1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: Cal Zone Media. 2 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 2: Welcome, Dick. It app to hear a podcast about things 3 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:09,280 Speaker 2: falling apart and how to put them back together again. 4 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 2: I am your host Mia Wong. With me is James Stout. 5 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 1: Hi may happy to be here again? 6 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:18,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I am. I don't know. I have mixed emotions 7 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 2: about this one. So today we are talking about how 8 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 2: the American state, particularly the sort of neoliberal American state 9 00:00:27,160 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 2: of the last about fifty years, created Elon Musk and 10 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 2: how it is destroying itself. And we'll start with the 11 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:35,600 Speaker 2: fun part of this, which is that Tesla stock is 12 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 2: down twenty five percent in the last month. Yay, it's 13 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:41,720 Speaker 2: extremely funny. The protests are working. People are like lighting 14 00:00:41,720 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 2: them on cars on fire literally all over the world, 15 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:46,080 Speaker 2: Like there was just a big ration in France the 16 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:49,600 Speaker 2: day we're recording this. The pressure is working. He's having 17 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 2: a bad time. Twenty five percent is just the start 18 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:53,760 Speaker 2: we can get the other seventy five percent. 19 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:59,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, And like for people who I guess 20 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,319 Speaker 3: don't know, the value of Tesla stock is directly tied 21 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 3: to Elon Musk's net worth, Like obviously he's diversified, he 22 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 3: doesn't have all of his wealth and netstocks but like 23 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:10,759 Speaker 3: when Tesla Stock goes down, Elon Musk gets poorer. 24 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 2: Yep, it's great, it's great love. We love making Elon 25 00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 2: Musk poorer. 26 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's the one line we like to see. 27 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 2: However, Comma, So we've talked a lot on this show 28 00:01:18,640 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 2: about the things that Elon Musk is doing to the 29 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 2: American state and about all of the people who he 30 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 2: is harming in the lives is showing the people who 31 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 2: are dead because of his actions, and I think it's 32 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:33,000 Speaker 2: worth actually getting into how he was produced and how 33 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:35,600 Speaker 2: it came to be that. You know, at the beginning 34 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,640 Speaker 2: of the Communist Manifesto, Marx famously wrote that the bourgeoisie 35 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:40,960 Speaker 2: produced their own grave diggers. Yep. And you know, his 36 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:44,320 Speaker 2: his promised like inevitable victory of the proletariat has thus 37 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 2: far failed to materialize. But neoliberalism and like this specific 38 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 2: state seems to have produced their own gravediggers, partially in 39 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 2: the form of Trump, but partially in the form of 40 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 2: Elon Musk. And it's worth actually going into the story 41 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:03,920 Speaker 2: of how specifically this happened. And also I think what 42 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 2: neoliberalism is, because this is an important aspect of I 43 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 2: think people are kind of aware of the broad outlines 44 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,840 Speaker 2: of the story of the extent to which you know, 45 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:16,640 Speaker 2: Tesla and space Ax were built by American subsidies, but 46 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 2: it's worth going into some of the more structural elements 47 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:25,359 Speaker 2: of how this happened. Why So, one of the problems 48 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:27,320 Speaker 2: that we have here, and I say we have here 49 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:30,799 Speaker 2: because this is a problem that Elon Musk has, which 50 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:33,640 Speaker 2: is that he simply does not understand what neoliberalism is 51 00:02:33,800 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 2: or how it operates. 52 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, he says a lot of things he 53 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:37,520 Speaker 1: doesn't understand. 54 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: Via Yeah, and unfortunately he has inherited like the greatest 55 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:44,960 Speaker 2: of all neoliberal states. So the issue here is that 56 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 2: Elon Musk thinks that what his own ideology is supposed 57 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:51,079 Speaker 2: to be, what neoliberalism is, what is sort of weird libertarianism, 58 00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 2: whatever you call his sort of ideology, you know, is 59 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:56,239 Speaker 2: supposed to be and you know, like he is just 60 00:02:56,280 --> 00:02:58,839 Speaker 2: sort of a fascist. But on the other hand, he's 61 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 2: a product of this wing of that movement that was 62 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 2: created out of out of the neoliberal thing about like ah, 63 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:06,320 Speaker 2: you must like decrease the size of the state. You 64 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 2: gotta you gotta eliminate all regulations, you have to you know, 65 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 2: you keep decreasing the size of the state, keep fire 66 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 2: like you know, fire all government employees, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, 67 00:03:13,520 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 2: and again this is I think largely what a lot 68 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 2: of people think neoliberalism is, right. They think it's like, okay, 69 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,080 Speaker 2: neoliberalisms where the state gets smaller, And this has always 70 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 2: been a fucking joke. Like to the entiretyoliberal period, the 71 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 2: size of the state bureaucracy keeps increasing, and this has 72 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 2: always allowed a kind of like controlled capitalist opposition to 73 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 2: emerge to you know, when two thousand and eight happens, right, Yeah, 74 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 2: the economy, entire economy collapses, and then out of the 75 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:38,400 Speaker 2: woodwork come all of these like rand pall sort of 76 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:40,560 Speaker 2: like quote unquote libertarians who have a lot of sudden 77 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 2: interesting ties to a bunch of fascist groups and like 78 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 2: all of these all of these sort of fascist perilitaries. 79 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 2: But you know, they can come out of the woodwork 80 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 2: and say, oh, the reason that the two thousand and 81 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 2: eight collapse happened was because there is too much government regulation. 82 00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 2: And this is like sort of what bitcoin is, right, 83 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 2: It's like, ah, the evils of capitalism are happening because like. 84 00:03:56,840 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 1: Not enough capitalism. 85 00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, it's because like the but like bifically, the 86 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 2: evil and s trench interests have taken over the state 87 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 2: and you don't have the power to access the things 88 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 2: that they do, which is obviously you know, like it 89 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 2: is obviously true that these people have control of the 90 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 2: state and you don't. But this sort of controlled opposition 91 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 2: of if you put us in power, will eliminate parts 92 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 2: of the state, will get rid of all this regulation 93 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 2: that you can suddenly be in power. This has always 94 00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 2: been a controlled opposition thing, you know. And this is 95 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 2: disappears in the form sort of libertarianism or like on 96 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 2: the most extreme mention arco capitalism. Yeah, and this is 97 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 2: something that the Montpellier society, which is like the people 98 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:33,360 Speaker 2: who basically invented neoliberalism and where all like their academics 99 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 2: come from they slill of conferences, they've always had a 100 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 2: problem with this, where there's always been a branch of 101 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: an arcro capitalist there who think the only thing that 102 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 2: the state should do is enforced contracts or just that 103 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 2: it shouldn't exist. Everything should just yeah, and the neoliberals 104 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:50,359 Speaker 2: are like, okay, that you guys are fucking ridiculous. And 105 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:52,480 Speaker 2: the reason they think this is that the actual thing 106 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 2: that these people believe. And this is this is something 107 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:56,479 Speaker 2: that if you read more Hiak than just like the 108 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:58,160 Speaker 2: road to serve him, right, that's like the stuff for 109 00:04:58,160 --> 00:04:59,840 Speaker 2: public consumption. If you read the stuff that you actual 110 00:04:59,839 --> 00:05:02,560 Speaker 2: pub consumption, if you read sort of like rope Key, 111 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 2: and you read all of the sort of theorists who 112 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:08,279 Speaker 2: develop what becomes the IMF, and you know, you go 113 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:13,120 Speaker 2: through all the different schools what they actually believe. Contrary 114 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:15,360 Speaker 2: the things that they say were like, oh, markets naturally 115 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:18,200 Speaker 2: emerge and the state just like exists to control them. 116 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:21,039 Speaker 2: What they believe is that you have to use the 117 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:24,600 Speaker 2: state specifically to create markets, and you have to use 118 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 2: the state to discipline workers through just pure violence until 119 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 2: they become sort of like good neo liberal market subjects. 120 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 2: You go to work, go home, buy things, and do 121 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 2: nothing else. And the product of this is the nineteen eighties, right, 122 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:38,599 Speaker 2: is the replacement of the welfare state, you know, which 123 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:41,039 Speaker 2: is the sort of carrots of this system with just 124 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 2: the pure stake of the police, baton and the prison system. 125 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:47,039 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's the end of like the post Second World 126 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 3: War welfare state order, right, that we saw certainly in 127 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:54,279 Speaker 3: the US. But mostly in New Europe. 128 00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:57,400 Speaker 2: Right, yeah, yeah, but and this is very important. This 129 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:00,400 Speaker 2: never actually decreased the size of the state, because what 130 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 2: the state, you know, what it was was. It was 131 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 2: a shifting of sort of recourses and allocation away from 132 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:10,039 Speaker 2: like the state giving you things towards the states, you know, 133 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 2: like beating you over the head with a hammer, and 134 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 2: also insofar as it gives you things, making you go 135 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 2: through all of these unbelievable bureaucratic hurdles to access whatever 136 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 2: sort of like scant welfare policies still exist. 137 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, the states surveying you both for violence reasons and 138 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 1: for withdrawing your benefits reasons. 139 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, and this and this is always something that all 140 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:35,040 Speaker 2: of these people have supported. Right now. The other important 141 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:37,159 Speaker 2: part for our purposes is is the thing I said 142 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,680 Speaker 2: earlier about the state creating markets, And that's that's kind 143 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 2: of like an abstract thing, right. There are sort of 144 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,720 Speaker 2: historical examples you can go through to look at what 145 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 2: this looks like in a place where there aren't markets. 146 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 2: But this is something that's very important because a huge 147 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 2: amount of what TESLA is is a direct result of 148 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 2: you know, pure neoliberalism and action, which is the state 149 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 2: stepping into create a market as its way of doing 150 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 2: regulation and with the way interact with the world. And 151 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:05,239 Speaker 2: so here we need to get to carbon credits. Now 152 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 2: selling off carbon credits, they're also called regulatory credits. In 153 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:13,840 Speaker 2: twenty twenty four the selling of carbon credits was forty 154 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 2: three percent of Tesla's net income. Forty three percent. 155 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, so we should explain what a carbon credit is 156 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:21,679 Speaker 3: if people I'm familiar. 157 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:25,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, Actuos has numbers on this. Their numbers are that 158 00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 2: since twenty fourteen, thirty four percent of the total profits 159 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:34,240 Speaker 2: of Tesla are are from selling these carbon credits. So 160 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 2: the way the system works is that the EPA sets 161 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 2: standards for how much This is like you know, read 162 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,679 Speaker 2: the acxios thing too, but like the EPA set standards 163 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 2: for how much like CO two per mile all of 164 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 2: the cars and trucks combined that a a car company 165 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 2: makes can can admit. And you know, instead of doing 166 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 2: the thing where you're like, okay, hey, there's just going 167 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 2: to be like a firm cap on these emissions, they're 168 00:07:57,240 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 2: like no, no, no, you know this this is when 169 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 2: I say, when I say, they create a mar So 170 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 2: if what happens if you go over the cap isn't 171 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 2: that like you know, like people get hauled off to 172 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 2: jail or whatever. What happens is that you have to 173 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 2: buy someone else's carbon credits, and if you're below the cap, 174 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 2: it gives you credits you can sell to other companies. 175 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 2: So what this allows is because Tesla only makes electric cars, right, 176 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 2: their cars produced like zero basically like. 177 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 1: They don't have any fossil fuel use at all within 178 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:23,040 Speaker 1: their line. 179 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:25,640 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, Now obviously like whereas you know, you can 180 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 2: ask the question where is that electricity coming from? But 181 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:30,239 Speaker 2: you know, like, but that's that's what doesn't get factored 182 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 2: into it, which is part of the sort of problem 183 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:34,439 Speaker 2: with trying to use the state like this to solve. 184 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 3: Right, it doesn't look at life cyclists. Yeah, yeah, it 185 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 3: just looks at driving the car emissions. 186 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:40,319 Speaker 2: You know. This is this is the problem with trying 187 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 2: to use a regulatory state like this to solve the 188 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 2: problem with climate change by creating a market. And so 189 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 2: Tesla makes and again this is this last year, this 190 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 2: was forty three percent of its NEAT income came not 191 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 2: from selling cars, but from selling these carbon credits. So 192 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 2: what they're doing is making it so that other companies 193 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:01,199 Speaker 2: can produce more cars that are less fuel efficients can 194 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 2: produce less electric cars and produce less like hybrids. 195 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 3: It's why you couldn't get a plug in hybrid EV 196 00:09:08,400 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 3: pickup truck, like I think they may be plug in 197 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 3: hybrid Mavericks now, but like the reason that no US 198 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:19,280 Speaker 3: manufacturer bothered to make an electric pickup truck like the 199 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:22,040 Speaker 3: that form fifty lightning that they have now, it is 200 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:25,520 Speaker 3: because they could just trade with companies like Tesla instead. 201 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, and this is a fucking disaster for climate policy 202 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 2: because instead of having all of the car companies just 203 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:34,760 Speaker 2: like dramatically lowering their emissions, what you have is one 204 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 2: car company that makes electric cars and then all the 205 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 2: rest of the car companies increasing the amount of like 206 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 2: SEO tuper like biles, et cetera, et cetera. And the 207 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:44,480 Speaker 2: secondary problem, and this is the problem that we're experiencing now, 208 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,080 Speaker 2: is that, you know, neoliberals have like this very sort 209 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 2: of in a lot of ways, like romantic notion of 210 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 2: what a market is, right with the explain it. So 211 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 2: it's like, ah, there's all this, there's gonna be all 212 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:55,960 Speaker 2: this like competition in the market. The competition is going 213 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:57,640 Speaker 2: to create the best product and what actually happens, and 214 00:09:57,679 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 2: the neoliberals in their private doctor understand this is that 215 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 2: when the state creates a market like this, what he's 216 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:07,679 Speaker 2: doing is handing like a person, like a single individual, 217 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:11,200 Speaker 2: a giant monopoly. And that's what happens. And that monopoly 218 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:15,200 Speaker 2: is one Elon Musk, Yeah, who has now been handed 219 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 2: the title of the richest man in human history by 220 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 2: the state's regulatory apparatus. 221 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:24,080 Speaker 3: Because they've given him basically complete control every I mean, 222 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:26,679 Speaker 3: there are other ev only companies, but they're minute, right, 223 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 3: Rivan or something like that, And he's got this scarce 224 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 3: resource that the entire automotive industry now needs. 225 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:34,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. And again this is, you know, going back to 226 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 2: the market creation part of this. None off this shit existed, right, 227 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 2: Like carbon caps are not something the market would ever 228 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 2: produce by itself or whatever. 229 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:43,960 Speaker 1: Like. 230 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 2: This is a direct neilbal intervention into the market, which 231 00:10:47,679 --> 00:10:51,319 Speaker 2: is what neolibilism is, right. It's the nailable state coming 232 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 2: into create markets, and the product of it is Elon Musk. 233 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a monopoly. 234 00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:58,360 Speaker 2: Yeah. And when we come back from ADS, we'll go 235 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:01,520 Speaker 2: into a little bit of why specifically it was Elon 236 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 2: Musk and not all of these other companies that became 237 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:07,200 Speaker 2: the sort of single guy and how and how else 238 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:21,080 Speaker 2: he's benefited from the state. We are back, so the 239 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 2: other aspect, you know. So, so we've gone into how 240 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 2: how how Tesla is built on these on this carbon 241 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 2: credit trading. The other aspect of it is that Tesla 242 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:38,000 Speaker 2: has received unbelievable amounts of money from government contracts. The 243 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:42,480 Speaker 2: Washington Post in probably the last like expose they're ever 244 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:45,160 Speaker 2: going to do like this now that Bezos has been 245 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:48,080 Speaker 2: like we are free market capitalists, like tried to go 246 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:51,080 Speaker 2: through and find all of the money in government contracts 247 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:53,400 Speaker 2: that they've gotten. They totaled it well, I think I 248 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 2: think they're also including like tax credits and stuff like that. 249 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 2: But they totald it at thirty eight billion dollars. And 250 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 2: that's just the ones that are unclassified, which is very 251 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:04,520 Speaker 2: important because a bunch of what SpaceX does SpaceX's you know, 252 00:12:04,640 --> 00:12:08,560 Speaker 2: most other company is a bunch of contracts for classified 253 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 2: like the deployment of Spice satellites. So it's definitely way 254 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:14,559 Speaker 2: more than that, right, Yeah, But this comes to the 255 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:17,319 Speaker 2: other sort of aspect of how Tesla functions and how 256 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 2: tech companies work in general, which is that tech companies, 257 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:22,760 Speaker 2: like in general, do not make money, right. They hemorrhage 258 00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:25,200 Speaker 2: money for basically their entire existence until they can find 259 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 2: a bunch of government contracts that can make them money. 260 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:31,560 Speaker 2: And Tesla in particular was like really sort of eating 261 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:34,680 Speaker 2: shit after two thousand and eight, and you know, WAPA 262 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 2: talks about this. They got a four hundred and sixty 263 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 2: five million dollars low interest loan for the Department of 264 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:43,240 Speaker 2: Energy in twenty ten that basically saved the company from 265 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:44,160 Speaker 2: the brink of collapse. 266 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:46,280 Speaker 3: Good thing, there's nothing else to spend the money on 267 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 3: in twenty ten. No one else needed low Interestla into 268 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:49,719 Speaker 3: any think it was. 269 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 2: Fine, No, no, there was no attempt to build like 270 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:54,960 Speaker 2: a giant American high speed rail system that Elon Musk 271 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 2: also killed. Yep, you know not, nothing else was happening. 272 00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 1: I wasn't living in my car at that time. It 273 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:03,160 Speaker 1: was fine. Yeah, thank you Obama. 274 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 2: And so and so. As this goes on, right, the 275 00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 2: goal of you as a tech company, there's two things 276 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:07,960 Speaker 2: you want to do. If you're a smaller tech company, 277 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:09,920 Speaker 2: you're trying to get bought by a bigger tech company 278 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,240 Speaker 2: so you can retire on your pile of money, or 279 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 2: if you're a larger tech company, you are trying to 280 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:17,640 Speaker 2: amass enough US contracts, like US government contracts, to like 281 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:21,880 Speaker 2: get you to sort of stability. And this is what 282 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 2: happens with SpaceX. SpaceX now has gotten eighteen billion dollars 283 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:29,560 Speaker 2: of contracts with NASA, And this is sort of a 284 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 2: part of like, I mean, NASA has always used government contractors, 285 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:36,840 Speaker 2: but like this is different, Like this is just straight 286 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:40,120 Speaker 2: up there using Tesla's rockets to do things. And this 287 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:42,520 Speaker 2: is also part of why like Tesla and Boeing fucking 288 00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 2: this up, is part of why a bunch of astronauts 289 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,199 Speaker 2: are fucking stranded on the space station right now because 290 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 2: these things do not work. But there's there's been an 291 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:52,480 Speaker 2: enormous amount of money here. And the other thing, you know, 292 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 2: this is one of the other sort of like great 293 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:58,960 Speaker 2: neoliberal things, is that a lot of the factories that 294 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 2: Elon Musk sort of builds, you know, the ones that 295 00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:04,800 Speaker 2: are in the US, are there because they get unbelievable 296 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 2: amounts of tax breaks and tax incentives from from local 297 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,720 Speaker 2: states themselves. All of this brings us to you know, 298 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 2: one of the other really core aspects of sort of 299 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:18,560 Speaker 2: the profitability of Tesla in terms of selling in terms 300 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 2: of selling cars. But we should also mention this is 301 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 2: something Axios talks about that like, if they weren't able 302 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 2: to sell carbon credits, this company would literally never make money. 303 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, this has been the case. I write 304 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:29,520 Speaker 1: about this, like I think two years ago. 305 00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember writing about this before Ela Musk had 306 00:14:33,080 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 3: gone full fucking evil villain, I guess. But that's what 307 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:39,080 Speaker 3: they are. They're a carbon credit company that makes cars. 308 00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, but even their car sales are enormously bolstered by 309 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 2: a seven five hundred dollars tax credit for electric cars. 310 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I got some tax credit information on electric cars. 311 00:14:51,000 --> 00:14:51,840 Speaker 1: It's now the time. 312 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 2: Yeah yeah. Do you want to talk about the other 313 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 2: one that's driving these unhinged sales? 314 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 3: Yes, I do, because I have been driving around San 315 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 3: Diego and I have seen an obscene number of cyber 316 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:07,360 Speaker 3: trucks wrapped in people's business livery, and it occurs to 317 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:09,520 Speaker 3: me that they're not businesses that need a pickup truck, 318 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:11,320 Speaker 3: nor the people who need a pickup truck for work 319 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 3: by cyber trucks because they suck at being trucks. 320 00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: And so I did some digging, and I discovered that. 321 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 3: The IRS was a special tax deduction for vehicles which 322 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:24,800 Speaker 3: are rated over six thousand pounds gross vehicle weight. The 323 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 3: gross vehicle weight rating, if you're not familiar, that's not 324 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 3: like the mass of the vehicle if you drove it 325 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:33,520 Speaker 3: like off the dealer lot onto a scale. That's the 326 00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 3: maximum operating weight of the vehicles as specified by the manufacturer. 327 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 3: So like it's your tesla with I mean, they are 328 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:43,480 Speaker 3: very funny videos of guy cycloading one bag of composts 329 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:45,360 Speaker 3: into the back of the Tesla and being it's a 330 00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 3: great truck for truck stuff. 331 00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 2: The other really funny one is when they try to 332 00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:51,200 Speaker 2: attach like a winch to it and try to use 333 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:54,040 Speaker 2: it to pull the pull heavy things in the back 334 00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:55,800 Speaker 2: of the truck comes off because it's just like made 335 00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 2: of like it's like glue a unibody. 336 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, it might not be a body on frame, Like 337 00:16:01,920 --> 00:16:03,480 Speaker 3: it might not be a proper truck. I actually don't 338 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 3: know now how I will look into that afterwards. I 339 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 3: bet it's I bet most of the electric or like 340 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:11,920 Speaker 3: high minage pickup trucks are not so yeah, not a 341 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:15,240 Speaker 3: good truck. Actually under it's called section one seventy nine. 342 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 3: Under Section one seventy nine, a vehicle with a gross 343 00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 3: vehicle weight rating over six thousand pounds, you can deduct 344 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:26,600 Speaker 3: up to thirty one thousand in the first year rather 345 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 3: than deducting the depreciation of the capital good over time. Right, 346 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:33,880 Speaker 3: So instead of instead of deducting the depreciation of your 347 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 3: vehicle that you purchase your business over time and not 348 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:39,040 Speaker 3: paying tax on that amount, you cannot pay tax on 349 00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 3: thirty one thousand in the first year of your vehicle 350 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 3: if it's over six thousand pounds. 351 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: Right. 352 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 3: There are some exemptions for luxury vehicles, like if you've 353 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 3: got a may Bark or something really fucking heavy, So 354 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 3: that would even cover the Model X, right, the Tesla 355 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 3: Model X have a GBWR above that. With a truck, 356 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 3: there are exemptions for work vehicles, and they have to 357 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:01,440 Speaker 3: have a separate cargo compared apartment that is not the 358 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:04,919 Speaker 3: driver's compartment, that is six feet or more in length. 359 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:07,919 Speaker 3: So the cyber truck just happened to have a six 360 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 3: foot bed. Yeah, so you can deduct one hundred percent 361 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 3: of value in the first year of what I understand 362 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:17,000 Speaker 3: for these vehicles which have a six foot bed. 363 00:17:17,440 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 1: At least this was the case when I was looking. 364 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:21,640 Speaker 3: I became aware of the exact nature of this when 365 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 3: I went on the cyber Truck Owners Club forum and 366 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:26,880 Speaker 3: looked what a tax deductant people were doing, right, and 367 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 3: then I worked back from there, and it does seem 368 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,080 Speaker 3: that people are doing this. I think it might be changing, 369 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:33,600 Speaker 3: so you can only deduct a certain percentage. Soon it 370 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:35,919 Speaker 3: will shock listeners to hear that I'm not giving you 371 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 3: tax advice, nor am I qualified to do so. I'm 372 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 3: not an accountant. This is not accounting advice. On top 373 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:46,840 Speaker 3: of that, Mia mentioned the IRS Commercial Clean Vehicle credit, right, 374 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:50,000 Speaker 3: that's a credit, not a deduction. So the deduction would 375 00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,600 Speaker 3: discount the amount of your income that you pay tax 376 00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:55,760 Speaker 3: on versus the credit, which is just great credit. So 377 00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:59,639 Speaker 3: potentially the person could deduct the cost of the cyber 378 00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 3: truck plus the cost of wrapping the fucking cyber truck, 379 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:05,480 Speaker 3: right to prove it's a business vehicle, and then if 380 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 3: you're wrapping it. From what I understand, like these deductions 381 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 3: somewhat depend on the percentage of the vehicle's use that 382 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 3: is business. I guess this could be like the equivalent 383 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:17,119 Speaker 3: of a fringes on the flag tax theory people claiming 384 00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:20,640 Speaker 3: that when they're driving their their cyber truck to go 385 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 3: to Whole Foods, but it's wrapped, they're advertising a business, 386 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:28,440 Speaker 3: so it's a business use. I don't understand how how 387 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 3: like viable that is as a claim, but well, you know. 388 00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:34,320 Speaker 2: But part of this is, like it's very easy, like 389 00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 2: especially right now when the irs is being gutted, Like 390 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 2: it's very easy to do this kind of bullshit and 391 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 2: people are not getting all it did. 392 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:45,399 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so they can take a seven five hundred 393 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:49,359 Speaker 3: commercial vehicle clean vehicle credit in addition to deducting that much. 394 00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 3: And like you would struggle to persuade me that that 395 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:55,560 Speaker 3: is not why a lot of people are buying cyber 396 00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:57,760 Speaker 3: trucks right, Like it's got the weight rating, it's got 397 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:00,959 Speaker 3: the bedside. Like it's a lot of people who wouldn't 398 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 3: necessarily like not all trucks have six footbeds. 399 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:05,520 Speaker 1: Now, I will never buy a new drug because. 400 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,359 Speaker 3: I can't find a truck that has like a decent 401 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:11,880 Speaker 3: seating arrangement and larger than six foot bed and four 402 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:13,720 Speaker 3: by four and doesn't cost more than I earn in 403 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 3: a year. But like it's quite a like niche overlap 404 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:19,600 Speaker 3: of trucks that apply, and like for a truck with 405 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:22,520 Speaker 3: a six foot bed and a six thousand pound gross 406 00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 3: vehicle weight rating, the cyber truck's pretty small and it 407 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 3: fits kind of with people who don't actually need a 408 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:31,760 Speaker 3: work truck that can non the lens take advantage of 409 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 3: the work truck tax deduction. So once again, thank you 410 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:39,159 Speaker 3: government for subsidizing the shittiest vehicle on the roads today. 411 00:19:39,359 --> 00:19:42,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's worth noting. So like like Tesla, you know, 412 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:44,239 Speaker 2: you'll see a bunch of things about how Tesla is 413 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:48,000 Speaker 2: like one of the like best selling car manufacturers, right, 414 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 2: and part of it is from this, but also, you know, 415 00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:53,320 Speaker 2: and this is this is the other aspect of this. 416 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:55,640 Speaker 2: It's worth noting. There's a very good Bloomberg article out 417 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 2: today by A. Mendum More that talks about how fifty 418 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:02,679 Speaker 2: percent of all American consumer spending is now by people 419 00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:05,400 Speaker 2: who in the top ten percent of the income bracket, 420 00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:07,679 Speaker 2: so people make two hundred and fifty thousand dollars a 421 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:10,639 Speaker 2: year or more, and that means increasingly that everything in 422 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 2: the United States reflects the you know, the sort of 423 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 2: like cultural affect of these bunch of fucking rich assholes 424 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 2: who all also want to buy this for their sort 425 00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 2: of like like cultural grudges and you know, to like 426 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:26,440 Speaker 2: to own the libs and like show how like much 427 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 2: of a fucking man they are. Yeah, you know, and 428 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 2: and so you already you have that initial incentive and 429 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 2: then you suddenly have all of these fucking tax incentives 430 00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 2: that you get from buying this vehicle that like, definitely 431 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:38,159 Speaker 2: this is like designed with a shit in mind. 432 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:41,199 Speaker 3: Yeah, without a doubt, and it becomes, like you say, 433 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 3: it becomes like a status good, and it becomes like 434 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 3: a culture war signifier. 435 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. 436 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 3: In addition to all of those things, I guess people also, 437 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:50,200 Speaker 3: like I've noticed that there's been a lot of backlash 438 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:53,000 Speaker 3: against people who owned Tesla's. If you go on the 439 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,760 Speaker 3: day we're recording, the top article on the front page 440 00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:00,200 Speaker 3: of Reddit. On the third article Reddit, the top post 441 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 3: is someone who's been putting pictures that say sell your car. 442 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:06,159 Speaker 3: It's got a picture of musk Zeke hyling on people's 443 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:07,160 Speaker 3: test list in Boston. 444 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 1: Yep, shout out to that person. 445 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:11,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, Okay, so we're going to take a break and 446 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 2: when we come back, we're going to sort of finish 447 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,119 Speaker 2: this off with a sort of larger structural analysis of 448 00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 2: how this version of capitalism created Musk and where it's going. 449 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 2: We are back now. I think this all. I think 450 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 2: if you've been following Elon a lot, you've probably heard 451 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:38,720 Speaker 2: of most of this. I actually, okay, you've heard of 452 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:40,640 Speaker 2: most of what I've said to some extent. I don't 453 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:42,520 Speaker 2: think you've heard what James has said before, because I've 454 00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 2: seen very little coverage of this. But there's also something 455 00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 2: deeper going on here. The deeper thing going on here 456 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:51,880 Speaker 2: is that Elon Musk on a fundamental level is also 457 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 2: a product of the endless bubble economy that we've all 458 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:58,280 Speaker 2: been living in for decades now. It's a product of 459 00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:02,000 Speaker 2: an economic policy that the economist R. Brenner calls asset canesianism. 460 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,520 Speaker 2: So regular canesianism, right, is about you know, having the 461 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 2: government spend money on things like welfare programs and job creation. 462 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 2: Also you know, also like the military too, right, Like, 463 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:12,920 Speaker 2: let's not sort of like sugarcoat it, but it's about 464 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,800 Speaker 2: using a bunch of state money to like make there 465 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,120 Speaker 2: be jobs and using this to sort of I don't 466 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 2: know though the way they call it is like countercyclical spending. 467 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:21,960 Speaker 2: But it's like they want to use the state to 468 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 2: spend money to make their be jobs and to put 469 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 2: money into the economy and to put goods into the 470 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 2: economy to counteract economic downturns. Yea asset Knesianism is still 471 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:34,960 Speaker 2: the state spending a bunch of resources, right, But it's 472 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 2: the state expending those resources both bureaucratically and in terms 473 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,200 Speaker 2: of incentives and in terms of sort of tax structures, 474 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:43,440 Speaker 2: and specifically also very much in terms of the federal 475 00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:48,800 Speaker 2: reserves interest rates, specifically to increase the price of stocks. 476 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 2: And also you know, and you know the reason he 477 00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:52,879 Speaker 2: calls it assets, right, because it's not just stocks, right, 478 00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:55,159 Speaker 2: it's also things like real estates. It's to increase the 479 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 2: value of speculative assets, things that you buy because you 480 00:22:57,640 --> 00:23:00,159 Speaker 2: think it's going to be worth more later. I have 481 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:02,240 Speaker 2: talked about this a law on this show. This has 482 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:06,639 Speaker 2: been the fundamental global economic strategy of most of the 483 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 2: world's economies ever since sort of Japan kind of pioneered 484 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,520 Speaker 2: it in the eighties. As after the US sort of 485 00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:16,359 Speaker 2: like kneecapped its entire domestic sort of export manufacturing economy 486 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:18,480 Speaker 2: to the Plaza Accords. And by the end of this 487 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 2: fucking administration, everyone who listens to the show will be 488 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:22,960 Speaker 2: able to explain what the Plazai Chords and the River's 489 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:24,120 Speaker 2: Plaza Accords are from. 490 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 3: We stop, it won't happen here after that, because you'll 491 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:28,040 Speaker 3: understand and you'll stop it. 492 00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:31,919 Speaker 2: Yeah, you'll know, you'll know, you'll know the origin of 493 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:35,879 Speaker 2: the economy. Yes, so yeah again, the Plaza Cords, the 494 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 2: US forces all of these countries to increase the value 495 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:40,920 Speaker 2: if their currency is relative to the dollar. This makes 496 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 2: American manufacturing more competitive in nukes, all of their manufacturing. 497 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:46,959 Speaker 2: These countries need to find another place to you know, 498 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 2: develop their economy, right, and the thing that the solution 499 00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:53,440 Speaker 2: Japan comes to is real estate speculation. This blows up, 500 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:55,119 Speaker 2: This blows up in the nineties. This is this is 501 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:56,919 Speaker 2: a whole bunch of the sort of Asian market collapse 502 00:23:56,920 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 2: stuff is from this. And then the US is forced 503 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:01,359 Speaker 2: to do the ref first Plauset Cords in the nineties 504 00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:04,919 Speaker 2: is spoke Clinton and you know, sort of annihilate American 505 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,119 Speaker 2: and manufacturing in order to sort of prop up the 506 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:09,919 Speaker 2: rest like proper Japanese manufactury, to keep their economy from 507 00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 2: completely employing. Japanels a number two economy in the world 508 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:15,800 Speaker 2: at that point, but again this means that the US 509 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:17,800 Speaker 2: has now been doing this. There's the famous things called 510 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:19,720 Speaker 2: the Greenspan puts, where like to try to stop a 511 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 2: market collapse that was obviously coming with a tech bubble 512 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,240 Speaker 2: blew up. Green Span kept cutting the interest rates over 513 00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:26,200 Speaker 2: and over again, trying to keep the bubble from collapsing 514 00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:28,120 Speaker 2: and just making it bigger, and then eventually it blew up. 515 00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:30,919 Speaker 2: This is what two thousand and eight is was, you know, 516 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,480 Speaker 2: we did a whole bubble. I mean, there's another bubble 517 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:35,959 Speaker 2: and collapse between there. But like you know, and this 518 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 2: is what we've been doing for the last two decades, 519 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:39,440 Speaker 2: like since since two thousand and eight, we've been creating 520 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,119 Speaker 2: this giant tech bubble and this tech bubble shit and 521 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 2: this sort of asset speculation is also a huge part 522 00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:46,399 Speaker 2: of the value of Tesla stock is just you know, 523 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 2: people who've been given a whole bunch of access to 524 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 2: cheap credit and by and by people, I mean like 525 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 2: not really you and me, like a bunch of unbelievaly 526 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:56,840 Speaker 2: rich people have access to like incredibly cheap loans and 527 00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,080 Speaker 2: they use that money to buy Tesla stock. This is 528 00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 2: a sort of cyclical thing that just continues to increases 529 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 2: the value of the company. And it's not just sort 530 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,240 Speaker 2: of like banks and investors. A lot of money that 531 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 2: goes into Tesla comes in there from state pension funds yep, 532 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:13,240 Speaker 2: from a bunch of bunches of a whole bunch of 533 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:15,959 Speaker 2: different countries. And also like a huge number of American states, 534 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:17,879 Speaker 2: like your teacher's pensions are all tied up in this 535 00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,800 Speaker 2: because pension reform. But the way that we sort of 536 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:23,439 Speaker 2: like lost the pension as a normal thing was that 537 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 2: it was you know, it was converted to for a 538 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:26,880 Speaker 2: one case and the people who still have like regular 539 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,919 Speaker 2: state pensions, all of that money is now sort of 540 00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:32,679 Speaker 2: invested in the stock market and it puts billions of 541 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 2: dollars into Tesla every year. And so this is also 542 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,359 Speaker 2: another aspect. This is this is the broader structural level 543 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 2: on which on which US macroeconomic policy was designed to 544 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:46,040 Speaker 2: create a bunch of companies like Tesla, and then US 545 00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:48,560 Speaker 2: sort of like micro policy, the microcreation of markets to 546 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,720 Speaker 2: tax credits and you know, all of these government contracts 547 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 2: that they've been given to do like everything from like 548 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 2: fucking build these cars to like put spy satellites in orbit, right, 549 00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 2: and like the US, like contracting got startled. Like now, 550 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 2: I mean, like all of this stuff, right is is 551 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:08,800 Speaker 2: literally how Elon Musk was created. Yeah, but there is 552 00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 2: a third, even deeper level in which you know, we 553 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:16,359 Speaker 2: can look at at how how these cars are actually 554 00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 2: produced and how these rockets are actually produced, and they're 555 00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:23,720 Speaker 2: produced by just incredible, the incredible exploitation of a huge 556 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,360 Speaker 2: number of workers. And I think people tend to think about, 557 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,240 Speaker 2: you know, Tesla workers in the US, but there's Tessa 558 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 2: workers all over the world. There's a huge gigafactory in 559 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 2: shing John, you know, there's factories all over China, and 560 00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:38,920 Speaker 2: you know, these workers everywhere are paid like absolute shit. 561 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,120 Speaker 2: They work in unbelievably dangerous conditions and at the end 562 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,480 Speaker 2: of the day they get a very small amount of 563 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:46,199 Speaker 2: money so that the richest man in the world can 564 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:47,480 Speaker 2: get fucking richer every day. 565 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:52,199 Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's before we consider like ingredient pots to Teslas, right, 566 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:55,720 Speaker 3: like the you know that we we just addressed for 567 00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 3: instance in our episode on Congo. 568 00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:58,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, there are. 569 00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:01,879 Speaker 3: Pots, the tests, geotests that come out of this country 570 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,640 Speaker 3: where there has been a war for as long as 571 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,119 Speaker 3: most of us has been alive. Really very little effort 572 00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:10,320 Speaker 3: has gone into improving conditions for people there. 573 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 1: Certainly for workers. 574 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:15,439 Speaker 3: They're doing jobs that are essential to like our economy 575 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,160 Speaker 3: and to like Mia and my four for a one 576 00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 3: K line going up comes from exploiting workers. 577 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:25,840 Speaker 1: In Congo to an extent and elsewhere in the world. 578 00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:28,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know this is something that there's something 579 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,479 Speaker 2: our standard of living is based off of. But at 580 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 2: the end of the day, right, Elon Musks, all of 581 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 2: Elon Musk's profit comes from the fact that the States 582 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,800 Speaker 2: monopoly on violence is used to stop all of these 583 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:44,359 Speaker 2: people from ever attempting to resist him. It's deployed in 584 00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 2: order to stop these people from taking back the fucking 585 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:51,640 Speaker 2: value that they create. Now, unfortunately, all of this sort 586 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,679 Speaker 2: of Neilibal tinkering we've seen for the last fifty years, right, 587 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 2: this attempts to sort of like depoliticize everything and have 588 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:01,959 Speaker 2: everything run by the other technocrats and sort of have 589 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:04,399 Speaker 2: this sort of like non politics where you're voting for 590 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 2: two parties that are like literally even more the same 591 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 2: than they are now. This attempt to do things like 592 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 2: solve climate change to these to these promotion of carbon 593 00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:15,000 Speaker 2: markets and create the sort of like stable capitalist hegeniminy 594 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:19,280 Speaker 2: forever has ultimately been self defeating. It's why all attempts 595 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 2: to regulate capital inevitably fail, because the functioning of the 596 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,480 Speaker 2: capitalist system, and particularly the function of the way this 597 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:31,960 Speaker 2: version of neoliberalism has worked, has concentrated like the most 598 00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 2: wealth ever held by a single human being into the 599 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,760 Speaker 2: hands of one guy who was a Nazi. And then 600 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 2: these people use their wealth to cubate political power and 601 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 2: seize control of the state, dismantling the systems that were 602 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:46,280 Speaker 2: meant to regulate them. And you can't solve this problem 603 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 2: with regulation because again, eventually they will simply accumulate enough power, 604 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:54,880 Speaker 2: retake power, and eliminate their regulations. You can't even solve 605 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:57,200 Speaker 2: this problem just by killing them. I see people talk 606 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,000 Speaker 2: about like the killing of billionaires in China as like 607 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:01,480 Speaker 2: an example of this and a that's all political faction, 608 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,680 Speaker 2: lane fighting stuff, and they'll execute people specifically to sort 609 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,800 Speaker 2: of appease like the Chinese workers so that they never 610 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,640 Speaker 2: have to fucking watch the pla get right out of 611 00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:14,360 Speaker 2: Shanghai again. But the thing is, even if somehow you 612 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,400 Speaker 2: use the states to just kill them, right, it doesn't work, 613 00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 2: because capitalism will just produce more of these people. If 614 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:22,040 Speaker 2: you actually want to stop this, if you want to 615 00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:26,239 Speaker 2: stop this Elon Musk from destroying the entire country and 616 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 2: quite possibly ending all life on earth by fucking with 617 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:32,240 Speaker 2: America's nuclear weapons, un so, they're simply not out of 618 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 2: safety mechanisms. To stop someone from accidentally sending one off, 619 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:39,160 Speaker 2: you were going to have to destroy them completely. The 620 00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:41,960 Speaker 2: permanent base of their power, the power of the oligarch, 621 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:44,280 Speaker 2: the power of the billionaire, the power of the dictator, 622 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:47,560 Speaker 2: must be broken. This tiny group of men cannot, as 623 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 2: a class, be allowed to own the stores and factories 624 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 2: and fields and hospitals, supply chains to produce everything we 625 00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:57,080 Speaker 2: need to survive. It must belong to us. We create 626 00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 2: their wealth. The only way to save this world is 627 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,480 Speaker 2: to take it back. If we want to save democracy, 628 00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:04,640 Speaker 2: the only way to do it is to extend democracy 629 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:07,080 Speaker 2: into the spheres where Elon Musk rules as a tyrant. 630 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 2: Democracy must march into the workplace to slay the beast 631 00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:13,160 Speaker 2: that is lair before the despotism of the workplace consumes 632 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 2: our political democracy and leaves us with despotism there too. 633 00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 2: They must cease to rule. They must cease to exist, 634 00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:23,160 Speaker 2: not as individuals but as a class, and the only 635 00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 2: way to do that is by giving control of their power, 636 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 2: and their property and their wealth to the workers whose 637 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 2: subjugation produced all of it in the first place. That 638 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:33,080 Speaker 2: is the tax that we have in front of us. 639 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 2: The challenge that we face is that we face effectively 640 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,320 Speaker 2: the entire might of the American State, which is one 641 00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 2: of the most powerful apparatus of repression that has ever 642 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:45,560 Speaker 2: been built. Our advantage is that that apparatus of repression 643 00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 2: is currently being run by Donald Trump and Elon Musk, 644 00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:51,320 Speaker 2: who are and I cannot emphasize this enough, maybe the 645 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 2: two figures most emblematic of what the historian Mike Duncan's, 646 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 2: after his extensive study of a whole bunch of revolutions 647 00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 2: on the Revolutions Podcast, concluded to be the great idiots 648 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 2: of history, who who, by their their sheer and unmasterability 649 00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:08,880 Speaker 2: to make the wrong decision at every single moment, are 650 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:13,000 Speaker 2: what makes revolutions possible. And if these people are not 651 00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 2: the great idiots of history that allow us to bring 652 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,640 Speaker 2: them down and stop them from destroying everything that has 653 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 2: ever been in this world that is good, then nothing 654 00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 2: else is. 655 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, we have the one great stroke of a good 656 00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:30,720 Speaker 3: fortune we have, right, is that that the old Paris 657 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 3: been concentrated in their hands of complete idiots who are 658 00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:38,640 Speaker 3: addicted to diet coke and and being mad at their children. 659 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,080 Speaker 2: Yep. And and they you know, we have already seen 660 00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:44,440 Speaker 2: they't they don't understand how this apparatus works. 661 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:44,600 Speaker 1: Right. 662 00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:46,520 Speaker 2: They fired the nuke police by accident. 663 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:50,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, so it's very funny that they're stripping themselves of 664 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:54,320 Speaker 3: the means of coercive violence. Yeah, when we start to 665 00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 3: make you spoke about controlled opposition, right, and the idea that, 666 00:31:57,080 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 3: like the great debate of our time is how much 667 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 3: state regulation we should have and how much unfettered anarcha 668 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 3: capitalism we should have. They are drinking the kool aid 669 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:10,600 Speaker 3: that got them in power. That is the one thing 670 00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 3: going in our favor right now, that they are dismantling 671 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 3: the means of coercive violence because they genuinely believe the 672 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 3: myth that if the state didn't exist, they could be 673 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,560 Speaker 3: even more wealthy and even more tyrannical. 674 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:25,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, and well, and the second advantage that we have 675 00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:28,680 Speaker 2: is that been they have said about systematically alienating every 676 00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:30,480 Speaker 2: single group of people who they would need as their 677 00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 2: political base, they are pissing off the military. They are 678 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,200 Speaker 2: pissing off the intelligence services they are going through, and 679 00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,200 Speaker 2: they are like systematically pissing off the farm states, and 680 00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,080 Speaker 2: you know, like the farmers obviously do not have that 681 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,320 Speaker 2: like don't fucking matter, but they're they're pissing off the 682 00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 2: agro businesses. They are individually going through and pissing off 683 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:47,520 Speaker 2: a whole bunch of the of the of the country, 684 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:50,440 Speaker 2: scientific resources. They're going through, they're like fucking with the 685 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:54,360 Speaker 2: Social Security administration. They're individually going through and pissing off 686 00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 2: every single group of people on earth who matter, and 687 00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 2: people who like us under this system aren't supposed to 688 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,640 Speaker 2: matter until we fucking do something about it. And you know, 689 00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 2: the other big thing that we have right now is 690 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:08,440 Speaker 2: that he is pissing off massive sections of capital by 691 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,680 Speaker 2: actually doing these terrorists, which they didn't think he would do, 692 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:15,320 Speaker 2: and by pulling apart his base of support, and by 693 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,760 Speaker 2: putting together coalitions of some of these people and not 694 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:19,040 Speaker 2: all of them, some of them, some of them you 695 00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:21,040 Speaker 2: just need to divide and conquer by getting them out 696 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:24,400 Speaker 2: from backing him. Right, Like the whole thing with the 697 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:26,600 Speaker 2: Bolsheviks taking over in the October Revolution was that, but 698 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,680 Speaker 2: people just mostly stayed home and that was how they won. 699 00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:32,040 Speaker 2: Like that is largely what we need. We need these 700 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:35,560 Speaker 2: people to stay home, but these people can and will, 701 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 2: if we have anything to say about it, be fucking 702 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 2: driven home and hopefully we can bury both the grave 703 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,880 Speaker 2: diggers and the people whose graves they were digging in 704 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,520 Speaker 2: the same spot in the dust bit of history, and 705 00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:51,040 Speaker 2: never have to deal with these fucking assholes again. It 706 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,720 Speaker 2: Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. For 707 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 2: more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website pool 708 00:33:57,080 --> 00:33:59,959 Speaker 2: Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio, 709 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:04,000 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can 710 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 2: now find sources for It could Happen Here listed directly 711 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:08,680 Speaker 2: in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.