Speaker 1: All right, we're back with another episode of Cutting the
Speaker 1: Distance podcast. I'm your host, Dirk Durham, and I'm at
Speaker 1: my good buddy's house here in good old Montanna. This
Speaker 1: friend of mine, we've been we've known each other for
Speaker 1: a while. He's one of my older one of my
Speaker 1: oldest internet friends, if you will, the one and only
Speaker 1: John Gabriel from Apex Advertising. I think we've been buddy
Speaker 1: since like twenty ten somewhere in there.
Speaker 2: Man, it's been a long time for sure, and I'm
Speaker 2: getting old, so I don't remember.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, I was a young buck still am, but
Speaker 1: you still kind of look like a young buck. See's
Speaker 1: gray hairs right here, though, I mean like I'm starting
Speaker 1: to look like you. You like you had a long
Speaker 1: way to go to look. I don't have gray hair.
Speaker 1: I have white hair. Yeah, white.
Speaker 2: Hey, dude, it's filling in though. You know, I didn't
Speaker 2: have any of these until I got married. Yeah, and
Speaker 2: then it just went down. It's all downhill.
Speaker 1: It's all downhill. Yeah, yeah it is, you warned me. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: now I'm a distinguished gentleman with all this white hair.
Speaker 1: First time I've been called a gentleman in my whole life,
Speaker 1: but I'll take it. We'll take it. So John Gabriel,
Speaker 1: you guys, if you follow Phelps on social media, if
Speaker 1: you follow Phelps on YouTube, John's been on some of
Speaker 1: our Elk hunts together. But way back in the day,
Speaker 1: when Phelps was producing some video a video series called Tradition,
Speaker 1: the Traditions in your group, you had a group, you
Speaker 1: had a group name called Anger Mountain Productions. Angry Mountain Productions.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Damp damp Amp, Yeah, that's what we called it.
Speaker 2: But that was way back in the day. But that
Speaker 2: was that was kind of our Phelps when we started
Speaker 2: whole video series, started doing a lot of the video
Speaker 2: stuff for Phelps itself and that was kind of then
Speaker 2: well now it's just all rolled into Phelps. So but
Speaker 2: that that was kind of like back in the day,
Speaker 2: like what started the whole video thing, I think kind
Speaker 2: of on that side. So yeah, Jason didn't really have
Speaker 2: a lot of stuff before that for the brand itself,
Speaker 2: and then we kind of.
Speaker 1: Took off. And now if you dig deep and the
Speaker 1: annals and annals, anals, annuals of of YouTube, you can
Speaker 1: find I mean, if you really want to geek out
Speaker 1: on Jason Phelps, he started. He had a YouTube channel
Speaker 1: called what the heck was it called way Back in
Speaker 1: the Day, Primetime out Time.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, dude, you've got to look this up because
Speaker 2: that was the pre that was the way back.
Speaker 1: Yeah, prime time Outdoors. Guys, you got to look this up.
Speaker 1: I had a good chuckle to myself because Jason Phelps
Speaker 1: in his and and what he was doing back then.
Speaker 1: You know, he's been a YouTube tube star. I mean
Speaker 1: he's a YouTube starlet for years. He was like the
Speaker 1: inventor of you two.
Speaker 2: He basically he was that good god.
Speaker 1: But anyway, and then fast forward a few years and
Speaker 1: John and Jason and I got to share in el
Speaker 1: kunt in New Mexico, which that video lives on Loophol's
Speaker 1: YouTube channel, so check that out. We had an awesome
Speaker 1: hunt in New Mexico, lots of highs, lots of lows,
Speaker 1: but turned out to be a great hunt. We all
Speaker 1: tagged out on beautiful bulls. And then I'm over here
Speaker 1: at his house just lowfoot man. I've been I've been
Speaker 1: elk counting for the last few days, trying to trying
Speaker 1: to kill one in overtime basically, and I'm like, you
Speaker 1: know what, it's time to talk talk shop with with John,
Speaker 1: and John I don't want to get too far ahead.
Speaker 1: So Apex Advertising is the business you own, own and operate.
Speaker 1: Tell us about that first.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So, I mean I've had Apex and since twenty
Speaker 2: end of twenty eleven, I guess twenty twelve somewhere in there, So,
Speaker 2: I mean twelve years ish, and I mean kind of
Speaker 2: actually started with Phelps from day one when he started
Speaker 2: that brand and designed his original logo and was pretty
Speaker 2: much there since Jason started Phelps game calls back in
Speaker 2: the day, done a ton of design work, all his webwork,
Speaker 2: everything obviously until like recent with the whole you know,
Speaker 2: meat eater thing. But yeah, so I own and operate
Speaker 2: Apex Advertising, do a ton of design work in the industry, marketing,
Speaker 2: you know, kind of all jack of all trades a
Speaker 2: little bit, you know when it comes to you know,
Speaker 2: design and web design and vehicle wraps and trade show
Speaker 2: boosts and catalogs. I mean, we've done so much stuff
Speaker 2: with Phelps over the years, and like you know, in
Speaker 2: your Bugler brand, you know, back when you had that
Speaker 2: and like you know, everything there and worked with a
Speaker 2: bunch of companies in the industry and so that's kind
Speaker 2: of been my my bread and butter, and like Forte
Speaker 2: and like, I just absolutely love working and with all
Speaker 2: you guys and working on brands and building them and
Speaker 2: you know, it's it's a passion of mine, you know,
Speaker 2: outside of hunting obviously, which we all share that in
Speaker 2: the whole Elk passion side of things.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean, I've that's what that's what I
Speaker 1: do day in and day out.
Speaker 2: And you're sitting in my office right now and staring
Speaker 2: at at the wall. But uh, yeah, it's it's been good.
Speaker 2: So moved out of Washington and moved to Utah for
Speaker 2: a few years and then here we are in Montana
Speaker 2: now and hopefully I stay here because.
Speaker 1: I don't want to go back to the old Evergreen State.
Speaker 1: But man, yeah, no, I'm a I'm a born and
Speaker 1: raised Idaho native, and I'm jealous as hell that you
Speaker 1: live in Montana. I mean, Idaho at one time had
Speaker 1: some really awesome hunting. They still have a lot of
Speaker 1: really awesome hunting opportunities. But things are changing. There's some
Speaker 1: winds of change blown right now. I think, personally my opinion,
Speaker 1: Montana is still got some pretty awesome opportunities Wyoming has
Speaker 1: got some pretty awesome opportunities, and I feel like i'd
Speaker 1: love to I'd love to live in Montana. I'd love
Speaker 1: to live in Wyoming. What I have going on at home,
Speaker 1: that's probably not gonna allow it. But that's another story
Speaker 1: for another time, right Yeah, But I will say, you know,
Speaker 1: John and I work very closely together on if you've seen,
Speaker 1: if you've bought a Phelps game call, then the packaging.
Speaker 1: John does the package. He builds the artwork for the packaging.
Speaker 1: If you see the logos on the bugle tubes, on
Speaker 1: the diaphragms, John John does all that, He built all that.
Speaker 1: There's some really really big names in the outdoor industry,
Speaker 1: and he's he would probably never tell you unless you
Speaker 1: really if you were a close friend and new him,
Speaker 1: but he does. He does a lot of artwork, t shirts,
Speaker 1: a lot of T shirt designed for a lot of people,
Speaker 1: built some websites for a lot of big names in
Speaker 1: the outdoor industry. So he's the real deal. But that
Speaker 1: kind of overshadows sometimes. I feel like that kind of
Speaker 1: overshadows a little bit of like maybe John's hunting prowess
Speaker 1: because he's not a kind of stand at the top
Speaker 1: of the mountain to say look at me kind of guy.
Speaker 1: He just does what he does. He has a passion
Speaker 1: for elk hunting, he has a passion for mulder hunting,
Speaker 1: passion for whitetail hunting. Has been very successful at it.
Speaker 1: You know. He's one of those guys that kind of
Speaker 1: like they always say like train, but they say train
Speaker 1: in private. You know, train quietly in private, and then
Speaker 1: just and then show up with with what you do
Speaker 1: and then and that's kind of what you do every year.
Speaker 1: It's like you're not like say look at me all
Speaker 1: the time, but damn at the end of season, you've
Speaker 1: got some pretty nice bucks and bulls to show for it.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think, you know, and that's one thing,
Speaker 2: you know. I mean, over the years, I've always just
Speaker 2: kind of like do the homework and put in my
Speaker 2: time and behind the scenes and like what can I
Speaker 2: do to prepare for next year? You know all the time,
Speaker 2: and like that's I'm just always forward thinking. I mean, heck,
Speaker 2: what do we do? We say here tonight and you know,
Speaker 2: we eat dinner together and then it's like we're looking
Speaker 2: at Onyx trying to figure out, like what's our next
Speaker 2: game plan? Here because we've got some deer that are
Speaker 2: coming up, and you know, what's what are we doing?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 2: Where where is this going to fall? And so I
Speaker 2: feel like I'm always kind of going. But it's like
Speaker 2: three hundred and sixty five days a year that I'm
Speaker 2: preparing where you know, it's like you get other guys
Speaker 2: that are in the gym all the time and stuff
Speaker 2: like that, and like I used to be in the
Speaker 2: gym all the time and last couple of years and whatnot.
Speaker 2: Maybe this whole marriage thing, you know, I don't know,
Speaker 2: something like that that that kind of took over. Kylie
Speaker 2: ratted me out at dinner table there to right, but did.
Speaker 2: But I mean I used to spend a lot of
Speaker 2: time in the gym too, like you know, working out
Speaker 2: and feeling like I had to do that to be
Speaker 2: in shape to go be successful. I'm not saying that
Speaker 2: there's not you know, that level to that, you know,
Speaker 2: and still like we still got we do a lot
Speaker 2: of hiking and stuff during the summer and like we're
Speaker 2: in a pack and I feel like that very situational
Speaker 2: preparing the way that you're gonna hunt and is useful,
Speaker 2: you know, y, Yeah, it's key. My dad always said,
Speaker 2: he's like there's no way to get in shape like hiking,
Speaker 2: and so I truly believe that, and so we kind
Speaker 2: of focus more on that now and like being very
Speaker 2: proficient with you know, a bow or a gun or
Speaker 2: like whatever it is, whatever I were hunting with. And
Speaker 2: I feel when I leave the house, I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 2: like I have no question in my mind that it's
Speaker 2: like if I'm gonna shoot it something, I'm gonna kill it,
Speaker 2: you know. And so I don't know, but I do
Speaker 2: a lot of a lot of preparation in the off
Speaker 2: season and kind of all year, and that's just but
Speaker 2: that's one of the things that's like I'm just more
Speaker 2: of like I want to get results for myself and
Speaker 2: show that, like, you know, to myself, Like, hey, when
Speaker 2: I leave the truck come back the end of season,
Speaker 2: it's like I got a tag punched, you know. And
Speaker 2: sometimes it doesn't go smooth, you know. Sometimes you spend
Speaker 2: a lot more time than I think I should be
Speaker 2: out there spending that time to fill that tag. But
Speaker 2: it's kind of, you know, one of those things I
Speaker 2: want to kill a nice animal and make you know,
Speaker 2: sure that I gave it my effort that I feel
Speaker 2: like I'm satisfied and then you know, have something to
Speaker 2: prove to myself. But I don't go necessarily all the time,
Speaker 2: like you know, on social media all the time. I mean,
Speaker 2: I'll post a picture, you know, and be like, hey,
Speaker 2: this is the end result. But I mean there's a
Speaker 2: lot of what you see, like videos and stuff of
Speaker 2: animals in the meantime. You know, it's like I've seen
Speaker 2: or past or had close encounters on and like let go,
Speaker 2: and then I look back, I'm like, shoot, maybe I
Speaker 2: shouldn't have done that, and like, but you know, at
Speaker 2: the end of it, I just I mean, well, I've
Speaker 2: killed a few things. I mean, it's like you see
Speaker 2: my garage and you know, buck hanging here in the office.
Speaker 2: And I really love the white tail thing, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean for years, like eighteen years straight, Like that's
Speaker 2: my passion. I love chasing elk, I love chasing those
Speaker 2: white tails, meal deer two everything. But I really got
Speaker 2: hooked on the white tail thing. And I think we
Speaker 2: kind of hit it off too, because you came from
Speaker 2: a neck of the woods where used to have really
Speaker 2: good white tail hunting, and then my dad hunted that
Speaker 2: country back shoot, what like the nineties, in like that time,
Speaker 2: you know, when it was used to be really good.
Speaker 2: And you grew up in that neck of the woods
Speaker 2: in that era too, when it used to be really good.
Speaker 2: So I think we kind of shared the white tail
Speaker 2: thing in the very beginning, you know, like off the
Speaker 2: bat way back, and you know, that's always kind of
Speaker 2: been a thing. And then you know, obviously the alcoff
Speaker 2: you know, it's been a big part too. But it's
Speaker 2: kind of cool because sit here talking white tails and
Speaker 2: being out in the West, and a lot of guys
Speaker 2: enjoy that to where they're more oh yeah, that's something
Speaker 2: that guys go do in the Midwest, you know, or
Speaker 2: the East Coast, you know, where for us it's like, no, dude,
Speaker 2: these are cool mountain bucks, Like these are special deer
Speaker 2: that we get to go chase. And so I love
Speaker 2: that and I think that's kind of a cool thing.
Speaker 2: And then you know, like get a big old four
Speaker 2: point buck or five point.
Speaker 1: Here what neck of the woods you call it? Here? Okay,
Speaker 1: we have Gabriel count, so everyone's heard of Western count.
Speaker 1: So you just count all the points per Antler, So
Speaker 1: a five you'd have five points on a white tail
Speaker 1: antler on one side, five on the other, that'd be
Speaker 1: a five by five or a five point eastern count.
Speaker 1: They count them as a ten point. Well, the Gabriel's
Speaker 1: they count them as a four point with eye guards.
Speaker 1: They count white tail antler points like you count Muleier points.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, well, if you're no, I've always thought
Speaker 1: we should count Muleier points. It's a it's a four
Speaker 1: by four muleier with eye guards. Well what it should
Speaker 1: be called a five point? It should be a five
Speaker 1: by five. They are total points. Yeah, when you when
Speaker 1: you when you tally like and then and the poor
Speaker 1: Mulder doesn't even get like credit for for the the
Speaker 1: iye guards when it grows them. No, but that's that
Speaker 1: that's a jip man. They got they they got. They
Speaker 1: got kind of screwed on that deal because they grew it.
Speaker 1: Like I'm a firm believer they should get they should
Speaker 1: get credit for everything they credit, I mean everything over
Speaker 1: one inch. Yeah, fair enough, it does. It's a scorable point.
Speaker 2: But I'm just saying if you look at I think
Speaker 2: because you grew up in western Washington, and it's like
Speaker 2: you got the whole black tail, like Elk thing, you know,
Speaker 2: going on over there, mule deer and whatnot. And then
Speaker 2: really we didn't hunt white tails until you go to
Speaker 2: like eastern Washington and like the far east over towards
Speaker 2: your neck.
Speaker 1: The yeah.
Speaker 2: Washington over there, but everyone you know called it like
Speaker 2: a four point you know, it's like a four point
Speaker 2: four point, you know, and like whatever, and so I
Speaker 2: think it's kind of one of those things that it's
Speaker 2: just what I grew up around. So it's like when
Speaker 2: I see a white tail, I'm like looking at the
Speaker 2: main frame and I'm like, oh, it's one two three
Speaker 2: four four on that side. Oh, plus hie guards. But
Speaker 2: it's like blacktails really didn't have iye guards, So then
Speaker 2: it's like you just threw those on his extra.
Speaker 1: So I don't know.
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, technically I get where you're coming from.
Speaker 2: Five point or like a ten pointer or whatever, but yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm just gonna say, you Washington ducks, you guys,
Speaker 1: you guys are some weird ducks. You count Antler's weird anyway.
Speaker 1: So some of the folks in Washington State count elk Antlers.
Speaker 1: They they call like they would call a six point
Speaker 1: bowl or six by six bull they would call it
Speaker 1: a four point bowl with eye guards. Yeah, so I
Speaker 1: can see where. You know, you've got way off track
Speaker 1: from the beginning. I'm like, I think it's just that
Speaker 1: that Washington you know, heritage that we got your thrown
Speaker 1: for a loop and you know, dang it, the rest
Speaker 1: of the world, you know, we count them different.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it doesn't operate qright in the same No. Well,
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, we can blame it on Phelps too,
Speaker 2: because like his neck of the woods out there in
Speaker 2: old pl like they're the ones that they're the ones
Speaker 2: that started that, the Phelps plan to start it probably.
Speaker 1: Is do they even can they even count how many
Speaker 1: fingers and toes they have? I don't even know what
Speaker 1: they got going on many wait till I talk to him.
Speaker 1: We're going mule here. I'm going mule to Alton Phelps
Speaker 1: and here this later this week. So I'm gonna I'm
Speaker 1: gonna give it in his his dad, I think, and
Speaker 1: his un maybe an uncle or two are going to
Speaker 1: be there. So I'm gonna have to give him a
Speaker 1: raft of crap about that. Like all right, all right,
Speaker 1: sit down, we got to hash this out. You guys
Speaker 1: need to like change the world because they obviously you
Speaker 1: guys screwed up on elk Antler count Now the white
Speaker 1: tail Antler Clouts skewed. We gotta get this figured out.
Speaker 1: You got to figure it out. But they're they're definitely
Speaker 1: all skewed over there. I'll tell you that now. I
Speaker 1: get I love give a giant hard time about that. Anyway.
Speaker 1: I haven't done a season recap for twenty twenty three
Speaker 1: yet elk season September boat Archery season ye, And I
Speaker 1: don't know if you've done one yet with anyone. So
Speaker 1: tell us about your September. What was there any overall
Speaker 1: theme of September? Like you kept seeing a certain trend?
Speaker 1: Was it awesome? Was it hit and miss? Was up
Speaker 1: and down? What were you seeing like all September? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And then how did you end up with with with tags? Yeah?
Speaker 2: I know, so you know, I feel like this September.
Speaker 2: So I talked about this last year. Actually, I did
Speaker 2: a podcast with Brian Barney last year and we talked
Speaker 2: about my Montana hunting experience. I have not hunted. I
Speaker 2: take that back. There's two years. I guess I hunted
Speaker 2: the same spot in western Montana where and I think
Speaker 2: you went there one time too that I hunted like
Speaker 2: the same spot twice, Right, But I've every other hunt
Speaker 2: that I've ever done in Montana over the years, and
Speaker 2: every elk that I've killed has always been in a
Speaker 2: different unit. I've never killed elk twice in the same
Speaker 2: unit in Montana. Whoa, They've all been in different units,
Speaker 2: different mountain ranges. Wow, never the same spot.
Speaker 1: That's that's that's an interesting fact, toy. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's I mean it's kind of cool because
Speaker 2: like studying, going to learn a new area, never been there,
Speaker 2: and then you know, kind of take it as a
Speaker 2: challenge and like I'm gonna go fill a tag in
Speaker 2: this new spot that I've never been And I think
Speaker 2: it's kind of one of those things that it's like
Speaker 2: the drive to like explore something new and then just
Speaker 2: keep going and like finding that new way or new area, new.
Speaker 1: Turning over rocks, constantly find a new little things.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like maybe this can be my golden honey
Speaker 2: hole for like the rest of my life.
Speaker 1: You know, I haven't found that yet. But ye is
Speaker 1: greener guy, Yeah, yeah, exactly. I'm like grass is greener
Speaker 1: over there. We're gonna go check that out.
Speaker 2: So this year I put in we drew a tag
Speaker 2: again that we actually had in twenty nineteen, and I was,
Speaker 2: you know, it's tough. Last year Kylie and I drew
Speaker 2: a tag. We had probably the best hunt. I mean,
Speaker 2: I've ever probably gonna have my life, like just a
Speaker 2: number of bulls and like seeing stuff going on. We
Speaker 2: killed those two bulls like forty five seconds apart, and
Speaker 2: my biggest ball I've ever killed. I wanted to go
Speaker 2: back there so bad this year, but I was nervous
Speaker 2: to go back there because I didn't want to try
Speaker 2: to have a repeat of last year and then be
Speaker 2: disappointed in the outcome if if it wasn't right the same,
Speaker 2: those are some big shoes to fill. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 2: and that's the thing. It's like, I mean, where realistically
Speaker 2: are you going to go hunt a unit and it's
Speaker 2: like killing her three to sixty bowl like back to back,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like I'm just being real,
Speaker 2: like it's not in the cards. And so I got
Speaker 2: super nervous. And then my dad and sister kind of
Speaker 2: wanted to hunt with us too this year, and I
Speaker 2: was like, you know what, like let's go. We've hunted
Speaker 2: this other unit before and let's go back there and
Speaker 2: let's go hunt that this year and like see what
Speaker 2: it holds.
Speaker 1: Like we'll just we'll redo it. Sister wasn't with us
Speaker 1: last time.
Speaker 2: It was my dad and Kyle and I and then
Speaker 2: so I was like, well, we'll just go back and
Speaker 2: I kind of you know.
Speaker 1: Okay, back up, what's up? You said, Kyle. Now for
Speaker 1: the listeners that don't know, like our inner circle, John's
Speaker 1: wife's name Kylie, but our friend Charlie who builds the
Speaker 1: a large portion of Philips game called Diaphragms, and the
Speaker 1: when they when when John and Kylie first started dating,
Speaker 1: he made a wisecrack, Kyle, you're dating a guy, but no, no,
Speaker 1: learn how to read dude. It's Kylie. Oh okay, but
Speaker 1: it kind of stuck. So it stuck.
Speaker 2: So Kyle, Kylie became Kyle. So she's one of the bros. Now,
Speaker 2: I guess like maybe that's kind of you know, I
Speaker 2: don't know, so yeah.
Speaker 1: Real culture, real culture. So we lost the E and
Speaker 1: now it's just Kyle.
Speaker 2: So Kyle is always there and so everyone if we
Speaker 2: say Kyle, everyone just knows Kylie. So yeah, so she
Speaker 2: was there before, so you know, we had discussions and whatever, like,
Speaker 2: you know, we had an awesome hunt last time she
Speaker 2: lost a really big bowl. Last time I killed a
Speaker 2: good one. Dad had plenty of opportunities. We're like, let's
Speaker 2: go do it again. Go back there this year, and
Speaker 2: went in the summer, scouted saw bulls, I mean kind
Speaker 2: of all over the place like we did last time,
Speaker 2: and it was like, oh, man, like we're going to
Speaker 2: be in them.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be a great hunt. It's a great hunt,
Speaker 1: Like we're in it. We're going to do it again.
Speaker 2: Of course, I really was striving to try to kill
Speaker 2: another three fifty bowl because I was like, you know,
Speaker 2: just wanted to achieve that number again. Personal goal, like
Speaker 2: didn't have to, but like I wanted just to kill
Speaker 2: another big bowl like that, just to say like I'd
Speaker 2: done it, you know, and like could do it back
Speaker 2: to back, you know. But then I started thinking, even
Speaker 2: in my head, I'm like, man, this isn't even I
Speaker 2: don't even know if this is like realistic, you know,
Speaker 2: like am I putting a number on something that maybe
Speaker 2: I shouldn't versus the experience and so you know it
Speaker 2: kind of I did back up, Like we had numerous
Speaker 2: discussions this summer and I was like, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't know if like I want to
Speaker 2: put the number on the hunt, maybe we should just
Speaker 2: go have a good time and enjoy it.
Speaker 1: Let the cards fall how they may.
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly, like if you get a chance of the
Speaker 2: big one, like we'll get that chance, and like I'll
Speaker 2: take it all day. But I was gonna hunt. I
Speaker 2: only had one Elk tag this year, so I was
Speaker 2: like kind of putting all my eggs in that basket,
Speaker 2: and I was like, I'm gonna spend as many days
Speaker 2: as I need to to.
Speaker 1: Fill that tag.
Speaker 2: And I was like I was determined in a way
Speaker 2: to like hit that number, but at the same time,
Speaker 2: I just had kind of thrown it out and I
Speaker 2: just wanted to like experience elk and get as many
Speaker 2: as encounters as I could to try and learn more
Speaker 2: about elk, you know, like.
Speaker 1: What could I get away with?
Speaker 2: What would the elk be doing, different noises that elk behavior,
Speaker 2: just watching it exit all the crazy crap they do.
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly.
Speaker 2: And I mean I had days I got in on them,
Speaker 2: and I mean I literally had hundreds of elk and
Speaker 2: it was like a couple of different days, but I
Speaker 2: had like one hundred head one day that was just
Speaker 2: peeled off and they're sitting out kind of by himself
Speaker 2: with the bigger herd below and got in the mix.
Speaker 2: I heard more noises and weird elk noises that I mean,
Speaker 2: I wish I would have had someone there to film
Speaker 2: it because the stuff that I heard, and it was like,
Speaker 2: I mean, I feel like I've heard a lot of
Speaker 2: elk noises, but I'm.
Speaker 1: Like, what what are they doing? Like what is that?
Speaker 2: And watching them just interact with each other, you know,
Speaker 2: and like have a cow make a weird noise that
Speaker 2: you know, I'm like, I don't even know what that is.
Speaker 2: But man, that bowl over there is really paying attention,
Speaker 2: like you know, right, and he liked it. And then
Speaker 2: so I'm like, man, maybe if I can mimic kind
Speaker 2: of doing that, you know, I'm like, maybe that'll do something.
Speaker 1: What's crazy about elk vocalizations is herd dynamics and the
Speaker 1: number of elk versus what kind of talking they're doing. Sure,
Speaker 1: I had a lot of Idaho where there's really low
Speaker 1: numbers elk, you know, and a big herd would be
Speaker 1: five or six elk. A lot of times you might
Speaker 1: only see a bowl. He may only have two or
Speaker 1: three cows. You go to a place where there's a
Speaker 1: hundred cows, and and and back to idol they did.
Speaker 1: The cows are not real vocal, they don't talk much.
Speaker 1: They you may not even hear one single mew. You
Speaker 1: go to a herd of one hundred or more, and
Speaker 1: now you've got all these different voices and all these
Speaker 1: different characters saying these all these different vocalizations, and some
Speaker 1: of them are just like that sounds like a guy,
Speaker 1: Like that sounds like a hunter. Yeah, that's a really
Speaker 1: crappy somebody that don't even know how to blow an
Speaker 1: elk call. It's making elk noises, right, and they're trying
Speaker 1: to make an elk noise and you hear it all
Speaker 1: like like I didn't even know elk made a noise,
Speaker 1: Like just like what you're saying. So the herd dynamic
Speaker 1: changes when you have a lot more individual elk talking.
Speaker 2: One hundred percent, Like it changes so much. And I
Speaker 2: think that's the thing. It's like trying to just keep
Speaker 2: all these little things. And you know, it's like I'm
Speaker 2: always learning. I feel like I'm always trying to, you know,
Speaker 2: learning watching videos of people on these ranches or like
Speaker 2: you know, public Land.
Speaker 1: I don't even Cash Park now, yeah, National Park.
Speaker 2: I'm like, just give me, give me the book, like
Speaker 2: let me hear everything so that way I can like
Speaker 2: process all this and store it, you know. And then
Speaker 2: it's like, oh yeah, maybe this one time, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 2: I heard that one weird freaking weird cow or calf noise.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm gonna try that, you know.
Speaker 2: And so just like when we talked about like you
Speaker 2: doing like a bunch of calf noises a couple years ago,
Speaker 2: you know, and you're like, I'm just going to calf
Speaker 2: call season, you know type of thing, and it was like,
Speaker 2: oh yeah, well, like let's tryer, you know, like let's
Speaker 2: see what it does. And so I think it's like
Speaker 2: just processing all that and just really trying to like
Speaker 2: dive in. But this year, I I don't know, it
Speaker 2: was like at first I had this grand thing of
Speaker 2: the number, and then I kind of backed off the number,
Speaker 2: and then it was like experience.
Speaker 1: And then ELK.
Speaker 2: Season hit and it was like, oh boy, like what
Speaker 2: is going on? You know, like this is not what
Speaker 2: I thought it was going to be. Summer seemed great,
Speaker 2: scouting went good, and then it was like just downhill.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It was like we hit rock bottom like the second
Speaker 2: day and I was just like.
Speaker 1: You know, I was like the plane crash.
Speaker 2: It was like we just got thrown in and it
Speaker 2: was like dig your way out of the hole almost,
Speaker 2: you know. And we did see right off the bat,
Speaker 2: uh well, I actually talked about at dinner tonight, and
Speaker 2: we saw that big seven by club weird bowl like
Speaker 2: right off the bat, and I was like, oh man,
Speaker 2: like oughta gave anything to go back and figure out
Speaker 2: a way. Like just when you drive up on one,
Speaker 2: I mean a truck, it's like you're kind of I
Speaker 2: mean not expecting it. And then when you see a
Speaker 2: bowl like that, and it was just kind of like
Speaker 2: you screwed it up from the beginning, like you do
Speaker 2: not get out of the truck. You're not going to
Speaker 2: kill that elk And we went down after him kind
Speaker 2: of got close. I'm marching along way too fast and
Speaker 2: there's a really solid bull standing there and Kyle's yelling
Speaker 2: at me and I didn't hear until it was too late,
Speaker 2: and you know, this bull runs off, spooked off, and
Speaker 2: I was like dang, you know, like it just kind
Speaker 2: of felt like everything kind of like sank right there,
Speaker 2: and I was like, guy, just blew the whole thing.
Speaker 1: And uh.
Speaker 2: But then it was like looking back at that, it
Speaker 2: was kind of like first that was like the first
Speaker 2: day first, and I was just like, man, you know,
Speaker 2: like this can be awesome. And then it just went
Speaker 2: downhill from there. And after it was almost like like
Speaker 2: the plane crashed and it just went and man.
Speaker 1: We spent days and days of trying to even just.
Speaker 2: Like get on elk really and then I took her home,
Speaker 2: got my sister, brought her back with my dad and
Speaker 2: I and we hunted for a week. And I mean
Speaker 2: it was hard. I mean, you know, just normal what
Speaker 2: I think the elk. You hear an elk And it
Speaker 2: was like, oh yeah, let's kay, let's do the game plan.
Speaker 2: Let's sneak in on them. I'll get you guys set
Speaker 2: up up here. I'm gonna sneak back, you know, call
Speaker 2: call it in, you know, doing you know, when they're
Speaker 2: fifty sixty yards ahead of me, like you know, bawl
Speaker 2: is gonna come in, look in there and shooting distance
Speaker 2: do Like nothing went right. It was like I'd even
Speaker 2: back up trying to get more distance, and it was
Speaker 2: like the elk would just like wander off and like
Speaker 2: go the other way type of thing, and they just
Speaker 2: were not respond ontive the calls. I was trying everything.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's like, I'm a big fan of Charlie's call.
Speaker 1: I love that purple Smith's signature, Purple, the purple nurple.
Speaker 2: It's the purple Smith's signature, Purple Smith's signature. It's a
Speaker 2: just it's a super heavy call, but I love it.
Speaker 2: I feel like my cow sounds are like very nasally
Speaker 2: like rich, yeah, rich, Like they're they're good. Like I
Speaker 2: feel like I get a lot of response to them,
Speaker 2: and I could just it was like.
Speaker 1: Nothing was working. So it's like, dude, I was trying
Speaker 1: your call, the Maverick, trying FELP signature, the orange shamp.
Speaker 2: I mean, dude, I was like just all over all
Speaker 2: over just trying to get different noises to try to
Speaker 2: get bulls to like respond, and it just I felt
Speaker 2: like nothing was working.
Speaker 1: It was. And then so finally we did get in
Speaker 1: on some one morning.
Speaker 2: We got out of the truck or hike out just
Speaker 2: a little bit, and I cow called a couple of
Speaker 2: times as bowl rips like, oh yeah, perfect right daylight
Speaker 2: like this one, I just felt right, call this bull in. Unfortunately,
Speaker 2: my sister missed it, and then like thirty minutes later
Speaker 2: calling another bull she and that one was a little
Speaker 2: different scenario, but like she ended up missing that one too,
Speaker 2: you know, and I just was like, oh, I'm like
Speaker 2: sis right now, like I love you. I'm just throwing
Speaker 2: this out there. But I mean, you know, it's just
Speaker 2: like unfortunate circumstances. You know, it wasn't like anything anyone
Speaker 2: really would have done. The first bowl was kind of
Speaker 2: a layup, but like she got excited, and you know,
Speaker 2: that's what it's about.
Speaker 1: It's hard to keep your crap together, especially you know,
Speaker 1: if you don't have a lot of reps with with
Speaker 1: elk right in front of you, I mean, eight hundred
Speaker 1: pound animal bugling, and my cousin Evan says, this thing
Speaker 1: comes screaming in, it's got swords on its head. Yeah,
Speaker 1: trying to want to kill something, right, that's pretty intimidating.
Speaker 1: It is, a lot of folks are exciting. Yeah, it's tough,
Speaker 1: Like that's why we do it.
Speaker 2: That's why we do it though, And I mean, I
Speaker 2: like I love it because I look at her and dude,
Speaker 2: her eyes and everything. I mean it just like she
Speaker 2: is like in La La Land, Like you know, you
Speaker 2: could talk.
Speaker 1: He even know her name. You know. It's cool.
Speaker 2: And I love that experience because not a lot of
Speaker 2: people get that experience in life, you know, and like
Speaker 2: seeing that. And so I looked back though, and I
Speaker 2: was like, man, like that day it was that was
Speaker 2: like the one day I remember what the date was,
Speaker 2: But that day if I was like, oh, things are turning,
Speaker 2: you know, like we finally like we've been grinding, we
Speaker 2: finally got in them. We called in a couple and
Speaker 2: then things went sideways. And then that night I went
Speaker 2: out by myself. My dad and sister they stayed. They
Speaker 2: went out by themself. They were pretty worn out from
Speaker 2: the morning. So I went out by myself that night,
Speaker 2: calling this six point to six yards, and I mean,
Speaker 2: like it was just like perfect god all, I mean,
Speaker 2: I got.
Speaker 1: Out big date was that? Do you remember what was?
Speaker 1: I think it was the.
Speaker 2: Thirteenth, Okay, Like I'm pretty sure I'd have to look
Speaker 2: it was thirteen fourteenth somewhere in there, Okay. So I
Speaker 2: bugled locate this bowl and like just did the hole,
Speaker 2: like cut the distance, get down in on him and
Speaker 2: got super close, and I was like and then all
Speaker 2: of a sudden, I could hear like I got raking,
Speaker 2: you know, like he was raking a tree, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: oh yeah, I'm getting close. So I dropped down below
Speaker 2: him and walking up this ridge and there's like an
Speaker 2: opening where I could shoot, and then there was I
Speaker 2: looked up about fifty yards ahead of me, and I
Speaker 2: seen another opening and I was like, oh, man, if
Speaker 2: I get to that tree, he's got to come down.
Speaker 2: And there's a bunch of big those like skeater type
Speaker 2: juniper bush things, and I was like, he's going to
Speaker 2: have to come down and circle under those and come
Speaker 2: right out. Versus, if I had set up fifty yards
Speaker 2: over here, it was open, like he would have came
Speaker 2: to the edge of that and like probably looked across
Speaker 2: and been like, you know, where is he?
Speaker 1: You know, or where's his cow? Like down here?
Speaker 2: So when I got up here, this bowl would have
Speaker 2: had to come down and like circle that bush and
Speaker 2: walk out broadside, you know, at twenty yards. Just like
Speaker 2: read this scenario, perfect had to win perfect in my
Speaker 2: face and just was right. So I get up there,
Speaker 2: start cal calling, do this thing's Rake and Rake and
Speaker 2: Rake and scream in. I got video on my phone
Speaker 2: and he's just like doing his thing, and I might
Speaker 2: I finally glass him up, and it was just kind
Speaker 2: of one of those things like ah, dang it, you know,
Speaker 2: it's like.
Speaker 1: Not quite really.
Speaker 2: I was like the first night i'd really hunted for
Speaker 2: myself all season, yeah, and I was like, ah, it's
Speaker 2: just not what I want to shoot yet. So lots
Speaker 2: of time, yeah, I thought, you know, yeah, it's like, oh,
Speaker 2: I got lots of time. I got four weeks, Archerie left,
Speaker 2: five weeks whatever that was if it was early, and
Speaker 2: I was just like, I'm not gonna do it.
Speaker 1: So this pole comes down.
Speaker 2: Dude walks right around the bush, I got my phone
Speaker 2: out video, walks right up six yards, stops broadside, and
Speaker 2: he's just like.
Speaker 1: Looking around trying to figure out where I'm at.
Speaker 2: I mean, if it was like if I wanted to
Speaker 2: shoot him, I mean it was like the most perfect
Speaker 2: like bow kill.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it was just like it was easy.
Speaker 2: And uh, of course my first night really hunting for myself,
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, it's too easy, you know.
Speaker 1: My things are turning on. Man, I really got this
Speaker 1: figured out. Yeah, I'm basically the greatest center of the world. Basically.
Speaker 2: I was like yeah, I mean I could smell the
Speaker 2: rich mahogany sitting. I was just like, oh, this is great,
Speaker 2: and so uh, all of a sudden, it kind of
Speaker 2: wins me in turns well. Then it even runs spooks
Speaker 2: and stops. I cow like twenty yards, dude stops the
Speaker 2: other way broadside and it's just looking at that was.
Speaker 1: Like a gift man, Oh yeah from the man upstairs. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you you didn't take it. No, I didn't even
Speaker 1: take it. I know. Thanks. Yeah, I turn my nose
Speaker 1: up at it. Yep, just let it go. Wow.
Speaker 2: But I looked back at that experience though, and I
Speaker 2: was like, man, that was pretty cool.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It was just like one of those things like Elk
Speaker 2: being Elk doing his thing. He totally thought I was
Speaker 2: an Elk and came in and I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: we're on like the next few days, like this is
Speaker 2: gonna be great, and.
Speaker 1: Then it just went downhill. Just like dude, it just
Speaker 1: was not good.
Speaker 2: Went back home, got Kyle, brought her back for her
Speaker 2: week to hunt, and so I was just kind of like,
Speaker 2: you know, I'll spend that week with her, and then
Speaker 2: when she's done, then I'll hunt for myself, like after that.
Speaker 2: So I was trying to get my sister a week,
Speaker 2: get her a week, and then I'll hunt for myself.
Speaker 2: And uh so we hunted with Kyle for that whole
Speaker 2: week and more kind of behind the scenes, you know,
Speaker 2: like we obviously you know, but like we had some
Speaker 2: issues going on like after the fact, but like during
Speaker 2: that time, like she was pregnant and she was really
Speaker 2: struggling with the whole uh like just being tired and
Speaker 2: like didn't you know physically have it to.
Speaker 1: Like hikes taxing when you're pregnant.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like do big long hikes. And usually she'll
Speaker 2: be there by my side. Like if I take off,
Speaker 2: she's there. We're going never have an issue. I don't
Speaker 2: have to worry about her.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It's just like as the guys that can we hunt together,
Speaker 2: like I feel like I know you're going to be there,
Speaker 2: or I know Phelps is there, like or you know whatever,
Speaker 2: I'm behind you if you take off, like we're just
Speaker 2: you just go. And so that's how she usually is
Speaker 2: what it was like it was pretty tough because it was,
Speaker 2: you know, like she just you could tell she was
Speaker 2: just drained every.
Speaker 1: Day, like no matter what we did didn't.
Speaker 2: I mean, I could hike half a mile and I
Speaker 2: felt like I could just look at her and tell like,
Speaker 2: you're struggling, what can I do? But like at the
Speaker 2: same time, I'm like, man, we're not gonna kill an
Speaker 2: elk if you don't get you know, like get after
Speaker 2: it a little bit. So I was pushing her and
Speaker 2: then uh, we had a rainstorm come in, and the
Speaker 2: elk usually turn on in that rain pretty good. And
Speaker 2: we did have like a day like where they kind
Speaker 2: of went nuts and I was like, yeah, this is
Speaker 2: it and just.
Speaker 1: Couldn't get it to work. And then.
Speaker 2: The wind picked up and it was just she just
Speaker 2: kind of had tossed in the towel. Like after that week,
Speaker 2: she's just like I'm done, Like, let's go home.
Speaker 1: I'm over it.
Speaker 2: I was like, you got one evening left, Let's hunt
Speaker 2: tomorrow in the morning and we'll come home. I was like,
Speaker 2: just stick it out, like trust me, just like you know,
Speaker 2: doing that like push it. You got one evening one morning,
Speaker 2: went out that evening driving along park and I'm like
Speaker 2: you know how you do.
Speaker 1: Sometimes.
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm gonna buggle down in this cannyon
Speaker 2: and this looks pretty good. And I rip a bugle
Speaker 2: and I hear this bowl and it was like the
Speaker 2: first bugle it did back, sounded like just a good, solid,
Speaker 2: big bugle. She's back in the truck and like run back.
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, the truck. I'm like, there's a bowl
Speaker 2: like right here, you know, like come on, we're gonna
Speaker 2: kill this thing. She's like I want to hear it,
Speaker 2: you know, and I'm like, you don't even need to
Speaker 2: hear it. She get your boat, you know, like we're
Speaker 2: gonna go. The wind's perfect, well circle, you're gonna kill
Speaker 2: this thing. I want to hear it. And I'm like, okay, fine,
Speaker 2: so I cow call a few times, dude, I mean
Speaker 2: it answered right away, but it sounded like a rag
Speaker 2: like four point bowl. At this point, I just looked
Speaker 2: at her. I'm like, do you want to kill one
Speaker 2: with your bow or not? You know, because I'm like
Speaker 2: this is I mean, it's bow hunting. Get one who cares, like,
Speaker 2: you know, just shoot one with your boat? Do it
Speaker 2: two years in a row, like get it, get another one,
Speaker 2: under your belt with your bow, and so finally talk
Speaker 2: her into it and I'm like, well, we're gonna drive
Speaker 2: back around. We'll get hike got this ridge and the
Speaker 2: wind's perfect. It's a knife, super sharp knife ridge. And
Speaker 2: I was like, I'll get on the back side, you
Speaker 2: get up on top. I'm gonna call that bowl right
Speaker 2: up over the top.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: To me, you're shoot him broadside when he comes up.
Speaker 2: Of course, it doesn't work quite like that, and so
Speaker 2: we end up spend like a half hour. I'm calling
Speaker 2: right like thirty yards behind her, and he's bugling his
Speaker 2: head off, and I'm just like why, you know, in
Speaker 2: my mind, I'm like he sounds close, Like why is
Speaker 2: she not shooting this thing? I don't, you know, I
Speaker 2: can't figure it out. And then I see her she's
Speaker 2: like range and stuff. I'm like kind of looking up
Speaker 2: at her, but I see her like range and stuff,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, why are you not shooting this thing?
Speaker 1: Like what is going on? He's bugling?
Speaker 2: And then pretty he's getting I can tell he's getting
Speaker 2: closer and closer, and I'm like, man, what are you
Speaker 2: waiting for? Like a five yard shot here? You know,
Speaker 2: Like I you know, I I gotta be standing right
Speaker 2: on her. Yeah, that's what I thought, Like I was like,
Speaker 2: that bowl has to be there. Well, she said, the
Speaker 2: whole time, he's got like sixty and it must have
Speaker 2: been the wind blown so hard that like it was
Speaker 2: carrying it where it sounded like he was really close.
Speaker 2: Well then she said he'd eat and lift his head
Speaker 2: bugle back down to eat and like look around eat
Speaker 2: Bugle didn't even care, and he'd just take a step
Speaker 2: and do that all the way up the hill, like
Speaker 2: all the way right to or to like thirty yards.
Speaker 2: And that was kind of like back to like I
Speaker 2: feel how this whole season went where the elk didn't
Speaker 2: really want to come in, they didn't want to commit.
Speaker 1: They didn't they weren't super mad, No, they not at all.
Speaker 2: That's the thing like this bowl find out after I mean,
Speaker 2: I didn't know how big it was and you know whatnot,
Speaker 2: but it's like to me, a bowl, I don't care
Speaker 2: how big it is. If he's alone, no cows, he
Speaker 2: should have came right into the cow calls. Yeah, like
Speaker 2: he should have just like marched. Now it's like, what
Speaker 2: the twentieth Yeah, that was the twentieth or something, I
Speaker 2: think eighteenth or no, nineteenth or twentieth when.
Speaker 1: She got it. Yeah, a bull by himself on the
Speaker 1: twentieth of September should just go bananas for for a
Speaker 1: cow Oh dude, yeah, he should just marched right in. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And so I.
Speaker 2: Couldn't figure it out. And then finally, all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: I'm looking at her and I see her range one
Speaker 2: last time. I see her clip on. I'm like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: like he's got to be right there. And I see
Speaker 2: her drawback and bo goes off and I hear the thud,
Speaker 2: and you know what, I'm like, oh yeah, like she
Speaker 2: hit it. I can't see those so of course, you
Speaker 2: know how you do. I'm like, I hope she figured
Speaker 2: out where she hit that thing. And she turns around,
Speaker 2: looks at me. I'm looking at her and I'm, you know,
Speaker 2: kind of hands in the air, but I'm cow calling,
Speaker 2: you know, trying to just calm him down. And I
Speaker 2: literally look at her look back and she's like, he's down.
Speaker 2: I mean, dude, it was like seconds. Thing ran forty
Speaker 2: six yards and falls over. She double lunged.
Speaker 1: It in ten seconds.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like if yeah, I mean it just like runs
Speaker 2: right over, crashed into the bush, and so I jump
Speaker 2: up and I'm like, you know, say a couple.
Speaker 1: Of choice words, hands in the air, like running towards her.
Speaker 2: But when I first jumped up, I gotta spike it
Speaker 2: like five yards and so like he's he was coming
Speaker 2: over the hill, but he was coming, but I think
Speaker 2: he was standing there the whole time, and she couldn't
Speaker 2: see him because he was kind of in this like
Speaker 2: coolie or this soul like draw.
Speaker 1: He runs. But I walk up and she's like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's not.
Speaker 2: That big, you know, blah blah blah blah blah. And
Speaker 2: so I walk over there and he sees eye guard
Speaker 2: sticking out of the bush. I see his fourth and
Speaker 2: sixth or fifth coming up the top through the tree.
Speaker 2: I'm like, what did you just kill? You know type
Speaker 2: of thing. But I'll be honest, it's like, you know,
Speaker 2: we always talk about like judging a bowl by his bugle,
Speaker 2: and it's like a lot of times I feel like
Speaker 2: you can tell when a bull has just got that
Speaker 2: raspy er bugle, like you know, he's not a young bull,
Speaker 2: but a young bull is not going to bugle like
Speaker 2: a big old bull usually, Like he just isn't going
Speaker 2: to be like a big, nasty like herd bull. But
Speaker 2: this bowl bugled like a freaking rag four point bowl,
Speaker 2: like the whole time. I mean, never like that very
Speaker 2: first bugle I heard, I was like, yeah, that's a
Speaker 2: good bowl. But then after that everything since it was
Speaker 2: like a rag ball. So I thought the whole time
Speaker 2: maybe there was another bowl down there with cows. And
Speaker 2: I was calling in the satellite bowl. When she killed it,
Speaker 2: I was like, holy cow. I was like, that's a
Speaker 2: great bull. I was like, you know, he just didn't
Speaker 2: he wasn't that worked up. He didn't care, he didn't
Speaker 2: want to play the game.
Speaker 1: How big was it?
Speaker 2: Oh, he's three h eight and so I mean, yeah,
Speaker 2: it's a great bowl. I mean, especially for her, you know,
Speaker 2: second archery bowl, Like I mean, that's a stud. I mean,
Speaker 2: you know it took me forever to kill three hundred kill,
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly, And so I mean it's it's just a nice,
Speaker 2: solid bowl. But he's got eighteen inch fronts and I mean,
Speaker 2: like his whole bottom end is just big. And then
Speaker 2: he kind of his beams kind of killed him. But
Speaker 2: he's got everything. Like he's just a solid six.
Speaker 1: Point, nice bull. It's a beautiful bull and so.
Speaker 2: Then we got that, took her home the next day.
Speaker 2: It poured rain for a couple of days and then
Speaker 2: it just went down here. It was just like again
Speaker 2: like I'm like getting into peak season when twenty fourth fifth,
Speaker 2: like it should be Primetime.
Speaker 1: Should be on like Donkey Kong.
Speaker 2: Yeah, bulls just ripping everywhere and I'm literally like glassing
Speaker 2: up bulls standing together, no caws.
Speaker 1: So weird. How do you explain that? I mean, that
Speaker 1: time of year just got it done early.
Speaker 2: Maybe like I don't know if it's that or like
Speaker 2: what happened, but it was like I'm literally like cow
Speaker 2: calling watching a group of bulls stand together and they're
Speaker 2: like no interest, and I'm just like something's going on,
Speaker 2: Like you know, like it's just weird. I think I
Speaker 2: talked to you in the meantime and like you were
Speaker 2: struggling because you were over here staying at my house
Speaker 2: actually like hunting around.
Speaker 1: And.
Speaker 2: Like you were having a hard time even getting bulls
Speaker 2: like you can respond or like you know, weren't here much.
Speaker 2: I feel like other people we talked to were kind
Speaker 2: of having that same scenario.
Speaker 1: All across the West. I talked to guys that hunt
Speaker 1: on the coast an organ that were just like, dude,
Speaker 1: it's been terrible that rut's been bad this year. We
Speaker 1: just haven't heard any bulls like they're they're they're not
Speaker 1: acting right. And Idaho they didn't act right for me.
Speaker 1: In two places in Idaho they didn't act right, and
Speaker 1: and Montana they didn't act right for me. And a
Speaker 1: lot of other folks had the same the same story.
Speaker 1: But then there's also some folks that had a great
Speaker 1: year yeah that said, oh this is my best year.
Speaker 1: I killed a great bull. So it was one of
Speaker 1: those weird years, you know, it's just kind of a
Speaker 1: weird year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was tough, and I think like where I'm hunting,
Speaker 2: it was more open to where you could like glass
Speaker 2: the elk and like see kind of what was going
Speaker 2: on watching herds. I'm like watching elk run and do
Speaker 2: elk things. But it was just like they didn't care
Speaker 2: about normal Like I mean, you get in on them
Speaker 2: and it's like you feel like you could call a
Speaker 2: bowl off or like call a satellite bull in, you know,
Speaker 2: like anything, and they just weren't doing that. So I hunted, man,
Speaker 2: well you left my house, I think, And then I
Speaker 2: stayed a couple of days, and then I left and
Speaker 2: went back and I was over there for like five
Speaker 2: or six more days, and then I finally like, so
Speaker 2: at this point, I've hunted like over three weeks, like
Speaker 2: three and a half weeks, and I was I mean,
Speaker 2: I put punched a time clock, and I mean I
Speaker 2: was out there every day like just going hard. And
Speaker 2: I think we talked and I'm like, man, you know,
Speaker 2: it's like I had that number in my head like
Speaker 2: all season. I was like, I feel like I didn't
Speaker 2: even seen a bowl like of that caliber. I mean
Speaker 2: you know, and so I was like it just not
Speaker 2: even realistic. And then it was like boom, I seen
Speaker 2: him and I got dude. It was just like that.
Speaker 1: Morning when you gave up hope. That's when you've seen
Speaker 1: the when you've seen your Moby Dick.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when he was there, yeah exactly. And I was like,
Speaker 2: it's just in my mind. I was like, it's you know,
Speaker 2: not gonna happen. I heard this bowl bugle snuck in
Speaker 2: on him, come up over this little knoll, and I
Speaker 2: mean here's a six by seven.
Speaker 1: I mean, dude, he is giant.
Speaker 2: I mean he's bigger than a bowl I killed last year,
Speaker 2: like all day, and I'm just like, holy cow, you know,
Speaker 2: and I'm like thinking in my mind, I'm like a
Speaker 2: punch of time clock for like three and a half weeks.
Speaker 2: This is like this is it, you know, I'm and
Speaker 2: I'm just like I'm going to kill this thing, you know.
Speaker 2: And I went in total kill mode, did everything I
Speaker 2: felt like I should have done, was bird.
Speaker 1: Dog in the herd.
Speaker 2: And then I got behind a clump of trees and
Speaker 2: he comes running by and grabs his cow. And had
Speaker 2: I been in the right spot at the right just
Speaker 2: I was in just got caught at the wrong spot
Speaker 2: and he didn't see me, you know. I was there,
Speaker 2: like I just wasn't in the right spot to make
Speaker 2: the shot. Runs by like forty yards and I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: dang it, you know, and so I'm crap. So I
Speaker 2: keep bird dogging him and he's standing there at ninety
Speaker 2: two yards feeding broadside and I'm like, dude, like I
Speaker 2: should just send it and like shoot this bowl. But
Speaker 2: then I'm like that's a giant bowl. I don't want
Speaker 2: to wound him. I don't have something go wrong. That's
Speaker 2: a long shot. Could I hit it all day? But
Speaker 2: I just I don't know, like something in my mind,
Speaker 2: I just was like, I'm not going to take this shot.
Speaker 1: So I didn't. I'm like, I'm gonna get closer. Well,
Speaker 1: then I come through this dip crack a stick.
Speaker 2: I look up and I see this calf and I'm like,
Speaker 2: oh shit, you know, like in my mind, I'm just
Speaker 2: like this is not good. Well, I didn't realize. I
Speaker 2: thought he only had like five six cows and then
Speaker 2: they're en it's being like thirty oh no, and so
Speaker 2: it just was like all of a sudden, the calf
Speaker 2: like spooks and runs out, and the herd and I
Speaker 2: got elk just kind of running. Well, he realizes something's
Speaker 2: not right, picks him up, they all scoot run off.
Speaker 1: He's just ripping bugles.
Speaker 2: But I didn't want to spook because they didn't really
Speaker 2: know what was going on because the calf kind of
Speaker 2: spooked and so it didn't really like alert like a
Speaker 2: bunch of the cows.
Speaker 1: It just was like something's not right. So I let
Speaker 1: him run.
Speaker 2: And then I uh that night saw I was like,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go back there and hunt him in the evening,
Speaker 2: and they didn't end up coming back around a good
Speaker 2: spot to hunt him. The next morning, boom, they were
Speaker 2: there again, and I was just like, oh, round two,
Speaker 2: like I'm gonna kill this bowl had him again and
Speaker 2: it just could not I mean it was just like
Speaker 2: not working, like it's just too open. He's out in
Speaker 2: the middle, like I couldn't get close enough, and so
Speaker 2: I just kind of wrote it off and I ended
Speaker 2: up there's a couple of guys over there that I
Speaker 2: had met when I was hunting and whatnot, and they
Speaker 2: I was asking what they were doing. And you know,
Speaker 2: this Brady guy that you and I had talked about
Speaker 2: a little bit, and he'd kind of been struggling this
Speaker 2: year too, and he actually had a big chunk of
Speaker 2: private that he could hunt, and he was struggling with
Speaker 2: the private and there was no elk on it even
Speaker 2: and usually there, I mean there'll be you know, one
Speaker 2: hundred two hundred head that hang out like on this
Speaker 2: like they weren't even there. And so I ended up
Speaker 2: hunt meeting up with him and hunting, and then we
Speaker 2: ended up getting together and this other guy that he knows,
Speaker 2: and we got on some milk that in the morning,
Speaker 2: it was like last day I had to hunt because
Speaker 2: we were going in for this ultrasound with Kyle on Monday,
Speaker 2: and it was just like, hey, let's just get over here.
Speaker 1: We're going to get above.
Speaker 2: These elk in the field, and we're gonna let him
Speaker 2: like feed up past us, you know, and just do
Speaker 2: the whole ambush thing. And dude, it worked like it
Speaker 2: was perfect. Had the six point come by behind a
Speaker 2: cow and a calf and a spike and got on
Speaker 2: a trail and just let him feed right by, and
Speaker 2: I end up shooting stopping the thing. At fifty one,
Speaker 2: I shoot him and then he runs forward and stands there,
Speaker 2: and then he walks out at fifty seven and shoot
Speaker 2: him again, and it was just like one of those
Speaker 2: things that at that point I was just kind of
Speaker 2: like I didn't care how big it was, Like I
Speaker 2: just wanted to fill a tag with my bow before rifle.
Speaker 1: Season got here.
Speaker 2: And it was October eighth, and I just was kind
Speaker 2: of like, man, I'd punched the time clock, like I
Speaker 2: was just mentally physically like I mean, I had put
Speaker 2: I'd given it, like I felt like everything I have
Speaker 2: at your own yeah yeah, and so I just when
Speaker 2: I mean, it was even better. There was just six point,
Speaker 2: but It was just kind of like one of those
Speaker 2: things that I mean, I knew what they were going
Speaker 2: to do and we had ran back over and gotten
Speaker 2: position when I seen him kind of feeding over this
Speaker 2: other side along this ridge and this kid Cole and
Speaker 2: I and he actually works at ONYX, and we had
Speaker 2: ran over this ridge and got set up and when
Speaker 2: they started feeding, it just it was one of those
Speaker 2: like experience wise, you know that you know, you kind
Speaker 2: of felt like looking at the situation like you knew
Speaker 2: like this is where they're going to go, you know,
Speaker 2: and so like making your best educated guests, you know
Speaker 2: in a sense, but like also kind of years of
Speaker 2: you know, just watching olk and seeing what they do. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was just like we set up in the perfect
Speaker 2: spot and it was just like here they came.
Speaker 1: And so it worked.
Speaker 2: And I mean, had I not had that kind of scenario,
Speaker 2: you know, that morning, like I don't know, maybe I
Speaker 2: wouldn't you know, shot one, Like I don't know, I
Speaker 2: mean if I say that, then that evening we did
Speaker 2: go out and getting a bunch more balls and you
Speaker 2: know whatnot for Brady trying to get him one, and dude,
Speaker 2: we I mean we had elk that night like running
Speaker 2: all over us and like we called in a couple
Speaker 2: of balls and just had bad luck, you know, and
Speaker 2: it just was like it is what it is. And
Speaker 2: so I mean, it's like we still made the best
Speaker 2: of the rest of the day after we got my
Speaker 2: Elk taken care of, but it was just was kind
Speaker 2: of like, dude, that was like the only night really
Speaker 2: the night before, I guess, and then that that day
Speaker 2: was kind.
Speaker 1: Of like October eighth.
Speaker 2: It was like we had Elk doing what Elk normally
Speaker 2: should do and like being able to call him in
Speaker 2: and getting them mad and everything that seemed late late,
Speaker 2: but that was like the only real day. I feel
Speaker 2: like out of the rest of the season, and all
Speaker 2: the days that I punched, I literally had like three
Speaker 2: days maybe that was like Elkie.
Speaker 1: Like you know.
Speaker 2: And so I mean, yeah, I don't know what went
Speaker 2: on this year, but I feel like I put in
Speaker 2: the work. I feel like I punched a time clock.
Speaker 2: I mean, obviously I filled my tag and you know,
Speaker 2: Kyle Fielder tag and whatnot, But dude, it like it
Speaker 2: was not a normal year, and I feel like we
Speaker 2: worked so hard to get those little moments of like
Speaker 2: an encounter.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that was it.
Speaker 2: It was like, and you better capitalize because you may
Speaker 2: only get one shot. Yeah, you may only get one shot.
Speaker 2: I mean, dude, I really didn't have While I say
Speaker 2: that I did have a few more, but like I
Speaker 2: look back at that first Bowl that I let go
Speaker 2: at six yards and you know how many nights like
Speaker 2: I went to bed and I'm like, he wasn't the
Speaker 2: biggest ball, but I'm like, I should.
Speaker 1: Have shot that thing. Yeah, you know, and just like,
Speaker 1: dang it, what did I do? What happened? That's that's
Speaker 1: the that's the trouble with you know, trying to like
Speaker 1: kill that you know, next level mature bowl. It's like, man,
Speaker 1: he passed on some of those, and then they come
Speaker 1: back to haunt you, and then you're like, man, maybe
Speaker 1: I should have sho started second guessing yourself. But in
Speaker 1: the end, it seemed like you had the perfect season.
Speaker 1: You had the highs, you had the lows, you had
Speaker 1: some more highs and lows. But I think that's what
Speaker 1: el cunning is all about. It's just that's almost like
Speaker 1: the perfect season if you to just go in there
Speaker 1: and smoke a giant on the first day or the
Speaker 1: first couple of days, like, would we appreciate like when
Speaker 1: we finally do get like like we do get that giant,
Speaker 1: mature bowl, would we appreciate it as much? I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you, like, you know, I don't think so,
Speaker 2: you know. And like the thing is, I was so funny, dude,
Speaker 2: I killed that elk and I literally like went down
Speaker 2: to it facetimed Kyle, and it was like I had
Speaker 2: more appreciation for that six point it was you know,
Speaker 2: it was like nothing. It wasn't even as big as hers,
Speaker 2: you know. And it's like she usually she gets like
Speaker 2: gives me crap because she's like, oh, yeah, John always
Speaker 2: kills a bigger animal than his wife, you know, like
Speaker 2: type of thing. And I'm just like, no, like it
Speaker 2: just like sometimes how it works out. But I'm like,
Speaker 2: this year, you killed a bigger elk than me. But
Speaker 2: I'm like, dude, I was more proud of that bowl.
Speaker 2: And like when I put the horns up out here
Speaker 2: in the garage and I just was like, I am
Speaker 2: more proud of that freaking elk than the ones hanging
Speaker 2: out here that when you drive in and look at him,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, man, those are impressive. And then it's like, oh,
Speaker 2: I hang this other one over here, but I'm like, it.
Speaker 1: Worked your ass off for that, dude. Yeah, Like it's
Speaker 1: so weird.
Speaker 2: It's like I literally just I feel like I accomplished
Speaker 2: some shit, you know, Like I just like I feel
Speaker 2: like I put in so much effort and time and energy.
Speaker 2: It was just like I didn't even care about the horns.
Speaker 1: I was so excited just that.
Speaker 2: I mean, dude could have been a cow and I
Speaker 2: still would have probably had those same exact emotions because
Speaker 2: I felt like I put in so much effort that
Speaker 2: it was.
Speaker 1: Just like I did it. Your each your goal, Yeah
Speaker 1: you got one.
Speaker 2: I got one with a bow. Like I didn't even care,
Speaker 2: you know, about the size. It was just like I
Speaker 2: got it. So I think it was almost like a
Speaker 2: good year to reset, because I feel like the last
Speaker 2: couple of years it was like really good, and then
Speaker 2: I look at it and I was just like, I
Speaker 2: can't keep doing it.
Speaker 1: We've got to get humbled every now and then, you know,
Speaker 1: if not, If not, then you start to start thinking
Speaker 1: stuff like man, I got these elk figured out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then you needed you need a year like this
Speaker 1: year to like, you know, take you down a notch. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know it did me. I mean, and I always
Speaker 1: know that I don't know everything about ELK. I'll feed
Speaker 1: the first to admit it, and I get I get
Speaker 1: learned up schooled every year by Elk. But this year,
Speaker 1: my my season wasn't a lot of different than yours.
Speaker 1: In the beginning, I'd done my homework all summer. I
Speaker 1: had trail camp with some big bulls. We were just
Speaker 1: looking at them, and I had some pretty impressive trail cameras,
Speaker 1: some really big bulls. I'm like, I'm probably just gonna
Speaker 1: shoot that. I don't know if I shoot that one,
Speaker 1: but I would definitely shoot this one. But you know,
Speaker 1: maybe if I got desperate, i'd shoot this other one.
Speaker 1: But you know, that's a little collie. Anybody would give
Speaker 1: their left leg to freaking shoot either one, right, their
Speaker 1: beautiful bulls. And so I'm hunting this new unit closer
Speaker 1: to home. My son, Austin, he he hasn't hunted much
Speaker 1: with me in the last few years. He's been working
Speaker 1: all the time, and finally he's able to get away
Speaker 1: a little bit and I'm like, well it, let's hunt
Speaker 1: a little closer to home so you can have more
Speaker 1: time to come join in, but I went on opening day.
Speaker 1: I was up there the day before opening day, put
Speaker 1: my camp up, got ready, was just poised to just
Speaker 1: just dump jump right in. I was so pumped. And
Speaker 1: Opening day was flat, it was kind of rainy. A
Speaker 1: trail camera had a mountain lying on it where it
Speaker 1: had elk earlier. You know, it's just like I went
Speaker 1: to check my camera. It's like, oh yeah, ilk currentt
Speaker 1: rely even here now. So anyway, fast forward day two.
Speaker 1: I tried a little different spot on the other side
Speaker 1: of the mountains, like, well it was elk, where'd they go?
Speaker 1: Maybe they went on the other side of the mountain here,
Speaker 1: get over there. First thing, bam right out of the
Speaker 1: right out of the starting gate. Get a bolt of bugle,
Speaker 1: climb up in there, and this bowl is bugling pretty good.
Speaker 1: I think I might call him in, and then he
Speaker 1: kind of starts slowing down. It's like, oh man, he's
Speaker 1: slowing down. I think he's going to bed. And he
Speaker 1: went to bed and he bedded in this reprod thicket
Speaker 1: and reprod that's reproduction. So years ago, probably twenty years ago.
Speaker 1: They logged this place and then replanted it, and it's
Speaker 1: grown back. When it grows back, it usually grows back
Speaker 1: way thicker than the forest was when they logged it. Right,
Speaker 1: you know, there's lots of young trees, lots of fresh
Speaker 1: tree so it's thick with trees and it's thick with brush.
Speaker 1: So this bowl's up here, bedded in this thing, and
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get close. And what I'm trying
Speaker 1: to do, I'm trying to self film myself too, because
Speaker 1: cameraman Dusty, he can't come yet. And I was like, well,
Speaker 1: I got to be here for the opener, right, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go out for the first three days a season.
Speaker 1: So I'm like, I'm gonna film this myself. So I've
Speaker 1: got my camera and I got my tripod and I
Speaker 1: look like a monkey trying to hump a football man.
Speaker 1: It was. It was bad. I was like, but I'm
Speaker 1: trying to get the shots, you know, and I'm getting
Speaker 1: I'm moving in on this bowl and I'm in his
Speaker 1: betting area and he moved, he leaving, so I'm getting close.
Speaker 1: And finally I thought, okay, I'm super cool. I'm within
Speaker 1: eighty yards of this thing. So I start calling again
Speaker 1: and he answers a little bit. He answers maybe once
Speaker 1: or twice, but it's like you can tell he just
Speaker 1: he's just kind of going, just doing that moany bugle.
Speaker 1: He's not interesting. He's not coming in. So I'm like, okay,
Speaker 1: I gotta get move up. So I move up, and
Speaker 1: I move up, and I'm like, okay, I'm gonna push
Speaker 1: a little more pressure and like I'm gonna move up
Speaker 1: to where I'm gonna see this thing, and he's gonna
Speaker 1: like he's gonna have to show himself. Well my error.
Speaker 1: I made this error. It was on this north facing slope,
Speaker 1: but there was a little beam of sunlight shining down.
Speaker 1: And I've always said, you know, stay out of the
Speaker 1: side and say, stand in the shadows. You know, be
Speaker 1: a vampire, right, stay in the shadows. I walked to
Speaker 1: that beam of sunlight, and that sucker pops up up
Speaker 1: out of bed. He sees me, pops up out of bed,
Speaker 1: and I see a brief glimpse of him going away.
Speaker 1: I think he's one of my target balls. I think
Speaker 1: he was the lesser of the lesser of the two,
Speaker 1: but still a freaking dandy, right, yeah, And he goes away,
Speaker 1: but he doesn't spook up. He didn't know what he saw.
Speaker 1: He just didn't like what he saw. So I called
Speaker 1: a bugle, cow call, and I sat down right there,
Speaker 1: and I'm just like, man, sit down here for a
Speaker 1: little bit and think about my choices in life. What
Speaker 1: have I done to myself. I'm like, I'm in a
Speaker 1: bad place. It's like nasty, yeah, and I'm sitting there.
Speaker 1: I sit there for like thirty minutes. I'm pretty sure
Speaker 1: I hear a stick pop, I hear another stick pop,
Speaker 1: and I bugle that's him. He left, made a big circle,
Speaker 1: came back, and it beds down like fifty yards right
Speaker 1: below his for first bed. And I sit there the
Speaker 1: rest of the day with him right there. He ain't
Speaker 1: coming in, he don't care. So sit there the rest
Speaker 1: of the day. Now the day goes by. I'm ticking.
Speaker 1: I'm hours like this was like nine o'clock in the morning,
Speaker 1: eight o'clock in the morning, when I put him to bed,
Speaker 1: he had this encounter. Fast forward to like five o'clock.
Speaker 1: I'm there. The wind had been like amazing all day,
Speaker 1: and I had an elk all around. So at five
Speaker 1: he gets up, stretches a little bit, bugles, and then
Speaker 1: he starts moving. And then I hear him bugle up here,
Speaker 1: and he can kind of switch his position. He gets
Speaker 1: in a better position for me. So I'm like, all right,
Speaker 1: here we go. I kind of went quiet too, I
Speaker 1: didn't said anything. So I get over there super close,
Speaker 1: start calling, don't really care. But then he'll bugle, but
Speaker 1: he ain't bugling at me. And then way off in
Speaker 1: the distance, I hear this other bowl bugle, like across
Speaker 1: the drainage. Hear this other bul bugle. Person is getting closer,
Speaker 1: person is getting closer. I'm like, that bull's coming over here.
Speaker 1: That bull comes all the way across the drange, hits
Speaker 1: the crik, climbs up our side, and now I'm in
Speaker 1: the between these two bulls, Like I need to get
Speaker 1: forward of another fifty yards and I'm gonna be on
Speaker 1: a direct b line between the two, but I'm kind
Speaker 1: of pinned down. Well, finally that bowl, that one gets
Speaker 1: up there into that position and he bugles, and the
Speaker 1: bull on the top of the hill he'd been bugling
Speaker 1: like a raghorn. Just we talked earlier about how they
Speaker 1: you know, oh yeah, it's harder to judge a bull
Speaker 1: by bulls, I feel like they're like people. They they
Speaker 1: kind of speak to their disposition. So all day he'd
Speaker 1: just been kind of being real, very coy, just like
Speaker 1: these wimpy moany, crappy bugles. When that bowl got within
Speaker 1: one hundred yards of him and bugled, that bull gave
Speaker 1: him the biggest King Kong Godzilla, f you bugle you've
Speaker 1: ever heard. He bugles so hardy cut out at the top,
Speaker 1: at the high note, He's just like I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: oh man, this is gonna happen. They're like they're gonna fight. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the other bull. All I heard was crash, crash, crash crash.
Speaker 1: He took off, he was gone, he left, and then
Speaker 1: the bull come off the hill. He comes boiling off
Speaker 1: the hill and it was so brushy I couldn't see him.
Speaker 1: He come boiling off the hill and went right after
Speaker 1: him and chased him. Cla Claire out of the canyon.
Speaker 1: I heard more. I heard more bugling out of the canyon.
Speaker 1: Was like, crazy, what the heck just happened? I worked,
Speaker 1: I worked all day try to say things to make
Speaker 1: him mad, and he didn't really care. He just to
Speaker 1: give me these like whatever. For whatever reason, he hated
Speaker 1: that other bowl. I feel like elk are not too
Speaker 1: dissimilar than people, like like they have attitudes, they have egos,
Speaker 1: obviously have they have mortal enemies that they don't like.
Speaker 1: There's like, you know, there's probably those one people that
Speaker 1: just that really rub you wrong, and if they said
Speaker 1: the wrong thing, you'd probably get right in their face. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was that bowl.
Speaker 2: He probably he probably knew that bowl and was like nope,
Speaker 2: Like we spent all summer together.
Speaker 1: I heard you once. Yeah, we're done. I will not
Speaker 1: have allowed there, yeah, like absolutely not. So I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: this is great, this is going to be good. So
Speaker 1: I go back there the next day. It's a ghost town.
Speaker 1: Crickets those when he left and pushed out of their
Speaker 1: bowl out they went somewhere else. So I had one
Speaker 1: more day, so I hunted around. I never I got
Speaker 1: up on top of that ridge that they went off
Speaker 1: on top of and out of the canyon, and I walked.
Speaker 1: I think I walked eight miles that that that day,
Speaker 1: like in and out, and I did not I found
Speaker 1: I found a place where some bulls had fought, could
Speaker 1: have been them, but I could not buy a bugle.
Speaker 1: I was in the dark, like well, I walked for
Speaker 1: like an hour in the dark on the way back,
Speaker 1: crazy and did not hear a peep. If it wouldn't
Speaker 1: have been for the tracks, if you'd have told anybody like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I had some balls in this area, bugle, and there
Speaker 1: had been like uh huh, you're a liar, they'd have
Speaker 1: made the biggest liar out of me. So anyway, I'm like,
Speaker 1: Labor Day weekends coming up, I'm gonna get out of
Speaker 1: the woods. A lot of people recreate. I'm like, I
Speaker 1: don't want to deal with all the four wheelers and
Speaker 1: the UTVs and the dirt bikes and all the you know,
Speaker 1: let the people have their fun after the weekend. I'll
Speaker 1: go back. So I went home, spent time with family,
Speaker 1: went back after the weekend, and all the people that
Speaker 1: were pulling in for the weekend were still there. Times ten,
Speaker 1: I didn't know this, but this place is pop popular,
Speaker 1: like really popular. And dude, there anywhere anywhere you could
Speaker 1: possibly camp, like a place that was big enough to
Speaker 1: put a tent or a camper where there was a
Speaker 1: tent or a camper there and maybe two three four pickups.
Speaker 1: Every trailhead had had four or five pickups every every
Speaker 1: road that you could ride a four wheeler or a
Speaker 1: quad or an ATV or a UTV urbike. It was
Speaker 1: like a swarm of bees, like you could just hear.
Speaker 1: So my son gets there, I'm like, man, I don't
Speaker 1: know what we're gonna do. So we canvassed this area,
Speaker 1: you know, not in this zone. There's several units within
Speaker 1: this zone that make up this elk hunting zone, and
Speaker 1: I we canvassed every fricking zone. And it was the
Speaker 1: same story anywhere that was like, oh, that's beautiful old
Speaker 1: country there was it was. It was loaded with folks.
Speaker 1: So we did find some elk. We did chase around
Speaker 1: some bugles a couple of days, but then within no
Speaker 1: time at all, there was other folks, you know, found
Speaker 1: him too. So finally it's like, I'm about ready to
Speaker 1: like go somewhere else. I got this Montana tag burn
Speaker 1: a hole in my pocket. Maybe we should get over there.
Speaker 1: And Austin's like yeah, He's like, I'll go back home.
Speaker 1: I got some chores I gotta do and I to
Speaker 1: get it back to work anyway. So I'm like, all right, great,
Speaker 1: So we left. He just kind of wrote off that
Speaker 1: Idaho tag. Unfortunately I really didn't want to, but I could.
Speaker 1: I could just see the writing on the wall. I
Speaker 1: could spend several more days there, you know, spend a
Speaker 1: bunch more gas money just trying to get find, you know, somewhere,
Speaker 1: you know, spend lots of boot leather hiking around. But
Speaker 1: we weren't going to escape the other people. So it's like,
Speaker 1: let's let's go go to plan be well. Dusty camera man, Dusty,
Speaker 1: he had a milk tag in a different part of
Speaker 1: the state. I'm like, hey, on the way to Montana,
Speaker 1: why don't we just stop in for a few days
Speaker 1: for your tag, Dusty, And he's like, yeah, that'd be great.
Speaker 1: So we go over to his spot. And this spot,
Speaker 1: it's a where he was at. It's a cap zone.
Speaker 1: So Idaho only sells so many tags in this zone,
Speaker 1: the limit number. It's not a drawing. But but when
Speaker 1: they're gone, they're gone. Unlike some over the or the
Speaker 1: over the counter. They'll sell as many elk tags as
Speaker 1: people will buy, which is I think is what they
Speaker 1: did in that other unit. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. So
Speaker 1: we went to this other unit. We did hear some
Speaker 1: bulls bugle. They'd only bugle once or twice. They didn't
Speaker 1: act right, and and we would fight a bowl and
Speaker 1: nobody would be nobody was around, and we would call
Speaker 1: a little bit to it, and I'm like, all right,
Speaker 1: let's let's get like one or two more replies from
Speaker 1: this bowl and then we'll go after it. Sure, And
Speaker 1: then the second time the bull would reply, it was
Speaker 1: a little further away, and the third time I would
Speaker 1: reply it was further away. Yet I was like, what
Speaker 1: the heck and this is and we heard in two days,
Speaker 1: we heard twelve different bulls bugle there out there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they didn't want anything to do with our calls. And
Speaker 1: then we trained areas two or three times, so I
Speaker 1: think we spent four days in that area, and it
Speaker 1: just like there was more and more and more people
Speaker 1: all the time. It's like you would find it a
Speaker 1: spot where some milk and then prettysume more people woul
Speaker 1: show up. So I'm like, well, my buddies in Montana
Speaker 1: are saying they're killing bulls and they're talking, so let's go.
Speaker 1: I feel like we should have probably went to Montana
Speaker 1: first and they came and hit that Idaho on the
Speaker 1: back back end, But I mean, you don't know what
Speaker 1: you know, right, So we get up to Montana. Well,
Speaker 1: a few days before you know, guys, are you know
Speaker 1: having some success, bulls talking, they're killing some bulls. We
Speaker 1: get up here and it's like we were like caught
Speaker 1: the back end of that little wave, like like how
Speaker 1: you talked, like it was good for a day or
Speaker 1: two and then it kind of would like collapse for
Speaker 1: a few days, like a week, and then you'd get
Speaker 1: a couple more good days and they would kind of collapse.
Speaker 1: And that's kind of like what we found. We got
Speaker 1: here with all these high hopes and it was pretty quiet.
Speaker 1: It was a ghost town. And then finally we had
Speaker 1: we had one We had one day that was like
Speaker 1: a like a rut melee, rutfest, whatever you want to
Speaker 1: call it. We had bulls bugling all over We had
Speaker 1: this bowl bugling down over in this little can't draw
Speaker 1: below us. And it was by the shape of the
Speaker 1: land and the geography. If you've hunded Elk much and
Speaker 1: you understand like how sound and their bugles reflect, refract, re,
Speaker 1: relay to you from different terrain features, So like if
Speaker 1: they're down in a deep draw, they get a little echoey.
Speaker 1: If they're over on an open face, or if they're
Speaker 1: on a face directly acrossroom beer. It's a lot clearer,
Speaker 1: more clear sound. Anyway, this bull was down in this
Speaker 1: hole below us, and it sounded really muffled and kind
Speaker 1: of echoey, like we couldn't really pinpoint where he's at.
Speaker 1: And I'm looking at my on ax, I'm just like,
Speaker 1: I just don't understand, like why this sounds this way,
Speaker 1: because the map doesn't say it sure that they should
Speaker 1: sound like this. And I'm trying to figure this out,
Speaker 1: and I'm bugling, and I'm i'm I'm I'm going all out.
Speaker 1: I am hitting, like every ten seconds, I'm ripping the
Speaker 1: meanest ass bugle, lip ball bugle you've ever heard, and
Speaker 1: then mix in with some cow calls, excited cow calls,
Speaker 1: and this bull is eating it up, eating it up,
Speaker 1: and then pretty soon it's like, oh, Dusty, he's coming.
Speaker 1: He sounds closer, let's go. So we start working down
Speaker 1: our way down the Settle ridge and it's kind of burnt,
Speaker 1: kind of burned there, and I take five steps and
Speaker 1: I look up that bull. He's marching up the hill
Speaker 1: right to us, like he did not sound that close.
Speaker 1: It was one of those weird places where or and
Speaker 1: I don't know if he was bugling quiet or what,
Speaker 1: but I thought he was further away anyway. I look
Speaker 1: up here, that sucker is just on a on a
Speaker 1: bee line, coming right to us. And then I see
Speaker 1: him and I stop and freeze, and then he sees us,
Speaker 1: and he stops and freezing, and then we have the
Speaker 1: stair down felt like forever. And then finally he kind
Speaker 1: of like locks his lips a little bit and kind
Speaker 1: of looks around. He's like bugles. I'm like, oh, that's
Speaker 1: a good signing. He don't he don't recognize us as people.
Speaker 1: And then he kind of looks around and there's it's
Speaker 1: a windfall jungle. It's a burnt right, it's a windfall.
Speaker 1: It's a mess. And he's like like looking this way,
Speaker 1: like like trying to decipher which way he wants to come.
Speaker 1: And then he turns and starts to walk off. I'm
Speaker 1: like no, So he walks out of sight and I
Speaker 1: run down the hill fifty yards because he's at ninety.
Speaker 1: Whenever he catches us, I scream. He pops up, He
Speaker 1: pops back up, facing us. He immediately he runs back
Speaker 1: up the hill right to us, and then he's like
Speaker 1: looking around. He's like I don't see no elk So
Speaker 1: then he turns around and goes back out of sight,
Speaker 1: and then I just run hard as hard as I can,
Speaker 1: and then drop over the side of this liddle. It's
Speaker 1: kind of like a little hog backridge. I drop off
Speaker 1: the side. I'm like, okay, and then he's like fifty
Speaker 1: sixty yards. I don't really want to shoot that far anyway,
Speaker 1: and then there's just way too much brush and crap.
Speaker 1: There's you know, that stupid fireweed that grows that purple
Speaker 1: flower fireweed. That stuff's like shoulder high, and there's just
Speaker 1: all sorts of just crap, and it just there wasn't
Speaker 1: a good clear shop even if I wanted to shoot
Speaker 1: that far, which I typically don't. And anyway that he
Speaker 1: drug us down in there, we pursued him. There was
Speaker 1: other bulls in there, and we just we went. We
Speaker 1: went to every corner of this big basin, chasing bugles
Speaker 1: all day and finally some at one point I just
Speaker 1: put my tube away. I just quit colin. They were
Speaker 1: bugling so much. I'm just like almost gonna walk right
Speaker 1: up on them, and a couple of times I did.
Speaker 1: We got really close, just not close enough, you know,
Speaker 1: there sixty eighty yards out. It's pretty you got down there,
Speaker 1: it is open enough where they can pick you off.
Speaker 1: But we chased bugles all day, awesome day. Went back
Speaker 1: the next day. There's four four pickups sparked there. Everybody
Speaker 1: else found them too, Yeah, everyone else. So I'm not,
Speaker 1: I'm not. I'm not into combat hunting. I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't want to get in there and have to compete
Speaker 1: with other people and I want to mess them up.
Speaker 1: I don't want them to mess me up. So I'm
Speaker 1: just like, well, we'll go somewhere else, we'll go find someone,
Speaker 1: we'll get this. We'll let those guys kind of stir
Speaker 1: it up for a day or two and then we'll
Speaker 1: go back. Yeah. But every time we went back there
Speaker 1: was there was guys there. But we bounced around all
Speaker 1: over the unit, you know, all over this mountain range
Speaker 1: and tried different spots, and we found towards the end
Speaker 1: of the season, towards the end of our time that
Speaker 1: we could be there. The last three days, I think
Speaker 1: we found some more balls. We got into them and
Speaker 1: chased them around, but it's just like they kept that
Speaker 1: magic buffer between you and it was pretty open timber,
Speaker 1: and they and we'd advance and we we'd we'd hear
Speaker 1: them bugle and I would just I wouldn't even call
Speaker 1: until I was like, okay, I'm gonna walk until I
Speaker 1: almost step on these things. And we'd walk right up
Speaker 1: on him and then call and then it just didn't
Speaker 1: just didn't does not happen. Yeah, And the last night
Speaker 1: we had this bowl, we did we'd done that, we'd
Speaker 1: we come we in the morning, we'd heard five different bulls.
Speaker 1: Well that night I'd put marks on on X. I'm like, okay,
Speaker 1: well this this afternoon, this evening, we're gonna walk up
Speaker 1: here and we're gonna go to every single one of
Speaker 1: those marks and see if we can find that bowl.
Speaker 1: And we found every single one of those bulls, but
Speaker 1: they did not want to play. And then we'd heard
Speaker 1: a different bowl. We didn't hear it all in the morning,
Speaker 1: this big nasty growler bowl, and I'm like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's we didn't hear him before. That's the bag, the
Speaker 1: big daddy, And it was like one of again, it's
Speaker 1: like one of those weal. Echoey is like I couldn't like,
Speaker 1: where is that coming from? Dusty, And He's like I
Speaker 1: can't tell it was just like you would hear it,
Speaker 1: and then you when you hear a bugle, you kind
Speaker 1: of turn your head a little bit and like try
Speaker 1: to like get your your ears orientated to the direction
Speaker 1: to like pick it up. And we could not pinpoint it.
Speaker 1: So I'm just like, okay, we got a hike, hike up,
Speaker 1: so we'd already come down from this section, so my
Speaker 1: hike up, up up. We got to get hired to
Speaker 1: hear what this thing is that finally we figured out.
Speaker 1: So we put the move on him. And this bowl
Speaker 1: was so smart, like as we'd get close and I
Speaker 1: would call to him and he'd take off and he
Speaker 1: would make it like he would make this J hook pattern,
Speaker 1: so he'd go and make a J like straight line,
Speaker 1: like on the same contour line as us, and then
Speaker 1: he would hook up and get right above us, and
Speaker 1: he would shut up, and we'd go past him, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, where did he go? And finally a bugle
Speaker 1: right above us but back, and I was just like,
Speaker 1: finally fed up. I'm like, all right, this is it, guys,
Speaker 1: and this is the way the season ended. And then
Speaker 1: I'm kind of talking to the camera and I'm like
Speaker 1: and then he bugles one more time. Like, if I
Speaker 1: run up there right now, I think he might have
Speaker 1: enough light, we might have enough light left to shoot him.
Speaker 1: I if he just stands there, just dumb lucky, I
Speaker 1: just run up on him. So I take off charging
Speaker 1: like a wild bowl. Right, I'm like a bowl out
Speaker 1: and I'm I'm screaming and I'm running hard as I
Speaker 1: can at this bowl because this is that, this is
Speaker 1: all the putting, all the chips on the table, the
Speaker 1: last chance, and he j hooked me again, and I'm
Speaker 1: just like, all right, well that's that's the end of
Speaker 1: the story. Yeah, I'm sorry. You know you didn't get one, guys.
Speaker 1: But I you know, in the whole season, I did
Speaker 1: I draw my drew my bow back twice. It was
Speaker 1: it was September twenty ninth before I drew my bow
Speaker 1: for the first time of the season, so you tell
Speaker 1: like it was just a weird year. And then on
Speaker 1: that first time, I had a big I did have
Speaker 1: a beautiful six point come in. I don't want to
Speaker 1: spoil it because you're gonna watch the video at some point.
Speaker 1: But misjudge the yardage, you know, I'd ranged everything. I
Speaker 1: misjudge which tree was what. I guess I'm getting old.
Speaker 1: It's not as polished as I thought. I was shut
Speaker 1: right over. This freaking bull's back is BEAUTI football and
Speaker 1: we had some fun, but we've really got our teeth
Speaker 1: kicked in really hard and it hurts a lot. And
Speaker 1: I'm still trying to.
Speaker 2: Like like shake it off, like you're you're back out
Speaker 2: here right on.
Speaker 1: I've I've spent more days elk hunting, and I hunted
Speaker 1: elk in Idaho with a rifle. I got the probably
Speaker 1: the worst rifle tag. I've always said this, this this
Speaker 1: unit is arguably the worst one in Idaho. It's wolf infested.
Speaker 1: Their elk numbers are tanked, but it's beautiful. I love
Speaker 1: the country found success there last year. I'm like, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go up there. I just need some me time.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go by myself a lot. I got up
Speaker 1: there and I got really close and had another hunter
Speaker 1: followed up. But anyway, I've spent more time hunting elk
Speaker 1: this year than any year I've ever I make I
Speaker 1: spent ninety percent of September on into October archer hunting.
Speaker 1: I spent I was in the woods Elkwood's October fifth
Speaker 1: through October twentieth, and I know, and now here I
Speaker 1: am in Montana doing her again. I'm just hoping it's
Speaker 1: a deer year. Yeah, I'm just hoping, Like I'm just
Speaker 1: kind of starting I'm starting to think, starting to think.
Speaker 1: I'm like, there's always hope, but I'm starting to think, Man,
Speaker 1: maybe it's a deer year. Maybe I'll get a nice
Speaker 1: meal to your buck, and I'll get a nice white
Speaker 1: tail buck. And it's a deer year. And I've had
Speaker 1: those before. Yeah, but you can't they all can't be diamonds, right, No,
Speaker 1: that's very true.
Speaker 2: I mean, heck, last night we were sitting out there
Speaker 2: in the truck and you call an elk right.
Speaker 1: To the truck. I called it. Yeah November what yeah? No, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's well October, t it's October twenty ninth, it's almost November. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you call one right to the freaking hood of
Speaker 1: the truck. Pretty much. So, I mean it was a baby, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was a baby. But it was legal to shoot it.
Speaker 1: And it was like, I can't shoot that. It was cute. Cute? Yeah,
Speaker 1: it does to take its life for such little meat,
Speaker 1: that would just be wrong. Yeah, for sure, but it
Speaker 1: was cool to see. But it was cool.
Speaker 2: But the fact, I mean you did calling right, Yeah
Speaker 2: went in. So I mean there's that but.
Speaker 1: Still got it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you still got it. I mean that was the
Speaker 2: plus out of the whole season. But yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: I mean, I feel like this year was tough. I
Speaker 2: talked to so many people and I mean like other people,
Speaker 2: like I mean even hunting the area I was in
Speaker 2: and like you know areas that you know around, and man,
Speaker 2: it was a struggle. It was not a normal like
Speaker 2: what I would call like normal elk here. I feel
Speaker 2: like heck, like both of us, like we've had years
Speaker 2: and it's like you feel you're just like, oh yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna bowl.
Speaker 1: Sounds good.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna call him in and check him out. I'm
Speaker 2: gonna call that ball in, check him out. Just this year,
Speaker 2: they just didn't want to play the game, you know.
Speaker 2: And it's so, I mean, it's like I look back
Speaker 2: and I'm like, I feel like I learned a lot
Speaker 2: and I feel like I had a lot of experiences
Speaker 2: and like got in on them. But dude, I mean
Speaker 2: overall it was like experience wise, I feel like it
Speaker 2: was hard, you know, And so I mean, I, you know,
Speaker 2: I don't know, feel fortunate, but it's like you talk
Speaker 2: about being humbled, and I mean, I feel like this year.
Speaker 1: Really kind of kicked ye. Yeah, you know, yeah. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm a beginner again. Yeah, I'm born again. I started
Speaker 1: at square. Next year's square one, back to zero, back
Speaker 1: to zero, back to zero. I did have a theory.
Speaker 1: I did have a theory. And I don't know if
Speaker 1: I advertise this on this podcast. I know I've talked
Speaker 1: about it others before but in the past, but I
Speaker 1: call it the Year of the huckleberry, and this is
Speaker 1: my theory year of the huckleberry. This year, all over
Speaker 1: Idaho was a banner year for a huckleberry. And a
Speaker 1: huckleberry if you don't know what that is, it looks
Speaker 1: like a blueberry, but there they grow in the mountains.
Speaker 1: They have three times as much potency and flavor than
Speaker 1: a blueberry does. They're amazing to make great pie, jelly wine,
Speaker 1: whatever you want to make out of them. But anyway,
Speaker 1: this year was a banner year for huckleberries. And I
Speaker 1: always say during the year of the huckleberry, elk don't
Speaker 1: bugle for shit, And this year proved it again and
Speaker 1: what causes that you're of the huckleberry In my opinion,
Speaker 1: and this is probably true, but lots and lots of moisture.
Speaker 1: You got a really good snowpack from last winter, and
Speaker 1: then you have a wet summer. And that's true like everywhere.
Speaker 1: Like when I was doing all my cameras this summer,
Speaker 1: there was several days on cameras where it was like wet,
Speaker 1: you know, the animals were wet, you could see the rain,
Speaker 1: or there was bushes moving on a rainstorm. I hot
Speaker 1: picked that up. And we had an abnormally wet summer
Speaker 1: in North Idaho and throughout the region, and and some
Speaker 1: some areas had some really bad winters. You look at
Speaker 1: southeast Idaho, you look at part of Utah, they had
Speaker 1: they had one hundred year winter, lots of moisture, they
Speaker 1: had a lot of a lot of herd mortality. And
Speaker 1: then when you're heard when you start having herds, I think,
Speaker 1: and this is opinion, I don't know if this is true.
Speaker 1: I feel like whenever your your elk goes so far
Speaker 1: in the negative, like in their in their physical condition
Speaker 1: to just to stay alive, and then spring comes and
Speaker 1: they have to kind of build back from there. I
Speaker 1: don't think sometimes by September they're built back good enough,
Speaker 1: like they just don't have enough yet to just go bananas.
Speaker 1: And Phelps did a podcast. You guys have to look
Speaker 1: this up. I don't know which podcast number it was
Speaker 1: or what the biologist name, but he did a podcast
Speaker 1: with a biologist out of Utah that talked about how
Speaker 1: cows don't come into heat every year. Sometimes they do.
Speaker 1: Sometimes a lot of the cows coming to heat, sometimes
Speaker 1: hardly any of the cows coming to heat. And it
Speaker 1: all in his opinion, from the data shows that physical
Speaker 1: condition of the cow dictates when she's going to come
Speaker 1: into heat come into estress. Interesting, and if she doesn't
Speaker 1: achieve the proper physical fitness you know, to to to
Speaker 1: become pregnant and to carry a calf through the winter,
Speaker 1: she won't go into estress. And this year, I feel
Speaker 1: like that kind of really prove that, that idea prove
Speaker 1: that because a lot of the West, you know, had
Speaker 1: some pretty bad winners and those cows went probably in
Speaker 1: the minus yeah to have to try to like come
Speaker 1: back though we did have really wet summer, lots of feed.
Speaker 1: But I don't know if that didn't I don't know
Speaker 1: if that helped or not to enough degree. But also
Speaker 1: back to the Year of the Huckleberry. Yeah, when you have
Speaker 1: a wet summer, you have feed everywhere. On a dry year,
Speaker 1: things dry up. On a drought year, things dry up
Speaker 1: and the good feed is concentrated in smaller areas, and
Speaker 1: elk have to go to those areas. Now there's a
Speaker 1: lot more competition for breeding rights. This year there was
Speaker 1: food everywhere. They didn't have to congregate, they didn't have
Speaker 1: to concentrate, and there was a lot less a lot
Speaker 1: less competition for breeding per se. Like if a bull
Speaker 1: had some cows, he may not he could push those
Speaker 1: cows wherever you want and may not encounter anymore else,
Speaker 1: especially in the area with low elktons. So that's my
Speaker 1: theory on the Year of Huckleberry. I may be wrong,
Speaker 1: but I still think there's something to it. But I
Speaker 1: mean it's true, though. I tell us what you think.
Speaker 1: You can email us at CTD at Phelps Game Calls
Speaker 1: dot com. Let us know about your the Huckleberry, let
Speaker 1: us know about what your experience. Did you have a
Speaker 1: banner year like elk the elk rutt year of your
Speaker 1: life or was it kind of like what we described
Speaker 1: really hit and miss and just kind of prey lackluster. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'd be curious. I want to know. I want to
Speaker 1: hear from people. Yeah, well, thanks John Man. I appreciate
Speaker 1: you coming on here. I don't think people Sometimes people
Speaker 1: they see the success of other hunters, but they don't
Speaker 1: know the homework that is put into it. And I can.
Speaker 1: I'm here to tell you. John and his wife Kylie Kyle,
Speaker 1: if you will, they put in their homework, and she's
Speaker 1: right there with him. They spend their summers, well, everybody
Speaker 1: else is out jet skiing and watersk in and doing
Speaker 1: fun stuff like that. John is grinding in the mountains.
Speaker 1: He is sitting behind binoculars, He's sitting behind a spotting scope.
Speaker 1: He's hiking up hills, he's stashing water five miles from
Speaker 1: the truck, packing it in and the dead dead heat
Speaker 1: of summer. That way he has it in September. Myself,
Speaker 1: I do a ton of summer work, setting trail cameras,
Speaker 1: packing heavy loads all over the place, doing things that
Speaker 1: most people. I can't get anybody to help me. Nobody's
Speaker 1: gonna help me because it sucks. Everybody's like, oh, I'm
Speaker 1: going to the river. I'm going swim, I'm going to
Speaker 1: the lake. Man, I'm I'm I don't see much river
Speaker 1: time or lake time in the summer every now and
Speaker 1: then I do. But but man, I but it's a
Speaker 1: labor of love, it is. And that's the thing.
Speaker 2: I mean, I you know, we kind of really touch
Speaker 2: on it a ton, but it's, you know, one of
Speaker 2: those things where I think both of us, it's like
Speaker 2: can share that kind of passion and that drive to
Speaker 2: like want to achieve and just spend time in the
Speaker 2: woods because like we love it, you know, and I
Speaker 2: think that's the biggest thing. But it's like three hundred
Speaker 2: and sixty five days a year, you know. It's like
Speaker 2: I'm thinking about it all the time. We're researching. Heck,
Speaker 2: how many times we bounce ideas off each other like spot, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: And so I mean it's like I'm always learning. I'm
Speaker 2: all I feel like I'm a student of the game,
Speaker 2: like you know, like I'm always trying to figure it
Speaker 2: out and like learn and how can I do things better.
Speaker 2: I feel like we could do a whole podcast just
Speaker 2: on like talking about you know, the scouting phase, like
Speaker 2: the stuff that we do that leads up to those
Speaker 2: successful moments, you know, and like in everything and like
Speaker 2: how I mean this year, like I felt like a struggle,
Speaker 2: but I feel like we also had a heck of
Speaker 2: a game plan. And it's like, looking back, if I
Speaker 2: didn't have all that time scouting and knowledge and stuff
Speaker 2: that I had done in the off season, I don't know,
Speaker 2: Like I mean, probably have had a lot tougher season
Speaker 2: than it even was.
Speaker 1: After the first time you went from having good luck
Speaker 1: to bad luck, your plan would have fizzled because you
Speaker 1: didn't have any other plans to backup plans, right, and
Speaker 1: then you've been like, well let's go home, And I
Speaker 1: think you know a lot of folks that don't have
Speaker 1: that second plan.
Speaker 2: That's what happens. Yeah, get your plans right, man, yep.
Speaker 2: And I think that's the biggest thing. It's just to anybody,
Speaker 2: is like, study have plans A through Z and then
Speaker 2: some and just keep checking the boxes. And it's like
Speaker 2: when things get tough, which we both experienced this here
Speaker 2: a lot, it's like you can't give up, you know.
Speaker 2: It's like you got to keep punching that time clock
Speaker 2: and hey, it might come down to the last day
Speaker 2: and a bull jay hooks in the last ten minutes.
Speaker 2: But it's like you can't control that, but at least
Speaker 2: you were in them left all on the table. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you tried, and like you gave it that effort and
Speaker 2: you moved areas like.
Speaker 1: You you you.
Speaker 2: Checked new areas even at the last, you know, ten
Speaker 2: minutes of the game, to like go find a new out.
Speaker 1: Take a risk.
Speaker 2: Yeah, to take a risk. I think that's what it
Speaker 2: comes down to be. Cause it's like I know a
Speaker 2: lot of people. I think they feel like they get
Speaker 2: kind of hung up on a and they end up
Speaker 2: staying there the whole week, ten days whatever most people have.
Speaker 2: I feel fortunate that, like we have the time that
Speaker 2: we do because it's like we're able to spend you know, two, three,
Speaker 2: four weeks out there, five weeks whatever, you know, chase
Speaker 2: an elk where a.
Speaker 1: Lot of people don't.
Speaker 2: But like I look at that and I'm like, man,
Speaker 2: I almost feel like we have to have a bigger
Speaker 2: deck of cards than a lot of the other people
Speaker 2: because it's like, when you spend that much time.
Speaker 1: You're going to play through your cards. Really with that
Speaker 1: much time, Yeah, if you're just weaken worrying it. You
Speaker 1: better have the right cards to play on those few
Speaker 1: days you have. But if you have a lot of time,
Speaker 1: you better got the double deck cards. Yeah is that
Speaker 1: p knuckle or two decks?
Speaker 2: Yeah, you better have it all because it's like, I mean,
Speaker 2: you'll burn through them. And yeah, I don't know. I
Speaker 2: mean I feel like this year is tough. I hope
Speaker 2: next year's heck of a lot better. And you know,
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, I dude, it has to get better
Speaker 2: after this year. But it's like I'm already back, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean, heck, what is it, you know, right now
Speaker 2: into October and it's like I'm already back at the
Speaker 2: drawing board.
Speaker 1: We're planning for next year already.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like studying maps and like where am I going
Speaker 2: to go next year? And it's like I'll look at
Speaker 2: the same spots seventy five times, you know. It's like
Speaker 2: I just like I'll study it and be like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: would I miss in this? What did I miss? And
Speaker 2: I'm like until I understand like the whole map of
Speaker 2: that little area and like topo, Google Earth, whatever, and
Speaker 2: then I like pick another spot and like I learn
Speaker 2: everything I can about that area without setting foot in it,
Speaker 2: or maybe I've set foot there and like what did
Speaker 2: I pick up there?
Speaker 1: And like take notes in market for.
Speaker 2: Like next year, and then keep moving to these other
Speaker 2: spots until I feel like I've got so many different
Speaker 2: spots dialed. And in the back of my head, it's
Speaker 2: like we get out of the truck and I'm like,
Speaker 2: I know, I feel like I've walked this area fifty times,
Speaker 2: you know, Like I just like I know it, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, we're gonna go in here. I'm everyone set
Speaker 2: foot here, but like I know it, like and this
Speaker 2: is what's this is what the animals are going to do.
Speaker 2: This where they're going to be boom. And I feel
Speaker 2: like that's just what go into like putting that much
Speaker 2: time and effort like into it, you know, And so
Speaker 2: I feel like it's aided in my success a lot
Speaker 2: over the years of just the homework.
Speaker 1: Everybody I know that kills big elk and big deer,
Speaker 1: they put in a lot of homework and they may
Speaker 1: not advertise it where you're going to see it. Like
Speaker 1: that's the thing of the trap with social media is
Speaker 1: you don't people share as much as they want. Sometimes
Speaker 1: they don't share a lot. Sometimes they share very little
Speaker 1: other than the success, but what took them to get
Speaker 1: there was usually countless hours of time studying and lots
Speaker 1: of sweat and a lot of blood and like a
Speaker 1: lot of time put in understanding the area, understanding animals
Speaker 1: and just like just doing the homework. Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 1: I mean, heck yourself.
Speaker 2: I mean I don't post as much as like I
Speaker 2: used to on social media and whatnot. And it's like,
Speaker 2: but I never did ever post like really ever like
Speaker 2: my work behind the scenes.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It's just was kind of I mean like we kind
Speaker 2: of hit on the beginning. It was like I was
Speaker 2: always quiet, did the homework, went and got the results.
Speaker 2: But it was like I just that was kind of
Speaker 2: how I always was, you know. And it's like I
Speaker 2: am like I just like I don't show it or
Speaker 2: flawing it like all over the place. It's like I
Speaker 2: just punched the clock, and I'm like, you know.
Speaker 1: You know what, because you do it for you, You
Speaker 1: do it for the love it. You do it for you, Kylie.
Speaker 1: You guys love it. Yeah, that's why you do it exactly.
Speaker 1: I mean, like doing it for you're not doing it
Speaker 1: for likes. Yeah, yeah, you're doing it because you love
Speaker 1: it and share some of the stuff along the way.
Speaker 2: So true, and like I mean, I I love being
Speaker 2: out there with her, you know, because it's like one
Speaker 2: of those things. It's like especially when we have success. Dude,
Speaker 2: was she shot that bowl this year? It was like
Speaker 2: I was more excited for her, you know, like just
Speaker 2: then she probably was even shooting that help you know
Speaker 2: what I mean, And it was like I was so jacked.
Speaker 2: And it's like, but I love just seeing other people succeed,
Speaker 2: like you know, and like experiencing what elk cunting is
Speaker 2: because I know how much it's meant to me over
Speaker 2: the years, and to see someone else be able to
Speaker 2: could enjoy that and experience what an ELK is and
Speaker 2: what they do and like how big they are and
Speaker 2: like everything and like just go through the process and
Speaker 2: then it's like to punch your tag at the end
Speaker 2: of it, and it's like, dude, that is like it's special,
Speaker 2: you know, And I just love seeing her get out
Speaker 2: there and enjoy it.
Speaker 1: And there's I don't know if there's a greater gift
Speaker 1: that you can give to someone than to call them
Speaker 1: in an elk yeah and have them take it home
Speaker 1: with them. I mean, I don't know a better gift.
Speaker 2: No, I don't either, That's why I told her. I
Speaker 2: mean she got you know, hey, we got married.
Speaker 1: I might not. This el cut is way better. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Honeymoon moon, Yeah, I know, she said we need to
Speaker 3: do a honeymoon. Yeah we did, we would he cut? Yeah, Yeah, No,
Speaker 3: it's it's good. I mean, I love it. Can't wait
Speaker 3: till next year.
Speaker 2: I just hope that they'd beg a little bit better.
Speaker 2: But I mean, we're definitely gonna start punching the time
Speaker 2: clock right now. I mean, already for next year. Even
Speaker 2: know we still have hunts left this year to do.
Speaker 2: But I'm I'm my mind's turning.
Speaker 1: So yeah, well right on, man, Well, I appreciate you
Speaker 1: coming on here. Thanks a bunch. Check out John Gabriel.
Speaker 1: Give him a follow on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, we're not
Speaker 1: on Yeah, and Apex advertise advertising if you guys need
Speaker 1: some killer T shirt design, web design logos. He's the man.
Speaker 1: He is the man. He does great work and it's
Speaker 1: really easy to work with. So appreciate Tom. Yeah, thank you, Yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you. M