WEBVTT - Return to the 404 0:00:15.356 --> 0:00:15.796 Pushkin. 0:00:20.316 --> 0:00:24.356 Welcome to the bonus Holiday special Atlanta, theine edition of 0:00:24.396 --> 0:00:29.716 Revisionist History, Part two. A word before we begin. There 0:00:29.836 --> 0:00:33.956 is no overarching theme to what follows. No beginning, no middle, 0:00:34.036 --> 0:00:38.916 no end, no single compelling through line. My editor Julia Barton, 0:00:39.036 --> 0:00:42.236 who is normally lovely, actually got all grumpy about doing 0:00:42.236 --> 0:00:45.156 this episode, so grumpy in fact, that I thought I 0:00:45.196 --> 0:00:47.756 should let her put in her two cents before we 0:00:47.836 --> 0:00:48.276 get going. 0:00:49.116 --> 0:00:50.036 Okay, I thought about it. 0:00:50.076 --> 0:00:52.716 Some more Happy holidays, Malcolm. 0:00:53.556 --> 0:00:55.436 From here on out, you're on your own. 0:00:56.996 --> 0:01:00.196 All right, all right, all right, here's my feeling. If 0:01:00.276 --> 0:01:03.316 there is anything in the world that unites my fellow 0:01:03.476 --> 0:01:07.876 revisionist historians, it is our endless appetite for wandering down 0:01:08.036 --> 0:01:14.356 empty corridors and poking through the cobwebs of the half 0:01:14.356 --> 0:01:25.436 baked and the marginal. By the way, do you have 0:01:25.516 --> 0:01:28.236 anything better to do? No, you don't, and no do I. 0:01:28.236 --> 0:01:30.836 I've been cooped up in my house for nine months, 0:01:30.996 --> 0:01:32.236 and I'm moving my mind. 0:01:33.516 --> 0:01:49.196 And dreaming of Atlanta. 0:01:50.556 --> 0:01:54.916 So I'm just going to answer a few more random 0:01:54.996 --> 0:01:59.716 questions from you, my listeners. Lucas Nicholson asks on Twitter, 0:02:00.236 --> 0:02:04.636 what's your favorite memory of your father. Okay, As you know, 0:02:04.916 --> 0:02:07.196 my dad comes up on the show every now and again. 0:02:07.556 --> 0:02:09.996 I like to refer to him as the patron saint 0:02:10.076 --> 0:02:14.316 of Revision's history, because, among other things, Graham Glabo was 0:02:14.356 --> 0:02:17.716 a deeply mischievous man in a way that we strive 0:02:17.876 --> 0:02:21.276 every day to emulate here at Pushkin. Oh, I should 0:02:21.276 --> 0:02:25.356 point out, why do we call Pushkin Pushkin? Not because 0:02:25.396 --> 0:02:29.196 we have some pretentious intellectual connection to the famous Russian poet. 0:02:29.556 --> 0:02:32.636 Well kind of, it's half of it. The other half 0:02:32.716 --> 0:02:36.876 is Graham Glabo named our family's first dog growing up, Pushkin, 0:02:37.476 --> 0:02:40.876 a floppy eared Shepherd lab mix, and have always loved 0:02:40.876 --> 0:02:43.956 the name. My dad also named his garden Rhodo Tiller 0:02:44.356 --> 0:02:48.876 Alexander after Alexander the Great, and his garden cart Rufus 0:02:49.276 --> 0:02:52.396 after the English king, King William the Second, otherwise known 0:02:52.436 --> 0:02:57.116 as William Rufus. He really liked to name things. My 0:02:57.276 --> 0:03:00.796 dad was English. In the nineteen fifties, he meets my mother, 0:03:01.076 --> 0:03:03.596 they get married, and a few years later they move 0:03:03.676 --> 0:03:06.116 back to Jamaica, where my mother is from, and my 0:03:06.236 --> 0:03:09.756 father teaches mathematics at the University of the West Indies 0:03:10.276 --> 0:03:12.276 UI as it's called in Kingston. 0:03:12.356 --> 0:03:12.836 Jamaica. 0:03:13.716 --> 0:03:16.876 Parenthetically, while he's there, who does he meet and try 0:03:16.916 --> 0:03:21.236 to encourage to take mathematics? Donald Harris, father of future 0:03:21.316 --> 0:03:29.916 Vice President Kamala Harris. Small world anyway, So my dad 0:03:29.996 --> 0:03:32.916 is working on some crazily complex bit of math, and 0:03:32.996 --> 0:03:35.676 this is before the Internet. Of course, if you needed 0:03:35.716 --> 0:03:38.476 to read some crucial bit of scholarship, you had to 0:03:38.476 --> 0:03:41.596 go to an actual library. And he realizes the closest 0:03:41.636 --> 0:03:44.396 library that has the books he needs is at Georgia 0:03:44.436 --> 0:03:47.836 Tech in Atlanta. So he writes the chair of the 0:03:47.836 --> 0:03:50.436 math department at Georgia Tech, can I come and use 0:03:50.476 --> 0:03:52.556 your library stay on campus for a bit while I 0:03:52.596 --> 0:03:55.716 do my research? They say, of course. He starts to 0:03:55.756 --> 0:04:00.116 plan his trip vote from Kingston to Miami, bus from 0:04:00.156 --> 0:04:04.916 Miami to Georgia. This is nineteen fifty nine. Georgia Tech 0:04:05.196 --> 0:04:09.356 is still a segregated institution and the administration realizes that 0:04:09.436 --> 0:04:12.196 the head of the math department has just extended an 0:04:12.236 --> 0:04:16.516 invitation to a professor from the University of the West Indies, 0:04:16.956 --> 0:04:22.276 a place chock full a black people. Panic sweeps through 0:04:22.316 --> 0:04:25.836 Georgia Tech. They start calling around other math departments. Does 0:04:25.876 --> 0:04:29.156 anyone know a Graham Gladwell no one does, because my 0:04:29.236 --> 0:04:32.716 dad is twenty five years old. He's a nobody. Finally, 0:04:33.156 --> 0:04:35.396 just before my dad is about to leave Jamaica, they 0:04:35.516 --> 0:04:39.676 manage to reach him by phone. Professor Gladwell, I have 0:04:39.716 --> 0:04:45.076 an important question for you. Are you white? My father says, why, yes, 0:04:45.116 --> 0:04:48.756 I am, and the Georgia Tech guy says, oh, thank god. 0:04:53.036 --> 0:04:56.116 Now my dad doesn't say anything at the time, because 0:04:56.116 --> 0:04:58.836 that's the way he was. I'll poker face. But when 0:04:58.876 --> 0:05:01.476 he finally gets to Atlanta, a bunch of people from 0:05:01.516 --> 0:05:04.396 the university take him out to dinner and he announces 0:05:04.436 --> 0:05:08.196 to the group, gentlemen, I've just gotten married. I want 0:05:08.276 --> 0:05:11.116 you to see a picture my lovely bride, and passes 0:05:11.116 --> 0:05:16.236 a photo of Joyce gladwell sister around the table. I 0:05:16.276 --> 0:05:18.996 think you can see why he's the patron saint. 0:05:18.916 --> 0:05:20.716 Of Revision's history. 0:05:26.316 --> 0:05:28.476 It's funny. I hadn't thought about that story for a 0:05:28.476 --> 0:05:31.836 long time, but Lucas Nicholson's question inspired me to do 0:05:32.036 --> 0:05:35.156 a follow up. So a few weeks ago, I called 0:05:35.196 --> 0:05:37.756 up the dean of computer science at Georgia Tech, an 0:05:37.876 --> 0:05:41.996 artificial intelligence researcher named Charles I isbel I'm going to 0:05:42.036 --> 0:05:44.836 warn you this is a tangent, But as Himon Roth 0:05:45.036 --> 0:05:50.356 said to Michael Corleone, tangents are the business we've chosen. Yeah, 0:05:50.596 --> 0:05:52.436 tell me a little bit about your own are you 0:05:52.596 --> 0:05:53.556 Are you from Atlanta? 0:05:54.116 --> 0:05:55.996 Yes, Well, as you can tell by my accent, I'm 0:05:56.036 --> 0:05:59.236 from Chattanooga, Tennessee. But my earliest memory is arriving in 0:05:59.236 --> 0:06:01.036 Atlanta on a moving truck at the age of three. 0:06:01.196 --> 0:06:02.836 So I think of myself as being from Ataint. Yeah. 0:06:02.916 --> 0:06:05.156 And did you do your undergrad at Georgia Tech? 0:06:05.196 --> 0:06:06.916 I did undergrad at Georgia Tech, and I did my 0:06:07.116 --> 0:06:08.556 master's and PhD and mit. 0:06:09.196 --> 0:06:12.396 Oh I see, so but you are you consider yourself? 0:06:12.396 --> 0:06:13.076 You're in Atlanta? 0:06:13.076 --> 0:06:14.716 And oh yes? 0:06:15.356 --> 0:06:18.796 And through through is Bell then told me the following story. 0:06:19.156 --> 0:06:22.276 We started the first online masters of science and computer 0:06:22.356 --> 0:06:25.556 science from a large elite university. Give you a sense 0:06:25.556 --> 0:06:28.596 of scale of that, we had zero students and as 0:06:28.636 --> 0:06:32.396 of this past semester we have about eleven thousand. So 0:06:32.436 --> 0:06:34.956 we went from zero to eleven thousand in less than 0:06:35.036 --> 0:06:35.596 six years. 0:06:35.836 --> 0:06:38.116 For around six and a half thousand dollars, you can 0:06:38.156 --> 0:06:41.836 now get a Master's of Computer Science from Georgia Tech online, 0:06:42.116 --> 0:06:45.356 as opposed to the forty six thousand dollars it would 0:06:45.396 --> 0:06:49.396 cost you on campus, same professors, same course materials, same 0:06:49.396 --> 0:06:50.436 academic standards. 0:06:50.596 --> 0:06:53.516 So once you accept this larger idea, you start asking yourself, Okay, well, 0:06:53.516 --> 0:06:55.396 if we want to educate everyone, if we want to 0:06:55.396 --> 0:06:57.596 truly be accessible and live up to this idea, then 0:06:57.916 --> 0:07:00.036 where can we go? Who can we talk to? So 0:07:00.436 --> 0:07:04.516 I took a trip for somewhat unrelated reasons to Kenya 0:07:05.436 --> 0:07:09.676 and visited Kenya, ended up visiting Nigeria and a few 0:07:09.676 --> 0:07:12.236 other countries in Sub Saharan Africa and started meeting with 0:07:12.316 --> 0:07:15.276 people there, and I came to the conclusion that this 0:07:15.436 --> 0:07:20.076 is a population where you have a large amount of 0:07:20.156 --> 0:07:24.076 untapped talent, people who are really interested in figuring out 0:07:24.116 --> 0:07:27.756 how to get formal education in computing and in computer science. 0:07:28.116 --> 0:07:30.636 Is Bill and his colleagues began traveling to Africa all 0:07:30.676 --> 0:07:33.836 the time. Their goal is to make Georgia Tech the 0:07:33.876 --> 0:07:38.636 world's number one educator of IT talent in Sub Saharan Africa. 0:07:39.396 --> 0:07:41.436 Does it make a difference that you're an African American 0:07:41.476 --> 0:07:44.356 when you're making this case for Georgia Tech in Africa? 0:07:44.436 --> 0:07:49.596 I think it does certainly. The conversations I've had make 0:07:49.676 --> 0:07:51.916 me think that it does. I think people are excited 0:07:52.556 --> 0:07:55.956 that there's someone over here who wants to have those conversations. 0:07:56.316 --> 0:07:59.196 Then I told Isbell the story about my dad. I 0:07:59.236 --> 0:08:01.436 feel like there's something First of all, he would have 0:08:01.476 --> 0:08:03.556 been so happy to hear about what's happening now at 0:08:03.556 --> 0:08:06.676 Georgia Tech. But just this wonderful story about how, in 0:08:06.676 --> 0:08:11.196 the space of sixty years the institution has gone from 0:08:11.356 --> 0:08:15.156 turning its back on people even if they suspect them 0:08:15.356 --> 0:08:19.676 of being black, to like opening up its doors to 0:08:19.716 --> 0:08:22.876 sub Saharan Africa. I think that's I don't know, I 0:08:23.556 --> 0:08:24.116 was moved. 0:08:24.836 --> 0:08:26.716 Well, you know, I'm glad to hear you say that. 0:08:26.756 --> 0:08:29.396 It's actually a remarkable thing, particularly when you put it 0:08:29.436 --> 0:08:29.756 like that. 0:08:30.436 --> 0:08:33.236 Today, Georgia Tech is one of the largest producers of 0:08:33.316 --> 0:08:37.516 black engineers, Hispanic engineers, and Asian engineers in the country. 0:08:37.876 --> 0:08:40.356 It has more black undergrads who go on to do 0:08:40.396 --> 0:08:44.196 PhDs in computer science than any other American university. 0:08:44.836 --> 0:08:46.876 Yeah, you know, I have these I talk to people 0:08:46.916 --> 0:08:49.716 all the time, and you know, they asked me about 0:08:49.756 --> 0:08:51.356 my life story and the things that I've gone through, 0:08:51.396 --> 0:08:54.276 positive and negative, and and I was having this conversation 0:08:54.316 --> 0:08:56.276 with some of the other day, and you know, I 0:08:56.316 --> 0:08:58.236 was telling about, you know, interactions I've had with the 0:08:58.236 --> 0:09:00.636 police in my younger days that didn't go very well, 0:09:00.676 --> 0:09:02.796 and things people had said to me over the years. 0:09:02.796 --> 0:09:05.396 And I started talking about what I was hoping was 0:09:05.436 --> 0:09:08.196 going to happen for the future. And someone said to me, well, 0:09:08.196 --> 0:09:10.756 you know, you seem very optimistic and hopeful. And I 0:09:10.796 --> 0:09:13.036 thought about it, and I thought, you know, it's true. 0:09:13.316 --> 0:09:15.836 In the end, I'm optimistic and hopeful. I do like 0:09:15.876 --> 0:09:17.876 the idea that you know, within a generation, and it's 0:09:17.876 --> 0:09:19.876 certainly a place like Atlanta. There's the reason why I 0:09:19.916 --> 0:09:20.436 love the city. 0:09:25.476 --> 0:09:29.156 And I saw on your website that you do I 0:09:29.156 --> 0:09:32.196 don't know you still do, but hip hop reviews on 0:09:32.236 --> 0:09:34.796 the side. I mean, this is the most Atlanta thing 0:09:34.796 --> 0:09:38.036 I've ever heard in my life. The AI professor Georgia 0:09:38.076 --> 0:09:39.916 Tech who does hip hop stuff on the side. 0:09:40.996 --> 0:09:43.796 Yes, I've been a huge fan of hip hop's it's 0:09:43.836 --> 0:09:47.676 the very beginning, well, certainly the modern hip hop Araasi's 0:09:47.676 --> 0:09:51.556 the very beginning. I did an online hip hop award 0:09:51.596 --> 0:09:55.356 show for about eight years. For a while there had 0:09:55.436 --> 0:09:57.556 the first online black history database. 0:09:58.036 --> 0:10:00.876 And I saw on your lab page everyone gets a 0:10:00.916 --> 0:10:03.316 p funk Dame. Everyone gets a p funk name, p 0:10:03.476 --> 0:10:06.996 Funk being, of course, the nickname of Parliament Funkadelic, the 0:10:07.076 --> 0:10:12.116 legendary funk band started by George Clinton. On Isabel's laboratory website, 0:10:12.316 --> 0:10:16.516 it reads the P in p funk stands for probabilistic, 0:10:17.196 --> 0:10:20.396 as for the funk, it stands for many things as well. 0:10:20.436 --> 0:10:20.876 It should. 0:10:21.356 --> 0:10:25.196 Specific interpretations are left as an exercise for the reader. 0:10:25.476 --> 0:10:27.516 You are atomic dog, you would have to be at home. 0:10:27.596 --> 0:10:30.556 Of course, I'm atomic dog. What a there's no other option? 0:10:31.356 --> 0:10:32.556 How much do I love Atlanta? 0:10:36.076 --> 0:10:36.396 All right? 0:10:37.516 --> 0:10:42.156 Roger Nation twenty four asks on Twitter, why have you 0:10:42.196 --> 0:10:46.236 never made an episode about Kanye West? His career trajectory 0:10:46.276 --> 0:10:50.156 seems like the perfect fit for your podcast. Very very 0:10:50.156 --> 0:10:53.516 good question, Roger Nation twenty four. Let's put it this way. 0:10:53.796 --> 0:10:56.556 It's not for lack of trying, because no one likes 0:10:56.556 --> 0:10:59.276 a celebrity hang more than me. I once met David 0:10:59.316 --> 0:11:02.956 Hasselhoff in Sweden, of all places, got a selfie with him, 0:11:03.036 --> 0:11:04.836 and if you look at the photo, I have this 0:11:04.956 --> 0:11:08.276 big stupid grin on my face, like I'm the happiest 0:11:08.356 --> 0:11:11.996 I've ever been in my life for the Hoff. But 0:11:12.036 --> 0:11:14.596 I have a better story which also, and you're not 0:11:14.596 --> 0:11:21.396 going to believe this involves my favorite city, Atlanta. So 0:11:21.636 --> 0:11:24.316 a couple of years ago, when Kevin Durant was still 0:11:24.356 --> 0:11:27.396 with the Golden State Warriors, they came to Atlanta to 0:11:27.436 --> 0:11:31.396 play the Hawks, and after the game, Quavo of the 0:11:31.396 --> 0:11:35.036 great hip hop group Migos comes up to Durant, and Durant, 0:11:35.076 --> 0:11:38.676 who is like seven feet tall, leans down and takes 0:11:38.716 --> 0:11:41.916 off his jersey and gives it to Quavo. One of 0:11:41.956 --> 0:11:45.316 the greatest basketball players in the world, comes to town 0:11:45.596 --> 0:11:48.956 and pays homage to the king of Atlanta hip hop. 0:11:49.716 --> 0:11:53.196 The picture goes viral. It's a sensation. In fact, you 0:11:53.236 --> 0:11:56.956 should look it up for yourself image Google Quavo and 0:11:57.036 --> 0:12:03.756 Kevin Durant epic pop culture defining moment. Right now, while 0:12:03.756 --> 0:12:07.316 you're at it, look to the right. You'll see a 0:12:07.356 --> 0:12:09.876 bunch of people standing in the background. You might have 0:12:09.916 --> 0:12:13.276 to zoom in a bit. There's a skinny guy wearing 0:12:13.316 --> 0:12:18.236 a beige jacket, glasses, big head of curly hair. Now 0:12:18.276 --> 0:12:23.156 who does that look like? Oh yeah, baby, I love Atlanta. 0:12:24.276 --> 0:12:27.036 We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor, 0:12:38.676 --> 0:12:41.996 We're back with more of your excellent questions. This one's 0:12:41.996 --> 0:12:46.916 from Zoe Rattis. At the conclusion of each Revisionist History episode, 0:12:47.076 --> 0:12:51.636 mister Glapple says original scoring by the next two words 0:12:51.676 --> 0:12:58.156 could be Leuis Scarra, Louise Sierra, lou Wiscerra, or some 0:12:58.276 --> 0:13:00.876 other combo I haven't thought of yet. I would like 0:13:00.916 --> 0:13:03.116 to get in touch with this person, as I think 0:13:03.196 --> 0:13:07.316 their talents are neat and as an aspiring scorewriter myself, 0:13:07.636 --> 0:13:10.276 I hope they might share some fun with me about 0:13:10.276 --> 0:13:12.356 how they came to be in this role. Thank you 0:13:12.436 --> 0:13:16.676 so much, Zoe, Zoe. I am happy to tell you 0:13:16.996 --> 0:13:21.156 his name is Luis Gera g u e r r A. 0:13:21.756 --> 0:13:24.396 He's a musical genius, as should be a parent if 0:13:24.436 --> 0:13:26.636 you've listened to any episode of this show, and I 0:13:26.676 --> 0:13:30.316 will let him answer the rest of your questions himself. 0:13:30.916 --> 0:13:33.396 Well, it's like I would double take to hear Malcolm 0:13:33.396 --> 0:13:36.276 Gladwell and put musical genius with by my name in 0:13:36.316 --> 0:13:37.316 the same sentences. 0:13:37.356 --> 0:13:38.556 A little bit of a what. 0:13:40.476 --> 0:13:43.436 So I mean that's with that said, my name is 0:13:43.516 --> 0:13:47.196 Luis Guerra, you could also say Louis Gera. Totally fine. 0:13:47.396 --> 0:13:50.356 I have two ethnic identities. Go on here, so I 0:13:50.396 --> 0:13:54.316 do compose music for a living. I'm pushing into my 0:13:54.436 --> 0:13:58.076 thirtieth year as like a full time musician. So I 0:13:58.116 --> 0:14:00.356 started really young in my life. I grew up in 0:14:00.356 --> 0:14:03.156 a family where all of us kids, there was four 0:14:03.196 --> 0:14:05.916 of us, we were encouraged and required to play a 0:14:05.996 --> 0:14:08.956 musical instrument, and I sort of jumped around the most. 0:14:09.436 --> 0:14:12.436 So I start out on drums, went to piano, played 0:14:12.436 --> 0:14:14.996 a little guitar, and then ended up playing bass, and 0:14:15.036 --> 0:14:17.756 for whatever reason, stuck with the bass. It wasn't really 0:14:17.796 --> 0:14:20.916 something that I wanted to do for a career. It 0:14:20.956 --> 0:14:24.836 was more about, this is a great way to escape 0:14:25.876 --> 0:14:29.676 things going on in my life. And so then you know, 0:14:29.756 --> 0:14:32.876 long story short. I moved to Austin, Texas in the 0:14:32.916 --> 0:14:37.236 early nineties, and artist, musician, whatever, a creative person, you 0:14:37.276 --> 0:14:39.916 didn't need a lot of money to pay your rent 0:14:39.956 --> 0:14:42.916 and your bills, okay, So as a young person, that 0:14:42.996 --> 0:14:45.796 was a great place to actually like just jump into 0:14:45.796 --> 0:14:49.796 a scene. And I also was a short order line cook, 0:14:49.916 --> 0:14:53.036 and those two things sort of merged later on in 0:14:53.076 --> 0:14:56.036 my life because I started realizing that as people would 0:14:56.036 --> 0:14:57.556 come up and ask for their food to be made, 0:14:57.556 --> 0:14:59.396 they would also sometimes come and ask for me to 0:14:59.476 --> 0:15:02.236 make a piece of music, and you know, either one 0:15:02.276 --> 0:15:10.996 I just would do it podcasting. I was like, I 0:15:11.036 --> 0:15:13.116 didn't think a whole lot of it, honestly, and it 0:15:13.196 --> 0:15:15.076 was just something that like I would, you know, occasionally 0:15:15.116 --> 0:15:17.116 listen to a podcast when I go run or something. 0:15:17.156 --> 0:15:19.356 But when this came up, I knew that this was 0:15:19.396 --> 0:15:22.996 going to be a very serious project, and so I 0:15:23.036 --> 0:15:25.876 was like, heck, yeah, that sounds awesome. The podcast would 0:15:25.876 --> 0:15:28.676 it's things overlooked right and misunderstood, and I think there's 0:15:28.796 --> 0:15:33.036 room to explore musical cliches, and so I'm feeling like 0:15:33.156 --> 0:15:36.596 there's that's sort of the top level down I want 0:15:36.636 --> 0:15:40.796 to take stereotypical ideas sort of that we're there predictable 0:15:40.796 --> 0:15:44.596 and start inverting them and like not just remixing them, 0:15:44.916 --> 0:15:48.436 you know, but actually like really playing with that. Maybe 0:15:48.436 --> 0:15:50.396 there's three things that come to mind and how I 0:15:50.396 --> 0:15:53.796 approach it. One, I wanted the music to be transparent. 0:15:53.996 --> 0:15:56.716 I don't want it to stand out so that it's 0:15:56.796 --> 0:15:59.796 just overshadowing, right and like overtaking and like wow, that's 0:15:59.796 --> 0:16:01.876 a really great piece of music or that's a really 0:16:01.876 --> 0:16:04.396 great sound, but then you forget whatever the topic was. 0:16:04.636 --> 0:16:06.676 The other one is I wanted to support and evolve 0:16:06.716 --> 0:16:08.956 and be interesting, so that if you actually do find 0:16:08.996 --> 0:16:12.196 yourself thinking about the music, you're like, well, what is that? 0:16:12.236 --> 0:16:14.476 What's the sound? What's going on? And then the other 0:16:14.676 --> 0:16:17.076 is like, I want it to be flexible. I do 0:16:17.196 --> 0:16:20.196 imagine this music could be performed live. I've thought about 0:16:20.196 --> 0:16:22.556 Revision's History. I had this team of producers is like 0:16:22.596 --> 0:16:24.796 a band. We've been in this band for five years, 0:16:24.836 --> 0:16:27.196 you know, and sometimes the band gets bigger and more 0:16:27.196 --> 0:16:30.636 producers step in and they're like, we're all supporting Malcolm, 0:16:30.636 --> 0:16:37.476 who's the front man. So how do I shape the 0:16:37.556 --> 0:16:44.756 music to sound to match Malcolm's voice on Revision's History. Well, 0:16:45.236 --> 0:16:48.356 it's a little trick in composing for media, but every 0:16:48.396 --> 0:16:52.196 speaker has some sort of tonality to their voice. So 0:16:53.076 --> 0:16:55.396 if I can find that, then I can actually make 0:16:55.476 --> 0:16:59.716 things sound more harmonious. But if I wanted to create tension, 0:16:59.876 --> 0:17:02.076 then I can actually like create you right in a 0:17:02.156 --> 0:17:07.916 key to be sort of juxtaposed or to clash specifically 0:17:07.956 --> 0:17:10.596 with the voice. So for malcol voice, there's a few 0:17:10.996 --> 0:17:15.116 tonal centers that I do. If you listen to Revision's 0:17:15.116 --> 0:17:17.716 History music, there are tonal centers that I pick frequently 0:17:18.196 --> 0:17:22.716 that really I feel like support his voice. So there's 0:17:22.876 --> 0:17:26.556 a mysterious element to this, Right, I want to pull 0:17:26.996 --> 0:17:30.316 from the cliche that I'm referencing, but I also want 0:17:30.356 --> 0:17:32.796 it to be done in a revision's history sort of way. 0:17:33.676 --> 0:17:37.396 So in this situation, there's marimba, right, But a marimba 0:17:37.436 --> 0:17:39.556 to me, with like a certain amount of delay and 0:17:39.636 --> 0:17:43.996 reverb is going to put the listener into this zone 0:17:44.076 --> 0:17:45.636 even if they don't know what, they're going to immediately 0:17:45.636 --> 0:17:48.796 feel like, hmm, what's going on here? 0:17:49.156 --> 0:17:49.396 You know? 0:17:49.556 --> 0:17:51.676 And so it's a device, if you will. And I 0:17:51.676 --> 0:17:55.956 think that's what composers do. Every day's a new adventure 0:17:56.036 --> 0:17:56.636 at studio. 0:17:57.116 --> 0:17:57.476 I can't. 0:17:57.476 --> 0:17:59.676 I mean, it's I don't know, it's a fun job. 0:17:59.756 --> 0:18:01.276 I could think of worse things to be doing. 0:18:02.396 --> 0:18:11.916 Thank you, Louise for five years of making me sound fantastic. Okay, 0:18:12.116 --> 0:18:14.996 back to listener mail bag. And I have to warn you, 0:18:14.996 --> 0:18:17.116 you know how like a fleeting moment can inspire a 0:18:17.156 --> 0:18:21.156 whole novel that takes years to complete. This one is 0:18:21.236 --> 0:18:26.676 kind of like that. Jonathan Walfitz asks on Twitter, what 0:18:26.716 --> 0:18:28.676 do you do when you feel like you've reached a 0:18:28.716 --> 0:18:32.836 dead end in a story. Very very good question, Jonathan. 0:18:33.476 --> 0:18:36.316 This actually happened to us last season when we were 0:18:36.316 --> 0:18:38.796 in the middle of doing the episode about the tangled 0:18:38.836 --> 0:18:43.436 provenance of van Go's Vaz with Carnations. Here's a little 0:18:43.436 --> 0:18:47.276 piece of that story. In nineteen fifty six, Kirk Douglas 0:18:47.316 --> 0:18:51.116 started a movie about van Go called Lust for Life. 0:18:51.716 --> 0:18:54.836 Few people know the real story of this intense, strong 0:18:54.916 --> 0:18:58.836 willed man. Now his tumultuous career is revealed for the 0:18:58.876 --> 0:19:02.836 first time with frankness and intimacy, with all that lust 0:19:02.876 --> 0:19:03.196 for life. 0:19:03.196 --> 0:19:04.916 If you look at the corner of the movie poster 0:19:05.036 --> 0:19:08.276 for Lust for Life, there it is Vaz with Carnations. 0:19:09.116 --> 0:19:11.596 If by then gets it sold it. He didn't hang 0:19:11.636 --> 0:19:13.076 on to his van Go the way he did his 0:19:13.116 --> 0:19:16.716 other treasures. It wasn't for him. The painting passed to 0:19:16.756 --> 0:19:20.476 the heiress to the Kmart fortune, Katherine Kresgy, who, among 0:19:20.476 --> 0:19:23.716 other things, was once married to a Swedish baron. She 0:19:23.876 --> 0:19:26.436 convinced him to leave London and come live with her 0:19:26.476 --> 0:19:31.716 in her native Detroit. Perhaps unsurprisingly, the Swedish baron's order 0:19:31.716 --> 0:19:34.596 for Miss Gresgy did not survive the move to Michigan. 0:19:35.556 --> 0:19:38.516 When Kresgy died in nineteen ninety, she willed Vaz with 0:19:38.556 --> 0:19:42.036 Carnations to the Detroit Institute of Arts. She gave it 0:19:42.076 --> 0:19:45.676 without restriction, meaning the Dea, as it's known, could do 0:19:45.796 --> 0:19:48.596 with it what they wanted, sell it, trade it. They 0:19:48.596 --> 0:19:50.716 didn't have to make it part of their permanent collection. 0:19:51.756 --> 0:19:54.756 Kresgy clearly didn't care any more for the painting than 0:19:54.796 --> 0:19:58.596 Gets did, and neither did the Dia. They put it 0:19:58.676 --> 0:20:02.396 in her basement for twenty years. Vincent van Goh painted 0:20:02.436 --> 0:20:07.956 many remarkable canvasses. This is not one of them. While 0:20:08.036 --> 0:20:10.996 we were reporting this epit, we had to solve a problem, 0:20:11.276 --> 0:20:13.716 which was we didn't know whether the van Go was 0:20:13.756 --> 0:20:17.236 a fake. So I said to my producer, Elouise Linton, 0:20:17.716 --> 0:20:21.796 can we find out? Thinking foolishly, it would be easy. 0:20:22.796 --> 0:20:25.836 Eloise starts with a curator at the Detroit Institute of 0:20:25.916 --> 0:20:28.916 Arts named George, who went on the record years ago 0:20:29.076 --> 0:20:31.796 to say that he thought Vaz with Carnations was a fake. 0:20:32.156 --> 0:20:36.716 I call his home in Maine. He doesn't answer. I 0:20:36.796 --> 0:20:40.556 leave a message. I call again. His wife picks up. 0:20:41.876 --> 0:20:44.676 I tell her what I'm asking about, and she says 0:20:44.836 --> 0:20:47.076 they're going on a trip and if I call back. 0:20:46.956 --> 0:20:47.676 They won't be there. 0:20:49.916 --> 0:20:53.276 This was the beginning of the pandemic. April, Eloise and 0:20:53.316 --> 0:20:56.396 I had started having these zoom calls where we shared 0:20:56.436 --> 0:20:57.276 our frustrations. 0:20:57.876 --> 0:21:03.556 That's one little weird fact. Number One, he's retired, he's 0:21:03.596 --> 0:21:05.236 living in Maine. He doesn't want to talk about a 0:21:05.276 --> 0:21:08.996 painting that he neither liked nor thought was real. 0:21:09.556 --> 0:21:11.316 Next, what was next? What happened next? 0:21:11.796 --> 0:21:16.036 Then Eloise tries a prominent art journalist who'd written extensively 0:21:16.076 --> 0:21:19.916 about Bengo. As soon as she mentions Vaz with Carnations, 0:21:20.196 --> 0:21:23.316 the guy disappears. Then she just starts calling up big 0:21:23.396 --> 0:21:26.876 name Bengo experts, one after another, same thing. 0:21:27.276 --> 0:21:30.516 I told him I was thinking about Days of Carnations, 0:21:30.556 --> 0:21:33.556 and he stopped replying, and then I followed up two 0:21:33.556 --> 0:21:35.796 weeks later because someone had recommended. 0:21:35.836 --> 0:21:37.916 I talked to him and. 0:21:38.636 --> 0:21:41.076 He said that he would speak to me this morning, 0:21:42.236 --> 0:21:45.916 and then when I called his office, they said he 0:21:46.036 --> 0:21:49.876 wasn't there, and then I emailed him and he never responded. 0:21:50.556 --> 0:21:53.756 Understand, this is not the Mona Lisa we're talking about. 0:21:54.236 --> 0:21:58.996 Vaz with Carnations is a third rate. Maybe Bengo. It 0:21:59.076 --> 0:22:01.876 spent much of its life over the past few decades 0:22:02.116 --> 0:22:05.356 in the basement of the Detroit Institute of Arts and 0:22:05.436 --> 0:22:08.796 also understand that we're doing this reporting while the entire 0:22:08.836 --> 0:22:11.756 world is at home. Do you know how easy it 0:22:11.836 --> 0:22:14.876 is to get people to talk during lockdown. It's been 0:22:14.916 --> 0:22:18.116 the most fantastic stretch of reporting in my thirty five 0:22:18.196 --> 0:22:20.916 years in journalism. I could get the Pope on the 0:22:20.996 --> 0:22:23.436 phone if I want it, because he's sitting in his 0:22:23.476 --> 0:22:27.716 palazzo like everyone else doing nothing but watching Italian Netflix. 0:22:28.556 --> 0:22:31.716 Everyone was available except art people. 0:22:33.156 --> 0:22:34.836 I talked to the lawyer on the other side of 0:22:34.836 --> 0:22:38.356 that controversy and he says insists everything has to be 0:22:38.396 --> 0:22:42.316 on background, and then sends me this long email in 0:22:42.356 --> 0:22:44.636 which he tells me something that it's like totally obvious, 0:22:44.636 --> 0:22:47.836 like I could have gotten off Wikipedia and says, you 0:22:48.236 --> 0:22:49.836 can use that, but only on background. 0:22:50.116 --> 0:22:55.436 This is this random painting which isn't any good, which 0:22:56.596 --> 0:22:58.436 we thought was fake for years and years and years, 0:22:58.716 --> 0:23:00.396 and the whole world doesn't want to talk about it, 0:23:00.956 --> 0:23:05.476 not even till little old us. Yeah, who knows what 0:23:05.796 --> 0:23:06.116 I mean. 0:23:06.636 --> 0:23:10.236 I can't understand why unless we're just being part of 0:23:10.236 --> 0:23:13.596