for I don't know, over six hours

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Speaker 1: before they before we received any contact. What did they

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Speaker 1: tell you had happened, Kathy Um? They didn't know at

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Speaker 1: that point. It was just Gene and Ryan Um. She was,

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Speaker 1: she was in tears. She she knew Jackie or she

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Speaker 1: had worked with her for three contracts and this being

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Speaker 1: the third, and she was devastated and in tears and

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Speaker 1: just said they just didn't know what had happened Um,

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Speaker 1: and that she was heartbroken. And she was. I'm sure

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Speaker 1: she was. But it took us a while to get

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Speaker 1: any information that about anything that had occurred. I think

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Speaker 1: it was a few days before we heard from the

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Speaker 1: investigator detect the penemies and in UM Australia. And one

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Speaker 1: thing is concerning me, David matt Well, there are a

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Speaker 1: lot of things about Jackie's untimely death that are red

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Speaker 1: flags to me. Number One, You've got the ex boyfriend

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Speaker 1: that she broke up with, ex boyfriend Roman Uh. There

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Speaker 1: is a crew member, Daniel that I'm looking at none

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Speaker 1: of these people have been named a suspect or a

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Speaker 1: person of interest. They are people connected to Jackie. Then

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Speaker 1: there is an engineer on board named Janice. But what's

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Speaker 1: concerning me, just right off the bat, Dave Matt, is that,

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Speaker 1: according to reports, allegedly Roman, the ex boyfriend that she

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Speaker 1: broke up with, and he's extremely jealous, according to reports,

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Speaker 1: lied in his first police interview all right, and denied

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Speaker 1: that he was ever jealous after seeing her and um,

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Speaker 1: the engineer Janice together on board. Now, there's absolutely nothing

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Speaker 1: wrong with this young lady having a boyfriend. She's beautiful,

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Speaker 1: she's talented, she's smart, she's headed to Broadway, and she

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Speaker 1: broke up with this guy and he just couldn't stand it,

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Speaker 1: according to reports. Now that's one thing, but lying to

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Speaker 1: police is a whole another can of worms if it's true,

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Speaker 1: Dave mac Well, Nancy, here's what we've got. You know,

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Speaker 1: we've got actual statements from each three, all three of

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Speaker 1: the guys that are involved in the police report and

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Speaker 1: the detectives report, and each one of them was not truthful.

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Speaker 1: Each one of these men was not telling the truth

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Speaker 1: all the way. And Roman, in particularly the ex boyfriend,

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Speaker 1: really has some problems here because as we know, when

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Speaker 1: you go on a cruise, you've got the key lock,

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Speaker 1: you know that where you swipe your card and that

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Speaker 1: key reader. They've got a track record of every time

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Speaker 1: the doors open and who opened it. They know when

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Speaker 1: these guys were in their rooms, when they were near

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Speaker 1: her room, and when this guy Roman, I mean Nancy,

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Speaker 1: he was all over the place between the time she

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Speaker 1: gets back to her room and he goes back to

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Speaker 1: his own room. He's in a WiFi place getting the bar,

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Speaker 1: but he can't explain why he's anywhere, but he's walking

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Speaker 1: around like he's panicked doing something. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: that's the guy who lied about being the incredibly jealous

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Speaker 1: boyfriend of this beautiful younger. That is the beginning of

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Speaker 1: my problems is with the ex Roman. Can you imagine her?

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Speaker 1: Jackie cast Analis is young American girl. She's on board

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Speaker 1: the cruise ship working. Little does she know she's in

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Speaker 1: the middle of an ocean. Was someone eaten up with

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Speaker 1: jealousy after their breakup with me? Are Jackie's parents Kathy

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Speaker 1: and Mike Castonnellis. I want to pause and thank our

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Speaker 1: I want to talk parent to parent. You know, we

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Speaker 1: keyword grace. That's pound two fifty and say grace. Now

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Speaker 1: back to the story of this young girl, Jackie castro

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Speaker 1: nellis okay, just gott Morgan. You're trying to tell me

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Speaker 1: that this young girl's death was a natural cause, and

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Speaker 1: I am not buying the parents. Just heard them say

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Speaker 1: she did not have a heart condition, and the condition

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Speaker 1: they're talking about would have probably been hereditary. Joe Scott, Oh,

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Speaker 1: let's back up a second. I'm not telling you that

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Speaker 1: the people in Northwest Territory are telling you that. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It's uh. No. I say it because I know what

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Speaker 1: the fallback position for a lot of these people that

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Speaker 1: do inadequate work is. I've been around them my entire

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Speaker 1: adult life, and this sounds like what I refer to

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Speaker 1: as a weasel diagnosis, and that means that they're trying

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Speaker 1: to hedge their bets. And this is a sad thing

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Speaker 1: when you're talking about a young girl's death that remains

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Speaker 1: unexplained up to this point. Uh. And I have a

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Speaker 1: real problem with this, um. And another big problem that

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Speaker 1: I have with this case, Nancy, is that when this

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Speaker 1: took place, UM, the corner as they're referred to in

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Speaker 1: this location, did not attend the scene. Uh. They were

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Speaker 1: completely depended upon the eyes and the ears of the

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Speaker 1: police at the scene. And this we have to go

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Speaker 1: back to this and examine this set of circumstances because

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Speaker 1: the police are not equipped to examine a case like

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Speaker 1: this that is multi layer, that's very thick with scientific uh, Dad,

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Speaker 1: But they have to that they have to uh sift

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Speaker 1: through euipment. Okay, hold on, you know what you're losing me.

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Speaker 1: You're losing me big time. I want to go through

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Speaker 1: what we know about that night, Dave, Matt. What do

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Speaker 1: we know about that night? What happened all right in

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Speaker 1: the hours? Um, the hour in question here from when

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Speaker 1: when she Jackie gets back to her to her room. Okay,

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Speaker 1: we've got three men all telling different stories about when

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Speaker 1: and where they were at the time that they Again,

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Speaker 1: Roman claims that he saw her with another man at

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Speaker 1: a time that is impossible based on her own room code,

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Speaker 1: her own key. Rather, we've got the engineer on the boat, Janice,

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Speaker 1: who also told a different story, claiming he was with

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Speaker 1: her much earlier. And we have another man, Daniel, who

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Speaker 1: was involved in some type of relationship with her according

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Speaker 1: to him, but again he also was not truthful about

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Speaker 1: the time. She was never tested for ketamine. They didn't

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Speaker 1: do a proper DNA test to rule out first responders

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Speaker 1: and to find out who actually was there that they

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Speaker 1: could go back to later on and actually figure out

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Speaker 1: what happened. Nancy, this is messed up from the beginning

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Speaker 1: to the very end. In my heartbreaks for the parents.

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Speaker 1: Another problem that I see to Kathy and Mike, who

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Speaker 1: were joining us, this is this is Jackie's parents. Is

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Speaker 1: that out on the high seas. It's a whole different

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Speaker 1: ball game because you cannot possibly go back and reconstruct it.

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Speaker 1: Uh at the end of that week, Well, of course,

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Speaker 1: now she was in a staff room, but there's a

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Speaker 1: turnover immediately and the room is sanitized and it's gone,

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Speaker 1: so it's very hard to reconstruct what happened. Kathy Um

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Speaker 1: she had her own room, that was her room, right,

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Speaker 1: So they're on there for months. That's that whole us

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Speaker 1: to Crewe us together for months, and we were promised

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Speaker 1: by the detective that if he had to fly to

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Speaker 1: China to reinterview people, that would be done, and that

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00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:12,680
Speaker 1: was never done. We were they made us so many

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Speaker 1: assurances um that they never did, they never followed up on,

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Speaker 1: and we didn't fully understand or realize all that until

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00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:23,560
Speaker 1: we finally saw this full report and we finally had

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Speaker 1: to get some people involved to understand this better than

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00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:28,280
Speaker 1: we do, to go through it with us and help

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Speaker 1: us understand it. So it's taken us years here of

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Speaker 1: trying to understand what is yourn with the investigation. I've

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Speaker 1: got a lot of concerns, But what are your concerns?

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Speaker 1: That they made a diagnosis based on heavily based on

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Speaker 1: witness statements, and as it's already been pointed out, you

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Speaker 1: know the same thing we know the witnesses, they're not

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Speaker 1: their contradictory. The statements are contradictory. It doesn't tell us

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Speaker 1: really where people were. It needs to be examined again,

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00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,359
Speaker 1: they have the cabin access records. Those can be reviewed again,

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00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:07,480
Speaker 1: they can get access to the people involved and reinterview

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Speaker 1: them and find out more surely where people were, and

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Speaker 1: they had other people they never interviewed that they could

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Speaker 1: have interviewed. Um, so they didn't get corroboration. What is

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Speaker 1: your understanding, Kathy, of Jackie's your daughter's movements the night

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Speaker 1: of her death. What happened? Did she perform that night?

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Speaker 1: Was it an off night? Did she go to dinner?

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Speaker 1: What do you know? Well, we know that we spoke

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Speaker 1: with her that afternoon. We skyped with her that afternoon,

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Speaker 1: and she was in good spirits and fine. She was

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Speaker 1: in between rehearsals, which is typical, and she told us

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Speaker 1: they were going to be important the next day at Darwin.

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Speaker 1: They were expected to be important Darwin the next day. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So Um, at the time we skyped whe her, she

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00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,399
Speaker 1: was just resting in her room and she said she

364
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Speaker 1: had to go back out. Um we assumed for another rehearsal. Um,

365
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,600
Speaker 1: we now understand that, um. In the The next thing

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Speaker 1: that she tended was a captain's party, which is typical

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Speaker 1: where they meet and greet the guests on the ship. Um,

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00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 1: and then following that, they had another rehearsal, a forty

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Speaker 1: five minute rehearsal, and then they received a late dinner

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Speaker 1: in the crew mass at eight thirty pm, which is

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Speaker 1: typical of of their schedule on the ship. And she

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Speaker 1: was at the dinner correct, Yes, yes she was. She

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Speaker 1: was fine at eight thirty Okay, Then what happened? Um?

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Speaker 1: Then that's when the reports are, you know, the time

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Speaker 1: of people remembering different times. They all went to the

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Speaker 1: um what are you called the crew lounge or the

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00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 1: crew bar, I'm sorry, the crew bar where they were

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Speaker 1: having a going to shore party because the ship had

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Speaker 1: been stuck out at sea with a typhoon. So this

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00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,200
Speaker 1: was after five days they were finally going to make sure,

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00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:52,639
Speaker 1: so the crew that was having a little bit of

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00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:56,000
Speaker 1: a going ashore party, so there were a lot of

383
00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:58,560
Speaker 1: people at the crew Barum. Jackie went down with the

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Speaker 1: cast members and she was sitting with the cast talking

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Speaker 1: with people. Then she left, presumably to go back to

386
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 1: her room, because she came back changed until like there

387
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,480
Speaker 1: was supposed to be a beach theme. She came back

388
00:23:10,520 --> 00:23:14,760
Speaker 1: in shorts and a beach shirt and floppy sandals and

389
00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 1: stayed at the bar and her cast members left. They

390
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,119
Speaker 1: said they saw her when they left a quarter of

391
00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:26,480
Speaker 1: twelve and the crew bar closes at one am, and

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Speaker 1: Jackie's cabin access shows that she entered her cabinet ten

393
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Speaker 1: of one. So and yet there's another access to her cabinet.

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Speaker 1: On who got access to her cabinet? Well, we don't

395
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:40,800
Speaker 1: know if that was her, if she went in and

396
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,439
Speaker 1: maybe I know from speaking to the other girls in

397
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,679
Speaker 1: the cast that sometimes they would leave their room to

398
00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: go upstairs to the I think it's the crew mess

399
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 1: that's kind of open all night with the cruise changing

400
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:53,880
Speaker 1: um because they can get internet up there when they're

401
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,040
Speaker 1: at sea sometimes. Did you repaid that last sentence? Okay,

402
00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,840
Speaker 1: So talking to her cast members, what they said, Well,

403
00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 1: maybe she went out of her room again to go

404
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:06,600
Speaker 1: upstairs with her to get access to the internet in

405
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 1: the crew mass. But there's no statements from anybody who

406
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 1: was at the crew mass who saw her. We would

407
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:14,360
Speaker 1: like to know. Let me ask you this, Why are

408
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:16,920
Speaker 1: you saying that she may have left her room? Are

409
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:20,439
Speaker 1: you just saying that her door opened nor her cabin

410
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,120
Speaker 1: was accessed again at one am? And we don't know

411
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:27,320
Speaker 1: how or why with her with her key. Yes, she

412
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:31,920
Speaker 1: has an individual card. Yes, so she was there at

413
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:36,439
Speaker 1: the end of the going shore party. It was closing down,

414
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 1: it was about and she leaves the party and goes

415
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:46,680
Speaker 1: to her room and you can tell that her cabin

416
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:50,520
Speaker 1: record shows okay, and then at one forty, which is

417
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:55,520
Speaker 1: about fifty minutes later she leaves, she comes back in

418
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:58,600
Speaker 1: her room again. Is that correct? Well, we don't know.

419
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 1: Then was it with her card? Well? Yes, I mean

420
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 1: they never collected the cards in the evidence, so I

421
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 1: don't know. Well, can they not tell whose card accessed

422
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:15,440
Speaker 1: her room? It was her card? Okay? So how about

423
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 1: use of the internet? Was there any use of her

424
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:23,880
Speaker 1: internet between one and one forty? We were that they said, no,

425
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:27,680
Speaker 1: we don't know. That doesn't really make any sense. What more,

426
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 1: Mike cast analysis is Jackie's dad? Do you know it's

427
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:35,920
Speaker 1: that murky time between one and one forty where somebody

428
00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 1: using her card comes back in her room and then

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00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 1: I guess it's the next day that she is found dead.

430
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:48,720
Speaker 1: What do we know about that time? She did not

431
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 1: access the internet? What about anybody else's key? Was she

432
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:57,840
Speaker 1: in any other part of the ship. There's no record

433
00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 1: of her leaving her room after that point in time,

434
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:05,800
Speaker 1: and there's no witnesses that saw her in any of

435
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:10,200
Speaker 1: the places in the crew areas and in her room.

436
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 1: It was it was they all have private rooms, don't they. Uh, well, yeah,

437
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 1: the the headliners get private rooms. Yes. Now, what do

438
00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 1: you make, Mike cast an Ellis of the guys that

439
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 1: the one roman that she had broken? Wait a minute,

440
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 1: why don't they have any surveillance cameras on a cruise ship? Mike, Well, uh,

441
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: We've been told again and again the cruise ships are do,

442
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 1: in fact have a great deal of video surveillance. However,

443
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:43,680
Speaker 1: on this ship, from what we have been told from

444
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: the Australian authorities, the crew areas on this ship did

445
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 1: not have videos. I had mentioned to you earlier that

446
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 1: I had we had taken the children on a Disney

447
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 1: cruise and everywhere I looked there was a camera looking

448
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:03,840
Speaker 1: right at me. Everywhere. I mean, you couldn't sneeze without

449
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:06,439
Speaker 1: a camera looking right at you. Now, granted I was

450
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 1: not in the crew areas, but it seemed to be

451
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,200
Speaker 1: blanketed with cameras. Mike, It's just really hard to believe

452
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:17,879
Speaker 1: that in the hallways like in hotels and uh, I

453
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:20,440
Speaker 1: know on the Disney Cruise in the hallways there were cameras.

454
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,960
Speaker 1: I didn't think anything of it. Might well not just

455
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:29,359
Speaker 1: that this is also the the starship of the fleet. Uh,

456
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,360
Speaker 1: they only have three ships, but this is the big one,

457
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,280
Speaker 1: UM and the newest, and you would think that they

458
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:40,200
Speaker 1: would certainly have that type of capability throughout the ship,

459
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:45,199
Speaker 1: because we professionals have told us that other cruise ships

460
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 1: have it in both the crew quarters as well as

461
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,919
Speaker 1: the public areas. But again what we've been told is

462
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,960
Speaker 1: that this ship, for some reason, there was nothing in

463
00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 1: the crew areas. So Kathy question, what do you make

464
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:03,640
Speaker 1: of these gentlemen. You've got the guy she broke up

465
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 1: with four months before, who we now here is allegedly

466
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 1: extremely jealous of her. There is the engineer Janice that

467
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 1: she had been seeing, and then there is a third

468
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 1: guy and he's kind of in the periphery. What what

469
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: is your understanding of these three guys? Um, I don't

470
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:26,080
Speaker 1: really have an opinion one way or the other. Accepted

471
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 1: say that I think that everyone who had access to

472
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 1: Jackie should be reinterviewed thoroughly. I mean, we never saw

473
00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 1: the first interviews that were done. They didn't release that

474
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,480
Speaker 1: information to us, So we don't know what was said

475
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:44,240
Speaker 1: in the first interviews as compared to the second interviews. Um.

476
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 1: Some of the interviews that have been released to us

477
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 1: are really interviews, they're just a signed statement, so we

478
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:53,600
Speaker 1: don't really know what was said. UM. So much information

479
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 1: just has not been given to us that we asked

480
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:59,320
Speaker 1: for repeated. Well, I know this much, Kathy, and let

481
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 1: me go to you on this. Dave Mack, indicated talk

482
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 1: show host the one guy that she had broken up with,

483
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 1: claims he saw her with the engineer Janice at one

484
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 1: forty a m. That would have been them either going

485
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:20,840
Speaker 1: in her cabin together to hang out or leaving her cabin.

486
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: But he says he saw her with Janice the engineer

487
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:29,680
Speaker 1: at one forty a m. And that does coincide with

488
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:35,040
Speaker 1: her cabin door being accessed by her by her own swipe. Um.

489
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 1: We also see an interest to Janie's cabin around twelve fifty,

490
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,160
Speaker 1: which is the same time about that she entered her

491
00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 1: cabin after the party. But we also know that he

492
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 1: lied according to reports. So I don't know that I

493
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: can believe anything he has to say. Dave mac I

494
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:53,120
Speaker 1: don't believe a word out of any three of those guys.

495
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 1: You know. The other part about it all, this, Nancy,

496
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 1: is the investigation was so incompetent that well, like after

497
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:02,280
Speaker 1: forty they just let the ship leave with all these

498
00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 1: three guys on there, without any DNA testing, without any

499
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 1: drug testing, with nothing, just let him go and say,

500
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 1: oh yeah, we'll chase him down wherever we need to,

501
00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 1: which we know they haven't. But back to the inconsistencies

502
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: on Roman, this is an interesting cat that he claims

503
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 1: he sees his ex girlfriend Jackie with Janice the cabin

504
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 1: guy at one forty in the morning, when we know

505
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 1: that his door was accessed fifty minutes earlier, not at

506
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 1: one forty. Then we have Jackie herself store accessed around

507
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 1: that same time that Roman claims he sees a couple.

508
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 1: Back up a minute, and now we've got romans own door,

509
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:37,400
Speaker 1: his access at one fifty in the morning to eight

510
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: in the morning and three thirteen in the morning. So

511
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,600
Speaker 1: we've got a guy that is a loose cannon, lies

512
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: about his relationship to Jackie to the police, denies he

513
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 1: has one. Then they've come back in little wait a minute,

514
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,360
Speaker 1: you're stalking her at one fifty. You're figuring something out here,

515
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,800
Speaker 1: So he's circling up and trying to do something. A minute,

516
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: want to I want to talk about what you just said.

517
00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 1: You're stalking her. That's what I'm looking at im now

518
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 1: that Hold on. At first I would say, hey, hey, hey,

519
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,239
Speaker 1: I don't know anything about any stalking. But if you

520
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:11,120
Speaker 1: think about it, what is he doing seeing them at

521
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,520
Speaker 1: one forty in the morning. How does he know what

522
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: she's doing at one forty in the morning. Hold on,

523
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 1: hold that thought just a moment, because I want to

524
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 1: thank our partner that is making our investigation into Jackie

525
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 1: castron ellis death possible. This young American girl, just twenty

526
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 1: four years old, her world before her dies on a

527
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:36,160
Speaker 1: cruise ship where she is working as a celebrity entertainer.

528
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 1: What happened our partner making this investigation possible. It is

529
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Speaker 1: link a k C. Christmas is right around the corner

530
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531
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Speaker 1: of the fun. Get the link a k C Smart caller.

532
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533
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534
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Speaker 1: KC caller is a GPS locator and the fitness Activity Tracker,

535
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539
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540
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541
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Speaker 1: a car. I can see exactly where he is right

542
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557
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558
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Speaker 1: go back to what happened the night that Jackie castro

559
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:19,520
Speaker 1: Nellis suffered very untimely death, I'm very, very dissatisfied with

560
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 1: what Australian police are saying to her American parents. I

561
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562
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579
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581
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:46,719
Speaker 1: everyone for joining us and listening today. Let me throw

582
00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 1: this to Karen Stark for now psychologists joining us out

583
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 1: of New York. Karen Stark, people use the term stalking

584
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: very very loosely. But and he has not been charged

585
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:58,279
Speaker 1: with stalking. But what is he what position is he

586
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:02,800
Speaker 1: in to be watching her at one forty in the morning,

587
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:06,319
Speaker 1: Karen Starr? How did that happen? What a coincidence? I mean,

588
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 1: if you see this cruise ship here in start it's huge.

589
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 1: He just happened to see them. It's all very suspicious, Nancy,

590
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:18,280
Speaker 1: stalk and behavior is really a barren behavior and criminal.

591
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,360
Speaker 1: You're not allowed to do that. And yet you wonder

592
00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:25,320
Speaker 1: at that time in the morning what he was doing

593
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: being aware of where she was in such as you said,

594
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:35,200
Speaker 1: it's a huge ship, and yet he happens upon her.

595
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 1: So this is all very suspicious. Just the lying alone. Yeah,

596
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:44,320
Speaker 1: I just find that quiet. The coincidence that he happens

597
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 1: to be exactly where she is, and combine that with

598
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 1: reports he is extremely jealous of her knee relationship and

599
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 1: she ends up dead. Uh no, no, no no. And

600
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 1: I find it interesting what Dave mac, syndicated talk show host,

601
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 1: was saying about him popping up with his swipe card

602
00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 1: all over the ship. Why what does he do? Is

603
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 1: he following them? What exactly is he doing? Or is

604
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:15,760
Speaker 1: something even more nefarious occurred? Does he know what happened

605
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 1: to Lee Egan, crime online reporter joining us Lee way In, Um,

606
00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:24,319
Speaker 1: I think there's something very strange with all three men.

607
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 1: I think all three need to be reinterviewed. I think

608
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: the Australian Police or whoever's handling this at this point,

609
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,400
Speaker 1: you need to do their job. They let these guys goum.

610
00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:36,280
Speaker 1: Do they even know where they are at this point?

611
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 1: I think Kathy said once in China? Do they know

612
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 1: how to find him? All three, all three of them

613
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 1: have to be reinterviewed and thoroughly know. This reminds me

614
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:47,880
Speaker 1: so much to Michelle Barton joining us. This is the

615
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: mother of Tanner Barton. Uh just uh scrubbed with sunshine,

616
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:58,440
Speaker 1: young college student who mysteriously passed away, and she has

617
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 1: been crusading ever to find the truth. Michelle, what Kathy

618
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: and Mike Castanlis are saying ring so true to your story?

619
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:12,719
Speaker 1: What is your advice? How do you keep going and

620
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:17,959
Speaker 1: keep that search for justice alive? Michelle? Well, my heart

621
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:21,279
Speaker 1: goes out to um, Mike and Cathy. It's awful. Um,

622
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:25,400
Speaker 1: God bless you. UM. It's I just pushed forward. I

623
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:30,800
Speaker 1: never ever stopped because Tanner, Tanna deserves more. Tanna deserves truth,

624
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:34,880
Speaker 1: Tanna deserves answers, and so does their daughter. So I

625
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:39,760
Speaker 1: just keep pushing, keep pushing, keep putting the spotlight on everyone.

626
00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 1: Like the investigation with Tanner, Michelle, there are so many

627
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 1: holes in the investigation of Jackie's death, and it's just

628
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:53,840
Speaker 1: very disheartening. How do you keep going and plugging away

629
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 1: trying to find out the truth, Michelle, I don't know.

630
00:37:57,160 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 1: By God's grace, I honestly, I just every day I

631
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 1: woke up. It's a it's a full time job. It's

632
00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:07,360
Speaker 1: twenty four hour job, seven days a week. I never stopped.

633
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 1: I never stopped well, listen to this what I am

634
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 1: learning as I investigate more and more into her death.

635
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:18,800
Speaker 1: I learned that police never examined the ex boyfriend romans

636
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 1: computers and the cruise ship ends up leaving Australia with

637
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:26,799
Speaker 1: the three men on board, all right, and the his

638
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 1: computer was never searched. I'm talking about his laptop, his iPad,

639
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:35,280
Speaker 1: his iPhone. They did not test the sheets and pillow

640
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 1: cases in her room for d NA. They didn't rule

641
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,319
Speaker 1: out the first responders. They did not check her cabin

642
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 1: for fingerprints. That is elementary, that is number one, you

643
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:53,359
Speaker 1: take fingerprints in DNA. The Northern Territory forensic examiners did

644
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:58,760
Speaker 1: not test her for the drug ketamine, which stunned her family. Also.

645
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: The family then goes on to organize an independent blood

646
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,879
Speaker 1: and tissue analysis to be done in the US where

647
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 1: they know that it will be done correctly, but the

648
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 1: police refused to cooperate. The US consulate had to get involved,

649
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:20,640
Speaker 1: and so what happened then, Cathy, after the consulate gets involved. Well,

650
00:39:20,680 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: this is where we are now, and this is why

651
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:25,080
Speaker 1: we appreciate you shining a light on this so strongly.

652
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:27,120
Speaker 1: We are in a position right now where the corner.

653
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:29,640
Speaker 1: There's a new corner. It's an elected office, I believe,

654
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:34,960
Speaker 1: and he's considering reopening the investigation. Um. What happened when

655
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 1: we tried to get the evidence moved here was that

656
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 1: there was open opposition by the pathologist who had done

657
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:43,640
Speaker 1: the autopsy. He did not want a second review a

658
00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:47,440
Speaker 1: lab technician. I don't like that, right there? Hold on,

659
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: Justice got Morgan, a death investigator and professor forensics. You

660
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:55,160
Speaker 1: know what when I was in the d a's office,

661
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:58,759
Speaker 1: you know, for ten years, I try cases constantly. We

662
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:02,360
Speaker 1: were on trial every other week. If I suddenly had to,

663
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:05,000
Speaker 1: uh say, I got a speedy child demand and I

664
00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 1: had to go forward with another case or else there

665
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:10,400
Speaker 1: be an acquittal, I had no problem handing my files

666
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:14,080
Speaker 1: over to somebody else saying, look, take this file, I've

667
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:16,680
Speaker 1: got it ready. Ask me anything you want to know.

668
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:19,080
Speaker 1: Get busy. It's going to go to trial in a

669
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: couple of weeks. And I'm I'm called off on a

670
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,880
Speaker 1: murder trial. I mean why, I mean, what's there to hide?

671
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:29,359
Speaker 1: Why doesn't he want another medical examiner to look at

672
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 1: the results. Why explain that to me? Joe Scott, There

673
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:34,960
Speaker 1: is no explanation for it. Nancy, the reality is this,

674
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:38,279
Speaker 1: you do, you work as a professional. You meet, you

675
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:42,120
Speaker 1: meet and exceed the standard by which you are are

676
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:46,400
Speaker 1: conferred that title of forensic pathologists. And you should not

677
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:48,759
Speaker 1: worry about what someone else is going to think about

678
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 1: the case. Let the chips fall where they may. This

679
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,080
Speaker 1: is a major problem with this case, and this backs

680
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 1: up all the way to the scene. Nancy. There is

681
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:58,040
Speaker 1: a there is a thread that runs through this thing

682
00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:01,399
Speaker 1: that stinks to high heaven. Even at university, at this

683
00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:04,640
Speaker 1: young age, I teach my students that every death, not

684
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 1: some death, but every death, all deaths are considered a

685
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:12,240
Speaker 1: homicide until proven otherwise. It goes back to the legal adage.

686
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 1: You can never unring the bell once you cross that

687
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:19,279
Speaker 1: threshold into that cabin. If you go in there slipshod

688
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:21,719
Speaker 1: and you just act as if this is just a

689
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 1: death and it's probably a natural death because we don't

690
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 1: see things overturned and and a struggle and all that

691
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 1: sort of thing. That assumption is going to wreck the

692
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 1: entire case. And it has made the life of these

693
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 1: parents pure hell at the hell hell. So the family

694
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:39,839
Speaker 1: has to go out the Caustionnellis have to go out

695
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:43,320
Speaker 1: on their own to organize independent blood and tissue analysis

696
00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:47,040
Speaker 1: in the US. At that time, the anti police Northern

697
00:41:47,120 --> 00:41:50,760
Speaker 1: Territory refused to cooperate the consulate. They have to call

698
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:55,560
Speaker 1: in the U s Consulate. So the Northern Territory Police

699
00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:59,640
Speaker 1: finally admit failure and they send a package of samples

700
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:06,080
Speaker 1: to their counterparts in Groveland, Massachusetts and to the FBI. Now,

701
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:10,360
Speaker 1: please tell me I'm wrong, Mike. When the FBI opens

702
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 1: the package, they find tissue samples, but the blood samples

703
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 1: and the autopsy photos are missing. That's correct, And the

704
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:24,560
Speaker 1: words of the FBI agent um the two most important pieces,

705
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 1: the blood sample and the autopsy photos, we're missing. I

706
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:35,000
Speaker 1: don't understand it. What is what is the Northern Territory Police?

707
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 1: What is that? Mike? Well, yes, the good question. Is

708
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:45,239
Speaker 1: that Australia the way we've heard it best described. Oh, yes,

709
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 1: it's it's a It's a section of the outback. It's

710
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:52,279
Speaker 1: very remote. Uh and Darwin is perhaps the only real

711
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:56,160
Speaker 1: big city in that area upon the So let me

712
00:42:56,200 --> 00:43:01,439
Speaker 1: understand my question, elis they come onto the up what's

713
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: the name of the ship again, Mike, the Seventh Seas Voyager,

714
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:10,160
Speaker 1: the Seventh Seas voyager and they what take over the investigation?

715
00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:12,960
Speaker 1: Is that what happened and then they boughtch it that's

716
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:22,879
Speaker 1: my understanding. Oh oh okay, So what's happening right now, Mike,

717
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:28,879
Speaker 1: what's happening with Jackie's case right now? Well, it's things

718
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:32,799
Speaker 1: have really uh broken open here over the last few

719
00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:35,719
Speaker 1: weeks as a result of an article that was in

720
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:41,040
Speaker 1: the Australian Sunday magazine UM and one of their reporters

721
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 1: had made contact with his Cameron Stewart, and he really

722
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 1: got things start moving forward again for us. We've been

723
00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 1: in a holding pattern really for the last two and

724
00:43:55,680 --> 00:44:00,439
Speaker 1: a half three years, with just resistance that every turn

725
00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:04,240
Speaker 1: corner UM. But this now we're starting to get people

726
00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 1: at least talking to us uh and people obviously are

727
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:11,240
Speaker 1: taking notice. I'm assuming that's how you also heard of

728
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:14,320
Speaker 1: I read about it. I heard about her case and

729
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:18,560
Speaker 1: that started investigating it. And I mean, what you've suffered

730
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:23,640
Speaker 1: with losing her is devastating, but then not knowing what

731
00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:28,000
Speaker 1: happened and having people I know it's not intentional, I'm

732
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:30,799
Speaker 1: sure it's just slipshod work, but it's almost as if

733
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:35,319
Speaker 1: they're sabotaging your search for what really happened and what's

734
00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:39,359
Speaker 1: really getting to me aside from that is claiming that

735
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:44,320
Speaker 1: she had some sort of a heart ailment mind. Um, yeah,

736
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,920
Speaker 1: the and you had mentioned it earlier that that type

737
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 1: of heart ailment is something that does have a genetic base.

738
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:56,759
Speaker 1: We've all been tested, both of her brothers as well

739
00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 1: as us, and we there's no evidence whoever, to support

740
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 1: that type of funding. Kathleen, when she was found, this

741
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:08,200
Speaker 1: is Kathy castornellis Jackie's mom. Did she have on her

742
00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:11,400
Speaker 1: pj's did she still have on the close you or

743
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:16,000
Speaker 1: to the beach party? Was she unclothed? Could you tell

744
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 1: if she had gotten ready for bed, like taking off

745
00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:21,720
Speaker 1: from makeup and all that. What do we know about

746
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:24,160
Speaker 1: the way she was found Kathy? Um, well, we didn't.

747
00:45:24,160 --> 00:45:26,800
Speaker 1: We know just from the witness statements of white, the

748
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,440
Speaker 1: the maid or whatever that went into her side, like

749
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:31,959
Speaker 1: initially a steward. I think it went to the cabin

750
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:34,359
Speaker 1: and opened it because her alarm was going off, her

751
00:45:34,440 --> 00:45:37,200
Speaker 1: alarm to wake up on her BlackBerry, and she wasn't

752
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:39,280
Speaker 1: where she was supposed to be, so they were concerned.

753
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:42,799
Speaker 1: And um, so she was in bed covered up, but

754
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:46,400
Speaker 1: she had on just her her black underwear typical for

755
00:45:46,440 --> 00:45:47,960
Speaker 1: her would be more of a T shirt and a

756
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:50,719
Speaker 1: pair of unaware of her bed, and she had all

757
00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 1: of her makeup on. Still, um, which is a little

758
00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:56,920
Speaker 1: not to that normal for not that normal. Known typically

759
00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: she takes good care of her skin. She's in the

760
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:03,799
Speaker 1: performance industry. Um, So, I mean, I just can't go

761
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,640
Speaker 1: to bed with makeup on my face. It just I

762
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 1: can't even stand the thought of it. But but but

763
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:16,000
Speaker 1: typically typically she would remove the makeup. Yes, and she

764
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:20,040
Speaker 1: didn't have on her customary T shirt. But that's not

765
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:23,360
Speaker 1: that alarming one way or the other. But they didn't

766
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 1: even pick up her clothing that she had worn that night.

767
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:30,560
Speaker 1: You would think they to test taken that into evidence.

768
00:46:30,600 --> 00:46:32,960
Speaker 1: And we did not know that. So when all this

769
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:37,120
Speaker 1: all they was shipped home, we you know, we donated it,

770
00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:40,440
Speaker 1: We dispensed of it, you know, except for some special items.

771
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:43,480
Speaker 1: We didn't realize that they would have shipped home clothing

772
00:46:43,520 --> 00:46:47,919
Speaker 1: that might have possibly been important. My stars, right, Yes,

773
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:52,239
Speaker 1: we didn't know. What can we do to help? Um? Well,

774
00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:54,759
Speaker 1: at this point I think that shining the light like

775
00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:57,759
Speaker 1: you did to bring it, keeping the public awareness on

776
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:02,239
Speaker 1: it shows the corners at UM, we're committed. This is

777
00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:04,880
Speaker 1: a new corner. This is not the corner that closed

778
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:08,239
Speaker 1: the case. UM. So it's a new corner. There's a

779
00:47:08,280 --> 00:47:14,080
Speaker 1: new attorney general, and we're hopeful that if we continue

780
00:47:14,120 --> 00:47:17,280
Speaker 1: to we're still communicating with them, We're trying, we're getting

781
00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:20,480
Speaker 1: information to them, We're trying to answer all their questions

782
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:24,120
Speaker 1: about why we think it should be reopened. And so

783
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 1: the more people that can weigh in, that can say,

784
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:29,839
Speaker 1: you know, as you had your experts say on the

785
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 1: air that this is not a standard for We had

786
00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:36,440
Speaker 1: pathologists from the FBI say that they typically deal with

787
00:47:36,520 --> 00:47:39,080
Speaker 1: death around the world and everybody shares information if it

788
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:42,320
Speaker 1: helps figure out why someone's child died, why wouldn't you

789
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:46,279
Speaker 1: share everything. Um. At this time, we're still looking for

790
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,719
Speaker 1: her blood sample. That's our biggest concern. We are that

791
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:54,080
Speaker 1: one of there is a statement. We don't have confirmation

792
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,680
Speaker 1: that perhaps one of the blood samples was actually destroyed

793
00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:00,319
Speaker 1: by the police. We're not sure, but we're I'm still

794
00:48:00,360 --> 00:48:04,000
Speaker 1: hopeful that if we continue to keep this in the spotlight,

795
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 1: that they will produce there were two blood samples, that

796
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:09,600
Speaker 1: there's a possibility that there's still a blood sample there.

797
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:13,760
Speaker 1: This is what I want. I want to know the truth.

798
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:19,719
Speaker 1: I want justice for Jackie's family. I don't buy some

799
00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:24,960
Speaker 1: hereditary heart elment. Something happened on that cruise ship and

800
00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:28,160
Speaker 1: we are calling out for the case to be reopened

801
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:31,520
Speaker 1: by the coroner. I want to take this moment and

802
00:48:31,600 --> 00:48:36,680
Speaker 1: thank our partner for making our serious sex in program possible.

803
00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:40,839
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804
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806
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807
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823
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824
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:06,919
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825
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:08,800
Speaker 1: Goodbye friend, h