Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Tim
Speaker 1: Stenebeck on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2: Ari Alstedter he is Canada real estate reporter at Bloomberg
Speaker 2: News and he joins us from our Toronto bureau. Ari,
Speaker 2: you know, it's funny, not funny. We've been talking about
Speaker 2: this story a lot in the newsroom because it really
Speaker 2: seems to potentially have some significant consequences for how we
Speaker 2: look at India geopolitically and just a lot of other
Speaker 2: serious issues. But again, relaid it out briefly, but tell
Speaker 2: us about, you know, maybe even the conversations you had
Speaker 2: with Jill Webber, the editor of the magazine, about why
Speaker 2: we had to do something on this story.
Speaker 3: Right. Well, like you said earlier in the program, I
Speaker 3: think for an international audience outside of Canada, this really
Speaker 3: has been flying under the radar. But that really under
Speaker 3: sells how important it is, because, as you say, India
Speaker 3: was really looked to, or has been being looked to by,
Speaker 3: you know, Western democratic countries as a potential democratic counterweight
Speaker 3: to the rising power of China, a billion person country
Speaker 3: that is in Asia that Western democracies could look to
Speaker 3: to sort of represent their values in the region. And
Speaker 3: champion those values in the region. The problem with that
Speaker 3: for the last few years is that even as Western
Speaker 3: countries like the US, France, the UK and Canada have
Speaker 3: been trying to cultivate India as a friend, the government
Speaker 3: of Prime Minisner under Modi has taken a liberal turn
Speaker 3: back home. Opposition politicians, journalists, minority communities have said that
Speaker 3: mister Modi and his nationalists Hindu nationalist DJP government has
Speaker 3: cultivated a klim where speaking out speaking against the government
Speaker 3: line is a risky thing and could incur legal penalties, harassment,
Speaker 3: all sorts of unpleasantness from the state to try to
Speaker 3: induce people not to do this. Now. Expediencies sort of
Speaker 3: allowed or demanded that these western countries turn a blind
Speaker 3: eye to this for as long as it was happening
Speaker 3: in India. But the murder of a Canadian citizen on
Speaker 3: Canadian soil is something Priminis gusture so couldn't look away from.
Speaker 3: And that puts his allies in the US and the
Speaker 3: UK and France and the other countries in an awkward
Speaker 3: situation too, because on the one hand, you know, killing
Speaker 3: each other's citizens is really an unspoken rule. There's really
Speaker 3: an unspoken taboo against this among all these Western countries,
Speaker 3: India violated this. So what do you do with that
Speaker 3: as you want to continue to cultivate India as a friend.
Speaker 1: So that's a really good, really good context for the
Speaker 1: background and the backdrop of this assassination earlier this year,
Speaker 1: back in June. Let's go back to who Hardeep sing
Speaker 1: Najar is or.
Speaker 3: Was, well right, He was a Canadian citizen. He owned
Speaker 3: a plumbing business in Surrey, British Columbia. He had a
Speaker 3: wife and two adult sons. He was also president of
Speaker 3: his gurdwara, which is the Sikh temple. But most relevant
Speaker 3: is he was a vocal supporter of as you say, Khalistan,
Speaker 3: this movement to establish a Sikh homeland and Punjab. And
Speaker 3: most important, he was one of the leaders of this
Speaker 3: activist effort to stage unofficial referendums in the Sikh diaspora
Speaker 3: around the world on Kalistan, putting votes to people who
Speaker 3: are part of the Sikh community. Do you believe there
Speaker 3: should be an independent Seak homeland, an independent Punjab, yes
Speaker 3: or no? These these votes. The group that put these
Speaker 3: on that that mister Niner was a part of, seeks
Speaker 3: for Justice have staged these votes in sea communities around
Speaker 3: the world, including the UK, Austria, Australia, Switzerland, others. And actually,
Speaker 3: in April of this year, mister Niner got up during
Speaker 3: a Sikh festival in front of his gurdwara and said
Speaker 3: that the referendum would now be coming a British Columbia.
Speaker 3: A few months later, he was killed.
Speaker 2: And a you know what, I oh, I'm sorry, please
Speaker 2: go ahead.
Speaker 3: Well what I thought was just going to yeah, please,
Speaker 3: my apologies. Well, what I thought was.
Speaker 2: Interesting what you said at the at the beginning. I'm
Speaker 2: going to go I'm going to go for a second,
Speaker 2: just because because what I think was interesting. No, but
Speaker 2: because we really have been talking about this in the newsroom,
Speaker 2: because it has gotten buried among so many other headlines.
Speaker 2: And I think about what you said at the beginning.
Speaker 2: India has been looked at as a democratic counterweight to
Speaker 2: the rise of China. You know, we're living in an
Speaker 2: error where geopolitics and I feel like geopolitical relationships are
Speaker 2: being you know, rethought or you know, and we're we're
Speaker 2: definitely seeing increased pushback against China. And so what I'm
Speaker 2: wondering is, as you did, this story and looked at
Speaker 2: what happened.
Speaker 1: To him.
Speaker 2: You know, what are you finding out about what's going
Speaker 2: on in the Indian government? Because Prime Minister Modi has
Speaker 2: said the allegations against him in connection with this or
Speaker 2: his government absurd, right, and he calls certain individuals terrorists.
Speaker 2: But what have you been finding out your reporting? As
Speaker 2: again we increasingly look to India as maybe that's the
Speaker 2: partner of the next big partner for the world.
Speaker 3: What have you found out, well, our colleagues in India,
Speaker 3: have you know, looked into what the reaction to this
Speaker 3: story has been in the country, and interestingly it's produced
Speaker 3: a kind of rally around the flag effect. Right wing
Speaker 3: media is very powerful in India and many of the media,
Speaker 3: in part out of this sort of broader climate that
Speaker 3: pre Minister Modi and the BJP have cultivated, many media
Speaker 3: have fronted more right wing voices in their coverage, and
Speaker 3: these kind of commentators have been very much denouncing Canada,
Speaker 3: proclaiming Hardep signature as a terrorist and saying that the
Speaker 3: killing was justified, pointing to the US saying the US
Speaker 3: conducts drone strikes on people it considers terrorists in other countries.
Speaker 3: Why shouldn't India be able to do the same. India
Speaker 3: labeled Hardeep signature as a terrorist and said that he
Speaker 3: was involved in a plot to kill a Hindu priest
Speaker 3: in Punjab. It earlier accused him of having of leading
Speaker 3: Sikh activists or seeks into terrorist training camps in British Columbia.
Speaker 3: The thing is, by their own admission, the Indian government,
Speaker 3: from our sources, from our discussions with them, brought that
Speaker 3: latter terrorist training camp allegation to Canadian police. Canadian police
Speaker 3: checked it out and determined that they were just going
Speaker 3: to a show range outside of Surrey. The community where
Speaker 3: they were going. The mayor, when he got wind of this,
Speaker 3: spoke out and said it was absurd that there was
Speaker 3: a training camp nearby, any kind of terrorist training camp nearby.
Speaker 3: So the issue with a lot of the allegations community
Speaker 3: the Indian government seems to be proof. And also that
Speaker 3: if there was proof, and if there was strong evidence,
Speaker 3: there is an extradition process. Charges can be brought in
Speaker 3: India and you can apply for extradition. Canada is a
Speaker 3: place where there is rule of law, unlike the places
Speaker 3: where the US has conducted his drone strikes. Yemen, Somalia
Speaker 3: very hard to extra write someone out of Yemen. For Canada,
Speaker 3: it's not such a big problem if it meets the
Speaker 3: standards of evidence for Canadian law. The Indians seem to
Speaker 3: don't make much of this argument, which is essentially what
Speaker 3: the Canadian government has been saying and deem or accuse
Speaker 3: the Canadians of ignoring their complaints about the activities of
Speaker 3: people like Heartyep signature and just not doing anything about it.
Speaker 3: And so our sources and the government say that that
Speaker 3: prompted them to take matters into their own hands, or
Speaker 3: at least decide that Nigure was a problem that had
Speaker 3: to be addressed.
Speaker 1: Well, what do we know about the actual crime that occurred,
Speaker 1: the assassination here who? What do we know about who
Speaker 1: exactly was behind it and how are people being held accountable?
Speaker 3: Well, we don't know who's behind it. What we have
Speaker 3: is the Canadian allegations or the allegation by the Canadian
Speaker 3: government that India, the government of India, was behind it.
Speaker 3: We do know details of the crime itself as it occurred.
Speaker 3: We know that it was a Sunday evening in Surrey
Speaker 3: Father's Day in June. Hardep sing Jar at around eight pm,
Speaker 3: was leaving the Gurdwara after a day of working there
Speaker 3: as the president giving his Sunday speech and the like.
Speaker 3: He was driving out sort of the back exit of
Speaker 3: the Gridwara parking lot. As he was driving Goodwara security
Speaker 3: cameras capture a serious white sedan seemed to start moving
Speaker 3: as soon as he did, pulled in front of him
Speaker 3: on the road out and then stopped right before the
Speaker 3: exit of the Gridwara merged into a larger road when
Speaker 3: that car stopped at forced hardiep Sing the Jersey stop
Speaker 3: and then two people in black, two men in black
Speaker 3: emerged from the south of the road and fired into
Speaker 3: the driver's seat window of Niger's truck. The firing continued
Speaker 3: for around five seconds, maybe a bit longer. As soon
Speaker 3: as the firing started that that white car pulled out
Speaker 3: of the out of the gridir and drove away. And
Speaker 3: then the two gunmen stopped firing and they started running.
Speaker 3: Witnesses saw them running, and witnesses who I spoke to
Speaker 3: three people pursued them, followed them into a park nearby.
Speaker 3: One says that one of the gunmen they were justsed
Speaker 3: all in black. They had black hoodies on, and they
Speaker 3: appeared to be concealing holding something in their pockets in
Speaker 3: the front hoodie pocket and one of the gunmen pulled
Speaker 3: a gun out and threatened one of the pursuers, then
Speaker 3: proceeded deeper into the park. The pursuers, after hesitating twenty
Speaker 3: seconds or so, continued and caught up just in time
Speaker 3: to see the two gunmen, still masked, get into a
Speaker 3: silver sedan that was parked in a cul de sac
Speaker 3: right at the end of the park and then drive away.
Speaker 3: And so that's what we know. The police have released
Speaker 3: a lot of disinformation. The white sedan is still a mystery.
Speaker 3: The police identified the silver car as a two thousand
Speaker 3: and eight Toyota Corolla and asked for information of that
Speaker 3: identifying the other the driver that as another suspect. And
Speaker 3: that's pretty much where it starts.
Speaker 2: Yeah, unfortunately we have to run. There is so much
Speaker 2: rich detail in this story, and it reminds me of
Speaker 2: the complicated relationship that the world has had which Jane
Speaker 2: over the last twenty thirty years. And now you wonder
Speaker 2: if it's just a repeat with India. Ari Alstetter, thank
Speaker 2: you so much.