1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:11,480 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Last Monday, McKenzie Lewick's family 2 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:14,320 Speaker 1: says she landed at the Salt Lake City International Airport 3 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 1: after attending her grandmother's funeral in California. She took a 4 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,439 Speaker 1: lift from the airport to an address in North Salt Lake. 5 00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: Her family and friends say since then, the twenty three 6 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:25,480 Speaker 1: year old hasn't been seen or heard from it. I've 7 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:29,159 Speaker 1: never met a person that doesn't like McKenzie. She is 8 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:33,519 Speaker 1: the sweetest and most genuine. Julianna Cowley says she has 9 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:37,160 Speaker 1: felt lost ever since her best friend McKenzie Lewick disappeared 10 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 1: the Paramedic College at the University of Utah, where Luick 11 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:44,159 Speaker 1: is studying kinesiology. Collie says they hit it off from 12 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: the start. It's not like her to go off the grid, 13 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: and if she did, then she would tell me. Luick 14 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 1: was last heard from around one am on June seventeenth, 15 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 1: when she texted her mom to say her flight landed 16 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: safely at Salt Lake International Airport. From there, police say 17 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 1: she order to lift to an address in North Salt Lake, 18 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 1: but Coley says Louie didn't live in North Salt Lake 19 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 1: and she doesn't know why she went there. Her parents 20 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:12,000 Speaker 1: reported her missing three days later. Our friend from CBS, 21 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: David benode the mystery surrounding the disappearance of a gorgeous, 22 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:21,760 Speaker 1: young co ed McKenzie Luke in the last hours a 23 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:26,080 Speaker 1: major break in the case. McKenzie was met at Hatchpark 24 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:29,399 Speaker 1: by an individual in a vehicle. Police believe she met 25 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 1: with the person at the park Willingly. The making the 26 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:35,200 Speaker 1: model of the car has not been determined. From here 27 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: McKenzie disappeared. Does mackenzie have an alternate phone that she 28 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:43,560 Speaker 1: is used or is using? Who did McKenzie meet in 29 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 1: North Salt Lake City? Does mackenzie have any social media accounts? 30 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:51,200 Speaker 1: We don't know about. One more question police are trying 31 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 1: to answer, does she want to be found? She hasked 32 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 1: no obligation to call the police department or anyone else, 33 00:01:56,640 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 1: and saying here's where I went. Chris Burbank is a 34 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 1: former Salt Lake City cheap He says police are doing 35 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: the right thing, calling Lewick missing, but not necessarily in 36 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 1: danger and in the circumstance it would certainly be tragic 37 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 1: if this young woman is in fact in danger and 38 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: we didn't do enough. Our friend at Fox's thirteen mc McDonald. 39 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 1: This young student, just twenty three years old, a nursing 40 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:27,640 Speaker 1: student goes missing, and it seemed totally out of character 41 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 1: because this young girl, Mackenzie Luke even texts her mom 42 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:34,799 Speaker 1: when she touches down at the airport. Video surveillance from 43 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:38,519 Speaker 1: the airport showing her after she's off her playing getting 44 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:44,760 Speaker 1: her luggage, leaving the airport, and she's texting somebody very 45 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 1: very significant. Then the next player in this scenario is 46 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:52,920 Speaker 1: a lift driver at the gate go This all seemed 47 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: very unusual to me. The lift driver divulges. He takes 48 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: her to a park at three o'clock in the morning. 49 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: Her flight got in super late. By the time she 50 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,079 Speaker 1: gets her luggage is way past one o'clock. But why 51 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: drop her off at a park? Joining me right now 52 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:17,600 Speaker 1: All Star Panel Telecommunications expert ben Levitan at ben Levitan 53 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:22,399 Speaker 1: dot com, Forensics expert Joseph Scott Morgan, New York psychologist 54 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: at Karen Stark dot com, Karen Stark trial lawyer, author 55 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:31,160 Speaker 1: of red Flags on Amazon, Wendy Patrick, commander of the 56 00:03:31,280 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: Cajun Coast Research and Rescue Tony Wade, and joining me 57 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 1: right now, Crime online dot com investigative reporter Dave mac 58 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: Dave explained to me about the lift driver because he 59 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 1: says that he drops her all basically at an open 60 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 1: field at three o'clock in the morning. Dave, the lift 61 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 1: driver takes her to the park and says that she 62 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: got out of his car and that she was greeted 63 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: by another person. She didn't seem to be stressed out 64 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 1: and anyway, didn't seem to be concerned about anything. They 65 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: greeted one another as if they knew one another, and 66 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:08,360 Speaker 1: she got in the car and left. Okay, Now, right 67 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:10,800 Speaker 1: there at the get go, it defies common sense to 68 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: me that anybody wants to be let off at a 69 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 1: park at three o'clock in the morning. Joining me right 70 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:23,359 Speaker 1: now out of Raleigh telecommunications expert renowned expert Ben Levitan 71 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:27,040 Speaker 1: at ben levitan dot com. Ben, how can we track 72 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: whether the lift driver was telling the truth? Well, this 73 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,840 Speaker 1: is just easy because your phone and the lift driver's 74 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 1: phone both have GPS in it. When you order a lift, 75 00:04:39,040 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: your locations get stored at the lift server in Tan Francisco, 76 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:48,120 Speaker 1: and that's the way lift should assure that their drivers 77 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:50,839 Speaker 1: are affecting a lot of people. That the software allowed 78 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 1: the driver to be located, so we have confidence that 79 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 1: if we're going to lift it was independent in this 80 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 1: and talk to them. They can give us a track 81 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:05,480 Speaker 1: of both these people until she was dropped off, probably 82 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:08,919 Speaker 1: within thirty feet, Nancy, we know where she was dropped off. Okay, 83 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: ben Levitant, let me understand this. Every time I order 84 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 1: a lift or an uber, what I write into the 85 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:20,560 Speaker 1: two boxes A my pickup, B where I want to 86 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 1: get dropped off, that's being stored somewhere out there in 87 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: the cloud. Yeah, that's what lifts businesses. They have a 88 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: server in San Francisco and when you put in your 89 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:39,160 Speaker 1: when you put your pickup location, it knows automatically the 90 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 1: exact location of every one of its drivers, and the 91 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 1: driver that's closest to you will come pick you up. 92 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:51,039 Speaker 1: Now for business, you know the way this works. Lift 93 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:54,360 Speaker 1: will know exactly where you are when you're picked up, 94 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: and although where you dropped they kept a record of 95 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 1: where she was until they dropped her off in Hatch Park, 96 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 1: and they probably know where they dropped her off within 97 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:10,960 Speaker 1: thirty feet, napteen, within thirty feet. And here's another thing 98 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,160 Speaker 1: with me telecommunications expert out of Raleigh being lift hand 99 00:06:14,440 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 1: ben how quickly, And we're not dealing with the phone 100 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:21,560 Speaker 1: company that drags it out forever. You got to go 101 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: with a subpoena. They've got a process that it's got 102 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:27,240 Speaker 1: to go through corporate blah blah blah. When you're talking 103 00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: about lift or Uber or another ride service, how long 104 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: does it take to get that info? And one more thing, Well, 105 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 1: I'm thinking about it. You say they know where their 106 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:38,080 Speaker 1: driver is at all times? What is it like a 107 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:40,599 Speaker 1: video game? They can see the movement of the driver. 108 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:44,880 Speaker 1: Just about That's how video games work. Basically, your phone, 109 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:48,600 Speaker 1: your phone is a tracking device and as long as 110 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:51,720 Speaker 1: your feeding information back to lift us to your location, 111 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:54,919 Speaker 1: which they are doing when they're being picked up and 112 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:59,800 Speaker 1: dropped off. Yes, you can sit at the left location 113 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:04,080 Speaker 1: or insulation, just like a big video game. That's exactly 114 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:08,240 Speaker 1: how Because Wendy Patrick trial lawyer joining me out of 115 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 1: California and author of Red Flags. You can find it 116 00:07:11,160 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: on Amazon, Wendy Patrick. When we're dealing with a phone company, 117 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 1: like hey, let's triangulate their cell phone. Let's find out 118 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:20,800 Speaker 1: where they were last on the phone, like we're doing 119 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:24,239 Speaker 1: in Kelsey Barres's case. You know, Patrick, frazy the killer 120 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:28,360 Speaker 1: fiancee allegedly, we're trying trying to find out where her 121 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:33,440 Speaker 1: phone went, and it took forever, Wendy Patrick. Why could 122 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 1: they get this out of the lift within seventy two 123 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:39,320 Speaker 1: hours and it takes days and days and days to 124 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,320 Speaker 1: get it from the phone company, Wendy, Isn't that a 125 00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 1: great question, Nancy? That's the ban of our existence as prosecutors, 126 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 1: is trying to figure out how we can get the 127 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,760 Speaker 1: forensic evidence we need the quickest. You know, Nancy, you 128 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 1: and I remember back in the day when we didn't 129 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 1: have this type of technology and it was virtually impossible 130 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:58,239 Speaker 1: to track people to the extent that we can today. 131 00:07:58,520 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 1: But that's the angeled question. Why does cooperation seem to 132 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 1: be so easier I should say easier in some instances 133 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: than others. I don't know, but that's one of the 134 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 1: questions that I'm sure is going to be answered, along 135 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 1: with so many others that are outstanding about this case. Well, 136 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 1: another thing that you're talking about, Wendy Patrick, you know, 137 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: to hey, with the prosecutor, I'm talking about maybe saving 138 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: somebody's life, because by the time the prosecutors typically on it, 139 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:27,160 Speaker 1: it's any been investigated and dieted, and it's going to 140 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 1: a jury, or at least a grand jury, and I'm 141 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 1: talking about saving the girl's life. We need the information 142 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:40,680 Speaker 1: right now. So okay to you joining me, renowned guests, 143 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 1: the commander of the Cajun Coast Research and Rescue, Tony Wade. 144 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 1: You've been on so many searches I can't even count them. 145 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: We are talking about this young girl, Mackenzie Luke, and 146 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:57,959 Speaker 1: I would never have thought it, but apparently it doesn't 147 00:08:57,960 --> 00:08:59,520 Speaker 1: make sense to me. You want to get dropped off 148 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:02,320 Speaker 1: in an open park at three am? But he's telling 149 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 1: the truth. So then what do you do? You go 150 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:08,400 Speaker 1: to the park and what do you do? Well, you know, 151 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:10,959 Speaker 1: the first thing we want to do is it clear 152 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:13,560 Speaker 1: that part to make sure that she is not in 153 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,680 Speaker 1: the surrounding miles. Uh. You know, he's saying that that 154 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:20,319 Speaker 1: another vehicle picked her up, So in a search standpoint, 155 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 1: that that that kind of throw us a lot of 156 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:24,960 Speaker 1: problems because you know, now, now we have an information 157 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: that that she probably left the park, where do you 158 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:32,239 Speaker 1: go next to to even attempt to search for um? 159 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: You know, there's there's a whole lot of holes in 160 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:38,439 Speaker 1: a story that's coming out almost daily right now. So 161 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:40,720 Speaker 1: you know, as far as the search standpoint you have, 162 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 1: you just don't have any idea of where do you 163 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 1: even start at? Dang okay now, and Tony Wade, the 164 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:48,240 Speaker 1: commander of the Cajun Coast Research and Rescue says, you 165 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 1: don't know where to start. That's the truth. You don't 166 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:53,880 Speaker 1: know where to start. They're left there at that park. 167 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 1: But in the last hours a stunning break in the 168 00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 1: case climb stories with Nancy Grace. Investigations confirmed that on 169 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 1: June seventeenth, McKinsey departed a plane at the Salt Lake 170 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:25,280 Speaker 1: City Airport at approximately two am. McKinsey obtained a ride 171 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 1: via Transport Services to the destination of Hatch Park, located 172 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,959 Speaker 1: in North Salt Lake City. McKenzie was dropped off by 173 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: the Transport services at the Hatch Park, where another individual 174 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: met with her. McKinsey left the park with this individual 175 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:49,199 Speaker 1: at approximately three am on June seventeenth. Investigations were conducted 176 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 1: on McKenzie's phone records, social media and other communications, which 177 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:59,959 Speaker 1: showed that all communications ceased from McKenzie at three am 178 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:04,720 Speaker 1: in June seventeenth, Joining me right now. Forensics expert Professor Forensics, 179 00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University. Order of Blood Beneath My Feet on 180 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:13,199 Speaker 1: Amazon Joseph Scott Morgan in the last hours of major 181 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:15,679 Speaker 1: break in the case of the search for a beautiful 182 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:20,439 Speaker 1: young nursing student. Mackenzie Luke just got Morgan. What does 183 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 1: this mean to you as a forensics expert that all 184 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:31,679 Speaker 1: communications ceases at three a m. It gives us an indication, Nancy, 185 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 1: that the shum woman, for whatever reason, has has gone 186 00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:42,240 Speaker 1: completely silent. And what would be the need for that. 187 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:47,679 Speaker 1: It's a scary proposition in this day and age, particularly 188 00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 1: with cell phone devices, where you completely you completely just 189 00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 1: fall off of the grid at that point, Tom, was 190 00:11:56,120 --> 00:12:00,320 Speaker 1: the phone shut off? Was the phone destroyed? And it 191 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: gives us an indication that there might be something malicious 192 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 1: going on here? Well, also to telecommunications expert joining me 193 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:09,720 Speaker 1: out of Raleigh, you can find them at ben Levitan 194 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 1: dot com. Then you also have to look at the 195 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 1: targets pattern. I try to go long stretches of time 196 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:22,840 Speaker 1: when I'm around the twins without getting on my cell 197 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:27,840 Speaker 1: phone or consulting it or looking at it. And I 198 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:30,760 Speaker 1: do that on purpose so they're not exposed to Mommy 199 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 1: constantly putting the cell phone before them. So other people 200 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 1: don't have that concern and they're on the phone all 201 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 1: the time. What do I explain why someone's patterns are important. Well, 202 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 1: that's really good, dancy. If we by the way, LIFT 203 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:54,960 Speaker 1: has an exigent of situation platform set up. If you 204 00:12:55,120 --> 00:13:00,920 Speaker 1: have an emergency, LIFT will assist immediately. Guys, we're asking 205 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 1: why is it so hard? Every stuff on the company 206 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 1: has a place where you can go into a true emergency. 207 00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:11,319 Speaker 1: But what your point is, we want to look at 208 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: her history and say, find out has she been to 209 00:13:14,679 --> 00:13:18,320 Speaker 1: this park before? Is this a regular meeting place? If 210 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 1: it is, that gives us a good possibility that other 211 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:25,360 Speaker 1: people know where she is, or a matter at the park, 212 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:28,679 Speaker 1: or they're other witnesses. I was thinking among the lines 213 00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 1: of the fact that all I mean typically with me anyway, 214 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:36,720 Speaker 1: at three am, all my communications have ceased. Okay, because 215 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:41,959 Speaker 1: I am asleep. I hope I'm hearing a lot of echo. 216 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:44,680 Speaker 1: You have got to mute everybody because it is really 217 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:48,680 Speaker 1: messing us up. Mute everything while I'm talking, because I'm 218 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 1: hearing myself in my ear talking back. I'm going to 219 00:13:51,320 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 1: say that again. Well, another issue, and what I was 220 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: driving at is at three am. You would expect most 221 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 1: people's communications online too, you have ceased. So what's interesting 222 00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 1: to me when they say all her social media ended 223 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 1: at three am, it means it didn't pick up the 224 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:11,560 Speaker 1: next morning. I mean, it's very clear if this was 225 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 1: a young woman that stayed on her phone all the time, 226 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: which I think she did, and then suddenly nothing, it's 227 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:24,280 Speaker 1: very very telling. A couple of days go by and 228 00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: then this so far missing Mackenzie Lewis's cell phone has 229 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: not been recovered. Rather eerie. Her Instagram account suddenly showed activity. 230 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 1: Her account started following another one, and as we see 231 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 1: so often in these cases nowadays, a missing person's digital 232 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: footprint becomes so critical, okay to Dave Matt Crime online 233 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 1: dot Com investigative reporters. So she goes missing day's past 234 00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 1: and then suddenly she starts following another account. In other words, 235 00:14:55,880 --> 00:15:00,960 Speaker 1: her account becomes active even though she's missing. What did 236 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:03,480 Speaker 1: that mean to police? Dave mac You know, Nancy, it 237 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: meant that either somebody had her phone and was using it, 238 00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 1: or she was not missing as much as they thought. 239 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 1: You know, early on they said, look, she's an adult, 240 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 1: she can go away without people being, you know, being 241 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 1: told where she is. It's just out of character. So 242 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 1: her family and friends got real excited when that Instagram 243 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: thing popped up. They're like, hey, wait a minute, who's 244 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:26,320 Speaker 1: got the phone? Where is she? You know in her 245 00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:31,560 Speaker 1: social media accounts. Certainly there is an indication there as 246 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:34,560 Speaker 1: to who picked her up. We've established the lift driver 247 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: was telling the truth. Karen start joining me, New York psychologist. 248 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: You can find her at Karen dot com. It all 249 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 1: seemed out of the ordinary to me, because this is 250 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: a girl that actually texted her mother when she landed 251 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: late at night on a late night flight. And it 252 00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 1: just seemed inconsistent to me that this girl would then 253 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:58,640 Speaker 1: go and get out of a lift car at a 254 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:01,200 Speaker 1: public park and up in the car with somebody else. 255 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 1: It does that sounds inconsistent. It doesn't fit her personality 256 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:09,360 Speaker 1: at all, Nancy. She doesn't sound like she's very impressionable 257 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 1: that all of a sudden she would meet somebody and say, 258 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 1: why don't you meet me at this place? Back to 259 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 1: ben Levitan, telecommunications expert out of Rali. Ben, as much 260 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: as we know about the lift procedure, you know where 261 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 1: you get picked up, you know where you get dropped off, 262 00:16:27,040 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 1: they can follow the lift driver's car like it's a 263 00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 1: video game. What about social media? I mean, can't they 264 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 1: figure out couldn't they figure out who she was meeting 265 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:41,240 Speaker 1: in that part? I mean she had to do make 266 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:44,400 Speaker 1: a cell phone call, a text and emails something to 267 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: get picked up there. Well, actually, Nancy, it could be 268 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 1: even easier than that. It's three in the morning, Like 269 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:54,440 Speaker 1: you said, your cell phone company connection to a cell 270 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: powered dum of the tower that covers hatch part. That 271 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,200 Speaker 1: would give you a list of every phone number that 272 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:06,400 Speaker 1: was connected to that cell tower in that part the organance, 273 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 1: and that couldn't be that many. Okay, wait a minute, 274 00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:11,160 Speaker 1: Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait tell me again, 275 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:14,960 Speaker 1: cell towered dump? What is in slowdown for me? Okay, 276 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:20,000 Speaker 1: So when you are using yourself, when you are connected 277 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 1: to the closest cell tower at all times, and the 278 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 1: phone company knows has a list of every cell tower 279 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:33,480 Speaker 1: that is connected to it at any given time, of course, 280 00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 1: because if they want to send you a call, they 281 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,480 Speaker 1: have to know where you are. So at three in 282 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 1: the morning, how many people could possibly be connected to 283 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: the cell tower it hatched park? Very few? If the 284 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 1: police go request a cell towered dump. In other words, 285 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:55,280 Speaker 1: please dump for me a list of all the phones 286 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:01,880 Speaker 1: that were connected to this cell power between say two 287 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:05,000 Speaker 1: and four in the morning. You'd probably get a list 288 00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 1: of two dozen people, and you'd have an automatic list 289 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:13,520 Speaker 1: of suspects and automatical list of possible witnesses. You know, 290 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 1: I've been talking about doing that in the Missy Beavers 291 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:21,520 Speaker 1: mom murdered inside a church in Midlothian, Texas forever and 292 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:23,879 Speaker 1: I've got a funny feeling they have not done it. 293 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 1: A cell tower dump Bill Levitant's talking about. And then 294 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 1: out of the blue, take a listen to our friends 295 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:36,520 Speaker 1: at Fox thirteen City Police. And a lot of digging 296 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:39,520 Speaker 1: in that backyard. There were canines that were brought in. 297 00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 1: We're not sure if those were cadaver dogs or not, 298 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:44,359 Speaker 1: or whether they hit on anything. Chief wouldn't say, but 299 00:18:44,440 --> 00:18:45,959 Speaker 1: we do know that there was a lot of digging. 300 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 1: And then this morning we actually witnessed the vehicle that 301 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:51,800 Speaker 1: belongs to the State Medical Examiner that was at the 302 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:55,480 Speaker 1: home and then left about five am. Typically those are 303 00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:58,119 Speaker 1: not called to a seen unless there is evidence of 304 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,320 Speaker 1: a body there or some sort of human remains, but 305 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,199 Speaker 1: they were there the chief would not confirm withhether or 306 00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:06,000 Speaker 1: not anything of that nature was found at the host 307 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:22,080 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. The local contractor has come 308 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:24,639 Speaker 1: forward claiming a Jah he asked him in April to 309 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 1: build a soundproof hid in room behind his secret door 310 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:31,200 Speaker 1: at the house. Never I've never ever had anybody asked 311 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,280 Speaker 1: me anything like this. After he turned down the job, 312 00:19:34,520 --> 00:19:38,560 Speaker 1: a Ja, he persisted making repeated requests through texts, and 313 00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: he was adamant about getting it done really fast, and 314 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 1: money was no object and he just needed to get 315 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 1: it done before his girlfriend came into town. Police say 316 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 1: Mackenzie Lewick met a Jah he had a local Salt 317 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 1: Lake City park at three am June seventeenth. From there, 318 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,399 Speaker 1: police believe a Jah. He then took her to his home. 319 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 1: The next day, neighbors reported a large fire coming from 320 00:19:57,560 --> 00:20:02,560 Speaker 1: the backyard. Wow. Literally overnight, this happens. I gotta tell 321 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:07,639 Speaker 1: you something, asking for a soundproof room to be built 322 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:11,920 Speaker 1: behind a secret door. Welcome back, everybody, Ainency Grace, this 323 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,760 Speaker 1: is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. In 324 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:19,200 Speaker 1: the last hour. Stunning developments rapidly unfold in the case 325 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:23,920 Speaker 1: of a missing nursing student. McKenzie Luke last seen at 326 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:27,360 Speaker 1: an open park around three am in the morning when 327 00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 1: a lift driver drops her off and that has been 328 00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 1: confirmed and she gets into the car of another person. 329 00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 1: The search is on and then suddenly we hear about 330 00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:40,200 Speaker 1: a contractor describing a soundproof room behind a secret door 331 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:44,840 Speaker 1: that he, by the way, refused to build. To Dave 332 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 1: Matt Crime online dot Com investigator reporter, the secret soundproof room, 333 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 1: what were the specifications for that? What did the guy 334 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:57,240 Speaker 1: want in the room? You know, the guy that he 335 00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: called was actually just a drywall contractor. For the most part. 336 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: He actually wanted it to be built in such a 337 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,160 Speaker 1: way that it was about four foot by eight foot 338 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:08,440 Speaker 1: and just a little bit bigger than a walk in closet. 339 00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:10,760 Speaker 1: But he wanted there to be a special entry where 340 00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:13,800 Speaker 1: you had to use like your thumb imprint to enter, 341 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,160 Speaker 1: so the only person that could open that door would 342 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,160 Speaker 1: be the POI and he could use it them. Then 343 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:23,880 Speaker 1: inside the room, he wanted soundproofing. And when the contractor said, dude, 344 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:25,639 Speaker 1: why do you want it like this is awful small, 345 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 1: he said, well, I'm gonna put wine racks. He wanted. 346 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,439 Speaker 1: He wanted these big hooks, big nasty hooks. To be 347 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,080 Speaker 1: put up about eight feet up off the ground, and 348 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:34,680 Speaker 1: he's like, why do you want hooks up that high? 349 00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:37,000 Speaker 1: And he said, oh, I'm gonna I'm gonna hang wine racks. 350 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:38,719 Speaker 1: And he goes said, why do you need to be soundproof? 351 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:40,680 Speaker 1: He said, I'm gonna listen to my music down here 352 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 1: really loud. Okay, you know, maybe I've been in the 353 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:48,440 Speaker 1: business too long. But to Windy Patrick, renowned trial attorney 354 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:51,520 Speaker 1: out of California, author of red Flags on Amazon, Windy, 355 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,760 Speaker 1: I mean I could hear somebody like defense attorney Mark 356 00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 1: Garrett Goes or some other famed lawyers saying, hey to 357 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 1: each his own to wait here if he has a 358 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:03,359 Speaker 1: sound prey for ram with hooks across the top. Yeah, 359 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,080 Speaker 1: I disagreed. I think a jury would too. Yeah, Nancy, 360 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:08,399 Speaker 1: we duly type of frit flags. Well, I suppose this 361 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,040 Speaker 1: is one of them. It's kind of like the case 362 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: where you have somebody going to a hardware store and 363 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 1: buying duct tape and uh and wire and types of 364 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:18,160 Speaker 1: things that could be used in a murder. Butt could 365 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 1: all okay, white white, white, Windy Windy plays, let's complete 366 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 1: the list. Duct tape, wire, a tarp uh, you know, 367 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:30,080 Speaker 1: cleaning supplies. You know you yet don't have all that 368 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,919 Speaker 1: to complete your murder. And it never fails that they 369 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: go straight to home deep I were lows, and they 370 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 1: get caught on video camera buying at all with their 371 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:40,520 Speaker 1: credit card. Okay, go ahead, Well here's there's what else 372 00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:42,520 Speaker 1: is similar, Nancy. Not only do you have the complete 373 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:44,959 Speaker 1: murder shopping list at home depot. Okay, I'll give you that, 374 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,080 Speaker 1: but you also have the fact that, like you say, 375 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,920 Speaker 1: a defender, a defense attorney could come back and say, hey, look, 376 00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:53,600 Speaker 1: there could be an innocent explanation for all of these 377 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:58,119 Speaker 1: incriminating looking items, because they only look incriminating in retrospect. Nonetheless, 378 00:22:58,160 --> 00:22:59,920 Speaker 1: the fact that, and you wonder whether there's more to 379 00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 1: the story, but the fact that this contractor refused to 380 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:06,640 Speaker 1: participate in the building and construction of that room, that 381 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:09,520 Speaker 1: in and of itself is incredibly telling. By today Matt 382 00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 1: Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, did I just hear 383 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 1: about a fire pit in the backyard? I mean I 384 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 1: haven't heard that, says Stephen Avery. Murder Theresa haulback and 385 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:26,199 Speaker 1: then became a media darling with Netflix, making a murderer unbelievable. 386 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:28,760 Speaker 1: You're right, Nancy. And actually it was interesting in the 387 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,720 Speaker 1: investigation turned on this. You know, we didn't even hear 388 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,120 Speaker 1: about the police and a search warrant until after neighbors 389 00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:37,439 Speaker 1: came forward to journalists and said, hey, we had a 390 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: neighbor over here burning something in the middle of the 391 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:43,119 Speaker 1: night and it was really the stench was horrible. It 392 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: was a description that could only be met with, well, 393 00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: it's got to be a body of some type. And 394 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 1: then the neighbor said that he used gasoline. And we 395 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: all know you don't use a bunch of gasoline to 396 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:54,200 Speaker 1: light a fire in the backyard. You're cook and barbecue. 397 00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:56,320 Speaker 1: But if you want to destroy evidence, well you do that. 398 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:58,640 Speaker 1: So he actually had been burning this in the middle 399 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 1: of the night, and it was so bad that neighbors 400 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:05,000 Speaker 1: actually contacted journalists too. Forensics expert author of Blood Beneath 401 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:07,959 Speaker 1: My Feet on Amazon Joseph Scott Morgan Joe Scott, what 402 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:10,359 Speaker 1: do you make of the gasoline of the stinch? Well, 403 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 1: if you're attempting to get rid of something, many people 404 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 1: labor under this illusion that you can burn it up 405 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 1: with gasoline get rid of it. In this case, maybe 406 00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:21,679 Speaker 1: we might be thinking of a body of some type 407 00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,360 Speaker 1: it takes a lot more than just gasoline, and it's 408 00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:29,679 Speaker 1: gonna smell to be perfectly blunt with you, like a 409 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: barbecue gone bad. It'll create a huge stinch in a 410 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:36,880 Speaker 1: particular area. Keep in mind, this is something that would 411 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: have been completely foreign to all of the neighbors that 412 00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:43,080 Speaker 1: they're smelling the smell. So yeah, it would really grab 413 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,600 Speaker 1: the people in the neighborhood. It would grab their attention 414 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:50,000 Speaker 1: very very quickly. Well, let me be more specific, Joe Scott. 415 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,840 Speaker 1: When I was in New York on nine one one 416 00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:58,600 Speaker 1: September eleven, there was not only the smell of something burning, 417 00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 1: but it was a weird, to my untrained senses, electrical smell. 418 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 1: That's the only way I could describe it. It smell 419 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:12,359 Speaker 1: like somebody was burning wires and electronics. So if you 420 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: burn a human body, what do you smell? The body? 421 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 1: A body will just like if you're thinking of any 422 00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:23,840 Speaker 1: other type of tissue that we might barbecue, for instance, 423 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,439 Speaker 1: it's going to give off that. Okay, I was just 424 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:28,440 Speaker 1: waiting for you to bring in the idea of a 425 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:30,720 Speaker 1: backyard barbecue. I knew it was going to happen. I 426 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 1: was hoping it wouldn't, but you did it, Okay, go ahead, Well, 427 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,679 Speaker 1: it's going to have a very and after this is 428 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,160 Speaker 1: exposed for a protracted period of time where the fire 429 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 1: has continued to build, it will give that charred, horrible 430 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:48,719 Speaker 1: smell that we smell just like with any other severely 431 00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:52,399 Speaker 1: burned piece of tissue. Tony Wade with me, Commander of 432 00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:56,399 Speaker 1: the Cajun Coast Research and Rescue. You've seen it all. 433 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,640 Speaker 1: Do you agree or disagree with Joe Scott Morgan who's 434 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:04,000 Speaker 1: described ribbing the stinch the neighbors must have smelled if 435 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,120 Speaker 1: that backyard fire had anything to do with McKinsey Luke. Yeah, 436 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:08,879 Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's gonna free to smell that that 437 00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 1: it's gonna get everybody's attention whether it or not, whether 438 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:13,679 Speaker 1: it is or not, I mean, it's just gonna be 439 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: it's a unique smell, uh, you know, different than than 440 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 1: any other animal. Humans, human remains have a smell that 441 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,640 Speaker 1: is just all of its own. So I mean it's 442 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 1: it's gonna create some issues and somebody's gonna question it 443 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,240 Speaker 1: because it's gonna smell strange. It's gonna smell bad um, 444 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 1: you know. And on the opposite side of that that 445 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:36,160 Speaker 1: even if you burn the body. Uh you, you can't 446 00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:39,240 Speaker 1: burn it enough to where the dogs in our situation, 447 00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 1: kennars can't pick it up. And we're gonna pick it up. 448 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,680 Speaker 1: We do it all the time in house fires. We're 449 00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:46,080 Speaker 1: going to search and and the dogs still can identify 450 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 1: that source. But it's just going to create a stinch 451 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,880 Speaker 1: that that all the neighbors are gonna know. Um, it's 452 00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:52,399 Speaker 1: just it's not gonna smell good at all. You know, 453 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:56,679 Speaker 1: it's funny as an odd and canny for instance. And 454 00:26:56,720 --> 00:26:59,320 Speaker 1: I was telling the story about the smell after the 455 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:05,040 Speaker 1: attack on the twin towers. I didn't know why it 456 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,119 Speaker 1: smelled that why I could only describe it as something electrical. 457 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 1: I want you to take a listen to police Chief 458 00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:17,520 Speaker 1: Mike Brown. Neighbors informed detectives that they observed him burning 459 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,879 Speaker 1: something in his backyard with the use of gasoline on 460 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:24,639 Speaker 1: the dates of June seventeenth and June eighteenth. The search 461 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:27,560 Speaker 1: warrant resulted in the findings of a fresh dig area 462 00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 1: on his property. A forensic excavation of the burn area 463 00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,120 Speaker 1: was conducted, which resulted in the finding of several chart 464 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: items that were consistent with personal items of McKinsey. Luck. 465 00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,960 Speaker 1: Other chart material was located, which has now been forensically 466 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 1: has been determined to be female human tissue. A DNA 467 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:50,359 Speaker 1: profile of that human tissue was obtained during forensic testing 468 00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:54,080 Speaker 1: by the Utah State Lab. That DNA profile was compared 469 00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 1: and is consistent with the DNA profile obtained through further 470 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:11,440 Speaker 1: forensic testing a personal eye of McKenzie Luck. Investigations in 471 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 1: the McKenzie the communications and data ceased at the time 472 00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:22,400 Speaker 1: of June seventeenth, at approximately three am. Investigation of McKenzie's 473 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:26,679 Speaker 1: phone records show that her last communication were with the 474 00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 1: interview with him. He admitted to having text conversations with 475 00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 1: McKenzie on June sixteenth at approximately six pm, but nothing 476 00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: after that time, that he did not know what McKenzie 477 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 1: looked like, and denied having seen a photo or online 478 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 1: profile of McKenzie, despite having several photos of her and 479 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: the profile photo. The person denied any personal contact with 480 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,680 Speaker 1: McKenzie or meeting with her at any time. So he 481 00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 1: denies any personal contact or meeting with McKenzie at any time. 482 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 1: You were just hearing the assault. Lake City Police Chief 483 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:03,360 Speaker 1: Mike Brown. The guy they're looking at, says he had 484 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 1: no idea what McKenzie even looks like, but then police 485 00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 1: find pictures of McKenzie on his cell phone at all 486 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: comes to a boiling point. It's with heavy heart that 487 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:19,200 Speaker 1: I address you today. After an exhaustive week of investigation, 488 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 1: we are filing charges of aggravated murder, aggravated kidnapping, obstruction 489 00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 1: of justice, and desecration of a body in the homicide 490 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 1: of McKinsey. Luck. The man charged with these horrific and 491 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 1: tragic crimes is the person of interest. Ayola odd to 492 00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 1: say at Chaya, I will not be saying the killer's 493 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:55,400 Speaker 1: name again. Iola Ajaya, the man now arrested in the 494 00:29:55,520 --> 00:30:00,680 Speaker 1: murder of this gorgeous young nursing student, a thirty one 495 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 1: year old former Army IT specialist, an author of a 496 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 1: self published book titled Forge Identity. Let me understand this. 497 00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 1: To Dave Matt Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, is 498 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:22,560 Speaker 1: it true that in his self published book Forge Identity, 499 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 1: victims suffer in a shockingly similar way to McKenzie Luke 500 00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 1: about gruesome murders and the victims being burned alive. That's 501 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,040 Speaker 1: what even makes it worse, Nancy, as we heard the 502 00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:43,720 Speaker 1: evidence of us coming out. You know, they found in 503 00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,920 Speaker 1: the backyard. And yet you're looking at this book where 504 00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,840 Speaker 1: he's actually talking about the ultimate torture of two fifteen 505 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:54,240 Speaker 1: year olds and then burning them alive, not killing them 506 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 1: and burning the remains. We're talking about killing somebody by 507 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:01,000 Speaker 1: burning them. What do we know about this guy? You know, 508 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:06,040 Speaker 1: my nephew is an IT troubleshooter. Yeah, he's brilliant when 509 00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: it comes to all of that. I never know what 510 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 1: he's even talking about. This thirty one year old is 511 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:17,720 Speaker 1: a former Army IT specialist. I mean, hold On ben 512 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:22,360 Speaker 1: Levitan telecommunications expert. What does that mean? An IT specialist? Well, 513 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:26,120 Speaker 1: it could mean a wide variety, thinks. But he hooks 514 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 1: up computers and most programs and that sort of stuff, 515 00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: probably for military applications in the Army, was probably trained 516 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,440 Speaker 1: to do so that would probably be transferable to this, 517 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:40,960 Speaker 1: you know, the civil world. Wow, okay, let me understand 518 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,239 Speaker 1: something else to Karen Start, and boy do I need 519 00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:48,960 Speaker 1: a shrink. Karen Start joining us from Manhattan, well known psychologists. 520 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: You can find her at Karen Start dot com. Karen 521 00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: to write a book about it. I mean, you know, 522 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:58,400 Speaker 1: other than my nonfictions of regarding the crime and the 523 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: criminal justice system. I write murder mysteries. I try my 524 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:06,240 Speaker 1: best to turn them into movies for Hallmark. Long story short, 525 00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:11,280 Speaker 1: I doubt seriously if I'm ever going to use any 526 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: of my made up imaginary plots on real people, although 527 00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 1: my husband did get a little nervous when we were 528 00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:20,920 Speaker 1: at Gatorland with children. But what does it mean that 529 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:26,400 Speaker 1: it's in the book and then police believed he kills 530 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 1: Mackenzie Luke the same way as forge identity. It means 531 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 1: he's a psychopathmatic, which says that unlike you or anyone 532 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,560 Speaker 1: else who would write a murder mystery, this is a 533 00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:43,760 Speaker 1: fantasy that was inside this guy's head. If you look 534 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:47,520 Speaker 1: in that book and you read about anything gruesome or tortuous, 535 00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,800 Speaker 1: he's been dreaming about it, fantasizing about it, and then 536 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:56,600 Speaker 1: he finally gets this opportunity, unfortunately, to do it with McKenzie. 537 00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,840 Speaker 1: So he's enacting something that he's been wanting to do 538 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:04,400 Speaker 1: for a very long time. It gives him pleasure, I mean, 539 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,800 Speaker 1: good grief. He's got one of a soundproof room with 540 00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 1: hooks at the top that he could only get in 541 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:15,000 Speaker 1: with his fingerprint fingerprint identification to open the door. He's 542 00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 1: writing books publishing them. That's pretty bold about murder the 543 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:26,160 Speaker 1: same way we believe McKenzie was murdered to Tony Wade, 544 00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:30,040 Speaker 1: commander of the Cajun Coacht Research and Rescue Team. Tony, 545 00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:35,040 Speaker 1: you mentioned that your dogs could find a body even 546 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 1: if it had been burned. Let me ask you this. 547 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:41,920 Speaker 1: If he burned her body in the backyard and they 548 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 1: have found female human tissue in the burn pit, what 549 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 1: do you expect to find back their, Tony Wade, and 550 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:50,480 Speaker 1: what have you found in the past when victims have 551 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:54,920 Speaker 1: been burned a lot of times, we're going to find 552 00:33:55,040 --> 00:34:00,000 Speaker 1: some parts of flesh to burn. We're going to find, 553 00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:04,960 Speaker 1: you know, skeletal remains of thus or somebody understands that 554 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: you have to have an extremely high degree of terature 555 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:13,200 Speaker 1: to to actually consume all of the flesh in the body, 556 00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,400 Speaker 1: having to be extremely hot. So you know, we're going 557 00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:19,200 Speaker 1: to find uh, you know, it's gonna look like ash, 558 00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:21,200 Speaker 1: but there's going to be portions of flesh there, and 559 00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:24,279 Speaker 1: then there's gonna skeletal remains. He just got Morgan weight in. 560 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:25,839 Speaker 1: What do you expect to find in a burn pit 561 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 1: when a body's been there. The problem with this guy 562 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:31,600 Speaker 1: needs is the way he went about this apparently is 563 00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:34,879 Speaker 1: that he has used an accelerant like gasoline, and it's 564 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 1: flashed over very quickly. That means that on her body, 565 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,080 Speaker 1: if this gas which I assume that it probably was, 566 00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:43,960 Speaker 1: was poured directly to it, it would flash over, it 567 00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: would burn intense just for a very short period of time. 568 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:49,960 Speaker 1: But as our colleague mentioned, in order to get he 569 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,480 Speaker 1: didn't have that here. So she had enough soft tissue, 570 00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 1: Nancy that in one one source that I'm reading, they 571 00:34:57,120 --> 00:35:00,720 Speaker 1: were able to extract DNA from actually the soft tissue. 572 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:04,719 Speaker 1: That tells me that you very well might find a 573 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:08,279 Speaker 1: cause of death or some indication the cause of death. 574 00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,279 Speaker 1: For instance, if she had been stabbed, you will still 575 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:16,880 Speaker 1: see potentially injuries to the soft tissue with actual wound 576 00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:20,080 Speaker 1: tracks in this area. And also the underlying bone has 577 00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:23,959 Speaker 1: not been disturbed, and currently the organs have not been 578 00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:27,200 Speaker 1: decimated to the point where you couldn't appreciate the trauma. 579 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,120 Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friend at Buck's thirteen. This 580 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 1: is Laurence Steinbrecker. What exactly is it inside this home? 581 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:36,640 Speaker 1: I talked to a woman who was here a couple 582 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 1: of months ago, saying now that she saw something inside 583 00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:43,120 Speaker 1: that she hopes will help police. And I saw the 584 00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:45,520 Speaker 1: images of the house and I was like wow. Tera 585 00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:49,080 Speaker 1: Chatterton immediately recognized this fair Park home. She came to 586 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,479 Speaker 1: clean it back in March. It's just like basic wipe 587 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:53,600 Speaker 1: down of cleaning the house. I talked to him for 588 00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:56,480 Speaker 1: an hour and a half while I was cleaning, so 589 00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:58,800 Speaker 1: he was really nice in play. Now she's in shock 590 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:01,040 Speaker 1: to see the house and the owner part of an 591 00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:04,840 Speaker 1: investigation related to missing University of Utah student Mackenzie Lewick. 592 00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:07,840 Speaker 1: When Tara cleaned the home, she did take note of 593 00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:11,239 Speaker 1: something that she now hopes could help police. That there 594 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,680 Speaker 1: was cameras everywhere in the house. In the master bedroom, 595 00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:18,040 Speaker 1: there was three cameras in there. Okay, cameras in your home. 596 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:21,239 Speaker 1: It's not unusual, especially if you have nanny cams like 597 00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:26,880 Speaker 1: some people me, but Joe Scott Morgan, come on, three 598 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:31,800 Speaker 1: cameras in the bedroom. This goes to this fantasy world 599 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,440 Speaker 1: Karen was speaking of. He's observing things as they go 600 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:39,160 Speaker 1: through And with psychopaths like this, I've worked a number 601 00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:43,160 Speaker 1: of cases involved in serial killers. They like to relive 602 00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:47,120 Speaker 1: these fantastical moments over and over and over again. And 603 00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,760 Speaker 1: as sick and twisted as it is. That's the reality 604 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:53,400 Speaker 1: that the police are dealing with. And if you heard, 605 00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,840 Speaker 1: if you heard in the pressor that chief of police 606 00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,520 Speaker 1: when he made this announcement, he said, I'm not even 607 00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:02,719 Speaker 1: gonna say this guy's name again. I can imagine that 608 00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:05,040 Speaker 1: they've already witnessed some of these things that he did 609 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:10,160 Speaker 1: to this poor woman. Be Levitan, telecommunications expert out of Raleigh, 610 00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:14,760 Speaker 1: how do you retrieve that video from security cams placed 611 00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:17,160 Speaker 1: throughout the home or can you? Oh, I'm sure that 612 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:19,720 Speaker 1: all the sub video is goes back to the server 613 00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:23,080 Speaker 1: in his own homes and all that will be a 614 00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:27,480 Speaker 1: retrievable even if you will raise it forensically. The police 615 00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:29,719 Speaker 1: have the equipment that would be able to retrieve all 616 00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:34,200 Speaker 1: this video and the digital footprint I'm sure also includes 617 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:36,720 Speaker 1: that he uploaded a lot of this to a clown 618 00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:39,800 Speaker 1: as the backup to said generally, what people do? It 619 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:43,279 Speaker 1: just kind of technology. To Dave Mattcrime online dot Com 620 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:46,759 Speaker 1: investigative reporter, what can you tell me about the estranged 621 00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:50,560 Speaker 1: wife of this guy? Well, apparently Nancy. He married a 622 00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: woman with a number of children back in twenty eleven 623 00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:57,560 Speaker 1: in Dallas She says they never consummated the relationship because 624 00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,279 Speaker 1: she was scared of him. Well, she was pregnant when 625 00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:01,839 Speaker 1: they got married, and then she was afraid of him 626 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,880 Speaker 1: after she gave birth to her final little boy. But 627 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: here's the other catch, Nancy. She claims that he was 628 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:10,400 Speaker 1: physically violent with her, that he threatened to beat her, 629 00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:12,759 Speaker 1: he threatened to kill her with a knife, and they 630 00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,040 Speaker 1: actually got into a fight because he wanted to move 631 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,960 Speaker 1: back from Dallas to Salt Lake, where he was from. 632 00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:20,359 Speaker 1: She said in the last time she saw him that 633 00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 1: she actually had to escape from him by jumping out 634 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:26,680 Speaker 1: a window where she damaged attendant in her hand to 635 00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 1: prevent her from being able to work to this day. 636 00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:32,799 Speaker 1: If you have information regarding the disappearance of McKenzie Luke, 637 00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:37,520 Speaker 1: please dial eight zero one seven ninety nine three thousand, 638 00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:41,799 Speaker 1: Repeat eight zero one, seven ninety nine three thousand as 639 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:47,359 Speaker 1: investigators build the case against her alleged killer. Nancy Grace 640 00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:49,840 Speaker 1: Crime Story signing off Goodbye Friend.