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Speaker 1: This episode of the Chuck Podcast is brought to you

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Speaker 1: and rates may vary. Hello Aaron, Welcome to the Wednesday

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Speaker 1: edition of the Chuck Podcast. We have a nice complete

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Speaker 1: episode for you. As always, I will have a lot

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Speaker 1: to say about all things having to do with the

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Speaker 1: war in Iran and it's impact on the atomy and frankly,

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Speaker 1: the I don't know what you call it. I'm not

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Speaker 1: going to call it necessarily leadership from the president on

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Speaker 1: this war, but he is a bit of a weather

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Speaker 1: vane on this war, and I will get into that

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Speaker 1: in a few minutes. My interview, my guest today is

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Speaker 1: the essentially the head of a it's a I'm sticking

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Speaker 1: to my theme every Wednesday, I've been dropping interviews between

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Speaker 1: now and Local News Day with various editors and publishers

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Speaker 1: and founders of sort of the new independent media that

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Speaker 1: has popped up since the gutting and cratering of local

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Speaker 1: news that of course all began with the advent of

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Speaker 1: Craig's List. In particular, the focus today.

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Speaker 2: Is on a.

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Speaker 1: News organization out of Minnesota called the Sahan Journal. The guest,

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Speaker 1: the publisher is Moor Jayson and what the san Journal.

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Speaker 1: It is a local independent news source primarily focused in

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Speaker 1: its audience is for the immigrant communities of Minnesota, so

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Speaker 1: not just the smaller community, but the among community, first

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Speaker 1: generation Hispanic community. It is an interesting business story as

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Speaker 1: well as a sustainability story when it comes and it's

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Speaker 1: I think there's a lot to learn. There's all different

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Speaker 1: types of local news operations out there, and my goal

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Speaker 1: was to do profiles of sort of the different types

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Speaker 1: of and this is one that is very much has

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Speaker 1: a narrow cast in the audience that it is covering for,

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Speaker 1: but an example of what can be an improvement in

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Speaker 1: the vibrancy of the tapestry of local news. We will

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Speaker 1: also do questions and of course a top five list,

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Speaker 1: But I'm going to begin where it's understandable. Right if

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Speaker 1: you're if it's early in the week since the start

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Speaker 1: of this Iron War, you may be confused if you've

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Speaker 1: been listening to Donald Trump's rhetoric, because if you listen

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Speaker 1: to Donald trump'srhetoric, this war is going to come to

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Speaker 1: an end any day now, maybe any week now, any

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Speaker 1: day now, any hour now. It's close. It's close. They're

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Speaker 1: dealing with the right people. They're doing this, and it

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Speaker 1: you know, if you follow the military side of things,

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Speaker 1: we're on the verge of escalating this conflict. We're on

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Speaker 1: the verge of sending in ground troops at least at

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Speaker 1: a minimum, to the shorelines or to the key islands

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Speaker 1: in order to try to figure out how to how

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Speaker 1: to open up the straight up more moves. And I

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Speaker 1: think it's you know, it's obviously it's we know this

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Speaker 1: is all due to Donald Trump kind of simultaneously. He's

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Speaker 1: basically trying to manage two wars simultaneously, one in the

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Speaker 1: Middle East and one on the trading floor of Wall Street.

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Speaker 1: And I guess the question that's worth asking is which

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Speaker 1: one is he trying to win? And I think this

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Speaker 1: is the I think this is the open question because

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Speaker 1: right now, in some ways the markets, he has had

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Speaker 1: some success manipulating the markets. Right. We've noticed there is

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Speaker 1: this pattern, right if you will, and five straight weeks

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Speaker 1: somewhere between twelve and fifteen hours before the opening bell

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Speaker 1: for that given week, since the start of the Iran war,

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Speaker 1: there'll be a statement from Donald Trump which injects diplomatic

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Speaker 1: hope one might call it into a deteriorating military situation, right,

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Speaker 1: And each time he does it, it has the desired effect.

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Speaker 1: It stabilizes the equities markets. It knocks oil back down

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Speaker 1: closer to right around one hundred dollars range, maybe even

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Speaker 1: below it until the news of the reality of the

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Speaker 1: situation percolates back up, and then suddenly the energy markets respond.

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Speaker 1: So you know, let's let's I'm going to go through

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Speaker 1: each example week by week, So we'll start with this.

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Speaker 1: Right in week one, he sort of had the pivot

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Speaker 1: from the shock, and all right, and you heard so

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Speaker 1: you had Operation Epic Fury launches on February twenty eighth,

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Speaker 1: tomahawks hit cities in Iran. Global markets braced for what

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Speaker 1: they thought was going to be a seventy style oil shock.

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Speaker 1: Then what does Trump do on March second? That Monday,

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Speaker 1: Trump ignores the smoke over Tehran and focuses on the

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Speaker 1: ticker and he says, I thought oil prices were going

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Speaker 1: to go up higher than they are now, and I

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Speaker 1: thought we would see a bigger drop in stock it

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Speaker 1: it hasn't been that bad.

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Speaker 3: We're in control, all right.

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Speaker 1: That's week one, and then he claims that the war

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Speaker 1: would be a four to six week sprint. Remember he

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Speaker 1: called it excursion. I think he meant incursion. He said

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Speaker 1: it wouldn't be a forever war. So he stabilizes the

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Speaker 1: initial panic sell off in week one. Week two, reports

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Speaker 1: surface that the IRGC is leaderless and it's on its

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Speaker 1: back foot after target it strikes. What does Trump do

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Speaker 1: that Monday? And March ninth, at eight fifteen in the morning,

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Speaker 1: before the stock market opens, he says there will be

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Speaker 1: no deal with Iran except underconditional surrender. And after that,

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Speaker 1: we will work tirelessly to make Iran economically bigger, better,

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Speaker 1: and stronger than ever before. Iran will have a great future.

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Speaker 1: So he's proposing essentially a Marshall Plan right, using rhetoric

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Speaker 1: like it actually helps create a surge in the stock market,

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Speaker 1: even as the Pentagon admits they had no day after plan.

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Speaker 1: Week three, the sanctions carrot if you will carg Island right,

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Speaker 1: Iran's main oil terminal, ventually obliterated. Gas prices surge over

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Speaker 1: four dollars a gallon. So what does Trump do that Monday?

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Speaker 1: In an interview with The New York Post released just

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Speaker 1: before the opening of the stock market, he says, I

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Speaker 1: have a plan for everything. I could waive certain oil

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Speaker 1: related sanctions to reduce prices if they behave. They're begging

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Speaker 1: to reach a deal. They're calling me constantly. I don't

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Speaker 1: always pick up, but they're calling. Well. Oil drops four

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Speaker 1: percent on the waving sanctions comment, despite the fact there

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Speaker 1: was no functioning Iranian government left to actually negotiate with.

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Speaker 1: Then there's the false pause that was Week four. This

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Speaker 1: is March twenty second and twenty third. The military reality

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Speaker 1: is domestic pressure mounts as three thousand casualties are reported.

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Speaker 1: Israel pushes for strikes on some nuclear sites. So Trump

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Speaker 1: on Monday, March twenty third, says, surprise press conference on

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Speaker 1: the tarmac again before the market's open, We're having a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a pause. I've decided to pause the

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Speaker 1: threat to hit the energy sites for a few days

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Speaker 1: because the talks are going very well. He claims, very

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Speaker 1: very well. You'll be very happy. So while Trump claimed

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Speaker 1: to pause, the Pentagon simultaneously was briefing that the operations

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Speaker 1: are going to continue at pace. The market though heard

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Speaker 1: the word pause. Maybe that's what they wanted to hear

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Speaker 1: for seventy two hours before the Thursday extension revealed it

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Speaker 1: was a tactical stall, not a peace deal. Then there's

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Speaker 1: the threat from over this last weekend hitting the desalinization plants,

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Speaker 1: are the energy markets. So the reality is the eighty

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Speaker 1: second airborne shows up in the region for quote unquote stabilization.

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Speaker 1: Iran HiT's a Q eighty oil tanker. But what does

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Speaker 1: Trump do on Monday morning seven am truth social thread

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Speaker 1: quote The US is in serious discussions with a new

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Speaker 1: and more reasonable regime. Great progress. However, if a deal

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Speaker 1: is not reached shortly, we will have no choice but

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Speaker 1: to completely obliterate their electric plants, oil wells, and possibly

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Speaker 1: all desalinization plants. So this is his strait of orm

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Speaker 1: moves play out's a new regime totally unverified to keep

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Speaker 1: the dow steady, while the threat to obliterate water sources

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Speaker 1: keeps oil traders from shorting the market. So the White

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Speaker 1: House and the President keeps using his truth social to

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Speaker 1: basically front run the official Pentagon briefings. Official Pentagon briefings

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Speaker 1: simply create to me a drum beat of escalation, not

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Speaker 1: de escalation. And there doesn't appear to be many off ramps,

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Speaker 1: and we keep sending in more folks who would be

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Speaker 1: part of any sort of ground troop operation if he

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Speaker 1: orders it. See of that, then you have the fact

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Speaker 1: that allies have no idea what we're up to. AP

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Speaker 1: reported that Trump has been telling allies go get your

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Speaker 1: own oil, and you go in the straight OHR moves

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Speaker 1: and get it. We don't need it. Now, here's something

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Speaker 1: to understand, right, And this goes to the question of

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Speaker 1: which war is Trump really wanting to win? He sits

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Speaker 1: here and he's clearly look, it is no doubt he

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Speaker 1: knows he's boxed himself in. He's in an impossible situation, right,

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Speaker 1: it is, you know, heads, he loses, tails, we lose.

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Speaker 1: We all are going to lose here in the short term.

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Speaker 1: And you know this, We now know why so many

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Speaker 1: presidents before never did this, realizing the immassive economic global

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Speaker 1: economic impact that this would have hasn't hit yet. But

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna explain that. Frankly, it's about to come unfortunately.

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Speaker 1: And meanwhile, he just just trying to He's just trying

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Speaker 1: to win the day. Right, I'll gladly give you a

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Speaker 1: quarter tomorrow for a hamburger today. Infamous those of you

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Speaker 1: old enough to remember Popeye and the dude that always

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Speaker 1: always always wanted a hamburger today, he would gladly pay

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Speaker 1: you tomorrow for it. This is Donald Trump in a nutshell, right.

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Speaker 1: He's just always putting off, just trying to put off,

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Speaker 1: put off. It is just can he deal with today?

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Speaker 1: Can he deal with today? And he's kind of he's

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Speaker 1: basically a political day trader who's obsessive about the stock

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Speaker 1: market itself on it now here is something that is

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Speaker 1: an uncomfortable truth and it deserves scrutiny because there's no

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Speaker 1: doubt there is grift and market manipulation going on. Since

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Speaker 1: February twenty eighth, the S and P five hundred has

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Speaker 1: declined overall. Not a surprise the war started on February

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Speaker 1: twenty eighth. Of course it's down, but eighty five percent

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Speaker 1: of the S and P five hundreds Green days as

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Speaker 1: in days when a majority when the overall S and

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Speaker 1: P five hundred was up, not down, have occurred on

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Speaker 1: a Monday following a Trump piece is coming post. So

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Speaker 1: the point is is here we go again, and he

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Speaker 1: did it again, and he's been doing it again, and look,

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Speaker 1: should this be investigated? Of course, is his sec going

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Speaker 1: to do anything serious?

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Speaker 3: Of course not right.

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Speaker 1: All of this is happening in plain sight. And of

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Speaker 1: course we have the other story about I love the

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Speaker 1: weird denial by Sean Parnell, the spokesperson for Pete Haigseth,

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Speaker 1: that Financial Times had this big story about that somebody

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Speaker 1: representing Pete hag Seth was shopping around looking to make

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Speaker 1: a big purchase of sort of investments in the defense industry,

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Speaker 1: and it was it's clear the way And I got

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Speaker 1: to read you the Parnell quote directly on this because parsing.

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Speaker 1: It tells you everything you need to know about what

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Speaker 1: is actually truthful in that financial time story. Sometimes the

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Speaker 1: respokesperson's response actually confirms the story they're trying not to confirm.

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Speaker 1: So Parnell on X says the following that neither Secretary

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Speaker 1: Hegseth nor any of his representatives approached black Rock regarding

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Speaker 1: an investment in the defense industrials Active ETF. So it's

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Speaker 1: he's denying the black Rock portion of the story specifically, right,

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Speaker 1: You see a denial of specific details, but sort of not.

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Speaker 1: He never overall denied that any of the that the

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Speaker 1: larger idea that he was looking for an investment in

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Speaker 1: defense industries and that you know, before the start of

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Speaker 1: the war, he didn't deny any of that. He just

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Speaker 1: denied a specific part of the accusation. Anyway, the point

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Speaker 1: is it's pretty clear that more of that report is

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Speaker 1: true than not true. And then they as a as

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Speaker 1: a clever spokesperson would do, not an honest and ethical one,

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Speaker 1: but a clever one would do, is you find a

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Speaker 1: keith a specific fact that you can deny and hang

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Speaker 1: your hat on and then and hope that most people

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Speaker 1: take it as a full denial of the whole story

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Speaker 1: rather than what the denial actually it is. But the

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Speaker 1: fact is, this is one of those stories where do

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Speaker 1: the details even matter. I mean, the entire Trump administration

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Speaker 1: has been behaving this way. I mean, and there's not

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Speaker 1: really any doesn't seem to be any any negative blowback

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Speaker 1: unless it looks like you're keeping Trump out from getting

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Speaker 1: a cut, like you know, he'll over time get upset.

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Speaker 1: If it looks like you're trying to pull one over

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Speaker 1: on him financially, then he'll get upset. But if you're

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Speaker 1: doing something like this, I mean, look the whole philosophy.

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Speaker 1: I mean, we've seen there was a good study by

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Speaker 1: Pro publica earlier this week about the cases that the

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Speaker 1: Department of Justice, led by Pam Bonni has dropped in.

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Speaker 1: How many white collar cases are just being dropped left

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Speaker 1: and right right. If you look at Donald Trump's pardons, anybody,

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Speaker 1: anybody that is hit with massive fines that have basically

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Speaker 1: been convicted and sentenced to go to prison for what

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Speaker 1: one would call white collar crimes, so financial crimes if

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Speaker 1: you will, it's almost universally an easy pardon for him.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I guess you can say he wants to

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Speaker 1: do unto others as he wants to be treated. And

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Speaker 1: you know, if he thinks financial crimes shouldn't be punishable

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Speaker 1: as felonies then he's not going to let any of

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Speaker 1: his friends see financial crimes punished as felonies here. So

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Speaker 1: the point is is that, you know, it was amusing

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Speaker 1: to me. That's why I love that. This is why

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Speaker 1: as a reporter it's always really important to ask for

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Speaker 1: a response, because the response can actually tell you more

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Speaker 1: than the story itself. And Parnell's response, in a very

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Speaker 1: specific denial about the black Rock portion of this, tells you, oh,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot more truth to this. He just found

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Speaker 1: the one thing that they thought they could hang their

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Speaker 1: hat on that wasn't you know whatever the specifics was right.

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Speaker 1: It's probably an affiliate of black Rock, some entity that's

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Speaker 1: not technically black Rock but might be. By point is

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Speaker 1: he's that we all know that there was all sorts

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Speaker 1: of fuzzy natures of that fact. But you know what

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Speaker 1: is disappointing is this idea that there was no denial

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Speaker 1: that he was looking for investment opportunities in the defense

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Speaker 1: industry before the start of this war.

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Speaker 3: But again, the sun rose in the east and the

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Speaker 3: sunsets in the west.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 3: This is sort of par for the course for this administration.

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Speaker 1: am a customer. But the question is, and I think

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Speaker 1: that this that's a fair question. What is about to

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Speaker 1: happen in this war? Are we going to because now

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Speaker 1: you've got the reports in the Wall Street Journal that

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Speaker 1: indicate Trump is thinking about I mean, that's the other

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Speaker 1: thing thinking about just Okay, he promised this was only

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Speaker 1: going to be four to six weeks. We've seen the reports.

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Speaker 1: He's kind of bored of the war. He'd probably much

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Speaker 1: prefer to talk about his ballroom, his new plans for

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Speaker 1: a presidential library to become a let's just say for

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Speaker 1: some of us, too prominent of a position in the

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Speaker 1: Miami skyline. I just it's a head scratcher to me

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Speaker 1: that a guy who's never lived a day in his

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Speaker 1: life in Miami, has really no serious connections to Miami

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Speaker 1: is going to dot the skyline of Miami in a way.

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Speaker 1: I mean, please go put it in New York, Go

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Speaker 1: put it in Trump Tower, Go put it at Fifth Avenue.

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Speaker 1: Hey Penn, how come you don't want the Donald Trump

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Speaker 1: Presidential Library? But I will? But it is what it is.

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Speaker 3: I will just tell you this.

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Speaker 1: If the building, that building, that rendering that Eric Trump sent,

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Speaker 1: I can't I assume Calshi or polymarket of it. Will

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Speaker 1: this building ever be completed? And will it be as

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Speaker 1: tall as they claim? Because you know, it's interesting about

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Speaker 1: height issues in South Florida is there's only you can

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Speaker 1: only go a certain height on buildings in Miami because

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Speaker 1: you can't it doesn't support. Eventually, you can't dig a

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Speaker 1: you can't dig too far deep to create a stable,

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Speaker 1: a stability underground before you hit the ocean. So I

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Speaker 1: think he's going to be limited in what they actually

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Speaker 1: can do structurally there. So the idea that the actual

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Speaker 1: library building will look remotely similar to the rendering that

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Speaker 1: Eric Trump sent I think is quite small. But the

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Speaker 1: point is is that the reports Donald Trump's board with

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Speaker 1: the war, he realizes by the way, he's now at

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Speaker 1: an all time low and his approval rating all time high,

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Speaker 1: and is disapproval rating the consumer confidence index is now

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Speaker 1: at the same horrible low that it was at the

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Speaker 1: height of the inflationary period in twenty twenty two, which

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Speaker 1: was dragging down the Biden presidency and arguably destroyed destroyed

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Speaker 1: the Biden presidency politically right well, Donald Trump's consumer confidence

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Speaker 1: numbers that the Michigan Index are now that low. His

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Speaker 1: approval rating is lower than where Joe Biden was at

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Speaker 1: this point in time. His disapproval rating is higher than

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Speaker 1: it was. His approval rating is lower now than it

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Speaker 1: ever was in his first term, and he already had

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Speaker 1: a bad midterm that first term. Of course, he only

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Speaker 1: lost the House, not the Senate, in that first midterm.

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Speaker 1: And I think this time, I think it's fairly I

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Speaker 1: think it's fair to say, and that's going to be

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Speaker 1: my top five this week. I think it's fair to

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Speaker 1: say that at this point in time, I think Democrats

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Speaker 1: are favorite to win them both. It would be they

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Speaker 1: have to make mistakes now, they have to have bad

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Speaker 1: candidates do bad things in general election sort of below

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Speaker 1: an opportunity because the environment and the national wins and

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Speaker 1: all of that. Right this is we are now in

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Speaker 1: blue wave territory, pure and simple. It is there. You're

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Speaker 1: looking at twenty. I mean, the House is done. The

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Speaker 1: question really is how much. And some of it will

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Speaker 1: have to do with the with the various redistricting efforts.

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Speaker 1: I kind of think, you know, the irony just on

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Speaker 1: a quick aside here before you get back to a run.

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Speaker 1: This environment is so good for Democrats at the moment

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Speaker 1: that I think if Virginia did not, if they don't

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Speaker 1: pass their maps right now, it's six or five democratic advantage.

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Speaker 1: With this political environment, they're going to be eight. It's

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Speaker 1: going to be a three without remapping anything in Virginia,

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Speaker 1: and they're trying to get ten to one. Probably ends

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Speaker 1: up nine to two. But you know, this is why

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Speaker 1: I think this is such a wasted effort and probably

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Speaker 1: going to be probably going to blow back on the

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Speaker 1: party in Virginia sooner than Virginia Democrats realize here and

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Speaker 1: the irony is they didn't need it. They didn't really

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Speaker 1: need it. We're talking that maybe this redistricting is going

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Speaker 1: to net him one more seat than the political environment

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Speaker 1: itself would have net it. And to think all of

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Speaker 1: this political capital that Barack Obama's flushing down the toilet,

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Speaker 1: that Abigail Spamberger's flushing down the toilet for one extra

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Speaker 1: seat in an environment that they're probably going to win

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Speaker 1: twenty to forty nationally overall. But look, I'm going to

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Speaker 1: set that aside. Where we are here is this war.

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Speaker 1: Is that Trump is now in his continues to be

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Speaker 1: in this impossible box. He knows he's got to get

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Speaker 1: out of this war. And yes, America can withstand and

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Speaker 1: energy crisis caused by this war better than most other countries.

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Speaker 1: And so that's why, you know, he's trying to basically say,

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Speaker 1: you worry about it, but that But I'm sorry, if

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Speaker 1: Europe gets the flu, We're economy gets the flu, We're

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Speaker 1: going to get a cold, all right. We are all interconnected.

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Speaker 1: We are not going to be able to hide from

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Speaker 1: this and this, and eventually it's going to get worse.

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Speaker 1: And I'm want to share. I want to share a

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Speaker 1: few interesting pieces that have been written. This came from

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Speaker 1: Liz Hoffman her newsletter in Semaphore, and she was trying

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Speaker 1: to explain answer the question why do markets look calmer

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Speaker 1: than they should in this current period? Right, so far

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Speaker 1: the price of oil hasn't gone as high yet as

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Speaker 1: folks expect, and the Nasdaq correction looks more of it

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Speaker 1: AI driven due to the impact on the investors and

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Speaker 1: some of the major investors in AI right now in

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Speaker 1: the Gulf States. And the question is is this resilience

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Speaker 1: or is this simply complacency? Right? Is the world so

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Speaker 1: flush with money that it can still absorb more risk?

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Speaker 1: And maybe that's true of the American Stock exchange or

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Speaker 1: investors expect another government bailout, right, They've gotten they got

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Speaker 1: so used to government bailing them out of the COVID

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Speaker 1: pandemic or government bailing them out of the credit crisis. Right,

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Speaker 1: But there's a third option, and that is just simply

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Speaker 1: borrowed time. Right. We got an oil buffer, we have

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Speaker 1: tankers already at sea, you've had the national reserve releases

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Speaker 1: have already taken place in a lot of countries. But

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Speaker 1: guess what all of that is going to get exhausted?

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Speaker 3: Sooner than you think.

432
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 1: And the real point that Liz Hoffman was trying to

433
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 1: make is that the second and third order effects of

434
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: this war have not let y enda. I've not landed yet.

435
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 1: We don't yet have crops stunted by fertilizer shortages. We will.

436
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:53,520
Speaker 1: We don't yet have blackouts in Asia due to because

437
00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:56,399
Speaker 1: of how much oil to Asia comes out of the

438
00:25:56,400 --> 00:26:01,879
Speaker 1: Strait of Warmus. We don't have MRI yet from helium shortages.

439
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:06,720
Speaker 1: We will, and we don't yet have grocery price increases

440
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,680
Speaker 1: from trucking costs. But the promise you we will.

441
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:10,120
Speaker 2: Right.

442
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:13,359
Speaker 1: All of that is these have been lagging indicators and

443
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:21,160
Speaker 1: they haven't hit yet. Right. She used a pandemic metaphor,

444
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: meaning scientists warned us we went to dinner anyway, then

445
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: we didn't for a very long time. Well, it may

446
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 1: be the same slow motion dynamic. Right. EU energy chief

447
00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:34,439
Speaker 1: is urging Europeans to cut travel, Soul is weighing driving

448
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 1: restrictions because of the energy shortage. The last this is

449
00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:41,879
Speaker 1: important to note, the last Middle Eastern jet fuel shipment

450
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: reaches Britain this week, which means, all of a sudden,

451
00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:48,920
Speaker 1: we're going to have a jet fuel shortage. Twenty percent

452
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:50,800
Speaker 1: of the world's oil comes through the Strait of hormones.

453
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:56,800
Speaker 1: Of Europe's oil comes from the Strait of hormones. And

454
00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:58,880
Speaker 1: we have the first company Unil ever citing the war

455
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:05,919
Speaker 1: for a hiring freeze. So the point is, all of

456
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 1: the fears of what's going to happen haven't hit yet,

457
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 1: and Donald Trump's actions have really helped mask a reality

458
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:16,919
Speaker 1: that maybe hitting is going to be about to hit

459
00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 1: us extraordinarily hard in the next four to six weeks,

460
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 1: which may explain why he so desperately wants to find

461
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:27,320
Speaker 1: a way out. And you know, whether it's he thinks

462
00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:31,720
Speaker 1: that maybe he can bomb the leadership into submission, I

463
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:33,880
Speaker 1: think that is of question. But this is a regime

464
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,160
Speaker 1: that is no problem killing and its own people as

465
00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:40,919
Speaker 1: it is. Why does he think making the Iranian people

466
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 1: suffer through blackouts and lack of water? This is Donald

467
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 1: Trump that it's somehow going to bring the regime to

468
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 1: its knees. So I think that is one miscalculation here.

469
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:57,160
Speaker 1: So then, of course, how you know, if he's got

470
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,440
Speaker 1: to open the strait of horn moves and he's essentially

471
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:04,400
Speaker 1: alienated all of our allies for the last year through

472
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 1: tariffs and through what he's done in Europe, and through

473
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 1: his lack of interest in helping Ukraine and all of that. Right,

474
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,680
Speaker 1: he's mad at NATO now while he's been treating NATO

475
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: allies like crap for the last year, he's mad at

476
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,159
Speaker 1: other countries not helping go get your own oil out

477
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 1: of the strait of Hoar Moves, and he's been beating

478
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 1: them up with tariffs. So of course they don't want

479
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,360
Speaker 1: to help. But at the end of the day, we're

480
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:30,640
Speaker 1: the United States of America. We broke it, we got

481
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:36,159
Speaker 1: to fix it. So it does seem as if the

482
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 1: military planners are assuming they're going to go in with

483
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 1: some minimal ground invasion of some sort to figure out

484
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:48,240
Speaker 1: how to open up the straight of war moves. And

485
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 1: once again, once you we have started a war we

486
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:55,200
Speaker 1: don't know, we don't necessarily have the ability to finish.

487
00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 1: Yet we pull up states right now, all we do

488
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:05,280
Speaker 1: is hand Iran more leverage he walks away. He's basically

489
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 1: handing them more leverage over the strait of our moves

490
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 1: than they had before this war started. So the question

491
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: I think really is, and it is sort of do

492
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: you believe what he says, or do you believe what

493
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 1: they're doing? And if you follow what they're doing, this

494
00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 1: war is about to escalate. They're about to send in

495
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 1: more ground troops, actual ground troops. There's going to be

496
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,400
Speaker 1: an attempt here. And maybe in his head he thinks

497
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 1: commandeering control of Iranian oil means he controls oil Venezuela

498
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:43,440
Speaker 1: oil in Iran and then somehow that might give him

499
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 1: leverage with China. I kind of think that's wishful thinking,

500
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 1: but it may be a strategy they think they're pursuing

501
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 1: at the moment. But I do think this, if you think,

502
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 1: what should you believe? Do you believe that he is

503
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: trying to find a way out of this was an

504
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:02,160
Speaker 1: easy way out? I think he already have found that

505
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: exit ramp and would have left. Or do you follow

506
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 1: what they're doing? Not what they're saying, And what they're

507
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 1: doing appears to be a preparation for escalation, and at

508
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 1: some point the economy and traders and the markets are

509
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: going to have to are going to end up accepting reality.

510
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 1: They're desperate not to accept reality, and any kind of

511
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:31,280
Speaker 1: breadcrumb he drops to be to be used as an

512
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: excuse to say, well, maybe it's not you know, maybe

513
00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 1: this isn't going to be as catastrophic as we thought.

514
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:40,560
Speaker 1: Traders have grabbed onto it. But when you start to

515
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 1: look at these other fundamentals, right, consumers are already changing

516
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 1: their behavior. Consumer confidence wouldn't be this low if they

517
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 1: weren't changing their behavior, And you're going to see the

518
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 1: second and third order effects start, unfortunately cascading very soon

519
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 1: and perhaps very quickly. So I hate to be such

520
00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 1: doom and gloom about it, but I think when you

521
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:09,320
Speaker 1: look stare at the situation, then you throw in the

522
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:13,960
Speaker 1: fact that the allies that Donald Trump cares about the

523
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 1: most in the East are as financial allies. I think

524
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:20,719
Speaker 1: he's I think Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and Qatar have

525
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:23,240
Speaker 1: a lot more influence on him than Israel. Does I

526
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 1: know the popular mythology is that Israel has all.

527
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 3: This influence on him. No, no, no, no.

528
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:31,080
Speaker 1: It's the people that pay him money that have influence

529
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:35,960
Speaker 1: on him. Right. This is why this should be such

530
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 1: an important focal point of being concerned about this, because

531
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 1: who's making the strongest arguments now for the United States

532
00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 1: not to leave and to not end this war until

533
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 1: that regime is essentially overthrown. But they don't say overthrown.

534
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: They say tamed in some fort. But it's the Saudis,

535
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,040
Speaker 1: u Akuate bah Rain. They're all at this point. I

536
00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:05,239
Speaker 1: think they all regret telling him go ahead and do it,

537
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, this is the mistake. Donald Trump

538
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 1: does not is not somebody you can rely on long term.

539
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:15,720
Speaker 1: You can convince Donald Trump to do something for you

540
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 1: short term if he thinks there's benefit to him, but

541
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: you cannot rely on him to stick to anything and

542
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:26,040
Speaker 1: to be a long term partner with you, on anybody.

543
00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 1: And it's a huge mistake the Golf States made. It's

544
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 1: what it was interesting and this fight, you know, sort

545
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,520
Speaker 1: of there's been an interesting fight between the two parties

546
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 1: to figure out how to win over the hearts and

547
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: minds of the Golf States both parties, if you know,

548
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 1: there was a look Joe Biden wanted to write those

549
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 1: folks off, but the reality was there's too much American investment,

550
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 1: too much of the American business community does do business

551
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: with the Golf States, and every presidential administration needs to

552
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: be in good terms with them. And the argument that

553
00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 1: the Biden folks are trying to make to the Golf States,

554
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 1: you know, and you know essentially they were trying to

555
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,959
Speaker 1: They didn't want to be bought off. And I think

556
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 1: the Golf States got lured in because Trump was so transactional,

557
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 1: i e. Easy to buy off, and they figure, oh,

558
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 1: we can manipulate him, and they can't. The problem is

559
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 1: you can't get him to stick to anything. And so

560
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: they think they're getting what they want. And now I

561
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:24,040
Speaker 1: guess you can go to be careful what you wish for.

562
00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:27,960
Speaker 1: And the Golf States are now the dog that caught

563
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:29,520
Speaker 1: the car. They got in the American president to do

564
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 1: their dirty work. They've been wanting to get rid of

565
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 1: this regime in Iran, arguably with more vigor than the Israelis,

566
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:42,400
Speaker 1: and now they don't want us to leave. Now they're

567
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:47,280
Speaker 1: petrified because they're they are they are dealing with the

568
00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 1: second and third order effects and they have a lot

569
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: more to lose in this situation. And one wonders if

570
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 1: they now regret how much they have invested in the Trumps,

571
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 1: in the Trump family, thinking that they're getting.

572
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 3: What they want.

573
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 1: Well, they got the foreign policy they think they wanted.

574
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 1: Are they sure they wanted this? Is this what they wanted?

575
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 1: A global energy recession because unfortunately, I have a feeling

576
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:22,240
Speaker 1: that's where that's where this is headed. One more little

577
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,839
Speaker 1: note that I wanted to share with you, and this

578
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 1: came from a column another Semaphore column from earlier today.

579
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,759
Speaker 1: And by the way, they have these interesting newsletters by

580
00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 1: region that I just think are tremendous. They have an

581
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:39,880
Speaker 1: African newsletter that I think is really good. They have

582
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: a Golf State every day and it's a daily newsletter.

583
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:45,840
Speaker 1: I never was getting daily news from the continent of

584
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 1: Africa or from the Golf States. And I'm certainly glad

585
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:51,920
Speaker 1: i am today. So kudos to my friend Justin Smith

586
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 1: there and Ben Smith who've done some great work. But

587
00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:00,360
Speaker 1: what's interesting is this point that Somemophore makes in the

588
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,360
Speaker 1: Southern newsletter they do energy newsletter that they do. The

589
00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:06,840
Speaker 1: war is accelerating the global gleen energy transition, they write,

590
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 1: And China dominates seventy percent of all green hardware. Chinese

591
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 1: ev giant Gheely is up thirty percent since the war began.

592
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 1: The world's largest battery maker, COTL is up twenty eight percent.

593
00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,919
Speaker 1: So we are now. America is now a petro state

594
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 1: thanks to Donald Trump because he wanted to get rid

595
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 1: of windmills and get rid of anything that was alternative

596
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:30,319
Speaker 1: energy other than oil and gods. So we're now a

597
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:34,759
Speaker 1: petro state, and China is becoming an electro state at

598
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:38,400
Speaker 1: a time when being a petro state is very, very expensive.

599
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 1: So the irony is that Beijing has been thinking long

600
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 1: term on green energy and the Iran war may have

601
00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 1: just handed them a decisive advantage not in the battlefield,

602
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 1: but in the supply chains as the rest of the

603
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:57,640
Speaker 1: world panics about oil, especially if the Strait of horn

604
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:03,120
Speaker 1: Moves is basically a battle a battlefield of sorts, if

605
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:06,239
Speaker 1: you will, for months on end, you're gonna have a

606
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:10,560
Speaker 1: lot of economies around the world desperately trying to transition

607
00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 1: to green energy, and they're not gonna be able to

608
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 1: buy supplies from the United States. They're gonna be able

609
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 1: to get their material from China. So yet another way,

610
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 1: so this war with Iran has strengthened Russia, has strengthened China,

611
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:32,520
Speaker 1: and basically as weaken the United States diplomatically and certainly

612
00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 1: our reputation around the world, and the fact that essentially,

613
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 1: even though we're winning on the battlefield, we're essentially losing

614
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:44,800
Speaker 1: in the larger strategic battle, if you will, with China

615
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:50,040
Speaker 1: and with Russia. One wonders if that ends up forcing

616
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,800
Speaker 1: more bad decisions to follow more bad decisions. Right, this

617
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 1: is the concern. So many folks had this the minute

618
00:36:56,520 --> 00:37:00,319
Speaker 1: you go open this door on Iran, Right, there were

619
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 1: no good exit ramps and here we are. Hey, one

620
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 1: more note I want to share. It's a totally totally

621
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:20,160
Speaker 1: different subject matter. But number one, it's a newsletter that

622
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 1: I think you guys should everybody should subscribe to. You know,

623
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:26,520
Speaker 1: with so many questionable news sources when it comes to

624
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:30,279
Speaker 1: science these days, especially when it comes to viruses and

625
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 1: what Bobby Kennedy Jr. Has done to eviscerate the credibility

626
00:37:35,239 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 1: of the CDC, the FDA, and of course all things

627
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:42,879
Speaker 1: having to do with HHS, I started subscribing as something

628
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: called your Local Epidemiologist, and I have to say it

629
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,400
Speaker 1: is fantastic. They do a great job. They keep up

630
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: to date with public health developments, they share actual statistics,

631
00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 1: actual recommendations. Well, guess what, there's a new COVID variant

632
00:37:57,600 --> 00:38:02,120
Speaker 1: that is out there, but it's manageable, and I just

633
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 1: wanted to read what it is because there's a there's

634
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 1: a good warning here because what I love about and

635
00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:10,080
Speaker 1: I just highly recommend, especially if you're frankly over the

636
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 1: age of fifty, because they do a really good job

637
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 1: of sort of dealing with the basic questions. Okay, there's

638
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 1: a new COVID variant. What should I do? All right?

639
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:18,680
Speaker 3: So this new COVID variant.

640
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:25,480
Speaker 1: Is called the Cicada variant. It's a descendant of omicron.

641
00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 1: It's been circulating around the globe over time. It is

642
00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 1: now accounts for eleven percent of US cases, and it's

643
00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:34,840
Speaker 1: you know, they're basically warning you know. So this is

644
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:36,840
Speaker 1: the question, is this going to cause a spring or

645
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 1: summer wave? Well, the answer is they don't have much

646
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,520
Speaker 1: data of how fast it is growing this but their

647
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 1: guess is that this will cause a mini wave of sorts.

648
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:49,319
Speaker 1: It won't be a nothing burger, nor will it be

649
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:53,000
Speaker 1: a tsunami. Then the question is should people over sixty

650
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:57,799
Speaker 1: five get a spring COVID nineteen shot? And the recommendation

651
00:38:57,920 --> 00:38:59,200
Speaker 1: is this, And this is why I want to share

652
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 1: it because I know a lot of you you are

653
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,600
Speaker 1: always concerned about this, and again, so great substock your

654
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 1: local epidemiologist. Go look it up. Should people over sixty

655
00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 1: five get a spring COVID nineteen shot answer. If it's

656
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,960
Speaker 1: been at least three months since your last dose, a

657
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:19,120
Speaker 1: spring shot is a reasonable call. Timing in around May

658
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:22,560
Speaker 1: or June tends to align well with how COVID nineteen

659
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:28,000
Speaker 1: seasons typically play out. So look, you're not gonna Unfortunately,

660
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:31,600
Speaker 1: we can't rely on the actual public health officials to

661
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:37,400
Speaker 1: give us sort of normal common sense advice, normal common

662
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 1: sense facts about what is actually happening. And so I

663
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 1: found that news helpful, and I figured I might as

664
00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:48,799
Speaker 1: well share it with you guys that you might find

665
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:52,360
Speaker 1: helpful to, all right, So with that, let's sneak in

666
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:57,120
Speaker 1: a break when we come back, get to know a

667
00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 1: local news site that was designed for the growing immigrant

668
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 1: community of Minnesota as a ham journal. This episode of

669
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700
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Speaker 1: Am I continuing coverage and Yes News Day on April ninth,

701
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:06,399
Speaker 1: Circle Year Calendar's Local News Day in April ninth. One

702
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:10,440
Speaker 1: of my goals has been to essentially profile, if you will,

703
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:14,120
Speaker 1: different types of local news startups that are out there,

704
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:18,000
Speaker 1: and obviously part of the goal of Local News Day

705
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:20,600
Speaker 1: in April ninth is to create more awareness out there.

706
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 1: And there are a lot of local news startups in

707
00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,920
Speaker 1: your neighborhood that you may have not heard about. Some

708
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 1: of them are very community specific, maybe for a smaller

709
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:34,759
Speaker 1: community that's a part of your area. Maybe it's geographic,

710
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:39,120
Speaker 1: maybe it's ethnic, but these startups are everywhere. And in fact,

711
00:42:40,239 --> 00:42:43,799
Speaker 1: the profile of the organization I want to showcase today

712
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:47,880
Speaker 1: is the Sahan Journal. It's based in Minnesota, and we

713
00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:52,719
Speaker 1: have the publisher here with this, Vanan Muru Gayson. He's

714
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:56,640
Speaker 1: not the original founder. He actually just he has essentially

715
00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:00,319
Speaker 1: taken it over and expanded it from its original and tent.

716
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:04,279
Speaker 1: It is a news organization that has been vital to

717
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 1: the immigrant community in Minneapolis in particular. But it's not

718
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:11,319
Speaker 1: just about one community. You know, what's been what's been

719
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:14,239
Speaker 1: interesting about Minneapolis over the last couple of decades and

720
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:18,959
Speaker 1: what's given it some amazing cultural features, if you will,

721
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 1: that make it even more unique place to visit today

722
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:24,600
Speaker 1: than it was thirty years ago when Prince was walking

723
00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:28,600
Speaker 1: the city the city streets, is that it has a

724
00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 1: lot of new communities, the Somali community among community, in

725
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:35,600
Speaker 1: addition to sort of maybe more familiar immigrant communities that

726
00:43:35,640 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 1: many of you have out there. And they're just doing gangbusters.

727
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 1: And this is a a story of a local of

728
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:47,240
Speaker 1: a local news outlet filling the vacuum for a community

729
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 1: that was just completely underserved. We know that there are

730
00:43:49,719 --> 00:43:52,720
Speaker 1: geographic news deserts, but sometimes there are.

731
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 3: Community news deserts.

732
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 1: And I think what the Shan Journal was able to

733
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 1: essentially a gap they were able to is for a

734
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:06,560
Speaker 1: community a news organization that doesn't just meet them subject

735
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 1: on the subject matters that they care about, but also

736
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:12,719
Speaker 1: on the platforms that they use, and I think this

737
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:16,880
Speaker 1: is something a lot of traditional newsrooms don't realize. The

738
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:20,799
Speaker 1: various ways immigrant communities get their information. They're in a

739
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,359
Speaker 1: lot different apps than the apps you see, whether it's

740
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:27,120
Speaker 1: WhatsApp being a big one, even telegram, and so the

741
00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:29,279
Speaker 1: work that the Sahon Journal has done there I think

742
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:33,160
Speaker 1: will serve as as something for some of you out

743
00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:35,799
Speaker 1: there in this space. There's going to be a lot

744
00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:37,960
Speaker 1: to learn. So, without further ado, let me bring Vonon

745
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,520
Speaker 1: into the conversation. Vonon, welcome to the podcast.

746
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:46,239
Speaker 2: Thank you Chuck for having me. It's a pleasure to

747
00:44:46,280 --> 00:44:46,960
Speaker 2: be here today.

748
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:50,120
Speaker 1: Well, before we get started, tell me how did I

749
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,600
Speaker 1: do in the introduction to the news organization? And please

750
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:55,439
Speaker 1: fill in some gaps? What did I miss? How would

751
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:58,080
Speaker 1: you if you're in an elevator with me and we're

752
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:00,000
Speaker 1: riding up fifteen flights?

753
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,600
Speaker 3: How are you describing it to somebody?

754
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:04,440
Speaker 2: Fifteen flights? Will that's quite generous of you here.

755
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:06,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm assuming we have five minutes right.

756
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:11,440
Speaker 2: Well, thank you, thanks for opportunity. It's so great that

757
00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:15,480
Speaker 2: you're celebrating, you know, local news stap but also looking

758
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:17,879
Speaker 2: to uplift the different types of news outlets. That are

759
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 2: working in this space, and in particular, I'm here to

760
00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:24,520
Speaker 2: talk a little bit about immigrant serving newsrooms, and so

761
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 2: I'll try to talk a little bit about Sahan and

762
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:30,480
Speaker 2: so also maybe it gives your audience a little bit

763
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:34,920
Speaker 2: of context around how immigrant newsrooms work. So Sahan will

764
00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 2: started twenty nineteen. You are right, I am not the founder.

765
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 2: The founder is actually his name is Muktari brought him.

766
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:43,919
Speaker 2: He's a traditional journalist, really really good journalists. He worked

767
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 2: for the Star Tribune and he worked for the MPR

768
00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:49,360
Speaker 2: for Minnesota Public Radio News, and at that time he

769
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 2: noticed something that you know, was not something that he

770
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:57,600
Speaker 2: wasn't able to cover. You know, Minnesota has one of

771
00:45:57,680 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 2: the best local news scenes in the country, as you

772
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:00,319
Speaker 2: know that.

773
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:03,640
Speaker 1: Look, it's funny you bring up Minnesota Public Radio probably

774
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 1: one of the strongest affiliates of the NPR system that there.

775
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:15,160
Speaker 2: Is exactly particularly exactly exactly, and yet he felt working

776
00:46:15,200 --> 00:46:18,120
Speaker 2: for both of these organizations, he felt there were still

777
00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:20,960
Speaker 2: important stories that were being missed, that was important to

778
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:23,880
Speaker 2: be covered, and in stories around the immigrant communities. You know,

779
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:26,799
Speaker 2: he he was somewhat disappointed at that time where he

780
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:29,279
Speaker 2: was packed as the Somali journalist and he would cover

781
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:32,440
Speaker 2: Somali issues and whatnot. And you know, at that time,

782
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 2: unfortunately and even in some places, in some instances today

783
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 2: issues from immigrants are talked around from a crime perspective

784
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:44,879
Speaker 2: or things that of negative in nature. Right, he grew

785
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:47,480
Speaker 2: very frustrated. And now this is the man. Mind you.

786
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 2: His wife was pregnant with his third maybe fourth child,

787
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:54,000
Speaker 2: I think the third child. He quit his job in

788
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:56,200
Speaker 2: the cold month of December because he just couldn't take

789
00:46:56,239 --> 00:46:58,880
Speaker 2: it anymore. And so he started Sahan Journal because he

790
00:46:58,920 --> 00:47:01,480
Speaker 2: felt like some of this and studies were not showing up.

791
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:08,759
Speaker 2: And that's why newsrooms like SAHAN exist in Minnesota today.

792
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:11,279
Speaker 2: And I just want to I think it's important to

793
00:47:11,280 --> 00:47:18,560
Speaker 2: also mention this is not a Minnesota thing. It's you know,

794
00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:21,560
Speaker 2: it exists all around the state, all around the country.

795
00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:24,520
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, right, oh, I mean I could tell I

796
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 1: know growing up in so I grew up in Miami,

797
00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:29,319
Speaker 1: I grew up in South Florida. And one of the

798
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 1: hallmarks of the last ten years of local media is

799
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 1: how micro and community oriented it is. If you want

800
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:44,120
Speaker 1: to talk to the Caribbean communities, there's actually individual you

801
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 1: need to talk to. This Instagram influencer, and you need

802
00:47:46,560 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 1: to talk to this person here. The demand in these

803
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:53,480
Speaker 1: immigrant communities for somebody that looks like them, that understands

804
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 1: their life telling them today's news is through the roof.

805
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:00,680
Speaker 1: I get it, and I think that this is why

806
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:03,760
Speaker 1: I think this is. You guys are the best example

807
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:06,880
Speaker 1: of I think one that's getting traction and creating a

808
00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:08,879
Speaker 1: revenue stream and all of this, because I think that's

809
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:13,120
Speaker 1: the more difficult part is how do these become financially sustainable? Right?

810
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:15,120
Speaker 1: And this is all part of what we're working on

811
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:15,960
Speaker 1: with Local news Day.

812
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:18,400
Speaker 2: You know, I, Chuck, I'm going to use this line,

813
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:20,440
Speaker 2: and I'm not sure how to resonate with you in

814
00:48:20,440 --> 00:48:22,520
Speaker 2: your audience, but I've said this before in the past.

815
00:48:22,760 --> 00:48:25,160
Speaker 2: I feel like the impulse behind the creation and the

816
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:28,479
Speaker 2: need behind immigrant news rooms is very much the same

817
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:32,239
Speaker 2: impulse that built kind of like Fox News where it

818
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:36,400
Speaker 2: is right now. It's basically a community that for the

819
00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:43,440
Speaker 2: most part has felt either unseen or where traditional media

820
00:48:43,600 --> 00:48:48,279
Speaker 2: their realities were not reflected there in traditional legacy media.

821
00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 2: Now I would say, obviously there is That's where the

822
00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:54,799
Speaker 2: point of similarity would end and how we would use

823
00:48:54,920 --> 00:48:58,480
Speaker 2: that moment would be different. But I you know, I'm

824
00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:01,880
Speaker 2: not a journalist. I'm not a trained journalist, and I've always.

825
00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:05,799
Speaker 1: An engineer, a mechanical engineer. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but you

826
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 1: certainly are a numbers guy.

827
00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:10,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a mechanical engineer. I did m my MBA.

828
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:14,360
Speaker 2: But I'm also a consumer. I love business models, and

829
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:17,080
Speaker 2: I'm a consumer of news content, and I've always observed

830
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 2: news from a not just from a reader, but like, hey,

831
00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:22,440
Speaker 2: what's going on over here? And I you know the

832
00:49:22,480 --> 00:49:24,760
Speaker 2: fact that the first of all, things have changed dramatically

833
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:27,640
Speaker 2: and I would say improved quite a bit since since

834
00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:30,719
Speaker 2: twenty twenty and since SHAN has been since created. But

835
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:34,480
Speaker 2: for the most part, people felt their reality was not

836
00:49:34,560 --> 00:49:40,120
Speaker 2: reflected in how traditional news media portrayed it right, And

837
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:42,879
Speaker 2: so it was very important for SAHAN when we were

838
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:45,480
Speaker 2: when we were founded, to make sure that, yes, we

839
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:47,800
Speaker 2: are speaking to the facts, but we are also making

840
00:49:47,840 --> 00:49:53,120
Speaker 2: sure that people's lives are reflected accurately in that space. Yeah.

841
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:57,360
Speaker 1: No, I get what you're saying. And I think I

842
00:49:57,360 --> 00:50:00,239
Speaker 1: can tell you my experience that Meet the Press is,

843
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:03,480
Speaker 1: particularly with immigrant audiences, is that a lot of I

844
00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:07,360
Speaker 1: had a lot of first gen viewers for Generation viewers

845
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:09,720
Speaker 1: and they and they would tell me, and it would frankly,

846
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:11,880
Speaker 1: it's the same thing I do when I'm in a

847
00:50:11,920 --> 00:50:14,960
Speaker 1: foreign country, even for a week, which is I want

848
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:17,880
Speaker 1: to assimilate and understand what's going on locally as quickly

849
00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 1: as I possibly can. What's the best way to do it.

850
00:50:20,200 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 1: A lot of times it is through the news, and

851
00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:25,799
Speaker 1: you know, maybe there's a language barrier, and so maybe

852
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:28,880
Speaker 1: I'm finding anything that's in my language that still reflects

853
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:31,319
Speaker 1: what's going on in the community, or maybe you'll find

854
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:34,799
Speaker 1: your expat community in a specific city. But the thing

855
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:37,960
Speaker 1: is is that you know the sort of I think

856
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:42,319
Speaker 1: the ignorance sometimes that we portray about like how we

857
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:45,320
Speaker 1: behave when we move to a new area, we quickly

858
00:50:45,360 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 1: want to assimilate. Is how anybody behaves when they move

859
00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:50,319
Speaker 1: to a new area, which is they're constantly looking, but

860
00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 1: they want to understand the place they're living in. And so,

861
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:56,239
Speaker 1: you know, I know, the first thing I'd be doing

862
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:58,799
Speaker 1: if I lived in Malaysia would be to find the

863
00:50:58,880 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 1: Sunday whatever thequivalent of the political programs are, just so

864
00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:04,400
Speaker 1: I understood the lay of the land, I understood the

865
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: politics of the area, Frankly, it's a survival. It's for survival.

866
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 1: You're not doing it because you want to know. You're

867
00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:13,000
Speaker 1: doing it because how do I navigate this new community?

868
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:15,279
Speaker 1: Let me learn the politics and economics of.

869
00:51:15,200 --> 00:51:19,760
Speaker 2: The new community exactly exactly. And yeah, so in a nutshell,

870
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:23,320
Speaker 2: that's how that's what SAHAN was was was was created.

871
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:28,440
Speaker 2: You know, since then, you know, I have colleagues and

872
00:51:28,640 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 2: I know the leaders of mp of minist of Public

873
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:33,360
Speaker 2: Radio and the Stout Tribune and whatnot, and things have

874
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:36,680
Speaker 2: dramatically changed since then. But I would say just the

875
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:41,440
Speaker 2: thing though, SAHAN, our coverage is one hundred percent focused

876
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:45,160
Speaker 2: on issues that impact immigrants and communities of color, right,

877
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:50,040
Speaker 2: And I like to use this analogy. So Stout Tribune

878
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:52,480
Speaker 2: and MPR they're like, you know your targets, you know,

879
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 2: or you know, I don't know what's the grocery.

880
00:51:56,320 --> 00:51:58,520
Speaker 1: A department store, But you're what you're saying is they

881
00:51:58,520 --> 00:52:02,399
Speaker 1: have a little bit for everybody, exactly, And everybody can

882
00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:06,200
Speaker 1: find something in a target that is meant for them.

883
00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:09,279
Speaker 1: But maybe that target doesn't have everything they're looking for,

884
00:52:09,320 --> 00:52:11,839
Speaker 1: but they have a couple of things they at least

885
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:15,360
Speaker 1: acknowledge my existence exactly exactly.

886
00:52:15,960 --> 00:52:18,480
Speaker 2: But if you want something very specific, and I use

887
00:52:18,520 --> 00:52:20,680
Speaker 2: grocery stores because I cook and eat a lot. But

888
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:23,440
Speaker 2: if I want that bock Choi vegetable, right, and even

889
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:26,239
Speaker 2: though Target sells it for whatever, I'm going to build

890
00:52:26,239 --> 00:52:28,960
Speaker 2: that an Asian stall two miles away just because I

891
00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:31,319
Speaker 2: know it's legit for whatever it is, right.

892
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:34,160
Speaker 1: And then you think that they're more likely to find

893
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:36,759
Speaker 1: the smart, the better growers of bock choi, and they

894
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:37,120
Speaker 1: know where to.

895
00:52:37,120 --> 00:52:40,000
Speaker 2: Get exactly exactly exactly, They're going to care a little

896
00:52:40,040 --> 00:52:43,000
Speaker 2: bit more. They ca they care much more. Frankly, for

897
00:52:43,040 --> 00:52:45,239
Speaker 2: that matter, they care much more. And they could also

898
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:49,160
Speaker 2: provide insights that the target may not have, right, and

899
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:52,160
Speaker 2: that's not targets business foun They shouldn't care. They cut

900
00:52:52,160 --> 00:52:55,880
Speaker 2: care for everything, right. And so that's why Sahn exists.

901
00:52:56,080 --> 00:52:58,920
Speaker 2: We exist within this ecosphere. If you care about immigrants,

902
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:02,080
Speaker 2: and if you care about issues that the main papers

903
00:53:02,120 --> 00:53:04,640
Speaker 2: may not have the resources or time to cover, which

904
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 2: it does happen right down the daily cycle, that's why

905
00:53:08,239 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 2: you come to Sahan. Because you come to Sahan because

906
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:13,520
Speaker 2: you're curious, you're interested, and you seek to understand issues

907
00:53:14,560 --> 00:53:15,919
Speaker 2: more than just the surface level.

908
00:53:16,360 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 1: Well let's talk about Shan specifically, because you are doing

909
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 1: something that on paper wouldn't be easy to do, because

910
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:24,840
Speaker 1: you're basically saying, look, we're going to cover all of

911
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:28,920
Speaker 1: these underserved immigrant communities, and then while they have some

912
00:53:29,040 --> 00:53:31,799
Speaker 1: things in common, they actually don't have a lot in common. Right,

913
00:53:32,120 --> 00:53:37,240
Speaker 1: a Somali community versus among community versus a first generation

914
00:53:37,760 --> 00:53:40,960
Speaker 1: Mexican American community, right, like it is? It is not

915
00:53:42,120 --> 00:53:47,479
Speaker 1: so that actually I wonder how difficult that is. That's

916
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:51,120
Speaker 1: your north star. But you're basically you know that that's

917
00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 1: a pretty wide breadth of coverage. So yeah, give me

918
00:53:56,120 --> 00:54:00,879
Speaker 1: a specific how does it? You know what when you decide, hey,

919
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:03,319
Speaker 1: this community needs we need a we need a full

920
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:04,600
Speaker 1: time reporter for this community.

921
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:11,600
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, well we well, thank you, Chuck Fall putting

922
00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:14,200
Speaker 2: my problems in a nutshell essentially, but thank you for that.

923
00:54:14,239 --> 00:54:17,239
Speaker 1: Thank you for uh and my part of our goal here, right,

924
00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:19,520
Speaker 1: we're trying to figure out how to solve how many

925
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:21,960
Speaker 1: of these problems can we solve individually, and how many

926
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:24,560
Speaker 1: of these problems are we going to have to build

927
00:54:24,560 --> 00:54:26,560
Speaker 1: a collective network for. I mean, I know I have

928
00:54:26,600 --> 00:54:29,359
Speaker 1: a vision of a of a collective network that can

929
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:32,520
Speaker 1: where you get to keep your independence. But maybe there

930
00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:36,279
Speaker 1: is ways to share some expenses, right, and that's you know,

931
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:39,239
Speaker 1: to make all of this a little more affordable.

932
00:54:39,239 --> 00:54:41,600
Speaker 2: Exactly exactly. So let me try to answer you a question.

933
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:43,920
Speaker 2: So a couple of things. So you know, Sahan is

934
00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:45,799
Speaker 2: six years old. So some of the things that you

935
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:47,719
Speaker 2: bring up, we're still trying to crack the code, right,

936
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 2: you're trying to solve it, right, So a few things.

937
00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:55,359
Speaker 2: I think there was a deliberate, very deliberate decision that

938
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:58,120
Speaker 2: was made when we were started. We published in English,

939
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:01,319
Speaker 2: and that was deliberate because our mission is not to

940
00:55:01,440 --> 00:55:05,360
Speaker 2: just serve one pocket of immigrants, right, Like as you mentioned,

941
00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:08,399
Speaker 2: we have a whole host of communities. We primarily serve

942
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:11,760
Speaker 2: East Africans among Its of Hispanic, but it was also

943
00:55:12,080 --> 00:55:15,680
Speaker 2: equally important for us to show all Minnesotas, so the

944
00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:19,120
Speaker 2: non immigrants to a more equitable state. And that only

945
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:22,640
Speaker 2: works if we have non immigrants of non immigrants reading

946
00:55:22,680 --> 00:55:26,160
Speaker 2: our work as well. Now, and we don't really bucket

947
00:55:26,239 --> 00:55:33,160
Speaker 2: our stories into Somali among Hispanic. We we do traditional beats, healthcare, education,

948
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:40,399
Speaker 2: social justice, you know, uh, police reforms uh sorry uh,

949
00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:46,000
Speaker 2: and security and crime criminal justice and stuff like that.

950
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:49,200
Speaker 2: And you know, sometimes those stories relate to a Somoli

951
00:55:49,200 --> 00:55:52,719
Speaker 2: community modern not among community. As you can imagine, some

952
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:55,600
Speaker 2: of the fraud coverage that we were covering right right

953
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:59,760
Speaker 2: would would center on a particular community, So we don't

954
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:04,319
Speaker 2: necessarily cover them by community. But about topic issues, now,

955
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:07,520
Speaker 2: one of the things that we've noticed is that people

956
00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:10,760
Speaker 2: are not jumping from let's say I'm a mong person.

957
00:56:11,360 --> 00:56:15,279
Speaker 2: I'm not necessarily going to jump to the Hispanic main

958
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:19,319
Speaker 2: story or a Mons story, sorry, a Somali story. And

959
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:21,400
Speaker 2: that's something that we're trying to work through right now.

960
00:56:22,480 --> 00:56:24,680
Speaker 2: But for you, for the fact is that's one of

961
00:56:24,719 --> 00:56:29,399
Speaker 2: the challenges that we have. So we don't we try

962
00:56:29,400 --> 00:56:33,799
Speaker 2: to cover things that matter to a particular community, regardless

963
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:36,960
Speaker 2: of their regardless of their background. Now, this is what

964
00:56:37,040 --> 00:56:39,440
Speaker 2: I would say though, and this is a little bit

965
00:56:39,480 --> 00:56:41,880
Speaker 2: of like a business model where you if you serve

966
00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:45,760
Speaker 2: the outlier case, you tend to also serve the general public.

967
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:49,960
Speaker 2: When it comes to education, right, we wrote a beautiful story.

968
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:53,680
Speaker 2: We've written Step one of our education reporter is absolutely

969
00:56:53,719 --> 00:56:58,800
Speaker 2: amazing and everywhere I'm blessed that everywhere I go people

970
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:01,200
Speaker 2: just talk about the report is more than and the

971
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:04,040
Speaker 2: ones that I've inherited from this job, so they're really good.

972
00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:06,759
Speaker 2: But when you talk about the education needs of the

973
00:57:07,160 --> 00:57:12,040
Speaker 2: current community or the Somali community, and it is uplifted

974
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:17,000
Speaker 2: and regardless of your background, when you read it and

975
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:19,240
Speaker 2: you're trying to improve the school system and you care

976
00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:23,040
Speaker 2: about the immigrant that particular community, you do uplift your

977
00:57:23,160 --> 00:57:25,760
Speaker 2: education system for your own child as well. And so

978
00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:28,400
Speaker 2: that's one of the things that we've learned that we've

979
00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:33,240
Speaker 2: seen where you know, the majority non immigrant population in

980
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:39,800
Speaker 2: Minnesota still use our news contents their source of not

981
00:57:39,880 --> 00:57:45,480
Speaker 2: just information, but to advocate for their own child's education system.

982
00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:47,560
Speaker 2: I can't tell you the amount of moms that I've

983
00:57:47,560 --> 00:57:51,360
Speaker 2: bumped into who use our education stories in their mom's

984
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:55,560
Speaker 2: chat group, because we are at the end of the day,

985
00:57:55,600 --> 00:57:59,080
Speaker 2: it is a melting bodies, a multi racial society, and

986
00:57:59,160 --> 00:58:01,600
Speaker 2: what's best for this child is also good for my child,

987
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:05,160
Speaker 2: and so it's not as binary as you think as

988
00:58:05,240 --> 00:58:07,680
Speaker 2: one would think, you know, which is what I walked into.

989
00:58:07,840 --> 00:58:10,240
Speaker 2: But I you know, I learned quite a number of

990
00:58:10,320 --> 00:58:12,000
Speaker 2: things as I into my new role here.

991
00:58:12,880 --> 00:58:14,560
Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting you said that you guys are

992
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:18,120
Speaker 1: you always publish in English. Yeah, do you think you're

993
00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:23,720
Speaker 1: leaving any readers on the it is? I mean, does

994
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:26,880
Speaker 1: the effort to publish in multiple languages? I mean, is

995
00:58:26,960 --> 00:58:29,240
Speaker 1: that a how much of that is a financial decision

996
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:31,640
Speaker 1: and how much of it is Look, I know, like

997
00:58:31,720 --> 00:58:33,560
Speaker 1: I said, had grown up in Miami. When I grew

998
00:58:33,640 --> 00:58:35,480
Speaker 1: up in Miami in the seventies and eighties, I knew

999
00:58:35,520 --> 00:58:40,640
Speaker 1: many I had many friends whose parents insisted that English

1000
00:58:40,720 --> 00:58:42,920
Speaker 1: be spoke in the house, even though they were Spanish

1001
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:47,080
Speaker 1: first parents, because they wanted their kids to assimilate to America.

1002
00:58:47,200 --> 00:58:50,360
Speaker 1: So I know there's a lot of immigrant parents who

1003
00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:52,800
Speaker 1: are here with their kids and they're like, no, no, no, no,

1004
00:58:53,480 --> 00:58:56,480
Speaker 1: you've got to We want you to assimilate into American cultures.

1005
00:58:56,560 --> 00:59:00,200
Speaker 1: So we'll do this. So I understand that five. But

1006
00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:04,160
Speaker 1: I'm curious if you looking at at the numbers, if

1007
00:59:04,280 --> 00:59:08,040
Speaker 1: you ever contemplated, well maybe we should or I don't know.

1008
00:59:08,800 --> 00:59:13,840
Speaker 2: It is an ongoing conversation, and let me let me clarify. Yes,

1009
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 2: we do publish in English, and last year we started

1010
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:20,160
Speaker 2: Sahan and Espaniels, and then you can imagine what that is, right,

1011
00:59:20,200 --> 00:59:23,880
Speaker 2: and so we do have translations in Hispanic, and we

1012
00:59:24,040 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 2: chose Hispanic because they are the largest immigrant population within Minnesota.

1013
00:59:29,640 --> 00:59:33,560
Speaker 2: It is okay, it is, I mean, Somali is very

1014
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 2: close to second.

1015
00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:37,840
Speaker 1: But but this is state wide versus city. If you

1016
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:40,400
Speaker 1: just did this in Minneapolis proper, would it be Somali

1017
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:41,080
Speaker 1: over Latino.

1018
00:59:41,240 --> 00:59:44,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, the numbers I mentioned was statewide. Yeah, yeah,

1019
00:59:44,520 --> 00:59:49,520
Speaker 2: absolutely right, yeah yeah. And so here I'm not going

1020
00:59:49,600 --> 00:59:51,640
Speaker 2: to throw anyone under the bus here, but I got

1021
00:59:51,760 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 2: to tell you the founder and our editor in chief,

1022
00:59:54,920 --> 00:59:57,600
Speaker 2: they are really picky if they feel like they cannot

1023
00:59:57,640 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 2: get the translation right. They were not going to do

1024
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:01,720
Speaker 2: it at all all because they felt like it would

1025
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,000
Speaker 2: insult that population, that community.

1026
01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:07,040
Speaker 1: That is also true, and they're looking forward to how

1027
01:00:07,080 --> 01:00:07,920
Speaker 1: AI blows this.

1028
01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:11,720
Speaker 2: Exactly so, And if you if you want to think

1029
01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:14,560
Speaker 2: about AI explosion and technology, this we're talking about the

1030
01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:17,080
Speaker 2: last twelve months. But before I when I came on board,

1031
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:19,520
Speaker 2: it was that was what I heard, like, we can't

1032
01:00:19,560 --> 01:00:21,960
Speaker 2: do if we can't do this right, which means actually

1033
01:00:22,240 --> 01:00:28,240
Speaker 2: actually having a human translator translated from a cultural context. Chunk.

1034
01:00:28,600 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 2: Don't forget, I'm not talking about word usage, but it's

1035
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:32,200
Speaker 2: a word for a word.

1036
01:00:32,240 --> 01:00:36,000
Speaker 1: It's crazyactly, No, no, no, no, that's always much much

1037
01:00:36,080 --> 01:00:37,600
Speaker 1: harder to connect exactly.

1038
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:40,880
Speaker 2: So our our editor in chief was mon and and

1039
01:00:41,120 --> 01:00:44,040
Speaker 2: found those Somali. They were like, Nope, not going to

1040
01:00:44,120 --> 01:00:46,000
Speaker 2: do it, not going to do it because it's it's

1041
01:00:46,040 --> 01:00:51,360
Speaker 2: too expensive to have a human translator. Right now, I've

1042
01:00:51,400 --> 01:00:54,120
Speaker 2: always wondered when I came on board, you know. And

1043
01:00:54,800 --> 01:00:58,439
Speaker 2: now he's two things that we've that I've I've seen

1044
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:03,160
Speaker 2: a We've seen a lot of articles where it's published

1045
01:01:03,200 --> 01:01:05,680
Speaker 2: in English and then the comment section is in the

1046
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:08,800
Speaker 2: native town like someone's yep.

1047
01:01:08,760 --> 01:01:11,800
Speaker 1: Because it's a less server posted on our somewhere.

1048
01:01:11,560 --> 01:01:15,560
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly. And so the the the assumption that we're

1049
01:01:15,560 --> 01:01:17,400
Speaker 2: pulling is that people are just reading it, but then

1050
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:20,920
Speaker 2: they're communicating to the community about the content in their

1051
01:01:21,200 --> 01:01:22,040
Speaker 2: in their own language.

1052
01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:24,640
Speaker 1: Right. So that's perfectly normal. Yeah, perfectly normal.

1053
01:01:24,680 --> 01:01:28,840
Speaker 2: And I've seen that in my own life. But then

1054
01:01:28,880 --> 01:01:31,520
Speaker 2: now I'm thinking, now news from like, huh, that's interesting.

1055
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:46,000
Speaker 2: We've all experienced this, yeah exactly, and that's probably the

1056
01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:49,920
Speaker 2: second generation immigrant population that we're referring to. And now

1057
01:01:50,000 --> 01:01:51,800
Speaker 2: the third thing is this a I think it is

1058
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:55,400
Speaker 2: ridiculous how you can press a button here and people.

1059
01:01:56,040 --> 01:01:59,280
Speaker 2: There's two options. We can provide the button to be

1060
01:01:59,360 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 2: pressed so that the language is translated, but you could

1061
01:02:02,880 --> 01:02:06,800
Speaker 2: also just click on the page and google whoever it is.

1062
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:09,920
Speaker 2: Your your provider is going to say translated yourself. Right,

1063
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:13,720
Speaker 2: So we are at a crossroads right now. My one

1064
01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:16,640
Speaker 2: of my team member, my growth person, brought this idea

1065
01:02:16,680 --> 01:02:18,360
Speaker 2: to me and say, hey, do you just want to

1066
01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:21,640
Speaker 2: have three buttons up there, English, Somali, mong up the

1067
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:24,560
Speaker 2: top and so people can just click And I would say,

1068
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:28,960
Speaker 2: at this point we could explore it. It's a slightly

1069
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 2: lower list I have my my it's a it's a

1070
01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:34,720
Speaker 2: lower lift than what it was twelve months ago, that's

1071
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:39,800
Speaker 2: for sure, right. And my curiosity around audience growth is

1072
01:02:39,880 --> 01:02:45,120
Speaker 2: not necessarily around language, but it's around uh, the needs,

1073
01:02:45,600 --> 01:02:50,600
Speaker 2: the information needs of a particular generation. So I hope

1074
01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:53,240
Speaker 2: that answers your question, because it was a curiosity that

1075
01:02:53,440 --> 01:02:56,720
Speaker 2: expected that I was curious. I was thinking about, well, it's.

1076
01:02:56,560 --> 01:03:00,440
Speaker 1: One of those things where you know, news make the

1077
01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:02,800
Speaker 1: mistakes sometimes where they think, we know we have to

1078
01:03:02,880 --> 01:03:06,360
Speaker 1: do this, let's not use an outside tool, let's not assume,

1079
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:09,880
Speaker 1: and sometimes your own readers will do it. So go

1080
01:03:09,960 --> 01:03:12,920
Speaker 1: ahead and embrace what their tools may be, and then

1081
01:03:13,000 --> 01:03:15,800
Speaker 1: you just offer them all right. You know, it's almost

1082
01:03:15,840 --> 01:03:18,680
Speaker 1: like you let your readers. Some of you want to

1083
01:03:18,760 --> 01:03:21,040
Speaker 1: translate this. How do you want it done? You know,

1084
01:03:21,120 --> 01:03:22,960
Speaker 1: do you have a favorite Most people might have their

1085
01:03:23,000 --> 01:03:25,440
Speaker 1: own way. You know what, I use my own translator.

1086
01:03:25,800 --> 01:03:27,640
Speaker 1: I don't need you. Maybe you guys can come up

1087
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:29,600
Speaker 1: with a better one. But you're reinventing the wheel here,

1088
01:03:30,160 --> 01:03:32,440
Speaker 1: and you know what, it turns out none of us

1089
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:35,520
Speaker 1: have the resources to reinvent wheels in the local news space.

1090
01:03:35,720 --> 01:03:37,920
Speaker 1: We've got to save every dollar that's possible here. So

1091
01:03:38,600 --> 01:03:41,720
Speaker 1: you know where you can share a resource? Well, great, Hey,

1092
01:03:42,160 --> 01:03:44,680
Speaker 1: here's Google. Here's the button for Google Translate. Here's the

1093
01:03:44,720 --> 01:03:48,200
Speaker 1: button for Apple's version. Here's the button for open Aiyes,

1094
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:51,400
Speaker 1: and clauds or whatever, Right, and I buy that. Let's

1095
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:54,440
Speaker 1: talk about your business model. Yeah, do you imagine that

1096
01:03:54,520 --> 01:03:56,480
Speaker 1: you're always going to be a nonprofit or do you

1097
01:03:56,640 --> 01:03:59,600
Speaker 1: see the do you see a vision here? Because you know,

1098
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:05,280
Speaker 1: when you're serving an underserved community, your opportunity to have

1099
01:04:05,400 --> 01:04:09,440
Speaker 1: a classified ad system I think is probably higher than

1100
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:14,240
Speaker 1: a more general news local news outlet. The opportunity that

1101
01:04:14,320 --> 01:04:17,240
Speaker 1: you have specific businesses that want to target you know,

1102
01:04:17,880 --> 01:04:22,720
Speaker 1: your community that you're serving because they provide services that

1103
01:04:22,960 --> 01:04:27,960
Speaker 1: over index with immigrant populations. Right. So I imagine there

1104
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:33,840
Speaker 1: is some interesting business opportunities that you have. What's working,

1105
01:04:34,520 --> 01:04:37,200
Speaker 1: what do you think is underutilized that you're hoping to

1106
01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:40,640
Speaker 1: experiment with, and do you think this can move from

1107
01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:46,520
Speaker 1: nonprofit to for profit? You know?

1108
01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:49,920
Speaker 2: I as part of my homework, I did hear the

1109
01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:52,960
Speaker 2: interview that you did with John right, and there was

1110
01:04:53,000 --> 01:04:55,320
Speaker 2: a line that he said that I think residents of

1111
01:04:55,400 --> 01:04:58,840
Speaker 2: a lot of people the nonprofit faul profit that's essentially

1112
01:04:58,880 --> 01:05:01,960
Speaker 2: a tech status right at the end of the day, yep.

1113
01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:04,640
Speaker 2: And the key here is sustainability. That's all what we

1114
01:05:04,800 --> 01:05:05,520
Speaker 2: that's all we want.

1115
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:08,280
Speaker 1: We want to have enough regardless of whatever the whatever,

1116
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:13,560
Speaker 1: the your whatever your tax is, are you sustainable or unsustainable?

1117
01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:16,400
Speaker 2: Exactly? I think one big difference is if you're a

1118
01:05:16,440 --> 01:05:19,640
Speaker 2: nonprofit and you have a banner year, you are reinvesting

1119
01:05:19,720 --> 01:05:22,200
Speaker 2: those dollars into the community and into the work, as

1120
01:05:22,240 --> 01:05:26,640
Speaker 2: opposed to going to a shareholder or whatnot. Right. So

1121
01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:29,240
Speaker 2: the goal here is so let me try to talk

1122
01:05:29,240 --> 01:05:31,120
Speaker 2: about it from a sustainability perspective.

1123
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:33,240
Speaker 1: Chuck, that's a great way, perfect perfect is that?

1124
01:05:33,760 --> 01:05:37,200
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, if we move the for profit, so be

1125
01:05:37,320 --> 01:05:39,440
Speaker 2: it that. I'm guessing I'm going to have to pay

1126
01:05:39,560 --> 01:05:41,400
Speaker 2: lawyers a bunch of money to make that happen. But

1127
01:05:41,600 --> 01:05:42,680
Speaker 2: is that what we really want?

1128
01:05:43,200 --> 01:05:48,560
Speaker 1: So he's either way, lawyers, either way, because you got

1129
01:05:48,640 --> 01:05:50,400
Speaker 1: to pay a smart account and a lawyer and then

1130
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:52,920
Speaker 1: not for profit and nonprofit all of it, right, like,

1131
01:05:53,120 --> 01:05:56,280
Speaker 1: no matter what. That's why everybody tells tells their kids

1132
01:05:56,280 --> 01:05:58,640
Speaker 1: a go to law school because there's always a job. Yeah,

1133
01:05:58,880 --> 01:05:59,800
Speaker 1: go ahead, yeah, but I do.

1134
01:06:00,600 --> 01:06:04,640
Speaker 2: So let me talk about sustainability here and you I'm

1135
01:06:04,680 --> 01:06:06,960
Speaker 2: not I'm sure you are familiar with this, but let

1136
01:06:07,040 --> 01:06:09,800
Speaker 2: me share out this story for your audience if they're

1137
01:06:09,800 --> 01:06:14,800
Speaker 2: not so familiar but local for a nonprofit entity, it's

1138
01:06:14,880 --> 01:06:18,920
Speaker 2: usually the national funders who come in to catalyze a

1139
01:06:19,040 --> 01:06:21,440
Speaker 2: news room, right, and so they see a need right

1140
01:06:21,600 --> 01:06:24,680
Speaker 2: here in Minnesota, great news ecosystem. But man, that's the

1141
01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:28,240
Speaker 2: huge segment of the population that's been neglected. Boom, let's

1142
01:06:28,360 --> 01:06:33,200
Speaker 2: invest in Sahan journal, Okay, And from a national foundation perspective,

1143
01:06:33,400 --> 01:06:37,000
Speaker 2: they like that, you know, they catalyze they whatever you

1144
01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:40,040
Speaker 2: want to call it. The shiny object kind of thing.

1145
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:43,200
Speaker 2: But eventually they believe, and I agree with them, that

1146
01:06:43,760 --> 01:06:46,600
Speaker 2: the work needs to be sustained from a from the

1147
01:06:46,680 --> 01:06:50,320
Speaker 2: local foundation perspective, from the local reader's perspective, and whatnot. Right,

1148
01:06:50,360 --> 01:06:53,800
Speaker 2: And that's the journey where Sahana is in this midpoint.

1149
01:06:53,920 --> 01:06:58,000
Speaker 2: We still have national funders, but the conversation is that, hey,

1150
01:06:58,080 --> 01:06:59,560
Speaker 2: we need a little bit more time, but we are

1151
01:06:59,600 --> 01:07:05,920
Speaker 2: slowly moving into local foundations in local readers. Right if

1152
01:07:06,200 --> 01:07:09,600
Speaker 2: eventually we end up becoming like a public like the

1153
01:07:09,760 --> 01:07:12,080
Speaker 2: NPR model where I think you're I don't know what's

1154
01:07:12,120 --> 01:07:15,240
Speaker 2: the number, but anywhere between sixty to seventy percent uh

1155
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:20,120
Speaker 2: funded by your audience, right, and then the remaining to

1156
01:07:21,080 --> 01:07:24,120
Speaker 2: other maybe it's foundations, a couple of foundations here in there,

1157
01:07:24,200 --> 01:07:27,120
Speaker 2: but out of business benures. I think that is where

1158
01:07:27,640 --> 01:07:30,160
Speaker 2: we need to be, whether we have for profit, So

1159
01:07:30,320 --> 01:07:32,960
Speaker 2: for profit is going to be like a paywall system.

1160
01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:35,200
Speaker 2: I guess if you want to call it, but nonprofit

1161
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:38,040
Speaker 2: then people are paying twenty bucks a month. They pay

1162
01:07:38,120 --> 01:07:40,760
Speaker 2: twenty bucks on Netflix. Now they're paying some undy dollars

1163
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:43,520
Speaker 2: a month. And that's the key piece here because when

1164
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:46,400
Speaker 2: we have a lot of majority, if our revenue comes

1165
01:07:46,480 --> 01:07:51,800
Speaker 2: from individual donors. Then we are not beholden to some

1166
01:07:52,000 --> 01:07:55,240
Speaker 2: of this. I mean it does happen. We're not beholden

1167
01:07:55,280 --> 01:07:59,360
Speaker 2: to lunch lunch, you know, big donors and and and

1168
01:07:59,520 --> 01:08:01,560
Speaker 2: and big onnus.

1169
01:08:01,680 --> 01:08:04,400
Speaker 1: Right, the right you don't want to have, right, No,

1170
01:08:04,480 --> 01:08:07,680
Speaker 1: I know what you mean, meaning like you're you either

1171
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:11,600
Speaker 1: have shareholders, that's one thing, and they demand and it

1172
01:08:11,680 --> 01:08:15,800
Speaker 1: really is, look, they demand. It's a judiciary responsibility that

1173
01:08:16,000 --> 01:08:18,240
Speaker 1: that word means something for a reason. Right, it is

1174
01:08:18,320 --> 01:08:22,840
Speaker 1: about maximizing your profits hard stocks. Right. There is not

1175
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:25,519
Speaker 1: a there is not a character test on that. Right,

1176
01:08:25,600 --> 01:08:29,160
Speaker 1: it is just maximizing profits an individual. I always say,

1177
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:32,040
Speaker 1: you know, you can have a benevolent billionaire or a

1178
01:08:32,160 --> 01:08:34,680
Speaker 1: malevolent billionaire, or you could have a billionaire who's both

1179
01:08:34,760 --> 01:08:39,839
Speaker 1: malevola some years and benevolent other execs. Right, and relying

1180
01:08:39,880 --> 01:08:42,840
Speaker 1: on the whim of one means you're always going to

1181
01:08:42,840 --> 01:08:45,639
Speaker 1: be defined by that one, for better or for worse.

1182
01:08:45,800 --> 01:08:47,800
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, look at the Washington Post. They're

1183
01:08:47,840 --> 01:08:50,920
Speaker 1: being defined by their individual owner. I never thought the

1184
01:08:51,000 --> 01:08:53,680
Speaker 1: Washington Post would ever put itself in that situation. Right,

1185
01:08:53,760 --> 01:08:56,000
Speaker 1: it was like, you know, most people can't tell you

1186
01:08:56,120 --> 01:08:57,719
Speaker 1: the name of who owns the New York Times.

1187
01:08:58,520 --> 01:08:59,360
Speaker 2: That should be.

1188
01:08:59,760 --> 01:09:02,639
Speaker 1: How the Washington Post works, even the Wall Street Journal.

1189
01:09:02,680 --> 01:09:05,920
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people don't fully a lot

1190
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:07,960
Speaker 1: of you know, I'm guessing if you're in the business,

1191
01:09:08,040 --> 01:09:10,760
Speaker 1: you know who owns it. But I bet you it

1192
01:09:10,880 --> 01:09:14,519
Speaker 1: isn't easily known, right because the murdocks are so afraid

1193
01:09:14,560 --> 01:09:18,599
Speaker 1: of the Wall Street Journal losing its prestige, they kind

1194
01:09:18,600 --> 01:09:21,479
Speaker 1: of back off, back off. They don't want it, They

1195
01:09:21,520 --> 01:09:24,920
Speaker 1: don't want to be the defining image and brand of that.

1196
01:09:25,479 --> 01:09:29,240
Speaker 1: So I totally understand what I'm curious about, because this

1197
01:09:29,400 --> 01:09:33,680
Speaker 1: is what happened to the successful black press news organizations

1198
01:09:33,720 --> 01:09:37,840
Speaker 1: of the thirties, forties and fifties and sixties, where it

1199
01:09:37,960 --> 01:09:43,200
Speaker 1: was incredibly necessary until mainstream media finally acknowledge the existence

1200
01:09:43,240 --> 01:09:48,479
Speaker 1: of these communities. Then over time, the resources of those

1201
01:09:48,560 --> 01:09:55,120
Speaker 1: large news organizations suddenly finally covering Black America made it

1202
01:09:55,200 --> 01:09:58,320
Speaker 1: harder for the black press to to you know, survive

1203
01:09:58,439 --> 01:10:01,240
Speaker 1: in that in that instant. I mean, look, this would

1204
01:10:01,280 --> 01:10:03,920
Speaker 1: be a good problem for your communities to have. Suddenly

1205
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:08,280
Speaker 1: the start Tribune had the resources to cover it all. Yeah,

1206
01:10:08,479 --> 01:10:11,040
Speaker 1: is that something or do you think we're you know,

1207
01:10:11,080 --> 01:10:14,080
Speaker 1: we're in a. This is a generational shift in how

1208
01:10:14,800 --> 01:10:17,360
Speaker 1: the information ecosystem on a local level is going to work.

1209
01:10:18,040 --> 01:10:21,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean if you work. I came from a

1210
01:10:21,760 --> 01:10:25,960
Speaker 2: nonprofit background before this, right, And if at the end

1211
01:10:25,960 --> 01:10:28,040
Speaker 2: of the day your job is to kind of work

1212
01:10:28,080 --> 01:10:30,080
Speaker 2: yourself out of the job at the end of the day,

1213
01:10:30,120 --> 01:10:31,559
Speaker 2: that means like some point.

1214
01:10:31,439 --> 01:10:33,880
Speaker 1: If you're doing it, well, if you're using nonprofit, well

1215
01:10:34,320 --> 01:10:37,799
Speaker 1: that's exactly right, that whatever you're doing, you should eventually

1216
01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:40,880
Speaker 1: not have to be doing that because exactly your investment

1217
01:10:41,080 --> 01:10:45,719
Speaker 1: was so smart and targeted that it got it thrives

1218
01:10:45,800 --> 01:10:47,080
Speaker 1: on its own exactly.

1219
01:10:47,520 --> 01:10:49,679
Speaker 2: So. But let me go back to what you were saying.

1220
01:10:50,360 --> 01:10:51,479
Speaker 2: Here's so, here's my theory.

1221
01:10:51,560 --> 01:10:52,519
Speaker 1: I do think.

1222
01:10:54,120 --> 01:10:58,320
Speaker 2: Fundamentally we do need to be reader funded by a reader,

1223
01:10:58,600 --> 01:11:01,400
Speaker 2: like a big portion, more than fifty sixty maybe even

1224
01:11:01,400 --> 01:11:04,160
Speaker 2: seventy percent. And I don't know what the exact number is,

1225
01:11:04,360 --> 01:11:06,760
Speaker 2: and and that's something that we have to work it through.

1226
01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:13,040
Speaker 2: I have a a. I also have a theory. Again,

1227
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:14,960
Speaker 2: I'm saying this again because I'm not a journalist, so

1228
01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:17,160
Speaker 2: I might be saying things that might make me look

1229
01:11:19,840 --> 01:11:25,080
Speaker 2: dumb or whatnot, but I I'm not convinced I'm not

1230
01:11:25,280 --> 01:11:34,479
Speaker 2: convinced that audience size is our Is it panacea? That's

1231
01:11:34,560 --> 01:11:39,240
Speaker 2: the word panacee? Yeah, we do. We need to do

1232
01:11:39,320 --> 01:11:41,879
Speaker 2: a good job. We need to have a sizeable audience,

1233
01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:44,920
Speaker 2: not just from an impact perspective. Right, you guys talk

1234
01:11:44,960 --> 01:11:46,720
Speaker 2: about here, you write the best article in the one

1235
01:11:46,720 --> 01:11:47,800
Speaker 2: than five people read it?

1236
01:11:48,000 --> 01:11:49,240
Speaker 1: Who cares? Right? Right?

1237
01:11:49,439 --> 01:11:51,360
Speaker 2: So okay, so if it's not five, how about five

1238
01:11:51,439 --> 01:11:54,040
Speaker 2: thousand volient? How about fifty thousand? What maybe it is

1239
01:11:54,080 --> 01:11:56,679
Speaker 2: half a million dollars, but half a million. But here's

1240
01:11:56,720 --> 01:11:59,280
Speaker 2: the thing, Chuck, if I would read it right now,

1241
01:11:59,479 --> 01:12:00,960
Speaker 2: if I will read this, we have let's say about

1242
01:12:00,960 --> 01:12:03,240
Speaker 2: two hundred thousand a month, it goes up to three

1243
01:12:03,320 --> 01:12:05,320
Speaker 2: hundred thousand a month or four hundred thousands of a month.

1244
01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:09,320
Speaker 2: Does that mean our revenue size double? No, it's not right.

1245
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:11,600
Speaker 2: I don't think so, because it's not. It's not a

1246
01:12:11,760 --> 01:12:15,479
Speaker 2: one for one thing, right we. Part of it feels

1247
01:12:15,520 --> 01:12:18,200
Speaker 2: that we talk about reader size because it's still tied

1248
01:12:18,240 --> 01:12:21,479
Speaker 2: to the old way of making money, which was advertising. Right,

1249
01:12:22,160 --> 01:12:24,320
Speaker 2: And the way I look at audience size is that

1250
01:12:24,680 --> 01:12:27,920
Speaker 2: it is important for legitimacy, It is important for impact.

1251
01:12:28,280 --> 01:12:30,599
Speaker 2: Even if ten people read that and those ten people

1252
01:12:30,720 --> 01:12:32,280
Speaker 2: happened to be state legislatures.

1253
01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:37,000
Speaker 1: Good for good for Saha. Oh absolutely right. Yeah, Looking CNBC,

1254
01:12:37,200 --> 01:12:39,080
Speaker 1: I can tell you the business model for CNBC is

1255
01:12:39,120 --> 01:12:41,800
Speaker 1: not ratings. They've never had. There's not a lot of

1256
01:12:41,840 --> 01:12:44,160
Speaker 1: people that watch the stocks every day. But you know

1257
01:12:44,200 --> 01:12:47,120
Speaker 1: it's CNBC sells. They have CEOs who keep their TV on.

1258
01:12:47,680 --> 01:12:52,000
Speaker 1: So it's the it's they're selling who's watching, They're not

1259
01:12:52,240 --> 01:12:55,280
Speaker 1: selling how many are watching. And what you're saying is

1260
01:12:55,479 --> 01:12:58,800
Speaker 1: the quality of your reader is as important to yours.

1261
01:12:58,640 --> 01:13:02,000
Speaker 2: As inporting and exactly and so yes, we you know,

1262
01:13:02,520 --> 01:13:05,160
Speaker 2: is that what the grow audience? Yes, I think if

1263
01:13:05,200 --> 01:13:07,000
Speaker 2: we have time to talk about in the future, we've

1264
01:13:07,040 --> 01:13:09,439
Speaker 2: talked about where we want to grow next. But I

1265
01:13:09,840 --> 01:13:13,080
Speaker 2: I we we do need an excizeable audience, but we

1266
01:13:13,280 --> 01:13:18,360
Speaker 2: need to leverage that audience. How do I say, the

1267
01:13:18,479 --> 01:13:22,400
Speaker 2: understanding of what sahan means the brand right, and how

1268
01:13:22,479 --> 01:13:24,400
Speaker 2: can we make money from that? We've talked about I

1269
01:13:24,479 --> 01:13:28,280
Speaker 2: mean you've already seen events. They've talked about creating events,

1270
01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:29,000
Speaker 2: right John.

1271
01:13:32,479 --> 01:13:35,559
Speaker 1: You know, a quarterly festival of some sort of cultural

1272
01:13:35,720 --> 01:13:39,200
Speaker 1: might be news, might be you know whatever, right exactly.

1273
01:13:40,320 --> 01:13:44,639
Speaker 2: You know I've talked about I think the future generation

1274
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:47,040
Speaker 2: people are yearning for a sense of community, and what

1275
01:13:47,200 --> 01:13:50,400
Speaker 2: can SAHAN do to create that sense of community? Right

1276
01:13:50,760 --> 01:13:53,200
Speaker 2: and and when they have this thing from us, I'm

1277
01:13:53,240 --> 01:13:57,720
Speaker 2: sure they will continue to support SAHAN. So I don't

1278
01:13:57,760 --> 01:13:59,760
Speaker 2: have a full answer yet, but I've told this to

1279
01:13:59,840 --> 01:14:01,800
Speaker 2: my team before. It's become a broken record to the

1280
01:14:01,840 --> 01:14:03,479
Speaker 2: point where I actually need to do it. But if

1281
01:14:03,560 --> 01:14:06,040
Speaker 2: I find out that, hey, a laundromet that has a

1282
01:14:06,160 --> 01:14:09,640
Speaker 2: net profit margin of thirty percent, maybe SAHAN should just

1283
01:14:10,080 --> 01:14:13,280
Speaker 2: own laundro mets and turn the profit margins to fund

1284
01:14:13,320 --> 01:14:16,320
Speaker 2: for newsroom because I don't care as long as it's clean,

1285
01:14:16,439 --> 01:14:19,000
Speaker 2: legit money, obviously, But at the end of the day,

1286
01:14:19,280 --> 01:14:21,479
Speaker 2: if we can transfer some of our net earnings from

1287
01:14:21,520 --> 01:14:25,880
Speaker 2: one unrelated business model to support of a newsroom, that's

1288
01:14:25,920 --> 01:14:28,240
Speaker 2: a win for me. You know, I find it so

1289
01:14:28,439 --> 01:14:29,400
Speaker 2: unfortunate that, but.

1290
01:14:29,479 --> 01:14:31,960
Speaker 1: That's exactly how media has always been funded. You know,

1291
01:14:32,080 --> 01:14:35,040
Speaker 1: it's interesting take you know, I sort of joke that

1292
01:14:35,720 --> 01:14:39,280
Speaker 1: a man named Craig decided classified how to be free, YadA, YadA, YadA,

1293
01:14:39,360 --> 01:14:42,800
Speaker 1: we destroyed the entire local news ecosystem, right, Well, it

1294
01:14:42,920 --> 01:14:46,600
Speaker 1: turned out for a lot of news organizations you know,

1295
01:14:47,160 --> 01:14:50,360
Speaker 1: and this was true of some newspaper publishers. They believe

1296
01:14:50,479 --> 01:14:54,559
Speaker 1: they were running an advertising business and whatever space they

1297
01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:58,400
Speaker 1: couldn't fill an ad, they had to have news article,

1298
01:14:58,960 --> 01:15:02,000
Speaker 1: you know. And and I think that that is how

1299
01:15:02,080 --> 01:15:05,400
Speaker 1: some news publishers felt it was simply a vehicle for

1300
01:15:05,560 --> 01:15:09,680
Speaker 1: advertisement and and you know, and so you know, there

1301
01:15:09,760 --> 01:15:12,200
Speaker 1: is that there there there is that line there that

1302
01:15:12,360 --> 01:15:14,719
Speaker 1: I that I think is that that there was probably

1303
01:15:14,760 --> 01:15:19,080
Speaker 1: some truth to that. But you're not wrong. It's like whatever,

1304
01:15:19,479 --> 01:15:22,080
Speaker 1: you know, you may stumble on like, I've got this

1305
01:15:22,280 --> 01:15:24,479
Speaker 1: theory that there's a lot of money to be made

1306
01:15:24,520 --> 01:15:29,680
Speaker 1: in youth sports exactly, yep, and that youth sports can

1307
01:15:29,840 --> 01:15:33,000
Speaker 1: be a way to become the new classified advertising for

1308
01:15:33,120 --> 01:15:36,720
Speaker 1: local journalism. So youth sports is something that families of

1309
01:15:36,840 --> 01:15:40,280
Speaker 1: all shapes and sizes care about. Everybody is you know what,

1310
01:15:40,600 --> 01:15:42,640
Speaker 1: and there's always a there's some sport we have our

1311
01:15:42,720 --> 01:15:45,559
Speaker 1: kids participating in. It is a glue for a community.

1312
01:15:46,120 --> 01:15:48,800
Speaker 1: It they are always you know, it is very niche.

1313
01:15:48,880 --> 01:15:51,400
Speaker 1: But at the same time, it's also something everybody has

1314
01:15:51,479 --> 01:15:53,559
Speaker 1: in common. No matter how wealthy you are or how

1315
01:15:53,600 --> 01:15:55,639
Speaker 1: poor you are, you may have a kid who's playing

1316
01:15:55,720 --> 01:15:59,920
Speaker 1: in participating in youth sports. So you may stumble upon

1317
01:16:01,320 --> 01:16:04,960
Speaker 1: a way to showcase youth sports games that make a

1318
01:16:05,080 --> 01:16:08,519
Speaker 1: ton of money that finances the journalism. So I totally

1319
01:16:08,600 --> 01:16:09,320
Speaker 1: see where you're going.

1320
01:16:09,439 --> 01:16:13,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thank you for You know, Amazon was not

1321
01:16:13,400 --> 01:16:16,800
Speaker 2: really profitable until they stumbled on. I'm not gonna use

1322
01:16:16,800 --> 01:16:19,400
Speaker 2: stumble because the person will be insulted. But Amazon Web

1323
01:16:19,479 --> 01:16:23,000
Speaker 2: Service isn't this right? Finally turned finally to quantify.

1324
01:16:22,720 --> 01:16:25,160
Speaker 1: They're the profit engine, and that's right. I don't know exactly,

1325
01:16:25,600 --> 01:16:27,960
Speaker 1: I don't know if Amazon has ever made money as

1326
01:16:27,960 --> 01:16:31,280
Speaker 1: a retail outlet. It acquired audience, right, it was a

1327
01:16:31,479 --> 01:16:34,519
Speaker 1: loss leader, and you know, they just wanted it quickly.

1328
01:16:34,600 --> 01:16:36,760
Speaker 1: I mean, look at how they've suckered us all in

1329
01:16:36,880 --> 01:16:40,240
Speaker 1: on streaming services. Right. It turns out we all got

1330
01:16:40,280 --> 01:16:43,240
Speaker 1: addicted at three and four dollars a month, Like, okay, great,

1331
01:16:43,280 --> 01:16:45,920
Speaker 1: now it's nineteen ninety nine a month. Whoa, whoa? What

1332
01:16:46,080 --> 01:16:47,840
Speaker 1: am I all of a sudden, I'm spaying what up

1333
01:16:47,840 --> 01:16:49,559
Speaker 1: out of the cable bundle? Right? Like, we're all going,

1334
01:16:49,640 --> 01:16:50,920
Speaker 1: exactly where did that go?

1335
01:16:51,760 --> 01:16:54,080
Speaker 2: So? I think so that's where we're that's where we're looking.

1336
01:16:54,120 --> 01:16:56,240
Speaker 2: That's the that's the moment we're looking for. Like, so

1337
01:16:56,400 --> 01:17:00,920
Speaker 2: I found this is one of my surprising things. And

1338
01:17:01,080 --> 01:17:02,800
Speaker 2: you are probably going to say, yeah, what if you

1339
01:17:02,880 --> 01:17:05,960
Speaker 2: didn't know that? But newsrooms can be conservative at times

1340
01:17:06,000 --> 01:17:07,640
Speaker 2: in terms of what they're willing to try out from

1341
01:17:07,680 --> 01:17:13,080
Speaker 2: a business model perspective. I'm fortunate that I'm not that

1342
01:17:13,479 --> 01:17:16,439
Speaker 2: in that space. You know, I work with I'm in

1343
01:17:16,479 --> 01:17:20,640
Speaker 2: a coalition with other newsrooms, like like newsrooms Documented in

1344
01:17:20,760 --> 01:17:24,960
Speaker 2: New York, el Teimpannel in in in the Bay Area

1345
01:17:25,080 --> 01:17:28,080
Speaker 2: and then connect to Arizona, and we are working you know,

1346
01:17:28,160 --> 01:17:29,679
Speaker 2: it's funded by Press Forward.

1347
01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:31,760
Speaker 1: Uh Press Forward.

1348
01:17:32,240 --> 01:17:34,599
Speaker 2: Foundation, Yep, you're familiar with that. And we are trying

1349
01:17:34,600 --> 01:17:38,760
Speaker 2: to identify new revenue, new revenue streams for not just newsrooms,

1350
01:17:38,840 --> 01:17:41,960
Speaker 2: but in the immigrants serving newsrooms, and so we are

1351
01:17:42,520 --> 01:17:44,960
Speaker 2: you know, we're piloting a few things, we're testing them out.

1352
01:17:45,360 --> 01:17:48,639
Speaker 2: But the spirit of being an immigrant and where you're

1353
01:17:48,720 --> 01:17:53,000
Speaker 2: not tied to certain traditional legacy media practices allows us

1354
01:17:53,040 --> 01:17:55,439
Speaker 2: to push things out on the boundaries. And hey, if

1355
01:17:55,479 --> 01:17:56,920
Speaker 2: we have some good news to share, A love to

1356
01:17:56,960 --> 01:17:59,479
Speaker 2: be coming back to your show with my colleagues to

1357
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:01,840
Speaker 2: talk about how we are making money to support the work.

1358
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:16,360
Speaker 1: So have you networked with other immigrants focused news organizations

1359
01:18:16,400 --> 01:18:19,120
Speaker 1: around the country. And if so, tell me about that network,

1360
01:18:19,200 --> 01:18:22,479
Speaker 1: how how much of you how how much of it

1361
01:18:22,640 --> 01:18:25,479
Speaker 1: is it? How loose is it or how specific does

1362
01:18:25,520 --> 01:18:25,800
Speaker 1: it get?

1363
01:18:26,439 --> 01:18:31,240
Speaker 2: Sure? Yes, So on my first day, on my first week,

1364
01:18:31,400 --> 01:18:35,519
Speaker 2: I even before going to the office, I met with

1365
01:18:35,680 --> 01:18:39,519
Speaker 2: this this group. So we call ourselves I n C

1366
01:18:39,640 --> 01:18:44,400
Speaker 2: Immigrant Newsroom Coalition right now, it's just it's it's document

1367
01:18:44,560 --> 01:18:46,519
Speaker 2: like I'm going to say, in names again, documented in

1368
01:18:46,640 --> 01:18:50,639
Speaker 2: New York, Sahan in Minneapolis, out Timpano in the Bay Area,

1369
01:18:50,640 --> 01:18:53,879
Speaker 2: and connect to Arizona. Each of us have very different,

1370
01:18:55,040 --> 01:18:58,960
Speaker 2: you know, slightly different for sure, different audiences, different business models.

1371
01:18:59,840 --> 01:19:03,120
Speaker 2: And they've just taken me on board to just not

1372
01:19:03,320 --> 01:19:06,439
Speaker 2: just to educate me about the industry, to welcome me,

1373
01:19:07,200 --> 01:19:09,680
Speaker 2: to tell me, hey, yeah, this is how it is

1374
01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:11,840
Speaker 2: in the in in the space that we're operating in.

1375
01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:17,000
Speaker 2: And and we we meet weekly. This is a very

1376
01:19:17,120 --> 01:19:19,080
Speaker 2: dedicated group of leaders and news rooms.

1377
01:19:19,560 --> 01:19:22,040
Speaker 1: Very so this is national. You do like a weekly

1378
01:19:22,120 --> 01:19:24,240
Speaker 1: zoom or something, We do a weekly zoom.

1379
01:19:24,320 --> 01:19:28,120
Speaker 2: We we meet quarterly for a retreat to strategize, and

1380
01:19:28,600 --> 01:19:31,040
Speaker 2: you know, we we have a few we're working through

1381
01:19:31,040 --> 01:19:33,559
Speaker 2: a few things. I mentioned a little bit about our revenue,

1382
01:19:34,640 --> 01:19:37,439
Speaker 2: the different pilots we're testing out to bring in new

1383
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:40,880
Speaker 2: revenue streams. But we feel but one of the and

1384
01:19:40,960 --> 01:19:44,479
Speaker 2: we're working through a few initiatives right now. I think

1385
01:19:44,520 --> 01:19:48,160
Speaker 2: one big part is to continue to to impress upon

1386
01:19:48,880 --> 01:19:51,519
Speaker 2: important stakeholders like you know, Chuck, you you got you

1387
01:19:51,600 --> 01:19:54,160
Speaker 2: get the message, and you got the message pretty loud

1388
01:19:54,200 --> 01:19:56,160
Speaker 2: and clear early on in your life. And the same

1389
01:19:56,320 --> 01:19:59,479
Speaker 2: fact is not everyone is in that space, you know,

1390
01:19:59,640 --> 01:20:01,439
Speaker 2: And so we do feel like we do need to

1391
01:20:01,560 --> 01:20:05,400
Speaker 2: champion we do need to champion the needs of immigrant

1392
01:20:05,400 --> 01:20:08,559
Speaker 2: serving newsrooms. You know, we have some really good newsrooms

1393
01:20:08,600 --> 01:20:11,599
Speaker 2: out there around the country that that's still.

1394
01:20:11,400 --> 01:20:13,719
Speaker 1: Tell me about them. Tell me a couple of partners

1395
01:20:13,760 --> 01:20:16,240
Speaker 1: that you think people ought to be aware of that

1396
01:20:16,479 --> 01:20:21,000
Speaker 1: you look to as where you've learned something, you've taken something. Obviously,

1397
01:20:21,040 --> 01:20:23,639
Speaker 1: you guys share best practices. So yeah, i'd love I'd

1398
01:20:23,640 --> 01:20:24,840
Speaker 1: love a couple of shout outs.

1399
01:20:25,400 --> 01:20:29,679
Speaker 2: Yeah sure, sure, let me So I'm going to use God,

1400
01:20:30,680 --> 01:20:32,560
Speaker 2: you're putting me in a spot where i feel like

1401
01:20:32,960 --> 01:20:34,800
Speaker 2: I'm picking favorites here, then I'm going.

1402
01:20:34,720 --> 01:20:36,759
Speaker 1: To get on exactly.

1403
01:20:38,479 --> 01:20:42,559
Speaker 2: So one of my favorite so I think one one

1404
01:20:42,640 --> 01:20:45,439
Speaker 2: key thing that that is in common with all immigrant

1405
01:20:45,439 --> 01:20:49,280
Speaker 2: serving news rooms that I've observed is the lack of

1406
01:20:49,439 --> 01:20:53,519
Speaker 2: adherence to certain practices that traditional media tends to follow.

1407
01:20:54,040 --> 01:20:56,439
Speaker 2: And so I would one of my favorite stories is

1408
01:20:56,479 --> 01:21:00,280
Speaker 2: from Connect to Arizona. So the founders Maritza Felix, and

1409
01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:02,960
Speaker 2: I'm going to butcher her origin story, but it's pretty

1410
01:21:03,000 --> 01:21:06,960
Speaker 2: cool for what it's worth. During COVID pandemic, you know

1411
01:21:07,040 --> 01:21:08,519
Speaker 2: her mom who lives on the other side of the

1412
01:21:08,600 --> 01:21:10,439
Speaker 2: border with she would be on the phone with her

1413
01:21:10,520 --> 01:21:13,719
Speaker 2: mother talking about COVID precautionary stuff and all that stuff,

1414
01:21:13,760 --> 01:21:17,600
Speaker 2: and her mom was receiving incorrect information, and so she

1415
01:21:17,680 --> 01:21:19,559
Speaker 2: would spend a lot of time just speaking to her

1416
01:21:19,600 --> 01:21:23,640
Speaker 2: mother over the phone. She said, And Mariita is a

1417
01:21:23,720 --> 01:21:30,840
Speaker 2: journalist herself, and that phone call became in my mind,

1418
01:21:31,320 --> 01:21:35,720
Speaker 2: it became like an audio newsletter because right now, she does,

1419
01:21:35,840 --> 01:21:38,640
Speaker 2: if you go to journal dot com, you're going to

1420
01:21:38,720 --> 01:21:43,040
Speaker 2: see something that looks like a traditional website, and Mariita's

1421
01:21:43,040 --> 01:21:46,719
Speaker 2: Connected result does not have that because her primary content

1422
01:21:46,880 --> 01:21:49,840
Speaker 2: is still through WhatsApp channels. Right, So someone could say

1423
01:21:49,920 --> 01:21:53,400
Speaker 2: I have five hundred newsletter subscribers. She will say I

1424
01:21:53,479 --> 01:21:56,200
Speaker 2: have five hundred. I don't know what terminology she uses,

1425
01:21:56,320 --> 01:22:00,679
Speaker 2: like WhatsApp subscribers, right, I'm so glad you up WhatsApp

1426
01:22:00,800 --> 01:22:04,679
Speaker 2: in general, because I don't think people realize how global

1427
01:22:04,960 --> 01:22:07,120
Speaker 2: and how it's such an important lifeline to so many

1428
01:22:07,160 --> 01:22:11,360
Speaker 2: immigrant communities in America because it's global exactly. So I

1429
01:22:13,439 --> 01:22:16,880
Speaker 2: can't remember when, but I was walking past her. She

1430
01:22:17,120 --> 01:22:19,439
Speaker 2: was just filming a whatstapp, She was reading a script,

1431
01:22:19,520 --> 01:22:22,160
Speaker 2: she was basically reading her content, and she said she

1432
01:22:22,320 --> 01:22:25,360
Speaker 2: was going to send push to all of her subscribers, right,

1433
01:22:25,880 --> 01:22:31,360
Speaker 2: So isn't that I mean, that's really cool, Chuck. How

1434
01:22:31,439 --> 01:22:34,280
Speaker 2: many legacy newsrooms would say they would do that to

1435
01:22:34,400 --> 01:22:37,040
Speaker 2: connect primarily with the audience, because there is a deep

1436
01:22:37,160 --> 01:22:41,680
Speaker 2: understanding that my audience are auditory audience as opposed to

1437
01:22:42,200 --> 01:22:44,360
Speaker 2: they would prefit things over right, So.

1438
01:22:44,720 --> 01:22:46,479
Speaker 1: I think this is what you know. It's funny if

1439
01:22:46,520 --> 01:22:48,400
Speaker 1: you look at the history of media, and one of

1440
01:22:48,479 --> 01:22:51,320
Speaker 1: the things I like to remind people is that, like, actually,

1441
01:22:51,400 --> 01:22:55,400
Speaker 1: disruption is a feature, not about meaning. It starts with

1442
01:22:55,600 --> 01:22:58,400
Speaker 1: when we figured out how to reproduce photographs. Then people

1443
01:22:58,479 --> 01:23:01,560
Speaker 1: launched a bunch of magazines because we could now reprint photographs.

1444
01:23:01,800 --> 01:23:04,080
Speaker 1: When we figured out how to transmit audio, we had

1445
01:23:04,160 --> 01:23:07,519
Speaker 1: radio stations everywhere. When we figured out how to do

1446
01:23:09,160 --> 01:23:12,200
Speaker 1: moving pictures, then we got television right like. And so

1447
01:23:12,760 --> 01:23:15,760
Speaker 1: what we're in now is this fragmenting stage and the

1448
01:23:15,840 --> 01:23:20,960
Speaker 1: specialization stage, where there is no barrier to entry to

1449
01:23:21,040 --> 01:23:25,080
Speaker 1: create news and information anymore. There's no you know, look

1450
01:23:25,160 --> 01:23:27,960
Speaker 1: at the organization I used to work at NBC. We

1451
01:23:28,080 --> 01:23:31,160
Speaker 1: used to have a feature called where in the world

1452
01:23:31,360 --> 01:23:34,000
Speaker 1: is you know, filling the anchor blanks? You know that name,

1453
01:23:34,280 --> 01:23:37,240
Speaker 1: because we're going to go live from the Gobi Desert.

1454
01:23:37,520 --> 01:23:40,479
Speaker 1: We're going to go live from Antarctica. And it was

1455
01:23:40,560 --> 01:23:44,320
Speaker 1: such a marvel ten fifteen years ago that we could

1456
01:23:44,360 --> 01:23:48,160
Speaker 1: take you lot. Anybody can go live from Antarctica. You've

1457
01:23:48,160 --> 01:23:51,080
Speaker 1: got to get there, okay, But you could have an

1458
01:23:51,080 --> 01:23:55,160
Speaker 1: antic correspondent. Today, you could find somebody that lives there

1459
01:23:55,600 --> 01:23:59,120
Speaker 1: and they could real time transmit information back and forth.

1460
01:23:59,200 --> 01:24:03,960
Speaker 1: The point being is, I think the future of news

1461
01:24:04,040 --> 01:24:07,240
Speaker 1: delivery is going to be personal. It is going to

1462
01:24:07,320 --> 01:24:11,040
Speaker 1: come through trusted curators. The person that conveys the information

1463
01:24:11,200 --> 01:24:15,720
Speaker 1: maybe part of a larger network that aggregates information collectively. Right,

1464
01:24:15,840 --> 01:24:18,880
Speaker 1: we may all work in some of these same newsrooms together.

1465
01:24:19,240 --> 01:24:21,640
Speaker 1: We may bundle like I could see, you know, I

1466
01:24:21,760 --> 01:24:23,720
Speaker 1: bet you in the future, I'm going to, hey, I

1467
01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:27,160
Speaker 1: want I want to subscribe to all Minnesota publications for

1468
01:24:27,320 --> 01:24:30,360
Speaker 1: one hundred dollars a month and I'll get a bundled

1469
01:24:30,439 --> 01:24:32,919
Speaker 1: fee or I want you know, you know, and everybody

1470
01:24:33,000 --> 01:24:34,960
Speaker 1: will get a piece of that. And maybe that's how

1471
01:24:35,080 --> 01:24:38,040
Speaker 1: I'll I'll roll there. But I just think we're going

1472
01:24:38,200 --> 01:24:41,800
Speaker 1: to the way people come into a news organization is

1473
01:24:41,840 --> 01:24:44,760
Speaker 1: going to be personal, not based on a brand, but

1474
01:24:44,880 --> 01:24:47,200
Speaker 1: based on an individual I just think that. And you

1475
01:24:47,360 --> 01:24:51,759
Speaker 1: just described the individual way that suddenly half a million

1476
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:52,519
Speaker 1: people showed.

1477
01:24:52,360 --> 01:24:55,920
Speaker 2: Up in exactly Yep. It's one individual way. And and

1478
01:24:56,560 --> 01:24:59,680
Speaker 2: that's just what it's with WhatsApp, right, And that's a

1479
01:24:59,720 --> 01:25:03,200
Speaker 2: lot of information that's been shared over sms. Now. Sahans

1480
01:25:03,240 --> 01:25:06,200
Speaker 2: started from it, and it's still predominantly like a very

1481
01:25:06,280 --> 01:25:09,800
Speaker 2: traditional outlet right now. We do really good work with

1482
01:25:09,960 --> 01:25:13,240
Speaker 2: social media, with TikTok and with our video content, and

1483
01:25:13,320 --> 01:25:16,160
Speaker 2: that's why we over index with not just immigrant population,

1484
01:25:16,320 --> 01:25:19,840
Speaker 2: but young immigrant population, something that I'm really proud of.

1485
01:25:20,479 --> 01:25:21,600
Speaker 1: But the.

1486
01:25:23,080 --> 01:25:24,920
Speaker 2: I think what I said earlier, what was it the

1487
01:25:25,080 --> 01:25:30,040
Speaker 2: lack of adherence to legacy practices binds us together not

1488
01:25:30,240 --> 01:25:33,880
Speaker 2: just from a content creation, content distribution, but also from

1489
01:25:33,960 --> 01:25:37,720
Speaker 2: a revenue generation perspective. So we are willing to take

1490
01:25:37,760 --> 01:25:40,719
Speaker 2: a risk. We take a risk coming to this country.

1491
01:25:40,800 --> 01:25:42,880
Speaker 2: We believe in the ideal supports in this country. We're

1492
01:25:42,880 --> 01:25:44,560
Speaker 2: willing to take a risk, and it shows up in

1493
01:25:44,920 --> 01:25:46,600
Speaker 2: the way we run our organizations.

1494
01:25:49,160 --> 01:25:54,760
Speaker 1: Well, look, I anyway, it's very exciting. I think these possibilities.

1495
01:25:55,400 --> 01:25:59,960
Speaker 1: Let me ask this, what kind of are you syndicate

1496
01:26:00,160 --> 01:26:02,599
Speaker 1: in your work? Yeah? Meaning you know it's the Star

1497
01:26:02,720 --> 01:26:05,400
Speaker 1: Tribute and said, you know what, we want to improve

1498
01:26:05,439 --> 01:26:08,479
Speaker 1: our coverage, and it may be I'm curious if you

1499
01:26:08,479 --> 01:26:10,800
Speaker 1: would do this or would you see this is too close,

1500
01:26:10,920 --> 01:26:11,640
Speaker 1: too competitive?

1501
01:26:11,880 --> 01:26:15,680
Speaker 2: No, no, we actually do that already, so we have

1502
01:26:17,000 --> 01:26:20,519
Speaker 2: you know, I walked into a Kumba Kumbay. Kumbay is

1503
01:26:21,200 --> 01:26:25,719
Speaker 2: what I'm learning here, Kumbaya. I got you situation.

1504
01:26:25,880 --> 01:26:26,040
Speaker 1: Yep.

1505
01:26:26,120 --> 01:26:28,719
Speaker 2: So you know Sahan was incubated Minnesota.

1506
01:26:28,880 --> 01:26:34,840
Speaker 1: Nice. Please, it's Minnesota. Nice. You guys are all too cooperative, right, Hey,

1507
01:26:35,880 --> 01:26:36,799
Speaker 1: I that's.

1508
01:26:36,680 --> 01:26:40,559
Speaker 2: Some friendly competition. But you know, Sahan was incubated at

1509
01:26:40,640 --> 01:26:43,880
Speaker 2: Minnesota Public Radio, like muk Bar had a desk in there.

1510
01:26:44,040 --> 01:26:47,800
Speaker 2: They they funded the first million dollars. They was far

1511
01:26:48,439 --> 01:26:52,120
Speaker 2: and yeah, and so I think I look, first of all,

1512
01:26:52,160 --> 01:26:54,920
Speaker 2: I look about Sahan listening Minnesota Public Radio.

1513
01:26:55,120 --> 01:26:59,240
Speaker 1: So we do have content already collaborating. We are already.

1514
01:26:58,920 --> 01:27:05,519
Speaker 2: Collaborating the Start Tribune. I believe every Sunday chooses one

1515
01:27:05,680 --> 01:27:09,080
Speaker 2: article that we run, that we've published, and then they

1516
01:27:09,120 --> 01:27:11,600
Speaker 2: put it into their their circulation and say, this is

1517
01:27:11,720 --> 01:27:15,320
Speaker 2: a hundred article. You know, they because they realize that

1518
01:27:15,560 --> 01:27:20,000
Speaker 2: of the value, our value the ecosystem, and we also

1519
01:27:20,120 --> 01:27:22,280
Speaker 2: realized that they have the reach that we don't. We

1520
01:27:22,360 --> 01:27:24,240
Speaker 2: will never get. Well, I wouldn't say we will never

1521
01:27:24,320 --> 01:27:28,519
Speaker 2: get because my team will slaughter be. We're not. We're

1522
01:27:28,560 --> 01:27:31,760
Speaker 2: not there yet, right, Yeah, So we are cooperating around

1523
01:27:31,840 --> 01:27:36,880
Speaker 2: along those lines. I'm really excited that we are also collaborating.

1524
01:27:37,360 --> 01:27:40,240
Speaker 2: We are finding stories that we can collaborate on. You know,

1525
01:27:40,360 --> 01:27:45,200
Speaker 2: because frankly, if you I'm sure you are aware of

1526
01:27:45,280 --> 01:27:49,559
Speaker 2: what happened in the first quarter of the year in Minneapolis, and.

1527
01:27:50,560 --> 01:27:52,240
Speaker 1: This was a case where the story so big it

1528
01:27:52,280 --> 01:27:55,720
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. You kind of needed each other as resources

1529
01:27:55,800 --> 01:27:56,880
Speaker 1: and exactly.

1530
01:27:56,960 --> 01:28:00,920
Speaker 2: So we found some some we found some opportunities to

1531
01:28:01,000 --> 01:28:04,320
Speaker 2: collaborate editorially, and I'm extremely curious to see how that

1532
01:28:04,400 --> 01:28:04,880
Speaker 2: plays out.

1533
01:28:05,439 --> 01:28:09,559
Speaker 1: Let me close with this, you know, I'm I look

1534
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:13,920
Speaker 1: at I look at local news into two ways, and

1535
01:28:14,040 --> 01:28:17,360
Speaker 1: I think the mistake. The reason national news never has

1536
01:28:17,439 --> 01:28:22,040
Speaker 1: the trust that local news has, I believe is simply

1537
01:28:23,640 --> 01:28:27,160
Speaker 1: national news is news. You you should know, it's it's

1538
01:28:27,240 --> 01:28:31,560
Speaker 1: civics class, okay. And I say that not as a

1539
01:28:31,600 --> 01:28:33,360
Speaker 1: way to knock it. It's what it should be at

1540
01:28:33,400 --> 01:28:37,679
Speaker 1: its best. It is because you know, but local news

1541
01:28:37,840 --> 01:28:42,599
Speaker 1: sometimes is civics and sometimes it's just very personal. It's

1542
01:28:42,680 --> 01:28:47,479
Speaker 1: service journalism, meaning it ain't the greatest, it ain't the

1543
01:28:47,560 --> 01:28:51,000
Speaker 1: sexiest story. Oh you know, but if you're helping your

1544
01:28:51,160 --> 01:28:57,280
Speaker 1: readers save money, save time, live their lives, you're just

1545
01:28:57,439 --> 01:29:00,599
Speaker 1: helping them live their life a little better. It does.

1546
01:29:00,760 --> 01:29:05,000
Speaker 1: It isn't always telling them who's corrupt. Sometimes it is

1547
01:29:05,240 --> 01:29:08,439
Speaker 1: letting them know where to find more affordable chicken, right

1548
01:29:08,600 --> 01:29:11,120
Speaker 1: like you know, And I used to say, the reason

1549
01:29:11,160 --> 01:29:14,479
Speaker 1: that the local newspaper has such a nostalgic field for

1550
01:29:14,600 --> 01:29:17,040
Speaker 1: some of us is because it was they had something

1551
01:29:17,120 --> 01:29:20,920
Speaker 1: for everybody, right If the news junkie the puzzle junkie,

1552
01:29:21,000 --> 01:29:24,439
Speaker 1: the sports junkie, the coupon clipper, the whatever you want

1553
01:29:24,479 --> 01:29:26,240
Speaker 1: to look, the person looking for a job. Right, there

1554
01:29:26,240 --> 01:29:30,160
Speaker 1: were there was a It was one entity that provided

1555
01:29:30,320 --> 01:29:33,400
Speaker 1: service to eight to ten different parts of the community.

1556
01:29:34,680 --> 01:29:38,200
Speaker 1: How would you describe at the SAHAN Journal? What are there's?

1557
01:29:38,360 --> 01:29:41,720
Speaker 1: There's there's the news that we'd all traditionally sense. What

1558
01:29:41,800 --> 01:29:42,439
Speaker 1: are type of this?

1559
01:29:42,680 --> 01:29:42,720
Speaker 2: What?

1560
01:29:42,920 --> 01:29:46,800
Speaker 1: What tell me your service oriented type of journalism? And

1561
01:29:47,240 --> 01:29:53,560
Speaker 1: how much culture? How much you know youth coverage, sports, food, entertainment?

1562
01:29:54,200 --> 01:29:56,280
Speaker 1: You know? Are you are you? I know those are

1563
01:29:56,400 --> 01:29:59,240
Speaker 1: luxury items as you grow right as a news organization,

1564
01:29:59,600 --> 01:30:01,240
Speaker 1: But where are you on that? And and what do

1565
01:30:01,320 --> 01:30:03,960
Speaker 1: your readers want? I mean, obviously ultimately you should be

1566
01:30:04,040 --> 01:30:06,080
Speaker 1: only providing what your readers actually correct?

1567
01:30:06,160 --> 01:30:16,840
Speaker 2: What what would consume correct? We it's a let'm trying

1568
01:30:16,840 --> 01:30:19,080
Speaker 2: to unpack this question a little bit here, but uh,

1569
01:30:20,320 --> 01:30:25,759
Speaker 2: we we do a really good job when it comes

1570
01:30:25,800 --> 01:30:28,640
Speaker 2: to hard hitting news that impact immigrants, and so we

1571
01:30:28,800 --> 01:30:30,800
Speaker 2: don't we will we will never run away from that.

1572
01:30:30,880 --> 01:30:36,200
Speaker 2: We will not stay away from it, right we We

1573
01:30:36,360 --> 01:30:39,280
Speaker 2: also strongly believe that if it was if there was

1574
01:30:39,320 --> 01:30:41,800
Speaker 2: something that that that was hard to be covered from

1575
01:30:41,800 --> 01:30:44,639
Speaker 2: an from an immigrant community perspective. We are the best

1576
01:30:44,680 --> 01:30:46,640
Speaker 2: ones to do it because we we bring a lot

1577
01:30:46,680 --> 01:30:49,439
Speaker 2: of perspective that that that that better to the reader.

1578
01:30:49,960 --> 01:30:53,960
Speaker 2: Now along the lines are like what you just said,

1579
01:30:54,840 --> 01:31:00,479
Speaker 2: it's also very my dog just walked in. Sorry a lot.

1580
01:31:01,280 --> 01:31:03,240
Speaker 2: There are a lot of parts about being an immigrant

1581
01:31:03,280 --> 01:31:06,120
Speaker 2: that that needs to be celebrated, that needs to be

1582
01:31:06,280 --> 01:31:10,280
Speaker 2: looked at from a from a joyful perspective that oftentimes

1583
01:31:10,400 --> 01:31:13,280
Speaker 2: is missing in coverage. And that's a piece that we

1584
01:31:13,800 --> 01:31:16,759
Speaker 2: that we also seek to highlight because it shows the whole,

1585
01:31:17,320 --> 01:31:20,120
Speaker 2: the whole, the whole picture of what it means to

1586
01:31:20,160 --> 01:31:23,920
Speaker 2: be an immigrant within in Minnesota. Right, So yeah, we

1587
01:31:24,160 --> 01:31:27,120
Speaker 2: cover we cover. You can cover your restaurant openings, but

1588
01:31:27,200 --> 01:31:29,680
Speaker 2: we cover the holidays that are being celebrated by these

1589
01:31:29,720 --> 01:31:33,080
Speaker 2: different communities. Right. We just did a beautiful story about

1590
01:31:33,160 --> 01:31:37,720
Speaker 2: Ramadan and also eat. I have so many I'm not

1591
01:31:37,760 --> 01:31:39,599
Speaker 2: going to share the stories, but I have so many.

1592
01:31:41,120 --> 01:31:44,000
Speaker 2: We have stories about the passing of a father from

1593
01:31:44,080 --> 01:31:46,840
Speaker 2: a Mong father, Monk farmer father, and how it was

1594
01:31:46,920 --> 01:31:49,840
Speaker 2: celebrated by the community that was you know, Mong but

1595
01:31:50,040 --> 01:31:55,800
Speaker 2: also uh also white in the suburbs. So we we

1596
01:31:56,040 --> 01:32:01,280
Speaker 2: don't we don't cover sports, and that's that's okay, that's okay, But.

1597
01:32:01,439 --> 01:32:03,720
Speaker 1: You will, I promise you at some point you might.

1598
01:32:04,439 --> 01:32:08,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and a bit of art arts are being celebrated,

1599
01:32:08,240 --> 01:32:10,640
Speaker 2: but uh and and and and and we feel like

1600
01:32:10,720 --> 01:32:14,400
Speaker 2: that's a good opportunity for the population to understand the

1601
01:32:14,520 --> 01:32:17,760
Speaker 2: immigrants space within the art space. And so yeah, we

1602
01:32:17,960 --> 01:32:21,120
Speaker 2: we do. I call it the candy broccoli analogy. I

1603
01:32:21,200 --> 01:32:23,519
Speaker 2: think you guys used news that people need to have

1604
01:32:23,880 --> 01:32:26,640
Speaker 2: versus what they want. So it's the candy broccoli thing.

1605
01:32:26,720 --> 01:32:28,880
Speaker 2: And so that's a fair mix of that. Yeah.

1606
01:32:29,360 --> 01:32:35,040
Speaker 1: Well, anyway, I've enjoyed this conversation, and I know everything

1607
01:32:35,080 --> 01:32:38,360
Speaker 1: I've heard about and and been reading about SAHAN Journal

1608
01:32:38,400 --> 01:32:40,360
Speaker 1: has been I mean, you guys seem to be a

1609
01:32:40,479 --> 01:32:43,040
Speaker 1: bright a bright spot here and and these and this

1610
01:32:43,240 --> 01:32:45,599
Speaker 1: growing local entrepreneur space.

1611
01:32:45,760 --> 01:32:47,160
Speaker 2: And thank you, thank you so much.

1612
01:32:47,200 --> 01:32:49,680
Speaker 1: No, I think a lot of like I said, the

1613
01:32:49,720 --> 01:32:53,000
Speaker 1: barrier entry has never been lower, but you know you

1614
01:32:53,080 --> 01:32:53,800
Speaker 1: still got to jump.

1615
01:32:53,880 --> 01:32:57,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, thank you. I I appreciate you highlighting

1616
01:32:57,560 --> 01:32:59,920
Speaker 2: the importance of local news. I completely agree with you.

1617
01:33:00,040 --> 01:33:03,800
Speaker 2: You there's a very very strong there's some study that

1618
01:33:03,840 --> 01:33:06,880
Speaker 2: has shown that local news is also less divisive right.

1619
01:33:07,320 --> 01:33:09,599
Speaker 2: We tend to look at news outlets and there's always

1620
01:33:09,640 --> 01:33:12,840
Speaker 2: someone yelling at someone else, and you know, you say, oh,

1621
01:33:13,040 --> 01:33:16,519
Speaker 2: this restaurant opened, this treat me that's less divisive, but

1622
01:33:16,600 --> 01:33:19,280
Speaker 2: it's helpful, right, And studies have shown when people in

1623
01:33:19,400 --> 01:33:22,000
Speaker 2: the RCT with the local news, they are most civically

1624
01:33:22,120 --> 01:33:24,679
Speaker 2: engaged and civic minded and stuff like that as well.

1625
01:33:24,840 --> 01:33:28,880
Speaker 1: And then there's the other stories that uh, local news.

1626
01:33:28,920 --> 01:33:33,040
Speaker 1: Deserts pay more than taxes, so you know, you know,

1627
01:33:33,320 --> 01:33:36,640
Speaker 1: there's a there's a fiscal Uh, there's a there's a

1628
01:33:36,760 --> 01:33:42,400
Speaker 1: there's fiscal health for people's personal bank accounts at Staycare anyway, yes, uh,

1629
01:33:42,720 --> 01:33:44,000
Speaker 1: but it was a pleasure.

1630
01:33:44,320 --> 01:33:47,000
Speaker 2: Oh, pleasures all mine, Chuck. I remember if I had

1631
01:33:47,040 --> 01:33:48,280
Speaker 2: this day with you, so thank well.

1632
01:33:48,360 --> 01:33:52,320
Speaker 1: Let's celebrate Local News Day. And I imagine most people

1633
01:33:52,400 --> 01:33:56,880
Speaker 1: in Minneapolis are very very well read city and community,

1634
01:33:56,960 --> 01:34:01,000
Speaker 1: but hopefully those that aren't aware will be more aware

1635
01:34:01,040 --> 01:34:01,840
Speaker 1: of come April night.

1636
01:34:02,680 --> 01:34:03,360
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.

1637
01:34:03,479 --> 01:34:16,840
Speaker 1: Thanks right to start with you, all right, remember April ninth,

1638
01:34:17,040 --> 01:34:21,439
Speaker 1: Local News Day. I hope you've already. I've got a

1639
01:34:22,000 --> 01:34:25,160
Speaker 1: great email the other day from somebody saying that they've

1640
01:34:27,040 --> 01:34:28,920
Speaker 1: you know, thanks to me, harping on this so much.

1641
01:34:28,960 --> 01:34:30,760
Speaker 1: And I think that's what they use the words harp.

1642
01:34:31,160 --> 01:34:32,840
Speaker 1: It's like, okay, if you want to say I'm harping,

1643
01:34:32,880 --> 01:34:37,040
Speaker 1: I'm harping that they've signed up and subscribe to a

1644
01:34:37,120 --> 01:34:43,120
Speaker 1: local news outlet. So hey, I'm happy to be the

1645
01:34:43,240 --> 01:34:47,000
Speaker 1: harp player for you here. So April ninth, local news day.

1646
01:34:47,840 --> 01:34:49,320
Speaker 1: But you don't have to wait till libor ninth to

1647
01:34:49,400 --> 01:34:51,880
Speaker 1: go find out what good local news is in your

1648
01:34:52,240 --> 01:34:55,519
Speaker 1: neck of the woods. Go figure it out now. But

1649
01:34:55,680 --> 01:34:59,200
Speaker 1: on April ninth, hopefully those local news proprietors will be

1650
01:34:59,400 --> 01:35:02,760
Speaker 1: making it ea for you to find them. All Right,

1651
01:35:02,800 --> 01:35:05,960
Speaker 1: it's my it's Wednesday. Let's do a top five, top.

1652
01:35:07,880 --> 01:35:10,280
Speaker 3: Five top test.

1653
01:35:12,680 --> 01:35:14,160
Speaker 1: And I'm just going to go back to basics here.

1654
01:35:14,240 --> 01:35:17,080
Speaker 1: But the premise of the top five list this week

1655
01:35:17,400 --> 01:35:19,600
Speaker 1: is the premise that I think now it is official.

1656
01:35:21,200 --> 01:35:23,080
Speaker 1: I think in the moment we're in at the moment

1657
01:35:23,120 --> 01:35:25,800
Speaker 1: and this, you know, it's very interesting when it comes.

1658
01:35:25,840 --> 01:35:28,080
Speaker 1: I've I've always had this debate with my friend Charlie

1659
01:35:28,120 --> 01:35:30,280
Speaker 1: Cook and the folk Namy Walter, the folks over at

1660
01:35:30,280 --> 01:35:33,840
Speaker 1: the Cook Report, folks at crystal Ball, the folks inside Elections,

1661
01:35:34,360 --> 01:35:37,040
Speaker 1: which is when you do your rankings, do you do

1662
01:35:37,160 --> 01:35:39,720
Speaker 1: it trying to figure out it's based on where you

1663
01:35:39,920 --> 01:35:42,200
Speaker 1: think the political environment is going to be in November

1664
01:35:42,320 --> 01:35:46,200
Speaker 1: or where you are at the moment, right, And I

1665
01:35:46,240 --> 01:35:48,519
Speaker 1: would say, you know, we all will say, well, it's

1666
01:35:48,560 --> 01:35:50,680
Speaker 1: a hybrid, right, And that's where I am.

1667
01:35:50,760 --> 01:35:51,360
Speaker 3: It's a hybrid.

1668
01:35:51,640 --> 01:35:53,439
Speaker 1: I think we are. I think this is a political

1669
01:35:53,560 --> 01:35:57,400
Speaker 1: environment that is that is deteriorating quickly for Republicans.

1670
01:35:57,960 --> 01:35:58,080
Speaker 2: Right.

1671
01:35:58,160 --> 01:36:01,000
Speaker 1: You now have the House and the Senate openly feuding

1672
01:36:01,200 --> 01:36:06,280
Speaker 1: over how to resolve thes DHS funding crisis. In fact,

1673
01:36:06,560 --> 01:36:08,840
Speaker 1: the fact that House Republicans and Senate Republicans are in

1674
01:36:08,880 --> 01:36:12,320
Speaker 1: a completely different place on this has bailed out Democrats.

1675
01:36:12,520 --> 01:36:12,640
Speaker 2: Right.

1676
01:36:12,920 --> 01:36:16,040
Speaker 1: I think now Republicans own this more at the moment

1677
01:36:16,680 --> 01:36:20,519
Speaker 1: because the Senate Republicans passed something to do this, and

1678
01:36:20,600 --> 01:36:23,479
Speaker 1: then the House Republicans, I guess, with a little bit

1679
01:36:23,520 --> 01:36:27,680
Speaker 1: of Donald Trump's encouragement, decided to tank it. And so

1680
01:36:27,760 --> 01:36:31,280
Speaker 1: now we're in this uncomfortable situation where yes, TSA employees

1681
01:36:31,280 --> 01:36:33,280
Speaker 1: are kind of getting paid. But anyway, the point is

1682
01:36:33,400 --> 01:36:37,400
Speaker 1: is that every week it seems, you know, this goes

1683
01:36:37,479 --> 01:36:40,599
Speaker 1: back to the Haley barbarism that I've been quoting quite

1684
01:36:40,640 --> 01:36:42,439
Speaker 1: a bit here for those of you that listen a lot,

1685
01:36:42,840 --> 01:36:44,720
Speaker 1: and that as good gets better, bad gets worse. And

1686
01:36:44,880 --> 01:36:48,800
Speaker 1: right now this political environment for Republicans bad is going

1687
01:36:49,040 --> 01:36:51,679
Speaker 1: to worse. Right The Texas situation is not any better.

1688
01:36:52,080 --> 01:36:55,439
Speaker 1: What looked like could be an opportunity for Republicans to

1689
01:36:55,520 --> 01:36:59,760
Speaker 1: save a Senate seat down in Texas with John Cornyn unexpectedly,

1690
01:37:00,280 --> 01:37:02,439
Speaker 1: you know, being the top vote getter in the first

1691
01:37:02,520 --> 01:37:05,120
Speaker 1: round of voting. Maybe they could convince Trump to endorse

1692
01:37:05,240 --> 01:37:09,320
Speaker 1: Cornan over Paxton. Will that ship is ill right, the

1693
01:37:10,200 --> 01:37:12,640
Speaker 1: Paxton folks have bought enough time. Now it looks like

1694
01:37:12,680 --> 01:37:14,840
Speaker 1: Trump's not going to do it. And we know Trump

1695
01:37:14,880 --> 01:37:20,160
Speaker 1: will never back somebody he fears could lose and embarrass

1696
01:37:20,240 --> 01:37:22,280
Speaker 1: him because you know, I think we're going to find out.

1697
01:37:22,560 --> 01:37:24,759
Speaker 1: And my friend Jonathan Martin is a great piece about

1698
01:37:25,160 --> 01:37:27,400
Speaker 1: how May is really going to be the month that

1699
01:37:27,520 --> 01:37:31,280
Speaker 1: we learn how tight is Trump's grip on the Republican Party.

1700
01:37:31,720 --> 01:37:34,559
Speaker 1: Can you run away from Trump? Can you criticize Trump

1701
01:37:34,600 --> 01:37:36,840
Speaker 1: and survive in a primary? Right, it's going to be

1702
01:37:36,920 --> 01:37:39,439
Speaker 1: tested all over the map. Thomas Massey is probably going

1703
01:37:39,520 --> 01:37:43,720
Speaker 1: to be the first test. But that's I think we're

1704
01:37:43,720 --> 01:37:45,439
Speaker 1: gonna we're going to We're going to start. That'll be

1705
01:37:45,520 --> 01:37:48,640
Speaker 1: a big one. And if he succeeds, you're going to

1706
01:37:48,680 --> 01:37:53,839
Speaker 1: start to see I think more Republicans feeling emboldened perhaps

1707
01:37:53,920 --> 01:37:57,360
Speaker 1: to try to chart their own course, because you do

1708
01:37:57,479 --> 01:37:59,519
Speaker 1: get to a point anytime when you're in a political

1709
01:37:59,560 --> 01:38:02,320
Speaker 1: party where the national environment's going south on you. It

1710
01:38:02,439 --> 01:38:07,680
Speaker 1: becomes every every member, especially on the incumbent side, every

1711
01:38:07,680 --> 01:38:10,800
Speaker 1: incumbent for themselves. There's no longer, there's no more team player.

1712
01:38:11,240 --> 01:38:14,080
Speaker 1: It is survival of the fittest, or survival of the

1713
01:38:14,400 --> 01:38:16,840
Speaker 1: of the of the fittest, might be the wrong way,

1714
01:38:17,320 --> 01:38:19,760
Speaker 1: of the of the most pragmatists, or whatever you want

1715
01:38:19,800 --> 01:38:22,479
Speaker 1: to call it, but the point is is everybody kicks

1716
01:38:22,520 --> 01:38:25,040
Speaker 1: into survival mode and we may be in there. So

1717
01:38:25,479 --> 01:38:28,439
Speaker 1: look with that, and you've seen this turn right, There

1718
01:38:28,479 --> 01:38:30,240
Speaker 1: was a new norm, you know. So look Number one

1719
01:38:30,320 --> 01:38:34,519
Speaker 1: my top five list, top five Senate seats most likely

1720
01:38:34,600 --> 01:38:37,560
Speaker 1: to flip. And the big news on my list this

1721
01:38:37,640 --> 01:38:39,640
Speaker 1: week is there's not going to be a single republicancy

1722
01:38:39,800 --> 01:38:42,599
Speaker 1: a Democratic health seat on my list, and the only

1723
01:38:42,640 --> 01:38:45,559
Speaker 1: one that comes close is Michigan. But I will tell

1724
01:38:45,600 --> 01:38:48,120
Speaker 1: you in a minute why I have no longer put Michigan.

1725
01:38:47,800 --> 01:38:48,200
Speaker 3: On that list.

1726
01:38:48,280 --> 01:38:51,040
Speaker 1: But number one continues, and in fact I think it's

1727
01:38:51,160 --> 01:38:54,000
Speaker 1: number one, and there's actually some space now, and that

1728
01:38:54,160 --> 01:38:56,519
Speaker 1: is North Carolina. There's I just saw a recent poll

1729
01:38:56,560 --> 01:38:58,920
Speaker 1: that had Cooper up eighteen points, so I think he's

1730
01:38:58,960 --> 01:39:02,720
Speaker 1: up eighteen points. I don't. But the fact is it

1731
01:39:03,160 --> 01:39:05,719
Speaker 1: seems as if the gap is spreading, it is not closing.

1732
01:39:07,320 --> 01:39:09,720
Speaker 1: You know, Michael Wattley, the former R and C chair,

1733
01:39:09,800 --> 01:39:11,360
Speaker 1: was already trying to do something, and I think was

1734
01:39:11,439 --> 01:39:15,120
Speaker 1: quite hard to go directly from being a national chair

1735
01:39:15,160 --> 01:39:17,880
Speaker 1: of the chair of a national party to try to

1736
01:39:17,960 --> 01:39:21,400
Speaker 1: win a Senate seat. Tim Kaine pulled this off, but

1737
01:39:21,520 --> 01:39:23,640
Speaker 1: he was also a governor, a former governor, so he

1738
01:39:23,720 --> 01:39:29,120
Speaker 1: had had some he had had some electoral experience. It

1739
01:39:29,280 --> 01:39:33,080
Speaker 1: is much more difficult to basically make this your first

1740
01:39:33,280 --> 01:39:36,080
Speaker 1: entree into into sort of state wide elect the politics

1741
01:39:36,120 --> 01:39:39,439
Speaker 1: like that in general. But you're also you own everything Trump, right,

1742
01:39:39,479 --> 01:39:42,400
Speaker 1: there is no way Whatley can be independent of Trump

1743
01:39:42,560 --> 01:39:45,840
Speaker 1: under any circumstance, and you sort of see it in

1744
01:39:45,920 --> 01:39:48,439
Speaker 1: the numbers. And Cooper doesn't have to deal with a

1745
01:39:48,680 --> 01:39:51,280
Speaker 1: didn't have to deal with any sort of radical left

1746
01:39:52,080 --> 01:39:55,519
Speaker 1: and you know, anybody way to the left, he didn't

1747
01:39:55,560 --> 01:39:57,720
Speaker 1: have to deal with, even somebody you know, from the

1748
01:39:57,920 --> 01:39:59,920
Speaker 1: from further to his left, but maybe in the main

1749
01:40:00,000 --> 01:40:02,760
Speaker 1: extream liberal wing of the party. He didn't have to

1750
01:40:02,800 --> 01:40:05,320
Speaker 1: deal with any of that. And if you can avoid

1751
01:40:05,360 --> 01:40:07,840
Speaker 1: a primary in this environment as a Democrat in a

1752
01:40:08,160 --> 01:40:11,320
Speaker 1: purple state like North Carolina, you're gonna have a lot

1753
01:40:11,360 --> 01:40:13,679
Speaker 1: of room to run. So he's number one, and arguably

1754
01:40:14,160 --> 01:40:18,400
Speaker 1: there is huge space now like that is I'm almost

1755
01:40:18,439 --> 01:40:22,000
Speaker 1: at a seventy five percent confidence level on that one.

1756
01:40:22,600 --> 01:40:25,799
Speaker 1: You can go take a look at what Polymarketer Calshier

1757
01:40:25,880 --> 01:40:29,400
Speaker 1: at and find out where the actual money is. Number

1758
01:40:29,400 --> 01:40:32,479
Speaker 1: two continues to be made. And we've seen even and

1759
01:40:32,680 --> 01:40:35,720
Speaker 1: I look, I'm going to keep it here. At number two,

1760
01:40:37,840 --> 01:40:40,960
Speaker 1: we see the governor Janet Mills has gone a bit

1761
01:40:41,000 --> 01:40:44,960
Speaker 1: scorched earth trying to salvage her you know, we put

1762
01:40:44,960 --> 01:40:49,640
Speaker 1: it this way, her behavior going after Graham Platner confirms

1763
01:40:49,680 --> 01:40:51,640
Speaker 1: that all the polling is true. Platner is ahead, and

1764
01:40:51,760 --> 01:40:53,280
Speaker 1: he's ahead by a lot. So the fact that he's

1765
01:40:53,320 --> 01:40:56,559
Speaker 1: already ahead and he didn't really have much name minded

1766
01:40:57,439 --> 01:41:00,560
Speaker 1: going into this thing and me, it's going to be

1767
01:41:00,800 --> 01:41:04,960
Speaker 1: really hard for her to dislodg him, especially because he

1768
01:41:05,000 --> 01:41:08,040
Speaker 1: has the resources to respond. You know a lot of times,

1769
01:41:08,200 --> 01:41:13,920
Speaker 1: you know, an insurgent like Platner may catch fire, but

1770
01:41:14,000 --> 01:41:16,840
Speaker 1: they don't really have the resources. Once the big bad

1771
01:41:16,960 --> 01:41:22,160
Speaker 1: establishment machine sort of trains its negative ad guns on you,

1772
01:41:22,640 --> 01:41:26,240
Speaker 1: it's harder to recover. But he has enough resources to respond.

1773
01:41:26,520 --> 01:41:29,280
Speaker 1: I think he's done a reasonable job responding. And as

1774
01:41:29,320 --> 01:41:34,640
Speaker 1: we see this is you know, when you're in environments

1775
01:41:34,760 --> 01:41:38,400
Speaker 1: like this as a challenger, it is harder as an incumbent.

1776
01:41:39,000 --> 01:41:41,200
Speaker 1: In some ways, both Janet Mills and Susan Collins are

1777
01:41:41,240 --> 01:41:43,679
Speaker 1: incumbents in this situation, right, One is a sitting governor,

1778
01:41:43,720 --> 01:41:45,920
Speaker 1: one is a sitting senator. Graham Platner gets to be

1779
01:41:45,960 --> 01:41:48,200
Speaker 1: the outsider, whether he's running against in the primary against

1780
01:41:48,240 --> 01:41:50,559
Speaker 1: Mills or he's running in a general against Susan Collins.

1781
01:41:51,240 --> 01:41:53,880
Speaker 1: And if you want to make him the referendum, I

1782
01:41:53,960 --> 01:41:55,400
Speaker 1: get why you want to do it. You try to

1783
01:41:55,439 --> 01:41:58,120
Speaker 1: make his character referendum. The problem is, in a political

1784
01:41:58,200 --> 01:42:01,400
Speaker 1: environment like this, the incumbents, it's much harder for an

1785
01:42:01,400 --> 01:42:06,800
Speaker 1: incumbent to change, to change the climate to where it's

1786
01:42:06,920 --> 01:42:09,240
Speaker 1: no longer a referendum on those in office. And I

1787
01:42:09,320 --> 01:42:11,400
Speaker 1: think that's especially going to be difficult for Susan Collins,

1788
01:42:11,439 --> 01:42:13,200
Speaker 1: but I think it's also a bit of a problem

1789
01:42:14,160 --> 01:42:17,000
Speaker 1: for Janet Mills. But the fact of the matter is

1790
01:42:17,040 --> 01:42:19,320
Speaker 1: it won't It may not matter which Democrat wins the primary.

1791
01:42:19,840 --> 01:42:22,439
Speaker 1: Either one right now is ahead of Susan Collins, and

1792
01:42:22,600 --> 01:42:26,639
Speaker 1: that's why it sits at number two. So number three

1793
01:42:26,920 --> 01:42:32,320
Speaker 1: on my list is now Ohio because that is another thing,

1794
01:42:32,360 --> 01:42:35,559
Speaker 1: and this is how you can see things deteriorating. Right,

1795
01:42:36,760 --> 01:42:39,360
Speaker 1: you know, during the presidential election cycle, Sharon Brown when

1796
01:42:39,400 --> 01:42:42,240
Speaker 1: he was running in it's you know, he's now running

1797
01:42:42,280 --> 01:42:44,880
Speaker 1: for the other Senate seat technically, right, he lost the

1798
01:42:45,200 --> 01:42:49,600
Speaker 1: Senate CETL before he lost to Bernie Moreno. This is

1799
01:42:49,840 --> 01:42:52,920
Speaker 1: the special technically the special election to fill out the

1800
01:42:53,240 --> 01:42:56,960
Speaker 1: rest of JD. Vance's term after he became Vice president.

1801
01:42:57,040 --> 01:43:03,560
Speaker 1: The appointed Republican senators John Houston. And look, when this

1802
01:43:03,680 --> 01:43:06,600
Speaker 1: race began, you saw that the generic Republican advantage in

1803
01:43:06,680 --> 01:43:10,320
Speaker 1: Ohio was holding and Houston would be up by a

1804
01:43:10,400 --> 01:43:13,040
Speaker 1: couple of points. And to me, with somebody as well

1805
01:43:13,120 --> 01:43:15,360
Speaker 1: known as Shared Brown, if you're trailing somebody who's less

1806
01:43:15,360 --> 01:43:18,479
Speaker 1: known than you, yes, Houston as run statewide himself, was

1807
01:43:18,520 --> 01:43:20,680
Speaker 1: the elected secretary of state, been a running mate, all

1808
01:43:20,720 --> 01:43:26,400
Speaker 1: of those things shared Brown's you know, probably had more

1809
01:43:26,439 --> 01:43:29,160
Speaker 1: than a billion dollars of TV ads run on his

1810
01:43:29,320 --> 01:43:32,560
Speaker 1: behalf of just in just this decade, right in the

1811
01:43:32,680 --> 01:43:38,040
Speaker 1: multiple time, basically since twenty eighteen. So he's a far

1812
01:43:38,280 --> 01:43:41,920
Speaker 1: more well known figure in Ohio than John Houston is.

1813
01:43:42,640 --> 01:43:48,479
Speaker 1: But this is where I've seen that the biggest change

1814
01:43:49,640 --> 01:43:53,080
Speaker 1: in any in sort of the political climate has been

1815
01:43:53,200 --> 01:43:56,800
Speaker 1: with the start of this around war, the negative view

1816
01:43:56,840 --> 01:44:00,840
Speaker 1: that many voters have, particularly independence in the middle, throw

1817
01:44:00,920 --> 01:44:05,920
Speaker 1: in the impact on the economy, and now all of

1818
01:44:05,960 --> 01:44:08,439
Speaker 1: the polling has started to show Democrats taking a small

1819
01:44:08,520 --> 01:44:13,760
Speaker 1: lead in Ohio. That is hugely significant. You already have

1820
01:44:14,000 --> 01:44:17,840
Speaker 1: a very good challenger candidate here. Look, my skepticism on

1821
01:44:18,000 --> 01:44:22,200
Speaker 1: Brown is still there that it's tough to be a

1822
01:44:22,439 --> 01:44:25,400
Speaker 1: challenger when you've been sort of in office as long

1823
01:44:25,439 --> 01:44:30,120
Speaker 1: as he has. But if the bigger issue is the

1824
01:44:30,200 --> 01:44:33,920
Speaker 1: economy and Trump, you know, I don't know if the

1825
01:44:34,000 --> 01:44:35,800
Speaker 1: Republicans are going to able to make this a referendum

1826
01:44:35,840 --> 01:44:38,920
Speaker 1: on share Brown. They had a better They did it,

1827
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:41,160
Speaker 1: They did a better job. It was an easier thing

1828
01:44:41,240 --> 01:44:43,240
Speaker 1: for them to do in twenty four. It's gonna be

1829
01:44:43,280 --> 01:44:46,439
Speaker 1: a little harder now. And again, the national political environment,

1830
01:44:46,479 --> 01:44:51,479
Speaker 1: you sort of feel it hasn't bottom hasn't fallen yet,

1831
01:44:52,400 --> 01:44:55,040
Speaker 1: but you can hear the cracks. And that's what this

1832
01:44:55,200 --> 01:44:58,240
Speaker 1: war has done, right. It has sort of weakened the

1833
01:44:58,360 --> 01:45:01,960
Speaker 1: floor that republic are currently standing on, and there's every

1834
01:45:02,080 --> 01:45:06,280
Speaker 1: chance it could sink down the level sooner than we think,

1835
01:45:06,400 --> 01:45:10,280
Speaker 1: so Ohio. Number three on my list of most likely

1836
01:45:11,120 --> 01:45:18,760
Speaker 1: to flip. Number four is Alaska, and we've seen Mary

1837
01:45:18,800 --> 01:45:22,240
Speaker 1: Patola again, she's somebody else that appears to be starting

1838
01:45:22,280 --> 01:45:26,880
Speaker 1: in a strong position. I still I think this race

1839
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:30,720
Speaker 1: is a coin flip at best. But I you know,

1840
01:45:31,040 --> 01:45:35,519
Speaker 1: and I am you know, there is a chance that

1841
01:45:36,560 --> 01:45:41,519
Speaker 1: Alaska short term economy might benefit from the rising cost

1842
01:45:41,600 --> 01:45:44,000
Speaker 1: of energy in some ways that can happen sometimes to

1843
01:45:44,080 --> 01:45:47,280
Speaker 1: a state that is exporter of oil and gas. So

1844
01:45:47,840 --> 01:45:50,800
Speaker 1: you know, I don't I don't want to fully characterize

1845
01:45:50,800 --> 01:45:53,000
Speaker 1: the economy yet in what it's going to feel like

1846
01:45:53,120 --> 01:45:55,120
Speaker 1: or look like in Alaska, because it might be unique

1847
01:45:55,120 --> 01:45:58,519
Speaker 1: and different given the current circumstances that we're in. But

1848
01:45:58,680 --> 01:46:04,160
Speaker 1: we've already seen early polling indicating Popolo starts an extraordinarily

1849
01:46:04,200 --> 01:46:07,120
Speaker 1: strong position here. I think Dan Sulvin's going to be

1850
01:46:07,200 --> 01:46:12,280
Speaker 1: hard to magify, if you will. But because you have

1851
01:46:12,400 --> 01:46:14,720
Speaker 1: Lisa Murkowski sitting there as a sort of closer to

1852
01:46:14,960 --> 01:46:18,080
Speaker 1: being a true independent in the Senate, I think by comparison,

1853
01:46:18,160 --> 01:46:23,000
Speaker 1: he certainly looks more trumpy than certainly Lisa Murkowski. And

1854
01:46:23,080 --> 01:46:25,120
Speaker 1: then I think the question is what is number five

1855
01:46:25,200 --> 01:46:28,160
Speaker 1: on the list? What is the fifth most likely to flip?

1856
01:46:30,000 --> 01:46:32,479
Speaker 1: And I think at this point I'm going to say

1857
01:46:32,479 --> 01:46:35,120
Speaker 1: it's Nebraska, And this is going to be a bit

1858
01:46:35,200 --> 01:46:37,280
Speaker 1: of the surprise. But let me explain why I think

1859
01:46:37,360 --> 01:46:41,680
Speaker 1: Nebraska and Dan Osborne winning as an independent and what

1860
01:46:42,320 --> 01:46:45,800
Speaker 1: kind what that could mean. Some of you may think, oh,

1861
01:46:45,880 --> 01:46:48,400
Speaker 1: it's just wishful thinking that I want to see sort

1862
01:46:48,439 --> 01:46:54,120
Speaker 1: of both parties get challenged here from a third way,

1863
01:46:54,240 --> 01:46:56,800
Speaker 1: from an independent way. Yes, it's true. I think both

1864
01:46:56,840 --> 01:47:01,519
Speaker 1: parties need to need a a disruption from the outside

1865
01:47:01,560 --> 01:47:05,000
Speaker 1: as much as they're trying to disrupt each other internally.

1866
01:47:08,000 --> 01:47:11,439
Speaker 1: But my skepticism, Look, I think Pete Ricketts is no

1867
01:47:11,560 --> 01:47:14,759
Speaker 1: debt Fisher, and I don't mean that to not debt Fisher,

1868
01:47:14,840 --> 01:47:17,280
Speaker 1: but I think Ricketts is going to be is already

1869
01:47:17,320 --> 01:47:21,080
Speaker 1: a bit more prepared for this campaign, is probably going

1870
01:47:21,200 --> 01:47:24,639
Speaker 1: to drop more APO on Osborne than Fisher ever did.

1871
01:47:24,800 --> 01:47:30,400
Speaker 1: She waited too long. So, but again, when you're the

1872
01:47:30,520 --> 01:47:34,759
Speaker 1: incumbent and you're having to defend a really bad political environment,

1873
01:47:35,400 --> 01:47:39,200
Speaker 1: it is harder to turn your challenger into to create

1874
01:47:39,240 --> 01:47:42,599
Speaker 1: a referendum on the challenger. It's not impossible. And Ricketts

1875
01:47:42,640 --> 01:47:45,920
Speaker 1: has some deep pockets and has even his own money

1876
01:47:46,000 --> 01:47:48,960
Speaker 1: potentially if he chooses to use it. His father TD

1877
01:47:49,080 --> 01:47:52,600
Speaker 1: Ameritrade at least a piece of that version of the

1878
01:47:52,680 --> 01:47:56,000
Speaker 1: company before it merged with some other aspects of it.

1879
01:47:56,040 --> 01:48:01,040
Speaker 1: But there's some deep financial pockets there. But I think

1880
01:48:01,080 --> 01:48:04,479
Speaker 1: this political environment presents Osborne an even stronger opportunity to

1881
01:48:04,520 --> 01:48:06,880
Speaker 1: win than the presidential environment did. Right. First of all,

1882
01:48:07,280 --> 01:48:10,200
Speaker 1: presidential turnout Nebraska made it even harder for him, I think,

1883
01:48:10,240 --> 01:48:13,439
Speaker 1: to overcome. But the other thing that's that is still

1884
01:48:13,479 --> 01:48:15,479
Speaker 1: going to be a difficult thing for him to overcome

1885
01:48:15,760 --> 01:48:18,839
Speaker 1: is this idea of well, if he's running against Ricketts,

1886
01:48:18,880 --> 01:48:21,200
Speaker 1: it means he doesn't want Republicans control the Senate. So

1887
01:48:21,680 --> 01:48:24,760
Speaker 1: by default, Dan Osborne, does that mean you want Democrats

1888
01:48:24,760 --> 01:48:27,519
Speaker 1: and Chuck Schumer to run the Senate. How he answers

1889
01:48:27,600 --> 01:48:30,200
Speaker 1: that question, and how he answers that question throughout the

1890
01:48:30,200 --> 01:48:32,240
Speaker 1: campaign is going to matter a lot and his ability

1891
01:48:32,240 --> 01:48:36,000
Speaker 1: to win. If I were in issues and I kept

1892
01:48:36,040 --> 01:48:37,960
Speaker 1: getting asked that question, So which party you're going to

1893
01:48:38,040 --> 01:48:41,120
Speaker 1: caucus with? He goes, Look, I don't know the easy answers.

1894
01:48:41,520 --> 01:48:43,200
Speaker 1: I don't want Donald Trump running the Senate. I don't

1895
01:48:43,200 --> 01:48:46,000
Speaker 1: want Chuck Schumer running the Senate. I know, when I

1896
01:48:46,080 --> 01:48:48,200
Speaker 1: get elected, I'm going to you know, I'm going to

1897
01:48:48,560 --> 01:48:52,360
Speaker 1: pull together the true independence of the Senate, Lisa Murkowski,

1898
01:48:54,080 --> 01:48:58,200
Speaker 1: Angus King, and whoever wants to be in this independent caucus.

1899
01:48:58,280 --> 01:48:59,960
Speaker 1: And I'm going to try to start an independent caucus,

1900
01:49:00,400 --> 01:49:03,160
Speaker 1: and we're going to make the two parties make their

1901
01:49:03,280 --> 01:49:06,280
Speaker 1: case to us as a group as to which party

1902
01:49:06,400 --> 01:49:14,439
Speaker 1: ought to run the Senate. And I think short of

1903
01:49:14,520 --> 01:49:18,880
Speaker 1: a response like that, there's that Osborne is going to

1904
01:49:18,920 --> 01:49:21,479
Speaker 1: have a hard time convincing. Maybe somebody who's not a

1905
01:49:21,520 --> 01:49:24,639
Speaker 1: big Rickets fan, maybe not a big Thoon or Trump fan,

1906
01:49:25,400 --> 01:49:27,519
Speaker 1: but doesn't want to see Chuck Schumer in charge of

1907
01:49:27,600 --> 01:49:32,760
Speaker 1: the Senate. Right to me, that's the voter. Osborne's got

1908
01:49:32,760 --> 01:49:34,080
Speaker 1: to figure out how to talk to and how to

1909
01:49:34,160 --> 01:49:40,040
Speaker 1: convince that he's serious about being an independant. And that's

1910
01:49:40,120 --> 01:49:42,680
Speaker 1: certainly how I would convey my seriousness about being an

1911
01:49:42,680 --> 01:49:46,280
Speaker 1: independent and basically saying, you know, my goal is not

1912
01:49:46,400 --> 01:49:48,600
Speaker 1: to pick either side. My goal is to work with

1913
01:49:48,720 --> 01:49:53,040
Speaker 1: the Common Sense Center or the common Sense Senators and

1914
01:49:53,160 --> 01:49:56,000
Speaker 1: we'll decide. You know, we don't want to be sucked up, right,

1915
01:49:56,120 --> 01:49:58,160
Speaker 1: you know, right now, Trump and Schumer, this is this

1916
01:49:58,320 --> 01:50:02,280
Speaker 1: is part of the problem. And if you can get

1917
01:50:02,320 --> 01:50:04,200
Speaker 1: to a message like that, and I think he has

1918
01:50:04,240 --> 01:50:05,880
Speaker 1: a better shot at getting to a message like that

1919
01:50:06,040 --> 01:50:10,720
Speaker 1: than many other candidates running, then I think that's a

1920
01:50:10,800 --> 01:50:14,000
Speaker 1: recipe there. So for that reason, I am putting Nebraska

1921
01:50:14,200 --> 01:50:19,840
Speaker 1: in the five slot there at this point. Now for

1922
01:50:20,120 --> 01:50:22,080
Speaker 1: this first time, I haven't put Michigan in the top five.

1923
01:50:22,280 --> 01:50:24,200
Speaker 1: And you ask why is that? Because I think the

1924
01:50:24,560 --> 01:50:27,720
Speaker 1: Michigan candidate that is hardest for Republicans to defeat is

1925
01:50:27,920 --> 01:50:30,559
Speaker 1: Mallory mcmarrow. And by the way, I've had people mentioned

1926
01:50:30,560 --> 01:50:32,519
Speaker 1: to me that I keep calling her Molly McMorrow. That

1927
01:50:32,680 --> 01:50:34,920
Speaker 1: is one hundred percent accurate in my head. I keep

1928
01:50:35,000 --> 01:50:39,000
Speaker 1: calling her Molly instead of Mallory. Mallory McMorrow. My apologies

1929
01:50:39,080 --> 01:50:40,880
Speaker 1: to you. Maybe this is why we haven't gotten you

1930
01:50:41,000 --> 01:50:48,040
Speaker 1: on yet, I tease, But I think the fact that

1931
01:50:48,120 --> 01:50:50,800
Speaker 1: her candidacy is getting more traction, more polling is showing

1932
01:50:50,840 --> 01:50:53,680
Speaker 1: her getting more traction. I think she is probably the

1933
01:50:53,760 --> 01:50:57,400
Speaker 1: nominee that is best suited to unify what is a

1934
01:50:57,720 --> 01:51:01,280
Speaker 1: very splinter Democratic primary. Right, Haley Stephens sort of the

1935
01:51:01,320 --> 01:51:05,719
Speaker 1: Schumer candidate, Abdul Elsai ed the Elizabeth Warren Bernie Sanders candidate,

1936
01:51:05,760 --> 01:51:09,200
Speaker 1: and there's malloy McMorrow sort of straddling the fence there.

1937
01:51:09,760 --> 01:51:12,720
Speaker 1: But I think in some ways she has leaned into

1938
01:51:12,800 --> 01:51:16,920
Speaker 1: being the outsider, and outsider is better I think than

1939
01:51:17,000 --> 01:51:22,680
Speaker 1: being establishment or Warren Sanders, progressive, right, outsider an independent.

1940
01:51:22,960 --> 01:51:27,479
Speaker 1: To me is what are the best descriptors to be

1941
01:51:27,640 --> 01:51:30,800
Speaker 1: to be a candidate in twenty twenty six. I would

1942
01:51:30,880 --> 01:51:33,960
Speaker 1: not say being progressive or conservative or I don't think

1943
01:51:34,000 --> 01:51:35,920
Speaker 1: those are the best adjectives to want to have as

1944
01:51:35,960 --> 01:51:41,040
Speaker 1: a candidate. Outsider, independent, I think those are the words

1945
01:51:41,760 --> 01:51:43,160
Speaker 1: that the swing voters of twenty.

1946
01:51:43,040 --> 01:51:44,800
Speaker 3: Twenty six are going to be looked for.

1947
01:51:51,360 --> 01:51:57,120
Speaker 1: Ask Chuck, Hey, Chuck, this comes from Chase, who I

1948
01:51:57,200 --> 01:52:00,479
Speaker 1: think is the person who invented the ash Chuck five

1949
01:52:00,560 --> 01:52:02,479
Speaker 1: timer Club, So he is I think I'm gonna make

1950
01:52:02,560 --> 01:52:05,599
Speaker 1: him president. You don't have to just hashtag in anymore.

1951
01:52:05,680 --> 01:52:09,640
Speaker 1: Chase you are you are? You are the president of

1952
01:52:09,720 --> 01:52:12,960
Speaker 1: the ass Chuck five timer Club, and he asks, hey,

1953
01:52:13,040 --> 01:52:15,439
Speaker 1: Chuck as the ranking echoes himself the ranking member, not

1954
01:52:15,560 --> 01:52:18,759
Speaker 1: the chair. But I'm gonna make a president. I reserve

1955
01:52:18,800 --> 01:52:21,519
Speaker 1: the right to lob the occasional tinfoil hat question. Those

1956
01:52:21,560 --> 01:52:23,519
Speaker 1: are the rules I wrote them. I could amend them

1957
01:52:23,920 --> 01:52:26,200
Speaker 1: at will. So what exactly is going on with all

1958
01:52:26,240 --> 01:52:28,880
Speaker 1: the alien talk lately? Between Obamas who knows, Trump talking

1959
01:52:28,920 --> 01:52:32,240
Speaker 1: about declassifying everything, jad Van saying aliens might be demons,

1960
01:52:32,280 --> 01:52:34,960
Speaker 1: and Rubio talking about possible long term cover ups. It

1961
01:52:34,960 --> 01:52:38,479
Speaker 1: feels like extraterrestrials suddenly became a bipartisan talking point. So

1962
01:52:38,680 --> 01:52:41,920
Speaker 1: actually something driving this wave of UFO UAP chatter or

1963
01:52:42,040 --> 01:52:45,200
Speaker 1: is this just the world's strangest recurring political subplot best regards?

1964
01:52:45,680 --> 01:52:47,519
Speaker 1: I have to tell you, I you know, I'm one

1965
01:52:47,560 --> 01:52:50,320
Speaker 1: of those who believe, who believes that we're not alone.

1966
01:52:52,960 --> 01:52:55,519
Speaker 1: By the way, I'm obsessed with the three body that

1967
01:52:56,560 --> 01:52:59,519
Speaker 1: I think the premise of the TV show on Netflix

1968
01:52:59,560 --> 01:53:01,479
Speaker 1: called the Three Body Problem. I think it is, which

1969
01:53:01,560 --> 01:53:03,840
Speaker 1: come on Netflix. I want my next season. It's been

1970
01:53:03,880 --> 01:53:05,600
Speaker 1: a while. I know it's in a very expensive and

1971
01:53:06,520 --> 01:53:08,240
Speaker 1: my friend Mark Murray read all the novels and he

1972
01:53:08,240 --> 01:53:11,080
Speaker 1: says they're fantastic. At some point I may delve into

1973
01:53:11,120 --> 01:53:13,760
Speaker 1: him myself. But the premise of that one is we

1974
01:53:13,840 --> 01:53:17,160
Speaker 1: find out sort of, you know, almost a couple generations

1975
01:53:17,240 --> 01:53:19,360
Speaker 1: in advance, that these aliens are coming, but it's going

1976
01:53:19,439 --> 01:53:24,960
Speaker 1: to take them a while, right, And so it is,

1977
01:53:25,920 --> 01:53:28,880
Speaker 1: you know, I buy that, you know, I buy the

1978
01:53:28,960 --> 01:53:31,080
Speaker 1: idea that maybe some of these things we see might

1979
01:53:31,120 --> 01:53:34,040
Speaker 1: be probes or something, but they're probably not people. They

1980
01:53:34,120 --> 01:53:37,640
Speaker 1: probably were coming from another entity that are just in

1981
01:53:37,680 --> 01:53:39,720
Speaker 1: the same way we send out you know, if we're

1982
01:53:39,800 --> 01:53:43,760
Speaker 1: sending out telescopes to go look at far off galaxies,

1983
01:53:44,439 --> 01:53:47,439
Speaker 1: if there is another civilization of sorts out there, or

1984
01:53:47,439 --> 01:53:50,360
Speaker 1: another species, they're likely doing the same thing.

1985
01:53:50,520 --> 01:53:50,640
Speaker 2: Right.

1986
01:53:51,600 --> 01:53:55,479
Speaker 1: So the odds, right, I don't know, can we bet

1987
01:53:55,520 --> 01:53:57,640
Speaker 1: on this on Calshier polymarket. I think the odds are

1988
01:53:57,680 --> 01:54:02,040
Speaker 1: in the ninety five percent area that there is there

1989
01:54:02,120 --> 01:54:07,479
Speaker 1: is extra terrestrial life outside the Earth. But I don't,

1990
01:54:08,120 --> 01:54:12,120
Speaker 1: you know, while all the increased chatter really hasn't added

1991
01:54:12,160 --> 01:54:14,800
Speaker 1: I'm with you, it hasn't added any new information other

1992
01:54:14,920 --> 01:54:20,040
Speaker 1: than oh okay. So it looks like the military and

1993
01:54:20,040 --> 01:54:22,840
Speaker 1: the government have been keeping track of any time members

1994
01:54:22,880 --> 01:54:25,200
Speaker 1: of the military think they see something they can't identify,

1995
01:54:26,040 --> 01:54:30,000
Speaker 1: but it hasn't really added to anything, right, So I

1996
01:54:30,160 --> 01:54:35,320
Speaker 1: count myself on you know, I think the movie Contact

1997
01:54:35,920 --> 01:54:39,600
Speaker 1: and the TV show Three Body Problem, I think are

1998
01:54:39,640 --> 01:54:46,200
Speaker 1: the ones that best. I think that you know. I'm

1999
01:54:46,680 --> 01:54:50,040
Speaker 1: in many ways. Contact was based on sort of Carl

2000
01:54:50,080 --> 01:54:55,040
Speaker 1: Sagan theories, right, I am. I find myself in that

2001
01:54:55,520 --> 01:55:00,480
Speaker 1: camp where the aliens are just going to show one day,

2002
01:55:00,640 --> 01:55:03,040
Speaker 1: we're going to get years in advance and sort of

2003
01:55:03,320 --> 01:55:06,040
Speaker 1: see this coming. The question is do we see it

2004
01:55:06,120 --> 01:55:11,600
Speaker 1: coming in time? And are they benevolent or malevolent? But

2005
01:55:11,720 --> 01:55:14,520
Speaker 1: I'm with you, I think all of the chatter is

2006
01:55:15,040 --> 01:55:19,839
Speaker 1: it's sort of self fulfilling, right, because the government's released

2007
01:55:19,840 --> 01:55:23,400
Speaker 1: a few more details, more people ask people that used

2008
01:55:23,400 --> 01:55:25,000
Speaker 1: to be in government about it, and more people that

2009
01:55:25,080 --> 01:55:27,200
Speaker 1: used to be in government feel more comfortable talking about it.

2010
01:55:27,640 --> 01:55:30,960
Speaker 1: But they don't have any more information really than any

2011
01:55:31,000 --> 01:55:35,280
Speaker 1: of us ever did. Next question comes from Dean from

2012
01:55:35,320 --> 01:55:37,040
Speaker 1: Long Island. He says, Hey, I understand your point that

2013
01:55:37,120 --> 01:55:38,920
Speaker 1: you can't win a race to the bomb, and I

2014
01:55:39,040 --> 01:55:41,360
Speaker 1: generally agree with your approach, but I sometimes wonder if

2015
01:55:41,400 --> 01:55:43,520
Speaker 1: what we're seeing now feels less like a race and

2016
01:55:43,600 --> 01:55:46,080
Speaker 1: more like a survival moment Politically, if one side feels

2017
01:55:46,120 --> 01:55:48,480
Speaker 1: like the rules are being rewritten, is it's still possible

2018
01:55:48,480 --> 01:55:51,000
Speaker 1: to play by the old rules and complete and compete effectively.

2019
01:55:51,040 --> 01:55:53,280
Speaker 1: At what point does the old playbook stop working and

2020
01:55:53,360 --> 01:55:57,000
Speaker 1: something else become necessary. Look, I get, I understand what

2021
01:55:57,080 --> 01:56:02,520
Speaker 1: you're saying, and I will just say that that history's

2022
01:56:02,600 --> 01:56:06,200
Speaker 1: lesson is when you do try to sort of change

2023
01:56:06,200 --> 01:56:09,560
Speaker 1: your principles to fit a moment because you're trying to

2024
01:56:09,600 --> 01:56:12,880
Speaker 1: survive a moment, it is very hard to get back

2025
01:56:12,920 --> 01:56:15,720
Speaker 1: to where you were on the principal side of things.

2026
01:56:19,440 --> 01:56:19,760
Speaker 2: And so.

2027
01:56:21,280 --> 01:56:24,160
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I'm guessing you're more writing about

2028
01:56:24,360 --> 01:56:27,960
Speaker 1: sort of my stubbornness about this Virginia remap, which I

2029
01:56:28,120 --> 01:56:32,840
Speaker 1: just think is again, this political environment right now, it's six'.

2030
01:56:32,960 --> 01:56:36,720
Speaker 1: Five the first and the second in this political environment

2031
01:56:36,720 --> 01:56:38,760
Speaker 1: would both, flip so we'd be at a three without

2032
01:56:38,960 --> 01:56:43,280
Speaker 1: changing the map at, All Virginia. Democrats so now you're

2033
01:56:43,320 --> 01:56:47,080
Speaker 1: going through this entire. Rigmarole you're basically burning whatever political

2034
01:56:47,160 --> 01:56:52,600
Speaker 1: Capital Abigails bamberger got for two extra, seats not five extra,

2035
01:56:52,720 --> 01:56:57,320
Speaker 1: seats not four extra. Seats two extra. Seats that's a

2036
01:56:57,480 --> 01:57:00,240
Speaker 1: lot of political capital for two extra. Seats that may

2037
01:57:00,440 --> 01:57:04,400
Speaker 1: not be that. Meaningful, look if it turns Out democrats

2038
01:57:04,440 --> 01:57:08,440
Speaker 1: win by five or, less Then virginia And california bailed

2039
01:57:08,480 --> 01:57:12,520
Speaker 1: the party. Out but it's not as if if that's

2040
01:57:12,600 --> 01:57:17,120
Speaker 1: How democrats win The, house that's no. Mandate that's you,

2041
01:57:17,200 --> 01:57:21,520
Speaker 1: know that's not effective. Control that's technical, control but it's

2042
01:57:21,560 --> 01:57:23,920
Speaker 1: not effective. Control and it doesn't mean the voters really

2043
01:57:23,960 --> 01:57:28,120
Speaker 1: were affirming For democrats control The. House it was, basically you,

2044
01:57:28,200 --> 01:57:32,320
Speaker 1: know anything less than five seats is just sort of

2045
01:57:32,400 --> 01:57:40,080
Speaker 1: a race by race. Contest so look what you, describe,

2046
01:57:40,160 --> 01:57:49,800
Speaker 1: right that is that's the judgment. Call BUT i think

2047
01:57:49,800 --> 01:57:51,680
Speaker 1: if you, want you, know it all comes through short,

2048
01:57:51,760 --> 01:57:56,680
Speaker 1: termism long, termism AND i just think the unintended consequences

2049
01:57:56,720 --> 01:58:00,600
Speaker 1: of essentially being a, party and AND, i you know

2050
01:58:00,680 --> 01:58:02,560
Speaker 1: this IS i get at this a little. BIT i

2051
01:58:02,640 --> 01:58:06,080
Speaker 1: don't think we're ready to move on from this moment

2052
01:58:06,120 --> 01:58:10,920
Speaker 1: we're living. IN i you, KNOW i sort OF i

2053
01:58:11,000 --> 01:58:14,480
Speaker 1: went deeper on My monday monologue about talking about sort

2054
01:58:14,480 --> 01:58:17,240
Speaker 1: of comparing the era Between jackson And lincoln to the

2055
01:58:17,280 --> 01:58:19,720
Speaker 1: era we're living in now and how long it took

2056
01:58:19,800 --> 01:58:22,560
Speaker 1: us we had seven presidents that basically refused to deal

2057
01:58:22,640 --> 01:58:25,880
Speaker 1: with the actual divide that was the issue that was

2058
01:58:25,880 --> 01:58:29,600
Speaker 1: actually dividing, us which was. Slavery in this era of,

2059
01:58:29,640 --> 01:58:32,040
Speaker 1: polarization we don't seem to be dealing with the issue

2060
01:58:32,120 --> 01:58:34,120
Speaker 1: that we're actually all arguing, about which is who's An

2061
01:58:34,120 --> 01:58:37,400
Speaker 1: american and who should be An? American and what what Is?

2062
01:58:37,440 --> 01:58:45,840
Speaker 1: America and until we confront that issue head, ON i

2063
01:58:45,920 --> 01:58:49,000
Speaker 1: don't you, know all these little things we do to

2064
01:58:49,160 --> 01:58:51,720
Speaker 1: game the situation on the left right to try to

2065
01:58:51,760 --> 01:58:56,120
Speaker 1: win power just, delays just puts that, large that confrontation

2066
01:58:56,400 --> 01:58:59,720
Speaker 1: and that issue off yet another election cycle or. Two

2067
01:59:00,240 --> 01:59:03,880
Speaker 1: SO i guess my longer term answer to your point here, Is,

2068
01:59:04,000 --> 01:59:09,240
Speaker 1: dinez this certainly allows you to deal with the moment

2069
01:59:10,560 --> 01:59:18,720
Speaker 1: on firmer, ground but it ain't a. Solution i'm gonna

2070
01:59:18,720 --> 01:59:21,760
Speaker 1: take one more question and THEN i unfortunately we're going

2071
01:59:21,840 --> 01:59:23,120
Speaker 1: to have to put this. One we don't want to

2072
01:59:23,200 --> 01:59:26,560
Speaker 1: go too long on these. Things last question comes From Scott,

2073
01:59:26,600 --> 01:59:28,800
Speaker 1: turner And. Oregon, Hey, CHUCK i listen to your podcast

2074
01:59:28,840 --> 01:59:32,120
Speaker 1: at the. Gym sweating around oldies rather than to them

2075
01:59:32,840 --> 01:59:34,440
Speaker 1: helps take my mind off of how much tougher it

2076
01:59:34,560 --> 01:59:36,360
Speaker 1: is to age at my. Age my question has to

2077
01:59:36,400 --> 01:59:38,760
Speaker 1: do with how media outlets handle political. Lies how often

2078
01:59:38,760 --> 01:59:40,800
Speaker 1: avery reporters say there's no evidence for those, claims which

2079
01:59:40,840 --> 01:59:42,800
Speaker 1: makes it sound like the claims might still be true

2080
01:59:43,040 --> 01:59:45,720
Speaker 1: instead of just. False why don't journalists more directly call

2081
01:59:45,800 --> 01:59:47,600
Speaker 1: lies what they? Are and how do reporters keep a

2082
01:59:47,600 --> 01:59:50,520
Speaker 1: straight face when they hear obviously ridiculous? Answers, also happy.

2083
01:59:50,560 --> 01:59:53,440
Speaker 1: Baseball your current Nets travail's remind me of being an

2084
01:59:53,480 --> 01:59:56,600
Speaker 1: early nineteen Eighties oaklanees fan in nearly empty. Stadiums thanks

2085
01:59:56,640 --> 01:59:59,760
Speaker 1: to all you do Is scott Seed. Turner scott Seed, Turner. Oregon,

2086
02:00:00,840 --> 02:00:08,560
Speaker 1: look it is always you. Know, UH i think you

2087
02:00:08,680 --> 02:00:13,400
Speaker 1: better be careful when you call somebody a, liar because

2088
02:00:14,640 --> 02:00:17,040
Speaker 1: you know they may truly believe something that isn't. True

2089
02:00:18,520 --> 02:00:22,200
Speaker 1: lying implies sort of, intent, Right and how do you?

2090
02:00:22,360 --> 02:00:24,040
Speaker 1: Know can you crawl inside their head and know that

2091
02:00:24,120 --> 02:00:28,800
Speaker 1: they are intentionally misleading you or there or you? Know

2092
02:00:29,000 --> 02:00:31,960
Speaker 1: so that's why you see so many a journalists sort

2093
02:00:32,000 --> 02:00:36,360
Speaker 1: of couch. IT i think even in the infamous EXCHANGE

2094
02:00:36,400 --> 02:00:38,800
Speaker 1: i had With kelly And conway And meet The press alternative,

2095
02:00:38,840 --> 02:00:41,880
Speaker 1: FACTS i, said those are, falsehoods AND i you, KNOW

2096
02:00:42,000 --> 02:00:44,160
Speaker 1: i lost a little sleep wondering SHOULD i said lies or?

2097
02:00:44,200 --> 02:00:47,400
Speaker 1: Falsehoods AND i think when you use the word, lie

2098
02:00:47,560 --> 02:00:51,040
Speaker 1: you immediately put somebody on the, defensive and then you

2099
02:00:51,080 --> 02:00:54,200
Speaker 1: get to the point where you're no longer having you,

2100
02:00:54,280 --> 02:00:56,800
Speaker 1: KNOW i am more interested, in, well why do you think?

2101
02:00:56,880 --> 02:00:58,920
Speaker 1: That where did you get your? Information AND i think

2102
02:00:58,960 --> 02:01:00,920
Speaker 1: that that's the better way to, go because then you

2103
02:01:01,120 --> 02:01:07,320
Speaker 1: find out how somebody came to believe what they. Espoused

2104
02:01:08,080 --> 02:01:10,640
Speaker 1: AND i think the role of the journalists rolled should

2105
02:01:10,680 --> 02:01:14,440
Speaker 1: be more of trying to understand why did you say?

2106
02:01:14,480 --> 02:01:17,760
Speaker 1: That where did you get your? Information that's where the

2107
02:01:17,840 --> 02:01:23,240
Speaker 1: interrogation should, go and to help the viewer understand why

2108
02:01:23,360 --> 02:01:31,600
Speaker 1: they're misleading in that. Moment but, look it's A that's

2109
02:01:31,680 --> 02:01:33,680
Speaker 1: the WAY i viewed it is THAT i didn't want

2110
02:01:33,800 --> 02:01:36,880
Speaker 1: to chase people. AWAY i wanted everybody in the. Conversation

2111
02:01:37,720 --> 02:01:44,720
Speaker 1: so that's why you sometimes you, know WE'RE i don't

2112
02:01:44,720 --> 02:01:46,880
Speaker 1: want to say we're playing umpire, referee but it's sort

2113
02:01:46,920 --> 02:01:50,760
Speaker 1: of a little bit more in that territory where if

2114
02:01:50,840 --> 02:01:53,040
Speaker 1: you start throwing, out you, know all of a, sudden

2115
02:01:53,080 --> 02:01:58,280
Speaker 1: we're the debate participant versus being the debate. Moderator SO

2116
02:01:58,400 --> 02:02:00,040
Speaker 1: i guess that's the. Line that's certainly the. Line AND

2117
02:02:00,120 --> 02:02:02,480
Speaker 1: i was hugging all the, time which is why some

2118
02:02:02,560 --> 02:02:03,800
Speaker 1: people loved it and some people hated.

2119
02:02:03,840 --> 02:02:04,920
Speaker 3: It AND i understand.

2120
02:02:05,000 --> 02:02:08,920
Speaker 1: That all. Right with, that you're going to see me

2121
02:02:08,960 --> 02:02:12,360
Speaker 1: in forty eight hours on twenty eight four, hours as you, know,

2122
02:02:12,520 --> 02:02:17,320
Speaker 1: tonight first night Of, passover SO i will be dropping

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02:02:17,480 --> 02:02:21,120
Speaker 1: my next episode not On, thursday but On. Friday and with,

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Speaker 1: That i'll see in forty eight hours