1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:06,480 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff Mom Never told You. From how Supports 2 00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: dot com. Hello, welcome to the podcast. I'm Caroline and 3 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:22,680 Speaker 1: I'm Kristen, and today's episode is inspired by social media basically. Yeah, yeah, 4 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:26,600 Speaker 1: we're talking about the warrior women of Japan, women who 5 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 1: were in Japan's samurai class. Uh. And I have seen 6 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:35,720 Speaker 1: a lot of things being posted both on Tumbler and 7 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:42,239 Speaker 1: on Pinterest, these beautiful images of Japanese warrior women and 8 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:47,160 Speaker 1: even women dressed as samurai warriors in photographs. Yeah, there's 9 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,279 Speaker 1: one photo in particular that a lot of our listeners 10 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: have probably seen because, like you said, Caroline, it's everywhere 11 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: on Tumbler, pen dress, It's been shared on Twitter at nauseum, 12 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 1: and the reception is usually so cool. Here's a female 13 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: samurai look women were warriors too, so neat, and it 14 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: depicts a Japanese woman wearing armor and she's holding a 15 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,199 Speaker 1: helmet and she does look like she's ready for battle, 16 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 1: including her very impressive hairstyle with what looks like little 17 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:22,800 Speaker 1: flowers tucked in it. Because you know what, even though 18 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: you're going to the battle done, man, you have to 19 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:31,000 Speaker 1: look a mess. Um. But as Tracy and Holly are 20 00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:34,400 Speaker 1: our pals at our sister podcast Stuffy miss in History 21 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 1: Class have also noted this is not a female samurai, unfortunately, 22 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:42,840 Speaker 1: and you know, and it's it's kind of disappointing to 23 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 1: have to rain on what is such a fun parade. 24 00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:50,559 Speaker 1: But no, that the photo that a lot of people 25 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:56,559 Speaker 1: have probably seen is a kabuki performer. Yeah, she's an actress. 26 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:01,000 Speaker 1: She's she's dressed up incredibly for whatever play she's about 27 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 1: to act in. But she is not, in fact a samurai. 28 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 1: Nor is she an ona bog aisha or an ona musha, 29 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 1: which are the names for women warriors in Japanese culture. 30 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,000 Speaker 1: The ownA bu geisha is also known as the female samurai. 31 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:20,960 Speaker 1: But as we'll talk about, samurai is a gendered term, 32 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 1: and it is gendered male. It does not apply to ladies. 33 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 1: So in that case, so Caroline, does that mean that 34 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: calling this episode samurai women is misleading? Misleading but so 35 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 1: deliciously click baby. Okay, Well that's being so transparent with 36 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 1: our audience right now. Well, that's the thing. So when 37 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:46,120 Speaker 1: I did see um, not the photograph of the woman 38 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 1: in her armor, but I did see um beautiful Japanese 39 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 1: paintings of lady warriors. I was like, oh my god, 40 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: this is an amazing piece of history that I've somehow 41 00:02:56,800 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: missed out on. And yes, I definitely have miss out 42 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 1: on the history of women of the samurai class in Japan. 43 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 1: But as I as I started to dig around, and 44 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:10,000 Speaker 1: I even reblogged some stuff on Tumblr and which just like, 45 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:12,760 Speaker 1: should sminthy do this? This is definitely a topic that 46 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:18,200 Speaker 1: we should cover, I realized upon further digging that, oh, well, 47 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,840 Speaker 1: it's not that there were like armies of women going 48 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 1: into battle. It's just more that there were a lot 49 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:28,560 Speaker 1: of women of the samurai class who did train with weapons, 50 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 1: but it was more about defending the homestead, defending the castle, 51 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: helping their husbands defend the lord of the manner. Basically, 52 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 1: it was reminiscent to me as a far more intense 53 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 1: version of me taking self defense class as my p 54 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:52,080 Speaker 1: in college. It's like learning those kinds of tactics to 55 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 1: protect myself rather than dash out onto the streets and 56 00:03:56,960 --> 00:04:01,120 Speaker 1: sucker punch of a lot of dudes. I mean, I 57 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: hope you're not sucker punching anyone in general, but yeah, 58 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: so I wanted to know, like, who were these women, 59 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 1: how many of them were there were they literally just 60 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 1: housewives who had like a knife in the drawer to 61 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 1: protect themselves, had knives in their aprons. Yeah, what's so, 62 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 1: what's going on and what what's the true story? And 63 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 1: I was really interested to find out that the truth 64 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:27,280 Speaker 1: is somewhere between those things. A lot of people are like, yeah, 65 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:30,920 Speaker 1: Japanese women warriors, they're all over the place killing dudes. 66 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 1: And then there's this other side of the internet that's like, no, 67 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 1: they didn't. They weren't active at all. They were just housewives. 68 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 1: And so where are we going to be in the internet? 69 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 1: Are we in the middle saying, you know what, there 70 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:47,520 Speaker 1: were some housewives with daggers and not a lot of them. Yeah, 71 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 1: there were some, and there were some who did some 72 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 1: some neck chopping, as we'll talk about. But yeah, I 73 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:55,479 Speaker 1: wanted to kind of get to the bottom of who 74 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:58,920 Speaker 1: these women really were. And a part of understanding who 75 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:02,680 Speaker 1: they were and where they came from is understanding how 76 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 1: women were viewed and treated in Japanese society. Yeah, so 77 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 1: we're gonna have to give you, wait for it, some history. Oh, 78 00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 1: but this we need to lay this foundation for how 79 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 1: the warrior class developed and also how religion played a 80 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:26,400 Speaker 1: role and also developing governments, because I mean, this is 81 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:29,719 Speaker 1: we're looking at a lot of a lot of time here, Yeah, 82 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: and so we're gonna do our best to condense it, 83 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: but still try to give you perspective on how women's 84 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:39,919 Speaker 1: roles developed through ancient, medieval, and then early modern Japanese society. 85 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 1: So get ready, put your put your samurai helmet on, 86 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:46,119 Speaker 1: and let's go for a little red well I ride. 87 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:48,280 Speaker 1: Caroline starts in the good old days a k a. 88 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 1: Ancient history. Now, the very first documented evidence of attitudes 89 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 1: toward women are in these eighth century records called Kojiki 90 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:03,240 Speaker 1: and a Hungy, and it illustrates that women actually enjoyed 91 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 1: fairly high status, and this was partially thanks to Shintoism, 92 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 1: whose birth was related to the story of a sun 93 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 1: goddess named Amaterasu, who exemplified perfection, intelligence, beauty, fertility, and purity. 94 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 1: Just like Caroline, stuff mom never told you, that's right, 95 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:27,799 Speaker 1: And just like stuff mom never told you. Her feminine 96 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:33,240 Speaker 1: qualities culturally were really embraced and admired, especially on Facebook. 97 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:38,920 Speaker 1: Especially on Facebook. Yeah, nobody was telling her to uh 98 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 1: stop using up speak or vocal fry. You mean vocal fry. Yeah, 99 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,479 Speaker 1: oh my god. Um but yeah, it's just interesting to 100 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: see how religion, the influence and development of religion also 101 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:57,080 Speaker 1: affects the development of the way that women are viewed 102 00:06:57,120 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 1: and treated. Um. So, in the wake of the development 103 00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:05,080 Speaker 1: of Shinto is m, we get this pro lady mythology 104 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 1: that fosters pretty generally pro lady views in a relatively 105 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: matriarchal culture. Chinese records from the time, because those Chinese 106 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: had their nose and everything being the smarty pants worldpower 107 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 1: that they were, and their records show that not only 108 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 1: were women like cool, everybody's fine with women, but they 109 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,320 Speaker 1: were actually encouraged to rule and it was thought that 110 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 1: they would be peacekeepers, that they were chased and not 111 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: given to jealousy, which is definitely different from how I 112 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:37,280 Speaker 1: don't know a lot of people the stereotypes of women 113 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 1: just being jealous and gossipers. But back then people were like, yeah, women, great, 114 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: they're going to keep the peace and rule with an 115 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 1: even hand. And these Chinese records also discussed at the 116 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 1: beloved rulers pimmy co a k a himmy Ko. She's 117 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: the first known ruler of Japan who was thought to 118 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 1: be a descendant of that Sun goddess and her daughter Eo. 119 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:04,720 Speaker 1: But so we talked about how religion affected government and 120 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:09,680 Speaker 1: affected society, and women were considered as the go between 121 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 1: for deities and humanity in this religion, and men were 122 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 1: thought to be able to take those messages and put 123 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: them into action. And this is coming from a. Kana 124 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 1: Haruko's paper in the japan Christian Review from and she 125 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: writes that you've got men and women working together. Men 126 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 1: and women both could be rulers, and at the time 127 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:34,440 Speaker 1: the rulers were also priests, so power ended up being 128 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:39,840 Speaker 1: pretty evenly distributed relatively until the dawn of the imperial system, 129 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:43,320 Speaker 1: which consolidated power away from women. And Christen all of 130 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 1: this conversation about religion and women being empowered through religion 131 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:51,000 Speaker 1: reminded me of our conversation with Karacouti the Egyptologists talking 132 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:54,960 Speaker 1: about hat shops that and how she used her background 133 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:58,480 Speaker 1: in religion to sort of gain power and become queen. Well, 134 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:01,360 Speaker 1: and you just mentioned that with the dawn of imperialism, 135 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: power was consolidated away from women. But there's also this 136 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: instance of Empress Jingu in the third or fourth century 137 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 1: heading up an army possibly this might also be a myth, 138 00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: but weapons and armor were found in fourth century female 139 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 1: rulers tombs, so it's not clear whether it's because they 140 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 1: actually fought or whether the weapons were symbolics. So even 141 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 1: though maybe their their power actual power was slipping away, 142 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:35,440 Speaker 1: they would still get in on the warfare action from 143 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: time to time. But then we see a shift in 144 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:41,439 Speaker 1: the sixth century away from Shintoism as Buddhism is introduced, 145 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 1: and it really affected attitudes toward women. We get these 146 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:49,400 Speaker 1: anti feminine views imported from China. Suddenly women go from 147 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 1: being intelligent and symbolizing purity and fertility and they can 148 00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: rule and we love them their peacekeepers, to being seductresses 149 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:01,959 Speaker 1: with an evil nature. And so this ends up fostering 150 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 1: a chauvinistic society and kind of shuttles women off to 151 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 1: a subordinate place. So basically, under this structure, only men 152 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 1: can attain enlightenment, and if you're a woman, you can 153 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:16,200 Speaker 1: retain enlightenment if you're reincarnated as a man, so so 154 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:20,559 Speaker 1: good for you. And women's worth lay in political alliances 155 00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: created through father arranged marriages, which sounds a lot like 156 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:29,040 Speaker 1: old style Western marriages as well, and when we move 157 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 1: forward to the Hand period from seven ninety four to 158 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 1: eleven five a d. Things don't get much better. Women's 159 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 1: activities are super restricted, they have less access to education. 160 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:44,720 Speaker 1: There's a belief that they shouldn't be seen by men. 161 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:47,920 Speaker 1: Which is interesting that during this period this is happening 162 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 1: because there was an explosion and aristocratic women's writing. But 163 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 1: maybe it's just because they didn't have much else to 164 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 1: do while they were locked away, which explains why I 165 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:03,200 Speaker 1: have so many diaries from my home school years. Uh, 166 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: dear diary, Um, today is a century century three of 167 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 1: us being locked away from society. We used to be impresses. Um, 168 00:11:13,160 --> 00:11:17,080 Speaker 1: maybe tomorrow will be a better day XO XO. Yeah, 169 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:20,080 Speaker 1: and and it did. Tomorrow was a better day relatively 170 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 1: when we entered the feudal period, and feudalism was the 171 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 1: better day. Is that what you're about to say? Yeah, 172 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 1: I mean for ladies, oh man, talk about a real 173 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:33,920 Speaker 1: hard glass half ball. It puts it in stark relief. Yeah. 174 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:36,560 Speaker 1: So from five to sixteen or three, that's the feudal 175 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 1: period in Japan, and this is when we see the 176 00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: rise of the samurai warrior class. Uh. And samurai means 177 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 1: those who serve. So they're basically like nights, if you 178 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: want to think of an equivalent in Western culture, um 179 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:52,440 Speaker 1: nights without the whole chivalry aspect. There was no like, hey, 180 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: we need to treat our ladies with respect, and like 181 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,720 Speaker 1: put our capes down in puddles and and save damsels 182 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:01,679 Speaker 1: and and things like that. They didn't give a hoot 183 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 1: for courtly love. There was no damsel in distress, worries 184 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:08,920 Speaker 1: or anything like that. So it's interesting that as we 185 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 1: get feudalism, we also get less restrictive Buddhist sex emerging. 186 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: And that's s e c t. S groups of Buddhists, 187 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:22,440 Speaker 1: not Buddhist sex as in sexy times, although who knows, 188 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 1: maybe you never know. During this glass half Fule feudal period, 189 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:31,679 Speaker 1: things were really loosening up. Well. Women's freedom did expand 190 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: they were allowed rights to inheritance and to will property 191 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:38,960 Speaker 1: to their children. They were relatively more active in society. 192 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:43,440 Speaker 1: They managed their household staffs, they oversaw household finances, and 193 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: some of them trained in the Samurai way of life 194 00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 1: and this and this entails both training with weapons, training 195 00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:53,400 Speaker 1: in martial arts and fighting, but also just training in 196 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 1: that way of life that involved duty and loyalty, and 197 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,600 Speaker 1: in d nahs that were performed not too long ago 198 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: on recently excavated bodies dating back to a battle in 199 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:09,839 Speaker 1: fifteen eighty, found that thirty five of those dead bodies 200 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:15,960 Speaker 1: were women. And had these been siege situations, it's possible 201 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:18,959 Speaker 1: the women's remains were there because they'd killed them killed 202 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:22,080 Speaker 1: themselves to protect their honor, and that because that happened 203 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:23,560 Speaker 1: a lot the whole. I mean, I don't know that 204 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 1: you would classify that specifically as harcury, but there was 205 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,079 Speaker 1: a whole like honorable suicide thing going on. But instead 206 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 1: it seems more likely in this situation that they were 207 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:36,960 Speaker 1: actually fighting. So there's evidence, you know that they're at 208 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: least thirty five of them out there, Yeah, there are 209 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: at least thirty five. And this is just part of 210 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:48,640 Speaker 1: the interesting thing about lost history. I mean, we we 211 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 1: just don't know how many warrior women there were, how 212 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:57,000 Speaker 1: they were really viewed. It's entirely possible that they were 213 00:13:57,120 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 1: more common than we understand them to be, but that 214 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:04,760 Speaker 1: they were just not written about in in the history books. 215 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 1: And so anyway, this this expanded role for women, it 216 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 1: just did not stay this way forever. Husband and wife 217 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:18,040 Speaker 1: relationships began to resemble that whole feudal lord subject relationship, 218 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:24,040 Speaker 1: which just means total and utter submission to the husband 219 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:26,080 Speaker 1: as the lord. And so when we moved into the 220 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:30,080 Speaker 1: Tokugawa era from sixteen oh three to eighteen sixty seven, 221 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:33,480 Speaker 1: marriage and pleasing the husband is really the only role 222 00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 1: that women were fit for. Nobody had a great opinion 223 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 1: of ladies at this time. Uh. Samurai husbands were no 224 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: longer out there fighting. They were more like bureaucrats. Women, however, 225 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:47,840 Speaker 1: were still expected during this time to raise the kids 226 00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 1: with a proper samurai education because there wasn't much else 227 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:56,560 Speaker 1: they could do. What was a proper samurai education. This 228 00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 1: would still be in terms of loyalty, serving the home, 229 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:03,600 Speaker 1: s being the family, serving the lord. Uh, learning to 230 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:06,960 Speaker 1: fight and use weapons properly. When I hear serving the Lord, Caroline, 231 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: it does just take me right back to evangelical church. Yeah, 232 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:14,480 Speaker 1: this definitely means like the lord and master in terms 233 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 1: of your feudal lord. Not so much Jesus. I don't 234 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:21,880 Speaker 1: know if Japan was down with Jesus yet at this time. 235 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: I don't think Jesus had gotten to Japan yet. But 236 00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: what does all of this really say about women warriors 237 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: and samurai? With all of this up and down and 238 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 1: women being hidden away for these different periods, was there 239 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: really an opportunity for them to even be warriors? Because 240 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 1: some sources out there say women of the samurai achieved prominence, 241 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:51,000 Speaker 1: but others claimed they were just fulfilling their duties as housewives, 242 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 1: which we noted earlier. There's kind of that spectrum of like, yeah, 243 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:55,560 Speaker 1: they were totally there and other people being like, no, 244 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 1: they were just at home. So what gives the Caroline, 245 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: Let's let's pull some more meat from this timeline that 246 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 1: we just trotted through, So before we get into some 247 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 1: of these fighting women and talk about what they fought with, 248 00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 1: which is pretty neat, some disclaimers. Like we said at 249 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 1: the top of the podcast, these are not those pinterest 250 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:22,840 Speaker 1: friendly images from the late nineteenth century depicting women, probably 251 00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: kabogi performers, dressed as samurai. And like you said, Caroline, 252 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: even calling them samurai women is a little bit misleading 253 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:34,440 Speaker 1: because of how samurai is a gendered term. So can 254 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: you talk a little bit about that. Yeah, well, so 255 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 1: the women warriors of this period are referred to as 256 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,720 Speaker 1: own abu geisha or so called female samurai like you said, 257 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 1: but that more literally means women practicing the art of war. 258 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:52,200 Speaker 1: You've got the term geisha in there, like geisha's who 259 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 1: are performing artists. And then you've got the term own 260 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 1: a musha, which more literally means women warriors. So they 261 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 1: definitely would not have been referred to as samurai's back then, 262 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,920 Speaker 1: and they technically shouldn't be referred to as samurais now, 263 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: but the terms exist, and so did these women. But 264 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:13,600 Speaker 1: it is true that they existed within the context of 265 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:18,080 Speaker 1: their individual households because typically women in the warrior class 266 00:17:18,119 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 1: could be characterized by their role as castle slash homestead defenders. 267 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 1: So when the king or the lord not to be 268 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:31,280 Speaker 1: confused with Jesus Christ was away, protection of the home 269 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: fell to the wife. Her front was the home while 270 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: her husband was on the battlefield, and there was deep, 271 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: deep loyalty to the clan. This is part of that 272 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:45,200 Speaker 1: samurai education that we mentioned a few minutes ago. And 273 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 1: what did they use to defend their homestead Not just 274 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:56,159 Speaker 1: any old swould not not a not a sling shot, 275 00:17:56,520 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: I'm not none chucks, but rather something called an naga nada. Yeah, 276 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 1: it's basically a sort of spear sword hybrid, so it 277 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 1: looks like a long pole with a curved blade at 278 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:11,680 Speaker 1: the end. And it was really cute because they're all pink. 279 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:15,399 Speaker 1: But a girl, Caroline, you know that. That's how you 280 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 1: know that? It was Yeah, that's you know, it's for women. 281 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 1: They're real light. Yeah, And and girls would learn to 282 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:22,679 Speaker 1: use it from a relatively young age, and when they 283 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 1: reached adulthood, they were also given kaik in or small 284 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: knives for both self defense and also suicide if their 285 00:18:31,840 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 1: virtue was threatened. So basically you had to be prepared 286 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,680 Speaker 1: to die to protect your own honor as well as 287 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:41,879 Speaker 1: your family's honor. And a little bit of context to 288 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 1: that is that a short life was really not viewed 289 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:47,840 Speaker 1: as a tragedy. It was it was admirable, especially if 290 00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:51,080 Speaker 1: you died in the name of protecting your family or 291 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 1: your honor. But also when rumors of raping and pillaging 292 00:18:56,280 --> 00:19:00,199 Speaker 1: preceded and invading army, it was not uncommon for men 293 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 1: of that village or clan to participate in a math suicide. 294 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: And we saw a couple of interesting examples of basically 295 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:13,360 Speaker 1: ancient suicide notes left by women who were in this 296 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:16,680 Speaker 1: very situation that illustrate. I don't want to insinuate that 297 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:21,600 Speaker 1: suicide is interesting, but I think they illustrate how women's 298 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,680 Speaker 1: role in this samurai class, and that the way they 299 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,520 Speaker 1: fulfilled their the way they were supposed to fulfill their 300 00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 1: duty as part of the samurai class. So one from 301 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: the nineteenth century says, each time I die and I'm 302 00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:37,160 Speaker 1: reborn in the world, I wish to return as a 303 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:41,199 Speaker 1: stalwart warrior. And another woman wrote, I have heard that 304 00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:43,320 Speaker 1: this is the way of the warrior, and so I 305 00:19:43,359 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 1: set out on the journey to the land of the dead. 306 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: So I think that says a lot about Yeah, they're 307 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:52,640 Speaker 1: their front, as you said, might not be on the battlefield, 308 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,480 Speaker 1: but they certainly felt that they had a duty to 309 00:19:55,560 --> 00:20:00,080 Speaker 1: perform during times of war, and that nagnata was a 310 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 1: tool to guard ones personal sanctity unless it was actually 311 00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:09,159 Speaker 1: used for battle, because this did happen from time to time. 312 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 1: Martial arts historian Ellis Anders cites a sixteenth century chronicle 313 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: of a warrior wife who led more than eighties soldiers 314 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:20,080 Speaker 1: against the enemy after finding women and children in her 315 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 1: husband's castle had committed mass suicide. Yeah, so obviously there 316 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:26,960 Speaker 1: were some women who were like, uh no, not all 317 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: the women in my clan gets to kill themselves and 318 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:32,399 Speaker 1: just have that go by as a normal thing. And 319 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:36,439 Speaker 1: then author Stephen Turnbull describes the nineteenth century wife of 320 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:40,720 Speaker 1: a magistrate who, fearing the Imperial army would slaughter her family, 321 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:44,880 Speaker 1: ended up cutting off her hair preemptively killing her mother 322 00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:48,040 Speaker 1: in law and daughter, and then charging out into the 323 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:54,120 Speaker 1: fighting with her nagonata in hand. Intense, very intense. So 324 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 1: we really get this image of the naganata wielding warrior 325 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 1: woman emerging during the war during states period, which is 326 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: it falls under that feudal period in the mid fifteen 327 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:08,360 Speaker 1: to the early seventeenth centuries, and we start to get 328 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:13,200 Speaker 1: these accounts of warlord's wives wearing armor and leading women 329 00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: into fights with those naganata. But historical accounts of women 330 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:22,040 Speaker 1: in action deal more often with samurai class women defending 331 00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:26,760 Speaker 1: the home rather than specifically going out onto the battlefield. 332 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,199 Speaker 1: So basically the deal was that if you were a 333 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,159 Speaker 1: samurai dude, which is kind of redundant to even say, 334 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:34,960 Speaker 1: you'd be part of the warrior class, and you had 335 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 1: to accept that your whole family was obliged to serve 336 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:42,880 Speaker 1: the lord and master would also be like the Showgun 337 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:44,959 Speaker 1: with the you know, because the Showgun is a general, 338 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:48,160 Speaker 1: so they would all essentially be loyal to the Showgun. 339 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 1: And it wasn't uncommon for the women folk to have 340 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:55,080 Speaker 1: to perform the men folks duties if they were away, 341 00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 1: which might include everything from just working on house to repairs, 342 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:05,280 Speaker 1: to defending the castle or home, to you know, taking 343 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 1: care of heads once they've been chopped off of bodies, 344 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:14,639 Speaker 1: because there is a very ceremonial uh presentation of decapitated 345 00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: heads that would happen after the fighting had chilled out 346 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:21,920 Speaker 1: for a minute. Yeah, women's role during war if they 347 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:23,720 Speaker 1: were if they were holed up in the castle, it 348 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:27,520 Speaker 1: was really interesting. So they'd be doing everything from casing bullets, 349 00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:31,040 Speaker 1: to caring for the wounded, to throwing wet blankets on 350 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:34,160 Speaker 1: cannonballs before they could explode. Can you imagine I would 351 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:36,360 Speaker 1: not sign up for that job. I'll be like, I'll 352 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:39,000 Speaker 1: be over here, um, casing the bullets because there's no 353 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:43,920 Speaker 1: blood involved in that and no potential dismemberment from cannon balls. Um. 354 00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:46,960 Speaker 1: But yeah, like Kristen said, they would also prepare enemy 355 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: heads for head viewing ceremonies. And I read this and 356 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 1: was like, um, what this sounds awful? What is the 357 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 1: head viewing ceremony? And it's literally that it's like cleaning 358 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: up the head, washing it black in the teeth, and 359 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:05,960 Speaker 1: and presenting it to to the victor or the victorious 360 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:08,359 Speaker 1: family or clan to be like, hey, hey, look at 361 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 1: what we did. Very game of thronesy back then, very well. 362 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:15,719 Speaker 1: So in the mid seventeenth century, though after the Warring 363 00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 1: States period, we we hit a little bit of a 364 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:21,639 Speaker 1: more peaceful time. Women are still being trained to use 365 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,399 Speaker 1: the naganata because by this point it's pretty much a 366 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: ladies tool and it's only associated with them. But instead 367 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,760 Speaker 1: of all of this protecting the castle from the enemy thing, 368 00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:34,760 Speaker 1: they basically became, as one source said, kind of like 369 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 1: a neighborhood watch type of things. So even though their 370 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: rights were more restricted they were expected to stay in 371 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 1: the home, they would still if a stranger entered the area, 372 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,679 Speaker 1: grab the old naganata and run outside to protect their 373 00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 1: hood from strangers. It's like housewives today who by tasers. 374 00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:57,920 Speaker 1: You know, they're actually like taser shows. Instead of tupperware parties, 375 00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 1: there are taser parties. Yes, I know this firsthand from 376 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:05,879 Speaker 1: someone who has been to one and purchased one. I 377 00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:11,120 Speaker 1: would there there are pinkwashed tasers. I had no idea 378 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: Naganada way cooler just saying no, I'm not advocating for 379 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: tasers in the home um. But let's talk though about 380 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 1: some of the specific women, because one thing that definitely 381 00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:32,159 Speaker 1: emerged as we were researching this topic was that, a 382 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 1: the numbers are low and be there are just a 383 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:42,680 Speaker 1: handful of actual individual women with names that you hear 384 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:45,760 Speaker 1: about who are repeated over and over again in any 385 00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 1: kind of female samurai round up or history that you 386 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:51,879 Speaker 1: might read. And again, I keep catching myself saying female 387 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:55,800 Speaker 1: samurai because I feel like I'm just surethand okay, okay, sure, 388 00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:58,960 Speaker 1: I forgive you. Some of our listeners might write in, 389 00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,160 Speaker 1: but hey, we get we get it, we understand. Yeah, 390 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:06,159 Speaker 1: may I acknowledge that the imprecision of my language. Well, So, 391 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 1: in addition to the countless women that we've been talking 392 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:11,760 Speaker 1: about who defended their homes and avenge the deaths of 393 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 1: family and lords, we wanted to name a few that 394 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,120 Speaker 1: stand out in the history books. But the first two 395 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:20,919 Speaker 1: that we're going to talk about should be taken with 396 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:26,399 Speaker 1: a slight grain of salt. Because mainly they may not 397 00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:30,800 Speaker 1: have really existed. Oh no, yeah, So Tomo goes In 398 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,400 Speaker 1: is one of the most famous, most often cited examples 399 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 1: of a woman warrior. But she might have been a legend. 400 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:41,399 Speaker 1: It's not sure why. If she was a legend, she 401 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,080 Speaker 1: was created. It's possible that she was created to shame 402 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:48,639 Speaker 1: a certain male warrior, to make him seem like he 403 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: needed a woman to help him. But regardless, it is 404 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 1: a great story, and so let's take it as that 405 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:59,359 Speaker 1: and talk about the legendary Tema goes In. First of all, 406 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: goes In is not her last name. It's not like 407 00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:03,359 Speaker 1: how I'm Carolina. Herven goes In as a title, and 408 00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 1: it's basically young lady, And it was sometimes applied to 409 00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: women warriors specifically, so you could be goes In Caroline, Yeah, 410 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 1: lady Carolina. Well, it just reminds me of Gozer from Ghostbusters. 411 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 1: And then and then I just go on a tangent 412 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: in my brain, and then he goes in on a tangent. Well, So, 413 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:26,159 Speaker 1: during the gen Pay War from eleven eight to eighty five, 414 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:31,320 Speaker 1: uh Toma supposedly fought alongside male samurai warriors, and there's 415 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:35,280 Speaker 1: an account historical account that's possibly made up, that says 416 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:38,920 Speaker 1: many times she had taken the field armed at all points, 417 00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 1: and one matchless renown and encounters with the bravest captains, 418 00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:45,439 Speaker 1: and so in this last fight, when all the others 419 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 1: had been slain or fled, among the last seven their 420 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,840 Speaker 1: road Tomo. And she's the only woman warrior to be 421 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:57,000 Speaker 1: described in any detail in any war account. And so 422 00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:01,680 Speaker 1: it's this, it's this detail and this focus on her 423 00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 1: and her accomplishments and her badassary that makes people go, well, 424 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,439 Speaker 1: are we sure that she actually existed? And even if 425 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:12,960 Speaker 1: she didn't, it's a great myth and it's a great story. 426 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:14,960 Speaker 1: The same way that you might be inspired by the 427 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,600 Speaker 1: story of like Athena and think Athena is a great 428 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,920 Speaker 1: character in history, I think Tomo is too. She's described 429 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:24,399 Speaker 1: as beautiful, fearless, and a master swordsman and archer who 430 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,800 Speaker 1: led men into battle. And legend has it that she 431 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 1: escaped her enemies during a battle and gave up fighting 432 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:36,919 Speaker 1: to marry or become a concubine, whichever, and when her 433 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:40,160 Speaker 1: husband died, she ended up becoming a nun. And she's 434 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,040 Speaker 1: depicted a lot in art right, A lot of times 435 00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 1: those female lawyer. Uh paintings or even embroidery that you 436 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:53,600 Speaker 1: might see could be depicting Tomo goes In, or they 437 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: could be depicting Hangaku goes In also, who apparently rode 438 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,800 Speaker 1: into battle when her clan rebelled against the shogunn it 439 00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:04,520 Speaker 1: or the military leadership in eleven eighty nine. She ended 440 00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 1: up getting wounded and captured, and an enemy soldier who 441 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,560 Speaker 1: wanted her as a bride kept her from committing sepaku. However, 442 00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 1: other accounts do say she remained in the castle the 443 00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,919 Speaker 1: whole time until being felled by an arrow, and sepacu 444 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:21,400 Speaker 1: would have been an honorable suicide, correct, amundo? Well, and 445 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:26,000 Speaker 1: then we have a third and is she more verified? 446 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: Historically verified and Twitter verified? Our next, our next three 447 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:35,639 Speaker 1: are Twitter verified. So in fifteen seventy seven, oh, we know, 448 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:39,720 Speaker 1: Surahimi led a group of more than thirty women in 449 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 1: a charge against besieging troops, and when the samurai wouldn't 450 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:48,080 Speaker 1: engage and kill the women, the frustrated women warriors returned 451 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:53,320 Speaker 1: to the castle, and you guessed it committed mass suicide. 452 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 1: We'll just imagine. Okay, so here are these women who 453 00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:57,360 Speaker 1: are like, we're going to do our duty. We're going 454 00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 1: to do her honor. We're gonna be honorable women warriors. 455 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 1: We are going to go to war with these men. 456 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:05,160 Speaker 1: And they go outside and the guys were like, whoa, whoa, 457 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:08,760 Speaker 1: we night, we might not understand the concept of chivalry 458 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,000 Speaker 1: or practice it, but we're not going to kill ladies. 459 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: And the women are like, seriously, but I've got my armor, 460 00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 1: am I not Ganada? Like? Well, I wonder if they 461 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:21,320 Speaker 1: were like, we're not going to kill you, because we 462 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 1: could just capture you and make you are concubine. True story, 463 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:30,480 Speaker 1: probably accurate. And another figure who's often sided is Nicano Takikos, 464 00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:34,280 Speaker 1: who fought during the Botion Civil War from eighteen sixty 465 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 1: eight to sixty nine. During the Battle of Aizu, she 466 00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:41,120 Speaker 1: led other women warriors known as the Women's Army, and 467 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 1: of course they weren't recognized as an official part of 468 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 1: the army, but they went up against the Imperial Army, 469 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 1: who were horrified to see that they were facing women, 470 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: and so again similarly, they decided to stop fighting and 471 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:57,239 Speaker 1: take the women alive. And of course women were like, 472 00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:01,120 Speaker 1: oh wait, so you guys, you're not like fighting right now? Well, 473 00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:02,680 Speaker 1: we're just gonna kill a whole bunch of you. Then 474 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,720 Speaker 1: and after she was shot in the chest, she asked 475 00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 1: her sister to behead her so the enemy wouldn't again. 476 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 1: It's all about honor and death. It's like no, no, 477 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:16,440 Speaker 1: no, no no one else is gonna kill me. Yeah, I 478 00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:18,640 Speaker 1: will go down the way. It's like, you can't fire me. 479 00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:22,520 Speaker 1: I quit. Yeah, And so her sister did it, which 480 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 1: I also can't imagine. Her sister beheaded her and then 481 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 1: buried her head. And now there's like a there's a 482 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: memorial statue that you can go visit. Oh yeah, wasn't 483 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 1: that the one where school girls will often go and 484 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:40,960 Speaker 1: visit this monument to her because she's such a heroine. Yeah, 485 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,640 Speaker 1: it's pretty neat. Any any Japanese listeners, if you've been 486 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:47,080 Speaker 1: there and have a photo, please send it to us. Yeah, 487 00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:49,120 Speaker 1: or just any more details. We we want to hear 488 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,080 Speaker 1: details about all of this stuff. And another woman we 489 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 1: want to tell you about is Yamamoto Yaeko, who in 490 00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 1: eight sixty eight, during that same Battle of Au, replaced 491 00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: her gunnery instructor father, who had been killed during the fighting, 492 00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:06,600 Speaker 1: and using her repeating rifle, she fought alongside the men 493 00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,480 Speaker 1: and she's a really fascinating character, Like we could have 494 00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:12,920 Speaker 1: done an entire episode just on her alone. But she 495 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,760 Speaker 1: went on to teach at the Kyoto Women's School, where 496 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 1: she met and married this guy who sounds pretty awesome. 497 00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:23,280 Speaker 1: He's a pro women's rights former samurai who had spent 498 00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: a lot of time in the US, and together as 499 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: a pair, they founded the Dashisha University in Kyoto. So 500 00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,680 Speaker 1: after her husband died, she ends up joining the Japanese 501 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:38,520 Speaker 1: Red Cross, leading a team of forty nurses during the 502 00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 1: war between China and Japan, and becomes one of the 503 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: first women in Japan to be decorated for her service 504 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 1: to the country. Wow. Yeah, I mean she's an incredible figure, 505 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:53,200 Speaker 1: as are all of these women, even Tomo goes in, 506 00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:57,560 Speaker 1: who's potentially a mythological character. Well, I love the story 507 00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 1: too of Yamamoto though, because she just keeps going and 508 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 1: going and going, and it at least is honored and 509 00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: I mean, I guess, I mean, there's the monument to Nakano, 510 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: but Yamocho, you know, was able to to go and 511 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,800 Speaker 1: lead those those nurses during the Sinoe. She really didn't stop. 512 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 1: She continued on with the attitude of having duty, of 513 00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:27,000 Speaker 1: having honor, um, wanting to serve others, serve her country, um, 514 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,400 Speaker 1: and leading other women as she did it. And so 515 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 1: while there's not a ton of unfortunately, while there's not 516 00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 1: a ton of hard evidence out there about warrior women 517 00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:42,840 Speaker 1: in Japan, and even though a bunch of sources do 518 00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:47,280 Speaker 1: contradict each other, I think it is interesting just to 519 00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:51,400 Speaker 1: look at how culture shaped not only views of women, 520 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 1: but what they were even allowed to do. And that 521 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,280 Speaker 1: even if a woman could not be a samurai because 522 00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:01,040 Speaker 1: of samurai is a is a dude soldier, um, she 523 00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: could still pursue that duty and honor in her own 524 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,720 Speaker 1: way as part of the samurai class well. And their 525 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:13,720 Speaker 1: biography is just exemplify that cultural loyalty that was so 526 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 1: instilled through so many generations too. Well. So I'm definitely 527 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:20,640 Speaker 1: interested in hearing from listeners. I know we have a 528 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 1: bunch of history buffs and specifically some Japanese history bucks 529 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: out there. I know we had a lot of comments 530 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:30,760 Speaker 1: on UM the tumbler post about the oner Bu geisha, 531 00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 1: and so I mean, if you have any stories, have 532 00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:37,440 Speaker 1: you done any research, um, have you in fact trained 533 00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,080 Speaker 1: in any martial arts? Do you own a naga nata 534 00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,000 Speaker 1: and use it. Mom saf at house stuffwork dot Com 535 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 1: is our email address. You can also tweet us at 536 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:49,160 Speaker 1: mom Stuff podcast or messages on Facebook, and we've got 537 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 1: a couple of messages to share with you right now. Well, 538 00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:00,240 Speaker 1: I have a couple of letters here about our waste 539 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:04,160 Speaker 1: training episode. This once from Megan. She says, you mentioned 540 00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,640 Speaker 1: at one point that Jessica Alba started wearing a waste 541 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 1: trainer after having a baby helped her uterus go back 542 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,400 Speaker 1: to its previous size. While I agree that waste trainers 543 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,240 Speaker 1: are dangerous and it's unlikely that her waste trainer really 544 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 1: had this effect because it doesn't really go down far 545 00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 1: enough to fully support the uterus, there is a history 546 00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 1: of using belly banning of some sort to support the 547 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:26,480 Speaker 1: uterus postpartum and assisting it in returning to its pre 548 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,440 Speaker 1: baby shape, to support the back during pregnancy, and to 549 00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:32,480 Speaker 1: assist patients with uterine pro laps support the muscles of 550 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,560 Speaker 1: the uterus. As a midwife in training, this is something 551 00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 1: that's of great interest to me, and so Megan recommends 552 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:43,000 Speaker 1: looking up information about the use of fajas in Guatemala, 553 00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:46,040 Speaker 1: which she says is a traditional Mayan belly banding device 554 00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:48,919 Speaker 1: for pregnant women. She says they should definitely be used 555 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:51,759 Speaker 1: with caution, as if they are tied too tightly there 556 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,320 Speaker 1: can be side effects, but they have been anecdotally found 557 00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:57,080 Speaker 1: helpful by women who use them in South America. Just 558 00:34:57,120 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 1: another thought on the subject. So thanks Megan. I've got 559 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:04,280 Speaker 1: a letter here from Susan also about our way straining episode. 560 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: And let me just tell you how many letters we've 561 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: gotten about this episode. I love it, uh so, she writes, Uh. 562 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:16,120 Speaker 1: Several years ago, I was getting fitted for bridesmaids dresses 563 00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:18,640 Speaker 1: and at the time I was the heaviest i'd been, 564 00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:21,920 Speaker 1: so I was already little apprehensive of getting fitted when 565 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 1: I went in. The first thing the sales that he 566 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,640 Speaker 1: said to me was, well, I can tell from your 567 00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:31,440 Speaker 1: bust you're going to need a much bigger size. Lovely. Anyway, 568 00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:33,799 Speaker 1: as I was trying the sample size on and she 569 00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 1: measured me, she suggested that I think about losing weight 570 00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:40,160 Speaker 1: before the wedding. She kindly reminded me that there was 571 00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,000 Speaker 1: plenty of time before the wedding to lose a few 572 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,120 Speaker 1: pounds and maybe I should think about wearing a corset. 573 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:47,520 Speaker 1: She went on and on about how it will make 574 00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:50,319 Speaker 1: me look so much slimmer and leaner and give me 575 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:54,200 Speaker 1: a much better all around look. Feeling completely exposed, offended, 576 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,760 Speaker 1: and embarrassed, I just kept saying things like yeah, great, thanks. 577 00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:00,319 Speaker 1: After she was done explaining all the benef fits of 578 00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:02,400 Speaker 1: a course on the day of the event, she suggested 579 00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:05,200 Speaker 1: I start wearing one now to get used to it 580 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:09,000 Speaker 1: and to help me lose weight. Again, I said, oh, great, thanks, 581 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 1: to which she followed up with, well, if you can't breathe, 582 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:16,480 Speaker 1: you can't eat. I was horrified. I quickly dressed, paid 583 00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:18,960 Speaker 1: for my overpriced address, and ran out of there as 584 00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:21,920 Speaker 1: fast as I could. I promised I would never subject 585 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:24,920 Speaker 1: my bridesmaids to that kind of behavior or service if 586 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:27,720 Speaker 1: I ever got married. I laugh about it today because 587 00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,000 Speaker 1: it's just so ridiculous that anyone would say that in 588 00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:34,360 Speaker 1: two when this happened, but it was incredibly embarrassing and 589 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:38,239 Speaker 1: terribly offensive. Thanks so much for putting out such a 590 00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:41,080 Speaker 1: great podcast with such great topics. I recommend it to 591 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:45,400 Speaker 1: so many people I know, women and men, So thank 592 00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:49,600 Speaker 1: you so much, Susan. And oh boy, to that saleswoman 593 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:53,239 Speaker 1: if you're listening, uh, please never do that to a 594 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:56,480 Speaker 1: human body again. So we will now want to hear 595 00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:58,960 Speaker 1: your stories. Mom. Stuff at housel works dot com is 596 00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:00,880 Speaker 1: our email addressed and bri links to all of our 597 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:03,400 Speaker 1: social media as well as all of our blogs, videos, 598 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,359 Speaker 1: and podcasts with this one including our sources. So you 599 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:10,440 Speaker 1: can learn more firsthand about the warrior women of Japan. 600 00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:14,399 Speaker 1: Head on over to stuff mom Never Told You dot 601 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:21,320 Speaker 1: com for moral this and thousands of other topics. Doesn't 602 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:30,360 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com