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Speaker 1: Well, well, well, the Thunder the Pacers exactly as we predicted,

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Speaker 1: exactly exactly as I predicted, like thirty minutes ago. They

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Speaker 1: appear to be on a finals collision. Course, we'll discuss

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Speaker 1: whether wolves or Knicks can extend things, even make an

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Speaker 1: unprecedented comeback, I guess not unprecedented. But also some news

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Speaker 1: from around the NBA with NBA writer and musician Claire

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Speaker 1: de Loon on today's episode.

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Speaker 2: I'm Jack O'Brien and I'm Borian from Miles and this

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Speaker 2: is Miles on Jack.

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Speaker 3: I read boom ste.

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Speaker 1: Dongitj three guy it, I look at dongjit h.

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Speaker 3: T o kymb driving spinning by. I don't number nine two.

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Speaker 4: That's good.

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Speaker 2: Secure the selfis or NBA Champions to.

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Speaker 3: The double t yon us to tell.

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Speaker 1: What'd you go? Honest? Claire, Yes, NBA writer for The Guardian,

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Speaker 1: lead vocalist and songwriter for Tiny Deaths. Just to remind you,

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Speaker 1: because I don't know. Sometimes it's helpful. I forget who

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Speaker 1: I am. Sometimes I do all the time. Yeah, what's good?

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Speaker 1: How are you doing? How are you enjoying your NBA

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Speaker 1: postseason thus far?

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Speaker 5: I'm good, I'm uh.

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Speaker 6: I guess there's been some controversy among the NBA fans

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Speaker 6: about like if it's cool or not if that we're

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Speaker 6: heading towards like a PACER's Thunder Finals. And I would

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Speaker 6: just like to put my two cents in and say

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Speaker 6: that the basketball aside as a media member, I would

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Speaker 6: say this.

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Speaker 5: Is like a zero tier.

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Speaker 6: Travel finals for those of us to travel, right, So

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Speaker 6: that that would be my two cents is that, Like

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Speaker 6: I think the basketball would be hypothetically phenomenal, but from

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Speaker 6: a travel perspective, Indianapolis and Oklahoma City are like pretty

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Speaker 6: low on the power rankings of NBA cities to travel

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Speaker 6: to for work.

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Speaker 1: Like even San Antonio has the River Walk, you know,

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Speaker 1: like you can even pretty.

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Speaker 5: Much every other NBA city has.

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Speaker 1: A little bit more has a little something. Indianapolis has

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Speaker 1: that one steakhouse that has cocktail with very spicy, clear

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Speaker 1: your nostrils all the way out. So that's something there,

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Speaker 1: you go.

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Speaker 5: Cocktail.

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Speaker 2: Was it just for like the Final four or something

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Speaker 2: like that, or does Indy, if I'm not mistaken, to

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Speaker 2: have a basketball court at their airport?

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Speaker 1: They did?

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Speaker 5: That was just when they hosted All Star weekend.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, got it didn't even look forward to that. Got it.

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Speaker 1: Do they just have like a giant Papa shot thing

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Speaker 1: and there was that just just for the Final four?

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Speaker 1: Is there Convention Center always filled up with like basketball

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Speaker 1: trivia games. Yeah, you know, it's a great play. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they love hosting things that they're enthusiastic hosts. And imagine

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Speaker 1: I feel like the fans of both sides will be

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Speaker 1: so revved up for this that maybe you can at

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Speaker 1: least like bask in the secondhand serotonin, all the good

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Speaker 1: brain chemicals that'll be sloshing around.

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Speaker 5: In our cities arenas. It'll be awesome.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely. And the basketball is good. We'll

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Speaker 1: get to that. But the basketball, I feel like the

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Speaker 1: two coolest things I've seen so far in the postseason

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Speaker 1: are the Pacers coming back, just like making incredible, unprecedented

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Speaker 1: like comebacks. It's like just starting from the Bucks series,

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Speaker 1: Like I remember that was I think that might be

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Speaker 1: the only thing that I live texted you guys about Jamar.

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Speaker 1: I was like, yo, just see how Milwaukee went out.

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Speaker 1: And then also Oklahoma City's defense. It's to the two

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Speaker 1: kind of strongest weapons that seem like they're going to

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Speaker 1: actually be in the finals, which is exciting, but of

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Speaker 1: course we have to talk about the Lakers. Of course,

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Speaker 1: because we got Claire here, who you know, great Lakers coverage.

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Speaker 1: Lebron rumored to be planning to opt in this summer. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I feel like Lebron currently is underrated once again because

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Speaker 1: one thousand, Yeah, because of how the season ended, by

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Speaker 1: the way by Lakers fans full disclosure clear.

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Speaker 2: So I feel like Jack is going here, I'm going

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Speaker 2: to tell him myself, I am not underrating Lebron. I

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Speaker 2: merely stated that in the event that he wanted to

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Speaker 2: move on for his final season and go back to Cleveland,

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Speaker 2: I would support him in his dreams.

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Speaker 5: That's all I agree with that.

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Speaker 6: I'm I'm currently like tempering my rage because I was

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Speaker 6: listening to Bill Simmons this morning and he was ranking

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Speaker 6: his top fifteen players heading into next season, and he

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Speaker 6: didn't even have Lebron in the top fifteen, not.

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Speaker 1: In the top fifteen, and I was like, it's death.

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Speaker 1: At like eight or seven.

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Speaker 6: I was like, can we make the math math the

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Speaker 6: fact that this man was second team All NBA, which

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Speaker 6: just by definition theoretically makes you a top ten player

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Speaker 6: in the NBA if you're just going by the numbers,

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Speaker 6: of all NBA as theoretically the best fifteen players in

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Speaker 6: the league, and then he doesn't even make your top fifteen,

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Speaker 6: even with a spot vacated by Jason Tatum, who he

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Speaker 6: left off due to injury. Yeah, because he'll be out

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Speaker 6: for all of next season. Yeah, so I'm like, make

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Speaker 6: make the math math that Lebron is somehow now a

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Speaker 6: worse NBA player than Jalen Williams and Karl Anthony Towns

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Speaker 6: and like.

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Speaker 5: In his top fIF like Iron James.

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Speaker 1: I saw. I saw people saying Kat has like had

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Speaker 1: a great season. I've seen him play really well in

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Speaker 1: the playoffs. I've seen him play not so well in

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Speaker 1: the playoffs, and I'm here to tell you that I

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Speaker 1: would take Lebron James over that.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: That that was that was interesting. I feel like in

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Speaker 1: intense recency bias, well it was about.

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Speaker 6: Kingd of recency bias, which is what I tried to

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Speaker 6: tell myself as I was like going into a blind rage.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 6: But but yeah, No, I do think Lebron is just

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Speaker 6: sort of like the last few years he's just been

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Speaker 6: there's been this rhythm of like he is consistently underrated

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Speaker 6: in the off season due to his age. Yeah, then

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Speaker 6: he spends an entire NBA season showing that his age

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Speaker 6: is like not nearly as much of a factor as

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Speaker 6: the like theoretical narrative would have you.

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Speaker 1: Believe, because people are like, surely not this time.

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Speaker 6: Surely sure They're like, like Bill's reasoning was like, well,

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Speaker 6: he's going to be forty one.

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Speaker 5: I'm like, well he was forty and he just made second.

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Speaker 1: You know how you know how old he was last season?

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Speaker 1: Is cravity.

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Speaker 2: I have a theory to that it's all the lost

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Speaker 2: guys like me that are like, well, I know how

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Speaker 2: I feel in my forties way that I can.

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Speaker 6: Almost as if Lebron James is a unique physical specimen

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Speaker 6: that is not a direct one for one representation of

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Speaker 6: other people who are forty plus.

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Speaker 1: But I'm just going to need to see him do

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Speaker 1: it more, you know, like he did it as a

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Speaker 1: forty year old one years. Yeah, so defying expectations.

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Speaker 6: But I agree with you that if the Cleveland thing happens,

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Speaker 6: I think you know it would be there's plenty of

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Speaker 6: reasons for him to want to play for Cleveland versus

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Speaker 6: LA like not, the least of which is that the

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Speaker 6: Eastern Conference looks like it's going to be as weak

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Speaker 6: as it's ever been next year.

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Speaker 1: So fun. Yeah, I think I think I support that

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Speaker 1: on the mainly on the basis that it would be

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Speaker 1: so cute if you actually it would be so.

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Speaker 6: Actually, I think that you're onto something there, even though

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Speaker 6: I know it's sort of tongue in cheap because I think,

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Speaker 6: you know, people have asked me like, where would Lebron

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Speaker 6: go and whatever, and what I've said to them every time,

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Speaker 6: and this isn't like reporting, this is just conjecture based

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Speaker 6: on you know, following him very closely.

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Speaker 5: Is that I think he's.

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Speaker 6: So preoccupied with narrative and I think that's super important

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Speaker 6: to him. And I really don't see him ending his

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Speaker 6: career anywhere besides LA unless it fits like the narrative

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Speaker 6: arc of his career that he's trying to create. And

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Speaker 6: I could really see like a end it where I

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Speaker 6: started it and it where it all began, just a

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Speaker 6: kid from Akron, you know, type narrative arc. So I

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Speaker 6: think if he's gonna leave LA, which I haven't really

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Speaker 6: heard anything to make me believe that that's the case,

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Speaker 6: I think it would be cleveland if I if I

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Speaker 6: had to guess, But I haven't heard, honestly, anything that

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Speaker 6: makes me believe that he would be leaving. The only

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Speaker 6: thing is just like if you're watching the Lakers and

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Speaker 6: watching the sort of trajectory of the team, if he

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Speaker 6: wants to win a ring next year in his theoretical

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Speaker 6: potential last year in the league, Like I just based

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Speaker 6: on the moves the Lakers can make right now, like

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Speaker 6: and how good the West is and how much even

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Speaker 6: better it's potentially going to be next season, Like it's

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Speaker 6: an uphill it's going to be an uphill climb for

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Speaker 6: them to become contenders with what they have to work

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Speaker 6: with right now.

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Speaker 1: I think, and I feel like he's best served right now.

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Speaker 1: But he did defensively towards the end of this season

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Speaker 1: where he just suddenly became a stopper and like was

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Speaker 1: just awesome all over the boards and stuff. Was like,

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Speaker 1: it's amazing to see that he can do that. But

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Speaker 1: I feel like he might be better served on a

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Speaker 1: team like Cleveland where he's just like there's an offensive

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Speaker 1: weapon and you know Mobile is backing him up. Yeahs

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Speaker 1: oppose time have.

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Speaker 6: To be the defense at forty one years old, It's

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Speaker 6: like that you're sick.

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Speaker 5: I would imagine you had an idea.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, big news. Though, there's a picture of Luca where

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Speaker 1: he's looking slim and trim, so that's the other big

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Speaker 1: Lakers news. Are you guys buying it? He did look slim,

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Speaker 1: he looked trim A hell great.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean that additive free European food can do

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Speaker 6: the body good. He's back home for a while, I think, Yeah,

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Speaker 6: I don't think he's to my knowledge, he spends his

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Speaker 6: off season not in the United States. But yeah, I

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Speaker 6: mean I think, you know, he's got to be on

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Speaker 6: a mish at least a revenge mission like whatever however

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Speaker 6: that manifest for him, whether that's like, you know, putting

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Speaker 6: the time and energy into getting in better shape or

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Speaker 6: whatever it is. But like, there's no way he's going

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Speaker 6: to be going into his first full season having been

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Speaker 6: traded from the Mavericks without being on like a violent

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Speaker 6: mission to prove Neco Harrison wrong. You know, like that

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Speaker 6: just seems inevitable. So I wouldn't be surprised at all

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Speaker 6: if he got in really great shape this summer.

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Speaker 1: People need to just start seeding like being like Cooper Flag.

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Speaker 1: A lot of people are calling him the new Luca.

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Speaker 1: People are saying that that trade actually makes a lot

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Speaker 1: of sense.

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Speaker 6: Now, Mavericks have been doing that for freaking six months,

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Speaker 6: just like dragging his name through the mud and leaking

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Speaker 6: every like besmirching story that you could possibly imagine, Like

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Speaker 6: he has all the fodder that he needs.

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Speaker 3: Do you remember, you know what it feels like.

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Speaker 2: Do you remember that one Kobe commercial from back in

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Speaker 2: the day when it was like it shows him in

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Speaker 2: training and it was like all of the different articles,

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Speaker 2: all of the different headlines, all of the different you know,

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Speaker 2: like rebuddle to you know, his greatness or whatever, and

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Speaker 2: it was essentially him saying, like, you know, like I'm

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Speaker 2: going to use this as motivation, just basically just put

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Speaker 2: up all of Nico's in all of Dallas's you know,

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Speaker 2: comments and leaks over the last six months to your point,

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Speaker 2: and yeah, I can't see how he's not going to

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Speaker 2: be ready.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, no, for sure.

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Speaker 1: Do they have moves? I don't. I refuse to learn

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Speaker 1: do the homework of like learning about the yeah, the

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Speaker 1: apron all that stuff.

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Speaker 6: How do we feel I would debunk one thing that

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Speaker 6: I've heard Lakers fans say, which is like, oh, well,

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Speaker 6: if Lebron walks and we'll have all this cap space

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Speaker 6: to like go sign whoever. There's two things to that

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Speaker 6: that to debunk that myth thing. Number one, the way

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Speaker 6: that the collective bargaining agreement it's et cetera.

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Speaker 1: Work.

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Speaker 6: It's not like they just have access to all the

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Speaker 6: money of Lebron's that was on the books if he

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Speaker 6: were to walk, like, oh, he left, so now we

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Speaker 6: have fifty million dollars to play with. Like, I think

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Speaker 6: what it actually ends up being if Lebron and Dorian

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Speaker 6: Phiney Smith both decided not to opt in, is I

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Speaker 6: think they have total as far as like tax pit

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Speaker 6: to stay under the taxpayer limit. It's like sixteen million

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Speaker 6: or twenty million or something like that. It's very little

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Speaker 6: to work with. So it would not be to the

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Speaker 6: Laker's benefit for Lebron not to opt into his contract.

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Speaker 6: Like if you're trying to say, like, oh, that money

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Speaker 6: could be better used elsewhere and he decides he wants

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Speaker 6: to be traded because he does have a no trade clause,

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Speaker 6: then that money could be used for something else, but

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Speaker 6: not just if he ops out. And then the other

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Speaker 6: thing is I think there's been a lot of people

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Speaker 6: being like, oh, like go get this and go get that.

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Speaker 6: They don't have a ton of like movable assets that

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Speaker 6: are desirable or have like positive trade value, even like

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Speaker 6: they have one first round pick left, but that first

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Speaker 6: round pick is now of course worth a lot less

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Speaker 6: than it was before Luca was there, because theoretically they're

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Speaker 6: going to be good for a while with such a

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Speaker 6: young superstar. But yeah, so I think the average fan

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Speaker 6: things they don't might maybe don't know. A Lebron has

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Speaker 6: no trade clause, so he's only gonna if he opts in.

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Speaker 6: He can only get traded if he wants to, and

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Speaker 6: he has to sign off on wherever.

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Speaker 1: That is.

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Speaker 6: Number two, they don't have access to that salary if

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Speaker 6: he does opt out. That's not how the aprons work.

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Speaker 6: I'm not going to get too far into the weeds there.

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Speaker 6: And number three is like they probably have to get

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Speaker 6: pretty much anything that they're going to want to get

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Speaker 6: because of the aprons via trade and they don't have

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Speaker 6: a ton of super valuable trade assets ipso facto like dramatic,

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Speaker 6: huge seismic moves this summer probably not in the cards.

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Speaker 6: But I would have said that a Lukadn's trade mid

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Speaker 6: season wasn't.

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Speaker 5: In the cards either.

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Speaker 1: So Lakers fans love making a shopping list for you.

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Speaker 1: They're like, let's go get me proof.

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Speaker 2: So we're going to respond as a Lakers fan and say, so,

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Speaker 2: what you're saying is Austin Reeves is gone?

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Speaker 3: Now, okay, got it all right? What can we get?

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Speaker 6: So I guess that's also another good Maybe I'm just

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Speaker 6: here to debunk Lakers things. The other thing I would

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Speaker 6: mention as because there's been so much talk about I've

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Speaker 6: heard talking heads be like he's for sure gone this summer.

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Speaker 6: Like I haven't heard that at all. What I would

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Speaker 6: say about Austin is like what makes a lot more?

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Speaker 6: He's on one of the best.

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Speaker 5: Value contracts in the ABA right now.

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Speaker 6: He's if he think he's making like sub fourteen million

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Speaker 6: dollars at the moment. So for what he provides as

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Speaker 6: like a bonifide third option, like that is crazy value.

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Speaker 5: Obviously, that crazy value.

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Speaker 6: Makes him a more desirable trade candidate, except that he's

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Speaker 6: up for an extension, which he's almost certainly going to decline.

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Speaker 6: He's going to become a free agent. He's going to

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Speaker 6: want to get paid. He's going to command upwards of

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Speaker 6: thirty million dollars. A year, and anyone who trades for

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Speaker 6: him would know that, So it'd have to be a

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Speaker 6: team first of all that's willing to pay him, so

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Speaker 6: that eliminates some people. Second of all, the Lakers could actually,

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Speaker 6: in my opinion, benefit way more for the reasons I

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Speaker 6: said about the Lebron salary thing. From keeping Austin, giving

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Speaker 6: him whatever money he commands as a free agent next summer,

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Speaker 6: and then if they want to make a trade, then

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Speaker 6: they can get thirty to forty million dollars worth of

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Speaker 6: player back for him, versus if they trade him right now.

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Speaker 6: Because of the salary cap and how close they are

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Speaker 6: to that will be to that second apron, they can't

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Speaker 6: take back more salary than they give out. So they're

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Speaker 6: going to have to get fourteen million dollars worth of

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Speaker 6: NBA player back for Austin Reeves. And if you you know,

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Speaker 6: survey the market, even if you're just looking for a center,

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Speaker 6: the caliber of player you're going to get back for

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Speaker 6: fourteen million dollars is just not what Austin Reeves is

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Speaker 6: bringing to your roster. So it's in the Lakers' best

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Speaker 6: interest in all likelihood to keep him, give him whatever.

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Speaker 5: Money he wants.

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Speaker 6: Next summer when he's a free agent, and then at

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Speaker 6: that point, if they want to move on for him

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Speaker 6: for a fit that they think is better next to Luca,

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Speaker 6: it'll give them more salary flexibility to do so.

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Speaker 1: I'd like fourteen million dollars worth of NBA player please,

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Speaker 1: thank you very much. I get that tick sliced.

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Speaker 5: And it's a nice empathetic way to discuss human beings.

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Speaker 1: Love it it's I mean, it is the It does

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Speaker 1: feel like the Laker fan way where they're just like,

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Speaker 1: all right, go ahead.

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Speaker 3: And get Rea and that's it.

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Speaker 1: Fifteen million dollars of small forwards, get me, thirty million

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Speaker 1: dollars of backup center and point guard. You guys need

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Speaker 1: a dang point guard. It turns out. Let's uh, let's

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Speaker 1: take a quick break and we'll be right back and

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Speaker 1: talk about the remaining teams and why point guards are

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Speaker 1: suddenly so valuable and we're back, and yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: it's three to one. Both series I wish it wasn't.

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Speaker 1: The Next Pacers series has been super fun. I wish

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Speaker 1: it was going going the distance. Maybe, I mean maybe

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Speaker 1: the next turn a corner, but it certainly didn't look

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Speaker 1: like it in Game four, it looked that that felt

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Speaker 1: like a pretty definitive win for the For the Pacers,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't feel I don't know, I just don't feel

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Speaker 1: great about where the Knicks are at right now, especially

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Speaker 1: like the feels like even though Brunson is a bucket

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Speaker 1: when you most need a bucket, and he has scored

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Speaker 1: forty three thirty six twenty three thirty one in the series,

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Speaker 1: the game where he scored twenty three and was in

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Speaker 1: foul trouble was the game where they like made a run.

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Speaker 1: They seem to have like made more runs when he's out.

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Speaker 1: I think it's because like the Pacers seem to match

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Speaker 1: Haliburton with him, and so like Haliburton might not be

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Speaker 1: in as much when he's out. But it just, I

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Speaker 1: don't know, like there's something about this matchup where in

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Speaker 1: just the speed with which the Pacers moved the ball

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Speaker 1: around and you know, Brunson's defensive limitations that it just

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Speaker 1: like I feel like it's a riddle that the Knicks

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Speaker 1: still haven't quite solved and nobody has really I mean,

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Speaker 1: the Pacers feel like they're about to go to the finals,

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Speaker 1: and it's I'm convinced, like I don't I don't feel

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Speaker 1: it doesn't feel fluky to me, like they feel like

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Speaker 1: the best team I've seen in the East.

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Speaker 5: Yeah for sure.

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Speaker 6: I mean their path was bonified, like they got through Giannis,

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Speaker 6: and also all of this has been in five games,

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Speaker 6: Like they've gotten decisively through all of these rounds. You know,

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Speaker 6: they got through honest, they got through the Calves, which

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Speaker 6: were ostensibly the best team in the East all year long.

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Speaker 6: And then the Knicks, you know, who just took down

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Speaker 6: the defending champs and were kind of on fire and

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Speaker 6: on a roll. They seemed to be making like relatively

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Speaker 6: quick work of them as well. So like that's kind

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Speaker 6: of hard to argue with. I would push back on

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Speaker 6: you saying that Game four seemed super definitive, like I

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Speaker 6: think all these games have been, you know, like I

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Speaker 6: don't feel super convinced about either team in any win.

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Speaker 6: I mean, if you look at it, like the Knicks

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Speaker 6: should have won Game one, Like were it not for

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Speaker 6: Andrew Neasmith, absolute heroics the likes of which we've almost

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Speaker 6: never seen I think in the NBA playoffs, like they

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Speaker 6: would have won Game one.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought it was just because his great grandfather

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Speaker 1: invented the game.

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Speaker 6: You know advantage, you know, I think this could easily

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Speaker 6: be a two to two series. And that's kind of

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Speaker 6: how Game four felt to me, Like there were so

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Speaker 6: many moments where the Knicks just weren't able to capitalize

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Speaker 6: on the momentum. Like it felt like every time they

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Speaker 6: were kind of taking control of the game, they let

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Speaker 6: go of the rope in one way or another. But

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Speaker 6: I didn't feel like, Oh, the Pacers are definitively the

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Speaker 6: better team here. I just felt like, Oh, the Pacers

390
00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:22,960
Speaker 6: are playing just better enough tonight to eg out this win.

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Speaker 6: And I feel like every single game has been like

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Speaker 6: a coin flip really, which is what's made this series

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Speaker 6: so fun. But I don't think I don't think the

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Speaker 6: Knicks should overreact to this series and be like, Oh,

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Speaker 6: we need to tear this all.

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Speaker 5: Down, we need to get this whole project.

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Speaker 6: I think there's a universe where, you know, the Pacers

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Speaker 6: aren't the team of destiny that it feels like they

399
00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,040
Speaker 6: are this year, where every bounce goes their way, every

400
00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:47,240
Speaker 6: you know, every shot that needs to go in goes in,

401
00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:51,080
Speaker 6: where all those variance elements are not you know, not

402
00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:52,720
Speaker 6: in their favor, where the Knicks are going to the

403
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,520
Speaker 6: NBA Finals, like they are right there. They were so close,

404
00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 6: and I think we have sort of like a tendency

405
00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:03,000
Speaker 6: to overthink the playoffs sometimes when like a bounce doesn't

406
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,720
Speaker 6: go our way, when like the controllables are what you

407
00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:09,200
Speaker 6: can control obviously, and then there's like the luck, fate,

408
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:12,399
Speaker 6: destinies and a siquah of the playoffs, and like certain

409
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,879
Speaker 6: teams just kind of feel like they have that, and

410
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:16,960
Speaker 6: I feel like that's how the Pacers feel right now.

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00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:19,560
Speaker 6: Like I don't think the Knicks are far away, I

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00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:23,879
Speaker 6: do feel like their weaknesses have been exposed specifically in

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Speaker 6: this Pacers series, which is that because Brunson isn't like

414
00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:31,199
Speaker 6: a defensive minded Garden, he kind of needs to be

415
00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:33,080
Speaker 6: on the floor for them to be at their best.

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Speaker 5: It is like a little bit of a.

417
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Speaker 6: Liability to have another offensive first player like Kat on

418
00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:44,520
Speaker 6: the floor with him, and your top two players are

419
00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:49,639
Speaker 6: basically like offense first, like defensively lacking, and that's made

420
00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:52,040
Speaker 6: their starting lineup have a horrible plus minus and that's

421
00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,280
Speaker 6: made it kind of hard for Tips to juggle lineups.

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Speaker 6: So that would be where I think they could address

423
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Speaker 6: in this offseason, Like we need to surround Brunson should

424
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:04,920
Speaker 6: be the priority, like with more defense. But besides that,

425
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Speaker 6: I mean, I think they're right there, and like the

426
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:10,119
Speaker 6: Celtics are a non issue for the next year, Johannis

427
00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:14,080
Speaker 6: might be leaving the conference. So I wouldn't like overreact

428
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Speaker 6: to this Pacers series, would I would be this is

429
00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:20,800
Speaker 6: the farthest they've gotten in you know, my lifetime, so

430
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:24,920
Speaker 6: I think they should. They're on the right track. There's

431
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:27,240
Speaker 6: just tweaks that need to be made.

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Speaker 3: Of the two teams between the Knicks and the Wolves.

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Speaker 2: Obviously the two teams that are both down, you have

434
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Speaker 2: three one which do you feel more confidently in at

435
00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:34,600
Speaker 2: least extending.

436
00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:38,600
Speaker 1: This series? It's sending this year.

437
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Speaker 6: This year, I think the next time a better chance

438
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:45,760
Speaker 6: than the Wolves, just because I think the Wolves have

439
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:49,520
Speaker 6: looked relatively outclassed in most of these games, except for

440
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,000
Speaker 6: that one game where they absolutely blew them out and

441
00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 6: it was just.

442
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:53,640
Speaker 5: Like the upside down.

443
00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:57,240
Speaker 6: But I would say for the most part in these games,

444
00:21:57,280 --> 00:22:00,080
Speaker 6: it's more what you were kind of referencing, where it's like, oh,

445
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:02,680
Speaker 6: one of these teams is clearly better than the other,

446
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:07,160
Speaker 6: And I just personally feel like these the Eastern Conference finals.

447
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:09,240
Speaker 6: The reason they've been so fun is because it really

448
00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,119
Speaker 6: does feel like a coin flip series. It feels like

449
00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:14,400
Speaker 6: two teams that are both really good in very opposite

450
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:18,879
Speaker 6: ways and like play very different styles, and the clash

451
00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:20,359
Speaker 6: of the styles has just sort of been like the

452
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:23,320
Speaker 6: Pacers have been able to impose their style on the

453
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 6: series more than the Knicks have been able to do so,

454
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,800
Speaker 6: and you know, at the end of the day, their

455
00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,200
Speaker 6: best handful of players have played better than the knicks

456
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,080
Speaker 6: handful of players in that series. But it does feel

457
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,520
Speaker 6: like a more closely matched series. And if the Knicks

458
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:40,199
Speaker 6: were able to, like, for example, command the boards like

459
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,120
Speaker 6: they should be doing because that's more fundamental to their

460
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:47,399
Speaker 6: identity than the Pacers, like, it could be a different series.

461
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:49,920
Speaker 6: So to be fair, I don't honestly really think either

462
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,880
Speaker 6: of these series or going in the distance, But if

463
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:56,120
Speaker 6: I had to guess, I would take the Knicks over

464
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:57,400
Speaker 6: the Wolves in that scenario.

465
00:22:58,119 --> 00:22:58,560
Speaker 3: That's fair.

466
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I guess, not definitive necessarily, but just like it.

467
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:08,840
Speaker 1: They do seem to have like more bullets, They seem

468
00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 1: to have like more ways to win for sure.

469
00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:12,440
Speaker 4: Yeah.

470
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,720
Speaker 1: Deeper, I feel like they're like they have the better

471
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:21,360
Speaker 1: coaching going right now Pacers. Yeah, yeah, yeah, which.

472
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:22,359
Speaker 5: Is funny, am I.

473
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:25,639
Speaker 6: So I know that we're having like a Carlisle renaissance

474
00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:27,560
Speaker 6: right now, and you know, deservedly.

475
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 5: So he's been awesome. I'm like, I'm old enough to remember.

476
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:35,040
Speaker 6: Last year when he made some like horrible coaching blenders

477
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:36,440
Speaker 6: in the playoffs and we were like.

478
00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:37,280
Speaker 5: What are you doing?

479
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,200
Speaker 6: Like the it was they were on the other end

480
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,400
Speaker 6: of some like comebacks and like unlikely things last year.

481
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:45,840
Speaker 6: So obviously he you know, they grew from that. And

482
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 6: I'm not putting that all on Carlisle because it was

483
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 6: a young team and you make mistakes as a young team.

484
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,800
Speaker 6: But I remember having conversations like as a guest.

485
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 1: On podcasts passed him by, yeah.

486
00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 6: Yeah, being like, oh, he's like messing up like kind

487
00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:01,120
Speaker 6: of a lot, Like this is atle embarrassing, like does

488
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:02,640
Speaker 6: Carlisle still have his fastball?

489
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:03,400
Speaker 5: Like what's going on?

490
00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,680
Speaker 6: So it's kind of interesting that now the narrative it's

491
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,719
Speaker 6: like we're as such a recency bias like economy of media,

492
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,879
Speaker 6: but like now every conversation is like he's a bonafide

493
00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:15,359
Speaker 6: Hall of Fame NBA coach.

494
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 5: Is he one of the top four coaches in the league.

495
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 6: Like the conversation just hinges so much on this run

496
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:23,639
Speaker 6: they've been on, which is understandable. But it's just like

497
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,119
Speaker 6: he he got out coached in a couple of series,

498
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:28,040
Speaker 6: like you know what I mean.

499
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, last season, the people were coming back on them,

500
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,040
Speaker 1: and he was like, we should do that, and also

501
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 1: like people when he saw those people like making shots

502
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 1: to come back, he was like, we should like do

503
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:44,919
Speaker 1: better shot making. I think being even older than you

504
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,840
Speaker 1: and being able to remember like a decade ago, he

505
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,840
Speaker 1: does seem to be the only coach that I can

506
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 1: remember where it was like, oh, I think they won,

507
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:58,200
Speaker 1: Like you know, the team won because like they didn't

508
00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 1: have as much talent, but they won because like they

509
00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: had like schemed in a way like that in Dallas

510
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 1: when they beat Len where they just like broke Lebron's brain.

511
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,920
Speaker 1: And I don't think that was all him necessarily at all.

512
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 5: But he's a really good coach.

513
00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:15,760
Speaker 1: Just yeah, that, but like going into the playoffs every year,

514
00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 1: I'm always like, well, and they do have Carlisle, which

515
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 1: is you know, that's that could be an advantage. He's

516
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:25,959
Speaker 1: also just such just knowing people in the coaching world. Uh,

517
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:31,639
Speaker 1: my dad worked for him one time. He's like a

518
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:34,159
Speaker 1: nash Or. I guess he's like in Texas, one of

519
00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:38,119
Speaker 1: the top table tennis players for his age, A classically

520
00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:41,560
Speaker 1: trained pianist. He's like a scratch golfer who makes his

521
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:45,480
Speaker 1: own golf clubs. He's just like this, Like he was

522
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:47,959
Speaker 1: just like, yeah, he just never sleeps, and it's just

523
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 1: like a weird genius.

524
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 3: Looks like Jim Carrey.

525
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 1: And also my other friend who's a coach, told me

526
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,479
Speaker 1: that one time they were getting lunch and he ordered

527
00:25:58,560 --> 00:25:59,440
Speaker 1: a graveyard.

528
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 3: Do what that is?

529
00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 1: No, It's like when you get you ask somebody to

530
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 1: go to the soda fountain and just put every different

531
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:08,879
Speaker 1: type of soda in it like a child. It's a

532
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 1: child's drig and he has a grown up was like, yeah,

533
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 1: give me the graveyard. Anyways, Okay, see, I mean what

534
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,080
Speaker 1: do we think is It's like there's been a lot

535
00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:22,760
Speaker 1: of talk about you know, ANT isn't showing up. I

536
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: feel like I feel for anybody who has to go

537
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 1: against that, okay, see perimeter defense. And I feel like

538
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 1: what we've seen from Aunt again, who is like so

539
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 1: much younger than I feel like people remember, yeah, has

540
00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:40,440
Speaker 1: been a step forward, like compared to what he did

541
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 1: in the Western Conference Finals last year, which again he's

542
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:47,760
Speaker 1: in the Western Conference Finals again with probably less talent

543
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:51,400
Speaker 1: around him. I've been impressed with what I see in places,

544
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 1: and then there's definitely been some rough spots too, But yeah.

545
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:56,880
Speaker 6: I think the thunder of to answer your first question,

546
00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 6: like kind of like they've answered every question that people

547
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,719
Speaker 6: had to them going into this postseason, myself included. It

548
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 6: was just like they are it's so rare for the

549
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 6: youngest team in the league to be the best team

550
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:09,960
Speaker 6: in the league, Like that is just really hard to compute.

551
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:13,199
Speaker 6: So it was sort of like I'll believe it when

552
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:14,879
Speaker 6: I see it, you know, with them, even though they

553
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:16,840
Speaker 6: had shown us all regular season that they were the

554
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,359
Speaker 6: best team in basketball, like with a bullet really. And

555
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,600
Speaker 6: I think we've kind of, like not to sound too

556
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 6: like Saccer, but I think we've kind of watched them

557
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 6: grow up over the course of these playoffs. Like I

558
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,439
Speaker 6: do feel like they look like a different team, different

559
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 6: caliber of team now than they did in Round one

560
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 6: and even for the majority of Round two, Like, I

561
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:40,960
Speaker 6: think that test from Denver really brought out their maturity,

562
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 6: and it was the first time all season that they

563
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:45,760
Speaker 6: had really been sort of rattled, and I think you

564
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:47,680
Speaker 6: kind of watched them grow up from that, and they

565
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 6: just look so mature and poised and different in this

566
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:56,119
Speaker 6: Minnesota series, partially, I think because Denver was like a

567
00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 6: little bit worse of a matchup for them than Minnesota,

568
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,880
Speaker 6: but partially because they've been now, they've gone through, They've

569
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 6: gotten further in the playoffs at this point than they

570
00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:06,879
Speaker 6: ever have before, and they just look ready to me,

571
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,399
Speaker 6: Like I wasn't sure if they were, but at this

572
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 6: point I would be really surprised if either team from

573
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:16,120
Speaker 6: the East beats them in the finals.

574
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,080
Speaker 5: Like I think, I think they're ready.

575
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 2: One of my favorite things is watching a young team

576
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:22,879
Speaker 2: developing the way that you just described.

577
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 3: Because like, I love watching how a team responds to

578
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 3: getting punched in the mouth. You know, they go.

579
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 2: If I'm not mistaken, they went down to one to Denver?

580
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:32,520
Speaker 2: Did they not in that series?

581
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:37,919
Speaker 6: I think they they lost game one, but I think

582
00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:39,960
Speaker 6: did they not then win the next two?

583
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 5: I might be remembering incorrectly.

584
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 2: But I could be off, but they were obviously challenged

585
00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:47,000
Speaker 2: along the way, and seeing them get off the mat

586
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,440
Speaker 2: each time and seeing them not just do that, but

587
00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 2: respond and say like, Okay, yeah, we got this. Seeing

588
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,240
Speaker 2: Jalen Williams, who's found his offensive groove again over the

589
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 2: course of this postseason, it's inspiring.

590
00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 3: But you're exactly right, they have been the best team.

591
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 2: It was really just upon us, with us sitting back

592
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 2: saying like, oh, you have to show us, and clearly

593
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:05,680
Speaker 2: they were ready to do that.

594
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 5: Yeah.

595
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 1: I think it was mainly me challenging them that did it.

596
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 5: You were alone in your concerns.

597
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 1: No one else still still don't see it.

598
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 6: But with Minnesota, I think, yeah, I'm actually writing on

599
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 6: that right now, and like, I think we have this

600
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 6: sort of tendency to project expectations on a team or

601
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:29,880
Speaker 6: a player and then when they don't meet those expectations,

602
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,680
Speaker 6: the sky is falling. And it's like everyone was like,

603
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 6: you know, making comparisons to Michael Jordan and like saying

604
00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:36,960
Speaker 6: it was the next face of the league. And the

605
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 6: truth is he's still twenty three years old and he's just.

606
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 5: Not there yet.

607
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,520
Speaker 6: But the fact that he's already been the best player

608
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:47,440
Speaker 6: on a Western Conference finals team two years running is

609
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 6: like a legit accomplishment. And I have no doubt that

610
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:52,680
Speaker 6: he will at some point make the NBA Finals and

611
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 6: win a championship, like he's that good, But I do

612
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 6: I think he's had a subpar supporting cast both times.

613
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,959
Speaker 6: Like I just like, I know they're deep with you know,

614
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:07,880
Speaker 6: as far as like role player talent, but his like

615
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 6: number two in both cases I don't think was a

616
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 6: like good enough and be like the ideal fit next

617
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 6: to him in either case. And then I think Rudy

618
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 6: Gobert is like a really clunky fit with Anthony Edwards.

619
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:23,959
Speaker 6: And I've always felt that way, and I never was,

620
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 6: you know, in favor of that trade. I think it's

621
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 6: really really there's like the floor spacing is obviously lacking,

622
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 6: and it's especially lacking when Julius Randall is a no show,

623
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 6: which has happened to out of the four games in

624
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 6: the series.

625
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 5: But I just this is not the ideal.

626
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 6: Team build around Anthony Edwards, I don't think, and I

627
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 6: don't know how long it's going to take them to

628
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:47,360
Speaker 6: get there, but I think it's a little bit like

629
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:53,320
Speaker 6: unfair to expect a championship when the team is still

630
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 6: like quite a clunky fit, even though they are deep

631
00:30:56,040 --> 00:31:00,320
Speaker 6: and they are good and you know whatnot and they're

632
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 6: is a great regular season defensive player, but like he's

633
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 6: just proven that in the playoffs there is a minimum

634
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 6: of one series per year where he is basically unplayable,

635
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 6: Like it has been true his entire career, Like, regardless

636
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 6: of how far his team goes in the playoffs, there's

637
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 6: a series where Rudy gober gets played off the floor.

638
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 5: And like Misther, what is either a second highest paid

639
00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:26,280
Speaker 5: player or third highest paid. So it's just that's just

640
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 5: tough to overcome, I.

641
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: Think, all right, from one player that's openly disliked by

642
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: players around the league to another. I do just want

643
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:42,960
Speaker 1: to talk about Halliburton and specifically, I actually just want

644
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 1: to ask this question broadly. Is it a coincidence that

645
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 1: three of the four final teams that in a playoffs

646
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 1: that has felt like a sort of changing of the guard,

647
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 1: where like I feel like a lot you know, these

648
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 1: are a lot of young teams, a lot of people

649
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 1: who you know, haven't done it before. Three of the

650
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 1: four final teams are led by like scoring point guards

651
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:12,840
Speaker 1: or you know, like Halliburton is scoring a lot right now.

652
00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: It feels like point guards have suddenly like it I

653
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 1: remember two years ago watching the Suns be like, we

654
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,800
Speaker 1: don't need a point guard, Like we're just like Devin Booker,

655
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:25,640
Speaker 1: our shooting guard will bring the ball to the court

656
00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 1: and we're just you know, And that didn't go well.

657
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:32,320
Speaker 1: The Lakers kind of tried like a similar thing at

658
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: various points this year, and I just feel like we're

659
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 1: seeing a thing happen where like point guard is suddenly

660
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 1: incredibly important at a time when it was supposed to

661
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:46,880
Speaker 1: be becoming less and less important.

662
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 6: I mean, I would say, like the point guards that

663
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,360
Speaker 6: are left are so different that I don't know if

664
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 6: like you could take it as a referendum on the position,

665
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 6: like the version of a point guard that Jalen Brunson

666
00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 6: is and the version of a point guard that Tyre's

667
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 6: Halliburton is, or like universe a part I would say,

668
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,640
Speaker 6: like Tyreus Halliburton in and of himself might be a

669
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 6: referendum on the importance of the point guard position, because

670
00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 6: he is like a true blue old school run the offense,

671
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 6: like getting myself looks and scoring is like bottom of

672
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 6: the totem pole of importance type of point guard. Like

673
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:19,280
Speaker 6: he's like a quarterback out there, like he's quarterbacking their offense.

674
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:22,960
Speaker 6: He's dictating the pace, he's dictating the style, he's getting

675
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 6: people involved.

676
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 5: That is like a dying breed.

677
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,600
Speaker 6: I would say in the NBA, like there aren't many

678
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 6: point guards like that left, Whereas I would say like

679
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 6: Jalen Brunson is more of like a new school point

680
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 6: guard where it's like well by de facto because he's

681
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:37,840
Speaker 6: the shortest player on the floor, like he kind of

682
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 6: falls into the position of the one. But his facilitation

683
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 6: is not why he's there. He's there to score. He's

684
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 6: a score first player. So I don't really think it's

685
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 6: almost like in name only, they're the same type of players.

686
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:54,400
Speaker 6: So I really think it can serve as like this

687
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:56,840
Speaker 6: is the future of the league. But I will say

688
00:33:56,880 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 6: that like Tyre's Halliburton has shown that, like we don't

689
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:03,520
Speaker 6: need to kill off the old school version of a

690
00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:06,480
Speaker 6: point guard so fast. It just needs to evolve because

691
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:09,240
Speaker 6: to your point, he can score at a high clip

692
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:12,000
Speaker 6: if he needs to, he just doesn't choose to do

693
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 6: that first because that's not his priority on the floor.

694
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:16,800
Speaker 6: And I think we kind of like threw the baby

695
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 6: out with the bathwater with the point guard position, and

696
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 6: we're like, well, we don't need someone to orchestrate the

697
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,399
Speaker 6: offense because we just need one through five like spaced out.

698
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:26,759
Speaker 6: Everyone needs to be able to score, where it's like

699
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:30,440
Speaker 6: the more evolved version of that thinking is like everyone

700
00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 6: needs to be able to score, but it's still really

701
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 6: really valuable to have like a super high level offensive

702
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:40,759
Speaker 6: you know, creator, facilitator orchestrator on the floor for sure.

703
00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:43,600
Speaker 2: So Claire just really quickly, we were talking beforehand, how

704
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 2: do you think Sacramento feels about getting.

705
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:49,040
Speaker 3: Rid of right they feel?

706
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 6: I mean, it's crazy because now they're talking about, you know,

707
00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:54,720
Speaker 6: moving off of Sibonis, like that's those are the rumblings

708
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 6: I'm hearing, and that's who they got back in that

709
00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 6: because they had they it's sort of like Sophie's choice.

710
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 6: They had to like in their estimation, like equally high

711
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:07,240
Speaker 6: level point guard prototypes of Deer and Fox and Terrys

712
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,839
Speaker 6: Haliburn or guard prototypes, I guess, because I don't think

713
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,440
Speaker 6: Fox is even playing the point guard in San Antonio,

714
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:16,840
Speaker 6: and they chose Fox. And now not only is dearon

715
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:19,400
Speaker 6: Fox not on those Kings anymore, but the guy they

716
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 6: got back for, Tyreus Haliburton, is probably about to not

717
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 6: be on the Kings anymore, so they didn't choose very well.

718
00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:29,839
Speaker 6: I would say glass half full for the Kings. They've

719
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:32,840
Speaker 6: taken so much flak for their drafting over the years,

720
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,440
Speaker 6: and like the problem isn't the drafting, I think is

721
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:38,879
Speaker 6: what history is telling us, Like they can pick them,

722
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 6: it's just knowing who to keep and how to keep

723
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,319
Speaker 6: them build around them.

724
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,640
Speaker 1: But it does probably make them feel better, that's more.

725
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:46,359
Speaker 3: Well.

726
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 6: I just remember, like every NBA draft I've been like

727
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 6: cognizant of it's like the Kings again, like they messed

728
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,239
Speaker 6: up the draft again or whatever, and it's like, I

729
00:35:56,239 --> 00:36:00,319
Speaker 6: don't they're drafting fine, It's it's definitely more like then.

730
00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: They're like, yeah, we.

731
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:04,520
Speaker 5: Actually but no, I'm sure.

732
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 6: I mean, I'm so glad that Tyre's Haliburton ended up

733
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:11,399
Speaker 6: where he did because the Pacers obviously saw something in him,

734
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 6: and Rick Carlisle saw something in him where they're like

735
00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,480
Speaker 6: this guy's style of play and the way he plays basketball,

736
00:36:16,520 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 6: like let's just go with that, let's just build around that.

737
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:23,319
Speaker 6: And and I think, you know him happening Like I've

738
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 6: heard people like wish casting like like what if he

739
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:27,839
Speaker 6: had gotten drafted into Golden.

740
00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:28,440
Speaker 5: State or whatever.

741
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:30,799
Speaker 6: But and he might have fit in nicely to the

742
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:34,000
Speaker 6: Steve Kurse style of play, you know, of the sort

743
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,879
Speaker 6: of egalitarian like the beautiful game, like whatever. But I'm

744
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:40,239
Speaker 6: just glad that he basically got handed the keys to

745
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:44,440
Speaker 6: his own franchise to play like Tyre's Haliburton basketball, because

746
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 6: I don't think there were that many teams in the

747
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:48,840
Speaker 6: league that would have done that. And obviously it's paying

748
00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:50,360
Speaker 6: dividends absolutely.

749
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: All right, let's take one more break and when we

750
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 1: come back, it's time for the rabbit fire around of questioning.

751
00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 1: We'll be right back, and we're back, and it is

752
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,960
Speaker 1: the rapid fire round of questioning, Claire. We're going to

753
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 1: fire some questions that you you are just going to

754
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 1: give us your first answer. We're trying to keep this moving.

755
00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:25,480
Speaker 1: It is known far and wide as the fastest segment

756
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:28,320
Speaker 1: in podcasting, so we've got a reputation to uphold.

757
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 3: Don't mess us up.

758
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:34,359
Speaker 1: Don't mess this up for us, please, Brian, could you

759
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 1: do me a favor? Actually, could you start the clock? Okay? Cool,

760
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:41,040
Speaker 1: thank you, thank you, Brian.

761
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:41,800
Speaker 3: Ops the world.

762
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:47,239
Speaker 1: All right, do you want to start off, Jabari or

763
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 1: would you like me to go first?

764
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:49,919
Speaker 3: We can bounce on these.

765
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 1: Okay to mine?

766
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:54,200
Speaker 3: All right? So clear here we go. This player or

767
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:54,760
Speaker 3: that player?

768
00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 2: Which would you rather see Shay playing back in the

769
00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:02,640
Speaker 2: nineties or Rime in healthy Penny hard way into Day's game.

770
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 5: Shane the nineties would be fun.

771
00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 6: I feel like he would fit in really nicely in

772
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:09,360
Speaker 6: his play style and it's just like a more evolved

773
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 6: version of that game.

774
00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 5: So I'd like to see.

775
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 1: It Halliburton on those nineties Pacers teams or Prime Reggie

776
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 1: joining this current squad. And keep in mind, you do

777
00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: if he's on the squad, he can't be doing the game.

778
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,640
Speaker 6: Essentially, my answer, I would pick I would pick Reggie.

779
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 6: It's the same reason I was excited when Jeff and

780
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 6: Gundy got a coaching job. I was like, yeah, like,

781
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:32,920
Speaker 6: keep these guys busy. It's like handing a toddler, like

782
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 6: a Nintendo switch or whatever.

783
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:36,520
Speaker 5: You're just like just go sit over there.

784
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:39,160
Speaker 1: I feel like this has to be hard for Pacers

785
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:44,880
Speaker 1: because it's like you're you're like watching your team's finally

786
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,359
Speaker 1: making it, and it's just hard for people to root

787
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:47,799
Speaker 1: for them.

788
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 3: Keep it a going.

789
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: Jalen Jalen Bunch Jalen Brunson Berner.

790
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:57,399
Speaker 2: The Bunsen Burner exactly, Jalen Brunson transported back to join

791
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,680
Speaker 2: peak Ewing in ninety four, or Prime past jumping into

792
00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:03,280
Speaker 2: DeLorean and being available for this current series.

793
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,759
Speaker 6: Oh, Prime, Pat would be pretty freaking handy right now.

794
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:09,799
Speaker 6: For the New York next, I would have sure, I'm

795
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 6: going to go.

796
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 1: With that one two minutes to I bet tips just

797
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,439
Speaker 1: doesn't play. Yeah, it just doesn't play.

798
00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:20,640
Speaker 5: You'd be older.

799
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: Forty minutes a game, all right, and finally Aunt alongside

800
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,879
Speaker 1: KG for that two thousand and four run, or KG

801
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:36,080
Speaker 1: lining up beside Colbert for the current team, or maybe

802
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:37,480
Speaker 1: in place of Cobert.

803
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 6: I mean in place of Gobert, like ten times out

804
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 6: of time, what give me that one? Give me give

805
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:44,800
Speaker 6: me the Kevin Garnette instead of Rudio, a bear option,

806
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,320
Speaker 6: like on any team at anytime.

807
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,000
Speaker 5: Like that's great, Yeah.

808
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:52,400
Speaker 3: That is fair. Give us your prediction on these following

809
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:53,479
Speaker 3: players and where they are.

810
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 5: Next, be honest, San Antonio, wow.

811
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:10,080
Speaker 4: Zion Williamson, The New Orleans Pelicans, John maritt Man, I

812
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:13,000
Speaker 4: think I think he says it grizzly for now.

813
00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:20,000
Speaker 1: Kevin Durant, who did make these ryn kd with the rockets.

814
00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:20,960
Speaker 1: That would be so fun.

815
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,319
Speaker 6: It would be so fun. He's exactly what they need.

816
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:25,279
Speaker 6: It's like it's a beautiful fit.

817
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:28,600
Speaker 3: And Lebron James.

818
00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 5: Los Angeles Lakers.

819
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:36,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's your face, Jabbari, it happens. It happens. Sorry,

820
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:39,560
Speaker 1: the best player of all time stays on your team

821
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: sometimes it happened, all right. And finally, we want to

822
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:49,400
Speaker 1: tap into your musical knowledge and expertise with the Kendrick

823
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:52,360
Speaker 1: and this is a co headlining tour currently taking place.

824
00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 1: We want to hear your choice for a tour that

825
00:40:55,600 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 1: blends genres and like has two headliners just tray on

826
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 1: and off. Who are you going with?

827
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 6: Well, the thing about this is in Kendrick tours, they

828
00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:07,320
Speaker 6: have a lot of songs together.

829
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 1: So that's it?

830
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 6: Does that is that a prerequisite? Like do they have

831
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:11,800
Speaker 6: to have shared songs?

832
00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:12,839
Speaker 3: They could?

833
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:16,319
Speaker 1: They could record songs for this tour together based on

834
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:20,640
Speaker 1: your direction. We have a ton of power in this scenario.

835
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:21,400
Speaker 5: Man.

836
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 6: Well, Beach House is like my favorite band of all time,

837
00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 6: so I want that to be one of the artists.

838
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:28,960
Speaker 6: I mean, it feels like a cop out to use Kendrick,

839
00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:31,959
Speaker 6: but like Beach House and Kendrick be like on Fire Tour.

840
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:34,400
Speaker 6: I would love that so much, and they would be

841
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:36,799
Speaker 6: really cool collab. I think like they could make some

842
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,640
Speaker 6: really cool songs together. And I mean Kendrick has sampled

843
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 6: them before, he sampled them on Money Trees, So I do.

844
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:44,040
Speaker 5: A good start.

845
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:45,800
Speaker 3: I give you so much bready.

846
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:47,120
Speaker 1: I didn't realice that was then.

847
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:49,279
Speaker 3: I can tell you right now.

848
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:54,120
Speaker 2: I absolutely thought, okay, so tiny this, and I.

849
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,640
Speaker 6: Mean I would love that, but like, yeah, I feel

850
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:58,920
Speaker 6: like it's like the what are they isn't it? With

851
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 6: awards voting, It's like you have to like leave yourself.

852
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:02,200
Speaker 1: Recute yourself.

853
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:03,600
Speaker 3: Yeah that's fair.

854
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 1: Nah on that, not on this sved, not on this

855
00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:07,719
Speaker 1: show where crooked as.

856
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:10,640
Speaker 5: Hell, myself, me and jay z Onto worlds do that.

857
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:13,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, the fans have been asking.

858
00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:13,920
Speaker 3: That's the answer.

859
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:14,880
Speaker 1: That is the answer.

860
00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:15,760
Speaker 3: It is correct.

861
00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:18,760
Speaker 1: Thank you Jobori for leading her to the right answer.

862
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:22,839
Speaker 1: That just checking our scorecard and yes, every single one

863
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:27,280
Speaker 1: of those was the correct answer. Congratulations returning champion Claire Dulon.

864
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,120
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us. Where can people

865
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:33,719
Speaker 1: find you? Follow you, hear you, listen to you all

866
00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:34,440
Speaker 1: that good stuff?

867
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 6: Well, basketball wise, you can find my stuff at the

868
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 6: guardiantheguardian dot com and also I tweet about basketball and

869
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:45,640
Speaker 6: like post about across all social media at Claire Mpls

870
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:48,720
Speaker 6: music wise, you can find me under tiny Deaths wherever

871
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 6: you stream music.

872
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, yoh, you can give us a follow on Twitter.

873
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,360
Speaker 1: I'm at Jack Underscore. O'Brian Miles is at Miles of Gray.

874
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 1: I'm at Jack ob one on Blue Sky and Miles

875
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:03,440
Speaker 1: as also at Miles of Gray. He has good social

876
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 1: media continuity. I have the opposite, Jabari, where can people

877
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 1: find you?

878
00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:12,319
Speaker 3: Easy A? Davis on both?

879
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 1: All right, and that's going to do it. Another one

880
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:19,719
Speaker 1: in the books, swish we did it. We did it

881
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:25,399
Speaker 1: back next week, Kobe Lebron knuckle come on,