Speaker 1: He's the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft shows, your war
Speaker 1: room for insider news and draft analysis from deep within
Speaker 1: the confines of Cowboys Headquarters at Valley Rant. The Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys Selection by Rand Joe and now your hosts Dame Brugler,
Speaker 1: David Hellman, and Brian brought us. We're back here in
Speaker 1: the SWBC Mortgage studios for another edition of the Draft Show.
Speaker 1: So happy that everyone out there can join us. Brian
Speaker 1: brought us along with Dame Brugler from CBS Sports and
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys dot Com. Also joined back by David Hellman.
Speaker 1: Hey from a little vacation down in Uh, don't say
Speaker 1: it the Big Easy, Okay, that's fine. Thought he was
Speaker 1: on assignment. I he was on assignment until you kind
Speaker 1: of ratted him out for being in Mardi Gras. Is
Speaker 1: that me New York? Yeah, it was. It was Taylor.
Speaker 1: I listened to Taylor Radio. All right, Dad, I'm sorry
Speaker 1: about that, but nice to have you back. David. Thanks,
Speaker 1: and we're gonna get into some draft coverage. Kent Garrison
Speaker 1: producing the show, Executive producing the show as he is
Speaker 1: always and we appreciate his efforts. Uh want to get
Speaker 1: into some things that I kind of take the show
Speaker 1: around a little bit. Uh you know, we've been talking
Speaker 1: about a lot of the top players and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: One at some point time getting the show maybe about
Speaker 1: the little some guys in the middle of the draft.
Speaker 1: Maybe I also want to get in though. You know,
Speaker 1: Mayock put in his top five per position and I
Speaker 1: thought maybe we would dive into our top five as well.
Speaker 1: But uh, you know, we talk in talk about some
Speaker 1: top guys, but I want to get down, go through
Speaker 1: the board and talk about some guys maybe in the
Speaker 1: middle rounds of this draft. Everybody's very familiar with some
Speaker 1: of the top names, but let's let's give guys an
Speaker 1: idea maybe in that. You know, because we've been seeing
Speaker 1: I know, the guys I've been working with with Jeff Kavanaugh,
Speaker 1: and and and Kevin Turner. You know you came in
Speaker 1: last night watch film when this Day was in there
Speaker 1: for part of the time. We're starting to see those fourth, fifth,
Speaker 1: sixth round type of players. So I need to put
Speaker 1: some names out there. Saw a very interesting defensive end
Speaker 1: from app State last night. Yes, we did, a lot
Speaker 1: of people need to get on him. We'll put Dane
Speaker 1: and I give you guys credit because you guys are
Speaker 1: in here every night, grind in the film till wee
Speaker 1: hours of the night, putting the work in. And yeah,
Speaker 1: last night I did some work on Ronald Blair, Yeah,
Speaker 1: defensive end for app State. Did some work on him
Speaker 1: a couple of months ago, the two tapes that I had,
Speaker 1: I thought this a nice player, third round player. We
Speaker 1: watched him last night, the full cut up, including against
Speaker 1: Clemson Clemson, right, not just FCS competition, and he was unblockable. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is a player that wins the point of attack.
Speaker 1: He penetrates gaps, he used his length, his quickness, his
Speaker 1: effort is unrelenting. There's just so much to like about
Speaker 1: this player that you know, you look at the board
Speaker 1: and it's not a great pass rush group this Ye,
Speaker 1: that's that's kind of that. I like what the direction
Speaker 1: you're taking. So, you know, how early can we see
Speaker 1: a player like this going that shows this type of potential. Now,
Speaker 1: obviously we need to do more work on him. Why
Speaker 1: is he at app State? Is that you know Georgia
Speaker 1: kid need to talk to uh, you know, some coaches,
Speaker 1: some teammates figure out a little bit more about him,
Speaker 1: dive more in, but just on talent. We're talking a
Speaker 1: second round player, absolutely, And I tell you what I
Speaker 1: was in pressing, And the point you make is Ronald
Speaker 1: Blair was doing it against the team playing for the
Speaker 1: national championship this year. Yeah, I mean he was splitting blocks,
Speaker 1: beating blocks, getting captured in the edge, attacking plays to
Speaker 1: the outside. Effort was outstanding. He's a He's a six
Speaker 1: two and a half two hundred and seventy two pound player.
Speaker 1: He is the length though four yea, he is. He
Speaker 1: is a very interesting player. And so again that's we'll
Speaker 1: get into some of those names. So I'm glad you
Speaker 1: brought him up and you said he's a he was
Speaker 1: at Georgia. No, No, he's from Georgia, from Georgia, State
Speaker 1: of Georgia. We were the first question that came into
Speaker 1: my mind. And this is something that I learned a
Speaker 1: long time ago, and that you always want to find
Speaker 1: out the story of the player. He always and I
Speaker 1: always ask where's this guy from? Where's he from? And
Speaker 1: I'm you know, this, this might be a case, guys
Speaker 1: of just misrecruiting. This might be sure. The fact that
Speaker 1: you know and some people you know, Kevin Turner last
Speaker 1: night was talking about that, you know they have It
Speaker 1: was a specific major that he had at app State
Speaker 1: and he was interested and he's been a four year
Speaker 1: starter there. Right. Well, the best part about the draft
Speaker 1: process for me is finding out the journey that all
Speaker 1: of these kids take to get to this juncture because
Speaker 1: it's it's there's snow flicks. No two are the same,
Speaker 1: you know, whether a kid was a five star coming
Speaker 1: up in high school or a no star, just that journey,
Speaker 1: you know, all the different wrinkles until they get to
Speaker 1: this point. Look at Carson Wentz, one of the best
Speaker 1: quarterbacks in this draft right playing at North Dakota State.
Speaker 1: Well why is that? Well, okay, well he heard his
Speaker 1: arm as junior year, didn't play quarterback, didn't play quarterback
Speaker 1: till the senior year. And so I mean, each each
Speaker 1: kid has a journey, has a story exactly. And so
Speaker 1: for Ronald Blair, we're still figuring out the story. But
Speaker 1: the tape, yeah, the tape, the tape is very good.
Speaker 1: And again the Draft Show, our job is to investigate
Speaker 1: and then Dane educate And that's what we're gonna try
Speaker 1: and do for you here. And if you have the
Speaker 1: opportunity and you can get ahold of the Clemson game.
Speaker 1: Somehow app State versus Clemson this year. Uh check out
Speaker 1: number forty nine rushing for app ston't be able to
Speaker 1: miss him. You won't. And I'll tell you what I thought.
Speaker 1: App State played well in that game too. They did.
Speaker 1: They got after they put a few guys on defrond
Speaker 1: they know they know that and whatn't know and whenn't
Speaker 1: surprise Avious they got after they got after Clemson. They've
Speaker 1: got a safety that's not bad, Doug Middleton. I mean
Speaker 1: a few guys that app State is FBS. Now are
Speaker 1: they climbed up? Yeah? They are, and they are their
Speaker 1: first year in the Sun Belt. They had a pretty
Speaker 1: good season. I think they had nine wins something like that.
Speaker 1: So a good program. Nice job there. Okay, Uh, there's
Speaker 1: a couple of ways you could get a hold of
Speaker 1: us on this show. We do a thing, uh from
Speaker 1: Ed K. Hill that created a long time ago called
Speaker 1: Twitter on the twenty. I always appreciate his contribution to
Speaker 1: this show. There's a way also you can call us
Speaker 1: at eight eight eight eight five five two two nine seven.
Speaker 1: That'll be on the side of the screen right here.
Speaker 1: We'll take some calls. Always interested in what you folks
Speaker 1: have to offer. Always interested in your opinion on what
Speaker 1: you have on players. Maybe have some questions for Dave
Speaker 1: and Dane and myself. I want to get into because
Speaker 1: we got the Combine on the horizon as well, and
Speaker 1: I want to get in Dane. On CBS Sports, the
Speaker 1: Combine list came out and yes, last night we were
Speaker 1: going through some guys that snubs. Yeah, you know, and
Speaker 1: again as I'm looking at the I'm looking at the
Speaker 1: website here at CBS, Dane Burglar has it up, and
Speaker 1: I just want to go through, Dane a couple of
Speaker 1: those and maybe highlights some positions, maybe the two or
Speaker 1: three guys that you felt like. Again, the articles up
Speaker 1: for you to go and read, but maybe some guys
Speaker 1: that you felt like though really really did get snubbed. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And every year we have these types of guys. I mean,
Speaker 1: they're three hundred and thirty two players invited to the Combine.
Speaker 1: There's two hundred and fifty five draft picks. So a
Speaker 1: lot of these guys that invited the Combine will not
Speaker 1: get drafted. But then you also factor in last year
Speaker 1: there were forty one players who were not invited to
Speaker 1: the Combine. Who were drafted, right, So I mean if
Speaker 1: he's page yeah, it's about sixteen percent. I believe it's
Speaker 1: that's somebody can do the numbers. Well, it's one of
Speaker 1: those things where if with these players, even if you
Speaker 1: don't get that invite, the you know your journey's not over.
Speaker 1: You still have a great chance. And for this year,
Speaker 1: those players that did not receive an invite that stand out.
Speaker 1: We watched one of the players last night, j Tavis
Speaker 1: Brown out of Akron. Really he's undersized and there's nothing
Speaker 1: he can do about that's maxed out there, not gonna
Speaker 1: get bigger. But he's fast. He plays the game with
Speaker 1: this speed that is consistent and also just it pops
Speaker 1: off the filmy his closing bursts, his pursuit speed um
Speaker 1: And so I think at worse with Tavis Brown, you're
Speaker 1: looking at a special teams type of guy. I don't know,
Speaker 1: it's gonna be tough for him to work his way
Speaker 1: into the starting lineup as as a linebacker due to
Speaker 1: his size. But I think at worse you're talking about
Speaker 1: a special teams guy. There are not three hundred and
Speaker 1: thirty two players better than Javis Bryan No, I totally
Speaker 1: agree with you on that, and I was impressed you
Speaker 1: brought him up. You talk about Akron and again this
Speaker 1: guy you know the Bowl game. I mean he was
Speaker 1: all over the place, and you know, you talk about
Speaker 1: guys that had have the the instincts, the awareness you know,
Speaker 1: when you're short in your a little bit underside you
Speaker 1: better he does. He's got the explosive but you better
Speaker 1: be smart, better compen better compensate, and that he can
Speaker 1: carry guys out of the backfield, he could take guys underneath,
Speaker 1: played the ball with off hand us all that. Again,
Speaker 1: he just slacks height, but he's gonna make every single tackle. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's We've seen guys unless he's playing J. P. Ryan. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then and then and then it's a little bit trouble.
Speaker 1: But you you talked to him about that. The Yeah,
Speaker 1: I did talk to Ja Tavis about that. He told
Speaker 1: me Pe Ryan is the toughest player he's ever played.
Speaker 1: And we found stop him a couplet on film. But
Speaker 1: for the most part, he mean mean, he makes a
Speaker 1: nine out of ten tackle. Okay, who else you got there? Well,
Speaker 1: you know a guy that played locally here TCU, Aaron
Speaker 1: Green saw him with the senior Yeah, he had a
Speaker 1: good week at the Senior Bowl. And this is a
Speaker 1: player in space. He's gonna make you miss. I mean,
Speaker 1: but any type of contact he's going down. He's kind
Speaker 1: of funny the way it is. He's kind of a
Speaker 1: runner and runner and then he makes it cut and
Speaker 1: then he kind of gets really small. And I thought
Speaker 1: he was, you know, a late round type of guy
Speaker 1: because he doesn't play with power, doesn't run with power,
Speaker 1: and in the NFL, you know, good luck. You know,
Speaker 1: he's not gonna give you much between the tackles, but
Speaker 1: he can catch the ball, right, So I thought, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe he's a third round role. He can, you know,
Speaker 1: carve out some type of shoulder block like a little
Speaker 1: flipper guy. He's not really a square up and he's
Speaker 1: about two hundred pounds and he's not gonna get much
Speaker 1: bigger than I either. So um, he's a poor man's Abdullah.
Speaker 1: And oh, it's actually his best friend because he started
Speaker 1: his career in Nebraska. You you kind of liked that
Speaker 1: Duela last year though, when that kind of win of
Speaker 1: your guys, I remembered, and I mean, I know he
Speaker 1: climbed as it went. I just remember being surprised that
Speaker 1: he was as high of a pick as he was
Speaker 1: second round pick. Right, we were talking about him as
Speaker 1: like a third round guy, like the fourth morning back
Speaker 1: I think in the second round. Oh, he's got those
Speaker 1: traits though loose played traits. Just out of curiosity, Did
Speaker 1: the Texas Tech kid get invited? Which one? UM? Washington? Here? Washington?
Speaker 1: I thought they were both surprisingly good immobile. I honestly,
Speaker 1: I would have said I thought Green was better. Though. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's kind of surprising to me that Green didn't get
Speaker 1: invited but Washington did. Yeah, I was surprised. I mean,
Speaker 1: I again, I Green's probably more of a late round guy,
Speaker 1: but there were running backs that we are invited that
Speaker 1: I think that Green's clearly better. So was a little
Speaker 1: bit surprised to see that. Um. And you know, remember,
Speaker 1: like I said, forty one players last year were drafted,
Speaker 1: so you never know what some of these players they
Speaker 1: could at the pro day or you know, like Green
Speaker 1: had a chance at the Senior Bowl. Another Senior Bowl guy,
Speaker 1: jay Lee the Baylor White Really, yeah, that's what I
Speaker 1: was gonna get to. I was gonna get because I
Speaker 1: saw that as being a name that we're very familiar
Speaker 1: with from the Senior Bowl. I mean other than Braxton Miller,
Speaker 1: he was probably the best receiver at this your bowl, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean besides him and Shepherd. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Shepherd
Speaker 1: was on the end right, you're yeah, you're right. But
Speaker 1: jay Lee he on the North squad. I mean he was.
Speaker 1: He was terrific, making some pretty impressive catches and at
Speaker 1: Baylor his tapes okay, but at the Senior Bowl, I
Speaker 1: thought he really stepped up, used to size well and
Speaker 1: it expanded his catch radius and really impressed. So jay Lee,
Speaker 1: I know, I was looking forward to seeing what the
Speaker 1: combine to Seebody would run because he's a big, lumbering guy.
Speaker 1: Speed's not his uh not what he does best as
Speaker 1: a receiver. But you know, if you could run a
Speaker 1: Ford but able to be very productive in the Senior
Speaker 1: Bowl setting when it came down to okay, you can't.
Speaker 1: They weren't playing a lot of man coverage. He was
Speaker 1: able to run some. And the questions we have about
Speaker 1: the Baylor kids, and I know, especially with Coleman, is
Speaker 1: these kids as route runners exactly? You know, I mean,
Speaker 1: is it is a lot to do with the scheme.
Speaker 1: I mean, did they get production because of scheme? I
Speaker 1: thought Jay Lee showed well, though some other guys tell
Speaker 1: him going down to your list though as well. Uh
Speaker 1: kJ May was another kid we were talking about them
Speaker 1: from the Universe Minnesota. I thought he was kind of
Speaker 1: a little bit of a poor man's Duyne Harris, if
Speaker 1: you want to say, had a couple of tackles, right,
Speaker 1: I wrote about him. And then Paul McRoberts from Southeast
Speaker 1: Missouri was another guy that was given. Lee and mc
Speaker 1: roberts with the two most productive receivers on the South team.
Speaker 1: And I think wide receiver had the most you know
Speaker 1: snubs this year because he also Daniel Braverman out of
Speaker 1: Western Michigan, a player who is perfect for the slot.
Speaker 1: I think he'll get drafted. And then Michael Thomas, not
Speaker 1: the Ohio State Michael Thomas, but the Southern miss Michael Thomas,
Speaker 1: a really good player who he'll have his drops. He's
Speaker 1: very lean, but I think Michael Thomas has the skills
Speaker 1: to play at the NFL level. So I think Wide
Speaker 1: receiver had the most guys that stood out as players
Speaker 1: that should be at the combine or you know, at
Speaker 1: least deserved to get to that get to that stage
Speaker 1: and audition for NFL scouts. Yeah, every year, and that
Speaker 1: was an alarming number though I didn't realized the number
Speaker 1: was that. I mean it was last year's more than
Speaker 1: what we usually see. I went back into the last
Speaker 1: few years and uh, you know last year was a
Speaker 1: little more than we usually see. But see, I mean
Speaker 1: I have it right here. Last year was a forty one,
Speaker 1: the year before it was thirty two. So um in
Speaker 1: thirty two is about twelve and a half percent of
Speaker 1: the total draft field. So you know we're still talking
Speaker 1: double digit percents of players. I mean when you talk
Speaker 1: up drafted, what two hundred and fifty six guys get
Speaker 1: drafty Well, yeah, because the Patriots. So I mean you're
Speaker 1: talking like I mean last year was like once every
Speaker 1: five or six guys, and then the year before that's
Speaker 1: when every ten or twelve or so. I mean that's
Speaker 1: still a lot when you think about it. I mean absolutely,
Speaker 1: And I have a broken down here. Last year three
Speaker 1: in the fourth round, we're non combine invites, seven in
Speaker 1: the fifth round, sixteen in the sixth round, and then
Speaker 1: fifteen in the seventh round. So on Day three, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, we saw a lot of these non combine
Speaker 1: guys come off the board even as early as a
Speaker 1: fourth round. Yeah, and the medical information so important to me.
Speaker 1: These are probably guys that did visit, probably one of
Speaker 1: the thirty visits you know that get to come in
Speaker 1: before the pre draft stuff, and you know you can
Speaker 1: to me, the combine is really about the medical and
Speaker 1: about the interview exactly so. And actually it raises and
Speaker 1: what I think is an interesting question. Maybe you disagree.
Speaker 1: I just remember last year how many times we must
Speaker 1: have talked about well, when Gurley gets to the combine,
Speaker 1: that's when we'll know about his acl Is there anybody
Speaker 1: Miles Jack comes to mind? Maybe Jalen Smith also comes
Speaker 1: from who who? This year? Medical wise? Is a question
Speaker 1: that needs to be answered at the combine. Is there
Speaker 1: anybody that stands out? I think I think you hit
Speaker 1: the two right, Yeah, are the two main ones. I
Speaker 1: think Jalen Smith will have to wait until probably March
Speaker 1: in April to know really more about him. Yeah, a
Speaker 1: few running backs stand out. Devontae Booker, he was not
Speaker 1: able to be at Senior boause of a knee right
Speaker 1: that really it prematurely ended his Utah career. So I
Speaker 1: think Devontae Booker, I want to see what's going on
Speaker 1: with the knee. Jonathan Williams Yarks running back. He was
Speaker 1: limited at the Senior Bowl, wasn't a full participant. Uh,
Speaker 1: I want to see what he's able to do it.
Speaker 1: But you know, I get the question all the time
Speaker 1: about how how these invites happened to the combine. You know,
Speaker 1: how what's that process? You know when you were in
Speaker 1: an NFL uh you know, war room in front of
Speaker 1: the front office. How much input as a as a
Speaker 1: front office did you guys were able to give? You know, hey,
Speaker 1: we want to see this guy. Yeah, we we didn't
Speaker 1: you know when my days again, I started back in
Speaker 1: in uh in nineteen ninety two working in college and
Speaker 1: then I went to the pro side of it. So
Speaker 1: when I came here, though, they were we were just
Speaker 1: starting to get involved with that, you know it really
Speaker 1: Dude bad was the one that was running the combine.
Speaker 1: And we would go with and the National Scouts, the
Speaker 1: National Scouting Combine and then blessed and then you would
Speaker 1: have emerging You would have a meeting selection committee. A
Speaker 1: selection committee would come and say, Okay, these are the
Speaker 1: guys that we would like to submit and and and
Speaker 1: it was as a as a as a scouting unit.
Speaker 1: It wasn't as okay, the Green Bay Packers or the
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys. It was as a unit, we agree on
Speaker 1: these players. Now, where are the players were different? On Okay,
Speaker 1: we would we had a high grade on this player,
Speaker 1: or we had a high grade and or we didn't
Speaker 1: have a high enough high enough grade on the other players.
Speaker 1: So yeah, it was kind of one of those things
Speaker 1: where it was a selection committee from both both scouting
Speaker 1: groups that were able to merge the list, to merge
Speaker 1: the players. Yeah, people that don't know, you know, National
Speaker 1: and Blessed though the two big you know scouting. You know,
Speaker 1: they're they're made up of supplements to the supplements to
Speaker 1: what you have at your scouting right, they're the group
Speaker 1: that that actually submit the names, and I mean submit
Speaker 1: when you when you talk about that, uh, it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you could go to meetings in the spring and then
Speaker 1: you go to a meeting in the fall. A lot
Speaker 1: of the foundation were exactly they give you the names
Speaker 1: and then it's your job. I think I think there's
Speaker 1: about twenty five teams that are are members of these
Speaker 1: two groups, not every team, but about twenty five or so.
Speaker 1: But yeah, and that's and then the selection committee they
Speaker 1: come up with the invite list. And this isn't like
Speaker 1: the Senior Bowl, where if a player is not able
Speaker 1: to participate in the Combine they call someone up. This
Speaker 1: list is final, right. Uh, you know they're not going
Speaker 1: to call anyone up because of injury or anything like that.
Speaker 1: If they were not invited on this initial list. Uh,
Speaker 1: they're not gonna have any changes to him. Yeah, sure aren't.
Speaker 1: That's again that's Uh. I'm always interested though, And real
Speaker 1: quick though, talk about the Middle Tennessee. We know this. Uh,
Speaker 1: this team is a lot about safeties. Talk about the
Speaker 1: Middle Tennessee safety. He got snubbed in this uh, in
Speaker 1: this process as well. He did another Senior Bowl guy,
Speaker 1: Kevin Byrd. I was I thought, you know he was.
Speaker 1: I thought he's draft the Bowl. Uh, and so a
Speaker 1: player I'd like to see at the Combine. Uh. He
Speaker 1: had an okay week in mobile. Um, you know, he
Speaker 1: had a tremendous career at at Middle Tennessee. A career
Speaker 1: leader in interceptions, career leader interception yards. Uh, he was
Speaker 1: a playmaker. He had he had good tape. Alabama tape
Speaker 1: is good exactly exactly, So a player that I don't
Speaker 1: think stands out an you know, he's not the fastest,
Speaker 1: not the biggest, not the strongest, but he's able to
Speaker 1: be consistent because he I think he trusts what he
Speaker 1: sees and he reacts well, and he's he puts himself
Speaker 1: in the position to at least attempt to make a play.
Speaker 1: So I'm in the fifth round, yeah, and he still
Speaker 1: might go. Everything everything you said about the player I
Speaker 1: totally agree with. And again I find it hard that
Speaker 1: they would not put a guy in, you know, fifth
Speaker 1: round type of a player that to do that based
Speaker 1: on the numbers we're getting from Dane, Like, there's gonna
Speaker 1: be some he's gonna get drafted, And I mean, you're
Speaker 1: wrong if honestly you look at it, and I know
Speaker 1: some of these teams they don't see Kevin Byard or
Speaker 1: you know, one of these other guys on the Combine list,
Speaker 1: and they're okay with it because you know, it's all right,
Speaker 1: we'll hide him. Yeah, you know he's not gonna be
Speaker 1: on this big stage working out in front of all
Speaker 1: thirty two teams. We know will be at his pro day.
Speaker 1: We know we like the kid. We don't need to
Speaker 1: see him at the combine. You know, it's okay that
Speaker 1: he's not here. We maybe hide him a little bit.
Speaker 1: Maybe that's a few less teams that will consider drafting him. Okay, well,
Speaker 1: i'll tell you what. We're gonna take our first break
Speaker 1: of the day and then come back. We're gonna answer
Speaker 1: a few Twitter questions for Twitter on the twenty and
Speaker 1: then I want to get into some of these players
Speaker 1: that we talked about, Like in mayok had his top
Speaker 1: five pier position. Maybe we go through some of those,
Speaker 1: maybe how we see that different. But also some guys
Speaker 1: though down in the middle of this board. So we
Speaker 1: will be right back from the SWBC mortgage studios in
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Speaker 1: the Dallas Cowboys dot com Draft showy back here at
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Speaker 1: salary for this weekly show. Um want to get into
Speaker 1: now staple that we've had for three years now again.
Speaker 1: I always give ed K. Hill credit for this one, Eddie,
Speaker 1: and I'll turn the show over to you Twitter. Twit
Speaker 1: help me. What do you got. Let's let's go quick
Speaker 1: so we can get okay. Um. Actually this is a
Speaker 1: really timely one from Arthur based on what Dane was
Speaker 1: saying right before the break. Uh more stock in take
Speaker 1: more seriously, I think I know the answer to this.
Speaker 1: But combine or Pro Day more important to you as
Speaker 1: an evaluator, Well, I think it's they're different. With the combine,
Speaker 1: we see everyone on the same level playing field. You know.
Speaker 1: It's when when you go to different pro days and
Speaker 1: campuses you have to worry about you know, the wind,
Speaker 1: the track at the field surface, and there's so many
Speaker 1: of those things that variables they have to kind of
Speaker 1: factor into your times and different things like that. At
Speaker 1: the combine, it's all uniform. It's all everyone's jumping at
Speaker 1: the at the same uh you know, same drill and
Speaker 1: same same every same height for the vertex, same management
Speaker 1: for the you know, it's all set up already for you. Exactly,
Speaker 1: so it's a little more consistent uniformed exactly. So I think,
Speaker 1: you know, for me, that's really beneficial because you can
Speaker 1: look at the combine numbers and you know, it's apples
Speaker 1: to apples compared to pro days, where you do have
Speaker 1: to factor in some different things. I think a pro
Speaker 1: day is important though. If a kid doesn't do well
Speaker 1: at the combine with a top definitely, you know, so
Speaker 1: the way the way, and we're all veterans of this combine.
Speaker 1: We've seen them push and pull and do this. Players
Speaker 1: don't get any rest. It's a very difficult three or
Speaker 1: four days for them. And the fact that they can
Speaker 1: maybe run a better time at their school always gives
Speaker 1: me a little bit of psychological help. People are clearly
Speaker 1: listening to us because we've talked about this. So Steve
Speaker 1: wants to know deepest position in this draft besides defensive tackle.
Speaker 1: Two positions I think stand out to me linebacker yep,
Speaker 1: and wide receiver. That's fair, and I think we've been
Speaker 1: spoiled the last two years with the wide receiver classes.
Speaker 1: Two years ago is amazing, last year is really good,
Speaker 1: and this year is really good as well. And we
Speaker 1: might only have one wide receiver draft at top twenty,
Speaker 1: top twenty five this year Laquon Treadwell. But then the
Speaker 1: second round there's like seven or eight guys. You got
Speaker 1: to consider it your luck sorting that at right exactly.
Speaker 1: So I think wide receivers a pretty deep group. And
Speaker 1: why I think we could see Treadwell maybe slip to
Speaker 1: the teens because you know, if you don't keep that
Speaker 1: receiver in the first round, you're gonna have a lot
Speaker 1: of options in the second round. So even if Treadwell
Speaker 1: doesn't go to the teens, I don't think it's Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think it's less about him, more about you can
Speaker 1: get a later. Cornerback is another one for me. Corner
Speaker 1: Cornerbacke And depending on exactly depending on if you like
Speaker 1: Hargraves and Alexander Shorter guys there they'll be the top guys.
Speaker 1: And then but you can look at Robertson Apple, Howard,
Speaker 1: William Jackson, Mills candidate. I mean there's a list of
Speaker 1: guys that I'm just talking that we're second, third round
Speaker 1: type of guys. I think this thing goes down. I
Speaker 1: mean I've got a guy like, uh, you know, Harlan Miller. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've got him like a fourth round He's a top
Speaker 1: one hundred, Yeah, top one hundred type of players, So
Speaker 1: there's some depth I think in the cornerback spot as well.
Speaker 1: I'm a little surprised at least to hear you say linebacker,
Speaker 1: because I mean, I'm like, we're fixated on Jack. Obviously
Speaker 1: Smith is there, but he's hurt. And then maybe Darren Lee.
Speaker 1: I know you've got him pretty highly rated. But after
Speaker 1: oh yeah, wow, that's all. I totally forgot about Reggie.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I feel first round guy exactly like once
Speaker 1: you get past the elite guys that won't be there
Speaker 1: in the second round. I haven't heard a whole lot
Speaker 1: of talk about Deon Jones. I mean there's some guys
Speaker 1: that are like middle undersize to me, Jones brothers a
Speaker 1: coup with guys that are really good football players. But
Speaker 1: where do you take him, right? I mean that to me,
Speaker 1: where do you feel comfortable? Day two? I think we're
Speaker 1: gonna see something. Joshua Perry from Ohio stage a lot.
Speaker 1: I think he's a three down player. He's just a
Speaker 1: Day two guy. Uh you know he mentioned brothers Dion Jones.
Speaker 1: I yeah, he's in that third round mix. Jordan Jenkins. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's where we need to separate the pass rushers
Speaker 1: from the off ball line. But I think of him
Speaker 1: more as a defensive end in mind seven pounds and
Speaker 1: then you know, like like guy like Scooby. Right. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm not high him and I don't think you are either,
Speaker 1: but I think he's gonna end up going somewhere in
Speaker 1: the third round. So you know, I think these linebackers
Speaker 1: are It's not not the deepest group, but I think
Speaker 1: you'll be able to find starters outside the first round. Okay,
Speaker 1: and well, which is now that's something I want to
Speaker 1: look into because if Jack isn't the guy, you still
Speaker 1: probably need lineback I mean, especially if you don't bring
Speaker 1: back another one that meaner to see at the combines.
Speaker 1: Antonio Morrison from Florida, a player who pops off the tape,
Speaker 1: but he's had some knee issues. I really want to
Speaker 1: see what the doctors say at the combine with his knees.
Speaker 1: Aaron wants to know for the Cowboys more important to
Speaker 1: you and this is I mean, obviously it's February. Knows
Speaker 1: there's been no signings or cuts or anything. Defensive tackle
Speaker 1: or cornerback more important to you going into this draft,
Speaker 1: I think for this team. Yeah, I answered the question
Speaker 1: on Twitter this morning. I think someone asked me just
Speaker 1: on the side, and I felt like that with the
Speaker 1: situation with Clayborne and then also potentially car Looming, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, and then it's really just Scandrick now, and
Speaker 1: then do you want to you're gonna play You're gonna
Speaker 1: play Jones at corner or you get to draft potentially
Speaker 1: draft Ramsey Danny and I seem to think that Ramsey
Speaker 1: would be a better safety, you know, you know, so
Speaker 1: I mean, but the Cowboys very well might think that
Speaker 1: he's a corner. Excellent somebody asked me this too, just
Speaker 1: a very excellent chance to say this here, which I mean,
Speaker 1: the Cowboys don't have a draft board yet, you know,
Speaker 1: we are at all they Jalen. They might love Jalen Ramsey,
Speaker 1: they probably do, but there's no there's not gonna be
Speaker 1: a draft board March or April. I had a scout
Speaker 1: and I walked into work the other day when that
Speaker 1: all that news came out about him being Ramsey being
Speaker 1: the top on their draft board, and the scout looked
Speaker 1: at me and says, when do we get a draft board.
Speaker 1: They don't do we do we have a draft board. Now.
Speaker 1: They don't pay that thing together until what a month
Speaker 1: before the draft exactly. Yeah. So ye, like for those
Speaker 1: of y'all thinking that there's just these names on a
Speaker 1: board right now, it's way too early for that. Well, now,
Speaker 1: if Tony would have come out and said, and it's
Speaker 1: Tony Pauline right as he's in Tony's great Tony's he'd
Speaker 1: have come out and said, Ramsey's a top rated player
Speaker 1: they have. If he would have come out, and if
Speaker 1: he wouldn't use the word board, because board tells me
Speaker 1: you've already put your names up there, and he is
Speaker 1: the number one player in the stack, right, that's what
Speaker 1: that's where. But I completely believe that he's the guy
Speaker 1: that they think them most highly of out of all
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't have a problem thinking that right now,
Speaker 1: he's there a top five player. Yeah, he's a top
Speaker 1: five you know. And you start talking again and I
Speaker 1: keep saying this, you know, we might think he's a safety,
Speaker 1: they might think he's a corner. There's a lot of teams.
Speaker 1: I say, three quarters of the teams want to keep
Speaker 1: my corner. Yeah, I want to because they I've talked
Speaker 1: to some clubs that play the same schemes as the Cowboys,
Speaker 1: and they're selling him as a big, a big range corner.
Speaker 1: They want the next Richard Sherman. Yeah, that's what everyone
Speaker 1: wants anyway. Tell you what he's gonna Ramsey's gonna blow
Speaker 1: up the combo. I mean, this is a guy that
Speaker 1: could train for the Olympics if he wanted to, and
Speaker 1: a long jump and a few other drills. I think
Speaker 1: he's gonna test really well. And for his size, I mean,
Speaker 1: Tony might be right when they set their board well
Speaker 1: and how boys will be lucky if he's there at
Speaker 1: for and he might not even be. He's gonna he's
Speaker 1: We don't talk about defensive backs as contenders for the
Speaker 1: number one overall pick. And I said this over the
Speaker 1: summer when I was I was working on him. I
Speaker 1: took him flak for it. He's worthy at the number
Speaker 1: one overall pick because if you take what you want
Speaker 1: in a linebacker, a safety, in a corner, and you
Speaker 1: combine it in the one player I think you get,
Speaker 1: you have Jalen Rams. It's this why we like Miles
Speaker 1: Jack too, because of all the combinations of things playmaker, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean well yeah, and the sheer variety of things
Speaker 1: he can do, right, I mean you're not you bill
Speaker 1: him as a linebacker, but he can handle like two
Speaker 1: or three other roles. There's so many things. There's people
Speaker 1: will fight you on the fact of the lack of experience.
Speaker 1: People will fight you on that. Sure, they'll say twenty
Speaker 1: five games. Jim Moore, his coach, even said that. So,
Speaker 1: I mean that piece of the puzzle. I mean you
Speaker 1: have to factor it in somewhat. I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: it's just like Carson Wentzet the factor in that uh,
Speaker 1: you know, only a two year starter and most of
Speaker 1: every start except for one was against FCS competition. As
Speaker 1: part of the puzzle that you have to you know,
Speaker 1: factor into these guys. It's it's it's what makes scouting, Uh,
Speaker 1: You're really enjoyable for us because it's you know, you
Speaker 1: have to pop the hood, figure out what's going on.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna take some time before we go to Indie
Speaker 1: and just write down some notes about what the storylines
Speaker 1: are right now, you know, and see how it changes.
Speaker 1: We have a great opportunity we would go to Indie.
Speaker 1: We get to do our draft shows, every night to
Speaker 1: kind of wrap up today. But the fact that you
Speaker 1: get to sit down and we're gonna get to visit
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you know, we get to visit with UH,
Speaker 1: with these UH, these linebackers and Blair and you know,
Speaker 1: you know, you can can get a little bit idea
Speaker 1: what kind of kids they are. One more thing about
Speaker 1: talking about Jalen Ramsey and what position is he. I
Speaker 1: think that's one of the biggest thing with scouting UH
Speaker 1: is fit because a player can you know, be an
Speaker 1: NFL starter for one team and then struggle to act
Speaker 1: to starting lineup in another because this team understands how
Speaker 1: to use him while this other team doesn't. You know,
Speaker 1: dem Buchan and out of Washington State, I did not.
Speaker 1: I didn't know. I'm with you on that. I didn't
Speaker 1: have him in the first few rounds. Arizona takes the
Speaker 1: first round and he's playing really well for them. About it, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the way they use him, they identify his strengths and
Speaker 1: they use them in that way. But if he goes
Speaker 1: to another team and they try to pigeonhole him as
Speaker 1: you know, a deep safety or you know whatever, he's
Speaker 1: not going to be a successful I think there's a
Speaker 1: lot of guys like this in this class and thought
Speaker 1: with Jeremy Cash and Suet Cravens, Miles Jack. I mean,
Speaker 1: you have to use them to their strengths to get
Speaker 1: the most out of them. And for a guy like
Speaker 1: Miles Jack, that's not hard to figure out what his
Speaker 1: strengths are, but so much about the draft process and
Speaker 1: where they end up in their rookie years and how
Speaker 1: they progress his NFL pros. It's they're fit and how
Speaker 1: coaches use them. So uh, it's just it's something to
Speaker 1: watch with guys like Ramsey and Jack and see where
Speaker 1: they land and how that could project to you know,
Speaker 1: whether or not they have instant success in the NFL.
Speaker 1: We want to keep going or okay, all right, I'll
Speaker 1: give you one, right, all right, I got too quick,
Speaker 1: quick quick Trevor. And you know, Elliott's the first round
Speaker 1: running back Trevor. Uh, he's got Booker, Collins, pro Sie
Speaker 1: and Dixon. We've talked before about the log jam at
Speaker 1: running back, kind of like y'all said with receiver. Yep,
Speaker 1: how do you see that playing out? It's it's interesting
Speaker 1: because you know, different you talk to different people, they
Speaker 1: have different preferences for these second round guys, and we've
Speaker 1: seen in the last few years. Uh you know Bishop
Speaker 1: Sanky coming off the board. I think he was the
Speaker 1: first running back, you know, two years ago in that
Speaker 1: second round. Uh you know, just different teams like these,
Speaker 1: different running backs and differi style, different styles exactly. Uh.
Speaker 1: You know, we look at this year with Derrick Henry,
Speaker 1: uh with he didn't mention Derrick Hendry, Right, No, Well,
Speaker 1: depending on who you talk to, he's must be following
Speaker 1: me on Twitter. He's either number thirty four or number
Speaker 1: eighty depending on who you ask. Yeah. So well we'll
Speaker 1: get into that. We'll talk about some of these backs
Speaker 1: coming up though, But I I I totally agree with
Speaker 1: you on the how you see these The wild card
Speaker 1: guy to me is procise. Yeah, you know he hasn't.
Speaker 1: This is gonna sound funny because here I want to
Speaker 1: take a guy in Jack who hadn't played a lot
Speaker 1: of plays, and I'm gonna turn around, I'm looking at
Speaker 1: pro Sis. It's only Billy'd been a running back from
Speaker 1: one year yeah, and not even a year. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: mean he moved in the running back before yeah, and
Speaker 1: and so, but there's just something intriguing about him. Now,
Speaker 1: I agree with the Dixons, the Bookers. I agree with that,
Speaker 1: but there's something very intriguing to me about Procis and
Speaker 1: what he could do for a team. He's a physical dude.
Speaker 1: I like him. Yeah, and he's a little too big
Speaker 1: at time six one, two twenty and he's a big
Speaker 1: target for defenders to hit. He's got something to him there,
Speaker 1: He's got he has that something that that to me
Speaker 1: that Henry doesn't have. Yeah, that the go. He doesn't
Speaker 1: need an airport running, he doesn't need a runway out
Speaker 1: there DFW to get quickness and that second birth to
Speaker 1: go there you go. All right, I'm gonna try to
Speaker 1: keep this on track this one, Brian, I think don't know.
Speaker 1: This seems like a dumb question on the surface, but
Speaker 1: I don't think it is. Free agency hasn't happened yet.
Speaker 1: Obviously there's pieces of every team that are going to
Speaker 1: come together that aren't there right now. Mike wants to know,
Speaker 1: how does that affect your draft strategy? I mean, for
Speaker 1: you know, for instance, let's let's say they signed two
Speaker 1: defensive ends in free agency. Your defensive end position still
Speaker 1: looks a lot better than than it does now. Does
Speaker 1: that affect your desire to take Bosa or you know,
Speaker 1: yeah and whoever. I mean psychologically it would. But if
Speaker 1: but you have to give these guys their due, you
Speaker 1: if both, if you owe it to yourself, whoever your
Speaker 1: top players are, if you great, great, great, the great
Speaker 1: the position, put the board up. You've got some guys signed.
Speaker 1: People get tired of me saying this a learner from
Speaker 1: Ron Wolf there with the Packers. It just add another player,
Speaker 1: you know, if you feel good going to add another player,
Speaker 1: if Bosa is your best player, do you feel like
Speaker 1: long term, Maybe these free agents aren't the long term.
Speaker 1: Maybe they buy I'm fished for a couple of guys. Yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe it's not. Maybe it's a one. Maybe it's a
Speaker 1: Jeremy Mincy. You know, if you go out and get
Speaker 1: if they go out and get the Miami Dolphin, they
Speaker 1: get that kid Vernon or somebody. Let's say they don't
Speaker 1: bottom fish. Let's say they get a real then it's
Speaker 1: a little bit different. But this team tends to bottom fish,
Speaker 1: that's true. And when they bottom fish, I'm not thinking,
Speaker 1: I'm thinking bridge players. They're in mind to have more
Speaker 1: caps face this year than they've had. Absolutely, we wrote
Speaker 1: about this morning the mailback. They lessen a million dollars
Speaker 1: of dead money. It's unbelievable. They have got fishing on
Speaker 1: the mind. Yeah watch me, but you know to me
Speaker 1: Mincy the bridge player, right, it helps Bosa walk over
Speaker 1: the bridge to get into the job. Or Randy Gregory,
Speaker 1: I feel you. I think, I mean, we don't know
Speaker 1: what's gonna happen. They could free up a decent chunk
Speaker 1: if you go, if you go big time and you
Speaker 1: go out and spend money, and you go out and
Speaker 1: get one of those affect your draft you got and
Speaker 1: you go out get Miller. You got to get the
Speaker 1: running back milk. Then all of a sudden, I'm like,
Speaker 1: you know what, I love pro Sie, but guys, she's
Speaker 1: gonna go play somewhere else. Ye sure, you know it's
Speaker 1: psychologically you up. Does that affect your board though? Like
Speaker 1: do you move pro Sie down your board? Put your
Speaker 1: board up? Put your board up? Okay? Good, yeah, all right, good,
Speaker 1: all right? Uh god, I want to get into I
Speaker 1: want to get into. Uh like, say Mayok put out
Speaker 1: his top five per position, and I wanted us to
Speaker 1: talk about our top five per position, and uh, I'm
Speaker 1: sure we can you know, I know that you could
Speaker 1: go on and NFL dot com and look at his
Speaker 1: his list. But with our group, I want to talk
Speaker 1: about what we would have. And I'm just gonna go
Speaker 1: through and this position. Again. You can go and look
Speaker 1: at Mayo. There's some things that you know that I
Speaker 1: don't agree with him about, and that's fine. He probably
Speaker 1: wouldn't agree with mine. But I want to put out
Speaker 1: our top five by position, and and Dane Um and
Speaker 1: Dave you can chime in. You've seen somebody, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: well I'm gonna let y'all do the heavy lifting. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're gonna but but but feel free, Dane, we talk
Speaker 1: about these wide receivers. Yeah, give me your top five
Speaker 1: wide receivers on your board right now. And then if
Speaker 1: we have a little time, then maybe a guy down
Speaker 1: the line that you're kind of you know, maybe you're
Speaker 1: six or seventh or eighth guy Treadwells one. I think
Speaker 1: we both agree there. Uh, I think we disagree at
Speaker 1: number two right away. Corey Coleman to me, I I
Speaker 1: use some fun discrepancy here, not the biggest, but uh,
Speaker 1: the dude's explosive. And Corey Coleman, I know you watch
Speaker 1: him on tape and he's it's unchallenged routes. He's running
Speaker 1: basically four rountes. That's it, right, and so there's a
Speaker 1: projection there, but there's just too much skill level for
Speaker 1: me to believe that he uh, you know, you won't
Speaker 1: be a big time player. I think Corey Coleman's the
Speaker 1: second one, second wide receiver. Michael Thomas is three. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Michael Thomas is two for me. Okay, he's three for me.
Speaker 1: So we are we're right there with him like first early, second, right, um,
Speaker 1: and then four I'm I'm know I'm ahead of I'm
Speaker 1: not ahead, but different than a lot of people. Farall
Speaker 1: Cooper from South Carolina's my number four wide receiver. I
Speaker 1: see a Randall Cobb type. I think he can be
Speaker 1: an impact player for you in different ways that fifth spot.
Speaker 1: This is what I struggle with because this is we
Speaker 1: talked about wide receiver being a deep class. My fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth.
Speaker 1: I mean they're all very close, very close, and so
Speaker 1: you know we're talking about Rashad Higgins from Colorado State,
Speaker 1: Will Fuller, Dockson TCU, Sterling Shepherd, Braxton Miller, Tyler Boyd
Speaker 1: and these guys are all closely rated in that second round.
Speaker 1: It's hard. I mean it's kind of like, you know,
Speaker 1: what kind of wide receiver do you want? In terms
Speaker 1: of you know, who's gonna be your fifth guy? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would go. My order would be Treadwell Thomas at two.
Speaker 1: I love this description. I went Dockson at three. I
Speaker 1: went Kenny Lawler from cal as number four and Braxton
Speaker 1: Miller as number five. I'm gonna get you guys to
Speaker 1: like Lawler one day. Where do you have where you
Speaker 1: have Corey Coleman. I don't have Corey Coleman. I don't
Speaker 1: like his I don't like ninth on here you got
Speaker 1: him as a third round? Great, Yeah, I don't like his.
Speaker 1: His lack of heights scares me about five nine and
Speaker 1: a half. Yeah, I mean you're not wrong. So again
Speaker 1: I just feel like though that to me a little
Speaker 1: bit bigger receiver. I know a lot of people like Coleman.
Speaker 1: That's just me, you know, But I wanted to get
Speaker 1: into that. Okay, let's talk about let's go with offensive
Speaker 1: tackles here. I've skipped out well I shouldn't skip over
Speaker 1: the tight end, so I've only done four myself. But
Speaker 1: who is your who? Is your give me your just
Speaker 1: give me your tight ends and if you could real
Speaker 1: quick hunter, Henry, He's not gonna give you much as
Speaker 1: a blocker, but as a receiver, he's not gonna drop
Speaker 1: the ball. And he has rod acceler I agree with
Speaker 1: you on that. He's at two for me. Second round.
Speaker 1: Nick Vannette was my number two tight ends, better all
Speaker 1: around player and your Bowl guyner Bowl guy three. I
Speaker 1: have Duarte us UCLA. Okay, you didn't play him at
Speaker 1: wide receiver. We watched him last night. I play wide receiver,
Speaker 1: plays slot. I've got him slide at at tight end. Okay,
Speaker 1: he's twenty five six two, and I think he's gonna
Speaker 1: get a little bigger. I think you can do some
Speaker 1: different things with them, so you know, put him in
Speaker 1: the backfield, do some different things. Duarte's and my number
Speaker 1: three tight end Austin Hooper from Stanford a really vanilla guy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but and sometimes that's what you need or you know,
Speaker 1: and talking fourth round, that's not a bad player. Fifth, fifth,
Speaker 1: and sixth are kind of very closely rated. Henry Krieger
Speaker 1: Kobel from Iowa, another senior Bowl guy, and then Tyler
Speaker 1: Higby from Western Kentucky should have been at the Senior Bowl,
Speaker 1: but an injury kept him mouth. The injury is really
Speaker 1: keeping him from being a lock top five tight enda
Speaker 1: Geral Adams does nothing for you at all. I like
Speaker 1: him in the later rounds, but besides going down the scene, yeah,
Speaker 1: it doesn't give him much. Okay, offensive tackle obviously, Larry
Speaker 1: Tunsel number one. Who is the best player in this
Speaker 1: draft in my opinion, Ronnie Stanley is my number two.
Speaker 1: Taylor Taylor, Decker three, Decker two and Stanley three, and
Speaker 1: that's you won't be the only one. I think some
Speaker 1: teams around the league will have that as well. Different
Speaker 1: very different players. Four of Conklin, Ryk and State is
Speaker 1: that your number five? And then number five Sean Coleman,
Speaker 1: Jason Spriggs, those two guys in that mix. Spriggs, I
Speaker 1: know he was voted the best offensive line with the
Speaker 1: Senior Bowl. He didn't impress me in mom No, you know,
Speaker 1: I think he has the body control the size that
Speaker 1: you want. He can kick slide, but you run right
Speaker 1: at him. You know, Sheldon Day showed that you can
Speaker 1: go right through him. It's kind of the opposite of
Speaker 1: Jack Conklin. You you can maybe go around them, but
Speaker 1: you're not going through Jack Conklin. Right with Spriggs, You're
Speaker 1: not gonna go around him, but you can go through him.
Speaker 1: And so Spriggs I really worry about, you know, him
Speaker 1: translating to the pro game. I don't. I don't think
Speaker 1: he'll be able to start as a rookie. Um, so
Speaker 1: I think that hurts him. And then Sean Coleman, you
Speaker 1: know we know a story cancer survivor, right, but he's
Speaker 1: a from you from Texas A and m first round
Speaker 1: feet everything else. Uh, you know, it's a question mark.
Speaker 1: So I've got him in the third round, but he's
Speaker 1: not my This is where this is where the switch
Speaker 1: is here. I think he I think he's a third
Speaker 1: round player, but he would be my number five guy though.
Speaker 1: Over Spriggs. Real quick, yeah, real quick. We're gonna take
Speaker 1: a break, and I mean you take a break. Let's
Speaker 1: come back. Yeah, let's come back, and then we'll pick
Speaker 1: this back up and hustle through some stuff and get
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Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com Draft Show Swboys. Indeed, we're back on
Speaker 1: the clock here at the Draft Show. Brian broad Us
Speaker 1: Dame Brugler, David Hellman, Kent Garrison, executive producers and you
Speaker 1: out there listening. We appreciate that we were getting into
Speaker 1: our top five. Mike may I put his five out.
Speaker 1: We're gonna put our five out. That's something that is
Speaker 1: you evaluate these players. You can't be afraid to do that. Uh,
Speaker 1: you know, be willing to do the work and uh
Speaker 1: put it out there. And if everybody's willing to do
Speaker 1: the work, you should have some some good disagreements if
Speaker 1: you can with the h with the into the still
Speaker 1: in the offensive line here. Uh, guards is what we're
Speaker 1: looking at right now. Center guards. You can combo him
Speaker 1: if you want, or you can individual him if you want.
Speaker 1: Which one do you got? Let's do individual? Okay, Number
Speaker 1: one couldy white Hair. That's pretty clear cut for me
Speaker 1: this year is Zach Martin. He's not quite as gift
Speaker 1: as his acc but uh that call left tackle moving
Speaker 1: inside to guard, he can start right away, So to me,
Speaker 1: that's not just stay right right. Yeah. Josh Garnett from Stanford, Um,
Speaker 1: you know he's he's kind of in that second round
Speaker 1: range right after Christian Westerman Arizona State needed to everybody
Speaker 1: needs to take a look at your Christian Western player,
Speaker 1: A really good player. Uh really, the you watch Arizona State,
Speaker 1: that offensive line was not very good except for that
Speaker 1: left guard right Westerman is a good player. Denver Kirkland
Speaker 1: junior from Arkansas. I've got him in my top five.
Speaker 1: And then Joe Dahl from Washington State who had a
Speaker 1: pretty nice week at the Senior Bowl. Um, it's another
Speaker 1: college left tackle moving inside. I think he's in that mix. Yeah,
Speaker 1: last night you saw the kid from Boise though. Yeah,
Speaker 1: any thoughts about him? Is he more of a I
Speaker 1: think he's a borderline top one hundred guy at late third,
Speaker 1: early fourth, and he's in the top ten, didn't quite
Speaker 1: make the top five, but he's always going to mess
Speaker 1: up his name, Ohiam Mabou something like that. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're close. Your strength, it's not my strength. They're absolutely
Speaker 1: right about that though. And then also though, did you
Speaker 1: have Alex sanderd All from LSU He was number six
Speaker 1: for me? Um, I like him, don't love him. I
Speaker 1: have got him in the third. Yeah, so don't love him,
Speaker 1: don't let what do you'll like about him? This is
Speaker 1: purely like, No, it's fine, You're you're on the draft
Speaker 1: show for four year player, three year starters playing right
Speaker 1: tackle in college. That's not good for me. I don't
Speaker 1: like that, and you don't want to plug him in time.
Speaker 1: Don't think he play guards? Oh? I mean he could
Speaker 1: play guard for sure, Um, but he you know, he
Speaker 1: just never inspired me with his play. Yeah. And obviously
Speaker 1: you're talking about two different positions, right, he didn't. Actually
Speaker 1: I think he did spend some time at guard. He
Speaker 1: was a guard, yeah, but he never I mean this
Speaker 1: is not Lyle Collins. Obviously, like Collins was a top
Speaker 1: ten prospect. I know he never did anything. And I'm
Speaker 1: always down on the LSU guys. I'm with you too,
Speaker 1: but I get ever, except for Robertson, we'll get to
Speaker 1: that one. How about your centers. I think there's, uh,
Speaker 1: there's a good center class. I think it's a really
Speaker 1: good class. I think all five of these guys could
Speaker 1: potentially start. Ryan Kelly from Alabama's number one fan of his. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think he can be a top forty player. Uh.
Speaker 1: Draft pick Nick Martin number two. There you go there?
Speaker 1: Yea in that late second maybe early third round range
Speaker 1: guard or center. Third. I have Jack Allen Michigan State.
Speaker 1: Well you're preaching right, you're going right down my line.
Speaker 1: Good at fourth Max Turk from USC, I went to
Speaker 1: Missouri kid. He's my number five, okay, so we flip
Speaker 1: them bow him evan, bam, bam. Gotta see one day
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get these names. Just it's okay, But then
Speaker 1: I don't get him right, just the oe does not.
Speaker 1: You wouldn't say bow him there you ever. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's always going to be like an a kind of
Speaker 1: sound always well actually except for Boeing, I guess yeah,
Speaker 1: there you go. That's smart old Yeah, I almost called
Speaker 1: you something else. Yeah, okay, we flipped the Missouri kid
Speaker 1: and and we flipped the USC kid fourth round range
Speaker 1: for yeah, yeah, absolutely, okay. Quarterbacks, all right, now, okay,
Speaker 1: this is I'm curious to hear if you rather want
Speaker 1: to go running back, we do quarterbacks last no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: I want to I want to hear this. Jared Goff
Speaker 1: is my number one, okay, and when my number two.
Speaker 1: But they're touching, I mean I think tags are touching.
Speaker 1: Golf is like nine overall in my board, Wentz is ten. Okay,
Speaker 1: So when when people ask on Twitter, we said when
Speaker 1: the tags are touched. And that's what we mean. You
Speaker 1: could you could go either way right there. And so
Speaker 1: if golf comes off the board, and I'm not too
Speaker 1: upset because I know I can get wentz Um. Packson
Speaker 1: Lynch is my number three. I like Packson Lynch quite
Speaker 1: a bit. I just he's so it's such a projection
Speaker 1: there right, so young in quarterback years that in three,
Speaker 1: three to five years from now, Packison Lynch might be
Speaker 1: the best quarterback from this class. But it's such a
Speaker 1: projection that I'm going with the other two guys ahead
Speaker 1: of them. Okay, and who was your four or five?
Speaker 1: Connor Cook and Hackenburgh. But I mean a lot of
Speaker 1: confidence in Connor Cook. Here he sounded. Did you hear
Speaker 1: how unhappy he grudgingly? I mean, because Connor Cook he
Speaker 1: can start in this league. But he just has a
Speaker 1: to me, has as such a low ceiling. Um. I
Speaker 1: don't see him being this. This impacts every time you
Speaker 1: watch tape and something with Connor Cook, you're watching someone
Speaker 1: else playing, the ball goes flying over someone's head. I go, oh,
Speaker 1: we want we who were watching last night that defensive tackle?
Speaker 1: Thank you? We're watching an Indiana defensive tackle and they
Speaker 1: played State and like, Nope, there was no ball that
Speaker 1: hit a guy on the numbers ever ever, and that's
Speaker 1: why he never hit fifty nine percent completions. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's in his career. Just get him out of here.
Speaker 1: I got Lynch, I've got golf, I got WinCE, I've
Speaker 1: got number three would be a Winch is three, four
Speaker 1: is Hackenburg, and five is Brandon Alec at the High
Speaker 1: Riser right there. I like, I like third and round
Speaker 1: grade on Brandon Allen. Yeah, okay, which, and I'm not
Speaker 1: just doing that because of See I went back and
Speaker 1: watched him and he was the best. There's something. There's
Speaker 1: something there there for those of y'all they're there there
Speaker 1: who are not watching the camera feed. It's weird, like
Speaker 1: I think of us as being on camera. But I
Speaker 1: was listening to last week's show on my phone and
Speaker 1: it's weird like hearing it where it's just audio. Anyway,
Speaker 1: Brian's got this thing broken down by grade by round. Yeah, which, Okay,
Speaker 1: here's the curious thing. I mean, you've you've said before
Speaker 1: you think Cook is a first round pick, right. I
Speaker 1: think he could for a team like like the Texans,
Speaker 1: A plausible at least I hope so, and you, uh,
Speaker 1: Hackenburg maybe too right, you've said maybe, yeah maybe, If not,
Speaker 1: he's going to go in the second round exact. So
Speaker 1: you've got the big three who are all probably top
Speaker 1: fifteen picks, and then your next guy's got a third
Speaker 1: round grade. Yeah. Do you think that that's true? Do
Speaker 1: you think that'll hold up? That's my board, that's what
Speaker 1: you think. That's my asking you. If you really think
Speaker 1: there won't be a I wouldn't put it on that
Speaker 1: paper if I didn't believe that was the case. That's
Speaker 1: this is your opinion. That's my board. But do you
Speaker 1: think that Christian has gone? That's what I'm saying. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: that's my crazy I just I just proved to you
Speaker 1: I don't window dress my board. That's true, but that's
Speaker 1: what I do. So you think that they're you think
Speaker 1: all these highly paid teams to that do this professionally
Speaker 1: their boards. If they do, they deserve to have a
Speaker 1: bad draft as soon as the second rounds over the
Speaker 1: first picking. That third round, I think we're gonna have five,
Speaker 1: maybe six quarterbacks off the board that is the top three.
Speaker 1: This is terrifying to me. This is important. If you're
Speaker 1: talking about the Cowboys. But then again, I'm sitting you're
Speaker 1: doing radio with you too, I might not know what
Speaker 1: the hell I'm talking about. I mean we're saying we've
Speaker 1: all it takes is one team to like a cord
Speaker 1: You no doubt about that. If you look at the
Speaker 1: Cardinals and you know they like a guy like Christian
Speaker 1: Hackenburg or Cardell Jones, a player we haven't talk about,
Speaker 1: I mean they like him the late second, we're gonna
Speaker 1: take him, all right, we gotta move along here, all right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's fast, all right. I mean that's my board. Cardel
Speaker 1: Jones and Connor Cook you got in the fourth round.
Speaker 1: They're both gonna be gone by pick. I don't care, Okay,
Speaker 1: I don't care, all right, I really don't care. It's
Speaker 1: what I watched. Since I watched the tape I've got,
Speaker 1: I've got a four five on Hackenburg fourth fifth, So
Speaker 1: I mean that's when I would he didn't like Hackenburg
Speaker 1: scares the crap out of me. Yeah, talking about mediocre
Speaker 1: players that are gonna go in first teams, busting the
Speaker 1: drafts all the time. What if the Cowboys doing not?
Speaker 1: It's terrified that we don't want to four twelve was
Speaker 1: not fun to cover last year. I don't. Okay, running back,
Speaker 1: we've kind of talked about the running back, so just
Speaker 1: go through the names. Yeah, Zeke clear Cut number one,
Speaker 1: I've got Derreck Henry two, I've got a second round.
Speaker 1: Really okay, okay, all right, that sounded mean. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: I just I'm surprised by your surprise. He's just big,
Speaker 1: that's all he is. It's all he does for me.
Speaker 1: He doesn't have breakaway speed. He needs what he needs
Speaker 1: five yards of space. He had a steam thank you
Speaker 1: Jeff Kavanov with the runaway long all of Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's got impressive stats and stuff because he got more
Speaker 1: carries as a college player than most pro running backs
Speaker 1: ever do like, go ahead and finish, Dame. No, I
Speaker 1: he's what he's coming off, like, he's legitimately coming off
Speaker 1: like what a four hundred carry season in college? And
Speaker 1: I mean, people who love analytics have to hate that. Sure,
Speaker 1: well he's already got stupid mileage on him for twenty
Speaker 1: one Alabama. It's just hate for Alabama. For Alabama, then
Speaker 1: you must not like Kenneth Dixon because he was a
Speaker 1: four year starter and he's got fair I mean that's
Speaker 1: a fair point. But I with Derek Henry, I've seen him,
Speaker 1: you know, make himself small through holes. I've seen him,
Speaker 1: you know, have that breakaway speed, the second level runaway
Speaker 1: from linebackers. He has some quickness to him. He can't
Speaker 1: he's not he's not a big creator, but we've seen
Speaker 1: him do it here in spurts. To me, he can
Speaker 1: catch um all the backfield. He can pass protect. I've
Speaker 1: got a second round grade on him, a solid second.
Speaker 1: I think that's where's gonna end up. Going tast two
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty pounds. He'd better be able to pass protect.
Speaker 1: He does. He does the tape. I mean, where do
Speaker 1: I have him? You have him in the late third round? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, all right, that's okay. He makes some really
Speaker 1: good points, though you know what I'll say this tech.
Speaker 1: I mean, and we've talked about this before. Second round
Speaker 1: is second round, but I feel a lot better about
Speaker 1: him at like sixty than thirty four. Yeah, not drafting
Speaker 1: that thirty four. I agree, And that's why you know
Speaker 1: it's hard always the second round. Wait a minute, now,
Speaker 1: you wouldn't take him with thirty four. Well, no, there's
Speaker 1: a big difference between thirty four. You know, yes, early
Speaker 1: second round, but every second round you're even whatever you're
Speaker 1: about to say, you're wrong. There is a difference. I've
Speaker 1: got to say, Robert Blair or this guy Blair. But
Speaker 1: when you stop, I've got a second round grade on him. Yes,
Speaker 1: but when you stack up all your second round grade, yeah, altogether,
Speaker 1: Henry's not going to be the top second grade you have.
Speaker 1: He'll be towards the five Kenneth Dixon the second round,
Speaker 1: don't I you do? Yeah? Okay, go ahead. So what
Speaker 1: are your top five? I got? I would Elliott, Yeah, Dixon, Booker,
Speaker 1: pro Scis, and Jordan Howard and with in with and
Speaker 1: with the runway leader. This is the sixth guy the UNA.
Speaker 1: I like it, no, because I'm with you on Jordan Howard.
Speaker 1: He's my number three, behind Zeke and Henry and then
Speaker 1: I Booker, Dixon and pro Sys. So I think we
Speaker 1: have the same type s or yea top six, just
Speaker 1: different order. Yeah, we'll see how that all plays out. Okay,
Speaker 1: let's go these defensive ends left and right defensive ends
Speaker 1: got him number one, Bosa, mm hmmm, we're disagreeing. Off
Speaker 1: the top right, off the top, Oh, you got number one.
Speaker 1: I took Spence okay, as a pass rusher, sure, as
Speaker 1: an all around player. Give me Bosa all day, okay.
Speaker 1: And they're liable to take Bosa, and I have a
Speaker 1: problem with it. Spence. I like him as a pass rusher,
Speaker 1: but I just worry about you can run at him.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you can put put him in
Speaker 1: the game and he can't get to the quarterback. Oh,
Speaker 1: he can get to the quarterback if he's playing left end.
Speaker 1: Let somebody else get to the quarterback. It's fine, Bosa
Speaker 1: can control the game. Oh wait a minute. Now, we're
Speaker 1: picking up just a left end at four. I think, like,
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously we're we're gonna need to talk about
Speaker 1: this Bosa guy, which I mean, I have no problem
Speaker 1: with him taking Bosa. I just think you're gonna get
Speaker 1: a really, you're gonna get a good player, not a
Speaker 1: great player. It's early, but don't you just kind of
Speaker 1: think he's gonna be there? Oh? Sure he is. And
Speaker 1: and get ready when they hand that card we're gonna
Speaker 1: have We're gonna be our coverage. Get ready on Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot com. I actually I'm sorry, Dane will be one. Yes,
Speaker 1: I mean it's February is too early for predictions. But
Speaker 1: if Bosa is on the board, I will say it right.
Speaker 1: If bos is on the board of four, on the
Speaker 1: board of five. Actually, here's the thing. I don't disagree
Speaker 1: with you. I don't know that February is too early
Speaker 1: for predictions. If you're days right, if you're if you're
Speaker 1: picking fourth. And that's kind of why I asked that
Speaker 1: question earlier. If they go out and get somebody in
Speaker 1: free agency, maybe then you're not talking about it. Changes
Speaker 1: to play Lawrence on the right side. If you have
Speaker 1: Lawrence over yeah, I don't think boss are primarily a
Speaker 1: left and I think he can do. I want guys
Speaker 1: that can play both, and I think Lawrence and Bosa
Speaker 1: can play both. What about Bosa backing up at tackle too.
Speaker 1: He can do that jump inside. People talk all about sacks,
Speaker 1: and that's fine. You know, will both to be a
Speaker 1: double digit sack artist? I don't think so. But he's
Speaker 1: still it's all about impact. I got. I took a
Speaker 1: lot of grief for saying he's Greg Ellis because of
Speaker 1: the sack numbers he's better. But okay, look at no no,
Speaker 1: no, no no, no, But the sack numbers, look at what
Speaker 1: von Miller. Okay, very different players. Von Miller this year
Speaker 1: he had eighteen twenty sacks he had eleven. Yeah, oh,
Speaker 1: I mean, sack numbers can be deceiving. Von Miller impacts
Speaker 1: the game each snap, but you know, we get focused
Speaker 1: on these sack numbers. At Bosa, he yes, he had
Speaker 1: five sacks. They look at his quarterback, hurries his tackles
Speaker 1: for a loss the tape. He's double and tripled teams.
Speaker 1: He impacts the game on every snap. And so give
Speaker 1: me a guy like that kicking side on third downs.
Speaker 1: I love Joey Bosa. That makes me feel a lot
Speaker 1: better because I'm I mean, and I'm sitting here thinking,
Speaker 1: at least a good player. I listen to you too
Speaker 1: much is the problem, because I'm so he's a good player.
Speaker 1: If you're picking fourth, I want I want what I
Speaker 1: don't want, he and he and he wants he wants sex,
Speaker 1: and okay, if you get but if he can do
Speaker 1: the things he's saying, that's worth it. Who would you
Speaker 1: take other than Bosa at four? Well, I mean top
Speaker 1: four players when you're looking at Ramsey, okay, Jack, okay, Bosa? Right,
Speaker 1: I mean Tonsil's my number one guy, but I'm not
Speaker 1: taking my four Okay, okay, well then eliminate, eliminate him,
Speaker 1: then eliminate for the count, eliminate Tonsil. Right, who would
Speaker 1: you be the most happy with that? Of those three
Speaker 1: you just now? I mean, if I'm sticking to my
Speaker 1: board to be Jack, my number two player, my top
Speaker 1: four players, now I'm excited day Jack Zo Now I'm
Speaker 1: happy about it. I can't argue with that. And actually
Speaker 1: he made great points. I know that tread Will's still
Speaker 1: my guy. But the more we the more we look
Speaker 1: at this, and you've talked about it before, the more
Speaker 1: you realize like the quality of the players that are
Speaker 1: still gonna be there when they pick, It's hard to
Speaker 1: justify a wide receiver there. I mean like you're gonna
Speaker 1: have a pick between probably at least two of those
Speaker 1: three guys, and then you throw in the mix that
Speaker 1: it's highly likely that either it's definitive that one of
Speaker 1: the two of Goff or Wentz will be there, So
Speaker 1: then you throw that into the mix. You's gotta hope
Speaker 1: Cleveland takes wins if because golf in play as as
Speaker 1: anti taking a quarterback at four, as I am, if
Speaker 1: Goff is there at four. I think that has to
Speaker 1: be the guy. But that's just how about those guys.
Speaker 1: K Garrison or executive producer, gave me fifteen more minutes
Speaker 1: of this show, so let's let's good conversation. Sorry, we got,
Speaker 1: we got, and we'll do We'll get through this and
Speaker 1: take one or two calls at the end, but we
Speaker 1: got fifteen more minutes of the show and then we're
Speaker 1: gonna Wenna call it a day. So okay, I've got
Speaker 1: I got Spence Bosa, I've got Shack Lawson as number three.
Speaker 1: I put Ronald Blair at four and Kevin Dott at five.
Speaker 1: Shoot holes in my my deal. I've got Buckner listed
Speaker 1: as a d end. Uh. You know he's gonna be
Speaker 1: different for every team. For some teams he'll be inside.
Speaker 1: I think he's probably best than three four. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: that's kind of why I eliminated, I think exactly. So
Speaker 1: Buckner's on my defensive end board, Shack Lawson or Bosa Buckner. Uh,
Speaker 1: I've got Spence a linebacker, so he's it's a little
Speaker 1: different there. Uh. Your board is primarily reflecting a four three.
Speaker 1: I played a fourth three ski I played a fourth
Speaker 1: three Skime uh, Dodd and then Blair okay five, yeah,
Speaker 1: Blair at five, Yeah, I love you good? All right?
Speaker 1: Six man, anybody taken a fi all more than he's
Speaker 1: he's good. He's just there's no distinguishing trait there. You
Speaker 1: know he's good. Just you watch this white hair maul
Speaker 1: him to the point where he had to move over,
Speaker 1: beat up on that right tackle. But yeah, okay, defensive tackles.
Speaker 1: We got the ones in the three in my scheme.
Speaker 1: Now this is we'll definitely disagree here, just because there's
Speaker 1: you know, you could ask five different general managers. You're
Speaker 1: gonna get to five different orders. I don't think I
Speaker 1: don't think I'm disagree with you here, Okay, go ahead,
Speaker 1: shoot it. Number one, I've got Geron Reid. Yep, he
Speaker 1: disagrees with I disagree with the number two of Sheldon Rankins.
Speaker 1: I have n't was number two. I haven't been number two, okay.
Speaker 1: Three of Candici, I have him number one, okay, And
Speaker 1: he's a top ten talent, Robert him Dici. I like
Speaker 1: what you said about him last week, though, what's that
Speaker 1: he I don't trust him at all? Ye, yeah, it's
Speaker 1: hard to he's top ten talent. But he's not one
Speaker 1: of the top ten football players, doesn't. Yeah, And so
Speaker 1: at some point he's worth it. What's that point? It's
Speaker 1: kind of like Randy Gregory last year. At some point
Speaker 1: he's worth it. But you know where's that? Do you
Speaker 1: be surprised if somebody took him in the top ten?
Speaker 1: Very surprise, top fifteen, very surprise? Really? Is so you're
Speaker 1: saying he pulls a Gregory and false to thirty four?
Speaker 1: Is he the slider? Then? Is he the slider? I
Speaker 1: think back half a round one is where we're gonna
Speaker 1: say it's early and with a guy like this, it's
Speaker 1: it's delicate. We have to, you know, the combine be interesting.
Speaker 1: What do you got who gets picked for? Spence or
Speaker 1: old Man? All right, Spence apostaid old miss you did?
Speaker 1: It's okay. I think Spence is a little more cut
Speaker 1: and dry in terms of his issues. I mean he
Speaker 1: had so you think Spence goes before Kim d Yeah,
Speaker 1: very strongly. That is an indictment on Robert Candici right there. Well,
Speaker 1: it's not just the off field, it's he can be great,
Speaker 1: but how much does he want to be great? And
Speaker 1: if even if you have to ask that question that's
Speaker 1: an issue. I watched three or four games of his
Speaker 1: tape with Brian and like, there's no denying his ability,
Speaker 1: but I just like, I don't, Yeah, you don't. I
Speaker 1: don't see it. Every in thirty three starts he had
Speaker 1: seven sacks, and I just got done saying how Saks
Speaker 1: can be deceiving. But it shows on tape. I mean,
Speaker 1: the production does not match the ability. You talk about,
Speaker 1: and you talk about impacting the play on every snap,
Speaker 1: but I never saw that from me. You see flashes, yeah,
Speaker 1: but there's no consistency, and you just wonder how much
Speaker 1: he loves the game. But again, the talent is so
Speaker 1: great that that's why he's number one for you, he's
Speaker 1: number three for me. So if you just grade the tape, yeah,
Speaker 1: if you just grade the tape and don't know about
Speaker 1: the person, he's not a number. He's not the he's
Speaker 1: not the like. It wouldn't be that. I think you
Speaker 1: said it though, and I'm just trying to clear it up. Though.
Speaker 1: He is a top ten talent, just not a top
Speaker 1: ten football player. I'm not. What scares me is what
Speaker 1: he said, and we need to figure this out. What
Speaker 1: about does he really love football? I don't think that.
Speaker 1: That scares me a little that I hated me. I
Speaker 1: hate saying that about my scout came in and said, hey, Brian,
Speaker 1: I really don't think this guy loves That's like that
Speaker 1: would bother me a top. It's like box material for me.
Speaker 1: I don't want quotes. I don't want dudes who don't
Speaker 1: like football. That's terrible. Well, and it's some guys. Will
Speaker 1: you know he is some guys on this team. You
Speaker 1: know they they they it's a paycheck. Oh, you know
Speaker 1: every team in the league has guys. Exactly. It's fair.
Speaker 1: But what's his value? And that's where you have to
Speaker 1: factor it in at some point the draft. He's worth it.
Speaker 1: But what's that point? Whould you have Billings? My number
Speaker 1: five four is a Shawan Robinson. Five is Billings at
Speaker 1: Billions at three? Okay, is Billings a guy that we
Speaker 1: might see at thirty four? I think? So you've been
Speaker 1: doing a little snooping around with scouts, haven't you. I mean,
Speaker 1: not these scouts, but scouts around these defense It comes
Speaker 1: back to this defensive tackle class. I mean not everyone
Speaker 1: is as high on Billings as a short I think
Speaker 1: a lot. Yeah, and you know he ends up on
Speaker 1: the ground because of that. He the injury this year
Speaker 1: hurt him. I think a little bit um. But when
Speaker 1: you look at these defensive tackles, it's a it's a miss.
Speaker 1: It's different for every team. You look at the defensive
Speaker 1: tackle board in the late first round, early second round.
Speaker 1: That's why I'm not drafting defensive tackle top fifteen in
Speaker 1: his draft. No, I'm gonna get one in the late first,
Speaker 1: early second, especially the Cowboys. You can come away if
Speaker 1: I come away with Bosa and Billings first two rounds. See,
Speaker 1: that's what I was going to ask, you build that
Speaker 1: defensive line, and I think that's entirely possible. Maybe not
Speaker 1: maybe not Billings, but a defense I think. I think
Speaker 1: anybody paired with Billings makes it. You know, the names
Speaker 1: he gave you, whether it's Jack, whether it's Treadwell, whether
Speaker 1: it's you know, whoever it Bosa, whoever it is. I
Speaker 1: do not think you're I think you're pretty happy about that.
Speaker 1: I know it doesn't necessarily work this way, but I can't.
Speaker 1: Isn't it just hard for you to imagine them spending
Speaker 1: back to back like top fifty picks on defensive linemen,
Speaker 1: especially a defense team of Super Bowl. Just did it?
Speaker 1: Rod Marriage say, football teams, I said them, you know
Speaker 1: what if your board I think, I think what's going
Speaker 1: to happen at thirty four? That board's gonna point him
Speaker 1: right that defensive tackle. I'm saying that right now in February.
Speaker 1: Defensive line. I think that's it. And upgrading the defensive
Speaker 1: line helps your corners, it helps everyone else on the defense.
Speaker 1: So absolutely, But who are your six through ten? Real quick?
Speaker 1: Because this defense down class really deep? Yeah? Who do
Speaker 1: you got six or ten? That's that's when you get
Speaker 1: into the Butlers, you get into Austin Johnson, you get
Speaker 1: into Reader Ridgeway as a guy. Robinson, I'm just naming
Speaker 1: the guys. You're You're right about the depth. I don't
Speaker 1: think there's as many three techniques form my scheme, whereas
Speaker 1: I think there's I think there's You love when I
Speaker 1: talk about one time, it's the only thing you ever say.
Speaker 1: I love techniques, Malie Collins, Yeah, technique possibly in a
Speaker 1: third round, Yeah, Sheldon Sheldon Day. Rod Marinelli used him
Speaker 1: as a defensive in Yeah. That. I didn't see that
Speaker 1: one coming. Like Marinelli is gonna be like, no, no,
Speaker 1: we don't need they're not at thirty four. We'll get
Speaker 1: the Notre Dame kid in the four round like that's
Speaker 1: and and then you're interviewing him and you're talking to
Speaker 1: him like this, he's a bargain hunter. That's I mean, Nick,
Speaker 1: how about how about some players. I'm just saying, we're
Speaker 1: lining them up for you. I agree with everything you're saying.
Speaker 1: All I'm saying is I just can't imagine them ending
Speaker 1: that I have a pick on a defensive tackle because
Speaker 1: they haven't done it. Ever. Where do you have Washington,
Speaker 1: Adolphus Washington or ten? You don't like him as much? No,
Speaker 1: that it speaks to the depth of this defensive tackle group.
Speaker 1: He's one of my three techniques though. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I've got a solid two on him. But he's number
Speaker 1: ten on my list because there's guys like Vernon Butler,
Speaker 1: who's a late one, early two, number six on my list.
Speaker 1: So I and Ridgeway is in there. Malie Collins, DJ Reader, uh,
Speaker 1: Chris Jones from Mississippi State, interesting, Austin Johnson, Kenny Clark,
Speaker 1: his defensive tacle classes were pretty okay. Linebackers all right,
Speaker 1: I've got Miles jack one there we go even if
Speaker 1: Jalen Smith was healthy, that's off of the draft show today.
Speaker 1: We'll see you next week. Even Jalen Smith is hell
Speaker 1: mouth on it, it's never gonna happen. Just okay for you.
Speaker 1: Is Jalen Smith healthy? Miles Jack still your one linebacker? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I mean when I watched him both, it was Jack
Speaker 1: and Smith right there again, Tax touch Yu Tauch. I've
Speaker 1: got Spence in that mix as well, and then Ragland
Speaker 1: and Darren Lee my top five. Yeah, where I where
Speaker 1: I got it kind of messed up is with Jack Smith, Raglan,
Speaker 1: and then I had those two three four kind of outside.
Speaker 1: I think they're gonna they could babe say yeah fact
Speaker 1: roll and then uh Ka Korea from Poisey, Yeah, good player.
Speaker 1: Those are my two guys. I got to find a
Speaker 1: spot for them because I think they could play somewhere
Speaker 1: because I know they can rush the passer though too
Speaker 1: so kind of fact will be a nice tight end.
Speaker 1: Tell me about Darren Lee though, because I need to
Speaker 1: do I need to do Darren Lee. He's interesting because
Speaker 1: he's a richer sophomore, came out uh you know, in
Speaker 1: high school is a quarterback and then Ohio State Game
Speaker 1: of scholarship. He was a scout team safety as a
Speaker 1: red shirt. They moved to the linebacker as a freshman
Speaker 1: in two and fourteen, and he's a big part of
Speaker 1: that national title Buckeye team in twenty fourteen. Uh took
Speaker 1: over for Ryan Shazier played a similar role for that
Speaker 1: Buckeye defense at walk out linebacker. UH and he's still
Speaker 1: very young in linebacker years, but UH, the talent is outstanding.
Speaker 1: He's he's in that Ryan Shazier quant Alexander type of mold.
Speaker 1: So late first round is a good spot form. Okay,
Speaker 1: now let's get to the cornerbacks, which can I get
Speaker 1: Do you expect the Cowboys to uh or maybe look
Speaker 1: at defensive backs because I just there's an interesting trend
Speaker 1: here on your board, which is that that's my board,
Speaker 1: But but you pick who to watch. Yeah, So, I
Speaker 1: mean you got some gaps here, you got some positions
Speaker 1: where you've looked at eight to ten guys, you got
Speaker 1: some I mean you looked at a lot of wide receivers,
Speaker 1: and then you've looked at every cornerback and safety in
Speaker 1: the draft. I mean, like, seriously, probably there's more I
Speaker 1: have to do. You've probably done thirty as opposed. I'm
Speaker 1: would tell you what how many I need? I need
Speaker 1: to do some work on that top corner. You've looked
Speaker 1: at about six offensive tackles and you've looked at about
Speaker 1: thirty five defensive backs. It's just just the way the
Speaker 1: board did trying to tell me something. I don't feel
Speaker 1: like you're trying to do. You know, the drill what
Speaker 1: we do. Dane comes in, Katie Kims and Jeff comes in,
Speaker 1: and I let them pick a player. I think you
Speaker 1: have an idea though, No, okay, all right, I don't
Speaker 1: have an idea. Okay, I'm here doing the draft show
Speaker 1: with you. Okay, you like Hargraves, don't you. I have
Speaker 1: a problem with me liking Hargraves. That's that's well, you're right,
Speaker 1: he remember on corner. Isn't he played small? You're right,
Speaker 1: you're right. And you know what? And and that when
Speaker 1: I when I talk about window dressing my board, and
Speaker 1: I had him. He was one of the first guys
Speaker 1: I did and I started, and every time I see
Speaker 1: him on tape now I go, Okay, he's my number
Speaker 1: one corner on the s board, and I need to
Speaker 1: figure that out. And and and in February. I'm admitting
Speaker 1: right now that I that if you if of all
Speaker 1: the first round guys I have, there's eighteen names or so,
Speaker 1: he's the one I have the least amount of confidence
Speaker 1: that I have him in the right spot. Right after
Speaker 1: the season ended, the players were cleaning out their lockers
Speaker 1: and I was talking to Orlando Scandrick about his rehab
Speaker 1: and stuff, and we were just kind of joking around
Speaker 1: for before I left, and I was he said some
Speaker 1: about getting him some help at cornerback, and I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: Hargraves kid, and even maybe we'll get you some help
Speaker 1: in the backfield. And he says, I better not spend
Speaker 1: that high of a pick on a cornerback who's shorter
Speaker 1: than five ten. Yeah, And I go, you're shorter than
Speaker 1: five ten And he goes, I was a fifth round pick. Yeah.
Speaker 1: That's a lot of general managers in the league that
Speaker 1: think the same way. Well, I, I, you know what,
Speaker 1: and that shame on me for growing up in a
Speaker 1: program in Green Bay that did that and that, and
Speaker 1: and I should know better. But if you ask me
Speaker 1: right now who the player I have the I have
Speaker 1: the boast trouble with where he and that and thank god,
Speaker 1: I got seventy something days to change up. I need
Speaker 1: to figure that out well. And it makes it tough
Speaker 1: because Hargraves, you know, not the biggest guy, but he's tough,
Speaker 1: he's competitive, he's smart. You know, the term coach's son
Speaker 1: gets overused, but his dad's linebackers coach for Arkansas, and
Speaker 1: he grew up with the game. He grew up around
Speaker 1: it very just well ingrained in his mind how to
Speaker 1: play the cornerback position. So Hargraves is a good player,
Speaker 1: but he does play small at times. That shows up
Speaker 1: on tape quite a bit. So as a run defender,
Speaker 1: end in coverage. Yeah, and I think that I think
Speaker 1: Mackenzie Alexander's another guy. Clemson It Clemson. You have to
Speaker 1: if you're looking at the you're looking at the top wonders.
Speaker 1: You're saying, whoa wait a minute, there's some guys in
Speaker 1: that second, third, fourth round that have some range that
Speaker 1: are taller, bigger, more physical type players. I have a
Speaker 1: feeling that we're going to see some change, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe somebody waits a little bit longer on those smaller course.
Speaker 1: And that's I get asked all the time about Hardgraves
Speaker 1: at four for the Cowboys, and I'd keep saying, no,
Speaker 1: I don't like him in the top ten, you know,
Speaker 1: because of the size. That really worries me. I think
Speaker 1: he's a first round player though, So I don't disagree
Speaker 1: with you there. Yeah, okay, And so we get to
Speaker 1: go ahead and go through years if you would. I've
Speaker 1: got Alexander one, Hardgraves two, Eli Apple three, Kendall Fuller four,
Speaker 1: and William Jackson five. Okay, I got Richard Robinson in there. Talent, Yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: I agree with you. And I know people are very
Speaker 1: scared about David May's wonderful alma mater who won't play
Speaker 1: football next year because we have budget problems. That's so
Speaker 1: much bold anyway. But anyway, I think I think if you,
Speaker 1: oh it's yourself, folks, to take a look at Richard Robinson, no, yeah,
Speaker 1: and just get an idea where he's it's very likely
Speaker 1: that Richard German effect. But I just love big. Did
Speaker 1: you say you didn't say Xavier Howard? Did Xavier Howard?
Speaker 1: Did you? No? I did not heed my number six guy. Okay,
Speaker 1: I like him, keeping he's number five for me. Keep
Speaker 1: an eye on him, Baylor. Yeah, that's Okay, safety's real
Speaker 1: quick and then we and I'm gonna trying to take
Speaker 1: a couple of calls here before we finish out. Jalen
Speaker 1: Ramsey number one safety, Okay, Vaughn Bell, two, Cash, three,
Speaker 1: and then Darien Thompson, Carl Joseph My four and five. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I went Ramsey, I went Vaughan Bell, I went Carl
Speaker 1: Joseph at three, I went Jeremy Cash at four and
Speaker 1: then kneel the safety from Florida at five is the
Speaker 1: ones I went. So it isn't Joseph is coming off.
Speaker 1: He just got hurt, didn't he. Yeah, Combine, we big
Speaker 1: for him, for him. Yeah again, here's a run hit,
Speaker 1: blow him up. Always around the ball, ball gravitates towards him.
Speaker 1: Really really wanted to see him at the Senior Bowl.
Speaker 1: It's hard to get past the negative plays with him.
Speaker 1: That it's it's a little, it's a little. Yeah. You
Speaker 1: watch this highlight tape, yeah, first round pick. You watch
Speaker 1: the full tape and you see some of these negative plays.
Speaker 1: That's what we're I mean, I still have him in
Speaker 1: the third right because the positives are so good. I
Speaker 1: don't disagree with you, Okay, Uh, we said, thank you guys.
Speaker 1: I appreciate everybody chiming in on that. I hope everybody
Speaker 1: got a little bit of benefit out of that. Ken,
Speaker 1: I promise you thanks for giving us fifteen minutes. And
Speaker 1: can I turned the show over you for a couple
Speaker 1: of calls a week finish. Yeah, our good friend Denny
Speaker 1: in Hawaii has been on hold the whole show. Holy,
Speaker 1: how's your time, Denny? Denny, Aloha? What we do for you? So? Um,
Speaker 1: I have I want the zy two down number four.
Speaker 1: I don't care about you know, because I just think
Speaker 1: his impact will make the most of everybody, right, um,
Speaker 1: but um, I want to you know, I want to
Speaker 1: really sit down Marinelli and you know, really want to
Speaker 1: take read sure you know if he falls, if he
Speaker 1: falls to thirty four, because I think he can protect
Speaker 1: you know, Lee and whoever's a middle linebacker instead of
Speaker 1: you know, because because well I don't know what we're
Speaker 1: gonna do with Rolando McClean, but right like he can
Speaker 1: he can get the push and he can get the
Speaker 1: pressure as a as a number one. And thank you
Speaker 1: so much, a lord, Danny, thank you so much. Appreciate
Speaker 1: that he likes right, Yeah, he's smart, then he's a
Speaker 1: good he knows Ezekiel is an impact player. He'll impact
Speaker 1: your team from day one. I can't disagree with anything
Speaker 1: that he said about the player. It's just when you
Speaker 1: talk about running back, you talked about value. It's tough
Speaker 1: because you're talking about the highest percentage of uh. You know,
Speaker 1: players that can get hurt. Just the guys that touch
Speaker 1: the ball like that. It's so easy for them to
Speaker 1: get hurt. Now, Zeke doesn't have durability concerns from Ohio State.
Speaker 1: But you still just worry about investing such a high
Speaker 1: pick and a player that uh, you know, you could
Speaker 1: be gone on one player and you'd like read a
Speaker 1: lot too, don't you. I do. Yeah, And that's why
Speaker 1: if he's there at thirty four. Yeah, that card in run,
Speaker 1: that card in, we'll talk nicely. Doesn't have a huge
Speaker 1: radius of impact. But that's not much you want them for.
Speaker 1: You want him. He will help help Crawford and I
Speaker 1: didn't help, no question about it. I can't got one
Speaker 1: more in yet, one more Sean and Nova Scotia. You
Speaker 1: got the last word, Sean, go ahead, great, thanks, I
Speaker 1: appreciate you taking my call. A couple. Brian, first off,
Speaker 1: who's your number eighteen player with the first round grade.
Speaker 1: And since it's a grating season and you guys did
Speaker 1: the job with the Cowboys, I think, Brian, you guys
Speaker 1: and the writers did a great job. But I think
Speaker 1: you overvalued them. They weren't really a sea. They're more
Speaker 1: d's and ease. Yeah that's fair, No, that's fair. I totally,
Speaker 1: I totally agree with you. I looked at it. We
Speaker 1: gave I think we gave one player an F and
Speaker 1: that was Joseph randall right, who didn't even finish the year.
Speaker 1: That's uh, yeah, we were probably a little too nice.
Speaker 1: But hey see, I would think my eighteenth player, and
Speaker 1: I brought it up earlier, would be hard Graves. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because that's where I have my biggest question right now
Speaker 1: is does he deserve on my board to be the
Speaker 1: in the first round? What about like your bottom three,
Speaker 1: they're obvious ones that stick out besides Hardgraves that you're
Speaker 1: you're kind of at the bottom of your of your
Speaker 1: first round board. Yeah, do you have a guy that
Speaker 1: you're surprised you have him as a first round I
Speaker 1: mean Decker? I think with Decker, because I don't I
Speaker 1: have deckered Stanley flipped. Yeah, so Decker. No, I'm just
Speaker 1: gonna put that on record. I already told you that
Speaker 1: they'll Decker will get you'll get taken. He's not I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm not window dressed. I think he's a first round player.
Speaker 1: I'm not impressed. Okay, that's fine. That's another player I
Speaker 1: wish you would have thought the Senior Bowl. Yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 1: but yeah, so that's where I think Hargraves is my
Speaker 1: biggest Yeah, question mark right now, and I'll work on
Speaker 1: Decker for you. Okay, we'll see. Well, listen, thank you
Speaker 1: so much, folks for calling in, thank you for the tweets,
Speaker 1: and thank you so much for allowing us to try
Speaker 1: and educate you as we begin this journey, or as
Speaker 1: we've already begun this journey. We've got a show next
Speaker 1: week from the SBbc Mortgage Studios, and then the following
Speaker 1: week we're at Indianapolis, and we'll have shows every day
Speaker 1: from the Combine and Excited. We get there on Tuesday
Speaker 1: and finish up on a Sunday, So every day we're there,
Speaker 1: we're gonna try and have a draft show, so more
Speaker 1: opportunities for you to chime in and hopefully learn a
Speaker 1: little bit more about this NFL Draft. So for my
Speaker 1: buddies and my scouting partners for Dame Burglar, David Hellman,
Speaker 1: for Can't Carrison Executive us, I'm Brian. Thank you so
Speaker 1: much for joining us and we will see you next
Speaker 1: Friday at eleven am Central Time for the Draft Show.
Speaker 1: Have a great day. This has been a production of
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club