Speaker 1: The volume. All right, Jason timp is going to stop
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Speaker 1: on these NBA playoff games. We just watched the Pacers
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Speaker 1: finally dried up, couldn't score for three and a half
Speaker 1: minutes at the end, and the Celtics prevail. Killer deals.
Speaker 1: The ticket prices go down the closer you get to
Speaker 1: the game. Download the game Time app. It's hard to
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Speaker 1: lowest prices. Garren teed, all right, a lot of stuff
Speaker 1: to talk about tonight. Jason timpf hoops tonight, mercifully, the
Speaker 1: series is over. Derek White, big corner. Three Pacers don't
Speaker 1: get an offensive bucket last three and a half minutes
Speaker 1: of the game. Yes, I thought they were throwing up
Speaker 1: some crap in the fourth quarter. Yes, I think the
Speaker 1: Pacers are a good young team that I'm not sure
Speaker 1: would win a playoff series in the West. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure if they would. It is what it is. You know,
Speaker 1: sports predictions are fun. I've I've been wrong on the
Speaker 1: Dallas Mavericks all year. So I'm just I thought okay
Speaker 1: See was gonna beat him. I thought Minnesota would beat
Speaker 1: him in seven. I mean, you know, once they got
Speaker 1: you know, Gafford, PJ. Washington, They're a different team. Kyrie's
Speaker 1: playing real defense. But I've been wrong on that. This
Speaker 1: is the easiest sports prediction in the last year. Celtics
Speaker 1: make the finals, then you throw in the injuries. I
Speaker 1: don't know what to make of Indiana. I you know,
Speaker 1: TJ McConnell. You know they've got Pascal Siakam I've liked forever,
Speaker 1: but I kind of felt like this is one of
Speaker 1: those games where I appreciate the effort by Rick Carlisle,
Speaker 1: but I wanted the series to end, and I try
Speaker 1: not to root.
Speaker 2: I just wanted this series to end.
Speaker 1: Am I a bad guy?
Speaker 3: Though we did not need a Game five of Pacer Celtics,
Speaker 3: one of the things that's really fascinating to me about
Speaker 3: that particular series is like Boston was capable at any
Speaker 3: moment of strangling their offense the way they did over
Speaker 3: the final few minutes Indiana and the credit to Rick Carlisle.
Speaker 3: They have crazy ball in player movement. They'll get five
Speaker 3: interchanges within like ten seconds, and Boston switches a lot,
Speaker 3: so like when they're not really engaged, they botch switches
Speaker 3: and guys will bank open and someone will just end
Speaker 3: up breaking open right underneath the basket. But anytime they
Speaker 3: actually communicate and put in the requisite effort, they're actually
Speaker 3: I don't know if you remember college, you remember that
Speaker 3: twenty twenty two Celtics team, the team that made the finals.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they were like they played hard.
Speaker 3: On defense every single night, and it was scary how
Speaker 3: good Jalen Brown, Jason Tatum, Marcus Smart, and Derek White
Speaker 3: could be when they were really engaged defensively. And like, honestly,
Speaker 3: we talk so much about the offensive end with Boston,
Speaker 3: and they certainly have some frustrating things on that end
Speaker 3: of the floor, but when they really lock in defensively,
Speaker 3: they have four awesome versatile defenders. Derek White and then
Speaker 3: they can. Yeah, they can strangle the life out of
Speaker 3: teams when they really want to. Now, the question is
Speaker 3: do they have the habits tied in tightly enough to
Speaker 3: beat a really good team from the West. We're gonna
Speaker 3: find out. But yeah, like that that that punch for
Speaker 3: them has always been there. They just don't throw it
Speaker 3: as often as they need to.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And you know, Jalen Brunson now has a big contract.
Speaker 1: Porzingis Holiday Tatum. These are Richard dudes, you know they
Speaker 1: they and they also know their big favorites. There is
Speaker 1: talk that you can't flip a switch, but when I
Speaker 1: think there's a disparity between teams, like I think Boston
Speaker 1: will be much more engaged in the in the finals. Also,
Speaker 1: I think the last game of the NBA Finals is
Speaker 1: scheduled for like, you know, late June. I don't know
Speaker 1: what they're gonna do this. I mean, are they gonna
Speaker 1: start the final Saturday night? If Dallas closes it out,
Speaker 1: I mean, they may just get you. I look tonight,
Speaker 1: I'm like, how are they gonna How are they gonna
Speaker 1: stretch this out? That's baseball makes that mistake sometimes where
Speaker 1: people get into these series and baseball is an everyday game,
Speaker 1: and then you get into a playoff series and there's
Speaker 1: three days off. Well, it's in the football season, it's October.
Speaker 1: You lose me if you you know, if I want
Speaker 1: to watch the Braves and the Dodgers in the NLCS,
Speaker 1: you can't go three days off, you lose me. So
Speaker 1: I don't know what the NBA is gonna do with
Speaker 1: their final schedule, but I do think Boston's a team.
Speaker 1: This is a team. Now you go Marcus Martin, Drew Holiday,
Speaker 1: you know, a little more of a legacy player. Porzingis
Speaker 1: has made some big time money, been viewed as a unicorn,
Speaker 1: a star. So I think it's hard when these guys
Speaker 1: look at Indiana and they're like, they're terrible defensively, they're
Speaker 1: awfully young. They probably wouldn't be here without some injuries
Speaker 1: to the Knicks. So I think, you know, I was
Speaker 1: thinking about this, Jason. The two easiest ways to win
Speaker 1: a championship it is to be part of a dynasty.
Speaker 1: Those are hard to construct, but once you have it,
Speaker 1: you have lots of players, usually a great coach. You know,
Speaker 1: dynasties get rolling, play with confidence. So you know, once
Speaker 1: you win your first or second with the Bulls. The
Speaker 1: third feels like it's easier. The second way is as
Speaker 1: an underdog that comes out of nowhere with no pressure.
Speaker 1: Dirk and the Mavericks over the heat. The hardest way
Speaker 1: to win a championship is when you don't have one yet.
Speaker 1: We're expecting one for years and you go in as
Speaker 1: a favorite and I look at this Boston team, Dallas,
Speaker 1: I'm thinking it, and we just put this thing together.
Speaker 1: We just shovel the cards through it on the table.
Speaker 1: I think Boston is going to have a lot of
Speaker 1: pressure in the finals. What say you.
Speaker 3: There's gonna be a lot of pressure, and they're not
Speaker 3: gonna in all likelihood, Luca is the best player going
Speaker 3: into that series too, which is another interesting element. You know,
Speaker 3: one of the things one of the biggest lessons I've
Speaker 3: learned from this Dallas Minnesota series is that we got
Speaker 3: to stop looking at the championship picture within the context
Speaker 3: of individual teams, but rather look at it through matchups.
Speaker 3: Because you go out of the second round and you're like, oh, man, Minnesota,
Speaker 3: look at what they did to Denver. They have everyone's number. Clearly,
Speaker 3: they're the best team in the league, and it's like, well,
Speaker 3: actually they have a very specific weakness, which is rim protection,
Speaker 3: because Anthony Edwards loves to get downhill and attack the rim. Right,
Speaker 3: you go against Denver who can't protect the rim, and
Speaker 3: you go against Phoenix with Usuf Nurkic who can't protect
Speaker 3: the rim, and it's just slicing and dice in them
Speaker 3: all series long. All of a sudden, Dallas has a
Speaker 3: freaky athlete and Derek Jones Junior to put on the
Speaker 3: ball in an elite couple of rim protectors, and Derek
Speaker 3: Lively and Daniel Gafford, and they look flummoxed. They look
Speaker 3: like they don't know what to do when the game
Speaker 3: really slows down. And so I have to kind of
Speaker 3: take that into the finals as well. And as we
Speaker 3: look into the finals, you know, if it ends up
Speaker 3: being Dallas Boston, you know Luke is going to be
Speaker 3: the best player in the series. One of the biggest
Speaker 3: issues for Boston and it's a big part of why
Speaker 3: Indiana scored on them as effectively as they did. Boston
Speaker 3: has been the worst pick and roll defense in the
Speaker 3: playoffs to this point, and a lot of that has
Speaker 3: to do with Porzingis being out. But what do we
Speaker 3: know that Luca's gonna do. Lucas gonna pick on Al
Speaker 3: Horford every single opportunity he gets, just like you're seeing
Speaker 3: Indiana do so often over the course of this series,
Speaker 3: picking on him whenever they have an opportunity to opportunity
Speaker 3: to in ball screens. And so, honestly, like there's a
Speaker 3: lot of advantages that Dallas brings to the table. That said,
Speaker 3: Boston does just have a ton of talent, and they
Speaker 3: have one specific thing that I think is super fascinating.
Speaker 3: Jason Tatum is one of the few athletes in the
Speaker 3: league who's actually big and strong enough to cause some
Speaker 3: issues for Luca, And so I think that's kind of
Speaker 3: an interesting matchup piece going into that series. And so like,
Speaker 3: don't I don't necessarily think that Boston's talent or Dallas
Speaker 3: having survived the West means anything. We got to look
Speaker 3: at this in a vacuum, and Boston has a lot
Speaker 3: of advantages, Dallas has a lot of advantages. It's going
Speaker 3: to be really interesting to get to dig into. But
Speaker 3: you're right, Boston is going to go into that series
Speaker 3: a substantial favorite. I think we're over I think right
Speaker 3: now on DraftKings are already something like minus two to
Speaker 3: twenty to win the title. There's a ton of pressure. Again,
Speaker 3: if Jason Tatum does get badly outplayed by Luca in
Speaker 3: that series, after what happened with Stephan twenty twenty two,
Speaker 3: that would be a disaster. So I do think pressure
Speaker 3: will play a role. But I think Boston being at
Speaker 3: home to start helps, and the big time off helps
Speaker 3: a lot too. Because you were talking about the final schedule,
Speaker 3: it's set. They're not playing Game one till June sixth,
Speaker 3: So if Dallas wins tomorrow is going to six Yeah,
Speaker 3: there's going to be eight consecutive days off if dat
Speaker 3: Dallas wins tomorrow. A couple of things there. Luca's got
Speaker 3: a bad knee, that's really good for his knee. Chris
Speaker 3: hops porzingis a little bit extra time to get back
Speaker 3: from that calf injury. So we could be seeing very
Speaker 3: different versions of both of these teams when we get
Speaker 3: to that point. You know, for what could have been
Speaker 3: of much more entertaining conference finals, Dallas Boston feels like
Speaker 3: a pretty damn good NBA Finals. You excited about that?
Speaker 1: No, I think I said this today on FS one.
Speaker 1: I worked today and I said this is as good
Speaker 1: as it gets. I have a huge brand in the
Speaker 1: Celtics with two stars who have played together for years,
Speaker 1: so people know the story. I've got Mark Cuban and
Speaker 1: Dirk Novitsky made the Mavericks. They punch above their weight.
Speaker 1: That's a real brand. It's not the Lakers rorior Celtics,
Speaker 1: but it's a real brand. You have two stars, one
Speaker 1: of them controversial Kyrie Irving, you have the Boston Kyrie factor.
Speaker 1: You have the pressure on the Celtics to finally come on. Guys,
Speaker 1: you've been to a final, so you're going to have
Speaker 1: a favorite. This is as good as the NBA can do.
Speaker 1: I mean, I love watching Denver play, but I don't
Speaker 1: think they break through nationally. I don't think Minnesota does.
Speaker 1: I don't think Oh Casey does. I think the Knicks
Speaker 1: will if they could get a Paul George or one
Speaker 1: more highly effective wing player. But this is really good.
Speaker 1: There's I think it's going to be a great final.
Speaker 1: I didn't know. I was just sitting here looking to
Speaker 1: so you're right, that is right, June.
Speaker 2: Isn't that crazy? That's a long break? I mean, you're
Speaker 2: that's a whole playoff series.
Speaker 1: Well, you're lucky that, you know, because baseball's had long
Speaker 1: breaks and it's just a killer in October because there's
Speaker 1: a college football or pro football. I mean, Fox is
Speaker 1: now running college football games on Friday. You just can't
Speaker 1: do that in football season. You can do it now.
Speaker 1: It's funny. My takeaway, I said this on the air today.
Speaker 1: If Porzingis plays, I like Boston barely, but I do
Speaker 1: think I'll tell you a series it reminds me of
Speaker 1: two thousand Blazers Lakers, the Celtics of the Blazers. Blazers
Speaker 1: had our Vetus, Steve Smith and Scottie Pippin and Ponzi
Speaker 1: Wells and David Stodameier Rashid Wallace. They had more quality
Speaker 1: players than the Lakers did. The Lakers had Kobe and Shack,
Speaker 1: and it really experienced coach. Multiple times in that series.
Speaker 1: The Blazers gave them fits. Lakers couldn't stop Rashid Wallace.
Speaker 1: There were multiple matchup issues for the Lakers, but they
Speaker 1: had Shack and Kobe, and I kind of feel like
Speaker 1: the league's never been this gifted offensively ever, that's never
Speaker 1: looked like this, and increasingly in these series, you know,
Speaker 1: it's just like who's going to get the shots. I mean,
Speaker 1: Minnesota is the best defensive team in the league. People
Speaker 1: were targeting Rudy Gobert. It's like, that's the best defensive player,
Speaker 1: go after him. It's a different ballgame when you got
Speaker 1: seven footers that have to come and defend the perimeter.
Speaker 1: It's a different world. And I could just see this series.
Speaker 1: You know, aggressive teams win. They went and got I
Speaker 1: mean they first of all, they hired Nico Harrison from Nike,
Speaker 1: then they get Kyrie, then the trade deadline. I mean
Speaker 1: they took big swings and sports rewards. So there's an
Speaker 1: aggressive culture with this team. And don't you feel a
Speaker 1: little bit like Dallas, with Kyrie's temperament, feels like we
Speaker 1: should take advantage of the opportunity we have this.
Speaker 2: This may not be in the oven long, right, Like
Speaker 2: this might be one year.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, I mean, don't you think, Jason, there is
Speaker 1: a sense with Dallas like let's get this. This is
Speaker 1: the time. You know that Maverick dirt team, it was
Speaker 1: a jumbalaya. It was it was a bunch of stuff
Speaker 1: thrown together that the tarmac wasn't very long on it.
Speaker 1: So I the more I think about this, I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: it feels like seven and it feels like Luca's gonna
Speaker 1: hit a shot. It really does. Like I just it's
Speaker 1: so hard for me. I that Blazer Lakers series, I
Speaker 1: felt six games, hell, I felt going into the fourth
Speaker 1: quarter the Blazers were the better team in the series.
Speaker 1: And then Kobe and Shaq do their thing, and do
Speaker 1: you have a strong feeling either way?
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I find the dynamic to be super fascinating
Speaker 3: in the sense that Boston is this super talented team.
Speaker 3: They have four guys that make over thirty million, and
Speaker 3: they all deserve to if they all are free agent tomorrow,
Speaker 3: they all make over thirty million. And then Chris excuse me,
Speaker 3: Derek White is the one guy who doesn't. He makes
Speaker 3: like eighteen and if he was a free agent tomorrow,
Speaker 3: he'd make thirty thirty five. He has a huge Yeah,
Speaker 3: he's arguably their second or third best player. I'd say
Speaker 3: probably their third best player, right, And so like they
Speaker 3: have an absurd amount of talent, it's very equal opportunity.
Speaker 3: We've joked on the show, it's like vibes. It's like
Speaker 3: you take this possession, you take that possession. It's like
Speaker 3: when they won Game three. It's like Drew Holliday just
Speaker 3: decides to randomly attack Pascal Siakam at the end of
Speaker 3: the game.
Speaker 1: Even Al Horford has nights. I mean, Al Horford could
Speaker 1: drop twenty three, you'd never be shocked.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they look they almost look like a different version
Speaker 3: of themselves every night, Whereas like Dallas, it's like every
Speaker 3: single Dallas Mavericks basketball game I've watched since Luca got
Speaker 3: drafted has looked more or less the same, you know
Speaker 3: what I mean, Where it's like there's a corner three
Speaker 3: point shooter, there's a corner three point shooter, there's a
Speaker 3: lob threat, and then there's a guy on the opposite wing,
Speaker 3: and then there's usually a secondary creator, whether it's Jalen
Speaker 3: Brunt center, it's you know, Kyrie Irvinger, it's Spencer Dinwiddie, right,
Speaker 3: and so like it's so what I find fascinating about
Speaker 3: the build is like this to me, is the maximized
Speaker 3: version of the Luca Dallas Mavericks construction. Right, You've got
Speaker 3: Luca playing the best basketball he's ever played in his life.
Speaker 3: You've got the best number two he's ever played with.
Speaker 3: Kyry irving was playing the best basketball he's played in
Speaker 3: a long time, right, and he's also defending at a
Speaker 3: much higher level than he has in recent seasons. They've
Speaker 3: got legitimate wing defenders. Derek Jones Junior was a veteran
Speaker 3: minimum contract who's been one of the best perimeter guys
Speaker 3: in the league. He's done an awesome job on Anthony
Speaker 3: Edwards in this playoff series.
Speaker 2: PJ.
Speaker 3: Washington has been super valuable, valuable for them in all
Speaker 3: three rounds. And then they've got two vertical spacers, right
Speaker 3: and so in Gafford and Lively, and both of them
Speaker 3: have been big time defensive threats for them at various
Speaker 3: points during the season.
Speaker 2: And so what I.
Speaker 3: Find fascinating is it's very much like a star driven
Speaker 3: construct with guys playing super focused roles. Guard the other
Speaker 3: team's best player, hit a corner three, you know, protect
Speaker 3: the rim, screen, and roll hard with Luca like they
Speaker 3: have super focused roles versus Boston, where it's like everyone's
Speaker 3: kind of a Swiss Army knife doing something different on
Speaker 3: any given night. Even defensively, they'll have Tatum gard to center,
Speaker 3: They'll have Drew Holiday guard to center. They'll put Al
Speaker 3: Horford on Pascal Siakam because that's an archetype he has
Speaker 3: success with. So it's like, I find it really fascinating
Speaker 3: that they're two very very different team constructs. That said, like,
Speaker 3: one of the things that I worry about for Dallas
Speaker 3: in the series is they have the ability to put
Speaker 3: some more size and strength on Luca than Minnesota does.
Speaker 3: What I found really interesting in the Thunder series, Lou Dort,
Speaker 3: built like a linebacker, caused Lucas some problems. Jaden McDaniels,
Speaker 3: a more highly regarded perimeter defender, is getting bullied by
Speaker 3: Luca because he's skinny and gangly, and Luca can just
Speaker 3: shove him off and get wherever he wants. Tatum's got
Speaker 3: some real size and strength. Jaalen Brown is a more
Speaker 3: strong and stout lower base than a guy like Jaden McDaniels.
Speaker 3: Drew Holliday is a famous like fire truck built like
Speaker 3: really low strong kind of base. So they have a
Speaker 3: lot of big, strong bodies that throw at Luca. And
Speaker 3: then the second piece of it is. One of the
Speaker 3: big reasons why Minnesota's offense is struggling so bad in
Speaker 3: this series is they're really struggling to get the ball
Speaker 3: to the weak side, and Anthony Edwards is struggling to
Speaker 3: dissect their defense with their aggressive coverages. Boston is awesome
Speaker 3: at getting the ball moving around to shooters and like
Speaker 3: they will get you in space. And one of the
Speaker 3: things they did until Haliburton got hurt, they literally every
Speaker 3: single time down the floor were targeting Haliburton every single time,
Speaker 3: whether it was through Tatum and Brown, or Tatum and
Speaker 3: Derek White, or whether it was through Jalen Brown and
Speaker 3: Drew Holliday, they were attacking him every single time. They
Speaker 3: will do the same to Luca and they will try
Speaker 3: to wear him down, And so I would say that
Speaker 3: I lean towards Boston as well. But I do believe
Speaker 3: that this Dallas defense is really good and if they
Speaker 3: can play Boston into some poor shooting performances, if a
Speaker 3: guy like a PJ. Washington or a Derek Jones Junior
Speaker 3: can have a similar effect on Tatum that some other
Speaker 3: guys have had in the past, like Andrew Wiggins did
Speaker 3: in the twenty twenty two finals, if they have some success,
Speaker 3: I think they have a shot. But I would lean
Speaker 3: Boston at this point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, even getting the kid out of Duke Lively,
Speaker 1: who was viewed just you don't get many players at
Speaker 1: a college basketball that can play not only in the NBA,
Speaker 1: can play, but play for a really good team and
Speaker 1: get minutes. So it's like they even Dallas even throws
Speaker 1: that at you, where they get a college kid. Now,
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: How much you know.
Speaker 1: Again, the finals are different, like it. It feels really different.
Speaker 1: The finals even feel different than the conference finals. There's
Speaker 1: much more at tension. I don't think Boston has played
Speaker 1: with even they feel like they're playing about eighty percent.
Speaker 1: Like this game was a great example where I'm like, God,
Speaker 1: if I have to have another TJ McConnell shot, give
Speaker 1: me a break. And I just felt like, okay, this
Speaker 1: seven point lead is going to evaporate. And then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you could just sense it was like, okay,
Speaker 1: Boston started getting a couple of really nice defensive sets.
Speaker 1: Then they hit Derek White from the corner and you're like, okay,
Speaker 1: Boston really picked their spots to be engaged and they
Speaker 1: were good enough. I don't think that's what we'll see.
Speaker 1: I think they know, oh what they're in for, all right.
Speaker 1: We are getting closer to crowning an NBA champ and
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Speaker 1: I was thinking so much today about Bill Walton, the
Speaker 1: passing of the Great Bill Walton. So I grew up
Speaker 1: in the Pacific Northwest. You know that, so the first
Speaker 1: time I watched basketball was seventy two, seventy three. The
Speaker 1: Lakers had Weston Goodrich, a very old Wilt. They were
Speaker 1: very good back then, So I don't remember the Knicks
Speaker 1: winning a championship. That was like seventy one seventy two.
Speaker 1: I started watching TV in seventy two. I was like
Speaker 1: seven eight years old, so I remember the old west
Speaker 1: Goodrich Lakers, the seventy seven Blazers, the seventy six Sonics,
Speaker 1: the Warriors in about seventy seven to seventy eight won
Speaker 1: a title Washington with Elvin Hayes West Sunfield. But Bill
Speaker 1: Walton really was for people your age, you're more of
Speaker 1: a basketball encyclopedia, but he was. He was pre Jokic,
Speaker 1: That's what he played like that. And I said this
Speaker 1: today on Fox Sports that if Walton didn't have injuries,
Speaker 1: I think there'd be a debate today he would be
Speaker 1: in the debate for the second best center to Kareem
Speaker 1: of all time. I feel that strongly he wouldn't have
Speaker 1: been the score of Kareem. First of all, he's a
Speaker 1: consensus three time player of the Year in college basketball,
Speaker 1: not an All American. And remember in the era back then,
Speaker 1: it was full of NBA guys. He was the consensus
Speaker 1: Player of the Year three straight times, So there's that.
Speaker 1: The second thing was that Portland team really was not
Speaker 1: terribly talented offensively. It was a lot of Dave towards
Speaker 1: it and Henry Steele and Maurice Lucas. So I mean,
Speaker 1: to win was very much about Bill Walton. But I
Speaker 1: thought one of the interesting things was that we've talked
Speaker 1: about this before many it's surprising how often many of
Speaker 1: the great players in basketball have such unique games. Now,
Speaker 1: Kobe clearly copied a lot of Michael but generally nobody
Speaker 1: played like Kareem Nobody played like George Gervin. There was
Speaker 1: no pre bird to Bird. Lebron was a Swiss Army knife.
Speaker 1: Magic was totally unique. Bill Waller was unique. There was
Speaker 1: no Rvidas Sabonis there. He was the first player that
Speaker 1: came out and would gladly. I mean, if the Blazers
Speaker 1: would have had multiple great offensive players, he would have
Speaker 1: been more robust and dynamic as a distributor. But Walton
Speaker 1: and I remember watching him, the games weren't national. Remember
Speaker 1: you only got like the finals national and that was
Speaker 1: on tape delay, so you didn't get the regionalization. And
Speaker 1: I lived I lived two hours between Seattle and Portland,
Speaker 1: but we got Sonic games. So like, unless I went
Speaker 1: to Portland or they were on this Sunday game with
Speaker 1: CBS Brett Musberg, you didn't see Walton. So I only
Speaker 1: probably saw him six to seven to eight times, most
Speaker 1: of it against the Sixers in the finals. And I
Speaker 1: just remember thinking the hair, the headband. I'm like, I've
Speaker 1: never seen anything like that. Even as a kid, You're like,
Speaker 1: what is that? You know he had this he almost
Speaker 1: shot it like a guard, the way he had his
Speaker 1: hands perven So there are certain things in life as
Speaker 1: an old guy I wish young people could have seen.
Speaker 1: I've said this before. I wish people in their twenties
Speaker 1: understood how great boxing was forty years ago, how great
Speaker 1: it was like the Super Bowl and and and when
Speaker 1: Bill Walton passed, he touched so many lives. So many
Speaker 1: of the feed things on the feedbacks today on the
Speaker 1: internet were so touching. I think Bill Walton would have
Speaker 1: been he would have worked today. He really is a
Speaker 1: today player. There there's my take. He was. He was
Speaker 1: forty to fifty years ahead of his time. A lot
Speaker 1: of people are eight to ten years ahead of their time.
Speaker 1: I honestly, I honestly think Walton was fifty years ahead
Speaker 1: of his time. Who do you have a player that
Speaker 1: you watched when you were eight nine years old that
Speaker 1: literally is imprinted Doctor j and Bill Walton stand out
Speaker 1: to me, you know.
Speaker 3: Lebron was always that for me when I was growing up.
Speaker 3: And it's it's very interesting because the way you put it,
Speaker 3: it's it kind of a piggybacks off what we talked
Speaker 3: about last week in the sense that like all of
Speaker 3: these all time creates, they're almost all weird.
Speaker 2: There's like a weird element to them.
Speaker 3: And I agree with you that Bill Walton I think
Speaker 3: would have done really well in today's NBA because he
Speaker 3: was that connective piece and so many NBA teams now
Speaker 3: are running five out offense, which I'm not going to
Speaker 3: get into it, but the gist of it is it
Speaker 3: depends on a big guy that can make decisions, that
Speaker 3: can set screens and read the floor. The balls in
Speaker 3: the big guy's hands a lot in a lot of
Speaker 3: these modern NBA offenses, right, And like you know, it's
Speaker 3: funny though for me, Bill Walton, for everything mostly comes
Speaker 3: down to what he was as a broadcaster, right, which
Speaker 3: is weird. Yeah, yeah, what's so funny is ida buddy.
Speaker 3: His name was Matt Quartek. He played at the University
Speaker 3: of Arizona and I remember he was he registered there
Speaker 3: one year and he played behind those awesome front lines
Speaker 3: with like Aaron Gordon and Stanley Johnson and Caleb Tarzuski
Speaker 3: and then but I remember he came off the bench
Speaker 3: for those guys. He had a big game against Stanford
Speaker 3: on the road, and I remember he gotta throw it
Speaker 3: down big Man one time from Bill Walton on the call,
Speaker 3: and like me and my buddies were ras at him
Speaker 3: about that forever, because that's the dream, Like you got
Speaker 3: Bill Walton talking about you'd being the big man dunkin
Speaker 3: down the lane. Like he just was always iconic as
Speaker 3: a broadcaster, and like he always just brought this insane
Speaker 3: energy right uh, to to to the to that environment.
Speaker 3: Even when you'd go to McHale Center, because I used
Speaker 3: to go to a lot of University of Arizona games,
Speaker 3: Like you'd sit up there and you'd actually see him
Speaker 3: on the on the sideline and he stand out from
Speaker 3: the crowd because.
Speaker 2: He's so damn tall.
Speaker 3: And he's like waving his arms and he's getting all active.
Speaker 1: And Jason, he also was ahead of his time. He
Speaker 1: was very much against the Vietnam War. He was sit
Speaker 1: ins on UCLA's campus like he was. We had some
Speaker 1: track and field athletes that were socially conscious conscious. Bill
Speaker 1: was one of the first outspoken athletes I can remember.
Speaker 1: I there's a there's a great story about him. So
Speaker 1: he was close to John Wooden until John Wooden's passing.
Speaker 1: John a very humble man, lived in a very Bill Plashky.
Speaker 1: The La Times wrote about it today that Walton would
Speaker 1: call him a couple of times a week, and he
Speaker 1: called him on his nineteen ninetieth birthday and Plashky was
Speaker 1: there and John Wooden said, you know, I don't do
Speaker 1: much of the talking, but Bill calls regularly, and he goes.
Speaker 1: You know, there's no more enjoyable phone call I get
Speaker 1: than a couple of times a week from Bill Walton.
Speaker 1: But when he got to UCLA, Walton wouldn't cut his hair,
Speaker 1: and so he said, coach, very iconic plastic, I'm not
Speaker 1: going to cut my hair. And John Wooden said, well,
Speaker 1: we'll miss you. So Bill got in his bicycle and
Speaker 1: bicycle across campus to a barber, but we lost. I
Speaker 1: went and looked at I went to watch YouTube highlights
Speaker 1: of Bill Walton. Today, I went back and I do
Speaker 1: this when somebody passes. Could be you know Glenn Fry
Speaker 1: the Eagles, or you know anybody in sports and Bill
Speaker 1: today I sat there before the Celtics game for about
Speaker 1: thirty minutes and I went back and watched some college
Speaker 1: stuff and then his blazer stuff. And for a kid
Speaker 1: from the Northwest, Bill was really special. I want to
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about something that makes being an
Speaker 1: nbagm very difficult. It's very unique to the culture. So
Speaker 1: in football, most of your star players and almost all
Speaker 1: players Jason get in line with the coach, the culture,
Speaker 1: the system. There's not a lot of pushback. It's very
Speaker 1: It's not an independent sport. I mean even Brandon IU
Speaker 1: will go erase his social media stuff, but he's a Niner.
Speaker 1: He wants to be a Niner. And the NBA is different.
Speaker 1: And there were almost no offers for Kyrie Irving out
Speaker 1: of Brooklyn. He was talks at it. It was February fifth,
Speaker 1: twenty was at twenty three no offers. So I mean Brooklyn,
Speaker 1: you had the vaccine situation. But this is why Kawhi
Speaker 1: got a big contract, Jimmy Butler, who had bounced around
Speaker 1: in Miami. This is why Kyrie is going to get one.
Speaker 1: Because if you can get that player that's transcended and
Speaker 1: you just get him in the right frame of mind,
Speaker 1: you get trophies and it's as great as the basketball
Speaker 1: talent is. Man, Jason, there's like eight players in the
Speaker 1: planet that are just different. And I'm watching Kyrie and
Speaker 1: Traffic and I'm like, I don't there's no comp I
Speaker 1: don't even.
Speaker 2: Know what that is.
Speaker 1: He's better than Isaiah offensively, he doesn't shoot like Steph,
Speaker 1: but he's better around the rim and traffic, he's better
Speaker 1: with his left hand. I mean, like when they made
Speaker 1: the move, I said, you got to get Luca somebody,
Speaker 1: you know, and nobody wants to give you a great player.
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to swing because nobody's gonna say, oh,
Speaker 1: they've got Luca, let's give him another great player, or
Speaker 1: you're done. What was your initial thought when they got Kyrie?
Speaker 2: I loved the deal.
Speaker 3: I you know. One of the things that really bothers
Speaker 3: me about the way that deal has looked back at
Speaker 3: as like super risky and like, don't get me wrong,
Speaker 3: there was a certain element of risk and I loved you.
Speaker 3: I loved your opening. I think it was your open
Speaker 3: on the Herd today where you mentioned like pat Riley
Speaker 3: getting Jimmy Butler. It's like, yeah, that was a dude
Speaker 3: who is mercurial and was like gotten fights with players
Speaker 3: at practice and it was obviously like a very weird
Speaker 3: type of ego. And he's been amazing in Miami. Lebron
Speaker 3: James is a guy like if he did leave the
Speaker 3: Lakers this summer, which I don't believe you do, but
Speaker 3: there's been he will, but there's been some reports like
Speaker 3: the maybe Phoenix is interested, maybe Philadelphia is interested. You
Speaker 3: don't think if you signed Lebron James at a veteran minimum,
Speaker 3: it's going to come with a lot of additional stuff
Speaker 3: like media, like a lot of like a just drama
Speaker 3: over the course of the season, just by virtue of
Speaker 3: his star power. That's like part of the risk is
Speaker 3: just bringing in that type of like real big personality
Speaker 3: into a locker room.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 3: The part that bothers me about the way the Kyrie
Speaker 3: thing was looked back at is it made so much
Speaker 3: sense to me at the time because of why he
Speaker 3: was requesting a trade. He wasn't requesting a trade because
Speaker 3: he wanted to leave. He wasn't requesting a trade because
Speaker 3: he just wanted a change of scenery. He was in
Speaker 3: a contract year and Sean Marks wasn't going to give
Speaker 3: him a new deal, so he was heavily incentivized to
Speaker 3: go into his next situation and bring his a game
Speaker 3: both on the court and off the court. It was like,
Speaker 3: if there was a time to buy Kyrie, that was
Speaker 3: the time to buy Kyrie. It made a ton of
Speaker 3: sense and like and honestly, looking back at it, I
Speaker 3: remember saying this at the time.
Speaker 2: Loved the deal.
Speaker 3: They just needed to nail some stuff after the fact,
Speaker 3: and they did. They went to the summer, they got
Speaker 3: the sign and trade for Grant Williams, which ended up
Speaker 3: being a vehicle for them to use at this year's
Speaker 3: trade deadline. They got Derek Lively, who has been I mean,
Speaker 3: we're underselling him on this show. He's he's arguably better
Speaker 3: than Gafford's He's a better passer on the role, he's
Speaker 3: a better defensive player, like, he's an incredible player. And
Speaker 3: then obviously Daniel Gafford in the deal.
Speaker 2: PJ.
Speaker 3: Washington and the deal, we talked about the veteran minimum
Speaker 3: signing of Derek Jones Junior. He's probably the best veteran
Speaker 3: minimum signing that any team has made in the league
Speaker 3: this year. Like they nailed the stuff on the margins
Speaker 3: after the fact and tied it all together. And what
Speaker 3: it really comes down to is this, and this is
Speaker 3: why the risk, why I love the risk when you
Speaker 3: have real superstars that can do the really hard stuff
Speaker 3: to replicate. Like to your point about TJ McConnell, love
Speaker 3: TJ McConnell, played with them, played against him a few
Speaker 3: times at Arizona. He legitimately is like like an awesome competitor,
Speaker 3: a dude that's really fun to watch, but yeah, he's
Speaker 3: not going to be able to get a bucket against
Speaker 3: a really locked in Celtics defense, right, Like the really
Speaker 3: difficult to replicate stuff Hyrie can do. Right, So then
Speaker 3: you can you can by virtue having Luca and having Kyrie.
Speaker 3: You can then go get players that are specialists, and
Speaker 3: specialists are easier to find at discount and from there
Speaker 3: you can build out a roster that where it's like, hey,
Speaker 3: I don't need you to, you know, come off of
Speaker 3: this dribble handoff and make decisions in the lane the
Speaker 3: way that KCP does for the Nuggets. I just need
Speaker 3: you to guard Anthony Edwards and go stand in the corner.
Speaker 3: And the only way you have the ability to do
Speaker 3: that is if you give Luca a legitimate secondary shot creator.
Speaker 3: It made a ton of sense that he would. He
Speaker 3: obviously got dragged through the mud for good reason. He
Speaker 3: got dragged through the mud there for a couple of
Speaker 3: years in Brooklyn. Wasn't just the COVID stuff either. He
Speaker 3: was like ghosting on Steve Nash without telling him, Like
Speaker 3: he just go celebrate his sister's birthday for a week
Speaker 3: and like just leave the team. Like he was bad.
Speaker 3: He did a really bad job. But he had learned
Speaker 3: behind the scenes that he would pay the price by
Speaker 3: virtue of him not getting a new deal from Brooklyn.
Speaker 3: So that was the best time to buy. I thought
Speaker 3: Mark Cuban made the right risk there, and they've nailed
Speaker 3: everything since then and the rest is history. I mean,
Speaker 3: here they are, They're going to be in the NBA Finals.
Speaker 1: I've wondered for years why Dallas isn't a greater destination
Speaker 1: or a more alluring destination for free agents. Never have
Speaker 1: a five hour flight. If you play there, you're right
Speaker 1: in the middle of the country. I mean, if you're
Speaker 1: playing in the Pacific northwest of the West, you got
Speaker 1: five six hour flights all the time. It's a winter league.
Speaker 1: It's not Phoenix for Miami, but it's you know, it's doable.
Speaker 1: Winter weather, forty degrees forty eight to fifty two when
Speaker 1: you land, no state tax, beautiful women everywhere. I always
Speaker 1: Somebody once suggested that Mark Cuban was such a prominent
Speaker 1: star as an owner that he could take some of
Speaker 1: the appeal off star players that Europeans didn't mind that,
Speaker 1: you know, European Dirk and Luca, they don't want the press.
Speaker 1: But sometimes an agent wouldn't send his domestic star to
Speaker 1: Dallas because Cuban is such a star. Plus it's a
Speaker 1: cowboy town. So people have suggested, you know. But I
Speaker 1: sometimes I'll watch pro athletes and they'll you know, like
Speaker 1: when Justin Field says I want to play for the Steelers,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, you already had a defensive coach. You
Speaker 1: don't want another one. You're going to be a backup
Speaker 1: to Russell Wilson, that's not where you want to go.
Speaker 1: Kirk Cousins goes, I want to go play for Atlanta
Speaker 1: because it's got a great line, offensive weapons and a
Speaker 1: crappy division. And I look at some of these players
Speaker 1: and where they go, and I'm like, why don't more
Speaker 1: guys go to Dallas. I do feel like most European
Speaker 1: players we've talked about this Jason would rather be loyal,
Speaker 1: Like they just rather stay and not. They don't want
Speaker 1: to bounce around the league, you know. I mean they
Speaker 1: it's almost like they feel like they want that one.
Speaker 1: They love their homeland. These guys are on a golf
Speaker 1: stream the second the championship parades over seasons and they
Speaker 1: and they just want a second home and that's where
Speaker 1: they get drafted. They don't they don't want to beat
Speaker 1: They've those those guys bounce around Europe. I mean, Europeans
Speaker 1: travel because of their training system. They travel more than
Speaker 1: we do. Those guys bounce around their country. That's that's
Speaker 1: what they know. They come over here. They want to
Speaker 1: keep it simple. They want to play in San Antonio, Dallas, uson.
Speaker 1: They don't want to bounce around, so I you know,
Speaker 1: for Dirk. I felt like there was so much disappointment
Speaker 1: until he finally got it. It's if Luke, if Luca
Speaker 1: can win a title, boy, Dallas could be really good
Speaker 1: for a long time. I think there's a lot of
Speaker 1: guys because you know what, sometimes it just takes a catalyst.
Speaker 1: I mean, Jokic. Now you look at Denver, this football market,
Speaker 1: this hockey mark whatever, it's like, oh no, it's gonna
Speaker 1: be for a decade of basketball market and it takes
Speaker 1: certain players that you know, whether it's the Georgetown hoyas
Speaker 1: with John Thompson. Sometimes in college the coach is the catalyst.
Speaker 1: But I mean, would you sign Kyrie if if if
Speaker 1: you had to sign Kyrie to way, has he signed
Speaker 1: an extension.
Speaker 2: Or I think he has like two years left on
Speaker 2: That's what I.
Speaker 1: Think it is. But my takeaway is if you had
Speaker 1: to sign him, would you extend him for three and
Speaker 1: four years?
Speaker 3: So he he has a player option after next season,
Speaker 3: so they have him locked up for additional season, And like,
Speaker 3: I mean, here's the thing. It all depends on his
Speaker 3: level of play. Like right now, he's thirty two years old,
Speaker 3: so it kind of just depends on whether or not
Speaker 3: his body holds up over the course of the next season. Now,
Speaker 3: my thing is, like you you find out pretty quickly
Speaker 3: that the gap between a Kyrie Irving and then like
Speaker 3: a league average replacement guard someone like Andrew Nemhard is
Speaker 3: like a huge gap, and it's really hard to make
Speaker 3: up for that, right, so you know, you know, my
Speaker 3: thing is like you want to set yourself up for
Speaker 3: you talked about being you said one of the easiest
Speaker 3: ways to win is being a dynasty. And one of
Speaker 3: the first things I thought when you said that is
Speaker 3: like kind of like what Michael Malone was saying after
Speaker 3: they lost to Minnesota, which is like you kind of
Speaker 3: it's more about getting three and five or four and seven.
Speaker 3: And what that means to me is like, sometimes you
Speaker 3: catch a bad matchup, sometimes a guy gets hurt, like
Speaker 3: Jamal Murray had a calf muscle issue this year, right,
Speaker 3: So like sometimes there are just things that break your
Speaker 3: way or don't break your way, Like, for instance, Dallas
Speaker 3: didn't have to face Denver out of the Western Conference.
Speaker 3: It's very possible that if they ran into Denver they
Speaker 3: could have lost that a bad matchup, Yeah, exactly, and
Speaker 3: so so so Honestly, the way the way I look
Speaker 3: at it, like you just want to make sure that
Speaker 3: you're in the mix multiple years in a row because
Speaker 3: something might break your way, and like if it breaks
Speaker 3: your way, all of a sudden, you're in the dance.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: So, like, again the way I look at it, I
Speaker 3: think they'll obviously retain him, just simply because you could
Speaker 3: trade him at that point if you wanted to, Like
Speaker 3: if Kyrie, if you sign him for a two plus
Speaker 3: one and then he's like, you know, halfway through the
Speaker 3: first year, he's either declining a little bit or maybe
Speaker 3: Luca gets hurt or something like, you can pivot. It's
Speaker 3: in my opinion, it always makes more sense to retain
Speaker 3: the star because you can trade the star. Like every
Speaker 3: once in a while, someone screws up, Like look at
Speaker 3: zach Levine. Zach Lavine makes too much money, He's not
Speaker 3: good enough, nobody wants him, right, and it's just it's
Speaker 3: and zach Lvine's an interesting player, he just makes so
Speaker 3: much money that no team would be willing to sacrifice
Speaker 3: what it takes to bring him in, right. But like
Speaker 3: every time there's a star that needs to get traded,
Speaker 3: just find a way to trade him. And so when
Speaker 3: push comes to Shob, I think he'll end up just
Speaker 3: re upping and then maybe getting traded to a certain
Speaker 3: destination when the timing's right.
Speaker 1: I think it's going to be an interesting off season.
Speaker 1: I think Paul George is fascinating to me. I think
Speaker 1: he could make Philadelphia really a handful, and I think
Speaker 1: he works in New York. I just don't think he
Speaker 1: wants it. I think that, you know, Balmer's the richest
Speaker 1: or second richest owner in the sport. He's opening his
Speaker 1: new arena. He's not letting guys go. And Paul George.
Speaker 1: I mean, first of all, you have to be in
Speaker 1: alpha to be an NBA player. Largely, even Jason Tatum
Speaker 1: or Anthony Davis, they may not be, you know, like
Speaker 1: the supreme Alpha, but these guys are driven, competitive as hell.
Speaker 1: I if you had to predict one big move, gods,
Speaker 1: Paul George is gonna stay. You know. Here's the other thing.
Speaker 1: I think Golden State is now kind of understands Joe
Speaker 1: Lacob's one of the wealthier owners. I think they sort
Speaker 1: of understand like this, we tried to bridge old and new,
Speaker 1: and they're not going to bring Chris Paul back. Probably
Speaker 1: his name's getting bounced around. I think the Warriors are
Speaker 1: going to be a big player somewhere. I think we're
Speaker 1: concentrating on Philly and New York, and I understand that
Speaker 1: it's just a much easier avenue to get to the
Speaker 1: conference finals. In the finals, like, there's no disputing that. God,
Speaker 1: how good is the West going to be next year?
Speaker 1: But I think Golden State full of smart people. Jason
Speaker 1: looks at okay See, looks at Denver, looks at Dallas.
Speaker 1: It's like, come on, we're not even close. Like you said,
Speaker 1: there's a big gap between a Kyri Paul George and
Speaker 1: your average good wing defender. Paul can really dial it up.
Speaker 1: So I think teams like Golden State are like, right now,
Speaker 1: you know, we're all fucking Klay Thompson, Chris Paul want
Speaker 1: to do. I think they're going to take a huge swing.
Speaker 1: That's my get. Maybe it's Karl Anthony Towns. What do
Speaker 1: you think?
Speaker 2: I think so too.
Speaker 3: I think Dallas is the perfect example of why you
Speaker 3: should take a really big swing. I was actually talking
Speaker 3: about this with a buddy of mine, sam As Fondirio,
Speaker 3: covers the Warriors, and like I was talking about it,
Speaker 3: with him this morning, Like Dallas is the perfect example
Speaker 3: of why you look at your current situation with Steph
Speaker 3: Curry and you go, wait, if we bring him a
Speaker 3: second star and we hit like one or two moves
Speaker 3: on the margins, we could be right back in this thing.
Speaker 3: But Dallas missed the playoffs last year, like they literally
Speaker 3: missed a ten team playoff field. And it's the same
Speaker 3: two stars. They just made a couple of tweaks with
Speaker 3: specific role players. As long as your two stars work.
Speaker 3: Now to your point, there's a lot of fun stuff
Speaker 3: to talk about this summer, like Paul George potentially going somewhere,
Speaker 3: Like I would be lying if I didn't think it'd
Speaker 3: be fun, even though I don't think it'll happen. To
Speaker 3: see a Lebron James go to Phoenix and play alongside
Speaker 3: Kevin Durant, Bradley be Old, Devin Booker, those sorts of things.
Speaker 3: I think this is going to be the summer of
Speaker 3: the move of the Tier two stars. So like I
Speaker 3: think you'll see a Darius Garland move somewhere. I'd love
Speaker 3: to see Darius Garland in San Antonio with Webbin Yama.
Speaker 3: I think that'd be super fascinating. I think you'll see
Speaker 3: a Dejonte Murray get moved. De Jontay Murray's a guy
Speaker 3: who I think would make Golden State a really fascinating
Speaker 3: team if you gave Steph a real athletic backcourt shot
Speaker 3: creator next to him, that would fit I think really
Speaker 3: well in their five out attack, the way that they
Speaker 3: the way that they go. I think you'll see a
Speaker 3: Mikhale Bridges get pulled into a like McHale Bridge is
Speaker 3: a guy that you might see with the New York Knicks,
Speaker 3: you might see get moved to one of these teams.
Speaker 3: And so I think it's going to be the Tier
Speaker 3: two guys that move. But again, if you don't think
Speaker 3: about them as like real needle movers, think about them
Speaker 3: as guys that would offer support to existing Tier one stars.
Speaker 3: It's not de Jontey Murray in a vacuum, It's is
Speaker 3: Jana Murray next to Steph Curry. It's not you know,
Speaker 3: Darius Garland in a vacuum. It's Terius Garland next to
Speaker 3: Victor Webbin Yama. It's those are the types of moves
Speaker 3: that I think could have sizeable impact. Kyrie is a
Speaker 3: big name, and Kyrie has a lot of like star
Speaker 3: power behind him. But like, Kyrie's not a guy that's
Speaker 3: regarded as a top fifteen player in the league. He's
Speaker 3: just in the perfect role for him right now, secondary
Speaker 3: shot creator on a team where they have somebody that
Speaker 3: can guard. He doesn't have to guard the other team's
Speaker 3: best guard. He doesn't even have to be the guy
Speaker 3: that runs the offense for the majority of the game.
Speaker 3: He can play off of Luca. And how often have
Speaker 3: we seen Kyrie in this playoff run like chill for
Speaker 3: three quarters and then come in to start the fourth
Speaker 3: quarter and be like, all right, let's go, I'm going
Speaker 3: to attack this game. So like again, I think that
Speaker 3: those kinds of moves they can there's a tendency to
Speaker 3: always be like does that really move the needle? Does
Speaker 3: that really move the needle? I see that so differently.
Speaker 3: Like to me, basketball is more art than science. It's
Speaker 3: not about nolating talent points. It's not about accumulating talent
Speaker 3: points and like, oh, we hit the magic score of
Speaker 3: we have enough talent on the roster. It's like, no,
Speaker 3: you have responsibilities your team needs to fulfill on the court.
Speaker 3: And if you bring in a really good player, that
Speaker 3: can take a bunch of those responsibilities. It even takes
Speaker 3: your other role players and makes them play better because
Speaker 3: now they don't need to do as much. You know,
Speaker 3: like it to me, to me like that, that sort
Speaker 3: of thing. A lot of people overthink that. It's like,
Speaker 3: that's why I'm a big believer. And you're in the
Speaker 3: thing that.
Speaker 2: You always preach, which is like, take those risks. If
Speaker 2: you're close, take the risk.
Speaker 3: Dallas put it all on the line this year, yep,
Speaker 3: by trading that first round draft pick at the deadline.
Speaker 3: They have all of their eggs in this basket. And
Speaker 3: you know what, it might have failed. Maybe PJ. Washington
Speaker 3: doesn't get that foul call on the corner three. Maybe
Speaker 3: you head back to Oklahoma City for Game seven and
Speaker 3: you lose in Okay, see advances, and then everyone calls
Speaker 3: you idiots, right, but no, that's not what happened. And
Speaker 3: here they're going to go to the NBA Finals, And
Speaker 3: so I love it. I wish more teams would do
Speaker 3: that sort of thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's I think it's hard sometimes where
Speaker 1: you know, taking big swings. First of all, you have
Speaker 1: to be built for it. You have to be like
Speaker 1: Miami can do it because of their history and their legacy,
Speaker 1: you know, for the Mavericks to do it. Mark Cuban,
Speaker 1: you know, is moves out, so you have new ownership,
Speaker 1: you have a relatively new front office. Luca's kind of
Speaker 1: a new star. Dallas deserves a lot of credit to
Speaker 1: just say we're just we're gonna take some big swings here.
Speaker 1: But I also think there is an advantage because when
Speaker 1: you're in a market with the Dallas Cowboys, even the
Speaker 1: Texas Rangers and Sark and the Texas Longhorns, you know,
Speaker 1: Dallas stars now are good. I do think there's something
Speaker 1: to be said about competitive markets. I think over the
Speaker 1: course of my life, I've watched New York teams sometimes
Speaker 1: be too aggressive to keep up with the Yankees of
Speaker 1: the Giants, right, like too aggressive. And I think Dallas
Speaker 1: the advantage to being the Mavericks is when we make
Speaker 1: little mistakes, people don't pay attention to them. They pay
Speaker 1: attention to the cowboys.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: That's a cowboy town. So you're allowed to be a
Speaker 1: little bit under the radar in terms of national scope
Speaker 1: and even local scope because you're in a cowboy It's
Speaker 1: like being in Philadelphia. I mean, the Phillies are huge,
Speaker 1: the Sixers are gigantic, the Eagles are big, right, Like
Speaker 1: you're all sharing that, and I think I think Dallas,
Speaker 1: you know, they had the Dirk title, Cuban made them
Speaker 1: incredibly relevant. And not that it's easier to take swings,
Speaker 1: but they you know, they weren't the Warriors, they weren't
Speaker 1: the heat They they weren't the Lakers of the Celtics brand.
Speaker 1: And so I think that they were really smart swings,
Speaker 1: really smart thoughtful swings. And I think we all went
Speaker 1: on that stuff. You know, I say this even in football.
Speaker 1: The advantage in football if you take a big swing
Speaker 1: and miss, like Russell Wilson, is the draft provides you
Speaker 1: so many good players. I mean, like the story now
Speaker 1: is Bonix is just crushing it for Denver. Okay, you
Speaker 1: got the quarterbacks all one, one class, whereas you know
Speaker 1: the NBA draft can give you lively to the Mavericks.
Speaker 1: But you know he and he's been terrific. I went
Speaker 1: and read his draft preview tonight as I'm watching the
Speaker 1: game the other night, as I'm flying, I'm reading it
Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh, it was gonna be a good
Speaker 1: they said, good backup player. Nice little passer. I mean,
Speaker 1: they really marginalized him to like a six minute a
Speaker 1: game guy. And he comes in and he's a factor.
Speaker 1: But it's harder to take sometimes chances in the NBA
Speaker 1: because you don't get bailed out by the draft.
Speaker 2: You just don't.
Speaker 1: And so the guys deserve when you take these big swings,
Speaker 1: These gms deserve credit. There is no safety net, you know,
Speaker 1: Russell Wilson. It's a year later, we got one more
Speaker 1: year a dead cap. We're done, all right, We're done.
Speaker 1: And so I what Dallas did. Take some cajonas and
Speaker 1: I think it and they've been rewarded. I just I
Speaker 1: think swings for me create content and.
Speaker 2: I'm oh, for sure, so you love them?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I just want swings. Any final thoughts, Let's
Speaker 1: circle back to the Celtics Mavericks and that's what it'll
Speaker 1: I'll say this again. The most fascinating part of it
Speaker 1: is Tatum will sign a bigness. So Jalen Brown got
Speaker 1: his money, Porzingis has his, Derek White has some, but
Speaker 1: Jason Tatum's gonna sign his MAX when the season's over.
Speaker 1: So you'll be fine if they don't want it this year.
Speaker 1: For one more year's run. But if you lost to
Speaker 1: Dallas this year, last year, next year would be so
Speaker 1: pressurized for Boston, like this is it, Fellas, So I
Speaker 1: kind of feel like you want to get it now,
Speaker 1: not later, because once Tatum signs, it's like, Okay, guys,
Speaker 1: this is it. We got no bench. You can forget
Speaker 1: your bench. It's over, Connie, I'll circle back again. I
Speaker 1: think that's the one thing about Boston. I could see
Speaker 1: him getting really tight, really tight in this series.
Speaker 3: Well, and to your point, the as you get into
Speaker 3: the future, there's also the second Apron rules that come
Speaker 3: into effect too, where Boston could be very handicapped in
Speaker 3: terms of what they're or handcuffed, I should say, in
Speaker 3: terms of what they're allowed to do to do things
Speaker 3: to supplement the roster, Like you can't even use the
Speaker 3: taxpayer mid level exception when you're in the second Apron,
Speaker 3: Like you can't even sign anybody unless it's a veteran
Speaker 3: minimum contract over the summer. Like, there's a lot of
Speaker 3: restrictions that come into play when you have that type
Speaker 3: of salary on your roster.
Speaker 2: I think like the big key to watch.
Speaker 3: Is Jason Tatum, Like if they lose and it's a
Speaker 3: competitive six to seven game series and you feel like
Speaker 3: Tatum goes toe to toe with Luca, Yeah, you're fine.
Speaker 3: But the one, the one thing that I think would
Speaker 3: actually be real crisis for Boston is what if they
Speaker 3: go in and they lose in games in the NBA
Speaker 3: Finals in Tatum's bad because if that happens, it's like, oh, wait,
Speaker 3: this whole construct is flawed because our best guy can't
Speaker 3: go toe to toe with the other best guys. That
Speaker 3: would be that would be the catastrophe. And because at
Speaker 3: this point, it's like, man, we are two whole years
Speaker 3: removed from that Steph Curry incident in twenty twenty two
Speaker 3: when he was amazing for three rounds and then just
Speaker 3: completely fell apart in the NBA Finals, right, And so like,
Speaker 3: I think that's the one thing that would that would
Speaker 3: cause me to like really press the panic button if
Speaker 3: I was Boston. But even if they lost, if Tatum
Speaker 3: can looks like he kind of met the level and
Speaker 3: kind of met the moment, then it's like, man, next year,
Speaker 3: we're definitely going to get it done. Like that, that's
Speaker 3: where you start to feel really confident. And by the way,
Speaker 3: you know Tatum has been frustrating offensively in this playoff run,
Speaker 3: but we do not talk nearly enough about what an
Speaker 3: impactful defensive athlete he is.
Speaker 2: He's big, he's strong, he's master the most of the guys.
Speaker 3: He's long, he can he can guard centers, he could,
Speaker 3: Like it's so funny watching how like anytime anybody tries
Speaker 3: to isolate or do something against Tatum on an island,
Speaker 3: it's just hopeless, Like he just swallows him up because
Speaker 3: he's And I'm really really excited. That's one of the
Speaker 3: biggest things I'm looking forward to in the next series
Speaker 3: is like how many times are they going to watch
Speaker 3: Luca you know, Bully Drew Holliday, Bully Derek White, Bully
Speaker 3: Jalen Brown before you know. Joe Mizoula goes like, all right,
Speaker 3: Jason Tatum, you're guarding you, and I really want to
Speaker 3: see that specific matchup. But like, yeah, I'm I'm more
Speaker 3: on the patient route with Boston because they are still
Speaker 3: so much younger than people think. Like Tatum is, what
Speaker 3: is he twenty six now, He's barely getting He's barely
Speaker 3: entering in the phase where we expect great players to win.
Speaker 2: He's barely there.
Speaker 1: Think about let's just rank the top ten players in
Speaker 1: this final mab Celtics. So Luca one, Tatum two.
Speaker 2: Yes, I'd probably go Jalen Brown, Right, what about you?
Speaker 1: I think just a sturdier athlete, a little bit more consistent.
Speaker 1: I would probably go Kyrie four.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: I mean because of Porzingis's health, God, do I go
Speaker 1: Derek White?
Speaker 2: Jesus Derek. I'd go Derek White five.
Speaker 1: Okay, Derek White five. If Porzingis is healthy, I'd go Porzingis.
Speaker 2: Six, Drewe Holliday's probably seven.
Speaker 1: Seven. Then I go PJ Washington.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, probably probably PJ Washington.
Speaker 1: Okay, so that's eight.
Speaker 3: Gaff I go Lively Probably, I think Lively. I think
Speaker 3: Lively is a better defensive player and a better passer
Speaker 3: than Gafford. Gafford's really good and he gets slandered, but
Speaker 3: I think Lively is a little better than him.
Speaker 1: Okay, And who's our tenth best player?
Speaker 3: You probably go? Like you probably go I Horford's got
Speaker 3: to be somewhere in there. Like Horford hits six or
Speaker 3: seven threes.
Speaker 2: The other night.
Speaker 1: If you give him that corner, three, dude, he finds himself.
Speaker 1: Like you can say what you want about Al Horford,
Speaker 1: He's had a more than redeemable career, really good veteran,
Speaker 1: hits open shots, tends to play above his weight in
Speaker 1: big spots, like never an anxiety player, like he's always
Speaker 1: ready to play. Sometimes with say Akham, he's just not
Speaker 1: quick enough, like you can get eaten up with him sometimes.
Speaker 1: But that's a lot of talent we had to get
Speaker 1: to like eight or nine, So I mean it's it's
Speaker 1: I mean one of the things Dallas doesn't deal with
Speaker 1: is getting all. They don't have a lot of bad
Speaker 1: half court offensive possessions like Minnesota does, Like they're just
Speaker 1: awful looking. Indiana's got some clunky ones, Boston doesn't, and
Speaker 1: Dallas doesn't. It will be aesthetically a really attractive series.
Speaker 1: It will be like fun, good ball movement great. I
Speaker 1: mean the degree of difficulty with Luca's insane. I mean
Speaker 1: he hit shot because you know he's not a big jumper,
Speaker 1: he's not twitchy fast, so almost everything he's dealing with
Speaker 1: a hand in his face. He is the great tough
Speaker 1: always said Phil Mickelson was the great tough shot maker
Speaker 1: in golf. Lucas the great tough shot maker. He makes
Speaker 1: more things. He even turns to the sometimes the wrong side,
Speaker 1: and he'll shoot a following and I'm like, God, why
Speaker 1: did you make that so hard? It's a fourteen footer.
Speaker 1: I think it's going to be aesthetically a lot like
Speaker 1: the Warrior Celtics series, where you can't take your eyes
Speaker 1: off it. It's just really good.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, you know Luca, Luca's I did a
Speaker 3: film session on him this morning because the end of
Speaker 3: that game I thought was super fascinating.
Speaker 2: How like it was one o four, one oh four, and.
Speaker 3: I don't think anybody thought Minnesota was going to win
Speaker 3: that game, you know, And it starts with a big
Speaker 3: mistake Anthony Edwards leadst PJ Washington wide open in the corner.
Speaker 3: It's a three. It's one oh seven to one to four.
Speaker 3: But from there, down the stretch of the game, Luca
Speaker 3: and Kyrie made three tough, contested pull up jump shots.
Speaker 3: Minnesota didn't get a bucket until Anthony Edwards had this
Speaker 3: like this like garbage time layup. But I want to
Speaker 3: just zero in really quickly on the Lucas shot over
Speaker 3: Jada McDaniels. It was the last shot he hit because
Speaker 3: he had a fade away over Nasried and then he
Speaker 3: hit one over Jade McDaniels and Jada McDaniels. By the way,
Speaker 3: I think he's the best perimeter defender in the league.
Speaker 3: He doesn't match up well with Luca because he's not
Speaker 3: very strong, but in terms of all the little things
Speaker 3: that make a perimeter defender great, I think he's got
Speaker 3: the full package, and he Luca hits this, like you said,
Speaker 3: a funky kind of release. He hit a shot in
Speaker 3: the first half against Nikile Alexander Walker where he did
Speaker 3: awkward kind of reverse footwork where he took like a
Speaker 3: leaning forward kind of floating jump shot in the lane.
Speaker 3: He faked that shot against Jaden on that final possession,
Speaker 3: and Jayden left his feet and got out a position,
Speaker 3: and then Luca immediately spun out of it over his
Speaker 3: right shoulder into a fade away and barely got.
Speaker 2: It off and hit it.
Speaker 3: And I was literally sitting there thinking like he's going
Speaker 3: against the best defender in the world, the best perimeter
Speaker 3: defender in my opinion, and he literally has to get
Speaker 3: a shot off in this situation, and he actually gets
Speaker 3: him to leave his feet and it's just enough to
Speaker 3: barely get the shot. It's like literally a game of inches,
Speaker 3: and it was based on a fake. I went through
Speaker 3: my film session today and I showed the shot that
Speaker 3: he takes, and then I showed the fake, and then
Speaker 3: I went into the shot that he took, and I
Speaker 3: was like, this guy is He is the most improvisational
Speaker 3: shot maker I've ever seen. He can tweak the angle.
Speaker 3: He hit a step back three over Karl Anthony in
Speaker 3: the right corner in the fourth quarter where he jab
Speaker 3: stepped and went a step back. Carl Towns almost blocked it.
Speaker 3: So he just shot it way up in the air,
Speaker 3: just shot a moon ball and it just went way
Speaker 3: up in the air and it came down And I
Speaker 3: was like, so he just tweaked his whole release and
Speaker 3: changed the geometry of his shot to get this shot.
Speaker 2: Off and it went in. Like he is the most
Speaker 2: creative and audacious.
Speaker 3: Basketball player I can't remember watching like Like, I don't
Speaker 3: love everything about Luca. He can complain sometimes I hate
Speaker 3: the way he talks to the refs all the time. Like,
Speaker 3: there are some things with Luca that drive me crazy.
Speaker 3: But as a basketball fan, the shot making is it's
Speaker 3: like art. It's like art with Luca it's so much
Speaker 3: fun to watch.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I always felt Kobe didn't have as many stock
Speaker 1: moves as Michael and Kobe went down and the canvas
Speaker 1: was pretty bare sometimes, and you know, you spill a
Speaker 1: lot of paint. There were some bad Kobe stretches, whereas
Speaker 1: Michael always went back to two or three like standard
Speaker 1: mid range moves, which he just owned. And Kobe is
Speaker 1: willing to be a little bit more of an artist.
Speaker 1: He had spots on the floor he like, but and
Speaker 1: so does Luca. All great basketball players have bots and
Speaker 1: comfort levels. But Jesus, there's just nothing like him in
Speaker 1: the planet. There's just nothing like Luca. All right, Jason
Speaker 1: timp hoops tonight. Can't wait. I think we're gonna have Sorry, Minnesota,
Speaker 1: we're already counting you out, but I think it's gonna
Speaker 1: be I think it's gonna be one of the most dramatic,
Speaker 1: pressurized finals and one of the most beautiful offensive finals
Speaker 1: we've seen in a long time. Good stuff.
Speaker 2: Totally agree, can't wait. It's gonna be fun.
Speaker 1: See you man the volume. Thanks so much for listening.
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