1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:06,240 Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound On. 2 00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:09,639 Speaker 1: Some of the greatest threat to our constitution are right 3 00:00:09,640 --> 00:00:12,479 Speaker 1: here in America. That has to be a red line. 4 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: We can't have tens of billions of dollars every election 5 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:18,240 Speaker 1: cycle floating around and not know where came from. Bloomberg 6 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: Sound On Politics, Policy Perspective from DC's top Name. This 7 00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: story is his oldest time rights about corporate malfeasance. If 8 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:27,920 Speaker 1: the surprise on time only is the major party, because 9 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: we know that typically independent candidates have a hard time winning. 10 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:34,080 Speaker 1: My job is to convince my colleagues that crypto is 11 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,879 Speaker 1: a garden of snakes. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew 12 00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio. Extreme weather, spiking, COVID cases, geopolitical tensions, 13 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: and a crypto meltdown. These are just a few of 14 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:52,120 Speaker 1: the big stories that we covered in and we're going 15 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: to dive deep into these issues that you need to 16 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 1: know before we head into three. On today's show, Welcome 17 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: to the Fastest hour in Politics. I'm Madison Mills in 18 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:04,160 Speaker 1: today for Joe Matthew. We got a great show ahead 19 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:06,399 Speaker 1: for you with a focus on the Supreme Court. The 20 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,760 Speaker 1: latest news on title forty two and the big SCOTUS 21 00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: moves you need to remember as we head into let's 22 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:15,840 Speaker 1: dive into our focus for the day here. Immigration. For 23 00:01:15,880 --> 00:01:19,120 Speaker 1: almost three years, the federal government has turned away migrants 24 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 1: seeking asylum at the US Mexico border under a public 25 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:26,160 Speaker 1: health order called Title forty two. The Supreme Court announced 26 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 1: Tuesday that the Trump era COVID nineteam border restrictions will 27 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 1: remain in effect during legal challenges. That's a victory for 28 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:37,320 Speaker 1: a lot of Republican challengers. Speaking with ABC news Phoenix 29 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 1: affiliate k t a Are on Wednesday, Sheriff Mark Daniels 30 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:44,959 Speaker 1: from Arizona responded to the decision, it gives communities both 31 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: on the border and also on our country a side relief, 32 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: but also it gives some time an opportunity for the 33 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 1: federal government to engage it to put an operational plan together. 34 00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 1: As communities breathe that side of relief, does the White House. 35 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 1: Here's Bloomberg political contributor Genie Schanzano on that I saw 36 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 1: this as a gift from the Supreme Court and the 37 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: conservatives on the Court to Joe Biden and the Biden administration, because, 38 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 1: of course, had they agreed to lift Title forty two, 39 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 1: they were facing an even larger influx of migrants on 40 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: the border, and as we've heard from El Paso and 41 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: all the border states, they are not prepared to handle that. 42 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: A gift of some sort for the Biden administration. Let's 43 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:33,680 Speaker 1: get more on that from Bloomberg's White House correspondent Jordan Fabian. Jordan, 44 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,760 Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us on this week 45 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: that a lot of your colleagues are off. We really 46 00:02:37,760 --> 00:02:41,519 Speaker 1: appreciate it. Give me the context here. What's the status 47 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:47,760 Speaker 1: of immigration at the border right now? Well, it's it's been, uh, 48 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 1: for the last really two or three years, very high 49 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:58,160 Speaker 1: numbers of migrants trying to cross the southwest border, and 50 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 1: it's only increasing. I've the US two months border agents 51 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 1: have had over two hundred thousand encounters with migrants, and so, uh, 52 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 1: I heard that what the your colleague said. Our colleague 53 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:14,480 Speaker 1: said earlier, this is a gift. But I mean, the 54 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:16,680 Speaker 1: fact of the matter is that Title forty two has 55 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 1: done little to deter the number of crossings, and in fact, 56 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: some people believe that it's only incentivizing more crossing. So 57 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,360 Speaker 1: it's very complicated situation happening right now, and there's a 58 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:32,520 Speaker 1: lot of uncertainty surrounding bordered immigration policy due to the 59 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: Supreme Court decision. Talk to me about the latter half 60 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: of what you just said, the idea that this could 61 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:41,720 Speaker 1: have been encouraging more migrants to come to the border. 62 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 1: Does this decision from the Supreme Court change that? So 63 00:03:46,880 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 1: what Title forty two does is allow authorities to quickly 64 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: expel uh, probably a little bit around half of the 65 00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:57,400 Speaker 1: migrants who show up at the border. Um. But but 66 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: under that program, uh, there's no real legal consequences for 67 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:04,040 Speaker 1: those people get turned away, so they can just try 68 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:06,720 Speaker 1: and cross again and again and again and again. And 69 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: what authorities have found is that, you know, there's the 70 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:13,120 Speaker 1: accounting people who have crossed five, six, seven, eight times, 71 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: and that's put strain on border agents because they have 72 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 1: to try and round all those people up again and again. 73 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 1: And so uh, with this this policy is still in place, 74 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:27,719 Speaker 1: they're going to still be dealing with that problem. Uh. 75 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,360 Speaker 1: And and there's not going to be real certainty about 76 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,479 Speaker 1: that for another few months as as this case worked 77 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 1: its way through the courts. Let's talk about the President, 78 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 1: who you spend a lot of your time covering for us. 79 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 1: Where did the Biden administration's immigration policy stand. Heading into 80 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 1: this Supreme Court decision, the Biden administration wanted a Title 81 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:52,720 Speaker 1: forty two gone, and uh, you know that you're the 82 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:55,599 Speaker 1: conturbator made a good point, which is that this, uh, 83 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,600 Speaker 1: this decision kind of saved them the headache of dealing 84 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 1: with a major new spike of migrants now. But it's 85 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 1: sort of like do you rip the band aid off 86 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: or do you rip the band or do you keep 87 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 1: it on and let the infection sort of fessor because 88 00:05:09,960 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: this policy, it's a public health policy that was tied 89 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:15,720 Speaker 1: from the pandemic, So it's eventually going to go away, 90 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:18,799 Speaker 1: and whether it's now or a few months from now, 91 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 1: they're going to have to deal with this. And you know, 92 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 1: the Biden administration has not succeeded in passing new immigration laws. Uh. 93 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:29,640 Speaker 1: They faced a lot of opposition from Republicans, and at 94 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,160 Speaker 1: the same time, Congress has not provided them with all 95 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: the money they wanted to deal with the influx of 96 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 1: the border. So they've really faced a lot of obstacles 97 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:41,920 Speaker 1: and trying to get their agenda on immigration path. Those 98 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:43,840 Speaker 1: obstacles are exactly what we're going to talk to our 99 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 1: panel about here. In a little bit. But just sticking 100 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: with President Biden, how does the current status of immigration 101 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: policy coming from the White House square with Biden's campaign promises, 102 00:05:56,080 --> 00:06:00,800 Speaker 1: with his promises on day one in office, he promised 103 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 1: to introduce an immigration reform bill, a comprehensive immigration reform bill, 104 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:07,359 Speaker 1: on on day one, and he did that, but it 105 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:12,440 Speaker 1: didn't really go anywhere. It was gonna provide passive citizenship 106 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 1: for the around eleven million illegal immigrants living in the 107 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 1: United States in exchange for uh, some enhanced border protection policies. 108 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:24,040 Speaker 1: But but that that sort of policy has been introduced 109 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: time and again over the past decade, and it hasn't 110 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: really gone anywhere. And even a smaller piece of legislation 111 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:32,839 Speaker 1: that was talked about in the Congress that would have 112 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: addressed the status of Dreamers, the young undocumented immigrants living 113 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:40,920 Speaker 1: in the United States, didn't go anywhere. And the prospects 114 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:43,360 Speaker 1: look even dimmer next year because Congress is going to 115 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:47,039 Speaker 1: be divided with the Republican House and the Democratic Senate, 116 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,800 Speaker 1: and there's just a lot of divisions, a lot of 117 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 1: opposition from Republicans to a deal like that, and so 118 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:57,479 Speaker 1: it's really hard to see the space for getting a 119 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 1: deal done, even though the situation that the border is 120 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:03,039 Speaker 1: becoming more and more dire. You've got division not only 121 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:06,280 Speaker 1: in Congress but also between state and federal governments. The 122 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: Justice is saying they'll hear arguments in late February or 123 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 1: early March on states bids to kind of intervene in 124 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 1: defense of this policy. And can you just explain to me, Jordan, 125 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 1: where do the states stand on this issue? So it's 126 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 1: a real legal mass. Madisone. But basically these states are 127 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 1: are there not actually party to the underlying lawsuit, but 128 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 1: they're nineteen Republican states who say that the repealing Title 129 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: forty two would cause the disaster at the border. And 130 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 1: what they're petitioning to do is intervene in this lawsuit 131 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: which was brought by the civil rights advocates who want 132 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 1: Title forty two gone. And so the Supreme Court at 133 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 1: first has to decide whether those states can intervene and 134 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 1: if they if and when they decide that, then they 135 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 1: would have to rule on the underlying lawsuits. So the 136 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: bottom line is that this could take months longer to 137 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 1: play out. The uncertainty surrounding Title forty two could could 138 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 1: continue well into next year. All right, Jordan, I want 139 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: to throw a wild card at you here. I know 140 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 1: that you are not on vacation with the White House 141 00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 1: family here, but let's pretend that you were. And you 142 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 1: got to ask President Biden a question about this issue. 143 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:22,320 Speaker 1: What is your biggest question for the Biden administration, for 144 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 1: the White House right now, specifically on immigration policy. It's 145 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 1: not a very creative question, masson, but but my basic question, 146 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 1: you know, what, what are you going to do about 147 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: this in a big way? Because you know, they've they've 148 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: proposed some things around the edges, like more money for 149 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,200 Speaker 1: the border, but really this is a systemic problem and 150 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:46,360 Speaker 1: it and it requires the big solution and uh, you 151 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 1: know it might require executive action, uh, in the absence 152 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:53,880 Speaker 1: of congressional action. So you know, my question would be, 153 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:55,320 Speaker 1: what are you gonna do about it? And are you 154 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:58,640 Speaker 1: going We're gonna try try and take matters into your 155 00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 1: own hands, as Barack Obama did, as Donald Trump did 156 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 1: on the issue of immigration, and try and do something 157 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:09,439 Speaker 1: to address the situation, because right now, this is one 158 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: area where they just don't seem to have a handle 159 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:14,000 Speaker 1: on the problem. Yeah, and it is a big problem 160 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:15,960 Speaker 1: and it's not going away. Jordan, Thank you so much 161 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 1: for joining us to give us the really important context 162 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 1: on that. Really appreciate your reporting on Title forty two. 163 00:09:22,280 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: We're gonna go now to Leon Fresco. He is a 164 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:28,079 Speaker 1: partner at Holland and Night former Deputy Assistant Attorney General 165 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 1: for the Office of Immigration Litigation. Leon, thank you so 166 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: much for being here to give us your expertise on this. 167 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:37,080 Speaker 1: Talk to me about your reaction to the SCOTUS news here. 168 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,080 Speaker 1: What would you say is the single biggest concern that 169 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:43,200 Speaker 1: you have about the impact of this decision from the 170 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 1: Supreme Court. Well, the interesting thing is that what's being 171 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: reported isn't exactly in line with the actual facts of 172 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:56,079 Speaker 1: what's going on, meaning that there are so many levels 173 00:09:56,080 --> 00:10:00,080 Speaker 1: that layers to these cases that it's really hard to 174 00:10:00,080 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 1: sort of get a straight arrow reporting of what is happening. 175 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:05,960 Speaker 1: And here's what I mean. So, for instance, in the 176 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:09,840 Speaker 1: Louisiana case, which is the case that's actually keeping now 177 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:14,559 Speaker 1: Title forty two in effect until at least now June 178 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,680 Speaker 1: of three, that's the case that the Biden administration could 179 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: have chosen to speed up in the appellate process and 180 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:26,679 Speaker 1: asked for expedited consideration, but they didn't, and so that's 181 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: why we don't have an answer on the fate of 182 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 1: Title forty two faster. Secondly, in the DC case, which 183 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,319 Speaker 1: is the case that was actually dealt with yesterday, but 184 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: the Supreme Court about this issue of whether the States 185 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:42,920 Speaker 1: could intervene or not and whether that decision from the 186 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 1: DC District would be stayed. The only reason there's a 187 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: decision to be staying now is because the Department of 188 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:55,200 Speaker 1: Justice took an appeal to the Court of Appeals of 189 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:57,920 Speaker 1: the d C Circuit. Had they not taken an appeal, 190 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:00,839 Speaker 1: there would have been nothing for the states. They intervened too, 191 00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: and there wouldn't have been yet again a stay. And 192 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:09,160 Speaker 1: so what's fascinating about this is the Biden administration could say, well, 193 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: we don't want type of forty two around, but that's 194 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: not actually consistent with two different litigation decisions that have 195 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:19,880 Speaker 1: been made in these cases. So the fair point is 196 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 1: to say they may have a loopwarm desire to have 197 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: tit of forty two around, but there are certainly the 198 00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 1: actions that have taken place are actions where it doesn't 199 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 1: seem like there's actually a great desire to entitle forty 200 00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:38,199 Speaker 1: two with regard to the Biden administration. Have we seen 201 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: comprehensive immigration plans from the right, Well, they are not 202 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: in the mood to do anything at the moment that 203 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:51,000 Speaker 1: would have sort of the pillars of immigration reform, which 204 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,360 Speaker 1: would be there're sort of three or why is that? 205 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,720 Speaker 1: Why are they not in the mood for that? Well, 206 00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:58,679 Speaker 1: I think they view the current situation on the border 207 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:02,880 Speaker 1: as one where to the extent that now you're seeing 208 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:05,839 Speaker 1: more and more programming in this regard, even not of 209 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,720 Speaker 1: just Fox News or News Max, but you're seeing it 210 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 1: on MSNBC and CNN. That that to that van takes 211 00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:15,600 Speaker 1: a situation to show that there's not an ability to 212 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 1: end those scenes on the southern border, and so why 213 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 1: basically give a hand up to a person who's not 214 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:25,960 Speaker 1: able to handle this situation. But at the end of 215 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 1: the day, I do think that there will be a 216 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:31,800 Speaker 1: confluence of factors that will hopefully lead to an immigration 217 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 1: reform efforts. And the question is when and how that 218 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:37,679 Speaker 1: will happen. When and how that will happen because as 219 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 1: as we've been mentioning, I mean, we're focusing on the border, 220 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: but migrants seeking asylum here this is a global issue. 221 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: As you know first Handley on this is this is 222 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 1: something that's that's happening and migrants seeking asylum here from 223 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,560 Speaker 1: countries around the globe. Do you get a sense that 224 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:58,760 Speaker 1: Washington is missing a story here on other nations with 225 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:03,120 Speaker 1: migrants seeking this Alum, Well, this is an interesting question 226 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 1: because there's sort of two buckets of what's going on 227 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 1: on the southern border. There's the pure political turkmoil buckets 228 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:15,880 Speaker 1: and that's what you're seeing from the Nicaragua Venezuela Cuba 229 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:18,960 Speaker 1: group that you're seeing in the southern border. And that 230 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:21,840 Speaker 1: there's the economic turmoil bucket, which is what you see 231 00:13:21,880 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 1: from the traditional Central American Mexican migration on the southern border. 232 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:29,080 Speaker 1: And then the Haiti situation is a bit of a 233 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:34,439 Speaker 1: hybrid of both, and that group is ebbing and flowing. 234 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: So when at one time you have the Central American 235 00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 1: economic migration and another time now you're seeing this political 236 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:44,840 Speaker 1: migration of Nicaragua veneers very like Cuba. But it's always something, 237 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:47,640 Speaker 1: and so the question is there's not. This is why 238 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 1: I'm always skeptical of these sort of root cause approaches, 239 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 1: because there's always gonna be different nations that will pop 240 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:57,200 Speaker 1: up that will lead to an asylum surge on the 241 00:13:57,240 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: southern border. So anything you do in one isn't gonna 242 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:02,880 Speaker 1: pick something that you do in another. What really is 243 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:08,720 Speaker 1: necessary is a system for people to report somewhere in 244 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 1: an orderly process that isn't one to two hundred feet 245 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:16,280 Speaker 1: inside of the US Southern border. That's what we have 246 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:18,320 Speaker 1: to get to a close up. So whether that's going 247 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:20,800 Speaker 1: to be at the U s Port of Entries, or 248 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,560 Speaker 1: whether that's going to be at US consulates in Mexico, 249 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:25,800 Speaker 1: or whether that's going to be a new pop up 250 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 1: locations on the Mexican side of the southern border. But basically, 251 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: what there has to be is a manageable stream of 252 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 1: appointments whereby people can present themselves, get fingerprinted, have a 253 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: vetting of whether they actually have a credible fear of 254 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 1: persecution in their home country. It's that infrastructure, right Leon. 255 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm so sorry to jump in here, but 256 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:50,800 Speaker 1: it's it's you talk a lot about the infrastructure changes 257 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 1: that need to be put in place to kind of 258 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 1: fix the system in your view. I know you also 259 00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 1: spend a lot of time speaking with individuals who are 260 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 1: going through this. Can you talk to me about what 261 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 1: we might be missing in the headlines about what those 262 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: asylum seekers are experiencing when, like Jordan mentioned earlier, they're 263 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 1: coming to the border multiple times again and again trying 264 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 1: to get entry into this country. Well, right, it's a 265 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:18,320 Speaker 1: terrible experience for them. They're putting all their possessions, their valuables, 266 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 1: their their life practically on the line, and they would 267 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 1: gladly follow an orderly process if one is available, but 268 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: they go to the ports of entry, or they hear 269 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 1: from people who are trying to wait at the port 270 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:32,160 Speaker 1: of entry and they're told there's no way to do that, 271 00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: or you have to go a hundred miles too, maybe 272 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:36,720 Speaker 1: this port, and then they go ahead, they do that, 273 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:38,760 Speaker 1: and then a hundred miles later they're told to go 274 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,680 Speaker 1: to another port. And all of that lead people to 275 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: just say, well, you know what, if that's what's gonna happen, 276 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:46,440 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna take matters into my own hands and 277 00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 1: cross the border. And that's what you don't want. You 278 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 1: don't want a policy that encourages that. And we we've 279 00:15:52,080 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 1: actually seen. What's fascinating is we now have the evidence 280 00:15:55,440 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 1: and the the Ukraine, the Ukrainian program very clear. Another 281 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:03,920 Speaker 1: big story Leon. Sorry to cut you off here, but 282 00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: we got to run another big story we covered yesterday, 283 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 1: what's going on in Ukraine. We're going to cover all 284 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:10,920 Speaker 1: of this and more coming up here. This is Bloomberg. 285 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Sound on on Bloomberg Radio. I'm Madison 286 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 1: Mills in for Joe Matthew. We're taking into immigration on 287 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: today's show, a big issue not going away anytime soon. 288 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,120 Speaker 1: Joining me to discuss is our panel today. We've got 289 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 1: Boyd Matheson, host of KSL Radio's Inside Source, Republican strategists 290 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: and former chief of staff for Senator Mike Lee. We've 291 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:43,000 Speaker 1: also got Max Burns, democratic strategists and founder of Third 292 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:46,200 Speaker 1: Degree Strategies. Thank you both so much for joining me today. 293 00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:48,760 Speaker 1: I'm excited that we've got you all on our panel 294 00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 1: because the two of you, I feel could not be 295 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: further politically. But we're going to try to get some 296 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 1: consensus here and we're gonna have a great conversation. Max. 297 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:58,920 Speaker 1: I want to begin with you. We've been dancing around 298 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 1: this discussion to day about whether or not the White 299 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 1: House reads this as a gift. What's your take? Does 300 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:07,840 Speaker 1: the Biden administration get let off the hook with this, Well, 301 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:09,680 Speaker 1: I think it does take some of the pressure off 302 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:12,600 Speaker 1: the White House because now they can wait until effectively 303 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: June for this decision, and it also allows them to 304 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,920 Speaker 1: message a bit more aggressively this idea that Republicans have said, 305 00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 1: you know that they they believe no government program, every 306 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 1: government program essentially becomes permanent, and are now lobbying the 307 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:31,320 Speaker 1: Supreme Court to extend what is a public health policy 308 00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:34,679 Speaker 1: into becoming sort of an immigration policy, which is I 309 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: think an argument that people will be receptive to. But 310 00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:40,920 Speaker 1: to your point, yes, it definitely takes this a little 311 00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:43,160 Speaker 1: bit off of Joe Biden's plate and hands it back 312 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 1: to the Supreme Court for a few months. Well, boyd, 313 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:48,480 Speaker 1: I want to get your take on this too, because 314 00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:51,600 Speaker 1: the White House yesterday White House Press Secretary said the 315 00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:55,000 Speaker 1: order gives Republicans in Congress plenty of time quote to 316 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:58,880 Speaker 1: move past political finger pointing and join their Democratic colleagues 317 00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:02,480 Speaker 1: in solving the child lunch at our border. What do 318 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 1: you make of that? I'm actually going to agree with 319 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 1: her because I will be an equal opportunity offender on 320 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:12,280 Speaker 1: this and this this is such a great example of 321 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: what happens when Congress doesn't do its job, and it 322 00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:19,200 Speaker 1: doesn't matter who's in power, and what happens when the 323 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:23,480 Speaker 1: executive branch or presidents act by executive order in regardless 324 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 1: of who's in the White House, will get done by 325 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 1: executive order, gets undone by executive order, or what gets 326 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 1: done by executive order ends up in the courts uh 327 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,199 Speaker 1: and works its way through. And we've seen that with immigration, 328 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:36,879 Speaker 1: We've seen that with student loan forgiveness. And to me, 329 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 1: that's the real issue of all of this is Congress 330 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:44,040 Speaker 1: can totally do this. I still firmly, passionately believe that 331 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 1: we could solve the immigration issue in a single afternoon 332 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:50,200 Speaker 1: on the floor of the House and the Senate, because 333 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:53,440 Speaker 1: everybody agrees. Everybody knows we need to have a secure border. 334 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: Everybody knows we need to fix this outdated system that 335 00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:59,359 Speaker 1: makes it impossible to work its way through. Everyone knows 336 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: we need to know who comes in and who leaves 337 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:03,800 Speaker 1: the country. I mean, if if Disneyland can tell me 338 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 1: where my kids are in the park at any point 339 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,120 Speaker 1: for three days, surety the greatest country on Earth can 340 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 1: figure out who comes in and who goes out. And so, 341 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:14,200 Speaker 1: to me, this is not about a policy issue. This 342 00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:17,720 Speaker 1: is about political will and I'll be equal opportunity offender 343 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 1: today both sides, uh, could really come to the table. 344 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:23,399 Speaker 1: And I actually hope, I actually hope that this little 345 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 1: break in this particular issue with Tile forty two actually 346 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,159 Speaker 1: create space to have a different kind of conversation. And 347 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:32,560 Speaker 1: I actually think it could be that gift to President 348 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:35,800 Speaker 1: Biden because he could lead this and not just call 349 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 1: out the Republicans, but call out his friends and see 350 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,000 Speaker 1: if we can't get something that would actually solve the 351 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 1: policy issue, just the political issue for both sides. But 352 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:46,439 Speaker 1: but I gotta stick with you on the political issue 353 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:49,800 Speaker 1: for one second here, because you mentioned political will, I 354 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: have to wonder what is the political will for Republicans 355 00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:56,960 Speaker 1: and Congress to attack this as we enter a divided session, uh, 356 00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:00,760 Speaker 1: and as we head into election. Is it is potentially 357 00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:05,400 Speaker 1: a convenient political football for the GOP. Yeah, it's it's 358 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,119 Speaker 1: always a convenient political issue, and this time it's for 359 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 1: the Republicans and next time it will be for the Democrats. 360 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,160 Speaker 1: And both sides raise millions and millions of dollars off 361 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,399 Speaker 1: of it and use it as a political wedge issue 362 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,879 Speaker 1: when it's convenient for them. And so the real test 363 00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 1: in where we really have to have somebody step up 364 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 1: with real leadership say let's not treat this as a 365 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:28,879 Speaker 1: political issue. Let's create this as a policy issue, and 366 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: let's start with what we agree on, and we don't 367 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 1: need a four thousand page bill that nobody's read. Let's 368 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 1: just start picking it up because there is massive agreement. 369 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 1: Let's let's let's dig into that policy that you're mentioning. 370 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: Because if there is that massive agreement that you mentioned, 371 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 1: I wonder what the specifics of that policy and that 372 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: consensus could look like. Max, we heard Gor, you know, 373 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: really passing the buck to Congress here. What is the 374 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:59,560 Speaker 1: consensus look like? Yeah, I think you make that point, 375 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: Neil Gore, which was very unconvinced by by taking this 376 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,480 Speaker 1: case in the first place and allowing this to continue on. 377 00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:10,080 Speaker 1: As he mentioned, this is not an immigration policy. This 378 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:13,680 Speaker 1: is a COVID policy. And there is a sense here, 379 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,280 Speaker 1: I think with Republicans, especially in the House, who are 380 00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:19,400 Speaker 1: about to go through this bruising decision of who their 381 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:21,720 Speaker 1: speaker will be, are going to need to come in 382 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 1: and do something that shows legitimacy that they can take 383 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 1: governing seriously. And there's a real opportunity here, I think 384 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:32,880 Speaker 1: to get something that is centrist on immigration. I think 385 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,119 Speaker 1: that most Democrats, even though they may not say so 386 00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 1: out loud, are more than willing to negotiate on something 387 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,040 Speaker 1: that gets us to a yes on immigration, that that 388 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 1: may not include an explicit pathway to citizenship, but provides 389 00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 1: maybe protection for dreamers. That's a little bit stronger than 390 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 1: has been the case so far. But this idea that 391 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:53,320 Speaker 1: that both sides are so far apart, I think is 392 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:57,600 Speaker 1: largely a product of of media more than it is 393 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,639 Speaker 1: the actual policymakers I speak to, and there is just 394 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: they're waiting for this moment to find an opportunity to 395 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: do this, And as long as they keep kicking it 396 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 1: to the courts and avoiding this issue, I mean, we're 397 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: not going to get there. Okay, So let's let's play 398 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:15,679 Speaker 1: a little game here and pretend that you are, you know, 399 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 1: on the floor in Congress. You're able to make one 400 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:23,159 Speaker 1: suggestion on immigration, Max, what do you say? What is 401 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 1: the thing that you think brings the two sides of 402 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:28,919 Speaker 1: the aisle together on this issue. I think we can 403 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 1: agree on streamlining the process for legal immigration, for especially 404 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 1: for skilled immigration. We've seen has been a major sticking 405 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:40,199 Speaker 1: point that both parties are unhappy with, and and Dreamers especially. 406 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,400 Speaker 1: I think now has become a very politically doable thing 407 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:45,880 Speaker 1: for both sides. I don't think there's anyone who thinks 408 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:49,000 Speaker 1: there is political points to be had in in trashing 409 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 1: these children who have have become in some cases exceptional 410 00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:56,480 Speaker 1: young Americans, And there's a lot of political value there 411 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,920 Speaker 1: in recognizing them and doing something to help out. Boy, 412 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 1: I want to ask you the same question, what do 413 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:04,560 Speaker 1: you say on the floor to kind of uh find 414 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:09,159 Speaker 1: common ground, but also more more specifically, to you know, 415 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 1: really make some policy moves here. Yes, I think it 416 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:16,080 Speaker 1: be really begins with this idea that we need to 417 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:18,600 Speaker 1: abandon the fake fight and the false choice, that we 418 00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 1: can have rule of law and compassion, that those are 419 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,000 Speaker 1: compatible principles. And I think we can even do that 420 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:27,200 Speaker 1: in the context of Title forty two. I mean, clearly, 421 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 1: we live in a country where the lady in the 422 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,880 Speaker 1: harbor says, bring me, you're tired, your poor, your huddled 423 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:36,040 Speaker 1: masses yearning to be free, and let's let them breathe free. 424 00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: And we understand that no one is more compassionate than 425 00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:42,760 Speaker 1: the people of this country, and so let's be compassionate 426 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: in a way that creates certainty. When we're doing things 427 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:49,439 Speaker 1: by executive order, we create uncertainty. I agree with Max, 428 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,680 Speaker 1: we need to make sure for the dreamers rather than 429 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,959 Speaker 1: doing this football back and forth and executive orders that 430 00:23:56,040 --> 00:24:00,359 Speaker 1: create more uncertainty in their lives. Let's do it, and 431 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:02,920 Speaker 1: let's do it. Uh, it makes make it certain. So 432 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:05,879 Speaker 1: h one, visas the dreamers we need to deal with 433 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:07,440 Speaker 1: for short title forty two, I think we can do 434 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:11,800 Speaker 1: with an honest, true asylum seekers who are in dress, 435 00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:15,000 Speaker 1: who are under threat of their own lives. Those are 436 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:17,879 Speaker 1: all very simple things and very easy places to start, 437 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,199 Speaker 1: because again everybody agrees, but we have to keep proving 438 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:24,720 Speaker 1: out that this fake fight, false choice world that we're 439 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 1: living in isn't real, and we can prove it an 440 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:31,560 Speaker 1: immigration that rule of law and compassion are compatible right 441 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 1: down to the policy. I really appreciate the optimism from 442 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 1: both of you that Congress is going to be able 443 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 1: to get a lot done on this issue, particularly as 444 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,440 Speaker 1: we head into a divided Congress. You know, I can't 445 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:46,840 Speaker 1: help but think about history here, Bush, Obama, Trump, Biden 446 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:50,879 Speaker 1: all somewhat stepping back on immigration as a core issue 447 00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 1: once they're entering office after not making that headway in Congress. 448 00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:59,000 Speaker 1: Are our White House correspondent earlier in the show said 449 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,959 Speaker 1: that his big shton Biden, if he could ask him 450 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: anything right now, would be do you need to take 451 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 1: matters into your own hands here as we enter this 452 00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 1: divided Congress? I wonder if Max you can touch on 453 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:13,959 Speaker 1: that for me. I mean, what do you make of 454 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,880 Speaker 1: that argument that Biden is the only one who can 455 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,800 Speaker 1: move the needle here. I think he certainly has credibility here. 456 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,480 Speaker 1: I mean, he's shown through legislation just in the last 457 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,600 Speaker 1: six months in the Senate that he's been able to 458 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:29,200 Speaker 1: move things through a Congress that many people thought would 459 00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 1: be d o a for him. But this is essentially 460 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:35,399 Speaker 1: in Congress's hands, and I think there is an appetite. 461 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:39,399 Speaker 1: I mean, we've almost had these immigration deals multiple times before, 462 00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 1: and it has always been this very small core of 463 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,960 Speaker 1: fundamentalists who has managed to derail that. And I think 464 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:49,760 Speaker 1: that there's more knowledge of that now. And I think 465 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:53,400 Speaker 1: that both sides have this ingrained incentive here to show 466 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,440 Speaker 1: the American people that they are the party that can govern. 467 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 1: You know, this is one of the benefits of being 468 00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,439 Speaker 1: so close in the house is that you have great 469 00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 1: incentive for both parties to be as mature as they 470 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 1: can be, should show the American people they should get 471 00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 1: the majority in two years. Max and Boyd really appreciate 472 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 1: your insights on this. We're gonna come back to you 473 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:18,800 Speaker 1: later on in our show. This is Bloomberg Sound On 474 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio. I'm Madison Mills in for Joe Matthew. 475 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 1: We got to talk about the weather because it's impacting travel, 476 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:31,080 Speaker 1: and it's impacting our energy system and it just keeps coming. First, 477 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:34,080 Speaker 1: we had record low temperatures in the Northeast, causing power 478 00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:38,040 Speaker 1: outages across the US, upwards of thirty deaths in Buffalo, 479 00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:41,200 Speaker 1: New York. That's in the backdrop of the travel chaos 480 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:45,439 Speaker 1: that is plaguing those specifically who are flying on south 481 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:50,760 Speaker 1: West Airlines, canceling SI of Tuesday, Wednesday's flights already and 482 00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:55,200 Speaker 1: six more heading into tomorrow. Here's the CEO. I want 483 00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 1: everyone who is dealing with the problems we've been facing, 484 00:26:57,840 --> 00:26:59,880 Speaker 1: whether you haven't been able to get to where UNI 485 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,880 Speaker 1: to go, are you one of our heroic employe He's 486 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: caught up in a massive effort to stabilize the airline 487 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 1: to know is that we're doing everything we can to 488 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: return to a normal operation. And please also hear that 489 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:17,440 Speaker 1: I'm truly sorry. He's truly sorry. There are hopes that 490 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:20,800 Speaker 1: Southwest can ease on these issues as the weather warms 491 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:22,920 Speaker 1: up in the coming days and next week. That was 492 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 1: CEO Bob Jordan's on from Southwest Airlines on that. But 493 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:30,280 Speaker 1: not so fast, because we've got an atmospheric river coming 494 00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:33,160 Speaker 1: into the West Coast and Pacific Northwest. I know you're thinking, 495 00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:37,199 Speaker 1: what is that. It's a meteorologists terminology there. It's an 496 00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:41,159 Speaker 1: extreme weather event hitting the Pacific Northwest and West Coast 497 00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:44,399 Speaker 1: again causing rain, winds and even snow. Power lines are 498 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:46,679 Speaker 1: already down in the Bay Area, So the question is 499 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:50,679 Speaker 1: what impact could that have on our already cracking electrical 500 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 1: grids across the country. Joining me to discuss is Mark 501 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 1: Chediac and Noreen Malik too, of our Bloomberg News reporters. Mark, 502 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:00,240 Speaker 1: thanks for being here. Let me start with you on 503 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:03,760 Speaker 1: the context here. I remember when this happened in Texas, 504 00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 1: the idea was that that was a one off because 505 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 1: Texas is in a warmer climate. They weren't prepared to 506 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,399 Speaker 1: deal with the cold weathers. But now we're seeing the 507 00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:16,359 Speaker 1: same issues emerged in the Northeast, which should potentially be 508 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: more prepared to deal with the cold Is this a 509 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:21,960 Speaker 1: bigger issue here with the U S energy system we're 510 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 1: seeing Yes, I mean to step back a little bit. Um. 511 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:30,080 Speaker 1: I think what we saw here was compared to Texas, 512 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:36,040 Speaker 1: so much bigger and widespread polar blast which impacted a 513 00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 1: lot larger section of the country and affected uh, you know, 514 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,520 Speaker 1: multiple power grids at the same time, which caused a 515 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:48,760 Speaker 1: lot of problems in terms of coordinating and supplying energy 516 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 1: across state line. Um. Actually where we saw the rotating 517 00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:57,960 Speaker 1: that blackouts, it did happen to be into a little 518 00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: warmer weather states and North Carolina, Tennessee, in South Carolina, 519 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 1: they simply didn't have enough power supply, um for homes 520 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:12,240 Speaker 1: and businesses at that really record cold front moved through 521 00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:17,720 Speaker 1: in the northeast. Um. You know, they begged consumers to 522 00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:22,080 Speaker 1: cut back their energy use, and they warned of black 523 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,840 Speaker 1: about possible blackouts. But they actually did not have to 524 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 1: pull the plug. Um. But they but they got very close, right, 525 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,680 Speaker 1: and they also had to ask a lot of customers 526 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,600 Speaker 1: to pull back on energy usage, which is typically something 527 00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,080 Speaker 1: that happens in the summer, unless in the winter. Nori 528 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 1: and I want to bring you in here talk to 529 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 1: me about the impact of these freeze off, specifically on 530 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 1: natural gas outputs. What do we know? So the US 531 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 1: is more reliant on natural gas than ever. This is 532 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 1: because of the bounty of the shale boom that we 533 00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,080 Speaker 1: saw in the mid two thousands in the past decade, 534 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 1: and so we've had a lot of power plants and 535 00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: households just relying on natural gas. So normally throughout the year, 536 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 1: this isn't a big deal. There's enough like pipeline space, 537 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 1: you can get gas where it needs to be. But 538 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,760 Speaker 1: winter has become a problem because not only do you 539 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 1: now have a lot more households using a lot more 540 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,680 Speaker 1: gas when it's super cold, you then have power plants 541 00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 1: like competing for space on the same pipelines for gas 542 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:23,920 Speaker 1: and households get you know priority, you have to heat 543 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:26,960 Speaker 1: them and then so that makes it sometimes difficult for 544 00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 1: power plants. Um defined gas this it's it's still too 545 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:35,000 Speaker 1: early to tell exactly what happened this past weekend, but 546 00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:39,360 Speaker 1: we've definitely heard about um, you know, some power plants 547 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 1: and PGM, the largest US gridge with grid which stretches 548 00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:46,680 Speaker 1: from New Jersey to like UM Illinois, said that there 549 00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:51,200 Speaker 1: were um, you know, power plants that had problems getting gas, 550 00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:53,720 Speaker 1: But we don't know the magnitude of that problem. We 551 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:57,080 Speaker 1: do have reports that producers, like today on Bloomberg TV, 552 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: UM e q T CEO Toby Rice said that they 553 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:04,720 Speaker 1: had curtailed production because of you know, wells freezing and 554 00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:07,800 Speaker 1: what you said earlier is right on the point. You know, 555 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:12,680 Speaker 1: these are regions that have experienced freezing temperatures before. So 556 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:16,400 Speaker 1: that's where a lot of investigation will also be UM 557 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 1: directed at, is like what went wrong this time? Right? 558 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 1: You know, right? What went we're on this time and 559 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:25,320 Speaker 1: what needs to be done to fix it? I I 560 00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 1: got to wonder about the impact this is going to 561 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 1: have on consumers who are already dealing with record breaking inflation. 562 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,560 Speaker 1: Mark what do we know about how these costs could 563 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: get passed on to consumers? Well, UM, essentially the cost 564 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 1: at some point we'll get passed on to consumers in 565 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,200 Speaker 1: some form or another. We saw this in Texas after 566 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: the winter storm, where you had billions of dollars of 567 00:31:55,040 --> 00:32:01,760 Speaker 1: energy costs. UM basically tagged packed onto customer bills or 568 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:05,640 Speaker 1: will be tacked onto customer bills over the next five, ten, 569 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:09,880 Speaker 1: fifteen years. Um, do we know the extent of the 570 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:12,520 Speaker 1: price increases just yet or is it is it too 571 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 1: early to tell, Like do we have any indication of 572 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,120 Speaker 1: how much the bills are going up? Well, that's a 573 00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 1: great question, and it's too early to tell the impact 574 00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:27,200 Speaker 1: to the actual in in consumer or the the utility customer. 575 00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:30,200 Speaker 1: But what we do know, and what Marien and I 576 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: reported on today was that basically a wholesale power prices 577 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 1: search more than six thousand percent in parts of the 578 00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:45,240 Speaker 1: country during the part of this cold snap. So, um, 579 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 1: you know, that's it. That's a significant increase. Obviously, all 580 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: of that you know, won't flow through to customer bills, 581 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 1: but but some of it will. And this is coming 582 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,479 Speaker 1: at a time where where consumers are already grappling with 583 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: inflation and and and how inergy build right right, I mean, 584 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: I guess the good news for the FED is that 585 00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 1: this only makes up about three per cent of the 586 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 1: c p I, so that's not going to be a 587 00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,719 Speaker 1: huge factor in in inflation data. But of course it's 588 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 1: going to impact consumers marine, I I wanna wrap with you. 589 00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:19,040 Speaker 1: We've got about a minute left here. What is the 590 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:21,720 Speaker 1: single biggest thing that needs to be done to fix 591 00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 1: this infrastructure as we head into so that next winter 592 00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:30,840 Speaker 1: we're not talking about this exact same issue again. I 593 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,600 Speaker 1: think one of the biggest things that's come out is 594 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,600 Speaker 1: is that we need to rethink, you know, how we 595 00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,800 Speaker 1: think about reliability. That means making sure that the gas 596 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:43,120 Speaker 1: industry is in sync with the power industry, the regulation 597 00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,959 Speaker 1: and the requirements for both industry are a little different. 598 00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:49,640 Speaker 1: And then try to figure out how are you going 599 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,560 Speaker 1: to you know, set the policies in place, which is 600 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 1: going to be a big issue next year is like 601 00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: how much more transmission lines are needed, how do you 602 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:00,520 Speaker 1: build them, how do you integrate integrate renewables, and and 603 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:02,480 Speaker 1: how do you keep the fossil fuels that need to 604 00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:06,880 Speaker 1: be online online? So there's a there's a lot of 605 00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:08,799 Speaker 1: debate that's going to happen, and a lot of this 606 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,239 Speaker 1: policy is going to be shaped next year the regulators 607 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 1: and on the state level, right and a lot that's 608 00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:17,800 Speaker 1: that's behind these upcoming price hikes that we're going to 609 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:20,440 Speaker 1: have to dig into with both of you, hopefully we 610 00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:22,640 Speaker 1: can have you on again to dig into that. And 611 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:26,520 Speaker 1: of course we've got this atmospheric river even impacting the 612 00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:29,200 Speaker 1: West Coast and Pacific Northwest here, so a lot of 613 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,560 Speaker 1: weather impacts to continue to cover. Thank you so much 614 00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: for joining us. We're gonna be back with more here 615 00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:50,480 Speaker 1: on sound On. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg. Sound 616 00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:55,000 Speaker 1: On on Bloomberg Radio. Bloomberg sound On, brought to you 617 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 1: by This is your daily reminder from Innovation Refunds to 618 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,480 Speaker 1: apply for a payroll tag refund if you're small or 619 00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:05,920 Speaker 1: medium sized business was impacted by COVID nineteen Innovation Refunds 620 00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:10,400 Speaker 1: clients already claimed over two billion dollars in payroll tax refunds. 621 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:14,760 Speaker 1: Get started at get refunds dot com. I'm Madison Mills 622 00:35:14,760 --> 00:35:17,319 Speaker 1: in for Joe Matthew. We've got some breaking news here. 623 00:35:17,360 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 1: The layoff news not stopping over the holiday is Goldman 624 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:24,360 Speaker 1: Sachs CEO David Solomon says staff cuts are coming next month. 625 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:27,280 Speaker 1: He said that in his year end message to staff. 626 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,800 Speaker 1: Solomon said, we're conducting a careful review and the production 627 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,759 Speaker 1: will take place in the first half of January. That 628 00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,839 Speaker 1: is a redhead crossing on your terminal now Goldman Sachs 629 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 1: CEO Solomon says staff cuts are coming next month. Join 630 00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:44,239 Speaker 1: me to discuss is our panel boyd matheson coast of 631 00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 1: k s L radio's inside source, Republican strategist and former 632 00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:51,080 Speaker 1: chief of staff for Senator Mike Lee. We've also got 633 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:55,120 Speaker 1: Max Burns, democratic strategists and founder of Third Degree Strategies. 634 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,760 Speaker 1: Thank you both for joining me here on Wall Street. 635 00:35:57,840 --> 00:35:59,799 Speaker 1: That layoff news I just mentioned that's going to be 636 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: up of mind as we head into three. But you 637 00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 1: are are Washington experts, so let's stick with d C. 638 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:08,960 Speaker 1: What do you think is the biggest story that's going 639 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,319 Speaker 1: to be top of mind for lawmakers as they start 640 00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:14,680 Speaker 1: to trickle back into Washington next week. Max, let's start 641 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:16,000 Speaker 1: with you on that. What's going to be the number 642 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:19,279 Speaker 1: one issue on lawmaker's minds? Well, I think you're you're 643 00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,040 Speaker 1: already hearing a lot of lawmakers talking about looking into 644 00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:26,520 Speaker 1: these snarling travel problems with Southwest. A lot of constituents 645 00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:30,360 Speaker 1: have been blowing up lawmakers phones in their offices, some 646 00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:33,400 Speaker 1: of them stranded now for three or four or five days. 647 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:35,799 Speaker 1: And this is something that has a lot of immediacy 648 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:39,480 Speaker 1: to it, and they're very unsympathetic target. So there's a 649 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:43,680 Speaker 1: lot you can do in bringing Southwest executives forward and 650 00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,600 Speaker 1: in putting on hearings and in making people see that 651 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:49,359 Speaker 1: you're listening to their concerns. Okay, but I gotta ask, 652 00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:51,560 Speaker 1: and you guys might not be able to answer this. 653 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:54,360 Speaker 1: But you know, I cover companies in Wall Street. Typically 654 00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:57,440 Speaker 1: I have to wonder how much Washington can move the 655 00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:00,279 Speaker 1: needle here. This is a corporate issue. I mean, what 656 00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 1: is what is your take on that. Is this just 657 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:04,760 Speaker 1: a lot of talk from Washington or can they actually 658 00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:08,719 Speaker 1: make Southwest do something? Yeah, this was really an internal, 659 00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:12,160 Speaker 1: complete failure of leadership at Southwest. This was not Herd 660 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:16,480 Speaker 1: Keller's delivering the customer experience, but long before it became 661 00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:20,200 Speaker 1: a customer service nightmare, it was an internal problem. It 662 00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,200 Speaker 1: was a failure of systems and and supporting the employees, 663 00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:25,200 Speaker 1: many of whom were trying to do the right thing 664 00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,200 Speaker 1: and to be especially helpful. So it is very internal. 665 00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,000 Speaker 1: I think there are a few things that government can 666 00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:33,840 Speaker 1: do in that space. I don't think there's a ton um, 667 00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:36,640 Speaker 1: but there, you know, there's always some regulatory components um 668 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,200 Speaker 1: that I think do help the problem. Is when we 669 00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:43,200 Speaker 1: have an experience like this, the natural tendency of Washington 670 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:45,960 Speaker 1: is to overreach and to swing too far, which neither 671 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:49,120 Speaker 1: solves the problem uh and usually just creates more burden 672 00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:53,400 Speaker 1: for for those companies that makes the experience even less effective. 673 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,480 Speaker 1: So I think a lot of the lawmakers are going 674 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,520 Speaker 1: to hear a lot of this. I think a lot 675 00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:01,080 Speaker 1: of lawmakers are trying to help square the circle in 676 00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:04,000 Speaker 1: terms of what's going on in the economy and what 677 00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:07,840 Speaker 1: people are actually feeling and experiencing around the kitchen table. 678 00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:10,600 Speaker 1: Because we can count a lot of good things, and 679 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:13,359 Speaker 1: politicians are really good at counting the good things. But 680 00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:16,000 Speaker 1: if it's not congruent for what the American people are 681 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:19,080 Speaker 1: feeling around the kitchen table, that's where politicians on both 682 00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:21,360 Speaker 1: sides of the ais'll end up getting themselves in trouble 683 00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 1: either telling the story that sounds great to them but 684 00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:27,000 Speaker 1: isn't really resonating with the people back home. Right, you 685 00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 1: gotta wonder whether the voters back home are paying attention 686 00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:32,480 Speaker 1: to the Fed minutes in the same way that Washington 687 00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:36,760 Speaker 1: and certainly US business reporters are prone to do. I wonder, 688 00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:38,440 Speaker 1: how long do you guys think it's going to be 689 00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,200 Speaker 1: until CEO Bob Jordan's of Southwest has to make his 690 00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:44,319 Speaker 1: way down to Washington. In our final twenty seconds here, Max, 691 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:46,759 Speaker 1: what do you think about that? Oh, I'm sure if 692 00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:49,160 Speaker 1: Pete Buddha Judge had his way would be next week. 693 00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:52,399 Speaker 1: But I think there's definitely going to be a reckoning here. 694 00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:54,720 Speaker 1: It may not amount to much, but it will certainly 695 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:57,120 Speaker 1: drag him through the coals for as long as they 696 00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,600 Speaker 1: can sit him there. Yep, all right, well we will 697 00:38:59,719 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 1: can and you to monitor that of course. Thank you 698 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,600 Speaker 1: both so much for being here. We had Boyd Matheson 699 00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:08,080 Speaker 1: and Max Burns joining us on our panel today and 700 00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,720 Speaker 1: again just a reminder of that breaking news from Wall 701 00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:13,680 Speaker 1: Street Goldman SAX CEO David Salmon says staff cuts are 702 00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:16,840 Speaker 1: coming next month in his year end message to staff, 703 00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:18,920 Speaker 1: A big story we're going to be covering. Continue to 704 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:21,080 Speaker 1: stick with us here at Bloomberg to get all of 705 00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:23,560 Speaker 1: the news you need. I'm Madison Mills in for Joe 706 00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:25,680 Speaker 1: Matthew today. This is Bloomberg