1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,000 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You missed in History Class, the production 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:12,960 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hello, and welcome 3 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 1: to the podcast. I'm Tracy V. Wilson and I'm Holly Fry. 4 00:00:16,640 --> 00:00:18,919 Speaker 1: Today we are finishing out our two part are on 5 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:22,279 Speaker 1: the direct the litamide, which caused serious health problems and 6 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: multiple disabilities and at least ten thousand people born in 7 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 1: the late nineteen fifties and early nineteen sixties, so folks 8 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 1: who are in their late fifties and early sixties. Today. 9 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: We're recording this in twenty nineteen. Last time we talked 10 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:36,839 Speaker 1: about the direct itself and how it made it to 11 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,239 Speaker 1: market and how a crisis unfolded after its release, and 12 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:42,840 Speaker 1: today we're going to talk about the response to all 13 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 1: of this, including criminal trials, changes the drug laws, and 14 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 1: debates about the legality of abortion, and how this has 15 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:52,479 Speaker 1: really continued to evolve for the litamide survivors until today. 16 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: This will probably not make much sense if you have 17 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 1: not heard part one. Yeah, you'll be a little in 18 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:01,600 Speaker 1: the weeds. Uh. Again, we mentioned at the top of 19 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 1: the other one at part one that this is, you know, 20 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:06,600 Speaker 1: a little bit more of a serious subject and not 21 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,400 Speaker 1: always the most comfortable discussion, So keep that in mind. 22 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:12,640 Speaker 1: There's still some appalling stuff in the realm of disability 23 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:15,119 Speaker 1: rights in terms of how people have been treated that 24 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 1: kind of thing as well. So after thelidamide was withdrawn 25 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 1: from the market, authorities started reviewing the case histories of 26 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:25,240 Speaker 1: people who were affected by the drug, including children born 27 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 1: with fetal pilidamide syndrome and their parents, and adults who 28 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:32,880 Speaker 1: had developed permanent neuropathy and other nerve disorders. After six 29 00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 1: years of review, the bill of indictment that was delivered 30 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 1: was nearly one thousand pages long. Ultimately, charges were brought 31 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: against nine men who worked at Shami grunenthalogy mb H, 32 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 1: which was the pharmaceutical company that had developed the litamide. 33 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: This included owner and founder Herman Vertz, senior chief scientist 34 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: Dr Heinrich Muchter, and seven other men. They were charged 35 00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 1: with involuntary manslaughter and intent to commit bodily harm, and 36 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 1: their trial began on May seven, nineteen sixty eight. Criminal 37 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 1: proceedings went on until nineteen seventy, with a panel of 38 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:11,480 Speaker 1: five judges hearing hundreds of hours of testimony from more 39 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 1: than three hundred fifty witnesses and receiving tens of thousands 40 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 1: of pages of evidence. Throughout it all, Grunenthal maintained that 41 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 1: it's safety testing on the litamide had met the requirements 42 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:24,360 Speaker 1: of the time and that it could not have known 43 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 1: that the drug could disrupt fetal development. But then, after 44 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,200 Speaker 1: nearly two and a half years, on December eighteenth, nineteen seventy, 45 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 1: the panel of judges dismissed the charges. They did this 46 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 1: with the approval of the prosecution, and Grunenthal was granted 47 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:43,240 Speaker 1: immunity from further criminal prosecution in Germany. At the same time, 48 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 1: the company agreed to establish the Countergone Foundation, funded with 49 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: one hundred million Deutsche marks matched by the West German government. 50 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 1: More than two thousand, five hundred families who had pending 51 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 1: civil cases were pressured to drop their lawsuits and to 52 00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 1: accept this settlement. Ins and the years since this happened, 53 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:06,920 Speaker 1: there have been many allegations of wrongdoing relating to this trial. 54 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:12,080 Speaker 1: In the UK's the Litamide Trust unearthed documents suggesting that 55 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 1: there had been a secret, behind the scenes negotiation between Grudenthal, 56 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:19,160 Speaker 1: the German federal government and the state government of the 57 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:22,920 Speaker 1: state of North Ryan West Failure without any the Litamide 58 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 1: survivors or their representatives present. Journalist Harold Evans reported on 59 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 1: this through The Guardian and Reuter's. According to these reports, 60 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 1: Hermandert Sr. Was at these meetings even though he had 61 00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: been excused from attending the trial for reasons of his health. 62 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: The documents also suggested that State Minister of Justice Joseph Newbarger, 63 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 1: whose department was overseeing the prosecution, had previously been a 64 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 1: partner at Grunenthal's law firm. Yet that would be a 65 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 1: huge conflict of interest. Meanwhile, Grudenthal's website now today maintains 66 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 1: that quote Grunenthal is adamant that there was no secret 67 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 1: deal or other politic interference to halt the trial. We 68 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 1: are not aware of any evidence justifying these claims. The 69 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:09,200 Speaker 1: company's statement goes on to say, quote, the allegedly new 70 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:12,560 Speaker 1: documents were in part wrongly dated, and that the relationship 71 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:17,159 Speaker 1: between them was wrongly described or distorted by the attorneys. Also, 72 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 1: in more recent years, some writers have looked into connections 73 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 1: between Grunenthal and members of the Nazi Party. There is 74 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: a whole conspiracy theory that solidimided was developed prior to 75 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 1: or during World War Two and tested in concentration camps 76 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,400 Speaker 1: that does not appear to be true, but it is 77 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:36,599 Speaker 1: true that various people working at Grunenthal did have ties 78 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:39,240 Speaker 1: to the Nazi Party, which is frankly also true of 79 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 1: a lot of businesses that operated in Germany during and 80 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 1: after World War Two. Regardless of whether these claims about 81 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 1: the trials are accurate, the end result was the same. 82 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 1: The charges against eight Grunenthal employees and its founder owner 83 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:58,240 Speaker 1: were dropped, the company was given immunity from prosecution, and 84 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 1: the Contragne Foundation was a ablished to provide financial support 85 00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 1: to families who were affected by the litamide. The foundation's 86 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 1: operations are governed by German public law and today it's 87 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:12,919 Speaker 1: paying monthly pensions, annual pensions, or one time payments to 88 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:16,359 Speaker 1: people in thirty eight countries. Grunenthal has maintained that this 89 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,719 Speaker 1: settlement was quote widely supported by the parents of the 90 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:23,360 Speaker 1: affected children as well as the general public, but many 91 00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:27,560 Speaker 1: solidamide survivors have said the opposite, Without even getting into 92 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:31,200 Speaker 1: the idea of compensation for the emotional pain and grief involved, 93 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:34,039 Speaker 1: many pensions just have not been enough to support the 94 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 1: basic day to day needs of many people born with 95 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:41,480 Speaker 1: fetal solidomide syndrome. Payments from the foundation have been increased 96 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:44,280 Speaker 1: that a couple of points since it was first established, 97 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 1: and today the maximum is eight thousand, one seventeen euros 98 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: a month. Grnenthal also added an additional fifty million euros 99 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,280 Speaker 1: to the fund into and two thousand nine, but today 100 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:57,840 Speaker 1: the payments from the foundation are coming from the German 101 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: government rather than from Grunenthal. There's also a separate Grunenthal 102 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:06,719 Speaker 1: Foundation that distributes non cash support, like modifying the litamide 103 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: survivors bathrooms and vehicles to make them accessible. That eight thousand, 104 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:15,479 Speaker 1: seventeen euro number might sound like a lot, but living 105 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 1: with fetal the litamide syndrome can be incredibly expensive. Many 106 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: survivors require round the clock care or assistance, along with 107 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:27,839 Speaker 1: multiple surgeries and medications, physical therapy, and devices like powered 108 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: wheelchairs with customized controls and lifts to move a person 109 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: to and from the wheelchair. My mom's powered wheelchair cost 110 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:39,559 Speaker 1: more than my car. Yeah, that's an industry my husband 111 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: worked in for a while, and there were some models 112 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,200 Speaker 1: that I was absolutely mind boggled when I saw the 113 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:49,600 Speaker 1: prices on them. Yeah. So, Apart from whether the financial 114 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 1: settlement itself is enough money, many survivors have described the 115 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 1: process of getting benefits as unnecessarily bureaucratic and difficult. Applicants 116 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: have to document how they were exposed to the lidamide, 117 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:06,599 Speaker 1: including sending their medical records. Applications have to be submitted 118 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 1: in German and there's a life certificate showing that the 119 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: applicant appeared in person. People who don't live in Germany 120 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 1: have to travel to a German embassy or consulate, although 121 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 1: in some countries there are alternate locations that are like 122 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 1: notaries or other other places. That includes in Brazil, Spain, 123 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 1: the Netherlands and Great Britain and Ireland. If an applicant 124 00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:31,000 Speaker 1: is physically unable to leave their home, or if the 125 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: location where they're supposed to appear in person isn't accessible 126 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: to people with disabilities, because that is still an issue 127 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 1: in a lot of the world, the applicant can submit 128 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 1: a certification from their physician. The Linamite survivors and their 129 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 1: families have really criticized Grunenthal's actions and responses to all 130 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 1: of this, including an apology that the company issued on 131 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: August thirty one. The apology was delivered at the dedication 132 00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:00,800 Speaker 1: to a memorial in Stolberg, Germany, and it depicts a 133 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: sculpture of a young girl with fulk amelia wearing prosthetic 134 00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 1: legs as well as an empty chair. Yeah, a lot 135 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 1: of people felt like Grunenthal did not need to be 136 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:12,840 Speaker 1: at that dedication at all, and then at it. Harold F. Stock, 137 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:17,520 Speaker 1: the CEO at the time, delivered this apology translated into English. 138 00:08:17,520 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 1: It's said, in part, quote, Grunenthal has acted in accordance 139 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 1: with the state of scientific knowledge and all industry standards 140 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: for testing new drugs that were relevant and acknowledged in 141 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties and sixties. We regret that the tar 142 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,560 Speaker 1: atogenic potential of the litamide could not be detected by 143 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:35,040 Speaker 1: the tests that we and others carried out before it 144 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 1: was marketed. The statement later went on to say, quote, 145 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:40,439 Speaker 1: we also apologized for the fact that we have not 146 00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:42,960 Speaker 1: found a way to you from person to person for 147 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:46,720 Speaker 1: almost fifty years. Instead, we have been silent, and we 148 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 1: are very sorry for that. We asked that you regard 149 00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:51,959 Speaker 1: our long silence as a sign of the silent shock 150 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: that your fate has caused us. We have learned how 151 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 1: important it is that we engage in an open dialogue 152 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:01,080 Speaker 1: with those affected and to talk and to listen to them. 153 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,200 Speaker 1: We have begun to mutually develop and implement projects with 154 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:07,880 Speaker 1: them to improve their living situation and assist in hardship 155 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 1: situations easily and efficiently. We will continue to pursue this 156 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 1: path in the future. Overwhelmingly, the lidamiters and their families 157 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: did not find this sufficient. Parts of it definitely read 158 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: as though they are saying, we're sorry, but it wasn't 159 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 1: our fault. Exactly. If you go and read their f 160 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 1: a Q and their website, there are a lot of 161 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 1: things on it that kind of make you go, you 162 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: didn't really answer that question, and also you're still saying 163 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:36,600 Speaker 1: it wasn't your fault. The immunity that was granted to 164 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 1: Grunenthal when these charges were dismissed in nineteen seventy only 165 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: applies in Germany. So there have been other court cases 166 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 1: and civil suits in multiple other countries, both against the 167 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:51,960 Speaker 1: pharmaceutical companies that distributed the litamide in those countries and 168 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:55,560 Speaker 1: the governments that allowed them to do it, just as 169 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 1: examples the UK, the Litamide Trust was established as the 170 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:02,840 Speaker 1: Litamide Children Trust in nine seventy three following a settlement 171 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 1: between the Stiller's Company Limited in four nine disabled children 172 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: who had been exposed to the litamide in Canada, A 173 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:14,199 Speaker 1: lawsuit against the litamides distributor there led to cash settlements 174 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:17,120 Speaker 1: and the establishment of a federal fund. The result of 175 00:10:17,160 --> 00:10:19,840 Speaker 1: all of this is kind of a patchwork of programs 176 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:22,800 Speaker 1: and benefits that really vary from one country to another, 177 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:26,360 Speaker 1: with some paying benefits only if the applicant isn't getting 178 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: support from somewhere else. Many programs also require documentation of 179 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 1: the litamite exposure, which in some cases is simply not possible. 180 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 1: One of the things we talked about is that sometimes 181 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: people would share their medications with someone else, probably not 182 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:44,359 Speaker 1: any documentation there. Um. In the minds of many survivors, 183 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:47,680 Speaker 1: it also shouldn't be necessary since outside of the context 184 00:10:47,679 --> 00:10:52,440 Speaker 1: of the litamite exposure, these patterns of disability are incredibly rare. Yeah, 185 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 1: It's like there's sort of a choice between possibly paying 186 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,600 Speaker 1: benefit to somebody who has a similar disability that wasn't 187 00:10:59,640 --> 00:11:03,599 Speaker 1: caused by the litamide, which is incredibly rare, or requiring 188 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: all the litamide survivors to go through this huge rigmarole 189 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: and a lot of effort to get basic support for 190 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: day to day needs. Um. I didn't really write it 191 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:16,360 Speaker 1: in this outline, But there have also been some countries 192 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 1: that have issued formal apologies or have talked about issuing 193 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:24,920 Speaker 1: formal apologies for not regulating the companies that were distributing 194 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 1: the litamide more carefully before and during this whole crisis. 195 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 1: So all of this is really really still ongoing. A 196 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:37,559 Speaker 1: financial support package known as the Canadian the Litomized Survivors 197 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:42,240 Speaker 1: Support Program or ct SSP, was announced on January ninth, 198 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,839 Speaker 1: twenty nineteen, so just this year, with an application period 199 00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:50,840 Speaker 1: running until June. That follows on to earlier programs from 200 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: and this is intended in part to allow survivors who 201 00:11:56,040 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 1: were previously turned down for a lack of documentation to reapply, 202 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: and it's ongoing in another sense as well. The solidamide 203 00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:07,520 Speaker 1: survivors who were born in the nineteen fifties and sixties 204 00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 1: are in their late fifties and early sixties now. Numerous 205 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 1: surveys of survivors in various countries have reported that their 206 00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 1: general health and quality of life are decreasing as they age. 207 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:20,880 Speaker 1: To quote from the result of a survey conducted in 208 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:24,680 Speaker 1: the UK, quote, as the litamide survivors reach their mid fifties, 209 00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:28,079 Speaker 1: they are experiencing a wide range of secondary health problems, 210 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:32,720 Speaker 1: in particular muscular skeletal problems and depression and anxiety, with 211 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: multi morbidity a growing issue. These health problems are having 212 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,160 Speaker 1: a negative impact on their employment. Two fifths are unable 213 00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 1: to work and their physical health related quality of life, 214 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: which is significantly poorer than the general population. Some of 215 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 1: this is exacerbated by the fact that many the litamide 216 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:54,079 Speaker 1: survivors have compensated for missing or shortened limbs by using 217 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:57,640 Speaker 1: their other limbs instead, so for example, using their feet 218 00:12:57,679 --> 00:13:00,760 Speaker 1: in place of hands, and this means that they're particularly 219 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:06,079 Speaker 1: susceptible to overuse injuries, joint issues, and other muscular skeletal problems. 220 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 1: This also means that many thalidomie survivors are needing additional 221 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 1: care and support while simultaneously reaching retirement age or being 222 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:17,480 Speaker 1: unable to work because of their disabilities and health conditions. 223 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:20,160 Speaker 1: And many of those who are receiving support from one 224 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 1: of the Solidamie survivor funds were evaluated when they were 225 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:26,120 Speaker 1: much younger, so they need more now than they did 226 00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: when they were initially approved, and the dollar amounts that 227 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 1: they've been granted have not necessarily been adjusted for inflation. 228 00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:36,359 Speaker 1: Plus some of these funds will only pay for specific 229 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: types of treatments and services, and not for things that 230 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 1: aren't regarded as a medical necessity. But a lot of 231 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 1: thelidamide survivors report that what they actually need the most 232 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: help with is day to day tasks like housekeeping and 233 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:53,920 Speaker 1: personal hygiene, which some funds won't cover. Some funds also 234 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:58,440 Speaker 1: won't cover things that weren't directly connected to the litamite exposure. So, 235 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:02,880 Speaker 1: for example, of fund might pay for prosthetic arms because 236 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,640 Speaker 1: a person's folk amelia was directly caused by the litamite exposure, 237 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:10,439 Speaker 1: but not pay for physical therapy to address an injury 238 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 1: that resulted from using feet in place of missing hands. 239 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 1: We are going to take a short break before we 240 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,560 Speaker 1: talk about some of the changes to disability rights, medicine, 241 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 1: and the law that followed the the litamide crisis. Back 242 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 1: in part one, we talked about how in many parts 243 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,720 Speaker 1: of the world, the first response to newborns who had 244 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:39,560 Speaker 1: been exposed to the litamide was a sense of hopelessness 245 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:44,760 Speaker 1: and recommendations that be placed at institutions. Those attitudes started 246 00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:48,840 Speaker 1: to shift hospitals and other practices that had specialized in 247 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:51,760 Speaker 1: fitting patients with prosthetic limbs, a lot of them had 248 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:56,560 Speaker 1: initially been focused on veterans of wars turned their attention 249 00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 1: to making limbs that were suitable for children. Soon specialists 250 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 1: were working on a range of limbs that were appropriate 251 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 1: for different stages of a child's development, and on new 252 00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:09,360 Speaker 1: types of press dcs that could work with different types 253 00:15:09,400 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 1: of folk amelia. There's obviously still a long way to 254 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: go in terms of accessibility and social attitudes about disability, 255 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: but it was a start. And also, I don't want 256 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 1: us to give the impression that every thalidomide survivor uses 257 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 1: press decies. It really depends on what an individual person 258 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 1: is comfortable with and wants to use and what works 259 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:32,800 Speaker 1: for them. Attitudes about congenital conditions and disabilities also started 260 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: to shift in the wake of the thalidomide crisis. The 261 00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: field of teratology, or the study of malformations during development, 262 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:43,360 Speaker 1: was still very new. It's generally noted as being established 263 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 1: in the nineteen thirties, and before that point there had 264 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 1: not been much research into how a substance or condition 265 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 1: could affect development in uteroone. It had been established that 266 00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:56,560 Speaker 1: some things could negatively affect how a fetus developed, including 267 00:15:56,560 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: a lack of vitamin A or vitamin B, or the 268 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 1: rubella virus. The general public often thought congenital disabilities or 269 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:06,600 Speaker 1: health conditions were brought on by natural forces or were 270 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 1: just random, and there were lots of superstitions and religious 271 00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:12,720 Speaker 1: and spiritual beliefs that were kind of baked into this 272 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: whole idea and muddied the waters a bit. The The 273 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 1: litamide crisis prompted a lot of research into teratology in general, 274 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:24,520 Speaker 1: with the first medical journal dedicated to it established in 275 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 1: the nineteen sixties. I feel like at timelines of of 276 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 1: teratology as a field, a lot of times there's literally 277 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 1: a pre the litamide and post the litamide era in 278 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: the timeline. Researchers started studying which drugs can pass through 279 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: the placenta and what allows them to do that while 280 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,760 Speaker 1: other drugs can't. And then there have also been hundreds 281 00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:51,120 Speaker 1: of studies into the litamides specifically over the decades. It's 282 00:16:51,160 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 1: only been in the last couple of decades that researchers 283 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: have started to figure out exactly what causes the litamides 284 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:01,960 Speaker 1: teratogenic effects without getting too deep into chemistry, because there 285 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 1: are about ten different terms involved. That we would have 286 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:09,240 Speaker 1: to define. This solidimide molecule exists into configurations which are 287 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: essentially mirror images of each other. The one known as 288 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: the R configuration acts as a sedative, the one known 289 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 1: as the S configuration is a tarata gym, and the 290 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:23,440 Speaker 1: R configuration can be converted into the S configuration within 291 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:27,199 Speaker 1: the human body. So even if drug manufacturers made a 292 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:30,119 Speaker 1: very pure version that only included the R type of 293 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:33,360 Speaker 1: the drug, it's still would not be safe during pregnancy. 294 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:37,600 Speaker 1: Research is still ongoing into exactly how the S configuration 295 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:42,880 Speaker 1: disrupts fetal development. I found five different headlines spanning more 296 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,960 Speaker 1: than a decade that each claimed that researchers had finally 297 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: figured it out. This is a thing that's building and 298 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:52,960 Speaker 1: discovering new elements of figuring it out. The most recent 299 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:56,120 Speaker 1: of these came from Dana Farwork Cancer Institute in August 300 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 1: of eight teams, so just last year, according to the 301 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 1: press really ease quote. Building on years of previous research, 302 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:06,120 Speaker 1: the researchers found that the litamide acts by promoting the 303 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:11,440 Speaker 1: degradation of an unexpectedly wide range of transcription factors cell 304 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 1: proteins that helped switch teams on or off, including one 305 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:19,479 Speaker 1: called SAL four. The result is the complete removal of 306 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:23,359 Speaker 1: SAL four from cells. Aside from these shifts in public 307 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:26,399 Speaker 1: awareness and attitudes and the huge growth of a huge 308 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:30,159 Speaker 1: field of medical research, no single drug has had a 309 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:34,680 Speaker 1: bigger impact on pharmaceutical regulations than the litamine. In much 310 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:37,679 Speaker 1: of the world, the pharmaceutical industry was really growing without 311 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:40,280 Speaker 1: a lot of regulations in place in the nineteen fifties 312 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 1: and nineteen sixties. In May of nineteen sixty three, British 313 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:47,159 Speaker 1: Minister of Health Kenneth Robinson said, quote, the House and 314 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,880 Speaker 1: the public suddenly woke up to the fact that any 315 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:55,520 Speaker 1: drug manufacturer could mark any product, however inadequately tested, however dangerous, 316 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,080 Speaker 1: without having to satisfy any independent body as to its 317 00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:03,360 Speaker 1: efficacy and safety. And the public was almost uniquely unprotected 318 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 1: in this respect. So these new laws, and I mean 319 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: they are really all over the world, set much more 320 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:13,119 Speaker 1: specific standards into how drugs had to be tested, including 321 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 1: animal testing meant to confirm whether a drug is safe 322 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 1: during pregnancy before it's tested on or administered to humans. 323 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:25,359 Speaker 1: In places where abortion was illegal, the palidomide crisis also 324 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,920 Speaker 1: became part of debates about legalizing it or adding additional 325 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:32,640 Speaker 1: exceptions to the existing law. In the US, for example, 326 00:19:32,680 --> 00:19:36,159 Speaker 1: abortion was a felony, and usually the only exception was 327 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,720 Speaker 1: if the mother's life was at risk. Along with a 328 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 1: rubella epidemic that was happening at roughly the same time, 329 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:45,360 Speaker 1: the palidomide crisis led to discussions about whether the law 330 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,960 Speaker 1: should be expanded to include exceptions for pregnancies in which 331 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 1: the baby would not be able to survive after being born, 332 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: and there were also people who used the crisis to 333 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 1: support a eugenics argument in the context of abortion, either 334 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:03,280 Speaker 1: to support the idea of allowing abortion for eugenic purposes 335 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:06,880 Speaker 1: or to advocate for keeping abortion illegal because of its 336 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 1: potential use for eugenics. This became national news in nineteen 337 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:14,840 Speaker 1: sixty two. Sherry Chessen was the host of Arizona's locally 338 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:18,720 Speaker 1: syndicated version of the children's TV show Romper Room. Her 339 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:21,399 Speaker 1: husband had brought some medication home with him from a 340 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:23,760 Speaker 1: trip to London, and she had taken some of it 341 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:27,159 Speaker 1: early in her pregnancy with their fifth child. Later, she 342 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 1: read an article about Dr Francis Oldham Kelsey's work to 343 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:33,480 Speaker 1: prevent the litamite distribution in the United States, and she 344 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:35,879 Speaker 1: realized that it was the same drug that her husband 345 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:38,600 Speaker 1: had brought home with him. Chessen talked to her doctor, 346 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 1: who contacted doctors in Europe and then recommended that she 347 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:47,680 Speaker 1: terminate her pregnancy. Chessen later described this decision as absolutely agonizing, 348 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:50,640 Speaker 1: and she was also afraid that the same thing might 349 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,720 Speaker 1: happen to other women, so she told her story to 350 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: the Arizona Republic under the understanding that her identity would 351 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 1: be kept confidential. Chessen's name became public after the hospital 352 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: ultimately turned down her request for an exception and her 353 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 1: attorney filed suit on her behalf. She lost her job, 354 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:11,320 Speaker 1: she got hate mail and death threats, including threats to 355 00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:14,680 Speaker 1: her other children. Chested and her husband ultimately had to 356 00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:18,520 Speaker 1: travel to Sweden, where abortion was legal, to terminate the pregnancy. 357 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 1: Although it's no longer manufactured or distributed by Grudenthal, the 358 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:26,080 Speaker 1: litamide has been reintroduced in several parts of the world 359 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,200 Speaker 1: in the years since it was banned. That's something that 360 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:30,679 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about in just a moment. And 361 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:34,240 Speaker 1: as different regulatory agencies have tried to figure out how 362 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:38,280 Speaker 1: to minimize the risk to developing fetuses, abortion has continued 363 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:41,040 Speaker 1: to be part of this conversation, and that conversation has 364 00:21:41,119 --> 00:21:45,960 Speaker 1: also included the litamide survivors themselves. During advisory committee meetings 365 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,560 Speaker 1: related to the reintroduction of the litamide, Randolph Warren, the 366 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:53,639 Speaker 1: founder of the Lidamide Victims Association of Canada, stressed the 367 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 1: need to consider the possibility of abortion in this context, saying, quote, 368 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:01,240 Speaker 1: people should not be forced to sign anything that would 369 00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: force them to have an abortion should a the litami 370 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:07,040 Speaker 1: be born, because we have some quality of life and 371 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 1: some right to be here. A lot of these questions 372 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:13,080 Speaker 1: about the lidamide and abortion in general are still ongoing 373 00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 1: in many parts of the world today, and we're going 374 00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:17,920 Speaker 1: to talk about the reintroduction of the lita mine after 375 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:29,480 Speaker 1: we take another sponsor break. It wasn't long at all 376 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 1: after the litamides worldwide ban that doctors began discovering that 377 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:36,760 Speaker 1: it could have medical use as an adult patients beyond 378 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:40,360 Speaker 1: being a sedative. In nineteen sixty four, so just two 379 00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:43,879 Speaker 1: years later, doctors at a hospital in Jerusalem gave the 380 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 1: lidamide to a patient who had advanced Hanson's disease, which 381 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:50,880 Speaker 1: is also known as leprosy. This patient was in very 382 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,600 Speaker 1: severe pain and could not rest, so a doctor administered 383 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: some the litamide that he had on hand, basically as 384 00:22:57,359 --> 00:23:01,640 Speaker 1: a last resort. This doctor, j GB chess Can, realized 385 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 1: that that the litamide also treated some of the diseases 386 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:09,480 Speaker 1: symptoms beyond just being a sedative. The World Health Organization 387 00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: conducted a clinical trial of solidamide as a Hanson's disease 388 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 1: treatment in nineteen sixty seven. Today, it's used in some 389 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 1: places to treat your thema a dosum laprosum or e 390 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: n L, which is a complication that causes painful nodules, 391 00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:27,240 Speaker 1: high fever, and inflammation. The litamide is approved for treating 392 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:29,520 Speaker 1: E n L in some parts of the world, but 393 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: the World Health Organization does not recommend it because of 394 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,679 Speaker 1: its teratogenic effects and because there are other drugs that 395 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 1: can treat E n L. Yeah. Even though today hanson 396 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 1: disease can be treated with a very long course of 397 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:46,000 Speaker 1: multiple antibiotics, this complication can happen during the process or 398 00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:49,640 Speaker 1: even afterwards. So even though Hanson's disease is more treatable 399 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,040 Speaker 1: than it used to be, this particular complication still does 400 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: happen for people. Since then, the litamide has also been 401 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,200 Speaker 1: discovered to be effective against a number of other serious 402 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:04,560 Speaker 1: diseases and conditions and complications, including AIDS, wasting syndrome, and 403 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:08,880 Speaker 1: multiple miloma. Because it can inhibit the growth of blood vessels, 404 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 1: it's also effective and cutting off the blood supply to 405 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:16,040 Speaker 1: certain cancers. This has of course been an incredibly difficult 406 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:19,760 Speaker 1: and sensitive topic amongst the litamide survivors in their families. 407 00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:22,720 Speaker 1: In the words of Randolph Warren from an article in 408 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:25,920 Speaker 1: f DA Consumer in two thousand one, quote, we will 409 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 1: never accept a world with solidamide in it. However, we 410 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 1: are forced to prefer licensing of the drugs that disabled 411 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:36,199 Speaker 1: us for compassionate reasons and to prevent uncontrolled access to 412 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 1: the drug. Yeah. I mean, no group of people is 413 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 1: a monolith. People all have their own opinions. But as 414 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 1: a group, the litamide survivors in general have been like, 415 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 1: we're not going to try to stop you from keeping 416 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 1: people who need this drug from having it, but we 417 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 1: have got to protect people. So, for example, when the 418 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,399 Speaker 1: US was trying to set standards for prescribing the litamide 419 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 1: for multiple mileoma and hands and disease, Warren and the 420 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,680 Speaker 1: the Linamide Victims Association of Canada were part of that process, 421 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,880 Speaker 1: including attending advisory committee meetings with the Food and Drag 422 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: Administration in the National Institutes of Health. The result from 423 00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 1: all these meetings was the system for the Lidomide Education 424 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,640 Speaker 1: and Prescribing Safety Program known as STEPS, which is now 425 00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: called Risk Evaluation and Mediation Strategy or REMS. REMS is 426 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,000 Speaker 1: very involved, providers have to be certified, and distribution of 427 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:31,880 Speaker 1: the drug is highly restricted. Patients who could become pregnant 428 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:34,439 Speaker 1: are counseled on the risks of the drug. Along with 429 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:39,199 Speaker 1: contraception and emergency contraception. The litamide can also be present 430 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:42,640 Speaker 1: in siemens, so male patients whose partners could become pregnant 431 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: are required to use condoms even if they have had 432 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,159 Speaker 1: a vasectomy or if their partners are using contraceptives, and 433 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:53,160 Speaker 1: this is really just the beginning. Patients who could become 434 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 1: pregnant are required to have two negative pregnancy tests before 435 00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: starting treatment. They must use two forms of birth control 436 00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 1: while being treated, and also take regular pregnancy tests. The 437 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:07,880 Speaker 1: pills are also dispensed in blister packs rather than pill bottles, 438 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 1: so that they can't be confused with other medication or 439 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:15,040 Speaker 1: easily put into an unlabeled container. The pills themselves in 440 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:19,120 Speaker 1: most cases literally have a picture of a pregnant silhouette 441 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,720 Speaker 1: crossed out they're printed on the pill. No more than 442 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: four weeks of doses are dispensed at a time, and 443 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: there are no automatic refills. Unused doses are supposed to 444 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:32,760 Speaker 1: be returned rather than discarded, and there's just a lot 445 00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:37,199 Speaker 1: of follow up and monitoring of patients regardless of their sex. 446 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 1: And this is the standard in the US. So in 447 00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,320 Speaker 1: order to be treated with solidamide, a person has to 448 00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 1: give up a degree of bodily autonomy just to comply 449 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,160 Speaker 1: with all these regulations. That has led to a whole 450 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:51,200 Speaker 1: discussion of medical ethics and what it means for patients 451 00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:54,240 Speaker 1: to essentially just be reduced to being viewed in terms 452 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: of their capacity to have children and how to control 453 00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 1: that capacity, as well as what it means for a 454 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 1: disabled person to be reframed as a problem that should 455 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: be prevented. Yeah, we've we've talked on the show at 456 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 1: various points about disability rights and about the evolving view 457 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: of not thinking of disability as like a bad thing 458 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:16,959 Speaker 1: that needs to be fixed, but instead thinking of society 459 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,119 Speaker 1: is something that needs to change to be accessible to everyone. 460 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:25,960 Speaker 1: The the litamide survivors community has been pretty vocal about 461 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:29,359 Speaker 1: the fact that in their view, this is something that 462 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: happened to them that should not have happened to them 463 00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,119 Speaker 1: and should not happen to anybody else. So it's a 464 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 1: little bit different nuance than some of the other disability 465 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,639 Speaker 1: rights things that we have talked about. And then also, 466 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:42,960 Speaker 1: like we said back in part one of this episode, 467 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: these steps don't necessarily prevent every exposure. Hanson's disease is 468 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:52,760 Speaker 1: really prevalent in Brazil, and the litamide was re licensed 469 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:56,719 Speaker 1: in Brazil for that reason. In n there have been 470 00:27:56,800 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: people born with feetle the litamide syndrome in Brazil than 471 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:04,680 Speaker 1: including in very recent years. After examining the birth records 472 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:08,199 Speaker 1: of seventeen point five million people born between two thousand 473 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:12,240 Speaker 1: five and about one hundred were found to have health 474 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:16,160 Speaker 1: conditions and disabilities that are consistent with fetal the litamide syndrome. 475 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:21,600 Speaker 1: Brazil has similar regulations for dispensing the litamide compared to 476 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:24,040 Speaker 1: what the US does, But the parts of Brazil where 477 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:26,919 Speaker 1: hands and disease is the most prevalent are also the 478 00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,880 Speaker 1: parts where the medical system is the least robust, and 479 00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:32,960 Speaker 1: I mean it would not surprise me at all that 480 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,479 Speaker 1: if there are other countries where the litamide has been 481 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,440 Speaker 1: reintroduced that have a similar situation, but Brazil is where 482 00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 1: the most research has been done. So that's the litamide 483 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,520 Speaker 1: not a story that is confined to the past, as 484 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:49,160 Speaker 1: folks may imagine it from seeing things like Call the Midwife, 485 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 1: which um that plot arc on Call the Midwife plays 486 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:55,160 Speaker 1: out over a long time in terms of episodes, because 487 00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:57,360 Speaker 1: it has a very similar trajectory to what we talked 488 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:01,640 Speaker 1: about in Part one, between somebody having morning sickness being 489 00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 1: given this drug because it's been sort of a wonder 490 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: drug for treating morning sickness, to then eventually much later 491 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 1: making the connection between that drug and people being born 492 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 1: with this range of disabilities. Tracy d have a bit 493 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:15,960 Speaker 1: of listener mail to wrap this one up. I do. 494 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 1: This is from Emily. Emily says, Hi, Holly and Tracy. 495 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 1: I'm excited to finally have something to contribute for listener mail. 496 00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:25,480 Speaker 1: I was born and raised in Conquered, California and have 497 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 1: driven through the Conquered Naval Weapons Station and on the 498 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:31,160 Speaker 1: Port Chicago Highway for a long time, but I didn't 499 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,480 Speaker 1: learn about the disaster until my twenties. For people that 500 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,920 Speaker 1: would like to know more but can't visit the port itself, 501 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,720 Speaker 1: there's another place to visit. There's an exhibit about the 502 00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 1: disaster at the Rosie the Riveter World War Two home 503 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:46,560 Speaker 1: Front National Historic Park Visitors Center in Richmond, California. This 504 00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 1: is where I first learned about the event, along with 505 00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:51,160 Speaker 1: a lot of other amazing stories about the people who 506 00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,960 Speaker 1: fought the war from home and how wartime shaped the 507 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,719 Speaker 1: Bay Area. The museum is at the site of the 508 00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 1: Richmond Shipyards and Fort Assembly Plant. I highly recommend this 509 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,840 Speaker 1: free museum to anyone who is interested in these topics 510 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:04,960 Speaker 1: or as in the area. Thanks for keeping me company 511 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,000 Speaker 1: through the more monotonous parts of my day, Best Emily. 512 00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:10,920 Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Emily for this note. If folks 513 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,680 Speaker 1: have been sort of waiting for a reason to write us, 514 00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:16,320 Speaker 1: you can write us for any reason. Just say hi. 515 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:19,240 Speaker 1: You can send pictures of your pets. We love to 516 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 1: hear random things about people's lives, as well as emails 517 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:25,160 Speaker 1: like this that have a cool new information that we 518 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:27,479 Speaker 1: didn't know about before. So thank you so much, Emily. 519 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:29,760 Speaker 1: Uh If you would like to write to us, we're 520 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: a history podcast at how Stuff works dot com and 521 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 1: then we are all over social media at miss in History. 522 00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:39,280 Speaker 1: That's where you will find our Facebook, Interest, Instagram, and Twitter. 523 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,480 Speaker 1: You can also come to our website, which is missing 524 00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:44,760 Speaker 1: history dot com, where you will find a searchable archive 525 00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:47,720 Speaker 1: of all the episodes that we have ever done and 526 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:49,680 Speaker 1: show notes for the episodes that Holly and I have 527 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:52,920 Speaker 1: done together. Uh and you can subscribe to the show 528 00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: on Apple, podcast, the I heart Radio app, and wherever 529 00:30:55,960 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: else you get your podcasts. Stuff you Missed in History 530 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,440 Speaker 1: Class is a production of I Heart Radio's How Stuff Works. 531 00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:09,160 Speaker 1: For more podcasts for my heart Radio, visit the heart 532 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,239 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 533 00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:12,960 Speaker 1: favorite shows.