1
00:00:02,800 --> 00:00:07,120
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

2
00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:15,320
Speaker 2: I'm joined in the studio today by chocolate covered pretzels.

3
00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:18,320
Speaker 2: They're my favorite chocolate snack, and I've brought them with

4
00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:21,000
Speaker 2: me today because right now the world is in the

5
00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:26,080
Speaker 2: grips of a coco crisis. The global supply of coco

6
00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:31,080
Speaker 2: has plummeted and prices are at an all time high.

7
00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:33,320
Speaker 1: I mean, we're going to get in trouble. We see

8
00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:33,720
Speaker 1: it coming.

9
00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:38,080
Speaker 2: Jacques Torres is a chocolateear based in New York. You

10
00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:41,040
Speaker 2: might recognize him as a judge on the cheeky baking

11
00:00:41,120 --> 00:00:44,440
Speaker 2: competition show Nailed It, where they nod to his bubbly

12
00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:46,440
Speaker 2: and very French approach.

13
00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:50,040
Speaker 3: The judge that knows the fudge Monsieur Jaquestrres.

14
00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:54,560
Speaker 2: He's the owner of Jacques Torres Chocolate, one of the

15
00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:58,640
Speaker 2: pioneers of artisanal bean to bar chocolate. The company is

16
00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,200
Speaker 2: still known best for one of the very first treats

17
00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:05,320
Speaker 2: Torres served, hot chocolate. He got the flash of inspiration

18
00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:07,760
Speaker 2: for the signature product when he tried a cup of

19
00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:10,840
Speaker 2: American style hot chocolate. It was nothing like what he

20
00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:12,080
Speaker 2: grew up with in France.

21
00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:14,679
Speaker 1: I'm from the south of France, and when you want

22
00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:17,920
Speaker 1: to hot chocolate, it's there. They make hot chocolate starting

23
00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:21,520
Speaker 1: from chocolate chocolate. Do they really they make the real thing?

24
00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:25,560
Speaker 2: Torres thought, I will introduce America to real hot chocolate

25
00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:30,960
Speaker 2: made with actual chocolate, no cocoa powder. People will love it.

26
00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,440
Speaker 1: Nobody wanted, adult was telling me. So I start to

27
00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:37,640
Speaker 1: give it away every weekend. I do. I don't know

28
00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:41,800
Speaker 1: how many, how many containers of hot chocolates, and I

29
00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:45,880
Speaker 1: give it away until people start to say, you know what,

30
00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:46,840
Speaker 1: it's actually good.

31
00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,080
Speaker 2: The hot chocolate caught on, and twenty five years after

32
00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:53,640
Speaker 2: the company's creation, Torres is still selling that super thick

33
00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:57,400
Speaker 2: hot chocolate, along with everything from bon bonds to chocolate

34
00:01:57,480 --> 00:01:58,600
Speaker 2: bunnies to bars.

35
00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:01,640
Speaker 1: About one hundred tons for this year. My guess, I

36
00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:05,240
Speaker 1: don't know bars is that WA's over ten thousand.

37
00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:09,720
Speaker 2: That's a lot chocolate chocolate that's getting more expensive to

38
00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:13,160
Speaker 2: make by the day. And in order to survive, Torres

39
00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:17,239
Speaker 2: is faced with some tough choices like should he raise

40
00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:18,000
Speaker 2: his prices?

41
00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,760
Speaker 1: But it's a risk because people might not buy it,

42
00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:22,640
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? I don't know what solution

43
00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:22,919
Speaker 1: we have.

44
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:27,680
Speaker 2: Torres is in this situation because of events unfolding thousands

45
00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:30,919
Speaker 2: of miles away in the cocoa farms of West Africa,

46
00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:34,480
Speaker 2: where dyeing crops and drinking harvests have turned cocoa into

47
00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,919
Speaker 2: an increasingly hot commodity. Bloomberg correspondent Mumby Gatou has been

48
00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:39,920
Speaker 2: following the story.

49
00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:43,519
Speaker 3: Now speaking to a chocolate to make a wild buck,

50
00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:46,040
Speaker 3: and he said, maybe instead of buying cold people should

51
00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:46,800
Speaker 3: be buying coco.

52
00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:55,799
Speaker 2: Today on the show, We've Got a Chocolate problem. Extreme

53
00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:59,320
Speaker 2: weather and a deadly fungus have killed millions of cocoa plants,

54
00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:03,119
Speaker 2: and now everyone from farmers to chocolate makers are scrambling

55
00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:07,200
Speaker 2: to survive. In many ways, the very future of chocolate

56
00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:08,000
Speaker 2: is at state.

57
00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:10,000
Speaker 1: We have to pay the farmer, We have to give

58
00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:13,880
Speaker 1: them support. Otherwise the next generation of chef will not

59
00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:14,680
Speaker 1: have chocolates.

60
00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:18,000
Speaker 2: We track the cocoa crisis from the farms of Ghana

61
00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:20,760
Speaker 2: to the chocolate factories of New York on a journey

62
00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:25,079
Speaker 2: from bean to bar to pretzel. This is the big

63
00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:32,400
Speaker 2: take from Bloomberg News. I'm Sarah Holder. My bag of

64
00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:35,680
Speaker 2: chocolate covered pretzels costs four ninety, but pretty soon it

65
00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:39,520
Speaker 2: could cost even more. Right now, cocoa is trading at

66
00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,760
Speaker 2: an all time high more than ten thousand dollars a ton,

67
00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,640
Speaker 2: that's about five dollars a pound this time last year,

68
00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,680
Speaker 2: it costs just over a dollar a pound. This is

69
00:03:49,720 --> 00:03:52,520
Speaker 2: all happening because of what's going on in West Africa,

70
00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,800
Speaker 2: where most of the cocoa in the world is grown.

71
00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:59,040
Speaker 3: Precisely, we get seventy five percent of a cocoa supply

72
00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:00,600
Speaker 3: from Justusta.

73
00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:04,560
Speaker 2: Mumbiguitao has been covering the cocoa story for Bloomberg and the.

74
00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:08,240
Speaker 3: Top producers in that region are Ivory Coast in Ghana,

75
00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:10,960
Speaker 3: and their production has fallen quite a lot in the

76
00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:11,840
Speaker 3: current season.

77
00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:13,720
Speaker 2: Just how low is that supply?

78
00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:17,000
Speaker 3: For what we have on record from Ivory Coast, production

79
00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:20,800
Speaker 3: is expected to fall by twenty five percent. Twenty five

80
00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,120
Speaker 3: percent is a huge number.

81
00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:26,960
Speaker 2: And as supply has fallen, prices have soared. Cocoa prices

82
00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:30,360
Speaker 2: have more than doubled in just the last few months, like.

83
00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:33,680
Speaker 3: A rocket launch. That has just been a vatical rise

84
00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:35,440
Speaker 3: in the prices.

85
00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,760
Speaker 2: Cocoa is a hard plant to cultivate. It's fussy and

86
00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:42,440
Speaker 2: only grows in a handful of places in the world.

87
00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:45,320
Speaker 2: The plants take years to produce, cocoa pods, and when

88
00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:48,800
Speaker 2: they do reach maturity, they're prone to disease. But over

89
00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:51,880
Speaker 2: the last few years, growing cocoa has gotten even harder

90
00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:56,159
Speaker 2: as extreme weather events have hammered West Africa.

91
00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,160
Speaker 3: Not a very good combination for coco moving from an

92
00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,799
Speaker 3: extreme of heavy rains to a next stream of dryness.

93
00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:07,200
Speaker 3: We've also had diseases like swollen shoe that infects are plant.

94
00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:10,080
Speaker 2: You mentioned that disease that's been killing off a lot

95
00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,720
Speaker 2: of cocoa plants, swollen shoot. Can you say more about

96
00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:15,360
Speaker 2: what that disease does and why it's so destructive.

97
00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:18,640
Speaker 3: If you've seen a coco tree, it produces pods that

98
00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:23,040
Speaker 3: are the size of a rugby ball, and it's shaped

99
00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:26,320
Speaker 3: in an oval shape. So when a tree is infected,

100
00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,200
Speaker 3: those pods start to fall, the tree starts to turn

101
00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:33,000
Speaker 3: black and gray and it doesn't produce anymore. And the

102
00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:36,440
Speaker 3: problem with swollen shoe is that once one tree is infected,

103
00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,120
Speaker 3: it starts to infect the rest of the trees in

104
00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:42,039
Speaker 3: that plantation. So it starts to spread in just not

105
00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:45,280
Speaker 3: one farmer's plantation, but the next farmer could have the

106
00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:47,800
Speaker 3: same issue, and the next farmer will have the same issue,

107
00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:51,520
Speaker 3: and the only way to eradicate it is by appruiting trees.

108
00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:55,440
Speaker 2: Up rooting trees. That also means planting new ones, new ones,

109
00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:58,480
Speaker 2: which could take up to five years to start bearing parts.

110
00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:01,359
Speaker 2: In the meantime, the harvest out of countries like the

111
00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:04,560
Speaker 2: Ivory Coast and Ghana have gotten smaller and smaller.

112
00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:09,279
Speaker 4: Ghana have I started dropping and we are headed for

113
00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:10,640
Speaker 4: a twenty year low.

114
00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:14,679
Speaker 2: Eco Danto covers Coco for Bloomberg out of Acra, Ghana.

115
00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:18,720
Speaker 2: He says, the coco farmers he's spoken with are really struggling.

116
00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:21,839
Speaker 4: I say, Charlie, I've lost hope. Look at the trees.

117
00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:26,120
Speaker 4: I've invested everything. I've spent my money, getting liberals and

118
00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:28,279
Speaker 4: put a whole thing in place. But here you are

119
00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:30,640
Speaker 4: the range one of four that you watch everything wither

120
00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:32,240
Speaker 4: or away, and you are helpless.

121
00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:35,479
Speaker 2: You might think the soaring price of cocoa would be

122
00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:39,039
Speaker 2: benefiting farmers, even if they're producing less, their cocoa is

123
00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:44,160
Speaker 2: worth a lot more, But that isn't happening. In Ghana

124
00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:47,400
Speaker 2: and the Ivory Coast. The government dictates the price of coco.

125
00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,200
Speaker 2: Farmers get a fixed amount for their beans, so even

126
00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:54,039
Speaker 2: as cocoa price is sore, the farmers aren't the ones

127
00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:55,359
Speaker 2: making that extra money.

128
00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:58,560
Speaker 3: Farmers have been earning the same amount they've been earning

129
00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:01,560
Speaker 3: for such a long time, and you can imagine the

130
00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:04,520
Speaker 3: cost of living crisis that we've seen, the inflation that

131
00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:07,400
Speaker 3: we've seen in the last cacolovias. Yet farmers have been

132
00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,040
Speaker 3: earning the same That means they've not been able to

133
00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:13,520
Speaker 3: invest back into the firms. They've not been able to

134
00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:18,160
Speaker 3: afford fertilizes, chemicals, everything that is needed to make sure

135
00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:21,520
Speaker 3: that a tree continues producing as much as it can produce.

136
00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:25,120
Speaker 3: So some have resulted in abandoning their farms. Some have

137
00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:28,080
Speaker 3: gone into other crops that they think are more profitable.

138
00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:32,440
Speaker 2: Others have sold off their land to speculators who are

139
00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:36,480
Speaker 2: hunting for gold deposits beneath the cocoa trees. Ghana reporter

140
00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:41,240
Speaker 2: Ecodonto spoke with Francis Giabeg about his situation. Giabang is

141
00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:44,600
Speaker 2: a farmer. He sixty four, has eight children. He owns

142
00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:47,960
Speaker 2: a cocoa farm in southwestern Ghana. He spoke with Echo

143
00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:55,640
Speaker 2: by phone. He's telling Echo that the crop disease was

144
00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:58,440
Speaker 2: intense and this year's drought was long. With the scorching

145
00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:02,360
Speaker 2: sun He says he's no benefit from high cocoa crisis

146
00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:08,640
Speaker 2: and his cocoa pods are withered and dead. Echo has

147
00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:11,880
Speaker 2: spoken with many farmers and says when it comes to cocoa,

148
00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,400
Speaker 2: things might get worse before they get better.

149
00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:18,600
Speaker 4: Future of cocoa is bleak in this country. I expect

150
00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,840
Speaker 4: that in the next five years will be operating just

151
00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:25,800
Speaker 4: about maybe half a million tons for some time until

152
00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:28,040
Speaker 4: all those disease farms are rehabilitated.

153
00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:32,520
Speaker 2: When we come back, how the cocoa shortage is flowing

154
00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:35,640
Speaker 2: from the farms of Ghana up the supply chain to

155
00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:38,400
Speaker 2: chocolate makers. Really real?

156
00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:40,200
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, this is real. I mean we're going

157
00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:41,000
Speaker 1: to get in trouble.

158
00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:53,160
Speaker 2: That's after the break. We're back. We've been talking about

159
00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,199
Speaker 2: the global cocoa crisis and its origin in the cocoa

160
00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,600
Speaker 2: farms of Western Africa. Now these issues are flowing up

161
00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,319
Speaker 2: the go supply chain to places like this.

162
00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:05,280
Speaker 1: So you come with me, You go through the door.

163
00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:07,280
Speaker 1: You guys can go to the shoe clearer.

164
00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:10,040
Speaker 4: Okay, I assure you do that.

165
00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:17,720
Speaker 2: Oh it smells amazing. This is Jacques Torres's chocolate factory

166
00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:22,320
Speaker 2: in Brooklyn, New York. It is vast Torres zips around

167
00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:25,040
Speaker 2: on a scooter from the Bonbond decorating room to the

168
00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:30,040
Speaker 2: chocolate sculpting room to the chocolate cookie room and connecting

169
00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:33,679
Speaker 2: them all a network of white pipes running along the ceiling.

170
00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:37,360
Speaker 1: We have a forty thousand squaffee chocolate manufacture that are

171
00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:38,280
Speaker 1: going to show you around.

172
00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:40,400
Speaker 2: And what are we hearing right now?

173
00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:44,280
Speaker 1: So there is a lot of different pumps going on

174
00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:47,120
Speaker 1: and pushing the chocolates. The problem with the chocolates in

175
00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:49,840
Speaker 1: those pipes. And you see the pipes on the ceiling,

176
00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:52,560
Speaker 1: and all those pipes have chocolate running through.

177
00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:56,680
Speaker 2: Them, pipes full of chocolate. I know what you're thinking,

178
00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:58,320
Speaker 2: Where's the chocolate river?

179
00:09:58,600 --> 00:09:59,760
Speaker 4: What is the chocolate river?

180
00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,080
Speaker 2: That would be the chocolate river from the classic film

181
00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:04,920
Speaker 2: Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory.

182
00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:07,199
Speaker 1: What do you Monca is completely fake. I am the

183
00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:07,760
Speaker 1: rear feed.

184
00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:12,720
Speaker 2: But working in chocolate isn't as sweet as it used

185
00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:16,199
Speaker 2: to be. Cocoa prices are on Torres's mind all the time.

186
00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:19,760
Speaker 1: I'm tired of it. I don't want the business side anymore.

187
00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:21,520
Speaker 1: I want to do what I love to do, to

188
00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:24,360
Speaker 1: make chocolate, to eat chocolate, to drink our chocolate I'm

189
00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,319
Speaker 1: not about the money. I'm more of a craftman.

190
00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,079
Speaker 2: But with cocoa costs more than double what they were

191
00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,400
Speaker 2: just a few months ago, there's no ignoring the money part.

192
00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,280
Speaker 2: How often are you checking the price every day? First

193
00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:37,079
Speaker 2: thing when you wake up?

194
00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:41,679
Speaker 1: Yes, on my computer and I check prices.

195
00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,920
Speaker 2: Torres doesn't even get most of his cocoa from West Africa,

196
00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:48,439
Speaker 2: but the cocoa shortage there has created global supply chain

197
00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:52,360
Speaker 2: issues and spike the price of cocoa everywhere. That means

198
00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:56,199
Speaker 2: cocoa prices are seeping into Torres's world of pure imagination

199
00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,680
Speaker 2: in a big way. He might have to pay four

200
00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,280
Speaker 2: time is what he paid for cocoa last year, but

201
00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:05,880
Speaker 2: he can't quadruple the price of his chocolates. Customers are

202
00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:08,720
Speaker 2: sensitive even to small price sikes instant.

203
00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:12,120
Speaker 1: We lose costumer right either way. And it's interesting sometimes

204
00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:13,880
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, you know what we're going to rate to

205
00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:16,000
Speaker 1: put another twenty five cents there, and nobody going to

206
00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:19,800
Speaker 1: see the difference. People know the price of things, so

207
00:11:20,960 --> 00:11:22,679
Speaker 1: it's dangerous to go with it to be too high

208
00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,200
Speaker 1: in price or too fast, because then you lose customer.

209
00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:30,280
Speaker 2: All of this makes the Wonka business pretty tough producers

210
00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:32,840
Speaker 2: like Torres tend to have a reserve of cocoa, so

211
00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:36,360
Speaker 2: higher prices don't affect them immediately, But Torres says by

212
00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:38,240
Speaker 2: the end of the year the math is going to

213
00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:41,760
Speaker 2: get really hard. About a quarter of the cost of

214
00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:44,960
Speaker 2: Torres's chocolate bars come from cocoa, and if he can't

215
00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:48,640
Speaker 2: pass those rising costs onto the consumers, he has to

216
00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:52,200
Speaker 2: start taking a look at the product itself. Would you

217
00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:54,360
Speaker 2: ever change your chocolate recipe?

218
00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:57,680
Speaker 1: No, The only way to change your recp is to

219
00:11:57,679 --> 00:12:01,640
Speaker 1: put less quality kakel beans or most sugar, so more

220
00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:04,559
Speaker 1: sugar will not I can't. I mean, it's it's not

221
00:12:04,640 --> 00:12:07,000
Speaker 1: who we are, it's not how we develop the company.

222
00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:09,200
Speaker 1: It's not how do we develop how do we develop

223
00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:12,120
Speaker 1: our name? So no, I will not change that. It's

224
00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:13,840
Speaker 1: that's too important. Cannot touch that.

225
00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,560
Speaker 2: Some of the big chocolate makers are already changing their recipes,

226
00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:21,800
Speaker 2: putting a little less chocolate in their chocolate or making

227
00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:25,680
Speaker 2: their products smaller shrinkflation. But that won't work for a

228
00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:30,120
Speaker 2: smaller scale producer like Torres. He says, his customers would notice,

229
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,760
Speaker 2: But also the molds themselves are expensive, and buying all

230
00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,800
Speaker 2: new ones would be a major cost for him. That

231
00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:41,520
Speaker 2: leaves one last option filling the chocolates with more extra stuff.

232
00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:45,480
Speaker 1: If you do a chocolate bar with almonds, then one

233
00:12:45,520 --> 00:12:47,960
Speaker 1: third of the chocolate is going to be removed to

234
00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:50,720
Speaker 1: fill the almonds. So one of the solutions that we

235
00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:55,920
Speaker 1: are looking at is, okay, what is less expensive than

236
00:12:56,000 --> 00:13:01,160
Speaker 1: cakeo a ten thousand dollars ton. So if almonds became

237
00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:03,760
Speaker 1: less expensive than cacao, we're going to put a little

238
00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:06,720
Speaker 1: bit more almonds, a little bit less chocolates, so people

239
00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:10,360
Speaker 1: or customer, we get the same chocolate bar, the same weight,

240
00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:13,920
Speaker 1: no shrinkage. So that's maybe a solution for us.

241
00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:19,240
Speaker 2: Torres and his team are experimenting with adding more nuts

242
00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:22,200
Speaker 2: and fruits to their chocolate bars. They're also thinking up

243
00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:25,760
Speaker 2: new products. Price spikes and shortages are nothing new for

244
00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:30,160
Speaker 2: chocolate tears. Torres says, during World War Two, Italian chocolate

245
00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:33,160
Speaker 2: makers couldn't get their hands on much coco, so they

246
00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:34,400
Speaker 2: started to adapt.

247
00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:36,600
Speaker 1: So what the Italian? What the Italian?

248
00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:36,920
Speaker 2: Did?

249
00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:42,280
Speaker 1: They come up with this recipe? This is a jam

250
00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:43,439
Speaker 1: douya juma.

251
00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:46,200
Speaker 2: Coco might have been hard to come by for the Italians,

252
00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:49,440
Speaker 2: but there were lots and lots of hazelnut trees.

253
00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:52,360
Speaker 1: So what do they do. They used the hazel nuts

254
00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:54,560
Speaker 1: that they have in Pimo and they mix it with

255
00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:56,800
Speaker 1: chocolates and they make a bombon with it.

256
00:13:57,640 --> 00:14:02,520
Speaker 2: The hazelnut chocolates became hugely, as did another product created

257
00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:04,440
Speaker 2: out of that moment, Nutella.

258
00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:05,839
Speaker 1: So those products was born.

259
00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,280
Speaker 2: So we may get a new nutella because.

260
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:09,520
Speaker 4: Maybe we will.

261
00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:10,440
Speaker 1: We will look at it.

262
00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:12,960
Speaker 2: And he's hoping to bring some of that old school

263
00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:15,880
Speaker 2: innovation to this moment to help him adapt to soaring

264
00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:20,120
Speaker 2: cocoa prices. Right now, nothing is off the table, not

265
00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,760
Speaker 2: even his beloved hot chocolate, the product that started it all.

266
00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:28,600
Speaker 2: He bruised me a cup. It's made of crushed up chocolate.

267
00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:32,600
Speaker 2: It's been his signature product for twenty five years. We

268
00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:36,800
Speaker 2: use real chocolate, it says on the tin, never cocoa powder.

269
00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:41,520
Speaker 2: But that famous cocoa might have to change. Already a

270
00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:45,520
Speaker 2: fourteen ounce container costs about twenty five dollars. Charging more

271
00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:49,280
Speaker 2: could be tricky, so instead Torres might have to rethink

272
00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:49,800
Speaker 2: the mix.

273
00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:52,600
Speaker 1: If I have to, I will replace twenty percent of

274
00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:56,480
Speaker 1: the powder, maybe with a mixture of caca went sugar

275
00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:02,640
Speaker 1: to not lose the flavor, but helping us with the price.

276
00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:05,240
Speaker 1: I don't know what I'm going to do or do

277
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,160
Speaker 1: I just tell Costumer just more expensive. But it's a

278
00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:11,000
Speaker 1: risk because people might not buy it, you know. I mean,

279
00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:12,640
Speaker 1: I don't know what solution we have.

280
00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:14,880
Speaker 2: Does it make you sad that you might have to

281
00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:16,960
Speaker 2: change the ratios? No?

282
00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:20,800
Speaker 1: Look again, in life, you do what you have to do.

283
00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:23,920
Speaker 1: So I don't going to put something on the market

284
00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:27,120
Speaker 1: that's not good. If I don't like it, I don't

285
00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:31,680
Speaker 1: make it. I am very stubborn about it.

286
00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:35,200
Speaker 2: In the meantime, Torres is doing everything he can to

287
00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,920
Speaker 2: try and avoid making some of the more painful changes.

288
00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,640
Speaker 2: He's been making deals with cocoa farmers to try and

289
00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:41,840
Speaker 2: lock down future supply.

290
00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:45,480
Speaker 1: We're also waiting. I don't want to change everything because

291
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:46,920
Speaker 1: it may be on the way down.

292
00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:50,520
Speaker 2: Torres is still holding out hope that somehow prices will

293
00:15:50,560 --> 00:15:53,040
Speaker 2: go down and he'll be able to keep his signature

294
00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:57,560
Speaker 2: drink just as it is pure melted chocolate, very hot.

295
00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:03,200
Speaker 1: Okay, so be careful. That would sick.

296
00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:10,600
Speaker 2: This is the big take from Bloomberg News. I'm Sarah Holder.

297
00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,280
Speaker 2: This episode was produced by Julia Press, Jessica Beck, and

298
00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,520
Speaker 2: Alex Sugiura. It was edited by Stacy Vanicksmith and Jeff Sutherland.

299
00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,360
Speaker 2: It was mixed by Ben O'Brien. It was fact checked

300
00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:25,080
Speaker 2: by Adrianna Tapia. Our senior producer is Naomi Shaven. Our

301
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:28,640
Speaker 2: senior editor is Elizabeth Ponso. The Cold Beemster bor is

302
00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:31,840
Speaker 2: Our executive producer. Sage Bauman is our head of podcasts.

303
00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:35,200
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening. Please follow and review The Big Take

304
00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:38,240
Speaker 2: wherever you listen to podcasts. It helps new listeners find

305
00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:40,240
Speaker 2: the show. We'll be back tomorrow.