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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Sager and Crystal.

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Speaker 2: Here, independent media just played a truly massive role in

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Speaker 2: this election, and we are so excited about what that

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Speaker 1: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 1: news media, and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 1: dot com.

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Speaker 3: Let's move on to the the man who's always sprinkling

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Speaker 3: good luck on everyone, Bernie Sanders. Bernie Sanders was on

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Speaker 3: Flagrant with Andrew Schultz and the Gang and Brian I

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Speaker 3: watched this. Did you get a chance to watch it?

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Speaker 4: Sing and tell me about these guys. I don't watch

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Speaker 4: this show, so.

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Speaker 3: Cccer's friends with them, actually, but they are book you know.

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Speaker 3: Charles was talking on the podcast, he's like the cosms

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Speaker 3: of a lifelong Democrat, repeatedly in his conversations with Bernie's

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Speaker 3: I really wanted you to win in twenty sixteen. He's

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Speaker 3: kind of like he's similar. I would say he's sort

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Speaker 3: of politically similar to Rogan, probably a little less you know,

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Speaker 3: interested in some of the wild conspiratorial so like he's

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Speaker 3: not in as deep probably on all of those things.

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Speaker 3: But it kind of similar. And there's like Bernie brow

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Speaker 3: Ish and he even talked about how the podcast bros

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Speaker 3: Have been labeled similarly to the Bernie Bros. In conversation

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Speaker 3: with Bernie Sanders, part this almost yeah, this almost sexist

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Speaker 3: approach to lumping people in the pejorative categories. O.

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Speaker 4: Jay's going to come for you pretty soon. Yeah, keep

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Speaker 4: doing that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they'd come right for you. DEI. But anyway, it's

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Speaker 3: the conversation before we kick it over to this one

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Speaker 3: fascinating clip. We have a couple of clips, but the

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Speaker 3: one we're going to play for verst is really, really good.

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Speaker 3: I just want to say the first part of the conversation,

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Speaker 3: they're spending like twenty minutes talking about the Brooklyn Dodgers.

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Speaker 3: And the reason that's important is I don't think there

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Speaker 3: are a lot of Democrats who can sit and talk

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Speaker 3: totally organically. Bernie is just like blowing them away with

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Speaker 3: his knowledge of like the nineteen fifty eight lineup of

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Speaker 3: Brooklyn Dodgers.

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Speaker 4: The Dodgers going to LA I think it was a

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Speaker 4: formative experience for Bernie Sanders in a way that he said, Yes,

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Speaker 4: the early childhood trauma can be and I think you

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Speaker 4: can connect it to this sense of like who are

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Speaker 4: the wait, who are these oligarchs that can rip a

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Speaker 4: community apart? Like Yeah, and as somebody who was as

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Speaker 4: passionate about baseball in my childhood as Bernie was in his,

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Speaker 4: baseball feels like it is part of the It is

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Speaker 4: part of the community. It does not feel like it

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Speaker 4: should be something owned by an individual who can do

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Speaker 4: something with it.

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Speaker 3: That's why you got to go with the Green Bay Packers.

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Speaker 4: And one of the greatest sense of senses of injustice

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Speaker 4: I would ever feel as a child was when the

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Speaker 4: Phillies would not be on TV. What do you mean

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Speaker 4: I can't watch the Philadelphia Phillies. That the Philadelphia Phillies. They

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Speaker 4: have to be on TV? Yeah, this is insane.

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Speaker 3: It's outside You're outside of Philadelphia. Yeah. The reason that

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Speaker 3: I wanted to start with that point is precisely because

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Speaker 3: I think I'm saying this as a conservative. The if

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Speaker 3: you are a If you are an ideological liberal and

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Speaker 3: you watch Bernie's fluent, natural organic conversation about the Brooklyn

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Speaker 3: Dodgers with Andrew Schultz for twenty minutes, he gives the

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Speaker 3: best pitch for democratic socialism, all in the context of

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Speaker 3: baseball in the first twenty minutes of that podcast. That

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Speaker 3: is changing hearts and minds. Is persuading people that the

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Speaker 3: left is reasonable, even if I disagree with it. You're

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Speaker 3: a eighteen year old boy and you're listening to that,

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Speaker 3: You're like, holy shit, this is completely true. These billionaires

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Speaker 3: come in buy up teams. Jack got the ticket prices

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Speaker 3: so that a family of four can't afford a vacation.

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Speaker 3: Now it's literally the price of a vacation. Yes, can't

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Speaker 3: afford to go to a game without it being the

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Speaker 3: price of the weekend at a beach for everyone to

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Speaker 3: get a hot dog, decent ticket, whatever.

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Speaker 4: Punch in the face.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And so they come in and buy it. Parking, Well,

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Speaker 3: they use your money to build the stadium, then charge

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Speaker 3: you eighty bucks a ticket for a decent seat, and

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Speaker 3: then they take the team somewhere else ten years later,

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Speaker 3: once you've already bought your kid's gear, and you've sort

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Speaker 3: of emotionally invested in the franchise.

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Speaker 4: It's an eighteen dollars eighteen dollars for a coke.

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Speaker 3: And it's baseball. It's America's pastime. Yeah, And so the

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Speaker 3: way Sanders starts that segment is just a fantastic pitch

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Speaker 3: for democratic socialism. And there are so few he's willing

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Speaker 3: to laugh at their jokes about. Like they say something

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Speaker 3: about Bernie's like, we learned how to do arithmetic this

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Speaker 3: way by watching baseball, and Schultz goes, well, today, we

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Speaker 3: call that autism, and Bernie's laughing at it. And it's like,

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Speaker 3: you don't find other democrats, Like imagine Alista slot Can

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Speaker 3: just being able to roll with a comedian making a

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Speaker 3: joke about that she wouldn't. And it's the same thing

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Speaker 3: when Schultz makes jokes about you can only be bigoted

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Speaker 3: around your close friends, like Bernie Sanders like, look, I'm

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Speaker 3: against bigotry. Schultz goes, unless it's around your close friends,

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Speaker 3: and Bernie just rolls your close friend, Yeah, to your

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Speaker 3: close friends. So let's roll this clip so that I

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Speaker 3: can stop doing summaries of clips. I know everybody loves

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Speaker 3: that this is d one.

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Speaker 5: It's good about what happened to you in twenty sixteen

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Speaker 5: with this Bernie Brose movement where you're your followers are

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Speaker 5: seen they have a racism problem, missagy problem.

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Speaker 3: Do you think that's a superPAC thing behind that?

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Speaker 4: No, it was the Democratic establishment. Oh wow, okay, you know.

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Speaker 6: That was just they were sitting there. We had a

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Speaker 6: lot of young people, we have people of color, and

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Speaker 6: you know, they create this kind of myth with the

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Speaker 6: help of the corporate media or all that stuff. You know.

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Speaker 7: It's kind of interesting to that note is during this election,

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Speaker 7: the podcast space, which the Democrats largely avoided, they feel

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Speaker 7: had some influence in the election, and they started to

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Speaker 7: label us the podcast bros and said that we were

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Speaker 7: sexist and we were racist and bigeted. It's almost like

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Speaker 7: it's the exact same strategy to get you out of there.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, that's what the liberally China does. They run away,

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Speaker 6: look getting again. I would hope that everybody who's watching

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Speaker 6: the program is that we as a nation have got

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Speaker 6: to and or forms of biggotreat right. Yes, that I

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Speaker 6: thought off as a basic assumption. Unless I see your

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Speaker 6: close friends, right, it's racism but sexism, homophobia or aenophobia,

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Speaker 6: whatever it is. But and you know, liberal democrats talk

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Speaker 6: about that all the time. And then you get to

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Speaker 6: what we call identity politics. That you're black, you're wonderful,

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Speaker 6: you're tremendous, you're yeah, you're the greatest human being on earth. Yeah,

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Speaker 6: And rather than say what do you what do you

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Speaker 6: stand for?

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Speaker 4: Exactly ya? That's why who cares? What do you stand for?

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Speaker 6: You know, is every gay person brilliant and wonderful and great?

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Speaker 4: Now of course that everybody's um.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, So the issue is what you stand for, which

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Speaker 6: huts you back to what we discuss every class politics

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Speaker 6: in the sense of which side are you on? Are

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Speaker 6: you going to stand with working families, Are you going

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Speaker 6: to raise the minimum wage to a living wage or not?

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Speaker 6: Are you going to guarantee fight to guarantee healthcare to

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Speaker 6: all people or not? Are you going to demand that

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Speaker 6: the wealthiest people stop paying their fair share of taxes on?

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Speaker 6: Those are the issues, and no one cares what color

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Speaker 6: you want, you know, what your gender is, et cetera,

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Speaker 6: et cetera.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so Ryan, well done again. You just this is

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Speaker 3: what's so frustrating is democrats. I just wrote about this morning. Actually,

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Speaker 3: like they're on their quest, we can put the next

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Speaker 3: hair straight up on the screen, this multimillion dollar quest

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Speaker 3: to find the nextra rogue. In The New York Times

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Speaker 3: had an interesting three Yeah, The New York Times had

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Speaker 3: an interesting report on it. Sorry, yes, I skipped ahead

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Speaker 3: about how Democrats are now throwing millions of dollars they

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Speaker 3: have spreadshere of influencers to try and create the next

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Speaker 3: Joe Rogan when obviously they lost the original Joe Rogan.

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Speaker 3: Who's somebody who had Bernie Sanders on and then a

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Speaker 3: big conversation with Bernie Sanders about universal health care and

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Speaker 3: all of these democratic socialist policies that Rogan is pretty

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Speaker 3: interested in. And Democrats don't want to change their policy

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Speaker 3: offerings or their tone, as evidenced by the fact that

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Speaker 3: they're not leaning into Bernie being the guy that can

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Speaker 3: help them win back the Rogan instead of astroturfing some

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Speaker 3: partisan hack that's going to be exactly the opposite of

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Speaker 3: what succeeds on the podcast circuit, which is the anti

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Speaker 3: partisan ship of free, willing conversation and authenticity. Bernie can

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Speaker 3: go on flagrant just like Trump can, just like Jade

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Speaker 3: vance Can and he can go in Theovonne, he can

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Speaker 3: go on Joe Rogan, and it's because he's a critic

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Speaker 3: of the Democratic Party in the same way that Trump

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Speaker 3: is a critic of the Republican Party. You could say

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Speaker 3: Bernie's more sincere than Trump, sure, but they're both criticizing

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Speaker 3: their own party, which is what you're not going to

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Speaker 3: pay a bunch of influencers to do. Nobody wants the

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Speaker 3: dem donors to give millions of dollars to people who

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Speaker 3: are then going to go trash the Dems.

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Speaker 4: We got Rokana coming pretty soon, So let's roll this

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Speaker 4: last clip of D two from here where he talks

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Speaker 4: about our Democrats a threat to democracy as well.

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Speaker 7: The problem I think a lot of voters had is

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Speaker 7: like they didn't even know if it was her. We

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Speaker 7: didn't even know if Biden was president. We didn't even

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Speaker 7: know if these were her talking points, and we felt

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Speaker 7: that over the last four elections, Democrats we felt that

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Speaker 7: we didn't have a say on who could be president.

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Speaker 7: We talk a lot about the Republicans being autocrats and

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Speaker 7: oligarchs and taking over democracy, but from the Democrat perspective,

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Speaker 7: and as I'm a lifelong Democrat. I felt like the

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Speaker 7: Democratic Party completely removed the democratic process from its constituents

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Speaker 7: and they I think they need to have some accountability

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Speaker 7: of that.

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Speaker 4: No, um, I don't for you.

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Speaker 7: I mean I wanted you to. Like twenty sixteen, I

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Speaker 7: was like, this is going to happen. This guy's going

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Speaker 7: to do it, and it felt like they it felt

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Speaker 7: like they stole it from it. And I'll be honest,

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Speaker 7: it broke my heart when you when you support him.

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Speaker 6: Look but you have in the world that I live in,

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Speaker 6: you got a choice. And I mean a lot of people,

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Speaker 6: including my wife, agree with you, but you know you're

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Speaker 6: down to a choice. It's going to be Hillary Clinton

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Speaker 6: or is it going to be Donald Trump? Not a

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Speaker 6: great choice, but it ended up being him anyway.

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Speaker 4: So why don't we burn it down?

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Speaker 6: Well, because it's easy to say, burning it down means

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Speaker 6: that children are not going to have you know, foodia,

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Speaker 6: that the schools will deteriorate, people will not have healthcare.

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Speaker 6: I got it, and I you know, I'm an elected official.

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Speaker 6: I got to represent the people and I can't turn my.

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Speaker 5: Back on But then could we not also say if

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Speaker 5: ostensibly there hasn't been a fair primary for the Democrats

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Speaker 5: since two thousand and eight, Are they not also a

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Speaker 5: threat to democracy?

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Speaker 7: We often hear fair.

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Speaker 3: Enough that is that is Yeah, I'm not going to

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Speaker 3: argue with that point, including my wife.

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Speaker 4: That was a pretty funny line. Yeah, that's why he

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Speaker 4: can hang with the Yeah, and Jane is Yeah, she

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Speaker 4: is more of a burn it down than Bernie is.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that is more than Bernie bro than Burney.

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Speaker 4: Sure, Bernie actually wanted somebody to primary Obama in twenty twelve,

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Speaker 4: which killed him. Then in twenty sixteen they used that

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Speaker 4: against him ruthlessly. Then I think he would like at

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Speaker 4: the time, he would have loved to take it back.

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Speaker 4: He didn't have any idea that he was going to

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Speaker 4: be a competitive presidential candidate in the next cycle. So, yeah,

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Speaker 4: twenty twelve that was fair because no he ran against

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Speaker 4: him Obama. Twenty sixteen, we know twenty twenty votes were fair. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: but the party just consolidated around Joe Biden. Yeah, Bernie

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Speaker 4: was like pulling ahead even among black voters after Nevada,

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Speaker 4: But the Democratic primary voters are very lockstep. And when MSNBC,

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Speaker 4: CNN people to judge Obama, Amy Klobuchar, everybody consolidated they moved.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, and that's what sends just really cheating.

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Speaker 4: It's like they used the power of the party to

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Speaker 4: beat him, which, yes, is hypocritical if your name is

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Speaker 4: the Democratic Party.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's the reason that you end up getting

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Speaker 3: the Andrew Schultz of the world looking seriously at Donald Trump.

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Speaker 3: And it's because they're so disillusioned by how Bernie Sanders

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Speaker 3: was treated. And until Democrats acknowledge that they're not going

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Speaker 3: to have success in the anti establishment podcast circuit, they

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Speaker 3: can continue to you know, New York Times, the Daily

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Speaker 3: and pr they'll still do really well in the podcast charts.

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Speaker 3: It's something that I think them sort of take for granted.

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Speaker 3: But they're not going to win back young men until

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Speaker 3: these faults are acknowledged, and they're not going to pay

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Speaker 3: their way to bullshitting people and to thinking that they're

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Speaker 3: sincerely acknowledging those faults. So good luck to everyone. That's

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Speaker 3: how we're ending every segment there.

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Speaker 4: Good luck exactly all right. Up next, we got Rocan

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Speaker 4: in the studio, a Democrat of congressman is taking his

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Speaker 4: pitch to some red districts or at least purple districts

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Speaker 4: around the country. Here let's play a little bit of

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Speaker 4: a Rokanna heading to Pennsylvania. I want to ask.

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Speaker 7: Are we safe?

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Speaker 8: Is my family safe? And you know you asked are

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Speaker 8: we safe? And you're mature enough and you're thoughtful enough

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Speaker 8: that I'm going to give you an honest answer. And

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Speaker 8: the honest answer is that there are people right now

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Speaker 8: in power who are making it harder for folks who

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Speaker 8: are lesbian. And in this country, there are people who

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Speaker 8: are making it harder for folks who are on Medicaid

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Speaker 8: and who need those services to live well and to

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Speaker 8: have basic health care. That's true about what's going on,

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Speaker 8: But you know, we also have a country where a

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Speaker 8: sixth grader gets to stand up and talk about that

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Speaker 8: and talk about that and talk about that in a

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Speaker 8: way that is so much more powerful than anything I

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Speaker 8: can say or any congress person can say.

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Speaker 4: All right, joining us here is Democratic Congressman Rocanna. Thanks

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Speaker 4: for joining it.

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Speaker 8: Thank you the standing of issue. So it was for

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Speaker 8: the sixth grade girl, not for me, But that was

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Speaker 8: a powerful moment because she stood up there a lot

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Speaker 8: of courage and she said, I'm afraid. I'm afraid for

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Speaker 8: my family, and what can you tell me? That's going

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Speaker 8: to keep me safe. And there's not much you can

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Speaker 8: tell folks. And I was pretty honest with her about

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Speaker 8: some of the cuts that are taking place and the

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Speaker 8: climate affair that it's been created.

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Speaker 4: And this is this is kind of your you know,

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Speaker 4: this is your homecoming in a way. You're from Bucks County.

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Speaker 4: I was actually just up that way from my cousin's

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Speaker 4: high school graduation from Boyertown High I was born. I

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Speaker 4: was born in Allentown, which you also visited.

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Speaker 8: That's why we were having such a hard time getting

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Speaker 8: a venue. I said, how's it so hard? They said

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Speaker 8: the graduation graduation?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly. So how is Allentown? Where'd you go in Allentown?

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Speaker 8: We were in Allentown and it was right next to

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Speaker 8: the Mack Truck facility. A lot of the folks in

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Speaker 8: Mack Truck, unfortunately, are losing their jobs in July. Two reasons. One,

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Speaker 8: those jobs are going to Mexico. So I'm in Donald

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Speaker 8: Trump here's talking about bringing manufacturing jobs back. How about

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Speaker 8: we just start not losing them. And the second thing

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Speaker 8: is these blanket tariffs have caused Mack Trucks to raise

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Speaker 8: their prices by twenty five percent, and they've lost twenty

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Speaker 8: five percent of orders. And so these folks from UAW

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Speaker 8: were there saying, you know, three hundred and fifty four

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Speaker 8: guys are going to get laid off if you guys

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Speaker 8: don't do something, and appealing to Ryan mackenzie, the congress

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Speaker 8: person there in Donald Trump to save their jobs.

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Speaker 4: So what would an industrial policy look like? That didn't

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Speaker 4: lead to that, because Trump, when he talks about bringing

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Speaker 4: manufacturing back, is not talking about mack Truck laying people

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Speaker 4: off in Allentown. He's talking about the opposite of that.

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Speaker 4: And mack Truck laying people off has been going on

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Speaker 4: for forty years and it had a bit of a revival,

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Speaker 4: but there was a formative experience with my child. Remember,

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Speaker 4: like everybody talking in Allentown, mack Truck is moving to

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Speaker 4: South Carolina. Like one of the first things that a

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Speaker 4: lot of these companies do is they move from the

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Speaker 4: Union states down to the non union states, and then

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Speaker 4: when there's a little bit of union activity there, then

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Speaker 4: they had to Mexico or China or Vietnam or wherever

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Speaker 4: they go. So what would you do, because obviously it

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Speaker 4: makes no sense for US policy to be hurting mac

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Speaker 4: in Allentown.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, well, first, you wouldn't have blanket tariffs that are

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Speaker 8: making it harder for manufacturers to import things that they

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Speaker 8: need for their trucks before you actually phased in the

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Speaker 8: production in the United States. So if you wanted to say, Okay,

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Speaker 8: here are the component parts, we're going to produce that

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Speaker 8: in the United States and phase in tariff's fine. But

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Speaker 8: you can't just have these blanket tarfs. Second, I would

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Speaker 8: have an offshoring tax. I mean, if you're going to

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Speaker 8: offshore a plan, you're causing a lot of disruption, You're

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Speaker 8: causing a lot of harm to a community. There should

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Speaker 8: be a tax right now. Actually, the tax overseas is

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Speaker 8: less than the corporate tax in the United States. It's

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Speaker 8: twenty one percent here, but to repatriot profits it's only

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Speaker 8: ten percent. So we need to have an offshoring tax.

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Speaker 8: And third, i'd have an economic Marshall plan and development

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Speaker 8: policy of what are we going to invest in these

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Speaker 8: communities to build new factories and where are we going

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Speaker 8: to commit to buying things where the government can buy things.

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Speaker 8: Some of it may be mac trucks, some of them

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Speaker 8: may be other kinds of manufacturing. Some of it may

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Speaker 8: be healthcare, education, it's not all going to be manufacturing,

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Speaker 8: but you need to have a concerted investment economic development strategy,

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Speaker 8: none of which down from as he wants to just

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Speaker 8: wave a magic wand with blanket tariffs. And it's in

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Speaker 8: some cases like mack Truck, unintentionally. I don't think Trump

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Speaker 8: wants to hurt them, but unintentionally hurting them.

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Speaker 3: So I have a two prong question on that point.

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Speaker 3: Because the Big Beautiful Bill, if it gets past, is

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Speaker 3: promising tax ri offs for investment in the United States, building, manufacturing, building,

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Speaker 3: factory building in the United States, and retroactive to January twentieth,

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Speaker 3: like one hundred percent write offs on all of that.

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Speaker 3: Corporate tax would go down from twenty one percent to

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Speaker 3: fifteen percent. The Trump administration sees that as a sort

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Speaker 3: of compliment to the tariff policy, as kind of an

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Speaker 3: industrial policy in a tax structure way. What do you

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Speaker 3: make of that? Do you think substantively that's helpful? And

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Speaker 3: having been talking to people in counties that went Obama, Trump, Biden,

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Speaker 3: Trump in many cases people who have voted for Democrats

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Speaker 3: and Republicans in the presidential ticket in recent decades, do

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Speaker 3: you think those types of policies could be sold by

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Speaker 3: the Trump administration, like, do you think the Trump administration

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Speaker 3: will have an easy time saying, listen, we are bringing

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Speaker 3: manufacturing back if that bill passes in substance and in style.

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Speaker 3: I guess is the question.

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Speaker 8: Well, first of all, on this substance, they're also repealing

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Speaker 8: some of the Inflation Reduction Act production tax credit. So

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Speaker 8: it's not a clean build that says, if you're making

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Speaker 8: things in America, we're going to give you tax credits.

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Speaker 8: I guess if you're making things that happen to be

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Speaker 8: low carbon, they want to take those tax credits away.

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Speaker 8: They have some of the accelerated depreciation, but it's also

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Speaker 8: a very trickle down approach. Their view, I mean, a

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Speaker 8: genuine view is we're going to create these global deals.

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Speaker 8: We're going to provide these tax breaks, and somehow it's

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Speaker 8: going to lead to more job creation in the United

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Speaker 8: States and every community, and may lead to more job

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Speaker 8: creation in Silicon Valley. It may lead to more job

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Speaker 8: creation and capital centers. But I don't think these companies

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Speaker 8: are going to say, Okay, now we're going to go

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Speaker 8: in Johnstown, We're going to go in Lorraine. We're going

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Speaker 8: to build the types of manufacturing that those communities want.

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Speaker 5: To do that.

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Speaker 8: You need federal directed investment, you need a workforce, you

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Speaker 8: need to ask these communities what to do. In terms

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Speaker 8: of the politics of it, I think he's going to

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Speaker 8: try to sell that, but ultimately reality is reality. At

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Speaker 8: some point people are going to say, Okay, am I

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Speaker 8: getting laid off? Am I getting new jobs. It's why

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Speaker 8: Donald Trump is so much more effective as an outsider

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Speaker 8: than as president in my view. As an outsider, you know,

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Speaker 8: David Brooks said, he asked all the right questions, he

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Speaker 8: just said some of the wrong answers. As an outsider,

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Speaker 8: he can say all these problems, but when he's as

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Speaker 8: a president, he's going to be judged on the actual record.

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Speaker 4: Great, and so you had you were saying you had

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Speaker 4: some Trump protesters. We did, who showed up? How what

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Speaker 4: was their deal?

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Speaker 8: But first of all, it's an argument for every Democrat

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Speaker 8: going on Fox News because they said, you know, first

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Speaker 8: they started approaching me. I said, oh no, I'm going

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Speaker 8: to get yelled at. And they said, we have a request.

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Speaker 8: Can we get a selfie? I said, you want a

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Speaker 8: selfie with me? So we see you all the time

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Speaker 8: on Fox News. So that's the That's what started the conversation.

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Speaker 8: And then I said, well, why don't you just listen,

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Speaker 8: because I just introduce a bill to codify Donald Trump's

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Speaker 8: executive order. I'm the first the pharmaceut on the pharmaceutical

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Speaker 8: bill to say that Americans shouldn't pay more than people

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Speaker 8: in every other part of the world. And Bernie and

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Speaker 8: I had done something simil or years ago where we

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Speaker 8: said that if you're paying more in America than places

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Speaker 8: in Japan or Germany, we should take away the patents

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Speaker 8: from those pharma companies. Trump says, let's import the cheap drugs,

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Speaker 8: and we got to bipartisan. It's with bigs, it's with Luna,

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Speaker 8: and so this got the Trump voters paying attention. I said,

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Speaker 8: I'm not for medicaid cuts. They said, well, we don't

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Speaker 8: want Medicaid cuts. I said, I'm for keeping this mac

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Speaker 8: truck jobs here. They said, we're for that.

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Speaker 9: Now.

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Speaker 8: I said, you know, the bill actually has these cuts.

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Speaker 8: And I think that the politics the debate is going

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Speaker 8: to be whether Trump can sell them that is not

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Speaker 8: cutting medicaid, when in my view it actually is. He's

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Speaker 8: calling it waste, fraud, and abuse.

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Speaker 4: It's not though, right.

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Speaker 3: So on that point, even actually on the drug bill,

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Speaker 3: Have you heard anything from the White House? Have your

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Speaker 3: Republicans heard anything, Republican colleagues heard anything from the White

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Speaker 3: House that there might be movement on that or is

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Speaker 3: Republican leadership going to do everything they can not to

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Speaker 3: let that come to the floor or get into any

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Speaker 3: other packages.

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Speaker 8: It's an uphill battle get it onto the floor. There's

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Speaker 8: so much lobbying money off big pharma. And you know,

434
00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 8: Donald Trump's out there saying he's already lowered drug prices

435
00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:13,960
Speaker 8: by eighty five percent, so accomplished. He's got the talking points.

436
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,400
Speaker 8: But again, he's president and maybe right now people think, okay,

437
00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:19,120
Speaker 8: this is going to happen, But a year from now

438
00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:22,160
Speaker 8: they're going to wonder, have drug price has actually gone down?

439
00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,440
Speaker 8: And I would think this would be such a home

440
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,040
Speaker 8: run for him if he would actually we would pass

441
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,840
Speaker 8: this law and codify it, and he'd be the president

442
00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:33,600
Speaker 8: to take on big pharma, he would it would be

443
00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:35,960
Speaker 8: a huge deal. But I just don't think that the

444
00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:37,920
Speaker 8: Republicans in Congress are going to do it or the

445
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 8: Senate are going to do it.

446
00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 4: He just got a kind of surprise win in the

447
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,120
Speaker 4: Senate on a similar vein where they passed Last night,

448
00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:48,199
Speaker 4: they passed it alt the No tax On Act got

449
00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:50,280
Speaker 4: one hundred votes in the Senate, just went through by

450
00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,920
Speaker 4: unanim's consent. Democrats like, all right, fine, we'll do this.

451
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:58,000
Speaker 4: Do you think is that going to pass the House?

452
00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:00,520
Speaker 8: It's going to be part of the Reckon Soation Bill.

453
00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:02,399
Speaker 8: I do think it'll pass. You know, as you know,

454
00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,480
Speaker 8: they've given the no tax for tips for four years.

455
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 8: They're giving the tax breaks for the millionaires and billionaires

456
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:09,080
Speaker 8: for ten years.

457
00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:10,960
Speaker 4: Well that's why it was only one hundred and thirty

458
00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:13,040
Speaker 4: five or and that's the.

459
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:16,479
Speaker 8: Gimmick that they had. But look, Donald Trump obviously has

460
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:21,119
Speaker 8: incredible political instincts. You don't become president twice. I mean,

461
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 8: I don't agree with his leadership, but his no tax

462
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 8: on tips was a stroke of brilliance in Nevada and

463
00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:29,720
Speaker 8: other places. My view is, we got to raise the

464
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:32,680
Speaker 8: living wage, but in the meantime, yeah, why are we

465
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:37,520
Speaker 8: taxing tips on working families? And so you're going to

466
00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:39,320
Speaker 8: get support for it, and I think the argument from

467
00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:41,399
Speaker 8: Democrats is why are you making this four years and

468
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:45,160
Speaker 8: not ten years and having the millionaire billionaire tax cut

469
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:50,119
Speaker 8: for ten years? By the way, eighty thousand dollars plus

470
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 8: that every millionaire is going to get based on this

471
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,320
Speaker 8: tax plan, and it's about seven hundred and fifty dollars

472
00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 8: for people under one hundred thousand dollars just on the

473
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,360
Speaker 8: tax breaks. And then there was this CBO study which

474
00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 8: is just astounding of distributional analysis saying that the bottom

475
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 8: ten percent are going to be hurt because of the

476
00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:12,240
Speaker 8: Medicaid cuts and the cuts and food stamps, in the

477
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:14,440
Speaker 8: top ten percent are going to benefit. And it's a

478
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:16,639
Speaker 8: pretty straightforward analysis.

479
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:20,960
Speaker 4: Could you see the So what about the pharmaceutical measure?

480
00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:24,359
Speaker 4: It feels like from a political perspective, You've got Trump

481
00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,440
Speaker 4: has already said it, he's for it, he's claimed he's

482
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:31,920
Speaker 4: doing it. You've got the bill. What's the mechanism to

483
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:36,639
Speaker 4: expose the big pharm a lobby as the ones in

484
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 4: the way of it, because once they're exposed, it's much

485
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 4: more difficult for them.

486
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:42,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, call up the Health and Human Services secretary, see

487
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 3: if he wants to do some message.

488
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,760
Speaker 8: That's not a bad idea. Actually we can reach out

489
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:49,359
Speaker 8: to him. I'm hoping we get as many Republicans and

490
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:52,560
Speaker 8: Democrats to sign on to it. Look, it's not perfect

491
00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 8: in terms of what I prefer Lloyd Doggett or Bernie's approach. Yes,

492
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:58,399
Speaker 8: but the argument I'm making to my Democratic colleagues is

493
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 8: I'm not changing the language because I don't want to

494
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:03,639
Speaker 8: then say to Republicans, here's an excuse to oppose it.

495
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 3: Now.

496
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:08,440
Speaker 8: For Republicans, I'm saying, look, we're literally codifying Trump's executive order,

497
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,040
Speaker 8: and then how are you not for this? And I

498
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 8: think we can get to a large number of House

499
00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 8: members on this bill, we start to get momentum because

500
00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 8: the reality is that both parties have taken money from

501
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 8: big pharma or buy into those talking points always going

502
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 8: to hurt innovation and hurt drug discovery. Not true. I mean,

503
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:33,119
Speaker 8: most of that is happening with your and my tax dollars.

504
00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:36,439
Speaker 8: But we've got to expose it. It's a powerful lobbying

505
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:39,520
Speaker 8: group and that's really what's standing in the way now.

506
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,240
Speaker 4: The debate consuming Democrats right now is the you know,

507
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:46,480
Speaker 4: what did you know and when? About President Biden's sinility.

508
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:50,040
Speaker 4: Megan Kelly and Jake Tapper had it out a little bit.

509
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,440
Speaker 4: Let's to set the context. Let's play some of this

510
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:54,760
Speaker 4: Kelly Tapper clip over here.

511
00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 10: In my ecosphere. We were covering all of these. It

512
00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:00,879
Speaker 10: wasn't just falling down, it was get lost. It was

513
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,000
Speaker 10: some of the stuff you report in your book. We

514
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 10: knew and we were reporting on, like the multi jump

515
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:09,479
Speaker 10: cuts in the videos of him, or it was obvious

516
00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:11,800
Speaker 10: he couldn't get through a one minute take. It was

517
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,159
Speaker 10: clear to us that he was using teleprompter, and there

518
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:16,800
Speaker 10: was some reporting on that at the time, all of

519
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:19,680
Speaker 10: which the White House was denying. Now the current White House,

520
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 10: I have some connections with the Joe Biden white House.

521
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 4: I had none, but you did.

522
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:25,639
Speaker 3: There was an attempted cover up.

523
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 10: It could only ever work if you allowed it, if

524
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 10: the press allowed it. Some of us tried not to,

525
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:33,280
Speaker 10: and some of us were complicit.

526
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 11: The Biden white House did not like me. Okay, this

527
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,280
Speaker 11: is I do not have great connections with the Biden

528
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:40,760
Speaker 11: White House.

529
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:42,160
Speaker 7: Well, clearly you have a lot of sources.

530
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 10: You say you talked to over two hundred sources for

531
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:45,880
Speaker 10: this book, so you have something you could have called

532
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 10: and worked.

533
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 3: I know.

534
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,959
Speaker 4: That's the point is that they were not being honest.

535
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 3: That's how the Street Journal get it.

536
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 10: In June of twenty twenty four, and Jake Tapper and

537
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 10: CNN couldn't find sources for this story then before he

538
00:26:58,440 --> 00:26:58,920
Speaker 10: dropped out.

539
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 11: No, it's just again going to do if we're going

540
00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:05,360
Speaker 11: to if we're going to do this, let's just stick

541
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 11: to the facts here, Okay when there is a damn, That's.

542
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 10: What I've been doing all along. I'm talking about what

543
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,680
Speaker 10: you miss the biggest story of the century when it

544
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 10: comes to presidential politics.

545
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 4: So that's Jake Tapper taking the beating.

546
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 8: A little bit of his own medicine.

547
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 3: Yes, speaking of that. Actually, Joe Scarborough getting a little

548
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 3: bit of from from Mark Halpern.

549
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, let's let's roll some of this next clip too.

550
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:33,200
Speaker 12: I say to people, go watch the State of the

551
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:36,040
Speaker 12: Union address. Talk to people who talked to Joe Biden.

552
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 12: He had good days and bad days. You were with

553
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,719
Speaker 12: him on a good day and had conversations with him

554
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,440
Speaker 12: on a good day, but good days on good days,

555
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 12: good days.

556
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 3: Yeah.

557
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 12: Looking but looking back at that, do you say, well,

558
00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:50,560
Speaker 12: it was misleading to say best by never without caveating

559
00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:52,520
Speaker 12: it and say except on the days when he's not

560
00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:56,360
Speaker 12: the best Biden? Well, but but I never I never

561
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 12: saw those days.

562
00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:58,080
Speaker 4: First, Well you did?

563
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:00,400
Speaker 12: You did, because he saw Hi, address the dead congress woman,

564
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 12: and you saw him in South Carolina.

565
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,399
Speaker 3: And yeah, more than I can show you.

566
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 12: So I can show you the r n C clip Reils.

567
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,200
Speaker 12: There were plenty of days in public when he when

568
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 12: he was not the best Biden ever, and.

569
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:14,879
Speaker 9: Of course stumbled and he stumbled and he stumbled and

570
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:15,600
Speaker 9: bumbled around.

571
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:15,880
Speaker 8: Mark.

572
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:19,360
Speaker 9: I mean, yeah, he he certainly did. Uh, Donald Trump did,

573
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:24,119
Speaker 9: other politicians did. But but but it And it's actually

574
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,239
Speaker 9: the same case as a lot of times when I've

575
00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:27,720
Speaker 9: gone in and talked to Donald Trump.

576
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 4: So where did you where did you come down on

577
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 4: this storing? Like, what what was your sense of Biden's

578
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 4: sinility and ability to be president versus privately versus publicly.

579
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 8: Well, first of all, obviously right now everyone is hoping,

580
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,560
Speaker 8: uh and praying for his full recovery from from prostate cancer.

581
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 8: But what I have said is it was a mistake

582
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 8: for President Biden to run. I had seen him a

583
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 8: few times in the year UH and had said that

584
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,480
Speaker 8: based on my conversations, he should run. Now, in light

585
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:04,000
Speaker 8: of all that's come out, I think that was a

586
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 8: wrong judgment. We also were hearing from a lot of

587
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 8: people in the Botton White House that he's capable of

588
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 8: doing it, he has the energy. We should have pushed back.

589
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,400
Speaker 8: It should have been more independent, should have asked more questions,

590
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 8: shouldn't have had as much deference. I do think it

591
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,920
Speaker 8: was capable of doing the job of president. But was

592
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 8: he up for a grueling campaign in four more years.

593
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,719
Speaker 8: That seems obvious that some of us, many of us

594
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:29,680
Speaker 8: in the party, got it wrong.

595
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 3: Well, I'm curious. I imagine you know, if you do

596
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:35,320
Speaker 3: more town halls, you'll hear sentiments that sound just like

597
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 3: Meghan's to Jake Tapper.

598
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:37,160
Speaker 8: There.

599
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 3: I feel like it's part of a trust deficit that

600
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:42,120
Speaker 3: voters have with Democrats now. It feels like a significant

601
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:46,480
Speaker 3: question mark that people will come to Democratic congressman with

602
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 3: the correct me if I'm wrong, if that's not something

603
00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 3: you hear from your constituents. But I wonder how you

604
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 3: address that, how Democrats address that. I know Jake Tapper

605
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 3: isn't like an elected Democratic official, but as somebody.

606
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:02,160
Speaker 4: In Kansas like to the public, right, yeah, well.

607
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 3: And he did. I mean, his coverage was mixed. He's

608
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 3: trying to defend his record, but the point is he

609
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 3: wasn't banging the drum every day saying this guy is

610
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 3: he doesn't seem capable of leading the country for another

611
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 3: four years, and there's significant questions about whether he's capable now.

612
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:18,880
Speaker 3: So how do you think Democrats can or should or

613
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 3: shouldn't address that question?

614
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:25,760
Speaker 8: Well, I do think this created a trust deficit and

615
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,040
Speaker 8: was read one of the big reasons we lost, and

616
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,520
Speaker 8: the American people punished the Democratic Party for that trust deficit.

617
00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 8: But I think the American people are very fair and

618
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:37,200
Speaker 8: also tend to move on. And the only way that

619
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:39,320
Speaker 8: this story drags out, in my view, is if we're

620
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:41,560
Speaker 8: not honest. If we don't come out and say it

621
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 8: was a mistake, we own it, We're going to be

622
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:47,640
Speaker 8: better in pushing back, and now we want to talk

623
00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 8: about the future and what's happening with medicaid and your

624
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:54,920
Speaker 8: jobs and tax policy. If we continue to say, well,

625
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 8: we were right and we didn't make a wrong call,

626
00:30:57,520 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 8: then I think it drags on. And that's why I

627
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,240
Speaker 8: just think I don't think it is in any way

628
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,360
Speaker 8: betraying Joe Biden. I'm still very proud of his record

629
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 8: off the IRA and the Chip sack. I just think

630
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 8: he made a wrong judgment to run, and many of

631
00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 8: us should have asked tougher questions and shown more independence,

632
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:16,240
Speaker 8: And I guess if you say that, I think the

633
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,440
Speaker 8: American people are pretty fair and just.

634
00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 3: In terms of like the lessons that can be taken

635
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 3: away from it is one of do you, in your

636
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 3: own mind, when you look back, do you think one

637
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 3: of the reasons that maybe you didn't push for the

638
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 3: answers to those questions hard is that there didn't seem

639
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 3: like a good alternative in the moment because Joe Biden

640
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 3: had pushed for some of the economic populist economic policies

641
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 3: that people like you had pushed for. Is there something

642
00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 3: that you thought maybe it held you back from asking

643
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 3: pushing further asking those questions. I think the.

644
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 8: Biggest thing, in my view is the deference to seniority

645
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:47,600
Speaker 8: and party leaders that sort of the culture of the

646
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 8: Democratic Party. I mean, we see this unfortunately today with

647
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:54,840
Speaker 8: Jerry Connolly's passing, but we saw that in the Oversight race.

648
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,680
Speaker 8: We've seen this time and again that the Democratic Party

649
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 8: has a lot of culture of deference to seniority, to

650
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 8: people who've been there, to party leaders, and we just

651
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,600
Speaker 8: need to be more willing to push back at least

652
00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:12,120
Speaker 8: to get for me that was the main reason. I

653
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 8: also think the fact that it went so long at

654
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 8: the end. You know, if there was a robust open

655
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:19,760
Speaker 8: primary and someone like Bernie Sanders would have gotten in

656
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:21,680
Speaker 8: and had the time, that's one thing. But when it

657
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 8: was one hundred days left, there was a fear that

658
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 8: Biden had championed and was championing fairly progressive policy and

659
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 8: that the DNC would sort of engineer something that would

660
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:34,720
Speaker 8: move the party in a much more corporate direction. And

661
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 8: that's I think also part of the reason that you

662
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:40,760
Speaker 8: had progressives being out there for Biden because they liked

663
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:42,120
Speaker 8: a lot of Biden's policies.

664
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that's the case too, And I wonder

665
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 4: how much the coronation of Kamala Harris plays into this whole,

666
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 4: the same sense of betrayal or rejection that the public

667
00:32:56,320 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 4: feels towards the Democratic behavior in twenty twenty five, or

668
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 4: do you think if when you know, even Obama we

669
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 4: now know through reporting, and it seemed you could kind

670
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:08,800
Speaker 4: of sense it at the time, but we now know

671
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 4: that the Obamas, both Obamas, thought that there should be

672
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:14,880
Speaker 4: an open primary and that the convention should really choose

673
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:18,520
Speaker 4: a candidate a completely radical idea like Democrats get together

674
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 4: and democratically decide who should be the nominee, and they

675
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:26,960
Speaker 4: were front run by, eventually by Biden and then others

676
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 4: who could very quickly just endorsed Kamla and there it

677
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 4: was done. So do you think do you think that

678
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 4: plays into it? Do you think that was do you

679
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:37,120
Speaker 4: think that was a mistake not to have You know,

680
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 4: the argument was all will be six weeks of fighting

681
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:42,880
Speaker 4: on and on, But what was that a mistake to

682
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:44,160
Speaker 4: not have an open primary?

683
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 8: It was Look, the ideal situation would have Biden does

684
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 8: better than expected at the midterms, announces he's not doing

685
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 8: his second term, and there's a real open primary. Because

686
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,600
Speaker 8: I do think it was awkward to go to a

687
00:33:56,720 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 8: convention and to pass over the sitting vice president. I'm

688
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 8: not saying that that wouldn't have been preferable to what

689
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:06,280
Speaker 8: we did, but there's an awkwardness to that, Whereas I

690
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 8: don't think anyone would have said that if there was

691
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 8: an actual open election. The second best case, though, would

692
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:13,960
Speaker 8: have been an open convention and primary. And the reason

693
00:34:14,120 --> 00:34:16,879
Speaker 8: is that the American people have this sense. In my view,

694
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 8: I mean having lost races, having lost a race and

695
00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:22,000
Speaker 8: won a race two years later. I mean I lost

696
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 8: to an incumbent and the one against the same incoment

697
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 8: two years later, and the biggest thing I got was, well, bro,

698
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:28,600
Speaker 8: you're really working hard. You must really want this job.

699
00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 8: You've been campaigning so long. And I think with Donald Trump, unfortunately,

700
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:34,800
Speaker 8: there was a sense like he's been campaigning for this

701
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:39,240
Speaker 8: for four years what we saw as criminal charge lawsuits.

702
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 8: People said, well, he's really fighting this and he's fighting assassinations.

703
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:44,880
Speaker 8: And so there was here's this person who's been campaigning

704
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:47,279
Speaker 8: for four years for a job and someone who's you know,

705
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,640
Speaker 8: one hundred days, and the American people kind of want

706
00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 8: you to earn it. They want you to beg and

707
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:55,880
Speaker 8: ask for their votes and fight for that. And that

708
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 8: is something that Obama really benefited from, right. I mean,

709
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 8: he was in every milk and cranny of this country

710
00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:06,600
Speaker 8: fighting for his Hillary. And I think it hurt Harris

711
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:10,759
Speaker 8: in just her chances had she defeated someone, and it

712
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:12,440
Speaker 8: would have actually strengthened her.

713
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 4: And can you imagine the hagiography that Biden would be

714
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:21,240
Speaker 4: getting right now if he had anybody watching this. Who's

715
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 4: if you're in your eighties and you're hanging on to

716
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,279
Speaker 4: your Senate seat, like, think about this.

717
00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, they love breaking points if Biden.

718
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:31,040
Speaker 4: I'm sure they do. If Biden. They watched it right

719
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 4: after the PBS News Hour clip on YouTube bends. Yeah,

720
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:36,520
Speaker 4: if Biden had stepped down, like you said, after the

721
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 4: mid after they overperform in the mid terms, he steps down,

722
00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 4: he says, I said I was going to be a bridge.

723
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:46,920
Speaker 4: I'm following through on it, like the glowing portrayals of

724
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 4: his legacy that we would be kind of sloshing through

725
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 4: right now.

726
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 8: Do you think even if Trump wins that's the case.

727
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 4: I think even if Trump wins, because he then he

728
00:35:58,280 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 4: did the best he could. He did what he said

729
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 4: he was going to do. He set the party up,

730
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 4: and then the people chose Trump. But I think actually

731
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 4: Democrats probably win.

732
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 3: The cancer diagnosis tragically would have vindicated that decision as well, saying,

733
00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 3: you know you it was maybe.

734
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:15,920
Speaker 4: Could have been honest about the cancer diagnoses earlier. Right

735
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:18,720
Speaker 4: she's saying that he just learned that he's in the phones.

736
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 4: It's like, I'm not a cancer doctor, but.

737
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 8: Saying that he hasn't been tested since twenty fourteen, I mean,

738
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:24,080
Speaker 8: I don't.

739
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:26,840
Speaker 4: You know that's what the what kind of guy? His

740
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:30,839
Speaker 4: age doesn't get regular anyway alone the president, as as

741
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 4: Biden says, anyway.

742
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 8: Yeah, but look, I think that Democrats have to find

743
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 8: a way to genuinely celebrate some of the policy achievements

744
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,360
Speaker 8: because we don't want to move back to a Democratic

745
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:48,760
Speaker 8: party that doesn't have a worker centered politics, a belief

746
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 8: that there should be stayed intervention, that there shouldn't be

747
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:54,920
Speaker 8: blanket trade, right. I mean, just because Trump's blanket tariffs

748
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:57,439
Speaker 8: aren't working doesn't mean that the Democrats now should start

749
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:01,080
Speaker 8: celebrating NAFTA or China's ascension. It's a world trade organization.

750
00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 8: I think Biden represented a break from unfettered globalization and

751
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,960
Speaker 8: separating that and being proud of that, from his decision

752
00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:12,560
Speaker 8: to run and owning up to that. And you know,

753
00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:15,120
Speaker 8: other than maybe Dean Phillips or a few people, there

754
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:20,280
Speaker 8: are very few Democratic elected officials who weren't endorsing Biden

755
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,879
Speaker 8: and saying something or the other about why he would

756
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:25,960
Speaker 8: have been a good president. And we could just say

757
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 8: we made a wrong judgment, didn't a light to what

758
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 8: it's come out.

759
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:31,840
Speaker 4: At least Dean went for it. But connorson KNA always

760
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 4: a pleasure to have you in the studio.

761
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:34,840
Speaker 8: I appreciate it. I always enjoyed it.

762
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 3: Thank you. Elon Musk made a big announcement, actually in

763
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 3: a pretty casual way yesterday. He was asked during a

764
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 3: conference or Zoom whether he would well, I don't know Zoom.

765
00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:51,319
Speaker 3: It could have been whatever else not skyp. Skype is gone,

766
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:53,239
Speaker 3: but it could have been Google Meet. Who knows. He

767
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:56,000
Speaker 3: was asked about his political donations, the future of his

768
00:37:56,080 --> 00:38:02,080
Speaker 3: political donations, which again donated just a crazy amount of money. Yeah,

769
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:04,920
Speaker 3: almost three hundred million just in the last cycle. So

770
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 3: Republicans he has this America Pack have been have been

771
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 3: really building up an infrastructure around an anticipation of future

772
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,800
Speaker 3: donations from Elon Musk. Let's take a listen to what

773
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 3: he said.

774
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 8: I think.

775
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 13: In terms of political spending, I'm going to do a

776
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 13: lot less in the future.

777
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:26,560
Speaker 3: And why is that.

778
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:29,799
Speaker 13: I think I've done enough?

779
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:34,920
Speaker 3: Is it? Is it because of blowback?

780
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:40,520
Speaker 13: Well, if I see a reason to do political spending

781
00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:41,440
Speaker 13: in the future, I will do it.

782
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 4: I do I currently see a reason.

783
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:47,879
Speaker 3: And it's easy to read into that some awkwardness. It's

784
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,239
Speaker 3: always kind of baked into Elon Musk. Yes, but some

785
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:54,200
Speaker 3: awkwardness in his relationship with the Republican Party. With Donald Trump,

786
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 3: he seems my particulars. He seems kind of bitter almost so,

787
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,320
Speaker 3: though it can be hard to tell with Musk because

788
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:02,360
Speaker 3: it's hard to standard.

789
00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:02,759
Speaker 4: Yeah.

790
00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:06,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, So this was at Bloomberg's Cutter Economic Forum in Doah,

791
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:08,800
Speaker 3: which is just kind of hilarious in and of itself.

792
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:13,399
Speaker 3: But that was zooming into it again. Almost three hundred

793
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 3: million dollars in the last election cycle, a big pack

794
00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:19,360
Speaker 3: that Republicans have been counting on. My check on this

795
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,120
Speaker 3: is it's actually kind of good for the Republican Party

796
00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:25,560
Speaker 3: to not be tiptoeing around Elon Musk for the sake

797
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 3: of getting hundreds of millions of dollars from him in

798
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:33,000
Speaker 3: an election cycle. So just from a like populist standpoint,

799
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 3: that's a good thing. Anti corruption standpoint, maybe it is

800
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:37,319
Speaker 3: one way to put it. That's a good thing.

801
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 4: Yeah. On CNBC, he acknowledged that he took a beating

802
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 4: for his entry into the arena. He blamed it on

803
00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:54,160
Speaker 4: propaganda from the mainstream media. Let's roll f two.

804
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 14: You are somewhat divisive figure two years ago, but now

805
00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 14: you really are. I mean, there are people who love you,

806
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 14: but there are a lot of people who dislike you,

807
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:05,680
Speaker 14: some of whom were your customers, And I wonder was

808
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:08,520
Speaker 14: it worth the undertaking it Doge and everything.

809
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:09,720
Speaker 4: Else that you've done, and how it's spoken.

810
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,800
Speaker 14: You've been in terms of the things you believe in

811
00:40:12,719 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 14: to antagonize so many potential buyers and or users of

812
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:17,880
Speaker 14: things like a ROBOTAXI.

813
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 13: Well, I mean, unfortunately, what I've learned is that legacy

814
00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 13: media propaganda is very effective at making you believe things

815
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 13: that aren't true.

816
00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:28,719
Speaker 4: What would an example of.

817
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,759
Speaker 13: That be that I'm a Nazi, for example? And how

818
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:38,919
Speaker 13: many legacy media publications, talk shows, whatever try to claim

819
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 13: that I was a Nazi because of some random ham

820
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 13: gesture at a rally where all I said was that

821
00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 13: my heart goes out to you, and I was talking

822
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:49,960
Speaker 13: about space travel. And yet the legacy media promoted that

823
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,800
Speaker 13: as though if that was a deliberate Nazi gesture, when

824
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 13: in fact, every politician, any public speaker who's spoken for

825
00:40:57,239 --> 00:40:59,720
Speaker 13: any length of time has made the exact same gesture.

826
00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:03,480
Speaker 13: And yet there's sold people out there and I've never

827
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 13: had I've never had.

828
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 3: A single puss.

829
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:08,520
Speaker 4: You know what I wasn't I was I was talking

830
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:11,720
Speaker 4: about it. Yeah, and so this has had commercial damage

831
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 4: to in particular Tesla, the most I guess consumer facing

832
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:18,239
Speaker 4: of his companies. You can put up F three. This

833
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 4: article in The Bulwark highlights one guy who paid one

834
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,239
Speaker 4: hundred and ten thousand dollars a year ago for a

835
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,759
Speaker 4: cyber truck now being offered fifty four thousand dollars for

836
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 4: it by Carvana. There are an enormous number of unsold

837
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:36,120
Speaker 4: cyber trucks kick kicking around, but things could be turning around,

838
00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:41,160
Speaker 4: and you know, maybe thanks to his involvement in politics.

839
00:41:41,239 --> 00:41:46,760
Speaker 4: In the end, put up F four. Elon Musk apparently

840
00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 4: reached out to Pete Hegseth, saying that you know that

841
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:53,800
Speaker 4: he'd be happy to collaborate with the construction of this

842
00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 4: new Golden Dome that we talked about earlier in the program.

843
00:41:57,320 --> 00:41:59,680
Speaker 4: Donald Trump is going to keep us safe from the

844
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 4: while barrages that he apparently expects to come our way

845
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:07,120
Speaker 4: and is going to build us an iron dome times

846
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:10,800
Speaker 4: gold and Elon Musk wants a piece of this, you know,

847
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 4: five hundred billion dollar project. Well that that's what the

848
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:15,719
Speaker 4: CBO says it was cost. Trump says it's basically going

849
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:19,799
Speaker 4: to be a tiny fraction of that. If if you're

850
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 4: a betting man, you always take the over on any

851
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:25,800
Speaker 4: Pentagon contract. Elon Musk, a betting man, would like a

852
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,879
Speaker 4: piece of that action. So on the one hand, Musk

853
00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 4: saying politics has been really bad for me for the

854
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:36,320
Speaker 4: foreseeable future, I'm not going to be investing. At the

855
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 4: same time, he's still hoping he's going to be able

856
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 4: to continue to get government contracts, which in our pay

857
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,360
Speaker 4: to play system requires some involvement in politics, but it

858
00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:48,279
Speaker 4: doesn't require the level that he's been involved in. This

859
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 4: this unprecedented like I'm going to be your banker kind

860
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:55,960
Speaker 4: of thing role that he was playing. And I'm curious

861
00:42:56,120 --> 00:43:01,600
Speaker 4: how you know, Democrats were nervous that Elon Musk's superpack

862
00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:06,160
Speaker 4: was and I think some Republicans were nervous too privately, yeah,

863
00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:11,360
Speaker 4: that it was going to turn Trump into not dictator

864
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:13,279
Speaker 4: in the old sense, but like a guy who can

865
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 4: basically dictate anything to the Republican Party because if you

866
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,080
Speaker 4: step out of line, here's my man, Elon Who's going

867
00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:22,600
Speaker 4: to put ten million dollars into a superpack and is

868
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,160
Speaker 4: going to destroy you in the next primary more than not.

869
00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 4: And they basically said that explicitly, and that would give

870
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:35,480
Speaker 4: a president an amount of power over his party that

871
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 4: no president really has ever had before. But almost seems

872
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 4: like Trump can do that anyway. But he doesn't even

873
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:45,360
Speaker 4: need the money, just his own, his own kind of

874
00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 4: power and influence within the party can do it well.

875
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:51,920
Speaker 3: Primaries, yeah, I think in the primaries maybe, but in

876
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:54,560
Speaker 3: general elections. I mean, I think we've talked about this

877
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 3: in the Wisconsin Supreme Court election that Elon Musk actually

878
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 3: went to Green Bay and Cheese.

879
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:03,160
Speaker 4: Had on good. Western civilization was at stake.

880
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:07,279
Speaker 3: Said, Western civilizations at stake. I think we're right. Our

881
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 3: coverage has been correct to pinpoint that as the moment

882
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 3: in which must started to slowly disentangle himself from the

883
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:16,439
Speaker 3: Trump administration. At least in public view, it does seem

884
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 3: like that's happening. Privately, it does seem like he's gradually

885
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:22,239
Speaker 3: spending less and less time near the White House, in

886
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:24,120
Speaker 3: the White House and in Washington, d C.

887
00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:27,279
Speaker 4: And luckily for him, he's heavily invested in Eastern civilization too.

888
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:31,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, and space civilizations.

889
00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 4: In many civilizations. Yeah, he's covered.

890
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 3: The bases are covered, yes, so, but I think part

891
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 3: of that is because he wanted to be able to

892
00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 3: wield so much easy power in that that Wisconsin election

893
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,400
Speaker 3: was a test case post twenty twenty four general election

894
00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:52,880
Speaker 3: of Musk being able to come in register tons of

895
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:58,320
Speaker 3: new Republican voters by offering money, like bribing people to

896
00:44:58,360 --> 00:45:01,520
Speaker 3: register to vote, and then just come in and flick

897
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:05,320
Speaker 3: your finger and flick of the risk, flick of the wrist,

898
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:09,920
Speaker 3: and you've totally changed. You've bought an election. Essentially, he

899
00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:13,600
Speaker 3: was testing that he was trying that and it didn't work.

900
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 3: And so now in retrospect, the way Democrats framed the

901
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,440
Speaker 3: election in Wisconsin as sort of a test case for

902
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,880
Speaker 3: whether or not Musk can buy his way to complete

903
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 3: in total domination politically of the United States, that framing

904
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:29,400
Speaker 3: looks pretty good because it seems to have been a

905
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:31,759
Speaker 3: message to him that he cannot, that it will not

906
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:35,200
Speaker 3: be that easy, and that, if anything, his attempt to

907
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:40,120
Speaker 3: do that has become a sort of what's in albatross

908
00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 3: for the Republican party that wants to have a new

909
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:48,480
Speaker 3: populist messaging, wants to have a new populist brand, and

910
00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:51,120
Speaker 3: you have a billionaire coming in as sort of openly

911
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:54,879
Speaker 3: bribing people to register to vote, and trying to buy

912
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 3: elections again openly, pretty openly trying to buy elections, spend

913
00:45:58,520 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 3: a bunch of money. If cash infusion changed the game,

914
00:46:02,239 --> 00:46:04,759
Speaker 3: it didn't work, and it didn't work for a couple

915
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:07,400
Speaker 3: of reasons. Voters didn't like it. It's not great for Republicans.

916
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:11,960
Speaker 3: So that's where, at least I think on the public level,

917
00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 3: we're seeing him step back, genuinely step back. But whether

918
00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:19,200
Speaker 3: or not that investment, because we can put this funny

919
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 3: post from Tim Miller on the screen F three. This

920
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:24,440
Speaker 3: is about a guy who bought his cyber truck for

921
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:26,720
Speaker 3: one hundred and ten grand and then was offered fifty

922
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:30,799
Speaker 3: four thousand back for it by Carvana. It's a long

923
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:34,040
Speaker 3: bowlwark story about how they say in their stubheading Trump

924
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:37,279
Speaker 3: killed Tesla. And obviously it's true to that Tesla is

925
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:40,759
Speaker 3: struggling immensely. Some of these cars are struggling immensely. The

926
00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:43,840
Speaker 3: Tesla's valuation. Valuation has always been about more than just

927
00:46:43,960 --> 00:46:46,560
Speaker 3: the cars. It's also the technology. I mean, it's primarily

928
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 3: probably like the FSD full stub driving technology that's in

929
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:53,799
Speaker 3: the cars. Nevertheless, yeah, the cyber truck in particular, has

930
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:56,160
Speaker 3: struggled for reasons that aren't just Trump related, but are

931
00:46:56,160 --> 00:46:59,360
Speaker 3: definitely Trump related to So if you thought that that

932
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:05,000
Speaker 3: was representative of Musk taking a big hit, it actually

933
00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:07,759
Speaker 3: may turn out that you know this, the Tesla hit

934
00:47:08,239 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 3: is nothing compared to the gain for SpaceX, for Starlink,

935
00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:16,600
Speaker 3: and for other Musk properties, because he's now built up

936
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 3: tons of goodwill with the Trump administration going forward. He

937
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:22,600
Speaker 3: has great connections with Pete Hegseth. And by the way,

938
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 3: that's why people influence pedal to get the influence when

939
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:29,320
Speaker 3: they want it, for example, when there's massive contracts.

940
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:34,160
Speaker 4: Golden Dome contract available. Yeah, and hey, look I'm rooting

941
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:37,080
Speaker 4: for Tesla. We need more, you know, we need electric

942
00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:40,000
Speaker 4: vehicle companies and we need American ones. So I hope

943
00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:42,719
Speaker 4: he pulls this off. And I'm also very delighted that

944
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 4: he's tweeting much less, because God, that was not so

945
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:48,640
Speaker 4: much less. That was so obnoxious to just see him

946
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:50,440
Speaker 4: constantly in your feed. It was nothing you could do

947
00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:50,759
Speaker 4: about it.

948
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:52,640
Speaker 3: It wasn't even obnoxious so much as it was just

949
00:47:52,719 --> 00:47:56,719
Speaker 3: like watching a slow motion cyber truck crash right like.

950
00:47:56,800 --> 00:47:59,640
Speaker 4: It was painful, and he would he just would keep

951
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:03,000
Speaker 4: lading like Kat turn and Ian Miles Chong and everybody's fees.

952
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:07,160
Speaker 4: You're not doing the world a service with that. And

953
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:08,120
Speaker 4: he was for yourself.

954
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:10,520
Speaker 3: He was openly admitting that they were half baked, right,

955
00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:12,959
Speaker 3: He was like, sometimes I'll be right, sometimes I'll be wrong.

956
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:16,400
Speaker 3: And for a billionaire to be so casual about these

957
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:19,400
Speaker 3: pronouncements that, even if he wants them to have less power,

958
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:21,719
Speaker 3: even if he wants people to realize that this is

959
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:25,839
Speaker 3: just my half baked two in the morning thoughts. It's

960
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:27,920
Speaker 3: not how people interpret things that are coming out of

961
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:28,920
Speaker 3: the mouth of a billionaire.

962
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 4: And one of the best things culturally about him is

963
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,800
Speaker 4: that he's always been interesting. Yes, and he stopped being interesting.

964
00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 4: He became a reply He became a reply guy. He

965
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:39,240
Speaker 4: became boring.

966
00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's right.

967
00:48:40,719 --> 00:48:43,520
Speaker 4: No pun intended on his company. And so maybe he'll

968
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:45,279
Speaker 4: get his interesting mojo back.

969
00:48:45,440 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, it wasn't. It wasn't even good for like his

970
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:50,759
Speaker 3: personal brand. Terrible, many different robles. So we'll see. But

971
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 3: if you had said in January twenty first, for example,

972
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:58,000
Speaker 3: May twenty first, so exactly five months ago that uh,

973
00:48:58,239 --> 00:49:00,719
Speaker 3: you know, Elon Musker four months ago, I can't count

974
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 3: that's keep that in mind for all of the economic segments.

975
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:06,000
Speaker 3: I know you already know many of you already do.

976
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:11,160
Speaker 3: But if you have on January twenty first, for someone

977
00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 3: coming to you and saying by May twenty first, Elon

978
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 3: is saying he's gonna be no more political donations and

979
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:18,880
Speaker 3: basically he's done with DOGE. I think a lot of

980
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:20,760
Speaker 3: people would have been like, WHOA, what happened?

981
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:24,040
Speaker 4: Well, and russ Vote is taking over Doje And russ

982
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:27,440
Speaker 4: Vote is much more dangerous probably person than Elon because

983
00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:32,200
Speaker 4: he's methodical and he's like a revolutionary depends on your perspective.

984
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:37,160
Speaker 3: I mean, if you support the government becoming more limited,

985
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:42,840
Speaker 3: relatively limited, then Russ's is definitely less dangerous because Elon

986
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:46,879
Speaker 3: is more of like a crony capitalist than like rest

987
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 3: is an opponent of crony capitalism, like ideologically. So we'll

988
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:51,279
Speaker 3: see where that.

989
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,760
Speaker 4: Goes, Yes we will. And we touched on this briefly

990
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:59,440
Speaker 4: while Rocana was here. But the news that broke during

991
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 4: the show is that Representative Jerry Connolly of Virginia has

992
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:09,360
Speaker 4: has died of cancer. This will create a special election,

993
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:14,440
Speaker 4: It'll give Republicans one extra vote cushion as they're pushing

994
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:18,359
Speaker 4: through their big, beautiful bill. But on on a personal level,

995
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:23,920
Speaker 4: you know, Connolly took a lot of heats for despite

996
00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:30,040
Speaker 4: facing cancer running for terminal cancer turned out to be terminal.

997
00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:32,759
Speaker 4: He thought he was going to beat it the top

998
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:35,800
Speaker 4: position on the community. It was a bad it was

999
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:40,000
Speaker 4: a bad prognosis and not being up to the task.

1000
00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:44,880
Speaker 4: And I think he deserved, deserved, you know, criticism for that,

1001
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:48,040
Speaker 4: you know, mis misreading that moment. I have a soft

1002
00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:50,359
Speaker 4: spot for him. He was elected in two thousand and eight,

1003
00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:54,439
Speaker 4: so he came in in this There were two big

1004
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:56,759
Speaker 4: waves of Democrats that came in in two thousand and

1005
00:50:56,800 --> 00:50:59,040
Speaker 4: six and then again in two thousand and eight, and

1006
00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:02,600
Speaker 4: both those classes, you know, were a big part of

1007
00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 4: the two thousand and nine and ten Obama rush of

1008
00:51:07,480 --> 00:51:11,880
Speaker 4: legislation which created the CFPB, the Affordable Care Act, and

1009
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 4: on on and so he was he was always in

1010
00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,920
Speaker 4: the speaker's lobby. Uh and he I think to his

1011
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:22,879
Speaker 4: dying days almost which means that he was out out

1012
00:51:23,040 --> 00:51:26,080
Speaker 4: off of the floor, just hamming it up with reporters,

1013
00:51:26,160 --> 00:51:32,959
Speaker 4: always willing to be transparent about where he was giving

1014
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:37,600
Speaker 4: good quotes, giving and also given given good intel and

1015
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:40,120
Speaker 4: you know, he just represents a it was a swing

1016
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:42,600
Speaker 4: district at the time. Now it's a little bit more democratic,

1017
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:46,240
Speaker 4: So it's not like he was Democratic Socialist of America champion,

1018
00:51:47,560 --> 00:51:51,560
Speaker 4: but he was well liked and a charming guy. Like

1019
00:51:51,640 --> 00:51:54,719
Speaker 4: he came up just a machine politician, like he was

1020
00:51:55,160 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 4: Fairfax board of Supervisors for you know, decade and that

1021
00:52:00,120 --> 00:52:03,400
Speaker 4: decade plus and then member of Congress. Like you know,

1022
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:06,080
Speaker 4: he's not not not upbending politics, but as far as

1023
00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:09,560
Speaker 4: like a machine politician goes a good guy and it's.

1024
00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 11: A you know, so.

1025
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:13,080
Speaker 4: You know he'll be he'll be missed on.

1026
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:17,200
Speaker 3: That level that people have friendly memories of of him,

1027
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,160
Speaker 3: certainly that people have shared those machine politicians, many of

1028
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:22,479
Speaker 3: them dudes. They're they're very nice.

1029
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:26,600
Speaker 4: That's why they're successful, backslapp and they love the chicken dinners.

1030
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:29,640
Speaker 3: Yeah they do. They're super extroverted people, gregarious.

1031
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:29,960
Speaker 6: Yeah.

1032
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:36,080
Speaker 4: So he was also Jamal Kashoggi's representative, and I was

1033
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 4: always grateful for him to him for raising the alarm

1034
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:42,839
Speaker 4: before we knew that he was that Kashogi had been killed.

1035
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:45,960
Speaker 4: He was because he went into the consulate and I

1036
00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:49,160
Speaker 4: heard immediately, like you from people close it was his

1037
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 4: fiance were like, he hasn't come out, and so there

1038
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:54,839
Speaker 4: was about a week where there was still some hope

1039
00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:56,520
Speaker 4: that he was alive and there could be enough pressure

1040
00:52:56,560 --> 00:52:58,640
Speaker 4: put on Saudi Arabia that he would be released. That

1041
00:52:58,760 --> 00:53:01,239
Speaker 4: we didn't know at the time he'd been killed right

1042
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:06,600
Speaker 4: there in the consolate, but Connolly was outspoken in real time,

1043
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:09,840
Speaker 4: so that was I credit him for that.

1044
00:53:11,239 --> 00:53:13,239
Speaker 3: Who's back on the show tomorrow? Ryn? Are you here

1045
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:15,960
Speaker 3: with Crystal? Yes? Great, something to look forward to. And

1046
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:17,320
Speaker 3: I think it's just you and me on the Friday

1047
00:53:17,360 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 3: Show this week.

1048
00:53:18,040 --> 00:53:20,640
Speaker 4: That sounds right, all right, Well, plenty more, we'll get

1049
00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:21,839
Speaker 4: a special guests or something.

1050
00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:26,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's we couldn't it's Soccer's baby, just the baby,

1051
00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:31,239
Speaker 3: not Soccer, just the Yeah, that's right, all right, we'll

1052
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:33,080
Speaker 3: stick around for that. Breaking Points dot Com if you

1053
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:34,840
Speaker 3: want to see the second half of the Friday Shows.

1054
00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:37,080
Speaker 3: You get the show in your inbox early every day,

1055
00:53:37,280 --> 00:53:39,279
Speaker 3: so make sure to subscribe there if you can. If

1056
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:41,279
Speaker 3: you can't, just make sure to subscribe. We appreciate it

1057
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 3: very much, and Ryan and Crystal will see you back

1058
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:43,880
Speaker 3: here tomorrow.

1059
00:53:44,080 --> 00:53:44,360
Speaker 4: See that