WEBVTT - Bonus: In Conversation with Alicia Keys 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:11.680 Family Secrets as a production of I Heart Radio. I'm 0:00:11.760 --> 0:00:15.480 Danny Shapiro and this is a very special bonus episode 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:19.159 of Family Secrets. I love every single one of my 0:00:19.160 --> 0:00:22.319 guests on Family Secrets, but I have to say this 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:28.040 particular guest and conversation blew me away. I learned so 0:00:28.120 --> 0:00:33.239 much from to get ready for it, the extraordinary, brilliantly gifted, 0:00:33.760 --> 0:00:43.839 strong and powerful human being, Alicia Keys. Alicia, thank you 0:00:43.920 --> 0:00:47.760 so much for joining me on Family Secrets. I'm just 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:50.839 honored and delighted to have you on as a as 0:00:50.880 --> 0:00:54.319 a special guest. I couldn't be more excited too. I'm 0:00:54.440 --> 0:00:57.800 very happy to speak to you. So I started this 0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:02.240 podcast after having discovered my own family secrets and after 0:01:02.280 --> 0:01:05.880 a lifetime of writing about them without knowing why. And 0:01:05.920 --> 0:01:09.959 I realized how much we hide from ourselves and what 0:01:10.160 --> 0:01:14.360 liberation can happen when we speak to our deepest truth. 0:01:15.280 --> 0:01:20.000 And your journey, which you tell so beautifully in your 0:01:20.000 --> 0:01:24.959 new book More Myself, seems to explore so clearly this 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:30.720 path towards deeper knowing, which is of course a lifetime's work, 0:01:31.000 --> 0:01:34.000 and it kept on striking me as I was reading 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:39.440 your book that it's a spiritual journey that you take 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:45.160 us on. Would you agree with that? M wow, Um, 0:01:45.200 --> 0:01:50.400 absolutely absolutely, because I think it's the deepest uncovering, finding 0:01:50.440 --> 0:01:53.160 your way to yourself and your truth and and that 0:01:53.280 --> 0:01:56.440 is a spiritual process. That's like an opening and revelation, 0:01:56.920 --> 0:02:03.240 a searching of seeking um a rawness. So yeah, I do. 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:08.320 And I think even even more so the confidence to 0:02:10.080 --> 0:02:13.240 try to see yourself and to be brave enough to 0:02:13.320 --> 0:02:17.119 look at it and hear yourself and all those things 0:02:17.120 --> 0:02:20.880 that I personally have found, um is part of what 0:02:20.919 --> 0:02:24.880 I'm learning more and more and demanding of myself. So yeah, 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:27.240 I love that idea of being a spiritual journey for sure. 0:02:27.760 --> 0:02:32.799 Given the moment that we're having this conversation, there's a 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:35.600 really brief passage in your book that I just want 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:40.480 to read. It's fairly early on, and you're right, nothing 0:02:40.880 --> 0:02:46.520 but uncertainty is certain circumstances come together only to fall 0:02:46.560 --> 0:02:49.280 apart moments or months later, and then in a flash, 0:02:49.280 --> 0:02:51.960 we must rise up and regain our footing. In the 0:02:52.000 --> 0:02:54.800 rear view mirror, I now see so clearly what escaped me. 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:58.600 Then It's not that the ground underneath me was suddenly shifting. 0:02:59.000 --> 0:03:01.959 It's that it's never ill. That's part of the work 0:03:02.000 --> 0:03:08.240 of my journey getting comfortable with life's groundlessness. Yeah, that 0:03:08.440 --> 0:03:13.079 is so true. It's wild when we have our own 0:03:13.080 --> 0:03:15.560 words kind of like spoken back to us, it's like, yeah, 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:19.480 that's right, it is so true. I mean, I think 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:22.959 about that so much, even in the context of as 0:03:23.240 --> 0:03:26.440 as we are all discovering who we are and figuring 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:29.760 out who we are and finding you know, our base 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:32.800 and our truths and and and all of these things, 0:03:32.800 --> 0:03:37.600 and especially me as I'm discovering that it's always shifting 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:40.760 and it's always kind of coming back to me UM, 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:43.960 demanding to know if I actually learned the lesson or 0:03:44.000 --> 0:03:48.160 if I can just recited well. And that's a really 0:03:48.360 --> 0:03:51.160 big one because a lot of times I find that 0:03:52.200 --> 0:03:54.440 I'll be tested, and we'll all be tested in these 0:03:54.440 --> 0:03:59.920 small ways, UM, especially tested about will I choose myself, 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:04.160 Will I be willing to say more nose, Will I 0:04:04.240 --> 0:04:08.280 be willing to understand and and really listen to myself 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:12.320 internally and and and be comfortable with what I think 0:04:12.480 --> 0:04:15.600 as opposed to looking for the validation from the outside 0:04:15.640 --> 0:04:19.280 world or from people I trust, even um and and 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:21.159 and these tests they keep coming back to me and 0:04:21.160 --> 0:04:24.760 coming back to me. And sometimes you know, Danny, I 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:27.359 I don't do that well, and I'm like, damn, there, 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:30.320 I did it again. I already know this. Why am 0:04:30.320 --> 0:04:33.679 I finding myself in this place? And sometimes I really 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:36.600 do get it and I say, no, that's not what 0:04:36.640 --> 0:04:38.400 I need to do right now. And I'm very strong 0:04:38.480 --> 0:04:41.279 and clear and it's crystal, and I'm so proud because 0:04:41.320 --> 0:04:44.839 I didn't have to second gather doubt or whatever. But 0:04:44.920 --> 0:04:47.839 it is definitely always the shift. It's always shifting. I 0:04:47.880 --> 0:04:51.200 think we're always learning something new. We're always being asked 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:54.680 to remember what we already know um and and do 0:04:54.760 --> 0:04:57.599 it some more. Uh So it is for sure, that 0:04:57.760 --> 0:05:01.200 is so true. Thanks for reading that. I think your 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:04.520 your book speaks to that so beautifully because no one 0:05:04.520 --> 0:05:06.880 of the things that struck me as I was reading it, 0:05:06.920 --> 0:05:11.520 I was thinking, you know, I would be immersed in 0:05:11.920 --> 0:05:16.799 these life lessons whether this book was written by Alicia 0:05:16.880 --> 0:05:20.599 Keys or not. You know, like it wasn't you. You 0:05:20.800 --> 0:05:23.359 you write at one point, fame for the sake of 0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:26.680 fame has never been the dream. But spreading light is 0:05:26.680 --> 0:05:32.000 a pleasure I'll always live for. And that's what your 0:05:32.040 --> 0:05:35.440 story feels like to me, it's and it also strikes 0:05:35.480 --> 0:05:38.719 me that that's part of what's allowed you to become 0:05:38.800 --> 0:05:41.719 you again and again and again over the course of 0:05:41.720 --> 0:05:48.039 your life thus far, is that spreading light is what 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:55.120 keeps us honest and open and moving out of ourselves 0:05:55.160 --> 0:05:57.799 and into the deepest parts of ourselves but not into 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:00.920 like what the world is looking for are from us? 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:06.320 And you know, you you cover the span of your 0:06:06.400 --> 0:06:11.080 life pretty much from your childhood growing up in New 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:16.480 York City to pretty close to the present. And one 0:06:16.520 --> 0:06:18.279 of the things that it seems like it's about to 0:06:18.360 --> 0:06:24.159 me is when you became hugely famous really young, and 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:28.120 there's this really sweet moment where you know, you're you're 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:31.800 twenty years old and you've just been on Oprah and 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:37.760 you've played on Oprah's you know, sort of massive stage, 0:06:38.240 --> 0:06:42.200 and you fly home and somebody recognizes you in the 0:06:42.240 --> 0:06:44.480 airport and you think, do I know you? Oh? No, 0:06:44.800 --> 0:06:47.880 Like I'm actually just being recognized. And then you're back 0:06:47.920 --> 0:06:51.600 in your neighborhood and you're in your mom's neighborhood and 0:06:51.720 --> 0:06:54.760 you're you're you're walking around and you write something like 0:06:55.240 --> 0:06:57.520 I was probably out like going to the to the 0:06:57.560 --> 0:06:59.839 fake I d place because I wasn't twenty one yet. 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:06.920 And it's like so often people who are told who 0:07:06.920 --> 0:07:10.200 they are by the world, or that they're great, that 0:07:10.280 --> 0:07:12.160 they have greatness, or that they have a great gift 0:07:12.440 --> 0:07:17.840 when they're that young can't handle it, you know, can't 0:07:18.440 --> 0:07:21.480 lose themselves or never have a chance to find themselves. 0:07:21.600 --> 0:07:25.600 And yours is a story of finding yourself over and 0:07:25.720 --> 0:07:28.760 over again. And I'm just wondering, how what do you 0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:34.160 think gave you the inner compass to do that, to 0:07:34.400 --> 0:07:39.280 just keep your feet on the ground. Wow, Oh man, 0:07:39.360 --> 0:07:41.360 you know there's so many parts of that that that 0:07:41.360 --> 0:07:45.120 that just brought up for me. Um, even the part 0:07:45.200 --> 0:07:48.200 where it was you know, over has been such a 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:50.480 beautiful mentor to so many of us in the world 0:07:50.560 --> 0:07:53.160 because we you know, even before I knew her personally, 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:55.880 she was a you know, somebody that I that I 0:07:55.920 --> 0:07:58.920 looked up to and that I thought such a powerful 0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:02.320 force from good. And that was the first person that 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:05.680 I actually recognized. I remember being so clear seeing her 0:08:05.680 --> 0:08:07.960 and realizing that you could not only be in a 0:08:08.400 --> 0:08:13.240 extremely powerful business person, but also on a side of good. 0:08:13.640 --> 0:08:17.320 And I think so many times we witnessed people who 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:21.400 are very, very successful. Um, and I don't know, you know, 0:08:21.400 --> 0:08:24.360 it's like kind of by any means necessary cutthroat. You know, 0:08:24.480 --> 0:08:25.960 they'll just like do whatever they have to do to 0:08:26.000 --> 0:08:29.400 follow the dollar. The dollar is king, and and and 0:08:29.480 --> 0:08:32.400 obviously that doesn't lead us in any good place, which 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:33.760 is you know, I think a lot of what we're 0:08:33.840 --> 0:08:38.200 flowing now as a as a global family just recognizing, um, 0:08:38.240 --> 0:08:41.000 the different unfairnesses that we're seeing all around us, and 0:08:41.080 --> 0:08:42.880 so a lot of that is all is always led 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:45.640 by greed. So so I think that was such a 0:08:45.679 --> 0:08:49.480 powerful recognition for me and so to be able to 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:51.400 meet her and perform on her show, and for her 0:08:51.440 --> 0:08:54.240 to embrace my song, and and then to come back 0:08:54.520 --> 0:08:56.640 to my neighborhood and come back on the plane, and 0:08:56.679 --> 0:09:00.120 for people to actually be recognizing me and and have 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:04.040 been touched by that moment. I remember I actually distinctly 0:09:04.280 --> 0:09:06.480 not only do that film them a great pride, of course, 0:09:07.200 --> 0:09:10.160 an excitement because whoa who would have ever imagined and 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:12.520 the these things that you dream about and when they 0:09:12.559 --> 0:09:15.080 start to come to fruition, you can't believe it. But 0:09:15.160 --> 0:09:21.120 I also remember becoming very self conscious, very self conscious, 0:09:21.160 --> 0:09:23.959 and almost um to the place where I always wanted 0:09:24.000 --> 0:09:27.120 to hide, And I do believe that that's the beginning 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:30.040 of some of the ways that I started to kind 0:09:30.040 --> 0:09:33.960 of tucked myself away and and put on what I've 0:09:34.000 --> 0:09:37.640 definitely referred to as an armor. And that's saying that 0:09:37.679 --> 0:09:41.040 we just kind of that wall, that feel that we 0:09:41.160 --> 0:09:43.080 put on so that we can get through the day 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:48.760 and and kind of not exposed to much of ourselves personally, 0:09:48.920 --> 0:09:52.000 and and to be able to just kind of handle everything. 0:09:52.040 --> 0:09:54.320 And and I know that for a lot of my life, 0:09:54.360 --> 0:09:59.360 I've been unwinding that armor, that steel, that wall. Um 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:02.040 that I think was a direct result of that kind 0:10:02.080 --> 0:10:05.800 of immediate attention that I just I didn't know how 0:10:05.840 --> 0:10:08.480 to handle it, and I it was just a girl 0:10:08.600 --> 0:10:11.480 from Hell's Kitchen and Harlem, and man, I didn't know 0:10:11.520 --> 0:10:14.400 what to do with is so um. So I think 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:18.480 that in a way that it is something that I've 0:10:18.520 --> 0:10:22.720 also been unwinding for myself. But I think the way 0:10:22.760 --> 0:10:24.760 I was able to keep my feet some you know, 0:10:24.800 --> 0:10:28.280 on the ground through it all also was because of 0:10:28.320 --> 0:10:36.120 this almost desire to stay normal whatever, to be a 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:40.600 normal human being who could actually you know, just it's 0:10:40.600 --> 0:10:43.120 who I've always been, who have always been I didn't 0:10:43.160 --> 0:10:44.920 want that to be taken away from me. I didn't 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:48.040 want to not recognize myself. I was I think I 0:10:48.120 --> 0:10:50.559 was very afraid of not being able to recognize myself, 0:10:50.800 --> 0:10:53.480 to the point where I stifled my growth in a 0:10:53.520 --> 0:10:56.400 lot of ways because I just wanted to recognize the 0:10:56.440 --> 0:10:59.560 person I've always known. But that's impossible because they're growing, 0:10:59.640 --> 0:11:02.679 and we have to grow, and we should allow ourselves 0:11:02.720 --> 0:11:04.880 to grow, and we shouldn't meet the new parts of ourselves. 0:11:04.920 --> 0:11:09.720 And that's only something that I recognize now, many years later. Um. 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:11.920 So it's so amazing how all these things kind of 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.840 happened at one time and later you kind of see 0:11:14.920 --> 0:11:17.400 what it's all for. And I think the real reason 0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:19.480 I was able to be grounded is because my mother 0:11:20.160 --> 0:11:25.840 is so such a little firecracker, Like she is so phenomenal, 0:11:26.000 --> 0:11:28.600 and she's always just she raised me a single mother, 0:11:28.760 --> 0:11:31.760 and you know, there's a certain and you know, there 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:35.120 was just a certain humbleness that was had to be 0:11:35.320 --> 0:11:36.959 just because that's the way that we live in the 0:11:37.120 --> 0:11:41.280 circumstances we were in. And she was always big on like, well, 0:11:41.360 --> 0:11:43.959 how do you think that makes somebody else feel? And 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:45.760 you know, would you want to be treated like that, 0:11:45.920 --> 0:11:48.600 and she would always give me these big, big ideas, 0:11:48.640 --> 0:11:52.600 these big lessons, these golden rules, these things that would 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:55.160 stuck stuck with me a lot, And I think that 0:11:55.360 --> 0:11:58.199 was how I was able to stay on the ground 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:01.440 and stay very grounded because of her guidance in the 0:12:01.480 --> 0:12:05.000 way that she was very honest in law and even 0:12:05.040 --> 0:12:07.280 when things started going she you know, she couldn't be 0:12:07.360 --> 0:12:10.400 less impressed. You wanted to do that. People were taking 0:12:10.480 --> 0:12:12.720 advantage of me, you know, because I was a kid 0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:17.160 of sixteen seventeen, you know, so so um and I 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:19.600 get it. So it's it's I think she's a big 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:22.079 part of how I was able to stay in that 0:12:22.160 --> 0:12:25.920 grounded space. We'll be back in a moment with more 0:12:25.960 --> 0:12:34.920 family secrets. The part of your book it maybe actually 0:12:34.960 --> 0:12:39.400 get a little cheery. Your wise Nana, your father's mother, 0:12:40.040 --> 0:12:44.120 and the way that you describe her UM actually really 0:12:44.160 --> 0:12:46.440 reminded me. I've in my work, I've written a lot 0:12:46.480 --> 0:12:48.880 about an elderly aunt of mine, my aunt Shirley, who's 0:12:48.920 --> 0:12:57.080 now and the wisdom like the the the kind of pure, 0:12:57.200 --> 0:13:02.840 unadulterated wisdom just filter down to you by your grandmother 0:13:02.920 --> 0:13:06.320 who Um, who loved you so much and who you loved. 0:13:06.360 --> 0:13:09.080 And we don't need a lot of people like that 0:13:09.200 --> 0:13:12.160 in our lives, but we need, you know, one or 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:15.040 two if we're lucky, that give us that sense of 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:18.240 um And would you would you say that that Nana 0:13:18.360 --> 0:13:22.080 also was part of that grounding for you? Oh my gosh, 0:13:22.120 --> 0:13:24.400 so much. You know. One of my favorite things people 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:26.800 tell me is that I'm so much like my Nanna. 0:13:26.920 --> 0:13:29.200 And when people tell me that, like that our spirits 0:13:29.840 --> 0:13:34.240 are similar and that we even look similarly, it's the biggest, 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:37.400 biggest compliment that I can ever be given, because to me, 0:13:37.520 --> 0:13:41.800 she was everything, just everything. She just invited, you know, 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:45.320 she just embodied such a kindness, such a thoughtfulness, such 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:48.920 a spirit of soul. Is not a person that didn't 0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:51.000 know her the way that she walked in alone, she 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:54.240 filled it. She filled the whole room that she she 0:13:54.600 --> 0:13:57.720 every kid on the street team, every kid at the school. 0:13:57.800 --> 0:14:00.440 She was you know, she was that involved. You know, 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:03.280 I remember all the time coming in being a bed 0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:06.360 or her. The kitchen's table was filled with cards that 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:09.679 she was sending card this that she was sending to 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:13.040 people to remember an event, to remember an occasion, to 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:15.400 tell them that she loved them, Like these things that 0:14:15.480 --> 0:14:18.000 she would just do was just you know, that spirit 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:22.480 that was so president and so thoughtful and and so 0:14:22.720 --> 0:14:24.960 to me. She I learned so much from her. I 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:27.720 just that strength that she had in a way that 0:14:27.760 --> 0:14:30.640 she was like a leader in those ways, and and 0:14:30.640 --> 0:14:35.119 and such a giver, you know, like a lover. So um, definitely, 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:36.640 I think she also came to the ground in this 0:14:36.800 --> 0:14:39.720 especially that time which I don't even know, No, I 0:14:39.720 --> 0:14:41.840 don't even think I wrote this in the book. When 0:14:42.280 --> 0:14:45.320 I Um, she told me we were going to like 0:14:45.440 --> 0:14:47.600 church or something, and she was bringing me somewhere special. 0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:48.920 She was bringing me, and she put me in it's 0:14:49.000 --> 0:14:52.320 really pretty dressed and she told me, you know, I said, 0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:55.160 I'm going outside. She's like, do not get distress dirty. 0:14:55.440 --> 0:14:58.200 And I was playing with my friends and we were 0:14:58.280 --> 0:15:00.600 jumping over a thing and I didn't lize that like 0:15:00.680 --> 0:15:04.720 the the hose had prayed the dirt and the dirt slippery. 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:07.040 And when I jumped over the thing we were jumping over, 0:15:07.120 --> 0:15:09.240 I slipped in my shoes and my white dress and 0:15:09.280 --> 0:15:12.240 I found them mud and exactly what she told me 0:15:12.320 --> 0:15:13.800 not to do happen. And I went back in the 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:16.720 house and I know she was so upset at me. 0:15:16.800 --> 0:15:19.120 She was so upset at me because she specifically told 0:15:19.120 --> 0:15:22.000 me don't get dirty, and she just looked at me, 0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:28.200 and that look crushed me harder then if she yelled 0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:31.720 and screamed and you know, flapped the back of my hand. 0:15:31.920 --> 0:15:35.280 It crushed me so hard to disappoint her, you know, 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:39.320 more than any type of physical anything that she could 0:15:39.320 --> 0:15:43.080 have done. And again, such a testament to that shrink 0:15:43.240 --> 0:15:46.360 to that, like, you know what what that does to you, 0:15:46.400 --> 0:15:50.280 that that that beautiful poise that she she had well 0:15:51.080 --> 0:15:54.640 and definitely locked of life lessons that she gave me too. 0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:58.080 So she was another big part of my ground and 0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:00.640 a very important woman in my life that I think 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:04.000 showed me what a woman looks like. I love that 0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:06.200 you said that people you know say to you that 0:16:06.200 --> 0:16:08.840 that you you remind them of of your Nana. Because 0:16:09.400 --> 0:16:11.360 one of the things that it felt like to me 0:16:11.480 --> 0:16:16.080 was that the lessons, those life lessons that she transmitted 0:16:16.120 --> 0:16:22.000 to you, um, you're transmitting in in in your through 0:16:22.040 --> 0:16:25.760 your journey and in your story. Um. She you know, 0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:30.120 there was a lot there about forgiveness and and there 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:34.040 are just these places where you, um, you really talk 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:38.360 to us. You know, you talked to the reader um 0:16:38.400 --> 0:16:44.840 about these kind of universal values of um. You know 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:48.200 what it is to forgive, and she really urges you 0:16:48.280 --> 0:16:50.080 to do that. You know that there there are more 0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:53.400 important things, more important things than holding onto an old 0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:57.040 story doesn't change the story. It just changes you and 0:16:57.480 --> 0:17:01.560 hardens your heart. And it seems like so much of 0:17:02.120 --> 0:17:06.200 the way that your growth has happened is about opening 0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:10.200 your heart, not closing it, opening your palms not clenching them. 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:15.760 Mm hmmmmmmmm No, yes, see, totally. And and as she 0:17:16.119 --> 0:17:18.800 you know, I thought that was it's so right, and 0:17:18.840 --> 0:17:22.920 actually became you know, she passed away. She had cancer, 0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:27.639 and as she became more sick, I remember, and I 0:17:27.680 --> 0:17:29.560 spoke about this, and I'm sure we've all felt like 0:17:29.640 --> 0:17:32.080 this in some way or another, but I remember being 0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:35.560 quite upset that I didn't feel like I saw the 0:17:35.600 --> 0:17:38.119 amount of people that I know that she wrote all 0:17:38.160 --> 0:17:43.199 those letters and spent all this all this time and 0:17:43.359 --> 0:17:46.920 energy and efforts with and and I you know, I 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:49.840 remember I felt a little bit frustrated, like where are they? 0:17:49.960 --> 0:17:53.280 Where are they? And you know, even Craig, my father, 0:17:53.480 --> 0:17:57.600 who was feeling now that I can be more empathetic 0:17:57.600 --> 0:18:02.960 and understanding about how difficult you know, seeing your mother, 0:18:03.359 --> 0:18:07.399 you know, the approaching a transition, you know, at death. 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:11.120 I didn't understand even he. I was like, where is he? 0:18:11.680 --> 0:18:14.919 And I know now that that was so hard for 0:18:15.000 --> 0:18:18.480 him to come to terms with. Um. You know, I've 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:21.400 learned a lot more grace and a lot more empathy 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:25.960 in the you know, over time and um. But she 0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:29.159 she had this these thoughts and she knew already that, 0:18:29.760 --> 0:18:31.680 you know, she was. She was so clear that you 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:34.720 you can't change people, You can't make people who you 0:18:34.760 --> 0:18:36.280 want them to be. And I said, what are you 0:18:36.280 --> 0:18:38.919 talking about? You gotta tell people what you think, and 0:18:38.960 --> 0:18:40.920 how do they know if you don't tell them? And 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:44.879 you gotta you know, it's all and she's like, you 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:47.720 you can't. It's spending so much energy trying to do 0:18:47.840 --> 0:18:51.840 something that may just disappoint you. And that's something I 0:18:51.920 --> 0:18:55.119 never learned for a long time. And again, not to 0:18:55.160 --> 0:18:59.720 get it confused. I do believe that you should express 0:18:59.720 --> 0:19:02.000 your truth. And I don't think that just because you 0:19:02.080 --> 0:19:05.280 may get disappointed means you should not express your truth 0:19:05.440 --> 0:19:09.000 or should not do something that you deeply know you 0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:11.320 need to. So I don't want it to get my construed. 0:19:11.440 --> 0:19:14.720 But um, but there was a knowing like this wise 0:19:15.920 --> 0:19:20.719 wisdom and knowing that people are as they are, and 0:19:20.760 --> 0:19:23.200 if you can actually accept that, then you can decide 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:26.280 what to do with it. You can decide, you know what, 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:29.000 I that person is that way and I choose to 0:19:29.760 --> 0:19:33.080 not interface with that person as much, or that person 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:35.040 is that way, and I'm okay with that because I 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:37.760 know they're like that, and I'm I can accept that. 0:19:38.080 --> 0:19:39.960 Whatever you're gonna do with it, at least you can 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:42.600 choose what you want to do with it, as opposed 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:45.920 to you know, emotions taking you everywhere, you know, because 0:19:45.960 --> 0:19:48.400 you want somebody to do what you want them to do. 0:19:48.480 --> 0:19:51.960 So there's been so amazing. She still feed me all 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:57.240 the time. Yeah, I totally can imagine. We'll be right back. 0:20:02.320 --> 0:20:04.600 I'd love to know a little bit about what was 0:20:04.680 --> 0:20:10.080 the spark, like, what was the impetus? Um, it's not 0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:13.320 like you don't have enough going on. What why did 0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:17.840 you decide to share this journey in this way? And 0:20:18.200 --> 0:20:19.959 I mean, at one point I think you compared it 0:20:20.000 --> 0:20:26.520 to you know, it's creating an album takes a lot 0:20:26.560 --> 0:20:30.040 of time and a lot of care and a lot 0:20:30.040 --> 0:20:32.800 of thought about what belongs with what you know, which 0:20:32.840 --> 0:20:35.560 is similar I think too writing a book book? What 0:20:35.680 --> 0:20:40.359 made you I want to do it? Now? You know, 0:20:41.080 --> 0:20:43.520 it's been a as you know, it's been a little 0:20:43.520 --> 0:20:46.400 while since I actually had the thought to do it 0:20:46.400 --> 0:20:49.680 has It takes on quite some time, right, far more 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:55.119 time than I possibly ever expected. So at the time 0:20:55.160 --> 0:20:59.679 when I was first considering this idea, UM, it was 0:20:59.760 --> 0:21:03.040 really right around the album that I put out called 0:21:03.160 --> 0:21:06.479 Here and Here was a really this is the album 0:21:06.560 --> 0:21:11.440 before the one that I'm putting out UM next, which 0:21:11.480 --> 0:21:16.480 is called Alicia. But here Um was really a transformational 0:21:16.560 --> 0:21:21.760 time for me, and it completely made me look at 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:24.919 myself in a way I never had before. And it 0:21:24.960 --> 0:21:29.160 made me look at um the world in a way 0:21:29.160 --> 0:21:32.280 that I never had before too. In regards to our 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:38.320 learned behaviors and our you know, the things that we 0:21:38.440 --> 0:21:44.800 pick up from our parents, from the television, from all 0:21:44.840 --> 0:21:47.600 of the all of the all the places that we 0:21:47.680 --> 0:21:50.199 walk from the day that we're born. We start to 0:21:50.200 --> 0:21:53.640 receive this information as narrative that you know, you were 0:21:53.640 --> 0:21:56.320 talking about this a little bit ago, this story that 0:21:56.400 --> 0:21:59.000 we create for ourselves and that we buy into. And 0:21:59.040 --> 0:22:02.200 I've been through and call our truths and all these things, 0:22:02.200 --> 0:22:04.639 and I was really starting to awaken to that and 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:09.400 understand that I wanted to redefine what that was for me, 0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:12.919 and I was I realized that so many choices that 0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:15.199 I was making, so many things I was doing, was 0:22:15.280 --> 0:22:19.760 based off of um, you know me, kind of buying 0:22:19.800 --> 0:22:24.000 into this ideal of many different things of what beauty 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:28.160 is of um, what success is of you know how, 0:22:28.320 --> 0:22:30.800 and if it wasn't, if it's important or not to 0:22:30.840 --> 0:22:34.160 be liked by many people, to please. For all these 0:22:34.200 --> 0:22:37.479 ideas and things of who I was that I just 0:22:37.640 --> 0:22:40.000 was starting to really challenge and I started to challenge 0:22:40.000 --> 0:22:42.760 it through music, and I started to challenge it. Actually 0:22:42.760 --> 0:22:45.680 remember very distinctly, and I wrote about this that I 0:22:46.040 --> 0:22:48.959 wrote a list of ships that I was sick of 0:22:49.680 --> 0:22:52.600 and the first time I ever wrote a list like that. 0:22:53.080 --> 0:22:54.840 And I don't know if you've ever written a list 0:22:54.880 --> 0:22:56.600 like that. Yeah, I think I think I need to 0:22:56.760 --> 0:23:00.959 right away. You need to write this list. It was 0:23:01.040 --> 0:23:03.640 so crazy because I think so much of our lives 0:23:03.640 --> 0:23:08.480 we spend being so damn accommodating and so extra thoughtful. 0:23:08.600 --> 0:23:10.600 We don't want to stay the wrong thing or do 0:23:10.760 --> 0:23:13.119 the wrong thing. And so we keep our lists of 0:23:13.160 --> 0:23:15.800 things that might make us so angry to ourselves, because 0:23:15.800 --> 0:23:18.560 God forbid we make anybody angry, or we dissens in 0:23:18.560 --> 0:23:21.639 our opinions or whatever. And so I was that me. 0:23:22.000 --> 0:23:23.959 I was that the person I fight against being all 0:23:24.000 --> 0:23:27.560 the time. And so and so I wrote this list 0:23:27.960 --> 0:23:31.199 and it really started to clarify these feelings that I 0:23:31.280 --> 0:23:35.159 had ignite, uh, just a word to put through it. 0:23:35.680 --> 0:23:38.520 And I took that list and I translated it into 0:23:38.560 --> 0:23:41.920 these songs that ended up becoming the Here album, which 0:23:41.920 --> 0:23:43.840 is one of my all time favorite albums that I 0:23:43.920 --> 0:23:46.560 ever did, because it was the first that I didn't compromise. 0:23:47.200 --> 0:23:50.440 I didn't compromise my message. I didn't try to make 0:23:50.480 --> 0:23:52.360 a bunch of songs that I was going to be commercial, 0:23:52.400 --> 0:23:56.119