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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff

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Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind.

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Speaker 1: My name is Robert Lamb. My name is Julie Tuglas. Julie.

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Speaker 1: Do you have any magical objects with you today? Any

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Speaker 1: good luck charms, any personal items of importance? Nope, I

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Speaker 1: was thinking about this. I'm not really into the sort

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Speaker 1: of magical thinking lucky items I have to say. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: hold up your hands. Do you have any rings on? Oh?

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Speaker 1: You don't have any rings on? Nothing? Nothing? Huh okay, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean maybe I have my lucky underwear on. Maybe

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Speaker 1: I don't you, Um, I mean not underwear? No, well,

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Speaker 1: I mean nothing. Let's see what do I have on?

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Speaker 1: I mean right now? I just I have my wedding ring,

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Speaker 1: and I do. There's so there's a certain amount of

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Speaker 1: magical thinking involved in that. Um, do I have any

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Speaker 1: And No, I don't have any amulets on me right now.

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Speaker 1: But I in the past, I've I've certainly fallen in

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Speaker 1: the habit of using them. I think I've talked about

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Speaker 1: this before. I previously had a Ganesha remover of obstacles.

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Speaker 1: Remover of obstacles. The the Hindu god that is that

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Speaker 1: has the you know, the elephant appearance. Uh, And I

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Speaker 1: had featured on The Simpsons in a hilarious episode. Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: also also made fun of there. But I would carry

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Speaker 1: it around because you know, remover of obstacles and you

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Speaker 1: know all this various ties into ties into creativity and all.

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Speaker 1: And so I would carry that in my pocket. And

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Speaker 1: then eventually I lost it, like it crawled out in

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Speaker 1: the washing machine or something and left me. And and

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Speaker 1: so I've always felt I felt kind of bad. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: where did Ganesha go? Did Ganesha abandon me? And then

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Speaker 1: and then I found Ganesha put him back in and

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Speaker 1: then and then he disappeared again and hasn't come back.

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Speaker 1: And and then also in the past, all occasionally like

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Speaker 1: pick up a rock, Like if I'm at the beach

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Speaker 1: and I'm having a particularly good day, I'll pick up

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Speaker 1: that rock and take it with me, and That'll end

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Speaker 1: up in my pocket for maybe a year or so. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, because that kind of comes to symbolize like

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Speaker 1: a nice memory, and so I can take it out

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Speaker 1: and I can sort of think back to that time.

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Speaker 1: So what I'm hearing is that you have various kinds

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Speaker 1: of movies. Yeah, security blankets. Oh, yes, yeah, I guess

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Speaker 1: they are to a certain extent security blanket. I mean

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Speaker 1: they're not you know, apples to apples, but there is

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Speaker 1: this sort of warm and fuzzy thing that you're trying

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Speaker 1: to evoke with with an object, right, yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: it's uh, I mean it's weird for me because like

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Speaker 1: when I'm if I'm holding a ganitia, I don't actually

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Speaker 1: think that I'm using this as a totem to to

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Speaker 1: get in touch with some sort of a god, you know,

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Speaker 1: like it's not like a literal interpretation of the amulet,

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Speaker 1: but there is a certain amount of positive thinking that

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Speaker 1: that comes with having it. And I've also wondered a

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Speaker 1: lot of times when I'm passing by my own desk

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Speaker 1: or coworkers desks, or seeing somebody's desk on TV where

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Speaker 1: they have action figures, uh, typically like a dude's desk,

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Speaker 1: you know, we have various action figures, and I wondered

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Speaker 1: to what extent our modern action figures kind of akin

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Speaker 1: to the amulets of old, you know, like today we

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Speaker 1: don't have a pathion of gods to really call upon

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Speaker 1: for the most part, but instead we have all these

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Speaker 1: various pop culture icons and cartoon characters that represent various

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Speaker 1: things at least on like a subconscious level, and we

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Speaker 1: keep them around to draw strength from them. You haven't

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Speaker 1: found the Pantheon room. They just Wantheon room. No, do

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Speaker 1: we have one? Oh my goodness, but to the room

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Speaker 1: with the black toilet and the black sink. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: the superhero bathroom. Okay, well, see I've been missing that.

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Speaker 1: But if you if you passed by my desk, you

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Speaker 1: passed by like Jonathan Strickland's desk, you passed by is

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Speaker 1: these office you'll see little little figures, you know. So

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Speaker 1: I wondered what I mean. Obviously they're on our death

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Speaker 1: they're in our workspace, they're in our work environment, informing,

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Speaker 1: you know, our our relationship with our with our work,

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Speaker 1: with with what we're trying to do with and and

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Speaker 1: representing a little bit of who we are. So to

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Speaker 1: what extent are those was becoming deities? I don't know. Well, okay,

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Speaker 1: so that's what we're going to try to get to

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Speaker 1: the bottom of today. We're gonna look at objects, our

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Speaker 1: relationship to objects, and we're going to try to figure

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Speaker 1: out how much of this has to do with our

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Speaker 1: own uh ability to acquire things, and whether or not

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Speaker 1: this acquisitiveness is natural to us, and then we're gonna

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Speaker 1: look a little bit at a compulse supporting too. When

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Speaker 1: it comes to materialism, it is really a distinctive human

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Speaker 1: trait for the most part, especially when you look at

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Speaker 1: its more outrageous examples. The one that I was really

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Speaker 1: partial to was the one I brought up by Steve

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Speaker 1: Taylor in his article The Madness of Materialism, which just

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Speaker 1: a great, short, little article, but he he mentions gold,

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Speaker 1: especially the like European colonists love of gold and in

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Speaker 1: their flashes with with the native peoples in the Americas. Uh.

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Speaker 1: There's one example that he brings up where in Indian

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Speaker 1: chief in Cuba learned that the Spanish sailors were about

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Speaker 1: to tack as end, so he actually praised to the

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Speaker 1: spirit of the gold to for for a like they've become.

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Speaker 1: They're trying to figure out why are these one of

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Speaker 1: these these people so into gold, this this shiny rock

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Speaker 1: from the ground. They must have some sort of They

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Speaker 1: must believe it's a god. They must believe that it

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Speaker 1: is that has supernatural powers, because otherwise, why would you

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Speaker 1: go to such ridiculous ends. Why would you wage all

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Speaker 1: of this bloodshed just to get it right? Because otherwise

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Speaker 1: it's like, well, you guys are just talking like ferrets

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Speaker 1: going after something shiny. So surely this piece of gold

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Speaker 1: has something to it. And he prayed to it right

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Speaker 1: and it didn't work. Didn't work because, as as he

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Speaker 1: points out in this article, as Steve Taylor points out,

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Speaker 1: a certain amount of hoarding of resources makes evolutionary sense.

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Speaker 1: You know we've talked before and in the wild there

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Speaker 1: are certain things that are scarce. I mean food itself

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Speaker 1: is going to be scarce, uh, to varying degrees. And

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Speaker 1: so to whatever degree we can plan ahead that we

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Speaker 1: can stockpilot, the better off will be. If that means

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Speaker 1: bearing nuts in the yard, if that means uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: finding something that is that is more rare in nature,

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Speaker 1: like sugar and being able to store that away like

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Speaker 1: like all that makes sense firewood. I mean, there are

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Speaker 1: things that are they're part of our survival that that

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Speaker 1: that makes sense when we're hoarding it. Well, it makes

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Speaker 1: sense I think to a culture that is settled. But

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Speaker 1: if you look at back at early man um in

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Speaker 1: particularly the fact that early Man was a nomadic species. Um,

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Speaker 1: then you know that hoarding or stockpiling just really wasn't convenient,

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Speaker 1: That's right. I mean yeah, if you're always on the

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Speaker 1: mood move if you even if you have kind of

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Speaker 1: like cyclical uh patterns to your to your movement, and

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Speaker 1: you know, going from you know, north to south depending

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Speaker 1: on what the weather is doing, Yeah, you're not gonna

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Speaker 1: be able to carry all of this with you. You

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Speaker 1: can maybe stockpile some of it, but you're not going

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Speaker 1: to carry it all on your back. Yeah. So there's

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Speaker 1: just a big question mark, like is this really genetic?

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Speaker 1: Is this something that's natural to humans, this impulse to

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Speaker 1: buy and possess things, or is it something that really

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Speaker 1: is um more symptomatic of modern man, particularly from the

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Speaker 1: nineteenth century on right, when things became much easier to produce,

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Speaker 1: to produce cheaply, and then to acquire cheaply. Yeah. And

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Speaker 1: I mean when it comes to stockpiling things that are important,

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Speaker 1: I mean, when once we get out of this uh,

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Speaker 1: this transitory nature of culture and we get into into

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Speaker 1: actually settling in areas and growing food, I mean, being

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Speaker 1: able to stockpile food. I mean that's part and partial

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Speaker 1: to a lot of our cultural growth as as a

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Speaker 1: as a species, our ability to put food away, have

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Speaker 1: more food than we need, and then specialize our roles

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Speaker 1: within a community. But what about just buying lots of

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Speaker 1: plastic things, right and putting them in a storage unit

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Speaker 1: and then that storaging in it being auctioned off in

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Speaker 1: a show called storage Wars or something like that. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because yeah, then it's it seems like we're definitely getting

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Speaker 1: into pathological area. We're getting into an area where it

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Speaker 1: is just it is a sickness. It is some natural

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Speaker 1: instinct that has been perverted. Because even even though the

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Speaker 1: you know, the native peoples of the Americas couldn't understand

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Speaker 1: the luss for gold, if you put gold within the

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Speaker 1: context of of of wealth and then wealth equals power, power,

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Speaker 1: wealth equals comfort, wealth equals food, then I can see

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Speaker 1: the cognitive steps you know, necessary to think I gotta

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Speaker 1: have all the gold, right because I have to possess

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Speaker 1: the symbol of it, which is probably a large part

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Speaker 1: of why we do have this such such a high

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Speaker 1: degree of acquisitiveness, right, like wanting to get acquire everything. Um.

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Speaker 1: But you know, the question is is that genetic Well

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Speaker 1: there was a study by Justine Giddon's, Julie Shermer and

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Speaker 1: Philip Vernon from the University of Western Ontario, and they

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Speaker 1: wanted to know how much of it was an environmental

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Speaker 1: how much of it which genetics. Of course, they turned

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Speaker 1: to the twins. Uh. They recruited two hundred and forty

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Speaker 1: pairs of twins, identical and fraternal, and they looked at

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Speaker 1: the benchmark of individual differences um, personality, values, happiness, and

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Speaker 1: we know about forty pc of those traits are heritable, right,

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Speaker 1: So to the surprise of these researchers, they found that

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Speaker 1: individual differences in materialism were almost entirely attributed to environmental

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Speaker 1: factors and not a genetic thing going on here. So

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Speaker 1: that kind of makes sense, right, And that actually makes

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Speaker 1: sense to me in the context of hoarding, because yes,

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Speaker 1: hoarding does have some pathological brain disorder elements to it,

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Speaker 1: but a lot of the triggers for hoarding our environmental. So, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, if you had a loved one who recently

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Speaker 1: passed away or something that was life changing, that kind

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Speaker 1: of sort of flipped the switch and hoarding behavior. And

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Speaker 1: when I talk about hoarding behavior, I'm talking about an

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Speaker 1: excessive collection of objects. This is like one of those

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Speaker 1: things where it's like I must keep every newspaper that

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Speaker 1: has ever come out. And it's not just keep them,

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Speaker 1: but like if you were to be separated from those newspapers,

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Speaker 1: you would suffer, you would feel pain, you would you

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Speaker 1: would be confused, you would have an inability to really

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Speaker 1: make clearheaded decisions about the sort of stuff in your life. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you've seen one of these shows. To me, that's

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Speaker 1: enough supporting shows, because it can be a bit much

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Speaker 1: to take in, and it can be and there they're

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Speaker 1: kind of depressing. Uh, but but I think I saw

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Speaker 1: one once where it was like food items and it

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Speaker 1: wasn't in a sense that like I need to save

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Speaker 1: all the sweet potatoes because I love sweet potatoes and

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Speaker 1: I need need to eat the sweet podata is later,

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Speaker 1: but it would be like, oh, the sweet potato looked

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Speaker 1: really good. This is a really cool looking sweet potata,

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Speaker 1: and like this weird emotional attachment to the sweet potato,

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Speaker 1: and then it must be kept even though it's rotting

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Speaker 1: in the refrigerator. Yeah. Well, it turns out that people

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Speaker 1: who have hoarding behavior or hoarding disorder, they actually have

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Speaker 1: a part of their brain. Um, this is an interior

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Speaker 1: singular cortex. This part of their brain is actually not

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Speaker 1: behaving the same way as quote unquote normal people, because

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Speaker 1: that is the part of the brain that's actually governing

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Speaker 1: your decisions in and you restraint. Is that also, um,

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Speaker 1: some some impulse control, yeah, um, but primarily it's the

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Speaker 1: decision making. And so if you take people who have

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Speaker 1: the hoarding disorder and you look at them in m

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Speaker 1: r I scans when they are considering whether or not

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Speaker 1: to part from an object that they own, you'll see

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Speaker 1: that You'll see the fuzzy nature going on there, so

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Speaker 1: you know that it is, Um, it is a brain disorder.

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Speaker 1: It is this this part of their brain that is saying,

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Speaker 1: I just don't know what to do here. And so

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Speaker 1: it's not just like Okay, I need to have everything

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Speaker 1: in the world, or there's some sort of gluttonous you know,

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Speaker 1: void that they're trying to fill. It really is coming

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Speaker 1: from the decisions that their their brain circuitry is making.

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Speaker 1: And um, this is I thought this was really interesting

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Speaker 1: when I found out about it. Um. Hoarding behavior actually

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Speaker 1: has some connection, or a lot of connection to narcissism.

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Speaker 1: So you think about narcissism and you think about vanity.

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Speaker 1: You think about narcissus, you think about the function in

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Speaker 1: the pool captivated by one's appearance. But it really is

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Speaker 1: sort of a coping mechanism, and I believe it was

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Speaker 1: Dr Rebecca Beaten. She explained this to me a couple

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Speaker 1: of years ago when I interviewed her um about hoarding.

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Speaker 1: She told me that kids who are feeling abandoned from

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Speaker 1: their parents, or they don't have a significant relationship with

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Speaker 1: a parent, or really any sort of guardian in other words,

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Speaker 1: they they're not getting that emotional connection or even sort

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Speaker 1: of the touch of the hug or any of that,

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Speaker 1: they begin to turn inward and they began to become

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Speaker 1: narcissists because they have to find self comfort from themselves,

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Speaker 1: and some of that gets attributed to objects. So then

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Speaker 1: they began to collect objects. Is this part of comfort,

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Speaker 1: and that's where you see the behavior played out. And

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Speaker 1: of course this brings to mind the Peanuts character Linus

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Speaker 1: and his blanket, right, his woobie, his his comfort blanket,

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Speaker 1: his uh or if you want to get into the

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Speaker 1: more technicals, his comfort object, his transitional object um, which

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Speaker 1: is something you see with a lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of kids. I mean, it's Uh, let's see, did I

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Speaker 1: have no Now, my sister definitely had a blanket, uh

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Speaker 1: called blankie and uh, and it got to the point

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Speaker 1: where they ended up like cutting off the edge of

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Speaker 1: Blanky so that she could continue to carry Blanky around

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Speaker 1: with her. And I think she may still have I

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Speaker 1: think she still keeps blankly around. Well, you know, my

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Speaker 1: daughter's four, and the same thing has happened to her blanket.

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Speaker 1: She calls it Blankie's blankie. Wait, now, the part that

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Speaker 1: came off she carries around is called Blanky's blankie. So

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Speaker 1: it's the blank like the shard of blanket. It's all right,

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Speaker 1: it's like a like it's kind of like a religious artifact.

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Speaker 1: And she hides it in her bed and she's really

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Speaker 1: freaky about it, like we can't find it. It's like

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Speaker 1: blank is blanket. Well, I mean to an uninformed observer,

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Speaker 1: it could seem a little freaky because it's like, because

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Speaker 1: it is kind of borderline religious obsession, it may seem like.

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Speaker 1: In fact, if you go back to the nineteen forties,

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Speaker 1: attachment to a special object by a shot was regarded

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Speaker 1: as just pathological behavior and it's just a case of

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Speaker 1: childhood fetish reflecting something askew in the mother child relationship. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I must be doing something wrong because your kid has

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Speaker 1: this gross the scrap of a blanket that they're carrying around.

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Speaker 1: And I think it's interesting that they look at it

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Speaker 1: as a fetish, particularly if you kind of take a

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Speaker 1: wide angle view of that period anyway, where you see

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Speaker 1: a lot of this idea as of fetish fetishism coming out. Um.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, it wasn't until the fifties right when they

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Speaker 1: started to say, you know what, this is actually a

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Speaker 1: normal thing, it's a good thing. Yeah. Yeah, people like DW.

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Speaker 1: Wincott started defining these is normal and necessary and is

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Speaker 1: a transitional experience, a key step in an infantsi ability

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Speaker 1: to distinguish this inner subjective world from the outside reality. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, through the even through the seventies and eighties,

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Speaker 1: there was still this sort of people are still clinging

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Speaker 1: to this old notion that it's there's something wrong that

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Speaker 1: the kid has some you know, some anxiety problems or something,

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Speaker 1: and that's why they're holding onto it. But but really,

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Speaker 1: the the the academic understanding of it was was pretty

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Speaker 1: much in place, Yeah, because they began to understand that

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Speaker 1: this could really help allay some of the fears, um,

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Speaker 1: some of the anxieties that children have. Of course they

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Speaker 1: haven't because remember they have an entirely new view of life,

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Speaker 1: so they have to categorize every loud sound, every image

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Speaker 1: and try to make sense of it. Is it a threat?

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Speaker 1: Is it not a threat? And so this transitional object

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Speaker 1: really does help because it is sort of like the

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Speaker 1: stand in for, you know, parental unit or something else.

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Speaker 1: There's a study by G. Japara, R. H. Passman, and C. Eisenberg,

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Speaker 1: and they found that during a routine third year pediatric examination,

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Speaker 1: the security object enhanced rapport with the examining nurse and

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Speaker 1: then children attached to a blanket who were allowed access

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Speaker 1: to it were rated as less distressed and they experienced

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Speaker 1: less physiological stress um and that is evidenced by the

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Speaker 1: heart rate and this is stallic blood pressure. So this

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Speaker 1: is in contrast to kids who are undergoing medical evaluation,

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Speaker 1: evaluation without their movies. Really, yeah, and certainly these woobies, um,

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Speaker 1: as you said that they can end up becoming like

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Speaker 1: an important parenting tool. I understand as well. I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you're if you're you use it wisely, right, I

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Speaker 1: mean it's i guess it's powerful stuff to play with,

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Speaker 1: But I was reading about how you know a parent

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Speaker 1: can can use it to their advantage, and a kid

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Speaker 1: needs the wovie too to remain comfortable in a position

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Speaker 1: when the month is away. I think it's really important

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Speaker 1: to um, like around age one and so on and

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Speaker 1: so forth, when when they start to feel the separation

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Speaker 1: anxiety as you say, like leaving the house or even

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Speaker 1: just sleeping at night, I think having something to grab

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Speaker 1: onto is really important. One of the interesting things about

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Speaker 1: studying transitional objects is that is that there's ultimately kind

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Speaker 1: of a lack of uniformity in the definition of it

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Speaker 1: and also the cultural significance of it. Like some of

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Speaker 1: the cultural stats are pretty interesting, like um, the United States,

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Speaker 1: sixty percent of children have at least a mild degree

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Speaker 1: of attachment to some sort of soft inanimate object. And

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Speaker 1: I think, looking back, I did have. I had a

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Speaker 1: stuffed rhinoceros named Rinchiu had an attachment to um. But

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Speaker 1: but I don't know. Then you're getting into like stuffed animals.

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Speaker 1: You're getting into a whole different area because those have personality.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, does Blankie or does Blankie's Blankie have

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Speaker 1: a personality. Do you think, well, sometimes Blanky's Blankie gets

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Speaker 1: some new trouble or does things like takes all the

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Speaker 1: toilet paper off the toilet roll or something like that.

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Speaker 1: But um, generally I think that's just general scoundrelness right now. Well, okay,

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Speaker 1: so anyway, six children in the US have some sort

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Speaker 1: of mild degree, thirty two percent exhibit strong attachment. But

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Speaker 1: then if you look at incidences of attachment in the

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Speaker 1: Netherlands and New Zealand and Sweden, that's that's comparable to

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Speaker 1: the United States. Korean children have substantially fewer attachments to blankets,

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Speaker 1: down to eighteen percent, uh that compared to American children,

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Speaker 1: but in Korean born children living in the United States

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Speaker 1: to play an intermediate percentage of thirty four percent. Five

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Speaker 1: percent of rural Italian children have transitional objects compared to

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Speaker 1: thirty one percent of urban Italians, and it goes as

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Speaker 1: far as the sixty two percent of foreign children living

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Speaker 1: in Rome. So I don't know, you just see the stats.

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Speaker 1: I guess kind of skewing towards urban areas. Yeah, as

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Speaker 1: we say, that's interesting to see that it can be

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Speaker 1: you know, within one country you could have such a

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Speaker 1: so many different variables there and oh but in London,

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Speaker 1: just sixteen percent of children have a special security object

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Speaker 1: in there the that's London. So there goes the the

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Speaker 1: urban argument. See, it's just it's it's hard to find

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Speaker 1: the exactly what's going on. There's just so many cultural

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Speaker 1: factor to look at the get well, and you have

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Speaker 1: to wonder too if if part of that is just

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Speaker 1: to say, like, that's not as accepted and therefore maybe

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Speaker 1: in that culture it's not as encouraged, or it's not

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Speaker 1: maybe as prominent, people don't see it as much. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: or maybe there's less of a culture of these are

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Speaker 1: my objects and these are your objects, and it's more

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Speaker 1: these are our objects. You know, some of us had

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Speaker 1: to do with memory to write, like they would go

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Speaker 1: back and say, oh, did I have an object that

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Speaker 1: I was connected to? And so they're collecting some of

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Speaker 1: this data from faulty memory where people are saying yes

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Speaker 1: or no and they couldn't exactly remember. I also want

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Speaker 1: to point out to that, uh, you know, transitional object

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Speaker 1: is very different from a pacifier, And of course a

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Speaker 1: pacifier is something that's used to self soothe and babies,

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Speaker 1: but I kind of think of it as gum for babies.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's an activity to to try to help

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Speaker 1: them with their eventual um eating skills. Uh, they're swallowing skills,

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Speaker 1: and it kind of helps keep them occupied if they're

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Speaker 1: hungry and you're trying to prepare a bottle or something

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Speaker 1: like that. But it is very different in terms of comfort. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: all right, we're gonna take a quick break and when

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Speaker 1: we come back, we will get into the world of

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Speaker 1: magical thinking, lucky charms and something called the I ke

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Speaker 1: ef fector Okay, so we're back, Yeah, and we're going

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Speaker 1: to get into the realm of magical thinking. This is

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Speaker 1: territory that we've we've moved through many times before, but

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Speaker 1: it it continues to be important because it really does

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Speaker 1: deal with how we think about the world and versus

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Speaker 1: how the world really is. I mean we Magical thinking,

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Speaker 1: of course, is uh the belief that an object, action,

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Speaker 1: or circumstance not logically related to a course of events

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Speaker 1: can influence its outcome. So in magical thinking, you get

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Speaker 1: into all these ideas of of everything from a haunted house,

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Speaker 1: the idea that oh, something bad happened here, so now

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Speaker 1: something is bad with the house, you know, like the

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Speaker 1: idea that that that that an event can affect the

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Speaker 1: physical object or even near mementos. I mean I've mentioned

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Speaker 1: my father's watch before, you know, like obviously that's that's

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Speaker 1: something that has significance to me. And there's a certain

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Speaker 1: amount of magical thinking involved there. Um, you know, even

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Speaker 1: if it's at a subconscious level, even if I'm not thinking,

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Speaker 1: oh this this has the spirit of my dad, and

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Speaker 1: I think, oh, that's that is that was his watch,

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Speaker 1: and there is some sense of him about it. So

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Speaker 1: magical thinking kind of uh, you know, is intertwined in

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Speaker 1: all our lives, uh, to varying degrees, and you know,

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Speaker 1: be it conscious or subconscious. One of the more more

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Speaker 1: conscious ways, of course, is with the idea of a

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Speaker 1: lucky charm. Yeah, and uh, there's something called apophenia, and

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Speaker 1: that is seeing patterns where there are none. And that

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Speaker 1: is a little bit of the suit based two magical thinking, right,

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Speaker 1: because again, if you let's say you're wearing something and

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Speaker 1: something great happens, you think, oh, those are those lucky socks,

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Speaker 1: and let's wear them every time that I have to

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Speaker 1: do this certain challenge and began to to make this

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Speaker 1: causal connection. But then there's always that difference between Oh,

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Speaker 1: I've got a big interview, I'm gonna wear those lucky

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Speaker 1: socks of mine. There's that, and then there's these are

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Speaker 1: my lucky socks. I must wear them every day and

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Speaker 1: they must never be washed, or they must be washed

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Speaker 1: exactly eight times to contain their their magic, you know.

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Speaker 1: I mean there's a line between just sort of helpful

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Speaker 1: magical thinking and UH and and and helpful lucky charm

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00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:22,960
Speaker 1: and belief to uh. And then there's then there's a

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Speaker 1: whole realm of pathology. But it's a little O C

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Speaker 1: D in a way, right, so called adventitious reinforcing, and

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Speaker 1: then is making that connection and then keep you know,

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Speaker 1: doing whatever that ritual is over and over again so

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Speaker 1: that you can hopefully, you know, evoke those spirits of

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Speaker 1: magic to help you in your quest. So has anyone

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Speaker 1: studied lucky charms? Of course, not the cereal the cereal

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Speaker 1: that's a whole different kettle of fish. But but yes,

426
00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:52,760
Speaker 1: as far as studying the effects that lucky charms lucky

427
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:55,440
Speaker 1: objects have on us. Uh, there's a really cool study

428
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:59,200
Speaker 1: from the University of Cologne in two thousand ten, and uh.

429
00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:03,360
Speaker 1: They started off with just golf. They they invited these

430
00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:06,080
Speaker 1: these test subjects to come and uh and see how

431
00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:09,119
Speaker 1: many of tin putts they can make from the same location.

432
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:12,920
Speaker 1: And when the experiment has handed them a golf ball,

433
00:22:13,280 --> 00:22:16,400
Speaker 1: they would they would sometimes just give them the ball

434
00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:19,199
Speaker 1: and say, hey, everyone's used this ball so far. You know,

435
00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:21,119
Speaker 1: no big deal. Here's a golf ball. Why don't you

436
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:22,440
Speaker 1: hit it and see what I'll go in that hole

437
00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 1: over there. And then sometimes they said, hey, this ball,

438
00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:27,760
Speaker 1: this must be a lucky ball, this one, this one's

439
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 1: really worked well for people. And then they they analyzed it.

440
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,080
Speaker 1: They let everyone play a little golf see what happened,

441
00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 1: and the mere suggestion that the ball was lucky significantly

442
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:42,880
Speaker 1: influenced performance, causing participants to make almost two more puts

443
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:46,800
Speaker 1: on average. See this is where like when David Eagleman says, like,

444
00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:49,639
Speaker 1: we don't have any free will, I began to really

445
00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:51,840
Speaker 1: sort of say, you know, he might be onto something,

446
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:56,120
Speaker 1: because the mere suggestion that it's lucky would actually have

447
00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 1: some sort of um bearing on your performance. That's crazy,

448
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,640
Speaker 1: you know. So of course they weren't going to stop

449
00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:07,400
Speaker 1: just there, because generally, if you have a scientific experiment,

450
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,720
Speaker 1: if you have a study going on. And it begins

451
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,679
Speaker 1: and ends with people just playing golf one afternoon. You know,

452
00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:14,440
Speaker 1: that's probably not enough. You need to push it a

453
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,760
Speaker 1: little a little further. Yeah, So what they did is

454
00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 1: they had test subjects come in and they had them

455
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,920
Speaker 1: them bring lucky artifacts with them, you know, be at

456
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,159
Speaker 1: their their old blankie or they're you know, like me,

457
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:29,760
Speaker 1: you know, I forgot about this. I always bring this

458
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 1: uh tri Steratops squeeze toy into the office with me. Yeah,

459
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:36,720
Speaker 1: And I don't think of it as a lucky charterer.

460
00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 1: I think of it more as like something to occupy

461
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 1: my hand when I'm feeling kind of without it. I

462
00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:46,199
Speaker 1: don't podcast without it. So there's a certain amount of

463
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,840
Speaker 1: magical thinking involved, their certain amount of good luck charm

464
00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:52,480
Speaker 1: going on with that tristeratops. So anyway, they invited people

465
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,639
Speaker 1: to bring in their tri Sterotops toys. They're they're lucky

466
00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:58,600
Speaker 1: you know, four leaf clovers, what have you and uh,

467
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,399
Speaker 1: and then they started the us. They assigned them to

468
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: either a condition where they would be performing a task

469
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,440
Speaker 1: in the presence of their charm or in absence of

470
00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:10,560
Speaker 1: their charm and uh. And then the participants rated their

471
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:14,199
Speaker 1: perceived level of self efficiency and then completed a memory

472
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 1: task that was essentially a variant of the you know,

473
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 1: the classic card game concentration. So psychologist Lisaan and Thomish,

474
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 1: she found that those people who had their lucky charms,

475
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:29,200
Speaker 1: they were doing a couple of things here to improve

476
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 1: their performance because really it does prove improve yours. That

477
00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:34,439
Speaker 1: was they found once again, if they had their lucky

478
00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 1: charms on hand, they did better. Yes, they were setting

479
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,639
Speaker 1: lawtier goals from for themselves, and then they were exhibiting

480
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:45,359
Speaker 1: increased persistence right they were. They did not give up

481
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:49,080
Speaker 1: as easily because they felt bolstered by these lucky charms. Yeah,

482
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: it's it's pretty crazy. I mean, it's the idea that

483
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:54,400
Speaker 1: the so here's the try sarratops squishy in my hand

484
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 1: and bringing in I'm thinking, well, I've got to try

485
00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,159
Speaker 1: sarratops with me. I'm gonna you know, I'm not just

486
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:00,920
Speaker 1: gonna go for norm. I'm going to shoot for higher

487
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: because I've got this, I've got the power up in

488
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 1: my hand, and then I'm gonna stick to it more

489
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:08,560
Speaker 1: because because because my I'm focusing with my attention, I

490
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:13,199
Speaker 1: have the the symbol of my my commitment with me

491
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,120
Speaker 1: as well. Well here's where the fun house mirror shutters.

492
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 1: If you are aware of this effect, then supposedly this

493
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 1: no longer works anymore. If you become conscious that you

494
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 1: are attributing magical qualities to an object, then it's supposedly

495
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:31,720
Speaker 1: is not going to be effective, you know. And I

496
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:34,600
Speaker 1: don't really I don't really buy that part of the study. Well,

497
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,199
Speaker 1: I think it depends. I think that this depends on

498
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 1: the individual, because for my own part, I find myself

499
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,440
Speaker 1: able to drift in and out of believing in things

500
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,720
Speaker 1: depending on what my day to day outlook is and

501
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:48,679
Speaker 1: depending on, you know, how I want to view the world,

502
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 1: Like I find myself able to to a certain extent,

503
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:55,640
Speaker 1: you know, engage in the belief that an object might

504
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,399
Speaker 1: have some sort of you know, luck, or believe in

505
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 1: some varying levels of spirituality depending on on how I'm

506
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,320
Speaker 1: viewing the day. So I can imagine somebody, you know,

507
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 1: logically knowing that something is just a piece of metal,

508
00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 1: but then still buying into it enough to get that

509
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 1: effect out of it. Well, I think that's because you

510
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: have a creative, fiction twisted mind that's been trained that way.

511
00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 1: So you can, I think, dive into magical thinking very easily. Yeah, well,

512
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:25,920
Speaker 1: and then still be hanging out with reality. But I don't.

513
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 1: I'm not unique in that, and that that that so,

514
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:33,239
Speaker 1: so I think the study is fascinating. That I do,

515
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: I do kind of disagree on that part. Um about

516
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,879
Speaker 1: the idea that just merely by listening to this podcast,

517
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,959
Speaker 1: we have deactivated all of your lucky arms out there,

518
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:43,159
Speaker 1: I mean some of you, if you're the right kind

519
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 1: of person, that we just totally zapt all of your

520
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,520
Speaker 1: your magic do dads? Sorry about that, Um, All right,

521
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 1: so let's change the subject and close this podcast out

522
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,400
Speaker 1: on Ikea, because I kea. What is this but the

523
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 1: the iconic symbol of all objects known to man that

524
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,920
Speaker 1: can be acquired by man? Right right? And of course

525
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: the thing we always come back to with Ikea anytime

526
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:07,760
Speaker 1: we're talking about Ikea, anytime we're we're thinking about Ikea,

527
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 1: and I'm not talking about in the podcast, but just

528
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:14,400
Speaker 1: in general all of us is the assembly of these items.

529
00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:19,880
Speaker 1: They come with the really well does well designed graphically instructions,

530
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:21,360
Speaker 1: and you bring them home and you try to make

531
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 1: sense out of them, and then you take one or two,

532
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 1: three or four goes. That assembling it correctly. Generally, with

533
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:29,879
Speaker 1: some there's a little bit it's like going through a

534
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 1: maze because you end up getting a dead corner and

535
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,439
Speaker 1: then you realize, oh, I already used those screws in

536
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:37,199
Speaker 1: the wrong spot. Let's see if they can actually be

537
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,919
Speaker 1: removed without destroying the product? Is that little is it?

538
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:42,919
Speaker 1: The l Is that a Elan wrench? Yeah? Okay, that

539
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 1: thing is ridiculous to me because you have you have

540
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:46,679
Speaker 1: all these pieces in front of you, and then you

541
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 1: have this tiny little Alan wrench that's supposed to do

542
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:50,480
Speaker 1: the job. Well, you can get a screw driver with

543
00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 1: the Alan. Well, power tools always come out. That's the

544
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,359
Speaker 1: joke of it, right, And I feel like the h

545
00:27:55,920 --> 00:28:00,439
Speaker 1: the little man that is that is the symbol of

546
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 1: the person that's supposed to be you is overly comical too,

547
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:05,880
Speaker 1: And it's sort of like this commentary on the whole process.

548
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 1: I think he's supposed to be kind of disarming as

549
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 1: well when you reach the frustration point. See I see

550
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 1: his passage as being mocking. He's laughing at you. You're

551
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 1: just sitting in the living room floor, just surrounded by

552
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 1: half as symboled furniture. Yeah, yeah, beating away. Yeah. I mean,

553
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:24,879
Speaker 1: I have, I have. There have been times when I've

554
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 1: been assembling Ikea furniture and I love i Kea furniture,

555
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 1: but there have been times when I've been assembling it

556
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 1: where I've just about lost my mind. Well see, I

557
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: think that is what plays into this whole idea of

558
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:37,919
Speaker 1: this I keya effect right right, And this is the

559
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 1: idea ultimately, it's the idea that if we build something ourselves,

560
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 1: even if it's crap, we care more about it. And

561
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 1: you we've all encountered this with people. You know, it's

562
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,360
Speaker 1: anybody that knows somebody who engages in a bit of

563
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 1: of art, a bit of creative endeavor would be it,

564
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 1: be it a be it somebody who's really good at it,

565
00:28:58,040 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 1: or you know, someone who's new to to the practice.

566
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 1: There's a tendency to to love your own work, even

567
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: when it's not good. Well, I mean you see this

568
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:08,959
Speaker 1: in fiction writing a lot, right when you're going through

569
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 1: the editing process. Is that what was the term, kill

570
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 1: your children? You don't want to do it, darlings, kill

571
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 1: you darlings. You don't want to to This is your

572
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 1: creation and it doesn't fit in and it doesn't really

573
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: even matter to the plotline anymore. But it's very hard

574
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 1: to get rid of those things. Yeah, I mean it's

575
00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:26,600
Speaker 1: it's why you need an outsider to come in and

576
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,480
Speaker 1: look at your stuff. That's the beauty of the editor. Um.

577
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: You know, that's why you know I have awesome ladder

578
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: Milk around to edit my work for the website, because

579
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 1: otherwise stuff would remain in there that really needs to

580
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 1: be cut. He needs you need a hard cruel louder

581
00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:44,720
Speaker 1: Milk is not cruel to come in and and and

582
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: take out all the unimportant organs, just rip them right

583
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 1: out of the body. Yeah, you do need someone putting

584
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 1: in comments next your work saying, hey, what's up with this? Yeah?

585
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 1: But see, this is really interesting about the IKEA effect.

586
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:57,360
Speaker 1: Is that, um, you know in the NPR story about

587
00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 1: this called Why You Left, that I keep it a

588
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:02,200
Speaker 1: keya table even if it's crooked. Um, they're saying that

589
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: people don't have this editor coming in. And you see

590
00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 1: this in company, see people getting really tied to this

591
00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: idea of what a product is or what it is

592
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,560
Speaker 1: that they're making it. Sometimes it's two years in the mak. Yeah,

593
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 1: you're putting just loads of time and energy into it

594
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 1: and you're just you're just you're in the jungle with it.

595
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 1: You're in the jungle, and then someone from the outside

596
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:23,800
Speaker 1: comes in and goes, it's crooked. Yeah, you know, um,

597
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:25,520
Speaker 1: and that you need that, you need you need that

598
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 1: sort of fresh perspective. So that's helpful. I mean, we're

599
00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: we've kind of transitioned away from objects more into um

600
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 1: philosophy here. But hey, I mean, isn't that what objects

601
00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 1: are doing in the first place. They're just metaphors for

602
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 1: us really. Yeah, So that the study was big on

603
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 1: stressing that that building your own stuff boost you're feeling

604
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:46,200
Speaker 1: of pride and confidence signals to others that you are competent,

605
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: which I think is as good as well and reminds

606
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: me of that recent Portlandia sketch. Did you see this

607
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,960
Speaker 1: with the duty build his own furniture? No? I didn't

608
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 1: see that one. He's he's like the all the women

609
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: want to date him and marry him and they can

610
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:02,720
Speaker 1: make make him their own because they learn, oh, he

611
00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: makes his own furniture, you know, because like it's you know,

612
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 1: it's just the perfect thing, right, But then they find

613
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 1: out that he makes really crappy furniture. But he just

614
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: doesn't realize it, so so it kind of fits in

615
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 1: with what we're talking about. But the third thing that

616
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,720
Speaker 1: they found in the study that was interesting was that, uh,

617
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,800
Speaker 1: this is a direct quote from the study, threatening consumers

618
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 1: sense of self increases their propensity to make things themselves.

619
00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 1: So the idea to the idea here that that the

620
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 1: author talks about in this this article is that theoretically,

621
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 1: if you were to provide a visitor to Ikea with

622
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 1: a really difficult math problem to you know, to really

623
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,479
Speaker 1: bust them down a few chops and make them make

624
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:46,720
Speaker 1: them feel kind of stupid, then let him into Ikea,

625
00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 1: they're going to be even more into the idea of

626
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:52,000
Speaker 1: buying something and building it themselves so they can make

627
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 1: good again. So because their ego has been taken down

628
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:56,479
Speaker 1: a couple of notches, and then if they can just

629
00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 1: assemble something, they can regain that. Yeah, yeah, idea. I

630
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 1: think so, because it's it's kind of like anything, you know,

631
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 1: whenever you're logged in a in a process that is

632
00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 1: just seemingly never ending that you don't really feel like

633
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 1: there's a sense of completion, or you have one of

634
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 1: those days where you work on eighteen different things and

635
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 1: finish none of them. Like, what you really want to

636
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:19,200
Speaker 1: do is is nail something you want to say? I

637
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 1: went home and I made a girl cheese from start

638
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,760
Speaker 1: to finish and then I ate it case close close

639
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,080
Speaker 1: that loop. Oh that would get you a lot of ladies.

640
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:30,479
Speaker 1: Hey he makes cheese. He makes cheese. Yeah, well not

641
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: from start to finish, not making your own bread and cheese.

642
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:34,560
Speaker 1: That that would be impressive as well. But yeah, yeah,

643
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 1: I don't know. This is what writ the author was saying,

644
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,840
Speaker 1: is that maybe I could start to game their customers

645
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 1: to their advantage and give them these math problems, or

646
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 1: just put up big placards that say, like, you know

647
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,480
Speaker 1: you're awful and lousy, to put some furniture together and

648
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:52,160
Speaker 1: you feel better. I mean some people love it. I

649
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 1: know people that are just in love with the idea

650
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:57,240
Speaker 1: of putting together furniture. Well, Ikea Hacker is a great

651
00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:00,560
Speaker 1: website to see what people do to to sort of

652
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 1: change the the or to make it more unique, or

653
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 1: you know, try to game the furniture too. Haven't have

654
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: another purpose. I've been saying for a while that Ikea

655
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:14,240
Speaker 1: needs to do like a game show where and the

656
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,280
Speaker 1: teams of of Ikea hackers have to like compete against

657
00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 1: each other, and maybe they're having to do a symbol

658
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 1: furniture in weird places like you know, in a hot

659
00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:25,040
Speaker 1: air balloon or on the subway. But my boy, I

660
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: think you got something there. Yeah it did that sound

661
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,120
Speaker 1: like nineteen Yeah a little bit, A little bit right,

662
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:34,400
Speaker 1: So there you go. Objects um, a little insight into

663
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:37,880
Speaker 1: why we've surround ourselveselves with so much stuff while it's

664
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 1: so important. And I was really I was really interested

665
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,240
Speaker 1: in you know, we're talking about that that space, that

666
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,080
Speaker 1: that that your mind occupies, that that moment when you're

667
00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 1: holding something in your hand and trying to decide whether

668
00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 1: you can part with it and throw it away or

669
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 1: if it has value that it needs to be held

670
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: and and and maintained like that, That to me is

671
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,520
Speaker 1: a very interesting frame of mind um to occupy. And

672
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:04,880
Speaker 1: we've all been there, and uh and and and we

673
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 1: all kind of skew different ways. I think when when

674
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:09,799
Speaker 1: faced with that situation, some of us will just throw

675
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,120
Speaker 1: stuff away at the drop of the hat. My my

676
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:14,320
Speaker 1: wife is one and and she's been a good influence

677
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:18,000
Speaker 1: on me and making me more susceptible to getting rid

678
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: of things instead of keeping them around needlessly, so you

679
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,919
Speaker 1: just have boxes of notes and stuff. Yeah, you know, Um,

680
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 1: if I'm in a store, which I don't really shop

681
00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 1: that much, but if I'm in the store and I

682
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:29,680
Speaker 1: see something I fancy, I actually will carry it around

683
00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:31,759
Speaker 1: for about fifteen minutes to see whether or not I

684
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 1: actually wanted in. Nine out of ten times I put

685
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,880
Speaker 1: it back. That's a that's a good way of doing it.

686
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:39,800
Speaker 1: I found myself doing that sometimes when there's like a weight,

687
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 1: you know, you're having to wait in line to to

688
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 1: check out, and you have the objects in your hand

689
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:46,759
Speaker 1: and you really start to think about what you're doing

690
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:49,360
Speaker 1: and decide, I don't know that I really need that,

691
00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 1: And of course there realizes the danger of of online

692
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:55,640
Speaker 1: shopping immediate. So, hey, what we would love to hear

693
00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:58,560
Speaker 1: from everybody about this, about your thoughts on your relationships

694
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: with objects, because we we all have the um and

695
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,359
Speaker 1: I'd love to hear some stories. I love to hear

696
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:07,799
Speaker 1: some some new insight on blank's that you were fond

697
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,400
Speaker 1: of as a child, other stranger things that you attached

698
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,839
Speaker 1: to as a as a child, things that you're still

699
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:16,359
Speaker 1: attached to in as adult, The various deities that may

700
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 1: occupy your work desk, be they actual Hindu gods or

701
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:25,760
Speaker 1: action figures. I have both online, so I no no judgment. Uh,

702
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:27,680
Speaker 1: let us know what you think. We'd love to hear

703
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,840
Speaker 1: from you at our Facebook account at our Tumbler account.

704
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:32,919
Speaker 1: On both of those we are stuff to blow your mind.

705
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,320
Speaker 1: We also have a Twitter account where our handle is

706
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 1: blow the Mind and you can always drop us a

707
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 1: line at blow the Mind at Discovery dot com For

708
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics, Is it

709
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: how Stuff Works dot com