Speaker 1: This is Matt Barnes. You're listening to All the Smoke
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Speaker 1: subscribe at the top of the All the Smoke Show
Speaker 1: page on Apple Podcasts. Welcome back, All the Smoke Man,
Speaker 1: coming to you from Dallas. Set the tone with the
Speaker 1: boss man, mister Mark Cuban, And now we got one
Speaker 1: of the greatest to ever do it.
Speaker 2: Jack. Yeah. He shot a lot of jumpers in face,
Speaker 2: both of them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we got one time.
Speaker 2: We got him.
Speaker 1: Know, we're going to talk about that a little later.
Speaker 1: But man, this is long overdue. I mean your accolades
Speaker 1: twenty one years, over, thirty thousand points, drank six All Time,
Speaker 1: fourteen All Stars, seven MVP Finals MVP, and eleven newest
Speaker 1: member to the Hall of Fame. Congratulations for that. That's
Speaker 1: a great class. We'll get to that a little bit.
Speaker 1: Anything funny happened in that during that Hall of Fame weekend,
Speaker 1: I mean it.
Speaker 3: Was just unbelievable experience. Honestly, my family, I had like
Speaker 3: one hundred and fifty people from all over the world
Speaker 3: flying in some next teammates, So nothing really funny. You know,
Speaker 3: me and me and d Wade had a little history,
Speaker 3: so we actually we.
Speaker 2: Bonded a little bit.
Speaker 3: That weekend we filmed the podcast for his new new thing,
Speaker 3: and so we actually got into some of the stuff
Speaker 3: really happened in six and eleven and the fake coffin
Speaker 3: they were doing, and so that was probably, uh, that
Speaker 3: was probably the moment I would say, I didn't expect
Speaker 3: that at all. Everything else was amazing, and uh and
Speaker 3: and and just enjoyed every moment.
Speaker 1: Well, you definitely deserved the man hell of a career,
Speaker 1: hell of a run.
Speaker 2: I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Germany recently took gold in the Feeble World Cup. If
Speaker 1: someone told you back in the nineties that this is
Speaker 1: what would be going on, would you ever would have
Speaker 1: believed it?
Speaker 2: No, no chance. Incredible.
Speaker 3: I mean basketball's has grown, not only obviously in Germany,
Speaker 3: but all over the world. You know of players, international
Speaker 3: players from all over the world, representing you know, MVP
Speaker 3: type COUNTI of players, franchise players. So it's been fun
Speaker 3: to watch where the game has gone. When I first
Speaker 3: got there in their nineties, you know, you had a
Speaker 3: few euros running around, but now every team has has
Speaker 3: a couple and it's been, it's been, it's been a
Speaker 3: pleasure to watch. And you know Germany now is just
Speaker 3: with a Shuder leading the team.
Speaker 2: But they were super solid.
Speaker 3: They had some shooters as some some some defenders, so
Speaker 3: I think they they looked incredible at it.
Speaker 4: Then.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but they're building organizations around European players now, so
Speaker 5: that's that's the testament to how they are developing now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely, I mean to speak of it. I mean,
Speaker 1: the last five MVPs have all been international player, the Gianni,
Speaker 1: Joic and obviously MB before that, they're only three yourself,
Speaker 1: Steve and Hakem. What do you think has really kind
Speaker 1: of opened up the floodgates to make this NBA more
Speaker 1: of a global game.
Speaker 3: Well, the game has grown, I think that's one thing,
Speaker 3: but make the game more accessible outside the US. And
Speaker 3: then you know the coach has gotten better and uh,
Speaker 3: I guess uh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and and the you know, the NBA.
Speaker 3: Has changed and I think it's when I first got
Speaker 3: leg it was so physical and you know, the fours
Speaker 3: and fives were all the rebounders. And then once the
Speaker 3: NBA changed rules a little bit. You know, you guys
Speaker 3: were there. They you know, they put in the zone,
Speaker 3: they got rid of the hand check in made it
Speaker 3: a little softer, so to speak. And that's playing right
Speaker 3: in the in the Euros, in the European game and
Speaker 3: in the national game. We grew up playing outside, swing
Speaker 3: the ball, five and five pick and roll game. You know,
Speaker 3: when I first got here, all plays I just got
Speaker 3: called up and then it was ISO.
Speaker 2: It's just cleared the side, you know, and.
Speaker 3: And some some of that with the zone, and you
Speaker 3: can there's other things you can do now that that
Speaker 3: sort of got away from that, and it forced teams
Speaker 3: to move the ball a little more, play a little
Speaker 3: more team game, and that played right in our hands.
Speaker 3: And so that's that's I guess what you've been seeing
Speaker 3: that the game is growing and yeah, and the game
Speaker 3: has has played similar the way it is in Europe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's jump back to nineteen ninety eight Hoops Summit,
Speaker 1: where you became on you know, a lot of American
Speaker 1: people's first kind of real glimpse at you. We thought
Speaker 1: we put a hell of a team out there. One
Speaker 1: of our buddies, Ray Young, who works with us, isn't
Speaker 1: here today but him, Eric Barkley, Harrington, Richard Lewis, Quinn Richison,
Speaker 1: Jeron Rush, one of the best players never to make it,
Speaker 1: Stromole Swift, You busted all their thirty three Ray told this,
Speaker 1: They tried to throw every player at you, and nothing
Speaker 1: was working. What was working for you that day.
Speaker 2: A little bit of everything.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: That was really my first time arriving in the US,
Speaker 3: and you know, it was during the Final Four at
Speaker 3: the time in San Antonio. I was I was so
Speaker 3: hyped to be there. It was an incredible experience. We
Speaker 3: got to train here Dallas for a few days with
Speaker 3: the team, and then they flew us down to San
Speaker 3: Antonio for the Final four. We got to watch the
Speaker 3: two semi finals game with you know, U and C.
Speaker 3: You got to watch Vince Carter and I was just
Speaker 3: so hyped. And then the game was the.
Speaker 2: Following morning, and I don't know, man, it was just
Speaker 2: one of those days.
Speaker 3: Had a good start, got a couple, got to frouline
Speaker 3: a couple of times that game and just you know,
Speaker 3: helped me settle my nerves and just kind of rolled
Speaker 3: through there and showed it was able to show a
Speaker 3: little bit of my whole repertoire, which which I guess
Speaker 3: was was great. So that was that was a fun.
Speaker 2: Game and really, honestly, it changed my life overnight.
Speaker 1: That was the next question.
Speaker 2: I mean, my you know, back then.
Speaker 3: There was no internet, there was none of that, and
Speaker 3: so I didn't I don't even think I had a
Speaker 3: cell phone back then. So my my parents had had
Speaker 3: to get an answering machine at real college coaches ordering
Speaker 3: and off the hook, I mean all night long, and
Speaker 3: they didn't understand back in the day the time change
Speaker 3: and right, So I mean we had to get an
Speaker 3: answering machine because it was getting crazy. So I was
Speaker 3: getting recruited from like probably forty colleges, and you know,
Speaker 3: all of a sudden, I was, I was on the scene,
Speaker 3: and and then people were saying, hey, after that game, you.
Speaker 2: Might be a lot of a pick. You know, you know,
Speaker 2: I don't think you should be should be going to college.
Speaker 1: And so that had not to cut you off. Had
Speaker 1: that even crossed your mind prior to that.
Speaker 2: Or not a chance?
Speaker 3: I was looking at colleges and then I was, I
Speaker 3: wasn't even thinking about staying maybe in Europe, go to
Speaker 3: I visited like a Barcelona, like a great team in
Speaker 3: Italy and Milan. I thought maybe I'll go pro there
Speaker 3: a little bit. I have a good competition and then
Speaker 3: maybe if I make it, come on later. But you know,
Speaker 3: like I said that that game change changed everything really cool.
Speaker 1: Pissed off the press a little bit because you kind
Speaker 1: of had to do it was right for you, you know,
Speaker 1: by leaving and then obviously you had to leave your
Speaker 1: club to even play in it.
Speaker 2: Correct.
Speaker 1: Can you speak to a little bit of kind of
Speaker 1: what it back home? Although it would change your life
Speaker 1: in a positive it wasn't positive from everyone's outlook.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So there was a tough, tough period because we were
Speaker 3: in the playoffs sort of getting promoted. You know in
Speaker 3: Europe that you're getting get promoted and relegated. So we
Speaker 3: were in the second division at the time, and we
Speaker 3: wanted to go up in the first division. And we
Speaker 3: tried for years ever since I started the age of fifteen,
Speaker 3: and every year we're right there and we didn't make it.
Speaker 3: And that year we had a good team and we
Speaker 3: had a great foreigner.
Speaker 2: He was amazing.
Speaker 3: At the back of the days you only could play
Speaker 3: with one foreigner on the team. They still had the
Speaker 3: rule in the first division, you had two in the
Speaker 3: second division, you had won, and he was amazing, and
Speaker 3: so we thought we'd have a great shot at it.
Speaker 3: And then this game came along and my coach at
Speaker 3: the time, my personal coach, Holgar, was like, I think
Speaker 3: you gotta go. We gotta go, but we can't tell
Speaker 3: the team. And so I finished a playoff game that
Speaker 3: Sunday and on Monday morning, we drove to Frankfurt and
Speaker 3: flew out and I didn't tell the team, but we
Speaker 3: didn't tell the management, and so of course that didn't
Speaker 3: go well. You know, some of the guys had big
Speaker 3: bonuses on the line. How it is in Europe when
Speaker 3: you actually get promoted, they get paid, and so I
Speaker 3: heard there was some bad blood a little bit. But
Speaker 3: fast forward to come back that weekend. I had a
Speaker 3: good game and the team won the game that I
Speaker 3: was gone. So it ended up being amazing and we
Speaker 3: ended up getting promoted that year. And you know, I
Speaker 3: had a good game, So everything knock on wood worked
Speaker 3: out great. But uh, I heard some of the guys
Speaker 3: who are a little bit a little bit pistle.
Speaker 2: I can't never feel guilty about doing what's best for you,
Speaker 2: I know, but in the middle of the playoffs.
Speaker 3: I guess that's so that's a tough but yeah, money, yeah,
Speaker 3: it worked out.
Speaker 2: It worked out well.
Speaker 5: So growing up in American culture, movies, rap, basketball, how
Speaker 5: was that?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 3: I was a big nineties kid, you know, I loved
Speaker 3: Once I started playing basketball, I got more into the
Speaker 3: culture and you know, and and the rap and the
Speaker 3: and listen to Woo Tank Clan and I.
Speaker 2: Had all that. I had all that. I had all that.
Speaker 3: In my repertoire, and I don't know, I love the
Speaker 3: you know, wearing the Jordan shoes and uh and yeah,
Speaker 3: I just try to be a basketball guy.
Speaker 2: And it was it was fun.
Speaker 3: And then but when I came over, it a lot
Speaker 3: was different and my my language was just not quite there.
Speaker 3: My English show I was really shy my first year.
Speaker 3: You know, they didn't really understand the guys in locker room.
Speaker 3: It's a little different from the English I learned at school,
Speaker 3: and little guys no.
Speaker 2: Slang, and so.
Speaker 3: I didn't really understand that much. So my first year
Speaker 3: was just kind of trying to learn and learn on
Speaker 3: the fly and pick up all the calls on the court, understand.
Speaker 2: The guys off the court. So that was probably the hardest.
Speaker 3: Transition my year one, and it was a lockout year
Speaker 3: ninety eight ninety nine, so we you know, we had.
Speaker 2: Like six games in eight days.
Speaker 3: So they threw a lot at me my first year,
Speaker 3: and looking back, it was a very important year, but
Speaker 3: going through it, yeah, sucked.
Speaker 1: Homesick at all during that journey.
Speaker 3: Honestly, I didn't really have that much time. Honestly, there
Speaker 3: were so many games my first year and literally after
Speaker 3: the day of the last game, I was out.
Speaker 2: The next day. I couldn't wait to go home.
Speaker 3: But the break I was it was good for me
Speaker 3: to have Steve nash On, you know, we talked about
Speaker 3: him early Finley was was good for me. I had
Speaker 3: good two friends that that were there for me, that
Speaker 3: helped me and took me out of the hotel room
Speaker 3: and I was when I was homesick, and uh, they
Speaker 3: they were big for me, book supporters on and off
Speaker 3: the floor, and I'm not sure I would have gone
Speaker 3: this smooth with without them. So they I owe them
Speaker 3: a lot, and they're friends for life. We talk to
Speaker 3: them all the time, we see each other, we go
Speaker 3: on vacation together with the kids. Now, so uh, that's
Speaker 3: that's that's a tight bond before a long time ago,
Speaker 3: and I'm glad those guys were here for me at
Speaker 3: the time.
Speaker 5: Steve was my VIT when I got drafted. So I know,
Speaker 5: Steve Nash my guy. Your name has been dropped one
Speaker 5: hundred and seven times in hip hop songs.
Speaker 2: You have a favorite one? I didn't know.
Speaker 1: Someone really did some digging to get there, one hundred
Speaker 1: and six Sell you got a favorite that you can remember.
Speaker 3: No, actually, I can't even remember one that's my name
Speaker 3: was dropped, But I got I got some research that that.
Speaker 2: One hundred and seven times.
Speaker 5: Check that out holder guests you winner man behind the
Speaker 5: scenes will help you get recognized.
Speaker 2: Talk about him.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I met him when I was about fifteen
Speaker 3: and just about a good relationship. I mean he was
Speaker 3: he played in the seventy tie Olympics for Germany, so
Speaker 3: he played the game himself and was playing a little
Speaker 3: bit still still at the time, and I was on
Speaker 3: on a youth team and he saw me playing and
Speaker 3: he came up to me after the game and it's like, hey,
Speaker 3: who practiced with you and your skills? And I'm like,
Speaker 3: ball nobody. I didn't know he was. It was just
Speaker 3: some older gentleman and came up to me. So I'm like, nobody, really,
Speaker 3: I just I'm still in high school and you know,
Speaker 3: I played tennis and I played basketball a little bit.
Speaker 3: So he's like, you got you got what it takes.
Speaker 3: You got a good field for the ball, but you
Speaker 3: need to improve in your skills, your shooting and dribbling
Speaker 3: and stuff. And I'm like, yeah, whatever sounds good. So
Speaker 3: the Fall of Fastward. A couple months later, he actually
Speaker 3: showed up at my club and he's like, I would
Speaker 3: love to work with you and help her out. And
Speaker 3: really I had nothing to lose. All I was doing
Speaker 3: was was playing a little bit on the club team.
Speaker 3: And so we started work about once twice a week
Speaker 3: at the beginning because I was still in school and
Speaker 3: I could really see a rapid, rapid improvement.
Speaker 2: He he thought outside the box.
Speaker 3: He had had different training methods and I didn't believe
Speaker 3: in weight training at all. It was all body weight
Speaker 3: training and you know, handstands, and I mean some of
Speaker 3: the stuff has been has been reported, but he was
Speaker 3: he was definitely a different guy. And then he came
Speaker 3: to my parents' house and said, hey, I think he's
Speaker 3: he's got a lot of talent. If he if he
Speaker 3: if he wants to really go for it, you know,
Speaker 3: we can go for it, but I need him all in.
Speaker 3: And then that's when I quit tennis and went all
Speaker 3: in on basketball and started training, you know, every day.
Speaker 3: And he was my mentor basically my entire career and
Speaker 3: still friends obviously his day. He's almost eighty now, but
Speaker 3: he's doing well. He's still back home in Germany. So
Speaker 3: he helped me a lot in times where, you know,
Speaker 3: especially the first couple of years where stuff that wasn't
Speaker 3: going right. Jumper was gone for two three days straight.
Speaker 3: I'd call him up, he'd be on the plane, come
Speaker 3: over the next day. So he helped me through a
Speaker 3: ton and owe him a lot.
Speaker 5: Is he responsible for those spinning shots and the weird
Speaker 5: one what shot?
Speaker 2: For sure?
Speaker 3: He was responsible for all that. I mean, he taught
Speaker 3: me everything, how to shoot, how to move the dribble,
Speaker 3: to play the game. And he always said, listen, you
Speaker 3: might be tall, but you're not the most athletic. You're
Speaker 3: not build strong. He's like, if you just if you
Speaker 3: want to go to the NBA, you got to bring
Speaker 3: something new to the game. And that's why we kept
Speaker 3: working on the jump shot constantly, because he's like, you know,
Speaker 3: you're not going to be as athletics as the guys
Speaker 3: at the fours and five spots. You need to if
Speaker 3: you want to get a little bit of recognition there
Speaker 3: or make it, you have to bring something else to
Speaker 3: the table.
Speaker 2: And so, like I.
Speaker 3: Said, that was his vision outside of outside of the box,
Speaker 3: not not training like everybody else. And so I was
Speaker 3: always training with face to the basket, shooting three. He's
Speaker 3: trying to one or two dribble it up, and so
Speaker 3: that's that's how I started to learn how to play
Speaker 3: the game. And so later on then I felt completely uncomfortable.
Speaker 3: We'll get to that series later, but I wasn't comfortable
Speaker 3: playing with the back to the basket at all because
Speaker 3: all my all, my basically ever since I learned when
Speaker 3: I was fifteen, always faced the basket. So that's that's
Speaker 3: what all the stuff that Holbert taught me.
Speaker 2: You are.
Speaker 5: You've already been a big part of the culture because
Speaker 5: of your game, like we all, but when you married
Speaker 5: a sister, you know, you know how much we fell
Speaker 5: in love with.
Speaker 2: You, brod. It's crazy. I'm just saying, like, is that
Speaker 2: this great way it actually was.
Speaker 5: It actually was look right there right there actually yeah,
Speaker 5: but we real talking thought. You know, everybody's a fan
Speaker 5: of Dirt with the culture. Fell in love with you
Speaker 5: ten times when we married.
Speaker 1: Such talk about family, yeah, and what that means to
Speaker 1: you obviously you have three kids.
Speaker 2: Talked to us about that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's been a crazy journey. You know, off the floor,
Speaker 3: made some mistake as well. Uh yeah, well well documented documented. Yeah,
Speaker 3: but yeah, I ended up being being super lucky and
Speaker 3: I'm ed Jess at like a charity event and a
Speaker 3: bunch of a while ago, and then got married like
Speaker 3: right away.
Speaker 2: We're both ready for a.
Speaker 3: Family and shoot, were married last year was over to
Speaker 3: ten years or anyway. So three kids now they're ten,
Speaker 3: eight and six and you know, the oldest is a girl.
Speaker 3: Two boys, they're just there starting there. They're journey in
Speaker 3: sports with with tennis and soccer, and so it's been
Speaker 3: it's been fun and it makes me super proud of
Speaker 3: to just watch them, and it's a fatherhood and being married.
Speaker 3: It's it's been a dream of mine. It's been I'm
Speaker 3: enjoying every minion right now. They're in a great age
Speaker 3: and now I'm obviously done I'm retired, I have time.
Speaker 2: I don't have a boss. I can go to everything
Speaker 2: I want, and.
Speaker 3: So it's been we can travel the world, which we've done,
Speaker 3: you know, we have I'm from Germany and my wife
Speaker 3: is half Swedish, half Kenyon, so we go to Africa,
Speaker 3: we go to Sweden. So I want them to I
Speaker 3: want our kids to be global citizens and you know,
Speaker 3: speak different languages and travel the world. Whatever later on
Speaker 3: they get thrown into they can handle. And so it's
Speaker 3: been it's been a fun journey off the court with
Speaker 3: them the last couple of years since since retirement.
Speaker 1: Love It ninety eight Draft Heavy bibby Antoine Jamison, Vince Carter,
Speaker 1: Paul Pierce to name a few, What was your draft
Speaker 1: process like? And did you have to do a bunch
Speaker 1: of workouts? A couple of workouts? How many workouts you do?
Speaker 2: So I did? I had it?
Speaker 3: Actually none, I wasn't actually so at the time, No,
Speaker 3: I did.
Speaker 2: I did one.
Speaker 3: Well, obviously some NBA teams saw me here and then
Speaker 3: Donnie Nelson, who was assistant coach of the Maps. He
Speaker 3: was the assistant coach of the Hoop Heroes team that
Speaker 3: we talked about earlier. So he's obviously seen me up
Speaker 3: front and closed for like a week, and and then
Speaker 3: I did a workout for for the Boston Celtics, I
Speaker 3: think for Rick Pittinos somewhere, and he was in Italyan vacation,
Speaker 3: and so he saw me. I knew Dallas at the
Speaker 3: sixth pick. I knew Boston and the tenth pick at
Speaker 3: the time, and uh, but the rest was kind of
Speaker 3: up in the air because I told everybody I wasn't.
Speaker 2: I wasn't quite sure if I was ready for it.
Speaker 2: I was.
Speaker 3: I told him I might still pull out. I can
Speaker 3: still go to college, I don't have an agent, I
Speaker 3: can still stay in Europe. So I didn't even go
Speaker 3: to draft. I think our drafted at that year was
Speaker 3: in Toronto. I can't remember Vancouver. I think it was
Speaker 3: in Canada.
Speaker 2: And uh.
Speaker 3: I didn't go to the draft because I thought, there's
Speaker 3: no way somebody has actually taken me with with that
Speaker 3: risk of me not showing up and wasted top ten pick.
Speaker 3: And so I stayed in Germany. I trained all the
Speaker 3: way through and got a call in the middle of
Speaker 3: the night or olger my guy, got a call from
Speaker 3: Donn in the middle of the night, said hey, dal
Speaker 3: we picked you, and we're like what and uh, sure enough,
Speaker 3: Like literally a day or two days later, they flew
Speaker 3: in Donny Flu and Big Nelly, who you guys know
Speaker 3: I was the coach at the time in Rossboro Junior,
Speaker 3: who was the owner before Cubes. So they all came
Speaker 3: into my hometown of warts Burg and hang out for
Speaker 3: a couple of days and got to know my family
Speaker 3: and and they were like, listen, don't make a decision
Speaker 3: to say no before you I'm seeing Dallas and met
Speaker 3: some of the fellas. So they flew me in a
Speaker 3: couple of days after the draft. They got to meet
Speaker 3: Steve and Mike and some of the other players, and
Speaker 3: they were like, listen, we're not a great team. We're
Speaker 3: a young team, we're still growing, and you know, we
Speaker 3: just you know, there's no pressure on you. And and
Speaker 3: then I was like, you know what, Then they think
Speaker 3: there I could do it, and so I decided I'll come.
Speaker 2: So it was a big step for me.
Speaker 3: Uh of course, coming out of Germany, they haven't really
Speaker 3: played first division yet, and so that was a big
Speaker 3: jump from basically the second division of Germany to the NBA.
Speaker 3: I mean, it was quite the decision then and then
Speaker 3: there was a lockout ninety eight so I couldn't sign
Speaker 3: a contract. So that that allowed me to stay in
Speaker 3: Germany a couple almost six more months, got to train,
Speaker 3: got to play First Division from a home club because
Speaker 3: we had just gotten promoted. Those months were important for me.
Speaker 3: I think where I played some you know, some men
Speaker 3: and some had a little better competition every day and
Speaker 3: so and then yeah, summer in January, they called me
Speaker 3: and said the season is saved.
Speaker 2: And I was like, I.
Speaker 3: Was secretly hoping that there was the whole season right,
Speaker 3: secretly hoping I can have a whole year to train
Speaker 3: and get ready more and get a little more stronger.
Speaker 3: But sure enough they called me and they saved the season.
Speaker 3: So then I came over end of January, and then
Speaker 3: it was like from February till May, it was like
Speaker 3: a three months, crazy whirlwind season.
Speaker 2: So I was, uh, that was wild, but glad it.
Speaker 2: I'm glad I got through it.
Speaker 1: First impression of Big Nelly done.
Speaker 3: I mean, he was the master, mastermind was you know, honestly,
Speaker 3: I was lucky. I was lucky to get to a
Speaker 3: team where where he was. You know, I think back
Speaker 3: when I got started in the late nineties, there were
Speaker 3: not a lot of coaches that wanted big guys to
Speaker 3: shoot and pick and pop, and sometimes he brought the
Speaker 3: ball up. And you know, if I would have ended
Speaker 3: up somewhere else in another system, or even with Rick Patino,
Speaker 3: who helped me from the full court press, I don't
Speaker 3: think that. I don't think that that would have worked
Speaker 3: well for me. I think so I was in a
Speaker 3: perfect system with with Steve and Mike who supported me.
Speaker 2: So I was. I was really fortunate there.
Speaker 3: And and all Nelly was kind of doing was his
Speaker 3: place was super simple. I mean, you guys know, it
Speaker 3: was a high pick and roll, It was fisted up,
Speaker 3: it was a fist side, and then there was these
Speaker 3: elbow catches with some curls around and the rest was
Speaker 3: let him, let him play.
Speaker 1: So process is like the number one offense in the
Speaker 1: league for a lot of different teams. When he ran it,
Speaker 1: it was simple, but it got the job done. You
Speaker 1: were in the golden era of power forwards. Kevin Garnet,
Speaker 1: Him Duncan, Chris Weber, Rashid Wallas Been, Baker, Karl Malone, mcdce,
Speaker 1: Juwan Howard. I know we're forgetting some but yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: that's a hell of a That was the strongest position
Speaker 1: in the league, probably outside of center at the time.
Speaker 2: And what was it like for you early on?
Speaker 3: Oh man, it was it was tough every night I
Speaker 3: had to bring in and the good thing was on
Speaker 3: my defense. Obviously it was never great in my career,
Speaker 3: but at the beginning it was really terrible. So what
Speaker 3: they were doing is I would even if I would
Speaker 3: end up on one of these guys, they would just
Speaker 3: have me front, and so I had to work on
Speaker 3: my fronting. As soon as they crossed, like the little
Speaker 3: free throw line, try to post me, I would just
Speaker 3: try to wrestle my way around him. And as soon
Speaker 3: as they love, here comes Sean Bradley over in seven
Speaker 3: six and we'll kind of trap him. So that was
Speaker 3: that was one defensive strategy. And the other was just
Speaker 3: let the fives go out their force and I would
Speaker 3: guard the fives just because you know they're they're these
Speaker 3: guys were so good and they were I was a
Speaker 3: mismatch to all these guys.
Speaker 2: So you know, it's all Nelly.
Speaker 3: Coming up with with with defensive things that we can
Speaker 3: kind of get away with with me being on the court.
Speaker 3: And stretching the court on offense and and getting away
Speaker 3: with it on the defensive end. But at the end
Speaker 3: of the day, we still try to outscore, you know,
Speaker 3: Steve on the show, Finn posting up doing his all
Speaker 3: around game, and I'm running around shooting, and so those
Speaker 3: were some fun years.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 2: We had with Nick van Exell, and we had he
Speaker 2: was we had we had it. We had a good Nick,
Speaker 2: good squad.
Speaker 3: So but yeah, the power forward was loaded. And it
Speaker 3: also of course made me better because I knew I
Speaker 3: had to I had to bring my a game.
Speaker 2: Every night every night.
Speaker 1: Your first season you struggled a little bit. Second and
Speaker 1: third season you started to find your stride. You know,
Speaker 1: forty game, forty wins, fifty three wins. By year three
Speaker 1: you're at twenty two ten and shooting forty from the
Speaker 1: three point line, which is unheard of because as again,
Speaker 1: people your size aren't really shooting threes at that time.
Speaker 2: What clicked? Were you? What changed? Well?
Speaker 3: It was fortunately my second year. You know, they saw
Speaker 3: I was a little too slow for Actually I started
Speaker 3: being a small forward because they knew I can't go
Speaker 3: to any other power forwards. So I started small forward.
Speaker 3: And then that was tough to keep up though, so
Speaker 3: that they kind of saw, okay, this is not he's
Speaker 3: not really a small forward in this league, so let's
Speaker 3: try to play him a power forward. And then we
Speaker 3: had a guy named Gary Trent. You guys probably remember him.
Speaker 3: He was an ox so and he played amazing for
Speaker 3: us my rookie year, and then he was clearly the
Speaker 3: starter going in my second year, and which was totally fine.
Speaker 3: I think I would have come just off the bench.
Speaker 3: And then in pre season he tore his hamstring and
Speaker 3: so basically there were not a lot of other power
Speaker 3: forwards on the roster, so you know, we kind of
Speaker 3: had to make it work, and that's when we came
Speaker 3: up with all these defensive schemes. But then all of
Speaker 3: a sudden, my year two, I went from not starting
Speaker 3: in my first year to playing thirty thirty five minutes
Speaker 3: to night and confidence, you know, got to play through
Speaker 3: mistakes and learn from mistakes, and finally my language starting
Speaker 3: to catch up. Now I had a full training camp
Speaker 3: under me, I finally got an apartment in.
Speaker 2: The car, was fully settled.
Speaker 3: So I think all that I played in the year
Speaker 3: two where year one was just so quick, and I
Speaker 3: mean I had a rental car my whole year one.
Speaker 3: I didn't really have time to get settled even so
Speaker 3: that that all played in, felt more comfortable off the floor,
Speaker 3: and then had a lot of playing time, got to
Speaker 3: learn and make some mistakes and they fellas obviously helped
Speaker 3: me with everything. So that that was a big jump
Speaker 3: from year one to year two, and that that year
Speaker 3: two kind of set me up to keep going and
Speaker 3: keep getting better, and that gave me a lot of confidence.
Speaker 1: Real quick, jeffre you go, I want to say, hopefully
Speaker 1: this is you someone else. Did you not know how
Speaker 1: to use the A C in your car?
Speaker 2: That was you? Right?
Speaker 1: I heard a story about that summertime.
Speaker 2: Tell us about that.
Speaker 3: Well, you know, so I have my Year one. I
Speaker 3: just had a rental Rentald car because I was literally here.
Speaker 3: I knew I was here only for three months, and
Speaker 3: uh and so I was I was coming to Rentald.
Speaker 3: The guys were always killing me when I drop up
Speaker 3: in my little mini car. And then uh, yeah, it
Speaker 3: was going you know, the season was going longer. It
Speaker 3: was going into May, and it was already getting warm,
Speaker 3: and I'd come to the game and I had a
Speaker 3: couple of sweat drips on my forehead and they're like,
Speaker 3: where are you coming from? You know, you run in
Speaker 3: or something. And one day I'm like, nice, it's always hot.
Speaker 3: I've got to drive with my uh and roll down
Speaker 3: my windows it's so hot. And then something yeah, but
Speaker 3: they actually showed me. So there's this button that's a
Speaker 3: C and yeah, I didn't have that in my first
Speaker 3: car in Germany and I didn't have an A C.
Speaker 3: But and so I had no idea. I kept, you know,
Speaker 3: putting the fan up, but it was it was blowing
Speaker 3: warm air. So I always came to the game sweaty,
Speaker 3: and then until until upon the A C button, and
Speaker 3: that's uh change phenomena.
Speaker 5: I think it's called yogging with the soft JA.
Speaker 2: That's funny, yoggy. I gotta see ron Berg. Dennis Rodman
Speaker 2: had a brief stand here. What was that? Like? I
Speaker 2: was wild.
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm a big Chicago Bulls fan in the
Speaker 3: nineties there obviously, uh so he was. He was one
Speaker 3: of my heroes. And then you know, q S bought
Speaker 3: the team the second my second year, halfway through and
Speaker 3: he's like, you know, we need to make a splash here,
Speaker 3: we need to get on the map. This is a
Speaker 3: cowboys town and I want to bring the the Mavericks back.
Speaker 3: I think I'm gonna sign Dennis Rodman.
Speaker 2: Who were like, are you serious?
Speaker 3: But he ended up doing it and it was it
Speaker 3: was quite an experience, so he uh every time. So
Speaker 3: as a team meeting, we usually meet with Nelly, obviously
Speaker 3: with forty minutes before the game.
Speaker 2: So the first game we have.
Speaker 3: Dennis Robman, We're all kind of like excited he's starting.
Speaker 3: So forty minute rolls around. He gets up, Nell's about
Speaker 3: to start the film. Robin gets up and goes take
Speaker 3: a shower, like okay, so he comes back. He didn't
Speaker 3: see the video, he doesn't know the coverages, so he
Speaker 3: just goes out and kind of does Sometimes he squeezes,
Speaker 3: sometimes he hedges a little bit, sometimes he does nothing.
Speaker 3: So I was like, okay, maybe he just did it
Speaker 3: one time. Second game, forty minutes on o'clock, he gets
Speaker 3: up in showers, so he missed all the pregame meetings
Speaker 3: before the game and had no idea about the coverages
Speaker 3: that we're doing and kind of did his own thing,
Speaker 3: And I was like, that was just his routine. At
Speaker 3: forty minutes before the game, he was he was showering,
Speaker 3: and then and then after the game he would just
Speaker 3: put his own gear on and would go lift hard
Speaker 3: for like an hour and a half, two hours. Wouldn't wouldn't,
Speaker 3: wouldn't be with the team, would just be fine, fine,
Speaker 3: his his his workout room and he had his little
Speaker 3: workout coach, and then they were just lifting heavy for
Speaker 3: like an hour and a half after the game. And
Speaker 3: then he just put on a cowboy hat with these
Speaker 3: long feathers, didn't shower and just walked right out the arena.
Speaker 3: And it was and then media scrum would chasing him
Speaker 3: and he's and he's mumbling something is it was a
Speaker 3: comedy side show. And then it just wouldn't work. It
Speaker 3: wasn't working well that those couple of games he was here,
Speaker 3: and but it was definitely a splash.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know that the arena.
Speaker 3: Was full, and he got kicked out of one game.
Speaker 3: He sat on the court for a while and the
Speaker 3: rest didn't want to throw him out. I mean, there
Speaker 3: was a lot of stuff happened, which was a cool
Speaker 3: experience for me, I guess as a young guy growing up,
Speaker 3: but it just basketball wise, it just unfortunately didn't work.
Speaker 2: How did you get your signature.
Speaker 3: Move well, I think I started shooting that later. You know,
Speaker 3: in the twenties, you have the power, somebody's crowded, you
Speaker 3: try to rip through and get the basket, get fouled
Speaker 3: a lot. And just as I gotten older, I lost
Speaker 3: the step and you know, I didn't want to do
Speaker 3: all the grinding get fouled, So I looked for for
Speaker 3: a shot that I can do with without a lot
Speaker 3: of you know, effort.
Speaker 2: You know I'm tall.
Speaker 3: It was just one or two bumps and lean back.
Speaker 3: I knew nobody can get to the shot. So that's
Speaker 3: really how I started shooting a little bit at the beginning.
Speaker 3: And you know, of course I had the support from
Speaker 3: the coaches because you know, not a lot of guys
Speaker 3: wanted to shoot a one leg fade away, but you know,
Speaker 3: they saw it go in a little bit, and I
Speaker 3: was practicing it a little bit, and so I started
Speaker 3: shooting and mostly that that year we actually had the
Speaker 3: championship run and things were going really well there and
Speaker 3: I made most of them. So I was like, okay,
Speaker 3: this is a good weapon for me going forward, because
Speaker 3: you know, guys was really starting to crowd me because
Speaker 3: losses to a step or two and then uh, this
Speaker 3: was just a way for me to still stay efficient
Speaker 3: and and and still be a decent score even in
Speaker 3: old age.
Speaker 2: He's a decent kind of right.
Speaker 1: Uh oh three, you hurt your knee in game for
Speaker 1: how tough is that? I mean, obviously changed the series dramatically,
Speaker 1: uh mentally kind of your first injury in the n
Speaker 1: B A big injury in the n B. A.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was terrible.
Speaker 3: We were That was the year when we had Van
Speaker 3: Exel and he was he was amazing for him to
Speaker 3: believe we had we had a fun crew that year.
Speaker 3: I still think you guys would have been us, honestly.
Speaker 3: I mean you guys were were so solid and with
Speaker 3: with Timmy and and everybody. I mean, I still don't
Speaker 3: think even if I'm healthy, we win that series. But
Speaker 3: at least seven it would it would have been It
Speaker 3: would have been interesting. It would have been interesting. I think,
Speaker 3: like we had such a we had such a good run,
Speaker 3: but they were so jugging out on defense that our
Speaker 3: offense never really clicked the way we wanted it because
Speaker 3: they were so smart, well coached, and you know, Timmy
Speaker 3: in the middle, and so I'm not sure we would
Speaker 3: have beaten, you guys, But that was brutal to sit there,
Speaker 3: and I think it was monoil. I fell into my
Speaker 3: knee and I just sprained my knee, and I wanted
Speaker 3: to play so bad the next game. And then actually
Speaker 3: I even went to the pregame workout and I looked okay,
Speaker 3: And that's where actually Nelly and Cuban went into it,
Speaker 3: got in a little bit and they were never on
Speaker 3: the same page again. I think Cubes wanted me to
Speaker 3: play the way I worked out pregame, and Nelly was like, listen,
Speaker 3: he's twenty three longer, long career had him, I'm not
Speaker 3: going to play him, and so they didn't see Eyda
Speaker 3: I actually ever since after that. So but yeah, going
Speaker 3: back now, I think it was the right decision not
Speaker 3: to play because I was so young, and even just
Speaker 3: standing there watching some of the game, I felt my
Speaker 3: knee was getting a little weak, a little sore, and
Speaker 3: so I think it was the right decision not to play.
Speaker 2: But of course it was. I mean, it was tough we.
Speaker 5: Put him in the game playing game six because they
Speaker 5: they were saying he was going he was saying he
Speaker 5: was going to play, and it was game six.
Speaker 2: We just knew he was going to play, he didn't
Speaker 2: put that uniform. And then we had remember we had
Speaker 2: Wald Williams.
Speaker 3: After every three he gave a shake and then we
Speaker 3: were up going to fourth like fifteen points, and there
Speaker 3: comes Steve Kerr. I don't know, we didn't have him
Speaker 3: on the on the radar at all, and he came
Speaker 3: in and we obviously trapped Timmy every.
Speaker 2: Time down and.
Speaker 3: Then Steve had like four or five. Hasn't played all year. Again,
Speaker 3: it was the whole bang game too. Yeah, I don't
Speaker 3: think he played that playoffs, the whole Steve I'm not sure,
Speaker 3: but he did. He comes in drains four threes and
Speaker 3: completely changed the game. And that was That was a
Speaker 3: tough one. And maybe I would have tried to play
Speaker 3: in seven, but well, we'll never know.
Speaker 2: But like I said, you guys were I had twenty
Speaker 2: three a game. Yeah, easy, twenty three. You went out there,
Speaker 2: so it was cool.
Speaker 1: Six up too, oh against Miami in the finals and
Speaker 1: d Wade and Sheck company come back when you guys
Speaker 1: and went four straight.
Speaker 2: What was that like? Mentally?
Speaker 3: Well, you know, there were a couple of low points
Speaker 3: in my career. That was definitely one of them. You know,
Speaker 3: we left here to oh feeling good. The Dallas Morning
Speaker 3: News and newspaper here had the parade route or in
Speaker 3: the paper. Wow, so it's big enough a jink.
Speaker 2: So you can't do that.
Speaker 3: You can't you can't do that. But we were we
Speaker 3: were kind of going down there. Things are going well,
Speaker 3: we think we're going to win this, and then we're
Speaker 3: still played well in game three and we were still
Speaker 3: up with like a couple of minutes ago, we were
Speaker 3: we were still up, and then uh, you know, we
Speaker 3: ended up losing that game, and then things kind of.
Speaker 2: Just fell apart. I think we're still too young.
Speaker 3: We were quite ready for that stage, and that was
Speaker 3: really that was the way it's coming out party. I mean,
Speaker 3: he was unguardable, picking rolls, getting to the basket at
Speaker 3: will and starting to make some shots. We couldn't keep
Speaker 3: him in front of us, and so, uh, yeah, we
Speaker 3: ended up losing, got blown out in game four, switched
Speaker 3: hotels before game five. Avery snapped on us after game four,
Speaker 3: it's like too much family here.
Speaker 2: I went out.
Speaker 3: So we moved somewhere to fund Lauderdale and uh and
Speaker 3: try to stop the bleeding, and then lost a close
Speaker 3: one in Game five again and then lost it here
Speaker 3: in game six. So you know, I was, I was
Speaker 3: really frustrated disappointed, But honestly I was I was thinking, Okay,
Speaker 3: I'm I'm in my prime, I'm ready for this, and
Speaker 3: we're going to be back. We have a good team.
Speaker 3: We're bringing the same team back again next year. And
Speaker 3: uh so I wasn't as disappointed in O six.
Speaker 2: As as I actually was in O seven.
Speaker 5: But looking back at that though, do you see something
Speaker 5: that you could have switched after game too to make
Speaker 5: that series go indifferently?
Speaker 2: I'm man at it. Yeah, I don't know, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I mean, like I said, d Wade was was incredible
Speaker 3: that series.
Speaker 2: Uh, I don't know if we could have.
Speaker 3: Trapped them more trying to keep them out the lane,
Speaker 3: I'm not sure. But their role players started to play
Speaker 3: better too, and and you know they had Entin Walker
Speaker 3: and Gary Payton and Posey that that's some good players.
Speaker 3: And then you know, they started to get more confidence
Speaker 3: after that first win and they started to play better,
Speaker 3: shoot better from the outside. You know, Haslam is a
Speaker 3: great player. Always had a lot of respect for him.
Speaker 3: He's He's probably one of the guys that guarded me
Speaker 3: best throughout my career. So they had they had a
Speaker 3: good team, and so which if we finished that game
Speaker 3: three off with a little more experience, I think that
Speaker 3: then we have it. But since we let them, we
Speaker 3: let them get some life and get some they got
Speaker 3: hyped and and and played even harder, and then you
Speaker 3: know that's yeah, the rest was history.
Speaker 1: Next season MVP sixty plus wins. Nelly took this personal,
Speaker 1: like we weren't even supposed to be in the playoffs,
Speaker 1: but he said, if we get in the playoffs, we're
Speaker 1: going to play Dallas and we're gonna beat him.
Speaker 2: And that's all I care about life.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he quit. I don't quits a big well,
Speaker 1: he might have checked out after he didn't give a
Speaker 1: damn after that. So that that season again, Hughes sixty
Speaker 1: five win, sixty seven wins, sixty eight wins.
Speaker 2: Sixty seven seven wins.
Speaker 1: You're the MVP one verse eight, What is your thought
Speaker 1: going into that series?
Speaker 2: Verse?
Speaker 1: Because we actually played you guys well that season, although
Speaker 1: we were out of the mix at the time, we
Speaker 1: played you guys well.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So where's and O six? Like I said, I
Speaker 3: wasn't that frustrated. Of course, I was a little disappointed,
Speaker 3: as I was like, I'm in my prime. Next year
Speaker 3: we're coming in where we have the same team, We're
Speaker 3: going to roll. Started season off one to four win
Speaker 3: in a double overtime in Phoenix. We're about to go
Speaker 3: on five and we win and then roll the rest
Speaker 3: of the season. It was just one of those roles
Speaker 3: where like we're on the road somewhere down the fourth
Speaker 3: quarter and we just looked at each other and Jet
Speaker 3: like where we're going to We're gonna come up with this.
Speaker 3: We're gonna get some big starts and we need him
Speaker 3: and we're going to just find some offense and give
Speaker 3: the ball to me and Jet and we'll make it happen.
Speaker 3: So there was We had a crazy amount of confidence
Speaker 3: during that whole season and then here come the Warriors,
Speaker 3: and I didn't we didn't love playing you guys.
Speaker 2: I gotta say it's that was. That was a tough matchup.
Speaker 2: That was. Yeah, you could laugh. I wish I could lay.
Speaker 2: We didn't love playing Yeah, I wish I could laugh.
Speaker 2: Now you were.
Speaker 3: You guys were a tough matchup for us. Not only
Speaker 3: did Nellie know every every strength of ours since he
Speaker 3: coached us and he knew exactly.
Speaker 2: What to do.
Speaker 5: Bro, I had tape on you just you your moves
Speaker 5: just up to about thirty minutes.
Speaker 2: Is just your tape, bro.
Speaker 3: Well, there were a lot of move There was always
Speaker 3: going left. You always said you can only you can
Speaker 3: only go left. No, But you also had a lot
Speaker 3: of teams obviously had the blueprint, but they didn't have
Speaker 3: the personnel.
Speaker 2: To pull it off.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you guys had a small team that always gave
Speaker 3: me problems and other problems. You guys are running in
Speaker 3: the post. Usually I can catch on anybody. We had
Speaker 3: a tough time getting the ball to me. Passed it
Speaker 3: first of all. Then every time I drove one way
Speaker 3: and I spun where I came the trappin, He's gonna
Speaker 3: I like shooting out of my spin.
Speaker 2: So then when I.
Speaker 3: We didn't have a great shooting team, or we didn't
Speaker 3: have a great passing team. So both of these things,
Speaker 3: you guys just just took advantage of.
Speaker 2: It. Was it was tough.
Speaker 3: I couldn't stop the bleeding. I didn't I didn't shoot well.
Speaker 3: I mean that was That was probably my worst playoff
Speaker 3: series that I've played. And all the credit obviously to
Speaker 3: you guys. And that was that was tough. And then
Speaker 3: I took seven almost harder than six, because you know,
Speaker 3: maybe I had such high expectations.
Speaker 2: We beat the Spurs like three out of four that
Speaker 2: the year.
Speaker 3: Mind, I'm saying, we're we're winning the championship that year,
Speaker 3: and and I had so much made so much pressure
Speaker 3: on myself, and then maybe maybe I was even froze
Speaker 3: up a little bit too much.
Speaker 2: I didn't play loose.
Speaker 3: Against you guys and have fun, and so that was
Speaker 3: that was one of that was one of the toughest.
Speaker 3: I felt like almost embarrassed for for a couple of weeks.
Speaker 3: I didn't want to leave my house. I didn't want
Speaker 3: to go to the m v P ceremony.
Speaker 2: Take the m v P. You know, usually back in
Speaker 2: the days, the m.
Speaker 3: V P ceremony was during the second round, during the pregame.
Speaker 3: We didn't have a game anymore, so I had to
Speaker 3: put a pseudo on and go down there, and it
Speaker 3: was just it was just awkward. I didn't want to
Speaker 3: be there. So every time I see my m v
Speaker 3: P trophy not at home, it's unfortunately in my mind,
Speaker 3: I think you guys, I think all the smoke.
Speaker 2: When I see my my.
Speaker 1: Dumb hair or something at the wall in Oracle.
Speaker 2: Because I've never heard the story how that happened.
Speaker 3: So I'm I'm always I was just pissed off. I'm
Speaker 3: not quite sure how it happened. Somebody said it was
Speaker 3: a trash can. Uh, somebody said it was a chair.
Speaker 3: I don't think a trash can could actually make a
Speaker 3: hole like this, so I I can actually can't remember.
Speaker 2: How it happened. But yeah, afterwards, somebody said, yeah on
Speaker 2: the wall.
Speaker 1: And they hung we believe Jersey up next to like
Speaker 1: the mass.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was there forever it was different, which was great.
Speaker 2: I mean, you guys had had a fun team.
Speaker 1: I think you know, with all due respect you winning
Speaker 1: MVP as good as your team, you came back with
Speaker 1: the different you were different the next year though. We
Speaker 1: felt like like we like we helped you.
Speaker 2: You came back a different dirt.
Speaker 3: Well, you know, as it is in life, you have
Speaker 3: to learn from from tough situations, from tough tough moments,
Speaker 3: and I felt like, you know, you guys pushed me
Speaker 3: to be better a little bit with my back to
Speaker 3: the basket. You know that was I mentioned it earlier.
Speaker 3: I always liked to face like to drive and then spend.
Speaker 3: It was just a little too predictable. So you know,
Speaker 3: I said, you have to add, you have to add
Speaker 3: more to your game. You have to work car the
Speaker 3: summer and be a better be better leader, and more
Speaker 3: complete players. So I got a lot more comfortable, you know,
Speaker 3: posting up then and even if it was free throw
Speaker 3: line or or down the box, and I would never
Speaker 3: even still then I would not.
Speaker 2: Out muscle you and get to the basket.
Speaker 3: But I was more comfortable there operating in that area
Speaker 3: and shooting over smaller guys, shooting fadeaways. And then the
Speaker 3: one legger came and so I think, yeah, you guys
Speaker 3: forced me to get back in the lab and and
Speaker 3: get better and push and and I always say, without
Speaker 3: the disappointments in O six and O seven, I wouldn't
Speaker 3: have been the closer and.
Speaker 2: Eleven, I think that's that's very true.
Speaker 3: You know, you have to go through tough times and
Speaker 3: and and learn from from some tough mistakes and and
Speaker 3: and get better. And so that was you guys pushed
Speaker 3: me to be to be better.
Speaker 1: So eight and ten, you guys are building. You bring
Speaker 1: in Jason Kidd, tricks, Sean Mary and Paysia Karan who
Speaker 1: doesn't help you get down the stretch run.
Speaker 2: Because he gets hurt over a big piece.
Speaker 1: Rick Carlisle as well, what are all those pieces being
Speaker 1: to you?
Speaker 3: So actually when we made I was like, okay, oh seven,
Speaker 3: we still had the best team going to A eight.
Speaker 3: We lose to you guys, but we're we won sixty
Speaker 3: seven games, we're straight, we're good. And then the oaits
Speaker 3: even started and stuff is just not going as well,
Speaker 3: and it actually shows don't take stuff for granted. Man,
Speaker 3: Sometimes things can change in a heartbeat within one season.
Speaker 3: You know, all of a sudden, we're not right there anymore.
Speaker 3: We're not with the best team. All of a sudden,
Speaker 3: teams have passed us by. And then our window from
Speaker 3: six and seven all of a sudden looked closed. And
Speaker 3: so things were going well at all in the wait season,
Speaker 3: and then we did the trade at that also game
Speaker 3: for Jake Kidd.
Speaker 2: We felt like his leadership is.
Speaker 3: Is you know, like I mentioned earlier, weren't great passing,
Speaker 3: We were on great, great playmaking. We had some good
Speaker 3: scores at the guard, but not not getting everybody involved playmakers.
Speaker 3: And so we made the deal for for j Kid
Speaker 3: at the All Star Game, and and that didn't pan
Speaker 3: out that we wanted to at the beginning either. So
Speaker 3: they were in eight to ten, there was there were
Speaker 3: a lot of changes. You know, we still had Avery
Speaker 3: when uh, when Jay Kidd first came, and then you know,
Speaker 3: Carla took over, I believe in the eight or nine season.
Speaker 3: Then we did the big trade with with Washington to
Speaker 3: bring in Heywood d Steve who was crazy and uh
Speaker 3: and uh of course Karan and so they fit in well,
Speaker 3: and all of a sudden, you know, there the windows
Speaker 3: open again.
Speaker 2: We felt like we had a good team.
Speaker 3: We had some veterans and yeah, and going into that
Speaker 3: you know, ten to eleven season, we felt like we
Speaker 3: had a good team. I don't think we were necessarily favorites,
Speaker 3: but we felt like we had some veterans and we.
Speaker 2: Had a good start to the season.
Speaker 3: And then I got hurt right around Christmas time, and
Speaker 3: then so I was out. I was hurt, and then
Speaker 3: New Year's Day, I'll never forget. We're in Milwaukee, that's
Speaker 3: where Karan is from, and I'm sitting out in a
Speaker 3: suit because I'm not playing, and Karan goes up for
Speaker 3: a rebound and just screams and lays on the ground
Speaker 3: and I'm so, we're all rushing over there, and I
Speaker 3: see literally he tore his patel attendant and his his
Speaker 3: kneecap had dislocated, so it sat, it sat on top
Speaker 3: on his skigh. I'm like, I'm trying to dry heath.
Speaker 2: It was.
Speaker 3: It was nasty, and so our trainer was like, oh
Speaker 3: my god, we need wheelchair. Wheelchair And that was one
Speaker 3: of the toughest things I was saying. I mean, Kuran,
Speaker 3: it's pretty tough. So he heard wheelchair and he's from Wisconsin.
Speaker 3: His grandmother was there, his family. He's like, I'm not
Speaker 3: I'm not getting out here in a wheelchair. So he's
Speaker 3: like I watched him push his kneecap down by himself
Speaker 3: and he gets up and starts hopping. You know how
Speaker 3: in the old Milwaukee arena that was to go back
Speaker 3: to the locker, and he walked out on his own power.
Speaker 3: I said, this, this guy, this guy is built different.
Speaker 3: And uh but then you know, here we go again.
Speaker 3: We think in our our windows closing, you know, losing up.
Speaker 3: He was probably our second best scar. I think he
Speaker 3: was our second best scorer the year. And so we're like,
Speaker 3: oh god, here it goes again. Right, It's just a
Speaker 3: bunch of bad luck. And but I would say that
Speaker 3: he he motivated us, inspired us the way he wanted
Speaker 3: to come back and fought and attacked rehab. I mean
Speaker 3: he was almost ready to play in that in that
Speaker 3: final series in eleven.
Speaker 2: I mean he was. He was a beast.
Speaker 3: And every day watching him, how he how he handled himself,
Speaker 3: how he attacked that rehab, That that really motivated us,
Speaker 3: and that that inspired us for that ten to eleven run.
Speaker 2: Blazers Lakers, Okay see Miami.
Speaker 5: Twenty eight points were gained, forty nine percent field goal,
Speaker 5: forty throw line gee Woolakers took down Kobe kat and
Speaker 5: Lebron We call that as you know, on one, he
Speaker 5: was definitely on one.
Speaker 2: Well what mind frame will you win?
Speaker 3: We had a good run, you know, I started. We
Speaker 3: started against Portland. They they gave us some problems there.
Speaker 3: Yeah that Marcus roy b roy still they had they
Speaker 3: had a good team, they were they were smart. Uh,
Speaker 3: and so we didn't play the well there. We almost
Speaker 3: lost one at home and I took us, we took
Speaker 3: us well to get going. And then I felt like
Speaker 3: we lost both both games in Portland and it was
Speaker 3: it was two two coming back here, and that's still
Speaker 3: I remember to this day. I was like, we're not
Speaker 3: going to lose to them. We're not going to lose
Speaker 3: Game five on our home court. And I don't know
Speaker 3: why I said that to I usually don't say much
Speaker 3: in the team meetings and stuff. I'm a quiet guy.
Speaker 3: Let the coaches do their thing. But that day, I'm like,
Speaker 3: even in the pregame meeting, I was like, they're they're
Speaker 3: not beating us.
Speaker 2: Where we got that, you know, you know what they do.
Speaker 2: Your teammate to hear Dirk say that, you.
Speaker 5: In the back of the locker room quires, no, it
Speaker 5: ain't beating us today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, everybody. Yeah, I just felt that.
Speaker 3: I just felt that because in Game four we were
Speaker 3: up like twenty and b Roy made that magical run
Speaker 3: and they beat us, and I just had that that's
Speaker 3: not going to happen again. And so and then from
Speaker 3: there we started a role. We started a roll. We
Speaker 3: won Game five at home, beat them in game six,
Speaker 3: went straight down to LA and stole a miracle Game
Speaker 3: one where Kobe was like hot at like forty I
Speaker 3: think it could seem like he couldn't miss, and we
Speaker 3: basically stole that one at the buzzer and from there,
Speaker 3: I don't know, we just we just got confidence was
Speaker 3: getting better, and we had the roles were defined perfectly right.
Speaker 3: You had you had Tricks and Kid and Tyson. They
Speaker 3: were the defenders right on offense, we knew Jet and
Speaker 3: I and JJ we were going to wheel and deal
Speaker 3: and do our thing, and obviously we had some shooters,
Speaker 3: but I felt like we're our roles were perfectly defined,
Speaker 3: and we had, you know, a great bench that we
Speaker 3: can change the tempo.
Speaker 2: A little bit.
Speaker 3: So uh yeah, I don't know. It was just a
Speaker 3: magical time. We had Pager that we signed somewhere in February,
Speaker 3: I think we got bought out in Toronto and we
Speaker 3: took a chance on it. He did it looked like
Speaker 3: he could play with his back, and he rehabed for
Speaker 3: two three months every day and then gave us unbelievable
Speaker 3: ron there made some huge shots in the Lakers and
Speaker 3: Okay Ce series, and so everything that we did that
Speaker 3: year kind of panned out, and I know it's fortunate.
Speaker 1: I guess you guys ended up getting to the top
Speaker 1: of the mountain on a hell of a journey. Were
Speaker 1: there ever times Cube talked about it at some point
Speaker 1: in your career, trying to get Paul Pierce, trying to
Speaker 1: get Kobe. Was there ever a time you possibly thought
Speaker 1: about hitting the market or possibly playing for someone else?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, so I four years was the rookie deal,
Speaker 3: and then basically right right in the my last year,
Speaker 3: I believe on my rookie deal, I signed a max
Speaker 3: deal signed just you know, the same deal that Vince
Speaker 3: signed back in the days, and Paul we signed a
Speaker 3: six year deal. And then I wasn't I TDT really
Speaker 3: hit free agency till my tenth year in the league,
Speaker 3: So I was I think I was free agents there
Speaker 3: in twenty ten and right before actually the championship year,
Speaker 3: and you know, I didn't want to go anywhere.
Speaker 2: I loved it here.
Speaker 3: It's been ten years, but you know, do you think about, hey,
Speaker 3: are we ever going to get back to the stage.
Speaker 3: And so I went to since I really didn't have
Speaker 3: an agent. Hold girl was helping me with some of
Speaker 3: that stuff, but I didn't have an agent, So I
Speaker 3: just went over to Mark's Houston. We sat down on
Speaker 3: his couch and you know, just reminisced and talk for like,
Speaker 3: you know, two hours on what we've done and how
Speaker 3: fun this run was, and I said, okay, let's let's
Speaker 3: run it back.
Speaker 2: And then.
Speaker 3: Both got a little emotional talking about the old days.
Speaker 3: And then I ended up signing that four year deal,
Speaker 3: and then we ended up winning the championship and in
Speaker 3: year one and so it's yeah, it worked out perfect.
Speaker 3: And then of course I knew I wasn't gonna go
Speaker 3: anywhere after winning the championship. That would have been the
Speaker 3: only reason to go somewhere at the end to chase
Speaker 3: something or maybe chase a ring. But since since we
Speaker 3: got it done here, I never I never had to
Speaker 3: do that.
Speaker 2: Luca.
Speaker 1: He came in your last season, extremely talented. We talked
Speaker 1: about off camera, Jack, did did you see this? You're like,
Speaker 1: I don't know if we saw to this extent, but
Speaker 1: he's been special. What is your relationship with him like?
Speaker 1: And what how's it been just being able to see
Speaker 1: him play night in, night out.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So when once we uh, my my end of career
Speaker 3: wasn't pretty. You know, we're struggling. There was some talk
Speaker 3: of tanking going on, and you know, just things didn't
Speaker 3: go well here for this franchise and uh, and we
Speaker 3: needed a little spark blog to change things. And uh
Speaker 3: and here I didn't I didn't think that was gonna.
Speaker 2: Be this kid. I didn't think it was going to
Speaker 2: be this kid.
Speaker 3: When he walked in the first time here in this
Speaker 3: practic facility, you know, he looked, he's sick.
Speaker 2: He's a big boy.
Speaker 3: But I'm like, I'm not sure this is gonna work.
Speaker 3: Is he quick enough? Is he athletic enough to go
Speaker 3: by guys like he is in Europe? And so there
Speaker 3: were there were plenty of doubts there from from everybody
Speaker 3: on the team. And you know how you meet already
Speaker 3: before training camp starts. Uh, you know, you meet a
Speaker 3: month before and you hoop every day and you work
Speaker 3: out together. And so guys were trying to test him
Speaker 3: a little bit and you know, foul him a little
Speaker 3: bit here and there, and there scrimmages and and you
Speaker 3: can already see that this kid's got something about him.
Speaker 3: He's got that swag. He knows how to play. He
Speaker 3: was he was getting some in one mixtape, passes out
Speaker 3: of nowhere, and I'm like, he was, he was flashing
Speaker 3: some of the talent. So we were we were we
Speaker 3: were thinking, man, he's he's going to be a really
Speaker 3: good player.
Speaker 2: But I didn't think he was going to go to
Speaker 2: that levels, right, I mean, he's a couple. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I think it was last season or before he averaged
Speaker 3: triple double for an entire month. I mean, I didn't
Speaker 3: see that coming. So in my first year, unfortunately my
Speaker 3: last my last year, his first year, I was I
Speaker 3: was hurt a lot. I missed the first thirty forty games,
Speaker 3: so I didn't really get to spend you know, I
Speaker 3: didn't even go on road trips the first couple of months,
Speaker 3: so that was a little tough. I didn't really get
Speaker 3: to spend as much time around him as I wanted to.
Speaker 3: But I mean that was his time to shine.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: We looked to him and he he you know, he
Speaker 3: took the took the ball and took it from there.
Speaker 3: And yeah, just really proud of how he developed and
Speaker 3: my role with him. I guess we're we're friends where
Speaker 3: we're cool, we're you know, when I'm town, we go
Speaker 3: to dinners or whatever. Mento would be a little strong
Speaker 3: because he doesn't really need me. I mean he's he's
Speaker 3: as you guys see, he's he plays like a thirty
Speaker 3: two year old veteran. Now he reads the game, how
Speaker 3: he carries himself on the court, And I mean I didn't.
Speaker 2: Really I wish.
Speaker 3: I would love to say I helped him and talk
Speaker 3: to him about it, but it's just the guy just came.
Speaker 3: He's been a pro since he's like eleven years old,
Speaker 3: and that's how he it's the game like there's nothing
Speaker 3: can rattle him during the game, and he just does
Speaker 3: his thing and and and so his his development has
Speaker 3: been incredible, and I didn't think he couldet better from
Speaker 3: year to ear, but he's he's still showing it and
Speaker 3: I'm super happy for him.
Speaker 2: How you do anything is how you do everything. That's
Speaker 2: cute saying talk about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean Mark obviously has been a big influence
Speaker 3: on my career and my life as well. Uh he
Speaker 3: bought the team in my second year, and we've developed
Speaker 3: a great friendship and relationship and uh he was always
Speaker 3: my number one supporter when stuff was going right. Uh
Speaker 3: even off the floor, he was there helping me out
Speaker 3: with stuff and uh so he was a big influence
Speaker 3: for me and he was always loyal to me. So yeah,
Speaker 3: we've we've had a great friendship. I mean, I say
Speaker 3: this all the time. How many owners go to.
Speaker 2: Their best players bachelor party in Vegas? But he he
Speaker 2: was there.
Speaker 3: Bit yeah, so we had a special bond and relationship
Speaker 3: and so yeah, and that's at the beginning. He was
Speaker 3: literally so fired up when he bought the team. He
Speaker 3: was at every practice, at every road game, he was
Speaker 3: sitting in the players section, on the on the plane
Speaker 3: and so he was he was constantly around. And his
Speaker 3: energy and and you know, his savviness is the way
Speaker 3: he cares himself kind of also obviously carried over to
Speaker 3: the team. So he was he was a big influence
Speaker 3: on being on the Mavericks sport.
Speaker 1: He said something that kind of surprised me when he
Speaker 1: said when he first got the team because it was
Speaker 1: new to him. So he said, guys like you and
Speaker 1: Steve and Mike kind of helped him learn the ropes
Speaker 1: and what it's like in the locker room and how
Speaker 1: players like things and and it was refreshing for me
Speaker 1: to hear, because you think, someone who's got a bunch
Speaker 1: of money and this is my team or my way.
Speaker 1: He was more really almost like a player's owner, so
Speaker 1: to speak, as far as kind of getting to really
Speaker 1: know what you guys like and dislike.
Speaker 3: He yeah, he changed everything, you know, And when when
Speaker 3: I first got here, you know, we were doing the
Speaker 3: bare minimum. We were staying you know, Mary Odds and
Speaker 3: all that, and we had the flight flights that everybody had,
Speaker 3: those old planes. And then he was like, okay, we
Speaker 3: need to change some stuff around. I want to I
Speaker 3: want to put I want free agents to come here
Speaker 3: and look at Dallas as the spot to be. And
Speaker 3: so he just started to turn everything around. Money at
Speaker 3: that point at the beginning didn't matter at all. He
Speaker 3: bought a new plane, he built a new arena. We
Speaker 3: started to stay at these nice hotels. We started have
Speaker 3: good catering after we didn't have any food.
Speaker 2: My first cater for the team. Yeah, we started that.
Speaker 3: He wanted to show basically the visiting teams, hey, you know,
Speaker 3: we take care of you guys here.
Speaker 2: It's just imagine what it's like.
Speaker 3: He just planning a little seed, you know, Hey, hey guys,
Speaker 3: we will take care of you guys here. So and
Speaker 3: so he was just like I said, resources were not
Speaker 3: the problem. He put everything in and he took care
Speaker 3: of his players, and he took him made that trade
Speaker 3: with Washington when we got jrew On where we took
Speaker 3: a bunch of money back and it cost us a
Speaker 3: ton of money for him, obviously, but he showed I'm
Speaker 3: willing to pay whatever I wanted to win, and so
Speaker 3: that was a fun atmosphere I think for US players
Speaker 3: to be around. And I always say I had a
Speaker 3: fun time playing my twenty one years, But those first
Speaker 3: couple of years when when you're part of something, you're
Speaker 3: turning it around. We were garbage for a whole decade
Speaker 3: in the nineties, and then slowly, surely Steve, Mike and
Speaker 3: I we get better. We turn things around. You see that,
Speaker 3: you know stuff is happening. People get excited in the city.
Speaker 3: Those are some of the best years I had in
Speaker 3: the NBA.
Speaker 2: Really dope.
Speaker 5: I was always I was almost your teammate in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 5: Oh no almost, So we heard you beat up the trade.
Speaker 2: Thanks, I must have detailed that before.
Speaker 1: Obviously, thank you for your time.
Speaker 2: Before we get to these quick hitters.
Speaker 1: Obviously, when you're in the mix and you're almost on
Speaker 1: the Hampshire wielder in your career, you never get to
Speaker 1: kind of sit back and appreciate, you know what you've accomplished.
Speaker 1: You know, you've been removed for a handful of years now,
Speaker 1: like when you look back on your career, like, what
Speaker 1: what do you think about? When comes to your mind?
Speaker 3: It's been a heck of a ride, and it's very
Speaker 3: fortunate obviously to be here and being stay in one
Speaker 3: spot and you know, stay stay sort of you know,
Speaker 3: injury free throughout my whole ride. So it's been, Yeah,
Speaker 3: it's been. I was blessed and as one as an
Speaker 3: incredible ride and to me, topped it off this summer
Speaker 3: with the Hall of Fame. I think now to me
Speaker 3: that that was sort of the closure. My first half
Speaker 3: of my life is over with this and couldn't have
Speaker 3: gone any better, honestly, you know. So I'm extremely happy
Speaker 3: and of course proud, and my family is super proud
Speaker 3: of out of Germany, I was able to play in
Speaker 3: the NBA for twenty one year. It's been a hell
Speaker 3: of a ride. And we'll see what the next chapter
Speaker 3: looks like.
Speaker 5: Now, how does it feel to be the best U
Speaker 5: up in play ever?
Speaker 3: Well, you know, now it's gonna be tough, you know,
Speaker 3: to keep that as you are, Yeah, keep that up
Speaker 3: now with the with the generation that we have coming now.
Speaker 3: I mean, but it's it's yeah, it's it's if before
Speaker 3: me there were some fun European players. Shremp was one
Speaker 3: of my idol songs from Josh and Petrovitch was a
Speaker 3: stud Kukach. I mean there there were great players. And
Speaker 3: then you know, if if if I came in and
Speaker 3: Tony Parker Gasol, if we came in and sort of
Speaker 3: helped these other guys now a little bit, or inspired.
Speaker 2: Them in a way or motivated them in a.
Speaker 3: Way, that that's that's obviously thrilling and humbling to hear.
Speaker 3: So if we were part of somebody else's journey, and uh,
Speaker 3: that's that's been amazing. And now we have you know,
Speaker 3: j and Joker and Bro.
Speaker 2: On the back. Bro you killed in the NBA for
Speaker 2: a long time.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this was a Yeah, it was a long time.
Speaker 3: But like I said, it's been so many opened the
Speaker 3: door for me, and if I pushed the door open
Speaker 3: even a little wider, then that's that's humbling.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, quick hitters, first thing to come to mind,
Speaker 1: let us know and we'll get you out of here.
Speaker 1: The biggest risk you've ever taken.
Speaker 2: No question, coming to the NBA.
Speaker 3: Coming out on yourself though, coming out of the second
Speaker 3: division in Germany.
Speaker 2: I mean that was that was a wild move, but
Speaker 2: I ended up ended up working with pretty well.
Speaker 3: For you, you have an it. What's your guilty pleasure?
Speaker 3: I'm a big food guy. Ice cream, I mean snacker,
Speaker 3: not good, not good.
Speaker 1: Worst piece of advice you've ever heard.
Speaker 2: Worst piece of advice, I'm not sure. Yeah, nothing. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Just just see yourself as a work in progress. Really,
Speaker 3: always keep improving. Never be satisfied.
Speaker 2: Uh you know. I always see yourself as a as.
Speaker 3: A learning guy. Even now in life. Try something new,
Speaker 3: try to learn different things. Never see yourself as a
Speaker 3: finished product.
Speaker 2: Dallas Maverick's all time starting five with me or without me?
Speaker 3: I mean, I played with some some studs, so I'm
Speaker 3: gonna have to go probably a small lineup. Snashy is
Speaker 3: obviously one of my best buddies. He's the one Jake
Speaker 3: Kidd Hall of Famer. He played the two. He can
Speaker 3: guard the two's now they can both handle the ball.
Speaker 3: My guy, Finley is was play the three. I mean
Speaker 3: he helped me so much growing up, and he wasn't
Speaker 3: He was basically the man when I got here, and
Speaker 3: then I mean, there's.
Speaker 2: A lot of guys. If I've if I played the four,
Speaker 2: then there's a lot of guys for the fifth spot, you.
Speaker 3: Know, like a jet or I mean, yeah, this Nick Vannox.
Speaker 3: That was amazing for us those couple of years he
Speaker 3: was here. Uh yeah, that's that's a tough one. But
Speaker 3: it's a really small lineup. But those those are probably
Speaker 3: a four or.
Speaker 1: Five center on that thing.
Speaker 2: How good with Josh Howard. I love Josh. I love Josh.
Speaker 3: You know, he played with a chip on his shoulder
Speaker 3: because he he was pissed off that he was drafted
Speaker 3: so late. You know, he thought he had a great
Speaker 3: couple of years there at Wake Forest and then he
Speaker 3: dropped almost you know, into the first round and what
Speaker 3: I'm going to show everybody? And then that's how he
Speaker 3: approached every game. He was going at people's next and
Speaker 3: we love that. He was our defender. He was long,
Speaker 3: he was versatile, and I love Josh. He's still around here.
Speaker 3: I've never thought he'd be he'd get into coaching because
Speaker 3: he was at times, i'd say.
Speaker 2: At a little tough to coach.
Speaker 3: Uh he's coaching some college around here. So I run
Speaker 3: into him every now and then and apparently he's great
Speaker 3: and they love him, and but I didn't see I
Speaker 3: didn't see Stack becoming a coach either.
Speaker 2: Say he's doing great.
Speaker 3: Some of these guys were a little tough on on
Speaker 3: their own coaches. But okay, now now they now they're
Speaker 3: head coaches.
Speaker 1: Childhood crush, Yeah.
Speaker 3: Oh shoot, childhood crush. And I mean the nineties. I
Speaker 3: mean it was a little Kim Foxy exactly exactly exactly see.
Speaker 2: What else.
Speaker 4: She was unable soft picture this. I'm having one of
Speaker 4: those moments. Yeah, something you wish you were better at
Speaker 4: mm hmmm.
Speaker 2: In life or something anything.
Speaker 3: Maybe a better communicator in life. I think I take
Speaker 3: a lot of stuff in in myself. I don't I
Speaker 3: don't love share my feelings too much. And I know
Speaker 3: over over my my life that's driven my career, my
Speaker 3: my family nuts a little bit. So I wish I
Speaker 3: was communicate my feelings a little better. I think that's uh,
Speaker 3: that's that's that's one that's I need to work on.
Speaker 2: That's me and period and period five dinner guess dead alive?
Speaker 3: I mean i'd say Michael Jordan obviously, I mean he
Speaker 3: was He's my hero, is my goat always.
Speaker 2: I'd say mommad Ali.
Speaker 3: Oh, and then there's a there's so many greats out there.
Speaker 5: Just because of you was at Cubans. We asked him
Speaker 5: by his pop. He had you at his tape. Really, yes,
Speaker 5: that's sweet.
Speaker 3: I would not have him on my table. I'm gonna go.
Speaker 3: I was a big tennis guy, so I'm gonna go
Speaker 3: with Roger Federer. I mean, unbelievable, A big, big tennis
Speaker 3: fan growing up. I was a big Boris Becker fan.
Speaker 3: So that's four mainly sports and the fifth do uh
Speaker 3: maybe Tiger Woods?
Speaker 2: Nice? That's table.
Speaker 5: If you could see one guest on our show, who
Speaker 5: would it be? But you have to help us get
Speaker 5: your answer on the show.
Speaker 2: Can't be shy? Okay, who hasn't been on the show.
Speaker 2: Excuse me, excuse me? Okay, you guys trying to get Luca.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he said, look, I ain't.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't know what she was going to say. Well,
Speaker 2: we'll see.
Speaker 3: He is still in the phase you know where he's
Speaker 3: a little shy.
Speaker 2: You know you've been there.
Speaker 3: I came here, and you know, sometimes if it's just
Speaker 3: English the second language, you're almost a little you're scared
Speaker 3: to say something wrong. Yeah, and then and then I
Speaker 3: think he's already gotten a little looser in interviews from
Speaker 3: his first year or first two years, So I think
Speaker 3: eventually he'll get there. We'll have some fun with you guys,
Speaker 3: but he's just not.
Speaker 2: This is the show to let loose on the show.
Speaker 2: The fuck up. But we understand anybody.
Speaker 1: Well, Dirk Man, we want to thank you for your time.
Speaker 1: Obviously you know you're busy, but also just give you
Speaker 1: your flowers.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 1: Obviously everything you did for this franchise, but the league
Speaker 1: and you know obviously the international influx now of talent
Speaker 1: and like you said, if you kicked it open a
Speaker 1: little bit, but we know you kicked it open a lot.
Speaker 1: But man, it was a pleasure to battle against you
Speaker 1: and you play. And congratulations on just the career and
Speaker 1: the family and everything.
Speaker 2: Man, well deserve. I appreciate you, bro. That's a wrap.
Speaker 1: The one and only Dirk Newhizky. He can catch us
Speaker 1: on Showtime Basketball, YouTube and the iHeart platform.
Speaker 2: Black Effects