00:00:02 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. This is the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at seven am e's durn on Apple, car Play or Android Atto with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 00:00:27 Speaker 2: Sonya Martin joins us Use, the chief economist for d Z Bank Sonia. What do you make of this move here by Japan in the US to kind of support the Japanese in here. What's your take? 00:00:38 Speaker 3: Actually, I think it's a pretty clever move. 00:00:40 Speaker 4: I mean, the back of Japan has been trying to, you know, to manage the end. 00:00:44 Speaker 3: They've been trying to support the currency for some time. 00:00:46 Speaker 4: They happen to be time and again, and every time then dolentus ended up going higher afterwards. So it wasn't a particularly successful intervention story. So moving in together with the Americans is a much more smarter move, and it's much more likely to have some success in it. So far is that it may well serve to draw a limit to the upside dot a en. It's not going to change the fact that the en is a week currency, but it might be more successful and it's a very very strong signal to the marketing, particularly because it seems to be the case that they might be further intervention if need be. 00:01:20 Speaker 5: Investors were heavily positioned though for a week or en before the intervention, and maybe early to tell. But how much of the move we're seeing, in your view is about a policy shift versus maybe an unwind in positioning. 00:01:33 Speaker 4: Yeah, well, we'll have to wait a week until we get some data on this, but I suspect strongly that quite a few of these positions have been wiped out, and that is a good thing because it's a clear signal to investors that speculating against the end is no longer going to be sort of a free lunch as it were. I mean, we have been having these problems that investors have been speculating heavily against the currency, and maybe this move will at least curtail this happening in the future. 00:02:03 Speaker 2: One of the interesting mechanics here of this potential intervention have been reports that the US Treasury used euros rather than dollars to fund its purchases. Talk to us about that. 00:02:12 Speaker 4: Yeah, well, it's very unusual, certainly, don't expected. I wonder whether they called the ECB to at least let them know, you know, a courtesy call, that this was going to happen. So yeah, a bit unusual. There's a lot of speculation about why they might have done this, and I think that the current consensus seems to be that they didn't want to open the Pandora's box of the strong dollar policy, so by intervening in EUROPEA and this circumvented having to use to sell dollars, which again may have raised questions about the official strong dollar policy that US governments have held for decades. So maybe that's why they did this. That's the I think the most logical explanation. We'll see if they have to intervene again, whether they stick to that, and if they do, what the ECB might have to say about that as well? 00:02:58 Speaker 6: And what about the FED? 00:02:59 Speaker 5: I mean, we have cher Kevin Waash signaling a different approach to FED communication with less forward guidance, and we have the New York Times reporting that it may even be I think six times a year, And how is that going to change the way fixed income investors think about risk? 00:03:13 Speaker 4: More broadly, I think Kevin Whash is a big challenge for the bond market right now. He's very different than his predecessor or predecessors, I should say. 00:03:24 Speaker 3: He obviously has plans with the FED. 00:03:25 Speaker 4: There's all these working groups that you know, are active trying to change certain things about the way that the FED does business. Then there's to talk about less meetings. He is a bit of a closed book when it comes to communicating with the market. You know, it's very different, and I think people are sort of not sure how to read the FED, and that ultimately creates more volatility, I think, because it leaves much more room, you know, for speculation, and given the fact that there's so much political pressure on the FED from the White House, I think personally, I'm not sure if this is the right moment to sort of, you know, scale down the communication with the market, because that could be interpreted as something rather unfavorable. So more volatility, more uncertainty, I think. And maybe over time we'll get to know Kevin Walsh better and you can read them better. 00:04:08 Speaker 3: But for now, it's a bit of a black box, sonya. 00:04:11 Speaker 2: A lot of folks are trying to get their handle on underlying inflation out there in the marketplace. Today's a day where we've got oil down five six percent here, but it can just as easily up five to six percent given the social media activity out there. What's your view of kind of underlying inflation out there in the marketplace. 00:04:32 Speaker 4: Well, I think, you know, ever since this trade of hamuse was effective at closed with the beginning of the war, with what we were basically witnessing is this big wave of inflation that every day it just gets a little bit taller and it builds up a little bit further, right, and and so that is still happening, even if the op price goes down temporarily, even after we had the MoU and there was some you. 00:04:52 Speaker 3: Know, ship traffic going through the strait of Hormus. 00:04:55 Speaker 4: Ultimately, the factors that are pushing inflation higher are still very much in place, and it is of course predominantly energy. But the longer this is going on, the more you're going to have other effects. I mean, I always the best example, I think is food prices. I mean food is expensive energyized to store, to cool, to transport. 00:05:13 Speaker 3: You know, we're going to see that effect that we have. 00:05:15 Speaker 4: Of course, the issue with wheak prices being higher because of what's happening in the Ukraine so there are a lot of inflation factors still in the pipeline as it were, and those aren't going to disappear just because the ore price falls by five or six percent, or because we maybe get a resolution in Iran. Potentially we'll see that's still very much in place. I think that's what central banks we need to focus on. 00:05:39 Speaker 5: Between FED policy, Sonya and coordinated ethics invention throwing geopolitics there and maybe even oil. What do you think is the biggest macro risk that markets are underestimating at the moment. 00:05:52 Speaker 4: Well, I think, okay, so I mean a risk that could be a negative or if we think about focasting a positive event. But I think on the downside, I think the big unknown and the big risk is probably the question of when we will get physical shortages of goods, including including potentially oil. I mean, one of the reasons why we've fared so reasonably well for the last five months despite what's happening in Iron is the fact that strategic reserves have been drawn down. But that is not an that will end at some point. At some point, you cannot draw down strategic reserves more. Some countries like the US or China still have a lot other countries have less. So this is I think a major risk. And I think when I look at how the market is behaving in this environment, you know, the equity market. 00:06:33 Speaker 3: I mean the Ducks just posted a new record high. 00:06:36 Speaker 4: Clearly, this is a risk that I think is heavily underpriced in the market. 00:06:41 Speaker 2: H Right, very good, Sonia, Thank you so much for really appreciate gating a few minutes of your time, Sonia Martin. She's the chief economist at Easy Bang. There to stay with us. More from Bloomberg Surveillance coming up after this. 00:07:01 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Surveillance podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from seven to ten am. E's durn Listen on Applecarplay and Android Otto with the Bloomberg Business app, or watch us live on YouTube. 00:07:13 Speaker 2: Ryan Mittrion joins us. She's a founding partner of the Callan Family Office. Hey, Ray, and we're about sixty percent of the way through the S and P five hundred earning so far this quarter here seems to be pretty darn good. What do you make of it? 00:07:28 Speaker 7: Good morning, Paul. 00:07:29 Speaker 8: Yeah, absolutely, we're off to another really strong start for this earning season. We have eighty six percent of companies are beating on earnings, seventy seven percent are beating on revenues. 00:07:40 Speaker 7: You have ten of eleven sectors that. 00:07:42 Speaker 8: Have year over year growth in earnings, and eight of those have double digit growth. So we're really seeing broad based strength across the board. And earnings growth is now expected to come in for the quarter at around forty seven percent, which is more than double the twenty three percent expectation coming in into the quarters. So we've really seen we're really pleased to continue seeing that the strength is still there. 00:08:06 Speaker 5: How are you interpreting the earning season so far? Because I feel like this is the earning season where AI spending stopped being enough on its own, and maybe investors were really really looking for when they'll see the ROI And you see investors really seeing rising costs or delayed payoffs and really punishing them. 00:08:23 Speaker 8: That's absolutely true, I mean, and you're seeing companies that are coming out with phenomenal results and are selling off on that news. But a lot of it, I mean, especially what we saw last week with some of those hyperscaler earnings, that there are very different outcomes in the stocks based based on what we're seeing and it's not. 00:08:41 Speaker 7: Enough to just be spending. 00:08:42 Speaker 8: We need to see that there is potentially some ROI coming from that, and we saw that last week with Microsoft with the Azure and Copilot businesses and Amazon with AWS and the growth that they're both seeing. But then the opposite, the market didn't feel as good about what came out from the Meta report at the free cash flow dropping significantly weaker than expected results. So we are going to need to start seeing more tangible results I think for the stocks to continue moving up on these high expectations and all. 00:09:11 Speaker 7: This cash that's being spent to fund these investments. 00:09:15 Speaker 2: Hey, Ryan, I know a lot of investors are probably looking for some diversification away from the AI trade here, which seems to be impacting a lot of different sectors across the marketplace. Where where do you guys look for a little diversification. 00:09:30 Speaker 7: That's a really important thing. 00:09:32 Speaker 8: I mean, we believe strongly in diversified portfolios, and you know, even within the equity markets, trying to find some of that diversification outside of the tech sector. Even though to your point, you are having a lot of the AI trade is you know, you're seeing it in the power gen you're seeing it in the industrials with the data center build out, You're seeing it in small caps with smaller semiconductor companies and emerging markets. But we do want to have that spread out of exposure across the board, and you know, leaning into some more of that value, more of the international, especially the emerging markets, the small caps, and just getting some of that diversified exposure, as well as looking into other parts in the market, whether it's fixed income or alternatives where appropriate for different investors, just to have a little bit of diversification. 00:10:17 Speaker 7: So when we get into these. 00:10:18 Speaker 8: Periods where you see some volatility in the markets like we've seen this past month, your portfolio can still hold up. 00:10:25 Speaker 5: What about semiconductors. We saw, for instance, of Philadelphia Semiconductor index see it's worst month since a great financial crisis. Do you view that as a buying opportunity or do you think that maybe it's a sign that expectations got a little too far ahead of reality. 00:10:40 Speaker 8: There's no question that the momentum has pushed up those stocks so high. I mean, they were up over eighty percent for the year, so it's not that surprising to see it take a little bit of a breather and have some of that profit taking and rotation into other sectors. We saw dollars going to value and more defensive sectors financials and staples, healthcare. But we do think if if you're under allocated in that area, we do think, you know, some of those valuations have now come down, even though the group as a whole is. 00:11:09 Speaker 7: Still up about sixty percent. 00:11:11 Speaker 8: There are still some good names and good buying opportunities in there as well if you're under allocated, But we're not looking to overweight that sector given where we are in the market. 00:11:21 Speaker 2: And how about the fixing come side of the world here, boy, you can clip some very nice coupons in the treasury market one and a quarter percent on the two year you know for sixty five, four, seventeen to ten year. Is that where we should be hanging out or you suggest some of your clients take credit risk on top of that, we. 00:11:39 Speaker 8: Keep most of our fixed income allocations primarily in high quality investment grade, but we do think that there is some opportunity as well in the below investment grade space, and some of that we're leaning in some on private credit. We do have some unique high yield exposure as well, but you know, some spreads are spreads are still pretty tight, so we want to be careful about where we're taking that and being very deliberate. 00:12:03 Speaker 7: And that's why we like the private markets for some of that as well. 00:12:07 Speaker 6: And what about the Fed? 00:12:08 Speaker 5: I mean, the Fed remains focused on inflation, but markets are pricing and a possible rate hike. What data point to you matters the most when it comes to the next move and interest rates. 00:12:19 Speaker 8: I think we really need to be They're very focused on inflation and what direction that's going to go in. I mean, the labor market really has been incredibly resilient and looks pretty healthy. 00:12:29 Speaker 7: So we'll get some more data obviously on that this week. 00:12:32 Speaker 8: So unless we see some surprise in one direction or the other, we think the focus will continue to remain on the inflation picture, since we're still pretty far above that two percent target. 00:12:44 Speaker 7: If we get softer than expected. 00:12:46 Speaker 8: Employment picture picture, then maybe the Fed stays on pause a little bit longer. But if we see a surprisingly strong report, then we may see yields jump on the expectation that they may make a hike sooner rather than later. 00:13:00 Speaker 2: And what's the appetite from your clients? For alternative investments, whether it's private credit, private equity, hedge funds. What's the appetite and kind of how do you deal with that? 00:13:11 Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean we work with ultra high net worth investors with pretty multi generational time horizons, so there's certainly in most cases the ability to take that ill liquidity. 00:13:22 Speaker 7: Into their portfolios. 00:13:24 Speaker 8: But we want to make sure we're evaluating each case by case and that the willingness is there and it's appropriate for the client. But we do think that there is the ability to enhance your returns over the long term if you take some of that illiquidity and invest in private markets. I mean, so many companies are staying private for so much longer now. I mean we saw it, you know, for example with SpaceX, with Anthropic, of these companies that are seeing so much growth in the private markets. So it does open up the opportunity set if you go in that area, and we like it on the. 00:13:53 Speaker 7: Private credit, private real estate as well. 00:13:55 Speaker 8: We think that helps to add some diversification to the portfolio and most of our clients to to take advantage of those opportunities as well. 00:14:02 Speaker 2: Ray, And thank you so much. Always appreciate getting a few minutes of your time. Ray and Mittrion founding partner in Callen Family offices down there in West Palm Beach, Florida, which is kind of ground zero for high network families and individuals. So that's a good place to have a family office of business here to stay with us. More from Bloomberg Surveillance coming up after this. 00:14:30 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Surveillance podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from seven to ten am Eastern Listen on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app, or watch us live on YouTube. 00:14:42 Speaker 2: Sarah Hunt joins his partner and chief market strategist at Alpine Saxson Woods joins us here in studio. 00:14:47 Speaker 7: Sarah. 00:14:48 Speaker 2: Last week we had a lot of tech earnings and there were some winners and some losers. And when you look at the stock market performance after they reported, how does that influence how you think about the AI trade? Where is the market in terms of how it wants to be exposed to AI? How do you guys think about that? 00:15:04 Speaker 9: Well, if you look at where we were, you know a year ago, everybody was raising capex and they were getting rewarded for raising capex almost across the board, and I think that that's obviously changed dramatically. I think you saw in the results this week that where you start to see that acceleration and growth which you saw for Microsoft and Amazon, versus where you have issues like you saw with Meta. Apple's got different issues because I think that's much more about the supply chain and the fact that memory prices are so high. But I don't think it's a demand problem. So for something like Apple, I would be less concerned about that in the near term, but a longer term or medium term. But I think that it really shows you you're starting to get bifurcation on how people are accepting the kind of spending that's happening, and what people hope for on the return side. 00:15:44 Speaker 5: So this is definitely the earning season where AI spending stop being enough on its own, but we're seeing companies spend billions and billions on AI infrastructure. Are there key signs that you're looking at to see whether those investments will actually pay off? That might be a tricky question, but I know you look at these closely well. 00:15:59 Speaker 9: I think I mean, I think that this was where the earnings were very important, because had you not seen the acceleration in demand that Microsoft was talking about and that AWS was talking about. 00:16:08 Speaker 2: On that side, I. 00:16:08 Speaker 9: Think that that question would be even more in focus. But I think the fact that also you've seen a little bit of moderation on that raise of capex. Yes, the capex is still strong, but we're not talking about doubling it again and again and again. And I think that that's important. And I also think that you know, the issue with what's going on in China and some of those models that are cheaper, that also brings into question, Okay, maybe the capex moderates a little bit, and I think the market starts to reward that moderation to some degree, because it's not just you have to get there first, it's how do we integrate this, what's actually going to happen, and what are you going to get paid for? 00:16:39 Speaker 2: Overall? What's your take so far of earnings? Because what we had a really high bar to clear and we had fantastic earnings in the first quarter, pretty big expectations for Q two as well. 00:16:48 Speaker 9: I think that the earnings, you know, you're still seeing earnings growth in the places where you expect to see it, and the information technology side you're STI also seeing it industrials. What you're starting to see, like Tyson and like Pocter and Gamble, is some real issues on thensumer side because consumer staples are having trouble with that pricing. You're starting to hit a wall with pricing. You don't see that yet in the technology space, but you, I mean, this is the whole. This is why you saw such volatility. Is that that adding to China with a cheaper potential mix into there makes it question how much you can continue to raise price on the technology side. I think that's going to be the tension going into twenty twenty seven. I can't believe I'm saying that we're going into twenty twenty seven, but there you are, and I think that that's how people are going to be looking at things as are am. I seeing that acceleration in demand and can I count on some returns from all that spending that I'm doing Right now? 00:17:32 Speaker 5: We are heading into twenty twenty seven and it's August, which is for me hard to believe. What about the FED, They're balancing stubborn inflation against concerns about consumer pressure. Do you think there's a risk that maybe keeping rates high for longer may create more economic damage than maybe some brief relief. 00:17:48 Speaker 9: I think the problem is that where we're seeing the inflation coming from, it's hard to see how higher rates are going to solve that problem. If you have a supply shock on oil, it's hard to see how higher rates help you unless you just kill demand, and that has lary effects that they don't necessarily want. So I think it's more about keeping things elevated as opposed to elevating them further. Although that argument is going to continue into the summer and we'll see what happens both with the employment report and what happens with inflation, because that oil shock that was getting better is now it's now gotten worse. I mean today you're down a little, you're down four box five. There's a lot more volatility there, and I think people were expecting a one way trip down, and I think that's going to complicate things for the FED once again. 00:18:24 Speaker 2: Twenty twenty six is shaping up to be a year driven by information technology communication services. Are there areas outside of there that maybe investors should be looking for, whether it's financials, healthcare, I'm not sure absolutely. 00:18:37 Speaker 9: I think that there are places in healthcare. I think that there are places in industrials. This is really a good time. I mean, you saw what happened with the memory stocks, and you see what happens with the hardware stocks. Occasionally on this AI trade, you want to be looking at the companies that are outside that to some degree and have a good cash flow, a good balance sheet. You know, we're big Beliezer vision capital return. We want to see those dividends being paid. We want to see that cash flow coming through and that cash flow growing. And I think that this is a good time to be looking in those areas because some of the valuations are not as punchy as you see on the AR hardware track. 00:19:06 Speaker 2: Some of those tech names that we've since the beginning of time, whether it's Google or somebody else, gobs of free cashlow gobs CFA term gobs of free cash. Now they were cash flow negative in some reas. I mean, that's a real issue for investors to deal with. 00:19:20 Speaker 9: And I think that that's exactly why that capex question is becoming a bigger and louder one, Which is okay, if you're funding it at a cash flow, at least you're funding yourself if you're now going to the debt markets, are going to the equity markets, you really have to justify that in a way that when you had gobs of cash I cant of CFA turn on your balance sheet, people didn't question that so much. And I think that those questions are getting louder. 00:19:41 Speaker 2: All right, sir, thank you so much, Really appreciate it. Sarah Hunt, partner and chief market strategist at Alpine Saxon Woods. Stay with us. More from Bloomberg Surveillance coming up after this. 00:19:59 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Surveillance podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from seven to ten am. E's durn Listen on Apple Karplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app, or watch us live on YouTube. 00:20:11 Speaker 2: We're going to check in with Joan g. Diego's co founder bomb Blocks. Talk to her about the bond market and what the bond markets reacting to this new FED chair and kind of his strategy is going forward. Paisley and Nardini. She has portfolio Mattress Simplify Asset Management. Get her thoughts on these markets. Apparently, Eric Balchunas is supposed to join us here to talk about the ETF business. He has not badged in. That could be a problem given he depends on the Ascella train, but we'll hope for the best there. So we all lot coming up in the next hour. Here, we've got some green on the screen. Let's go right to our first guest joining Go Diego. She's a co founder bond Blocks. Join it. Talk to us about how the bond market reacting to FED Chairman Walsh his second meeting last week. Kind of have the bond market doing the work of the FED bringing rates up over time? Here? What are you singing in your plat with your flows? 00:21:00 Speaker 6: Yeah, so I think a lot's been said this morning. 00:21:03 Speaker 10: A lot of guests have mentioned the same thing that you have about the market doing the work for him and his comments on wanting to change the meeting schedule and the pace of the data, maybe being able to absorb and process that data. I think that's kind of important because we've gone through so many mini scares and cycles. 00:21:21 Speaker 6: I always like to bring it up. 00:21:22 Speaker 10: On this show that in twenty twenty three we thought there'd be a banking crisis, you know, when SVB went down. There's been Liberation Day War, and so these these these moments, you know, the bond market reacts and you're seeing the long end really move out and actually like although this time these are historical even for the last four or five years, so this is a this is a big move, and investors are you know, absorbing it and reacting as they have where we're seeing a lot of short end and ultra short flows into etips and they're great ways to look at what's happening in investor views, and we. 00:21:58 Speaker 5: Have Chairwash suggesting this yields themselves can maybe help slow the economy. Do you think that the bond market is doing some of the Fed's work or do you think that they're signaling something more concerning. 00:22:11 Speaker 10: The way we look at this and what we're talking to clients about are Okay, this is happening. We've seen again lots of different bouts of volatility, the rate and the curve move, especially on the long end, and what we talk to clients about is what you should do now, And we think that what clients are focusing on as they're focusing on income, they're focusing on the traditional role because the traditional return expectations are back bonds. The corporates are yielding five to seven percent, five to six percent. How yield is yielding seven to twelve percent. You have a four percent treasure yield on the short end. That is the traditional return expectations you should have. And so when you compare that against equity returns, which have been outsized in the last five years but are still on average about fifteen percent annually, the long term rate is ten percent. 00:23:02 Speaker 6: Bonds are becoming. 00:23:04 Speaker 10: More competitive in your portfolio and what you should do next. So what you should do next is you should allow bonds to take that traditional position in your portfolio, add them in for both income and stability. 00:23:15 Speaker 6: Equities are expensive right now. 00:23:17 Speaker 10: They're pricing twenty one to twenty two times they're earnings. It's a moment for you to acknowledge, which I think maybe feathers into Worsh's policies and thoughts that you know, when things have reset to their traditional levels, you should be using bonds in a traditional way and also in a more precise way. 00:23:37 Speaker 2: Pc MM, which is the ticker for the bond blocks Private Credit clo ETF talk to us about that. What are you seeing there? 00:23:45 Speaker 6: It's my favorite product to talk about. 00:23:47 Speaker 10: In your previous guests, was talking about middle market exposure, and she's also talking about structural advantages and approaches, so in this is the perfect marriage between the structual side of the ETFs and the benefits you give from ETF's liquidity, but also with a way to get access to private credit that's much. 00:24:07 Speaker 6: More diversified than the stories we've been seeing. 00:24:09 Speaker 10: So the way this product works to hold clos, which are packages of middle market loans eighty percent of the portfolio as exposure to middle market private debt, which is direct loans to companies. 00:24:21 Speaker 6: And what that gives. 00:24:22 Speaker 10: You is there's about eighty colos in the product and that represents around seventy eight thousand underlying loans across twenty five to thirty managers. So the concerns of concentration and manager decision concentration in certain deals in certain sectors. It has that power of the ETF where you're getting broad diversification, you don't lose the characteristics of the asset class, you don't lose the opportunity to access those liquidity premiums. The product yields seven around seven percent, the fun portfolios seven percent, and you're getting a duration of something like seven months, so really low volatility with you know, compelling yields that investors don't want to give up, you know, private credit completely. 00:25:08 Speaker 6: This is a great entry point. 00:25:09 Speaker 10: This is a great way to complement your more liquid and liquid products in your portfolio. So I think it has a marriage of all the things that you know, other guests have been talking about, and we really keep reminding clients to look past the headlines and you know, maybe introduce something like this structure to help you, you know, ease into your private credit exposure. 00:25:29 Speaker 5: Many investors are now worried about taking too much duration risk. Where are you finding the best balance between maybe yield and rate sensitivity. 00:25:37 Speaker 10: Yeah, we say we say income over duration and what just as a way to talk to clients about it, we have been recommending intermediate duration for the last six seven months. If you are in the three year, you really hit the mark. As of June thirtieth, it's completely flat. If you're in the three year treasury, you're completely flat and you got to round a four percent yield all all of that part of the year. 00:26:03 Speaker 6: If you're in the five year, you're down just a little bit. 00:26:05 Speaker 10: So that three five and lower has been the place to be in terms of interest rate risk but we also want to encourage people to go out and add some spread to that to that equation, so that's where the income comes in. You would want to go into either shorter intermediate corporate debt, either in investment grade or high yield. 00:26:29 Speaker 6: Those spaces have. 00:26:30 Speaker 10: Low duration risk, interest rate risk. High yield people don't realize is actually low and interest rate risk it has about a three year duration in it. So anything under three years is something we think is compelling. We think that all those spreads are tight, it's still a place where you want to reach and grab the yield from that and add the income into your portfolio. So don't be afraid of credit. One of our top recommendations is our triple C product. You're going to get equity like returns at twelve percent and with really strong underlying you know, fundamentals, you know. 00:27:04 Speaker 6: Relative to historical levels. 00:27:06 Speaker 10: In extended credit, we we can't talk enough about making sure that you're you're taking advantage of the opportunities of these rates that are structurally higher, but also the health and the resilience of the economy, and you know, to lean into that in fixed income. 00:27:22 Speaker 2: Janna, thanks so much for joining us. As always Joannaga Diegos partner at Bond Blocks. They've dot in fixed income ETA for pretty much every way to slice and dice the bond market. We appreciate get a few minutes, so Joinna's time. 00:27:34 Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast, available on Apple, Spotify, and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live each weekday, seven to ten am Easter and on Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business app. You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube and always on the Bloomberg terminal. 00:28:00 Speaker 7: Reason not