WEBVTT - An Empowerment Guide for Women on How to Prioritize a Career Path

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news.

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<v Speaker 2>This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Tim

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<v Speaker 2>Stenebek on Bloomberg Radio.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, she's a woman in the world, got you knows it?

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, So how's this for a little career advice, Carol,

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<v Speaker 2>think of yourself as a growth stock. Okay, flicking video,

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<v Speaker 2>that's a growth stock. Embrace steering through skids, so kind

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<v Speaker 2>of embrace the moments where you're feel like you're kind

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<v Speaker 2>of getting off your path and steering out of control.

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<v Speaker 2>Beware of managers who keep you from growing. So if

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<v Speaker 2>you're good at your job, your manager might keep you

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<v Speaker 2>in that place and then you're not going to grow

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<v Speaker 2>and do other stuff, which I think is a really

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<v Speaker 2>important trap to watch.

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<v Speaker 4>Uh.

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<v Speaker 2>And oh, how about not faking it until you make it?

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<v Speaker 1>This is what I want to dig into. That one

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<v Speaker 1>kind of blows my mind because we talk about the

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<v Speaker 1>difference between men and women and faking it till you

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<v Speaker 1>make it. Those are just some of the tips from

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<v Speaker 1>the new book written by our next guest, which, by

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<v Speaker 1>the way, no a thing or two about climbing the

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<v Speaker 1>corporate ladder. Between them, they have got decades of experience

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<v Speaker 1>in senior positions at United Airlines, Craft Foods, Toilette, Motorola, McKinsey,

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<v Speaker 1>and Moore.

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<v Speaker 2>Grace Puma is the former Chief Operations Officer at PEPSI COO.

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<v Speaker 2>And Christina Christiana Smith, she is the former president of

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<v Speaker 2>the Consumer Direct Division at Nike. The new book it's

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<v Speaker 2>called Career Forward Strategies from Women Who've Made It. Grace

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<v Speaker 2>joins us from Tampa, Florida, and we got Christina from Portland, Oregon.

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<v Speaker 2>Good to have you both with us this afternoon. So Grace,

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<v Speaker 2>I just want to start with you and we're going

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<v Speaker 2>to get to the book in just a second, but

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<v Speaker 2>we got to talk about the consumer space because the

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<v Speaker 2>two of you have just so much experience when it

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<v Speaker 2>comes to working for companies that go directly to consumer,

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<v Speaker 2>companies that have relationships with consumer, and we talked about

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<v Speaker 2>the consumer all the time powering this economy. Grace, what

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<v Speaker 2>out there is interesting to you about the consumer space

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<v Speaker 2>or in the consumer space right now?

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<v Speaker 4>Well, I think the consumer is going through, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>some challenging times right now. For one thing, they're certainly

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<v Speaker 4>dealing with this economic uncertainty and so the shifts and

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<v Speaker 4>what they're buying and how they're spending their money is

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<v Speaker 4>certainly a factor. But you're also really seeing people start

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<v Speaker 4>to get a little more nervous about their job security,

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<v Speaker 4>and I think that factors as well into how consumers

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<v Speaker 4>are thinking about their purchases.

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<v Speaker 1>Christiana, come on in on that as well, and your

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<v Speaker 1>take on the consumer. You guys really do have some

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<v Speaker 1>an incredible vantage point in terms of what you've seen

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<v Speaker 1>and how you think about the space and where it's going.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, you know, obviously everyone's got their own opinions. I

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<v Speaker 3>would say from what I see on a day to

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<v Speaker 3>day basis, the consumer is still voting with their dollars

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<v Speaker 3>for brands they love. So if there was ever a

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<v Speaker 3>time to make sure that you know, from a brand

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<v Speaker 3>point of view, you were connecting with your consumers and

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<v Speaker 3>you were projecting that the image that you at that

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<v Speaker 3>time is now.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, and I think about you know, when it comes

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<v Speaker 1>to brands too, Grace, let me go back to you,

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<v Speaker 1>if we may ingest the importance of women and thinking

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<v Speaker 1>about women purchasing and their purchasing power or they're purchasing

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<v Speaker 1>power for their families, and I do wonder how you

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<v Speaker 1>both Okay, So that's kind of just in terms of

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<v Speaker 1>the brand approach, but how you guys have thought about

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<v Speaker 1>your own specific experiences and whether or not there were

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<v Speaker 1>commonalities that you found between each other in terms of

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<v Speaker 1>what worked. So Grace start there as you guys were

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<v Speaker 1>starting to put this book together, the commonalities you found,

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<v Speaker 1>the differences you found in kind of your way forward.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, you know, this book kind of got birked on

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<v Speaker 4>the fact that we had Matt when we were both

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<v Speaker 4>on a corporate board and one day we went out

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<v Speaker 4>after the meeting and really connected, and it connected around

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<v Speaker 4>identifying that although we took very different paths to achieve

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<v Speaker 4>what we achieved some of the top levels and in

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<v Speaker 4>different corporations, we had some of the same learnings and

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<v Speaker 4>some of the same truths. And then you add to

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<v Speaker 4>that that we both have it's hard to call them

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<v Speaker 4>millennial children, but children that are now in their thirties

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<v Speaker 4>and having their own career paths, and we really wanted

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<v Speaker 4>to transfer the knowledge and the learning that we felt

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<v Speaker 4>really could be helpful as they set their own path.

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<v Speaker 2>I should note that you guys are still on some

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<v Speaker 2>pretty pretty interesting boards. Grace is on the board of Target,

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<v Speaker 2>among others. Christiana on Columbia Sports, where Ups West Marine,

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<v Speaker 2>to name a couple others. So yeah, I mean definitely

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<v Speaker 2>still in the consumer space right now, no question.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, exactly, Christiana, So come on in too. Like, as

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<v Speaker 1>you guys were putting together the book, what did you

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<v Speaker 1>want to make sure was kind of in the messaging

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<v Speaker 1>here from your own experience?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I think we had a really strong goal to

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<v Speaker 3>address this moment in time as well as just share,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, decades of career experience learning that Grace and

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<v Speaker 3>I had. And as Grace said, even though her path

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<v Speaker 3>was very much through some of the top CORP corporate

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<v Speaker 3>brands and companies, mine was consulting for over twenty years

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<v Speaker 3>and then a C three job at Nike, we had

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<v Speaker 3>similar takeaways about how to build a career that you

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<v Speaker 3>love and how to make it worth it. And when

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<v Speaker 3>we first started writing the book, we were still in

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<v Speaker 3>the pandemic, and there was of course all this talk

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<v Speaker 3>about women falling out of the workforce because they couldn't

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<v Speaker 3>make the childcare life work balance work. And then there

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<v Speaker 3>was quiet quitting, and there was just act your wage.

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<v Speaker 3>There's so many things right now that show in this

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<v Speaker 3>moment a need to talk about how you can still

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<v Speaker 3>invest in yourself and still have a great career while

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<v Speaker 3>meeting this moment and balancing all the other forces that

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<v Speaker 3>are at work in your life.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, we wanted to.

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<v Speaker 1>Do some of the specifics, but I wondered, Grace, if

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<v Speaker 1>I said, luck, skill, timing, what was the most important

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<v Speaker 1>thing in your career path?

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<v Speaker 4>That's a great question. I would probably say to me

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<v Speaker 4>all of it too.

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<v Speaker 1>Skill.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, no, I think it's skill, and I think it's

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<v Speaker 4>about not just you're not boring with the skill, Okay,

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<v Speaker 4>it's cultivating skill reevaluating what the next skill or capability

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<v Speaker 4>is needed or will be needed. So it's an ongoing

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<v Speaker 4>commitment to learning. And we talk a lot about that

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<v Speaker 4>in our book, and to read the tea leaves on

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<v Speaker 4>what is necessary and valuable in those skill sets.

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<v Speaker 3>Same thing to you, Christian, And if I could, yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>please do you mind? If yeah, it's going to say,

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<v Speaker 3>do you mind if I jump in on that? Going

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<v Speaker 3>even a step further with Grace, and I believe is

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<v Speaker 3>you can do a lot more than you think to

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<v Speaker 3>create your own luck. What do you mean when we

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<v Speaker 3>talk about when we talk about people we see at

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<v Speaker 3>work and we say, oh, she's so lucky she got

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<v Speaker 3>that project. He's so lucky that story hit right at

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<v Speaker 3>the right time, whatever it is. But you roll the

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<v Speaker 3>tape back, you realize they invested in building their network

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<v Speaker 3>inside and outside the company. They invested in knowing things

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<v Speaker 3>that are important, and at that moment in time, they

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<v Speaker 3>demonstrated performance. That's when opportunities tend to come to you.

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<v Speaker 3>And then we say the key is do you hear

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<v Speaker 3>the knock on the door when opportunity is knocking, and

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<v Speaker 3>do you answer it right? That's timing. So there's clearly

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<v Speaker 3>serendipity in your career, there's no question. But you can

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<v Speaker 3>do an awful lot to be in the right place

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<v Speaker 3>at the right time through the steps that you take

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<v Speaker 3>to invest in yourself well.

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<v Speaker 1>And some would say, I'm trying to think whether I

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<v Speaker 1>want to think our leader or book or other books

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<v Speaker 1>that about this whole idea of being the first one

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<v Speaker 1>at the office, being the last one to leave. And

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<v Speaker 1>sometimes you can't do that, but it's certainly early on

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<v Speaker 1>your career things will People will move around and be like,

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<v Speaker 1>who's here, who can do this? You're here because you're

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<v Speaker 1>here early and you're here late. And it's as simple

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<v Speaker 1>sometimes as something like that.

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<v Speaker 2>It is, but I'm wondering and I want to go

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<v Speaker 2>to you grace first on this one. If in an

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<v Speaker 2>era of hybrid and remote work, that that is more

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<v Speaker 2>of an issue because you're not going to run into

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<v Speaker 2>the boss on the zoom. You're only going to run

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<v Speaker 2>into the boss, you know, at the water cooler, if

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<v Speaker 2>you're physically around the boss. And there's an entire generation

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<v Speaker 2>really brought you know, who graduated in the last four

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<v Speaker 2>years that that don't have the same idea of going

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<v Speaker 2>to the office that I think a lot of us

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<v Speaker 2>grew up with.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I mean no doubt, and certainly, you know, during

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<v Speaker 4>the time that we had been in a lot of

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<v Speaker 4>our career, it was an opportunity, you know, your first

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<v Speaker 4>and first out. But today is very different and you know,

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<v Speaker 4>I definitely think, you know, addressing the virtual world, there

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<v Speaker 4>is still a need to ensure connection, and connection through

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<v Speaker 4>work is really the best connection. But making sure that

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<v Speaker 4>you're where you need to be and that you're contributing

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<v Speaker 4>in those moments and that you're establishing relationships. You hear

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<v Speaker 4>a lot of people in the hybrid work right now

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<v Speaker 4>going out and even meeting with colleagues outside of work,

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<v Speaker 4>just to make sure they have a connection. But I

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<v Speaker 4>think what you said earlier, you know, we talk about

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<v Speaker 4>this concept of growth stock that's more important, I think

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<v Speaker 4>than the FaceTime and we talk about it. Yeah, I do,

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<v Speaker 4>because we talk about it in the book about And

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<v Speaker 4>let me just take a minute on it. If you

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<v Speaker 4>think about a growth stock, a growth stock, you can

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<v Speaker 4>think of any company that comes to mind. Let's take

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<v Speaker 4>Apple for example. They tend to grow at a much

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<v Speaker 4>faster pace in their competitors, and they do that by

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<v Speaker 4>reinventing themselves, by looking around the corner, and by investing

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<v Speaker 4>in the right things. So when you apply that to yourself,

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<v Speaker 4>whether you're working virtually or in the office, you're going

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<v Speaker 4>to adopt a mentality that says, you know, I want

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<v Speaker 4>to no matter where I am, no matter how well

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<v Speaker 4>I'm doing in my current job, I'm going to be

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<v Speaker 4>thinking future forward, and I'm going to be cultivating and

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<v Speaker 4>growing and investing in the type of things that I

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<v Speaker 4>need to be able to learn and contribute at a

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<v Speaker 4>higher rate. And those often lead to opportunities and career

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<v Speaker 4>progression along your journey.

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<v Speaker 1>So Christian and it's kind of like, you know, don't

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<v Speaker 1>wait for someone to tell you what you need to do.

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<v Speaker 1>Look around you and figure out what you need to

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<v Speaker 1>do to either get to the next level, or the

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<v Speaker 1>next position, or the next opportunity.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, we would definitely agree with that notion of staying curious,

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<v Speaker 3>of thinking ahead of planning a bit in terms of saying, Hey,

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<v Speaker 3>this year, what are my goals in terms of skills

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<v Speaker 3>I'm going to need to build, what are my goals

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<v Speaker 3>in terms of people I want to get to know,

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<v Speaker 3>And in the spirit of meet the moment, we would

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<v Speaker 3>also say make the most of the opportunities that you

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<v Speaker 3>do have. So specifically in this hybrid and remote work environment,

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<v Speaker 3>you may not, as Grace noted, have as many chances

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<v Speaker 3>to just hang around the water cooler, but you're on

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<v Speaker 3>zoom all the time. There's one way you can approach

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<v Speaker 3>those meetings like, oh, I got another zoom, I'm going

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<v Speaker 3>to turn off my camera. I'm going to be doing

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<v Speaker 3>my email while the meeting's going until they hear them

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<v Speaker 3>call my name, all that kind of thing. We've all

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<v Speaker 3>been there. Those are really important opportunities. There are other

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<v Speaker 3>people on that call, and there are other chances that

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<v Speaker 3>you've got to show up. So we would just also say,

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<v Speaker 3>make the most of the chances that you get. If

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<v Speaker 3>you're in the room, you're there for a reason, speak up, participate.

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<v Speaker 3>That room nowadays may be virtual, but it's really important

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<v Speaker 3>that if you're there, you're noted.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a really good point do.

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<v Speaker 2>I just think talking to colleagues at other companies, people

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<v Speaker 2>who work in other industries, like, there's definitely a culture

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<v Speaker 2>at some places where the camera's on or the camera's off.

0:11:17.720 --> 0:11:18.600
<v Speaker 1>That's really interesting.

0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:19.559
<v Speaker 2>It's really interesting.

0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:21.280
<v Speaker 1>I've always kind of had it on and like.

0:11:21.520 --> 0:11:23.640
<v Speaker 2>Oh, yeah, this is the camera culture.

0:11:23.679 --> 0:11:25.439
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, this is a camera on culture. Do you want

0:11:25.440 --> 0:11:27.000
<v Speaker 1>to get back to the authors of a new book

0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:30.480
<v Speaker 1>it's called Career Forward Strategies from Women who have made It.

0:11:30.840 --> 0:11:34.640
<v Speaker 1>The authors are Grace Puma, former chief operations officer at PepsiCo,

0:11:35.000 --> 0:11:38.560
<v Speaker 1>and Christiana Smith, she former president of the Consumer Direct

0:11:38.559 --> 0:11:42.040
<v Speaker 1>division at Nike. One thing we wanted to get into

0:11:43.400 --> 0:11:46.319
<v Speaker 1>is this idea of don't fake it till you make it.

0:11:46.679 --> 0:11:48.080
<v Speaker 1>And the reason we bring it up. We had a

0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:52.160
<v Speaker 1>conversation with the head of one of the divisions at

0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:55.200
<v Speaker 1>one of the major cruise companies just on Friday, and

0:11:55.240 --> 0:11:57.720
<v Speaker 1>this idea of when she got a big promotion that

0:11:57.760 --> 0:11:59.720
<v Speaker 1>people were like, yeah, but you didn't have all the

0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:02.600
<v Speaker 1>necessary experience, and she's like, yeah, you're kind of right,

0:12:03.080 --> 0:12:05.240
<v Speaker 1>you know, but I think about the difference and forgive me.

0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:08.040
<v Speaker 1>I don't like to make generalizations, but there has been

0:12:08.040 --> 0:12:10.120
<v Speaker 1>a lot written about where men will be like, I

0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:12.320
<v Speaker 1>got it, I'll figure it out. Women are like, oh

0:12:12.400 --> 0:12:16.160
<v Speaker 1>my god, I don't have all the qualifications. Again, generalizations,

0:12:16.200 --> 0:12:18.600
<v Speaker 1>but people have written about a lot of this grace.

0:12:18.679 --> 0:12:21.400
<v Speaker 1>Let me go to you first. Why do you guys

0:12:21.400 --> 0:12:24.120
<v Speaker 1>say don't fake it till you make it? What exactly

0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:25.959
<v Speaker 1>do you mean, because sometimes you don't have all the

0:12:26.000 --> 0:12:28.760
<v Speaker 1>qualifications but you can figure it out.

0:12:29.480 --> 0:12:32.760
<v Speaker 4>Yeah. When we think about, you know, fake it till

0:12:32.760 --> 0:12:34.320
<v Speaker 4>you make it, we don't think that's a bad thing.

0:12:34.360 --> 0:12:36.760
<v Speaker 4>We think it's a good thing. The reason is because

0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:39.000
<v Speaker 4>you do whatever you need to do to gain the

0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:41.680
<v Speaker 4>confidence as you go into a new business or a

0:12:41.720 --> 0:12:44.440
<v Speaker 4>new environment, or a new position. No one goes into

0:12:44.480 --> 0:12:46.959
<v Speaker 4>a position when they know everything, okay, especially if you

0:12:47.000 --> 0:12:50.320
<v Speaker 4>progress your career. So we think it's okay to stand up,

0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:52.040
<v Speaker 4>whether you have to talk to yourself in the mirror,

0:12:52.559 --> 0:12:55.520
<v Speaker 4>pump yourself off, but you're there for a reason. Believe

0:12:55.520 --> 0:12:57.600
<v Speaker 4>you're there for a reason, and have the confidence to

0:12:57.679 --> 0:12:59.640
<v Speaker 4>know you're going to figure it out, You're going to

0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:01.920
<v Speaker 4>learn things, and you're going to be able to apply

0:13:02.000 --> 0:13:05.040
<v Speaker 4>the talents you do have to be successful. That's very

0:13:05.080 --> 0:13:08.679
<v Speaker 4>different than what you hear about imposter syndrome, where people say, hey,

0:13:08.679 --> 0:13:10.679
<v Speaker 4>they got the job and they're not qualified. We think

0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:13.720
<v Speaker 4>that's unhealthy. But fake it till you make it means,

0:13:13.760 --> 0:13:16.199
<v Speaker 4>you know, have the confidence that you're in that position

0:13:16.400 --> 0:13:18.959
<v Speaker 4>or you've been given that opportunity for a reason, and

0:13:19.160 --> 0:13:21.640
<v Speaker 4>have the faith that your past history will tell you

0:13:21.679 --> 0:13:23.160
<v Speaker 4>that you'll learn and you'll achieve.

0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:26.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Christina, jump on in here and sort of share

0:13:26.160 --> 0:13:27.840
<v Speaker 2>your experience with this in the way that you thought

0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:29.600
<v Speaker 2>about it when you were writing about this in the book.

0:13:30.559 --> 0:13:34.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. The reason we you might think we're saying don't

0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:36.040
<v Speaker 3>fake it till you make it is because what we're

0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:39.800
<v Speaker 3>saying is get past that thinking. Right. You were put

0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:41.920
<v Speaker 3>there for a reason, and your bosses aren't crazy. The

0:13:41.920 --> 0:13:44.200
<v Speaker 3>people who hired you knew what they were doing right.

0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:46.880
<v Speaker 3>Learning what you need to learn to fill in your

0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:50.520
<v Speaker 3>gaps in a new role is not faking it right,

0:13:50.600 --> 0:13:54.400
<v Speaker 3>that's being programmatic, that's being strategic, that's leaning into it,

0:13:54.440 --> 0:13:57.760
<v Speaker 3>that's being forward thinking. So all we would say is

0:13:58.240 --> 0:14:00.840
<v Speaker 3>don't fake it till you make it. A plan together

0:14:01.559 --> 0:14:03.320
<v Speaker 3>to get the rest of what you need in terms

0:14:03.360 --> 0:14:06.640
<v Speaker 3>of the experience, the skills, the confidence to do the

0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:09.440
<v Speaker 3>new role that you were put in, but recognize that

0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:12.120
<v Speaker 3>you are there for a reason in the meantime, and

0:14:12.880 --> 0:14:14.920
<v Speaker 3>saying that I've got to learn and get down this

0:14:15.040 --> 0:14:17.319
<v Speaker 3>learning curve in this new role is not the same

0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:20.080
<v Speaker 3>as saying I'm an impostor and I don't belong here.

0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:24.520
<v Speaker 3>We really really dislike the phrase imposter syndrome because that

0:14:24.640 --> 0:14:27.720
<v Speaker 3>leaves you no place to go, that doesn't give you

0:14:27.880 --> 0:14:31.320
<v Speaker 3>a path forward, and that's not a very confidence building mindset.

0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:35.520
<v Speaker 2>You explore this idea in the book about making sure

0:14:35.520 --> 0:14:38.240
<v Speaker 2>you're growing within a role, and you argue that you

0:14:38.240 --> 0:14:40.960
<v Speaker 2>don't want to be too comfortable in a job, and

0:14:41.000 --> 0:14:43.040
<v Speaker 2>I think for a lot of people that can be

0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:45.680
<v Speaker 2>kind of tough because, Okay, well, you know, they've worked

0:14:45.680 --> 0:14:48.320
<v Speaker 2>so hard to get to a certain place and they're

0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:51.400
<v Speaker 2>finally in that place, Why do they want to be

0:14:51.560 --> 0:14:53.640
<v Speaker 2>necessarily longing for something more grace?

0:14:55.360 --> 0:14:57.520
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, so you know, it starts with what we're trying

0:14:57.520 --> 0:14:59.880
<v Speaker 4>to encourage people to do is to have and set

0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:02.840
<v Speaker 4>a strategic path for your career and a cardinal direction.

0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:05.480
<v Speaker 4>And a cardinal direction gets determined on what are your

0:15:05.520 --> 0:15:09.480
<v Speaker 4>aspirations and they can evolve over time. So to your point,

0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:12.160
<v Speaker 4>you know, we think it's important that if you're in

0:15:12.160 --> 0:15:14.240
<v Speaker 4>a job and you feel like you know, I'm doing great.

0:15:14.280 --> 0:15:16.720
<v Speaker 4>I might be getting great performance reviews, but you're no

0:15:16.800 --> 0:15:20.400
<v Speaker 4>longer learning, then you have the obligation for yourself to

0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:24.200
<v Speaker 4>meet your aspirations by continuing to look for opportunities to

0:15:24.280 --> 0:15:28.040
<v Speaker 4>expand your capabilities and expand your contributions. And that can

0:15:28.120 --> 0:15:30.080
<v Speaker 4>show up in a number of different ways. It might

0:15:30.120 --> 0:15:32.680
<v Speaker 4>be raising your hand and saying, hey, I'd like to

0:15:32.680 --> 0:15:35.720
<v Speaker 4>get involved in this particular project or this particular initiative

0:15:35.760 --> 0:15:38.440
<v Speaker 4>that's outside my area, because you're going to know that

0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:41.440
<v Speaker 4>you're going to grow through that experience. So that's kind

0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:44.080
<v Speaker 4>of the basis of it, and it also is important

0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:46.840
<v Speaker 4>if you set a cardinal direction of what you want

0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:49.720
<v Speaker 4>to aspire, that you're checking in with yourself and saying,

0:15:49.760 --> 0:15:52.920
<v Speaker 4>am I on track and does the job that I'm

0:15:53.000 --> 0:15:55.960
<v Speaker 4>doing today continue to grow me? And progress me on

0:15:56.000 --> 0:15:56.680
<v Speaker 4>that journey.

0:15:57.240 --> 0:15:59.520
<v Speaker 1>Is it safe to say that, Christiana? I mean, there

0:15:59.560 --> 0:16:01.280
<v Speaker 1>is a point that you get to that you might

0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:05.320
<v Speaker 1>be like, I've out grown either this company or this

0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:08.720
<v Speaker 1>career trajectory. I've hit the top, and it's just time

0:16:08.760 --> 0:16:10.400
<v Speaker 1>to move on. And you just have to face that,

0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:12.960
<v Speaker 1>even as much as you might like the company the

0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:15.080
<v Speaker 1>people you work with, if you really want to advance,

0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:17.280
<v Speaker 1>sometimes you've just got to leave. It's not just about

0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:19.280
<v Speaker 1>making more money, but advancing.

0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:23.600
<v Speaker 3>Yes, we agree with the notion that if you want

0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:26.800
<v Speaker 3>to keep growing, sometimes you have to go. And we

0:16:26.840 --> 0:16:29.720
<v Speaker 3>call that a fork in the road. And sometimes those

0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:32.120
<v Speaker 3>forks in your career path are forced on you by

0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:36.040
<v Speaker 3>a company change of ownership or a leadership change in

0:16:36.080 --> 0:16:41.320
<v Speaker 3>your management team, whatever, But sometimes it's because you're proactively realizing,

0:16:41.440 --> 0:16:44.040
<v Speaker 3>like you said, that you have grown to a point

0:16:44.080 --> 0:16:47.960
<v Speaker 3>where you need to do something different. And what we

0:16:48.000 --> 0:16:51.120
<v Speaker 3>want to encourage you to do is be self aware

0:16:51.240 --> 0:16:55.280
<v Speaker 3>enough to actually recognize those moments when they come, versus

0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:57.160
<v Speaker 3>get surprised by them. And the way you can get

0:16:57.200 --> 0:16:59.760
<v Speaker 3>surprised by them is if you don't go when you've

0:16:59.840 --> 0:17:02.200
<v Speaker 3>kind of outgrown your current role. If you don't actually

0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.960
<v Speaker 3>push yourself to get to something next or new. You

0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:09.760
<v Speaker 3>could end up on what we call benevolent stagnation. Benevolent

0:17:09.800 --> 0:17:13.800
<v Speaker 3>stagnation is I'm still in the same job, I'm still performing.

0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:18.320
<v Speaker 3>Everybody's kind of taken me for granted. I've noticed I'm

0:17:18.359 --> 0:17:21.199
<v Speaker 3>not seeing the same increases in my comp I've noticed

0:17:21.240 --> 0:17:24.240
<v Speaker 3>I'm not getting invited to some meetings. I've noticed I'm

0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:27.680
<v Speaker 3>not being pulled into the cool projects. And we use

0:17:27.760 --> 0:17:30.720
<v Speaker 3>the metaphor of a rocket in orbit, right, If you're

0:17:30.720 --> 0:17:33.280
<v Speaker 3>in orbit around a planet, you still got to turn

0:17:33.320 --> 0:17:36.360
<v Speaker 3>the gas on periodically, or gravity is going to pull

0:17:36.400 --> 0:17:38.760
<v Speaker 3>you down. Love, It's the same thing at a job.

0:17:38.840 --> 0:17:40.399
<v Speaker 3>You got to grow or you got to go.

0:17:40.600 --> 0:17:42.960
<v Speaker 1>All right, Grace, Christiana, we only have about a minute

0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:45.000
<v Speaker 1>left here, so just quickly, Grace, let me start with

0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:46.960
<v Speaker 1>you thirty seconds. Some final thoughts here.

0:17:48.600 --> 0:17:51.280
<v Speaker 4>I think I would just encourage you to really embrace

0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:54.720
<v Speaker 4>ambition and realize that ambition is a really good thing.

0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:58.280
<v Speaker 4>It means you're going to create a path for yourself

0:17:58.320 --> 0:18:00.520
<v Speaker 4>to achieve the best you can achieve. And it might

0:18:00.560 --> 0:18:03.560
<v Speaker 4>be different for every person, but we would encourage people

0:18:03.560 --> 0:18:06.159
<v Speaker 4>to do it because it's worth it. Having a career women.

0:18:06.200 --> 0:18:08.720
<v Speaker 1>Especially, It's okay to be ambitious. I'm just going to

0:18:08.760 --> 0:18:12.000
<v Speaker 1>put it out there. Christiana thirty seconds here your final thoughts.

0:18:12.160 --> 0:18:15.000
<v Speaker 3>Love love, owning the a word. As Grace said. The

0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:18.240
<v Speaker 3>other thing we like to say to women in particular,

0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:21.439
<v Speaker 3>but again applies to everybody, is if you're not in

0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:25.119
<v Speaker 3>the driver's seat of your career, somebody else is and

0:18:25.160 --> 0:18:26.959
<v Speaker 3>you can't get to a place you want to go

0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:29.399
<v Speaker 3>to unless you're the one at the wheel. So we

0:18:29.520 --> 0:18:31.520
<v Speaker 3>try to give you tools and ideas for how you

0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:34.120
<v Speaker 3>could stay in the driver's seat of your career.

0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:35.960
<v Speaker 1>Path well, and that plays into you Also a chapter

0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:38.120
<v Speaker 1>you guys have Steer about Steer into the Skid, which

0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:39.920
<v Speaker 1>I really love. I had to steer into his skid

0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:43.000
<v Speaker 1>and it was such a great opportunity that I ended

0:18:43.080 --> 0:18:44.760
<v Speaker 1>up creating, but it didn't feel like it as I

0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:47.480
<v Speaker 1>was going through it. So some great advice Grace Puma,

0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:51.560
<v Speaker 1>former Chief operations officer PepsiCo. Christianna Smith, she former president

0:18:51.600 --> 0:18:53.640
<v Speaker 1>of the Consumer Direct division at Nike. Their new book,

0:18:53.680 --> 0:18:56.880
<v Speaker 1>Career Forward Strategies from Women who Have made It Thanks

0:18:56.960 --> 0:18:57.560
<v Speaker 1>to you both.

0:18:57.800 --> 0:18:58.560
<v Speaker 3>This is Bloomberg