Speaker 1: This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 1: Chris Harrison and Lauren z MC company from the home
Speaker 1: office in Austin, Texas. Hope everybody's having a good week.
Speaker 1: We have a big week ahead. You and I are
Speaker 1: about to take off to one of our favorite places
Speaker 1: in the world, Monterey, California, Pebble Beach. Not to play golf.
Speaker 1: Let's just say that. I know you guys think, Okay,
Speaker 1: LZ's going out to play Pebble Beach again. We get it,
Speaker 1: she loves golf.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: Actually, gosh, I'm trying to think if this is the
Speaker 1: fifth or sixth time we're going to host the AIM
Speaker 1: Mental Health Gala up there at Pebble Beach in Monterey.
Speaker 1: And it's a wonderful, wonderful event that the last couple
Speaker 1: of years you and I have been co hosting together.
Speaker 2: Yes, you've hosted it longer than I've been part of
Speaker 2: it with you. But it is the AIM Youth Mental
Speaker 2: Health Organization. They do all sorts of great work with
Speaker 2: the youth of California, help with suicide prevention, depression issues, education.
Speaker 2: So a wonderful organization and you know, we're blessed the
Speaker 2: gala is in yeah, one of our favorite cities in
Speaker 2: the world, So we're going up there to support and
Speaker 2: co host that. But before we get into doing good
Speaker 2: in the world, let's just talk about some pop culture.
Speaker 2: A lot of media do some escapist headlines.
Speaker 1: We can talk about what we do best, which is
Speaker 1: debate media stuff. And there was a big announcement last week.
Speaker 1: Babe with Hot to Copy, the kind of pillar of
Speaker 1: the NBC Today Show been there for god, she's been
Speaker 1: there for decades. She's been crushing it one glass of
Speaker 1: chardonnay after the next on the show. And so no,
Speaker 1: it was a big news last week. And what I
Speaker 1: found interesting was she announced it obviously on her own terms,
Speaker 1: but then it came out later well maybe this was
Speaker 1: a contract.
Speaker 2: Dispute, so I don't even know if i'd call it
Speaker 2: a dispute. So ho to announce she's going to step
Speaker 2: down in August. She said, you know, she's turning sixty
Speaker 2: and that she wants to have more time with her children.
Speaker 2: I think this might be one of those things of
Speaker 2: two things can be true at once. Yes, like part
Speaker 2: of that probably is true, but you know, it's hard
Speaker 2: to leave sometimes when you've got a great, great gig,
Speaker 2: and you're making great money, and you think, well, you know,
Speaker 2: just one more year. I mean, I know you felt
Speaker 2: that with The Bachelor. It's like one more contract negotiation,
Speaker 2: a few more years. But there has also since that
Speaker 2: announcement come out, and I'll give credit to Puck News,
Speaker 2: one of my favorite sort of inside baseball media and
Speaker 2: Hollywood news organizations on this. They have reported that it
Speaker 2: might have been an issue with that Hodo was making
Speaker 2: quote more than twenty million dollars per year at NBC
Speaker 2: Good Lord and according to their sources that you know,
Speaker 2: Hodo was very beloved there and they knew her value
Speaker 2: to the brand, but that they wanted her to take
Speaker 2: a pay cut. That it was made quote clear to
Speaker 2: her agents that such stratospiric contracts were no longer justifiable
Speaker 2: given the industries inexorable decline. And for perspective, Puck notes
Speaker 2: that about a decade ago today averaged about five million
Speaker 2: viewers GMA as well, and today audiences are about half that,
Speaker 2: with two point something million viewers typically. So look, I
Speaker 2: think two things can be true at once. That is
Speaker 2: a staggering salary, it is, and if you think about
Speaker 2: how like It's not like Hode is the only one
Speaker 2: on the show. I mean Savannah Guthrie and multiple other people.
Speaker 2: Still they're paying tens of millions of dollars in salary contracts,
Speaker 2: And I completely understand how from a business perspective, they're
Speaker 2: just like, we don't have the viewers, we don't have
Speaker 2: the advertising dollars anymore. But then I've also been on
Speaker 2: the other side of it, where as an employee, you're
Speaker 2: looking at okay, but you guys are still making a
Speaker 2: lot of money, and you're still spending a lot of
Speaker 2: on a lot of things, and these numbers are still really,
Speaker 2: really big. And so maybe it just became time for her,
Speaker 2: of I'm going to go out on a high note.
Speaker 2: I don't want to take a pay cut to be here.
Speaker 2: I had been thinking about leaving to spend more time
Speaker 2: with my family anyway, I mean sixty, She's been doing
Speaker 2: this a long time. Yeah, And I will say I
Speaker 2: have one just small personal story with Hoda, but I
Speaker 2: met her briefly when we were both covering the Royal
Speaker 2: wedding Harry and Meghan, and she was lovely and I've
Speaker 2: never heard anything but lovely things about her.
Speaker 1: Same. Yeah, So I've run into her a couple of
Speaker 1: times and had some good conversations with her and could
Speaker 1: not be exactly what you see on the morning show.
Speaker 1: She's just a real gem and a sweet woman.
Speaker 2: I think that this everything I'm reading here seems true
Speaker 2: to me. What's your take on.
Speaker 1: I think you nailed it best. I think oftentimes in
Speaker 1: today's media, maybe with social media, we want to believe.
Speaker 1: It's like you hear a story and then you hear
Speaker 1: another part of it and we think, Okay, that's the
Speaker 1: story that oh my gosh, this was just a contract dispute.
Speaker 1: But what Lauren said is so true. Think about your
Speaker 1: own life. How often is one truth everything? It's multiple
Speaker 1: things can be true at one time, and that's what
Speaker 1: leads you to a decision. She was probably, you know,
Speaker 1: himming and hawing over is this the time? And like
Speaker 1: you said, it is so easy when that carrot is
Speaker 1: dangled in front of you. I was going through that
Speaker 1: at the time I left The Bachelor. I was in
Speaker 1: the middle of a contract negotiation. I'm like, oh, man,
Speaker 1: do I really want to sign on to this for
Speaker 1: five more years? And you know, deep down no, I didn't.
Speaker 1: But it's there and you feel like, well, i'd be
Speaker 1: crazy not to because I'm not even I wasn't even
Speaker 1: close to sixty, so I wasn't ready to retire anyway.
Speaker 1: So I get where she is. Where she's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm sixty years old. I've been waking up at three
Speaker 1: in the morning, driving into Manhattan every day, grinding this out,
Speaker 1: and man, those morning shows. That is a tough haul.
Speaker 1: But she's done it so well and she's so beloved,
Speaker 1: So I get that there were probably two sides, and
Speaker 1: maybe just that contract negotiation and them coming to or
Speaker 1: made it a little bit easier to just say, you
Speaker 1: know what, it's time to put a pin in this
Speaker 1: and hand it off to the next generation and move on.
Speaker 2: I think it's difficult but good to have that self
Speaker 2: awareness too. Of would I like say she'd said yes, yes, Well,
Speaker 2: then even though you love your job, you're going into
Speaker 2: it with a different level of resentment. You're thinking, oh,
Speaker 2: but I had kind of wanted to spend more time
Speaker 2: with my kids. Oh but I'm tired, and now all
Speaker 2: on top of that, I have an additional new resentment
Speaker 2: of I don't really feel like they're paying me what
Speaker 2: I'm worth here and what I had before, And so
Speaker 2: then you're kind of doing your job through a different
Speaker 2: lens and with a different chip on your shoulder. And
Speaker 2: then do you become worse at the work and do
Speaker 2: you start to get angry at something that you used
Speaker 2: to love? And that's a dangerous road to go down,
Speaker 2: But like you just said, it's an easy road to
Speaker 2: fall down because of it's a great job, and it's
Speaker 2: you know, you're still making good money, and it's a
Speaker 2: job that everybody wants. When you have this job that
Speaker 2: people generally think seems really glamorous and aspirational, I always
Speaker 2: called it the glittery hamster wheel. Like you're on this
Speaker 2: hamster wheel and you're like, I'm running on it, and
Speaker 2: maybe at first you're enjoying it and you're feeling good
Speaker 2: and you're on a runner's high, and then you're thinking, wait,
Speaker 2: I'm still running on this wheel, But do I get off?
Speaker 2: And it's really glittery and shiny and everyone's looking at it,
Speaker 2: But am I actually enjoying being on this?
Speaker 1: I the best some of the best business advice I
Speaker 1: ever got was very early on. I was twenty three
Speaker 1: years old. I was signing I think my first contract
Speaker 1: at KWATV and Oklahoma City, the CBS affiliate and the
Speaker 1: late great mentor of mine, Bill Tiggans, pulled me aside
Speaker 1: because I'm like, you know, should I negotiate it? He's like, look,
Speaker 1: the best advice I can give you is, don't ever
Speaker 1: sign a contract that you don't really fully believe in
Speaker 1: with your heart. And to that point, if you don't,
Speaker 1: you will come in every day with resentment in your
Speaker 1: heart and you're not going to give it your all.
Speaker 1: And you know what's funny is, so many years later
Speaker 1: I was about to do that. I was about to
Speaker 1: get involved with a contract where my heart wasn't in
Speaker 1: it anymore and the resentment would be there. And so
Speaker 1: that advice always stuck with me. I wish it had
Speaker 1: been with me and that in that moment, But I
Speaker 1: bet with Hoda it is that that that was the
Speaker 1: bridge too far. Its like, I'm not going to come
Speaker 1: in here and do something I love and have resentment
Speaker 1: my heart anymore. And kudos to her for a a
Speaker 1: great career. Congratulations. It's not the last we're going to
Speaker 1: see of her. I'm sure she'll be doing other things,
Speaker 1: but a beautiful career. If it is the end, God
Speaker 1: bless her. That's said. To go out on your terms
Speaker 1: is wonderful.
Speaker 2: It's really hard to do. It's really hard to end
Speaker 2: on a high note and to call it. And you know,
Speaker 2: Puck was speculating, and I agree with them that we
Speaker 2: might be seeing a little more of this in the
Speaker 2: next few years. Those sort of stallwarts of like TV
Speaker 2: News and Morning TV and all that saying goodbye, I
Speaker 2: mean for very similar reasons. One it's like are they
Speaker 2: aging out? And two these contracts are so I mean,
Speaker 2: they make the point here that on GMA, their morning
Speaker 2: team costs Disney more than seventy five million dollars.
Speaker 1: Strahan and uh Roberts, Oh my god, they have insane salaries.
Speaker 1: And like you said, the news, ABC News runs GMA,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure NBC News runs the Today Show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's really hard to justify those salaries in today's climate
Speaker 1: of trying to get eyeballs.
Speaker 2: I was thinking about this as well with the Ellen
Speaker 2: Degenerous special got released on Netflix a couple days ago
Speaker 2: on September twenty fourth. I think it premiered extra views,
Speaker 2: very mixed reviews. I tried to watch it, you did,
Speaker 2: I used to. I was a big fan of Ellen's
Speaker 2: stand up years ago, her Here and Now special, if
Speaker 2: anyone has ever seen it on HBO. My sister and
Speaker 2: I loved that special. We watched we were like young.
Speaker 2: We watched it over and over again because it and
Speaker 2: we could watch it because it was pretty clean humor.
Speaker 2: You know, Ellen was known for that. The special is
Speaker 2: like largely about like she jokes about the way light
Speaker 2: bulbs are packaged and our voicemail voices and all this
Speaker 2: really family friendly stuff. So our parents let us watch it,
Speaker 2: and I thought, you know, I don't even really care
Speaker 2: how much Ellen like addresses the cancel her being canceled
Speaker 2: kind of thing. I just wanted to see if she
Speaker 2: had to get another good stand up special. So I
Speaker 2: tried to watch it, and probably like everybody today, I
Speaker 2: gave it about fifteen minutes and I wasn't really laughing,
Speaker 2: and so I thought, Okay, I'm gonna turn this off.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm I'm not really laughing, I'm gonna go
Speaker 2: And so I didn't even get to the part where
Speaker 2: she talked about her career and everything that had happened. Really,
Speaker 2: but one thing that I take away from that is
Speaker 2: whatever you go through in your career ups and downs.
Speaker 2: In this industry and maybe in any industry, it's all
Speaker 2: about what kind of content you try to come back with,
Speaker 2: Like Will Smith after the slap. I don't think Will
Speaker 2: Smith is fully back. I don't he hasn't really done
Speaker 2: an interview. I think there's still a lot of controversy
Speaker 2: around that. In the moment, I thought that that whole
Speaker 2: moment was horrifying the fact that he physically assaulted someone
Speaker 2: on stage and then everybody in the room was still
Speaker 2: okay with him getting up and giving a speech and
Speaker 2: accepting an award. It was wild to me, and I
Speaker 2: get that in the moment, it was probably you know,
Speaker 2: you're having a live show and it's hard to make
Speaker 2: the right decision and it's very stressful. But it wasn't
Speaker 2: the right decision for him to go up there. But
Speaker 2: what he has come back with was he had the
Speaker 2: new Bad Boys movie this summer, and at the end
Speaker 2: of the day, it was a good movie. I guess
Speaker 2: people went to see it. It did huge box office and
Speaker 2: he made a movie that people enjoyed. So do I
Speaker 2: think that that is like step one on him maybe
Speaker 2: coming back, Yes, because now he can point to well,
Speaker 2: the most recent thing I did was a hit movie Ellen.
Speaker 2: I don't think This Special is that hit. I don't
Speaker 2: think it was funny and I don't think it was
Speaker 2: like it makes me sad because I don't think Look,
Speaker 2: whatever you want to think about Ellen. I do think
Speaker 2: some of that was true about the way that she
Speaker 2: treated people, but I also think she made great strides
Speaker 2: for the gay community. She had a great hit sitcom,
Speaker 2: she was very funny, and she did do a lot
Speaker 2: of good things over the years. So she's, you know,
Speaker 2: a mixed and dynamic person, but she is not going
Speaker 2: out on the note the way that Hoda is. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and that is kind of sad.
Speaker 1: It's hard to Yeah, it's hard to go out on top.
Speaker 1: It's hard to go out your way. As you've always said,
Speaker 1: things in for a reason and usually when they end,
Speaker 1: it's not because of a good thing. And so it
Speaker 1: is very rare in sports.
Speaker 2: If something's ending, it's not usually not for a good reason.
Speaker 1: And sports, in any industry, you look at how many
Speaker 1: people go out on top, and there's very few that
Speaker 1: go out like, you know, like our friend Andrew Whitworth.
Speaker 1: It's like I won a Super Bowl, I'm done. I'm
Speaker 1: going to go into the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 2: Play.
Speaker 1: Yeah, John Elway did this. Uh and now you see
Speaker 1: it in movies and all that's like do you hang
Speaker 1: on for that last fight? And you're like, oh, like
Speaker 1: I didn't need to see Jordan in a Washington Wizard's jersey.
Speaker 2: They have come back again. No, no, he should. But
Speaker 2: but look now he's going to have another career as
Speaker 2: a broadcaster.
Speaker 1: By the way, noe to since we're talking media, we
Speaker 1: are a month into this now. He's done four or
Speaker 1: five games, remarkably gotten better market. Yes, quick, Learner are
Speaker 1: doing good? You know, are you? You critiqued him, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I critiqued him, and he's he had a lot of
Speaker 1: work to do and he's done it. He found his voice,
Speaker 1: he found his cadence, he found his rhythm. He's got
Speaker 1: his confidence. He just needed to needed that. You know,
Speaker 1: we call it happy feet when you're in the pocket
Speaker 1: and you're kind of unsure as a quarterback. He's settled
Speaker 1: down now. But look, I also think that when you're
Speaker 1: talking about astronomical salaries, he got one. And is anybody
Speaker 1: watching a game because you might hear the Tom Brady's
Speaker 1: on it. That's that's what I think Fox Sports or
Speaker 1: whoever his whip is going.
Speaker 2: To find out his salary is a sportscaster.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, you look it like interesting, it's yeah,
Speaker 1: it was over three hundred million or something. Just absolutely
Speaker 1: insane that I just can't fathom that that sports will
Speaker 1: ever get back. And I don't know how it was
Speaker 1: structured or whatever, but the numbers that was that were
Speaker 1: in the headlines were amazing. But as much as I
Speaker 1: like Tom Brady and he's doing a good job, I
Speaker 1: don't look.
Speaker 2: First Sports illustrated. I'll just interrupt you to give this
Speaker 2: number because it's more than either of us realized.
Speaker 1: He was three seventeen or something.
Speaker 2: For a ten year contract with Fox, which wild to
Speaker 2: sign on for ten years. That's a long time contract.
Speaker 1: I think they did it so they could disperse that money.
Speaker 1: He'll he'll probably not do it for ten years.
Speaker 2: But three, well, Tom, three one hundred and seventy five
Speaker 2: million dollars.
Speaker 1: Good lord.
Speaker 2: And see that's why when people are rena go siating
Speaker 2: like Hoder or whoever. Like I said, on the one hand,
Speaker 2: of twenty million dollars a year salary seems wild, and
Speaker 2: on the other hand, they're sitting here saying, but look
Speaker 2: how much money you have still overall, even though you're
Speaker 2: saying the industry's declining. I see it both ways.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's you know, I don't know anybody, any
Speaker 1: of my friends, any or women who think, hey, I
Speaker 1: wonder what game tom Brady's doing, I'm going to watch
Speaker 1: that game. So like, no, I'm from Dallas, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: watch the Cowboys, or oh tom Brady's doing that, or
Speaker 1: Tony Romo's doing it. I'm not going to turn a
Speaker 1: game hon Or off because of the announcer. That's That's
Speaker 1: going to be the interesting thing with Tom Brady. I
Speaker 1: think though that he was a property that everyone just
Speaker 1: felt like, we're not sure exactly how it's going to
Speaker 1: pay up, but we just need to own the greatest
Speaker 1: of all time. He's for sale. Let's buy him to Yeah,
Speaker 1: I get it, but I don't get it.
Speaker 2: Do you have the sense with how much better he's gotten,
Speaker 2: even in a short amount of time, that he will
Speaker 2: be one of those because I know you have every Elliston.
Speaker 2: I know this about sports. Guys have their whoever like sports,
Speaker 2: have their commonators that they like to like, hear their
Speaker 2: opinion on things. Is he going to be one of
Speaker 2: those people. Is are you going to want the Tom
Speaker 2: Brady take on things or is it just site? You
Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, no in sight versus opinion.
Speaker 1: I don't, you know, he's not a Colin Cowhert or
Speaker 1: something like that, where I love Collin's opinions and watch
Speaker 1: him and I think he has a good take. Tom
Speaker 1: Brady isn't like I have a hot take. And honestly, Tom, yeah,
Speaker 1: And honestly, what's more important in sports is the play
Speaker 1: by play guy. That's the you know, the color analyst
Speaker 1: that and I think there's some good ones out there.
Speaker 1: Traeikman is going to be on tonight with Joe Buck.
Speaker 1: I think that's a great team. And you have some
Speaker 1: other ones with Tom Brady, have Tony Romo and guys
Speaker 1: that you know, these guys that have left the field
Speaker 1: and they do a great job. But the play by
Speaker 1: play guy, the al Michaels of the World's the Joe Bucks,
Speaker 1: the uh, you know, Bob Costas was a classic one
Speaker 1: back in the day. Those are the guys. Mike Trico
Speaker 1: is another great one right now, They really their voice
Speaker 1: is the voice of the highlight, right They're the one
Speaker 1: calling the game. They're in the activity that excitement. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so they're the.
Speaker 2: Ones getting down the field.
Speaker 1: Is that it was it nineteen forty Yes, Hell, he's
Speaker 1: running down the field.
Speaker 2: In my mind the highlight eyes like that trans Atlantic
Speaker 2: look at their.
Speaker 1: Gams on that one.
Speaker 2: There I go.
Speaker 1: You just listen to the Kentucky Derby in nineteen thirty seven.
Speaker 2: Like my most recent sports movies are like, what's that?
Speaker 2: What's the no crying in baseball?
Speaker 1: Oh? Their own with Tom Hanks.
Speaker 2: I do want to say one thing about the Ellen
Speaker 2: thing though, because I said it's kind of sad before,
Speaker 2: and I do want to give this perspective and my way,
Speaker 2: did you you? You were on Allen many times, so
Speaker 2: here's but you didn't have bad experience.
Speaker 1: I have such mixed feelings about Ellen because I'm biased.
Speaker 1: I like Ellen. I was on her show gosh if
Speaker 1: I'm just guessing a dozen times, and even when the
Speaker 1: late Great Twitch her DJ DJ, he was off and
Speaker 1: I did a fill in thing where I was like
Speaker 1: I would dress people were coming on dressed up, and
Speaker 1: I dressed up as a panda and I sat in
Speaker 1: twitches like DJ, and she would try to guess throughout
Speaker 1: the show who the DJ was, and so I did
Speaker 1: stuff like that for Ellen. I did a bunch of
Speaker 1: like little vignettes for her.
Speaker 2: She was very into the Bachelor world.
Speaker 1: She was very into the Bachelor world. And then we
Speaker 1: kind of befriended each other. We played we were in
Speaker 1: a poker game together. We played poker together a few times,
Speaker 1: and we just every time we ran into each other.
Speaker 1: I found her very friendly. She was very kind to me.
Speaker 1: We had a relationship on the air, but a little
Speaker 1: bit of a relationship off the air. So I've always
Speaker 1: been a little biased that I have been a fan
Speaker 1: of Ellen.
Speaker 2: But that's true, and that's what I mean. I'm like,
Speaker 2: I don't and when you're someone that big, again, all
Speaker 2: these things can be true and it doesn't make her
Speaker 2: inherently a bad person, Like I don't think Ellen's evil,
Speaker 2: you know when people and I think people tried to
Speaker 2: paint her that way.
Speaker 1: And people need the either or thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I just want to add the note of
Speaker 2: even though I didn't love this latest special from the
Speaker 2: parts I watched, we still don't know how Ellen will
Speaker 2: be remembered overall. Like by that, I mean time changes everything,
Speaker 2: Like you know, think of like how a movie can
Speaker 2: be called a cult classic. Like maybe when the movie
Speaker 2: came out it bombed to the box office, but then
Speaker 2: over the years people created the spandom and realized, oh wait,
Speaker 2: that was actually a great movie, and now they quoted
Speaker 2: and it's beloved. We don't know. Ellen's career spanned decades.
Speaker 2: She did a sitcom, she did Finding Nemo Movies, she
Speaker 2: did her show, her talk show. So I just think
Speaker 2: we're going to need more time to see and I
Speaker 2: predict that in the future we'll look back and people
Speaker 2: will have more fondness and they will say that that
Speaker 2: little blip of the ending of it, doesn't she That's
Speaker 2: not how it will be.
Speaker 1: She was a groundbreaker and innovator, breaking into the late
Speaker 1: night shows and then and it's kind of.
Speaker 2: Fair to me to take away all of the bravery
Speaker 2: that she had, Yeah, announcing she was gay on television
Speaker 2: and getting show canceled over it. I don't want to
Speaker 2: take that moment from her.
Speaker 1: It was incredible, And look, she was an innovator. We
Speaker 1: were all looking for the next Oprah, and she stepped
Speaker 1: into those shoes in a very different way, found her
Speaker 1: own her own beat. Everyone tried to be Oprah. Instead,
Speaker 1: Ellen became Ellen and had a successful, you know, talk show,
Speaker 1: which is virtually impossible to do and make it successful.
Speaker 1: So I've always been a fan. She was always good
Speaker 1: to me and good to the franchise, and so I've
Speaker 1: always been a little biased in that regard, and so
Speaker 1: I wish her well and I will remember her fondly
Speaker 1: as a pretty good poker player too. There was a
Speaker 1: little bit of controversy on Dancing with the Stars. Did
Speaker 1: you see this with Anna Delvi?
Speaker 2: I saw the briefest of clips. I have not been
Speaker 2: watching this season, but Anna Delvey, the infamous alleged scammer,
Speaker 2: well convicted, convicted of st I get you know, I'm
Speaker 2: always careful.
Speaker 1: I want to this was legit. She was convicted.
Speaker 2: So she's on the show, but did not make it
Speaker 2: very long. I don't think the season has been airing
Speaker 2: that long. And she was eliminated. Yeah, and walk us
Speaker 2: through what she said?
Speaker 1: Well, she she basically had this quote at the end
Speaker 1: where they, you know, I think it was Julian Huff
Speaker 1: They give the brief goodbye, Yeah, the brief goodbye.
Speaker 2: It's do you have any words about the show, And she's.
Speaker 1: Like, you know, do you have any takeaways or do
Speaker 1: you have any words?
Speaker 2: What did the show teach you?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Nothing?
Speaker 2: She literally said, quote nothing and the show ended.
Speaker 1: And now you know, she has kind of come out
Speaker 1: and said the show used her. I painted her in
Speaker 1: a bad light. They just used her for ratings.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry. What does she think being on this show? Is?
Speaker 1: Well? What's funny is and bless her heart, I think
Speaker 1: she's kind of so delusional that she actually believes she's like, well,
Speaker 1: the reason I didn't stay on and people like Eric
Speaker 1: Roberts and others that got worse scores than I did,
Speaker 1: my viewers and my fans, my people are younger.
Speaker 2: Maybe she doesn't realize. I don't think she has a fandom.
Speaker 2: I think she has people interested in the drama of
Speaker 2: the story that she created and what she did, and
Speaker 2: it's salacious. But that's different than having fans.
Speaker 1: ABC isn't going to do anything if it's not for ratings.
Speaker 1: That's the point. Dancing with the Stars is having, by
Speaker 1: the way, a resurgence. It's having one of its best
Speaker 1: ratings years in quite some time. The last week's ratings
Speaker 1: were a point seven six four point eight million, That
Speaker 1: is just above Survivor as the number one show. Survivor
Speaker 1: does a point seven to two with four point four million.
Speaker 1: That is staggering, huge numbers. And so Anna, you were
Speaker 1: a part of feeding that flame. Your scandal was a
Speaker 1: part of that. I think maybe she thought this is
Speaker 1: going to be a big redemption to her and people
Speaker 1: are going to fall in love with me as I
Speaker 1: dance around with my anklet. She has to wear a
Speaker 1: she's at home whatever.
Speaker 2: Home monitor, which was a brilliant move. Now I can
Speaker 2: hear in her. I'm reading a quote here from she
Speaker 2: was on Tory's Spellings podcast and she said that you
Speaker 2: guys told me what I'm supposed to do. I tried
Speaker 2: to do it, and then I was still rejected. And
Speaker 2: I'm taking away nothing. This is what I'm taking away
Speaker 2: from it because your advice was worthless. The advice did
Speaker 2: not pay off for me, even though I tried to
Speaker 2: follow it. So you tell me what you're hearing in that,
Speaker 2: because what I'm hearing in that is I can hear
Speaker 2: the producers telling her this is going to be a
Speaker 2: redemption story for you, like you can win over the
Speaker 2: hearts of America.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, And so I know what I'm telling her
Speaker 1: I do know. Okay, look, I'll defend her in this.
Speaker 1: I know how it was sold to you. Anna, I
Speaker 1: know what they told you. But whoever your people are
Speaker 1: around you, you have to be more savvy than that.
Speaker 1: You were coming on for one reason. And if you've
Speaker 1: if you've ever seen the show, and she claims she's
Speaker 1: never really seen the show before, which that's on you.
Speaker 1: Then it's been on for twenty years.
Speaker 2: Do you research?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's on you. They weren't going to paint you
Speaker 1: as this great redemption story. That's not what it was about.
Speaker 1: You're a convicted felon, so that was the story. But
Speaker 1: I will also say this they needed because that's the
Speaker 1: thing with days, with the stories. It can't all be
Speaker 1: great stories.
Speaker 2: Well, and they can't all be the same type of person.
Speaker 2: But here's the thing. They're not going to shine a
Speaker 2: gentle spotlight on you. But I will say this, and
Speaker 2: I haven't seen how they painted or I haven't seen
Speaker 2: the packages, so I guess I didn't do my research
Speaker 2: on this one. But the redemption story is also on
Speaker 2: you to show that you want to be redeemed. Like
Speaker 2: another thing I'm not hearing in these quotes that she's
Speaker 2: saying yeah, and hey, look she's staying on her own brand.
Speaker 2: But she is, like she said, quote that the show
Speaker 2: is a waste of time. She said, it is what
Speaker 2: it is, and it's fine. I never had high expectations
Speaker 2: on the show for myself. Well okay, I mean, if
Speaker 2: you're going to treat it that way, like for it
Speaker 2: to be a redemption story, one, they are selling it
Speaker 2: to you that way, and so they're selling it. But
Speaker 2: if you want it to be that, you have to
Speaker 2: create that too, Like you have to be vulnerable and
Speaker 2: dig in and open up and show that you're sorry.
Speaker 2: And I don't know that she's done that. And that
Speaker 2: can go either way. Either she could have shown she
Speaker 2: was sorry and really gotten something off the show, or
Speaker 2: she's going to stay on Brandon's Annadelvi and people will
Speaker 2: like laugh about her wild comments, just like we're doing now,
Speaker 2: and maybe that'll.
Speaker 1: Take her something, I mean a little bit in her defense.
Speaker 1: You know, I think everybody has this idea when you
Speaker 1: go on reality TV that you have any amount of
Speaker 1: say and how your power, any power or any say,
Speaker 1: and how you're being portrayed. I'm sure she probably gave
Speaker 1: it the first week to see, oh, you know, they're
Speaker 1: asking me these questions, and I'm she may very well
Speaker 1: may have in all those interviews with the producers been
Speaker 1: very contrite, very loving, very glowing about Dancing with the Stars.
Speaker 1: They took it in the direction they wanted to. The
Speaker 1: producers decide how you're going to be portrayed. Every reality
Speaker 1: show is the same. This isn't just on ABC, but
Speaker 1: I know ABC does this. They're going to portray you
Speaker 1: how they want. And so your videos, what your dancers
Speaker 1: are saying, how the judges talk about you, all that
Speaker 1: has been decided by producers. So look, the deck was
Speaker 1: stacked again. But she should have known that coming in
Speaker 1: she was going to have to do a thousand times
Speaker 1: more to be have any sort of redemption. We've seen
Speaker 1: this season for twenty years. You knew what was going
Speaker 1: to happen. So Anna, you know, buyer beware and just
Speaker 1: coming in saying claiming ignorance. That doesn't fly with me,
Speaker 1: you know now in reality TV, and she should know.
Speaker 1: Ratings wise, by the way, I was just I did
Speaker 1: a deep dive on this. I was kind of interested
Speaker 1: because Dancing with the Stars is doing so well, and
Speaker 1: I say well as a relative term these days, because
Speaker 1: just ratings around the globe are just kind of dismal,
Speaker 1: but Dancing with the Stars and Survivor are very much
Speaker 1: at the top. Big Brother is still right there kind
Speaker 1: of in that number three spot with a point five
Speaker 1: seven three million viewers. Then you go down to Mass Singer,
Speaker 1: which just debuted again, which I remember everybody just laughing
Speaker 1: about that show that there's no way it was going
Speaker 1: to work, and man, it really has hung on. At
Speaker 1: the very bottom of the barrel is The Golden Bachelorette.
Speaker 1: Some of the worst ratings the franchise has ever had.
Speaker 2: It I think it was. I did see it started.
Speaker 2: It was the worst premiere ever.
Speaker 1: It started at a point two and it did go
Speaker 1: up to a point three, but still under three million viewers.
Speaker 2: So that's at a point three in Dancing was it
Speaker 2: a point seven? Yes, Oh that's a big difference.
Speaker 1: Two wow. So it's really really bad, kind of a
Speaker 1: disaster for the franchise. But the overall, I would say
Speaker 1: reality is strong, and you see some of the Pillars
Speaker 1: Survivors still holding on doing what they do best. And
Speaker 1: and I'm happy because Alfonso Roberto is hosting that with
Speaker 1: Julianne and it's doing well. So dancing has come back.
Speaker 1: So congrats to them for the resurgence. And Anna, did
Speaker 1: they do it at your expense? They did? And you
Speaker 1: should have known.
Speaker 2: One last headline unless you have anymore. But Kristin Cavaleri
Speaker 2: revealing this, I was going to surprise you with this.
Speaker 2: She has broken up with Mark Estes. They broke up
Speaker 2: after just seven months of dating. And you know, they
Speaker 2: made headlines for their age gap. He is twenty four,
Speaker 2: she is thirty seven. And we had talked about their
Speaker 2: relationship a little bit because obviously we have an age gap.
Speaker 2: But my rule is always I don't think age gap
Speaker 2: relationships should happen with people in their early twenties. Your
Speaker 2: brain isn't even fully developed yet. And so am I
Speaker 2: surprised that they broke up.
Speaker 1: No, he's a year older than our son. Think about that.
Speaker 1: If my son, if Joshua came over and said, hey guy,
Speaker 1: Christi Cavaler, if josh came home, that puts it in perspective.
Speaker 1: They're thee and if he was dating a thirty seven
Speaker 1: year old, I would really really need to know how
Speaker 1: they met, what they have in common, This what this
Speaker 1: relationship is based on. Because he's at a very he
Speaker 1: just graduated college and he's starting his career. This guy,
Speaker 1: I know he's a TikToker, but that's a very tough
Speaker 1: thing to figure out what your relationship is going to
Speaker 1: be based on.
Speaker 2: Look, the way that I always viewed it was this
Speaker 2: was a bit of like a rebound starting to get
Speaker 2: back into dating relationship for her post divorce, and no
Speaker 2: part of me is shocked that they broke up after
Speaker 2: seven months.
Speaker 1: I have one more thing to quote to ask you about. Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm very interested Taylor Swift and Travis Kelcey. You remember
Speaker 1: the pack, the breakup pack that leaked allegedly that they
Speaker 1: were going to break up on September twenty eighth.
Speaker 2: Yes, it was like footage of an alleged PR document which.
Speaker 1: Just reallyreaked a fake. Freaked a fake to me, Yes,
Speaker 1: yeahreaked a fake.
Speaker 2: I guess what PR company is going to put it
Speaker 2: the top of a document secret and confidential Travis and
Speaker 2: Taylor breakup plan? Like what?
Speaker 1: Welldon Lowrenzima, how come we haven't seen them together since
Speaker 1: September twenty eighth. She hasn't been to his games, she
Speaker 1: didn't go to his big acting debut of Grotesque ESK
Speaker 1: or whatever.
Speaker 2: Oh the grotesque ye show.
Speaker 1: She wasn't there. Allegedly she's getting ready to continue the
Speaker 1: Era's tour and she's working, but she has not been
Speaker 1: around and we have not seen them. So at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, is the joke on us.
Speaker 2: Well, wouldn't it be silly once that leaked for them
Speaker 2: to still break up September?
Speaker 1: Contract's a contract, I guess. Oh wow, good guys. In
Speaker 1: her defense, they're like, well, she wasn't at the game,
Speaker 1: you know, in La against the.
Speaker 2: City every game.
Speaker 1: Yeah, my god, she can't be the constant cheerleader. And
Speaker 1: by the way, I didn't even watch that game. It
Speaker 1: wasn't a great football game. So you can't expect her
Speaker 1: to care about all of them. And I think it's
Speaker 1: unfair to put that on her, like you need to
Speaker 1: show up at everything, or he needs to show up
Speaker 1: at everything for her. But it is funny that people
Speaker 1: are the murmurs are like, well, you know, we haven't
Speaker 1: seen them since that alleged date.
Speaker 2: She didn't go to the TV show premiere with him. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's a little surprising because that feels like it's like
Speaker 2: a big job. Yeah, huh.
Speaker 1: So there you go, just food for thought.
Speaker 2: The seeds are planted, anything's possible, things possible. We'll see
Speaker 2: what happens.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 2: Thank you everybody. We always love talking to you, and
Speaker 2: we will talk to you next.
Speaker 1: Time because we got a lot more to talk about.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram at the most
Speaker 1: dramatic pod ever and make sure to write us a
Speaker 1: review and leave us five stars. I'll talk to you
Speaker 1: next time.