1 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:09,720 Speaker 1: Welcome to Invention, a production of I Heart Radio. Hey, 2 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: welcome to Invention. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm 3 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: Joe McCormick. And today we have a special treat. We 4 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:19,080 Speaker 1: have an interview episode of Invention to share with you, 5 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,440 Speaker 1: and we're gonna be chatting with Jeff beach bum Berry, 6 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 1: a mixologist, author, um restaurantur, and just an overall expert 7 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 1: and historian of Tiki culture. He in fact, he's the 8 00:00:31,800 --> 00:00:35,519 Speaker 1: living authority on all things Tiki, having unearthed numerous recipes 9 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 1: from the golden age of Tiki and helped to bring 10 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,560 Speaker 1: about its comeback from obscurity and stagnation. His books include 11 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 1: beach Bumberri Sip and Safari and beach Bumberries Potions of 12 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:48,960 Speaker 1: the Caribbean, which is an excellent, excellent illustrated breakdown of 13 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:51,519 Speaker 1: Tiki history and the book that made me decide that 14 00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: we needed to reach out to the man for Invention. Now, Robert, 15 00:00:55,080 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: you're the one here that has definitely got a passion 16 00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 1: for this weird cultural artifact of this period known as 17 00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:04,960 Speaker 1: like the Tiki craze. What in short, what is the 18 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:08,319 Speaker 1: Tiki Craze? Well, it's weird, you know because it's like, Uh, 19 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:12,759 Speaker 1: you're dealing with with what can be an extremely delicious, 20 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:17,000 Speaker 1: rich and complex cocktail that is also delivered in this 21 00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 1: kind of faux uh Polynesian um uh, you know rapping uh. 22 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:24,840 Speaker 1: And of course all cocktails are you know, like fifty 23 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: percent ingredients presentation at least it may even you know, 24 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 1: depending on how you look at it, uh, that the 25 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:35,119 Speaker 1: percentage of presentation is even greater. Um. And yeah, they're 26 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: also they feel like an artifact of the past at 27 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 1: the same time, Now, this is gonna be somewhat different 28 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: than a lot of episodes we've done before that we've 29 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: looked at a lot of different kinds of takes on 30 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 1: the word invention. Usually we're looking at something more like 31 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: a technology, like a piece of hardware that does something 32 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: you can hold in your hand. But today we're gonna 33 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 1: be looking centrally, I think mostly at a an iconic recipe, 34 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 1: the invention of a recipe for a drink. The my 35 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,640 Speaker 1: that's right, the signature really the the the superstar of 36 00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: tiki cocktails. If no matter what how little you know 37 00:02:06,800 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 1: about tiki, you probably know the Ma Tai. You've probably 38 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:13,120 Speaker 1: at least seen it on the menu somewhere. Uh so, Yeah, 39 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 1: we're gonna be quizzing beach bum Berry about the history 40 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 1: the invention of the ma tai and in doing so, 41 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:22,000 Speaker 1: you know, get I think to the the invention of tiki, 42 00:02:22,040 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: but also just what we can what we can take 43 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 1: from the invention of the ma tai and apply to 44 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: invention and technology in general. Uh so, Yeah, I'm excited 45 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 1: to have have a beach Bumberry on the show. I've 46 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:36,120 Speaker 1: been a fan of his books for for a while. 47 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 1: I'm a fan of his restaurant in New Orleans, h 48 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 1: Latitude twenty nine, which you'll find in the French Quarter. 49 00:02:42,200 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 1: And if you want to check out his website, uh 50 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 1: it is beach bum Berry dot com. So without further ado, 51 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:58,240 Speaker 1: let's jump into the interview. All right, welcome to the show. Uh, Jeff, 52 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 1: would you mind introducing yourself to our listeners. Yeah, my 53 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: name is Jeff Barry Aliens speech by Barry, and I 54 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: write books about Polynesian drinks and food and I own 55 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 1: a restaurant and bar called Latitude nine in New Orleans. 56 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:17,600 Speaker 1: All right, well, we're going to be discussing the origins 57 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:21,080 Speaker 1: of tiki drinks. How the signature my tai came to 58 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: be and how America fell in love with the tiki cocktail. 59 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:27,080 Speaker 1: But first, how did Jeff Barry fall in love with 60 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,079 Speaker 1: tiki and become the beach Bump? The way I fell 61 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 1: down the Tiki rabbit hole was about oh man, I 62 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,880 Speaker 1: must have been eight years old, maybe younger. UM and 63 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 1: my parents we looked in the Sanfordando Valley UM just 64 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 1: outside of Los Angeles, and at that time in the sixties, 65 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:49,920 Speaker 1: just about every town or city had at least one UM, 66 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: you know, Polynesian themed restaurant or bar. The fad had 67 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: to sort of hit its peak in the sixties. And 68 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: the place they took me to was called a Fongs 69 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 1: and it was just a Chinese restaurant. But what they 70 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: had done was they had taken over a failed business 71 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 1: called the Bora Bora Room. The Bora Bora Room has 72 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 1: spent so much money on the core that they went 73 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:13,440 Speaker 1: out of business. They couldn't recoup their costs. So the 74 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:18,839 Speaker 1: place was beautiful. It was full of like running waterfalls 75 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 1: and a canoe hanging from the ceiling, and there were 76 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:25,839 Speaker 1: these dawn to dusk lighting changes with this little miniature 77 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: island diorama behind the bar, and you had to walk 78 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,919 Speaker 1: through the bar to get to the restaurant. So I 79 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:36,680 Speaker 1: noticed that, and I just became a Polynesiac at that point. 80 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 1: And this faux Polynesia, this sort of like little movie 81 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:42,599 Speaker 1: set Polynesia, actually made me want to go to the 82 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 1: actual Polynesia, which I did. And of course, when I 83 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 1: got old enough to drink, I wanted to find these 84 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,039 Speaker 1: places so I can actually drink in them. And that 85 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,719 Speaker 1: was and they were starting to disappear. The fat was over, 86 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:57,479 Speaker 1: so you could there were still a couple of places left. 87 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:02,160 Speaker 1: Um the tik Et, a little tiny place UM was 88 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:05,479 Speaker 1: which is actually still there with their generation owners, and 89 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 1: then Trader Vix was still there. So I went to 90 00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:10,159 Speaker 1: the places that were there and try some drinks, and 91 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 1: they kind of blew my mind. I mean, the good 92 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:15,800 Speaker 1: ones were really, really good. And this was at a 93 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:19,960 Speaker 1: time when uh, this was the cocktail dark ages. You 94 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 1: couldn't get a good drink anywhere. Um. Nobody was using 95 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:25,720 Speaker 1: fresh juices. Everybody was using mixes from a can or 96 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 1: a squeeze bottle, and Um Tiki places were the only 97 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 1: places that were still doing drinks the way they made 98 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:34,160 Speaker 1: them in the thirties, forties and fifties. They were using 99 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:37,719 Speaker 1: fresh juice, they were using you know, um house made 100 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:43,040 Speaker 1: syrups and premium RUMs, and they were mixing all these complicated, 101 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: um teasingly elusive flavors. And basically what they were doing 102 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 1: was they were doing craft cocktails, like seventy years before 103 00:05:50,080 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 1: that term even existed. UM. So I kept going to 104 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:56,480 Speaker 1: these places, not just because I love the interiors, um, 105 00:05:56,640 --> 00:05:58,680 Speaker 1: loved the decor, but because the drinks were so good. 106 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 1: And it wasn't until like the nineties that I actually 107 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:05,480 Speaker 1: tried to figure out how to make these drinks. Because 108 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: you could not find them in cocktail books. Um, they 109 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:13,480 Speaker 1: were top secrets. They were industrial secrets, basically trade secrets 110 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:17,360 Speaker 1: and very very jealously guarded because you didn't want rival 111 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:21,599 Speaker 1: tiki places making your drinks and stealing your market share. Uh. 112 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: And so you couldn't find them in a recipe books. 113 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: You couldn't find them in a newspaper articles, when you 114 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:28,720 Speaker 1: went to the library and looked up things on microfilm, 115 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:31,720 Speaker 1: you couldn't find them. Basically anywhere you could find bad ones. 116 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 1: Plenty of bad ones were printed, but the good ones 117 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:36,760 Speaker 1: were just still secret. And when you talk to the 118 00:06:36,760 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 1: old timers who were making them, UM, you know, by 119 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:41,040 Speaker 1: the nineties there were very few of them left. But 120 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:43,200 Speaker 1: when you talk to them, they wouldn't tell you anything. 121 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:45,159 Speaker 1: You know, you'd say, well, what's what's in this drink? 122 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 1: It's greating and they go rumman fruit juice, sort of 123 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 1: like you know, you you knew immediately that that was 124 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 1: the last question you were going to ask them, you know, 125 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,600 Speaker 1: So that sort of started me on this thing. I'm 126 00:06:56,600 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 1: trying to find, um, find find how to how to 127 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:01,839 Speaker 1: make the drinks, which I had to do of necessity 128 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 1: because all these places are going into business and eventually 129 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:07,160 Speaker 1: if I wanted to have a ticky drink, I'd have 130 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:09,159 Speaker 1: to be able to make it at home. Now I 131 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: know way less about a tiki drinks and tiki culture 132 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: than than Robert does, so I might ask the neophyte questions. 133 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 1: This might be a stupid question, but is it possible 134 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 1: to patent to drink recipe? Can you try to enforce 135 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 1: intellectual property rights on that? Or is that just you know, 136 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:26,960 Speaker 1: you can't even get started. That's an excellent question, actually, 137 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 1: and it's a question that's still being debated. Um. There's 138 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 1: one cocktail book writer, Philip Green, who writes books about 139 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 1: Ernest haming Away and drinking in the twenties and all that. 140 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:41,120 Speaker 1: And he's also a trademark lawyer and he actually did 141 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: a whole seminar about that, because everybody wants to know 142 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 1: that now during this whole cocktail renaissance, when you know, 143 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 1: drinks have become currency again for people's careers, and the 144 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:54,400 Speaker 1: short answers, no, you can't. Um, you can. You can 145 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: trademark a drink name, um, and but you can't actually 146 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 1: copyright or recipe and people can just do what they 147 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 1: want once the recipes UM out there. It's the same 148 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 1: thing with food. I mean, there are plenty of chefs 149 00:08:09,320 --> 00:08:11,040 Speaker 1: and restaurant owners out there who would love to be 150 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 1: able to copyright dishes and only serve them in their places. 151 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: But UM, I don't know all of the legal intercreases 152 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:21,200 Speaker 1: of why you can't. But but you can't. Now, there 153 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: have been there have been drinks that have copyrighted or 154 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 1: or trademark I'm not clear on which their names, like 155 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:32,120 Speaker 1: the Dark and Stormy UM, Gosling's Rum trademark that drink 156 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:36,720 Speaker 1: name which is basically just Ginger beer and Goslings Rum. 157 00:08:36,800 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 1: They want you to use Goslings Rum and Goslings Ginger beer. 158 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: So if you are a bar and you serve a 159 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:45,680 Speaker 1: Darkened Stormy and you don't use their products and you 160 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 1: call it a darkens Stormy, they could conceivably come after 161 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 1: you and see you for trademark violation. So that's about 162 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: as close as it gets to being able to protect 163 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:57,840 Speaker 1: a recipe. But of course people will do what I 164 00:08:57,880 --> 00:08:59,520 Speaker 1: do at my bar, which is, um, I'll just call 165 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:04,920 Speaker 1: the dark or in stormy or you know, something like. Say, 166 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:07,199 Speaker 1: the same thing happened with a very popular drink served 167 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 1: in a lot of t bars called the pain killer. 168 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:12,920 Speaker 1: Oh yes, um yeah, they the pusters rum trade marked 169 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: that one. So you have to use pushers rum and 170 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: you're a pain killer, or you can't call it a painkiller, 171 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:20,800 Speaker 1: so people call it, you know, all kinds of different things. Um. 172 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: But they did actually, um send a cease and desist 173 00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: letter to a bar in New York that was calling 174 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:30,199 Speaker 1: itself pain killer. Um. And if the bar was using 175 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 1: pushers rum pusses would have had no problem with it, 176 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:35,600 Speaker 1: but they weren't, and it got kind of heated. The 177 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:37,400 Speaker 1: owners of the bar got all New York and said, hey, 178 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:39,280 Speaker 1: we're gonna do what we want, and then pusses Rum 179 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: said no, you won't, and they basically forcing the trade 180 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:44,920 Speaker 1: there changed the name of their bar and all this 181 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,200 Speaker 1: other stuff. So people still remember that. Actually from that 182 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:51,040 Speaker 1: was about almost ten years ago. Now, you know, the 183 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 1: fact that you can't enforce intellectual property rights on a 184 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 1: recipe makes me wonder if like more complicated cocktail recipes 185 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 1: could be a business decision in addition to being a 186 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: culinary decision. Uh well, the um it does, except yes 187 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 1: and no. Um, yes, you're right. The more you can 188 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:18,319 Speaker 1: make something difficult to reverse engineer, For example, if you 189 00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:20,560 Speaker 1: have got a drink like the Zombie, which has all 190 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: kinds of like twelve ingredients in it, and it's nine 191 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:26,360 Speaker 1: four and the drink is a sensation, it's like the 192 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 1: Cosmos halt in its day. Everybody's writing about it. Um, 193 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: And you go to down to Beach Commerce Bar and 194 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:33,240 Speaker 1: you try and figure out how to reverse engineer by 195 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 1: watching them make the drink. Um, Well, good luck to you, 196 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 1: because the bottles don't have anything on their labels. What 197 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:44,480 Speaker 1: they did to try and stop people from ripping off 198 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 1: his recipes was they, uh you know those twelve bottles 199 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 1: they used. They had like numbers or letters on them, 200 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 1: so the people who mix the drinks, all they knew 201 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:53,760 Speaker 1: was like it's a half an ounce of number four 202 00:10:54,360 --> 00:10:57,840 Speaker 1: or a dash of number two. And um, you know, 203 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:00,600 Speaker 1: if if the if the guy tries to fire away 204 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:02,680 Speaker 1: that bartender and bring him to his bar and say okay, now, 205 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 1: make these really profit trends for me, and I goes okay, fine, 206 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 1: and he looks at the back bar and as well, 207 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,760 Speaker 1: where's your number two? Where's number four? There's nothing I 208 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: can do. And this actually, this was the thing Dan 209 00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 1: did do this. The other thing he did to stop 210 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:17,400 Speaker 1: people from figuring out how to make his drinks was 211 00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 1: he had all of the complicated tropical drinks made um 212 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 1: in the service bar. So if you go into his 213 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: bar and you order a martini, the bartender yesterday and 214 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:28,960 Speaker 1: or yes now, and he'll make it for you right 215 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:31,600 Speaker 1: there in front of you. But if you order zombie, 216 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: he'll open up a little door um behind the bar, 217 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:37,480 Speaker 1: open it up a zombie, close it again, and then 218 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 1: you know they're the team of elves in the back 219 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 1: bar where nobody who noted that you can see, will 220 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: make that drink. Then they'll open the door again and 221 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:48,360 Speaker 1: hand it to the bartender. And you can still see 222 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:51,840 Speaker 1: this being done. Um if you go to the Macai 223 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 1: restaurant in Fort Lauderdale, which opened in fifty six and 224 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 1: was um it's amazing sort of preserved an amber mid 225 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:01,800 Speaker 1: century Polynesian palace. That's the way they make their drinks 226 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 1: at the bar. You don't see anybody doing anything so um. 227 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 1: But but the no. Part of the answer about making 228 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:12,840 Speaker 1: drinks complicated is that it's it adds to the poor cost. 229 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 1: So the more complicated dish or a drink is, the 230 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 1: more ingredients you have to have on hand, um, which 231 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 1: you have to pay for, and the more labor it 232 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 1: takes to do it, which you have to pay for. 233 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:29,560 Speaker 1: So um, it's a tricky sort of balancing act there. 234 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:32,559 Speaker 1: But it's a that's a good question, though. I want 235 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 1: to come back to a restaurant you mentioned earlier, Tiki 236 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:39,319 Speaker 1: t I believe is that the Tiki restaurant in l 237 00:12:39,400 --> 00:12:42,080 Speaker 1: A that is next to currently next to a large 238 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 1: scientology center. Okay, when I went there about a year ago, 239 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: we were out there for business, and we we made 240 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 1: a point of like looking up like where did fo 241 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:55,559 Speaker 1: we go? Uh, you know for Fertiki in l a 242 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:58,040 Speaker 1: and and so we got to experience that place. And 243 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 1: it was certainly for me un guinny tiki restaurant, uh 244 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: tiki monity of the serve food tiki bar that I'd 245 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:08,200 Speaker 1: been to, because it was just so old and kind 246 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,400 Speaker 1: of kind of divy. Would you say, yeah, it's it's 247 00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:13,840 Speaker 1: a neighborhood bar that I mean, you went to basically 248 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 1: my local. I used to live not far from the 249 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:19,400 Speaker 1: tik t in Los Aelas and when when the Scientology 250 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:24,680 Speaker 1: Building was a KSET public television station, and that place 251 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,160 Speaker 1: was still one of my favorite bars in the world. 252 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:29,040 Speaker 1: I love that place. And yes, it is sort of 253 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:34,079 Speaker 1: like a you know, very low um, low fi neighborhood 254 00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:36,560 Speaker 1: bar that just happens to serve tiv drinks. It's also 255 00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:40,920 Speaker 1: a legendary bar that it was opened the n by 256 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 1: a guy named Ray Bowen, who had worked as one 257 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,360 Speaker 1: of the original bartenders at Donna Beachcomber, one of those 258 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,240 Speaker 1: guys who was behind them, you know, the wooden door, 259 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,840 Speaker 1: and worked at almost every famous tiki place in Eli 260 00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: before he opened his own bar. And um, you can 261 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 1: still have drinks the way they were made them, the 262 00:13:57,040 --> 00:13:58,720 Speaker 1: way they were making them in the thirties and forties. 263 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 1: If you go to the tiki t raised Ray put 264 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 1: his own spin on the recipes. But they're very very 265 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:06,760 Speaker 1: close um And then his son took over and and 266 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 1: now his grandsons and his son are running the place 267 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 1: and it's just a fun, friendly neighborhood bar. I can 268 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 1: get pat If you go at the wrong time of 269 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 1: the day, there'll be a line outside. And uh, you know, 270 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 1: it's a tiny place. Yeah, I remember when we were there. 271 00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 1: There were people who I just got the feeling they 272 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 1: had been regulars for decades. Oh yeah, and everybody has 273 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 1: their own area too, Like when I was there. When 274 00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 1: I was going there like twice a week or whatever, UM, 275 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:34,520 Speaker 1: I was expected to sit at a certain part of 276 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: the I would sit near the blenders so I can 277 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: watch them do what they do. But the one time 278 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 1: I moved up to the other side of the bar 279 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:41,920 Speaker 1: to say hello to some people and had to see 280 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:43,320 Speaker 1: it there looked at me like, what did you do? 281 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 1: You just crossed into North Korea. You know, it's a 282 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: really weird kind of thing. So I I definitely want 283 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,920 Speaker 1: to come back to um to to discussion of of 284 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 1: modern and past tiki bars, and especially Don the Beach 285 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 1: Comber and uh and and Trader Vic. But going to 286 00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: back up a little bit first. In your in your 287 00:15:02,600 --> 00:15:06,360 Speaker 1: book Portions of the Caribbean, which is a wonderful, just 288 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: beautiful volume that I recommend to anybody interested in the topic, 289 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 1: you chronicle five hundred years of tropical drinks, taking us 290 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,960 Speaker 1: on a drink citric journey through the history of Rome 291 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:21,200 Speaker 1: and colonialism in the region. As a self professed tiki nerd, 292 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 1: when did you realize that, despite all the South Seas trappings, 293 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:28,800 Speaker 1: the history of tiki is a history of the Caribbean. Well, 294 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:30,800 Speaker 1: first of all, thanks for the kind words about the book, 295 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 1: Um and uh. The the answer to that is far 296 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:38,920 Speaker 1: too late. I've been into tiki for years and years 297 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: and years and years before it finally hit me that, hey, 298 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:44,200 Speaker 1: all these drinks are basically based on the Planners punch 299 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: from Jamaica. It wasn't It wasn't until really the probably 300 00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 1: the twenty one century that I that I realized that. 301 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:54,680 Speaker 1: I mean, of course, you know that when you go 302 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 1: to a tiki place, there's going to be drinks like 303 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 1: the Martinique Swizzle or the Barbados Punch or so yeah, 304 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:02,920 Speaker 1: you get the idea that these are you know, their 305 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 1: Daqirie variations from Cuba, so you know that some of 306 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 1: the drinks are tropical drinks from the Caribbean, but they 307 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 1: all have names like Newik Newi and Tahitian Punch and 308 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:18,440 Speaker 1: things like that. And then the other thing is, um, 309 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: they were all invented by this guy in Hollywood on 310 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 1: the Beast Comber and another guy in Oakland, Trader vic Um. 311 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 1: So it's not like the Caribbean roots of all these 312 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: drinks really shows. It's only when I really really got 313 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 1: into Don the Beast Comber's secret recipes um, which took 314 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 1: me forever to get a hold of. But when I 315 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:43,760 Speaker 1: finally got some of them around two thousand four two five, Um, 316 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 1: this major d named Richard Santiago. His daughter Jennifer had 317 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:51,240 Speaker 1: his personal effects he had passed on. But he had 318 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:54,280 Speaker 1: a little telephone book size. Nope, only when I say telephone, 319 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:55,960 Speaker 1: but I mean like a dress book because in your 320 00:16:55,960 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 1: shirt pocket. Um. So he had like a little notebook 321 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 1: full of all of Dawn's original recipes from the from 322 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:07,880 Speaker 1: So I got ahold of that, and I was able 323 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:09,919 Speaker 1: to study it and pour through it and compare it 324 00:17:09,960 --> 00:17:12,639 Speaker 1: to the drinks that I've had in actual restaurants and 325 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:15,440 Speaker 1: the resties already knew about. And you start to see patterns. 326 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:19,359 Speaker 1: You start to see, well, everything is um a variation 327 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: on the Planners punch, which is the simplest drink in 328 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:23,600 Speaker 1: the world of sweet, sour, strong, and weak. As the 329 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 1: old recipe goes, you know, um, one of sour, tube sweet, 330 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:31,080 Speaker 1: three of strong, four a week. Um. I mean different 331 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 1: proportions than that, but that's the old poem from the 332 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:37,760 Speaker 1: nineteenth century. Sour being limes, juice, sweet being sugar, strong 333 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:39,880 Speaker 1: being you know, a Jamaican rum, and weak being either 334 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:43,639 Speaker 1: water or ice. So Um. What Dawn did was he 335 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 1: took that very basic formula, and I figured out that 336 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 1: about thirty three of the seventy drinks he invented were 337 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:52,960 Speaker 1: based on the Planners punch. That was sort of the 338 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:56,880 Speaker 1: building blocks for almost everything you did. And that didn't 339 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:01,000 Speaker 1: occur to me until fairly deep into my obsession with 340 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 1: this stuff. I think I'd written four books by that 341 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:06,639 Speaker 1: and then that's and that sort of grew into Potions 342 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 1: of the Caribbean. Was like, well, in order to really 343 00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 1: explain this twentieth century post prohibition phenomenon, you have to 344 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:17,080 Speaker 1: go back to you. Now. Now, this book, like any 345 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: book that I guess these days that that covers the 346 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,320 Speaker 1: history of of drink is going to it has some 347 00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:26,160 Speaker 1: recipes in it, but unlike you'll find recipes in potions, 348 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:29,120 Speaker 1: Unlike any recipes you'll find another books. You start off 349 00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 1: by taking us back to things like the Kalinago syphilis cure, 350 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:37,159 Speaker 1: as well as pre Columbian Mayan hot chocolate and in 351 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:41,439 Speaker 1: various other like centuries old mixed beverages. Uh and uh 352 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:45,399 Speaker 1: and and these these recipes are I'm hesitant to actually 353 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:48,919 Speaker 1: try any of them, but but or the early ones anyway, 354 00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:51,200 Speaker 1: but I have to ask, did you did you don't 355 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 1: I don't recommend the syphilis cure. That was gonna be 356 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:56,480 Speaker 1: my question. Did you did you try all of them? What? 357 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,360 Speaker 1: What was the cyphilis cure like? And uh? And then 358 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 1: what is the oldest mixed beverage you've come across that 359 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:06,240 Speaker 1: you would actually consider good? Oh? Okay? Um? I yes, 360 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 1: I tested and um and retested and tweaked just to 361 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:16,120 Speaker 1: make them as good as I thought I could make them. Um. 362 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,520 Speaker 1: Almost every recipe in the book, with the sole exception 363 00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:23,719 Speaker 1: the only one I didn't taste and and make myself. 364 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,960 Speaker 1: Was the syphilis cure um A because I couldn't find 365 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: pox would um and be because we have you know, 366 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:40,440 Speaker 1: penicilla now. But um. The earliest recorded recipe for um 367 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,119 Speaker 1: what we would now call a tropical drink is I 368 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 1: think it was from two and it was a French 369 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,880 Speaker 1: priest called Parallel Bat and he wrote down a fragment 370 00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:58,160 Speaker 1: of a drink recipe calling for Barbados rum, lime, juice, 371 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:03,720 Speaker 1: sugar and spy used with cinnamon, nutmeg and clove. And 372 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:07,199 Speaker 1: that when I you know, that's a fragment, it's a 373 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: recipe fragment. So I had to reconstruct it, so liberties 374 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:14,720 Speaker 1: were taken. Um. But that's the earliest one that was 375 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: that's actually been written down to the point where I 376 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 1: could recreate it. Um. There were other ones, like you know, 377 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:26,200 Speaker 1: the pre Columbian beverage atole a, but that's not really 378 00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:28,600 Speaker 1: a tropical it's not really what we call it a 379 00:20:28,760 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 1: precursor to a tigi drink because there's there's no citrus 380 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:33,480 Speaker 1: in it. It's more of a breakfast drink. Actually. The 381 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:38,400 Speaker 1: hot chocolate was another thing that I know basically all 382 00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 1: of the ingredients had been cataloged by various Spanish explorers 383 00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:45,760 Speaker 1: and monks and and uh, and there was enough there 384 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,320 Speaker 1: so that I could try to concoct a version of 385 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: it um so, you know, to give you an idea 386 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:53,919 Speaker 1: of the flavors that went into it. And I started 387 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,320 Speaker 1: off with a um an actual chocolate recipe, and then 388 00:20:57,320 --> 00:21:00,000 Speaker 1: started adding the things that they would have put into 389 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,120 Speaker 1: to it. Back and you know, the Concus Store days 390 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:07,280 Speaker 1: or pre pre Conus story is preconquest. All right, we're 391 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:09,160 Speaker 1: gonna take a quick break, but we'll be right back. 392 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 1: And we're back at this point, I want to get 393 00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,359 Speaker 1: back to one of my favorite aspects of of Tiki 394 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 1: history and something you write a great deal about in 395 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:24,400 Speaker 1: your books, and you've already you've already got into discussing 396 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:26,639 Speaker 1: some of it here already, and that is, of course, 397 00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:31,240 Speaker 1: the Tiki drama and the wars between the various wizards 398 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:34,159 Speaker 1: of Tiki during the golden age of you know, the 399 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:38,000 Speaker 1: Umbrella drink. Can you introduce us um to sort of 400 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:40,920 Speaker 1: reintroduce us, I guess to Don the beach Comber Beach, 401 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:45,920 Speaker 1: and it also introduces to Trader Vic. Yeah, the TWA 402 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:50,000 Speaker 1: bar was kind of single handedly invented by Ernest Raymond 403 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 1: Beaumont Gant, who opened up a place called Don's Beach 404 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:59,120 Speaker 1: Cafe the day after prohibition was repealed in December, and 405 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:04,119 Speaker 1: it became a sensation with the Hollywood crowd because of 406 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:07,240 Speaker 1: what he called his rum rhapsodies, which were the drinks 407 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:08,959 Speaker 1: he served. So he not only invented the cheeky boar, 408 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: he invented what we now called the cheeky drink. He 409 00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:16,000 Speaker 1: called them rum rapsies, which were these um, really complex 410 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:21,880 Speaker 1: layered um tropical punches rum drinks. And by nineteen seven 411 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:24,440 Speaker 1: he had a hundred and fifty copycats across the country 412 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 1: and he would be suing. He had to sue some 413 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 1: of them. There was one guy named Monty Proser, a 414 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 1: nightclub impressario in New York, who opened up a chain 415 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: of restaurants called Monty Proser's Beach Comber, and he used 416 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:38,440 Speaker 1: the exact same font for beach Comber that Dona Beachcomber had, 417 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:40,960 Speaker 1: and he claimed that he he was the home of 418 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,480 Speaker 1: the Zombie, which was a drink that Don Beach was 419 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:46,159 Speaker 1: most famous for. So Don actually had to sue him, 420 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:48,480 Speaker 1: and he would sue other places too, So he wasn't 421 00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:53,560 Speaker 1: happy about being ripped off on such a grand scale. Um, 422 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,680 Speaker 1: other people wanted to cash in on the immense popularity 423 00:22:57,240 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 1: and newsworthiness of his place. I mean, when you had, um, 424 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 1: you know, Marlena Dietrich and the Marx Brothers and Howard 425 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:08,160 Speaker 1: Hughes and all these like Hollywood Royalty coming in and 426 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,919 Speaker 1: going nuts over Don's drinks. Then of course the press 427 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: also went nuts over it. Um, So everybody wanted to 428 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,600 Speaker 1: get in on that, and he had he had people 429 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 1: like um, here was a guy called Joe Chasteck who 430 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:23,399 Speaker 1: just ran some kind of a deli in in l 431 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: a And he changed his name to Zamboanga Joe chast 432 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 1: Deck and ripped off Don's drink menu and other Sugie 433 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 1: you know, Harry Sugarman open a place called Sugi's Tropics 434 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:36,560 Speaker 1: and Beverly Hills, and um, right down there, you know, 435 00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: three blocks away from Dawn's, this guy Bob Brooks opening 436 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: up the Seven Seas. So everybody was ripping him off. 437 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:48,160 Speaker 1: We don't know how close they got to reproducing his drinks, 438 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 1: except for the fact that there were people like Ray 439 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 1: Bow and from the t T. Eventually, of the Tikt 440 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: who started off at Dawn's, he was making thirty five 441 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,119 Speaker 1: dollars a week, and Don beach Commerce in nineteen thirty seven, 442 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 1: and Bob Brooks said to him, Hey, why don't you 443 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 1: come over the seventh season make those drinks for me, 444 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:08,840 Speaker 1: and I'll pay you another fifteen bucks a week. So 445 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 1: we did that. And this is one way. This was 446 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:17,600 Speaker 1: before Don implemented that code. You know, this is when 447 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 1: he still trusted his original employees. But enough bartenders left 448 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 1: ons with that secret knowledge so that they can start 449 00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:27,920 Speaker 1: spreading it around in different bars and making a fortune 450 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:31,159 Speaker 1: off of it. Um, knowing these recipes gave you a 451 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 1: lot of power as an employee. Uh. Later on you 452 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 1: could dictate terms when tiki became a huge phenomenon after 453 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,800 Speaker 1: World War Two. I talked to a couple of bartenders 454 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: who told me that when they would apply for a 455 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,240 Speaker 1: job at a restaurant that wanted to serve these drinks 456 00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,479 Speaker 1: but didn't know how, they would make a deal like, Okay, 457 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 1: I'll make these drinks for you, and I'll tell you 458 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: what to order, you know, from your suppliers and and 459 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,560 Speaker 1: and all that. But if I don't like it here, um, 460 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:02,360 Speaker 1: I'll leave and I'll take my recipes with me. I'm 461 00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:04,800 Speaker 1: not going to tell you what the recipes are, and 462 00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 1: that gave bartenders an extraordinary or about leverage. So anyway, 463 00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 1: everybody was using this these secrets to their advantage if 464 00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:19,800 Speaker 1: they knew them and ripping Down off. There's only one 465 00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:25,880 Speaker 1: tiki impresario who decided that he wasn't content with industrial espionage. 466 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,159 Speaker 1: He didn't want to just steal away one of Don's 467 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:31,640 Speaker 1: bartenders or try to reverse engineering strengths. He wanted to 468 00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:37,119 Speaker 1: create his own original tiki drinks. And that was Victor Bergeron, 469 00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:40,280 Speaker 1: who came down to Dawn's in thirty seven and like 470 00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: all these other people, thought, wow, this is great as 471 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 1: a land office business. I want to get in on this. 472 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:47,679 Speaker 1: So he went back up to Oakland and turned his 473 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: barbecue shack Inky Dinks into Trader Vix, and he turned 474 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,280 Speaker 1: himself into Trader Vic Bergeron, and he did with a 475 00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,119 Speaker 1: lot of people. Did he um copied Down's sort of 476 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:02,479 Speaker 1: rafish South Seas person, a character like Don dressed like 477 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,600 Speaker 1: a beach comber, like a South Seas guy, with a 478 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 1: straw hat and ripped pants and all that, and Vick 479 00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 1: took on that same persona without ever having actually been 480 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:15,720 Speaker 1: to the South Seas the way Don had, and he's 481 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 1: at first he started serving the same drinks Don did. Um. 482 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:22,240 Speaker 1: You know, he tried to make a zombie, failed miserably. 483 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: It was it's a terrible drink. His version of his Zombie, 484 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:30,320 Speaker 1: he wasn't even close. But the difference between Don and 485 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,200 Speaker 1: Vic and all of the people who were ripping Don 486 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,680 Speaker 1: off was that Vic was a chef and he had 487 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:41,159 Speaker 1: a really, really, really good palette and he used that 488 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,440 Speaker 1: to try to create his own style of tropical drink 489 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,520 Speaker 1: as opposed to just you know, stealing other people's. So 490 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:52,679 Speaker 1: he um, he went to Cuba, and he went to Trinidad, 491 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 1: and he went to Jamaica, and he learned about tropical 492 00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 1: drinks the same way Don had. And he learned, you know, 493 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:00,960 Speaker 1: he got his education and Sweet Sour Strong in the 494 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,919 Speaker 1: week and came back to Trader Vix and created his 495 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:07,840 Speaker 1: own drinks. And the three most famous ones of the Scorpion, 496 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 1: the Fog Cutter, and of course the My Time Um, 497 00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:15,880 Speaker 1: those were ripped off by hundreds of restaurants the same 498 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,159 Speaker 1: way that all of Don's drinks, like the Zombie and 499 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 1: the Navy crog uh to hitan punch and all of us, 500 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:23,680 Speaker 1: just as they had been ripped off. People started putting 501 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 1: vixed drinks on their menu too, um, and that's a 502 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,200 Speaker 1: lot easier for them to do because Vic, unlike Don, 503 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,879 Speaker 1: actually published his recipes. He started. He was sort of 504 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:37,639 Speaker 1: the first real post World War two celebrity chef um 505 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:40,240 Speaker 1: who made a fortune with his own food product line, 506 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,760 Speaker 1: you know, for grocery stores. And he put out cookbooks, 507 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,120 Speaker 1: and he put out drink recipe books, and he put 508 00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:49,200 Speaker 1: his drinks in there. Now, not the my Tie though, 509 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:52,359 Speaker 1: because that was his signature drink, just like the Zombie 510 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,280 Speaker 1: was don signature drink. Um. But he published his fog 511 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 1: cutter and scorpion recipes. In his case, it was a 512 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:02,120 Speaker 1: smart business decision because as people could go to their 513 00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:05,440 Speaker 1: local grocery store and buy Trader of Vicks scorpion mix 514 00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:09,160 Speaker 1: and Trader Vicks fod cutter um, well not fod cutters, 515 00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: but Trader Vix ort syrup to put in the fog cutter, 516 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,480 Speaker 1: and Trader of Vicks white rum to put into the 517 00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,560 Speaker 1: drink or uh, you know, Trader of Vicks gold rum 518 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 1: or Trader Vicks brandy to put into the scorpion. So 519 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,639 Speaker 1: he was, you know, having it both ways. Um, the 520 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:25,800 Speaker 1: my Tai though he kept secret. If you wanted to 521 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,119 Speaker 1: make a Trader Vic my Tay at home, you bought 522 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:30,680 Speaker 1: a bottle of Trader Vick my Ti rum and a 523 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 1: bottle of Trader Vick my Ty mix. He wasn't going 524 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,199 Speaker 1: to tell you what the actual recipe was that they 525 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:41,320 Speaker 1: made in the restaurant. UM. So those two guys had 526 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 1: a quite a rivalry over the course of their careers. 527 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 1: Um Don really resented when Vic kind of stole his 528 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: thunder and became the most famous ticky impresario, largely because 529 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: of the my tie, which really took off and became 530 00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,280 Speaker 1: you know, it replaced the zombie as the most famous 531 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:02,040 Speaker 1: sticky drink. Uh. And Vic was a bit of a 532 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:04,840 Speaker 1: better businessman than Don. He opened up a chain of 533 00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:09,760 Speaker 1: restaurants across the US and eventually um Europe, in the 534 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 1: Middle East and Tokyo, and he got a lot more 535 00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:16,480 Speaker 1: pressed than Don did because Don ended up going to 536 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:19,320 Speaker 1: Hawaii and was sort of like out of the mainland 537 00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:23,720 Speaker 1: public eye as much as Vic was Uh. And to 538 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 1: Don's dying day, he claimed that he invented the myn time. 539 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:32,440 Speaker 1: It always really bothered him. The Trader Vic Um was 540 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: famous for creating a my time, and that gets into 541 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 1: the heart of the little war they had. UM. It 542 00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 1: gets really complicated, and it turns into like a Gilligan's 543 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:51,200 Speaker 1: Island sitcom plot almost. You know, don Don Beaches widow Phoebe. 544 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 1: I talked to her um well, emailed with her and 545 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,960 Speaker 1: went back and forth on it, because she wrote when 546 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:01,640 Speaker 1: she put out a book of recipes in two thousand 547 00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:04,120 Speaker 1: and three, which was kind of a revelation to see that. 548 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,480 Speaker 1: But these were all much later versions of his drinks, 549 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:10,920 Speaker 1: you know, from like the restaurant was still around in 550 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 1: the eighties. She had a recipe for a my tie, 551 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:18,880 Speaker 1: which she said Done invented in nineteen thirty three, and 552 00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:21,560 Speaker 1: I went, oh, well, that's interesting. So and then she 553 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 1: said that he invented the my tie. And you know, 554 00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 1: Trader vic didn't invent the my tie. So I made 555 00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,240 Speaker 1: the drink and it didn't taste anything like trader Vicks 556 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 1: my tie. UM. And then as I got deeper and 557 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: deeper and got more and more UM research materials, when 558 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,520 Speaker 1: I got Dick Santiago's Little Recipe Book, for example, from seven, 559 00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:46,360 Speaker 1: there was no my taie in that recipe book. And 560 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,520 Speaker 1: when you see a nineteen thirty seven beach comers menu. 561 00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:51,960 Speaker 1: There's no my Tie on that, and there's no my 562 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: Tie on any beach comer's menu until the Kennedy era, 563 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:58,800 Speaker 1: which is, you know, well after the drink became very famous. 564 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:01,000 Speaker 1: So in order to stay current, he would have had 565 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: to have put a my tie on his menu. Um. 566 00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: It was also a fog cutn't a scorpion on his menu? 567 00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 1: By then, you know, he'd taken Vick's most famous drinks 568 00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:12,200 Speaker 1: and put them on his menu. So what happened, Well, 569 00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:16,160 Speaker 1: Don actually was a beach farmer. He actually loved Tahiti, 570 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,120 Speaker 1: and he lived there for a while, you know, on 571 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,920 Speaker 1: the beach, and and he would have heard the phrase 572 00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:26,960 Speaker 1: my time, or more properly may te, which means basically 573 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:31,600 Speaker 1: it's Tahitian for awesome. You know, oh that's great may te. Um. 574 00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 1: So he would have known that phrase, and it would 575 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 1: have naturally been something that he would have named a drink. 576 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:40,120 Speaker 1: He called his drink the my Tie Swizzle, I believe um. 577 00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: And I kept pressing Phoebe about it, was like, well, 578 00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:45,480 Speaker 1: why isn't it you know, why can't I find any 579 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,360 Speaker 1: evidence of this drink served in his restaurants? Since she said, well, 580 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:53,120 Speaker 1: it wasn't one of his favorites. So okay, so let's say, 581 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 1: let's take phoebe at her word, and why shouldn't we 582 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 1: She was married to Don. I never even met the guy. Um, 583 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 1: so On invents a drink he calls the may Tay 584 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:06,800 Speaker 1: swizzle on in my talian um, and it doesn't end 585 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 1: up on his menu because he's not one of his favorites. 586 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,160 Speaker 1: Trader Vic the story. He tells us that he invented 587 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,680 Speaker 1: the Ma Tai one night at his bar in Oakland 588 00:32:15,760 --> 00:32:20,520 Speaker 1: in n with his head bartender, Fred Frank Poult, and 589 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:25,200 Speaker 1: they named the drink because a friend of his, Carrie Guild, 590 00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:27,160 Speaker 1: who lived into heat. He came into the bar and 591 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,280 Speaker 1: he handed her the first, um, you know, the final 592 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 1: version of the strength that he had been working all 593 00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:35,400 Speaker 1: day on with his bartender. And she drinks it and goes, 594 00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:39,720 Speaker 1: oh mate, which is you know again to Nitian for awesome. Um. 595 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,720 Speaker 1: So you've got a sitcom coincidence here. Um, Don the 596 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 1: beach Comber claims he invented the may tie. It's true. 597 00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 1: Trader Vic claims he invented in my time. This is 598 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:53,720 Speaker 1: also true. Um. But the whole truth is that Don 599 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:55,920 Speaker 1: invented a drink called the may Tie, put it in 600 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,560 Speaker 1: a drawer, nobody ever knew about it, and Trader Vick's 601 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:03,320 Speaker 1: mata is the my Tie that we all know. And UM, 602 00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 1: you know, he can certainly claim that that's his drink, 603 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:11,200 Speaker 1: I think, but it it was really a source of 604 00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:15,000 Speaker 1: tension between the two of them. UM. I mean, Don 605 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:18,600 Speaker 1: gave an interview to some Honolulu paper when he was 606 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:23,520 Speaker 1: well into his eighties and uh still claimed that he 607 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:27,160 Speaker 1: invented the my Tie, and I was really pissed him off. Now, 608 00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: one of the things you write about concerning them Tie 609 00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,720 Speaker 1: is that when it when it first came out, it 610 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 1: didn't have that initial splash like uh. I think you 611 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,480 Speaker 1: mentioned there was a particular menu where the Zombie was 612 00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:40,520 Speaker 1: still very much at the top. The my Tie was 613 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:42,960 Speaker 1: towards the bottom of the page. Uh. And it didn't 614 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 1: get like the same press, at least initially that the 615 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:48,840 Speaker 1: Zombie got. How did the my Taie ascend to become 616 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:52,640 Speaker 1: this just dominant drink, this this drink that everyone at 617 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: least has some surface level knowledge of. That's a great question, basically, Um, 618 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:02,320 Speaker 1: As you said, the Zombie was immediately successful. Um. Part 619 00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:04,719 Speaker 1: of the reason being that it was advertiser as being 620 00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: a very strong drink. Dawn said it was great at marketing, 621 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,320 Speaker 1: said only to to a customer because it's so strong. 622 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:14,279 Speaker 1: So radio comedians started to um tell jokes about the 623 00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:16,680 Speaker 1: drink and how strong it was, and travel riders said, 624 00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:18,200 Speaker 1: you have to go to town to beach commers and 625 00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 1: when you get out of the train and in central 626 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 1: station downtown and go have a zombie of downa beach 627 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:25,279 Speaker 1: combers is the first thing every touriss has to do. 628 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:29,360 Speaker 1: So it was huge from the very beginning. Uh. Trader 629 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:31,879 Speaker 1: vic says he invented in my time in nineteen four. 630 00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,839 Speaker 1: But nobody's written anything about it. There's nothing in the 631 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,680 Speaker 1: historical record, nothing in newspaper databases. Nobody's talking about it, 632 00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:43,319 Speaker 1: um and um. It obviously was not a hit right 633 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:47,200 Speaker 1: out of the gate. There is proof that it was 634 00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:49,560 Speaker 1: on as menu as early as nineteen fifty. That's the 635 00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:52,279 Speaker 1: that's the earliest menu I have from Trader Vicks that 636 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,359 Speaker 1: has the my tie on it um. But there are 637 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:57,360 Speaker 1: earlier menus I don't have which might have it um 638 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: at any rate. You In nineteen fifty two fifty three, 639 00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:06,319 Speaker 1: Vic Is hired to do the cocktail list for the 640 00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,400 Speaker 1: Matson Cruise ship lines. Uh. And these were luxury cruise 641 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,120 Speaker 1: liners that went to Hawaii. This is before you know, 642 00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:15,640 Speaker 1: commercial jet travel, so most people went to Hawaii on 643 00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:18,640 Speaker 1: a cruise, spent a week on a boat, and got 644 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:25,200 Speaker 1: into um Hontolulu Harbor. So he's doing the drinks for 645 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 1: the boats, you know, the ship bars. And Mattson also 646 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 1: owns the Royal Hawaiian Hotel and a couple of other hotels. 647 00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,040 Speaker 1: Me why so he does the same drinks for these 648 00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:38,799 Speaker 1: hotel bars. The whole idea of being that Mattson wants 649 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:40,799 Speaker 1: you to pay to take a cruise in their ships 650 00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:43,000 Speaker 1: and then to pay them to stay in a Madison hotel. 651 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 1: So to build a better mousetrap, well, let's make let's 652 00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 1: get Trader Vick to do these drinks for us. One 653 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:50,880 Speaker 1: of those drinks that he puts on them in NEU 654 00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:54,319 Speaker 1: is the my Tie. But as you say, it's all 655 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:56,920 Speaker 1: the way at the bottom of the cocktail list. I've 656 00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:01,160 Speaker 1: got a nineteen fifty three Royal Hawaii and menu and 657 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:03,719 Speaker 1: it's like second from the bottom. I think even the 658 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,600 Speaker 1: planners punches above it. So obviously it was not a 659 00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:11,839 Speaker 1: famous drink at that point, but it became famous in Hawaii. Uh. 660 00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:16,600 Speaker 1: I think several reasons. One was that it had a 661 00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:20,239 Speaker 1: great Hawaiian name. Um, I mean a Cetatian name, but 662 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 1: it just sounded really Polynesian and really romantic. And the 663 00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 1: drink name was great, just like the Zombie was a 664 00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:27,920 Speaker 1: great drink name. I mean names are very very important 665 00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:30,879 Speaker 1: for a drink is half the selling point for them. 666 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:34,600 Speaker 1: The drink started spread violerly through the islands as a 667 00:36:34,719 --> 00:36:38,919 Speaker 1: Luau drink um. Everybody went to a hotel Luau, every 668 00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:42,719 Speaker 1: tourist um and they all you know, sat there and 669 00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:47,040 Speaker 1: a uh you know, khalua pork and Loumie loumi salmon 670 00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 1: off the banana leaf mats and everything, and my Ties 671 00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:55,400 Speaker 1: became the default drink at these luous whether or not 672 00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,800 Speaker 1: they had Vick's formula um they were, they would improvise. 673 00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 1: If they didn't. Sometimes I would just be pineapple juice 674 00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:04,080 Speaker 1: and rum. As terrible company. You go to Hawaii even 675 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:06,520 Speaker 1: now when you have terrible Ma ties that there are 676 00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:10,080 Speaker 1: no relation to PIX, but the name worked for them, 677 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:13,680 Speaker 1: I guess. So the first people who start writing about 678 00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:16,879 Speaker 1: the my Tai are travel writers, and they're writing about 679 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:20,160 Speaker 1: traveling to Hawaii. UM, and it's like fifty three fifty 680 00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:22,800 Speaker 1: four when people, you know, people start writing about a 681 00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:24,520 Speaker 1: drink they I don't know why I called them may Tai. 682 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,359 Speaker 1: What really sends the mine tie over the edge is 683 00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,800 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine. Ninety nine is the year Hawaii it 684 00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:34,279 Speaker 1: becomes a state and not just a US territory. And 685 00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:38,840 Speaker 1: it's also the first year of commercial jet travel UM 686 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:42,680 Speaker 1: passenger jet travel. The Boeing seven oh seven makes his debut, 687 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:44,880 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, you can get to Hawaii 688 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,080 Speaker 1: from the west coast of the mainland in a matter 689 00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,440 Speaker 1: of hours, you know, four or five hours. If you 690 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,040 Speaker 1: wanted to take a plane. Before you had to take 691 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:57,560 Speaker 1: a prop um prop plane that took about twelve hours 692 00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,200 Speaker 1: to get there, and they had little berths that you 693 00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,959 Speaker 1: slept in um or most people just went by boat. 694 00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:05,399 Speaker 1: So all of a sudden, travel to Hawaii becomes very 695 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:10,319 Speaker 1: easy and affordable. And it's a state. So even the 696 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:13,960 Speaker 1: most xenophobic American from the Midwest or the South or 697 00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:15,480 Speaker 1: whatever it says, oh, well it's part of the US, 698 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:20,680 Speaker 1: I'll go there. And tourism blows up in Hawaii. UM. 699 00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,040 Speaker 1: It goes from thousands of people to tens of thousands 700 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:25,879 Speaker 1: of people a year, all going to lue. How's all 701 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: having a my tie and the drink just blows up 702 00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:32,280 Speaker 1: and by the by the Kennedy era, it's just all 703 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 1: it's all over the place. It's just the rage. And 704 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:38,480 Speaker 1: even non tiki bars are serving it or effects similar 705 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,680 Speaker 1: of it if they didn't know the rescipe. All right, 706 00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 1: we're gonna take a quick break, but we'll be right back. 707 00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:51,280 Speaker 1: And we're back, all right, So let's fast forward to today. 708 00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,480 Speaker 1: So you you have beach bum berries latitude twenty nine 709 00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,840 Speaker 1: in New Orleans. Has it changed the way you feel 710 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:01,120 Speaker 1: about any of the figures in tiky history? And uh? 711 00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:04,320 Speaker 1: And and what is your own relationship with with secret recipes? 712 00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:09,359 Speaker 1: That's great question. Yeah, it's really funny to go from 713 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:13,000 Speaker 1: writing about tiki drinks and researching TV drinks to serving 714 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:17,200 Speaker 1: them to people. And it's given me a whole new 715 00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:21,880 Speaker 1: um perspective on people like Don and Vic and all 716 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,439 Speaker 1: the bartenders who used to work for them and with them, 717 00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:30,120 Speaker 1: uh At a whole new level of respect for them 718 00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:35,799 Speaker 1: because it's running a restaurant's hard. Fortunately, Mrs Bum takes 719 00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,759 Speaker 1: care of most of the work. She's the one with 720 00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:40,719 Speaker 1: all their experience. You kind of drag me, kicking and 721 00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:43,359 Speaker 1: screening into opening the place, and I'm glad she did. 722 00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:46,279 Speaker 1: It's been great, but um, you know, there's there's a 723 00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:49,440 Speaker 1: lot of work involved, a lot of people to deal with, 724 00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:51,840 Speaker 1: and um, a lot of things to deal with it. 725 00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:54,480 Speaker 1: I never thought about when I was just writing about 726 00:39:55,760 --> 00:40:03,280 Speaker 1: drinks and restaurants, things like insurance, plumber, electricity, um, you know, payroll, 727 00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:08,040 Speaker 1: tax um. It just goes on and on. Permits goes 728 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:09,600 Speaker 1: on and on and on and on and on, and 729 00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:13,200 Speaker 1: it has nothing to do with how great a drink is. 730 00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:16,240 Speaker 1: It's just keep the place open and keep customers happy. 731 00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:21,320 Speaker 1: The other thing that was really interesting to me about 732 00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:26,000 Speaker 1: opening a place is um, I no longer after we've 733 00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,000 Speaker 1: been opened five years now. And for me, the most 734 00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:30,399 Speaker 1: important thing to hear when I'm walking through the dining 735 00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:33,960 Speaker 1: room and touching tables and asking how everything is is 736 00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:37,160 Speaker 1: when not when a customer says, oh, we love this drink, 737 00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:39,080 Speaker 1: this is a great drink, Thank you so much. It's 738 00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:42,360 Speaker 1: when they say, oh, um, you know, we love Sam 739 00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:45,600 Speaker 1: or we love Alexandro, we love um bread. They're they're 740 00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:49,720 Speaker 1: great and those are our staff. So if a server 741 00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:53,200 Speaker 1: or a bartender is making them, first of all, if 742 00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: they know them by name, and if they're raving about 743 00:40:56,640 --> 00:41:00,480 Speaker 1: them to the boss, like that makes me upier than 744 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 1: anything they could say about the drinks. It was like, 745 00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:06,000 Speaker 1: if you have a good experience and if our people 746 00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,360 Speaker 1: show you a good time and make you feel welcome 747 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:13,000 Speaker 1: and happy, that's you know, aloha bartending if you will. UM, 748 00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:16,400 Speaker 1: that's something that you know that's very very important. I 749 00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:19,960 Speaker 1: never really grasp that when I was just a customer 750 00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:24,879 Speaker 1: at these places. UM. But so there's so many more 751 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:29,920 Speaker 1: dimensions to dealing with with the drinks and with the 752 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,600 Speaker 1: creation of the drinks as well. UM. One technical note, 753 00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:38,160 Speaker 1: One of the things that was very eye opening to 754 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:42,240 Speaker 1: me was when I was researching recipes or tweaking recipes 755 00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,960 Speaker 1: or trying to reverse engineer them based on you know, 756 00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:49,080 Speaker 1: bartender's notes or whatever or fragments. If I wanted to 757 00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:51,880 Speaker 1: spend half an hour to make a drink, UM, I 758 00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:55,160 Speaker 1: could do it. And if I wanted to spend eighty 759 00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:58,839 Speaker 1: dollars one particular bottle of rum that would taste best 760 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:03,520 Speaker 1: in the drink, I could do that too. And you 761 00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:06,719 Speaker 1: can't do that when you've got customers who want to 762 00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:09,319 Speaker 1: be served, you have to work out. I had to 763 00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: look at every single recipe that I wanted to put 764 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:15,239 Speaker 1: on my menu atlat Um. You know, first of all, 765 00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:16,920 Speaker 1: they were like three I wanted to put on, but 766 00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:20,360 Speaker 1: I had to cut that down thirty because you can't 767 00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:24,840 Speaker 1: have too many recipes on your menu or your bartenders 768 00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:27,840 Speaker 1: can't do them, they can't be executed, and also people 769 00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:31,280 Speaker 1: can just get confused. I think, um, thirty is about 770 00:42:31,320 --> 00:42:35,440 Speaker 1: as much as you can cram onto the menu anyway. Um. 771 00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:37,400 Speaker 1: That was part of the learning curve as well. But 772 00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:42,319 Speaker 1: when I was doing revamping the recipes for service for 773 00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,520 Speaker 1: actually being served at loud to twenty nine, I had 774 00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:47,520 Speaker 1: to go through every single one of them and rebalance 775 00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:51,160 Speaker 1: them and retweak them because I was no longer just 776 00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,520 Speaker 1: trying to make the best possible drink. My goal when 777 00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:56,040 Speaker 1: I was writing the books was just a very singular goals, 778 00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:58,719 Speaker 1: like how do I make the best possible drink? Well, 779 00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:02,920 Speaker 1: that becomes like three dimensional chess from Star Trek when 780 00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:06,000 Speaker 1: you're trying to I realized that that's that's what I 781 00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:10,200 Speaker 1: had to do. From watching other cheeky places, other new 782 00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,120 Speaker 1: TV places like if it took ten minutes to get 783 00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,680 Speaker 1: a drink, no good, you know. And and if a 784 00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:19,399 Speaker 1: drink costs twenty five dollars, that's also no good. So 785 00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:23,360 Speaker 1: I had to go from first level, how do I 786 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,960 Speaker 1: make the best possible drink? Too? How do I make 787 00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:28,480 Speaker 1: the best possible drink in the least amount of time? 788 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:31,000 Speaker 1: And then the third thing was how do I make 789 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:33,040 Speaker 1: the best possible drink in the least amount of time 790 00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:36,640 Speaker 1: for the least amount of money. Um, not without sacrifice 791 00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:39,040 Speaker 1: and quality, but still making it so that I could 792 00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:43,719 Speaker 1: afford the drink and I could afford to not charge 793 00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:45,600 Speaker 1: people on arm and a leg for it. So you 794 00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:48,719 Speaker 1: I had to work out systems, and one of them 795 00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:50,600 Speaker 1: was as you as you know if you've made any 796 00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:53,239 Speaker 1: of the drinks from these books, they were all. Most 797 00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:55,400 Speaker 1: of these drinks, especially on the Beast Grimmers, drinks were 798 00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:58,959 Speaker 1: flash blended. In other words, um, they would be put 799 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:03,160 Speaker 1: into a top down Hamilton's beach mixer with a certain 800 00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:05,600 Speaker 1: amount of crushed ice and blended for like three to 801 00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:08,319 Speaker 1: five seconds, not to make a slushy drink, but to 802 00:44:08,360 --> 00:44:11,040 Speaker 1: sort of swizzle it in a way that no human 803 00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:15,120 Speaker 1: possibly could without marvel superhero strength um, and it gives 804 00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:19,560 Speaker 1: the drink a very unique texture, and it dilutes instantly, 805 00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:22,720 Speaker 1: and it chills instantly, and it's it's much better than shaking. 806 00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:26,160 Speaker 1: But the problem is that when I was making doing 807 00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:28,760 Speaker 1: the drinks for the book and guessing how much crushed 808 00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:31,120 Speaker 1: ice to put into each drink, because that was never 809 00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:34,840 Speaker 1: indicated on any of the you know, old vintage recipes 810 00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:37,000 Speaker 1: that I had un nerved um, I had to guess 811 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:40,280 Speaker 1: at it. And some drinks tasted good with four ounces 812 00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:42,200 Speaker 1: of crushed ice, like a half a cup. Some drinks 813 00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:44,520 Speaker 1: tasted great with a cup and a half like twelve 814 00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:46,759 Speaker 1: ounces of crushed ice. Some were perfect with one cup 815 00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:49,320 Speaker 1: of crushed ice. And if you look at my books, 816 00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:51,239 Speaker 1: that's the way they are. I mean, they all call 817 00:44:51,320 --> 00:44:54,480 Speaker 1: for a different amount of crushed ice. Well, the first 818 00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:57,440 Speaker 1: thing I realized was that's going to slow down the 819 00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:01,960 Speaker 1: bartenders if they have to a member how much crushed 820 00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:04,120 Speaker 1: ice goes into every drink as well as remember this 821 00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:08,680 Speaker 1: complicated recipe. Um, that's not good. So what I did 822 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:12,120 Speaker 1: was I had to rebalance each drink so that they 823 00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:14,680 Speaker 1: all used the exact same amount of crushed ice, so 824 00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:18,759 Speaker 1: the staff never had to think about the amount of 825 00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:21,239 Speaker 1: ice they were putting into the blender. I just went 826 00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:24,840 Speaker 1: into a restaurant supply store, got a long handled, six 827 00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:28,520 Speaker 1: ounce scoop, and I rebalanced every drink so that they 828 00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:32,359 Speaker 1: all worked with six ounces of crushed ice. And that's 829 00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:34,120 Speaker 1: all they have to do now, is just like dip 830 00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:36,399 Speaker 1: the scoop into the ice, well, level it off, put 831 00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:38,680 Speaker 1: it in and not think about it. And things like 832 00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:41,560 Speaker 1: that shave precious time off the making of a drink. 833 00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:45,680 Speaker 1: And also it eliminates mistakes. You're not gonna guess, you're 834 00:45:45,680 --> 00:45:47,239 Speaker 1: not gonna get the wrong amount of crushed ice in 835 00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:48,960 Speaker 1: there because you don't have to think about it. And 836 00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:50,759 Speaker 1: that's just one example of some of the things I 837 00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:52,960 Speaker 1: was doing on that second level of how to make 838 00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:55,279 Speaker 1: a drink in the least amount of time, um and 839 00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:58,239 Speaker 1: the least amount of money. Part is you know you 840 00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:00,920 Speaker 1: want of course you're using quality ingredients, but you're not 841 00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:05,000 Speaker 1: going to use a twenty bottle of twenty year appleton 842 00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:07,440 Speaker 1: Jamaican room to make your my tie. It's just not 843 00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:10,160 Speaker 1: you can't do that. You can't charge people fifty dollars 844 00:46:10,200 --> 00:46:12,400 Speaker 1: for my time. UM. So you have to come up 845 00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,919 Speaker 1: with other RUMs and mixed, you know, mixed less expensive RUMs, 846 00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:17,880 Speaker 1: they're still going to give you that depth of flavor. 847 00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:20,920 Speaker 1: So it's just a couple of, you know, examples of 848 00:46:20,920 --> 00:46:24,960 Speaker 1: the kind of uh much. You know, you could go 849 00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:28,719 Speaker 1: much much deeper and much broader um into this whole 850 00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:31,360 Speaker 1: phenomenon than I ever did when I was just writing 851 00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:34,080 Speaker 1: the books, when I would look back on some of 852 00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:37,160 Speaker 1: these recipes and see things that had never occurred to 853 00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:39,759 Speaker 1: me before I owned a restaurant, before I ever had 854 00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:43,799 Speaker 1: to make a menu for a for paying customers. If 855 00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:47,520 Speaker 1: you look at Dawn's early recipes from that ninety seven book, 856 00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:50,279 Speaker 1: they're all in very jagged proportions at one and a 857 00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:54,000 Speaker 1: half ounces of this um, quarter ouns of that, three 858 00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:56,640 Speaker 1: quarter ounces of this, half an ounce of that. And 859 00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,640 Speaker 1: if you look at that same recipe um from a 860 00:46:59,719 --> 00:47:03,239 Speaker 1: note book from the nineteen sixties, you know, thirty years later, 861 00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:06,480 Speaker 1: when he had thirty years more experienced that same drink, 862 00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:10,920 Speaker 1: he really he refigured it, reconceived it with the same 863 00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:15,600 Speaker 1: ingredients to be three quarter rounds, three quarter rounds, three 864 00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:17,560 Speaker 1: quarter arounds, three quarter a rounds, three quarter rounds, all 865 00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:22,000 Speaker 1: the way down the line. And that speed he did 866 00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:24,880 Speaker 1: that purely so that the drink could get out there faster. 867 00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:28,279 Speaker 1: Because he was dealing with a more high volume situation 868 00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,759 Speaker 1: instead of making a drink at his tiny little bar 869 00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:33,759 Speaker 1: in Hollywood, he was he had to come up with 870 00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:37,800 Speaker 1: recipes that could be made, you know, serve seven thousand 871 00:47:37,880 --> 00:47:40,440 Speaker 1: drinks a night. So you see that he wasn't just 872 00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:43,040 Speaker 1: thinking about taste and flavor. He was he was thinking 873 00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:45,280 Speaker 1: about those things, but he was also thinking about speed, 874 00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:48,919 Speaker 1: which was kind of a fascinating revelation which I which 875 00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:50,960 Speaker 1: never would have occurred to me if I hadn't actually 876 00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:53,880 Speaker 1: done a menu from my own place. This is funny 877 00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:56,920 Speaker 1: how well it parallels a lot of inventions we look 878 00:47:56,960 --> 00:47:59,160 Speaker 1: at that are more traditionally the kind of thing you 879 00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:00,759 Speaker 1: think of as in an invention, you know, a new 880 00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:05,120 Speaker 1: piece of technology. Where when we think about invention in 881 00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:07,440 Speaker 1: a zoomed out way where you're you know, not looking 882 00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:09,960 Speaker 1: at it very hard, we tend to think of invention 883 00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:13,640 Speaker 1: as the space of, you know, discovering what's possible, whereas 884 00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:16,200 Speaker 1: when you zoom in on the process of invention is 885 00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:20,480 Speaker 1: it is much more often about what is practical. Yeah, absolutely, 886 00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:23,120 Speaker 1: that's That's a perfect way to encapsulate it. Um, and 887 00:48:23,160 --> 00:48:25,920 Speaker 1: that was my learning curve. It's like, and you're absolutely 888 00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:29,920 Speaker 1: right with whether the invention is um, you know, uh, 889 00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:36,480 Speaker 1: the internal combustion engine, whether the invention is a zombie cocktail, um, 890 00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:40,800 Speaker 1: whether the invention is like a paper cutter. It's all about, yeah, Okay, 891 00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:43,960 Speaker 1: you've invented this thing. Now you have to be able 892 00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:46,239 Speaker 1: to replicate it, you know, and you have to be 893 00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:49,520 Speaker 1: able to make it faster and cheaper and uh and 894 00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:53,480 Speaker 1: streamline it and you know. So yeah, you're absolutely right. 895 00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:55,520 Speaker 1: It's the same process. I never thought of it that 896 00:48:55,560 --> 00:49:00,480 Speaker 1: way until today. Now you you have also invented some tales. 897 00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:04,239 Speaker 1: So I'm curious, like, what is what is your your 898 00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:07,799 Speaker 1: mindset like today? If you're if you're seeking to come 899 00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:09,759 Speaker 1: up with a new cocktail are you doing are you 900 00:49:10,120 --> 00:49:14,759 Speaker 1: engaging in this exercise as Jeff Barry the the the 901 00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:18,560 Speaker 1: author and UH and tiki historian, or is it more 902 00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:23,200 Speaker 1: in the mindset of of Jeff Berry the restaurant owner. Um, 903 00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:26,520 Speaker 1: that's a great question. Um, it's all of that has 904 00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:28,200 Speaker 1: to be thrown out of your head when you're trying 905 00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:33,680 Speaker 1: to create something. UM. I mean I used to work 906 00:49:33,719 --> 00:49:38,480 Speaker 1: in uh screenwriting and journalism and advertising, other forms of writing, 907 00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:40,680 Speaker 1: and the best piece of advice I ever got about 908 00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:45,319 Speaker 1: writing anything was right with no attachment to outcome. Don't 909 00:49:45,360 --> 00:49:47,600 Speaker 1: think about who's going to want to buy this, or 910 00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:50,520 Speaker 1: even who's going to want to read it. Just write it, 911 00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,799 Speaker 1: just get it done, and and then worry about all 912 00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:57,560 Speaker 1: that other stuff later. And the drink making process has 913 00:49:57,600 --> 00:50:00,600 Speaker 1: always been like that for me, and it hasn't changed. Um, 914 00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:03,800 Speaker 1: owning the restaurant hasn't changed it. Um, you know, writing 915 00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:05,920 Speaker 1: these books hasn't changed it for me. I wasn't. I 916 00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:09,319 Speaker 1: wasn't In many ways. Still I am an amateur in 917 00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:10,960 Speaker 1: the in every sense of the world. I mean I 918 00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:15,080 Speaker 1: an amateur as someone who loves um, whatever it is 919 00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:17,560 Speaker 1: they're obsessed about. So for me, it was a hobby, 920 00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:20,520 Speaker 1: all this drink stuff all through the nineties and nineties, 921 00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:24,160 Speaker 1: and in writing these books until we actually opened Latitude, 922 00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:25,799 Speaker 1: it was it was a hobby. It was it was. 923 00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:28,040 Speaker 1: I was coming at it as an amateur. I had 924 00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:32,400 Speaker 1: no professional training whatsoever. Um, you know, no mentors, no 925 00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:35,799 Speaker 1: guide books, nothing to go on about how to make 926 00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:39,960 Speaker 1: a drink. That was That wasn't Yeah, that was mine. 927 00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:41,520 Speaker 1: I mean, have plenty of guide books about how to 928 00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:43,359 Speaker 1: make a drink. It wasn't mine. But as far as 929 00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:49,040 Speaker 1: creating a drink, that all started to happen kind of accidentally. UM. 930 00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:52,160 Speaker 1: I was researching these recipes. I was uncovering all these 931 00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:55,520 Speaker 1: long lust drinks, and and very often the recipes were 932 00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:59,000 Speaker 1: either in code, which we talked about earlier and I 933 00:50:59,040 --> 00:51:01,920 Speaker 1: had to crack the code UM, or there were fragments, 934 00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:04,520 Speaker 1: or they were like bartender's notes to self. UM. We 935 00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:07,520 Speaker 1: already used the example of how they wouldn't indicate how 936 00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:09,760 Speaker 1: the drink was actually put together, whether it was shaken 937 00:51:09,840 --> 00:51:11,799 Speaker 1: or blended, and if it was blended how much ice. 938 00:51:12,080 --> 00:51:16,440 Speaker 1: So there's a lot of guesswork involved, and over time, 939 00:51:17,200 --> 00:51:19,879 Speaker 1: without realizing it, bias mosis I was sort of like 940 00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:24,160 Speaker 1: getting an education in tropical mixology just by trying to 941 00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:27,560 Speaker 1: recreate these drinks that already existed in one form or another. 942 00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:31,800 Speaker 1: And it's gradually it got to the point where I 943 00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:34,400 Speaker 1: felt confident enough to try and invent my own stuff. 944 00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:37,319 Speaker 1: But it was always just noodling around, you know. It 945 00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:39,879 Speaker 1: was just like tinkering with something in the garage pretty much. 946 00:51:40,520 --> 00:51:45,799 Speaker 1: UM I never developed a method for making a drink. 947 00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:49,239 Speaker 1: It would always just be Okay, here's this bottle. What's 948 00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:52,360 Speaker 1: what's this stuff? Some very herbal charge. Troots is some 949 00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:55,760 Speaker 1: very herbal cure. What other drinks have been made with Chartroots? 950 00:51:55,800 --> 00:51:59,120 Speaker 1: Have looked at it? Okay, I wonder what it works with. 951 00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:03,040 Speaker 1: And it would always just be messing around with no 952 00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:08,560 Speaker 1: attachment outcome. It's like maybe something will happen, maybe it won't. 953 00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:12,839 Speaker 1: And that's still kind of way I do things. It's 954 00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:15,160 Speaker 1: the only way I know how to do things. Um, 955 00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:17,600 Speaker 1: I don't start with this. You know, some some people 956 00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:20,000 Speaker 1: have proportions in their head, like you will talk to 957 00:52:20,080 --> 00:52:23,919 Speaker 1: some um bartenders and cocktail makers to say, well, there's 958 00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:27,000 Speaker 1: a golden mean for um, you know, for a dacori 959 00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:30,680 Speaker 1: or or it's it's three quarter ounces, three quarter rounds, 960 00:52:30,680 --> 00:52:33,719 Speaker 1: two ounce, or it's half ounce, half ounce, one or 961 00:52:33,719 --> 00:52:37,480 Speaker 1: half ounce starts. I don't believe in that. It's just like, um, 962 00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:40,520 Speaker 1: it doesn't work. It just doesn't work for me. I 963 00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:42,360 Speaker 1: just sort of like get in there and mess around 964 00:52:42,480 --> 00:52:45,279 Speaker 1: and and just just make a mess and um and 965 00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:49,439 Speaker 1: see what happens. Um. It's much more fun that way 966 00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:51,600 Speaker 1: for me. Anyway, I would feel very constricted if there 967 00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:54,360 Speaker 1: was some sort of methodology that you have to follow now. 968 00:52:55,080 --> 00:52:58,799 Speaker 1: Of course, the fact is that I'm no longer making 969 00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,640 Speaker 1: drinks just to drink from myself and my friends in 970 00:53:01,719 --> 00:53:04,000 Speaker 1: my house and maybe put them in a book if 971 00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:06,879 Speaker 1: they're any good. Now, whenever I make a drink, it's 972 00:53:06,920 --> 00:53:09,640 Speaker 1: for for a reason, you know. Either I have to 973 00:53:09,680 --> 00:53:12,200 Speaker 1: go do a cocktail seminar somewhere and I have to 974 00:53:12,320 --> 00:53:15,000 Speaker 1: use uh, sponsor ingredients, so I have to come up 975 00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:19,120 Speaker 1: with a drink that uses those, or maybe the latitude 976 00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:21,400 Speaker 1: needs a new drink on the menu, or some magazine 977 00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:23,279 Speaker 1: or newspaper wants me to create a drink for them. 978 00:53:23,680 --> 00:53:28,279 Speaker 1: So that's a very specific outcome that needs to be met. 979 00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:33,120 Speaker 1: And that actually is helpful because when you have a frame, 980 00:53:33,160 --> 00:53:35,360 Speaker 1: when you're put in a box and you have to 981 00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:38,799 Speaker 1: do something that uses this or that ingredient, um, and 982 00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:40,680 Speaker 1: it has to be done by such and such a date, 983 00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:49,239 Speaker 1: those limitations are very freeing, paradoxically ironically, because you can 984 00:53:49,320 --> 00:53:52,960 Speaker 1: only go down that road and not down the fifty 985 00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:56,120 Speaker 1: other roads that you might have ventured down and reached 986 00:53:56,120 --> 00:53:58,680 Speaker 1: the dead end at um. So if you if you 987 00:53:58,719 --> 00:54:00,759 Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about, Yah, Yeah, it's kind of 988 00:54:00,760 --> 00:54:03,440 Speaker 1: like a writer's prompt imagine. Yeah, so um, I know 989 00:54:03,480 --> 00:54:05,080 Speaker 1: I've been going on and about this, but of course 990 00:54:05,120 --> 00:54:08,560 Speaker 1: it's it's m always been an obsession of mine. And 991 00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:11,520 Speaker 1: it's fun. I mean, it's fun to do it without 992 00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:16,279 Speaker 1: any restrictions or worrying about outcome. But also you don't 993 00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:19,880 Speaker 1: come up with that many drinks that way, if you know. 994 00:54:20,239 --> 00:54:23,719 Speaker 1: It's uh, it's like I just did a bunch of 995 00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:27,800 Speaker 1: drinks for this uh pure company called Real Real Syrups, 996 00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:30,399 Speaker 1: the Coconut and Passion Food and all there are things, 997 00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:33,480 Speaker 1: and and they wanted seventeen recipes, one for each one 998 00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:35,800 Speaker 1: of their expressions, one of these one of their flavors. 999 00:54:35,800 --> 00:54:37,920 Speaker 1: I thought, oh my god, that'll take me five years. 1000 00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:40,640 Speaker 1: You know, I come up with one drink every three years. 1001 00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:45,880 Speaker 1: But having those restrictions just I zoomed through it like 1002 00:54:45,880 --> 00:54:49,480 Speaker 1: I did it in about five days, and it was 1003 00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:53,160 Speaker 1: very freeing to be put in this box where Okay, 1004 00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:56,520 Speaker 1: you have to use this Raspberry pure to drink um. 1005 00:54:56,600 --> 00:55:00,760 Speaker 1: You know, that's that's that's job one. H and you can't. 1006 00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:03,360 Speaker 1: You can't use rum and every single one of these 1007 00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:06,680 Speaker 1: seventeen drinks. What will work with a Raspberry that isn't rum? 1008 00:55:06,719 --> 00:55:09,399 Speaker 1: So then you have a different based spirit. You lock 1009 00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:14,879 Speaker 1: into that and Okay, what citrus works with raspberry? Does 1010 00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:17,600 Speaker 1: lime work? Does lemon work? What's the best one? So 1011 00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:21,680 Speaker 1: you get it done faster, um, and it narrows your 1012 00:55:21,719 --> 00:55:24,400 Speaker 1: focus to the point where you can actually complete something. 1013 00:55:24,680 --> 00:55:27,319 Speaker 1: So one of my favorite facts that stood out from 1014 00:55:27,560 --> 00:55:30,200 Speaker 1: portions of the Caribbean was just this weird bit where 1015 00:55:30,200 --> 00:55:34,200 Speaker 1: you mentioned that I think it was Jackie Kennedy's recipe 1016 00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:39,160 Speaker 1: for a dacriri involved frozen lime made. It was store 1017 00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:44,120 Speaker 1: bought frozen lime made. UM. That makes me wonder do 1018 00:55:44,120 --> 00:55:46,120 Speaker 1: you have thoughts about and and again this is going 1019 00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:51,040 Speaker 1: to involve, you know, subjective things about taste. But from 1020 00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:55,360 Speaker 1: your perspective, what leads to the proliferation of bad recipes 1021 00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:59,440 Speaker 1: for things? Um? That's a great question. And in the 1022 00:55:59,480 --> 00:56:03,200 Speaker 1: case of Jackie Kennedy's dachiri, which was frozen lime maide 1023 00:56:03,200 --> 00:56:05,600 Speaker 1: and a few drops of flaring um and rum, it's 1024 00:56:05,800 --> 00:56:10,560 Speaker 1: very often um economics. Uh. Now, of course, Jackie Kennedy 1025 00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:12,359 Speaker 1: came from a very wealthy family and she was married 1026 00:56:12,360 --> 00:56:14,680 Speaker 1: at the president United States. They could afford fresh lime juices, 1027 00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:18,200 Speaker 1: they could afford to pay uh an in house chef 1028 00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:20,799 Speaker 1: to make their decories for them. But you have to 1029 00:56:20,840 --> 00:56:24,480 Speaker 1: remember the times. This was during the beginning of the 1030 00:56:24,560 --> 00:56:31,000 Speaker 1: industrial food complex, where you had frozen TV dinners, frozen juices, 1031 00:56:31,120 --> 00:56:35,520 Speaker 1: frozen everybody had a refrigerator and a freezer and all 1032 00:56:35,560 --> 00:56:39,560 Speaker 1: the kitchens with appliances. Suburbia was growing and convenience was 1033 00:56:39,600 --> 00:56:42,799 Speaker 1: the order of the day, and food companies responded to that. 1034 00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:46,239 Speaker 1: So all of a sudden, everything was frozen. Everything was 1035 00:56:46,320 --> 00:56:48,880 Speaker 1: pre mixed and in a bottle like Trader Vix, Trader 1036 00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:51,359 Speaker 1: of X, my time mix. You know, why why mess 1037 00:56:51,400 --> 00:56:53,480 Speaker 1: around with all this other stuff, Just pour two ounces 1038 00:56:53,520 --> 00:56:56,960 Speaker 1: of that into your glass. So convenience, um you know, 1039 00:56:57,200 --> 00:57:03,800 Speaker 1: industrial mass production methods for food and drink. And that's 1040 00:57:03,880 --> 00:57:11,719 Speaker 1: really what killed the cocktail, was this um ah, the convenience. 1041 00:57:11,840 --> 00:57:13,960 Speaker 1: It was killed by convenience. It was killed by like 1042 00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:19,000 Speaker 1: canned and bottled mixes and by frozen this and frozen that. 1043 00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:22,720 Speaker 1: And you know, every restaurants realized they could cut their 1044 00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:27,320 Speaker 1: costs tremendously by not using fresh citrus um and by 1045 00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:30,919 Speaker 1: just not having to buy five ingredients, just buying Trader Vicks, 1046 00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:33,280 Speaker 1: My TIMEX. You would go into a lot of places 1047 00:57:33,840 --> 00:57:36,320 Speaker 1: in the seventies and eighties, and you would see Trader 1048 00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:39,200 Speaker 1: Vicks my time mixed behind a bar of even a 1049 00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:43,400 Speaker 1: really good, expensive restaurant. They would just use that stuff. Um, 1050 00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:46,960 Speaker 1: great for Vick, not so great for the Well. Yeah, 1051 00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:49,919 Speaker 1: I'm not an expert at this, but I mean, am 1052 00:57:49,920 --> 00:57:52,680 Speaker 1: I correct in thinking that citrus juice just does not 1053 00:57:52,840 --> 00:57:55,840 Speaker 1: age well? That is not something that that sits around 1054 00:57:55,840 --> 00:57:58,600 Speaker 1: on the shelf and stays good. There's a There are 1055 00:57:58,600 --> 00:58:01,800 Speaker 1: a couple of artenders in New York who are very 1056 00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:05,160 Speaker 1: very scientific in their approach these things, Donne Lee and 1057 00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:11,160 Speaker 1: Dave Arnold, and they have conducted tests under laboratory conditions, um, 1058 00:58:11,200 --> 00:58:14,760 Speaker 1: trying to figure out what the shelf life of fresh 1059 00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:18,240 Speaker 1: squeeze sittresses and when it's at its peak and um, 1060 00:58:18,640 --> 00:58:21,240 Speaker 1: I don't remember the specifics, but I think after four 1061 00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:26,360 Speaker 1: hours it starts to lose its Christmas and it's uh, 1062 00:58:26,360 --> 00:58:29,440 Speaker 1: it's you know, it's best flavor. I've found that you 1063 00:58:29,440 --> 00:58:35,120 Speaker 1: can keep it refrigerated fresh juice for two or three days, Um, 1064 00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:37,280 Speaker 1: but it's not going to taste the same the third 1065 00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:39,960 Speaker 1: day as it did when you fresh squeezed it. It's 1066 00:58:40,000 --> 00:58:43,680 Speaker 1: kind of interesting. Oxygen oxygen eating it um, Like there 1067 00:58:43,720 --> 00:58:46,120 Speaker 1: are other bartenders to say, well, I don't think fresh 1068 00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:49,600 Speaker 1: squeeze juice is that when when you're taking when you're 1069 00:58:49,600 --> 00:58:51,760 Speaker 1: cutting a line open, when you're making a decory, for example, 1070 00:58:51,840 --> 00:58:54,440 Speaker 1: run line and shutar Um. Okay, if you're at the bar, 1071 00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:57,520 Speaker 1: you cut a line open, you're squeezing it into the shaker, 1072 00:58:57,920 --> 00:58:59,919 Speaker 1: so it's as fresh as you could possibly get as 1073 00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:03,200 Speaker 1: has been cut and squeeze. Um. There are bartenders who 1074 00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:05,520 Speaker 1: will tell you that that doesn't taste as good as 1075 00:59:05,760 --> 00:59:08,440 Speaker 1: lime juice that's been in the well for about two 1076 00:59:08,560 --> 00:59:13,640 Speaker 1: or three hours, which is which is oxygenated a little bit. Um. 1077 00:59:13,640 --> 00:59:16,080 Speaker 1: You know. So it's a there's a there's actually a 1078 00:59:16,120 --> 00:59:19,640 Speaker 1: lot of You scratch a bartender, You scratch any bartender, 1079 00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:21,920 Speaker 1: and you're gonna find somebody who was a medical student, 1080 00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:26,720 Speaker 1: or an architecture student, or um, you know, a science whiz. Um. 1081 00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:29,800 Speaker 1: There're people to gravitate to bartending for all kinds of reasons. 1082 00:59:29,800 --> 00:59:33,880 Speaker 1: But you people get people with a technical bent and 1083 00:59:33,920 --> 00:59:36,720 Speaker 1: with a scientific background have really really gotten into this stuff. 1084 00:59:36,760 --> 00:59:40,480 Speaker 1: It's kind of cool to see. I basically flunked chemistry 1085 00:59:40,520 --> 00:59:41,840 Speaker 1: in high school, so for me, a lot of the 1086 00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:43,920 Speaker 1: stuff just goes right over my head. But but it's 1087 00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:48,240 Speaker 1: fascinating to see that approach being taken to something like cocktails. 1088 00:59:48,280 --> 00:59:50,560 Speaker 1: So is it safe to assume that the pre mixed 1089 00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:53,760 Speaker 1: Trader Vix My Time Mix was bad? Is that? Is 1090 00:59:53,760 --> 00:59:55,880 Speaker 1: that the case? You know what, that's a good question 1091 00:59:55,880 --> 00:59:59,800 Speaker 1: because I've actually used it when I'm on vacation, like 1092 01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:02,640 Speaker 1: to Hawaii, for example. You go into like the ABC store, 1093 01:00:02,680 --> 01:00:05,160 Speaker 1: which is like there's seven eleven or uh, you know, 1094 01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:07,560 Speaker 1: convenience store, and they all have Trader Vick My Time 1095 01:00:07,640 --> 01:00:10,720 Speaker 1: Mix uh in there for tourists who want to make 1096 01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:13,520 Speaker 1: my Time of hotel room. It's not bad, It's actually 1097 01:00:13,560 --> 01:00:17,680 Speaker 1: okay if that's what you've got to work with. Um, 1098 01:00:17,720 --> 01:00:20,800 Speaker 1: you know, when you're when you're staying in a hotel 1099 01:00:21,160 --> 01:00:24,040 Speaker 1: and you're a tourist in Hawaii, it's the only game 1100 01:00:24,080 --> 01:00:25,680 Speaker 1: in town. Like it's either that or you're gonna have 1101 01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:28,920 Speaker 1: to try and track down Oorge Out Syrup and you know, 1102 01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:33,959 Speaker 1: Orange Cursau and all this other stuff and just start 1103 01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:38,440 Speaker 1: turning your hotel into a bar room. Um so um wait, hey, 1104 01:00:38,520 --> 01:00:41,280 Speaker 1: you know when in Rome, it's I do not wish 1105 01:00:41,320 --> 01:00:43,920 Speaker 1: to u to dis Trader Vick's My Time Mix. It's 1106 01:00:43,960 --> 01:00:47,440 Speaker 1: one of the better ones out there. But um, is 1107 01:00:47,480 --> 01:00:49,520 Speaker 1: it as good as a fresh made My Time? I 1108 01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:51,720 Speaker 1: don't think, you know, not even Trader Vick would argue 1109 01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:56,360 Speaker 1: with me there. All right, Uh, Jeff the beach bum Barry, 1110 01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:58,360 Speaker 1: thanks for coming on the show and chatting with us 1111 01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:01,800 Speaker 1: about Tiki history, my tai history. The books are all 1112 01:01:01,840 --> 01:01:05,760 Speaker 1: out there. The app total tiki is excellent. I I 1113 01:01:05,800 --> 01:01:09,320 Speaker 1: am proud or ashamed to admit that I use it 1114 01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:13,360 Speaker 1: almost in a daily basis. And uh and and also 1115 01:01:13,360 --> 01:01:15,439 Speaker 1: I'm a huge fan of of your restaurant. I only 1116 01:01:15,440 --> 01:01:17,000 Speaker 1: make it down to New Orleans once a year, but 1117 01:01:17,000 --> 01:01:19,000 Speaker 1: when I go, I make sure I come by for 1118 01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:22,200 Speaker 1: at least a couple of drinks. But what else is 1119 01:01:22,200 --> 01:01:24,640 Speaker 1: going on in the world of of of the Beach 1120 01:01:24,680 --> 01:01:27,000 Speaker 1: bumb What do you have coming up or anything else 1121 01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:30,920 Speaker 1: you want to tell our listeners about. Well, the one 1122 01:01:30,960 --> 01:01:33,640 Speaker 1: thing which it's a little early to talk about is 1123 01:01:33,680 --> 01:01:37,080 Speaker 1: it just ended. But I've partnered up with Cocktail Kingdom 1124 01:01:37,240 --> 01:01:42,720 Speaker 1: about doing some pop up bars. Um Sip and Santa's 1125 01:01:42,720 --> 01:01:44,960 Speaker 1: serf Shack, which they've shortened just a Sip and Santa. 1126 01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:49,840 Speaker 1: It's a mash up of Christmas decor and flavors and 1127 01:01:50,200 --> 01:01:54,720 Speaker 1: tiki decorn flavors, and we had twenty seven bars across 1128 01:01:54,760 --> 01:01:58,440 Speaker 1: the country this past season participating in it. So we 1129 01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:01,920 Speaker 1: come up with like tiki drinks, tropical drinks, but have 1130 01:02:02,160 --> 01:02:05,560 Speaker 1: like what you associate with the holidays is flavors, uh, 1131 01:02:05,560 --> 01:02:10,600 Speaker 1: you know, cinnamon and cranberry and things like that. And 1132 01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:13,720 Speaker 1: then there's Christmas decor overlaid on top of tiv to course, 1133 01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:17,960 Speaker 1: we have two over the top uh decre themes graph 1134 01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:20,240 Speaker 1: it onto each other. And I mentioned it now because 1135 01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:24,120 Speaker 1: I start working on this pretty much in January, once 1136 01:02:24,200 --> 01:02:26,520 Speaker 1: Christmas is over. So when you're asking what's next for me, 1137 01:02:26,560 --> 01:02:28,560 Speaker 1: what's next is coming up with the recipes for the 1138 01:02:29,720 --> 01:02:32,400 Speaker 1: Sit and Sama pop ups, which aren't going to happen 1139 01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:37,320 Speaker 1: until after Thanksgiving, but that's what's gonna be occupying me now. Um. 1140 01:02:37,360 --> 01:02:41,480 Speaker 1: And then it's just running latitude and uh, you know, 1141 01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:43,560 Speaker 1: trying to get in there whenever I can. And we've 1142 01:02:43,560 --> 01:02:46,400 Speaker 1: got such a great crew now, um got our sea legs, 1143 01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:48,880 Speaker 1: which there's really not much for me to do there anymore, 1144 01:02:48,880 --> 01:02:52,760 Speaker 1: which I love. I'm basically just picking stuff up off 1145 01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:55,120 Speaker 1: the floor that you're like, oh, there's a plastic monkey 1146 01:02:55,120 --> 01:02:58,480 Speaker 1: that fell from the table. That's basically my job now 1147 01:02:58,560 --> 01:03:01,880 Speaker 1: because everybody else has got it all together. Um so, 1148 01:03:01,880 --> 01:03:03,400 Speaker 1: so yeah, I had a lot of traveling. I've been 1149 01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:04,840 Speaker 1: doing a lot of traveling, going to a lot of 1150 01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:10,440 Speaker 1: cocktail festivals, giving drink seminars. I'll be in UM Sacramento 1151 01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:13,920 Speaker 1: next week for the Sacramento Cocktail Conference, and I'm going 1152 01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:17,960 Speaker 1: to be in Atlanta actually UM for the March Tiki 1153 01:03:18,040 --> 01:03:22,520 Speaker 1: Festival in Awayle, I believe it's called UM. So you know, 1154 01:03:22,560 --> 01:03:26,040 Speaker 1: Florida and London and all kinds of other places. It's 1155 01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:29,680 Speaker 1: interesting with the whole cocktail renaissance that cocktail festivals and 1156 01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:33,680 Speaker 1: cocktail conferences sprung up everywhere, so I spent a lot 1157 01:03:33,680 --> 01:03:36,720 Speaker 1: of my time just going to those. At this point, awesome, Well, 1158 01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:39,880 Speaker 1: we'll safe travels as you you make your way around 1159 01:03:39,880 --> 01:03:41,480 Speaker 1: the map for all of this, and we'll be looking 1160 01:03:41,720 --> 01:03:46,280 Speaker 1: forward to Christmas. All right, all right, thank you, thanks, 1161 01:03:52,240 --> 01:03:54,840 Speaker 1: all right, So there you have it. Thanks once again 1162 01:03:54,960 --> 01:03:58,959 Speaker 1: to Jeff Beach Bumbarry for chatting with us again. He's 1163 01:03:59,000 --> 01:04:01,760 Speaker 1: the author of several book that you'll find imprint, including 1164 01:04:01,760 --> 01:04:04,960 Speaker 1: Beach Bumberrriy Sip and Safari and at beach Bumberri's Potions 1165 01:04:05,000 --> 01:04:08,880 Speaker 1: of the Caribbean again. His restaurant is beach Bumberry's Latitude 1166 01:04:08,920 --> 01:04:11,640 Speaker 1: twenty nine in the French Quarter of New Orleans, and 1167 01:04:11,800 --> 01:04:13,640 Speaker 1: if you want to check out his website, it's beach 1168 01:04:13,640 --> 01:04:16,880 Speaker 1: bumberry dot com. L In the app Total Tiki, that's 1169 01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:19,600 Speaker 1: the app that I use way too often, but it's 1170 01:04:19,640 --> 01:04:22,600 Speaker 1: a wonderful app. It's just right there on your phone. 1171 01:04:22,600 --> 01:04:26,760 Speaker 1: You have all these different um tiki cocktail recipes you 1172 01:04:26,800 --> 01:04:29,120 Speaker 1: can pull up. You can just slide through, like all 1173 01:04:29,160 --> 01:04:31,520 Speaker 1: the different versions of say the Zombie or the my Taie, 1174 01:04:31,640 --> 01:04:34,120 Speaker 1: and they're right there are your fingertips. Huge thanks as 1175 01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:37,600 Speaker 1: always to our excellent audio producer Seth Nicholas Johnson. If 1176 01:04:37,600 --> 01:04:39,000 Speaker 1: you would like to get in touch with us with 1177 01:04:39,120 --> 01:04:41,480 Speaker 1: feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest a 1178 01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:43,760 Speaker 1: topic for the future, or just to say hello, you 1179 01:04:43,800 --> 01:04:50,440 Speaker 1: can email us at contact at invention pod dot com. 1180 01:04:50,440 --> 01:04:53,560 Speaker 1: Invention is production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts 1181 01:04:53,600 --> 01:04:56,440 Speaker 1: for my Heart Radio because the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 1182 01:04:56,480 --> 01:04:58,120 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.