1
00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:08,799
Speaker 1: Hey, want to welcome in. I'm Doug Godi. This is

2
00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:12,280
Speaker 1: all ball and Man, we got a great guest for

3
00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:16,720
Speaker 1: you on this episode, actually this two part episode. David

4
00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:20,680
Speaker 1: Klaski joins with me. He's the head coach at NYU,

5
00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:24,959
Speaker 1: and I think you'll be impressed by his journey and

6
00:00:25,079 --> 00:00:28,200
Speaker 1: also the people who have affected him along the way

7
00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:32,120
Speaker 1: and what it's like to finally be a head coach

8
00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:34,839
Speaker 1: and have your own team, which he's been able to

9
00:00:34,880 --> 00:00:38,839
Speaker 1: do at NYU, one of the prestigious not just universities,

10
00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:42,320
Speaker 1: but also programs in Division II basketball. After being an

11
00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,560
Speaker 1: assistant most recently at Colgate University and then of course

12
00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,919
Speaker 1: he spent time in the private sector. All those pen

13
00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:54,160
Speaker 1: guys with their award and degrees and whatnot. A couple

14
00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,160
Speaker 1: of quick things though, in regards to basketball, since we

15
00:00:57,240 --> 00:01:00,080
Speaker 1: are in the offseason and many of these teams are

16
00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:04,080
Speaker 1: getting ready to take their overseas trips, you also had

17
00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:07,039
Speaker 1: the Bronnie James incident. Let's start with Bronnie. You know,

18
00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:10,560
Speaker 1: as of the time of this recording, nobody knows, you know,

19
00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:14,720
Speaker 1: we've seen Bronnie playing the piano. His dad took him

20
00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:19,160
Speaker 1: to dinner. Thankfully, he's not hospitalized. Looks all good, but

21
00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:22,200
Speaker 1: you know, those of us, especially in Los Angeles, you

22
00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:26,080
Speaker 1: grew up here, you remember, and Gathers right, and Gathers

23
00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:28,520
Speaker 1: went from me passed out when they played U see

24
00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:33,800
Speaker 1: Santa Barbara, and then he missed some games, then got medication,

25
00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:37,720
Speaker 1: then was a great player, and then of course tragically died.

26
00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:40,679
Speaker 1: Now I'm not like, and if anybody takes us like

27
00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:43,039
Speaker 1: I'm painting that as a picture, I have no idea,

28
00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:46,240
Speaker 1: nor is it really my business what Bronnie james medical

29
00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,400
Speaker 1: condition actually is that led to his heart stopping and

30
00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:52,320
Speaker 1: having to be having a cardiac arrest. I can only

31
00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:55,400
Speaker 1: tell you though that while USC had a player last

32
00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:58,240
Speaker 1: year that came back and played, Bronni is different because

33
00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:00,480
Speaker 1: one we don't know the medical can do if it's

34
00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:04,600
Speaker 1: the same or different too. I mean, like, I love basketball.

35
00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:07,720
Speaker 1: I'm sure he loves basketball, but can we be honest

36
00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,359
Speaker 1: he does not need to play basketball to have an

37
00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:13,839
Speaker 1: incredible life, right. And also we're like, do you think

38
00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:17,840
Speaker 1: he's going to get insured? Has anybody asked themselves that, like, oh, yeah, yeah,

39
00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:20,640
Speaker 1: you can. Like getting cleared is a really hard hurdle,

40
00:02:21,200 --> 00:02:23,960
Speaker 1: you know, and hopefully it is a very minor some

41
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,800
Speaker 1: sort of medical condition they feel like they can manage

42
00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:31,079
Speaker 1: with medication. But I mean, look, it's hard enough to

43
00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:34,480
Speaker 1: get cleared when you're, like most of us, you don't

44
00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:37,280
Speaker 1: come from much anything. When your dad's a billionaire and

45
00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,720
Speaker 1: the most famous basketball player playing in the world, it

46
00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,280
Speaker 1: seems like it's going to be hard to get him cleared.

47
00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:45,400
Speaker 1: And then you know, you get people saying, well, you know,

48
00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,240
Speaker 1: you can get a defibrillator, and yes, there have been

49
00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,400
Speaker 1: players come back and play with a defibrillator, but all

50
00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,200
Speaker 1: of these steps make it much much more difficult for

51
00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:55,920
Speaker 1: it comeback. Let's just I mean, all you can do

52
00:02:56,000 --> 00:02:58,560
Speaker 1: is go like, man, I'm so happy he's okay, and

53
00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:02,280
Speaker 1: wait to see. But I do think that while coming

54
00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:05,400
Speaker 1: back and playing is a possibility, I think there's an

55
00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:10,280
Speaker 1: equal or greater possibility he never plays basketball again. And honestly,

56
00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:14,360
Speaker 1: like people will will tell you, I've been a harsh

57
00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:17,560
Speaker 1: critic of Ronnie James, I haven't. It's not about Bronnie.

58
00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 1: It's about the way in which he's been rated or reviewed.

59
00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:26,440
Speaker 1: You know, his yelp is not really accurate for how

60
00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,720
Speaker 1: he has played or how he's actually evaluated by people

61
00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:34,200
Speaker 1: who evaluate it feels like it's a product of a one.

62
00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:36,600
Speaker 1: You see a little bit of Lebron and I'm in two.

63
00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:39,600
Speaker 1: There are people that want to curry favor with with Lebron.

64
00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:42,920
Speaker 1: So the critique is not of Bronnie. I mean you

65
00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:45,360
Speaker 1: obviously a critique is game like you do anybody, but

66
00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:48,440
Speaker 1: it's more a critique of again, how people talk about

67
00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,920
Speaker 1: all of those things. As far as conference realignment, Like,

68
00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:55,840
Speaker 1: we're on the brink here. Obviously, the Big Twelve feeling

69
00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:59,080
Speaker 1: like it's going to expand, and if it expands to

70
00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:03,680
Speaker 1: have Arizona in the Big twelve, man, I mean you

71
00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:08,400
Speaker 1: want to talk about a murderer's row Arizona, Kansas, Houston.

72
00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:13,560
Speaker 1: I think Cincinnati is going to be very very good.

73
00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:17,119
Speaker 1: There's the outside possibility of a Yukon joining the league. Again,

74
00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:19,880
Speaker 1: let's leave that as an outside possibility. I think that's

75
00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,640
Speaker 1: a bit of a stretch because the stronger likelihood is

76
00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:26,880
Speaker 1: that if the Big Twelve adds more teams, they don't

77
00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:29,239
Speaker 1: go east, they go west, And if they leave spots open,

78
00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:32,200
Speaker 1: they're not leaving them open for Yukon. It would be

79
00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:35,360
Speaker 1: leaving them open for the possibility of like an acc

80
00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:38,960
Speaker 1: implosion and the ACC implosion takes place, you know, they'll

81
00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:43,160
Speaker 1: go after Virginia Tech to partner with West Virginia. They'll

82
00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:47,440
Speaker 1: go after Florida State, you know, to marry them with

83
00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:51,239
Speaker 1: Central Florida. I think there's some just some big dogs

84
00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:52,880
Speaker 1: there in the ACC that you got to take a

85
00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:55,520
Speaker 1: swing at before you go back and settle at Yukon.

86
00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,640
Speaker 1: And I think Yukon fans know, I love the program,

87
00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:02,080
Speaker 1: the fact that you know, they put a ton of

88
00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:05,000
Speaker 1: money into baseball. Obviously, basketball is coming off a national championship.

89
00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:08,240
Speaker 1: Women's basketball should be back with pageback playing for the

90
00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:11,880
Speaker 1: women's team. But just football is not close to being

91
00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:15,240
Speaker 1: at that level, and there's the feeling from people in

92
00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:18,599
Speaker 1: the league that it'll never be at that level, and

93
00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:22,560
Speaker 1: it you know, it's at like it's an anchor. You know,

94
00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:25,920
Speaker 1: you don't want an anchor bringing down the football league.

95
00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:29,360
Speaker 1: My thought would be, hey, rising tide lifts all ships,

96
00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:32,560
Speaker 1: and yeah, maybe that's down in terms of football, but

97
00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:37,760
Speaker 1: you know, you have plenty of other opportunities to grow football.

98
00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:41,240
Speaker 1: Like I think Arizona State is a would be a

99
00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:43,840
Speaker 1: huge win. Arizona State, to me, reminds me kind of

100
00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:45,760
Speaker 1: a big ten school. You know, it's in a major

101
00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:49,280
Speaker 1: city and a growing city. Unlike some of those Midwest cities.

102
00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:52,080
Speaker 1: This is one of the growing metropolis in the United States.

103
00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:54,760
Speaker 1: And they you know, they have over one hundred thousand

104
00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:57,279
Speaker 1: students on any given year. And the other part to

105
00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:01,160
Speaker 1: the Arizona schools, which should not be under sold, should

106
00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:03,120
Speaker 1: not be underrated. I think Florida schools have a little

107
00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,640
Speaker 1: bit of this, but really Arizona schools is every one

108
00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:08,360
Speaker 1: of the athletic directors I've talked to said, you know,

109
00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:12,200
Speaker 1: we want to be in Arizona, not just because they're

110
00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:14,640
Speaker 1: starting to get players in Arizona and it start to

111
00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:18,200
Speaker 1: become part of the recruiting conversation. And you know, Phoenix

112
00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:21,200
Speaker 1: is a growing market. It also leaks into southern California.

113
00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:23,039
Speaker 1: But we have a lums in Arizona. We have a

114
00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:27,320
Speaker 1: lums in Phoenix, Scottsdale, Tempe, you know who retired. They're

115
00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:30,640
Speaker 1: powerful lums that retired want to play golf and then

116
00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:32,000
Speaker 1: want to donate to their school and now they can

117
00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:34,760
Speaker 1: see their school play on a yearly basis right there

118
00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:38,680
Speaker 1: in town. So I think Yukon's a bit of a stretch.

119
00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:41,880
Speaker 1: I think Arizona has been the most open about wanting

120
00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:43,240
Speaker 1: to reach out to be in the league. But I

121
00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,960
Speaker 1: do think that partnering with Arizona would probably be the

122
00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:49,440
Speaker 1: smartest thing and how that affects college basketball. You know,

123
00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:53,479
Speaker 1: if you've been paying attention, the state of Arizona, you

124
00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:56,159
Speaker 1: know is really really expanding in terms of the number

125
00:06:56,160 --> 00:07:01,279
Speaker 1: of prep schools and all of the reach of recruiting

126
00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:05,000
Speaker 1: is starting to reach there. You know, over time, Elite

127
00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:07,520
Speaker 1: is moving and they're going to have a league of

128
00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:10,720
Speaker 1: prep schools right there in Phoenix in the valley as well.

129
00:07:10,800 --> 00:07:13,480
Speaker 1: So I think it's a recruiting win. I think it's

130
00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:16,520
Speaker 1: a it's an expansion win. And obviously, you know, once

131
00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:21,040
Speaker 1: you can get Colorado, that begins the you know Power

132
00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:23,960
Speaker 1: five moving to Power five, that changed the dynamic. The

133
00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:27,320
Speaker 1: one thing I don't like for Colorado is that without

134
00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:31,680
Speaker 1: a Southern California school, that's going to change their recruiting.

135
00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:36,080
Speaker 1: And maybe those thoughts are from the past, right, I mean,

136
00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:40,160
Speaker 1: like players now will go to places they would never

137
00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:43,720
Speaker 1: go to before because it's about nil, not where you

138
00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:45,280
Speaker 1: want to play and where you want to stay. But

139
00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:48,080
Speaker 1: you know, Spencer Dinwid, he's an LA guy. You know,

140
00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:51,280
Speaker 1: and Colorado with their once they got in the pack twelve.

141
00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:53,160
Speaker 1: The idea is, we want to we want to get

142
00:07:53,200 --> 00:07:57,560
Speaker 1: California kids, California football kids, California basketball kids. Bring them

143
00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:01,200
Speaker 1: out to Boulder, you know, Boulders a great spot, very chill.

144
00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,680
Speaker 1: You know. That changed the dynamic, and I it'll be

145
00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:08,320
Speaker 1: interesting to see if the Big Ten can benefit recruiting

146
00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:12,680
Speaker 1: wise from getting into southern California, especially considering how all

147
00:08:12,720 --> 00:08:15,080
Speaker 1: in on sports the Big Ten is in comparison to

148
00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:18,920
Speaker 1: what's remaining in the Pac Ten. So all right, let's

149
00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:21,880
Speaker 1: we got some NBA stuff to get to. We'll get

150
00:08:21,880 --> 00:08:23,840
Speaker 1: to that in the next pod. I got a chance

151
00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:26,240
Speaker 1: to say down with Dave Klasky. He's the head coach

152
00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:35,080
Speaker 1: of NYU. Here's his journey Your first memories of basketball aware.

153
00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:41,000
Speaker 2: Oh wow, we're going way back. Yeah, I think I

154
00:08:41,080 --> 00:08:44,360
Speaker 2: was so My brother was in second grade, which means

155
00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,800
Speaker 2: I was about four or five, and I remember my

156
00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,920
Speaker 2: dad throwing me in his first and second grade rec

157
00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:56,679
Speaker 2: basketball game, being three years younger and just playing as

158
00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:59,280
Speaker 2: hard as I could, Like, I remember the little gym,

159
00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:03,400
Speaker 2: village school, the eight foot rims. But uh, that's probably

160
00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:08,320
Speaker 2: my first memory of playing the game that I can

161
00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:11,040
Speaker 2: like picture, So going back.

162
00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:13,679
Speaker 1: In Greenwich Village, that is it Greenwich Village?

163
00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:17,280
Speaker 2: No, No village school in Homedewn, New Jersey, which is

164
00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:20,800
Speaker 2: where I grew up. So random school, random elementary school

165
00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,280
Speaker 2: in New Jersey that no one except if you're from

166
00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:25,680
Speaker 2: home Dell would know about. But that's uh, that's what

167
00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:28,400
Speaker 2: came in my mind when you threw that question out there.

168
00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,400
Speaker 1: When did you decide like basketball was your jam? And

169
00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:36,040
Speaker 1: I say that because you know, specialization starts at a

170
00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:39,920
Speaker 1: younger age. Now when was it for you? They like,

171
00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:41,960
Speaker 1: this is what I like doing?

172
00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:47,040
Speaker 2: Probably not until I was twelve or thirteen. I grew

173
00:09:47,120 --> 00:09:50,840
Speaker 2: up playing every sport, but uh, I started to narrow down,

174
00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,280
Speaker 2: Like I gave up baseball in second or third grade.

175
00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:55,640
Speaker 2: I played soccer till eighth grade, but I was I

176
00:09:55,679 --> 00:09:58,600
Speaker 2: was pretty good at tennis, so I kind of thought

177
00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:03,640
Speaker 2: that would be my But the more life went on,

178
00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,839
Speaker 2: I just really enjoyed basketball more. So I just took

179
00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:11,920
Speaker 2: a turn and just started playing basketbamore. I never thought

180
00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:14,319
Speaker 2: I'd played Division one basketball until I was probably a

181
00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:16,880
Speaker 2: junior in high school and started to get recruited. But

182
00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:19,880
Speaker 2: I knew tennis, I could be good. I just didn't

183
00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:23,559
Speaker 2: enjoy the practice. I didn't enjoy private lessons of just

184
00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:26,000
Speaker 2: hitting one hundred four hands down the line, hundred four

185
00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:30,000
Speaker 2: hands cross court, you know, back so but basketball, even practice,

186
00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:32,840
Speaker 2: I just love competing and just the movements of basketball.

187
00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:36,880
Speaker 2: So I kind of navigate. Ended up going that way,

188
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,079
Speaker 2: And I would say probably twelve or thirteen was when

189
00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:43,280
Speaker 2: I really locked in on basketball. I don't want to

190
00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:45,199
Speaker 2: say basketball only because I still played tennis all through

191
00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:48,760
Speaker 2: high school, but that was when it got serious. I

192
00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:53,360
Speaker 2: would say, who's your high school coach, Tom Stead?

193
00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:56,000
Speaker 1: What was he like?

194
00:10:56,640 --> 00:10:59,240
Speaker 2: He's great. I'm still very close to him today. Him

195
00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:02,800
Speaker 2: and the assistant, Tom Pushy. Both of those guys their

196
00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:07,240
Speaker 2: legends in their own right. Just to both those guys,

197
00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:12,160
Speaker 2: they fostered a program of being demanding. But also we

198
00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:14,560
Speaker 2: had a great time, like great culture. We were very

199
00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:17,520
Speaker 2: successful in high school. We won two state championships at

200
00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:20,280
Speaker 2: Little Home Deel High School, which has never been done.

201
00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:23,400
Speaker 2: And those guys are a big part. We're still close today.

202
00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:25,480
Speaker 2: I'm sure I'll now make them watch this and they'll

203
00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:27,760
Speaker 2: get a kick out of seeing their their names mentioned.

204
00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:32,920
Speaker 2: But both were great influences on me, both on and

205
00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:37,040
Speaker 2: off the court. So still really grateful that I got

206
00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:38,319
Speaker 2: a chance to play for them.

207
00:11:38,679 --> 00:11:41,319
Speaker 1: What was his style like as a coach, how'd you

208
00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:42,959
Speaker 1: guys play?

209
00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:46,640
Speaker 2: We played pretty free before you were playing free. So

210
00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:50,360
Speaker 2: we had like a motion based offense where there's a

211
00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:56,000
Speaker 2: lot of passing, cutting and screening, basically positionless basketball. And

212
00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,640
Speaker 2: you know, I graduated high school and let's say ninety nine,

213
00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:01,640
Speaker 2: so this was way before it's time. We were firing threes,

214
00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,480
Speaker 2: way before everybody knew you could shoot threes, and they

215
00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:08,600
Speaker 2: were more valuable. So we had, you know, again, small

216
00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:11,920
Speaker 2: small town in Jersey, I was the only Division one player,

217
00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,680
Speaker 2: and then we had probably four really good Division three

218
00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:19,079
Speaker 2: players alongside of me that were just tough as nails.

219
00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:22,480
Speaker 2: We were undersized and just got a lot out of

220
00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:24,640
Speaker 2: what we were, but it was it was a fun time.

221
00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:29,360
Speaker 2: He was a demanding coach, but also he was he

222
00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:33,840
Speaker 2: was We were able to be ourselves and express ourselves

223
00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:35,600
Speaker 2: and have a good time while we were winning.

224
00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:39,120
Speaker 1: What was your recruiting process, Like, all.

225
00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:41,120
Speaker 2: Right, we're going way back here. I like it. So

226
00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:44,200
Speaker 2: I was. I played on a really good AU team

227
00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:47,360
Speaker 2: called the Central Jersey Hawks, all throughout my life, and

228
00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:51,000
Speaker 2: by the time we were sophomores in high school, it

229
00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:53,360
Speaker 2: started to become clear we were we were pretty good.

230
00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:57,120
Speaker 2: We made the national Championship, which back then there was

231
00:12:57,160 --> 00:12:59,840
Speaker 2: the Nationals. I'm sure you remember this. Uh, there wasn't

232
00:12:59,880 --> 00:13:02,520
Speaker 2: a hundred different tournaments. It was won the States. He

233
00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:04,760
Speaker 2: went to Nationals and that was where everybody, all the

234
00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:07,400
Speaker 2: best teams were. So we made the finals my sophomore

235
00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:09,800
Speaker 2: in junior season, we had guys and I'm going to

236
00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:12,440
Speaker 2: throw some names up, but I'm sure not many people

237
00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:15,040
Speaker 2: can remember these guys, But like Taj Holden played at

238
00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:19,360
Speaker 2: Maryland showan Exani played at Rutgers, Andrew Toole, who people

239
00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:22,440
Speaker 2: should still be familiar with in the basketball world. Head

240
00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:25,240
Speaker 2: coach of Robert Morris played at Elon and then transferred

241
00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,959
Speaker 2: to penm with me. A guy named Chris Adams played

242
00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:32,079
Speaker 2: at Elon, and then we had some stints of Dante

243
00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:35,560
Speaker 2: Jones playing with us a year and Rick Appadaca from

244
00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:38,320
Speaker 2: Hofstra and he played professionally in Puerto Rico for a

245
00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:40,360
Speaker 2: long time, so we knew we had a good team.

246
00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:43,640
Speaker 2: And I think for me, probably at the end of

247
00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:47,120
Speaker 2: my sophomore year, I started getting some calls, a lot

248
00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:50,079
Speaker 2: of ivs, some lower level division ones, it's some high

249
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:54,120
Speaker 2: level division threes. And again I didn't think I was

250
00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:56,920
Speaker 2: good enough. I thought it was too small, you know,

251
00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:00,839
Speaker 2: to this, to that. But as the seasons went on

252
00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:03,760
Speaker 2: and I started getting real recruitment from the Penn's and

253
00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,480
Speaker 2: the Harvard's and the Yales, I realized that I may

254
00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:11,320
Speaker 2: be able to play Division one basketball. So the Penn coaches,

255
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:13,800
Speaker 2: in particular Frand Dumpy and Steve Donna Whue is now

256
00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:17,040
Speaker 2: the head coach of Penn, did a really good job

257
00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:19,960
Speaker 2: of just being everywhere, like coach Donahue and coach Don

258
00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,920
Speaker 2: for had a ton of my games. I really liked

259
00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,960
Speaker 2: the fact that Penn had a tremendous business school. I

260
00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:27,280
Speaker 2: had a feeling I was going to get into some

261
00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:31,120
Speaker 2: type of finance or business after I was done playing.

262
00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:33,240
Speaker 2: So they just did a really good job. I think

263
00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:39,200
Speaker 2: I ended up committing before my senior year, so I

264
00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:43,000
Speaker 2: was done by probably September or August of September of

265
00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:46,320
Speaker 2: going into my senior year locked and loaded for Penn.

266
00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:51,040
Speaker 1: How go with your grades? I mean, because pretty good,

267
00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:52,280
Speaker 1: pretty good? I was.

268
00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:56,680
Speaker 2: I was probably in on own at that time. Now

269
00:14:56,960 --> 00:15:00,360
Speaker 2: now now not so much. Which has harder to is

270
00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:02,880
Speaker 2: to get into these academic schools. But I was, I

271
00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:08,160
Speaker 2: was like almost all a's taking aps. I don't remember.

272
00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:10,240
Speaker 2: I was somewhere around four point I was. I got

273
00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,440
Speaker 2: a lot of a's and some d's in there. And

274
00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:15,320
Speaker 2: then I'm a math guy, so I did really well

275
00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:16,800
Speaker 2: in the in the math part of the s A

276
00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:20,240
Speaker 2: T and and uh, I was able to find my

277
00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:20,840
Speaker 2: way into.

278
00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:24,520
Speaker 3: Pen Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.

279
00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:28,320
Speaker 3: Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio dot com

280
00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:31,720
Speaker 3: and within the iHeartRadio app. Search f s R to

281
00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:32,480
Speaker 3: listen live.

282
00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:38,160
Speaker 1: Where's that? Where does the academic did you? Was it

283
00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:42,720
Speaker 1: a strong push from home, like because it's interesting, you know,

284
00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:46,600
Speaker 1: raising kids now as opposed to raising kids then. And

285
00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:51,880
Speaker 1: you know, I, uh, I come from a Jewish family

286
00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:56,280
Speaker 1: that we There wasn't really a discussion over hey this

287
00:15:56,360 --> 00:16:00,200
Speaker 1: teacher is not nice or I don't understand. This was

288
00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,760
Speaker 1: the get good grades? What if I don't? There is

289
00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:09,080
Speaker 1: no don't you like you get good grades? Right? And uh,

290
00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:12,640
Speaker 1: my kid's mom she she was a self starter, so

291
00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:14,640
Speaker 1: she didn't she was the first one to go to

292
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:18,520
Speaker 1: college in her family. So she's not as much of

293
00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:23,080
Speaker 1: a pusher. Right for you, you achieve incredible things academically.

294
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:24,040
Speaker 1: Where's that come from?

295
00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:30,240
Speaker 2: My parents? I think probably similar households. It was academics

296
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:33,200
Speaker 2: come first, and if you have to miss practice, that's

297
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:35,120
Speaker 2: I mean, that was always a threat. I never actually

298
00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:37,920
Speaker 2: missed practice, but plenty of times my dad and my

299
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:39,520
Speaker 2: mom would be like, yeah, if you don't do your

300
00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:41,800
Speaker 2: work or you don't like do your best, you're you're

301
00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:43,880
Speaker 2: not going to practice, Like that's all that matters. You're

302
00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:46,840
Speaker 2: not going to be professional. I mean, growing up, I

303
00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:48,600
Speaker 2: didn't think I would even play at the level I did,

304
00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:51,640
Speaker 2: like I said, So it was it was really just

305
00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:55,000
Speaker 2: how our house was orchestrated.

306
00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:55,880
Speaker 1: You know.

307
00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:58,080
Speaker 2: My older brother went to Penn, I went to Penn,

308
00:16:58,080 --> 00:16:59,800
Speaker 2: and my younger sister went to Columbia. So it was,

309
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:04,239
Speaker 2: you know, clearly part of what we were taught and

310
00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:06,040
Speaker 2: thought about growing up, but it wasn't in a way.

311
00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,800
Speaker 2: You know, I've been coaching now at high academic schools

312
00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:12,719
Speaker 2: for a little over fifteen years, and you come across

313
00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:14,800
Speaker 2: all different types of families, right, You come across the

314
00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:17,720
Speaker 2: kids that are just completely pushed by their parents, and

315
00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:22,000
Speaker 2: they get free and it's like downhill, right because they

316
00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:26,119
Speaker 2: were never self motivated. But I really think about this

317
00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:30,240
Speaker 2: and talk about this a lot with people. Somehow my parents,

318
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,760
Speaker 2: and maybe it was my parents and my older brother,

319
00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,399
Speaker 2: they were able to do it in a way that

320
00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:38,800
Speaker 2: we were self motivated. Like I wasn't doing it for them,

321
00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:40,600
Speaker 2: I was doing it for me. I just wanted to

322
00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:43,680
Speaker 2: be better than everybody at school. That was kind of

323
00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:45,439
Speaker 2: the reality. I was very competitive. I wanted to be

324
00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:47,040
Speaker 2: whatever I did, I wanted to be better than people,

325
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,240
Speaker 2: and that included getting to higher math score. That getting

326
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,960
Speaker 2: a higher math score. So it is a tricky thing.

327
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:56,200
Speaker 2: I don't know as a parent now, same thing I'm

328
00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,720
Speaker 2: going through it, Like, all right, how can we motivate

329
00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:00,520
Speaker 2: them to want them to be the best they can

330
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,800
Speaker 2: be without shoving it down their throats where you know,

331
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:06,440
Speaker 2: as soon as they're old enough, it's gonna they're gonna

332
00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,119
Speaker 2: almost rebel and do the opposite. So it's the daily fight.

333
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:12,880
Speaker 2: I got little kids now, so I'm in it. But

334
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:15,600
Speaker 2: I think about it all the time. My mom and

335
00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:19,120
Speaker 2: dad were able to foster that within us, and can

336
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:21,520
Speaker 2: we do that to them in this generation which is

337
00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:22,679
Speaker 2: completely different.

338
00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:25,760
Speaker 1: It is a very different generation. So you show the

339
00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:31,200
Speaker 1: Penn how many because and people know like IVY leagues

340
00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:35,080
Speaker 1: have jbs, right there was you know, I mean it's

341
00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:38,000
Speaker 1: more how many kids they get in than some sort

342
00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,080
Speaker 1: of number. So how many were in your recruiting class?

343
00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:45,800
Speaker 2: With six in our recruiting class, big class, really good class.

344
00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:50,800
Speaker 2: So the two most high profile guys guy named Ugano

345
00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:55,520
Speaker 2: and que and Coco Archibong, We're just not IVY League

346
00:18:55,520 --> 00:18:57,800
Speaker 2: players at the time they were they were awesome. And

347
00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:01,639
Speaker 2: then myself and a guy named Andrew Coates, and another

348
00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:04,119
Speaker 2: Dwayne King, then Harold Bailey, so the four of us

349
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,720
Speaker 2: and even Dwayne King. Dwayne King was as a recruit

350
00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,760
Speaker 2: not really an I BELIEVEUE recruit at the time. He

351
00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:11,600
Speaker 2: was a little hi, more high profile. But we had

352
00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:14,760
Speaker 2: six big class. But like you said, Penn had a

353
00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:17,880
Speaker 2: full varsity team and a full JV team. But those

354
00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:21,679
Speaker 2: six guys were recruited for varsity only, and then there

355
00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:24,920
Speaker 2: might have been one or two that ended up playing JV.

356
00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:27,280
Speaker 2: I don't even remember who else was in our class

357
00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:29,480
Speaker 2: that played JV. I don't know if there were any,

358
00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:31,760
Speaker 2: but it's that's common at ivutes.

359
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,680
Speaker 1: So for practice is JB at practice and they're like.

360
00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:38,800
Speaker 2: No, it was. It's a separate entity. Now what pended

361
00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:41,000
Speaker 2: back in the day is of the JV guys. They

362
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:43,199
Speaker 2: would get called up for one home game so they

363
00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:43,760
Speaker 2: could play.

364
00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:44,440
Speaker 3: Uh.

365
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:46,000
Speaker 2: Now, they didn't always get in, but if we were

366
00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:48,520
Speaker 2: up a lot, they'd get in, and it was one

367
00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:51,560
Speaker 2: of the cooler moments for them to get in. The

368
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 2: crowd would go nuts, you know, they would they would

369
00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:57,240
Speaker 2: dress for one game and they would just would be

370
00:19:57,359 --> 00:19:59,280
Speaker 2: rooting for blowouts so they could get in.

371
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:02,320
Speaker 1: Awesome. What do you remember about your friend? Like, I

372
00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:06,240
Speaker 1: remember distinctly, I remember pick a ball leading up to

373
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:10,120
Speaker 1: like when I was at Notre Dame, I remember conditioning.

374
00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:15,159
Speaker 1: I remember my first practice as well. But what's it

375
00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,240
Speaker 1: like like a let's say a fall at Penn. You

376
00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:21,840
Speaker 1: guys are very good at the time, right, dumf has

377
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:26,280
Speaker 1: it rolling? What is like okay? At a high major school?

378
00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:29,560
Speaker 1: I mean I remember Oklahoma State and Notre Dame. Like

379
00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:33,119
Speaker 1: Oklham State, for example, we'd run at six in the morning,

380
00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:36,040
Speaker 1: then we'd all go have most of us have breakfast together,

381
00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:39,840
Speaker 1: go to class whatever in the afternoon. Lift, you play

382
00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:43,640
Speaker 1: right and you do that and then you have individual

383
00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:46,880
Speaker 1: workouts on other days, like it's a full week of stuff.

384
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:51,040
Speaker 1: And then you know, because you only have we only

385
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:53,800
Speaker 1: have one team and you have like twelve guys and

386
00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:56,320
Speaker 1: you have a couple of walk ons, the pickup ball

387
00:20:56,520 --> 00:21:00,919
Speaker 1: devolves after like like first week back, everybody's super excited,

388
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:03,880
Speaker 1: new guys kind of you know, trying to everybody's trying

389
00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:06,159
Speaker 1: to establish who they are, what they improved on, or

390
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:08,520
Speaker 1: who the new guys are whatever. But then like you

391
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:10,440
Speaker 1: can only play against the same guys so many times

392
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:12,840
Speaker 1: before it just gets fun day. What's it like a penn.

393
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:18,080
Speaker 2: I don't remember exactly that detail. I'm very impressed. I

394
00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:21,080
Speaker 2: do remember some of the memories and thoughts that I

395
00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:25,040
Speaker 2: had freshman year, and you know, I'll start with just

396
00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:27,280
Speaker 2: you come, like you said, you come as a freshman

397
00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,960
Speaker 2: and there wasn't all the social media, so you didn't

398
00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:34,320
Speaker 2: really know that much about everybody. So I remember like

399
00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:36,480
Speaker 2: playing pick up those were like the first memories and

400
00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:40,760
Speaker 2: just being like I am getting my ask. These guys

401
00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 2: are stronger, they're tougher, My moves aren't working, and I

402
00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 2: was just like, man, this is hard. And then I

403
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:51,879
Speaker 2: do remember our first like our four man workouts. You

404
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,480
Speaker 2: couldn't do full team then, but the four man workouts

405
00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:58,040
Speaker 2: being like a little bit of a little bit of

406
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:00,920
Speaker 2: skill work. But then Dump, if you've ever played for Dump,

407
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:03,360
Speaker 2: you know he just wanted he just like that just compete,

408
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,760
Speaker 2: like just compete, so we would compete. So I got

409
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:09,159
Speaker 2: through all those and again was ready for the season

410
00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:12,200
Speaker 2: to start. And then I remember my first practice and

411
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:14,960
Speaker 2: like he had been involved in the four man workouts,

412
00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:17,520
Speaker 2: but he basically just watched and the assistants ran the show.

413
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:22,440
Speaker 2: And then day one I remember he just like it's

414
00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:26,399
Speaker 2: Dump like and he's he's he's a politician. He's the

415
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:29,120
Speaker 2: greatest guy ever off the court and on the court.

416
00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:32,680
Speaker 2: But I didn't know how intense it was gonna be

417
00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,520
Speaker 2: my first practice because he recruits you and he's mild

418
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,760
Speaker 2: mannered and he speaks softly and slowly with a lot

419
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:41,640
Speaker 2: of substance. And then I get in the first practice

420
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 2: and he's screaming at guys. I'm like, oh my god,

421
00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:46,680
Speaker 2: this is this is what college basketball is. This is

422
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:49,600
Speaker 2: this is crazy, Like who is this guy yelling at me?

423
00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:52,720
Speaker 2: In day one? And I just remember the game moving

424
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:57,520
Speaker 2: so fast. I had six turnovers in practice, which like

425
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,680
Speaker 2: for my game. I ended up leading this the league

426
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:02,600
Speaker 2: and it's just a turnover that. I wasn't a turnover guy.

427
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 2: But I just remember like it was way too hard

428
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 2: for me and Coach Donna you pulled me aside after

429
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:10,240
Speaker 2: the Privy like that's not who you are, Like just

430
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:13,360
Speaker 2: slow down. And now as a coach, I always give

431
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:15,840
Speaker 2: that advice. I'm like, look, your first day or your

432
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 2: first week, it's gonna seem like the game is moving

433
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:21,880
Speaker 2: so fast. It's okay because the game will slow down

434
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,080
Speaker 2: even after one week, but especially as you keep playing

435
00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:27,520
Speaker 2: in this system and against the same guys. But I

436
00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 2: just remember being like, oh my god, this is this

437
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:32,960
Speaker 2: is really hard. What am I getting myself into.

438
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:38,320
Speaker 1: It's interesting because it was probably about three weeks in

439
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 1: my first year Notre Dame and another PENG guy, Frean

440
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:46,119
Speaker 1: McCaffrey that's a recruited me to Notre Dames, and I

441
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,080
Speaker 1: was just getting my ass kicked. Now. Part of it

442
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:53,160
Speaker 1: was one we didn't really play a style that was conducive,

443
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 1: and our five on five stuff in practice with John

444
00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 1: McCleod was like, put twenty six seconds in the clock

445
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:00,919
Speaker 1: and we'll play in half court basketball, because you know,

446
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 1: back then it was a what a thirty five second child, right,

447
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 1: And and I mean we're running like a motion offense.

448
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:13,480
Speaker 1: And you know my chool program same thing. I was

449
00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:16,520
Speaker 1: coached by Andy Ground. He went onto windnes State championships

450
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 1: in junior college as well. He's a very good coach.

451
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:21,720
Speaker 1: And so you think my dad was a college coach.

452
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:22,360
Speaker 2: You think you.

453
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:25,200
Speaker 1: Practice at a level of intensity and then you have

454
00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:28,919
Speaker 1: no idea. Plus the bodies are so much bigger, you know,

455
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 1: you can't really avoid being screened nearly as well. And again,

456
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 1: like you said, this is the old motion offense days,

457
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 1: and you're just you think you're guardinger guy. Then boom

458
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,760
Speaker 1: boom boom. And the guy that I was brought into

459
00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:41,560
Speaker 1: like you're going to beat him out, don't worry about it.

460
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 1: He is kicking add more whites to the name, and

461
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:47,960
Speaker 1: he is kicking my like on a daily basis. And

462
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 1: at Notre Dame we had the Blue was the first team,

463
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,119
Speaker 1: that Gold was the second team. And I used to

464
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 1: come in every day and my jersey was gold enough.

465
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 1: I would I made up a song on the gold again.

466
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,160
Speaker 1: Just came up to play some defense with my friends.

467
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:03,280
Speaker 1: I can't wait to get on the gold again right

468
00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:06,040
Speaker 1: like I was. I was, so I was like second team.

469
00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:08,919
Speaker 1: Finally I went into Franny and I was like, Franny,

470
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: you got to send me home. I suck. I'm just good,

471
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: Like I'm sorry. I know you guys thought I was good,

472
00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 1: but I clearly can't beat that at more White and

473
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 1: I was supposed to be and he's just kicking my ass.

474
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 1: So I remember, I remember, but but then I remember

475
00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:31,280
Speaker 1: a turning once games started. But Penn's so different. Right,

476
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:34,360
Speaker 1: as good as you guys are, you're not playing guarantee

477
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 1: games where you can thump somebody earl year. So what

478
00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 1: was as a freshman, what was your early experience like

479
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:41,399
Speaker 1: when games started?

480
00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 2: So actually this is again because I was getting my

481
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 2: butt kicked every day by the seniors and the older guys.

482
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 2: Our opening game was against Kentucky out Rup, so it

483
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,440
Speaker 2: wasn't like, uh, you know, you walk in, like you said,

484
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:01,200
Speaker 2: a guarantee game or a Division three game. We started

485
00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 2: playing against Jamal mcglore. I think Tayshaun Prince might have

486
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 2: been on that team. Saul Smith was my matchup though.

487
00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:10,639
Speaker 1: So if you thought you thought that first practice was

488
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:12,919
Speaker 1: something you walk out in the Big Blue Nation and

489
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:14,359
Speaker 1: that was when they had it rolling.

490
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 2: Oh they were rolling, they were rolling, and but we

491
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 2: were good, like we had We had a really good

492
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 2: team returning. They just won the Ivy's and we brought

493
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 2: in this like awesome freshman class, so we battled like

494
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 2: I think we might have been winning at halftime. But

495
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 2: I actually my memory is the opposite because like Mike

496
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,919
Speaker 2: Jordan at the time, he was a senior and he

497
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 2: was IVY League Player of the Year for one or

498
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 2: two years and just like a dog, like one of

499
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 2: the best defensive players will have to play against, played

500
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:45,639
Speaker 2: professionally for thirteen years. So he was guarding me every

501
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 2: day in practice. And I got to the game and

502
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 2: it was Saul Smith and like, this is easy. I

503
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,680
Speaker 2: don't know m j on me anymore. This is ah,

504
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 2: this is a cake walk. So I actually had like

505
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 2: a little bit different experience. Now, the difference was you

506
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,159
Speaker 2: get by him and Jamal mcglore is standing in the

507
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:04,399
Speaker 2: back line, you know, and you're not you're not getting

508
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,480
Speaker 2: an shots off. But but that that was a really

509
00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 2: fun experience to play at Kentucky and they ended up

510
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 2: beating us by probably ten ten points or so or

511
00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 2: I don't even remember how much. But we were in

512
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 2: the game and it was really the competitive and I

513
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,159
Speaker 2: I got in, which again I was shocked about. But

514
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:22,640
Speaker 2: I ended up having a very big role that year.

515
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 2: And you know, like you said, once games came around,

516
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:29,920
Speaker 2: then all those things that you're good at that lead

517
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 2: to winning that might not show up in practice start

518
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:34,680
Speaker 2: to show up, like taking care of the ball and

519
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 2: taking good shots and guarding and getting loose balls, like

520
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:40,919
Speaker 2: all those things, which is what I did as a

521
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:45,159
Speaker 2: fifth option on that team was extremely valuable. So I

522
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 2: found a way to get on the court early.

523
00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:49,919
Speaker 1: What was dump like in games.

524
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:55,480
Speaker 2: Dump in games, the intensity was still the same, and

525
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,359
Speaker 2: I like, he's now a little bit different of a

526
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 2: coach in this area. He's one of the small artist

527
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 2: guys will ever meet, just in terms of how he thinks.

528
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:07,359
Speaker 2: But uh, he was intense. And you know his best

529
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,879
Speaker 2: line that I remember is, you know, if you started

530
00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,320
Speaker 2: the game poorly, he'd just looked at you and be like,

531
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:14,719
Speaker 2: I wish you would have let me know that you

532
00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 2: weren't ready to go, then I would have started somebody else.

533
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 2: And you're like, I thought I was ready, And maybe

534
00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,600
Speaker 2: not in that tone. Maybe it was a little bit

535
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:27,240
Speaker 2: louder and aggressive as.

536
00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 1: Any kid, by the way, ever gone like a coach,

537
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 1: I'm not ready to start start, Jimmy. Things that don't

538
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 1: ever happen, like that that that that adm where the

539
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:44,040
Speaker 1: ball goes out of bounds and it's off the kid

540
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 1: and he turns to the raft and he's like, no,

541
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,920
Speaker 1: it was off me. Things that just don't happen, Like

542
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:51,960
Speaker 1: I know they should happen, but they just don't.

543
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 2: No, he was he was great. I mean he he

544
00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 2: was a guy that just got the most out of you.

545
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,720
Speaker 2: You played so hard or you didn't play. So that

546
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 2: was that carried over to games, and I think that

547
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 2: was what he did. He got the most out of

548
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 2: his teams and his players.

549
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: How how because like I felt like that was the

550
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:21,440
Speaker 1: magic to coach Suddon was that, you know, I mean

551
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 1: we didn't run anything super special. We had really good players.

552
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 1: I mean we had good, good players and a lot

553
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 1: of them we were we had transfers before transfers really

554
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 1: in vogue, right, But if you tried to find like

555
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 1: what's the secret sauce, it's like you just played way

556
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 1: harder than you ever thought possible, you know, And that

557
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:50,360
Speaker 1: was really it, Like hard and tough and like that's it.

558
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 1: And I do think there's like a that's that's the

559
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 1: secret sauce, especially the college game, like that that's the

560
00:29:57,920 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 1: secret sauce. Right, Yeah, you got to not turn the

561
00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:02,360
Speaker 1: back a ball over. There's a tough to sellment to that,

562
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: but there's also a skill element to it. You know,

563
00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:07,640
Speaker 1: you got to take good shots, you got to Coaches

564
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 1: got to be demanding to a point, right, and some

565
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: of that has evolved and changed, but getting you guys

566
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 1: to play just hard. And I've heard coaches say like, well,

567
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 1: you don't coach effort, Like I frankly that's bullshit, Like

568
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,200
Speaker 1: you may not coach it, but you demand it, right.

569
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:27,720
Speaker 1: And so his way, it was just an every day

570
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:32,920
Speaker 1: in practice sort of thing where one there's a little

571
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 1: bit of fear of God in him and I don't

572
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 1: know if dump had this right, where you just I

573
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:38,800
Speaker 1: don't know why, you're just scared to death of the

574
00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 1: old man. And then and then you recruit competitive kids

575
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 1: right where they're all out there, you know, we're all

576
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 1: fighting after one bone. And then there's the constant demands

577
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 1: in practice of kind of everybody of just hey, let's

578
00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 1: get after it. Let's like harder, harder, play hard, play harder,

579
00:30:57,080 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 1: play hardists, right, But that was his style. How did

580
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 1: dump get you guys to play at that level in

581
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:04,200
Speaker 1: terms of energy wise?

582
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 2: Very similar to what you just said. I think again,

583
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 2: different errors. And I'd be curious to go to one

584
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:12,640
Speaker 2: of his practices now I went a couple of years ago.

585
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 2: But uh, the fear of the fear of God, of knowing.

586
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 2: You know, he was intense and you wanted to please him.

587
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 2: And it wasn't like it is today. Like he said

588
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 2: some things that that I never took his offensive. It

589
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 2: was like, all right, I got to do better, and

590
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:33,479
Speaker 2: and he had that way of doing that. I use

591
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 2: this example a lot. His way of motivating was he

592
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:40,800
Speaker 2: never demeaned you. He never you know, made you feel

593
00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:43,720
Speaker 2: like you were two feet tall. But he like had

594
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 2: this way of driving you to be the best you

595
00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 2: could be. And a specific example is like you'd be

596
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 2: on defense and practice and and somebody would get the

597
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:55,560
Speaker 2: ball and they'd go middle on you. We didn't give

598
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:56,720
Speaker 2: up middle at the time.

599
00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:01,480
Speaker 4: And he'd like, hold on, hold on, like David, you

600
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,360
Speaker 4: think Dwayne King can get middle on you? See, I

601
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 4: think higher of you than you do, because there's no

602
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:09,960
Speaker 4: way Dwayne King can get middle on you.

603
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:12,240
Speaker 2: But you clearly don't think as high as I do

604
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 2: about yourself. No chance that happens again. And like you're like, yeah,

605
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 2: how the heck did Dwayne just get middle on me?

606
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 3: He's not.

607
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,440
Speaker 2: That's not happening again, you know. Like so it was

608
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 2: one of those things where he'd call you out, but

609
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:26,479
Speaker 2: it wasn't in a way that made you It was

610
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 2: it was like making you feel most more so.

611
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,000
Speaker 1: That was that was that was that he said. That

612
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 1: wasn't I've told this story before. It was like our

613
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 1: first day of practice and we would do one on

614
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:41,120
Speaker 1: one contain on the side, right. We did a series

615
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:44,000
Speaker 1: of defensive breakdown drills every day, one on one contained

616
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 1: uh into you know, drive to the seal, which was

617
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:50,600
Speaker 1: the baseline help and then rotate and then we worked

618
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:52,959
Speaker 1: on post double and that stuff. Anyway, so we're playing

619
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: one on one contained on the side and you know,

620
00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:58,560
Speaker 1: you got to get a stop to get the ball

621
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: then for your playoffs, and uh, somebody been scoring. I

622
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 1: think Joe Atkins are too guard. He's been scoring on guys.

623
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: So I get out there and I a hold up, coach.

624
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: We forced in middle, were forcing baseline? What do you mean?

625
00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 1: I go, well, which way are we making him?

626
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 3: Go?

627
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,960
Speaker 1: Like guard your man? Like yeah, but I get a coach,

628
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 1: but like there's gonna be help four other guys in

629
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:25,720
Speaker 1: the game. Like where we send. It was like you

630
00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 1: guard your man or you come help me coach? Like

631
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 1: that was it? You guard man or you come help

632
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,280
Speaker 1: me coach like a coach like like a guard your

633
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 1: man and uh so you know then the guy's place.

634
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,240
Speaker 1: I like, yeah, we're for some baseline, we got help,

635
00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 1: but like don't ask him that. And that was that

636
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 1: was that was his way, you know, and he would

637
00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: just he would just it was just very very matter

638
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 1: of fact in a very stern kind of Southern way,

639
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 1: was like, you can't guard your man, just help me coach.

640
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: You a college man can't make that open shot? Call

641
00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:02,719
Speaker 1: help coach? Like that was that was That was his

642
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,200
Speaker 1: way of saying, you're gonna you're gonna sit on the bench.

643
00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:11,280
Speaker 1: Come hop? How good was that team?

644
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 2: Pretty good? I'm thinking so that was my freshman year.

645
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 2: I think Ken Palmer goes back that far. I want

646
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 2: to say we were like in the like forty to

647
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:26,799
Speaker 2: seventy range, which was really good. We ended up like

648
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:28,880
Speaker 2: twenty one and seven or twenty one and eight or

649
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:30,600
Speaker 2: something like that, and then lost in the first round

650
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:35,560
Speaker 2: to Illinois. Illinois I think a four to thirteen matchup,

651
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 2: or maybe it was a five twelve. But we had

652
00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:41,879
Speaker 2: a really good team, and I think we all were

653
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:44,160
Speaker 2: hoping we could knock somebody off in the tournament, but

654
00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:46,799
Speaker 2: it just didn't didn't work out for us.

655
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,880
Speaker 1: The IVY League then very different, right. It was basically

656
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:55,000
Speaker 1: you guys and Princeton because this was before Donahue goes

657
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:56,439
Speaker 1: to Cornell and got them going.

658
00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:56,799
Speaker 2: Yep.

659
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:01,839
Speaker 1: Right, Dartmouth really hasn't been competitive Browns, not really. They're

660
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:06,080
Speaker 1: better now than they've been, but they've never been at

661
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 1: the top of league. And Harvard, of course is before

662
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 1: Tommy and they were never really competing. It was kind

663
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 1: of a two horse race right before yalees Yale's good. Now, right,

664
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 1: What was the IVY League like in terms of it's

665
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:25,719
Speaker 1: got the unique Friday Saturday schedule? Right, there's all these

666
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 1: unique places. You're playing at the Polester, which is like

667
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 1: a palace. Oh, let me just ask you that first

668
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:34,440
Speaker 1: double triple header at the Plestro, What do you remember?

669
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 2: There's nothing like the Polestra. So I remember on my

670
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 2: recruiting trip going to watch Kansas versus pad Right and

671
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 2: Jeff Boshee and I think Rayful France might have been

672
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 2: on that team, and just being like, holy, this is

673
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:52,279
Speaker 2: this is ninety eight, ninety eight ninety Okay?

674
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:57,279
Speaker 1: So ninety eight was ninety seven ninety eight? Was you

675
00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:59,759
Speaker 1: went in thet seven ninety eight?

676
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:04,080
Speaker 2: I played? It must have been ninety eight ninety nine.

677
00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:10,919
Speaker 1: Okay, So yeah, that team had not Rafe had that's

678
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 1: the guy Kenny Gregory. Yeah, uh, Kenny Gregory.

679
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 5: Did a young start. I think who is Nick Bradford?

680
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 5: That Teamford Gooden was until the next year. Gooden was

681
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,000
Speaker 5: until I played them the next The next year had

682
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 5: three stars. Next year had had Collis and Heinrich and

683
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:36,480
Speaker 5: good Yeah.

684
00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 2: I remember we played.

685
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 1: We smacked the ship, We smacked the ship up twice.

686
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:41,719
Speaker 1: But it was only it was only because they were young.

687
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:43,719
Speaker 1: We were like old man and we kicked the ship

688
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:45,560
Speaker 1: out of the We've beat my thirty three and nineteen

689
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:49,319
Speaker 1: good but but ninety all on this. I love this

690
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:50,000
Speaker 1: challenge to it.

691
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 2: Okay.

692
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: So what was there? Because they beat us that year,

693
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 1: they were the Ryan.

694
00:36:55,400 --> 00:37:00,640
Speaker 5: Robertson, Ryan Robertson, Yeah, yeah.

695
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:02,320
Speaker 1: Ryan Robertson. Who is there, I don't know. I remember

696
00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 1: them having a young stad It was Kenny Gregory.

697
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:10,320
Speaker 2: Nikause she was young at that age. Yeah, sophomore.

698
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:12,640
Speaker 1: Yeah. They beat us on a really bad call at

699
00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:14,560
Speaker 1: their place, and then they played us. We played them

700
00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 1: the big tall championship game in the term, and that

701
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:19,400
Speaker 1: we couldn't school. We were so tired with big I

702
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:24,200
Speaker 1: bet fifty five thirty seven, fourth game in four days,

703
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:29,839
Speaker 1: and and you're playing basically and it's basically like faul Allen.

704
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:32,399
Speaker 1: But and we just got beat. But that's why where

705
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 1: the energy came from the next year for us to

706
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 1: crush them. But yeah, I mean so the thing about

707
00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:41,200
Speaker 1: the pleustra and Gallagher where I played was like this

708
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:43,919
Speaker 1: though too. But Pluster the roof is you know, it's

709
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,840
Speaker 1: like a cathedral, right. But still those older places that

710
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 1: are smaller, A team like Kansas comes in and god damn,

711
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,160
Speaker 1: they look like giants. They look like the biggest dudes

712
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:56,240
Speaker 1: Ever're like, oh god, these spaceship. The court's too small

713
00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:56,560
Speaker 1: for them.

714
00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 2: So it looks like, yeah, it's a shame though, you know,

715
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 2: I don't even remember who the coach was back then,

716
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:07,200
Speaker 2: but that would never happen today, Like Kansas would never

717
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:13,400
Speaker 2: go play Penn Williams Rose coach, that was coach. Yeah,

718
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:15,440
Speaker 2: Like when I was there, we had Maryland who ended

719
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,399
Speaker 2: up winning the national championship with with Blake and taj

720
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:21,840
Speaker 2: Holden and Baxter, and they came to the Paluster we

721
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:25,399
Speaker 2: got a WME game against Maryland, Like how how cool

722
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 2: is that? That just it doesn't happen anymore because because.

723
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: The play neutral sites, it's just too risky for them.

724
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 2: It makes no sense.

725
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: But though that's the thing though, it's it's really it's

726
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 1: like such a miss.

727
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:39,279
Speaker 2: You think, you know, let me hear, why do you

728
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:40,920
Speaker 2: think it's a misconception. I'm going to try and argue

729
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 2: the other side.

730
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 1: I mean now, and obviously it's very case by case dependent, okay,

731
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:51,120
Speaker 1: but for the most part, if you're that good, it

732
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. You're gonna win twenty five to thirty games anyway.

733
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:59,280
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I mean there's the the one

734
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 1: year where like, oh my god, and if you play

735
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:03,799
Speaker 1: a road game, like it doesn't really hurts you if

736
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:06,040
Speaker 1: you lose a game because you because the other team

737
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 1: played out of their mind. I mean, you gotta be

738
00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:09,839
Speaker 1: careful about it, right, Like you're not gonna go like, hey,

739
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 1: we're gonna go play at Southern Illinois and then we're

740
00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:13,959
Speaker 1: gonna go, right Like, you gotta be careful.

741
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 2: That's what I mean. Like, so our pen teams were

742
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 2: always pretty good, yeah, but you are.

743
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,320
Speaker 1: You guys were good, so it didn't hurt your numbers.

744
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 2: Nobody, it didn't.

745
00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:24,319
Speaker 1: And I'm sure you know like Roy Williams did it

746
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 1: every year, but he would do it to take a

747
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: kid home.

748
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:30,120
Speaker 2: Right, that's different. Now they do a neutral cord. Now

749
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,319
Speaker 2: that game would be played at you know whatever the

750
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:36,239
Speaker 2: town center, right, yeah, whatever that name is now. But

751
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 2: for them, like I'm gonna say, I'm gonna like combine

752
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,600
Speaker 2: my pen years in my Coolgate years. Colgate was very good,

753
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:45,680
Speaker 2: Like we were, you know, one hundred ken poum or

754
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:48,360
Speaker 2: one hundred and fifteen kN poms. So you're probably if

755
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:51,320
Speaker 2: you're a top twenty team, you're probably gonna win that game.

756
00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 2: But you know, the spread swings a little bit because

757
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 2: you're playing on the road, and if you lose that game,

758
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 2: it wasn't a big enough loss that it made sense

759
00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:04,279
Speaker 2: for you if you wont yeah, you're supposed to remember

760
00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,360
Speaker 2: you lose that game. Like that's that even though the

761
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:11,120
Speaker 2: numbers say it doesn't hurt you, it's the mistique. I think.

762
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 1: I wish there was a way where they could do

763
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:18,360
Speaker 1: like a some sort of like I don't know the

764
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 1: computer or whatever, but they like you have to play

765
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,360
Speaker 1: one game a year where you put your name in

766
00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 1: the hat and then it just draws it and just

767
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 1: be random.

768
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:29,600
Speaker 2: That's great, right, I love it.

769
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:32,680
Speaker 1: It just be random. But you know, I like, I'm

770
00:40:32,719 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: trying to think. We played played a home and home

771
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 1: with TC when I was at Notre Dame. Do we

772
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:43,280
Speaker 1: play anywhere? Put that Indiana? We got smoked paid Xavier

773
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,359
Speaker 1: this back when they played in the CINCINNATAI Gardens and

774
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:49,200
Speaker 1: we beat them. That was a huge win. We played

775
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:53,399
Speaker 1: Loyola of Maryland and beat them. They were not very good.

776
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,399
Speaker 1: That was a weird schedule thing that had beat There

777
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:57,359
Speaker 1: had to be somebody we were recruiting or something. We

778
00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:58,480
Speaker 1: literally played on the road to.

779
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:01,120
Speaker 2: Low of Maryland's Yeah, that doesn't.

780
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 1: Crazy crazy, But the other thing is like once you

781
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:09,200
Speaker 1: get into college basketball, like that's the stuff you love. Yeah,

782
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:15,239
Speaker 1: playing in these arenas that are quarter full is blah.

783
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:18,840
Speaker 1: I don't I much. I remember playing at TCU, I

784
00:41:18,840 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 1: remember playing at Xavier. I remember, uh you know, we

785
00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 1: played at UNLB twice two years in a row on

786
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:27,640
Speaker 1: the road. That was a great one. I pulled coach

787
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:29,359
Speaker 1: setting aside, we're walking off we beat them two years

788
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 1: in row, and I said, Coach, I don't believe the

789
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:36,319
Speaker 1: team at our levels ever played road games against one

790
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:40,399
Speaker 1: opponent two consecutive years. Like you love Vegas that much?

791
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 1: He's like, son Billy Beno couldn't organize his fist fight.

792
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:53,840
Speaker 1: I was dying. I was dying. Oh shit, I was like, okay, noted.

793
00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:59,879
Speaker 1: Was it your senior year. You guys lost Oakland State? Yeah, yes,

794
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 1: at the Garden right at the TV at whatever was

795
00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:08,240
Speaker 1: called back then, the Fleet Center maybe or Boston Boston Garden, whatever.

796
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, that was That was probably our best

797
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:16,240
Speaker 2: team when I was a senior. We had an awesome

798
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:18,640
Speaker 2: old team at the time, and then we had a

799
00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:21,880
Speaker 2: couple of young guys, like a sophomore Tim Begley, that

800
00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 2: was pretty good. So we were we were super excited.

801
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 2: We were we were like the trendy pick that was

802
00:42:27,239 --> 00:42:30,120
Speaker 2: a six to eleven game, and and we actually love

803
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 2: the draw. I'm not gonna lie. When it came out,

804
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,160
Speaker 2: we're like, this is awesome. We wanted to play Syrus.

805
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:36,719
Speaker 1: We got Syracuse second game too.

806
00:42:36,760 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 2: We wanted Syracuse first round. That's how crazy were because

807
00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 2: they played zone and you could not a zone that

808
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:44,319
Speaker 2: they would have smoked us. I don't know they would

809
00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:45,719
Speaker 2: have to come out of the zone, I think, but we.

810
00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:47,839
Speaker 1: Were Malcahima State was up. That was the national change

811
00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 1: was up seventeen at halftime.

812
00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 2: Again, yes, but anyway we got we got that drum like,

813
00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:55,359
Speaker 2: oh awesome. They haven't won a road game all year.

814
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:59,000
Speaker 2: Like they're young, they're they you know, they play kind

815
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 2: of a grinded out style. And then we got in

816
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,080
Speaker 2: the game and Tony Allen I think was able to

817
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:07,960
Speaker 2: guard three of us at one time. And Victor Williams

818
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 2: little point guard. I don't know if you remember one

819
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:11,719
Speaker 2: of it. He just like we had no chance of

820
00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:12,560
Speaker 2: keeping him in front.

821
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 1: So between these so freaking quick, so cool. That was

822
00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:19,120
Speaker 1: so my senior year. He was his red shirt year. Okay, okay,

823
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:22,040
Speaker 1: And I mean like now he would throw a ball

824
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:25,360
Speaker 1: at least twice a practice that would hit you know

825
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 1: that now they have the rotating boards, but back then

826
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:30,640
Speaker 1: they had the little plastic boards, and he would just

827
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:32,800
Speaker 1: throw a ball to nobody when it hit the boards.

828
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:36,640
Speaker 1: And uh, he was definitely a mid range guy more longer,

829
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 1: but he was. I mean, without any question, I guard

830
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 1: Alan Everson. He's the quickest dude I've ever tried to.

831
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:44,799
Speaker 2: I believe I would say the same. I never guarded Ai,

832
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 2: but I had no chance to keeping victory, but I

833
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,480
Speaker 2: was pretty good defensive player. No chance, no chance. That

834
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:52,239
Speaker 2: was a good game. I mean, it went back and forth.

835
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 2: I think they ended up they ended up winning by

836
00:43:54,520 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 2: a lot, but it was like a two possession game

837
00:43:56,719 --> 00:43:58,600
Speaker 2: with like three minutes left when they made free throws

838
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:02,239
Speaker 2: and we couldn't hit a shot. So disappointing, Like strangely enough,

839
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:05,160
Speaker 2: we had we went three of my four years and

840
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 2: we never won, and I I kind of am disappointed

841
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 2: with that because we had some monster teams. We had

842
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 2: really good teams, and we never could get the either

843
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 2: the matchup or the playing at our peak in the tournament.

844
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,000
Speaker 2: We just could never get it done. And it's like,

845
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:21,040
Speaker 2: just looking back, it still haunts me that we couldn't

846
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:21,359
Speaker 2: get it done.

847
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:23,640
Speaker 1: Do you like the ivy league having a tournament now.

848
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,120
Speaker 2: I love it. I love it. I wish we were

849
00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:30,040
Speaker 2: all eight teams, honestly. And now I'm in the UAA

850
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:32,799
Speaker 2: in Division three, which is the only Division one, two

851
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 2: or three conference that does not have a tournament, and

852
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:38,719
Speaker 2: I'm pushing and pushing a tournament, but logistically it's a

853
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:41,880
Speaker 2: little bit more difficult in our league. But we had

854
00:44:42,040 --> 00:44:44,400
Speaker 2: my junior year, we tied, so in the ivy's back then,

855
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 2: when there was no tournament, if you tied, it didn't

856
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:49,359
Speaker 2: matter the tie breakers. You had a tournament. So we

857
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 2: tied with there was a three way tie with US, Princeton,

858
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:54,880
Speaker 2: and Yale, so Princeton and Yale played first, and then

859
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:56,839
Speaker 2: the winner played US in the finals, so you kind

860
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:59,719
Speaker 2: of had a mini tournament. And I just remember that

861
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:02,239
Speaker 2: chanceampionship game that we played Yale to see who's going

862
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:05,400
Speaker 2: to go to the tournament was electric. It was ridiculous,

863
00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 2: and I was like, why would people not want this?

864
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,560
Speaker 2: So I'm glad they do it now. There's nothing like

865
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:13,480
Speaker 2: a conference tournament. It's just it's so fun, especially at

866
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:16,279
Speaker 2: the lower levels, where the winner it's like winning in

867
00:45:16,520 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 2: losing out right, and there's just so much.

868
00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:21,319
Speaker 1: The other side to it, though, is like, if you

869
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:24,279
Speaker 1: win your league, and especially the IVY league's a double

870
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:27,120
Speaker 1: round robin, right, so you play everybody twice. If you

871
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:31,480
Speaker 1: win your league, why do you have to go beat

872
00:45:31,480 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 1: everybody again?

873
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:38,319
Speaker 2: Because I believe that the team that should go is

874
00:45:38,360 --> 00:45:42,480
Speaker 2: the team that's playing the best in March. So if

875
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:45,160
Speaker 2: you started two and two and this happened to Penn

876
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:47,040
Speaker 2: a couple of years after, or maybe it was the

877
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:49,360
Speaker 2: year after our graduated, they started owing two and it

878
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:51,920
Speaker 2: was like, boo, they're done, but they weren't. They might

879
00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:53,279
Speaker 2: have been the best team in the league, but you

880
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:56,080
Speaker 2: just it's a really hard holder to dig out of.

881
00:45:56,840 --> 00:46:00,960
Speaker 2: And again I'm not saying that it's not warranted. Whoever

882
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,280
Speaker 2: wins the regular season is the best team in the league.

883
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:06,440
Speaker 2: I'm just saying there's something to be said for a

884
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 2: tournament style. You lose, you go home, you win, you're

885
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:14,080
Speaker 2: in come to play. It's what March madness is all

886
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:16,600
Speaker 2: about to a degree. And yeah, you might not always

887
00:46:16,680 --> 00:46:20,319
Speaker 2: have the best representative of your league, but playing that

888
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 2: tournament where the stakes are high, the crowds into it,

889
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 2: everybody understands what's going on. It's just it's fun. And

890
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:29,120
Speaker 2: I feel the same way right now in the UAA.

891
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 2: Now ua is a multi bid league, so it's a

892
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:34,759
Speaker 2: little bit different, but it's still the tournament is just

893
00:46:34,800 --> 00:46:37,839
Speaker 2: so fun. You watch these games in March of these

894
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:39,680
Speaker 2: lower levels and the gym's past. I love when the

895
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:42,600
Speaker 2: host hosts and the gym's packed and the I like.

896
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: That as well. I think that's I think that's the

897
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:48,520
Speaker 1: appropriate reward for for a winning your league right at

898
00:46:48,520 --> 00:46:52,120
Speaker 1: the home game. Yes, no, I like like the Patriot

899
00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 1: League has that. I've always always, always loved that.

900
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:56,960
Speaker 2: It's just so hard to win in Hamilton in March.

901
00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 2: Like you know, I think Boston knocked us off three years,

902
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:03,600
Speaker 2: but it's probably a fifteen or you know, close to

903
00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:05,879
Speaker 2: twelve to fifteen game winning streak, and it's just there

904
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:09,040
Speaker 2: hasn't really been a close game because we packed the

905
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 2: We packed the house and the fans were crazy. It's

906
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:14,759
Speaker 2: a small gym, and it's just it's a really fun

907
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 2: atmosphere that you don't always get in a fourteen game

908
00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:19,879
Speaker 2: regular season, even when it's a big game.

909
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:25,160
Speaker 1: One last thing about Penn. You know, things are so

910
00:47:25,320 --> 00:47:30,400
Speaker 1: different now, right Teams practice in the summer. They practice

911
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:33,600
Speaker 1: the summer obviously had summer tours as well, you have

912
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:37,359
Speaker 1: individual workouts. I really doesn't have any of that, still

913
00:47:37,360 --> 00:47:40,279
Speaker 1: doesn't have any of that. What was your what was

914
00:47:40,320 --> 00:47:42,160
Speaker 1: your your internships when you're at Penn.

915
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:47,640
Speaker 2: So my freshman and sophomore summer, I stuck around Philly,

916
00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:52,960
Speaker 2: which there's nothing like Philly summers, at least when I

917
00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:55,520
Speaker 2: was there, because what would happen is you get the

918
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:58,080
Speaker 2: guys from Drexel, the guys from Temple, the guys from

919
00:47:58,120 --> 00:47:59,880
Speaker 2: Saint Jose, they'd all come and we'd play pick up.

920
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:02,160
Speaker 1: So you didn't everybody play pick up? Didn everybody play

921
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:04,080
Speaker 1: pick up at Drexel, like, well, when I was there.

922
00:48:04,120 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 1: I was there one summer. I think it was for

923
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:10,920
Speaker 1: Maccabi and uh there was the big run was at

924
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 1: drex left.

925
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 2: It rotates. I remember playing at Drexel sometimes, I remember

926
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:18,399
Speaker 2: playing at Penn. And the great thing is is if

927
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:20,959
Speaker 2: you didn't have ten like some the way I got

928
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:26,040
Speaker 2: better between my freshman and sophomore years was like king

929
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:29,760
Speaker 2: of Court, playing against guys like Ashley Howard and Lamar

930
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:32,360
Speaker 2: Palmer who was on our team. Uh, and again they

931
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:34,920
Speaker 2: would kicking my butt. But I learned and learned and

932
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 2: just got better, and that's how my defense got better.

933
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 2: That's how my ability to get by got better. But

934
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:43,040
Speaker 2: just all summer just playing against the local Philly guys.

935
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:47,000
Speaker 2: We'd have runs with all different type players, you know,

936
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 2: different schools, pros would come back. So it was great,

937
00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:51,960
Speaker 2: it was It was a really good experience. And then

938
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:55,800
Speaker 2: junior summer, I got an internship in New York City

939
00:48:56,280 --> 00:48:58,160
Speaker 2: and that was a fun summer too. That was a

940
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:02,320
Speaker 2: little bit different of an experience. But because you're working

941
00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:04,279
Speaker 2: a lot of hours and then I just play.

942
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:06,359
Speaker 1: I mean, how did you manage playing ball?

943
00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:09,480
Speaker 2: So I found pickup games wherever I could. That summer

944
00:49:09,560 --> 00:49:11,960
Speaker 2: was a little bit different. Like pretty much every summer

945
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:14,080
Speaker 2: I worked on my game. You know, you're getting shots up,

946
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:16,840
Speaker 2: you're working on different things. That summer I was just

947
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:19,839
Speaker 2: competing like I didn't really I didn't really work on

948
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:24,319
Speaker 2: too many skills. Like I just found games and I

949
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 2: used to play. There's like a game at a little

950
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 2: little gym like near Houston and Thompson, and then there

951
00:49:31,680 --> 00:49:33,520
Speaker 2: was I used to get I used to go to

952
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:35,920
Speaker 2: the Nayak and play there with a lot of the

953
00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:40,319
Speaker 2: x ivy IVY guys and pros. So I'd lift there

954
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:42,440
Speaker 2: and play there and just find like wherever I can

955
00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:44,920
Speaker 2: find games. I tried to just get and get out

956
00:49:44,920 --> 00:49:45,320
Speaker 2: and play.

957
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:46,880
Speaker 1: What was your internship?

958
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 2: I worked for Merrill Lynch in a rotational program where

959
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:56,680
Speaker 2: you sit on a desk for six weeks, then you

960
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:59,560
Speaker 2: rotate it. Not six weeks, probably, uh probably it was

961
00:49:59,560 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 2: probably eight week's total, so probably two or three weeks

962
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:05,440
Speaker 2: at a time, and you're basically on an eight week interview,

963
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 2: so you're not doing a whole lot, but you're always,

964
00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:12,800
Speaker 2: you know, on edge because you're trying to get the

965
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:15,920
Speaker 2: job for the next year. Sure, that was that was

966
00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:18,200
Speaker 2: but it was fun like it. I loved it. I

967
00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:20,320
Speaker 2: loved it. It's strangely enough, I stayed in the NYU

968
00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:24,240
Speaker 2: dorms with one of my teammates and you know, you're working,

969
00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:27,759
Speaker 2: you're having a blast. You're twenty twenty one years old,

970
00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 2: living in the city. It was fun. It was It was.

971
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:32,239
Speaker 2: It was. It was a lot of fun.

972
00:50:32,360 --> 00:50:35,600
Speaker 1: I mean the I mean the the the actual the walls,

973
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:37,279
Speaker 1: the actual job, the Wall Street job.

974
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:41,120
Speaker 2: So as you like, you're not you, you weren't allowed

975
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 2: to have any real responsibilities, right, You can't trade, you

976
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:47,520
Speaker 2: can't talk to client. You know, you can't really do

977
00:50:47,600 --> 00:50:51,520
Speaker 2: anything because you're not certified. So in essence, you're the

978
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 2: go get guy, right like, hey, I need a coffee,

979
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 2: Go get me a coffee. I need lunch, Go get lunch.

980
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:59,480
Speaker 2: That that's like your main responsibilities. But on top of that,

981
00:50:59,520 --> 00:51:01,440
Speaker 2: you're trying to learn. You're trying to connect, and you're

982
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:04,200
Speaker 2: trying to show everyone how hard work you are and

983
00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:08,879
Speaker 2: how smart you are, and without being annoying. Like I

984
00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:11,959
Speaker 2: was in the opposite. You know, I was also working

985
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 2: on Wall Street and having interns, and you don't want

986
00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:16,200
Speaker 2: somebody sitting next to you asking a million questions, but

987
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:19,239
Speaker 2: you also want somebody you don't want them just sitting

988
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:22,120
Speaker 2: there doing nothing. You have to find a balance. So

989
00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 2: that was always a tricky thing, is Okay, how can

990
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:27,839
Speaker 2: I like show that I am inquisitive and want to learn,

991
00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:31,400
Speaker 2: but not be too annoying, because you know how annoying

992
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:33,480
Speaker 2: people are when they sit next to you, so you know,

993
00:51:34,000 --> 00:51:35,880
Speaker 2: so that was that was basically what you're trying to

994
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:38,879
Speaker 2: do is just meet people network, have them like you,

995
00:51:39,040 --> 00:51:41,200
Speaker 2: show that you can do the job and do it

996
00:51:41,200 --> 00:51:44,319
Speaker 2: well and are a hard worker. So that's always the

997
00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:46,839
Speaker 2: advice I give when people do these internships.

998
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:53,120
Speaker 1: That's it for part one of Coach KLASKI wait tea here,

999
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:57,920
Speaker 1: how the NYU job came to be and what it's

1000
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:01,239
Speaker 1: like for him to uh to be a head coach

1001
00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:03,239
Speaker 1: for the first time. Oh yeah, and by the way,

1002
00:52:03,360 --> 00:52:07,200
Speaker 1: like all of these intricate stories about how how Colgate

1003
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:10,160
Speaker 1: got it going, how they become so dominant in the

1004
00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:13,280
Speaker 1: Patriot League, all that's upcoming in the next episode. Reminded

1005
00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:15,560
Speaker 1: of the Doug Goatlib shows daily three to five Eastern time,

1006
00:52:15,560 --> 00:52:18,600
Speaker 1: twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.

1007
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:21,040
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening. I'm Doug Gotlieb. This is

1008
00:52:21,080 --> 00:52:21,439
Speaker 1: all ball