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Speaker 1: They run one vehicle up behind him and running another

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Speaker 1: one up and parked in front of the car and

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Speaker 1: open fire. Dad bailed out and he said, he he said,

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Speaker 1: I just ran, he said, and I ran hard. He said.

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Speaker 1: There was two ba bar fences. I don't remember jumping

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Speaker 1: any one of them. On this episode of the Bargaras Podcast,

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Speaker 1: we're going to continue building a biographical sketch of Louis

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Speaker 1: Dell and Charlie Edwards, two Southern characters known for being

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Speaker 1: turkey hunting outlaws, but also beloved men in their community.

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Speaker 1: By most we'll be diving into the Moonshine incident and

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Speaker 1: giving some backing for why people said they were rough men.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna hear about some fighting and some gun plays,

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Speaker 1: so if you're sensitive to such talk, be advised. But

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Speaker 1: if you want a picture into the American South, these

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Speaker 1: guys will deliver. These men were connected to the land

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Speaker 1: and it shaped their identity. Having known them my whole life,

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Speaker 1: I'm unashamed by how much I like these guys, but

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Speaker 1: conflicted by how much I disagree with some of the

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Speaker 1: stuff they did. Life is a paradox, and linear equations

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Speaker 1: built for judgment don't always add up. This episode is

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Speaker 1: a character sketch of two modern colorful characters. Their lives

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Speaker 1: were just straight up entertaining and intriguing. I doubt you're

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Speaker 1: gonna want to miss this one. And hey, stick around

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Speaker 1: to the very end and you'll hear me and Game

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Speaker 1: Warden Jimmy Martin relive the run in that I had

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Speaker 1: with him when I was sixteen years old. According to

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Speaker 1: game laws, they were poaching. According to our forefathers, they

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Speaker 1: were doing what they were supposed to. They grew up

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Speaker 1: with that mentality right Eron's Valley, and it still exists

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Speaker 1: to point we're more civilized now. Yeah. Yeah. My name

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Speaker 1: is Clay Nukelem and this is the Bear Grease Podcast,

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Speaker 1: where we'll explore things forgotten but relevant, search for insight

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Speaker 1: and unlikely places, and where we'll tell the story of

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Speaker 1: Americans who lived their lives close to the land. Presented

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Speaker 1: by f HF Gear American Maid, purpose built hunting and

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Speaker 1: fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged as the

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Speaker 1: places we explore. In Part one of our Genuine Outlaw series,

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Speaker 1: we introduced you to two brothers by the name of

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Speaker 1: Louis Dell and Charlie Edwards from Big Fork Arkansas in

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Speaker 1: the western wah Hitals. If you haven't listened to it,

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Speaker 1: you've got to for all this to make sense. Charlie

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Speaker 1: passed away in at the age of seventy three, and

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Speaker 1: Louis del in one at the age of seventy six.

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Speaker 1: I expressed my inner conflict in telling their story because

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Speaker 1: there is a risk of glamorizing breaking the laws and outlawing,

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Speaker 1: but being true to our mission. I love telling the

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Speaker 1: stories of people who live their lives close to the land,

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Speaker 1: especially in the South, and without a doubt, my whole life,

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Speaker 1: I've been intrigued by these men. I think it's an

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Speaker 1: apropos time to clarify the intent of telling this story.

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Speaker 1: It is not to decide if breaking game laws is

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Speaker 1: right or wrong. We all know the answer to that.

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Speaker 1: What it is is an intriguing look into human nature.

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Speaker 1: Often we gravitate towards stories that are far outside of

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Speaker 1: our personal experience. I've never been an intentional law breaker

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Speaker 1: or fighter, but these boys were. They're real deal characters

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Speaker 1: that shaped my view of rural Arkansas. You see, I

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Speaker 1: grew up in the same community as Louis Dell and Charlie,

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Speaker 1: and I was heavily influenced by my father, Gary Knucom,

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Speaker 1: a small town banker who would come home from work

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Speaker 1: and tell me stories about people he had met and

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Speaker 1: done business with. At the time, he nor I would

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Speaker 1: know how influential his storytelling would be in my life.

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Speaker 1: It taught me to value people of all types, and

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Speaker 1: he told me stories about Louis Dell and Charlie. But

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Speaker 1: the knowledge of these stories didn't push me to want

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Speaker 1: to break game laws. It was clear he valued them

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Speaker 1: for other reasons, and he still does. A window into

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Speaker 1: their life gave me a broader picture of the reality

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Speaker 1: of the world, a world that he knew I would

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Speaker 1: have to live in. The intent of exploring this story

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Speaker 1: is to help us evaluate our own biases, to search

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Speaker 1: for oocracies, and to see the bigger story that most

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Speaker 1: people have. Humans can't be described in totality by a

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Speaker 1: single descriptor or label. Life is sometimes gray. We don't

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Speaker 1: function well in those gray areas. Lastly, I hope this

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Speaker 1: story fortifies a culture of putting the wildlife resource first

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Speaker 1: by obeying science back to game laws. Being a poacher

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Speaker 1: isn't complex. You either is one or you ain't one.

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Speaker 1: But this story about Louis Dell and Charlie. Their life

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Speaker 1: is complex, and I'm not trying to decide whether I'm

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Speaker 1: okay with people being outlaws. I'm trying to make sense

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Speaker 1: of why people love them so much, and in the

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Speaker 1: same breath, understand how they were such rough characters. A

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Speaker 1: little backstory from episode one, we learned that the Edwards

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Speaker 1: brothers came from a family of moonshiners, and their uncle

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Speaker 1: and his coon dog were killed by police in the

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Speaker 1: ninth twenty six traffic stop gone Bad. These men were

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Speaker 1: known for killing a lot of turkeys and evading the

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Speaker 1: law with almost a supernatural ease, and they worked hard

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Speaker 1: at everything they did, including outlaw on we learned they

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Speaker 1: were generous and forthright, genuine even people used to the

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Speaker 1: scripture of pure But one thing is for sure, you

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Speaker 1: didn't want to cross them. Here's Stony Edwards, the son

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Speaker 1: of Charlie. He'll get us going into a string of

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Speaker 1: stories highlighting their rougher side. Get ready for a few rumbles.

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Speaker 1: They were as nice as can be, either one of them,

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Speaker 1: but they didn't have a whole lot of push to

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Speaker 1: The fuse was about that long and as long as

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Speaker 1: everything was going good and you were treating them as

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Speaker 1: well as they would treat using. You're fine, but then

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Speaker 1: you get on the bad side. And we were rough fellers.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they didn't believe in I will call the

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Speaker 1: law on you. They were gonna take care of it

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Speaker 1: theirselfs Do you remember several years ago there what was

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Speaker 1: the guy's name, How big old boy? Are you? Hard mercer? Well,

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Speaker 1: you know Pete Hillard and Jackie Ryan. They got this

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Speaker 1: great idea to call on Gloodell because they knew that

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Speaker 1: that would stir him up. And I don't remember who

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Speaker 1: they put, Oh they did. They got on the phone. Well,

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Speaker 1: we lived over here at dill Back Place at the time,

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Speaker 1: and I was about twenty, I guess, and here come

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Speaker 1: Uncloodell sliding into the yard. I mean he said, y'all

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Speaker 1: get in. We got take care of Now. You think

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Speaker 1: I'm joking, But when we left the house, every one

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Speaker 1: of us had a gunning ring. This wasn't gonna be

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Speaker 1: no barroom brawl crap. This was well, we got down

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Speaker 1: there and it was Jackie and peace and uh so Louis,

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Speaker 1: I mean Louis Dell was ready to it was. He

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Speaker 1: was ready for a shootout whatever it was gonna take

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Speaker 1: him and Dad both were really hard people are That's

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Speaker 1: how they came off. When you grow up like they did, though,

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Speaker 1: it was you gotta have that shell out there. That

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Speaker 1: was their protection. And then when they left here and

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Speaker 1: went to the city, they were dumb hillbillies according to

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Speaker 1: the city people, but they had that shell. Well. Everything

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Speaker 1: with them, too, was a fight. They didn't believe in

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Speaker 1: all the talking stuff. You just got walked. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I know, I've heard stories of a lot of our fights. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if only that phone call could have been recorded. Whatever

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Speaker 1: they said pushed Louis Dell to the edge. These brothers

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Speaker 1: had a stark and temperamental sense of justice. They didn't

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Speaker 1: do well with a lot of talking. Here's knee Old Taylor,

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Speaker 1: a good friend of the brothers. You know, Old Lois

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Speaker 1: del There's a lot of people that morning, Mike lud

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Speaker 1: mad h. I'm gonna tell you what, And you could

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Speaker 1: make him mad pretty easy. Charlie it was hard to

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Speaker 1: make mad, but Charlie is the one he wanted to watch.

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Speaker 1: He got mad because he was tougher and mean. Really,

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Speaker 1: everyone I spoke with said the same thing about Charlie.

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Speaker 1: He was tough here's Stony And for a little info,

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Speaker 1: The Candle Light is a bar on the edge of Oklahoma.

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Speaker 1: I was probably six and he had been over at

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Speaker 1: the Candlelight. They were shooting pool, which my dad loved

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Speaker 1: shoot pulling, and he had won a few games. And

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Speaker 1: he always wore a great, big old black leather cowboy hat.

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Speaker 1: I mean I remember him wearing one till the brim

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Speaker 1: on it was just nobs and he had sewed it

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Speaker 1: back together himself to three times. He was over there

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Speaker 1: that night and Uh, a man stood up and said,

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Speaker 1: I bet I can knock cut some hat off and

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Speaker 1: he won't do a thing about it. Well, he made

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Speaker 1: about two steps across the floor before Dad hit him

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Speaker 1: with a Q stick and he went down. He was done.

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Speaker 1: A couple of weeks later, they cornered Dad to go,

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Speaker 1: you know, bear to go, and uh went shooting at him. Well,

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Speaker 1: Dad bailed out of the car and off out across

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Speaker 1: the retaliating for what had happened. Well, they they run

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Speaker 1: one vehicle up behind him and running another one up

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Speaker 1: and parked in front of the car and opened fire.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, he Dad bailed out and he said he

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Speaker 1: he said, I just ran He said and I ran

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Speaker 1: hard and said. A couple of hours later he was

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Speaker 1: coming back. I want to get back to the car,

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Speaker 1: you know, And uh he said, there was two baby

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Speaker 1: our fences. I don't remember jumping in one of them.

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Speaker 1: Dad got into uh more of that stuff, and uh,

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Speaker 1: Uncle Adelle did. Uncle Ade was a little he was

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Speaker 1: just as rough, but he was a little more settled

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Speaker 1: about it. But as far as their heart went, they

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Speaker 1: do anything for for a friend or for somebody that

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Speaker 1: needed them. But they didn't want everybody to know about

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Speaker 1: it because that would affect that shell that they wouldn't

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Speaker 1: be tough guys. Anymore. Interesting analysis from Stony about them

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Speaker 1: developing a hardened shell. It seems the catalysts of this

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Speaker 1: hardness worked both ways. It made them deeply loyal and

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Speaker 1: devoted to friends, and it made them dangerous if you

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Speaker 1: cross them. Y'all remember Andy Brown here he is recalling

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Speaker 1: a story of a bar fight in Texas. If you remember,

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Speaker 1: these brothers worked out of state a fair bit in

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Speaker 1: the city. Oh Loudell talk hells a story about what

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Speaker 1: they were down there in DALYs of work. He said,

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Speaker 1: got that other one night, so it went to a

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Speaker 1: bar and he said, we walked in. He said, I

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Speaker 1: ain't been that bar ten minutes he said, he said, oh,

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Speaker 1: broke loose back there in the dangpool room. He said.

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Speaker 1: I looked around, and I said, where Charlie. He said,

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Speaker 1: he said he went back there and he said here

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Speaker 1: old Charlie that he said, Man, he's find the big

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Speaker 1: old boys. And he said, he said that old boy

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Speaker 1: and he whooped, he said, and he said about that time,

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Speaker 1: he said that old boy went to screaming and take

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Speaker 1: it on. And he said he finally looked. He said,

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Speaker 1: old Charlie was just taking bitens clugs out of me.

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Speaker 1: Tried to get away from him. Uh, it doesn't and

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Speaker 1: he whooped. He said, he went to their blugs out

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Speaker 1: of him. Wow, I can imagine a few people got

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Speaker 1: surprised by these outwardly unassuming hillbillies. You remember were Stoney

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Speaker 1: mentioning Jackie Ryan Prank calling Louis Dell, Well, this is

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Speaker 1: Jackie telling a story about the brothers. I was doing

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Speaker 1: a job in Dallas and they went down to a

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Speaker 1: club and uh, Charlie playing pool and and uh he

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Speaker 1: got in fat. I mean they getting he gets uh

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Speaker 1: you know it over money. I'm sure they're probably having

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Speaker 1: a bed. And Charlie he was good a bought both

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Speaker 1: of them is good pool shooters. And uh, but but

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Speaker 1: he gets in the fat in there, and there was

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Speaker 1: other people around and and uh, Louie got out there

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Speaker 1: truck and got his pistol and and I think the

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Speaker 1: fat he had moved outside or got outside, and there

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Speaker 1: was people around him while he was at the pistol

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Speaker 1: out and and Ann was keeping everybody off of them

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Speaker 1: while they was fat, and you know, and make sure

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Speaker 1: nobody get it bobbed, you know. And uh, I think

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Speaker 1: Charlie had used cuesdick on the game, you know. And

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Speaker 1: and there there was another part of it where he uh,

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Speaker 1: he chumped down on he's there. I know he did,

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Speaker 1: but he's uh. And Charlie had fathered face and they

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Speaker 1: he been a chunk guys there, that's what he did.

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Speaker 1: These guys weren't afraid to pull a gun or to

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Speaker 1: bite you. They played by their own rules. Like Andy said,

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Speaker 1: that's just the way it happened. Here's Andy with another one.

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Speaker 1: They were Dallas or Fort Worth putting in drop ceilings

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Speaker 1: for Walmart store, and uh, anyway, everything was kind of

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Speaker 1: open and anyway they had some old boys come in

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Speaker 1: there and kind of put in on them, and uh,

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Speaker 1: it was Charlie in Louddale in Vernon, Ryan Vernon was

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Speaker 1: working with him. This guy was yeen with with Loue Dell.

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Speaker 1: He was up on the scissor lift and Vernon said,

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Speaker 1: the whole time he's y yang and telling Loudell what

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Speaker 1: he's gonna do to him. He said, Charlie is slipping

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Speaker 1: up on that guy. He said he's got a claw Himer.

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Speaker 1: He said, he's got it in his hand. In Vernon.

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Speaker 1: Of course, Vernon says he's watching all this and watching

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Speaker 1: Charlie and he said, Charlie walks up behind that guy,

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Speaker 1: he said, with a claw in and he draws back

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Speaker 1: and Vernon said, I went, oh, whoa, whoa like it,

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Speaker 1: you know, And that guy saw him, but he said

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Speaker 1: Charlie was fixing and knocked him in the head with

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Speaker 1: that claw. Hammer said, but anyway, the guy kept telling

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Speaker 1: on Liddell, I'm gonna go get get my bunch and

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Speaker 1: I'll be back. And Loudelle said, that's exactly what you

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Speaker 1: guys need to do. And he said when that guy

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Speaker 1: walked off, Loudelle got down off his sister left, went

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Speaker 1: to his truck and I don't know, Clay, if you've

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Speaker 1: ever heard about the trust and the stories, he had

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Speaker 1: a rifle, that's all he ever deer hunted with. And anyway,

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Speaker 1: he went and got the five, put it on. The

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Speaker 1: sister left and got back up in the deal and

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Speaker 1: just kept working. And he kept working. But Loudell was

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Speaker 1: a great shot. I mean, when you run, when you

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Speaker 1: run deer with dogs, you've gotta be And then boys,

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Speaker 1: they wouldn't knew what happened if they had come back.

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Speaker 1: They never came back. No, they never come back. Thank god.

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Speaker 1: You know Verdon is scared to death or gonna come up. Yeah. Man,

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Speaker 1: it sounds like you wouldn't want to cross these boys.

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Speaker 1: And I'll tell you another thing that would not be

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Speaker 1: advisable would be messing with their dogs. This is a

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Speaker 1: longtime friend of the Edwards brothers, Jerry Dean Pickett. Well,

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Speaker 1: it was a dear season and we had been running

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Speaker 1: the dogs. There's a gap in there dogs. When I

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Speaker 1: was gap. We didn't kill the deer, but anyway, the

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Speaker 1: dog was checking it out. He had him with tracking

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Speaker 1: colors on and we come around are catching the dogs

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Speaker 1: and he said, one of my dog right up here,

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Speaker 1: on the right up here, and we drove up this

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Speaker 1: feller's house. He got out and he said, with my

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Speaker 1: dogs around here, right here close. He said, yeah, your

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Speaker 1: colors were on the woodpile. He said, I killed your

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Speaker 1: dog up there, and yeah, LOUI ain't never threatened him,

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Speaker 1: He never said nothing, but he just kept walking to him.

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Speaker 1: And when he got hands of him, he spatted him

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Speaker 1: when bouncing across him. Rocks and as a feller from

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Speaker 1: Texas hunting with this other fellow, I don't forgot his name,

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Speaker 1: and uh, Louis went to working on him. I'm telling you,

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Speaker 1: working on him. You're you're here, you're watching. I'm standing

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Speaker 1: right there and that other feller standing of workers. I

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Speaker 1: knew what was fending to happen when he said he

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Speaker 1: kill that dog, and I figured the other feller getting it,

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Speaker 1: but he didn't. Finally he hollered the whole hold Louis,

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Speaker 1: he didn't kill you, dough. So he stopped and he

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Speaker 1: told me, said asked him a question, He said, why

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Speaker 1: did you tell me you killed my dog? He never

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Speaker 1: would say, tell him, so he got his collar. He

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Speaker 1: got off fellow and he told him he said, I'm

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Speaker 1: going back to my house. My dog don't come home.

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Speaker 1: I'm coming back over and finished when I started, and

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Speaker 1: that's how Louis said, went on to the house. Sure enough,

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Speaker 1: the dog did come home. So so the guy was

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Speaker 1: just messing with Louis. Well, I guess, but Loui Dea

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Speaker 1: was't the type that you can mess with. He wasn't

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Speaker 1: gonna argue with you. It was just him and Charlie both.

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Speaker 1: You know, they didn't mind falling down the dirt, will

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Speaker 1: you if that's what you want to do. Now that

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Speaker 1: that's the part of them, I'm still trying to put

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Speaker 1: together the pieces because they were such like you get

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Speaker 1: this one feeling that they were just the nicest guys

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Speaker 1: in the world, which they were. I want to hear

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Speaker 1: how you connect the nicest guy in the world to

300
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Speaker 1: a guy that'll just fight you in a second? How

301
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Speaker 1: did that? How does that? Have you ever been in

302
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Speaker 1: there where people go to argon and you know, carrying on? Well,

303
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Speaker 1: I just want to time Charlie want nobody to tangle with.

304
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Speaker 1: So Charlie was the was a real tough guy, and

305
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Speaker 1: Louis was bad. But Charlie got more scrapped and Louis

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Speaker 1: did if you gen the beer, join or anywhere and

307
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Speaker 1: you got to won't argue with him. It was just

308
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Speaker 1: on Well, they shaved me three years old. He was

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Speaker 1: still laying block. Charlie was really he was still land

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Speaker 1: block at seventy three years that he was drown How

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00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:04,359
Speaker 1: how big were they? You know? I knew when I

312
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Speaker 1: was a kid. Louis was about my side. Carl It

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Speaker 1: was a little bit taller than Louis and he was.

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Speaker 1: They were both solid, yea stocky guys. Hands would big.

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Speaker 1: Both of them had big hand when you shook hands,

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Speaker 1: whether you could feel it. I find it a healthy

317
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Speaker 1: practice to peer into a world foreign too your own.

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Speaker 1: I've never been a fighter, nor would I condone violence

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Speaker 1: as a productive means of solving disputes. But I do

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00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:42,679
Speaker 1: admire their certainty to continue on in our study of

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Speaker 1: these brothers. I'm gonna read from a newspaper clipping from

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Speaker 1: the nineteen nine edition of the Mina Star. The headline

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Speaker 1: of this newspaper says big fort Man arrested and charged

324
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Speaker 1: with a legal whiskey still operation. A big fort Man

325
00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:01,960
Speaker 1: has been released a ten thousand dollar property bond after

326
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Speaker 1: being charged with the operation of the legal whisky whiskey

327
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:10,359
Speaker 1: still near the Polk Pike County line. Louis D. Edwards, forty,

328
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Speaker 1: will be arraigned Monday in Polk County Circuit courts, according

329
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Speaker 1: to Polk County Sheriff Fred Niblock. Niblock said it is

330
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Speaker 1: the first still confiscated in Polk County in approximately eleven years.

331
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Speaker 1: Officers also confiscated three hundred and five pounds of what

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Speaker 1: is believed to be deer meat, fifty to seventy five

333
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Speaker 1: pounds of what is believed to be turkey meat, along

334
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Speaker 1: with fifty two turkey beards at the house. According to the

335
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Speaker 1: the Arkansas Game and Fish Commission, Enforcement officers officers found

336
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:41,120
Speaker 1: an operational whiskey still, a hundred and sixty five gallons

337
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Speaker 1: of fermating mash, and partially filled wooden barrel containing approximately

338
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Speaker 1: twenty gallons of whiskey at edwards residence in Big Fork,

339
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Speaker 1: according to Nibblock. Also found were several gallon and half

340
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Speaker 1: gallon jars of whiskey. The officers sees the loaded shotgun

341
00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:01,440
Speaker 1: and several cartons of rifle and shot ammunition at the site,

342
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,879
Speaker 1: along with the nineteen four Chevrolet four wheel drive pickup

343
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Speaker 1: containing a bottle of what the officers believed to be

344
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:13,320
Speaker 1: illegal whiskey. Also confiscated where sugar yeast, corn starter mash,

345
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,000
Speaker 1: and utensils believed to have been used in the illegal

346
00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:19,840
Speaker 1: production of whiskey. Hey had a really nice set up.

347
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Speaker 1: I'll be dar Do you remember that as a kid.

348
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Speaker 1: I wasn't a kid. I was in the United States

349
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Speaker 1: Army when that What year was that? N Here's Neil

350
00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:37,399
Speaker 1: Taylor with what happened in the Moonshine raid. There was

351
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,480
Speaker 1: a guy come over to buy some fish. You know,

352
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:43,080
Speaker 1: Louie used to raise catfish. Louie had a little steel

353
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,399
Speaker 1: learned in the fish room, and they were just making

354
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Speaker 1: it for himself and mainly a few of his friends

355
00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:53,040
Speaker 1: out there. You know. Hey gave us old boys un well,

356
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:56,919
Speaker 1: they got drunk, got caught, told the more he got it,

357
00:21:57,000 --> 00:22:01,959
Speaker 1: you know. So they sent a sheriff Montgomery count here

358
00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:05,679
Speaker 1: over in pair of camouflage and talking about turkey hunting,

359
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:10,440
Speaker 1: you know, and and one off knew any place had some. Well,

360
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:13,440
Speaker 1: Louis gave him a court a game shot. That's good

361
00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:15,440
Speaker 1: that can I buy something? And not that I ain't

362
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:16,919
Speaker 1: gonna sell it to you, but he said, I'll give

363
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:19,399
Speaker 1: you a chuard of it. And Old Fred Neblake he

364
00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:21,920
Speaker 1: was sheriff and it was re election and he thought

365
00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:26,520
Speaker 1: that that would get him reelected. Oh, it was kind

366
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:30,000
Speaker 1: of a political move. Well to some extent it was

367
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:33,679
Speaker 1: he and they were just after and you know the

368
00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:37,080
Speaker 1: game Mordens eight was all in it in Ah. Oh.

369
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,520
Speaker 1: Look he was there at the house one morning and

370
00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:44,320
Speaker 1: he's camo overalls and barefoot didn't and all of a sudden,

371
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 1: long cars started pulling up in the front yard. Old

372
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: went out there and Old Fred he stepped out. He said,

373
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Speaker 1: what't going on? Fred? And I was I was kind

374
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Speaker 1: of afraid going out there, you know what he might do.

375
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Speaker 1: And he's, well, look you know what we heard. You

376
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:07,720
Speaker 1: had some uh well that he was making whiskey out here,

377
00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:13,119
Speaker 1: and Laris said, so he said, are you the smile

378
00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:22,280
Speaker 1: said the best whiskey you ever tasted. And so they

379
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:26,520
Speaker 1: coming learned. Of course the game wardens they had there's

380
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:28,760
Speaker 1: been they had been after him all his life, and

381
00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:31,040
Speaker 1: they coming there and they took Mete out of the

382
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:35,720
Speaker 1: freezers and they got turkey beards he kept through the years.

383
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:38,639
Speaker 1: And I don't know they had him for about twenty

384
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:42,800
Speaker 1: thousand dollars worth of game violations, and he was up.

385
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,119
Speaker 1: They heading to jail. I took him to jail, of course,

386
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:48,320
Speaker 1: and as upper and coming in, and I said, Lari said,

387
00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 1: we've got you for this, this, this now. If you'll

388
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:54,119
Speaker 1: plead guilty to the here said we'll drop it down

389
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 1: to in thousand and he said, boys, he said, I'm

390
00:23:56,800 --> 00:24:01,320
Speaker 1: not going to plead guilty to it. Fine. It wound up.

391
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:04,879
Speaker 1: They didn't. I like it, coughed him about Tian Graham

392
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:10,199
Speaker 1: on Whishkey making for the record. The idea that the

393
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,320
Speaker 1: raid was a political move by the sheriff isn't really

394
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 1: known for sure, but it was the speculation of many.

395
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,560
Speaker 1: The Moonshine raid also included a game and fish raid. However,

396
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:25,440
Speaker 1: all the wildlife violations were dropped. It's unclear to me

397
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 1: if it was because of faulty procedure in the raid

398
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:32,159
Speaker 1: making the evidence unusable in court, or if they just

399
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:36,600
Speaker 1: couldn't prove that all the wildlife was taken illegally. According

400
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:38,960
Speaker 1: to the family, the game and fish had to bring

401
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 1: back all the meat and return it to the Edwards freezer.

402
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:47,280
Speaker 1: So according to the law, Louis del was innocent of

403
00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:53,639
Speaker 1: the wildlife violations. On a completely irrelevant and tragic side note,

404
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:59,120
Speaker 1: Sheriff Fred Niblock would later become the mayor of Cove, Arkansas,

405
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: and in night he was murdered by a disgruntled seventy

406
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,200
Speaker 1: eight year old man upset about an eighteen dollar water bill.

407
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: The story made national news because the murderer had ridden

408
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,639
Speaker 1: his lawnmower to the city hall and also used it

409
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 1: as a getaway vehicle. David Letterman made a joke about

410
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,920
Speaker 1: the incident on his Late night show, bringing Arkansas into

411
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 1: the national spotlight for the eccentric murder. I bet you

412
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:31,919
Speaker 1: weren't expecting that. Here's some more of the back story

413
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:35,920
Speaker 1: on Louis Dell's moonshining from Jerry Deane Pickett that paints

414
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:39,400
Speaker 1: a little different light on it. For some info, Mr

415
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:42,840
Speaker 1: Mack was Louis Dell's father who only had one hand.

416
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:47,680
Speaker 1: Mr Mack he had done his grandpa and his daddy

417
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 1: and the old mate whiskey, and Mr Mack had a recipe.

418
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 1: And Louis Dale told me all along. He said, you know,

419
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 1: I ain't never made no whiskey, but I'd like to

420
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,920
Speaker 1: make it one time. Just see if I can, and

421
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 1: so he ended up getting to steal. He was making whiskey.

422
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:06,720
Speaker 1: He was already making it out there and buying his

423
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 1: house In't it a little garage I called it. He

424
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,439
Speaker 1: wasn't making it to sell or make a living. He

425
00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 1: just making it see if he could make Him and

426
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: Charlie I think he'd ruined about Tim Gallands at the time.

427
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: Did that bother him that he got that they busted

428
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 1: him for that? No, really, it just I mean he

429
00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 1: had to pay a lot of money though didn't well,

430
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: he had to get a lawyer affirt Main and they

431
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:32,879
Speaker 1: had to go to court and all that, But it

432
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 1: didn't bother He wasn't mad about that. I mean, but

433
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,240
Speaker 1: Louis never I never heard him say a horse word

434
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 1: against none of them he called him really so he

435
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:44,880
Speaker 1: just was kind of okay with him. Yeah, he got

436
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 1: Uh was he embarrassed about it? You think? Just kind

437
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,119
Speaker 1: of like just another day on Edwards Farm. He wanted

438
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,440
Speaker 1: to see if he could make it. But they wasn't

439
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:57,199
Speaker 1: making it to make money. They just Louis wanted just

440
00:26:57,680 --> 00:26:59,920
Speaker 1: he wanted to see if he could make it. Yeah,

441
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,200
Speaker 1: I've tried several times to get him to give me

442
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,920
Speaker 1: Max recipe, and he's to say, oh, jee, you don't

443
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: need that his recipe. It just gets you intro him.

444
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 1: That's all he would. He wouldn't give you till the

445
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 1: day he died. He never give me that recipe. Everybody

446
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:25,800
Speaker 1: agrees that Louis Dell never made moonshine again. If you remember,

447
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 1: on the first episode the game Warden, Jimmy Martin made

448
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:32,120
Speaker 1: some statements about how he never caught Louis Dell and Charlie,

449
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: which was correct because during his career nobody ever caught him. However,

450
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,440
Speaker 1: before Jimmy Martin became a game warden, they were caught

451
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 1: for illegal turkey hunting when they were young. Here's Neil

452
00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 1: Taylor telling about the brothers getting caught. Let me go back,

453
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:51,720
Speaker 1: let me go back. Before we was at just a

454
00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:55,120
Speaker 1: minute ago. I said that Louis never got caught. In Charlie,

455
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: they did get caught one time when they first started.

456
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 1: Really I guess say turkey hunted all her life off. No,

457
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: but when they really took off serious about it. Uh,

458
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 1: he had no toy Yoda, and he had take that

459
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:11,000
Speaker 1: thing where a billy goat couldn't go. You could look

460
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 1: at the body work on it until it But they

461
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:17,479
Speaker 1: went up as old skid trail top of the mountain

462
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: and they drought turkey hunting and they killed one. But

463
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: anyhow they called. They had parked down and walked up

464
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,879
Speaker 1: the mountain, was hidding the brush around a Loulie struck,

465
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:28,920
Speaker 1: he haven't Charlie come out, and they put the bird

466
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,439
Speaker 1: under the hood and stuff started getting the truck, and

467
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:36,120
Speaker 1: they come out and rested them, you know, and old

468
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 1: Charlie out And I could nobody tell it like Charlie did,

469
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 1: he said. After they rode as a tickets, he said,

470
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: the dumb ass old bees ask us for a ride

471
00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 1: back down the mountain. Louie said, well, sure, you give

472
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:56,160
Speaker 1: you a ride, just crawling the biker. Old Charlie, you

473
00:28:56,360 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: get tick, will tell me, he said. Louise hearted up

474
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,360
Speaker 1: and backed up, trying ran. He said he looked over

475
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:08,600
Speaker 1: it when he said, Charlie, you better hang on. He said,

476
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 1: Louis forward that thing, and he said we went off

477
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,520
Speaker 1: of that dad gum mounting on that good trail on

478
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 1: hitting him was wasshed out place, and he said, you

479
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 1: looked back her in the back. He said, they had

480
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 1: all be with her hands and hair stuck up in

481
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 1: the air on their back one time, he said, next

482
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:30,960
Speaker 1: time they'd become down on her ants. He said, it's

483
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 1: a wander at and killed. He said, you know when

484
00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 1: they stopped at the bottom, he said, has sound grateful.

485
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 1: They didn't even think us for giving him a ride.

486
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 1: So they did get caught. And I don't want to

487
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 1: take lightly these guys disregard for the law or putting

488
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 1: someone in danger, But that doesn't erase for me how

489
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: interesting this story is. If there was a movie about

490
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 1: these guys, which there probably should be, this would probably

491
00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 1: be your favorite scene. I I'm just trying to figure

492
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:03,960
Speaker 1: all this out because I don't think any of us

493
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 1: would condone such behavior or do it ourselves, but it's

494
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 1: no doubt intriguing. Author Mark Bowden, in his book Killing Pablo,

495
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:17,960
Speaker 1: gave some insight into the irony of our intrigue with outlaws.

496
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:22,720
Speaker 1: Here's the quote from the book, quote the ones immortalized

497
00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 1: by Hollywood al Capone Body and Clyde Jesse James. Large

498
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:31,520
Speaker 1: numbers of average people rooted for them and followed their

499
00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 1: bloody exploits with some measure of delight. Their acts, however

500
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 1: selfish or senseless, were invested with social meaning. Their crimes

501
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 1: and violence were blows struck against distant oppressive power. Their

502
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: stealth and cunning and avoiding soldiers and police were celebrated,

503
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: these being the time honored tactics of the powerless man.

504
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 1: That sounds familiar in dearmot to an outlaw is the

505
00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 1: time honored tactic of the powerless. We'll hear a lot

506
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 1: more about this in later episodes. Here's stody was some

507
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 1: more interesting intel. They got caught again, So they did

508
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 1: get caught. That was the one time they got caught. All.

509
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 1: Dad got caught another time. He'd been hunting down here. Oh,

510
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 1: there used to be an old man lived down here

511
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 1: named Fred Ferguson, And Dad had went in behind his

512
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: house that morning and he killed him a good gobbler.

513
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 1: And when he come back out, which Fred was about

514
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: seventy five or eight years old, then he stopped at

515
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: Fred's and cleaned it and gave Fred the bird. Well,

516
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 1: then Dad went home. Well, I guess the game, and

517
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: Fish had heard him shoot or seen him to leave Fred's.

518
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 1: And they went in and searched and found that turkey

519
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: and told Fred called Charlie and tell him get come

520
00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 1: over here. And take his ticket, or we're gonna take

521
00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 1: you to jail. And Dad got in his truck and

522
00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,719
Speaker 1: go back over there. Kind got his ticket. Dad told me,

523
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:07,640
Speaker 1: he said, have dollars that average apter list and thirty

524
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:11,360
Speaker 1: cents a bird today if you get caught. The law

525
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:15,400
Speaker 1: confiscates vehicles, guns and all kinds of stuff, along with

526
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 1: fines that can cripple a man, which we all believe

527
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: is a good thing. Again, I think Charlie's sentiment clearly

528
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,040
Speaker 1: shows this was a different era. Back then, it was

529
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 1: just a ticket and a three fine. I'll let you

530
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 1: do the math on how many turkeys Charlie claim to kill.

531
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 1: This also gives us a one time glimpse into what

532
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 1: these guys did with some of the meat. In this case,

533
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,360
Speaker 1: Charlie gave it to the elderly landowner. If you remember,

534
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,040
Speaker 1: the game warden didn't think they killed as many turkeys

535
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 1: as people believed because of the unsolved issue about what

536
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 1: was done with all the meat. However, one thing every

537
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 1: single person agreed on is that they would never waste

538
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 1: any meat. Here's Neil giving us some insight on some

539
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 1: of what they did with it. You know, I know

540
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,560
Speaker 1: that a lot of old people old ladies and stuff.

541
00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 1: And even if something old men, they got too old,

542
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 1: get out. Louis would take them, dear mate, he'd take

543
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 1: them turkey breast when he when he gave somebody like

544
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: get the mayor, you hey, might give a show for

545
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:25,240
Speaker 1: the refs too. Yeah, but them old people like it.

546
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:27,760
Speaker 1: He took the best cuts to him. He'd take him

547
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 1: if he took them tender on something, onom he took

548
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: them a young tender one, or he'd give them the breast. Yeah, turkey.

549
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,920
Speaker 1: When I mentioned to somebody about their ethic around meat,

550
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 1: they said, turkey poachers only take the breasts. Well, I

551
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 1: wanted to get to the bottom of this. Here's Jerry Deane.

552
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: I've heard it said that he had a really strong

553
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 1: ethic for not wasting meat. He would not hunt nothing

554
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 1: anything they're waste. I mean a lot of these people

555
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 1: take the breast out of a turkey and throw the

556
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 1: rest of the way. No, no, we we take all

557
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 1: the dark legion. Really, so, even even if he was

558
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 1: illegally killed a turkey and was sneaking it out in

559
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:14,799
Speaker 1: his pants pockets, he was taking the drumsticks and the

560
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 1: thighs and everything. You didn't leave nothing but the God.

561
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 1: I had another person off the record confirmed to me

562
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:25,239
Speaker 1: that they always took the entire turkey and never just

563
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:28,520
Speaker 1: breasted it out. I got a question for you. Have

564
00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 1: you ever breasted out of turkey and not used the

565
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:35,279
Speaker 1: thighs and drumsticks? Be honest, because I sure have. With

566
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,600
Speaker 1: today's wild game movement, most people are now keeping and

567
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:41,399
Speaker 1: using the dark meat on a turkey. Back in the day,

568
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:44,320
Speaker 1: I'm telling you they didn't do that. But these boys

569
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: were doing this long before it was cool. Again, I'm

570
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 1: not saying that made poaching right. That's not what I'm

571
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 1: saying at all. I'm just saying it's an interesting point.

572
00:34:55,560 --> 00:35:00,240
Speaker 1: Here's Stoney with some more details. We ate everything. I

573
00:35:00,239 --> 00:35:02,600
Speaker 1: I've had a lot of friends that would go hunting

574
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:04,919
Speaker 1: with us and they would sit there and bone out

575
00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:08,799
Speaker 1: of deer. Oh most of them don't take ribs, and

576
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,279
Speaker 1: they don't take necks, And there's not a lot of

577
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:14,440
Speaker 1: meat on ribs or necks either one. But when we

578
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:18,760
Speaker 1: get home, what we don't eat, our dogs do. Because

579
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,400
Speaker 1: we've got a cook pot that's as big as this table.

580
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:26,279
Speaker 1: We'll take ribs, we take coon carcasses, possum carcasses. We

581
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: don't skin coons and woods. We'll bring them home, skin

582
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 1: them out. Carcass goes in the freezer when we've got

583
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 1: enough in there. We filled pot up that potle feed

584
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,920
Speaker 1: dogs for about two weeks. When they were growing up.

585
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 1: That's all the dogs eight was. There was dog food

586
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 1: stuff when I was a kid, that pot cooking in

587
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,279
Speaker 1: the front yard and they just build a big pine

588
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 1: not fire into that pot. So they had a really

589
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,960
Speaker 1: strong thing about not wasting meat. None of it goes

590
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,880
Speaker 1: to waste. As long as they knew you were taking

591
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 1: it to eat, that they did not have a problem.

592
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:04,680
Speaker 1: Was it. Here's Stoney talking about the only time they

593
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 1: turned somebody else into the game and fish. They came

594
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,800
Speaker 1: from a different era and just had a mentality about

595
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,960
Speaker 1: taking more game than they were allotted. Like why did

596
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:19,359
Speaker 1: why do you think they thought they could do that?

597
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:21,399
Speaker 1: And what would they have been mad at somebody else

598
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 1: if somebody else has been like that, Like if there

599
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:26,359
Speaker 1: had been another another guy a couple of mountains over

600
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:30,680
Speaker 1: that was just as big a big outlaws them. I've

601
00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: seen them turn one person in and my whole life

602
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 1: they called they went drove out and called game fish

603
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:41,799
Speaker 1: on that was wasting meat. We were hunting down on

604
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: South Boundary. That was the only year we camped down there.

605
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 1: And there were some people camped down just below us,

606
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:52,399
Speaker 1: and they had four carcasses laying there and they had

607
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:54,920
Speaker 1: they hadn't even skin them, and they cut back straps

608
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 1: out of them, and the whole rest of the deers

609
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,719
Speaker 1: were all four deer were laying there. And my uncle

610
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:01,839
Speaker 1: drew by that and he said that ain't you on fly?

611
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,759
Speaker 1: And he drove from there to Langley and called game

612
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:09,760
Speaker 1: fish and had got him upburn and they got rope takes.

613
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:17,279
Speaker 1: Interesting stuff. These next two stories are just straight up

614
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:21,560
Speaker 1: entertaining that continued to paint a picture who these characters were.

615
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 1: Here's Andy Brown. I don't know he just I'm missing

616
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,120
Speaker 1: my missing every day, you know, I think about everybody's

617
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 1: got a Louis Hill story, and you know, I've one

618
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 1: of the funniest stories and of all time probably this.

619
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,279
Speaker 1: If If I had this on tape, I would I

620
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:42,439
Speaker 1: would have been a millionaire because back when I first

621
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 1: went to work for the company I worked for, I

622
00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:48,879
Speaker 1: had insured a house that Louisdell owned over between Big

623
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:52,040
Speaker 1: FOURK and Opal. Charlie lived in it with his wife

624
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:55,439
Speaker 1: and so when I insured it, we had a field man,

625
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,440
Speaker 1: Charles glide when he's one of the greatest guys I've

626
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: ever met in my life. And so we pulled up

627
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 1: over to Charlie's got out and they had a rot

628
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 1: water dog that you could road. I mean, he was

629
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 1: a monster. Step on the porch, you know, but I mean,

630
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:13,360
Speaker 1: you know. We get by the roight waller dog and

631
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:15,640
Speaker 1: we go in and I said to Charlie, I said,

632
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: I said, we need to look at your breaker box.

633
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 1: And he I can't remember what his wife's name was,

634
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 1: but she was really nice. He said, take him in

635
00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: there and sho him where the breaker box is. So

636
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:28,239
Speaker 1: we walk in this We walk in this bedroom and

637
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 1: there's this big old cage, I mean a big cage,

638
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:38,880
Speaker 1: and breaker box is over on the wall that anyway,

639
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 1: Charlie goes over and looks at it and takes a

640
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:43,360
Speaker 1: picture of it, and in about that time, this fox

641
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,040
Speaker 1: squirrel comes running out on this They got this tree

642
00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 1: for li Liam's cut. This fox girl comes running out

643
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 1: there and I said, I said, oh, you've got a

644
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 1: pet squirrel and she says, oh yeah, she says this thing. Thanks,

645
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:56,080
Speaker 1: I'm a smarma, and she just reaches over and opens

646
00:38:56,160 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 1: up the cage. That squirrel just hops up on her shoulder,

647
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: on her It's sitting there popping to stay like that,

648
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 1: and Charlie is standing about about eighteen inches from her.

649
00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:13,719
Speaker 1: And Charlie's dressed nice. He's got his tie on and

650
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 1: his white shirt and his knit pants. And about that

651
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,800
Speaker 1: time Charlie goes, oh, that's a nice squirrel, And about

652
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:29,680
Speaker 1: that time that thing just hops over on charts. Oh, man,

653
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 1: old Charlie. He just froze. He just stiffened up. And

654
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:37,680
Speaker 1: when she when she reached to get that squirrel, that squirrel,

655
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 1: Clay just ringed him like a dead snack. He had

656
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:48,120
Speaker 1: no stiff pants up. And when it did, he just

657
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:59,880
Speaker 1: stiffened up like anyone. He screamed like a walk anywhe

658
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 1: she got to squirrel over the closing anything like that,

659
00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:10,160
Speaker 1: I was out of control. I couldn't even catch my breath.

660
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 1: But anyway, that's a story, but that's hilarious. So they

661
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:22,080
Speaker 1: had a pet fox girl. Oh, he screamed like a wildcat.

662
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,880
Speaker 1: I'll never in my life forget Andy Belly laughing about

663
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:30,240
Speaker 1: this thirty years after it happened. Here's another interesting story

664
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:35,480
Speaker 1: about Louis Dell's appreciation of rattlesnakes and the Edwards brother's

665
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: choice of footwear. This is Jackie Ryan, the guy that

666
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:44,840
Speaker 1: nearly got shot when he prank called Louis Dell. We

667
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 1: was turkey out one morning, coming off a mountain and

668
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:50,320
Speaker 1: and I mean we should have ratt I mean just

669
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:55,040
Speaker 1: we went airborne to old same time, but uh, huge

670
00:40:55,120 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 1: rattler and they rattle return and we scattered. Well, I

671
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:03,439
Speaker 1: mean he should leave it, baby, don't don't mess with it. Said,

672
00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 1: he could have been at either one of us, you know.

673
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:08,640
Speaker 1: And uh he's told me stories here just not there

674
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 1: or four year ago or if five, maybe about one. Uh,

675
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 1: he was a word turkey on one morning and daylight

676
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:20,200
Speaker 1: and and uh he heard some rustling in the leaves

677
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 1: and and he should do was a monster one come

678
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:26,360
Speaker 1: right up between his legs, him sitting there against tree

679
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:28,880
Speaker 1: that he had set out on it. It was just

680
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 1: cold that morning, you know, it was early spring. And uh,

681
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 1: he just didn't never believe in killing rattlesnakes. I've seen

682
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,480
Speaker 1: him catch one. We've been aware of fishing on the

683
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:43,920
Speaker 1: cost Tot And he was out there barefooted at at dark.

684
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: It was just after dark and and got him a

685
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 1: stick and fork of stick, and he caught that thing

686
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:51,880
Speaker 1: and got it by the bash of the head and

687
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 1: put it back to the truck and carried it back

688
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:57,080
Speaker 1: and were with him a word baylock. I mean, I

689
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,719
Speaker 1: never didn't even kill one, so he turned it loose. Yeah,

690
00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:04,479
Speaker 1: he likes trattle snakes. I like that. I like rattle

691
00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:07,239
Speaker 1: snakes too. And he wore tennis shoes every I mean

692
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:09,640
Speaker 1: when he went a hunting most every time he went,

693
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:12,399
Speaker 1: he wore tennis shoes. Did he really, Oh? Yeah, yeah,

694
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: he didn't hunting boots. No, did he not know he'd

695
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 1: wear tennis shoes old Tam, he did, but he kind

696
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 1: of hunt and he did. He wore tennis shoes. This

697
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:26,800
Speaker 1: is new news to me. He always had crossing creeks

698
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: and getting wet and I didn't care about that. He

699
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,480
Speaker 1: weighed right out in it didn't matter, and just wear

700
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:36,200
Speaker 1: wet tennis shoes. And I'm sure cotton socks he probably didn't. Yeah,

701
00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:38,600
Speaker 1: I don't remember exactly what socks she wore, but I

702
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:40,799
Speaker 1: know he wore them tennis shoes old time. And he

703
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:43,799
Speaker 1: did that in Colorado too, did he really? Yeah, he'd

704
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:46,800
Speaker 1: wear tennis shoes. I don't remember him wearing many boots.

705
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 1: He did backed years ago work in boots. I don't

706
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,320
Speaker 1: think he done a whole lot in boots. Really, he

707
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 1: didn't even work in leather. But he wore tennis shoes

708
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:59,399
Speaker 1: most of the time. Oh my, okay, Jackie, you don't

709
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,200
Speaker 1: know what you've done, because this recks my philosophy. I

710
00:43:03,239 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: have a really strong philosophy on footwear. And you are

711
00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:10,040
Speaker 1: well inside the bounds. You're wearing a beautiful pair of

712
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 1: probably red wing boots. I don't know if it was Okay, okay,

713
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,120
Speaker 1: I got my schnays one. I don't like to go

714
00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:19,440
Speaker 1: anywhere where I don't have a good leather boot on me.

715
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 1: Was he ever bit by a snake that you know?

716
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 1: Not that I know of. I heard Charlie was one

717
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:31,400
Speaker 1: time a squirrel hunt, and they said he'd squirrel barefooted,

718
00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:35,120
Speaker 1: you know, because where you slip around and got bit

719
00:43:35,239 --> 00:43:38,040
Speaker 1: by a copy head. But I mean that just want

720
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: hunted squirrels barefoot. Yeah, I believe it. And I think

721
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:46,960
Speaker 1: they had competitions. I mean, you know, they was they

722
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 1: were competitive with each other, and you know, and and

723
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:53,399
Speaker 1: I think Louie always thought Charlie but a squirrel hunter,

724
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:57,240
Speaker 1: and he was that maybe not on anything else but squirrels.

725
00:43:57,280 --> 00:44:01,239
Speaker 1: I think it's you know, he thought, butter squirrel on it.

726
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:04,400
Speaker 1: I wouldn't want have been a squirrel in the woods.

727
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:10,160
Speaker 1: Louis Dell was a woodsman in the truest sense of

728
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 1: the word. He knew the woods like the back of

729
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:16,200
Speaker 1: his hand and how to gain resource from it. He

730
00:44:16,280 --> 00:44:18,239
Speaker 1: spent more time in the woods in a year than

731
00:44:18,320 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 1: most people would in a lifetime. To hear that he

732
00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,520
Speaker 1: wore tennis shoes kind of puts all our fancy gear

733
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 1: into perspective. I had a question for Stony about some

734
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:31,560
Speaker 1: of the deer's uncle and dad killed. Honestly, I was

735
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 1: hoping to see some of the racks. I was very

736
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:40,399
Speaker 1: surprised at what he said. Did Uh did your dad

737
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:42,560
Speaker 1: or Louis Dell ever kill any I mean, I know

738
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:45,839
Speaker 1: they did, real big bucks. Oh yeah, have you got

739
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:48,279
Speaker 1: some of their horns? Still you don't have any of

740
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:51,960
Speaker 1: their horns? Uh? Gloodell's got two deer hanging on his wall.

741
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:56,080
Speaker 1: About four years ago, we had been running all morning

742
00:44:56,320 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 1: and we got back to his house and I heard

743
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 1: two him dogs, three of my dogs. They've been running

744
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 1: five hours and I heard him come across the mountain

745
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:08,040
Speaker 1: up there, and Uncle, I'll run to the truck and

746
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:10,839
Speaker 1: got his gun, and uh, he said, they'll come out

747
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 1: at the crowd down there, and I said, all right,

748
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:16,600
Speaker 1: well it's a cross three hundred yards. Well, we looked

749
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 1: up and here coming this buck across the field and

750
00:45:19,239 --> 00:45:21,640
Speaker 1: he's coming right straight at us. Well, he got out

751
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:25,239
Speaker 1: there and turned broadside, and Uncle I said shoot him,

752
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:27,360
Speaker 1: and I said I I can't. He's a hundred and

753
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 1: fifty hundred and sixty yards and he's out of my

754
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:31,680
Speaker 1: He's got a six meli mate in his hand. I

755
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:36,920
Speaker 1: said you shoot him and he boom. He turned the

756
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:39,960
Speaker 1: circle there and fell over and then and he was

757
00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:44,040
Speaker 1: he's a nice, nice eleven point. And I told Uncle

758
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:46,520
Speaker 1: and I said, we need to go get that one mounted. Well,

759
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,640
Speaker 1: we we sat down right there before we even went

760
00:45:49,680 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 1: to the deer, because Dan's still hear the dogs. There

761
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:56,080
Speaker 1: was a mile behind him. He can still hear dogs running.

762
00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:57,640
Speaker 1: And I said, they'll be out here in a minute.

763
00:45:57,680 --> 00:46:01,000
Speaker 1: Let them let them find him, you know. And directly

764
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:03,080
Speaker 1: here you see all three of them coming across the

765
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 1: field right up there and circling in that deer. And

766
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:08,920
Speaker 1: we went ahead and drove out there then. And I

767
00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:10,760
Speaker 1: don't know if he was more proud of the deer

768
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:14,359
Speaker 1: or the dogs, because he sat there petting on him

769
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:17,320
Speaker 1: and feeding him liver. And you need, you need to

770
00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:20,319
Speaker 1: put that deer in this uh gas station. Uncloud Hell's

771
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:23,280
Speaker 1: got three sets of horns that he's kept his entire life.

772
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:27,239
Speaker 1: Ones is both kill elk five to five elk that

773
00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:30,880
Speaker 1: buck there and then year before last he killed a

774
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:34,200
Speaker 1: nice nine point. They saw off horns and just keep

775
00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 1: him in the barn or something. Yeah, but they gave

776
00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 1: him way over the years. Yeah, dad killed a killed

777
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:44,040
Speaker 1: a thirteen point. They had a twenty three inside spread

778
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:48,319
Speaker 1: and uh, my nephew came came from Tulsa, and Dad

779
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 1: gave him the horns. And they killed a lot of

780
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:53,680
Speaker 1: nice ones over the years. But the horns just didn't

781
00:46:53,680 --> 00:46:57,560
Speaker 1: mean much to him. It didn't mean anything. Give they

782
00:46:57,680 --> 00:47:01,280
Speaker 1: give away their deer horns. They just when we're deer

783
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:05,680
Speaker 1: camp during that week, it's all important, the big bucks,

784
00:47:06,040 --> 00:47:09,319
Speaker 1: who killed the biggest buck. When we go home that night,

785
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:12,280
Speaker 1: the last night of camp, none of it matters anymore.

786
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:14,799
Speaker 1: In fact, when we're packing up camp. Oh, you can

787
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: have them horned I feel on them. That was surprising

788
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:21,719
Speaker 1: to me that they didn't care about the horns. It

789
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:26,799
Speaker 1: doesn't fit the stereotypical ideas we have about quote poachers,

790
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:30,040
Speaker 1: but it does fit the character of Louis Dell and Charlie.

791
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:32,920
Speaker 1: I'd sooner give away my truck than a set of

792
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 1: white tail antlers. Does that make me a trophy hunter?

793
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:39,239
Speaker 1: Louis Dell and Charlie were serious deer hunters, and the

794
00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 1: only way they cared about killing one is if it

795
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:44,520
Speaker 1: was in front of a dog. And for the purpose

796
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:49,640
Speaker 1: of the expansion of our worldview, I'll mention this dog

797
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 1: deer hunters have often been known to think that still hunters,

798
00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:57,319
Speaker 1: tree stand hunters, guys that hunt over corn piles and

799
00:47:57,440 --> 00:48:01,720
Speaker 1: food plots aren't real sport wortsman. They believe it takes

800
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 1: more skill and dedication to craft to kill a deer

801
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:08,800
Speaker 1: in front of a dog, and when you hear their side,

802
00:48:08,960 --> 00:48:12,360
Speaker 1: it's hard to argue with the purpose of this is

803
00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:15,239
Speaker 1: not to incite an argument or debate of whether the

804
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:18,400
Speaker 1: doctrine is right or wrong, because there isn't an answer.

805
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:22,400
Speaker 1: I've always talked about supporting all legal methods of hunting.

806
00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:25,960
Speaker 1: Stuff like this teaches me the world is much bigger

807
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:30,000
Speaker 1: than my small window into it and my personal preferences

808
00:48:30,040 --> 00:48:33,240
Speaker 1: in my style of hunting, and I respect the way

809
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,839
Speaker 1: a man wants to hunt as long as it's within

810
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,799
Speaker 1: the boundaries of the law. What Stony is about to

811
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:44,720
Speaker 1: say is controversial, but he's speaking for his own father

812
00:48:44,760 --> 00:48:48,440
Speaker 1: and uncle, who can no longer speak for themselves, and

813
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,520
Speaker 1: I think he's got the right to express the mechanics

814
00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:56,719
Speaker 1: of their mentality. For anybody to hang a poacher stigma

815
00:48:56,840 --> 00:49:01,719
Speaker 1: on them, I believe it's wrong. According to UH game laws,

816
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 1: they were poaching. According to our forefathers, they were doing

817
00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:10,239
Speaker 1: what they were supposed to. I mean that, and that's

818
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:12,960
Speaker 1: the way they looked at it. If I come into

819
00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:14,920
Speaker 1: your house and tell you how to eat your corn,

820
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,799
Speaker 1: you know you have to have this much butter on it,

821
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 1: and you can only have ten pieces. You're gonna tell

822
00:49:20,600 --> 00:49:23,839
Speaker 1: me to go to when they come into our home,

823
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:27,640
Speaker 1: which I'm sorry. These mountains are their home, all of them,

824
00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:30,839
Speaker 1: not just the land they own. All these mountains are

825
00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:33,680
Speaker 1: their home. When you come into their home and say, well,

826
00:49:33,719 --> 00:49:36,600
Speaker 1: here's all these, dear, you can only kill this one

827
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,600
Speaker 1: or this one, but leave all these alone. They're gonna

828
00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:42,279
Speaker 1: tell you to go to if you go back far enough.

829
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:46,720
Speaker 1: Our country is founded on that very principle. Those guys

830
00:49:46,760 --> 00:49:50,239
Speaker 1: got tired of England telling them what they could and

831
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 1: could not have. Well, the people that moved in here

832
00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 1: weren't very far removed from those people that told England

833
00:49:57,120 --> 00:50:00,080
Speaker 1: go to So they grew up with that mental to

834
00:50:00,160 --> 00:50:04,320
Speaker 1: your Eron's Valley, and it still exists to a point.

835
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:11,440
Speaker 1: We're more civilized now. Yeah, the need isn't there now.

836
00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:16,200
Speaker 1: I asked Neil Taylor a question about how the community

837
00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:20,399
Speaker 1: dealt with these guys killing more than their share. How

838
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:24,640
Speaker 1: do you how did people perceive that, because everybody knew

839
00:50:25,080 --> 00:50:27,520
Speaker 1: that these were turkeys that you know, they were taking

840
00:50:27,560 --> 00:50:30,239
Speaker 1: away more than their share. What was your perception of

841
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 1: the way people in the community handled that. Well, I

842
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:37,560
Speaker 1: may not everybody knew it. You know, people's way of

843
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:41,239
Speaker 1: thinking change from time to time. From when you was

844
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 1: a kid, you already see a huge difference in how

845
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:49,120
Speaker 1: people thinks and takes different things. Yeah, it's totally different.

846
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:52,920
Speaker 1: There were still enough of the old timers back that

847
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 1: so they didn't care. There was plenty of turkeys for

848
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:58,440
Speaker 1: them and everybody else too. And there wasn't there that

849
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:02,440
Speaker 1: many turkey hunters back right, I could go out and

850
00:51:03,040 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 1: go hunting and never see a vehicle hardly. Now you

851
00:51:06,719 --> 00:51:09,520
Speaker 1: go out there and there's four or five vehicles where

852
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:12,719
Speaker 1: you've been scouting. On opening the morning, you know, a

853
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:15,480
Speaker 1: lot of people started coming in from the city, you know,

854
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:19,600
Speaker 1: and there was a few people that didn't like it

855
00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:23,480
Speaker 1: at all. I mean, you know, you know what you

856
00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:27,960
Speaker 1: said about how people's mentalities change over time, that's a

857
00:51:28,120 --> 00:51:31,359
Speaker 1: that's a very real thing that's hard to calibrate. Like

858
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:34,520
Speaker 1: I think today, I feel like today, even though certainly

859
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:37,760
Speaker 1: there's still people that break the law, it's much more

860
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:41,400
Speaker 1: common for people to pretty much obey the law. And

861
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:43,840
Speaker 1: there's a lot of reasons for that. You know, people

862
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:48,000
Speaker 1: are more educated about the science of game management, even

863
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:50,919
Speaker 1: if they're ones are not back then to call call

864
00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:52,440
Speaker 1: a game ward and you had to go to the

865
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:55,400
Speaker 1: house now and they can't take a picture of you

866
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:58,480
Speaker 1: and your tags right there, you call right there and

867
00:51:58,600 --> 00:52:02,719
Speaker 1: follow you know, right, Okay, So yeah, technology has made

868
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:06,600
Speaker 1: enforcement easier, which has made people be more apt to

869
00:52:06,600 --> 00:52:09,919
Speaker 1: obey the law. But I don't think that that's as much.

870
00:52:10,080 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 1: Is is what some people thinks it is. I think

871
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:18,960
Speaker 1: it's uh. The mentality of thinking what Neil is tapping

872
00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:23,400
Speaker 1: into is true. We have too many examples throughout history

873
00:52:23,440 --> 00:52:26,600
Speaker 1: of a shifting value system, and it doesn't make what

874
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:30,840
Speaker 1: happened before necessarily right. It just helps us make sense

875
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:34,880
Speaker 1: of how some stuff happened. I wanted to ask Stony

876
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:38,840
Speaker 1: something and I had no idea what he would say.

877
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:42,600
Speaker 1: What are the things that you you would pound the

878
00:52:42,640 --> 00:52:47,239
Speaker 1: table for for your kids or grandkids in terms of

879
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:49,600
Speaker 1: the values that they had that you would want them

880
00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:53,240
Speaker 1: to have. I want my kids to be law abiding

881
00:52:54,520 --> 00:52:59,480
Speaker 1: in in this day and time. You go buy a car, well,

882
00:52:59,520 --> 00:53:01,200
Speaker 1: if you met us up the game and fish can

883
00:53:01,239 --> 00:53:04,480
Speaker 1: take that car back in their prime when this was

884
00:53:04,520 --> 00:53:07,200
Speaker 1: going on, game fish didn't have that power. I mean,

885
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:10,239
Speaker 1: you get a fine, all right, we'll pay it and

886
00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:13,319
Speaker 1: go on. I want my kids pounding the table for

887
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 1: their guns, and my boys believing their guns, and I

888
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:20,919
Speaker 1: want them to pound on the table for their right

889
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:23,759
Speaker 1: to hunt, had to hunt the ways they want to

890
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:29,000
Speaker 1: bid bows and arrows or guns or black powder or

891
00:53:29,320 --> 00:53:33,680
Speaker 1: spear checking. I mean, but I also want them to

892
00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:38,160
Speaker 1: pound the table for conservation. There's a touch of that

893
00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:41,640
Speaker 1: bear grease redemption that we've all been looking for inside

894
00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:45,680
Speaker 1: of that. It's pretty powerful to hear Stony, Charlie's son

895
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:50,280
Speaker 1: say that about conservation. It took this family a little

896
00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:53,160
Speaker 1: bit longer to get there, But I think the Edwards

897
00:53:53,239 --> 00:53:57,360
Speaker 1: have shifted their positions in a lot of ways. Here's

898
00:53:57,480 --> 00:54:00,759
Speaker 1: Jerry Deane. They may have been some game warned. It

899
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:04,319
Speaker 1: could have called him when he was young. I'd like

900
00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:08,680
Speaker 1: to seeing them because they have been too. They probably

901
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:11,279
Speaker 1: some of them set out there the last fifteen years

902
00:54:12,719 --> 00:54:17,600
Speaker 1: trying to catch him, and even home eating breakfast. Undoubtedly

903
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,360
Speaker 1: the last fifteen years of their lives, Louis Dell and

904
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 1: Charlie slowed down on violating game lass. Many people said

905
00:54:25,040 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 1: this it would be a cute bota in this story

906
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:30,319
Speaker 1: to say that they had a change of heart, that

907
00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:33,120
Speaker 1: they could look back and say that they've done stuff wrong.

908
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 1: But I don't really know if that's true. Perhaps they

909
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:40,759
Speaker 1: just simply slowed down physically, or maybe the penalties for

910
00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:44,279
Speaker 1: game violations increased to the point that they couldn't risk

911
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:48,240
Speaker 1: losing it all. Will never really know. Would it change

912
00:54:48,280 --> 00:54:50,319
Speaker 1: the way that you feel about them at the end

913
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:53,160
Speaker 1: of the story, if they'd realized the error of their

914
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:57,200
Speaker 1: ways and changed. I guess the game of fish will

915
00:54:57,239 --> 00:55:00,640
Speaker 1: always know him is outlaw. Well, I get a lot

916
00:55:00,719 --> 00:55:04,359
Speaker 1: of other people of outlaw suit. But the world will

917
00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:06,680
Speaker 1: be a whole lot better if everybody would like old Lois.

918
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 1: That's all I can say about to get. If I

919
00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:15,440
Speaker 1: were falling on a rope somewhere, he'd be the one

920
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:19,960
Speaker 1: I wanted on the end of the rope, I want anything.

921
00:55:23,040 --> 00:55:27,000
Speaker 1: Pire's Neil with a very interesting take on Louis Dell

922
00:55:27,360 --> 00:55:31,120
Speaker 1: and Charlie Well. A lot of people that laugh at this,

923
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:34,520
Speaker 1: and I find it kind of comical, but it's the truth.

924
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:37,680
Speaker 1: They kind of they was kind of modern day Robin Hood.

925
00:55:38,080 --> 00:55:40,080
Speaker 1: Tell me what you mean by that, Well, you know,

926
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:43,280
Speaker 1: I mean Robin Hood. He was an outlaw by the government.

927
00:55:43,520 --> 00:55:49,279
Speaker 1: He would killed the king's game, and he robbed from

928
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:52,400
Speaker 1: the rich. Louis didn't rob, but in a way he

929
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:55,640
Speaker 1: did rob some games from some people. People might think

930
00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:58,320
Speaker 1: but he but he gave a lot of meat away.

931
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:03,040
Speaker 1: Like I said, old people on fixed incomes, okay, you know,

932
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:05,520
Speaker 1: and you could always count on him to help you.

933
00:56:06,880 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 1: They're kind will never be again. It was pretty much

934
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:16,440
Speaker 1: the last of a of a tie of people and

935
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:20,920
Speaker 1: I miss them. Oh, Louis, you know, hey, he was

936
00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:23,200
Speaker 1: quick to get mad, but he was quick to laugh,

937
00:56:23,880 --> 00:56:28,600
Speaker 1: you know, quick to forgive. Why won't there be other

938
00:56:28,680 --> 00:56:33,520
Speaker 1: people like them? Well, it's just it takes the times

939
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:36,560
Speaker 1: that they lived through will never be again. You know,

940
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:39,200
Speaker 1: that's what develops the power person. What they are and

941
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:44,680
Speaker 1: what they've lived through. Like I said, the mentality and

942
00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:47,080
Speaker 1: and the thoughts of the people that raised them and

943
00:56:47,120 --> 00:56:56,200
Speaker 1: they grew up around or them, people are no more. Man,

944
00:56:56,440 --> 00:56:58,880
Speaker 1: I don't know what to say. I've had a lot

945
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:02,759
Speaker 1: of people that I question why I highlighted these men,

946
00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:05,319
Speaker 1: But I've also had a lot of people that I

947
00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:08,759
Speaker 1: trust thank me for it. As we come to the

948
00:57:08,840 --> 00:57:13,480
Speaker 1: close of this biography section of this series, I'm still conflicted.

949
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:17,720
Speaker 1: But I have noted one thing. People that knew these

950
00:57:17,720 --> 00:57:21,720
Speaker 1: men were much more apt to extend mercy to them.

951
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:25,400
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that mercy means condoning illegal activity.

952
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:28,680
Speaker 1: It just means they weren't ready to lock them up.

953
00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:32,760
Speaker 1: People that never knew these men were much more likely

954
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:37,200
Speaker 1: to want justice. I envisioned some other podcaster making a

955
00:57:37,240 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 1: series on some outlaws that I didn't know. Maybe some

956
00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:45,320
Speaker 1: hellbillies from Alabama that just wore the turkeys out. I

957
00:57:45,360 --> 00:57:48,560
Speaker 1: have a feeling I might be like, how the heck

958
00:57:48,560 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: could these guys use their platform to highlight those heathen criminals.

959
00:57:53,200 --> 00:57:55,400
Speaker 1: These guys are the biggest threat to the North American

960
00:57:55,400 --> 00:58:01,400
Speaker 1: model of wildlife conservation I've ever seen. Lock them up. Honestly,

961
00:58:01,760 --> 00:58:05,720
Speaker 1: I might say that, but I think we're all full

962
00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:10,360
Speaker 1: of paradoxus. And I think that face to face human

963
00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:14,560
Speaker 1: relationship with other people means all the difference in a

964
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:18,760
Speaker 1: whole bunch of stuff, and that's what makes life interesting.

965
00:58:19,640 --> 00:58:23,600
Speaker 1: One thing is for sure. We're entertained and intrigued by

966
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:28,920
Speaker 1: outlaws for better or worse. And after exploring the fullness

967
00:58:28,920 --> 00:58:32,320
Speaker 1: of these guys stories, I am still proud to have

968
00:58:32,520 --> 00:58:36,080
Speaker 1: known these men, and I think their story is of

969
00:58:36,160 --> 00:58:42,360
Speaker 1: great value. Man, thanks so much for listening to Bear Grease.

970
00:58:42,760 --> 00:58:45,840
Speaker 1: On the next episode, we're gonna find out why we

971
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:49,000
Speaker 1: love outlaws, and I don't want to leave you with

972
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:53,439
Speaker 1: a nondescript cliffhanger, but I really doubt you're gonna want

973
00:58:53,440 --> 00:58:56,720
Speaker 1: to miss the next episode. Please leave us a review

974
00:58:56,800 --> 00:59:00,720
Speaker 1: on iTunes and share this podcast with a friend. We've

975
00:59:00,760 --> 00:59:03,520
Speaker 1: got our famous bear grease hats back in stock at

976
00:59:03,520 --> 00:59:06,320
Speaker 1: the meat Eater dot com, so check that out too.

977
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:12,720
Speaker 1: But hey, now I want to give you some of

978
00:59:12,760 --> 00:59:17,160
Speaker 1: that bonus material. This is some interesting stuff that I

979
00:59:17,200 --> 00:59:20,400
Speaker 1: couldn't fit into the main podcast. You guys remember the

980
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:22,720
Speaker 1: game Ward and Jimmy Martin from the first episode, who

981
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:26,080
Speaker 1: spent his whole career chasing Louis Dell and Charlie Well.

982
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:29,520
Speaker 1: After our interview, I asked him if he remembered the

983
00:59:29,640 --> 00:59:33,360
Speaker 1: time that he stopped me. He said he had zero

984
00:59:33,520 --> 00:59:38,360
Speaker 1: recollection of it, so I proceeded to tell him the story.

985
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 1: I do want to tell you about our run in

986
00:59:43,320 --> 00:59:48,200
Speaker 1: that you don't remember. Listen to this. I've never told

987
00:59:48,200 --> 00:59:53,200
Speaker 1: this story publicly. I was sixteen years old and it

988
00:59:53,280 --> 00:59:56,720
Speaker 1: was a Friday night, and I had a blue tick

989
00:59:56,800 --> 01:00:01,400
Speaker 1: coonhound named Thunder, and he got loose. I heard him

990
01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:05,600
Speaker 1: way off somewhere, treed long like I'll just as far

991
01:00:05,640 --> 01:00:07,760
Speaker 1: as I could hear. Somehow I knew he was treed

992
01:00:07,840 --> 01:00:11,840
Speaker 1: down in this hollow and it was it wasn't coon season,

993
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:14,240
Speaker 1: I want to say, it was this summer, and I

994
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:17,640
Speaker 1: had my coon light that had my pistol attached to

995
01:00:17,680 --> 01:00:22,680
Speaker 1: the belt. All in one deal and and when I

996
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:25,240
Speaker 1: I had to go get the dog, and I grabbed

997
01:00:25,240 --> 01:00:27,800
Speaker 1: my coon belt and I had my pistol on there

998
01:00:27,880 --> 01:00:30,840
Speaker 1: and my light, and I jumped on a fore wheeler.

999
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:33,640
Speaker 1: And now this is where the story gets interesting. I

1000
01:00:33,680 --> 01:00:35,720
Speaker 1: had decided that if there was a coon in the tree,

1001
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:38,000
Speaker 1: I was gonna shoot him, just I was. It was

1002
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:41,560
Speaker 1: a young dog and he's treed down there, and it's

1003
01:00:41,600 --> 01:00:44,760
Speaker 1: just like it's in my heart. I was like, I'm

1004
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:48,560
Speaker 1: gonna shoot this coon, but I wasn't coon hunting. Well,

1005
01:00:48,880 --> 01:00:51,880
Speaker 1: I jump on my dad's fore wheeler and it didn't

1006
01:00:51,920 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 1: have lights, no lights on the fore wheeler. So I'm

1007
01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:59,280
Speaker 1: running with a head lamp, my coon lamp shining, riding

1008
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:01,440
Speaker 1: a fore wheeler. Well, to get to the dog, I

1009
01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:04,440
Speaker 1: had to jump out on the highway, and I was

1010
01:01:04,640 --> 01:01:08,040
Speaker 1: riding is after dark, and I'm riding in the ditch

1011
01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:12,360
Speaker 1: of the highway going down to get to my neighbor's land.

1012
01:01:12,960 --> 01:01:14,600
Speaker 1: And he he would have known, you know, it's been

1013
01:01:14,640 --> 01:01:16,800
Speaker 1: a good friend of mine. And I was gonna drive

1014
01:01:16,840 --> 01:01:19,720
Speaker 1: down to his driveway and then go into the woods

1015
01:01:19,720 --> 01:01:21,840
Speaker 1: and get the dog. Well, as soon as I get

1016
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:26,280
Speaker 1: out onto the highway, there's one truck coming and it's you.

1017
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:31,040
Speaker 1: And so you see this coon light coming down the

1018
01:01:31,120 --> 01:01:33,520
Speaker 1: road and you're like, what's going on? Anyway? I see

1019
01:01:33,560 --> 01:01:35,520
Speaker 1: you turn around you put on your lights, and I

1020
01:01:35,640 --> 01:01:38,640
Speaker 1: just go, oh no. And you come over to me

1021
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:43,160
Speaker 1: and you say, son, what are you doing? And and

1022
01:01:43,200 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 1: I was honestly, was just like honest to a fault.

1023
01:01:47,040 --> 01:01:50,160
Speaker 1: I said, sir, I'm coon hunting. And I didn't even

1024
01:01:50,200 --> 01:01:52,680
Speaker 1: have I mean, I was sixteen, so I just didn't

1025
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:56,160
Speaker 1: have the wherewithal to like really give you the whole

1026
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 1: story of what was happening. And I just told you

1027
01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:01,880
Speaker 1: I was coon hunting, and you said, is it coon season?

1028
01:02:02,080 --> 01:02:05,560
Speaker 1: And I said I don't think so. And you pulled

1029
01:02:05,600 --> 01:02:08,200
Speaker 1: out your book and you look through and you knew

1030
01:02:08,200 --> 01:02:10,880
Speaker 1: it wasn't coon season, but you look through and you said,

1031
01:02:10,920 --> 01:02:14,800
Speaker 1: look here, well it turns out it's not. And uh

1032
01:02:15,080 --> 01:02:17,120
Speaker 1: and you said, well, take off your gun and your

1033
01:02:17,200 --> 01:02:20,600
Speaker 1: light belt and give it to me. And so I

1034
01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:25,440
Speaker 1: gave you my gun on my light belt. That's right.

1035
01:02:25,520 --> 01:02:27,840
Speaker 1: And I didn't tell you that and uh. And you

1036
01:02:27,880 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 1: said meet me at the courthouse tomorrow at noon. And

1037
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:34,240
Speaker 1: so you get in the truck with my light and

1038
01:02:34,320 --> 01:02:36,280
Speaker 1: drive off and then I've got a fourth of no

1039
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:39,280
Speaker 1: lights and I drive all the way home with no lights.

1040
01:02:40,280 --> 01:02:44,400
Speaker 1: And then uh so the next day, I mean, you

1041
01:02:44,480 --> 01:02:49,040
Speaker 1: treated me with complete respect. The next day, I show

1042
01:02:49,120 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 1: up at the courthouse and I'm scared to death, you know.

1043
01:02:52,160 --> 01:02:54,640
Speaker 1: And I really didn't break the law on purpose. I

1044
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:58,840
Speaker 1: mean I I've always been, even since a kid, straight laced.

1045
01:02:58,880 --> 01:03:01,120
Speaker 1: I mean, now I broke I've road claws on accident

1046
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:05,320
Speaker 1: and some on purpose. That you know it's happened. So

1047
01:03:05,360 --> 01:03:10,040
Speaker 1: I meet you at the courthouse and you you've probably

1048
01:03:10,080 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 1: got a little more of the story from me. And

1049
01:03:12,920 --> 01:03:17,320
Speaker 1: you said, Clay, I was on my way last night

1050
01:03:17,400 --> 01:03:22,200
Speaker 1: to break up a party out at ink At at

1051
01:03:22,240 --> 01:03:25,880
Speaker 1: the river down there somewhere, and he said, and here

1052
01:03:25,920 --> 01:03:30,440
Speaker 1: you are, minding your own business, coon hunting, he said,

1053
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:33,160
Speaker 1: And you you reached in and grabbed the belt and

1054
01:03:33,200 --> 01:03:36,080
Speaker 1: gave it to me and said, I just said, going

1055
01:03:36,160 --> 01:03:40,480
Speaker 1: your way. So you didn't give me a ticket. So

1056
01:03:40,560 --> 01:03:44,320
Speaker 1: you have no recollection though, man, that it happened just

1057
01:03:44,480 --> 01:03:49,600
Speaker 1: like that. Oh man. I was a nervous wreck that night.

1058
01:03:50,120 --> 01:03:53,680
Speaker 1: Lucky for me, Jimmy showed me mercy. I had another

1059
01:03:53,760 --> 01:03:57,120
Speaker 1: question for Jimmy about Louis Dell and Charlie. Were they

1060
01:03:57,360 --> 01:04:00,880
Speaker 1: the most notorious guys you ever chased guests in your time?

1061
01:04:01,240 --> 01:04:03,680
Speaker 1: They would have been in Polk County, but there were

1062
01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:06,840
Speaker 1: lots of others in other candies. Of course, my district

1063
01:04:07,280 --> 01:04:10,439
Speaker 1: was six counties is that we worked. So we worked

1064
01:04:10,440 --> 01:04:12,920
Speaker 1: some good ones out of Scott County and Yale County,

1065
01:04:12,960 --> 01:04:15,320
Speaker 1: and we had Louis Dale's, but they were in other counties.

1066
01:04:15,640 --> 01:04:17,720
Speaker 1: The other ones that I ran into them and I

1067
01:04:17,760 --> 01:04:22,400
Speaker 1: had to help work on weren't as likable as Charlie

1068
01:04:22,400 --> 01:04:24,360
Speaker 1: and Louis Dell, if that's a good way to put it.

1069
01:04:24,800 --> 01:04:28,280
Speaker 1: They the others were just out for what they could get,

1070
01:04:28,760 --> 01:04:32,640
Speaker 1: and if they weren't making money, well they just they

1071
01:04:32,680 --> 01:04:34,440
Speaker 1: just didn't enjoy what they were doing. They were just

1072
01:04:34,480 --> 01:04:37,200
Speaker 1: doing it to get even. I guess in these other

1073
01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:38,960
Speaker 1: candia they were getting as much as they could get.

1074
01:04:39,600 --> 01:04:41,680
Speaker 1: But Louis if, Loui Delle and Charlie may have been

1075
01:04:41,680 --> 01:04:43,840
Speaker 1: getting as much as they can get, but they you

1076
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:48,240
Speaker 1: liked him for it. You guys remember Uncle Andy from

1077
01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:51,080
Speaker 1: the first podcast. He was a ten year old brother

1078
01:04:51,120 --> 01:04:54,200
Speaker 1: of Carl Edwards that was killed by police. He was

1079
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:59,760
Speaker 1: involved in that shootout. Here's Jerry Deane. So you knew

1080
01:05:00,040 --> 01:05:04,320
Speaker 1: the Edwards. Yeah? Yeah, did he have part of his

1081
01:05:04,360 --> 01:05:08,360
Speaker 1: ear shot off? Sir? What what? What part of his

1082
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:12,360
Speaker 1: ear was shot up? Was the top part of his ear? Yeah? Me?

1083
01:05:12,440 --> 01:05:17,720
Speaker 1: And then he was uncle and that's what ruby. Here's

1084
01:05:17,760 --> 01:05:21,720
Speaker 1: another interesting clip from Jerry Deane about Louis Dell's character.

1085
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:26,080
Speaker 1: Jolly was fine fellow, but he uh, he wasn't worried

1086
01:05:26,080 --> 01:05:30,840
Speaker 1: about material things. Louis had the best business mind and

1087
01:05:30,920 --> 01:05:33,680
Speaker 1: he had done well, you know, with his job. And

1088
01:05:34,200 --> 01:05:37,360
Speaker 1: he treated everybody worked for the way he wanted to

1089
01:05:37,400 --> 01:05:40,680
Speaker 1: be treated. I mean you would you wentn't out nothing

1090
01:05:40,840 --> 01:05:43,800
Speaker 1: when you worked for Louis, and he paid good money.

1091
01:05:43,920 --> 01:05:47,760
Speaker 1: He took care of his workers. He took care of everybody. Yeah,

1092
01:05:47,800 --> 01:05:50,560
Speaker 1: Louis was fine feller and most people thought he was

1093
01:05:50,680 --> 01:05:54,560
Speaker 1: out law. But if you ever had anybody you wanted

1094
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:58,080
Speaker 1: as your friend, he'd be the man to pick. I

1095
01:05:58,200 --> 01:06:01,720
Speaker 1: had heart surgery ten years go. Louis told me, And

1096
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:04,000
Speaker 1: most people don't know it, but he told me. He said,

1097
01:06:04,040 --> 01:06:07,800
Speaker 1: don't worry about nothing, you need anything, you know, I

1098
01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:12,480
Speaker 1: pay forward. I'm here and he offered to pay my bills. Yeah,

1099
01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:16,080
Speaker 1: he pushed that type. And but let me tell you something.

1100
01:06:16,080 --> 01:06:20,200
Speaker 1: Money didn't mean nothing. Damn. That's why he was. That's

1101
01:06:20,200 --> 01:06:22,240
Speaker 1: why he could be so generous. You feel like it's

1102
01:06:22,240 --> 01:06:25,720
Speaker 1: because money didn't Well he wasn't. He wasn't a multimillionaire.

1103
01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:29,480
Speaker 1: But I guess you'd say, uh, he made money, money

1104
01:06:29,560 --> 01:06:35,040
Speaker 1: didn't make him. You understand. Yeah, he's really something. Everybody

1105
01:06:35,120 --> 01:06:39,600
Speaker 1: would have met him and my daddy, finest two fellers

1106
01:06:39,640 --> 01:06:43,600
Speaker 1: I ever met. Here's jerry On Louis del as a

1107
01:06:43,680 --> 01:06:47,800
Speaker 1: dog man. Lou Dell would have been just an all

1108
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:52,320
Speaker 1: around woodsman. Correct. Tell me about the kind of dogs

1109
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:55,200
Speaker 1: he had? Oh man, like what what types of that

1110
01:06:55,320 --> 01:06:58,880
Speaker 1: he had squirreled off? He had squirreled? Oh dear though

1111
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:04,680
Speaker 1: whom no, I'm man hog dog hog dog Louie probably had.

1112
01:07:05,240 --> 01:07:08,640
Speaker 1: It's one time. He probably had twenty dolluh. He still

1113
01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:11,959
Speaker 1: had good score though when he passed away. He kept

1114
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:16,080
Speaker 1: dogs all the live. He's a dog man. Here's jerry

1115
01:07:16,200 --> 01:07:20,160
Speaker 1: On Louis Dell's willingness to take people hunting. We'll probably

1116
01:07:20,240 --> 01:07:22,760
Speaker 1: learn on a later episode how willing he was to

1117
01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:27,240
Speaker 1: even entertain undercover officers too. No doubt Louis Dell and

1118
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:31,120
Speaker 1: Charlie shared their passion for turkey hunting with anyone that

1119
01:07:31,200 --> 01:07:34,600
Speaker 1: wanted to go. Some of the turkey ounors wouldn't even

1120
01:07:34,600 --> 01:07:36,520
Speaker 1: to tell you where they gonna go turkey hunting. If

1121
01:07:36,520 --> 01:07:39,040
Speaker 1: they heard the turkey Louis tell you, say, go right

1122
01:07:39,080 --> 01:07:41,480
Speaker 1: of where they went there. He'd tell anybody for the

1123
01:07:41,480 --> 01:07:45,840
Speaker 1: turkeys that you know. He wasn't no tyke to be

1124
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 1: staying you about anything. He'd take them. People that never

1125
01:07:49,160 --> 01:07:51,200
Speaker 1: had even turkey hunt, He take them and put them

1126
01:07:51,200 --> 01:07:54,760
Speaker 1: out there and uh let him kill one. And most

1127
01:07:54,800 --> 01:07:59,240
Speaker 1: turkey owners ain't that way. Yeah, exactly. And that's another

1128
01:07:59,320 --> 01:08:02,480
Speaker 1: thing about Louis there's a lot of young boys like

1129
01:08:02,680 --> 01:08:06,480
Speaker 1: John now that Louis Elle has told how to to

1130
01:08:06,640 --> 01:08:09,560
Speaker 1: turkey on and he just wasn't his family know it was.

1131
01:08:09,680 --> 01:08:12,840
Speaker 1: Anybody that wants to come, he he teaches what he could.

1132
01:08:14,120 --> 01:08:16,960
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening, guys. We'll check in with

1133
01:08:17,120 --> 01:08:19,320
Speaker 1: it next week on the Bear Grease Render