1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,840 Speaker 1: production of My Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noel. They called 6 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 1: me Ben. We are joined as always with our super 7 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: producer Paul Mission Control decond. Most importantly, you are you. 8 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 1: You are here, and that makes this stuff they don't 9 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 1: want you to know, coming to you live and direct. 10 00:00:41,720 --> 00:00:45,600 Speaker 1: Yet again, we're your favorite Quentin Quarantinos. We're still keeping 11 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 1: the lights on in our separate bunkers here. Just wanted 12 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,440 Speaker 1: to check in with everybody real quick before we dive in. 13 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: How are you today? I'm really good. Over the weekend, 14 00:00:56,440 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: I spent some time digging through our voicemail arch I've 15 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:04,039 Speaker 1: and everybody that's been calling in and got to talk 16 00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:08,520 Speaker 1: with several of you you listening right now, speaking to you. 17 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:13,040 Speaker 1: I've been instructed to say the word divination to prove 18 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:15,119 Speaker 1: to one person that I called that it was real. 19 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:18,640 Speaker 1: So there you have it. UM. I would just say 20 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:22,039 Speaker 1: everyone out there that I've that I've spoken to, and 21 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 1: a lot of people that have been calling in. You know, 22 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: we're all still dealing with this thing. A lot of 23 00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 1: you are doing great work to continue both the economy 24 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:33,200 Speaker 1: and the health of others of us who are listening 25 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: and present today. So thank you to all of you. UM, 26 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 1: just keep doing what you're doing, especially you truckers who 27 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 1: are out there are still going every day. You healthcare 28 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 1: workers who are going every day, essential workers in the 29 00:01:47,240 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 1: grocery stores who are going every day and putting yourselves 30 00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 1: at risk. Big big props to you guys. Well said, uh, 31 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 1: what about you, nol. How's it going. Oh, it's good. 32 00:01:57,400 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 1: I had a really nice weekend. Uh. I am made 33 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 1: uh tied eye shirts with my daughter. Um, you know, 34 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 1: proof positive that the madness is really starting to take hold. 35 00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 1: Uh because that's the thing I never would have done before. 36 00:02:11,800 --> 00:02:13,240 Speaker 1: But you know what, it turns out I really like 37 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 1: it and it's uh you get some really nice results. 38 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 1: We tried two different methods. There's the twist method where 39 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:21,240 Speaker 1: you put rubber bands around it like a braid of 40 00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:24,239 Speaker 1: a giant ponytail, like a French braid. And there's something 41 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:25,880 Speaker 1: we just bunch it up and put the rubber bands 42 00:02:25,919 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: around the wad and the results are really delightful. I 43 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 1: think I'm a tied eye guy. Now nice good here. Uh. 44 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 1: And of course you can find some of those results 45 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:39,560 Speaker 1: on our very social media, which we will shout out 46 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: either during this show or at the end. Yeah, mind's 47 00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:44,919 Speaker 1: at how now, Noel Brown, if you want to check 48 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: it out, Ben, what have you been up to? All 49 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:51,040 Speaker 1: sorts of things? You know? Um? Uh. They're really deep 50 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:57,079 Speaker 1: into a really really deep into a strange web that 51 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 1: is the subject of today's show. This is something that 52 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: I think is familiar to a lot of our fellow 53 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 1: conspiracy realist It's it's a mystery, it's a disappearance. Uh. 54 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 1: And you know, of course, if we are being realistic, 55 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: which we must be, the sad truth of the world 56 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,960 Speaker 1: is that thousands of people disappear every day, even now, 57 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:23,239 Speaker 1: in as the surveillance state grows stronger than it ever 58 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: has been before. Yet, of all those disappearances, this case 59 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,920 Speaker 1: has always stood out for us, for me, for you, Matt, 60 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 1: you know, and particularly for Paul Michig controlled decade himself. Recently, 61 00:03:37,480 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: we received several partially redacted records from a source that 62 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: prefers to remain anonymous, and this prompted us to finally 63 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 1: dive into one of the most mystifying disappearances in modern history. Today, 64 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 1: we are asking what exactly happened to Emmanuela or Landing. 65 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: Quick quick bit of how keeping here? First, our source 66 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,080 Speaker 1: that decided to remain anonymous or preferred that way. Uh. 67 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 1: When when this source sent us these documents, we circulated 68 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 1: them amid ourselves. We haven't shared them anywhere. Uh, and 69 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:20,440 Speaker 1: we're I don't I don't know if we should honestly, um, 70 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: but we'll we'll get into that. And secondly, as we 71 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,799 Speaker 1: like to say at the top of every um, particularly 72 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: darker violent episode, Uh, there is content in today's show 73 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:35,280 Speaker 1: that may be triggering to some people. We will be 74 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: talking about the allegations of sexual abuse, we will be 75 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,840 Speaker 1: talking about murder, uh, and there will be scenes of violence. 76 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: So we want to put that up there at the top. Now, 77 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: we have to do some background for everybody who thinks 78 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:56,719 Speaker 1: Manuela or Landy, who is that? Did you say Orlando? No, 79 00:04:57,080 --> 00:05:01,040 Speaker 1: we said or Landy. Uh. And let learn a little 80 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:06,680 Speaker 1: bit about our main character. Here here are the facts. Yes, Uh, 81 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: Emanuela or Landy was born in nineteen sixty eight, UM, 82 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 1: one of five children, and according to records. Her father 83 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 1: worked either at the Vatican Bank or was actually a 84 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 1: member of the staff in the papal household UM. According 85 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 1: to a Manuela's older brother Pietro, the family lived inside 86 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 1: Vatican City and would often they grew up UH feeling 87 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 1: as though the Vatican gardens, which are lush and gorgeous, 88 00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 1: were was their own backyard. That's according to him, and 89 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 1: he's been a very outspoken person in the press about 90 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 1: this story. UM. In nineteen eighty three, Emmanuela was a 91 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:48,719 Speaker 1: sophomore in high school UM. The school year had ended 92 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: for the summer, and she was taking flute lessons nearby 93 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:57,160 Speaker 1: the music school UH at the Tomaso Ludovico de Victoria 94 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: School UM, and she was into music. She sang in 95 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: the choir, played the flute, and seemed to have a 96 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 1: real gift for just picking up instruments. It was on 97 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:12,600 Speaker 1: the twenty two of June in that year three when 98 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:16,880 Speaker 1: she disappeared, and we don't know much, but this is 99 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 1: what we do know. She left the family apartment. She 100 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:22,520 Speaker 1: was wearing a white T shirt. She had on denim 101 00:06:22,560 --> 00:06:27,159 Speaker 1: overalls and running shoes. She got onto a bus and 102 00:06:27,240 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 1: she traveled a pretty short distance only about two kilometers. 103 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 1: She got off near the Piazza Novona, and um, this 104 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,239 Speaker 1: is right in front of the Italian Senate. By the way, 105 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,680 Speaker 1: she was stopped by a young man in a green BMW. 106 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:45,159 Speaker 1: There was a traffic officer who witnessed this whole scene, 107 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:48,599 Speaker 1: just Emmanuela getting off in speaking to this man in 108 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:52,080 Speaker 1: a green BMW. The Senate security cameras were not working 109 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 1: that day though, so there was no video proof of this. Um. Now, 110 00:06:57,320 --> 00:06:59,919 Speaker 1: I just want to interjected him put this in the note. 111 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:03,799 Speaker 1: But it is important to note that her brother, Pietro 112 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 1: or Landy, who's going to play a big role in 113 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: this story. Uh, he is the reason that she ended 114 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 1: up using public transit. According to what we know, she 115 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: asked him for a ride to the flute lesson and 116 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 1: he refused for one reason or another. So that's that's 117 00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 1: why she ended up on the bus. Yeah, he has 118 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 1: stated several times over the course of all these years 119 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 1: that they got into a fight a row and that's 120 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: why they decided not to go that route. Right for 121 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:39,240 Speaker 1: him taking her there, But she did end up going 122 00:07:39,240 --> 00:07:42,120 Speaker 1: to her flute class or music class as she normally 123 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: would have. She did call her sister after that class 124 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 1: had completed, and that phone call was the last known 125 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:53,240 Speaker 1: contact that anyone ever had with Emmanuel, at least the 126 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: last known contact to the family and to investigators. Right. Yeah, 127 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:03,240 Speaker 1: she had made plans with her sister to meet at 128 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 1: a piazza at seven thirty pm, and that is where 129 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 1: her trail ends. She was reported a missing person the 130 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 1: next day. Also, want to bust a myth here. In 131 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 1: most countries you do not have to wait twenty four 132 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: hours to report someone missing. That's that's a story that 133 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: television has told us. If you have reasonable cause to 134 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: believe someone has gone missing, go ahead and report them, 135 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 1: because every hour, every second counts. So the investigation begins. 136 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 1: The next day, tips start rolling in. Some are much 137 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: more promising or seem much more solid than others. Two 138 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:48,720 Speaker 1: tips in particular, capture the investigator's attention. There's one caller 139 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:54,200 Speaker 1: who refers to himself as Pierre Luigi Uh. He makes 140 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: a call on June and he says, I've seen this child, 141 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: not in Vatican City, I've seen her earlier in Rome 142 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: on the day of her disappearance, and he provided details 143 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:11,560 Speaker 1: that made it sound believable to the authorities. He mentioned 144 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 1: that she had a flute a flute case with her. 145 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:17,080 Speaker 1: He described her clothing, which you described earlier, Matt and 146 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 1: his description match. However, he had some interesting things to say. Uh. 147 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:25,720 Speaker 1: Pierre Luigi said the girl was not going by the 148 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:30,440 Speaker 1: name Emanuela. Instead, she was calling herself Barbarella, and that 149 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 1: she had run away from home to sell, of all things, 150 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 1: products for Avon. That's an interesting detail too, because it 151 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 1: wasn't something that was out there in the public sphere. 152 00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:45,520 Speaker 1: You know. It's it's pretty common in high profile cases 153 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:49,680 Speaker 1: for authorities to withhold some information because it helps you 154 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 1: separate the wheat from the chaff, believe it or not. 155 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 1: In a lot of missing cases, a lot of suspected homicides, 156 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: when authorities asked the public for tips, they get a 157 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: lot of really cold hearted pranks where they get some 158 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:07,560 Speaker 1: unstable people making ridiculous claims. So the fact that he 159 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: knew about this Avon thing was especially fascinating because it 160 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: tracked with information provided by the family. Or Landi had 161 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:20,240 Speaker 1: mentioned wanting to sell Avon products earlier to her sister 162 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:23,199 Speaker 1: before her disappearance, which is something a lot of people 163 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 1: did not know. So a second call came just a 164 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:30,440 Speaker 1: couple of days later, on June, another man claimed to 165 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: have met a young woman going by Barbara who had 166 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:35,840 Speaker 1: also run away from home. And this caller said that 167 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:39,959 Speaker 1: he had seen her in a bar nearby the music school. Uh, 168 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:45,040 Speaker 1: and you know, calling herself Barbara. Um. There were several 169 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 1: other tips. Uh. Some callers speculated that there was a 170 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:54,439 Speaker 1: conspiracy afoot. A Turkish terrorist group called the Gray Wolves 171 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 1: allegedly had planned to kidnap or Landy allegedly um then 172 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 1: exchange her for one of their members, sort of a 173 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 1: political prisoner swap situation, a memet ali aga. Um, it 174 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:12,080 Speaker 1: would be assassin who had been imprisoned for shooting the 175 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:16,160 Speaker 1: pope two years earlier. Uh so what where did it 176 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 1: go from there? Oh? Devil coins, that's where it went. 177 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 1: And we shall also mentioned that second caller also said 178 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,560 Speaker 1: the young woman who was calling herself Barbara had run 179 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,960 Speaker 1: away from home. So they have those commonalities. And we 180 00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 1: have a great story that's not really ours to tell. 181 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: It is a story from our good friend writer or 182 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:39,719 Speaker 1: Die Paul mission controlled decond about fascinating coins that were 183 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:45,600 Speaker 1: allegedly discovered, uh during the the attempted assassination of the pope. 184 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:49,280 Speaker 1: That's a story for another day. But there's the door 185 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: to the Google rabbit hole. If you want to get 186 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 1: lost over the week, You're you're asking a vital question, Noel, 187 00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:03,359 Speaker 1: what did happen? There's no shore ritage of intriguing, compelling, 188 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:08,600 Speaker 1: tantalizing that would be the right word. Tantalizing theories surrounding 189 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 1: or Landy's disappearance and at this stage her presumed death, 190 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:18,319 Speaker 1: you know, the Turkish terrorist group that's just scratching the surface. 191 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 1: We have to remember the Vatican and the surrounding region 192 00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:25,440 Speaker 1: is a hub of religious power, and it's a hub 193 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 1: of mafia power. It's a hub of organized crime, and 194 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:34,160 Speaker 1: these groups often come under suspicion in the world of conspiracy, 195 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: I mean Vatican. The Vatican city itself is a very 196 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,320 Speaker 1: very weird place. Uh. Let's see the the age of 197 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:46,040 Speaker 1: consent for a long time, I think was twelve years old. Uh. 198 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 1: It's also the only place where you can find an 199 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:51,720 Speaker 1: a t M in Latin, just so where these aren't 200 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 1: all horrible quick facts. Uh. And it also wields this 201 00:12:56,679 --> 00:13:02,280 Speaker 1: outsize tremendous influence on human civilization, and it has for 202 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 1: centuries and centuries. You know, the the nexus of powerful 203 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:17,839 Speaker 1: religious organization, of incredibly powerful godlike financial institutions and criminal organizations. 204 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:22,080 Speaker 1: It all comes to a head here in a very 205 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:25,720 Speaker 1: real way. You could say it's um it's even more 206 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:29,000 Speaker 1: powerful than the City of London, which long time listeners 207 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: you'll recall, is not actually London, it's just in London, 208 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,880 Speaker 1: and it's called the City of London. It is a 209 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: very confusing time for names because Vatican City it's called 210 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: a city, and it is a city, but it's a state, 211 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:45,839 Speaker 1: and it's an uber state, and it's beyond a lot 212 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: of laws that would apply to Jane and John Doe's 213 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 1: like us and the people listening, unless you're listening and 214 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: you're the pope, in which case thanks for checking in. Man. 215 00:13:55,200 --> 00:14:00,840 Speaker 1: It is very odd to imagine Vaticans City as a 216 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: religious monarchy. That is just a strange that's a strange 217 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:12,679 Speaker 1: thing there. There are so few places that exists in 218 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:17,960 Speaker 1: that are full on monarchies, you know, without a parliament 219 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:22,640 Speaker 1: connected in some way, or without a secondary governmental institution 220 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:25,120 Speaker 1: attached in some way. There are they. I'm not saying 221 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 1: they don't exist, they are certainly they're certainly I guess 222 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: a dozen or so dozens. Let's say, but um, just 223 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: just to have the amount of wealth and power that 224 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:41,520 Speaker 1: they have. Um, it's pretty strange to see it both together. 225 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 1: And it's it's so weird to talk about this case 226 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:47,920 Speaker 1: because you know, if you picture this episode and this 227 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 1: exploration as us walking through an art gallery in a hallway, 228 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:58,320 Speaker 1: we're passing this gigantic mural that says Vatican Conspiracies, and 229 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:00,640 Speaker 1: we're kind of pointing at it for you, But it's 230 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 1: not it's not the part of this episode that we're 231 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:06,960 Speaker 1: going to focus on. You can find our earlier videos 232 00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: on this, you can find some earlier podcasts we've done. 233 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 1: But it goes very, very deep, and a disturbing amount 234 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 1: of the things that are treated as conspiracy theories about 235 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:18,760 Speaker 1: the Vatican have later turned out to be at least 236 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:23,200 Speaker 1: partially true. This is reality, and given this reality, it's 237 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 1: no surprise then that the Vatican is the subject of 238 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 1: so many conspiracy theories. And like the leads in the 239 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:33,880 Speaker 1: Orlandic case, some of these theories are way more plausible 240 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: than others. I think it's this inherent strangeness of Vatican City. 241 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:44,120 Speaker 1: Uh and and this bizarre, tragic disappearance of this fifteen 242 00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:48,120 Speaker 1: year old girl that combined to make this such a 243 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 1: mystifying mystery. And you know this is just context for 244 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,240 Speaker 1: the question we asked earlier. Will pause for a word 245 00:15:56,280 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: from our sponsors and return to ask what And to 246 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:13,200 Speaker 1: Manuela or Landy, here's where it gets crazy. Yeah, decades later, 247 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 1: this mystery is still just that a mystery. It is unsolved, 248 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,480 Speaker 1: though there are plenty of theories, as tends to be 249 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: the case when you have cold cases like this. We 250 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 1: had talked about the gray Wolves, but what about that 251 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 1: other organization that seems to thrive so readily in Vatican City, 252 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: the mafia. Mafia theories um largely revolve around a Rome 253 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:44,640 Speaker 1: based syndicate, a crime syndicate known as the Banda della 254 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:50,440 Speaker 1: Magliana led by Enrico di pettus Um. The theory states 255 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:54,080 Speaker 1: that the syndicate had loaned large sums of money to 256 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:58,800 Speaker 1: the Vatican Bank, but weren't getting their payments as quickly 257 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 1: as they would have liked were at all, They weren't 258 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:03,920 Speaker 1: being paid back what they were owed, so they decided 259 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 1: that taking a Vatican officials daughter for ransom was the 260 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:11,840 Speaker 1: way to get their money back, and one of de 261 00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 1: Pettis's former girlfriends claimed on the record that her ex 262 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:21,280 Speaker 1: told her he had kidnapped or landy Um, and these 263 00:17:21,359 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: claims were plausible enough that the authorities decided to get involved. Yeah. Yeah. 264 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:32,080 Speaker 1: Deppettis himself, like many mafio so had a lived by 265 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 1: the sword, die by the sword situation. He was fatally 266 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: shot in a square in Rome back in and years 267 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:44,720 Speaker 1: later after after his death, an investigative journalists found out 268 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:50,400 Speaker 1: that de Pettus's body had been very very quietly moved 269 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:55,920 Speaker 1: from a normal cemetery to the prestigious Basilica sant Apollinarii. 270 00:17:56,680 --> 00:18:02,120 Speaker 1: This is interesting because this Basilican picular is not It's 271 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:06,920 Speaker 1: like a very exclusive club for corpses, if you want 272 00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 1: to be crass about it. This is not where ordinary 273 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,560 Speaker 1: people are buried. This is this is the eternal parking 274 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 1: spot for the bodies of cardinals and princes and other 275 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:24,159 Speaker 1: you know, illustrious members of society, Vatican and lay people alike. 276 00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:30,080 Speaker 1: So it's odd that a very successful criminal would end 277 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 1: up first off buried somewhere else and then some for 278 00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: some reason, have his body moved posthumously to a different site. 279 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:43,919 Speaker 1: People were freaking out and so in like you're saying, 280 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 1: no from some of the leads they got. The authorities 281 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: actually decided that they would open the tomb of this mobster, 282 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: and they wanted to see whether the rumors were true, 283 00:18:57,119 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 1: whether it was in fact the case that Manuela or 284 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,840 Speaker 1: Landy was dead and that her remains were secretly placed 285 00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:09,840 Speaker 1: inside the tomb of Deppetus, which does see him on 286 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: the surface like it would be a little odd, right 287 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 1: he was killed in n she's been missing since nine three. 288 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:21,920 Speaker 1: That would mean seven years of waiting until you entered 289 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: her into a tomb. Just if he was if she 290 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:30,120 Speaker 1: was put into his original resting place, right, and then 291 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,360 Speaker 1: after he got moved. There were a lot of big 292 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:35,439 Speaker 1: you know what ifs, but there was there was rumor, 293 00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:39,440 Speaker 1: and there was you know, possibility. So it was looked into. 294 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:42,240 Speaker 1: And when they did open it up, they found more 295 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:46,440 Speaker 1: than they bargained for. Right, his his body was there. 296 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: It was a very nice sarcophagus in which he was placed. 297 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 1: He was well preserved. He had a dark blue suit 298 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 1: and a black tie. They took fingerprints from his body. 299 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:03,680 Speaker 1: They confirmed his identity. But they also found this other 300 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: thing talked away inside this ancient crypt where he was buried. 301 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:13,280 Speaker 1: That's right, they found not just one person's remains, but 302 00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:18,640 Speaker 1: multiple remains. There were dozens of boxes that held unidentified 303 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 1: human bones. You know, So they went looking for one 304 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: secret corpse and they found multiple remains. And then this 305 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 1: is this here's where the plot gets even trickier. Around 306 00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: the same time he said this was right, so roughly 307 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 1: around the same time, a returning guests of sorts to 308 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:46,440 Speaker 1: our show, the infamous Vatican exorcist, Gabrielle a More claimed 309 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:50,199 Speaker 1: that a Manuela or Landy did not run away and 310 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 1: claimed instead that she was kidnapped by a member of 311 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,119 Speaker 1: none other than the Vatican Police Force. He said that 312 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 1: she was kidnapped for the purpose of being abused at 313 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,000 Speaker 1: sex parties for lack of a better term, and then 314 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:07,320 Speaker 1: that she would be murdered. After that, he said she 315 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: had already died. He also alleged, and this is public too, 316 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:14,720 Speaker 1: It's been reported in multiple sources, he also alleged that 317 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:19,159 Speaker 1: officials of a foreign embassy they did not name were 318 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: also involved in this crime. That's important because if any 319 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 1: of that's true, what that means is that there was 320 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 1: an organized sexual abuse ring. Now this is something that 321 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:36,160 Speaker 1: you know, we here thrown around a lot in conspiracy circles. 322 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:39,119 Speaker 1: But one of the most troubling things about these sorts 323 00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 1: of allegations is that every so often they end up 324 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,840 Speaker 1: being at least partially true. And this is something that 325 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:49,119 Speaker 1: people from across the spectrum had been sane was going 326 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 1: on in the Vatican for a long long time, you 327 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,840 Speaker 1: know what I mean. Well, at the very least we 328 00:21:54,960 --> 00:22:00,240 Speaker 1: have hard proof of systematic cover ups of set sual 329 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:05,200 Speaker 1: abuse by priests, uh and and members high level members 330 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 1: of the clergy in the Vatican. You know, to take 331 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 1: it to the next level of organized sex abuse ring 332 00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: doesn't feel like much of a jump to me personally. Um, 333 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 1: you know, people may or may differ on that, but uh, 334 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:25,200 Speaker 1: it's certainly the cover up is essentially the same thing 335 00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 1: as um advocating or protecting that kind of behavior. So 336 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:32,920 Speaker 1: why would it be such a you know, suspension disbelief 337 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:35,840 Speaker 1: to to think that there's a step further and actually 338 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:39,840 Speaker 1: orchestrating that, especially for people that are very privileged and 339 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 1: used to being able to order people around and get 340 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:44,639 Speaker 1: everything they want and be waited on hand and foot. 341 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 1: You know, yes, but we also have the words here 342 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:53,760 Speaker 1: from an archives at the Vatican. UH, Monsignor Simeon Duca, 343 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:58,000 Speaker 1: who in twos six backed up the claims of our 344 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:06,720 Speaker 1: friendly neighborhood exorcist Gabriel. He cited quote credible information that 345 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 1: quote certain factions inside the Vaticans diplomatic Corps were involved 346 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 1: in procuring young adolescent girls for sexual slavery. And this 347 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:21,280 Speaker 1: this gentleman, Monsignor Duca. He also believed that Orlandy was 348 00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:24,199 Speaker 1: abducted for that purpose, and he believed that she was 349 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:29,199 Speaker 1: killed when I guess she had this it's terrible to 350 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:32,359 Speaker 1: think about it this in this way, but when she 351 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 1: was no longer innocent in the way that perhaps the 352 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:41,800 Speaker 1: people that we're doing this uh wanted. Yeah. Yeah, it's 353 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:47,760 Speaker 1: a it's a terrifying and very grim allegation. Uh. One 354 00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:53,480 Speaker 1: thing that's interesting about both Duca and a more statements 355 00:23:54,160 --> 00:24:00,439 Speaker 1: is that they're inherently drawing a line to geopolitans and 356 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 1: also to the halls of power, uh, to intelligence agencies. 357 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's ultimately where that rabbit hole leads. 358 00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: And it also jibes with ongoing, ongoing allegations like decades 359 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:20,399 Speaker 1: and decades old allegations that certain factions of intelligence agencies 360 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 1: have coerced people into these heinous acts of child abuse, uh, 361 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: in order to ensure their loyalty. You know, it reminds 362 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:34,560 Speaker 1: like as as out there in black mirror esque or 363 00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: Dan Dan brownish as it might sound, Uh, these possibilities 364 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 1: are less implausible than they might seem. So you know, 365 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,639 Speaker 1: the the scariest thing about this allegation is that you 366 00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:52,600 Speaker 1: can't immediately throw it out, you know what I mean. 367 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,679 Speaker 1: It's it's close enough to things that we know to 368 00:24:55,720 --> 00:25:00,920 Speaker 1: be true that it bears uh, it bears siries this consideration. 369 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 1: Even if, even if you know that headline might sound 370 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:09,760 Speaker 1: all red media and alarmists, that story doesn't come from 371 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 1: you know, thin air. There there's a vast, a vast 372 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:20,520 Speaker 1: trove of precedent behind there. And you know this, The 373 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:25,720 Speaker 1: thread of this continues in an Italian journalist named Amano 374 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:31,000 Speaker 1: Fid and apologies for my Italian pronunciation here, folks. Uh. 375 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:35,720 Speaker 1: This journalist was given a leaked document that appeared to 376 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:40,159 Speaker 1: be from the Vatican, and it was listing expenses for 377 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:45,119 Speaker 1: the care of Manuela or Landi abroad. It included things 378 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:50,160 Speaker 1: like room and board, as well as guidecological examinations. Now, 379 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:53,639 Speaker 1: when I say appeared to be a Vatican document. We're 380 00:25:53,640 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 1: being careful with our language there, because the Vatican vehemently 381 00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 1: denied that this document was legit. They called it a false, 382 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:11,200 Speaker 1: ridiculous reconstruction. And you know, I'm still kind of stuck 383 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:15,720 Speaker 1: on the allegations of an organized abuse ring. It makes me, 384 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:18,960 Speaker 1: it makes me think back when um, we're talking with 385 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,960 Speaker 1: Dan uh, with Dan Harmon and he actually changed my 386 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,639 Speaker 1: mind about whether large scale conspiracies were popular, were possible. 387 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,440 Speaker 1: Do you remember that? And he's like, look, maybe they'll 388 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:33,480 Speaker 1: just tell you can be in with us, but you 389 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,160 Speaker 1: have to eat this baby. Yeah, yeah, No, I mean 390 00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:39,640 Speaker 1: it's compromised, right, But when people are compromised, uh, it's 391 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:43,240 Speaker 1: a lot easier to control them. And this brings us 392 00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 1: to another potential lead, one that we will address in 393 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:58,879 Speaker 1: full after a brief word from our sponsor and we're back. 394 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 1: It's I'm to introduce a character known as Cardinal Ugo Pelletti. Yes, 395 00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 1: and to discuss Cardinal Poleetti, we have to jump to 396 00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,480 Speaker 1: two thousand five, when there was a television program called 397 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 1: Who Has Seen? And on that program there was an 398 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:21,919 Speaker 1: anonymous caller who alleged that Emmanuela had been seized at 399 00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:26,880 Speaker 1: the behest of someone Cardinal Ugo Polletti, who in three 400 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,280 Speaker 1: was Vicar General of Rome. This anonymous caller said, quote 401 00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:34,919 Speaker 1: on the matter of Emmanuela or Landy. To find a 402 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,960 Speaker 1: solution to the case, go see who was buried in 403 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 1: the crypt at St. Apollinaire Basilica, and about the favor 404 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:46,120 Speaker 1: that Rennettino did for Cardinal Pelletti at the time. Right. 405 00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 1: The caller also heavily implies that the motive behind the 406 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:58,719 Speaker 1: kidnapping they thought it was and the later burial, uh 407 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: was it's health sexual in nature. Cardinal Poletti passed away, 408 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,880 Speaker 1: so we can't get an official statement from him at 409 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 1: this point, but we do know a few more things 410 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:17,080 Speaker 1: about him. We know that back in he is the 411 00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:22,280 Speaker 1: person who greenlit the removal of Depettus's body and it's 412 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:28,000 Speaker 1: uh reinterment in the basilica. Uh. This this basilica again 413 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:33,360 Speaker 1: is usually reserved for the burial of senior clerics, uh, 414 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 1: not mafio so crime bosses. And this is also like 415 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:42,760 Speaker 1: we learned about Poletti because of these documents sent to 416 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:46,960 Speaker 1: us by our source. We want to be completely fair here. 417 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,800 Speaker 1: A lot of this is in English. A lot of 418 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:53,440 Speaker 1: it's in Italian, and we have not been able to 419 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 1: verify the authenticity of what we were sent, but it's 420 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:02,280 Speaker 1: got some damning stuff in it. If it's true, yeah, completely, Uh. 421 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: A lot of it appears to be some kind of 422 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:11,120 Speaker 1: transcript of a conversation where the concept of uh, Palletti 423 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:15,400 Speaker 1: being I don't know that there's some language that's really 424 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 1: kind of vague. Uh. He's referred to as having certain 425 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:22,640 Speaker 1: like proclivities kind of you know, I think the implication 426 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:26,880 Speaker 1: being that he likes young girls. Uh. There's also a 427 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:32,200 Speaker 1: discussion of hiring kind of high class call girls as 428 00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:34,880 Speaker 1: well thrown around in there. But it's not clear to me, 429 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 1: and I did ask the listener um to clarify and 430 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 1: to maybe help with some translations, but haven't heard back, 431 00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 1: uh since the initial uh you know, kind of document dump. UM. 432 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:48,920 Speaker 1: I'm not quite sure who's meant to be speaking in 433 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,920 Speaker 1: these um, but like you said, Ben, it is it 434 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 1: is quite damning. So let's let's talk about the implications here. 435 00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: We we'd already gone over someone who was very in 436 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:05,720 Speaker 1: that Basilica, right or Mafio so fellow de Pettis and 437 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:09,400 Speaker 1: or d Petti. However, you say it, and this tip 438 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:13,760 Speaker 1: that came through in two thousand five is referencing a 439 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 1: move that occurred in which is the year that the 440 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:25,880 Speaker 1: mafia fellow du Pettis was killed. Correct, And the burial 441 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 1: like who is buried? That's the thing here, who is 442 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,719 Speaker 1: buried there? In the basilica at St. A paulinaire Um. 443 00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:36,920 Speaker 1: They did find dozens of sets of bones when they 444 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:41,240 Speaker 1: did end up incurring or looking at the tomb in 445 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 1: so it all it gets a little confusing here, but 446 00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:51,320 Speaker 1: essentially it's this person would allegedly be is allegedly saying 447 00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:58,800 Speaker 1: that this cardinal had this person killed Emmanuela and then 448 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:03,280 Speaker 1: her bones perhaps moved around to different burial places. It's 449 00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:07,320 Speaker 1: pretty odd, but again, we did find a bunch of bones, 450 00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: and we're gonna keep going on here. We're going to 451 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 1: learn what officially from the Vatican at least, what who 452 00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:17,200 Speaker 1: those bones were or how old they were at least. 453 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,400 Speaker 1: And this is just something to quickly clarify here. In 454 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,400 Speaker 1: that quote that we read earlier about on the matter 455 00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:27,720 Speaker 1: of Emmanuelo or landy Um, it's referenced a name is 456 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:32,880 Speaker 1: referenced Rennettino. That name is referring back to de Pettus, 457 00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 1: the the mafia boss that we mentioned earlier there, who 458 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,560 Speaker 1: is in fact buried at the Saint Apollinaire Basilica. So 459 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 1: basically what was being you know, alleged here in all 460 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 1: of this discussion was that perhaps Rennettino ord Pettus the monster, 461 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:57,600 Speaker 1: did a favor for Cardinal Palletti, and then Paletti in 462 00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 1: turn did a favor for Rennettino, or for some other 463 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,920 Speaker 1: reason to obvious skate other bones or the burial of 464 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 1: other you know, people who were killed, had Rennettino moved 465 00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 1: to that Basilica from where he was first interred, perhaps, 466 00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:17,080 Speaker 1: I think? Is that correct? Bend, Yeah, that's about the 467 00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 1: size of it. The allegation is that it was a 468 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 1: quid pro quose situation when this source first reached out 469 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:27,360 Speaker 1: to me, and I believe to you as well. No, 470 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 1: one of the first things I did was capture images 471 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 1: of what this source sent so I could share it 472 00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: and get us all in the loop on email. Um 473 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:39,840 Speaker 1: instead of me just like telling you like, that's the 474 00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:42,920 Speaker 1: thing with this stuff, we can't really verify it. That's 475 00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:45,280 Speaker 1: an important point. You know. I may at the beginning, 476 00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 1: but I want to I want to underline that still, 477 00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: if any of this stuff is true, it is um. 478 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:55,920 Speaker 1: It's fascinating, and we're following up with this source to 479 00:32:56,320 --> 00:33:00,920 Speaker 1: see what we can learn about the proven pints of 480 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,480 Speaker 1: the stuff we found here, to see what we can 481 00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 1: learn about the uh what they see as the latest 482 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:12,719 Speaker 1: developments or unfolding developments. But this paints a picture of 483 00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 1: Cardinal Ugo Poletti as sort of a a known predator 484 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 1: uh and indeed a sadist. There's an interesting line where 485 00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 1: they say, uh, he was known for these weaknesses of 486 00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:31,120 Speaker 1: his as the euphemistically called them, and that uh people 487 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:36,040 Speaker 1: also knew he was therefore easy to blackmail because like 488 00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:40,560 Speaker 1: the intelligence agency hunting traps we mentioned earlier, there was 489 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 1: you know, there was a way to get leverage on 490 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:49,160 Speaker 1: this person. He was apparently pretty ruthless. Definitely in the 491 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,760 Speaker 1: political sphere. I mean, you think that politics in your 492 00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 1: country get nasty, imagine what goes on in the halls 493 00:33:55,960 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 1: of the Vatican right where people are jockeying for position 494 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:04,200 Speaker 1: in one of the most powerful institutions in the world. 495 00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 1: So Ploody played the game well. Uh. He was able 496 00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:12,319 Speaker 1: to make the right connections apply pressure, but he was 497 00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:17,280 Speaker 1: also due to his alleged activities. He was also easy 498 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:21,040 Speaker 1: to pressure himself because you want to keep these kind 499 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:25,560 Speaker 1: of um, these kind of despicable actions, uh, you want 500 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 1: to keep them secret. So there's this allegation that the 501 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:35,640 Speaker 1: Judiciary of Italy of Vatican had names of companies that 502 00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:38,879 Speaker 1: owned these phone numbers, and the administrators of these phone 503 00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 1: numbers were linked to the mafia. They were under their control. 504 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,280 Speaker 1: And the recordings that were gleaned from these phone numbers 505 00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:52,239 Speaker 1: paint the picture of an organization that is participating in 506 00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 1: human trafficking, providing women and children. Uh. To their quote 507 00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 1: high ranking friends essentially that it's a vast network of 508 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:08,480 Speaker 1: of of forced sex work. Uh, and it caters to 509 00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:12,920 Speaker 1: the elite. That's that's again that that's what these documents 510 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,840 Speaker 1: are saying. It's terrible that, you know, it's terrible that 511 00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:22,200 Speaker 1: we can't verify this stuff. It would be amazing if 512 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:24,040 Speaker 1: we could just come out and say, hey, look, this 513 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:26,839 Speaker 1: has been confirmed. There's action that could be taken now. 514 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:32,040 Speaker 1: But we have to caution anyone who's listening to not 515 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:37,359 Speaker 1: think of that as fact, because we cannot verify any 516 00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,120 Speaker 1: of that stuff as of this moment. No, we can't. 517 00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 1: And and and you know, just to clarify to our 518 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:49,360 Speaker 1: our our source UM has somewhat clarified that these transcripts 519 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:53,719 Speaker 1: that we're discussing were interviews carried out by this individual 520 00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:57,680 Speaker 1: and a team. But this person is not willing to 521 00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:02,120 Speaker 1: share the identities of any of the any of the interviewees. 522 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:06,120 Speaker 1: So even if there are accusations being made that are 523 00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:09,600 Speaker 1: very inflammatory and damning by the stuff about potentially hiring 524 00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,960 Speaker 1: sex workers and this notion of Poletti's kind of proclivities 525 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:20,160 Speaker 1: and also uh ties to underworld organizations and mob ties, UM, 526 00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:23,879 Speaker 1: we don't have the context of understanding who the speaker is. Understandably, 527 00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: this individual wants to protect their sources because they're afraid 528 00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,840 Speaker 1: that they could actually be in harm's way because of 529 00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:33,960 Speaker 1: the power of of of the Vatican. And uh again 530 00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:38,720 Speaker 1: we we were not personally as a show accusing anyone 531 00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:41,360 Speaker 1: and individually about this. But it's hard to you know, 532 00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,880 Speaker 1: you can't we can't just gloss over getting this information. UM. 533 00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:49,200 Speaker 1: It's it's definitely seems like this is a uh serious 534 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 1: amount of work has gone into this project on this 535 00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:57,759 Speaker 1: individual side. UM, but we were not able to confirm, 536 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:00,080 Speaker 1: you know, any of the stuff and and because we 537 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:01,600 Speaker 1: don't have the information to be able to do that, 538 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:03,839 Speaker 1: because we don't even know who's talking. But I think 539 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:07,799 Speaker 1: it's worth mentioning. And in the most recent exchange with 540 00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 1: with Ben and I, UM, there's a mention that Poletti, 541 00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:16,719 Speaker 1: you know, had ties to to the underworld and to 542 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 1: underworld organizations one this person mentioned called the Red Brigades 543 00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: UH and the n r A. These are terrorists sects 544 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:29,440 Speaker 1: is what this person mentions. UM. And the n R 545 00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:32,600 Speaker 1: n A R was responsible for a massacre, the Bologna 546 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:36,319 Speaker 1: massacre that killed eighty five people UM and injured more 547 00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:39,640 Speaker 1: than two hundred. Uh. But again, it's it's it's very 548 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:42,839 Speaker 1: difficult to I'm not quite sure what this person is, 549 00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:47,960 Speaker 1: what their angle is. Is it that the terrorists you 550 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 1: know angle is more accurate, that the crime boss angle 551 00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:54,080 Speaker 1: is more accurate the sex ring angle. It's very difficult 552 00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:56,239 Speaker 1: to say, and I'm trying to We're trying to find out, 553 00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,160 Speaker 1: but UM, it's it's it's hard to kind of pin 554 00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,160 Speaker 1: it down to one icular source, but it certainly does 555 00:38:02,239 --> 00:38:04,520 Speaker 1: seem like there was some foul play going on. There's 556 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:09,959 Speaker 1: also implications that Poletti himself was murdered because of you know, 557 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:12,479 Speaker 1: knowing too much and being able to kind of spill 558 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: the beans after he retired. Right Poletti officially died of 559 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:21,319 Speaker 1: a heart attack in however, you know, there's plenty of 560 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:26,360 Speaker 1: precedent for homicide by what appears to be a heart attack. 561 00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:29,520 Speaker 1: And then also, if we're going to be if we're 562 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:32,880 Speaker 1: going to completely apply critical thinking here, we have to 563 00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:37,319 Speaker 1: remember that cause of death is ultimately the decision of 564 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:40,800 Speaker 1: a medical examiner. God knows, there are conspiracy theories of 565 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:49,240 Speaker 1: plenty about wilfully fallacious medical examinations on bodies, right tail 566 00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:53,120 Speaker 1: as old as time. This this isn't over right. There 567 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:57,200 Speaker 1: was a another tomb search, an entirely different tomb back 568 00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 1: in the Orlandi family received even an anonymous tip, a 569 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:05,879 Speaker 1: brief letter that was sent to the Orlandes lawyer from 570 00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:10,279 Speaker 1: inside the Vatican, and it's pretty cryptic. It shows a 571 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: stone angel at an unmarked tomb in the Teutonic Cemetery. 572 00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:17,640 Speaker 1: This is a cemetery that is within the walls of 573 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:22,240 Speaker 1: the Vatican. The cemetery isn't even accessible to the general public. 574 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:28,200 Speaker 1: But on this, on this unmarked tomb, someone has kept 575 00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:31,479 Speaker 1: a red vote of candle lit only at this tomb 576 00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:35,360 Speaker 1: only at this specific one, and they've been replacing the 577 00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:39,640 Speaker 1: flowers on a regular basis. There's one thing engraved on 578 00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:44,040 Speaker 1: a marble scroll that the angel, the statutory holds and 579 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,760 Speaker 1: it just says the English version would be rest in peace. 580 00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:52,480 Speaker 1: This letter and this cryptic picture, of course, came at 581 00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:58,520 Speaker 1: a time when there were bombshell confirmations of long running 582 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:04,359 Speaker 1: allegations about sexual abuse within the church. UH. And this 583 00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:09,879 Speaker 1: so part of this is the the timing, I think. UH. 584 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:16,920 Speaker 1: And then this leads to another another decision by the 585 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:21,319 Speaker 1: Vatican UH to investigate grave sites. I believe this was 586 00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:25,040 Speaker 1: in July of last year. Yeah, July last year, Vatican 587 00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:27,640 Speaker 1: City decided that they were going to open up two 588 00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:31,600 Speaker 1: separate tombs and they're gonna allow these tombs to be 589 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 1: analyzed by forensic anthropologist Giovanni r. Couti or r qt um. 590 00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:42,520 Speaker 1: It's it's really interesting. So the two tombs, one of 591 00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:44,400 Speaker 1: them was the tomb of the Angel, that's the one 592 00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,200 Speaker 1: that was mentioned in that letter. And then actually part 593 00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:49,239 Speaker 1: of that letter, doesn't it say something about where the 594 00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:53,120 Speaker 1: Angel points um something to that effect within that letter 595 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:58,680 Speaker 1: referencing the Angel's hand and this one tomb, the tomb 596 00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:02,120 Speaker 1: of the Angel was meant to contain remains of two princesses, 597 00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:06,360 Speaker 1: German princesses, Princess Sophie of Oh I'm not gonna be 598 00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:10,919 Speaker 1: able to pronounce this hollin all Waldenburg bern Stein, and 599 00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:13,400 Speaker 1: the adjacent one, the one that was right next to it, 600 00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:16,440 Speaker 1: was meant to contain the remains of Duchess Charlotte Frederica 601 00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:23,440 Speaker 1: of Mecklenburg uh Schwern schwarn And So check this out. 602 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:26,719 Speaker 1: There were two princesses, German princesses. That's whos supposed to 603 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:28,239 Speaker 1: be in these two tumbs that are right next to 604 00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:30,720 Speaker 1: each other where this exhamation is going to take place. 605 00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:37,280 Speaker 1: They did the exhumations on the eleventh of July. Here's 606 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:41,360 Speaker 1: the deal. Not only did they not find the body 607 00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:46,040 Speaker 1: of EMMANUELA hidden in there, or you know, they didn't. 608 00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:48,440 Speaker 1: They don't think they found that body, they also didn't 609 00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,240 Speaker 1: find the bodies of the two princesses that were supposed 610 00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:54,719 Speaker 1: to be buried there. There's a there's a seems to 611 00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:59,080 Speaker 1: be almost a systemic issue with putting bodies where they belong. 612 00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:03,759 Speaker 1: Uh In at least those two burial sites, the Basilica 613 00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:07,760 Speaker 1: and the Teutonic Cemetery. Yeah, just a few days later, 614 00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:11,719 Speaker 1: they did find some bodies, not whole bodies, parts of 615 00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:16,840 Speaker 1: bodies of dozens of individuals. We're talking thousands of human 616 00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:22,160 Speaker 1: bones that were found underground at the Teutonic College where 617 00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:26,040 Speaker 1: this um, this burial site, where the tombs are located. 618 00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:30,600 Speaker 1: So how crazy is that. Okay, we opened these two tumbs. 619 00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:33,360 Speaker 1: Those bodies are not there. We don't find any evidence 620 00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:36,279 Speaker 1: of the body that was allegedly here, but we did 621 00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:41,000 Speaker 1: find dozens of other individuals that we have no idea 622 00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,239 Speaker 1: of the identities the what we did. What they did 623 00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:48,279 Speaker 1: find though, is that those bodies were likely prior to 624 00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,680 Speaker 1: the to the nineteen hundreds. I believe that's what they 625 00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:55,280 Speaker 1: found in this location. This is something that's happened multiple 626 00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:58,480 Speaker 1: times over the course of some of these exhumations, where 627 00:42:59,239 --> 00:43:01,520 Speaker 1: the person that's meant to be found there is not 628 00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:05,360 Speaker 1: there or is there, but with the addition of a 629 00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:09,399 Speaker 1: bunch of other bones, some of them very old. Yeah. Yeah, 630 00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:13,279 Speaker 1: And to be clear, we're pointing this out, but we're 631 00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:17,240 Speaker 1: not saying that those are necessarily related to the mystery 632 00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,239 Speaker 1: of a Manuela or Landy. We have to remember that 633 00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:24,360 Speaker 1: the Vatican and the Catholic Church is an ancient institution. 634 00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:29,600 Speaker 1: There are a lot of people who have passed away 635 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:34,439 Speaker 1: over over the millennia, and this means, you know, if 636 00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:36,880 Speaker 1: you think about it from the other side of the equation, 637 00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:43,040 Speaker 1: it would be unusual not to find strange, unidentified remains 638 00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:48,520 Speaker 1: in a cemetery this old. And at this point the 639 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:52,319 Speaker 1: mystery remains unsolved. However, NOL, I believe you have been 640 00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,680 Speaker 1: in contact with your source and there's an update. Yeah, 641 00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:59,640 Speaker 1: just you know, UM, just in going through this together, 642 00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:01,839 Speaker 1: there just a few questions that I had and UM, 643 00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,680 Speaker 1: I hadn't heard from from this individual since they sent 644 00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:10,200 Speaker 1: the initial uh scans um, and just as we're recording 645 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:13,279 Speaker 1: this hearing back and again because of the fact that 646 00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:15,680 Speaker 1: I'm not sure if this person is an investigative journalist 647 00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,360 Speaker 1: or is part of some kind of organization that's generally 648 00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:22,600 Speaker 1: trying to like be whistleblowers. Uh, it's really not clear, 649 00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:25,200 Speaker 1: and they were not comfortable telling any of that stuff. 650 00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:27,239 Speaker 1: So it's you gotta take all these documents and in 651 00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:30,680 Speaker 1: this perspective for what it's worth. Like we said earlier, 652 00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:35,120 Speaker 1: but um, we had mentioned earlier in the episode, Uh, 653 00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:39,279 Speaker 1: this crime family or street gang is what this person 654 00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:42,960 Speaker 1: is saying. They were the Magliani Gang. And I asked 655 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:48,000 Speaker 1: if this person's angle on the story was that there 656 00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:52,799 Speaker 1: was organized crime involvement and that that was part of 657 00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:58,600 Speaker 1: a sex trafficking operation that Poletti was essentially leading. And 658 00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:01,800 Speaker 1: I just wanted to clarify if was what this person believes, 659 00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:05,239 Speaker 1: and they said yes, I believe it's abundantly clear that 660 00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:08,920 Speaker 1: they had relationships with many people of high importance. Uh. 661 00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:13,520 Speaker 1: They supplied these individuals with girls, drugs, arms, cash, and more. 662 00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:16,000 Speaker 1: They knew full well that they would never be prosecuted 663 00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:17,880 Speaker 1: for their crimes as they held in their hands the 664 00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:21,720 Speaker 1: reputations of those who did the judging. Um. And then 665 00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:26,000 Speaker 1: I asked to clarify about the sex trafficking angle. Uh, 666 00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:28,960 Speaker 1: this notion of a sex trafficking ring, and I believe 667 00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:32,560 Speaker 1: referring to the Magliani gang, um, this individual says they 668 00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:35,120 Speaker 1: rose to power in the seventies mostly through drug pushing, 669 00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:39,480 Speaker 1: lotto machine sales, robberties, and occasional assassination. As for the 670 00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:44,240 Speaker 1: sex trafficking, most definitely, Palletti was allegedly using the convent 671 00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:48,200 Speaker 1: as a cover for trafficking. His representatives would bring random 672 00:45:48,239 --> 00:45:50,640 Speaker 1: girls to the convent. After a few weeks, other high 673 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:53,439 Speaker 1: officials would come to collect them. From there, they would 674 00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:56,520 Speaker 1: assumedly be brought to the Vatican or the neighborhood which 675 00:45:56,520 --> 00:46:00,399 Speaker 1: surrounded it. And this person believes that sometimes I'm after 676 00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:04,440 Speaker 1: the kidnapping or Landy may have been brought to that convent, 677 00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:08,759 Speaker 1: which was called the Handmade Sisters of the Immaculate. Well, 678 00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:11,960 Speaker 1: well that's a lot to take in, yeah, I know, 679 00:46:12,040 --> 00:46:14,200 Speaker 1: and I off Mike. We talked about whether it was 680 00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:16,640 Speaker 1: even worth mentioning this because it is a lot and 681 00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:20,760 Speaker 1: it's just impossible to verify. But at the very least, 682 00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:25,879 Speaker 1: I think we can take away from this that there's 683 00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,439 Speaker 1: something unusual about this case. And it's hard to put 684 00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:31,000 Speaker 1: it's it's hard for us to put our fingers directly 685 00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,440 Speaker 1: on it. But organizations like the Vatican that have been 686 00:46:34,440 --> 00:46:37,520 Speaker 1: around for so long and literally have a whole city 687 00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:40,680 Speaker 1: of which they control, you know, and not to mention 688 00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:45,520 Speaker 1: an entire you know, religious mass, you know, this is huge. 689 00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:48,120 Speaker 1: I mean, everyone just feel that they they are essentially 690 00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:52,160 Speaker 1: can do no wrong, um, even though we know they 691 00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:55,160 Speaker 1: can do wrong and and and have and there's been 692 00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:59,600 Speaker 1: verified cases of this with the sex abuse obviously, So 693 00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:03,440 Speaker 1: I just thought it was worth mentioning this person's perspective. 694 00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:06,640 Speaker 1: And there are documents that do seem to have an 695 00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:10,040 Speaker 1: air of legitimacy to them, but that's about as far 696 00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:12,120 Speaker 1: as we can take that. Well, what we do know 697 00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,239 Speaker 1: that there is a light at the end of this tunnel, 698 00:47:15,239 --> 00:47:19,160 Speaker 1: though dim it may be because we do know that 699 00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:22,040 Speaker 1: Emmanuel as brother that we mentioned at the top of 700 00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:25,960 Speaker 1: the show about the the person who you know, had 701 00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:29,360 Speaker 1: a bit of an argument with his sister before deciding 702 00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,600 Speaker 1: not to give her a ride, right, so she took 703 00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:35,839 Speaker 1: the bus. He is not convinced of any of the 704 00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:39,200 Speaker 1: I guess official stories that are out there. He thinks 705 00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:42,600 Speaker 1: there's something else that's going on. He has organized an 706 00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:47,120 Speaker 1: online petition. It's attracted over a hundred thousand supporters, and 707 00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:50,560 Speaker 1: the attempt here is to, you know, get the Catholic 708 00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:53,799 Speaker 1: Church to appeal to the world headquarters of that institution, 709 00:47:53,880 --> 00:47:57,640 Speaker 1: to get them to reveal everything that the institution knows 710 00:47:57,719 --> 00:48:02,479 Speaker 1: on an official level about this parents. Um just whether 711 00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:06,600 Speaker 1: or not they comply right is going to be the 712 00:48:06,600 --> 00:48:10,520 Speaker 1: the issue right as of now, at least as far 713 00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:14,600 Speaker 1: as I know, the Vatican maintains that it is doing 714 00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:19,360 Speaker 1: literally everything in its power to solve this mystery. Of course, 715 00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:24,520 Speaker 1: UH Pietro is not convinced. UH. Neither are the more 716 00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:28,200 Speaker 1: than a thousand people who signed that UH petition. And 717 00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:31,759 Speaker 1: at this point we hand it to you, fellow conspiracy realists. 718 00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:36,000 Speaker 1: What do you think? Which of these conspiracy theories? Which 719 00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:40,279 Speaker 1: of these theories really? Uh? If any scene most plausible? 720 00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:44,319 Speaker 1: Is this a case of someone who ran away? Is 721 00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:47,600 Speaker 1: this a case of someone who was kidnapped and murdered? Uh? 722 00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:52,600 Speaker 1: And if so, what makes you ascribe to a particular perspective? 723 00:48:53,080 --> 00:48:55,560 Speaker 1: Let us know. You can find us on Facebook, you 724 00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:58,320 Speaker 1: can find us on Instagram, you can find us on Twitter. 725 00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:01,360 Speaker 1: We especially love to shout out our Facebook community page. 726 00:49:01,560 --> 00:49:04,400 Speaker 1: Here's where it gets crazy. Yes, join us there to 727 00:49:04,480 --> 00:49:07,600 Speaker 1: talk about each of these episodes, this one in particular. 728 00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:10,239 Speaker 1: I guarantee you there will be a lot of us 729 00:49:10,280 --> 00:49:13,760 Speaker 1: talking about theories behind all of this and posting things. 730 00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:15,759 Speaker 1: So join us there. If you don't want to do that, 731 00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:18,359 Speaker 1: give us a phone call. Our number is one eight 732 00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:22,760 Speaker 1: three three S T D W y t K. Again, 733 00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:24,879 Speaker 1: I've been talking to a lot of you, have been 734 00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:27,040 Speaker 1: listening to a lot of messages I've still got about 735 00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:29,440 Speaker 1: fifty to go through and I'll be doing that tonight, 736 00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:32,359 Speaker 1: but they will be caught up, so we're gonna need 737 00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:35,400 Speaker 1: more calls. So please call in with your thoughts on 738 00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:37,359 Speaker 1: this and any other topic you'd like us to cover 739 00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:39,800 Speaker 1: in the future. And if none of that quite backs 740 00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:43,319 Speaker 1: your badgers, you can always contact us directly via our 741 00:49:43,400 --> 00:49:47,000 Speaker 1: good old fashioned email. We are conspiracy at iHeart radio 742 00:49:47,080 --> 00:50:07,719 Speaker 1: dot com. Yeah. Stuff they don't want you to know 743 00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:10,920 Speaker 1: is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts 744 00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:13,160 Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 745 00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:16,080 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.