1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:01,880 Speaker 1: If you have your own story of being in a 2 00:00:01,960 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 1: cult or a high control group. 3 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:06,440 Speaker 2: Or if you've had experience with manipulation or abuse the 4 00:00:06,480 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 2: power that you'd like to share. 5 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,040 Speaker 1: Leave us a message on our hotline number at three 6 00:00:10,039 --> 00:00:12,360 Speaker 1: four seven eight six trust. 7 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:16,040 Speaker 2: That's three four seven eight six eight seven eight seven eight. 8 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:19,919 Speaker 1: Or showed us an email at trustmepod at gmail dot com. 9 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 2: Trust me, Trust for trust me. 10 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,480 Speaker 3: I'm like a swat person. I've never lied to you. 11 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,320 Speaker 2: I never live if you think that one person has 12 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:34,239 Speaker 2: all the answers, don't welcome to Trust Me. The podcast 13 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:37,480 Speaker 2: about cults, extreme belief and manipulation from two people who've 14 00:00:37,479 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 2: actually experienced it. I am Lola Blanc and my co 15 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 2: host is Megan Elizabeth. She is not able to join 16 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,319 Speaker 2: for this intro today. Don't worry. She is safe, but 17 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:48,720 Speaker 2: she was a part of the interview itself. So today 18 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:52,560 Speaker 2: is rerun because we live in Los Angeles and obviously 19 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:55,360 Speaker 2: everything is crazy right now. We will be getting back 20 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 2: to new episodes soon, but today is a rerun of 21 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 2: the first part of our interview with Frank Leiford, survivor 22 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 2: of Heaven's Gate. Frank was a member of the group 23 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,520 Speaker 2: until he left after eighteen years, just a few years 24 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 2: before discovering that his friends and loved ones in the 25 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 2: group had died by suicide. In part one, he tells 26 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:13,920 Speaker 2: us how he began following the leaders Tea and Doe, 27 00:01:14,200 --> 00:01:16,640 Speaker 2: what it was like living a nomadic lifestyle with what 28 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 2: was called his check partner, and what happened when they 29 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 2: all settled in one place for class. They discussed being 30 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:24,919 Speaker 2: separated from the love of his life, how the rules 31 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:27,880 Speaker 2: became more strict and controlling, and how much darker things 32 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 2: got after Tea got cancer. And we will come back 33 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 2: hopefully for part two next week. Obviously, for those of 34 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:37,160 Speaker 2: you who don't know, we are Los Angeles residents, so 35 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 2: there is an ongoing active fire situation right now. 36 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 1: We are both. 37 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 2: Safe, our producer Steve is safe, but there is a 38 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:48,880 Speaker 2: lot to process, and many friends have had to evacuate 39 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 2: and or have lost their homes, and there is a 40 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 2: lot to deal with and a lot to process. So 41 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:57,800 Speaker 2: I promise we will start doing new episodes again very 42 00:01:57,880 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 2: very soon, but in the meantime, take care of each other, 43 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 2: stay safe. Please donate to families who need it and 44 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:08,799 Speaker 2: to organizations that are helping people on the ground. And 45 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 2: if you just want to hear some cult stuff, here 46 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 2: is Frank Lyifford. Welcome, Frank Lyford. Thank you so much 47 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:25,240 Speaker 2: for coming on. Thank you, It's good to be here, 48 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:27,079 Speaker 2: so happy to see you. I was just watching your 49 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 2: beautiful story in the HBO documentary and so nice to 50 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 2: get to talk to you in the flesh, well, in 51 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 2: the digital flesh. So Heaven's Gate, as many of our 52 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:37,959 Speaker 2: listeners will already know, was a religious UFO cult in 53 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: the seventies, eighties and nineties. It was run by a 54 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 2: man named Marshall Applewhite and a woman named Bonnie Nettles, 55 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: who went by Doe and Tea, respectively. So the man 56 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,440 Speaker 2: is Dough and the woman is Tea. And of course 57 00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:52,080 Speaker 2: they're most famous for committing a mass suicide in nineteen 58 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:55,320 Speaker 2: ninety seven. And you, Frank, were a member for eighteen years. 59 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: Is that right correct? 60 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 2: So can you please start us at the beginning? How 61 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 2: old were you when you first joined? Where were you 62 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:03,240 Speaker 2: at in your life? 63 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:03,360 Speaker 3: Like? 64 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:04,080 Speaker 1: Tell us about that? 65 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:09,640 Speaker 3: Oh it's going back, okay. I was twenty one. I 66 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:16,120 Speaker 3: was a story I naive, twenty one year old kid 67 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:21,920 Speaker 3: who had read some UFO books. I'd read about Edgar 68 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 3: Casey his book by Thomas Screw There was a River. 69 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:26,799 Speaker 1: What is that? 70 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 2: That's just like a UFO book. 71 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 3: No, Edgar Casey is a channeler. He's a trance channeler 72 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 3: in the nineteen thirties. 73 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 2: Gotcha. 74 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 3: He's also famous for several predictions about a state of 75 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 3: the world. 76 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 2: Gotcha. Gotcha? 77 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 3: Anyway, I had a girlfriend at the time. We've been 78 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 3: together three years, and both of us were interested in, 79 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 3: or you know, entertained the idea of UFOs. We were 80 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 3: getting ready to move in together, and we were going 81 00:03:57,760 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 3: to go on vacation. First. We were in Calgary, albert 82 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 3: and we went on the occasion out to the West coast. 83 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 3: We're gonna dip down into the US and visit my 84 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 3: first cousin, David Vin Sindron. He was one of my 85 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 3: favorite people and I just really enjoyed his company. So 86 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 3: we went to Corbalis, Oregon, where he was going to school. 87 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 3: He was a perpetual student, and in the course of 88 00:04:25,760 --> 00:04:29,320 Speaker 3: our talking, he told us about a poster that he 89 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 3: had seen around Corbalis. It's a college town, and he 90 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 3: said he would show it to us the next day. 91 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 3: So he did, and it intrigued me. It intreated Erica, 92 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 3: and he was also intrigued. The thing that piqued my 93 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 3: interest was a line in the poster that first of all, 94 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:55,040 Speaker 3: it was headed UFO two, Why they're here, who they 95 00:04:55,080 --> 00:05:00,240 Speaker 3: have come for? And when they will leave. There was 96 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 3: a line in there that peaked interested said something like, 97 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 3: if you have ever entertained the idea of a real 98 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 3: physical level of existence beyond the human level, you'll want 99 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:19,600 Speaker 3: to attend this meeting. So I did. I wanted to 100 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:24,600 Speaker 3: attend the meeting because I had entertained such a thing. 101 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 3: So the meeting was in a couple of days, so 102 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:31,920 Speaker 3: we drove about an hour to the coast of Oregon 103 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:38,279 Speaker 3: to a little place called Waldport, and the room was packed. 104 00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 3: We got there just before the meeting was going to start, 105 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 3: so we had trouble finding seats. There may be one 106 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 3: hundred people in the room. 107 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:50,839 Speaker 2: Oh, I can't imagine just a poster could get that 108 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:52,760 Speaker 2: many people there. It seems crazy now. 109 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 3: Well, apparently they had pepper the whole area. Plus, as 110 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:02,919 Speaker 3: we found out later, there was a commune in the 111 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 3: Woldport area of maybe fifty people who were all hippies 112 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:12,719 Speaker 3: and drop out. A lot of them ended up joining 113 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 3: the group, so you know, there were I sensed differing 114 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 3: mindsets of the people there. There were some who were 115 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:27,160 Speaker 3: who seemed quite excited and others who were standing at 116 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 3: the back as if you know, I'm not so sure 117 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:33,480 Speaker 3: about this. I'm gonna see what it's like. And if 118 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:36,559 Speaker 3: they sound crazy, I'm ready to leave, you know, ready 119 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:40,919 Speaker 3: to bolt. There were two people at the front kindo 120 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 3: at that point. They were called Bow and Peep, and 121 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 3: they spoke for maybe an hour. Their talk kind of 122 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 3: had a blend of three different approaches to life. One 123 00:06:54,440 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 3: was the spirituality common of that time, using some of 124 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 3: the work from the book Seth Speaks, and he was 125 00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 3: another channeled entity. They talked about Christianity and how the 126 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 3: same energies that they represented had visited the Earth two 127 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 3: thousand years ago in the form of Jesus. And they 128 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 3: talked about UFOs, how UFOs were the transportation of this 129 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 3: next evolutionary level above human that they were here to 130 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 3: tell people about. They said that if anyone was interested 131 00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 3: in following them, they would teach those people how to 132 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:48,920 Speaker 3: prepare to graduate to this next evolutionary level above human. 133 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 2: So when you say they represented the energy of Jesus, 134 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:56,280 Speaker 2: does that mean that they're like physically embodying Jesus, Like, 135 00:07:56,320 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 2: what does that mean exactly? 136 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 3: We found out later they believe they were the two 137 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:07,760 Speaker 3: witnesses talked about in the Book of Revelation in the Bible, 138 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 3: and they believed Doe the Man was the reincarnation of 139 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 3: Jesus and t the Woman was Doe's older member, those 140 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 3: elder those teacher long story short. At the end of 141 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 3: their talk, they said, if anybody's interested, there are son 142 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 3: here who have been with us for a few months, 143 00:08:36,080 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 3: and they will tell you where to meet to find 144 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:44,200 Speaker 3: out more information. So after the meeting, I felt higher 145 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 3: than a kite. They felt like just brimming with energy 146 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 3: and like really excited that this was pretty cool thing 147 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:57,120 Speaker 3: that we had stumbled across. So I was interested in 148 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 3: more information. And we had sat separately because of the 149 00:09:02,520 --> 00:09:06,560 Speaker 3: sparse seating. So I met up with my girlfriend Erica 150 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 3: and my cousin David, and we kind of compared notes. 151 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:15,079 Speaker 3: Erica felt the same way. David wasn't quite so sure. 152 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 3: He was intrigued, but he went to go back home 153 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 3: and talk with his girlfriend, Susie Strom. So we went 154 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 3: back to Corvalis and it was the next day or 155 00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 3: two days later we went to Eugene, where the follow 156 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 3: up meeting was. This was just a three of us. 157 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:40,360 Speaker 3: Second Susie still wasn't able to come, and we talked 158 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:43,439 Speaker 3: with some of the followers who had been with T 159 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 3: and Doo for weeks or months. I didn't really get 160 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 3: a definitive answer of is this legit? You know? Is 161 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 3: this a real thing? Do you have proof this is real? 162 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:02,240 Speaker 3: But I got the sense from the people that I 163 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 3: spoke with that it was real enough in their experience 164 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 3: that it meant that it was worth leaving behind all 165 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:17,600 Speaker 3: aspects of their human life to find out more about it. 166 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 3: So everyone I spoke to seemed sincere and truthful. They 167 00:10:24,559 --> 00:10:27,319 Speaker 3: weren't trying to pull the wool over our eyes. So 168 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:30,200 Speaker 3: we decided we would take the next step. So they 169 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:33,079 Speaker 3: took our phone numbers. They told us they would call 170 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:36,440 Speaker 3: us in a week. They told us to go home 171 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:42,600 Speaker 3: and tie up loose ends wow, and to get ready 172 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:46,319 Speaker 3: to be on the road for a while. The belief 173 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:50,880 Speaker 3: from T and Doo's talk and from these other followers 174 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:56,559 Speaker 3: was that this process of preparation would take months. It 175 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,560 Speaker 3: wouldn't take years, It wouldn't be long and drawn out. 176 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 3: That was thought, So they said, go home, tip sins 177 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:05,680 Speaker 3: and we'll call you and tell you where to meet. 178 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:09,960 Speaker 3: The next day, Eric and I left to go back 179 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 3: to Calgary to tie up loose sinds. 180 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:17,240 Speaker 2: Wow, what was it that was appealing? You already have 181 00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 2: this interest in UFOs and like extraterrestrial life, and it 182 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 2: just like really appeals to that interest that you already have. 183 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:28,679 Speaker 2: Is it the community? Is it the shared experience with Erica? 184 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:28,800 Speaker 3: Like? 185 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:30,800 Speaker 2: What about it was the most appealing to you? 186 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:38,439 Speaker 3: Well, I felt like I had the opportunity to learn 187 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:42,319 Speaker 3: things that I didn't think I could learn anywhere else. 188 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 3: So it was like this coole window into wisdom and 189 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 3: knowledge that I'd never experienced before. At least that was 190 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:57,080 Speaker 3: my perception. I think Erica and David felt the same way. 191 00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:00,600 Speaker 3: So all four of us ended up joining the So 192 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 3: we received our phone call after a week. We had 193 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 3: tied up loose ends in Calgary. 194 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 2: And when you say tie up loose ends, does that 195 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 2: mean just like quit your jobs? Talk to your family 196 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:12,079 Speaker 2: like what does that mean? 197 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:12,360 Speaker 3: Yeah? 198 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:14,760 Speaker 1: What was your life like that you had to tie up? 199 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 3: Well, there wasn't a lot to tie up. I was 200 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 3: a bartender at the time, so it didn't require a 201 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 3: lot of notice. I think Erica was a hostess somewhere. 202 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 3: We were both in the restaurant business. We didn't tell 203 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 3: anyone really what we were doing. We were warned that 204 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 3: if we did that, they would try to talk us 205 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 3: out of it. So we just told my parents, and 206 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 3: Erica told her parents, well, we're just going to travel 207 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 3: for a while around the US. We're going to meet 208 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:54,520 Speaker 3: some friends. We're not sure how long we're going to 209 00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 3: do it, but off we go, this is what we 210 00:12:56,559 --> 00:13:01,240 Speaker 3: want to do. And they didn't much of it until 211 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 3: weeks later when they didn't hear from us. Right right, 212 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 3: So we met in a place called Cherry Creek Campground 213 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 3: just outside of Denver. There were other people there, family camping, 214 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:20,079 Speaker 3: but it seemed a bit like a carnival there because 215 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 3: all kinds of people from all different meetings were meeting 216 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 3: up there. You know, it was a little bit wild. 217 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:30,440 Speaker 3: There was a lot of pot smoking, a lot of 218 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:35,559 Speaker 3: hippie type people there, mostly young. I was a little 219 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 3: bit skeptic of did we make the right choice here, 220 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 3: But then you know, we found somebody who could tell 221 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 3: us what was going on, and then they moved everyone 222 00:13:47,080 --> 00:13:50,480 Speaker 3: off into groups of ten or twelve, there were two 223 00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:54,200 Speaker 3: group coordinators who had been with TENDO for a while, 224 00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 3: and they briefed us on what they knew, and then 225 00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 3: in a few days we moved to a different campground 226 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 3: and the whole thing was a vetting process in a 227 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 3: way of weeding out the people who were not serious. 228 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 3: And then we moved to a third campground a week later, 229 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 3: and at that point we had a chance to meet 230 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 3: with t and do for the first time kind of 231 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 3: an additional layer of the vetting process. When I met 232 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:31,479 Speaker 3: and I felt like they could see my thoughts, Wow, 233 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:37,120 Speaker 3: I felt dirty, you know, I felt like I was impure. 234 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 3: And I don't know how much of this was my 235 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:44,680 Speaker 3: projection onto them, of putting them on a pedestal, but 236 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 3: they seemed like they were authorities of a kind that 237 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 3: I hadn't met before. Why dirty, impure, impure? 238 00:14:53,560 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, if somebody could read my thoughts, i'd feel pretty dirty. Yeah, 239 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:02,080 Speaker 1: that's stressful. I get that. 240 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 2: Did you know about the asexuality of the group at 241 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:16,520 Speaker 2: this point or that was that revealed sort of later on? 242 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:19,920 Speaker 3: They may have talked about it generally, we're going to 243 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 3: be getting rid of all the alien behavior eventually, but 244 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 3: they didn't really go hardcore into no sex whatsoever, I 245 00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 3: think until a year later when we gathered again. 246 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 2: So how long are you guys living on a sort 247 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 2: of a nomadic lifestyle. How long does this camping year? 248 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 3: Eight? A year, a year, rut a year and we 249 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 3: crisscrossed the country. I don't know how many groups there were. 250 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 3: Is there were as many as two hundred and fifty 251 00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 3: people doing that, But during that first year a lot 252 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:57,560 Speaker 3: of people fell away, people went back to their lives. 253 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 3: Shortly after we met Tindo, Rick and I were split 254 00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:03,680 Speaker 3: up and we were given new check partners. 255 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 2: Can you explain what a check partner is? 256 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 3: Similar to how Jesus instructs his disciples in the Bible, 257 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 3: you will go out two by two and spread the 258 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 3: good news. The purpose of a check partner is as 259 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:22,480 Speaker 3: a sounding board. We were taught over and over and 260 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 3: over again to not trust our own minds, to trust 261 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:33,080 Speaker 3: our check partners judgment more than our own, so that 262 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,880 Speaker 3: if both of us had that trust, we would arrive 263 00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:41,880 Speaker 3: at a decision that was best for everything and everyone, 264 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 3: basically without the interference of the eco mind. If that's 265 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:49,720 Speaker 3: not really how they described it, but the goal was 266 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 3: to between the two of you arrive at what your 267 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 3: older member would decide. You weren't using your own mind, 268 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 3: You weren't using your own history, your own logic, right, 269 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:07,639 Speaker 3: you were both reaching up to connect with your older 270 00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 3: member's mind. 271 00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 1: And did you find that, like decisions started to become better? 272 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:16,479 Speaker 1: Were they clearer? And I mean that sounds like just 273 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: from a therapeutic standpoint, that it could actually work. 274 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:23,439 Speaker 2: If it's someone who's wise though, and has your bestag 275 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:25,520 Speaker 2: in mind exactly. 276 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 3: That's the key is is were we really connecting with 277 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:36,399 Speaker 3: our older member's mind and were they actually receiving valid 278 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:40,200 Speaker 3: information from their older member's mind. You and Do presented 279 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:42,119 Speaker 3: it to us as if there was a chain of 280 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,879 Speaker 3: mind that we were reaching up and connecting too, in 281 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:51,320 Speaker 3: effect psychically or intuitively. And then you know, Dough would 282 00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:53,639 Speaker 3: be reaching up to his older member's mind, and his 283 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:57,679 Speaker 3: older member t would be reaching up to her older 284 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 3: member's mind, you know, not physically. Isn't on the surface 285 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:03,680 Speaker 3: of the earth that was the goal. 286 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:09,400 Speaker 2: It's interesting, though, Meghan, you see it as a therapeutically sound. 287 00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 1: I think what I'm thinking of is like AA when 288 00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 1: you think contrary action, where your first instinct sometimes if 289 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:21,000 Speaker 1: you bounce it off another person, you get clarity into 290 00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 1: how many decisions you're making based off of wrong information? 291 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:25,760 Speaker 4: Right? 292 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:26,000 Speaker 2: Right? 293 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:26,280 Speaker 1: Yeah? 294 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 2: See, my when I hear that, my first thought is, oh, 295 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 2: that's priming everyone to stop thinking for. 296 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 1: Themselves, trusting and trusting exactly exactly for sure. 297 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:39,359 Speaker 3: Right and I would agree with that. Probably the biggest 298 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 3: lesson of my life is to trust my own integration rights. 299 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:50,600 Speaker 3: And in effect, the teachings of Tin and Do were 300 00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:54,399 Speaker 3: telling me not to telling me that I didn't have 301 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 3: the answer that they did, and most people would be 302 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:05,120 Speaker 3: imediately run away from that, you know, from anything is fringe. 303 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,280 Speaker 3: Even at the point of hearing the first talk, they 304 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 3: would say, these people are nuts. They would run away 305 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 3: for some reason. That didn't happen for me. 306 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:19,359 Speaker 2: You were young and open minded and curious of me 307 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:19,959 Speaker 2: I was. 308 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:25,639 Speaker 3: I haven't lost that open mindedness. I've learned a lot 309 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:29,880 Speaker 3: about how to trust intuition. That was a slow journey 310 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,919 Speaker 3: post cult, but that has ended up serving me well. 311 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 2: Right, So tell us more about this year. So, so 312 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 2: things aren't really strict yet. Have you changed your name yet? 313 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 2: Have you cut your hair yet? Or does that happen later? 314 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 3: We all took new names right off the bet pretty much. 315 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 3: I don't think we cut our hair. As a matter 316 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:50,280 Speaker 3: of fact, I grew a beard well help we were 317 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:56,199 Speaker 3: on the road. It was brown and not white. But 318 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 3: the meetings that we held for recruiting were like the 319 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 3: blind leading the blind. We knew very little, you know, 320 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:05,920 Speaker 3: we learned more as we went along. Things were passed 321 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 3: down to us through drips and drabs. The coordinators would 322 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 3: have a scheduled phone call with the people surrounding Tin 323 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 3: Doe once a week. The coordinators were given a phone 324 00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 3: number to call, and then they would go to a 325 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:25,000 Speaker 3: pay phone. There were no cell phones, this was nineteen 326 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 3: seventy five. And then the coordinators would come back to 327 00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:33,360 Speaker 3: their groups and share what they were given from the 328 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:37,440 Speaker 3: helpers of T and DO. I think about twice maybe 329 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,919 Speaker 3: we had a gathering. One was somewhere in maybe Colorado 330 00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:45,080 Speaker 3: with T and Do, and then there was another one 331 00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:48,959 Speaker 3: in Mississippi where we all got a chance to gather 332 00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 3: and hear Tindo speak, And that was really exciting because 333 00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 3: we had very little contact with them. I had been 334 00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 3: partnered with two different partners. One there wasn't any connection, 335 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:05,240 Speaker 3: and there wasn't any negativity. It was just both neutral. 336 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:08,440 Speaker 3: So I said, is something supposed to be going on here? 337 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 3: Because I heard a lot of other partners had triggering 338 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:15,280 Speaker 3: circumstances between their partnerships and that was supposed to be 339 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:19,199 Speaker 3: of benefit if we could work them out. So I 340 00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 3: was switched to another partner. His name was Amos, so 341 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:25,560 Speaker 3: I took the name Andy. We were Amos and Andy. 342 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:29,880 Speaker 3: At one point we were in Phoenix, it was midnight, 343 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 3: we had a place to stay, we were looking for it, 344 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,320 Speaker 3: and we had also swapped cars, and it was part 345 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:40,600 Speaker 3: of letting go of all of our human connections, including 346 00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:44,360 Speaker 3: our possessions. So the little feat that I had come 347 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:47,720 Speaker 3: in with was long gone, and we exchanged it for 348 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,960 Speaker 3: this old, beat up powder blue Plymouth with a hole 349 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:55,040 Speaker 3: in the floorboard the driver's side you could see the 350 00:21:55,160 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 3: road going by. Had done nothing, so I had no 351 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 3: idea who the owner of the car was. At one point, 352 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,000 Speaker 3: we're going to go straight in an intersection, and Amos 353 00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,560 Speaker 3: and no, I'll turn left here. So I turned left 354 00:22:10,840 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 3: from the middle lane and I was pulled over by 355 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 3: a policeman and we both looked kind of scruffy. We 356 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:21,119 Speaker 3: both had beard's longer hair, so the policeman, you know, 357 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:23,920 Speaker 3: was kind of suspicious of us right off the bat, 358 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:27,960 Speaker 3: and he wondered why we were driving somebody else's car 359 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 3: and we didn't have a letter of permission or anything. 360 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,480 Speaker 3: But he couldn't really find fault with our story, but 361 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,639 Speaker 3: he still wanted to put me in jail for the 362 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 3: night because we had no money. So I spent the 363 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 3: night in the tempe Arizona jail. I didn't have any 364 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,000 Speaker 3: cell mates, so it was a little bit scary. Yeah, 365 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 3: but I didn't sleep, and eight point thirty came around, 366 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 3: somebody came and let me out, so I was outside 367 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 3: looking for Amos. I saw the blue Plymouth parked and 368 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,359 Speaker 3: he was in the back seat sleeping, so I thought 369 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:06,359 Speaker 3: I probably had a better sleep than he did. Anyway, 370 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 3: we've spent the week in Phoenix when on a meeting, 371 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 3: we got one recruit from that meeting, so Amos decided 372 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:18,240 Speaker 3: that he was going to go off on his own 373 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:22,639 Speaker 3: with some payote buttons into the desert and talked to 374 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:25,119 Speaker 3: his older member and determined what to do next. 375 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 2: An older means like metaphysically older, right. 376 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:30,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, wiser, okay, yeah, teacher. 377 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 1: Right. 378 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 3: Back then, it wasn't super clear that our older member 379 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:39,840 Speaker 3: was Dough and those older member was Tea. We thought 380 00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 3: we had to reach up into the heavens to speak 381 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,480 Speaker 3: with our older member, right, So that was what he 382 00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:48,280 Speaker 3: was going to do, so that I was going to 383 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 3: be the tech partner with our new recruit. So he 384 00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:56,800 Speaker 3: and I set out in his Citron because Amos took 385 00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:00,679 Speaker 3: the Blue Plymouth and we were going to Florida. Remember 386 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:02,440 Speaker 3: what we talked about, and I'm sure we talked about 387 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 3: what little teachings I knew of tend O's. And then 388 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 3: when we got to Miami, he decided that he was 389 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 3: going to wander the beach and simply talk to his 390 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:19,720 Speaker 3: older member. So I ended up with the Citron. All 391 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,080 Speaker 3: of the people in the group that I was in 392 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 3: had gone their separate ways. I was the only one 393 00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:30,520 Speaker 3: left in my group still following Tindo, so I had 394 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:35,560 Speaker 3: no way of contacting the people around Tindo. Except something 395 00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:40,200 Speaker 3: almost miraculous happened. At one point, somebody at a place 396 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:45,800 Speaker 3: where I had gone to ask for some assistance, food 397 00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 3: and gasp the car they had received a call from 398 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:56,040 Speaker 3: Kindo's helpers. So the people at this community center gave 399 00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:58,160 Speaker 3: me a phone number to call, so I did. I 400 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:02,560 Speaker 3: reconnected with my Orish, the coordinator in Cherry Creek, Colorado. 401 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:03,879 Speaker 2: Wow, a stroke of fate. 402 00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 3: Yeah. So they directed me to a group in New Mexico. 403 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:11,239 Speaker 3: So I met up with them and there were ten 404 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 3: or twelve of us. So I was given a new 405 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,880 Speaker 3: check partner and off we went again. That was kind 406 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:19,200 Speaker 3: of the nature of the first year. We were like gypsies, 407 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:23,200 Speaker 3: crisscrossing the countryside, holding recruiting meetings. 408 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:26,159 Speaker 2: Quick note here. So I was kicking myself after this 409 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:29,240 Speaker 2: interview for not asking why Frank still felt compelled to 410 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 2: go back even though everyone else had left and he 411 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,120 Speaker 2: was all alone. So I asked him after the fact 412 00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 2: and he told me this, and I quote, A big 413 00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 2: piece of it was the carrot as always of my 414 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 2: belief in the opportunity to ascend to the next level. 415 00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:44,960 Speaker 2: And looking back rolled into that was the fear of 416 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 2: missing out. I see the fallacy of net now because 417 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 2: I feel I've grown more self aware, but it was 418 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:51,080 Speaker 2: my motivation then. 419 00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:53,679 Speaker 1: And where was Erica during all of this? She was 420 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:58,119 Speaker 1: just in a different so called pod like right, and 421 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 1: were you guys still together or no? 422 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:05,280 Speaker 3: Okay? But when we met up in Biloxi. Everyone converged 423 00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:09,359 Speaker 3: in Biloxi, Mississippi. She had been in a similar circumstance 424 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:13,439 Speaker 3: in that she and her check partner were off on 425 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:18,399 Speaker 3: their own and their group had completely disintegrated. Oh, she 426 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 3: didn't know what to do because she still wanted to 427 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:25,480 Speaker 3: follow teen Doe. So she was actually in contact with 428 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 3: my parents in Calgary because she didn't feel like her 429 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:36,120 Speaker 3: parents would be sympathetic to her continuing interesting with ten 430 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:38,760 Speaker 3: Do because my parents were a little bit on the 431 00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:43,080 Speaker 3: wu Wu side anyway, nice because my mother gave me 432 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 3: the Edgar Casty Book and they sent my parents sent 433 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,760 Speaker 3: Erica some money, and then she somehow got in touch 434 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:57,119 Speaker 3: with everyone ended up in Biloxi, Mississippi, and we worked together. 435 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 3: But I still had huge feelings for her right and 436 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:06,600 Speaker 3: those actually never went away, except that I surpressed them 437 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:07,520 Speaker 3: over the years. 438 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,600 Speaker 2: Did you feel any resentment for being separated from her? 439 00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:18,359 Speaker 3: No, Because our thought was, even if, even if she's 440 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:23,159 Speaker 3: the love of my life, if this opportunity to gain 441 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 3: membership in a completely different kingdom level above the human level, 442 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:32,439 Speaker 3: even if if she's loved my life, that opportunity is 443 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 3: worth letting go of the love of my life to me, 444 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 3: this was a once in a lifetime opportunity, but that 445 00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 3: didn't stop me from, you know, feeling attraction for her 446 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 3: and feeling a deep connection with her. 447 00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 1: Had you guys gotten more details at this point about 448 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 1: the teachings, Were you more juiced in onto what was 449 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:00,159 Speaker 1: happening and where you were heading? 450 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:03,200 Speaker 3: Yeah? More and more. As time went on, we learned more, 451 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,640 Speaker 3: and the more time we spent with Tea and grow, 452 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,800 Speaker 3: the more we learned, the more discipline we could apply 453 00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 3: using the teachings that they had passed on to us, 454 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:18,200 Speaker 3: and the more things made sense, the more we realized 455 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:21,520 Speaker 3: what we had signed on for, and there was always 456 00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:25,640 Speaker 3: new information that we hadn't encountered before. 457 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 2: Tell us about when the class begins, what happens. You 458 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:39,840 Speaker 2: all kind of settle in one area. 459 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,800 Speaker 3: Right right, and it was wyoming where we were all 460 00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:46,240 Speaker 3: cold together. There could have been as many as two 461 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,960 Speaker 3: hundred people there, and that was wild. That was like 462 00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 3: I think of the children of Israel, you know, wandering 463 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 3: in a wilderness, the people who were unruly, and the 464 00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:01,360 Speaker 3: people were unruly there, it's crazy. So that was what 465 00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 3: Tindo wanted to do, was kind of bring us together 466 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:09,760 Speaker 3: into the same mindset and to help us establish some 467 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 3: kind of discipline. First, there was a lesson about kind 468 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:19,120 Speaker 3: distant consideration, things that made sense. That was kind of 469 00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:23,720 Speaker 3: a first basic essential lesson, And a few weeks or 470 00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 3: months later we had something called the seventeen Steps, which 471 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:33,080 Speaker 3: were guidelines for how to live in ways that were 472 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,680 Speaker 3: becoming two members of the next level, so that we 473 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:40,040 Speaker 3: would fit in there, so that we wouldn't stick out 474 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:43,040 Speaker 3: like a sore thumb, so that we wouldn't be. 475 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 2: Disruptive once you get to the higher plane. 476 00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 1: It's kind of like alien etiquette kind. 477 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 3: Of, yes, yeah, exactly. 478 00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:54,600 Speaker 2: I wrote down from some of what I heard, and 479 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 2: they included things like, can you follow instructions without adding interpretation? 480 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:05,120 Speaker 2: Can you deliver instructions as you receive them so I'm hearing? 481 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 2: Can you follow orders and do as we say and 482 00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 2: be controlled by us. They forbade things like clumsiness, procrastination. 483 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:15,440 Speaker 1: And even I'm not allowed in. 484 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 2: And even having private thoughts? Is that right? 485 00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:20,479 Speaker 3: Oh? 486 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, that is wild. You're not allowed to have private thoughts. 487 00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:27,080 Speaker 2: And then also arousal was forbid. 488 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 3: Yeah. Right. 489 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:31,120 Speaker 2: How did you feel about these steps? I mean, what 490 00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 2: did you feel good about them? 491 00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 3: Yeah? Because we were already to a degree brainwashed in 492 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 3: a sense, we were motivated. You know. It's like this 493 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:46,479 Speaker 3: carrot out in front of us that if you do 494 00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 3: as we teach you, you will graduate, you will ascend 495 00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 3: to this next evolutionary level. And during that first year, 496 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,440 Speaker 3: in the first several years, the idea was we would 497 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:06,520 Speaker 3: ascend while conscious and alive. We would ascend consciously into 498 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 3: this next evolutionary level above human. 499 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,160 Speaker 2: So tell us what vehicles means. 500 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:15,520 Speaker 3: Vehicle is your body that you, as a soul inhabit, 501 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 3: which I would say is accurate to a degree, but 502 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:23,880 Speaker 3: it was also considered the same as a car would 503 00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:27,360 Speaker 3: be to a driver. So the soul is the driver 504 00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:32,240 Speaker 3: of the car, of the vehicle. T would often say, 505 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 3: get your mind into your vehicle, meaning get your vehicle 506 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 3: under control of your mind. Kind of like a rider 507 00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 3: on a horse. A rider doesn't let the horse run wild. 508 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 3: The rider keeps the horse doing what the rider wants 509 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:49,600 Speaker 3: the horse to do. 510 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 2: So getting your sexual urges under control is a big 511 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 2: piece of that, right I mean, so I am a 512 00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:00,320 Speaker 2: little familiar with that idea just having grown up Morman, 513 00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:04,320 Speaker 2: you were sexuality is you know, there's a lot of 514 00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:07,080 Speaker 2: shame around it, and I felt a lot, you know, 515 00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 2: anytime I would feel an urge or like masturbate or anything, 516 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 2: I just felt so ashamed after Did you you know 517 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,840 Speaker 2: how successful were you in suppressing those urges or did 518 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 2: you like feel shame? Like what was going on there? 519 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:25,120 Speaker 3: Well, when we were on the road, we're virtually always 520 00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 3: in the presence of our check partner, and the goal 521 00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:34,280 Speaker 3: in sight in the assignment of check partners was if 522 00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:38,120 Speaker 3: you could easily be attracted to a member of the 523 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,280 Speaker 3: opposite sex or a member of the same sex that 524 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 3: was your sexual orientation, then they would partner with someone 525 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 3: who you would not be attracted to. You know, that 526 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,200 Speaker 3: was the goal. It didn't always work out that way. 527 00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:55,240 Speaker 3: I mean, that's why some of the people left is 528 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,200 Speaker 3: because they found some they were attracted to and they 529 00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 3: left with them. That's why I generally was partnered with 530 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:03,600 Speaker 3: the male, right. 531 00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:06,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's kind of like Mormon missionaries. Actually they're sent 532 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:10,080 Speaker 2: out two by two and they're together twenty four to seven, 533 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,720 Speaker 2: same sex, and yeah, their their behavior is just like 534 00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,680 Speaker 2: strictly constantly regulated by the presence of another person who's 535 00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:20,080 Speaker 2: trying to be righteous. 536 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 3: Right, living in the same community started after the first year, 537 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:30,400 Speaker 3: So from like September of seventy six to sometime in 538 00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 3: nineteen eighty one, we lived in campgrounds or on BLM land. 539 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 3: That's not lack lives Matter, that's Bureau of Land Management. 540 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:45,080 Speaker 3: Or we would get permission from ranch owners who had 541 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:50,960 Speaker 3: these vast expanses of ranch lands, who camp on their property, 542 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,959 Speaker 3: and so we would be unhindered and not interfered with 543 00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:59,120 Speaker 3: by curious people. You know. That was about five years 544 00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,160 Speaker 3: when we lived outside. I was outside all the time. 545 00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,760 Speaker 2: But then you get your cousin's trust fund kind of 546 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 2: starts funding a new lifestyles that right, I. 547 00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,960 Speaker 3: Think Rob Balsh had that backwards. Oh, his trust fund 548 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:17,640 Speaker 3: was funding us from seventy six to eighty one, and 549 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:20,279 Speaker 3: then it ran out. We ran it dry, and at 550 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,160 Speaker 3: that point half of us had get work and then 551 00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 3: pool whenever funds came in to the group communally. That's 552 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:30,719 Speaker 3: when we moved into houses. So there were as many 553 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,279 Speaker 3: as thirty six of us living in a house, and 554 00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,480 Speaker 3: yet we couldn't let on that there was that many 555 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,799 Speaker 3: of us there, so only certain people could go outside 556 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:40,720 Speaker 3: at that point. 557 00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:42,680 Speaker 2: Were you one of the people who went outside or 558 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:43,560 Speaker 2: did you stay in the house. 559 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:47,520 Speaker 3: I was one of the people who worked outside, but 560 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:51,920 Speaker 3: we had people called intercept or you know, they were 561 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:56,919 Speaker 3: assigned to be the interface between us and anyone who 562 00:34:56,920 --> 00:35:00,279 Speaker 3: had come to the door, so that it wasn't a 563 00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 3: different person each time. They would pretend to be like 564 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:07,719 Speaker 3: the householder. Right. I worked outside the group initially as 565 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:10,919 Speaker 3: a waiter, and this was near San Antonio. 566 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 2: And at any point are you you're you're really deep 567 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:17,839 Speaker 2: in at this point, I'm assuming everyone sort of has 568 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 2: the same haircut, kind of like my hair, right, and 569 00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:25,600 Speaker 2: you know, dressing the same and living this lifestyle because 570 00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:27,799 Speaker 2: you're interfacing with the outside world war. Is there any 571 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:30,359 Speaker 2: point at which you're questioning or does that not happen 572 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:30,879 Speaker 2: till later? 573 00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 3: Periodically doubt would come up in my mind and I 574 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:41,439 Speaker 3: would stuff it down because it was like the doubt 575 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:45,200 Speaker 3: would be, is this really going to happen? Or you know, 576 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 3: can I really do this? Can I really hack all 577 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:53,240 Speaker 3: of the requirements of this? Because you asked earlier how 578 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 3: successful was I regarding sexuality? And there were weeks and 579 00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:02,680 Speaker 3: months where I didn't think about it at all. I 580 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:07,280 Speaker 3: was too busy, too focused on other things. And then 581 00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 3: there were times when I would, it would be this 582 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:16,880 Speaker 3: internal battle, like you say, guilt and shame about having slipped. 583 00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 3: You know, there were slippages, and then there were major 584 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:25,320 Speaker 3: slippages sensuality, sexuality. It was a major slippage. Over time, 585 00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,839 Speaker 3: we had more and more and more guidelines and procedures 586 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:33,680 Speaker 3: and things to follow, ways of being and thinking and 587 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:40,680 Speaker 3: acting and behaving and speaking and eating and sleeping, showering 588 00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 3: in the morning. You know, everything was regimented. 589 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:47,040 Speaker 2: I remember hearing even the size of your pancakes was 590 00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,799 Speaker 2: regulated and how much syrup was poured on top of them. 591 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,160 Speaker 2: That is a very high control group right there. 592 00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:59,560 Speaker 1: When did the plan of the comet come into being? 593 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:01,759 Speaker 1: Or was that always? No? 594 00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:05,440 Speaker 3: That was when the world heard about the commet. That's 595 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,200 Speaker 3: when they got the hair brained idea that it was 596 00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:11,840 Speaker 3: their time to leave. That was in nineteen ninety seven, 597 00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:15,120 Speaker 3: or the end of nineteen ninety six, when the comet 598 00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:18,760 Speaker 3: was discovered by two people, Hail and Bob. 599 00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 2: And you'd been out already by that point. 600 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, I was left in August of ninety three. 601 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 2: I see, are you living with Doh and tee or 602 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,080 Speaker 2: are you in a sort of like a separate household. 603 00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:33,080 Speaker 3: For a while they did live in the same house. 604 00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 3: Eventually they felt like they could think better being separate 605 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:41,560 Speaker 3: from us, being separate from our vibrations, so they got 606 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:45,560 Speaker 3: their own separate house, their own separate quarters. They rented 607 00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:49,360 Speaker 3: a smaller house Classic. So we had different star groups, 608 00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:53,000 Speaker 3: four different star groups that this started in campgrounds. I 609 00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:55,760 Speaker 3: think we had forty eight people. So we had formal 610 00:37:55,840 --> 00:38:02,360 Speaker 3: out procyon alt air and serious. We went by numbers 611 00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:06,480 Speaker 3: one through twelve, I think, and I was P one. 612 00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:08,640 Speaker 2: That's your name, that was what you went by? 613 00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:11,520 Speaker 3: That was I think we even had name tags. 614 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:16,920 Speaker 2: Wow, P one one very dehumanizing. Is it kind of. 615 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 1: Like Harry Potter houses like Slytherin? Is that what it is? 616 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:23,560 Speaker 1: Is that the vibe? 617 00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:26,839 Speaker 3: Or well, it's kind of like that, but that's not 618 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,040 Speaker 3: the vibe. 619 00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: Not the vibe, got it right, No, but kind of 620 00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:34,040 Speaker 1: the same. 621 00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:39,239 Speaker 3: No, it wasn't serious. It was nera. Yeah. So this 622 00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,759 Speaker 3: was eighty five and we were in Dallas, Texas. At 623 00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,360 Speaker 3: this point I had moved up from being a waiter 624 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:51,480 Speaker 3: to being a medical receptionist and then I got a 625 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:55,879 Speaker 3: job at Microsoft in their Dallas sales office. We would 626 00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,640 Speaker 3: go to work and we would pretend to be normal. 627 00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:04,360 Speaker 1: I understand that feeling completely. 628 00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:08,319 Speaker 3: I would pretend to be a husband to somebody, and 629 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:10,719 Speaker 3: I had to go home to my wife at the 630 00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:13,960 Speaker 3: end of the day, and so I couldn't participate in, 631 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,719 Speaker 3: you know, going out to the bar or whatever. You know, 632 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,400 Speaker 3: if anybody would ask me to do that, right, Sorry, 633 00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:21,360 Speaker 3: I can't. I have other plans. 634 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:24,520 Speaker 2: Can you tell us about when t got cancer and 635 00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:26,120 Speaker 2: what that experience was like. 636 00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:31,120 Speaker 3: She had cancer twice. Once when we were in campgrounds, 637 00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:33,799 Speaker 3: she had cancer of the eye. She had cancer in 638 00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:37,239 Speaker 3: her eye, so she had her eye removed and she 639 00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:41,200 Speaker 3: had a prosthetic put in, and you know, everybody thought, well, okay, 640 00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:43,319 Speaker 3: that's good. I'm glad she had it taken care of. 641 00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:46,160 Speaker 3: It's over and done with. And then we moved into 642 00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:49,840 Speaker 3: houses around nineteen eighty one, and then nineteen eighty five 643 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,160 Speaker 3: we learned that Tea was sick again and they had 644 00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:56,279 Speaker 3: separate quarters, so we didn't We didn't see TNDO for 645 00:39:56,400 --> 00:40:01,160 Speaker 3: quite a while, and then they had two helpers go 646 00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:04,440 Speaker 3: help T and do while he was sick. In general, 647 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:07,960 Speaker 3: there were people who were trusted or by Tin do 648 00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:14,239 Speaker 3: to follow instructions, to be disciplined, to get things right. 649 00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:19,360 Speaker 3: These two helpers would go and stay at Tando's place, 650 00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:23,439 Speaker 3: called it crafts. It wasn't a house craft as in spacecraft. 651 00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:26,680 Speaker 3: So we had the main craft and we had air craft, 652 00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:29,680 Speaker 3: so we were all curious about what was going on. 653 00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,480 Speaker 3: And then it was only like two or three weeks 654 00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:38,120 Speaker 3: before Tea passed on and she had their cancer, so 655 00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:42,719 Speaker 3: the cancer head spread all throughout her body, right, and 656 00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:47,200 Speaker 3: this was never in the plant, of course, and so 657 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:54,080 Speaker 3: we were all devastated, particularly Dough. He was heartbroken because 658 00:40:54,120 --> 00:41:00,480 Speaker 3: this was his older member. And he came for meeting 659 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:05,080 Speaker 3: with us and said, I'm not sure we should continue 660 00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:11,160 Speaker 3: with the class, and virtually everyone said, no, we have to, 661 00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:15,640 Speaker 3: we have to keep going. We believe and you believe 662 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:19,759 Speaker 3: in the next evolutionary level of humans, so you know, 663 00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:25,040 Speaker 3: we were all completely on board. So he continued, Was. 664 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:30,360 Speaker 2: It confusing, like, how did you reconcile this idea that 665 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:34,680 Speaker 2: you know you are going to physically transform from your 666 00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:39,520 Speaker 2: vehicles with Tea's vehicle actually just dying. What was the 667 00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:40,719 Speaker 2: justification for that? 668 00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:46,600 Speaker 4: Well, the party line, I guess was we were taking 669 00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:51,280 Speaker 4: too long, and yeah, he had to go on ahead 670 00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:58,000 Speaker 4: and prepare a place for us get ready for our graduation. 671 00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:01,319 Speaker 3: And because we were taking too long, he decided to 672 00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:07,000 Speaker 3: exit her vehicle that way, right, but tease passing in 673 00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:11,200 Speaker 3: that way had a huge impact on those thinking about 674 00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:14,719 Speaker 3: how the graduation would occur, and that worked on him 675 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:18,080 Speaker 3: over the coming months and years, to the point where 676 00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:22,239 Speaker 3: he began to entertain ideas of how we might do 677 00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:27,520 Speaker 3: our vehicles in which was entirely diametrically posed to the 678 00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:29,080 Speaker 3: way it was originally presented. 679 00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:31,000 Speaker 2: How was it originally presented? 680 00:42:31,160 --> 00:42:35,760 Speaker 3: We will be taken up in a craft while we're conscious, 681 00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:38,400 Speaker 3: we will ascend while conscious and alive. 682 00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:40,440 Speaker 2: I'm going to leave that there for now. Come back 683 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:42,400 Speaker 2: next week for part two. I promise there will be 684 00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:48,320 Speaker 2: some amazing, juicy, fascinating, interesting, compelling new episodes very very soon. 685 00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,120 Speaker 2: But for right now, we are sending much love to 686 00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,959 Speaker 2: our fellows, Southern California residents, and remember to follow your gut, 687 00:42:55,239 --> 00:43:00,359 Speaker 2: watch out for red flags, and never ever trust me. Bye. 688 00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:06,160 Speaker 2: Trust Me is produced by Kirsten Woodward, Gabby Rapp and 689 00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:07,520 Speaker 2: Steve Delamator. 690 00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,160 Speaker 1: With special thanks to Stacy Para, and. 691 00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:11,439 Speaker 2: Our theme song was composed by Holly amber Church. 692 00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:14,520 Speaker 1: You can find us on Instagram at trust Me Podcast, 693 00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:18,120 Speaker 1: Twitter at trust Me Cult pod or on TikTok at 694 00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:19,799 Speaker 1: trust Me Cult Podcast. 695 00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:23,359 Speaker 2: I'm Oola Lola on Instagram and Ola Lola on Twitter. 696 00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:26,640 Speaker 1: And I am Megan Elizabeth eleven on Instagram and Debraham 697 00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:27,840 Speaker 1: Hits on Twitter. 698 00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:30,320 Speaker 2: Remember to rate and review and spread the word.