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Speaker 1: Previously on Whedian House.

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Speaker 2: You know, I was a grieving brother, but I had

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Speaker 2: no sort of focus at the time. I was mostly

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Speaker 2: just like, Okay, I want to do this for Meli.

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Speaker 2: We need to continue to tell the narrative in the

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Speaker 2: story of Meli. And then as time went on, it

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Speaker 2: was like, well, I need to go out there and

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Speaker 2: get involved because I think what was important is talking

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Speaker 2: to people like you and other leaders in the community

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Speaker 2: and other organizers. I come to realize that, like all

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Speaker 2: of this stuff is connected, so.

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Speaker 1: I think people need to start giving people like me

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Speaker 1: a chance. I'm looking for work right now.

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Speaker 3: I'm struggling to you know, even pay rent, and with

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Speaker 3: the cost of living, it's getting worse.

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Speaker 1: They're increasing my rent every.

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Speaker 3: Month at the place where I was put in and

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Speaker 3: it becomes very difficult to make ends meet.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to Whedian House, Happy New Year.

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Speaker 3: I'm your host, Theo Henderson, and we have an exciting

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Speaker 3: special guest on the show today, two former Black Panther activists.

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Speaker 3: But first on House News. A recent Los Angeles audit

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Speaker 3: shows very few on house transitioned from temporary to permitted housing,

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Speaker 3: wasteful spending of two hundred and eighteen million dollars could

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Speaker 3: have aided the unhoused into permanent housing. The audit also

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Speaker 3: found gaps in how the city tracks funding and distributes resources.

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Speaker 3: There's a lack of support for those who leave temporary housing,

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Speaker 3: which just feeds the cycle of housing insecurity. What would

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Speaker 3: our city look like if they had taken the two

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Speaker 3: hundred and eighteen million dollars and put it toward permitted

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Speaker 3: housing instead of empty pr initiatives and hostile architecture. Long

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Speaker 3: term problems cannot be solved with short term solutions. Story more,

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Speaker 3: older unhoused residents are freezing to death in California. In

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty three, one hundred and sixty six Californians died

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Speaker 3: from hypothermia. That's doubles the number in twenty fifteen. There

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Speaker 3: has been a link between houselessness and cold weather. Federal

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Speaker 3: data shows more than two thirds of Sacramento unhouse are

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Speaker 3: susceptible to inclement weather. Older adults fifty five plus are

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Speaker 3: more susceptible and account for three quarters of hypothermia deaths.

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Speaker 3: What can we do as a society to push the

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Speaker 3: issue to our city leaders and our state leaders? The

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Speaker 3: answer is more warming centers and more permanent support of

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Speaker 3: housing options.

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Speaker 1: And that's in House News.

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Speaker 3: When we come back, we'll speak with organizers and former

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Speaker 3: Black Panthers Lorenzo and Janina Irban. Welcome back to Wiedian House.

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Speaker 3: We have a special treat to start out twenty twenty

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Speaker 3: five with the upcoming inauguration of a very problematic president

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Speaker 3: as well as the upcoming holidays celebrating the life of

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Speaker 3: doctor Martin Luther King. It is my honor to introduce

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Speaker 3: two former Black Panther community members sharing their experiences from

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Speaker 3: the past to the president. We have two former Black

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Speaker 3: Panther as well as two active civil rights or human

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Speaker 3: rights activists on the scene today and I'm going to

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Speaker 3: read a little bit of their synopsis on who they are.

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Speaker 3: This is no way includes the extensive actions and activists

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Speaker 3: activities that they are doing even today. Joanninah Abron Irvin

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Speaker 3: is an activist, author and retired educator. Her work includes

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Speaker 3: a campaign to end the naked jailing of black men

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Speaker 3: in Kalamazoo, Michigan. She is a former editor of the

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Speaker 3: Black Panther newspaper, an author of the book Driven by

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Speaker 3: the Movement. Activists of the Black Power era a retired

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Speaker 3: Western Michigan University Associate professor of communication. She has published

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Speaker 3: several articles about the Black Panther Party and the Black

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Speaker 3: Panther Era. Our next guest, Lorenzo Comboa Irvin is an

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Speaker 3: American writer, activist, and black anarchist. He is a former

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Speaker 3: member of SNICK, the Black Panther Party, and Concerned Citizens

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Speaker 3: for Justice. Following an attempt to frame him on weapon

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Speaker 3: charges and for threatening the life of a Ku Klux

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Speaker 3: Klan member or leader, Irvin hijacked a playing to Cuba

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Speaker 3: in February nineteen sixty nine. While in Cuba and letter

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Speaker 3: in Czechoslovakia, Irvin grew dissolusion with the authoritarianism of state socialism.

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Speaker 3: Captured by the CIA in Eastern Europe, he was extradited

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Speaker 3: to the US, put on trial and sentenced to life

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Speaker 3: in prison in nineteen seventy He was introduced to anarchism

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Speaker 3: while in prison, inspiring him to write Anarchism and the

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Speaker 3: Black Revolution in nineteen seventy nine. Released after fifteen years,

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Speaker 3: Irvin remains politically active. I dare say yo all night

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Speaker 3: as well. I want to thank you very much for

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Speaker 3: coming on the show. I understand you have a very

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Speaker 3: busy itinerary, and I want you just start off with

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Speaker 3: the softball questions. Tell us a little bit more about yourselves,

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Speaker 3: and I will start if you don't mind, Janina, and

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Speaker 3: then I.

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Speaker 1: Will take it to you. Lorenzo Well I.

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Speaker 4: Was born in Tennessee that I grew up in Jefferson City, Missouri,

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Speaker 4: capital city of Missouri. I am the oldest of three

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Speaker 4: daughters of a United Methodist minister and a music teacher.

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Speaker 1: I was a PK preacher's kid. Preacher's kid.

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Speaker 4: Grew up in Jefferson City, Missouri, you know, in the

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Speaker 4: nineteen fifties and in the nineteen sixties, when I was

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Speaker 4: eight year years old, I had been attending segregated schools

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Speaker 4: for kindergarten, first grade, and second grade. But by the

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Speaker 4: time I was ready for third grade, Brown versus Board

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Speaker 4: of Education had been ruled on by the Supreme Court,

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Speaker 4: So you know, I started going to integrated schools, although

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Speaker 4: I didn't really understand what that meant because I was

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Speaker 4: just a kid, you know, I didn't really know no

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Speaker 4: know what all that was about. I grew up during

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Speaker 4: that period of the Civil Rights era, when you know,

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Speaker 4: doctor King and other people were marching and protesting, so

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Speaker 4: I would, you know, I'd see that on television. I

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Speaker 4: would watch the news with my parents and all. That

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Speaker 4: was of a great interest to me. And I think

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Speaker 4: that one of the things that really influenced me at

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Speaker 4: an early age was to see little kids in Birmingham,

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Speaker 4: Alabama who were, you know, protesting segregation. They were attacked

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Speaker 4: by you know, barking dogs and you know, fireholes with

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Speaker 4: water coming out. And it caught my attention because some

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Speaker 4: of these kids were really very young and I'm I'm

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Speaker 4: ten years older than my youngest sister and some of

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Speaker 4: them were like four and five years old like she

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Speaker 4: was at the time, and I'm like, wow, it blew

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Speaker 4: my mind to see little kids like that out there

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Speaker 4: doing that, and it just I think that was probably

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Speaker 4: it really inspired me because I thought, wow, you know,

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Speaker 4: here I am. You know, I was fifteen at the time.

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Speaker 4: I thought, well, these little kids can do that, then

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Speaker 4: you know, there must be things that I can do.

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Speaker 4: And I think one of the next things that really,

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Speaker 4: I guess kind of radicalized me was by the time

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Speaker 4: I got to college, doctor King was assassinated near the

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Speaker 4: end of my sophomore year. Was halfway through college, and

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Speaker 4: you know, it radicalized a lot of young black people

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Speaker 4: like me. My only own feeling was, well, you know,

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Speaker 4: he was supposed to be, as they called him, me

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Speaker 4: apostle nonviolence. But here he is murdered, you know, shot

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Speaker 4: to death, shot down. And so I said, you know,

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Speaker 4: as soon as I can get involved in the black struggle,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to. So after I graduated from college, went

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Speaker 4: to graduate school, I did join the Black Panther Party

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Speaker 4: in Detroit, Michigan. I saw that the Black Panther Party

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Speaker 4: was an organization that was doing something about freedom and

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Speaker 4: liberation and black people. The first time I saw the

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Speaker 4: Black Panther Party, however, had been on television and when

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Speaker 4: they were protesting here in California, in Sacramento, when they

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Speaker 4: were doing away with the law that allowed people to

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Speaker 4: carry guns. Of course, the Black Panther believed in armed

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Speaker 4: self defense, and the police hated that, so they got

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Speaker 4: the state legislature to.

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Speaker 1: Pass the law.

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Speaker 4: That's the first time I saw them on television protesting

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Speaker 4: up in Sacramento. This was May of nineteen sixty seven,

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Speaker 4: and I was only about eighteen, nineteen years old then,

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Speaker 4: and I'm gonna be honest, my first reaction to that

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Speaker 4: was these people are crazy. You know that these black

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Speaker 4: people are crazy, then I can be able to walk

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Speaker 4: into the legislature, which is mostly white, and do this.

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Speaker 4: I thought they were totally nuts. But as time went on,

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Speaker 4: I learned what the Black Panther Party was doing.

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Speaker 1: I learned how they were.

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Speaker 4: Feeding children breakfast programs, and they were fighting for our liberation.

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Speaker 4: So I did ultimately join the Black Panther Party.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Jo Nina. Mister Lorenzo, you tell us a

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Speaker 1: little bit about yourself.

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Speaker 5: Well, I'm originally from Chattanooga, Tennessee. As you pointed out,

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Speaker 5: and just as you're and I to talk about. I

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Speaker 5: was influenced by the Civil Rights movement. But what I

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Speaker 5: was influenced by was the student led movement that erupted

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Speaker 5: in nineteen sixty And at the time, I might have

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Speaker 5: been twelve years old, and I was in the student

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Speaker 5: or youth in ACP chapter that you know, the group

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Speaker 5: except didn't do a lot, and the NACP as a

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Speaker 5: whole didn't do anything. I was very conservative, but the

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Speaker 5: city ins came to Chattanooga from Nashville and the city

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Speaker 5: in movement. The students at the local black high school

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Speaker 5: had a march and a rally downtown where they took

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Speaker 5: over the department stores. Now, my cousin was a little

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Speaker 5: older than I was named Curtis, and he was one

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Speaker 5: of the student leaders, and through him, you know, I

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Speaker 5: got a lot of the you know, the real history

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Speaker 5: of how this struggle went down in Chattanooga, because the

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Speaker 5: students themselves led the movement. They weren't influenced by the

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Speaker 5: advocates of pacifism and all this sort of stuff that

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Speaker 5: you get smacked in the mouth or hit in the

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Speaker 5: mouth and you turn the other cheek and just sit

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Speaker 5: there and take it. Well, when it happened in Chattanooga,

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Speaker 5: the students came and they sat down at the department

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Speaker 5: store of lunch Counts, they you know, demanded be services

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Speaker 5: like everybody else, and white racist hooligans jumped out and

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Speaker 5: started hitting people. What they didn't realize that these people

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Speaker 5: were going to hit back, and they jumped up and

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Speaker 5: started beating them and mopped the floor up with them.

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Speaker 5: And this was a five intended party store, that's right,

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Speaker 5: the Survive and ten department store, and they picked up

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Speaker 5: everything that was at hand, you know, mops, wrenches, everything else,

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Speaker 5: and was beating them with beating them bloody, and so

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Speaker 5: the cops came in and had to save them from

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Speaker 5: being beaten to death, I suppose, you know. And for me,

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Speaker 5: the younger kids in the communities, we marched from another

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Speaker 5: end of town, from the downtown sector and from the

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Speaker 5: West side, which was you know, one of the large

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Speaker 5: downtown communities at that time, and people were trying to

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Speaker 5: converge in the center of the city. And this actually

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Speaker 5: was the first time they used high pressure water hoses,

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Speaker 5: not Birmingham, before Birmingham, three years before Birmingham. This is

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Speaker 5: his hisity. And they shot high pressure water hoses. They

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Speaker 5: loosed police dogs to try to bite people or drive

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Speaker 5: them back. They had the cops throwing tear gas bombs

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Speaker 5: at people, and this was going on all day. You know,

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Speaker 5: we were trying to get into town. You know, we

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Speaker 5: did get into town at some time, but they kept

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Speaker 5: us so we couldn't get in on this fighting that

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Speaker 5: was taking place. You know, That's what's what they were

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Speaker 5: trying to do, and that's what they did. Well. Now,

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Speaker 5: this is a Southern city, a racist Southern city, you know,

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Speaker 5: to be quite honest, and the Ku Klux Klan was

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Speaker 5: very active in this time. But they were scared to

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Speaker 5: death to see black people of all ages resisting police

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Speaker 5: terrorism and itching to fight them, and so they arrested

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Speaker 5: the black students, but then they hurriedly released them, and

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Speaker 5: they shut the department's store down so that they wouldn't

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Speaker 5: be further conflict. And then by the time people got

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Speaker 5: to town and so forth, everything was over, you know,

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Speaker 5: but this continue for days. You know, you had these

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Speaker 5: young black men come in, women as well, sisters as well,

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Speaker 5: sit in and demanded to be served, and of course

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Speaker 5: the they wouldn't serve them. Then the owner come out

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Speaker 5: and he tell, well, why are you people here. Well,

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Speaker 5: you know, good and well, you're not supposed to get

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Speaker 5: fled in this city here, u this is the South,

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Speaker 5: and we don't cotton to any kind of uh uh

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Speaker 5: you know, integration. We're not going to integrate. We're not

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Speaker 5: going to give you service. So he said, well, we'll

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Speaker 5: be here until you do. Well, we don't deserve negroes anyway,

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Speaker 5: he said, well we don't need them, so that's okay.

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Speaker 5: We'll we'll be until you serve us some real food

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Speaker 5: and so, uh, you know this kind of stuff. We'd

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Speaker 5: go on and after the rebellion though that scared every

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Speaker 5: everyone in the authority, including the federal government, and they

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Speaker 5: call themselves going to send negotiators down and all this

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Speaker 5: kind of stuff on behalf of the students, and they

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Speaker 5: got the black pastors and so forth to you know,

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Speaker 5: to do a song and dance to try to you know,

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Speaker 5: stop the students from protesting and drive them out of downtown,

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Speaker 5: present them from coming. And of course the guy who's

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Speaker 5: headed in a CP time and also the principal of

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Speaker 5: the high school where the student protesters came from, he

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Speaker 5: engaged in mass suspensions of as many students he could.

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Speaker 5: But none of that worked. What they tried to do,

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Speaker 5: and what they often they did, is they made concessions.

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Speaker 5: They allowed black people to come down there and eat

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Speaker 5: at the department stores. They stopped a lot of segregation

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Speaker 5: in terms of the movie theaters. Black people could attend

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Speaker 5: the movie theaters and so forth and so on. And

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Speaker 5: as time went by, they you know, all the open

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Speaker 5: trappings of racial segregation were being eliminated. Allegedly, it was

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Speaker 5: still a racist town. Black people had no political power,

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Speaker 5: and they were still being subjected to police terrorism, police killings.

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Speaker 5: And in fact, when I came out of prison. This

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Speaker 5: is another tale part of it. Chattanooga, Tennessee had the

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Speaker 5: largest number of police killings in the country of any

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Speaker 5: city under two hundred thousand, and that's an official statistic.

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Speaker 5: You know, at that time, when I came out in

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Speaker 5: nineteen eighty three, the mayor was an FBI agent. Now

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Speaker 5: I have not found anywhere else a situation where the

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Speaker 5: mayor himself was an FBI agent. But as I said,

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Speaker 5: that's another part of the story. But in my formative stages,

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Speaker 5: this is what set me on the path to revolution

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Speaker 5: and to being a political organizer, a black political organizer,

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Speaker 5: a radical black political organizer in the South, and then

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Speaker 5: you know, in other parts of the country and eventually

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Speaker 5: having the reach to you know, to reach people in

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Speaker 5: other countries. You know, I've been to quite a few

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Speaker 5: countries in the last i don't know, twenty five thirty

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Speaker 5: years that I never would have had the chance to

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Speaker 5: go to. And I've been able to spread the same

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Speaker 5: message and talk about the racism. And so when talk

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Speaker 5: about fascism, then I don't consider myself some textbook authority,

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Speaker 5: but I do say that I have practical experience that

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Speaker 5: I can, you know, give to the next generation, and

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Speaker 5: having been in the Black Panther Party and having been

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Speaker 5: exposed to the ideas in the Black Panther Party, especially

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Speaker 5: the ideas around fascism. You know, when I first came

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Speaker 5: out of the army and came back home and got

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Speaker 5: involved with first SNICK, the Student I Violent Coordinating Committee

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Speaker 5: that was one of the field organizers, an anti war trainer,

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Speaker 5: you know, training people to how to resist the war,

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Speaker 5: how to resist the draft, and so forth. That went

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Speaker 5: on for some time. Then a merger between the Student

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Speaker 5: nine Violent Coordinating Committee and SNICK took place in nineteen

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Speaker 5: sixty seven through sixty nine, and at that time I

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Speaker 5: went into the Black Panther Party. Well, all I managed

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Speaker 5: to do basically do this period would sell newspapers and

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Speaker 5: you know, give speeches. And in one instance, a brother

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Speaker 5: was killed at a department store where I worked at

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Speaker 5: and we organized a protest campaign and the racist that

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Speaker 5: shot him was driven out of that store. They he

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Speaker 5: couldn't come back to work at that store, and all

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Speaker 5: this sort of and it created a citywide protest movement.

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Speaker 5: There were five major so called racial rebellions, black people

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Speaker 5: resisting particular racist attacks in Chattanooga from nineteen sixty to

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Speaker 5: nineteen eighty. This was caused by as I said, well

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Speaker 5: in nineteen eighty, this is going to give you an example.

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Speaker 5: In nineteen eighty, the ku Klux Klan came and in

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Speaker 5: the black community, drove through the black community, the downtown

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Speaker 5: sector and shot at black people, and they shot and

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Speaker 5: injured battlely five black women. And it caused rebay and

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Speaker 5: especially when the officials were giving protection to the white supremacists.

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Speaker 5: They gave him free lawyers and put them in protective

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Speaker 5: custody at the city hall. Believe it or not. So

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Speaker 5: people were outraged and they had a rebey and it

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Speaker 5: was so heavy that the largest black housing project it

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Speaker 5: was in South Chattanooga, and in that housing project, these

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Speaker 5: young men had come out of Kuwait and they had

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Speaker 5: an armed resistance to that incident and the kodly Madi

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Speaker 5: calling by the city government and its officials openly you know,

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Speaker 5: racist and pastious. That was one of the things that

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Speaker 5: you know, took me to the next stage.

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Speaker 3: Well, thank you very much for bringing a lot of

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Speaker 3: interesting points that we will revisit. But I want to

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Speaker 3: jump back to Janina and I wanted to ask you

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Speaker 3: in your biography it stated that you stood up against

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Speaker 3: the forces of the dehumanization of black males incarcerated.

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Speaker 1: Can you tell us a little bit about that.

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Speaker 4: Well, this took place in Kalamazoo, Michigan, where I was

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Speaker 4: teaching journalism at Western Michigan University. And it was probably

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Speaker 4: September of nineteen, nineteen ninety nine, yep. And there's a

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Speaker 4: front page article and it had been it was an

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Speaker 4: interview with the black man who said that he had

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Speaker 4: been arrested. He said it was racial profiling and he

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Speaker 4: had been arrested for his resisting arrest when the police

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Speaker 4: stopped him and stripped of all his clothes and put

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Speaker 4: in jail naked. And this was on the front page.

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Speaker 4: It was the front page headline. And of course you

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Speaker 4: can imagine this was quite a controversy at the time,

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Speaker 4: you know. And I read about it, of course in

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Speaker 4: the paper. I said, wow, you know, you would not

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Speaker 4: think something like this would happen in a little college

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Speaker 4: town like Kalamazoo, Michigan. You know, I was kind of surprised,

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Speaker 4: but it did. And Lorenzo at the time was still

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Speaker 4: living in Chattanooga. He had come up to visit me

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Speaker 4: in Michigan. And he was saying with Joe nine, and

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Speaker 4: you know, you were in the Black Panther Party. You know,

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Speaker 4: you know how to organize against police terror, and you

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Speaker 4: need to get something going here.

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Speaker 1: There has to be a movement to stop this.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 4: I didn't really want to hear that at the time

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Speaker 4: because I hadn't done any organizing for a long period

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Speaker 4: of time. You know, I had come there to teach,

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Speaker 4: and I was a single parent, I was raising a daughter,

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Speaker 4: and I thought, wow, you know I don't I can't

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Speaker 4: do this. I haven't done anything like this in years.

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Speaker 4: And Lorenzo kept after me. He says, you know how

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Speaker 4: to do this, you were in the Black Panther Party.

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Speaker 4: And he wasn't gonna let up on me. He did

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Speaker 4: not let upon me. So I went to a Kalamazoo

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Speaker 4: City Commission meeting and I spoke out against this, that

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Speaker 4: you know, this naked jailing of black men, and you

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Speaker 4: know it. What happened was it came out other black

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Speaker 4: men went to the media and saying that the same

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Speaker 4: thing had happened to them when they had been put

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Speaker 4: in jail, to the Kalamazoo County jail either if they

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Speaker 4: weren't stripped totally naked, they were at least partially stripped.

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Speaker 1: So I went to the.

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Speaker 4: City Commission, spoke out about it, and people began contacting me.

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Speaker 4: So we started what was called the Southwest Coalition against

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Speaker 4: Racism and Police Brutality. Lorenzo actually wrote a pamphlet for

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Speaker 4: the campaign. We detailed the cases of the different uh

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Speaker 4: men who had been either stripped, naked or partially naked.

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Speaker 4: That what was it called the Naked Jailings of Kalamazoo.

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Speaker 4: He wrote the pamphlet. And you know, this coalition was

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Speaker 4: a multiracial coalition. We just began working and campaigning to

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Speaker 4: get this practice. Stop this this naked generally of black men.

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Speaker 4: And the university where I taught, of course, was a

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Speaker 4: predominantly white university, but many of the white professors were

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Speaker 4: outraged about this. How can you put people in jail naked?

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Speaker 4: You know, there was a lot of a lot of

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Speaker 4: outrage about it. So we basically had about a three

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Speaker 4: year campaign. We had protests, marches in I guess April

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Speaker 4: of two thousand, we had a march and a protests

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Speaker 4: through you know, downtown Caluma Zoo and we were told

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Speaker 4: that this had been that was the first time that

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Speaker 4: there had ever been a protest against police brutality in

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Speaker 4: Kalami Zoo. I mean it's a small town. There was

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Speaker 4: only about sixty thousand people. It's grown since then.

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Speaker 3: I finished my undergraduate in Grand Rapids, Michigan, so passed

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Speaker 3: through Kalumba Zoo many times.

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Speaker 1: So, yep, you know about Calumni Zoo. That's right.

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Speaker 3: Well that's also a song they got a Girl in Kalaumusuo.

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Speaker 3: What that's a difference.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I never heard of Kalama Zoo.

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Speaker 4: My daughter, who likes to watch old movies, she said,

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Speaker 4: you don't know about that song.

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Speaker 1: I got a girl in Kalamazoo, and you know he

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Speaker 1: brought it on the map.

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Speaker 4: So that's another story. But we had this organized, this

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Speaker 4: marching protest in April of two thousand and we weren't

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Speaker 4: sure anybody was going to come because it had snowed

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Speaker 4: the day before and it can snow really heavily in Kalamazoo.

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Speaker 4: But the next day it was sunny and bright and

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Speaker 4: the snow was melting. So we just started in the

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Speaker 4: start of the march in the black community of Kalamazoo,

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Speaker 4: and you know, people saw us and it came outside.

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Speaker 1: And they joined. They joined the march.

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Speaker 4: People were really outraged about this, about black men being

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Speaker 4: put in jail naked, and they joined the march. And

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Speaker 4: we went to downtown and we had a rally on

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Speaker 4: the steps of City Hall. The brother who had been

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Speaker 4: the first one to expose this, he spoke. Of course,

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Speaker 4: he was harassed by the police unmercifully because he had

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Speaker 4: done this, but he spoke, and other people spoke, and

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Speaker 4: you know, we began, we began building this movement. I'm

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Speaker 4: not going to tell you that police terror and Callum

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Speaker 4: was Zoo ended, but one thing we know is that

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Speaker 4: the uh, the naked jailing, at least they stopped that,

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Speaker 4: at least for a good period of time. The police

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Speaker 4: chief was forced to resign. Our campaign was so intensive

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Speaker 4: that we forced the police chief to resign from his post.

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Speaker 4: That was something that you know, I didn't expect, because

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Speaker 4: I didn't expect anything like that would happen in a

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Speaker 4: place like Calum was Zoo. You might think about it

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Speaker 4: happening in la or Chicago or New York. In fact,

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Speaker 4: they did have some naked jillings in New York City,

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Speaker 4: but they never had a campaign like we had that

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Speaker 4: actually just systematically organized and held marches and rallies and protests.

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Speaker 4: At one point, they were going to create some kind

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Speaker 4: of commission to deal with you know, police terror, police

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Speaker 4: brutality in Kalum and Zoo, and they invited me, as

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Speaker 4: the chairperson of the Southwest Michigan Coalition Against Racism and

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Speaker 4: Police Brutality, to join that. But I refuse because once

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Speaker 4: you join these kind of official commissions and everything, you know,

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Speaker 4: your voice becomes music because you become kind of part

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Speaker 4: of the system. So we never joined We never joined it.

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Speaker 4: We just kept on doing what we did.

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Speaker 3: We'll be right back with more from Lorenzo and Janina.

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Speaker 3: Welcome back. This is THEO Henderson with Leedian House. Let's

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Speaker 3: continue our discussion with community organizers and former Black Panthers

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Speaker 3: Lorenzo and Janina Irvin. Before I delve deeper into the past,

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Speaker 3: I want to bring us back to the current reality here.

432
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:54,240
Speaker 3: Have any of you heard of about Grant's past?

433
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:55,000
Speaker 4: No?

434
00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:57,120
Speaker 3: Prior to I have any of you guys have heard

435
00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:02,199
Speaker 3: about forty one to eighteen. No, okay, so allow me

436
00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:04,919
Speaker 3: to give a little crash course. I'm going to be

437
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:08,600
Speaker 3: just touching the highlights because it's a very exhaustive kind

438
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 3: of thing, but it interlinks what's going on in the past.

439
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:14,280
Speaker 3: So I'm going to start off for forty one eighteen.

440
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:19,679
Speaker 3: Forty one eighteen in short, is the current Jim Crow

441
00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 3: of now. It is stated very clearly it is against

442
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:28,920
Speaker 3: the law for a person to sit, sleep, or stand

443
00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,439
Speaker 3: or be anywhere near a sign that they are not

444
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:37,159
Speaker 3: allowed to be. It is aimed at unhoused people, particularly

445
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:40,240
Speaker 3: in Los Angeles. There is a large swath of unhoused

446
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,240
Speaker 3: peoples that are black. As you probably know, unhoused people

447
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:46,359
Speaker 3: that are black men and women and children. But most

448
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:50,480
Speaker 3: importantly there has been recently incarcerated black men that have

449
00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:54,440
Speaker 3: had to juggle this legislation. To put a finer point

450
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:56,520
Speaker 3: on it, it is like, for example, if you see

451
00:25:56,520 --> 00:26:00,400
Speaker 3: a special enforcement zone or a sign stating that if

452
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:03,840
Speaker 3: the person is not allowed to be there, they can

453
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,200
Speaker 3: be arrested, they can be incarcerated, they can be a

454
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 3: victim of all of the type of Charcole type of

455
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:13,920
Speaker 3: solutions that harken back into the fifties and sixties. So

456
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 3: to I say this to and let people know, because

457
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 3: there is a housing an unhoused crisis that's going across

458
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:24,919
Speaker 3: this country now in order to counteract what forty one

459
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:29,200
Speaker 3: eighteen was was supposed to be a temporary salve, because

460
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 3: activists got when of these kind of car through actions

461
00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 3: that were happening to unhouse people. They were tearing orizing them,

462
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:41,640
Speaker 3: tearing up their belongings, important papers, finding reasons to incarcerate

463
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 3: them or create a situation. For example, if you have

464
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 3: your own personal belongings and your own home or your

465
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,680
Speaker 3: own section, they give you a certain time period to

466
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,639
Speaker 3: collect them, and if you do not do it in

467
00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:59,640
Speaker 3: enough time, they can arrest you. Now, let's say, for example,

468
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 3: you rush and get as much as you possibly can,

469
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:06,120
Speaker 3: and then they put a yellow tape on it. Now

470
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,520
Speaker 3: you can be arrested for disturbing the tape and stealing

471
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:15,959
Speaker 3: your own stuff that is legalized in this city. And

472
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 3: I say this because also a quicker point was that

473
00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 3: we had Martin versus Boise. The Circuit court had forcefully

474
00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:26,040
Speaker 3: stated it is against the law, it's cruel and unusual

475
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 3: punishment to demonize and dehumanize people that are vulnerable in

476
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 3: the city. You cannot just arrest people or just make

477
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,080
Speaker 3: their life a live in hell for simply trying to exist,

478
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 3: simply trying to say the human body has to rest.

479
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 3: Nobody walks twenty four hours, that you have to have

480
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:47,199
Speaker 3: a point to sit down, you have to rest, you

481
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:50,160
Speaker 3: have to sleep, and to do that, to go out

482
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 3: of your way to continually have a legislation or law

483
00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,080
Speaker 3: on the books to terrorize people at whim at will,

484
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 3: it's dehumanizing and against the law. Now we enter Grant's

485
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 3: pass and Grant's pass overrides the.

486
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:08,000
Speaker 1: Cruel and unusual punishment.

487
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 3: It was released earlier in July of twenty twenty four.

488
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:16,359
Speaker 3: The six Conservative Supreme Court justices says it is not

489
00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:20,360
Speaker 3: cruel and unusual punishment to target unhoused people, and as

490
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 3: a result of fact, that has sparked a wave of

491
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:29,400
Speaker 3: legislations across the country from San Francisco now in San

492
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:32,040
Speaker 3: fran Monica. It is against the law for you to

493
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:36,520
Speaker 3: have a pillow or blanket. Now, you know, unhus people

494
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,680
Speaker 3: going to need usually use different things because it's cold

495
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 3: to night. I don't know if you know, like last night,

496
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 3: it's reason and so if you were caught with a

497
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 3: blanket or a pillow, that's justifications to be banned, taken

498
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 3: and arrested. And as you as well as I know,

499
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:59,520
Speaker 3: the most people that are usually affected economically financially and

500
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 3: their homes, houses are taking or they're being targeted, are.

501
00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 1: Usually people of color that are unhoused.

502
00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 3: Now to say that other communities are not, yes, that's true,

503
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 3: they are. But there is always a focused slant with

504
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 3: spirticularly with gentrification on the rise, the exploding rents, and

505
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 3: it's particularly here in Los Angeles where the gentrification is

506
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 3: starting to creep down in South La Crenshaw area. You

507
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 3: notice they're sprucing up the places. There's a way of

508
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 3: unhoused people and grants passed. Is the impectus to utilize

509
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 3: and to steamroll people's there. Now, there are communities like

510
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 3: when you guys did what we call today mutual aid,

511
00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 3: when you guys feeding, we have mutual a kind of

512
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,520
Speaker 3: things now to it's like you know, a band aid

513
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 3: on a broken leg. But the fact of it is

514
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 3: is there is a huge hunger crisis as well. There

515
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 3: is higher unhoused elderly people. In this conversation doesn't always

516
00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 3: get advanced and house elderly black.

517
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:02,200
Speaker 1: People that are out here on the streets.

518
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:04,560
Speaker 3: And I'm not talking about like you know, I'm not

519
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:09,719
Speaker 3: saying I'm elderly, but I'm talking about seventy eighty ninety

520
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:13,120
Speaker 3: years old. The oldest that I've known was eighty nine

521
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:16,800
Speaker 3: years old. So I know many of my grandparents' generation

522
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 3: are out here because of the exploding rents. They cannot

523
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 3: they're dealing with medication, they're dealing with advanced health issues.

524
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 1: Like you know, we were joking about some of our things.

525
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 3: But you know, you can't make them get a job

526
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 3: eighty nine years old to be able to get back

527
00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 3: a house. You cannot tell them that they all are

528
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 3: on substances. Then you can't say that they're all mentally ill.

529
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 3: It's that these are natural laws. These are natural progressions

530
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 3: of a systematic failure. So I put to you, after

531
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 3: this long explanation, what do you suggest for the new

532
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:54,920
Speaker 3: activists that are coming up. What would be some of

533
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,800
Speaker 3: the solutions just off the top of your head that

534
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 3: you could think of that would bring life or try

535
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 3: to help get other people involved into the movement or

536
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 3: try to get them to care.

537
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 5: Well, let me say this, first of all, all of

538
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:15,720
Speaker 5: this homeless crisis, a houseless crisis, can be put at

539
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,400
Speaker 5: the feet of the government. I think there was a

540
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 5: failure to have had massive demonstrations, civil rights demonstrations, whatever.

541
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 5: Years ago, it would have helped us at this point.

542
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 5: But we've reached this stage with a new generation of activists,

543
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:35,600
Speaker 5: not to say, a new generation of houseless people. People.

544
00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 5: Some people have died on the street. We know all

545
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:43,200
Speaker 5: these things, and the only way we ever get anything,

546
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 5: any kind of social or political justice, is we fight

547
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 5: in the street. We struggle in the streets. We struggle

548
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 5: in front of the rich people's palaces, we struggle in

549
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 5: front of the government buildings. We have never gotten anything,

550
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 5: any single thing that didn't require struggle. We've never been

551
00:32:02,600 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 5: given anything by this government. In fact, the so calls constitution,

552
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 5: the sections of it that really matter, the Bill of

553
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 5: Rights were created as a result of a social struggle,

554
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:19,719
Speaker 5: almost another revolution, just to get the Bill of Rights.

555
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 5: And then of course the civil rights provisions from after

556
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,640
Speaker 5: the Civil War were put into the Bill of Rights.

557
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:34,640
Speaker 5: So everything we've ever gotten is a result of struggle. Now,

558
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 5: I think we're at a stage where we're all facing

559
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:44,280
Speaker 5: the destruction of the economy, we're all facing mass imprisonment,

560
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 5: we're all facing all of these means to destroy labor

561
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 5: that they feel is not productive or that they feel

562
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 5: is an impediment to profit. And the thing that we

563
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,760
Speaker 5: have to understand, those of us who are looking at this,

564
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,000
Speaker 5: those of us who are trying to find ways to

565
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:06,600
Speaker 5: fight this, is that we have to take the struggle

566
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:09,960
Speaker 5: to a higher level. And we're looking right now at

567
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 5: fascists taking over the American government. That's where we are

568
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:19,720
Speaker 5: right now. And when the Black Panther Party was around,

569
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 5: my initial understanding and training around ideas of fascism came

570
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:29,200
Speaker 5: from the Black Panther newspaper. The entire struggle by the

571
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:31,720
Speaker 5: Black Panther Party and others in that period, the Black

572
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:34,720
Speaker 5: Power movement and the new Left in that period was

573
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 5: about not just fighting the government, but restricting their powers.

574
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,560
Speaker 5: In fact, the whole constitution is about that. But now

575
00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 5: we have people going in the power who don't even

576
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 5: see that the constitution means anything to bar them from

577
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:54,560
Speaker 5: having absolute and utter power. It's only the people, because

578
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 5: there have been other countries that have had you know, dictators,

579
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 5: a lot of them installed by America. And it's when

580
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:04,959
Speaker 5: the people rise up in enough numbers with a program

581
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 5: to resurrects not just resurrect society as it was, but

582
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 5: fighting for a new society fighting for a new kind

583
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 5: of economy, because we're going to need these things to survive.

584
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:20,960
Speaker 5: In this period, we're fighting the battle of our lifetimes

585
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 5: and and for our children and those unborn. We're going

586
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:28,840
Speaker 5: to be fighting that these people are they may and

587
00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 5: have the potential to put the Nazis shame. So these

588
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 5: conditions that exist now are planned. They are planned to

589
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 5: get rid of. Trump himself has said that when he

590
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 5: gets in our office, he is going to take unhouse

591
00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:48,840
Speaker 5: people in the cities and take them out somewhere to

592
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:52,239
Speaker 5: some desert. Yeah. I see.

593
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 3: They were saying that when he was first running that

594
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 3: he was going to try to put them out in

595
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:57,720
Speaker 3: the desert near the airport.

596
00:34:57,840 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 1: Yes, very much, the desert.

597
00:34:59,640 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 2: You know.

598
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 4: One of the things that there is so much I

599
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 4: don't live in Los Angeles. I don't know the numbers,

600
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 4: but there's so much abandoned housing everywhere. I'm sure there's

601
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:16,800
Speaker 4: hundreds and hundreds of homes in the Los Angeles metropolitan area.

602
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:19,480
Speaker 3: And not only I just to quickly jump jump up

603
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 3: into it too. Recently, when Grant's Pass was passed, Governor

604
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:28,560
Speaker 3: k Newsome doled out money to utilize to help criminalize

605
00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:32,720
Speaker 3: or create an environment that you hunted down unhoused people.

606
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 3: But here's the thing that millions of dollars that they

607
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:39,240
Speaker 3: could have used that have for example, like the people

608
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:42,280
Speaker 3: that are activists that had occupied housing during the pandemic

609
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 3: and were being evicted, they could have used that money

610
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 3: to keep these unhoused people in these places, help reverbish

611
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,759
Speaker 3: these places and have the place for them to stay.

612
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,279
Speaker 3: They don't have to reinvent the wheel. Throw the person out.

613
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 3: Then they got it. Now start over in this Sisaphyan

614
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:02,360
Speaker 3: task of trying to re established themselves into a stable place.

615
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,440
Speaker 3: They could keep many of them that are already housed

616
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:09,360
Speaker 3: or in these places, give them money, refurbish the place,

617
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:13,600
Speaker 3: and that will eliminate a lot of the detritus that

618
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 3: they have. But they won't do that because of the

619
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:20,880
Speaker 3: fact that it's much more newsworthy of going down terrorizing

620
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 3: unhouse people, tearing down the structures that they have, saying

621
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,560
Speaker 3: that they are criminals, saying that they just like being

622
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:26,920
Speaker 3: out here.

623
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:28,239
Speaker 1: They're service resistant.

624
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 3: Conversely, then understanding that other people when you're living on

625
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,720
Speaker 3: the street, from my own personal experience I've lived eight years,

626
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 3: sustain your life when you're in a survival mode. It

627
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 3: is a completely different conversation. You cannot live like you're

628
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:47,000
Speaker 3: living inside a building unless you are in a different

629
00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 3: fantasy world.

630
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:49,640
Speaker 1: You create a different.

631
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 3: World in order to survive the vagaries and the winds

632
00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 3: and rains of heaven and understanding climate control, which I

633
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:58,200
Speaker 3: will talk about later, but the fact of the matter

634
00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 3: is that you must understand that also, it is an

635
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:07,280
Speaker 3: industrial complex where they get more money demonizing and dehumanizing people.

636
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:13,480
Speaker 3: It's easier to blame, it is easier to demonize, then

637
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 3: you can criminalize.

638
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:16,640
Speaker 1: I always say that, but that's I digress.

639
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 4: You know, the whole thing this is this is class warfare.

640
00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:25,879
Speaker 4: It's class warfare against poor people, low income people. And

641
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 4: there needs to be a massive squatting rebellion. And I

642
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 4: don't know how to organize it, and obviously it will

643
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:36,279
Speaker 4: look different in different cities, but that's what's going to

644
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:36,800
Speaker 4: have to happen.

645
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:37,640
Speaker 1: People are going to.

646
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:43,319
Speaker 4: Have to take over all these abandoned homes and you know,

647
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,919
Speaker 4: fix them up, get the plumbing in the electricity.

648
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:47,919
Speaker 1: You have people who are.

649
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 4: Skilled who know how to do that. That's what needs

650
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 4: to happen because what we're seeing is the whule thing

651
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 4: people are being evicted because of these high rents and everything.

652
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:03,360
Speaker 4: As you you mentioned gentrification. Lorenzo and I were living

653
00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:06,440
Speaker 4: in Kansas City, Missouri for about five or six years,

654
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:08,640
Speaker 4: but and we had been able to move into a

655
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,279
Speaker 4: house where there was a special program that kept the

656
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 4: rent low for low income people like us. But that

657
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:17,440
Speaker 4: program ended and then of course the landlords were there

658
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 4: were all happy about that. Then the gentrification started to

659
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 4: begin and they were raising. In fact, the day we

660
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,759
Speaker 4: were moving out, a guy showed up at the front door.

661
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:27,759
Speaker 4: I guess he thought we were the owners, and he

662
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,799
Speaker 4: was there ready to well, you know, we could buy

663
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:31,440
Speaker 4: this from you and we could really fix it up,

664
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:33,919
Speaker 4: you know, I said, you know, I said, the bloodsuckers

665
00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 4: are here already and we haven't even gotten out the

666
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:41,000
Speaker 4: front door, you know, ready to take over. So we

667
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 4: are going to have to have massive squatting. We were

668
00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:47,719
Speaker 4: going to have to take over all of these houses

669
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 4: across the country, and there will have to be specific

670
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:54,280
Speaker 4: campaigns in each part of the country because every place

671
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 4: is different. I always say there's no one size fits

672
00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:00,680
Speaker 4: all because you know, La is not Chicago, not Boston

673
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:01,439
Speaker 4: or anything else.

674
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:02,920
Speaker 1: So I can't you know, I can't.

675
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 4: Tell anybody how to do this, but that's what's going

676
00:39:05,600 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 4: to have to happen. We're gonna have to take over

677
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:12,879
Speaker 4: these empty, abandoned houses. And I realized as you were

678
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 4: talking you gave the number of the legislation for I

679
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 4: am familiar with it. I did read about it, you

680
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:23,279
Speaker 4: heard about it on the news. But this is class

681
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 4: warfare against poor people. It's further criminalizing people who don't

682
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 4: have the resources to live in a house and saying

683
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:35,080
Speaker 4: you know that, well, you can't live on the streets.

684
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:37,200
Speaker 4: If you are on the streets, you're a criminal.

685
00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:40,000
Speaker 1: We're going to take a break and we will be

686
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 1: right back. We're back.

687
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:52,439
Speaker 3: What I find when I created the show the difficulty

688
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 3: for people, other people that are in vulnerable states to

689
00:39:55,719 --> 00:40:00,319
Speaker 3: understand the mass propaganda machine that is there. One thing

690
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:03,280
Speaker 3: that I have to say is hurt people. Hurt people

691
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 3: and people that are vulnerable. They have done a very

692
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 3: good job of trying to differentiate different facets of houselessness,

693
00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 3: the deserving poor versus the undeserving poor. And I say this,

694
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:17,880
Speaker 3: for example, then you have house people running around talking

695
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 3: about you only concerned about house kills because you don't

696
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:24,400
Speaker 3: talk about the unhoused children that are in la USD,

697
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 3: and there's a very high toll of those. You're not

698
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 3: concerned about those kids that parents are living in RVs

699
00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 3: or living in unstable couch commitments or living in shelters

700
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:39,080
Speaker 3: and they have to grapple and traits to the school

701
00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:43,040
Speaker 3: and deal with the privilege in class classes, behaviors that

702
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,920
Speaker 3: house children have and watching their parents. You're only concerned

703
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:50,239
Speaker 3: about your child that's in a house. My understanding that

704
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 3: your child that has to navigate school, navigate sleep deficiencies

705
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 3: and food deficiencies and insecurities, and to deal with going

706
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:03,240
Speaker 3: back into an unstabled environment, which plays an academic toll,

707
00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:05,680
Speaker 3: which also plays another facet.

708
00:41:05,680 --> 00:41:09,359
Speaker 1: Another rung of the prison pipeline.

709
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:11,239
Speaker 3: Which we don't talk about enough, is particularly here in

710
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 3: la We need to understand there are a cascade event

711
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 3: and we understand when we see and understand what houselessness

712
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:24,880
Speaker 3: is and understand how it's impacting due to systematic insufficiencies inadequacies,

713
00:41:25,239 --> 00:41:29,840
Speaker 3: then we can understand also the conversation wholesale, But again

714
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:30,839
Speaker 3: I'm digressing.

715
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: You know, any insight on that Lorento.

716
00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:38,520
Speaker 5: Well, let's look at this in terms of a class struggle.

717
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:44,880
Speaker 5: The government created these conditions, and it's the government that

718
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:48,720
Speaker 5: has the financial resource even the houses that the banks

719
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,719
Speaker 5: and the others are sitting on, as well as these

720
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:57,799
Speaker 5: corporations come along and destroying properties, destroying neighborhoods. I should say,

721
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:02,280
Speaker 5: you know, we need a u a coalition of groups

722
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:05,960
Speaker 5: of different types. We need people like you said, that

723
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:11,839
Speaker 5: are the traditional poor and the super poor, which is

724
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:14,240
Speaker 5: what you know, how sist people are. They're the super

725
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 5: poor and we need to find a way to unite

726
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:21,719
Speaker 5: them along with all the other social movements in this

727
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 5: period and to come. And if we don't do this,

728
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:27,439
Speaker 5: and we're not capable of doing this, then we can't win.

729
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:31,799
Speaker 5: But we can win if we believe that we can

730
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:34,760
Speaker 5: unite around these issues. It's just like we can unite

731
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:38,879
Speaker 5: around issues that people who were disabled head at that time.

732
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:41,399
Speaker 5: Many of them were homeless because they, as you said,

733
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:43,759
Speaker 5: they were the part of the undeserving poor. They didn't

734
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 5: deserve anything. And then they fought. They were able to

735
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:54,320
Speaker 5: fight and get certain types of social money and social

736
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 5: protections and so forth that would never happen if they

737
00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 5: just sat there and and you know, just limited the

738
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:04,280
Speaker 5: fact we've got to create a certain amount of unity.

739
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:08,920
Speaker 5: We've got to do massive political education the movement. I

740
00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 5: think that one of the things we have to say

741
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:14,319
Speaker 5: to this point is that what the government did in

742
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 5: the nineteen seventies, when when massive homelessness first started showing up,

743
00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:25,200
Speaker 5: the capitalists system created the situation. They drove productive jobs

744
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:30,080
Speaker 5: out of the country. They cut social money, you know,

745
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 5: whether it's food stamps or whatever. They cut those things,

746
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:38,200
Speaker 5: and they made it impossible to live. They assured that

747
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:41,480
Speaker 5: there would be a massive prison population because people were

748
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:43,680
Speaker 5: let's just say it the way it is, if you

749
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 5: don't have food to eat, you're going to steal. Yeah,

750
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:51,680
Speaker 5: ain't even stealing. It's survival, that's right. And we we

751
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 5: used to talk about crimes of survival back in the day,

752
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:59,360
Speaker 5: you know. And the state, the government is responsible for

753
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:02,799
Speaker 5: these things, and it is the government that we have

754
00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:07,719
Speaker 5: to confront in every instance. They have housing. They even

755
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:12,760
Speaker 5: have military basis that has housing. The government has the money.

756
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,279
Speaker 5: The government is responsible. They're the ones we need to

757
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 5: put the pressure on. And what has happened is that

758
00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:21,040
Speaker 5: they're able to use they were able to use the

759
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:25,080
Speaker 5: shelter system. The creation of the shelter system claim that

760
00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:30,600
Speaker 5: they could contain the problem because it's a explosive political

761
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:33,799
Speaker 5: issue and their thing is how do we control it?

762
00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:37,040
Speaker 5: And so now they're saying, how can we criminalize it?

763
00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:39,239
Speaker 5: And how can we just kill these people off or

764
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:42,279
Speaker 5: put them in prisons, put them in camps way out

765
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 5: in the country, somewhere out in the desert and all

766
00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 5: this kind of thing. Yeah, we have to fight every

767
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:49,759
Speaker 5: step of the way. We have to make people see

768
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:54,359
Speaker 5: that this is the kind of genocide steps that were

769
00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:57,680
Speaker 5: taken in Nazi Germany. We have to fight this step

770
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 5: of way. But we have to continually edge, kate, organize

771
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 5: and agitate. We have to be doing these things so

772
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 5: that the masses can see it because right now, and

773
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:11,279
Speaker 5: the way it has been for too many years is

774
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:13,880
Speaker 5: people to see while they're homeless, is I feel sorry

775
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 5: for him? There's nothing I can do. And also we're

776
00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 5: doing the best thing by getting them out of site

777
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:22,600
Speaker 5: and out of mind, you know, And you know what

778
00:45:22,640 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 5: happens with people that are out of sight and out

779
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,480
Speaker 5: of mind with a government like Trump, who's going to

780
00:45:28,520 --> 00:45:31,680
Speaker 5: be uh, you know, even worse than what has happened

781
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 5: to this point. He's telling you before he even gets

782
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 5: elected that he wants to remove people exactly. So the

783
00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 5: real answer here we have to create a poor people's

784
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:50,040
Speaker 5: survival movement, a mass movement dealing with class warfare, with

785
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:56,560
Speaker 5: exposing the crimes of the government, with fighting for social resources.

786
00:45:56,920 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 5: Somebody's talking the other day about reparations, and I said, said, listen,

787
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:04,600
Speaker 5: let me explain something to you. The government of the

788
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:08,720
Speaker 5: United States is not going to give you reparations unless

789
00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:12,799
Speaker 5: it's a payoff to collaborators, like what we're seeing right now.

790
00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:15,919
Speaker 5: Trump has told a lot of black people that, well,

791
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 5: you elect me, and I'll give you reparations, but he

792
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:23,000
Speaker 5: will give money to a class of parasites and sellouts

793
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:27,759
Speaker 5: and traders, and the rest of us will be up

794
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:29,320
Speaker 5: the creek, they say.

795
00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 3: And then they will use that narrative. What that you

796
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 3: would unhouse people is that we tried to help them.

797
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:37,640
Speaker 3: We gave them money, and they chose to squander it

798
00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:40,600
Speaker 3: or they chose to abuse it, and they just you know,

799
00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 3: this is their fault, and it's always going to be

800
00:46:43,160 --> 00:46:45,680
Speaker 3: the victim is always going to be victimized.

801
00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:48,400
Speaker 1: Further, well, this is what they did. You know, we

802
00:46:48,480 --> 00:46:49,040
Speaker 1: did try to.

803
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:50,680
Speaker 5: Help, so we can kill them off with thee them

804
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:54,400
Speaker 5: dies exactly as I said, the justification to, you know, exterminate.

805
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:58,120
Speaker 5: But I will say this, I don't I'm not pessimistic

806
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 5: even with these people in office, because I think that

807
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:04,040
Speaker 5: it's possible to build a broader based movement. Said, we

808
00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:07,759
Speaker 5: should be talking about what kind of society we want

809
00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:11,120
Speaker 5: to have and not just look at these people and

810
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:15,560
Speaker 5: say we can't do anything. We can do everything. We

811
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:18,399
Speaker 5: have the power. The thing about the nineteen sixties, brother,

812
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 5: is that we saw for the first time how powerful

813
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:26,799
Speaker 5: the black movement is. Because the Black movement organized everybody

814
00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:32,680
Speaker 5: into an autonomous political tendency that changed everything. And in fact,

815
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:34,440
Speaker 5: you know, they talk about Watergate, and this is one

816
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,640
Speaker 5: of the things I did, you know, some research on

817
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:40,319
Speaker 5: and thought about, and I want you to think about this.

818
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 5: Richard Nixon tried to do everything Donald Trump is doing

819
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:52,240
Speaker 5: right now, everything and more, but he was defeated, especially

820
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 5: about the Black Panther Party creating a massive anti fascist

821
00:47:56,120 --> 00:48:00,319
Speaker 5: movement called it the National Committee to Combat Fascism, and

822
00:48:00,360 --> 00:48:03,279
Speaker 5: it was in cities all over the country, and not

823
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,959
Speaker 5: only was it organizing black people, but it also linked

824
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:11,560
Speaker 5: up with other social and radical forces and that unity

825
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 5: beat back the attempt by Richard Nixon to take over

826
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:20,319
Speaker 5: the government. Now, granted, there was a massive anti war

827
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:24,719
Speaker 5: movement and the social protest movements were really powerful, much

828
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:27,000
Speaker 5: more than they are today, and we have to recognize

829
00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:31,239
Speaker 5: that fact. But they were able to prove to us

830
00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:34,040
Speaker 5: and fascism can be defeated even if they try, even

831
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:37,640
Speaker 5: if they're in power or trying to take power, they

832
00:48:37,640 --> 00:48:41,880
Speaker 5: can be defeated. They are retrograde force, and if the

833
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:45,680
Speaker 5: people themselves unite against it, they can beat it back

834
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:48,400
Speaker 5: and beat it completely. And this is what happeneds to

835
00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 5: have and it needs to be decisively defeated. But if

836
00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 5: we tell ourselves that we have to depend on the

837
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:57,560
Speaker 5: government to be able to fight the government, we will

838
00:48:57,560 --> 00:48:59,839
Speaker 5: never accomplish our goals. If you go back and look

839
00:48:59,880 --> 00:49:03,319
Speaker 5: at the entire Civil rights and Black Power period, and

840
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:04,800
Speaker 5: you know, the New Left and all this back in

841
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:06,920
Speaker 5: the sixties, especially because that was the closest thing we

842
00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:09,520
Speaker 5: had to full on revolution in this country.

843
00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:10,799
Speaker 1: If you go back and.

844
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:13,080
Speaker 5: Look at that, the one thing they did do they

845
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:16,280
Speaker 5: didn't ask for forgiveness, they didn't ask to have permits

846
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 5: and all this stuff. They just did it because it

847
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 5: had to be done, and they understood they were fighting

848
00:49:21,160 --> 00:49:24,160
Speaker 5: a class war. And we need to understand that now

849
00:49:24,560 --> 00:49:27,279
Speaker 5: what's happened here in this country, that the rich have

850
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:30,759
Speaker 5: taken power in a fascist coup, and we need to

851
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 5: recognize that, and we should not be feeling that we

852
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:40,160
Speaker 5: were defeated. In fact, this whole campaign is a forest.

853
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:44,320
Speaker 5: It was a forest. The Supreme Court and other forces

854
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:47,799
Speaker 5: put their thumb on the pulse if you want, whatever

855
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:51,520
Speaker 5: you want to call it, to allow Trump to take power,

856
00:49:52,040 --> 00:49:55,520
Speaker 5: to allow Trump to receive massive funding, and the billionaire

857
00:49:55,560 --> 00:50:00,000
Speaker 5: class which has destroyed the economy already in this country.

858
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 5: They created, on one end, a class of profiteers and plunderers,

859
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 5: and on the other end, they created a class of

860
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:14,719
Speaker 5: people who are struggling to survive, struggling to survive. And

861
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 5: so we need to look at it through the lens

862
00:50:17,960 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 5: of how do we fight back. How do we build

863
00:50:20,640 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 5: a movement, not only we build a movement, but a

864
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:26,560
Speaker 5: movement that takes us to a new society. How do

865
00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:29,719
Speaker 5: we stop those in power that want to wage war

866
00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:32,400
Speaker 5: and profit from it. How do we stop the people

867
00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:36,759
Speaker 5: who have created the massive prison system in America? They

868
00:50:36,760 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 5: don't even have to create a gulag or any kind

869
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:44,840
Speaker 5: of concentration camp system. They've already got them. This country

870
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:49,239
Speaker 5: has the biggest prison establishment in the world, and it's

871
00:50:49,239 --> 00:50:53,080
Speaker 5: the biggest prison establishment in world history. You could take

872
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:57,360
Speaker 5: all the people that Adolf Hitler rounded up and putting

873
00:50:57,400 --> 00:51:01,239
Speaker 5: his concentration camps all over Europe. You can take the Chinese,

874
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:05,560
Speaker 5: you can take all of these people and that were

875
00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:08,960
Speaker 5: in Russia, you know, and you can put them together.

876
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:13,960
Speaker 5: In the United States far outpaces them in numbers and

877
00:51:13,600 --> 00:51:20,319
Speaker 5: in the ability to crush the population using incarceration. And

878
00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:26,080
Speaker 5: so our fight has to be not just reforms. Our

879
00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:30,040
Speaker 5: fight has to be revolution. And when you say that,

880
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:33,520
Speaker 5: I'm not just talking about somebody said, well, revolution us violence.

881
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:41,160
Speaker 5: No revolution is social change, revolution is resisting violence. Fascism

882
00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:45,400
Speaker 5: is violence. Fascism is violence that can kill millions, that

883
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:49,040
Speaker 5: has done it. And in the United States right now,

884
00:51:49,120 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 5: the white government that exists that's coming into power is

885
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:58,319
Speaker 5: a fascist regime and it's installed by fascist populism. This

886
00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:00,759
Speaker 5: is the way they figured out how they could get

887
00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 5: into power. And let's be clear about these things. We

888
00:52:03,120 --> 00:52:06,680
Speaker 5: should be telling people this shouting from the highest roottop.

889
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:10,319
Speaker 5: Whatever your issue is that made you, an activist, or

890
00:52:10,440 --> 00:52:15,440
Speaker 5: your circles, we should be telling each other that the

891
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:18,920
Speaker 5: way to fight back is to create a mass movement

892
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:23,080
Speaker 5: of our own, to create the stages for a new society,

893
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:25,920
Speaker 5: you know, right now in the belly of the beast,

894
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:30,359
Speaker 5: like they said. And so from our standpoint, I really

895
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:33,200
Speaker 5: do think, and many like me have come to this

896
00:52:33,239 --> 00:52:38,640
Speaker 5: conclusion that it's all in our hands actually, and regardless

897
00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:40,640
Speaker 5: of who's in power and who's out of power and

898
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:44,680
Speaker 5: all that. They've created a mistake as well, though, because

899
00:52:44,680 --> 00:52:49,400
Speaker 5: they've shown people that the government, any government, is a

900
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:52,520
Speaker 5: fascist regime, has the potential to become a fascist regime,

901
00:52:52,840 --> 00:52:56,240
Speaker 5: even the ones who claim to be a democratic party

902
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,120
Speaker 5: or regime. So the only way we're going to survive

903
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 5: is that we come together, we unite and around all issues.

904
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:08,719
Speaker 5: We can't allow people to exclude houselessness and say that

905
00:53:08,719 --> 00:53:11,160
Speaker 5: that's not an issue that we are concerned about. We

906
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:14,000
Speaker 5: cannot allow that. We have to make it one of

907
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:15,920
Speaker 5: the central figure. We cannot allow them to claim that

908
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:20,400
Speaker 5: the prison movement are the prison industries that they've created

909
00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:24,200
Speaker 5: and profiting from. And Trump says he's going to boost

910
00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:29,239
Speaker 5: the prison population through the use of private prisons. He's

911
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:31,359
Speaker 5: going to allow private prisons to take over the state

912
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:36,319
Speaker 5: of California. He's on record of saying things.

913
00:53:36,040 --> 00:53:39,040
Speaker 3: Like that it is a felony in Tennessee to be

914
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:43,400
Speaker 3: unhoused is six y development. So it's not down in

915
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:47,480
Speaker 3: the future. It's happening under our watch, under our eyesight,

916
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:50,120
Speaker 3: And though we are focusing on all of the other

917
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:54,080
Speaker 3: atrocities that are going on outside of our country, we

918
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:57,760
Speaker 3: are not having the same layer of focus that's going

919
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:01,040
Speaker 3: on right under our nose. Which is why this show

920
00:54:01,080 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 3: is so adamant about trying to raise the alarm about

921
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:09,880
Speaker 3: Grant's past. People don't understand the implications. For example, climate

922
00:54:09,960 --> 00:54:13,920
Speaker 3: change is coming on the horizon. You can have all

923
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 3: of the things, you could do, everything that you're supposedly

924
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:18,560
Speaker 3: supposed to do, and then you can lose all of

925
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:23,359
Speaker 3: it through a hurricane or a forest fire or a

926
00:54:23,480 --> 00:54:26,680
Speaker 3: mud slide, what have you. You are susceptible to the

927
00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:30,040
Speaker 3: laws of Grant's past. You will not be saved beca

928
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:33,640
Speaker 3: because you did everything right. You will be subjected through

929
00:54:33,640 --> 00:54:37,279
Speaker 3: the same legal consequences, just like an unhoused person that

930
00:54:37,400 --> 00:54:40,680
Speaker 3: lost their housing or had a medical emergency or whatever.

931
00:54:40,760 --> 00:54:45,920
Speaker 3: The conversation is you are now in the same community.

932
00:54:46,400 --> 00:54:51,400
Speaker 3: Whether you believe that you're different, or you were deserving poor,

933
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:53,799
Speaker 3: or you're deserving the help and other people are not,

934
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:56,799
Speaker 3: you still are susceptible to these kind of laws that

935
00:54:57,239 --> 00:54:58,200
Speaker 3: are being down on the.

936
00:54:58,200 --> 00:54:59,440
Speaker 1: Books or put on the books.

937
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:04,000
Speaker 5: Excellent, and you know what this legislation actually is, and

938
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:06,640
Speaker 5: we need to just call it what it is. It's

939
00:55:06,760 --> 00:55:13,080
Speaker 5: fascists enabling legislation, and we'll see more of it, especially

940
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:16,400
Speaker 5: if there's no fight back. Everything that's happening right now

941
00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:21,000
Speaker 5: is contingent on whether there's fight back or whether people

942
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:24,880
Speaker 5: just sit down and say nothing and become intimidated at

943
00:55:24,920 --> 00:55:28,719
Speaker 5: the power of the government and the threats of a

944
00:55:28,840 --> 00:55:33,440
Speaker 5: lunatic who's now becoming the president. We have to understand

945
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:39,240
Speaker 5: that we can fight back and we can win significant victories,

946
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:43,359
Speaker 5: but only if we unite the struggles we can't have,

947
00:55:43,640 --> 00:55:47,000
Speaker 5: you know, struggles that are excluded of a class of

948
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:50,400
Speaker 5: people that are so far on the bottom, they're the

949
00:55:50,480 --> 00:55:53,080
Speaker 5: super poor. We can't have that. These are things that

950
00:55:53,120 --> 00:55:57,600
Speaker 5: are really important for organizers to understand. There's recently, I

951
00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:03,239
Speaker 5: understand that they have now ruled that nonprofit organizations that

952
00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 5: come out against the government or as critical of the government,

953
00:56:07,280 --> 00:56:09,959
Speaker 5: we'll lose their funding and their status.

954
00:56:10,520 --> 00:56:11,480
Speaker 1: It'll be called terrorists.

955
00:56:12,120 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 4: You support the Foulestinian movement, your terroist movement, the irs

956
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:18,600
Speaker 4: will revoke your five oh one c three status.

957
00:56:18,640 --> 00:56:21,600
Speaker 3: So basically becoming a country is that they denounce and

958
00:56:21,840 --> 00:56:25,680
Speaker 3: demonize exactly they're becoming these countries. They're just doing it

959
00:56:26,239 --> 00:56:27,440
Speaker 3: in the name of the democracy.

960
00:56:27,480 --> 00:56:30,800
Speaker 1: But that's it, absolutely.

961
00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:32,879
Speaker 5: Well, we can do better with their form of democracy.

962
00:56:33,200 --> 00:56:35,720
Speaker 5: That's what it amounts to. We can build a different

963
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:41,400
Speaker 5: kind of society where billionaires don't dominate the entire economy

964
00:56:41,520 --> 00:56:45,400
Speaker 5: and the people on the bottom suffer. We can remove

965
00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:49,440
Speaker 5: that class of parasites, and we can tax those parasites

966
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:53,200
Speaker 5: as they should be taxed while there exists. But if

967
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:55,719
Speaker 5: we sit around and do nothing, or get in a

968
00:56:55,719 --> 00:56:59,080
Speaker 5: political party that approves of it and does nothing, the

969
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:03,279
Speaker 5: so called democratocratic party, these people have led us down

970
00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 5: the Primrose path. And the so called left that you

971
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:10,120
Speaker 5: got in this country has not even said a word

972
00:57:10,239 --> 00:57:12,719
Speaker 5: or tried to protest against Trump even being able to

973
00:57:12,800 --> 00:57:15,520
Speaker 5: run for office. How does this happen. It happens because

974
00:57:15,560 --> 00:57:18,680
Speaker 5: there's been a wink and or nod kind of system

975
00:57:18,680 --> 00:57:24,040
Speaker 5: in place that has pushed his candidacy because the rich

976
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:27,280
Speaker 5: have decided that this is what is necessary to get

977
00:57:27,360 --> 00:57:30,600
Speaker 5: super profits and to get control of the government, and

978
00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:34,480
Speaker 5: to not have regulations and to not have people in

979
00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:38,280
Speaker 5: protest movements in any kind of way to be able

980
00:57:38,280 --> 00:57:41,480
Speaker 5: to stop them. You know, this is what they adopted

981
00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:45,480
Speaker 5: and they are shamelessly, you know, doing it. And we

982
00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:47,680
Speaker 5: seem to be the only ones that don't understand what's

983
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:51,200
Speaker 5: going on. We seem to be staring at fascism but

984
00:57:51,280 --> 00:57:55,000
Speaker 5: not seeing it. That's what we're confronted with now, and

985
00:57:55,040 --> 00:57:58,800
Speaker 5: so we really have to have these discussions as we're

986
00:57:58,840 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 5: having now. We should sure they turn you off until

987
00:58:01,200 --> 00:58:03,680
Speaker 5: they run you off the air. We need to have

988
00:58:03,720 --> 00:58:08,280
Speaker 5: these discussions in our own survival, but even in terms

989
00:58:08,360 --> 00:58:11,640
Speaker 5: of our ability to take the young people and others

990
00:58:11,680 --> 00:58:15,120
Speaker 5: that are already looking at things but not quite understanding.

991
00:58:16,080 --> 00:58:20,080
Speaker 5: And we need to have mass education, political education, so

992
00:58:20,120 --> 00:58:23,080
Speaker 5: that we can build a movement in this generation that

993
00:58:23,160 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 5: did even the things that rivals over things that happened

994
00:58:26,760 --> 00:58:29,520
Speaker 5: in the nineteen sixties. It's really really important.

995
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:37,360
Speaker 3: Thank you for joining us, Lorenzo and Jannina and for

996
00:58:37,440 --> 00:58:41,600
Speaker 3: that lively exchange of ideas and hope. Check out their books,

997
00:58:42,160 --> 00:58:45,320
Speaker 3: an Archism and the Black Revolution by Lorenzo Kimboya Irvin

998
00:58:46,080 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 3: and Driven by the Movement Activists of the Black Power

999
00:58:49,200 --> 00:58:57,720
Speaker 3: Era by Joe Nina Irvin. There are many ways of

1000
00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:01,440
Speaker 3: saying how language opens the door of comprehension action. So

1001
00:59:01,520 --> 00:59:03,200
Speaker 3: I will leave you with a quote by the late

1002
00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:06,800
Speaker 3: Great Tony Morrison to gird ourselves from the oppressant regime

1003
00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:12,080
Speaker 3: that's being ushered in. Oppressive language does more than represent violence,

1004
00:59:13,600 --> 00:59:17,600
Speaker 3: it is violence. It does more than represent the limits

1005
00:59:17,600 --> 00:59:26,960
Speaker 3: of knowledge, it limits knowledge. And on that note, this

1006
00:59:27,040 --> 00:59:29,960
Speaker 3: is THEO Henderson from Widian House. Happy New Year, and

1007
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:32,680
Speaker 3: thank you for listening, and may we again meet in

1008
00:59:32,680 --> 00:59:39,840
Speaker 3: a light of understanding. And as always, please like and subscribe,

1009
00:59:40,160 --> 00:59:41,800
Speaker 3: and if you would like to share your story on

1010
00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:43,959
Speaker 3: wiedian howse, please reach out to me at weedian House

1011
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:50,760
Speaker 3: on Instagram or email me at Weedianhouse at gmail dot com.

1012
00:59:50,960 --> 00:59:54,760
Speaker 3: Weedian House is a production of iHeartRadio. It is written,

1013
00:59:55,120 --> 01:00:01,000
Speaker 3: posted and created by me THEO Henderson, our producer, Jamie Loftus,

1014
01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:07,080
Speaker 3: Kailey Fager, Katie Ficial, and Lyra Smith. Our editor is

1015
01:00:07,120 --> 01:00:10,960
Speaker 3: Adam Wand and our local art is also by Katie Ficial.

1016
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:12,360
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.