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Speaker 1: No matter what twenty twenty five holes. A Talkspace therapist

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Speaker 1: sessions and messaging therapy. Your therapist will help you build

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Speaker 1: resilience and discover opportunities for growth in the year ahead.

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Speaker 1: Talkspace is in network with major insurers. Most covered members

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Speaker 1: have a copey of fifteen dollars or less, or you

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Speaker 1: can get eighty five dollars off of your first month

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Speaker 1: with promo code Katie when you go to talkspace dot

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Speaker 1: com slash Katiekuric. Hi everyone, I'm Katy Kuric and this

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Speaker 1: is next question. The statistics are pretty staggering when it

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Speaker 1: comes to the mental health of the United States. Forty

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Speaker 1: percent of Americans sixty five and older self identifies lonely,

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Speaker 1: and according to the NIH, approximately seventy percent do not

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Speaker 1: seek mental health treatment. In fact, many older Americans think

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Speaker 1: declining mental health is just a normal part of aging,

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Speaker 1: and of course, for young people, the numbers are even

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Speaker 1: more distressing. Forty percent of high schoolers report feeling persistently

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Speaker 1: sad or hopeless. One in five high school students seriously

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Speaker 1: considered attempting suicide in twenty twenty three, and suicide deaths

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Speaker 1: among ten to twenty four year olds increased by sixty

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Speaker 1: two percent from two thousand and seven to twenty twenty one. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: we're in the midst of a serious mental health crisis.

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Speaker 1: My guest today, doctor John Cohen, is the CEO of Talkspace,

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Speaker 1: the leading online platform making therapy more accessible than ever.

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Speaker 1: He's had quite a professional journey, as you'll hear in

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Speaker 1: our conversation, from winning the science fair in fifth grade,

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Speaker 1: to vascular surgeon, to COVID leader to now health innovator.

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Speaker 1: And here's a big highlight. Talkspace is expanding into medicare,

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Speaker 1: bringing much needed support to seniors. Talkspace is feeling a

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Speaker 1: hugely important need. I've long been interested in mental health

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Speaker 1: and the obstacles many people face when it comes to

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Speaker 1: getting the care they need. But that's a problem John

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Speaker 1: Cohen really wants to solve. Doctor Cohen, may I call

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Speaker 1: you John, absolutely, thank you, Thank you so much for

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Speaker 1: being here. Wow, You've had such an interesting career, and

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Speaker 1: I'm always fascinated by people's origin stories. So I want

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Speaker 1: to start from not the very beginning, but when you

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Speaker 1: realized you wanted to be a doctor.

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Speaker 2: Sure so thank you and thank you for the opportunity.

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Speaker 2: So I grew up in Queens and in fifth grade

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Speaker 2: I won the science.

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Speaker 1: Fair yay, and I was do you remember what your

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Speaker 1: project was?

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Speaker 3: I actually do.

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Speaker 2: It was actually a dissection of a calf's heart, which

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Speaker 2: I presented in this in this certain fashion.

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Speaker 1: Well that was very predictive, a.

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Speaker 3: Little bit of prediction. And I just loved science.

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Speaker 2: I love to read when I was growing up, and

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Speaker 2: I think it was from that point forward that I

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Speaker 2: said I really want to be a doctor. So I

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Speaker 2: don't that's the one event that I could point to

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Speaker 2: in my life early on.

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Speaker 1: You ended up becoming a vascular surgeon. That cow's heart

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Speaker 1: was really fascinating to you. Absolutely tell me about what

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Speaker 1: led you to that specialty.

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Speaker 2: So when you're in training and surgery training, it's a

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Speaker 2: five year surgical training program, which is I did a

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Speaker 2: New York Presbyterian Wild Cornell where I didn't meet my wife.

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Speaker 2: We met as residence and got married our second year.

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Speaker 1: Who's also a surgeon by the way.

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Speaker 3: Son in law. Thank you for that. Yes, And I.

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Speaker 2: Definitely wanted to be a surgeon for a long long time.

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Speaker 2: I don't know when that happened. I was quite honestly,

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Speaker 2: probably influenced by Mash the TV program. Really Alan, There's

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Speaker 2: no question that Hawkeye Peis was a hero of mine.

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Speaker 1: I think it's so funny.

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Speaker 2: I think it had some influence on me. And so

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Speaker 2: I trained for five years of surgery, and then trained

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Speaker 2: in VASCA surgery for a post residency up at the

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Speaker 2: Brigham and Women's Hospital at Harvard, then came back to

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Speaker 2: New York and then have been here ever since.

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Speaker 1: I have a dumb question, and I should know this

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Speaker 1: because I am really interested in medicine and science. I

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Speaker 1: think partly because of my husband's diagnosis of colon cancer,

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Speaker 1: I had to learn very quickly about cancer. And my

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Speaker 1: brother in law was the head of cardiology at the

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Speaker 1: University of Virginia, my alma mater, and so I know

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Speaker 1: a little bit about heart stuff, but I don't actually

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Speaker 1: understand what a vascular surgeon does. Is that embarrassing?

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Speaker 2: No, No, listen, not at all embarrassing. I'm not surprised

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Speaker 2: because most people don't.

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Speaker 3: Most people.

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Speaker 2: So the difference is between cardio surgery and vascal surgery

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Speaker 2: is vascal surgeons operate and all blood vessels except for

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Speaker 2: the heart so it's all the biginst of all blood cells,

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Speaker 2: the carotid arteries that supplied blood to the brain, a

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Speaker 2: orders that supplied blood to the rest of the body,

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Speaker 2: and so all of those blood vessels have certain abnormalities

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Speaker 2: during people's lifespan, and what we did is what we

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Speaker 2: do is vask In surgeons, is fix those abnormalities, whether

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Speaker 2: it could be fixing the blood vessel to the brain,

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Speaker 2: the crotid artery, whether it's fixing blood vessels to your

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Speaker 2: legs so people don't lose their limbs, or whether it's

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Speaker 2: fixing the aorta for something called ordic aneurisms that can burst.

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Speaker 2: So that's the specialty of Vaskal surgery. So that's what

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Speaker 2: I did for almost twenty years.

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Speaker 1: So you were less interested in the cow's heart and

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Speaker 1: more interested in what made that heart tick.

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Speaker 2: Oh, more about how you got the blood there and

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Speaker 2: how the blood left there, that's right, and the diseases

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Speaker 2: associated that. So that's in and of itself as its

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Speaker 2: own specialty.

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Speaker 1: What was your most frequent surgery that you'd perform?

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Speaker 2: Aerotic aneurisms, which are bubbles which form on very large

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Speaker 2: blood vessels. So the most common surgery it was aortic

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Speaker 2: aneurysm repairs and a lot of famous people including actually

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Speaker 2: Albert Einstein died of a ruptured aortic aneurism. Many people

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Speaker 2: much much early in the forties, fifties and sixties until

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Speaker 2: the techniques were developed to be able to repair them.

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Speaker 3: So that was my most common surgery.

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Speaker 1: So do you get a warning that you have that

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Speaker 1: problem or I mean, how do you operate on that?

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Speaker 2: So the ertic aneurisms are a silent killer. You only

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Speaker 2: would know it if you happen to get an ultrasound

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Speaker 2: or a cat scan and someone discovers it. You can

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Speaker 2: discover it on if they get very large on physical exam,

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Speaker 2: but most of them were discovered with people who do

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Speaker 2: not have symptoms. Now the other things I operate other entities.

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Speaker 2: I operated on corotid arteries, which is people frequently have

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Speaker 2: warning signs of a stroke. People who have leg problems,

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Speaker 2: we knew that they had those problems because see the

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Speaker 2: threatened limb loss or they had pain when they were walking.

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Speaker 2: So the different types of surgery, but for me personally,

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Speaker 2: it was mostly aortic and years of repair.

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Speaker 1: So after your career as a vascular surgeon, you transitioned

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Speaker 1: to a lot of other roles. You are a man

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Speaker 1: of many hats. You were leading the large scale COVID

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Speaker 1: nineteen testing efforts at Bioreference Labs during the pandemic. Yes,

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Speaker 1: what was that like?

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Speaker 2: So I was very fortunate. Yes, I've had a very

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Speaker 2: circuitous path.

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Speaker 3: Nice way of described haven't even gotten ye right.

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Speaker 2: Which is a sort of a nice way of saying

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Speaker 2: that I did a lot of things. So Bioreference I

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Speaker 2: was there for. I was the CEO and executive chairman

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Speaker 2: for about a year when COVID hit, which is just

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Speaker 2: an extraordinary event as we all remember or try not

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Speaker 2: to remember at this point. So we were faced by

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Speaker 2: references about the largest laboratory in the country, and we

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Speaker 2: were faced with the trying to figure out how to

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Speaker 2: make the diagnosis of people and how to get COVID testing.

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Speaker 2: So we did end up being the leader in a

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Speaker 2: lot of the customized solutions. So we ended up testing

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Speaker 2: for the NBA Bubble, if you remember, we did the

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Speaker 2: exclusive testing for the National Football League all fall two

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Speaker 2: hundred and fifty six games to Super Bowl. We relaunched

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Speaker 2: the cruise industry with Royal Caribbean and eventually was testing

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Speaker 2: out of ten or eleven ports around the country, and

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Speaker 2: then we were running most of the New York City

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Speaker 2: school testing, testing thousands of children and hundreds of schools

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Speaker 2: every single day. We did the overwelming majority of school

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Speaker 2: testing for New York City and other school districts. So

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Speaker 2: I had a very unusual experience with a great team

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Speaker 2: of people, and as you know, I ended up writing

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Speaker 2: about it about what it's like to be a leader

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Speaker 2: during a crisis, which is a very different crisis. So

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Speaker 2: there are crises that happen and then you have to react.

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Speaker 2: COVID was very different. One of my actually one of

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Speaker 2: my favorite quotes is COVID is where intuition goes to die.

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Speaker 2: Because every time we thought we knew what was going

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Speaker 2: to happen, something different happened, and you're it's a little

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Speaker 2: bit like being in the field in war because you

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Speaker 2: never really know what's going to happen the next day.

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Speaker 2: So every day we will wake up and changes would occur.

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Speaker 2: So it's a very different type of management than an

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Speaker 2: event that occurs and then you actually deal with the crisis.

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Speaker 2: So it was an extraordinary personal experience, an extraordinary experience

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Speaker 2: for the company.

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Speaker 1: I'm curious how you feel, John about all the Monday

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Speaker 1: morning quarterbacking that's happened after the pandemic ended, And it

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Speaker 1: seems it's become so politicized, and I think it actually

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Speaker 1: fueled a lot of people politically. And you know, there's

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Speaker 1: this lack of trust in science. There's so many, so

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Speaker 1: many things that are a part of this. But what

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Speaker 1: do you make of it?

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Speaker 2: So I'll stick to diagnostics because that's the industry that

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Speaker 2: I was. I will tell you that the rollout and

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Speaker 2: the COVID vaccine was remarkable in terms of the number

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Speaker 2: of lives that were saved, and I give there's a

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Speaker 2: lot of people that deserve credits for that. I do

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Speaker 2: think Pfizer and the CEO of Pfizer had an extraordinary

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Speaker 2: role in being able to move the COVID vaccine as

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Speaker 2: quick as they did, and the ability to the administration

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Speaker 2: of the Trump administration at the time to actually roll

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Speaker 2: it out. Now, having said that, on the diagnostic side,

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Speaker 2: as I sit here today, if God forbid there's a

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Speaker 2: bird flu outbreak or any other I will tell you

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Speaker 2: unfortunately we're still very very ill prepared for another pandemic.

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Speaker 2: On the diagnostics side, it continues to be an issue

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Speaker 2: relative can we scale and test millions of people a day?

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Speaker 2: And that discussion still really hasn't happened.

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Speaker 1: But why do you think you know, I've done interviews

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Speaker 1: about pandemic preparedness and this it's been ever thus. You know,

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Speaker 1: before the COVID outbreak, we weren't prepared. A lot of

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Speaker 1: people said, well, we've learned a lot and next time

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Speaker 1: will be better prepared. But it doesn't ever seem to

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Speaker 1: get traction. This idea of gearing up for the possible.

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Speaker 2: It's like you said, it's probably you know, all political

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Speaker 2: or politicized. At this point. I can't tell you why.

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Speaker 2: I just know that having been through it and seeing

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Speaker 2: you know, what we do or don't have, now, we're

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Speaker 2: not really ready for another pandemic. On the diagnostic side.

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Speaker 1: A lot of people I think complain about school closings, right,

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Speaker 1: and I always think, well, what if a bunch of

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Speaker 1: kids had died? Right? And that science is an art

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Speaker 1: and that people learn, as you said, where intuition goes

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Speaker 1: to die, people were learning in real time about how

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Speaker 1: this virus behaved.

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Speaker 2: Well, we were not only learning, but then every time,

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Speaker 2: as I said that, we thought then you had delta,

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Speaker 2: then you had omicron, and then we moved from testing.

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Speaker 2: Remember the lines people sitting in their cars for hours

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Speaker 2: and hours and hours to sit at a drive through

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Speaker 2: the get tested. And then we moved from filling from testing.

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Speaker 2: And at one point we were doing one hundred thousand

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Speaker 2: tests a day in the lab that had not done

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Speaker 2: one single test in March, and so we scaled for

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Speaker 2: several months to get up to that point. But remember

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Speaker 2: we moved from COVID testing, from swabbing you. Then we

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Speaker 2: moved to testing what it's called point of care, where

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Speaker 2: we would go someplace and they test you and you'd

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Speaker 2: wait for thirty minutes. And then we went to home testing,

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Speaker 2: but you had to send your result in. And then

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Speaker 2: we went to testing where people tested theirselves. So the

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Speaker 2: evolution of the technology alone was extraordinary once we got

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Speaker 2: to where people figured out what they needed. But those

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Speaker 2: changes alone only occurred over maybe six or seven or

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Speaker 2: eight months.

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Speaker 3: Think about that.

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Speaker 2: You know, we test everybody one way, and then we

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Speaker 2: wake up say oh, no, no, no, now we have to

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Speaker 2: test people another way. Oh and now we need to

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Speaker 2: test them another way. So we were trying to manage

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Speaker 2: that on a day to day basis and people screaming

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Speaker 2: for the results. Anyway, it was a quite It was

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Speaker 2: an extraordinary personal experience. I could tell you that I that, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it was for three years.

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Speaker 1: I was going to say, was it traumatizing in some ways?

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Speaker 3: No, I don't know.

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Speaker 2: To me, it was a traumatizing. It was its very

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Speaker 2: in some stance of vigor.

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Speaker 3: It was.

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Speaker 2: It was exciting that maybe not the right objective to

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Speaker 2: be in the middle of it, but to be part

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Speaker 2: of it and to help figure it out. It was Again,

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Speaker 2: it was an amazing personal experience and for the team

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Speaker 2: of people had around me, they were unbelievable to be

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Speaker 2: able to pull this off.

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Speaker 3: Quite honestly, we.

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Speaker 2: Did a lot of experimentation, guessing, making decisions, good decisions,

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Speaker 2: bad decisions, moving forward, and trying to figure out, you know,

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Speaker 2: what was going to work and what was going to work.

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Speaker 2: I mean, we were literally testing hundreds of thousands of

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Speaker 2: people a week in the test that didn't exist in

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Speaker 2: March of tw twenty twenty.

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Speaker 1: So you go from being a vascular surgeon to overseeing

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Speaker 1: sort of the diagnostic technology, the evolution of the diagnostic

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Speaker 1: technology for COVID right and implementing it in very high

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Speaker 1: risk situations. Right. I can't think of a higher risk

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Speaker 1: situation than a cruise ship right where there was such

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Speaker 1: a huge outbreak early on in the pandemic. How the

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Speaker 1: hell did you become CEO space?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's cool.

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Speaker 1: Maybe we should explain what talk space is. Can you

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Speaker 1: help us with that?

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Speaker 2: So Talkspace says we're publicly traded. We've been around thirteen years,

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Speaker 2: when public about three years ago. So Talkspace right now

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Speaker 2: is a mental health virtual provider. So what you do

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Speaker 2: for talk spaces If you need mental health therapy, you

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Speaker 2: go online and we have multiple modalities so you can

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Speaker 2: be treated a lot of people get treated by video,

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Speaker 2: live video. It's a live video visit. We are, by

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Speaker 2: the way, a fully hip a compliant healthcare organization. We

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Speaker 2: have six thousand therapists all fifty states across the country.

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Speaker 2: And what happens you get matched with a therapist and

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Speaker 2: the therapists just like you would go to a therapist

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Speaker 2: to get therapy. Mental health service does that online video

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Speaker 2: We also have which I thought was quite amazing when

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Speaker 2: I got there. Talk sayst died mostly original research that

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Speaker 2: you could provide therapy through texting and.

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Speaker 1: Messaging, right, so it's.

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Speaker 2: Called asynchronous therapy, and the reason it's a really bad move.

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Speaker 2: So asynchronous therapy means that if you send a message

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Speaker 2: to your therapist at three o'clock in the morning, she

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Speaker 2: or he's not getting back to you probably till nine

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Speaker 2: or ten the next day. So it means that it's

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Speaker 2: not happening to be instantaneously.

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Speaker 3: That's correct.

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Speaker 2: So well, that's why it's called asynchronous. So it turns

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Speaker 2: out they did the Toxics in most of the original

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Speaker 2: research on that to prove that you can actually deliver

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Speaker 2: therapy adequately through texting messaging and then move to video

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Speaker 2: from there and we talk about it. You know, I

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Speaker 2: got there a little over two years ago. We made

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Speaker 2: a big toxics at a big pivot to being in network.

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Speaker 2: So most people's insurance now cover therapy through talk Space.

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Speaker 2: That's very important. We have one hundred and sixty five

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Speaker 2: million covered lives soon to be two hundred million covered lives,

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Speaker 2: which means when you're looking for therapy now, good chance

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Speaker 2: you don't have to pay for it, or there's a

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Speaker 2: very small copay or at a pocket charge. That's changed

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Speaker 2: the dynamic dramatically for talk Space because the number one.

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Speaker 2: I talk about this all the time. The number one

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Speaker 2: barrier to getting health care is cost. Right, So now

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Speaker 2: instead of.

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Speaker 1: Going for therapy, mental health care and mentally.

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Speaker 2: Yeah right, and in general so general health care, the

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Speaker 2: number one is costs. So now in mental health because

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Speaker 2: of a bunch of other issues we could talk about

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Speaker 2: in terms of accessibility and availability, but affordability, cost has

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Speaker 2: been a big issue. So now if people are looking

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Speaker 2: for therapy, basically the insurance is going.

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Speaker 3: To cover it.

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Speaker 2: That's fueled a huge growth in talk space in terms

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Speaker 2: of the number of people accessing. So that's that's what

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Speaker 2: talk space says briefly.

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Speaker 1: Right now, why did this job appeal to you? And

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Speaker 1: no offense, but why are you qualified?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: So it's you've asked the same question you've asked is

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Speaker 2: what most of my close friends have asked me.

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Speaker 3: Also, like what you know? How in the world is

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Speaker 3: this happening? So I so.

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Speaker 2: First off, total transp answer. Yes, I during medical school.

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Speaker 2: I think I had a week of psychiatry. So I'm

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Speaker 2: not going to tell you that I have any psychiatric

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Speaker 2: background or out or any qualifications from a you know,

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Speaker 2: physician point of view to be a psychiatrist and I

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Speaker 2: have a chief medical officer at the company. Her job

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Speaker 2: is to be that physician and that leader. So I

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Speaker 2: was when I was at Bioreference, and prior to that,

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Speaker 2: I was actually a senior executive at Quest Diagnostics. I

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Speaker 2: have fairly deep background in digital health, so it was

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Speaker 2: always interested when we built a digital health platform and

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Speaker 2: how you get your medical records and how you get

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Speaker 2: results online. And we built a very interesting digital health

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Speaker 2: product when I was at bioreference to be able to

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Speaker 2: go to your home and draw your bloods and get

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Speaker 2: a digital result back. So we built that platform. There

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Speaker 2: was the chairman of the board that Talkspace met me

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Speaker 2: when I was at bioreference and asked me at the

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Speaker 2: time if I would consider coming on the board. So

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Speaker 2: I joined the board of Talkspace first and then post

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Speaker 2: COVID after leaving by a reference, not sure what I

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Speaker 2: was going to do next, they asked me if I

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Speaker 2: would consider coming off the board and taking on the

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Speaker 2: role of CEO of the company. So that's how I

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Speaker 2: ended up there. So I was on the board and

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Speaker 2: then came off to become CEO, and that's a little

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Speaker 2: over two years ago.

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Speaker 1: So it appealed to your interest and digital health and

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Speaker 1: I guess making health care more accessible and affordable.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So there were a couple of reasons. One is

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Speaker 2: which is we should get into is what we like

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Speaker 2: to say is that mental health time has come. If

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Speaker 2: you had this discussion ten years ago, we couldn't have

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Speaker 2: this discussion ten years ago. Now mental health has become

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Speaker 2: front and center. It's become physical health and mental health,

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Speaker 2: and it's become as important, which it should be as

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Speaker 2: physical health. So one is mental all the time has come,

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Speaker 2: So that was very interesting to me. Two is the market,

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Speaker 2: the total addressable market, meaning the ability to have something

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Speaker 2: that has a big influence and has a very big

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Speaker 2: market is very important because you have if you have

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Speaker 2: a solution but nobody wants it, that's it's not really

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Speaker 2: very great, right, but you have and if you have

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Speaker 2: a solution, which I believe Talkspace had in a market

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Speaker 2: where fifty percent of the people coming to talk space

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Speaker 2: every week are new to therapy.

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Speaker 1: What percentage fifty? Wow?

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Speaker 2: So you have this incalculable number of people who want it,

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Speaker 2: who need it, and turns out talk Space has a

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Speaker 2: solution that is scalable, affordable, accessible and available. So that

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Speaker 2: was the so for me, it was a very interesting opportunity.

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Speaker 2: And like I said, I'm not certainly not qualified on

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Speaker 2: the psychiatry part of the mental health part. I think

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Speaker 2: that eventually, as a leader, which you see in a

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Speaker 2: lot of different industries, if you learn how to lead,

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Speaker 2: then you can figure it out if you put good

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Speaker 2: people around you. And that's that is the listen, it's

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Speaker 2: whoever's president of United States, whatever.

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Speaker 3: Corporation to toe you.

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Speaker 2: Most people walk into a lot of people walk in

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Speaker 2: those positions with not having industry experience, but they have

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Speaker 2: a leadership experience. And there's a big difference between being

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Speaker 2: a successful person and being a leader, very very very different.

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Speaker 1: The new year is the time to make plans and

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Speaker 1: set goals, but the only thing you can be certain

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Speaker 1: of is change, good, bad, or in between. A Talkspace

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Speaker 1: therapist can help you get ready for what's next, whether

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Speaker 1: you have big ambitions for twenty twenty five or are

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Speaker 1: simply trying to stay the course. Through video sessions and

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Speaker 1: messaging therapy, a licensed talkspace therapist will help you build

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Speaker 1: your resilience and discover opportunities for growth. Talkspace is in

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Speaker 1: network major insurers and most covered members have a copay

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Speaker 1: of fifteen dollars or less, or you can take eighty

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Speaker 1: five dollars off your first month with the promo code Katie.

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Speaker 1: When you go to talkspace dot com slash Katiecuric Match

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Speaker 1: with the Licensed Therapist today at talkspace dot com slash Katiecuric.

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Speaker 1: What do you think makes a good leader? I'm just

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Speaker 1: curious because I feel like there's a real dearth of

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Speaker 1: leaders or I think a lot of people look around

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Speaker 1: and say, where are all the incredible leaders in our society?

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Speaker 2: So part of that is that, without getting too political,

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Speaker 2: is the reason the reason most people don't run for

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Speaker 2: office as a leader is because of the quote blood sport,

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Speaker 2: that the that the news and the presses nobody wants

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Speaker 2: to put their family and everybody else through what most

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Speaker 2: people have to go through if you're going to run

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Speaker 2: for office.

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Speaker 1: But it's also the oppa research. Just to defend the

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Speaker 1: press for a second, Yes, a lot of it is

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Speaker 1: coming from whoever is running against you, right right.

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Speaker 2: There's no question the oppositie your research is the and

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Speaker 2: so that to me is one of the bigges things.

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Speaker 2: So to back the issues of you know, leadership, So

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Speaker 2: I you know I do talk about it during the

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Speaker 2: COVID crisis, and the book is there. There are a

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Speaker 2: bunch of different attributes that make a person effective leader,

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Speaker 2: and there's a lot of people talk about it the

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Speaker 2: son without any particular order.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: First off is to me, it's very important that you

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Speaker 2: listen to your in a voice. I tell people I

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Speaker 2: call it the little man sitting on your shoulder, and

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Speaker 2: as a physician assurgeon, you need to listen to your

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Speaker 2: your gut instincts and what your brain is telling you

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Speaker 2: and not ignore the obvious. Now that may seem like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: well that doesn't sound very important, but a lot of

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Speaker 2: people don't. A lot of people don't listen to their

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Speaker 2: to their in a voice. So that's the one. Second

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Speaker 2: is you need to be able to communicate effectively, both

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Speaker 2: internal communications and external communications. No particular third I bes

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Speaker 2: mentioned you got to surround yourself with great people because

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Speaker 2: you can't do everything. And unless you have great people

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Speaker 2: around you who you really trust, you know incredibly important.

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Speaker 3: You need to read.

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Speaker 2: I know it's a sort of that you need to read,

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Speaker 2: and not just about your industry, but I would tell

441
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:10,439
Speaker 2: you an enormous number of ideas that come to us

442
00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:12,439
Speaker 2: or through me is because I read about something that

443
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 2: is totally unrelated to what I'm doing and saying, wow,

444
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,720
Speaker 2: maybe that applies to what we're doing. So becoming knowledgeable

445
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,280
Speaker 2: reading I think walking the walks very important. Mean you

446
00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 2: have to be out there. You can't be an armchair

447
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 2: surgeon or an armchair leader. You have to be out

448
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:30,959
Speaker 2: there and you know, you know, during COVID, I remember

449
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,040
Speaker 2: going to visit the cruise line industry. I've never been

450
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:34,919
Speaker 2: on a cruise of my life, and I was I'm

451
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 2: just not going to I'm very i get very very seasick.

452
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 2: But I went and I walked the ship to figure

453
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:42,240
Speaker 2: out how are we going to get people tested before

454
00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:43,680
Speaker 2: they got on the ship. Just to give an example.

455
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 2: So you need to walk the walk and really understand

456
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 2: what the dynamics are in the field to be able

457
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 2: to help lead effectively a bunch of people. I think

458
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 2: staying in touch with people's extraordinary important. I will tell

459
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:59,800
Speaker 2: you our ability to test different places when we tested

460
00:24:59,840 --> 00:25:02,040
Speaker 2: for or New York State, when we tested for New

461
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:04,560
Speaker 2: York City, when we did the majority of testing for

462
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:06,959
Speaker 2: a lot of fifteen in the counties in New Jersey.

463
00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,800
Speaker 2: It was all because of different people that had met

464
00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:11,399
Speaker 2: during my life that was able to pick up the

465
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 2: phone or they picked up the phone to call me

466
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:14,480
Speaker 2: and say listen, can you help?

467
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 3: So those are.

468
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 2: I think taking risk is important or feeling comfortable taking risks.

469
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:25,719
Speaker 2: Covid is we made a huge amount of decisions during uncertainty.

470
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:27,720
Speaker 2: You have to just get comfortable and you got to

471
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:29,720
Speaker 2: make a mistake. So those are just some of the

472
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 2: things that make an effective leader during a crisis.

473
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 1: Anyway, let's talk about mental health and the stigma that

474
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 1: used to surround it. Why is there less of a

475
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 1: stigma surrounding mental health today than there was ten years ago?

476
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: To your point, Well.

477
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:49,840
Speaker 2: First of if you look at either gen Z or millennials,

478
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:54,360
Speaker 2: they're so out there talking to people and comfortable discussing

479
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,680
Speaker 2: their feelings. They grew up in a very different environment

480
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:01,719
Speaker 2: than I grew up, and there are still cultural stigma issues.

481
00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 2: There are definite issues with certain sub segments of the

482
00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 2: population that just will never talk about it. However, the

483
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:15,720
Speaker 2: the the idea that the younger generations feel much more

484
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 2: comfortable now, maybe because it's also because of the phones

485
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 2: and cell phones, and they used to communicating and they're

486
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,400
Speaker 2: used to talking to people all the time, but it's very,

487
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,680
Speaker 2: very different. In addition, people are aware now and they're

488
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:28,520
Speaker 2: willing to discuss.

489
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 3: It.

490
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:31,879
Speaker 2: So you know, we may talk about, well, what's happening

491
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 2: with seniors, and now talking about seniors and loneliness and isolation.

492
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,280
Speaker 2: I'll give you a great example when if you remember

493
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:42,720
Speaker 2: Deamar Hamlin, he was when I had cardiac arrests during

494
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 2: the football team. Remember we're a football game. What was

495
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,240
Speaker 2: fascinating is, you know, fortunately he did incredibly well and

496
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 2: they got him off the field and you know he's back.

497
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,440
Speaker 2: But the day after that, I will never forget it

498
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,760
Speaker 2: was I think it was un CNN. One of the

499
00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 2: player reps, you know, the guys who lead part of

500
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 2: the players unions, got up there and said, guys, man up,

501
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 2: you need to go talk to people about this. You

502
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 2: guys can't just keep your feelings internal. You need to

503
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 2: go out there and see somebody talk about it. That

504
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 2: never would happen ten years ago that someone would sit

505
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,119
Speaker 2: on broadcast TV and say to guys like, guys, you

506
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:21,280
Speaker 2: got to figure out how to deal.

507
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:25,280
Speaker 3: With your emotions. So that the idea that it's out

508
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:27,000
Speaker 3: there is very important. I don't know if you know so.

509
00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:29,920
Speaker 2: Our brand ambassador for talk space has been Michael Phelps.

510
00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:31,679
Speaker 1: Yes, I know Michael.

511
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:32,960
Speaker 3: So he's been.

512
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,280
Speaker 2: Amazed, he still is. He's been amazing. And his journey,

513
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 2: his mental journey, actually helped put talkspace on the map

514
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 2: when he agreed to talk about his mental journey and

515
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,159
Speaker 2: he became a big part of talkspace and still is

516
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:47,719
Speaker 2: talking about his journey.

517
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,520
Speaker 4: It was October of twenty fourteen that I lost all hope.

518
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 4: I was one of the world's most successful athletes, eighteen

519
00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:59,440
Speaker 4: gold medals, all American dream come true.

520
00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 3: I was lost.

521
00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:04,440
Speaker 4: I hadn't left my room in five days. I questioned

522
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 4: whether I wanted to be alive anymore. I realized that

523
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 4: I'm the strongest person I know, but at that moment,

524
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,439
Speaker 4: I was the weakest. I realized I couldn't handle this

525
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:17,639
Speaker 4: by myself. That's when I decided to seek help and

526
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 4: work with a therapist. That decision saved my life. You

527
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:22,920
Speaker 4: don't have to wait for it to get that bad.

528
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 4: Please talk to a licensed therapist as soon as you

529
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:31,719
Speaker 4: feel you need help, brought to you by talk Space

530
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:34,400
Speaker 4: Therapy for all.

531
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:37,400
Speaker 2: So, I think it's people are now willing to talk

532
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:42,120
Speaker 2: about it, and actually it's no longer a stigma to

533
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 2: get help.

534
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: I think you're right, people are talking about it more,

535
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: and I think there's just a greater understanding, as you said,

536
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 1: about the importance of that mental health is as important

537
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 1: as physical health.

538
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 3: Right, I mean I.

539
00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 2: Would have to talk. I think everybody has should have

540
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 2: a primary care phosian. Actually, I believe everybody should have

541
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 2: a therapist. I think everybody should have somebody that they

542
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 2: could talk to. It would be really helpful.

543
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:13,440
Speaker 1: Let's talk about the accessibility, because I know there aren't

544
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 1: enough therapists out there, or at least that's what I've read,

545
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 1: especially in rural communities, especially in some underserved communities, and

546
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 1: I think there is still perhaps more of a stigma

547
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 1: and underserved communities. Can you talk about the challenges of

548
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 1: providing mental health services to people in those situations?

549
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 3: Sure?

550
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:43,760
Speaker 2: So the availability or accessibility there links. So availability is okay?

551
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 2: Is there a therapist actually available to take care of you?

552
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:49,480
Speaker 2: The other part of that is are they accessible to you?

553
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 2: Can you get to them? It's no good if you

554
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 2: have a therapist but you're three hundred miles away and

555
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 2: can't get to them. So the talk Space solution has

556
00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:00,000
Speaker 2: solved that issue because what happens is by doing virtual

557
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 2: you don't have to leave your house, you don't have

558
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 2: to travel. We make it incredibly easy for you to

559
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 2: schedule it. And by the way, if you want to

560
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 2: get a therapist to talkspace, we're going to match you

561
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,719
Speaker 2: with a therapist within twenty four hours and frequently it's

562
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 2: several hours. So you could start communicating your therapist within

563
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 2: twenty four hours if you match your therapist through talkspace.

564
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:21,400
Speaker 2: So that solution has made it very, very easy for

565
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 2: people to get help. So I know we may talk

566
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 2: about teen Space, which is the program we're running in

567
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:30,480
Speaker 2: New York City, but I'll jump ahead to some of

568
00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 2: the data. So we have almost two we have almost

569
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 2: twenty thousand kids between the age of thirteen and seventeen

570
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,320
Speaker 2: who are on the Talkspace platform. So we have a

571
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 2: contract with New York City it's public to provide Talkspace

572
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 2: to four hundred and sixty five thousand eligible teenagers between

573
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 2: the age of thirteen and seventeen for free for New

574
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 2: York City teenagers. So all you need is your zip

575
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:56,960
Speaker 2: code and your data birth to sign up. So if

576
00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 2: you think about it, We've had twenty thousand teens sign

577
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 2: up within the first year. I will tell you no question,

578
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 2: ninety nine percent of those kids never would have had

579
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 2: therapy before.

580
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:08,720
Speaker 3: Right.

581
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 2: The reason is is we've made it one affordable, it's free.

582
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 2: It's incredibly successful because they're ninety percent or greater of

583
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 2: the kids are accessing it through their phone. So now

584
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 2: it happens if you look at we've done the zip

585
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 2: code analysis, so where we're reaching, we're reaching into communities

586
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 2: of color, underserved, communities that never would have access before

587
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:32,520
Speaker 2: because we're meeting kids where they are, which is on

588
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:36,440
Speaker 2: their phone. So we've solved the issue. So, whether you

589
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 2: live in a rural community, as long as you have

590
00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 2: internet access, you can get therapy through talk space.

591
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 1: Are you finding it difficult to have enough therapists to

592
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 1: treat the need?

593
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 3: So we do not.

594
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:56,960
Speaker 2: We have therapist we have we're continually adding to the platform.

595
00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 2: Part of the reason is because well, the majority of

596
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 2: our therapists are what's called ten ninety nine's a part time.

597
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 2: A lot of them are actually stay at home moms

598
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 2: or they have a small practice on the side. So

599
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,680
Speaker 2: let's put aside the video for a second, because video

600
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:16,640
Speaker 2: you have to schedule, you know, we like people to

601
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 2: do an hour of the first intake and then subsequently

602
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 2: maybe shorter periods of time. But at least almost fifty

603
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:25,960
Speaker 2: percent of the talk space sessions are still done through

604
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 2: texting and messaging. The reason that's important is you have

605
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,960
Speaker 2: an incredible ability to scale when you're testing and messaging

606
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 2: all during the day or in the evening or weekends.

607
00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:40,360
Speaker 2: So our therapy network flexes to a significant degree. So

608
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 2: a lot of therapists may take extra hours a night,

609
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,479
Speaker 2: they may take extra hours during the weekends. They may say, oh,

610
00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:46,760
Speaker 2: you know what, a week from now, I'm going to

611
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 2: take a bunch of more sessions because I have time availability.

612
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 2: So because of the scheduling system is so effective, and

613
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:57,480
Speaker 2: because they can make themselves available, we have a lot

614
00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 2: of ability to flex because they're not they're not just

615
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 2: saying okay, I have I could see eight hours of patients.

616
00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 2: Say I could see eight people or I could see

617
00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 2: sixteen for half hour. We have therapists who could be

618
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:11,480
Speaker 2: texting messaging thirty or forty people at a different time.

619
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,960
Speaker 2: Because it's so easy in terms of how you message

620
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 2: people back and forth and have conversations.

621
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 3: Back and forth.

622
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,280
Speaker 1: Now, of course that raises a red flag for me, thinking, Gee,

623
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:24,719
Speaker 1: if I were a traditional therapist or I was somebody

624
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: who wanted therapy, how effective is that? And I know

625
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,400
Speaker 1: you all have done reams of research on it, but

626
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 1: you know talk therapy requires talk or does it?

627
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:40,080
Speaker 3: So it does, but not the butt.

628
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 2: The research is very clear that it's highly highly effective.

629
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:46,480
Speaker 2: So we have outcomes measures, we measure quality. May have

630
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:48,440
Speaker 2: a huge number of quality metrics is in terms of

631
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 2: we measure relative to therapists their ability to deliver therapy inadequately,

632
00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:56,920
Speaker 2: but we have we have measure in some instances every

633
00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 2: three weeks how effective the therapy is in terms of

634
00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 2: how what the outcomes look like.

635
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 3: So we know it works.

636
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 2: It wouldn't and to the credit of the insurance companies,

637
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,560
Speaker 2: they figured out it works also, which is why they've

638
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 2: put us in network because it's become a very it's

639
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:18,800
Speaker 2: an important solution for them to be able to provide

640
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:22,080
Speaker 2: mental health support as opposed to the standard way that

641
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 2: people usually provided.

642
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:29,360
Speaker 1: There was a time where people were too ashamed to

643
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:32,799
Speaker 1: put to contact their insurance companies and say, I mean,

644
00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:35,320
Speaker 1: I've been working for a long time and I think

645
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:39,600
Speaker 1: ten years ago people would be worried that their employers

646
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:43,839
Speaker 1: would look as scance at them, or they wouldn't have

647
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 1: enough privacy, and they would be afraid to actually reach

648
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 1: out to their insurance company to cover therapy.

649
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:58,120
Speaker 2: So if you ask any HR executive today or tomorrow,

650
00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:01,319
Speaker 2: what's their number one issue, it's mental health support for

651
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 2: their employees. So they have recognized to a very significant

652
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,279
Speaker 2: degree how important it is for their employees. And we

653
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,000
Speaker 2: again have data, so I will tell you it's another

654
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:16,760
Speaker 2: extraordinary statistic. The average number of days lost to mental

655
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:20,200
Speaker 2: health is twenty eight. Twenty eight days of a year lost

656
00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:23,160
Speaker 2: to mental health support for employee. So employers know if

657
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:25,279
Speaker 2: they support, if they have mental health support, which we

658
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:28,239
Speaker 2: do talk space with the large with a significant number

659
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:32,000
Speaker 2: of employers. Is it improved, First of all, decreases people

660
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 2: are absent, It increases productivity, and it makes the workforce happier.

661
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:41,720
Speaker 2: So the impact, it is hard to measure, but it's enormous.

662
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: So those days are over when you wouldn't tell your

663
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:47,719
Speaker 1: boss or would be afraid.

664
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 2: So we have In addition to I talked about the

665
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:54,520
Speaker 2: cover network, we still have a consumer is meeting people

666
00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 2: who still directly come to us to pay for therapy

667
00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 2: out of installa of using their insurance. And the reason

668
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,360
Speaker 2: is is there's still some people who say, I'm not

669
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:06,160
Speaker 2: sure who I want to know. I'd rather pay for

670
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:06,920
Speaker 2: it out of pocket.

671
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:09,919
Speaker 3: I'd rather just not have people though, So I don't

672
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 3: think that's.

673
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 2: Ever going to go away completely. But it's much less

674
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 2: than it was years ago, much much less.

675
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,160
Speaker 1: So you bring up affordability, how much does it cost

676
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:21,800
Speaker 1: or does it depend and how much does insurance cover?

677
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,759
Speaker 1: And what about people who don't have insurance.

678
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:30,280
Speaker 2: So the average out of pocket cost if you're covered

679
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:33,919
Speaker 2: by insurer right now is about fifteen dollars. The majority

680
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 2: of people have no out of pocket because we're covered.

681
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:38,320
Speaker 2: We're a covering service.

682
00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:42,799
Speaker 1: Now you're expanding the Medicare coverage, right, so we.

683
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 2: Just went we were by the well it's December. By

684
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 2: the end of this year, we will be in just

685
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 2: about every all fifty states. It turns out you have

686
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 2: to go state by state for Medicare, even though it's national.

687
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:59,319
Speaker 2: So we've made a big effort to cover Medicare, you know,

688
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:04,359
Speaker 2: elderly adults, and that will launch really January first of

689
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five. The reason being, of course, is twenty

690
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 2: five percent of people over the age of sixty five

691
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 2: have a diagnosable mental health condition, which is usually loneliness

692
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 2: and slash depression. Almost forty percent of people feel socially isolated,

693
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:25,360
Speaker 2: So we know that it is a very significant issue

694
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 2: relative to the older population. So we've launched into medicare.

695
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:32,160
Speaker 2: There people have standard medicare as you may know, where

696
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:35,560
Speaker 2: you get eighty percent covered and then you have other insurance,

697
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 2: or people are in Medicare advantage programs where there's no

698
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 2: out of pocket.

699
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:42,800
Speaker 1: Is that a fast growing population for you all? Because again,

700
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:45,360
Speaker 1: those are people. I mean, I'm going to be sixty

701
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:50,400
Speaker 1: eight in January, good lord, and I think that's still

702
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:54,759
Speaker 1: a population that might feel less comfortable with therapy or

703
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 1: talking about their problems. Right. So the I'm not by

704
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:01,000
Speaker 1: the way, so I.

705
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:03,279
Speaker 2: Wouldn't say the jury's out. The jury hasn't even been seen.

706
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 2: Meaning we're just getting into medicare. We believe that it's

707
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:10,360
Speaker 2: we know it's an enormous need. So we have a

708
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 2: whole plan to roll this out in terms of how

709
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 2: do we tell people about it, how do we get

710
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 2: them comfortable with it? So there's been some questions raised about, well,

711
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:24,400
Speaker 2: you know, our seniors going to use it. So my

712
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:27,399
Speaker 2: view is, like the teens, is we need to spend

713
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:29,640
Speaker 2: a lot of time educating people and telling them about

714
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 2: what they can do. We also have to spend time

715
00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 2: with their caregivers, which frequently is their children who are

716
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 2: taking care of their parents and getting them come. Frequently

717
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:43,440
Speaker 2: it's the children of the seniors that actually want the

718
00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 2: support more than the seniors want the support because they're dealing,

719
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:48,879
Speaker 2: you know, they're in between, they're dealing with their kids

720
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:51,479
Speaker 2: and then they're dealing with their parents. So we're about

721
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:55,280
Speaker 2: to launch. We'll see how we believe it will be successful.

722
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 2: We know that the need is very high. There's been

723
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:03,840
Speaker 2: some question about well we'll seniors use the technology. My

724
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:07,719
Speaker 2: view we talked about earlier. If you're a grandparent, ask

725
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,360
Speaker 2: any grandparent, they know how to get on to their phones,

726
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 2: they know how to talk to their grandchildren, and they

727
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,399
Speaker 2: know how to FaceTime them. So I think the technology

728
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:19,239
Speaker 2: piece is not of much concern to us. We do

729
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,640
Speaker 2: have the data on people use the technology from if

730
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 2: you're sixty five to seventy eight at seventy eighty, so

731
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 2: there is a fall off after eighty years old in

732
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 2: terms of certain abilities. But we do encourage people when

733
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:33,000
Speaker 2: they sign up and use it to find somebody to

734
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:33,399
Speaker 2: help them.

735
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 1: And that's going to change as population ages, because people

736
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:39,759
Speaker 1: are becoming more proficient on their phone and that's not

737
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:42,719
Speaker 1: going to change right as they get older. You're now

738
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:47,440
Speaker 1: focused on the military population as well. Why and how.

739
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 2: So Military there's ten million military and dependents. We just

740
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:57,399
Speaker 2: got into network with the coverage of the military, which

741
00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 2: is you know, it's called tricaren Try West, So that's

742
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:05,879
Speaker 2: also just being launched. The suicide rate, as you as

743
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:09,760
Speaker 2: you mentioned earlier, is high in the military. The amount

744
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 2: of you know, PTSD is obviously very high. It's a

745
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 2: little bit different for active military versus independence. We are

746
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 2: very early on, but we know that there's a significant

747
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 2: interest in the military spouses and children of active military

748
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 2: that are looking for mental support. So that's a that's

749
00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 2: also a work in progress, just launched.

750
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: If you want to get smarter every morning with a

751
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:47,520
Speaker 1: breakdown of the news and fascinating takes on health and

752
00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 1: wellness and pop culture, sign up for our daily newsletter,

753
00:40:51,000 --> 00:41:04,280
Speaker 1: Wake Up Call by going to Katiecuric dot com. Let's

754
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:08,480
Speaker 1: talk about the youth mental health crisis. It's something that

755
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 1: I've been very interested in and it's super concerning, as

756
00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 1: you well know. I mean, you look at some of

757
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:20,640
Speaker 1: the statistics. Teen mental health had already begun worsening prior

758
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 1: to the pandemic. By twenty twenty one, more than forty

759
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:28,640
Speaker 1: percent of high schoolers reported feeling persistently sad or hopeless,

760
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:33,080
Speaker 1: and experts expect the trend to continue. What is eating

761
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:34,760
Speaker 1: the nation's children.

762
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:39,680
Speaker 2: It is a crisis, an unparallel crisis. And you probably

763
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 2: see the Surgeon General report about social media.

764
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:48,480
Speaker 1: Fiction and also Jonathan Height's book The Anxious Generation. And yes,

765
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:50,719
Speaker 1: you know, it's so funny. When I was at CBS

766
00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:54,240
Speaker 1: in the early two thousands, I wanted to do something

767
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:59,240
Speaker 1: on phone addiction, and they all thought I was crazy,

768
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,719
Speaker 1: But you know, I thought it was tearing apart families,

769
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 1: that people weren't spending time together, that it was taking

770
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 1: over people's lives. Anyway, that's me patting myself on the

771
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: back for being prescient. But yes, it feels like we

772
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:19,800
Speaker 1: have reached a tipping point finally in understanding the negative

773
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:21,760
Speaker 1: impact of phone addiction.

774
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,879
Speaker 2: So you mentioned some of the data we know that

775
00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 2: twenty to twenty five percent of teenagers on intake have

776
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:36,319
Speaker 2: had suicidal ideation. It's which blows me away. I remember

777
00:42:36,440 --> 00:42:38,760
Speaker 2: seeing the data for the first time. It's just unbelievable

778
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:44,040
Speaker 2: to me to think that that's what's happening. So I don't,

779
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 2: so why is why is the crisis? You know here

780
00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 2: at the phone issue is unquestionably, you know, propelling a

781
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 2: lot of this, the social media addiction. So I don't

782
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:59,080
Speaker 2: know if you've you know, I've talked about, but the

783
00:42:59,239 --> 00:43:02,880
Speaker 2: average number of hours a teenager is on their phone

784
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 2: is eight eight hours a day right on their phone.

785
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:13,319
Speaker 2: And of course it's not just the it's not just

786
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:16,719
Speaker 2: the social media that they're looking at. It's the dangers, right,

787
00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 2: So you talk about suicide right being aware, it's of

788
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:26,799
Speaker 2: course the inappropriate content, it's the cyper bullying, it's the

789
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:30,560
Speaker 2: issues about being recruited to do something really bad.

790
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,600
Speaker 1: And then just old fashioned self esteem issues right where

791
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 1: you see people living their best life on social media

792
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 1: and it makes you feel bad about yourself, or with

793
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:44,880
Speaker 1: girls and eating disorders, and.

794
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:48,360
Speaker 2: Then there's so the social media adiction is obviously a

795
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 2: huge issue. So it's real, so't I don't predict that

796
00:43:54,520 --> 00:43:56,240
Speaker 2: you're going to be able to get kids off their phone.

797
00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:59,200
Speaker 2: I will tell you that having seen this, read about it,

798
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 2: see what's going on. I think I told you I

799
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:03,000
Speaker 2: have a seven and a half and a four and

800
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:07,400
Speaker 2: a half year old grandchildren. Terror it's terrifying to me

801
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:10,200
Speaker 2: about you know, what are you know what's my daughter?

802
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 3: And it's a looging to do about, you know, phones

803
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 3: with these kids.

804
00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:15,879
Speaker 1: Well, I think people who have kids that age are

805
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:19,839
Speaker 1: starting to realize how dangerous they are. And you know,

806
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:22,359
Speaker 1: by the way, so I have a grandson too, who

807
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:26,280
Speaker 1: just turned eight months, and I was thinking, when Ellie

808
00:44:26,600 --> 00:44:31,040
Speaker 1: is with him, if she's on her phone, she's modeling

809
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 1: a certain behavior. So it's not just not giving kids

810
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:42,040
Speaker 1: phones until they're fifteen or sixteen. It's not having them

811
00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,279
Speaker 1: as such an ubiquitous force in their lives, right.

812
00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 2: And it's just so it is difficult. We're not going

813
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 2: to totally solve that. So so it talks to us.

814
00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:53,200
Speaker 2: We've leaned in on teens, as I said, So we

815
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:55,759
Speaker 2: have the We talked about New York City, We just

816
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 2: announced Seattle another fifty five thousand students. We have Baltimore,

817
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:00,880
Speaker 2: and then we have a bunch of other private schools

818
00:45:00,880 --> 00:45:05,040
Speaker 2: in other districts. So the one of the so what's

819
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:08,200
Speaker 2: become very important of us is because we're actually using

820
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:12,360
Speaker 2: their phone to some benefit, which is texting the messaging therapy.

821
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 3: You know. We found that it's you know.

822
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:17,759
Speaker 2: Very very important and attractive for the student to be

823
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:20,000
Speaker 2: able to access it, and so most of them are

824
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:23,239
Speaker 2: accessing it actually after school just you know, after four pm.

825
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:25,439
Speaker 2: Turns out after four pm on Thursdays is the most

826
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:29,400
Speaker 2: popular time. But what's also important is we in twenty

827
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:32,680
Speaker 2: nineteen talks based reported on a large language model AI

828
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:37,279
Speaker 2: slash ability to actually predict suicide based on a conversation.

829
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 1: That's so fascinating to me. How can you in simple terms,

830
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 1: how that works.

831
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:46,560
Speaker 2: So what it is is we looked at all of

832
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:50,360
Speaker 2: the millions of conversations and was able to identify with

833
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:55,040
Speaker 2: kids at risk certain words and phrases in the context

834
00:45:55,040 --> 00:46:00,880
Speaker 2: of the conversation that will alert the therapist of possible

835
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:03,880
Speaker 2: self harm for the for that person and now teenager

836
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:09,400
Speaker 2: because we've revalidated in teens. So it's so let me

837
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:11,160
Speaker 2: it's let me describe it this way because his way

838
00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:13,319
Speaker 2: is debscribed to me, because I you know I knew

839
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:16,399
Speaker 2: nothing about this, certainly several you know, several months ago.

840
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:18,720
Speaker 3: Is some of the things we do is what's.

841
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:21,799
Speaker 2: Called bag of words. So here here's the context. If

842
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:24,640
Speaker 2: I say to you, look at these four words, and

843
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:27,600
Speaker 2: I'm going to say a crib, a rattle, a doll,

844
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:34,239
Speaker 2: and you know, uh, another toy. That's obvious and those

845
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:38,400
Speaker 2: words all belong together, right. But if I said to

846
00:46:38,440 --> 00:46:44,960
Speaker 2: you a rattle, a crib, a diaper, and a knife,

847
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:49,719
Speaker 2: say well, like okay, something's wrong. That's a simplistic way

848
00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 2: of what's called bag of words. So what the what

849
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 2: the engine does It looks at the conversation and it

850
00:46:56,760 --> 00:47:00,239
Speaker 2: is able to actually pick out words and phrases. Is

851
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:05,320
Speaker 2: that are key to determining whether or not a person

852
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:09,279
Speaker 2: is thinking about self harm. It's unbelievably fascinating. Now it

853
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 2: doesn't mean, it doesn't mean yeah. So it's eighty six

854
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:16,959
Speaker 2: percent accurate, and we've actually dialed it to be more

855
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:19,920
Speaker 2: false positive because what you want to do is is

856
00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:24,719
Speaker 2: have more false positives. Obviously, so we reported this back

857
00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:27,920
Speaker 2: in twenty nineteen. Since we report So what happens when

858
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:32,080
Speaker 2: you're on a texting messaging platform on talkspace the engine

859
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 2: is running in the background, and what it does is

860
00:47:34,120 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 2: it sends an alert to the therapist and then the

861
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 2: therapist decides whether it's real or not real.

862
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:42,279
Speaker 1: That's scary and big responsibility, isn't it.

863
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:43,880
Speaker 3: Well, it's like other healthcare alerts.

864
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,960
Speaker 2: It's it's like having telling your primary care physician, Oh,

865
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:51,480
Speaker 2: you know, Katie just had her blood's drawn. Her potassium

866
00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:53,359
Speaker 2: is six. We want to make sure that you've seen

867
00:47:53,400 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 2: that because that's really dangerous. So there are a lot

868
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:57,360
Speaker 2: of alerts that go on in medicine. So what this

869
00:47:57,520 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 2: is and there may be a reason for it. So

870
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:01,839
Speaker 2: the therapis then has a discretion Okay, this is real

871
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:04,400
Speaker 2: or it's not real, and then has to decide how

872
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:07,840
Speaker 2: to has it, deal with it, or refer the patient

873
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:11,320
Speaker 2: to a higher level of care. So since twenty nineteen,

874
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:15,080
Speaker 2: we've had it's over thirty two thousand alerts on the.

875
00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 1: Platform that people are risk of self harm.

876
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:18,919
Speaker 3: Right.

877
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:24,239
Speaker 2: We're running it, of course with the teens, and you know,

878
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:27,400
Speaker 2: we've had alerts that we've been able to intervene on.

879
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:31,319
Speaker 2: It's a proprietary algorithm. We don't think anybody else has it.

880
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 2: We are also looking at alerts right now for harm,

881
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:40,839
Speaker 2: both homicidal tendencies. We're also looking at eating disorders. We're

882
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:44,800
Speaker 2: also looking at abuse. So what we're doing is using

883
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 2: the engine.

884
00:48:46,880 --> 00:48:50,040
Speaker 1: Abuse someone who is being abused being abused.

885
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,360
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, there is more than you want to.

886
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:55,160
Speaker 1: Know about domestic violence.

887
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:58,440
Speaker 2: It means basic violence referrals we've had to make to

888
00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:01,359
Speaker 2: child's protective services. Yeah, it's more than.

889
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:01,759
Speaker 3: You want to know.

890
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:05,640
Speaker 2: What we're doing is we're trying to we're finding it right.

891
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:09,359
Speaker 2: So the power What you want to do is give

892
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 2: the therapists the ability to make decisions. What we don't do,

893
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:16,840
Speaker 2: which I'm a huge believer in, is is I'm not

894
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:18,240
Speaker 2: going to tell a therapist how.

895
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:19,200
Speaker 3: To give care.

896
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:21,320
Speaker 2: What I'm going to do is give them the alerts

897
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:25,719
Speaker 2: and let them decide. And we don't just you know,

898
00:49:25,760 --> 00:49:27,880
Speaker 2: we don't do AI bots or anything like that. We

899
00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:29,320
Speaker 2: will not do AI therapy.

900
00:49:29,719 --> 00:49:30,319
Speaker 3: So this is a.

901
00:49:30,280 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 1: Support MESA are some people doing, yes, yeah, there are some.

902
00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:36,319
Speaker 2: There are some some people out there who are doing

903
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 2: AI supporting.

904
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:39,520
Speaker 1: Like chap GPT stuff.

905
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:44,640
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, so that's what we're doing on the teen side.

906
00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:47,880
Speaker 1: The UH and so you said you've had thirty two.

907
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:50,200
Speaker 3: Thousand alerts since twenty nineteen.

908
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:55,440
Speaker 1: Is there any way to quantify how many suicides you've

909
00:49:55,560 --> 00:49:58,720
Speaker 1: intervened in or potential suicides?

910
00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:03,160
Speaker 2: So that's an amaz amazing question and the answer is no,

911
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 2: because we don't really know. We're again HIPPOC compliant. People

912
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:09,839
Speaker 2: could leave therapy. We don't know where that we can.

913
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 2: We can't follow up and say, hey, what happened to

914
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:17,359
Speaker 2: this person, So we don't know the answer. We've tried,

915
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 2: actually we've tried to use some surrogate analysis, but we've

916
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:24,680
Speaker 2: been unable to, you know, to determine whether or not

917
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:26,360
Speaker 2: how many people have gone on.

918
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:31,040
Speaker 1: What about the effectiveness of working with these teens in

919
00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:33,319
Speaker 1: the New York City public schools? You say you're going

920
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:36,960
Speaker 1: to do another program in Seattle, right, is there any

921
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:42,000
Speaker 1: way of knowing the efficacy of talks based therapy for

922
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:45,640
Speaker 1: these kids? How do you measure if it's working and

923
00:50:45,680 --> 00:50:47,240
Speaker 1: what kind of feedback have you gotten?

924
00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:50,319
Speaker 2: So the program for New York City is for all

925
00:50:50,600 --> 00:50:53,040
Speaker 2: teenagers who live in New York. It's not just public schools.

926
00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:56,720
Speaker 2: So whether it's parochial schools or yeshivas or charter schools,

927
00:50:56,800 --> 00:50:59,719
Speaker 2: any kid thirteen to seventeen has access. And that was

928
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:02,640
Speaker 2: the decision. That's the mayor decided that when he did

929
00:51:02,640 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 2: the program was that's how he wanted it. He wanted

930
00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:05,759
Speaker 2: to make it available to everybody.

931
00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:08,239
Speaker 3: So we do have one year into the New York

932
00:51:08,280 --> 00:51:10,760
Speaker 3: City program. We have one year data.

933
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:14,400
Speaker 2: We've had almost seventy percent improvement in terms of clinical outcome.

934
00:51:15,160 --> 00:51:17,399
Speaker 2: I think I talked about we're reaching kids where they are,

935
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:19,880
Speaker 2: which is in all you know, all sorts of communities.

936
00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 2: What's interesting is the top diagnoses or problem is actually

937
00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:28,960
Speaker 2: being a better self. Second is relationships, and then it

938
00:51:29,040 --> 00:51:34,600
Speaker 2: drops off to anxiety slash depression, bullying relatively low, which

939
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:37,520
Speaker 2: was a surprise to us. But the relationship thing and

940
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:39,880
Speaker 2: being a better self is really important. And we had

941
00:51:39,880 --> 00:51:42,640
Speaker 2: done a bunch of focus groups before we launched, and

942
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:46,960
Speaker 2: it was very clear the kids, I say, they want access,

943
00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 2: they wanted immediately, and they wanted you know, almost whenever.

944
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:54,440
Speaker 3: They could get it. So we've basically solved that issue.

945
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:57,440
Speaker 1: When you say relationship.

946
00:51:57,120 --> 00:52:01,279
Speaker 2: My relationships with family or relationship with friends, they'll say,

947
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 2: I have an issue with a friend, I have an

948
00:52:02,640 --> 00:52:04,360
Speaker 2: issue with my parents, I have an issue with so

949
00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:08,759
Speaker 2: help me talk me, you know, the therapist, help me

950
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:10,799
Speaker 2: get through that. Do I how do I deal with

951
00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:13,839
Speaker 2: those kind of familial problems or other problems that they have.

952
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:17,439
Speaker 2: The the being a better self just means they want

953
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:19,360
Speaker 2: to be better at who they are, they want to

954
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:21,200
Speaker 2: be more self aware.

955
00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:26,160
Speaker 1: It's really a full fascinating it is area, and I

956
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 1: think you're right as a physician. If you see a

957
00:52:30,239 --> 00:52:34,319
Speaker 1: need and you have the capacity to fill it, that

958
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:36,080
Speaker 1: must be incredibly gratifying.

959
00:52:36,719 --> 00:52:40,399
Speaker 2: No, it's it's a I'll tell yes, love of everything else,

960
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 2: we're doing good, that we're doing a lot of good,

961
00:52:42,760 --> 00:52:45,920
Speaker 2: which makes you know, all of us feel really good

962
00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:47,160
Speaker 2: about what we're doing every day.

963
00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:50,520
Speaker 1: How do you increase awareness that this is out there?

964
00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:53,280
Speaker 1: And like, let's say I'm like, oh, I really enjoyed

965
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:57,759
Speaker 1: talking to doctor Cohen. I want to be a part

966
00:52:57,800 --> 00:53:01,000
Speaker 1: of talk space. I want I don't have a therapist.

967
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:06,120
Speaker 1: Actually I don't have a therapist, and you know, I

968
00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:10,320
Speaker 1: want to find a therapist. Do I go to an app?

969
00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 1: To what do I do?

970
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:15,440
Speaker 2: So there's multiple ways that essentially you go on to

971
00:53:15,640 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 2: talkspace dot com. For the teens, it's actually it's New

972
00:53:18,239 --> 00:53:19,160
Speaker 2: York City teen Space.

973
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:22,799
Speaker 1: What about other teens across the nation? Is it available

974
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:24,600
Speaker 1: to them? Or not yet, so.

975
00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:27,480
Speaker 2: It is if it is to their to their parents' insurance.

976
00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 2: So the difference is.

977
00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:33,319
Speaker 1: You have to go be hard because sometimes you don't

978
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:35,040
Speaker 1: want to go on and tell their parents.

979
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:38,560
Speaker 2: Well, that's another interesting issues parental consent. We do get

980
00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:41,080
Speaker 2: parental consent through the process. It's all part of the

981
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:43,840
Speaker 2: digital intake. We send an email to the parents, they

982
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:47,080
Speaker 2: mail us back their consent. There are exceptions that you

983
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:51,640
Speaker 2: cannot have to get parents consent. There is certain kids

984
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:55,440
Speaker 2: who are, you know, by the court, deemed independent. There

985
00:53:55,480 --> 00:53:57,920
Speaker 2: are kids that are married, they're kids that have children,

986
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 2: and then they are just kids that will come on

987
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 2: and say I don't want to tell my parents, and

988
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:05,280
Speaker 2: then what happens. They have a conversation with the therapist

989
00:54:05,320 --> 00:54:07,840
Speaker 2: and then the therapists will make the ultimate decision with the

990
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:09,960
Speaker 2: child about whether or not they're at risk and whether.

991
00:54:09,760 --> 00:54:10,760
Speaker 3: They should tell their parents.

992
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:13,600
Speaker 2: So we have an entire consenting mechanism that's built in,

993
00:54:14,520 --> 00:54:17,680
Speaker 2: so that's an important part of it. But most teens,

994
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:20,600
Speaker 2: if you get it through one of the programs. The

995
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:23,880
Speaker 2: reason it's so important that there's a program that pays

996
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:25,759
Speaker 2: for it is because you don't want to have a

997
00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:28,120
Speaker 2: teenager to say, okay, well what's your parents insurance? Go

998
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:30,560
Speaker 2: get their insurance card, fill out the information. As we

999
00:54:30,560 --> 00:54:35,120
Speaker 2: said earlier, the number one barrier we know is cost

1000
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:38,960
Speaker 2: or having to identify costs. So sure every teenager across

1001
00:54:38,960 --> 00:54:43,120
Speaker 2: the country has access, but those other teenagers have to

1002
00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:45,480
Speaker 2: go through their insurance, which is a barrier.

1003
00:54:46,120 --> 00:54:47,040
Speaker 3: It's always a barrier.

1004
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:50,319
Speaker 1: And I can't believe you don't have a shortage of therapists.

1005
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:52,840
Speaker 1: I mean, I know you talk about the flex schedule

1006
00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:56,840
Speaker 1: and everything, but I mean I've heard for a long

1007
00:54:56,920 --> 00:55:00,600
Speaker 1: time that it's just there aren't enough there therapists for

1008
00:55:00,719 --> 00:55:02,000
Speaker 1: all the patients out there.

1009
00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:02,759
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1010
00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:06,400
Speaker 2: We then they're unfortunately referred to as ghost networks. So

1011
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:09,560
Speaker 2: you've probably heard the term. No, okay, so there's a term.

1012
00:55:09,600 --> 00:55:12,200
Speaker 2: It's called ghost networks for the payers, which means if

1013
00:55:12,200 --> 00:55:15,600
Speaker 2: you try and get a therapist frequently, if you find

1014
00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 2: somebody and you check the not taking new patients, or

1015
00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:20,960
Speaker 2: it's a three month wait to get it right.

1016
00:55:21,080 --> 00:55:23,239
Speaker 1: Yes, so how do you combat that?

1017
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:24,359
Speaker 3: Right now?

1018
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:26,200
Speaker 2: For us, it's not potission and we do know that

1019
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:30,760
Speaker 2: quod Hotly, the therapists mostly like being on the talkspace platform.

1020
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:33,239
Speaker 2: We made it very easy for them. They don't, they

1021
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:35,200
Speaker 2: just have to come on in New therapy, we do

1022
00:55:35,239 --> 00:55:38,400
Speaker 2: all the billing and collection and our step and we

1023
00:55:38,520 --> 00:55:40,680
Speaker 2: educate them and we provide a network for them. We

1024
00:55:40,719 --> 00:55:42,960
Speaker 2: provide you know, other people for them to talk for us.

1025
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 2: So it's not it's not just that they're coming on talkspace,

1026
00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 2: but they're they're becoming part of a very large community

1027
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,200
Speaker 2: that helps them, you know, be better at what they do.

1028
00:55:52,239 --> 00:55:55,320
Speaker 1: Also, I always tell young people to go into therapy.

1029
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:58,640
Speaker 1: Talk about a growth industry, right, don't go into media.

1030
00:55:58,760 --> 00:55:59,840
Speaker 1: Become a therapist.

1031
00:56:00,960 --> 00:56:03,480
Speaker 2: Sounds right, It sounds about right. So, but yes, we

1032
00:56:03,520 --> 00:56:04,440
Speaker 2: are always recruiting.

1033
00:56:04,920 --> 00:56:06,839
Speaker 1: Do you do group therapy?

1034
00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:10,279
Speaker 2: No, we do peer to peer, which is it's not

1035
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:13,200
Speaker 2: really group, but it's peer to peer support. We also

1036
00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:17,319
Speaker 2: have launched and we don't do we don't really do coaching, right,

1037
00:56:17,640 --> 00:56:18,280
Speaker 2: So would.

1038
00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:21,000
Speaker 1: You ever get into group therapy which is very effective.

1039
00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:25,840
Speaker 2: We we've talked about it, and like I like to

1040
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:28,239
Speaker 2: talk about I like to stay in our lane. What

1041
00:56:28,280 --> 00:56:30,480
Speaker 2: I mean by that is there's so much need for

1042
00:56:30,560 --> 00:56:32,840
Speaker 2: what we have right now. I want to continue to

1043
00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:35,360
Speaker 2: focus the company on what we do best, which is

1044
00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:36,360
Speaker 2: what we're doing right now.

1045
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:40,840
Speaker 1: Do you have anyone who specializes, say in cognitive behavioral therapy.

1046
00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, no, all the basically every therapist does. Yeah,

1047
00:56:45,000 --> 00:56:47,359
Speaker 2: because that's how they're their license. Remember all our all

1048
00:56:47,360 --> 00:56:51,040
Speaker 2: of our therapists are licensed. You know, they're fully licensed

1049
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:54,040
Speaker 2: to deliver therapy in the state that they're in and

1050
00:56:54,080 --> 00:56:55,640
Speaker 2: each state has different rules and ranks.

1051
00:56:55,840 --> 00:56:57,160
Speaker 1: Have you tried talk space?

1052
00:56:57,600 --> 00:56:58,920
Speaker 3: I have, yes, So.

1053
00:57:00,520 --> 00:57:02,759
Speaker 1: I think that's kind of a personal question. You don't

1054
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:05,959
Speaker 1: have to necessarily answer that. What I mean, I would think,

1055
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 1: as the CEO, you would want to test your product.

1056
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:11,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, so what I've done it actually twice to test

1057
00:57:11,480 --> 00:57:13,440
Speaker 2: the product and see what the therapists do and to

1058
00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:17,120
Speaker 2: try the intake. But yes, I've tried. I've taken it

1059
00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:20,720
Speaker 2: to a certain point. But beyond that, it would be

1060
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:23,120
Speaker 2: difficult for me to have one of my own therapists

1061
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:24,160
Speaker 2: obviously take.

1062
00:57:23,960 --> 00:57:24,320
Speaker 3: Care of me.

1063
00:57:24,520 --> 00:57:26,960
Speaker 1: And by the way, I mean talk about a need

1064
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:30,480
Speaker 1: the medical community, I mean we saw during COVID the

1065
00:57:30,520 --> 00:57:35,720
Speaker 1: amount of burnout among medical professionals, nurses and doctors and

1066
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:38,680
Speaker 1: people who work in hospitals was so high, so many

1067
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:43,840
Speaker 1: people left the profession. Is that a population you're kind

1068
00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:44,760
Speaker 1: of reaching out to?

1069
00:57:45,680 --> 00:57:47,960
Speaker 2: So, right, at the beginning when I first got there,

1070
00:57:48,720 --> 00:57:51,760
Speaker 2: talks I said, had done actually not only delivering therapy

1071
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:54,280
Speaker 2: to healthcare workers. Did a study he was six hundred

1072
00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:57,800
Speaker 2: plus healthcare workers, thirty five percent of them were new

1073
00:57:57,880 --> 00:58:01,919
Speaker 2: to therapy, described an enormous need, you know, watching what.

1074
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:02,360
Speaker 3: Was going on.

1075
00:58:02,560 --> 00:58:04,760
Speaker 1: By the way, can I just interject one thing, John,

1076
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:08,000
Speaker 1: I thought during COVID that hospitals could have done a

1077
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:11,960
Speaker 1: much better job of providing mental health support. I mean,

1078
00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:15,280
Speaker 1: I know, everybody's hair was on fire. And I'm not

1079
00:58:15,320 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: being critical. I just think that was a huge vacuum

1080
00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:20,400
Speaker 1: at the time.

1081
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:24,720
Speaker 2: So we did, we were providing it. We saw fifty

1082
00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:27,160
Speaker 2: I think it was fifty percent improvement within four weeks.

1083
00:58:27,400 --> 00:58:27,680
Speaker 1: Wow.

1084
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:31,360
Speaker 2: And there were a lot of healthcare workers who were

1085
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 2: texting and messaging the therapist and getting online to be

1086
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:37,160
Speaker 2: able to you know, help them through. It was an enormously,

1087
00:58:37,200 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 2: as you said, difficult time for healthcare providers. I mean

1088
00:58:39,960 --> 00:58:42,960
Speaker 2: we were, because I'm here, you know, we were at

1089
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 2: almost ground zero for COVID in the Northeast at the beginning.

1090
00:58:47,600 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 3: I remember, yeah, me too.

1091
00:58:50,320 --> 00:58:53,920
Speaker 1: Is there anything you'd say to people who are still

1092
00:58:54,040 --> 00:58:59,720
Speaker 1: reticent about getting mental health care or the word therapy

1093
00:59:00,040 --> 00:59:01,880
Speaker 1: kind of still freaks them out a bit.

1094
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:09,560
Speaker 2: I think it's the message is to try it. It's

1095
00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:12,880
Speaker 2: very easy, it's very affordable. Is to try it and

1096
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:15,520
Speaker 2: see if it makes a difference in your life. I

1097
00:59:15,560 --> 00:59:21,160
Speaker 2: would say to parents to encourage their kids if there's

1098
00:59:21,200 --> 00:59:25,480
Speaker 2: an issue and there's still a stigma in certain populations

1099
00:59:25,480 --> 00:59:27,960
Speaker 2: for parents who don't want to talk about this with

1100
00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:31,560
Speaker 2: their kids, and I would encourage parents to also have

1101
00:59:31,640 --> 00:59:32,800
Speaker 2: their kids sign up.

1102
00:59:33,160 --> 00:59:37,760
Speaker 1: That's one interesting thing that I've learned recently that I

1103
00:59:37,800 --> 00:59:40,640
Speaker 1: think a lot of parents, with the number of kids

1104
00:59:40,640 --> 00:59:45,320
Speaker 1: who have suicidal ideation, I think for so long parents

1105
00:59:45,320 --> 00:59:47,840
Speaker 1: felt like they shouldn't talk about it or bring it up.

1106
00:59:48,480 --> 00:59:54,920
Speaker 1: But my understanding is that it's okay to say to

1107
00:59:55,040 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 1: a child, do you feel like harming yourself? Do you

1108
00:59:59,800 --> 01:00:04,200
Speaker 1: think about hurting yourself? That that's okay. We don't have

1109
01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:06,760
Speaker 1: to necessarily talk about this because you're not a therapist.

1110
01:00:06,880 --> 01:00:10,240
Speaker 1: But I'm just curious what you're understanding is.

1111
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 2: I certainly would encourage it one hundred percent. I mean,

1112
01:00:14,040 --> 01:00:18,959
Speaker 2: I think any conversation is good. Yeah, there's yes, there's

1113
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:21,440
Speaker 2: a kids it's just never talking to their parents.

1114
01:00:21,120 --> 01:00:23,680
Speaker 1: Also, you're afraid you're going to put the idea in

1115
01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:24,160
Speaker 1: their head.

1116
01:00:24,880 --> 01:00:27,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, let me tell you if you don't, they

1117
01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:29,480
Speaker 2: have plenty of access where that's going to go in

1118
01:00:29,480 --> 01:00:33,600
Speaker 2: their head. I mean the amount of unfortunately on the

1119
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:37,600
Speaker 2: social media stuff, whether whatever platform you're on, not criticizing

1120
01:00:37,600 --> 01:00:41,520
Speaker 2: any particular platform, there's all of these things out there

1121
01:00:41,680 --> 01:00:44,480
Speaker 2: relative to putting thoughts in the kids' heads that you

1122
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:48,640
Speaker 2: don't want them. And that's again why the whole issue

1123
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:51,400
Speaker 2: right now is about how you regulate social media, how

1124
01:00:51,440 --> 01:00:53,400
Speaker 2: you know what's appropriate, how do you prevent it, how

1125
01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:54,720
Speaker 2: do you alert kids.

1126
01:00:54,560 --> 01:00:56,840
Speaker 3: It's an enormous problem.

1127
01:00:57,040 --> 01:00:59,600
Speaker 2: You know, it's the General said, it's the greatest sorts

1128
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:01,520
Speaker 2: of children lives is social media.

1129
01:01:01,560 --> 01:01:03,160
Speaker 3: It's greater than cigarettes smoking right now.

1130
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 1: And I'm happy to hear so many schools are starting

1131
01:01:07,040 --> 01:01:12,640
Speaker 1: to say no phones during school hours. I'm taking them away, Tally.

1132
01:01:13,000 --> 01:01:15,320
Speaker 2: I couldn't agree with you more. We've had the discussion.

1133
01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 2: They say, well, you're providing therapy on your phone. You

1134
01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:19,640
Speaker 2: have an issues, said absolutely not take the phones away,

1135
01:01:19,760 --> 01:01:22,280
Speaker 2: you know during school hours, one hundred percent. You know

1136
01:01:22,360 --> 01:01:24,840
Speaker 2: they could get therapy after hours. They don't need to

1137
01:01:24,880 --> 01:01:28,800
Speaker 2: have their phone, you know during school it's a huge issue.

1138
01:01:29,240 --> 01:01:33,320
Speaker 1: Doctor John Cohen aka John, Yes, I can call you that.

1139
01:01:34,040 --> 01:01:36,600
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being on Next Question.

1140
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:37,560
Speaker 3: My pleasure.

1141
01:01:37,600 --> 01:01:40,120
Speaker 2: Thank you for the privilege actually, and it really is

1142
01:01:40,120 --> 01:01:41,680
Speaker 2: a privilege and honor to sit here and talk to

1143
01:01:41,720 --> 01:01:43,720
Speaker 2: you about this and to get the word out.

1144
01:01:43,760 --> 01:01:44,760
Speaker 3: So thank you for doing this.

1145
01:01:44,840 --> 01:01:56,760
Speaker 1: Actually, yeah, thanks for listening everyone. If you have a

1146
01:01:56,880 --> 01:01:59,640
Speaker 1: question for me, a subject you want us to cover,

1147
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:02,280
Speaker 1: or you want to share your thoughts about how you

1148
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:06,000
Speaker 1: navigate this crazy world, reach out send me a DM

1149
01:02:06,080 --> 01:02:09,400
Speaker 1: on Instagram. I would love to hear from you. Next

1150
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:13,160
Speaker 1: Question is a production of iHeartMedia and Katie Couric Media.

1151
01:02:13,600 --> 01:02:17,240
Speaker 1: The executive producers are Me, Katie Kuric, and Courtney Ltz.

1152
01:02:17,520 --> 01:02:21,760
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Ryan Martz, and our producers are

1153
01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:27,560
Speaker 1: Adriana Fazzio and Meredith Barnes. Julian Weller composed our theme music.

1154
01:02:28,400 --> 01:02:31,520
Speaker 1: For more information about today's episode, or to sign up

1155
01:02:31,520 --> 01:02:34,640
Speaker 1: for my newsletter, wake Up Call, go to the description

1156
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:38,600
Speaker 1: in the podcast app or visit us at Katiecuric dot com.

1157
01:02:38,880 --> 01:02:41,280
Speaker 1: You can also find me on Instagram and all my

1158
01:02:41,440 --> 01:02:47,320
Speaker 1: social media channels. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio, app,

1159
01:02:47,600 --> 01:02:51,200
Speaker 1: Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

1160
01:02:53,320 --> 01:02:55,520
Speaker 1: The new year is the time to make plans and

1161
01:02:55,600 --> 01:02:58,400
Speaker 1: set goals, but the only thing you can be certain

1162
01:02:58,440 --> 01:03:03,040
Speaker 1: of is change, good, bad, or in between. A talkspace

1163
01:03:03,160 --> 01:03:06,160
Speaker 1: therapist can help you get ready for what's next. Whether

1164
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:09,080
Speaker 1: you have big ambitions for twenty twenty five or are

1165
01:03:09,200 --> 01:03:12,480
Speaker 1: simply trying to stay the course. Through video sessions and

1166
01:03:12,520 --> 01:03:16,439
Speaker 1: messaging therapy, a licensed talkspace therapist will help you build

1167
01:03:16,480 --> 01:03:21,000
Speaker 1: your resilience and discover opportunities for growth. Talkspace is in

1168
01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:25,040
Speaker 1: network major insurers, and most covered members have a copay

1169
01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 1: of fifteen dollars or less, or you can take eighty

1170
01:03:28,360 --> 01:03:31,600
Speaker 1: five dollars off your first month with the promo code

1171
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:35,640
Speaker 1: Katie when you go to talkspace dot com slash Katiecuric.

1172
01:03:36,080 --> 01:03:39,960
Speaker 1: Match with the licensed therapist today at talkspace dot com

1173
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:41,240
Speaker 1: slash Katiecuric