WEBVTT - Ginni Rometty 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:03.360 Hi everyone, I'm Emily Chang and this is Bloomberg Studio 0:00:03.440 --> 0:00:06.760 one point Oh. I remember when Jinny Rometti was named 0:00:06.800 --> 0:00:10.039 IBM CEO. So much was made of a fact that 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:14.360 she was as she. Rometti herself, though rarely talked publicly 0:00:14.360 --> 0:00:17.160 about being a woman, and my interviews with her over 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:20.800 the years were strictly business. But in this conversation, as 0:00:20.800 --> 0:00:23.200 she leaves the company where she devoted forty years of 0:00:23.239 --> 0:00:28.120 her life, Romedi got more personal about life, love and 0:00:28.360 --> 0:00:31.720 being one of the rare female CEOs in American business. 0:00:34.159 --> 0:00:36.800 She joined IBM as a systems engineer in Detroit in 0:00:36.960 --> 0:00:41.040 nineteen one and rose through the ranks in technical sales 0:00:41.120 --> 0:00:44.520 and then management jobs. In two thousand twelve, she got 0:00:44.560 --> 0:00:48.880 the company's top job and steered IBM through major technological 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:54.920 transformations and ups and downs. On this edition of Bloomberg 0:00:54.960 --> 0:00:58.480 Studio one point Oh, former IBM CEO and Chair Jinny 0:00:58.560 --> 0:01:00.920 Remetti bids a fond fair well to one of the 0:01:01.000 --> 0:01:04.759 great loves of her life. This is her exit interview. 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:15.360 You are leaving IBM after an eight year tenure as 0:01:15.440 --> 0:01:19.759 CEO and nearly forty years at the company. How does 0:01:19.800 --> 0:01:24.800 that feel? Uh, it's almost surreal in some ways. Obviously 0:01:24.840 --> 0:01:26.560 it's a company I loved her I wouldn't have stayed 0:01:26.560 --> 0:01:29.399 here for forty years. So it feels like it's a 0:01:29.440 --> 0:01:33.240 great moment because we've just really been through quite a transformation. 0:01:33.680 --> 0:01:37.440 So on one way, on one hand, it's bittersweet. On 0:01:37.480 --> 0:01:41.040 another hand, I leave with really great confidence for the company. 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:44.399 What are you most nostalgic about and what are you 0:01:44.440 --> 0:01:49.360 most excited about? Uh, well, I'm certainly most nostalgic about. Um, 0:01:49.400 --> 0:01:51.560 the people in the platform of the company. I mean, 0:01:51.600 --> 0:01:54.480 I really do believe IBM stands for the gold standard 0:01:54.800 --> 0:01:58.320 of good tech and what we do most systems of 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:01.080 the world wouldn't run without us. So it's the people 0:02:01.240 --> 0:02:04.360 that do that work I'll be most nostalgic about, and 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:08.560 the clients who have been decades of relationships. Um. But 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:10.440 as well, what I'm going to look forward to, because 0:02:10.520 --> 0:02:12.320 I think it's been one of the great things I've 0:02:12.320 --> 0:02:15.119 had a chance to work on, is a lot about 0:02:15.160 --> 0:02:17.600 making an inclusive workforce. So one of the things I'm 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:19.919 going to do in my retirement is to lead up 0:02:19.960 --> 0:02:23.400 with Ken Fraser from murk an initiative called one ten 0:02:23.520 --> 0:02:26.079 to place a million black employees over the next ten 0:02:26.160 --> 0:02:30.680 years into our companies with one ten This organization of 0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:35.120 you know, three dozen or so companies is pledging to hire, train, 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:40.600 and promote one million black workers over the course of 0:02:40.680 --> 0:02:42.640 ten years. How did you come to be involved in 0:02:42.680 --> 0:02:45.920 this initiative? As I worked on the digital economy and 0:02:45.960 --> 0:02:48.600 saw digital transformation, what was happening to me, it was 0:02:48.720 --> 0:02:51.679 really clear a large segment of of the population would 0:02:51.720 --> 0:02:54.000 be left behind. So we had started some work which 0:02:54.000 --> 0:02:57.320 we can talk about on bridging this education gap because 0:02:57.320 --> 0:03:00.280 we needed the employees too. But you know, they couldn't 0:03:00.280 --> 0:03:02.800 get college degrees fast enough or was there another way 0:03:02.800 --> 0:03:05.840 to hire a whole swath of of of people out 0:03:05.840 --> 0:03:08.679 there that could be prepared with a high school degree 0:03:08.680 --> 0:03:12.000 and maybe an associate degree. So pause there. But then 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:14.760 as the pandemic happened, and then obviously with the killing 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:17.200 of George Floyd and really coming back to the surface 0:03:17.240 --> 0:03:21.720 around systemic racism, uh Ken can Channel from American Express, 0:03:22.040 --> 0:03:25.480 Can Frasier of of MERK, as well as Charles Phillips 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:28.280 and Kevin Sheer from am JEN came together and we 0:03:28.320 --> 0:03:30.720 all started saying what do we do best as companies? 0:03:30.760 --> 0:03:34.040 What we can do is hire people and economic opportunity 0:03:34.360 --> 0:03:36.880 is the best equalizer. That's just the beginning, because then 0:03:36.880 --> 0:03:40.320 it's the supply chains and very simply, it's just putting 0:03:40.320 --> 0:03:43.560 supply and demand together and all of the supply a 0:03:43.640 --> 0:03:46.840 subscale for black employees, and we're gonna help grow that. 0:03:47.320 --> 0:03:49.560 What do you think is broken about the way companies 0:03:49.640 --> 0:03:53.320 higher promote and train their workers. On one hand, you 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:55.680 have an education system that you may have gotten a 0:03:55.680 --> 0:03:57.960 lot of debt for an education, yet you really don't 0:03:57.960 --> 0:04:00.960 have employable skills yet. So one is to work with 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:03.840 the schools. And then on the employee side, it's really 0:04:03.880 --> 0:04:07.040 breaking down a barrier of a perception that, gee, if 0:04:07.040 --> 0:04:09.120 I bring people into my company that don't have a 0:04:09.120 --> 0:04:12.080 college degree, I'm in some form dumbing down the workforce. 0:04:12.640 --> 0:04:14.640 It's not true. I mean, now that I've been at 0:04:14.680 --> 0:04:17.600 it eight nine, ten years, what we've learned is that 0:04:18.000 --> 0:04:21.479 great aptitude just didn't have the same access as everyone else. 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:24.360 At the same time, these are best employees. And by 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:26.640 the way, as they've been around, lots of other people 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:30.120 now have college degrees and we just had our first PhD. 0:04:30.520 --> 0:04:33.040 So the biggest thing we're going to work with all 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:35.679 the employers on is you've got to change your job breath. 0:04:35.800 --> 0:04:38.760 It is a systemic barrier, meaning if every job you 0:04:38.880 --> 0:04:42.040 offer out there lists a whole set of college degrees required, 0:04:42.240 --> 0:04:45.799 you have completely blocked out large segments of the United 0:04:45.800 --> 0:04:48.720 States population. Sixty percent of Americans do not have a 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:51.760 college degree. Eight percent of Black Americans do not have 0:04:51.800 --> 0:04:54.720 a college degree. So you've just completely taken them off 0:04:54.720 --> 0:04:57.479 your radar screen. Now, if you would change that and 0:04:57.560 --> 0:05:01.000 say higher skills first, a different paradigm, well then you're 0:05:01.000 --> 0:05:03.279 going to open your aperture to some great employees. And 0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:05.560 so so when you say what is broke, I think 0:05:05.560 --> 0:05:09.440 it's this view that it's a degree only versus skills first, 0:05:09.760 --> 0:05:12.280 not just a degree. Do you think that companies and 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:16.280 the tech industry in particular, do they value differences in race, 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:21.600 differences in gender, differences in age as much as they should? Well, 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:23.760 look that the numbers don't lie about that, and so 0:05:23.960 --> 0:05:26.240 it'd be hard to answer that the system works. Right. 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:28.680 But now, look, I do come from a company. I 0:05:28.720 --> 0:05:30.719 feel like I stand on the shoulders of giants on 0:05:30.760 --> 0:05:34.279 this topic. Right, it was one of our predecessor companies 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:36.719 had their first woman in first black Right, so it 0:05:36.839 --> 0:05:40.240 was ninety five equal pay, nineteen fifty three equal opportunity. 0:05:40.360 --> 0:05:44.680 So I am used to that. All that said, all 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:46.559 of us have to do better. I mean, I'm so proud, 0:05:46.760 --> 0:05:49.440 you know what I mean. We had record record diversity 0:05:49.440 --> 0:05:51.840 and inclusion numbers in my last year and this year 0:05:51.880 --> 0:05:55.400 again at IBM, and so that takes though not one 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:58.039 deed to me. It is like a million things that 0:05:58.080 --> 0:06:01.320 you have to be so consistent. And the word is authentic. 0:06:01.520 --> 0:06:04.200 You have got to authentically believe that this will make 0:06:04.240 --> 0:06:07.240 you a better company. It will make you better innovation, 0:06:07.360 --> 0:06:10.200 better products. And you know, in my heart I believe that, 0:06:10.240 --> 0:06:12.200 and I think as a company in its DNA, it 0:06:12.240 --> 0:06:14.599 believes that. And how much do you think it matters 0:06:14.640 --> 0:06:17.640 that the CEO of the leadership makes this a number 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:23.400 one priority. I think it's imperative, point blank. And in fact, 0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:25.960 actually the one ten initiative I'm working on it is 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:29.039 only CEOs allowed. And so and I don't mean that 0:06:29.120 --> 0:06:31.520 in a in an exclusionary sense. We mean it as 0:06:31.880 --> 0:06:36.279 if you're going to actually change paradigms, remove barriers, you've 0:06:36.320 --> 0:06:38.040 got to have someone at the top say no, no, no, 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:41.560 this will be important. Diversity is a number. Inclusion is 0:06:41.600 --> 0:06:43.720 a choice and you have to show people you make 0:06:43.760 --> 0:06:49.120 that choice over and over. Absolutely, you joined DIBAN when 0:06:49.240 --> 0:06:53.559 Apple was in its infancy, Facebook, Google, Amazon didn't even 0:06:53.600 --> 0:06:57.080 exist yet. You have seen so many technological shifts, whether 0:06:57.120 --> 0:07:00.440 it was the rise of the PC or smartphone or 0:07:00.600 --> 0:07:04.680 more recently the cloud, AI, quantum computing um. Which of 0:07:04.720 --> 0:07:07.840 these shifts has surprised you most or you know, does 0:07:07.920 --> 0:07:12.160 anything even surprise you anymore? I'm not sure anything surprises 0:07:12.160 --> 0:07:15.760 me anymore, but I do think more current in this 0:07:15.840 --> 0:07:18.520 sort of last era, Uh, not a surprise, but it 0:07:18.600 --> 0:07:21.560 is absolutely the speed at which these have happened, and 0:07:21.600 --> 0:07:23.760 that there's been multiple shifts at one time, because you 0:07:23.760 --> 0:07:26.240 could say you saw cloud, you saw mobility, you see 0:07:26.280 --> 0:07:28.920 AI data, all this at one time. And I think 0:07:28.960 --> 0:07:32.760 that's actually been what's made this digital transformation era the 0:07:32.800 --> 0:07:34.920 one that has had the most impact and most impact 0:07:34.920 --> 0:07:37.520 on IBM. I mean clearly, when I took over, I 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:40.360 had to refocus the company for cloud and data and 0:07:40.480 --> 0:07:42.880 it's the speed at which those were moving in and 0:07:42.920 --> 0:07:45.080 for us, that's that's been a journey, right, It's it's 0:07:45.160 --> 0:07:48.240 clearly to been our most historic transformation where we've had 0:07:48.280 --> 0:07:52.360 to divest businesses or almost over ten billion dollars of 0:07:52.360 --> 0:07:55.160 businesses to give you fuel. And then we did in 0:07:55.240 --> 0:07:58.800 my time billion of R and D. And then another 0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:03.480 sixty five was Asians. IBM reacted very quickly when the 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:08.600 pandemic arrived in early March. How unexpected and unprecedented was 0:08:08.680 --> 0:08:13.000 that for you as a leader? Did that surprise you? 0:08:13.000 --> 0:08:15.840 You know, I'll have to say at a personal level 0:08:15.880 --> 0:08:20.080 to some degree yes, intellectually no, And and I'll give 0:08:20.120 --> 0:08:23.080 you this example so here, because we're global hundred seventy countries, 0:08:23.400 --> 0:08:26.360 we were obviously participating with this with our Chinese workforce, 0:08:26.360 --> 0:08:30.000 some Japanese workforce, we see, Italy were everywhere. And I 0:08:30.040 --> 0:08:32.520 am proud by the way every country we were able 0:08:32.679 --> 0:08:36.880 in days IBM r s we're working remotely. So UM, 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:39.160 I'm very proud of what this says about the infrastructure, 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:42.080 how we do our work, our customers. That said, UM, 0:08:42.240 --> 0:08:44.319 I kind of remember it was middle of March, I've 0:08:44.360 --> 0:08:48.480 done some TV interviews and that it was my wedding anniversary, 0:08:48.559 --> 0:08:50.800 and I was going to fly to meet my husband 0:08:50.840 --> 0:08:54.360 for a weekend. UH. And as I left, I only 0:08:54.400 --> 0:08:57.400 packed for four days UH to go down to that 0:08:57.559 --> 0:09:00.280 house to see him, and never did I really sort 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:03.600 of realized, nope, I might not actually come back after 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:06.920 this and stay at home, right, And and so that's 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:09.160 why miss so intellectually, I think we all saw it. 0:09:09.280 --> 0:09:11.520 Everyone I know right that I've talked to sort of 0:09:11.520 --> 0:09:14.640 has a similar story about um the speed at which 0:09:14.679 --> 0:09:16.920 it then moved that we really did need to stay 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:19.360 in place. The first thing is, okay, how do you 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:22.360 help people? Right, So of course your own employees, obviously 0:09:22.440 --> 0:09:24.000 we all worked on that first. So put that his 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:27.160 job number one. We do own the weather Channel, and 0:09:27.280 --> 0:09:29.400 we had a site immediately put up that you could 0:09:29.400 --> 0:09:31.960 see in your zip code. You know, what were the cases, 0:09:32.160 --> 0:09:34.640 how many deaths, the cases growing, check on your parents, 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:38.720 your kids, whatever it was, but one source, truthful data 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:41.479 that was out there. We did that. The second immediately 0:09:41.480 --> 0:09:43.640 in parallel, and this is still going now, is work 0:09:43.720 --> 0:09:46.240 on the cure. What could we do? That's us, you know, 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:49.640 like authentically us. And it was we sponsored for the 0:09:49.679 --> 0:09:53.640 government and put together a high performance computing consortium which 0:09:53.720 --> 0:09:58.440 now has uh forty people who donated their high performance computing. 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:00.600 We do have the top super comput years in the world. 0:10:01.200 --> 0:10:03.200 Think of it as if you could overnight buy a 0:10:03.200 --> 0:10:05.439 billion dollar computer. That's what it is. That we've put 0:10:05.480 --> 0:10:08.360 together six hundred pedo flops and there's a hundred world 0:10:08.400 --> 0:10:12.200 class scientific teams that are running all of their analyzes 0:10:12.200 --> 0:10:15.120 on this, so they've contributed to the cure. Um. We 0:10:15.200 --> 0:10:19.560 took Watson and AI twenty five countries, asking questions everything 0:10:19.559 --> 0:10:21.719 you can. You can remember those days, like how much 0:10:21.760 --> 0:10:26.160 misinformation was out there about COVID and so all that 0:10:26.200 --> 0:10:29.040 got underway. Then we had a quickly moved to another phase. 0:10:29.200 --> 0:10:31.720 Not quickly, it was months. But how do you return 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:35.000 to work safely? Other CEOs have used the words terror 0:10:35.240 --> 0:10:38.880 and fear and felt like we got hit by a torpedo? 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:42.040 Was there any amount of fear for you as as 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:44.040 a leader, as somebody who's in charge of these tens 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:50.679 of thousands of people, and you know, no, those are 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:54.199 not words in my vocabulary basically, And I think because 0:10:54.240 --> 0:10:56.560 we do mission critical work, I've always felt that when 0:10:56.559 --> 0:11:00.000 things got the most tense, I'd become the most calm um. 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:01.960 And it is in those moments that people look to 0:11:01.960 --> 0:11:05.080 you to steer them through something. So it is a 0:11:05.240 --> 0:11:08.720 determined calm, is how I would describe it. Where does 0:11:08.800 --> 0:11:14.040 that come from in you? You know, I guess I've 0:11:13.679 --> 0:11:16.120 I've I've often thought about that, and I think it 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:18.920 comes from my you know, my early time i've talked 0:11:18.960 --> 0:11:21.920 with you. I think before about my mother and single 0:11:21.960 --> 0:11:25.319 mom found herself raising four children. Suddenly she didn't have 0:11:25.360 --> 0:11:28.280 an education. We spent time on food stamps. My mother 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:30.360 was determined not to let that be the end of 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:33.080 the story, found her way out with an education. Out 0:11:33.080 --> 0:11:35.720 of that. The rest of us all turned out well 0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:38.400 by watching her, and in that moment, it taught us, 0:11:38.880 --> 0:11:41.200 you know, never lets something define you. Only you define 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:44.120 who you are, so you take control of that. And 0:11:44.160 --> 0:11:46.200 I think that that is what has stayed with me 0:11:46.240 --> 0:11:49.480 through all this time, and whether it's a crisis or 0:11:49.480 --> 0:11:52.320 whether it is actually the reinvention of a company or myself, 0:11:52.679 --> 0:11:55.120 the idea that only you define who you are, not 0:11:55.240 --> 0:12:02.960 someone else. This is the exit interview with former IBM 0:12:03.000 --> 0:12:06.480 CEO and chair Jenny Remetti. Up next, how did she 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:10.480 feel about being a quote woman CEO? And we go 0:12:10.559 --> 0:12:14.680 back almost forty years to Rometti's first day at IBM 0:12:14.720 --> 0:12:17.240 and what it took to rise to the top. I'm 0:12:17.280 --> 0:12:33.719 Emily Chang. This is Bloomberg studio one point. Oh, you've 0:12:33.760 --> 0:12:36.480 seen so much innovation, so much evolution in your time 0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:39.600 at IBM. How do you think IBM is a different 0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:43.120 company today than when you took over a CEO. We 0:12:43.240 --> 0:12:47.000 now have our next enduring technology platform. That's what the 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:49.920 team has built, hybrid cloud in AI. IBM does its 0:12:49.960 --> 0:12:54.360 best when it has a physical technology platform, so things 0:12:54.360 --> 0:12:56.719 like the main frame was there for decades, still will 0:12:56.720 --> 0:13:01.040 be there for decades, modernized, modernized, it's on z and 0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:05.559 and to me, hyperd cloud AI is this company's next platform. 0:13:05.960 --> 0:13:08.160 And because there's a very serious set of work we 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:11.040 do that requires the ability to run work wherever you 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:13.280 need to run it, whether it's a private cloud, multiple 0:13:13.360 --> 0:13:17.479 public clouds. Build something once, run it anywhere, get a 0:13:17.520 --> 0:13:21.320 scale advantage from that, not be locked in. Get open innovation. 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:24.440 This was all behind our open hybrid cloud. I would 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:26.400 love it if you would humor us and and go 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:28.760 back a bit more in time and paint the picture 0:13:29.480 --> 0:13:32.680 for us of a young, genuine meddy walking through the 0:13:32.720 --> 0:13:35.840 doors of IBM as a systems engineer in Detroit in 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:41.360 I came from a single mom who to get us 0:13:41.360 --> 0:13:43.280 off of food stamps, found her way back to get 0:13:43.320 --> 0:13:46.440 an associate degree so she could get a job, so 0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:49.400 we could all go to school. So I start there. Um, 0:13:49.440 --> 0:13:52.480 I've had a scholarship from General Motors blessed them through 0:13:52.520 --> 0:13:56.360 Northwestern University, so I first did work there. Um so 0:13:56.640 --> 0:13:59.360 before that, then I went to IBM, so I worked 0:13:59.360 --> 0:14:02.080 their year. But as as I've told Mary Barra, I 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:04.280 love what she does and she is passionate about cars. 0:14:04.840 --> 0:14:07.440 I wanted to apply technology a lot of things. So 0:14:08.480 --> 0:14:11.480 when IBM, and here's what I'll remember that first day. 0:14:11.520 --> 0:14:13.440 Of course, I did not have a blue suit, all right, 0:14:13.520 --> 0:14:15.400 had not had one. I'm not sure I had any 0:14:15.400 --> 0:14:18.880 suits actually, Um, but this is this is back in time, right, 0:14:18.920 --> 0:14:22.240 so this is out of blue suit. I can remember 0:14:22.280 --> 0:14:24.600 coming home from work, taking my jacket off, putting on 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:27.440 the couch, and my husband saying, do you realize the 0:14:27.480 --> 0:14:30.280 price tags are still on your suit? And that's how 0:14:30.320 --> 0:14:32.240 I remember my first day. And I thought, how gracious 0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:34.600 There wasn't a single person who said anything about that. 0:14:34.880 --> 0:14:37.280 Your mom, how influential was she over the years, And 0:14:37.400 --> 0:14:40.040 she showed us that nobody defined your future, you do it. 0:14:40.480 --> 0:14:43.280 And we watched that and learned that by by just 0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:45.720 looking at what she did. I remember when you took 0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:47.760 this job. In two thousand eleven, The New York Times 0:14:47.800 --> 0:14:50.840 wrote this big piece about your husband and how he 0:14:50.880 --> 0:14:54.720 was your support system and as all husbands should be, 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:56.880 and it had a big impact on me because I 0:14:56.960 --> 0:15:00.440 think we often think our support systems should be invisible, um, 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:02.480 but then we don't learn how other people do it. 0:15:03.000 --> 0:15:05.800 And I'd love to know more about how that partnership 0:15:05.840 --> 0:15:08.960 evolved over the years, especially as you were CEO. I 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:12.160 just had my four wedding anniversary and so forty years 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:15.280 and you know what I say about Mark, uh, he 0:15:15.480 --> 0:15:20.320 is he's my biggest fan and that, you know, I 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:22.720 think that makes all the difference in the world. And 0:15:22.760 --> 0:15:25.440 so that it's a partnership, and I know not everyone 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:27.680 has been blessed like I have to have that kind 0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:30.840 of relationship, um where not only you know, I said, 0:15:30.840 --> 0:15:33.240 when you become CEO, it's a family job. It isn't 0:15:33.280 --> 0:15:36.000 as if it's just one person. So it's impact on 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:38.440 time my whole life. I traveled from my position as 0:15:38.480 --> 0:15:40.760 an example, and we always had a rule that never 0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:43.240 be more than two weeks apart from each other, and 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:47.160 we oh, we never broke that rule. And forty years 0:15:47.200 --> 0:15:50.000 of my traveling, and so those are the kinds of 0:15:50.040 --> 0:15:52.360 things that I think, Um, you know, they keep you together, 0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:54.880 build it stronger. And I have been really blessed and 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:57.640 lucky to have someone like that by my side who 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:00.880 took as much pride and was you tried to learn 0:16:00.960 --> 0:16:03.200 as much about IBM and be it's his ambassador, right. 0:16:03.240 --> 0:16:06.080 I feel he was IBM s a ambassador, uh, and 0:16:06.120 --> 0:16:08.160 took as much interest in my clients as I did. 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:11.560 So it was a real partnership. And clearly I did 0:16:11.600 --> 0:16:14.040 nothing else but work, So I have such great empathy 0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:16.560 for women that you know, have children and all these 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:19.840 other responsibilities. I worked, and Mark really did take care 0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:22.680 of everything else while well, I did work. So I 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:25.240 was lucky from that sense. Well, I'm sure you're selling 0:16:25.240 --> 0:16:27.160 yourself a little bit short, and he is very lucky 0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:32.000 to have you as well. UM, I will just say that. UM, 0:16:32.080 --> 0:16:34.240 you've said you've never thought about yourself as being a 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:36.720 woman CEO, but that is how others have often thought 0:16:36.760 --> 0:16:39.960 of you. Did you find that frustrating over the years 0:16:40.120 --> 0:16:44.480 or unfair in any way? So that that's an interesting 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:47.320 question from two perspectives, because I've often felt when I 0:16:47.400 --> 0:16:50.480 first became CEO, I really did not want to be 0:16:50.680 --> 0:16:53.480 labeled that. I wanted to be recognized for what I 0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:56.000 could accomplish. I think many women feel that way. I 0:16:56.000 --> 0:16:59.120 think many people feel that way. Um, but I will 0:16:59.160 --> 0:17:01.280 tell you a different side of that story that as 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:05.160 time went on, I did begin to realize this obligation 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:08.119 to be a role model. And you could see so 0:17:08.200 --> 0:17:11.159 many people that would react to not just what I 0:17:11.200 --> 0:17:14.040 did or what I said, but that it was you 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:17.240 were a role model for their children, their daughter, someone themselves, 0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:21.000 and this idea that you cannot be which you cannot see. 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:23.560 I began to internalize that and did feel it was 0:17:23.560 --> 0:17:26.200 an obligation, and I've changed my view about that, and 0:17:26.359 --> 0:17:29.320 as my tenure went on, you saw me become, you know, 0:17:29.560 --> 0:17:32.000 more vocal about that and more involved in things because 0:17:32.400 --> 0:17:35.200 I realized, in whether it's a woman or any group, 0:17:35.640 --> 0:17:38.520 people have got to have role models to see what's possible, 0:17:38.720 --> 0:17:42.240 and and that is, in a positive way, an obligation there. 0:17:42.359 --> 0:17:44.919 Now with it becomes I've said to other women as 0:17:44.960 --> 0:17:46.800 they've taken on their CEO roles, I said, get ready, 0:17:46.800 --> 0:17:50.200 because everything you do is magnified, everything you do is personalized. 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:52.560 I can't tell you that that's fair, but it's what happens. 0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:56.000 And so just power through and do what it is 0:17:56.040 --> 0:17:58.959 you think must be done. So what is your advice 0:17:59.080 --> 0:18:02.320 to young women out there who want to be you, 0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:05.560 who want to be leaders. It's probably the one piece 0:18:05.600 --> 0:18:08.399 of advice I am best known for Emily around the world, 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:10.639 and it is my husband that taught me the lesson. 0:18:11.080 --> 0:18:14.720 It was early in my career. I had interviewed for 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:16.800 a job, was offered it, and I was very nervous 0:18:16.800 --> 0:18:18.359 about taking it. I didn't think I was ready. I 0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:21.120 thought I needed a few more years. And Market said 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:23.760 to me when I came home, he said, because I 0:18:23.800 --> 0:18:25.840 told the person, let me think about this. And I'd 0:18:25.840 --> 0:18:27.639 come home and Mark said to me, Jenny, do you 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:30.359 think a man would have answered the question that way? 0:18:30.600 --> 0:18:33.919 And in those moments, what I remember is that growth 0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:37.000 and comfort will never coexist, And so everyone I talked 0:18:37.000 --> 0:18:39.200 to I say, look, you just get really comfortable with 0:18:39.240 --> 0:18:42.440 being uncomfortable, and that when you're uncomfortable, that means you're 0:18:42.520 --> 0:18:45.639 learning and growing. And so to your earlier question about fear, 0:18:46.080 --> 0:18:49.320 I view those moments as like wonderful learning opportunities, and 0:18:49.359 --> 0:18:52.639 that's my biggest advice. So have you replayed that story 0:18:52.680 --> 0:18:54.840 to yourself over the years as you've had moments where 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:58.080 you're saying, man would not do this. Well, what I've 0:18:58.119 --> 0:19:01.440 replayed to myself more is go yourself at risk. Don't 0:19:01.440 --> 0:19:05.040 worry if you're nervous about something fantastic, or if you're 0:19:05.080 --> 0:19:08.320 not nervous, equally a concern, be sure you take on 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:14.359 something different and go learn something new. You're listening to 0:19:14.400 --> 0:19:18.200 my conversation with Jenny Remetti, former IBM CEO and chair 0:19:18.760 --> 0:19:22.680 coming up. Remetti leaves IBM at a crossroads and facing 0:19:22.760 --> 0:19:26.440 ever more powerful competition. What does the future look like 0:19:26.680 --> 0:19:29.520 and what does she think of her successor that's next. 0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:32.680 I'm Emily Chang and this is Bloomberg Studio. What point 0:19:32.680 --> 0:19:55.400 out stay with us? Ibm S shares declined during your 0:19:55.440 --> 0:19:58.600 tenure as CEO, and I wonder if that was frustrating 0:19:58.760 --> 0:20:01.959 to watch? I oh, you're you know. CEOs always tell 0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:04.080 us they don't pay attention to the share price, but 0:20:04.080 --> 0:20:07.399 but it has to be distracting. And I wonder is 0:20:07.400 --> 0:20:11.720 there something you think investors just didn't get? Well, Look, 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:15.000 we did return forty three billion dollars to shareholders during 0:20:15.000 --> 0:20:17.879 my time frame with with dividend and actually the dividing 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:21.920 group by a hundred percent. But but clearly obviously you 0:20:21.920 --> 0:20:24.320 would want your share price to grow, so of course 0:20:24.359 --> 0:20:26.679 to that. And I think the piece in what we 0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:29.600 had to undertake was the hard work to reinvent IBM 0:20:29.640 --> 0:20:32.280 for the long term. And that's what we went about 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:34.240 and did. We had it to all ordered it to us. 0:20:34.320 --> 0:20:37.760 We did it, and so I'm really looking forward to 0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:41.359 now this next chapter for the company. IBM is hanging 0:20:41.400 --> 0:20:43.439 a lot of its future on hybrid. How will the 0:20:43.480 --> 0:20:47.120 company and how should the company differentiate itself from rivals 0:20:47.160 --> 0:20:51.040 in hybrid like Microsoft? Okay, well, we're clearly the one 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:53.639 that defined hybrid and we are clearly the one I 0:20:53.640 --> 0:20:57.160 would say the others have joined us now in this conversation, um, 0:20:57.200 --> 0:20:59.399 and so how we're clearly distinguished. We are the only 0:20:59.440 --> 0:21:02.560 one with the open hybrid cloud. So think of it 0:21:02.680 --> 0:21:06.480 real simple for a client, this means if it's open technologies, 0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:11.160 open source, open technologies, you can get access to innovation anywhere. 0:21:11.280 --> 0:21:14.440 Oh so A, I get more innovation. B. I can 0:21:14.480 --> 0:21:16.719 write something once and it can run anywhere. It can 0:21:16.800 --> 0:21:18.840 run on another cloud as long as you have that 0:21:18.960 --> 0:21:21.920 hybrid open layer there, and that means it could run 0:21:21.920 --> 0:21:23.960 on any number of public clouds. It could run on 0:21:24.000 --> 0:21:26.080 your own cloud, it can run on your private cloud. 0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:29.400 You're on premise, okay, perfect. So when a pandemic hits 0:21:29.440 --> 0:21:31.520