1 00:00:15,356 --> 00:00:15,796 Speaker 1: Pushkin. 2 00:00:18,476 --> 00:00:21,796 Speaker 2: Hello, Hello Revisionist History listeners. We're having a very exciting 3 00:00:21,796 --> 00:00:24,596 Speaker 2: week here at Pushkin. You know that I'm Canadian, right, 4 00:00:24,876 --> 00:00:26,796 Speaker 2: We actually fly a big maple leaf flag here at 5 00:00:26,796 --> 00:00:31,556 Speaker 2: Pushkin HQ. Well, this week we added another Canadian. The 6 00:00:31,596 --> 00:00:35,596 Speaker 2: great Jonathan Goldstein, native of Quebec, has brought his acclaimed 7 00:00:35,716 --> 00:00:38,596 Speaker 2: narrative series Heavyweight to the Pushkin Network. 8 00:00:39,756 --> 00:00:48,076 Speaker 3: Oh Canada, our home and native land, true patrid love, 9 00:00:48,716 --> 00:00:50,876 Speaker 3: in all our hearts command. 10 00:00:52,316 --> 00:00:55,556 Speaker 2: Jonathan and the Heavyweight team represent everything we believe in 11 00:00:55,596 --> 00:00:58,636 Speaker 2: here at Pushkin. The power of storytelling, the value of 12 00:00:58,716 --> 00:01:02,196 Speaker 2: intelligence and emotion, the belief that Canadians can and should 13 00:01:02,196 --> 00:01:07,156 Speaker 2: dominate all aspects of American culture. Heavyweight examines personal histories 14 00:01:07,196 --> 00:01:09,956 Speaker 2: and resentments. It tries to heal old wounds, and then 15 00:01:09,956 --> 00:01:14,276 Speaker 2: the process reminds us of our shared humanity. Yes, it's 16 00:01:14,316 --> 00:01:17,716 Speaker 2: that good. We're dropping the first ever episode here in 17 00:01:17,716 --> 00:01:21,116 Speaker 2: the feed about Jonathan's quest to reconcile his father with 18 00:01:21,236 --> 00:01:25,756 Speaker 2: his estranged brother Buzz Enjoy And there is much, much, 19 00:01:25,916 --> 00:01:27,796 Speaker 2: much more to come. And if you want to listen 20 00:01:27,836 --> 00:01:30,676 Speaker 2: to more Heavyweight, which I'm sure you do, check out 21 00:01:30,716 --> 00:01:34,196 Speaker 2: the show notes for the Revisionist History team's favorite episodes. 22 00:01:41,316 --> 00:01:44,756 Speaker 4: Yell from Gimblet Media. This is Jonathan Goldstein. Your old 23 00:01:44,796 --> 00:01:46,956 Speaker 4: pal is that. 24 00:01:47,076 --> 00:01:48,916 Speaker 5: Was called Gimblet Gimblet Media. 25 00:01:49,156 --> 00:01:49,716 Speaker 4: That's correct. 26 00:01:49,836 --> 00:01:52,036 Speaker 6: It sounds like giblets, the inside of a chicken, like 27 00:01:52,036 --> 00:01:52,956 Speaker 6: all the innerds. 28 00:01:53,116 --> 00:01:54,436 Speaker 4: Well, everybody loves giblet. 29 00:01:54,676 --> 00:01:56,836 Speaker 6: You Oh shit, they're my kids. 30 00:01:56,916 --> 00:01:57,996 Speaker 2: Hey guys, I'm up here. 31 00:01:59,076 --> 00:02:01,076 Speaker 4: Do you know what my new podcast is about. 32 00:02:01,516 --> 00:02:02,916 Speaker 6: I know, I don't know anything about it. 33 00:02:03,036 --> 00:02:06,276 Speaker 4: Each week, I travel into people's past to help them 34 00:02:06,316 --> 00:02:10,276 Speaker 4: repair something that's been troubling them. I'm sort of like 35 00:02:10,316 --> 00:02:20,196 Speaker 4: a therapist, like a therapist. So yeah, do you find out? 36 00:02:20,276 --> 00:02:22,916 Speaker 4: Do you find that funny? I supportive? That's the laughter 37 00:02:22,956 --> 00:02:23,396 Speaker 4: of support. 38 00:02:23,476 --> 00:02:24,076 Speaker 6: I think it's great. 39 00:02:24,636 --> 00:02:27,036 Speaker 4: I think it's great. Do you have any questions for 40 00:02:27,116 --> 00:02:29,476 Speaker 4: me about what my show is and what it's going 41 00:02:29,516 --> 00:02:33,196 Speaker 4: to be? Like, what's the name of your show? 42 00:02:33,276 --> 00:02:34,276 Speaker 6: What's the name of your show? 43 00:02:34,876 --> 00:02:36,756 Speaker 2: Yes, we're gonna go now, but Johnson's just about tell 44 00:02:36,796 --> 00:02:37,836 Speaker 2: me the name of his new show. 45 00:02:38,156 --> 00:02:39,676 Speaker 6: As soon as he tells me, I'm going to bang 46 00:02:39,716 --> 00:02:44,116 Speaker 6: down on him in five Remember to do that, Yes. 47 00:02:44,036 --> 00:02:47,156 Speaker 4: To hang up the phone on each other? Okay, ready, Yes, 48 00:02:47,316 --> 00:02:52,116 Speaker 4: the name of the show is Heavyweight Heavyweight, you get 49 00:02:52,116 --> 00:03:03,956 Speaker 4: it too one. Hello. Hello from Gimblet Media. I'm Jonathan 50 00:03:03,956 --> 00:03:07,996 Speaker 4: Goldstein and this is Heavyweight today's episode. 51 00:03:08,756 --> 00:03:15,196 Speaker 6: But hello, hey Dad, Hi Johnny. 52 00:03:15,276 --> 00:03:19,076 Speaker 4: Hey, how you doing good? You good good good yum 53 00:03:19,156 --> 00:03:22,316 Speaker 4: tiv Shanapova oximea O. 54 00:03:23,796 --> 00:03:24,516 Speaker 6: What's that meaning? 55 00:03:24,516 --> 00:03:28,476 Speaker 4: I'm not sure. Oh, this is my father Buzz. I'm 56 00:03:28,516 --> 00:03:31,476 Speaker 4: calling him at his home in Montreal. And the reason 57 00:03:31,476 --> 00:03:34,636 Speaker 4: we're talking crazy talk is because it's young Kipper the 58 00:03:34,716 --> 00:03:37,636 Speaker 4: Jewish day of Atonement, which seems as good a day 59 00:03:37,636 --> 00:03:42,716 Speaker 4: as any to talk with him about forgiveness. So I 60 00:03:42,756 --> 00:03:45,396 Speaker 4: wanted to I wanted to ask you something and I 61 00:03:45,436 --> 00:03:50,196 Speaker 4: just wanted to gauge your interest. Yeah, how how would 62 00:03:50,236 --> 00:03:53,916 Speaker 4: you feel about paying your brother Sheldon a visit? 63 00:03:55,156 --> 00:04:00,796 Speaker 6: I have no feelings by I'm not really interested. You're not. No. 64 00:04:02,396 --> 00:04:05,636 Speaker 4: My father Buzz is eighty and his brother, Sheldon, his 65 00:04:05,756 --> 00:04:09,236 Speaker 4: only sibling, is eighty five, and for the past forty 66 00:04:09,716 --> 00:04:14,916 Speaker 4: they've pretty much been on the outs. My father lives 67 00:04:14,916 --> 00:04:18,076 Speaker 4: in Montreal and Sheldon lives in Florida, and the last 68 00:04:18,076 --> 00:04:20,876 Speaker 4: time they saw each other over twenty years ago was 69 00:04:20,876 --> 00:04:23,276 Speaker 4: at their mother's funeral when they had a fight over 70 00:04:23,316 --> 00:04:27,316 Speaker 4: the details of the arrangements. Since then, they've hardly spoken. 71 00:04:29,116 --> 00:04:31,996 Speaker 4: It worries me because there's not a lot of time left, 72 00:04:32,196 --> 00:04:35,076 Speaker 4: and I don't want my father to have regrets. When 73 00:04:35,116 --> 00:04:37,116 Speaker 4: the subject of his brother comes up, as it often 74 00:04:37,156 --> 00:04:40,716 Speaker 4: has over the years, my father feels competing things. He 75 00:04:40,756 --> 00:04:44,156 Speaker 4: grows angry or defensive, but other times he'll become sad 76 00:04:44,196 --> 00:04:47,836 Speaker 4: and remorseful. And it's the sorrow and the remorse that 77 00:04:47,876 --> 00:04:50,876 Speaker 4: I like best, because it's these feelings that I believe 78 00:04:50,956 --> 00:04:54,636 Speaker 4: speak to his better self, the self I want to encourage. 79 00:04:55,156 --> 00:04:57,036 Speaker 4: I'm not surprised that you're not jumping at the idea, 80 00:04:57,036 --> 00:05:00,756 Speaker 4: but I'm a little surprised at yours against the idea. 81 00:05:01,436 --> 00:05:05,836 Speaker 6: Yeah, time's passed. He hasn't shown much interest, so I'm 82 00:05:05,876 --> 00:05:07,396 Speaker 6: respecting that and I leave them alone. 83 00:05:07,876 --> 00:05:11,396 Speaker 4: What he did do was he called you on your 84 00:05:11,396 --> 00:05:15,156 Speaker 4: eightieth birthday not so long ago, and you felt good. 85 00:05:15,036 --> 00:05:17,196 Speaker 6: About it to him on his eightieth birthday. 86 00:05:18,036 --> 00:05:20,756 Speaker 4: This kind of tit for tat accounting is what always 87 00:05:20,796 --> 00:05:23,596 Speaker 4: gets in the way. There's been a competition between the 88 00:05:23,636 --> 00:05:26,316 Speaker 4: brothers since I was a kid. I remember how in 89 00:05:26,396 --> 00:05:29,436 Speaker 4: my grandmother's small New York kitchen, Sheldon and Buzz got 90 00:05:29,476 --> 00:05:32,316 Speaker 4: into an argument about who could do the most push ups, 91 00:05:32,676 --> 00:05:34,996 Speaker 4: and the next thing I knew, my father was pulling 92 00:05:34,996 --> 00:05:37,756 Speaker 4: off his shirt and dropping to the kitchen floor in 93 00:05:37,796 --> 00:05:41,076 Speaker 4: his undershirt. My mother, not used to seeing the side 94 00:05:41,076 --> 00:05:45,036 Speaker 4: of him, stood over my father, flapping a dishtowel hysterically 95 00:05:45,356 --> 00:05:48,796 Speaker 4: while begging him to the point of tears to please stop. 96 00:05:49,636 --> 00:05:52,356 Speaker 4: Now you go, my father said, rising from the floor 97 00:05:52,356 --> 00:05:55,116 Speaker 4: when he was done. But Sheldon shook his head with 98 00:05:55,156 --> 00:05:57,596 Speaker 4: a smile. It was like he didn't even think my 99 00:05:57,636 --> 00:05:58,956 Speaker 4: father was worth the effort. 100 00:06:00,116 --> 00:06:01,796 Speaker 6: You know what it is at this point with him, 101 00:06:01,876 --> 00:06:03,636 Speaker 6: I'll tell you what it is. I don't think it's 102 00:06:03,716 --> 00:06:07,236 Speaker 6: even anger. He's past anger, and he's past any feelings 103 00:06:07,236 --> 00:06:13,916 Speaker 6: of Animosity's he just doesn't care. Yeah, you know, that's apathy. 104 00:06:14,236 --> 00:06:18,476 Speaker 6: I mean, sometimes at least hate or love their emotions. 105 00:06:18,556 --> 00:06:24,156 Speaker 6: Apathy is nothing. Yeah, you know what. Johnny as a child, 106 00:06:24,316 --> 00:06:27,196 Speaker 6: even when I was ten, when I was nine and eight, 107 00:06:27,716 --> 00:06:30,636 Speaker 6: I was crazy about him. We had a great you know, 108 00:06:30,836 --> 00:06:32,396 Speaker 6: I loved him. He was the older brother. 109 00:06:32,596 --> 00:06:35,476 Speaker 4: He was hello, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm listening. 110 00:06:36,956 --> 00:06:37,156 Speaker 7: You know. 111 00:06:38,116 --> 00:06:40,436 Speaker 6: I just looked up to him, and he had older friends. 112 00:06:40,476 --> 00:06:43,156 Speaker 6: Sometimes he'd take me along with him and he was good. 113 00:06:44,596 --> 00:06:48,116 Speaker 6: Somebody trying to somebody trying to call here, binging me here. 114 00:06:49,156 --> 00:06:52,236 Speaker 4: Don't you see, Buzz, it's father time? Who is bringing 115 00:06:52,316 --> 00:06:56,876 Speaker 4: you here? And Buzz loses track of time. Air Conditioners 116 00:06:56,916 --> 00:07:00,556 Speaker 4: remain boxed all through July, and expired coupons from the 117 00:07:00,596 --> 00:07:04,396 Speaker 4: mid nineties make plump his wallet, so I worry he'll 118 00:07:04,396 --> 00:07:07,236 Speaker 4: put off reaching out to Sheldon until it's too late. 119 00:07:11,596 --> 00:07:14,876 Speaker 4: The most complicated question, the one I keep coming back to, 120 00:07:15,516 --> 00:07:18,356 Speaker 4: is how did the bad blood begin? And there are 121 00:07:18,356 --> 00:07:21,636 Speaker 4: many versions. An ill fated trip to Montreal where Sheldon 122 00:07:21,676 --> 00:07:24,236 Speaker 4: felt slighted about having to stay in my father's basement, 123 00:07:24,756 --> 00:07:26,996 Speaker 4: an ill fated trip to New York where my father 124 00:07:27,036 --> 00:07:30,436 Speaker 4: felt slighted about having to stay in Sheldon's attic, rude 125 00:07:30,436 --> 00:07:33,436 Speaker 4: words spoken to each other's wives. In one version of 126 00:07:33,476 --> 00:07:36,356 Speaker 4: the story, Sheldon's refusal to bring a table to my 127 00:07:36,436 --> 00:07:40,116 Speaker 4: brists almost resulted in my being circumcised on an ironing board. 128 00:07:41,276 --> 00:07:43,996 Speaker 4: But in the version being told today, my father was 129 00:07:44,036 --> 00:07:46,556 Speaker 4: asked by Sheldon to pay more than his fair share 130 00:07:46,676 --> 00:07:48,476 Speaker 4: for their mother's funeral, and I. 131 00:07:48,476 --> 00:07:51,996 Speaker 6: Said, you always working some kind of an angle, So 132 00:07:52,356 --> 00:07:55,396 Speaker 6: he got furious. He got furious, He started screaming into 133 00:07:55,396 --> 00:07:58,836 Speaker 6: the phone, go to hell, drop dead, bye bye bye. 134 00:07:59,396 --> 00:08:02,956 Speaker 6: Was that was how that ended? But I feel he's 135 00:08:02,956 --> 00:08:04,996 Speaker 6: the kind of guy that the gun he has angles 136 00:08:05,156 --> 00:08:09,676 Speaker 6: like that, you know he has angles. I always felt 137 00:08:09,716 --> 00:08:10,996 Speaker 6: I was on the up and up with him and 138 00:08:11,036 --> 00:08:11,756 Speaker 6: he wasn't with me. 139 00:08:12,316 --> 00:08:15,436 Speaker 4: If you've got a stronger sense that he was interested 140 00:08:15,476 --> 00:08:19,156 Speaker 4: in seeing you, then would you yet? 141 00:08:19,436 --> 00:08:22,276 Speaker 6: Yeah, you would be my I wouldn't stay at house though, 142 00:08:22,316 --> 00:08:23,236 Speaker 6: that's out of the question. 143 00:08:23,836 --> 00:08:27,316 Speaker 4: Okay, quick sidebar. Anytime I've ever raised the prospect of 144 00:08:27,396 --> 00:08:31,076 Speaker 4: visiting Sheldon, no matter how hypothetical the scenario, my father 145 00:08:31,156 --> 00:08:34,076 Speaker 4: always makes a point of insisting, how no matter what, 146 00:08:34,436 --> 00:08:37,836 Speaker 4: he would not stay in Sheldon's house, even if he 147 00:08:37,916 --> 00:08:41,516 Speaker 4: was invited to which I should point out he never is. 148 00:08:42,116 --> 00:08:45,596 Speaker 6: I wouldn't stay it his house. How come you I 149 00:08:45,636 --> 00:08:48,436 Speaker 6: wouldn't stay there? I mean, not my thing? 150 00:08:48,756 --> 00:08:51,356 Speaker 4: How come you always bring that up? I mean, normally, 151 00:08:51,396 --> 00:08:53,876 Speaker 4: when someone goes to visit someone that they haven't seen 152 00:08:53,916 --> 00:08:56,676 Speaker 4: in decades, don't stay at a hotel, you know. 153 00:08:57,196 --> 00:09:00,396 Speaker 6: I would stay at a motel or somewhere near ATel. 154 00:09:00,596 --> 00:09:00,796 Speaker 1: Yeah. 155 00:09:00,836 --> 00:09:03,196 Speaker 4: No, we'd get a place, you know, with an ice machine, 156 00:09:03,276 --> 00:09:05,516 Speaker 4: and uh, you know why you want. 157 00:09:05,356 --> 00:09:07,396 Speaker 6: To you're interested in making a trip. 158 00:09:09,836 --> 00:09:13,996 Speaker 4: I mean, I'm interested. Do you think that there's anything 159 00:09:14,036 --> 00:09:18,876 Speaker 4: to be gained in in seeing him? 160 00:09:19,036 --> 00:09:19,316 Speaker 7: Hmm? 161 00:09:21,596 --> 00:09:25,676 Speaker 6: I guess there's something then, you know, you share your 162 00:09:25,676 --> 00:09:29,156 Speaker 6: common experience and talk about the old days, and there 163 00:09:29,156 --> 00:09:33,076 Speaker 6: are things that only he and I can remember, you know, yeah, 164 00:09:34,036 --> 00:09:37,116 Speaker 6: you know you What you could do is you could 165 00:09:37,156 --> 00:09:40,196 Speaker 6: call him and see what what what? What his attitude is? 166 00:09:40,436 --> 00:09:43,556 Speaker 6: You know, it depends on you, know how how how 167 00:09:43,596 --> 00:09:46,476 Speaker 6: how you feel, what kind of receptions you get. 168 00:09:46,836 --> 00:09:49,476 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I would. I would be happy to 169 00:09:49,516 --> 00:09:49,756 Speaker 4: do that. 170 00:09:50,796 --> 00:09:54,716 Speaker 6: I like your initial suggestion that you call him, feel 171 00:09:54,756 --> 00:09:55,716 Speaker 6: him out, and see what he's like. 172 00:09:56,356 --> 00:10:00,356 Speaker 4: Okay, I didn't suggest that, but you you suggested that. 173 00:10:00,836 --> 00:10:03,156 Speaker 6: Yeah. I like that just because you'll give me an 174 00:10:03,196 --> 00:10:05,076 Speaker 6: honest you'll give me an honest reaction. 175 00:10:05,556 --> 00:10:09,156 Speaker 4: I'm happy to do it. But I mean, what what 176 00:10:09,156 --> 00:10:12,316 Speaker 4: what are you looking for from? What do you want 177 00:10:12,316 --> 00:10:13,116 Speaker 4: to hear from him? 178 00:10:13,396 --> 00:10:15,676 Speaker 6: I missed my brother. I would like to see him. Okay, 179 00:10:16,556 --> 00:10:21,476 Speaker 6: that's all. Okay, you understand, and you come back on 180 00:10:21,556 --> 00:10:23,196 Speaker 6: me with an honest evaluation. 181 00:10:33,396 --> 00:10:38,956 Speaker 8: Hello, Sheldon, yes speaking Hi. That was quite a shock 182 00:10:40,196 --> 00:10:45,716 Speaker 8: getting a phone call, you said, Johnath. Yeah, my hearing 183 00:10:45,876 --> 00:10:49,196 Speaker 8: is not that great, okay, And when I heard the 184 00:10:49,236 --> 00:10:52,436 Speaker 8: first message, I'm saying, who the heck is that? I 185 00:10:52,476 --> 00:10:54,316 Speaker 8: don't know anybody by that name. 186 00:10:55,436 --> 00:10:58,436 Speaker 4: Sheldon now lives outside of Fort Lauderdale, but my few 187 00:10:58,476 --> 00:11:00,596 Speaker 4: memories of him are from when he lived in upstate 188 00:11:00,676 --> 00:11:03,636 Speaker 4: New York. I remember he lived in a trailer. I 189 00:11:03,676 --> 00:11:06,076 Speaker 4: remember that he worked at a local prison, that he 190 00:11:06,116 --> 00:11:08,876 Speaker 4: smoked cigars, that he looked a little like my father, 191 00:11:09,156 --> 00:11:12,036 Speaker 4: but was hunched, like the world was weighing down on him. 192 00:11:12,436 --> 00:11:14,556 Speaker 4: And he always wore this expression on his face that 193 00:11:14,636 --> 00:11:19,316 Speaker 4: seemed to say, you gotta be kidding me. You're keeping okay, 194 00:11:19,356 --> 00:11:20,476 Speaker 4: you're keeping occupied. 195 00:11:20,996 --> 00:11:26,076 Speaker 8: Yeah, I read a lot. I going to gym. I 196 00:11:26,116 --> 00:11:30,036 Speaker 8: go shopping, you know, here and there, little things here 197 00:11:30,076 --> 00:11:30,676 Speaker 8: and there. 198 00:11:31,196 --> 00:11:33,356 Speaker 4: And so you still go. How often you go to. 199 00:11:33,316 --> 00:11:35,396 Speaker 1: The gym three times a week? 200 00:11:36,556 --> 00:11:36,836 Speaker 6: Wow? 201 00:11:36,876 --> 00:11:38,236 Speaker 4: And what kind of stuff do you do there? 202 00:11:39,676 --> 00:11:45,996 Speaker 8: Well? I do him about twenty minutes of aerobics, uh huh, 203 00:11:46,036 --> 00:11:49,876 Speaker 8: and then I do a little weight training. I try 204 00:11:49,956 --> 00:11:52,156 Speaker 8: to flirt a little with the women there. 205 00:11:52,516 --> 00:11:58,116 Speaker 4: Oh yeah. My father also goes to the gym. That's 206 00:11:58,156 --> 00:12:03,556 Speaker 4: a part of his routine. Also, he was happy to 207 00:12:03,596 --> 00:12:05,436 Speaker 4: hear from you on his eightieth birthday. 208 00:12:07,076 --> 00:12:07,476 Speaker 7: Yeah. 209 00:12:07,516 --> 00:12:11,356 Speaker 8: Well he didn't call me on my eighty. 210 00:12:11,236 --> 00:12:17,156 Speaker 4: Fifth though, tit meet tat Yeah, like, so you know, 211 00:12:17,596 --> 00:12:21,116 Speaker 4: maybe we could uh go out for dinner. I don't 212 00:12:21,116 --> 00:12:22,196 Speaker 4: know that kind of thing. 213 00:12:22,996 --> 00:12:28,836 Speaker 8: Uh huh uh. Well, what what kind of time frame 214 00:12:28,916 --> 00:12:30,436 Speaker 8: are we talking about here? 215 00:12:40,316 --> 00:12:44,516 Speaker 7: I don't know. Our lives have been much different. I 216 00:12:44,516 --> 00:12:51,836 Speaker 7: don't know how much we have to have in common anymore. Yeah, 217 00:12:52,396 --> 00:12:55,276 Speaker 7: we don't have. We don't have much in common anymore 218 00:12:55,316 --> 00:13:01,076 Speaker 7: except the fact that we're elderly and retired. Other than that, 219 00:13:01,276 --> 00:13:02,996 Speaker 7: I don't know what we have in common. 220 00:13:04,036 --> 00:13:05,396 Speaker 4: You have your past in common? 221 00:13:07,356 --> 00:13:12,476 Speaker 7: Yes, uh, I'll tell you honestly. I'm not a very 222 00:13:12,636 --> 00:13:20,196 Speaker 7: sentimental person, and I being a pragmatist, I take things 223 00:13:20,236 --> 00:13:24,636 Speaker 7: the way they are. I try not to dwell upon 224 00:13:24,796 --> 00:13:31,236 Speaker 7: the past, and I try not to take people the 225 00:13:31,316 --> 00:13:33,836 Speaker 7: way I remember them, but as they are. 226 00:13:36,316 --> 00:13:37,996 Speaker 4: Do you think that makes things easier? 227 00:13:40,556 --> 00:13:41,876 Speaker 7: Makes things easier for me? 228 00:13:42,756 --> 00:13:50,036 Speaker 4: Yeah? Do other people around you? Sometimes? Doesn't make it 229 00:13:50,076 --> 00:13:52,636 Speaker 4: harder for other people around you ever. 230 00:13:54,676 --> 00:14:00,276 Speaker 7: To be honest with you, I've been in the last 231 00:14:00,316 --> 00:14:05,396 Speaker 7: few years. I've been a loner. You would basically almost 232 00:14:05,436 --> 00:14:11,276 Speaker 7: call me a recluse. I don't social eyes with many people, 233 00:14:12,636 --> 00:14:19,276 Speaker 7: and I really don't give a damn what anybody thinks. Yeah, 234 00:14:19,876 --> 00:14:27,476 Speaker 7: and contrary to popular believe, I like being alone by myself. 235 00:14:28,476 --> 00:14:31,036 Speaker 7: I get along with myself very well. 236 00:14:31,516 --> 00:14:32,796 Speaker 4: Yeah. 237 00:14:32,836 --> 00:14:37,116 Speaker 7: Look, I don't want to be rude. Yeah yeah, but 238 00:14:37,236 --> 00:14:38,956 Speaker 7: I want to go have my lunch. 239 00:14:39,076 --> 00:14:41,996 Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that's fine. That's fine, Sheldon. I 240 00:14:41,996 --> 00:14:45,956 Speaker 4: appreciate your talking to me, and you would be amenable 241 00:14:46,076 --> 00:14:48,756 Speaker 4: to spending some time. 242 00:14:50,676 --> 00:14:54,516 Speaker 7: Why not? We are brothers. I mean, we're not closer 243 00:14:54,596 --> 00:14:58,436 Speaker 7: or anything, but you know we're not going to have 244 00:14:58,476 --> 00:15:01,236 Speaker 7: a chance to see each other much in the future. 245 00:15:04,316 --> 00:15:08,476 Speaker 4: Yeah, is that anything that you think about? 246 00:15:11,916 --> 00:15:12,756 Speaker 7: Not much more? 247 00:15:16,236 --> 00:15:18,556 Speaker 4: And so I call my father back and let him 248 00:15:18,556 --> 00:15:22,316 Speaker 4: know that Sheldon is amenable. And because I know that 249 00:15:22,356 --> 00:15:24,756 Speaker 4: from my father, the days tend to pile up like 250 00:15:24,876 --> 00:15:27,756 Speaker 4: unboxed air conditioners. I have my mother get on the 251 00:15:27,756 --> 00:15:30,076 Speaker 4: phone to help nail down a firm travel. 252 00:15:29,756 --> 00:15:33,316 Speaker 6: Date and Dad. He wants to go, if. 253 00:15:33,236 --> 00:15:35,036 Speaker 4: Dad wants to go, if he wants. 254 00:15:34,796 --> 00:15:37,276 Speaker 6: To go next weekend. 255 00:15:38,276 --> 00:15:39,556 Speaker 4: We don't have to go on the weekend. We can 256 00:15:39,556 --> 00:15:40,476 Speaker 4: go during the week. 257 00:15:41,836 --> 00:15:49,156 Speaker 6: Yeah. Comes, as you know, you caught me off. God, 258 00:15:51,916 --> 00:15:54,116 Speaker 6: how about it. I'll call you Wednesday or Thursday. 259 00:15:54,196 --> 00:15:57,596 Speaker 4: How's that today's Monday? Or yeah, or even if you 260 00:15:57,636 --> 00:15:59,196 Speaker 4: feel like calling tomorrow, you can call me. 261 00:16:00,076 --> 00:16:07,996 Speaker 6: Yeah, okay, I'll probably I'll call you at the latest Thursday. 262 00:16:08,036 --> 00:16:09,436 Speaker 4: To get the Thursday. 263 00:16:09,716 --> 00:16:12,796 Speaker 6: At the latest, that's three. 264 00:16:12,636 --> 00:16:17,316 Speaker 4: Days from today. Yeah, okay, all right, you do what 265 00:16:17,356 --> 00:16:17,956 Speaker 4: you want to do. 266 00:16:17,996 --> 00:16:20,596 Speaker 6: You call me, but I'll call you Thursday. 267 00:16:20,916 --> 00:16:26,916 Speaker 4: Coming up after the break Thursday, and so on Thursday, 268 00:16:27,276 --> 00:16:30,436 Speaker 4: possibly with a little nudging from my mother, Buzz agrees. 269 00:16:30,956 --> 00:16:33,556 Speaker 4: And then my father and I are off to Florida 270 00:16:34,076 --> 00:16:35,556 Speaker 4: to visit my uncle Sheldon. 271 00:16:36,516 --> 00:16:40,236 Speaker 9: And then you have an address, Yeah, I do, okay. 272 00:16:40,676 --> 00:16:43,116 Speaker 4: My dad and I meet up at the Fort Lauderdale Airport. 273 00:16:43,596 --> 00:16:45,956 Speaker 4: I flew from New York and my dad from Montreal. 274 00:16:46,516 --> 00:16:49,196 Speaker 4: My father's all dressed up, wearing a faux Swaede sports 275 00:16:49,276 --> 00:16:51,996 Speaker 4: jacket that I've never seen him in. We grab our 276 00:16:52,036 --> 00:16:54,556 Speaker 4: airport rental and prepare for the two hour drive to 277 00:16:54,596 --> 00:16:58,236 Speaker 4: Sheldon in the ninety degree heat. It's immediately made clear 278 00:16:58,316 --> 00:17:01,516 Speaker 4: that faux swayed might not have been the best fashioned choice. 279 00:17:01,636 --> 00:17:02,956 Speaker 6: It's like we're on a safari. 280 00:17:06,316 --> 00:17:08,996 Speaker 4: On the road to Sheldon's. My father will experience a 281 00:17:09,156 --> 00:17:12,996 Speaker 4: spectrum of feelings as we first set out, there's excitement. 282 00:17:13,356 --> 00:17:15,396 Speaker 10: You know, my brother was funny in a lot of ways. 283 00:17:15,636 --> 00:17:16,196 Speaker 1: I could laugh. 284 00:17:16,236 --> 00:17:18,756 Speaker 10: We're gonna have laughed with him, you know what I mean. 285 00:17:18,796 --> 00:17:20,116 Speaker 1: He's a very funny man. 286 00:17:20,756 --> 00:17:23,036 Speaker 4: A half an hour in and there's bitterness. 287 00:17:23,316 --> 00:17:26,636 Speaker 10: We invited him to your Moments and he returned a 288 00:17:26,756 --> 00:17:30,476 Speaker 10: very cold card. Sorry, we will not be attending. 289 00:17:31,676 --> 00:17:34,396 Speaker 9: You know, it's so mean, you know. 290 00:17:34,316 --> 00:17:35,516 Speaker 1: What I mean? Even the writing. 291 00:17:37,516 --> 00:17:39,556 Speaker 4: An hour in and how is Buzz feeling. 292 00:17:39,996 --> 00:17:40,796 Speaker 6: I'm relaxed. 293 00:17:40,876 --> 00:17:43,276 Speaker 9: I'm kind of old to get anxious, you know. 294 00:17:43,276 --> 00:17:43,716 Speaker 1: What I mean. 295 00:17:44,156 --> 00:17:46,116 Speaker 4: Half an hour to Sheldon's a. 296 00:17:46,036 --> 00:17:47,156 Speaker 1: Little bit apprehensive. 297 00:17:49,956 --> 00:17:56,476 Speaker 4: Yeah, ten minutes to Sheldon's and Buzz is feeling all right, Yeah, 298 00:17:56,636 --> 00:17:57,516 Speaker 4: he's feeling a little. 299 00:17:57,676 --> 00:17:58,276 Speaker 1: Uh. 300 00:17:58,676 --> 00:18:01,716 Speaker 9: It's gonna be strange. Yeah, it's gonna be very strange. 301 00:18:02,876 --> 00:18:05,076 Speaker 9: I mean, the man is a stranger to me now, 302 00:18:05,076 --> 00:18:06,116 Speaker 9: and yet he's my brother. 303 00:18:06,396 --> 00:18:06,956 Speaker 1: You understand. 304 00:18:06,996 --> 00:18:08,316 Speaker 9: It's a very strange feeling. 305 00:18:09,356 --> 00:18:10,476 Speaker 4: Yeah. 306 00:18:11,796 --> 00:18:16,636 Speaker 9: I wonder if he's getting nervous, maybe because he's waiting 307 00:18:16,636 --> 00:18:16,996 Speaker 9: for us. 308 00:18:17,076 --> 00:18:31,276 Speaker 11: Right, Yeah, yell sat, Oh it's hot, it's really hot. 309 00:18:31,356 --> 00:18:34,276 Speaker 4: Yeah. Sheldon lives in the corner house on a quiet 310 00:18:34,316 --> 00:18:36,716 Speaker 4: suburban street ring the bell. 311 00:18:37,196 --> 00:18:41,036 Speaker 1: I guess is this his door? 312 00:18:42,316 --> 00:18:44,276 Speaker 4: I'll double check, maybe because there is. 313 00:18:53,356 --> 00:18:59,796 Speaker 10: Yeah, thank you, I smell the good smell of cigar. 314 00:19:02,556 --> 00:19:04,316 Speaker 1: There I become a monk me. 315 00:19:04,436 --> 00:19:08,876 Speaker 4: And after all the years and the worry and the dread, 316 00:19:09,276 --> 00:19:12,076 Speaker 4: things seemed to be going swimmingly. We sit down at 317 00:19:12,116 --> 00:19:15,156 Speaker 4: Sheldon's kitchen table and my father gets right into it. 318 00:19:15,676 --> 00:19:18,196 Speaker 1: Now, there's things I want to know. You said that 319 00:19:18,596 --> 00:19:19,236 Speaker 1: Rainy died. 320 00:19:20,556 --> 00:19:23,756 Speaker 4: The dead are a good place to begin as a subject. There, 321 00:19:23,796 --> 00:19:26,756 Speaker 4: easily agreed upon and not likely to spark a fight. 322 00:19:27,276 --> 00:19:31,356 Speaker 1: The uncle died. The uncle died. He was the youngest brother. Oh, 323 00:19:31,436 --> 00:19:32,676 Speaker 1: he died long ago. 324 00:19:32,836 --> 00:19:33,316 Speaker 4: He died. 325 00:19:33,996 --> 00:19:38,636 Speaker 1: Oh you know who died? Offfman, real prick. Yeah, I 326 00:19:38,636 --> 00:19:46,156 Speaker 1: didn't know him that well, we didn't know. Yeah, nish shocking. Yeah, 327 00:19:46,276 --> 00:19:51,356 Speaker 1: he was fat. He was fat, red head, red head right, yeah, nish. 328 00:19:52,796 --> 00:19:52,996 Speaker 6: Yeah. 329 00:19:53,196 --> 00:19:54,356 Speaker 1: Remember Johnny. 330 00:19:54,396 --> 00:19:55,436 Speaker 10: Johnny was a sex man. 331 00:19:55,516 --> 00:19:58,676 Speaker 1: Ye, john He would fuck a dog on the street, 332 00:19:58,676 --> 00:20:01,156 Speaker 1: if you sort of dog. He tried to the dog. 333 00:20:07,276 --> 00:20:11,236 Speaker 1: Can I get your guys a cold? I'd like a beer, 334 00:20:11,316 --> 00:20:11,916 Speaker 1: olive beer. 335 00:20:12,516 --> 00:20:15,276 Speaker 4: Even though they're in their eighties, Sheldon and Buzz still 336 00:20:15,276 --> 00:20:19,356 Speaker 4: possessed voices and temperaments suited to shouting out Brooklyn tenement windows, 337 00:20:19,796 --> 00:20:23,876 Speaker 4: while my voice olive beer is best suited to asking 338 00:20:23,916 --> 00:20:26,916 Speaker 4: a waitress if there will be a sharing charge the 339 00:20:27,116 --> 00:20:29,836 Speaker 4: fight forgot about that. 340 00:20:29,956 --> 00:20:30,276 Speaker 7: Sorry. 341 00:20:30,596 --> 00:20:34,156 Speaker 4: Case in point this is Sheldon accidentally swiping a portable 342 00:20:34,196 --> 00:20:37,396 Speaker 4: microphone receiver off the kitchen table and me trying to 343 00:20:37,436 --> 00:20:39,196 Speaker 4: smooth things over like this. 344 00:20:39,996 --> 00:20:40,636 Speaker 1: It's annoying. 345 00:20:40,676 --> 00:20:43,076 Speaker 4: No, he just put it in the in your pocket. 346 00:20:42,716 --> 00:20:44,556 Speaker 1: There, just stake it off. 347 00:20:46,996 --> 00:20:49,836 Speaker 4: Over the next couple of days, my testes will flee 348 00:20:49,876 --> 00:20:54,476 Speaker 4: like frightened cockroaches upward, ascending to heights not seen since 349 00:20:54,516 --> 00:20:59,396 Speaker 4: the bar Mitzvah that Sheldon was not attending. And while 350 00:20:59,396 --> 00:21:03,036 Speaker 4: we're on the subject of testes, here's Sheldon reminiscing about 351 00:21:03,036 --> 00:21:05,396 Speaker 4: the time he was examined for a rupture by their 352 00:21:05,436 --> 00:21:06,236 Speaker 4: family doctor. 353 00:21:06,756 --> 00:21:10,676 Speaker 5: Me and Wilie Rosen were joining the yep, say you 354 00:21:10,716 --> 00:21:12,516 Speaker 5: how to be tested for a rupture? 355 00:21:13,396 --> 00:21:13,596 Speaker 6: Hey? 356 00:21:13,636 --> 00:21:16,916 Speaker 5: I remember he put his hand under my balls. I 357 00:21:17,116 --> 00:21:20,036 Speaker 5: started left and so hot I pissed right. 358 00:21:19,876 --> 00:21:20,516 Speaker 7: In his hand. 359 00:21:26,436 --> 00:21:28,556 Speaker 4: Over the years, I've seen my father in the role 360 00:21:28,596 --> 00:21:31,916 Speaker 4: of husband, uncle, and grandfather, but I've never really seen 361 00:21:31,956 --> 00:21:34,436 Speaker 4: him in the role of younger brother. How odd to 362 00:21:34,476 --> 00:21:37,676 Speaker 4: see it now at eighty. He sits beside Sheldon with 363 00:21:37,676 --> 00:21:41,116 Speaker 4: this expression I've never seen on his face. It's wide eyed, 364 00:21:41,356 --> 00:21:48,796 Speaker 4: sweet and deferential. But as the day wears on, Sheldon 365 00:21:48,836 --> 00:21:52,196 Speaker 4: and Buzz begin to squabble over their memories, fighting over 366 00:21:52,236 --> 00:21:53,316 Speaker 4: every little detail. 367 00:21:53,716 --> 00:21:56,716 Speaker 10: Remember to Hallabaloo he had with the die haad dye, 368 00:21:56,956 --> 00:21:57,836 Speaker 10: that heavy set. 369 00:21:57,716 --> 00:22:01,916 Speaker 1: Girl a manicurist. She was a head dying manicurist. No, 370 00:22:02,276 --> 00:22:04,076 Speaker 1: she was a head dying. Here's what happened. She went 371 00:22:04,116 --> 00:22:04,716 Speaker 1: over to earth. 372 00:22:04,716 --> 00:22:06,876 Speaker 4: They even argue over the death of their grandmother. 373 00:22:07,396 --> 00:22:08,476 Speaker 10: I have found her body. 374 00:22:09,356 --> 00:22:11,716 Speaker 1: I opened the door. No, I My mother was across 375 00:22:11,716 --> 00:22:15,236 Speaker 1: the street at Greenborough. I remember walk and I knew she 376 00:22:15,356 --> 00:22:15,756 Speaker 1: was dead. 377 00:22:16,596 --> 00:22:18,116 Speaker 10: I never saw a dead body of my life, but 378 00:22:18,116 --> 00:22:18,996 Speaker 10: I knew she was dead. 379 00:22:20,916 --> 00:22:24,076 Speaker 4: Sure, so wait till you found her, or you found her. 380 00:22:24,156 --> 00:22:25,796 Speaker 10: I remember looking in on a room to see how 381 00:22:25,876 --> 00:22:27,476 Speaker 10: she do. I said it was awfully crop. 382 00:22:27,316 --> 00:22:30,476 Speaker 1: Quite I found them, but let him No, I'm not 383 00:22:31,996 --> 00:22:32,676 Speaker 1: some credit. 384 00:22:36,916 --> 00:22:40,396 Speaker 4: The whole afternoon is like this. Every subject, even their 385 00:22:40,436 --> 00:22:44,476 Speaker 4: dead grandmother, somehow becomes fodder for another pissing match. They're 386 00:22:44,516 --> 00:22:47,156 Speaker 4: burning up all this time with small talk when what 387 00:22:47,196 --> 00:22:50,836 Speaker 4: they need is some big talk. In particular, they need 388 00:22:50,876 --> 00:22:52,756 Speaker 4: to address a story that I know who It's a 389 00:22:52,756 --> 00:22:55,716 Speaker 4: great deal of meaning for my father. It took place 390 00:22:55,756 --> 00:22:58,476 Speaker 4: in nineteen thirty nine, on the day their mother left them. 391 00:22:58,956 --> 00:23:01,876 Speaker 4: I've only ever heard the story from my father, never 392 00:23:01,916 --> 00:23:05,196 Speaker 4: from Sheldon. I wanted to ask what you remember, what 393 00:23:05,276 --> 00:23:06,236 Speaker 4: your perspective? 394 00:23:06,916 --> 00:23:11,236 Speaker 5: Well, I remember that time was one Pop was smacking 395 00:23:11,316 --> 00:23:13,956 Speaker 5: Iran and she ran out in the hole in her. 396 00:23:13,916 --> 00:23:15,436 Speaker 10: Slip fighting in the hole. 397 00:23:16,876 --> 00:23:20,716 Speaker 1: He was smack smacking around. She ran out. Yeah, So 398 00:23:20,756 --> 00:23:24,636 Speaker 1: what happened the next morning? In the next morning, Yeah, 399 00:23:24,996 --> 00:23:27,436 Speaker 1: they look in the closet, her clothes were gone. She left. 400 00:23:28,436 --> 00:23:33,316 Speaker 4: Oh what happened after this? And my father's telling is 401 00:23:33,356 --> 00:23:36,076 Speaker 4: that his mother returned soon after she left with a 402 00:23:36,076 --> 00:23:37,316 Speaker 4: policeman in tow. 403 00:23:37,516 --> 00:23:40,316 Speaker 10: And they came back to try to get you. They 404 00:23:40,356 --> 00:23:45,796 Speaker 10: wanted you to come back with them, and where were you? 405 00:23:46,396 --> 00:23:48,036 Speaker 1: I was there, but she was. They were trying to 406 00:23:48,116 --> 00:23:48,996 Speaker 1: drag you out of the. 407 00:23:48,956 --> 00:23:52,956 Speaker 10: House and you weren't trying to grin Now, no, no, 408 00:23:53,436 --> 00:23:55,116 Speaker 10: I could say my father. 409 00:23:54,876 --> 00:23:55,756 Speaker 1: And grandmother mother. 410 00:23:56,916 --> 00:23:59,196 Speaker 4: This is the point of the story. For my father. 411 00:24:00,076 --> 00:24:03,196 Speaker 4: It proves once and for all how his mother loved 412 00:24:03,196 --> 00:24:06,596 Speaker 4: Sheldon more than she loved him. Sheldon didn't move out 413 00:24:06,636 --> 00:24:09,476 Speaker 4: with her, and after a year their mother returned earned 414 00:24:09,636 --> 00:24:12,636 Speaker 4: and together, Buzz and Sheldon grew up under the same 415 00:24:12,716 --> 00:24:16,676 Speaker 4: roof in the same bedroom, often sleeping under the same blanket, 416 00:24:17,316 --> 00:24:20,556 Speaker 4: each knowing who the mother had chosen, and each having 417 00:24:20,556 --> 00:24:23,196 Speaker 4: to do their best to carry on and live life 418 00:24:23,516 --> 00:24:35,996 Speaker 4: with the burden of that knowledge. A couple times during 419 00:24:36,036 --> 00:24:38,556 Speaker 4: the day I ask them why they haven't spoken in 420 00:24:38,596 --> 00:24:42,156 Speaker 4: so long, and they both insist, maybe out of embarrassment, 421 00:24:42,556 --> 00:24:47,636 Speaker 4: that they do talk, just not often. But it isn't true. 422 00:24:47,716 --> 00:24:50,556 Speaker 4: In fact, my father learned of Sheldon's wife's death many 423 00:24:50,636 --> 00:24:54,876 Speaker 4: years after the fact, and then only from me. Sheldon's 424 00:24:54,916 --> 00:24:57,036 Speaker 4: daughter got in touch through Facebook and we made a 425 00:24:57,076 --> 00:24:59,156 Speaker 4: phone date where she caught me up on her life 426 00:24:59,236 --> 00:25:02,076 Speaker 4: in Sheldon's and a few nights later, while over at 427 00:25:02,116 --> 00:25:04,836 Speaker 4: my parents for dinner, I told my father of his 428 00:25:04,916 --> 00:25:07,716 Speaker 4: sister in law's death. There was a terrible look that 429 00:25:07,796 --> 00:25:11,556 Speaker 4: fell across his face, one of sadness, but something else too, 430 00:25:12,316 --> 00:25:15,956 Speaker 4: maybe shock over just how far he and Sheldon had drifted. 431 00:25:17,196 --> 00:25:21,396 Speaker 4: I found out about Judy about her death. 432 00:25:21,916 --> 00:25:25,716 Speaker 1: Who your wife? I didn't know about it either until 433 00:25:25,756 --> 00:25:27,556 Speaker 1: you told me. Yeah, I didn't. 434 00:25:27,556 --> 00:25:31,676 Speaker 5: I tell you. 435 00:25:30,156 --> 00:25:31,156 Speaker 7: Didn't know about it. 436 00:25:31,276 --> 00:25:34,196 Speaker 1: No, we didn't know. We didn't know. 437 00:25:37,276 --> 00:25:43,516 Speaker 5: She was sick about two years. Judy well, when she 438 00:25:45,236 --> 00:25:51,156 Speaker 5: got the diagnosis, she was already stage four. What did 439 00:25:51,156 --> 00:25:56,356 Speaker 5: I know about cancer? So the surgeon, so he said, So, 440 00:25:56,436 --> 00:25:59,756 Speaker 5: I said, well, doc, how did the surgery go? I 441 00:25:59,756 --> 00:26:04,756 Speaker 5: always show you went very well? But the kansas in 442 00:26:04,916 --> 00:26:07,476 Speaker 5: her living now spread. 443 00:26:08,196 --> 00:26:10,956 Speaker 1: I said, it's in No, I said what. 444 00:26:13,276 --> 00:26:17,316 Speaker 5: And on top of that, I'm driving home, I'm all 445 00:26:17,356 --> 00:26:21,876 Speaker 5: fucked up, and I'm space style and my driver windows open, 446 00:26:21,916 --> 00:26:24,996 Speaker 5: and some kids pull up alongside me, a flip a 447 00:26:25,116 --> 00:26:26,756 Speaker 5: lit cigarette into my car. 448 00:26:37,996 --> 00:26:40,476 Speaker 1: You know where I usually eat? I come in and 449 00:26:40,516 --> 00:26:43,876 Speaker 1: buy myself by the ball. They got a waitress, Stair 450 00:26:44,196 --> 00:26:45,396 Speaker 1: always waits on me. 451 00:26:46,796 --> 00:26:50,276 Speaker 4: He takes cook care for dinner. Sheldon takes us to 452 00:26:50,276 --> 00:26:54,116 Speaker 4: a local outback steakhouse. As people walk by, he provides 453 00:26:54,156 --> 00:26:56,996 Speaker 4: a running commentary of an elderly couple. 454 00:26:57,316 --> 00:27:00,756 Speaker 1: Don't get like that couple. Whatever you did, it's time. 455 00:27:00,556 --> 00:27:03,396 Speaker 4: For the execution of an overweight couple. 456 00:27:06,716 --> 00:27:08,076 Speaker 1: People are fat today. 457 00:27:09,356 --> 00:27:12,196 Speaker 4: It's as though he's sharpening his wit, readying it for 458 00:27:12,236 --> 00:27:15,756 Speaker 4: the main event. Teasing my dad about Canada. 459 00:27:16,116 --> 00:27:19,396 Speaker 5: I don't know how you could take Canada on your wife, 460 00:27:19,876 --> 00:27:20,556 Speaker 5: so he got nice. 461 00:27:20,596 --> 00:27:22,716 Speaker 1: Neighbor's nice. It's okay. 462 00:27:23,676 --> 00:27:24,036 Speaker 10: Uh. 463 00:27:24,196 --> 00:27:26,436 Speaker 5: I wasn't gonna have to say, you're living in the 464 00:27:26,556 --> 00:27:27,996 Speaker 5: same place for am. 465 00:27:28,436 --> 00:27:32,756 Speaker 10: Oh about thirty five, thirty eight years, something like that. 466 00:27:32,836 --> 00:27:35,316 Speaker 1: I'm happy here. Yeah. Yeah. 467 00:27:35,316 --> 00:27:37,836 Speaker 4: For my father, I know this is a touchy subject, 468 00:27:38,156 --> 00:27:40,876 Speaker 4: believing as he always has, that Sheldon looks down on 469 00:27:40,956 --> 00:27:43,756 Speaker 4: him for the dinkiness of his Canadian life and home. 470 00:27:44,316 --> 00:27:48,476 Speaker 4: It's like a constant reminder of just who is second best. Later, 471 00:27:48,596 --> 00:27:51,996 Speaker 4: my father will repeat Sheldon's words. You're still living in 472 00:27:52,076 --> 00:27:56,436 Speaker 4: that same place, He'll say, for how many years? But 473 00:27:56,596 --> 00:27:59,516 Speaker 4: just then I watch my father clench and unclench his 474 00:27:59,636 --> 00:28:02,436 Speaker 4: jaw as he does when he is brooding. I know 475 00:28:02,516 --> 00:28:04,876 Speaker 4: he's trying to take the high road, trying not to 476 00:28:04,956 --> 00:28:06,396 Speaker 4: ruin the evening, what. 477 00:28:06,716 --> 00:28:08,956 Speaker 1: Two hundred dollars and thirty cents. 478 00:28:11,196 --> 00:28:14,356 Speaker 4: Sheldon invites us back to his place for cookies, but 479 00:28:14,436 --> 00:28:17,516 Speaker 4: my father says he isn't up for it, thank you, 480 00:28:22,636 --> 00:28:26,836 Speaker 4: and I'll get cold. As we walk through the restaurant 481 00:28:26,916 --> 00:28:29,996 Speaker 4: parking lot to the car, my father is silent. I 482 00:28:30,036 --> 00:28:33,796 Speaker 4: find myself feeling protective of him. After midnight, lying awake 483 00:28:33,836 --> 00:28:36,636 Speaker 4: in our hotel. My father insisted we stay at one. 484 00:28:37,276 --> 00:28:39,636 Speaker 4: I lay in bed thinking about that day in nineteen 485 00:28:39,676 --> 00:28:42,836 Speaker 4: thirty nine when my grandmother came back for Sheldon, not 486 00:28:42,996 --> 00:28:46,276 Speaker 4: my father. For my father, not only did it push 487 00:28:46,356 --> 00:28:49,436 Speaker 4: him away from Sheldon, making him feel jealous and resentful, 488 00:28:49,956 --> 00:28:51,996 Speaker 4: but it also cast a shadow over the rest of 489 00:28:51,996 --> 00:28:55,796 Speaker 4: his life, causing him to always feel passed over. He's 490 00:28:55,836 --> 00:28:58,236 Speaker 4: mellowed with age, but as a kid, I saw it 491 00:28:58,276 --> 00:29:01,556 Speaker 4: come out in all kinds of ways, always sensitive to slights, 492 00:29:01,916 --> 00:29:05,516 Speaker 4: ready for a fight at the smallest perceived defense. I 493 00:29:05,556 --> 00:29:07,516 Speaker 4: wonder if there's a different way for my father to 494 00:29:07,516 --> 00:29:10,756 Speaker 4: see things. If there is is, the only living person 495 00:29:10,796 --> 00:29:14,196 Speaker 4: in this world who can help is Sheldon. When their 496 00:29:14,236 --> 00:29:18,596 Speaker 4: mom left, Sheldon was nine, my father five. Sheldon would 497 00:29:18,596 --> 00:29:22,836 Speaker 4: have understood a lot more than my father. Yesterday, Buzz 498 00:29:22,876 --> 00:29:24,996 Speaker 4: and Sheldon talked like a couple of kids who used 499 00:29:24,996 --> 00:29:28,516 Speaker 4: to play stickball in the old neighborhood. Today, if me 500 00:29:28,596 --> 00:29:31,716 Speaker 4: and my big fat meddling Yap have any sway, they'll 501 00:29:31,716 --> 00:29:34,556 Speaker 4: have a chance to talk as men, as brothers, even 502 00:29:35,316 --> 00:29:44,596 Speaker 4: because if not. Now when day two, this is a 503 00:29:44,676 --> 00:29:46,676 Speaker 4: damn good cigar he sent me well. 504 00:29:46,716 --> 00:29:47,516 Speaker 1: Dominica Republic. 505 00:29:47,636 --> 00:29:49,756 Speaker 10: They make a damn good cigar in Dominical Republic. 506 00:29:50,156 --> 00:29:52,916 Speaker 4: Despite the difficulties of last night, the coin is flipped 507 00:29:52,916 --> 00:29:55,956 Speaker 4: back to the good side. Sheldon offers my father a cigar, 508 00:29:56,556 --> 00:30:00,596 Speaker 4: and with the cigar some cigar talk, some pretty foul 509 00:30:00,636 --> 00:30:01,276 Speaker 4: cigar talk. 510 00:30:01,836 --> 00:30:05,436 Speaker 5: We'll ride Mount Queen's Boulevard. Johnny's in the back seat 511 00:30:05,556 --> 00:30:08,676 Speaker 5: with the who. He's got his naked ass up in 512 00:30:08,756 --> 00:30:12,996 Speaker 5: the and he's well. The funny thing, we had to 513 00:30:13,036 --> 00:30:17,356 Speaker 5: stop for a light and there's a truck driver sitting 514 00:30:17,436 --> 00:30:18,916 Speaker 5: in the cab bump high. 515 00:30:26,516 --> 00:30:28,996 Speaker 4: So if you guys missed each other, what do you 516 00:30:29,036 --> 00:30:29,676 Speaker 4: miss each other? 517 00:30:31,756 --> 00:30:31,956 Speaker 6: You know? 518 00:30:32,076 --> 00:30:37,556 Speaker 1: He asked the weirdest question. What is he abroad? 519 00:30:37,796 --> 00:30:40,436 Speaker 4: No, I mean, I don't know. That's you know, eager 520 00:30:40,476 --> 00:30:42,876 Speaker 4: to prove to my uncle Sheldon that in spite of 521 00:30:42,916 --> 00:30:45,836 Speaker 4: the fact I'm wearing my wife's travel deodorant, I am 522 00:30:45,916 --> 00:30:48,836 Speaker 4: indeed not abroad. I allow them to return to more 523 00:30:48,876 --> 00:30:52,836 Speaker 4: pressing matters. They're prostates, that said Jesus. 524 00:30:52,836 --> 00:30:57,116 Speaker 1: He says, your prestate feels like the moon craters in there. 525 00:30:57,196 --> 00:31:01,476 Speaker 1: He said, I said, thank you, doctor, complimenting me. 526 00:31:03,316 --> 00:31:05,356 Speaker 4: So if I could steer this away from the prostrates, 527 00:31:05,356 --> 00:31:08,676 Speaker 4: and so my father said that it's significant to him 528 00:31:08,756 --> 00:31:10,436 Speaker 4: to have what do you say? 529 00:31:10,676 --> 00:31:12,556 Speaker 1: I agree with whatever he said? 530 00:31:12,756 --> 00:31:13,796 Speaker 4: But what about you? 531 00:31:14,116 --> 00:31:17,076 Speaker 1: I said, I agree with whatever he said. Do you 532 00:31:17,116 --> 00:31:18,036 Speaker 1: want to written? 533 00:31:18,716 --> 00:31:18,956 Speaker 10: I know. 534 00:31:19,116 --> 00:31:19,676 Speaker 1: I'm happy. 535 00:31:20,356 --> 00:31:22,236 Speaker 4: It feels like I'm getting a taste of what growing 536 00:31:22,316 --> 00:31:26,236 Speaker 4: up with Sheldon might have been like. So again I 537 00:31:26,316 --> 00:31:30,156 Speaker 4: make my move. So I have some questions just about 538 00:31:30,836 --> 00:31:33,076 Speaker 4: because the stories that I know from my father. But 539 00:31:33,436 --> 00:31:37,516 Speaker 4: I'm curious what your take is because you were older? 540 00:31:37,676 --> 00:31:43,836 Speaker 4: Do you remember what was going on when your mom 541 00:31:44,076 --> 00:31:47,676 Speaker 4: when your mother left? Originally like what? 542 00:31:47,676 --> 00:31:48,236 Speaker 1: What? Why? 543 00:31:48,436 --> 00:31:49,316 Speaker 4: And what was going on? 544 00:31:49,836 --> 00:31:52,996 Speaker 1: Didn't you cover this ground before yesterday? 545 00:31:53,756 --> 00:31:56,756 Speaker 4: But from my father's perspective, the way I understood it 546 00:31:56,796 --> 00:31:59,596 Speaker 4: was always you were the favorite. Did you did you 547 00:31:59,636 --> 00:32:04,556 Speaker 4: feel that way? At this point, Sheldon's face suddenly softens. 548 00:32:04,836 --> 00:32:07,596 Speaker 1: I always felt that I got the short end of 549 00:32:07,676 --> 00:32:08,156 Speaker 1: the stick. 550 00:32:09,276 --> 00:32:12,956 Speaker 10: You were you were kind of a favorite with my mom. 551 00:32:13,516 --> 00:32:18,876 Speaker 5: Yeah, maybe with mom because maybe temperamentally we were closer 552 00:32:18,996 --> 00:32:23,556 Speaker 5: than I was with my father. My father never gave 553 00:32:23,636 --> 00:32:27,676 Speaker 5: me spit. Did you ever get any money from my father? 554 00:32:28,636 --> 00:32:29,396 Speaker 5: I can't remember. 555 00:32:30,156 --> 00:32:31,836 Speaker 1: You never got a line? 556 00:32:32,036 --> 00:32:35,876 Speaker 5: Now, I can't remember you never one time I sprained 557 00:32:35,956 --> 00:32:37,316 Speaker 5: my ankle so bad. 558 00:32:37,396 --> 00:32:39,116 Speaker 1: That was that was terrible. 559 00:32:39,196 --> 00:32:41,836 Speaker 5: I laid in that bed my ankle. He was He 560 00:32:41,996 --> 00:32:47,596 Speaker 5: says to me, you lazy bum. Yeah, man, he went 561 00:32:47,716 --> 00:32:49,396 Speaker 5: off on me that time. 562 00:32:50,276 --> 00:32:54,036 Speaker 10: He took Sheldon once Sheldon happened to say the word fuck. 563 00:32:55,756 --> 00:33:00,276 Speaker 1: He came in with that fucking strap, swinging with. 564 00:33:00,316 --> 00:33:02,436 Speaker 10: The bucket, and you know, I can understand it, leaving 565 00:33:03,196 --> 00:33:06,356 Speaker 10: a feeling of resentment and dislike. 566 00:33:06,556 --> 00:33:08,356 Speaker 1: Hey, yeah, that was his way of. 567 00:33:10,116 --> 00:33:15,436 Speaker 5: Communicating with us. Smack smack, and then what a way? 568 00:33:16,276 --> 00:33:20,876 Speaker 1: Yeah? Was he easier on you? You think it wasn't that? 569 00:33:21,196 --> 00:33:23,356 Speaker 10: But he was tough on Sheldon. 570 00:33:22,996 --> 00:33:25,716 Speaker 5: Was I know you were closer to him than I was. 571 00:33:27,196 --> 00:33:31,356 Speaker 5: A lot of things that went on you didn't understand really. 572 00:33:31,156 --> 00:33:33,996 Speaker 10: Well it did going on, So you had a different take. 573 00:33:34,516 --> 00:33:36,716 Speaker 4: Well are you surprised. 574 00:33:36,196 --> 00:33:38,236 Speaker 1: By But I was a kid. I didn't understand it. 575 00:33:38,516 --> 00:33:40,756 Speaker 4: But you didn't know that Sheldon was getting it so bad. 576 00:33:44,076 --> 00:33:47,476 Speaker 4: In Buzz's telling, their father was always more or less benign, 577 00:33:47,636 --> 00:33:52,316 Speaker 4: childish figure, incapable of expressing his feelings and so given 578 00:33:52,356 --> 00:33:55,436 Speaker 4: to temper tantrums. For Buzz, it was their mother who 579 00:33:55,476 --> 00:33:58,156 Speaker 4: was the manipulator, the woman who played the brothers off 580 00:33:58,196 --> 00:34:01,956 Speaker 4: each other, but hearing Sheldon's take, it sounds like maybe 581 00:34:01,956 --> 00:34:04,476 Speaker 4: their mother didn't come to take Sheldon because she loved 582 00:34:04,516 --> 00:34:08,036 Speaker 4: him best, but simply because he needed more protecting from 583 00:34:08,036 --> 00:34:18,556 Speaker 4: their father. For the first time during our trip, I 584 00:34:18,596 --> 00:34:22,076 Speaker 4: can see my father considering Sheldon's point of view, actually 585 00:34:22,116 --> 00:34:25,316 Speaker 4: taking it in. I know it's intense for him because 586 00:34:25,316 --> 00:34:29,156 Speaker 4: he can't even meet Sheldon's eyes. Instead, he looks at 587 00:34:29,156 --> 00:34:31,436 Speaker 4: me addresses his comments to me. 588 00:34:32,356 --> 00:34:34,116 Speaker 10: You know, it said that my father had such a 589 00:34:34,156 --> 00:34:36,676 Speaker 10: negative impact on him, you know, just. 590 00:34:36,716 --> 00:34:40,356 Speaker 1: Awful because he had so much going for me. He 591 00:34:40,476 --> 00:34:41,356 Speaker 1: was a wonderful son. 592 00:34:41,996 --> 00:34:44,716 Speaker 10: He worked hard, he was a good boy. 593 00:34:44,996 --> 00:34:48,356 Speaker 1: He went to school talking like I'm a failure in life. No, 594 00:34:48,596 --> 00:34:52,076 Speaker 1: you aren't a fail that I'm saying. You weren't a faide. 595 00:34:52,076 --> 00:34:54,356 Speaker 10: But all I'm saying is that emotionally he left an 596 00:34:54,396 --> 00:34:55,316 Speaker 10: impact on you. 597 00:34:56,076 --> 00:34:59,116 Speaker 5: It took a long time for me to get out 598 00:34:59,156 --> 00:35:00,116 Speaker 5: of that emotion. 599 00:35:01,236 --> 00:35:06,636 Speaker 1: And now I'm at peace to it myself. I can 600 00:35:06,756 --> 00:35:09,236 Speaker 1: talk about him and laugh about it. 601 00:35:10,596 --> 00:35:10,996 Speaker 7: Now. 602 00:35:11,036 --> 00:35:16,356 Speaker 5: I want peace quiet. I'm happy living by myself. 603 00:35:17,796 --> 00:35:18,516 Speaker 6: Are you lonely? 604 00:35:18,756 --> 00:35:21,116 Speaker 10: Sheldon O? 605 00:35:26,196 --> 00:35:28,996 Speaker 4: The last time my father saw my grandfather in full health. 606 00:35:29,396 --> 00:35:32,796 Speaker 4: My dad was visiting from Canada. My grandfather asked my 607 00:35:32,836 --> 00:35:36,276 Speaker 4: father to drive him to the cemetery to visit his parents' grave, 608 00:35:36,916 --> 00:35:41,556 Speaker 4: and once there, my grandfather wept inconsolably. Later that day 609 00:35:41,596 --> 00:35:44,196 Speaker 4: he would succumb to a stroke and shortly after be 610 00:35:44,276 --> 00:35:47,476 Speaker 4: moved to a nursing home. With Sheldon being more local, 611 00:35:47,876 --> 00:35:50,996 Speaker 4: the burden of my grandfather's care fell mainly to Sheldon. 612 00:35:51,796 --> 00:35:54,116 Speaker 4: It seems like a lot of the family's burdens fell 613 00:35:54,156 --> 00:35:54,716 Speaker 4: to Sheldon. 614 00:35:55,316 --> 00:35:58,796 Speaker 10: They put a lot of the responsibility on him. That 615 00:35:58,876 --> 00:36:02,716 Speaker 10: my dad should have been taking that responsibility, and he 616 00:36:02,796 --> 00:36:03,436 Speaker 10: shoulded that. 617 00:36:03,836 --> 00:36:05,876 Speaker 1: Well, who is going to take car of you? Who's 618 00:36:05,956 --> 00:36:07,316 Speaker 1: going to take you to school? 619 00:36:08,076 --> 00:36:08,436 Speaker 6: Meet ya? 620 00:36:08,476 --> 00:36:11,196 Speaker 1: I remember one time, hours later or something, you stood 621 00:36:11,236 --> 00:36:18,076 Speaker 1: outside that cry. I said, mosy, I'm here, I'm here. 622 00:36:18,956 --> 00:36:23,196 Speaker 1: He was good to meet at times me, you know, 623 00:36:23,516 --> 00:36:24,156 Speaker 1: just you were. 624 00:36:24,356 --> 00:36:26,396 Speaker 9: My older brother used to knock the ship out of 625 00:36:26,436 --> 00:36:29,196 Speaker 9: me sometimes, but you know that's the way it is 626 00:36:29,316 --> 00:36:30,276 Speaker 9: with brothers. 627 00:36:31,636 --> 00:36:34,836 Speaker 5: Well, yeah, I was good in some way some way 628 00:36:34,876 --> 00:36:35,636 Speaker 5: that I was mean. 629 00:36:35,756 --> 00:36:38,756 Speaker 1: Who's who was not? Who's not who is not? 630 00:36:39,716 --> 00:36:43,036 Speaker 4: So if you feel like you were compelled to see 631 00:36:43,036 --> 00:36:45,836 Speaker 4: each other now because you knew that you know it's 632 00:36:45,876 --> 00:36:48,036 Speaker 4: an hour and never kind of thing. Then it means 633 00:36:48,036 --> 00:36:50,836 Speaker 4: that it was important to you both right to see 634 00:36:50,876 --> 00:36:51,276 Speaker 4: each other. 635 00:36:54,916 --> 00:37:00,876 Speaker 10: You want to take that easy answer, yes, yes, because 636 00:37:00,876 --> 00:37:03,196 Speaker 10: we're not getting any younger. I mean, what's what's down 637 00:37:03,236 --> 00:37:03,636 Speaker 10: the road? 638 00:37:04,796 --> 00:37:09,436 Speaker 1: I'm eighty he's eighty five. I mean because the there's. 639 00:37:09,276 --> 00:37:10,716 Speaker 10: A lot of water under the bridge, and we want 640 00:37:10,716 --> 00:37:14,276 Speaker 10: to close that bridge. Now, I want to feel easy. Now, 641 00:37:14,316 --> 00:37:16,116 Speaker 10: I want to say, now he's going to be eighty six, 642 00:37:16,156 --> 00:37:17,716 Speaker 10: I want to call him on his birthday and say 643 00:37:17,716 --> 00:37:19,796 Speaker 10: happy birthday to him. Now, I'm not going to stand 644 00:37:19,796 --> 00:37:21,396 Speaker 10: any fucking ceremonies anymore. 645 00:37:22,396 --> 00:37:25,676 Speaker 4: As my father speaks, as per his brother's example, dropping 646 00:37:25,796 --> 00:37:28,636 Speaker 4: f bombs like he's in a Guy Ritchie film, Sheldon 647 00:37:28,716 --> 00:37:32,156 Speaker 4: keeps his arms crossed and his eyes shut tight. He's 648 00:37:32,236 --> 00:37:35,276 Speaker 4: quiet for several seconds, and then he reaches out to 649 00:37:35,316 --> 00:37:36,076 Speaker 4: pet his cat. 650 00:37:36,436 --> 00:37:39,756 Speaker 1: Should I leave you a cat in my will if anything. 651 00:37:39,396 --> 00:37:41,876 Speaker 10: Happen, if anything out, I'll take care of the cat. 652 00:37:42,556 --> 00:37:43,676 Speaker 1: I'll take care of the cat. 653 00:37:45,436 --> 00:37:46,876 Speaker 10: I'm happy I can't to see you. 654 00:37:47,076 --> 00:37:50,156 Speaker 1: That I am. I'm happy it can't here. That's good, 655 00:37:50,436 --> 00:37:50,956 Speaker 1: very good. 656 00:37:54,876 --> 00:37:56,916 Speaker 6: Why me I want to buy a house. 657 00:37:59,756 --> 00:38:02,796 Speaker 4: When it's time to leave. Sheldon walks us outside, but 658 00:38:02,876 --> 00:38:05,476 Speaker 4: before we get into the rental, he points across the 659 00:38:05,556 --> 00:38:08,356 Speaker 4: lawn to his neighbor's house. He tells my father that 660 00:38:08,396 --> 00:38:11,196 Speaker 4: it's for sale, and then he tells him the asking price, 661 00:38:11,596 --> 00:38:13,916 Speaker 4: and my father says that doesn't sound bad at all. 662 00:38:14,396 --> 00:38:17,836 Speaker 4: And Sheldon says that, what with Canada being so bloody cold, 663 00:38:18,196 --> 00:38:21,316 Speaker 4: my father should consider moving to Florida, and my father 664 00:38:21,396 --> 00:38:25,556 Speaker 4: says maybe he will. They don't get too emotional, they 665 00:38:25,556 --> 00:38:29,036 Speaker 4: don't even hug it by, They just shake hands. And 666 00:38:29,116 --> 00:38:32,436 Speaker 4: with that, it feels like Buzz has forgiven Sheldon, and 667 00:38:32,476 --> 00:38:33,796 Speaker 4: Sheldon has forgiven Buzz. 668 00:38:35,196 --> 00:38:40,596 Speaker 5: All right, you take care of the bridge, sank trip 669 00:38:40,716 --> 00:38:41,156 Speaker 5: both this. 670 00:38:41,636 --> 00:38:44,156 Speaker 1: Thank you, Yeah, thank you. We'll speak. 671 00:38:44,316 --> 00:38:44,916 Speaker 10: We'll speak. 672 00:38:53,076 --> 00:38:55,836 Speaker 1: Turn right on Northwest, man drawn. Oh my god, it 673 00:38:55,876 --> 00:38:56,876 Speaker 1: feels so different now. 674 00:38:58,356 --> 00:39:00,676 Speaker 10: You know that this has taking a lot off my 675 00:39:00,716 --> 00:39:01,956 Speaker 10: shoulders idea. 676 00:39:03,316 --> 00:39:03,516 Speaker 6: You know. 677 00:39:06,076 --> 00:39:08,356 Speaker 4: As we ride to the airport, my father says that 678 00:39:08,436 --> 00:39:10,916 Speaker 4: the thought of Sheldon all alone in that house with 679 00:39:11,116 --> 00:39:14,356 Speaker 4: just a cat makes him sad. Do you really think 680 00:39:14,396 --> 00:39:17,556 Speaker 4: he isn't lonely, my father asks. I assure him that 681 00:39:17,596 --> 00:39:20,676 Speaker 4: Sheldon seems okay with being alone. But my father doesn't 682 00:39:20,676 --> 00:39:24,316 Speaker 4: seem so sure. After all these years, the burden of 683 00:39:24,356 --> 00:39:27,036 Speaker 4: having lost his brother has been replaced by a new burden, 684 00:39:27,796 --> 00:39:29,316 Speaker 4: one that might be heavier to bear. 685 00:40:09,756 --> 00:40:15,556 Speaker 3: Now that the furnitures returned to its goodwill. 686 00:40:15,236 --> 00:40:23,236 Speaker 6: Home, now that the last month's raft is scheming. 687 00:40:23,036 --> 00:40:27,076 Speaker 7: With the damage, the possum take this moment to do so. 688 00:40:29,916 --> 00:40:32,316 Speaker 4: If we ment, If we talk. 689 00:40:34,236 --> 00:40:35,516 Speaker 6: Were felt around for. 690 00:40:35,756 --> 00:40:36,396 Speaker 8: Far too. 691 00:40:38,796 --> 00:40:44,076 Speaker 3: From the thaus it accidentally Talk. 692 00:40:46,396 --> 00:40:49,316 Speaker 4: Heavyweight is hosted and produced by me Jonathan Goldstein. This 693 00:40:49,436 --> 00:40:52,076 Speaker 4: episode was also produced by Wendy Dore, Chris Neary, and 694 00:40:52,156 --> 00:40:56,236 Speaker 4: Khalila Holt, editing by Alex Bloomberg and Peter Clowney. Special 695 00:40:56,236 --> 00:40:59,396 Speaker 4: thanks to Caitlin Kenny, Starle Kine and Rachel Ward. The 696 00:40:59,436 --> 00:41:02,116 Speaker 4: show was mixed by Hailey Shaw. Music in this episode 697 00:41:02,156 --> 00:41:05,236 Speaker 4: by Christine Fellows, with additional music and ad music by 698 00:41:05,276 --> 00:41:07,956 Speaker 4: Hailey Shaw. Our theme song is by The Weaker Bands, 699 00:41:07,996 --> 00:41:11,396 Speaker 4: courtesy of Epitaph Records. A version of the story appeared 700 00:41:11,396 --> 00:41:13,396 Speaker 4: on This American Life, and we had a lot of 701 00:41:13,436 --> 00:41:16,436 Speaker 4: help from the folks there, Ira Glass, Julie Snyder, Jonathan 702 00:41:16,476 --> 00:41:20,196 Speaker 4: men Heavar, Sean Cole and Robin Semeon a very special 703 00:41:20,236 --> 00:41:23,716 Speaker 4: thanks to Emily Condons follow us on Twitter at heavyweight. 704 00:41:24,276 --> 00:41:25,836 Speaker 4: We'll have a new episode next week. 705 00:41:37,396 --> 00:41:41,196 Speaker 1: We used to call him Mitchie, little bitchy, the older brother, 706 00:41:41,356 --> 00:41:42,036 Speaker 1: the oldest one. 707 00:41:42,076 --> 00:41:42,316 Speaker 6: He was. 708 00:41:43,116 --> 00:41:46,476 Speaker 1: Hey, well lucky we turned out as good as we did.