1
00:00:15,476 --> 00:00:15,956
Speaker 1: Pushkin.

2
00:00:20,436 --> 00:00:23,356
Speaker 2: Patrick Watson first came to international attention in two thousand

3
00:00:23,356 --> 00:00:26,076
Speaker 2: and seven when his album Close to Paradise won the

4
00:00:26,076 --> 00:00:31,116
Speaker 2: Polaris Music Prize that's Canada's most prestigious award for Canadian artists.

5
00:00:31,836 --> 00:00:34,076
Speaker 2: Over the course of his career, the Montreal based singer

6
00:00:34,116 --> 00:00:37,116
Speaker 2: and composer a built a devoted following through his orchestral

7
00:00:37,156 --> 00:00:41,396
Speaker 2: pop arrangements, his remarkable tenor voice, and live performances that

8
00:00:41,436 --> 00:00:45,516
Speaker 2: blend intimacy with a theatric sensibility. Watson's music has found

9
00:00:45,516 --> 00:00:48,196
Speaker 2: his second life far beyond his core fan base. His

10
00:00:48,316 --> 00:00:52,076
Speaker 2: song Jette Lacere des Mont became a viral phenomenon years

11
00:00:52,116 --> 00:00:55,236
Speaker 2: after its release, accumulating hundreds of millions of streams after

12
00:00:55,276 --> 00:00:59,396
Speaker 2: being discovered by a new generation on social media. His

13
00:00:59,516 --> 00:01:02,036
Speaker 2: songs have also found their way to television shows like

14
00:01:02,196 --> 00:01:04,876
Speaker 2: The Walking Dead and Grey's Anatomy, bringing his sound to

15
00:01:04,916 --> 00:01:09,076
Speaker 2: audiences worldwide. On today's episode, Bruce Seldom talks to Patrick

16
00:01:09,196 --> 00:01:12,876
Speaker 2: Watson about making his playful and adventurous new record uh Oh,

17
00:01:12,956 --> 00:01:15,516
Speaker 2: an album he recorded after recovering from a vocal cord

18
00:01:15,556 --> 00:01:18,796
Speaker 2: hemorrhage on tour. Because of his injury, Patrick chose to

19
00:01:18,796 --> 00:01:21,116
Speaker 2: feature a ton of guest artists on his new album

20
00:01:21,476 --> 00:01:27,436
Speaker 2: in the style of hip hop features This is broken record,

21
00:01:27,876 --> 00:01:36,796
Speaker 2: real musicians, real conversations. Here's Bruce Headlam speaking to Patrick

22
00:01:36,836 --> 00:01:39,436
Speaker 2: Watson to begin with the performance of a song called

23
00:01:39,476 --> 00:01:42,796
Speaker 2: House on Fire featuring Ariel Engel also known as La

24
00:01:42,836 --> 00:01:43,796
Speaker 2: Force sitting in.

25
00:02:05,516 --> 00:02:07,716
Speaker 3: I'll be ro and yoube right.

26
00:02:08,156 --> 00:02:08,796
Speaker 1: I don't know.

27
00:02:09,316 --> 00:02:10,236
Speaker 3: That's all right.

28
00:02:15,876 --> 00:02:19,356
Speaker 4: I keep trying to see your side, even though I

29
00:02:19,836 --> 00:02:21,196
Speaker 4: just I don't know.

30
00:02:21,116 --> 00:02:30,316
Speaker 5: How we are words, we are stones, swirls down silver weed,

31
00:02:30,556 --> 00:02:33,356
Speaker 5: areful wain did all go?

32
00:02:34,236 --> 00:02:35,356
Speaker 4: How'd your eyes got?

33
00:02:35,596 --> 00:02:38,876
Speaker 3: So you can wrap your truth and riveted bows? But

34
00:02:38,996 --> 00:02:42,476
Speaker 3: I just don't know how to be alone? And I'm

35
00:02:42,476 --> 00:02:45,676
Speaker 3: a man made out of homes. But tell me something

36
00:02:45,796 --> 00:02:59,876
Speaker 3: loud already I'll be wrong, You'll be wrong. I don't

37
00:02:59,956 --> 00:03:03,316
Speaker 3: mind it's wrong. I just want to make and man.

38
00:03:08,156 --> 00:03:09,276
Speaker 6: Just can fly his.

39
00:03:09,436 --> 00:03:14,036
Speaker 3: King cross while said our house so far, our.

40
00:03:13,836 --> 00:03:16,956
Speaker 5: House is a very fine out speak got housh we

41
00:03:17,236 --> 00:03:21,236
Speaker 5: gole you take your hands and cuppy wars screams so

42
00:03:21,356 --> 00:03:22,796
Speaker 5: loud that the neighbors.

43
00:03:22,436 --> 00:03:23,236
Speaker 6: Can be.

44
00:03:26,196 --> 00:03:40,676
Speaker 3: But I don't want you this. I was yours, your man.

45
00:03:41,036 --> 00:03:44,716
Speaker 3: There was so much on the line you're not keep

46
00:03:44,916 --> 00:03:46,396
Speaker 3: chance your sad.

47
00:03:48,276 --> 00:03:48,316
Speaker 7: Es.

48
00:03:52,996 --> 00:03:55,956
Speaker 3: Here's some Milosnamaker.

49
00:04:00,036 --> 00:04:02,556
Speaker 4: Drank the rain and bent to the sun.

50
00:04:04,036 --> 00:04:12,236
Speaker 3: When we will now we're counting down, when.

51
00:04:12,156 --> 00:04:20,476
Speaker 4: We can take the pictures off the walls, the budgets

52
00:04:20,596 --> 00:04:26,556
Speaker 4: in the hall, when we walk down the doors.

53
00:04:29,596 --> 00:04:37,636
Speaker 3: I don't love you anymore? Can't you hear those voices called.

54
00:04:40,076 --> 00:04:41,196
Speaker 6: Can't you hear.

55
00:04:41,036 --> 00:04:47,956
Speaker 3: Those voices called? Can't you hear those voices called?

56
00:04:51,236 --> 00:04:51,556
Speaker 6: Fall?

57
00:04:51,876 --> 00:04:52,996
Speaker 3: Love to break this.

58
00:04:53,276 --> 00:05:05,156
Speaker 6: Fall, love to brig this, fall.

59
00:05:06,876 --> 00:05:15,356
Speaker 3: For love to break this. I'll be wrong, You'll be

60
00:05:15,556 --> 00:05:17,156
Speaker 3: right out of my This.

61
00:05:17,436 --> 00:05:25,836
Speaker 4: Is all the most one, and I can't see through

62
00:05:25,876 --> 00:05:29,836
Speaker 4: all the tears. I can't see through all the years.

63
00:05:30,076 --> 00:05:32,276
Speaker 1: I can carry the weight of our lives.

64
00:05:32,916 --> 00:05:35,476
Speaker 3: I can carry all lost lives.

65
00:05:38,276 --> 00:05:41,316
Speaker 4: I can't see through all the tears. I can't see

66
00:05:41,396 --> 00:05:42,956
Speaker 4: through all the years.

67
00:05:45,876 --> 00:05:49,916
Speaker 3: I'll be wrong, you be right out of mine. It's

68
00:05:49,956 --> 00:05:54,036
Speaker 3: all right. I just want a man, right.

69
00:06:06,236 --> 00:06:09,836
Speaker 7: Welcome, Patrick Watson, you're here. Talk about you or your

70
00:06:09,916 --> 00:06:10,516
Speaker 7: ninth album.

71
00:06:10,756 --> 00:06:11,436
Speaker 1: I'm not counting.

72
00:06:11,796 --> 00:06:12,636
Speaker 7: You're not counting like.

73
00:06:12,636 --> 00:06:14,956
Speaker 1: It's bad luck. I'm not sure if it's eight or

74
00:06:14,996 --> 00:06:17,516
Speaker 1: nine because they probably didn't count the book one. But

75
00:06:17,556 --> 00:06:19,116
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm gonna go with I don't want

76
00:06:19,116 --> 00:06:19,316
Speaker 1: to know.

77
00:06:19,556 --> 00:06:22,556
Speaker 7: Okay, we don't know what album this is, but we

78
00:06:22,636 --> 00:06:26,756
Speaker 7: do know what it's called, and it's called uh oh.

79
00:06:27,556 --> 00:06:31,076
Speaker 7: And of course you're here with Ariel Engel, who people

80
00:06:31,076 --> 00:06:35,116
Speaker 7: would know from Broken Social Scene from her own and

81
00:06:35,156 --> 00:06:39,676
Speaker 7: you're still performing as Force, Force and Patrick. A lot

82
00:06:39,676 --> 00:06:42,796
Speaker 7: of people would know your music in the States, particularly

83
00:06:42,836 --> 00:06:43,796
Speaker 7: probably from movies.

84
00:06:43,876 --> 00:06:45,316
Speaker 1: To Build a Home was the first one that s

85
00:06:45,636 --> 00:06:48,476
Speaker 1: can really make ways. I mean it was like from

86
00:06:48,476 --> 00:06:51,996
Speaker 1: anything from Gray's Anatomy to like The Walking to music

87
00:06:51,996 --> 00:06:54,796
Speaker 1: and The Walking Dead. This is us when he dies,

88
00:06:55,356 --> 00:06:56,676
Speaker 1: it's to build a Home with.

89
00:06:56,756 --> 00:06:59,756
Speaker 7: The toaster follow really okay, Yeah, it was a song

90
00:06:59,836 --> 00:07:01,236
Speaker 7: like someone dies in a series.

91
00:07:02,276 --> 00:07:03,876
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then it ruins a serious for me because

92
00:07:03,876 --> 00:07:05,956
Speaker 1: I can't take it seriously. It ruined The Walking Dead

93
00:07:05,996 --> 00:07:06,196
Speaker 1: for me.

94
00:07:06,276 --> 00:07:09,076
Speaker 7: I couldn't yehause hearing your own song, I couldn't.

95
00:07:08,756 --> 00:07:11,716
Speaker 1: Take seriously after that guy was so into that show.

96
00:07:12,076 --> 00:07:15,396
Speaker 1: And then and then, funny enough, recently, when TikTok and

97
00:07:15,436 --> 00:07:18,636
Speaker 1: Instagram happened, the similar thing happened because a lot of

98
00:07:18,636 --> 00:07:21,076
Speaker 1: my music plays twelve images. And then a French song

99
00:07:21,116 --> 00:07:23,116
Speaker 1: out of the middle nowhere became another kind of song

100
00:07:23,156 --> 00:07:25,636
Speaker 1: that started playing everywhere. So I have a strange career,

101
00:07:25,716 --> 00:07:25,916
Speaker 1: you know.

102
00:07:26,156 --> 00:07:31,116
Speaker 7: Yeah, Well in that song is you have the I

103
00:07:31,156 --> 00:07:35,996
Speaker 7: think the most played French language song on Spotify.

104
00:07:36,076 --> 00:07:36,676
Speaker 1: You have like a.

105
00:07:36,596 --> 00:07:40,036
Speaker 7: Billion first one across a billion streams, which is incredible

106
00:07:40,476 --> 00:07:42,756
Speaker 7: because you're you were born in California, right, I.

107
00:07:42,716 --> 00:07:44,276
Speaker 1: Was born in California. I moved to CA back when

108
00:07:44,316 --> 00:07:46,636
Speaker 1: I was two, so I have very little memory. My

109
00:07:46,716 --> 00:07:48,196
Speaker 1: dad was a test pilot in the desert.

110
00:07:48,476 --> 00:07:51,396
Speaker 7: You're dad was a test pilot. Yeah, you're a rock

111
00:07:51,436 --> 00:07:53,676
Speaker 7: star and you're the second coolest person in your family.

112
00:07:53,956 --> 00:07:55,996
Speaker 1: He literally you know what makes it even worse, He

113
00:07:56,076 --> 00:07:58,436
Speaker 1: won the Top Gun Award and he used to have

114
00:07:58,516 --> 00:08:00,916
Speaker 1: it in my bedroom and it was like this, like

115
00:08:01,276 --> 00:08:03,076
Speaker 1: this kind of a shell of a missile. And then

116
00:08:03,116 --> 00:08:05,116
Speaker 1: we didn't really realize. And then when the movie Top

117
00:08:05,156 --> 00:08:07,756
Speaker 1: Gun came out with Tom Cruise, where because it's all

118
00:08:07,796 --> 00:08:10,716
Speaker 1: about that award, right, realized in our bedroom he had

119
00:08:10,756 --> 00:08:15,756
Speaker 1: actually won that award. And then my other brother is

120
00:08:15,756 --> 00:08:18,716
Speaker 1: cooler than me too, My brother Jamie. He's also a

121
00:08:18,716 --> 00:08:21,876
Speaker 1: pilot and he has the most hours of any other

122
00:08:21,916 --> 00:08:24,356
Speaker 1: C one thirty three pilot in like from like I

123
00:08:24,396 --> 00:08:28,276
Speaker 1: think ninety two to ninety eighty, did Rwanda Sirievo Iraq

124
00:08:28,516 --> 00:08:31,156
Speaker 1: wore he would be that last plane in and out

125
00:08:31,316 --> 00:08:35,956
Speaker 1: or those low level flying He's a very decorated pilot

126
00:08:36,156 --> 00:08:40,036
Speaker 1: and uh and has been through circumstances that I could

127
00:08:40,076 --> 00:08:44,156
Speaker 1: my depth cannot match his depth of experiences. So I

128
00:08:44,196 --> 00:08:45,836
Speaker 1: and then my other brother's kind of coolly just based.

129
00:08:46,036 --> 00:08:47,516
Speaker 1: I think I think of the last of my family

130
00:08:47,556 --> 00:08:48,516
Speaker 1: of the cool cool.

131
00:08:48,596 --> 00:08:50,916
Speaker 7: But yeah, okay, profession.

132
00:08:52,196 --> 00:08:54,676
Speaker 1: I know, I know. This was like a professional figure

133
00:08:54,676 --> 00:08:58,756
Speaker 1: skater for crinel out on the Canadian team. My other sister, Heidi,

134
00:08:58,956 --> 00:09:00,596
Speaker 1: is the one who built all the metro stations, the

135
00:09:00,596 --> 00:09:03,036
Speaker 1: head engineer in Los Angeles and does all the water

136
00:09:03,076 --> 00:09:06,556
Speaker 1: cheating plants and like leads construction sites and she's this

137
00:09:06,676 --> 00:09:09,476
Speaker 1: really lovely lady who just kills it. So I've really

138
00:09:09,556 --> 00:09:10,676
Speaker 1: literally the least cool.

139
00:09:11,436 --> 00:09:15,196
Speaker 7: Wow. Well, let's let's go over some of your underachievements there,

140
00:09:18,116 --> 00:09:21,156
Speaker 7: and let's start with the new album Great, which is

141
00:09:21,196 --> 00:09:22,996
Speaker 7: a very interesting genesis and I'd like you to talk

142
00:09:23,036 --> 00:09:23,476
Speaker 7: about that.

143
00:09:24,076 --> 00:09:27,796
Speaker 1: When I titled uh oh, the original inspiration was at

144
00:09:27,796 --> 00:09:30,636
Speaker 1: one point I had like totally broken my voice and

145
00:09:31,556 --> 00:09:33,836
Speaker 1: we were playing a show in Atlanta, and we were

146
00:09:33,836 --> 00:09:35,676
Speaker 1: playing the song here Comes the River, and I just

147
00:09:35,796 --> 00:09:39,356
Speaker 1: oversang it, especially because when you sing in the South,

148
00:09:39,476 --> 00:09:42,356
Speaker 1: you feel this kind of like this debt to the place.

149
00:09:42,476 --> 00:09:44,636
Speaker 1: So much music that was origining from there, so when

150
00:09:44,636 --> 00:09:47,116
Speaker 1: you play there, you feel this debt that you have

151
00:09:47,156 --> 00:09:48,796
Speaker 1: to pay. And I remember doing that show. It was

152
00:09:48,796 --> 00:09:51,036
Speaker 1: a very small audience, and I was trying to pay

153
00:09:51,076 --> 00:09:53,476
Speaker 1: that debt because there was so much inspiration from the South,

154
00:09:53,796 --> 00:09:56,796
Speaker 1: and I oversang and blew my chords out. We woke

155
00:09:56,876 --> 00:09:59,716
Speaker 1: up in Philadelphia the e and t's like, you've paralyzed

156
00:09:59,716 --> 00:10:00,476
Speaker 1: your vocal chords.

157
00:10:00,716 --> 00:10:02,516
Speaker 7: Now, did you know it when you were singing?

158
00:10:02,676 --> 00:10:04,996
Speaker 1: Yes, I didn't know how much trouble I was in

159
00:10:05,316 --> 00:10:08,956
Speaker 1: because it slowly started to get worse after the show.

160
00:10:09,116 --> 00:10:10,516
Speaker 1: Then when I woke up there was no more sound,

161
00:10:10,596 --> 00:10:13,036
Speaker 1: and there was no more sound for three months. That

162
00:10:13,116 --> 00:10:16,356
Speaker 1: came out of the chords and the other part of

163
00:10:16,356 --> 00:10:18,316
Speaker 1: the genus of the record when we talk about the title,

164
00:10:18,316 --> 00:10:20,716
Speaker 1: because we're working towards the uh oh, is that like

165
00:10:20,836 --> 00:10:22,876
Speaker 1: for the last seven years, you wake up, every time

166
00:10:22,916 --> 00:10:25,276
Speaker 1: you open the newspaper, you're always like, oh oh. It's

167
00:10:25,316 --> 00:10:27,836
Speaker 1: just like we're in this constant uh oh, And I

168
00:10:27,876 --> 00:10:30,396
Speaker 1: thought that that would be a fun way to approach

169
00:10:30,436 --> 00:10:33,276
Speaker 1: a record in these times, just being like, oh, oh,

170
00:10:33,356 --> 00:10:34,316
Speaker 1: what you gonna do about it?

171
00:10:35,476 --> 00:10:39,196
Speaker 7: I'm interested you when you blow out your your vocal chords.

172
00:10:40,156 --> 00:10:43,436
Speaker 7: I imagine given the business you are in, people have

173
00:10:43,476 --> 00:10:45,996
Speaker 7: lots of recommendations like go to this guy he did

174
00:10:46,716 --> 00:10:50,156
Speaker 7: Mariah Carey, or this guy does Celine Dion or something.

175
00:10:50,356 --> 00:10:53,516
Speaker 7: Did you like seek out who you could finds.

176
00:10:53,116 --> 00:10:55,196
Speaker 1: A hemorrhage, you know, like it was on a node.

177
00:10:55,196 --> 00:10:57,716
Speaker 1: It was an operation. Some blood vessels broke out, so

178
00:10:58,156 --> 00:10:59,996
Speaker 1: there was this complete perilous of the chords. So it's

179
00:10:59,996 --> 00:11:02,556
Speaker 1: not an operation you do to fix it. The doctors

180
00:11:02,556 --> 00:11:06,276
Speaker 1: didn't really know if I'd sing again. And then me

181
00:11:06,396 --> 00:11:08,876
Speaker 1: being a little bit of a science chunky, I'd been

182
00:11:08,916 --> 00:11:11,756
Speaker 1: done so much research. We're just like reading science journals

183
00:11:11,756 --> 00:11:14,396
Speaker 1: that I knew that when athletes had really big problem

184
00:11:14,436 --> 00:11:17,636
Speaker 1: they would going to hyperbaric auction chambers. We just put

185
00:11:17,716 --> 00:11:21,276
Speaker 1: you on a pressure because when a diver gets like

186
00:11:21,556 --> 00:11:24,396
Speaker 1: blood poisoning, they found that all the other wounds would

187
00:11:24,396 --> 00:11:26,116
Speaker 1: start to heal quicker when they put them into the

188
00:11:26,196 --> 00:11:29,436
Speaker 1: hyperbaric chambers. So to be honest, like no one told

189
00:11:29,436 --> 00:11:32,476
Speaker 1: me to do that. I'm super clausophobic. It's a little

190
00:11:32,476 --> 00:11:34,916
Speaker 1: glass jar. I was not feeling it, but I tried

191
00:11:34,956 --> 00:11:37,396
Speaker 1: it and I could start making a noise.

192
00:11:37,396 --> 00:11:40,996
Speaker 7: The next day, when you started this album, was your

193
00:11:41,076 --> 00:11:41,556
Speaker 7: voice back?

194
00:11:42,836 --> 00:11:45,436
Speaker 1: It slowly came back. When I did Celencio, it was

195
00:11:45,476 --> 00:11:49,796
Speaker 1: still not really great, and I didn't know if I

196
00:11:49,836 --> 00:11:51,676
Speaker 1: wanted to sing or not. And then I was with

197
00:11:51,796 --> 00:11:54,516
Speaker 1: Nova and we were sitting in this like really beautiful

198
00:11:54,516 --> 00:11:57,436
Speaker 1: apartment above Mamouth in Paris we had rented, and we

199
00:11:57,516 --> 00:11:59,396
Speaker 1: had like two mics and a laptop, like a real

200
00:11:59,436 --> 00:12:03,156
Speaker 1: simple audio setup, and we just talked about she had

201
00:12:03,196 --> 00:12:06,796
Speaker 1: recently not loss of voice, but became very unhealthy. She

202
00:12:06,836 --> 00:12:09,676
Speaker 1: couldn't breathe for like three months because of touring. And

203
00:12:10,596 --> 00:12:13,476
Speaker 1: she's a very sweet and favorite talented person. And then

204
00:12:14,076 --> 00:12:16,396
Speaker 1: while we talked, we had all these conversations and then

205
00:12:16,716 --> 00:12:19,276
Speaker 1: I just started singing again, kind of naturally in a conversation,

206
00:12:19,436 --> 00:12:22,876
Speaker 1: not in an attempt, and it was quite lovely because

207
00:12:22,916 --> 00:12:25,196
Speaker 1: the singing on that song, I'm not really singing in

208
00:12:25,196 --> 00:12:27,316
Speaker 1: that song, you know, it's much more talkie than I

209
00:12:27,356 --> 00:12:29,836
Speaker 1: normally would have done, which was I think a really

210
00:12:29,916 --> 00:12:34,876
Speaker 1: nice accident saying we started that intro in Spanish because

211
00:12:35,516 --> 00:12:38,356
Speaker 1: I loved that language musically. It's one of the most

212
00:12:38,596 --> 00:12:41,876
Speaker 1: beautiful musical languages you can, you know, the world has,

213
00:12:41,916 --> 00:12:44,916
Speaker 1: you know, And so I'd ask Nova originally to sing

214
00:12:45,036 --> 00:12:46,556
Speaker 1: in Spanish because she can do it in such a

215
00:12:46,596 --> 00:12:49,876
Speaker 1: lovely way. So the idea bind the collaborations were what

216
00:12:49,956 --> 00:12:52,436
Speaker 1: can I not do? I didn't want to add to

217
00:12:52,516 --> 00:12:54,276
Speaker 1: what I already do. I would look for people that

218
00:12:54,396 --> 00:12:58,316
Speaker 1: could be a different perspective, more in the tradition. I

219
00:12:58,316 --> 00:13:01,156
Speaker 1: would think of a hip hop feature, meaning that you

220
00:13:01,196 --> 00:13:03,036
Speaker 1: would have like two verses, and the two verses talk

221
00:13:03,076 --> 00:13:06,076
Speaker 1: about two different stories even and it doesn't really matter.

222
00:13:06,676 --> 00:13:08,756
Speaker 1: And I really admired that freedom they had in that

223
00:13:08,756 --> 00:13:11,796
Speaker 1: strung sure. What I really wanted at the collaborations was

224
00:13:11,996 --> 00:13:14,156
Speaker 1: people speaking over me and maybe not agreeing with me,

225
00:13:14,276 --> 00:13:17,236
Speaker 1: not necessarily singing harmony with me. Laf False I had

226
00:13:17,276 --> 00:13:20,156
Speaker 1: invited because it was the most personal song on the record,

227
00:13:20,196 --> 00:13:21,636
Speaker 1: and I've sing with her years and I don't I

228
00:13:21,636 --> 00:13:23,156
Speaker 1: couldn't really sing with anybody else.

229
00:13:23,836 --> 00:13:26,716
Speaker 7: Some of the songs seem like something close to a

230
00:13:26,716 --> 00:13:30,316
Speaker 7: classic duet. Some of them seem like arguments. It's interesting

231
00:13:30,356 --> 00:13:33,396
Speaker 7: every interaction with the other singer is a little bit.

232
00:13:33,756 --> 00:13:34,596
Speaker 1: Unique to them.

233
00:13:34,716 --> 00:13:35,196
Speaker 7: Unique.

234
00:13:36,276 --> 00:13:38,876
Speaker 1: They're all like people that I would want to sing

235
00:13:38,956 --> 00:13:41,316
Speaker 1: like first and all. And then some people ask me, like,

236
00:13:41,316 --> 00:13:42,876
Speaker 1: why is it no woman? I'm like, listen, I just

237
00:13:42,916 --> 00:13:44,796
Speaker 1: picked the best singers I could find, Like, that's not

238
00:13:44,836 --> 00:13:47,196
Speaker 1: a gender thing. It's like also, it was really a

239
00:13:47,276 --> 00:13:51,676
Speaker 1: question of like perspectives, like Martha Wainwright. Example of Martha

240
00:13:51,756 --> 00:13:54,236
Speaker 1: is that she's fire like I do not have that

241
00:13:54,276 --> 00:13:57,676
Speaker 1: fire that she has behind her voice, and I wanted

242
00:13:57,676 --> 00:13:59,996
Speaker 1: to experience what it was like to sing with someone

243
00:14:00,076 --> 00:14:02,356
Speaker 1: and write with someone with that kind of like bold

244
00:14:02,436 --> 00:14:05,756
Speaker 1: fire that I don't have access to. It's her magic power.

245
00:14:06,276 --> 00:14:08,396
Speaker 1: So a lot of these decisions were based on that.

246
00:14:08,556 --> 00:14:10,796
Speaker 1: I'm like, what is like to sing with Martha?

247
00:14:11,116 --> 00:14:11,596
Speaker 6: You like?

248
00:14:11,636 --> 00:14:15,676
Speaker 1: It was very selfish. So land this French singer the

249
00:14:15,716 --> 00:14:17,916
Speaker 1: way she like lands her words. It's very hard to

250
00:14:17,956 --> 00:14:20,156
Speaker 1: sing in French, very hard language to sing in.

251
00:14:20,356 --> 00:14:20,996
Speaker 7: And why is that?

252
00:14:21,516 --> 00:14:24,396
Speaker 1: Because it every bloody word ends with a vowel and

253
00:14:24,436 --> 00:14:26,436
Speaker 1: it takes like fifty words to say the same thing

254
00:14:26,476 --> 00:14:29,276
Speaker 1: it says three words in English, So you really need

255
00:14:29,316 --> 00:14:31,276
Speaker 1: to be a wordsmith to succeed at it. And you

256
00:14:31,356 --> 00:14:34,436
Speaker 1: really have a finesse of any your words is extremely

257
00:14:34,556 --> 00:14:38,476
Speaker 1: challenging for people outside the language to like it. There's

258
00:14:38,516 --> 00:14:41,236
Speaker 1: a few examples, like Gainsbourg, but games Book has this

259
00:14:41,396 --> 00:14:44,036
Speaker 1: lovely He's almost like a Leno cone kind of delivery,

260
00:14:44,116 --> 00:14:46,556
Speaker 1: like really dry and wordy, and it's funny the way

261
00:14:46,556 --> 00:14:49,196
Speaker 1: he finishes his words. And the thing about French too

262
00:14:49,276 --> 00:14:51,316
Speaker 1: is if it's too like if I say I love

263
00:14:51,356 --> 00:14:54,316
Speaker 1: you in French, like as a really kind of on

264
00:14:54,396 --> 00:14:57,076
Speaker 1: my sleeves kind of way meaning it, it doesn't work.

265
00:14:57,756 --> 00:14:59,236
Speaker 1: You need to say it in a way that's a

266
00:14:59,236 --> 00:15:02,836
Speaker 1: bit witty and it needs to be a little bit ironic,

267
00:15:02,916 --> 00:15:04,516
Speaker 1: with a little bit of like a little bit tongue

268
00:15:04,516 --> 00:15:07,076
Speaker 1: in cheek for it to have the same impact. So

269
00:15:07,076 --> 00:15:09,636
Speaker 1: we're English, I could say like clouds fire love and

270
00:15:09,676 --> 00:15:13,076
Speaker 1: people make some sort of connection, or French you need

271
00:15:13,116 --> 00:15:15,276
Speaker 1: to be witty as Bob Dylan to get away with

272
00:15:15,316 --> 00:15:16,876
Speaker 1: it or else it just doesn't work.

273
00:15:17,516 --> 00:15:19,156
Speaker 7: It doesn't land for a French audience, it.

274
00:15:19,156 --> 00:15:21,436
Speaker 1: Doesn't land for anybody like. It's not a language that

275
00:15:21,516 --> 00:15:24,356
Speaker 1: works that way. It's a very intellectual language. It's it's

276
00:15:24,356 --> 00:15:27,636
Speaker 1: a language that was developed in literature. English was a

277
00:15:27,716 --> 00:15:31,196
Speaker 1: language developed in trade, you know, it developed in a

278
00:15:31,196 --> 00:15:35,316
Speaker 1: way that you could communicate very easily in multiple scenarios.

279
00:15:35,716 --> 00:15:38,556
Speaker 1: And when you have like Spanish or Italian, these are

280
00:15:38,836 --> 00:15:41,436
Speaker 1: developed in poetry and songs, so that's why they roll

281
00:15:41,476 --> 00:15:42,596
Speaker 1: off the tongue like magical.

282
00:15:44,156 --> 00:15:46,476
Speaker 2: We'll be back with more from Patrick Watson.

283
00:15:50,796 --> 00:15:53,396
Speaker 7: When I listen to your music, it reminds me of

284
00:15:53,436 --> 00:15:56,596
Speaker 7: a lot of other Montreal artists, Leonard Cohens and one

285
00:15:56,636 --> 00:15:59,876
Speaker 7: of them in the Garagols. Yeah, you want to go

286
00:16:00,716 --> 00:16:04,156
Speaker 7: way back, but there are so many influences that you

287
00:16:04,236 --> 00:16:08,196
Speaker 7: don't typically find in I'll call it pop music.

288
00:16:08,836 --> 00:16:08,956
Speaker 4: Ye.

289
00:16:09,156 --> 00:16:12,716
Speaker 7: People struggle to label your music. I try not to

290
00:16:12,956 --> 00:16:14,716
Speaker 7: work in labels. But I look it up it's like

291
00:16:14,836 --> 00:16:18,036
Speaker 7: it was a dreamy pop is it folk experimentation? And

292
00:16:18,076 --> 00:16:20,636
Speaker 7: to me, I was like, well, no, that's Montreal just

293
00:16:20,676 --> 00:16:25,436
Speaker 7: has a natural kind of it has all these different influences.

294
00:16:25,516 --> 00:16:26,476
Speaker 7: Now did you find that?

295
00:16:26,716 --> 00:16:29,636
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean, here's the lucky thing about Quebec or Montreal,

296
00:16:30,196 --> 00:16:33,076
Speaker 1: and what's particular about it is that it's an island

297
00:16:33,116 --> 00:16:36,276
Speaker 1: in North America in a sense where the French, to

298
00:16:36,356 --> 00:16:40,356
Speaker 1: save their language, built these insanely high tall walls around it.

299
00:16:40,396 --> 00:16:43,316
Speaker 1: Culturally speaking, so like you know, when I was a kid,

300
00:16:43,316 --> 00:16:45,436
Speaker 1: there was no real labels. There was Constellation in the

301
00:16:45,476 --> 00:16:49,996
Speaker 1: Godspeed guys, but that's very experimental and Godspeed it's another

302
00:16:49,996 --> 00:16:52,036
Speaker 1: great example of what you're talking about too. The first

303
00:16:52,036 --> 00:16:54,036
Speaker 1: time I saw violins with guitar pedals is going to

304
00:16:54,076 --> 00:16:57,796
Speaker 1: be Godspeed. They had orchestral, super cinematic rock. It changed

305
00:16:57,796 --> 00:16:59,756
Speaker 1: my life when I saw them. But there was a

306
00:16:59,756 --> 00:17:02,116
Speaker 1: really strong rule in our city that you don't sound

307
00:17:02,156 --> 00:17:05,436
Speaker 1: like somebody else, and don't you can't be like a style.

308
00:17:05,516 --> 00:17:07,236
Speaker 1: I remember going to Toronto and the bands would have

309
00:17:07,276 --> 00:17:09,516
Speaker 1: like a like a portfolio and a press photo or

310
00:17:09,636 --> 00:17:12,156
Speaker 1: like this kind of idea, and we're like, we didn't

311
00:17:12,196 --> 00:17:13,836
Speaker 1: have any of that because there was no business there,

312
00:17:14,396 --> 00:17:16,756
Speaker 1: and I think with our music was completely isolated from

313
00:17:16,756 --> 00:17:20,236
Speaker 1: that until we would reach a certain point, the breaking point,

314
00:17:20,276 --> 00:17:22,116
Speaker 1: and then tour around the world and then we would

315
00:17:22,556 --> 00:17:24,916
Speaker 1: kind of see that for the first time. But it's

316
00:17:24,956 --> 00:17:28,356
Speaker 1: really important for a Montreal band to be very unique,

317
00:17:28,396 --> 00:17:31,196
Speaker 1: and if you're selling something, it's not a good look

318
00:17:31,236 --> 00:17:34,716
Speaker 1: in Montreal. It's not there's a certain ethics that that's

319
00:17:34,796 --> 00:17:37,796
Speaker 1: unset in Montreal, you know, And I think I would

320
00:17:37,836 --> 00:17:41,116
Speaker 1: say the modern bands that came from Montreal would definitely

321
00:17:41,156 --> 00:17:44,436
Speaker 1: be coming from God Speedy, Black Emperor, and they were

322
00:17:44,476 --> 00:17:48,476
Speaker 1: like very ethically strong about their choices about music, business

323
00:17:48,476 --> 00:17:51,276
Speaker 1: and politics, and so I think you'd be very reticent

324
00:17:51,356 --> 00:17:52,756
Speaker 1: to be like, oh, now I'm going to make like

325
00:17:52,756 --> 00:17:54,636
Speaker 1: a pop song and try to make it on the radio.

326
00:17:54,716 --> 00:17:56,316
Speaker 1: It would be it would not it would be a

327
00:17:56,316 --> 00:17:58,436
Speaker 1: bit frowned upon it in Montreal when I was younger,

328
00:17:58,476 --> 00:18:00,036
Speaker 1: you know, it's not you know, I mean, it was

329
00:18:00,076 --> 00:18:01,396
Speaker 1: not what we were darre doing, you know.

330
00:18:01,876 --> 00:18:05,196
Speaker 7: So you think it's it's more a political attitude.

331
00:18:04,756 --> 00:18:06,916
Speaker 1: Then I think it's a bit attitude.

332
00:18:07,036 --> 00:18:10,516
Speaker 7: To me. It's it's about ears almost years.

333
00:18:10,516 --> 00:18:13,796
Speaker 1: But it's also the French are like extremely inspired by

334
00:18:13,916 --> 00:18:15,596
Speaker 1: very like if I'm like and then like, let's say

335
00:18:15,636 --> 00:18:18,156
Speaker 1: I drive twelve hours of the North, like in the

336
00:18:18,156 --> 00:18:20,716
Speaker 1: middle of nowhere, they're going to listen to like super

337
00:18:20,716 --> 00:18:23,436
Speaker 1: experimental music in a small mining town, Like there's a

338
00:18:23,476 --> 00:18:27,116
Speaker 1: festival called FM where like we did. We did a

339
00:18:27,156 --> 00:18:29,796
Speaker 1: show with Mark Robo. We're like nine hours north than

340
00:18:29,836 --> 00:18:32,436
Speaker 1: a miners town. They loved it. You know, it's not

341
00:18:32,516 --> 00:18:34,036
Speaker 1: everywhere you go where you go to a small town

342
00:18:34,036 --> 00:18:35,716
Speaker 1: where they want to listen to Marcrobo and make crazy

343
00:18:35,756 --> 00:18:38,956
Speaker 1: noise on his guitar or like, it's pretty particular. Most

344
00:18:38,996 --> 00:18:43,116
Speaker 1: of the French Quebec musicians are extremely gifted and talented,

345
00:18:43,116 --> 00:18:44,716
Speaker 1: a bit like when you go to Nashville, you know,

346
00:18:44,796 --> 00:18:47,436
Speaker 1: everybody can play for reels. Yeah, well, I gotta be

347
00:18:47,476 --> 00:18:49,476
Speaker 1: honest with you. When you go to like Quebec and

348
00:18:49,516 --> 00:18:51,516
Speaker 1: the small town like people play for real a bit

349
00:18:51,596 --> 00:18:54,236
Speaker 1: like in that same way, you know. And I think

350
00:18:54,276 --> 00:18:57,316
Speaker 1: that Montreal is this collision of Europe and North America.

351
00:18:58,076 --> 00:19:00,196
Speaker 1: The wall, the cultural walls that the French put up

352
00:19:00,236 --> 00:19:03,716
Speaker 1: to save their language do play a part. And why

353
00:19:03,796 --> 00:19:06,516
Speaker 1: I think Leonard corn All these people are interested. I mean,

354
00:19:06,516 --> 00:19:09,036
Speaker 1: look at Lena Cohn. There is no other Anglophone singer

355
00:19:09,156 --> 00:19:13,156
Speaker 1: that sings about sex the way Leonard Cohen does. It's

356
00:19:13,156 --> 00:19:15,036
Speaker 1: a very French thing to do that, you know what

357
00:19:15,076 --> 00:19:17,596
Speaker 1: I mean. So and then the Quebecers are like, well,

358
00:19:17,676 --> 00:19:19,596
Speaker 1: Leonard Cohen speaks English, he's not French. And I'm like,

359
00:19:19,596 --> 00:19:23,316
Speaker 1: but guys, there's no English singer that is that pornographic

360
00:19:23,356 --> 00:19:26,316
Speaker 1: in their languages other than Leonard because he's living.

361
00:19:26,196 --> 00:19:27,516
Speaker 7: In Montreal, you know.

362
00:19:27,996 --> 00:19:31,036
Speaker 1: So these all these interesting arguments and collisions and it's

363
00:19:31,076 --> 00:19:33,636
Speaker 1: a lovely place. But I do think it's it's an

364
00:19:33,636 --> 00:19:37,036
Speaker 1: attitude of like there was no business there. We would

365
00:19:37,036 --> 00:19:40,116
Speaker 1: just do shows and do improvised, improvised music together and

366
00:19:40,156 --> 00:19:42,156
Speaker 1: there was a real spirit of like you should sound

367
00:19:42,196 --> 00:19:44,796
Speaker 1: like what you sound like and no one else and

368
00:19:44,836 --> 00:19:47,756
Speaker 1: then lots of orchestral instruments mixed into the field. And yeah,

369
00:19:47,796 --> 00:19:49,756
Speaker 1: it was it was a very lucky place to spend

370
00:19:49,756 --> 00:19:50,516
Speaker 1: time make music.

371
00:19:50,636 --> 00:19:50,836
Speaker 4: Well.

372
00:19:50,836 --> 00:19:55,796
Speaker 7: Montreal's also got a really strong classical music, yes, scene

373
00:19:56,556 --> 00:20:02,276
Speaker 7: Montreal Symphonies, big, big recording orchestra, and it's also got

374
00:20:02,316 --> 00:20:05,116
Speaker 7: French Canadian folk music, which isn't like a lot of

375
00:20:05,156 --> 00:20:07,916
Speaker 7: other folks. It's very rhythmic French Canadian folk music.

376
00:20:07,996 --> 00:20:11,436
Speaker 1: Well, when you're going back to the tulute, get down

377
00:20:11,676 --> 00:20:13,396
Speaker 1: the original stuff. To be honest, if you put a

378
00:20:13,476 --> 00:20:14,756
Speaker 1: hip hop eat on it, you'd be a little bit

379
00:20:14,796 --> 00:20:18,636
Speaker 1: surprised that the original they've kind of forgotten that. Like,

380
00:20:18,876 --> 00:20:21,196
Speaker 1: there was this revolution in Quebec that people don't really understand,

381
00:20:21,196 --> 00:20:23,396
Speaker 1: where we kicked the church out because the church was

382
00:20:23,436 --> 00:20:25,076
Speaker 1: making all the French people have like twelve kids, and

383
00:20:25,076 --> 00:20:26,756
Speaker 1: they were getting conservative and there was a they called

384
00:20:26,756 --> 00:20:28,796
Speaker 1: the quiet Revolution and then you have is.

385
00:20:28,676 --> 00:20:31,156
Speaker 7: Like which, by the way, it's the most Canadian title ever.

386
00:20:32,956 --> 00:20:35,116
Speaker 7: We revolted. We just didn't want anybody to know about it.

387
00:20:35,116 --> 00:20:37,596
Speaker 1: They're pretty our core. I mean, French don't don't screw around,

388
00:20:37,636 --> 00:20:39,276
Speaker 1: like when they when when they're when they don't like

389
00:20:39,316 --> 00:20:41,196
Speaker 1: something them, they like, you know, when we win a Stanley.

390
00:20:41,276 --> 00:20:43,276
Speaker 1: When Canadians do well, we burn the city down. I

391
00:20:43,316 --> 00:20:45,876
Speaker 1: mean the French Canadians know how to party. They're very

392
00:20:45,876 --> 00:20:48,356
Speaker 1: fiery and a lot of heart and soul in that

393
00:20:48,476 --> 00:20:51,556
Speaker 1: language and that culture. So there's this whole tradition that

394
00:20:51,556 --> 00:20:54,636
Speaker 1: they've kept and they've poured all they have into this

395
00:20:54,756 --> 00:20:57,516
Speaker 1: small scene that just belongs to them. With all these

396
00:20:57,556 --> 00:21:01,116
Speaker 1: grant money and people talk about public funding, but they

397
00:21:01,156 --> 00:21:05,476
Speaker 1: were an island of French beside America for crying out loud,

398
00:21:05,516 --> 00:21:07,436
Speaker 1: and they had to keep their language. So they built

399
00:21:07,436 --> 00:21:10,556
Speaker 1: these walls and they find out their music in a

400
00:21:10,596 --> 00:21:12,276
Speaker 1: way that I don't think any other place on Earth

401
00:21:12,276 --> 00:21:15,116
Speaker 1: has subsidized, which gives them their own They have their

402
00:21:15,116 --> 00:21:17,796
Speaker 1: own star system for crying out loud. They're eight million people.

403
00:21:18,236 --> 00:21:21,876
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's well, and they're very like the French in France,

404
00:21:21,876 --> 00:21:24,556
Speaker 7: they're very chauvinistic about their language and their culture.

405
00:21:24,716 --> 00:21:26,996
Speaker 1: But I don't think I would exist without those walls. Still,

406
00:21:27,036 --> 00:21:30,356
Speaker 1: even if I'm singing English. I think they they I

407
00:21:30,356 --> 00:21:33,356
Speaker 1: don't know like the way that they like. I'll play

408
00:21:33,356 --> 00:21:35,796
Speaker 1: a small town and all those concert halls are all

409
00:21:35,836 --> 00:21:38,796
Speaker 1: subsidized so they can keep on giving good music to

410
00:21:38,836 --> 00:21:41,196
Speaker 1: small towns. And so you play there, and you can

411
00:21:41,236 --> 00:21:43,436
Speaker 1: make a living playing there, and then all the people

412
00:21:43,476 --> 00:21:46,476
Speaker 1: show up to listen to crazy music. It's an example

413
00:21:46,516 --> 00:21:49,996
Speaker 1: of like what subsidy into the arts can do. But

414
00:21:50,036 --> 00:21:52,396
Speaker 1: and you're going against America. America is your neighbor, and

415
00:21:52,476 --> 00:21:54,436
Speaker 1: you speak French, like, can you imagine trying to keep

416
00:21:54,436 --> 00:21:57,156
Speaker 1: your language, you know, six to eight million people beside

417
00:21:57,196 --> 00:21:57,756
Speaker 1: that giant.

418
00:21:58,396 --> 00:22:00,196
Speaker 7: The other way to look at it is that it's

419
00:22:00,676 --> 00:22:02,516
Speaker 7: easier to keep your culture than it would be for

420
00:22:02,596 --> 00:22:03,516
Speaker 7: English Canadians.

421
00:22:04,036 --> 00:22:06,036
Speaker 1: Well you know, and it's I love Cana. I mean,

422
00:22:06,156 --> 00:22:09,036
Speaker 1: Canada's my country, and obviously I would never speak will

423
00:22:09,316 --> 00:22:11,356
Speaker 1: But they just do what the Americans do in a

424
00:22:11,356 --> 00:22:14,636
Speaker 1: way that's I find pressing. I feel like they're a

425
00:22:14,636 --> 00:22:17,316
Speaker 1: bad version of America. Now, like you you go to

426
00:22:17,356 --> 00:22:19,356
Speaker 1: like look at their music scene and it's like, oh okay, well,

427
00:22:19,356 --> 00:22:21,436
Speaker 1: it's like, here's a Canadian version of this American thing.

428
00:22:21,436 --> 00:22:24,036
Speaker 1: I'm like, guys, like, do your own thing, right, And

429
00:22:24,796 --> 00:22:27,076
Speaker 1: I don't even be harsh, and that's it's not my intention,

430
00:22:27,236 --> 00:22:29,796
Speaker 1: but I do think if I look at the most

431
00:22:29,796 --> 00:22:34,076
Speaker 1: successful artistic Canadian projects that actually matter, it's like Kids

432
00:22:34,076 --> 00:22:38,716
Speaker 1: in the Hall. It's like the Tailer Park Boys, jailerbag Boys.

433
00:22:38,716 --> 00:22:40,876
Speaker 1: Most people think they're stupid, right, but when you actually

434
00:22:40,876 --> 00:22:44,596
Speaker 1: watch it, it's brilliant. It's also way before the Office

435
00:22:44,596 --> 00:22:47,516
Speaker 1: with the fourth wall and the cameraman. They invented something

436
00:22:47,556 --> 00:22:50,436
Speaker 1: like whenever Canada does something original and kind of crazy,

437
00:22:50,796 --> 00:22:53,196
Speaker 1: that's when it works. Every time, it's like a cheap

438
00:22:53,236 --> 00:22:55,436
Speaker 1: knockoff of American culture. I don't see the point, do

439
00:22:55,436 --> 00:22:56,876
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? But and then all they

440
00:22:56,956 --> 00:22:58,796
Speaker 1: do is move, like you know, Drake's Canadian needs he

441
00:22:58,876 --> 00:23:01,596
Speaker 1: move to the US, and Justin Bieber's also Canadian. These

442
00:23:02,156 --> 00:23:04,836
Speaker 1: so there's this cross like that as well, but it's it's.

443
00:23:04,796 --> 00:23:07,116
Speaker 7: Complicated Canadian should I twain?

444
00:23:07,516 --> 00:23:11,396
Speaker 1: Now? Yeah, Sarah McLaughlin, these are big, big American stars

445
00:23:11,436 --> 00:23:12,196
Speaker 1: in a lot of way, you know.

446
00:23:12,436 --> 00:23:17,796
Speaker 7: Yeah, although a lot of Canadians knew selin Diana originally

447
00:23:17,796 --> 00:23:20,636
Speaker 7: because she sang French Canadian folk songs before.

448
00:23:20,716 --> 00:23:23,916
Speaker 1: She was amazing. She's she's like, he's incredible. Slid She's like,

449
00:23:23,996 --> 00:23:26,676
Speaker 1: she's say, she's look what you What you realize about

450
00:23:26,716 --> 00:23:30,116
Speaker 1: Clidion is like when I say the characters I feel

451
00:23:30,116 --> 00:23:32,996
Speaker 1: with like heart and like the heartless sleeves and passion.

452
00:23:33,396 --> 00:23:35,996
Speaker 1: When Celindion bangs her chest when she sings, That's what

453
00:23:36,036 --> 00:23:39,236
Speaker 1: I'm talking about. Like they have this passion. That's a

454
00:23:39,476 --> 00:23:44,076
Speaker 1: remarkable passion that that has carried my inside of my career.

455
00:23:44,076 --> 00:23:46,276
Speaker 1: I carry that passion even if I'm an Anglophone. I

456
00:23:46,596 --> 00:23:50,436
Speaker 1: grew up with Francophones and they're my family, and I

457
00:23:50,436 --> 00:23:52,996
Speaker 1: speak French fluently, and now my biggest song in the

458
00:23:53,076 --> 00:23:54,116
Speaker 1: I've ever done is in French.

459
00:23:54,156 --> 00:23:58,436
Speaker 7: Funny enough, did you did you speak English at home

460
00:23:58,476 --> 00:23:59,356
Speaker 7: growing up or French?

461
00:23:59,636 --> 00:24:01,916
Speaker 1: I spoken? My parents were English, and then I had

462
00:24:01,916 --> 00:24:03,396
Speaker 1: asked my mom in grade one to switch me to

463
00:24:03,436 --> 00:24:06,196
Speaker 1: French school for some odd reason, and then I went

464
00:24:06,196 --> 00:24:07,676
Speaker 1: there and I'm really happy I did.

465
00:24:08,596 --> 00:24:11,156
Speaker 7: Right, that's before you knew your dad was top gun.

466
00:24:11,636 --> 00:24:14,756
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is true. But my first memory of why

467
00:24:14,876 --> 00:24:16,636
Speaker 1: I think I wanted to go there a valley. I

468
00:24:16,636 --> 00:24:19,356
Speaker 1: went to like a dinner at my first French family

469
00:24:19,396 --> 00:24:20,956
Speaker 1: and they were doing that thing of the fondue where

470
00:24:20,956 --> 00:24:22,796
Speaker 1: if it drops you have to kiss the person beside you,

471
00:24:23,316 --> 00:24:25,356
Speaker 1: which is very never heard that it's a French thing.

472
00:24:25,436 --> 00:24:27,316
Speaker 1: And then my mom was very pretty and then I

473
00:24:27,396 --> 00:24:28,636
Speaker 1: dropped it and then I had to kiss the mom

474
00:24:28,636 --> 00:24:30,756
Speaker 1: on the cheek and she was I was like, yeah,

475
00:24:30,796 --> 00:24:33,476
Speaker 1: this place is amazing. I've never hanging out with these

476
00:24:33,516 --> 00:24:34,036
Speaker 1: people again.

477
00:24:34,196 --> 00:24:36,276
Speaker 7: Yeah, then you dropped five more.

478
00:24:37,076 --> 00:24:40,236
Speaker 1: Totally, but I mean, I don't know. Yeah, that's where

479
00:24:40,276 --> 00:24:43,076
Speaker 1: my heart's at, you know, with.

480
00:24:43,036 --> 00:24:45,796
Speaker 7: This album, because you went into it not sure how

481
00:24:45,876 --> 00:24:48,396
Speaker 7: much you were going to contribute, but you said you

482
00:24:48,436 --> 00:24:51,716
Speaker 7: literally traveled around with your laptop, two mikes, and two mics.

483
00:24:51,716 --> 00:24:52,916
Speaker 7: First of all, what were the mics.

484
00:24:52,956 --> 00:24:55,516
Speaker 1: They're cheps. They're pretty fancy. The cool thing about sheps

485
00:24:55,636 --> 00:24:57,156
Speaker 1: is like you're in that room, it sounds like you're

486
00:24:57,196 --> 00:25:02,236
Speaker 1: in the room. It's They're incredibly articulate and incredibly lovely sounding.

487
00:25:02,636 --> 00:25:04,556
Speaker 1: And I didn't even have fancy preamps. I literally had

488
00:25:04,596 --> 00:25:07,916
Speaker 1: my Apolo preamps, which are very kind of transparent preamps.

489
00:25:08,636 --> 00:25:11,436
Speaker 1: So like, like take a song like the wandering. That

490
00:25:11,556 --> 00:25:15,676
Speaker 1: whole like song is one take. The structure is still

491
00:25:15,756 --> 00:25:17,516
Speaker 1: structured take with two mics, so you hear the guitar

492
00:25:17,596 --> 00:25:19,596
Speaker 1: and a bit of the drums. So we would do

493
00:25:19,636 --> 00:25:22,676
Speaker 1: like a structural live take, so at least the bassis

494
00:25:22,716 --> 00:25:26,036
Speaker 1: had some real dynamics in life that we could build on.

495
00:25:26,516 --> 00:25:28,396
Speaker 1: But almost every song was like that. I'd make a

496
00:25:28,436 --> 00:25:32,516
Speaker 1: really like real bass track that's live, so all the

497
00:25:32,596 --> 00:25:35,036
Speaker 1: dynamics we weren't trying to like automate them in they

498
00:25:35,036 --> 00:25:36,636
Speaker 1: would just be there, and then we would build on

499
00:25:36,716 --> 00:25:39,116
Speaker 1: the natural autumn, natural ebb and flows.

500
00:25:39,676 --> 00:25:41,676
Speaker 7: So you would have a band in the room with you.

501
00:25:42,676 --> 00:25:45,356
Speaker 1: Well, me Miska did Celencio all by ourselves and Nova

502
00:25:45,436 --> 00:25:47,236
Speaker 1: with two mics that I was just playing piano and

503
00:25:47,276 --> 00:25:50,316
Speaker 1: he was playing guitar, and then we did all the

504
00:25:50,356 --> 00:25:53,076
Speaker 1: whole form, and then that one I added a little

505
00:25:53,076 --> 00:25:56,476
Speaker 1: bit of drums posts, and then the last one Olivia

506
00:25:56,516 --> 00:25:58,876
Speaker 1: came and helped us. But the initial take to the

507
00:25:58,876 --> 00:26:01,916
Speaker 1: whole song was a live take, wow, and the vocal

508
00:26:01,956 --> 00:26:03,956
Speaker 1: beginning still a live take too, like the whole thing's

509
00:26:04,076 --> 00:26:04,556
Speaker 1: very live.

510
00:26:04,996 --> 00:26:07,996
Speaker 7: Were any of these improvised or send me improvised? Did

511
00:26:08,036 --> 00:26:10,076
Speaker 7: you always have a track that you were working with

512
00:26:10,076 --> 00:26:12,196
Speaker 7: with the singers Noah Nova.

513
00:26:12,236 --> 00:26:14,796
Speaker 1: We me and Mishka wrote the chre progression like thirty

514
00:26:14,836 --> 00:26:17,796
Speaker 1: minutes before she showed up the Celand two, and it

515
00:26:17,836 --> 00:26:21,516
Speaker 1: was because that's what that room felt like, you know,

516
00:26:21,596 --> 00:26:23,596
Speaker 1: and we were just trying to match how nice the

517
00:26:23,676 --> 00:26:24,236
Speaker 1: room felt.

518
00:26:24,756 --> 00:26:26,316
Speaker 7: Then we wrote in the room, were you going into

519
00:26:26,356 --> 00:26:27,116
Speaker 7: studios or no?

520
00:26:27,276 --> 00:26:30,476
Speaker 1: Never studios. It's always weird, you know. I've been mixing

521
00:26:30,556 --> 00:26:32,436
Speaker 1: engineering my record since I was like younger, and the

522
00:26:32,476 --> 00:26:35,276
Speaker 1: evolution of recording has been dramatically different, you know. So

523
00:26:35,476 --> 00:26:37,956
Speaker 1: instead of spending on the studio, we rented this insane

524
00:26:38,036 --> 00:26:42,036
Speaker 1: like nineteenth century painter studio above Momart for the same budget.

525
00:26:42,076 --> 00:26:43,836
Speaker 1: But then we were in this most magical place you

526
00:26:43,876 --> 00:26:47,436
Speaker 1: can see with two mics and a laptop. I often

527
00:26:47,476 --> 00:26:50,676
Speaker 1: try to record moments and not recordings. Most of the

528
00:26:50,716 --> 00:26:52,436
Speaker 1: songs of mine that have you know, if I think

529
00:26:52,436 --> 00:26:54,956
Speaker 1: about to build a home, ers, thats a citemo. They're

530
00:26:55,036 --> 00:26:57,876
Speaker 1: not great recordings. I'm the engineer, I mean, I engineered

531
00:26:57,916 --> 00:26:59,196
Speaker 1: to build a home. I was like, what, like, I

532
00:26:59,396 --> 00:27:02,556
Speaker 1: maybe one or two years of experience throwing MIC's up

533
00:27:03,036 --> 00:27:05,076
Speaker 1: and what you hear as a moment, so I often

534
00:27:05,116 --> 00:27:08,116
Speaker 1: put more energy into the moment, and then with the

535
00:27:08,116 --> 00:27:09,916
Speaker 1: modern technology, it can be kind of you know, if

536
00:27:09,916 --> 00:27:11,556
Speaker 1: it doesn't sound good, you can be kind of crazy

537
00:27:11,596 --> 00:27:13,036
Speaker 1: with it and kind of make it sound cool. You know,

538
00:27:13,156 --> 00:27:16,356
Speaker 1: I'm very flexible, and you just try to make things work.

539
00:27:16,636 --> 00:27:18,396
Speaker 1: But the moment for me is still what I'm capturing

540
00:27:18,436 --> 00:27:21,076
Speaker 1: before the sound Like I hate sitting around for a

541
00:27:21,156 --> 00:27:24,036
Speaker 1: kick mic. I hate it. There were the engineers diddling

542
00:27:24,076 --> 00:27:26,356
Speaker 1: around for like the for like three hours by time

543
00:27:26,356 --> 00:27:28,196
Speaker 1: to get to the rum doesn't want to play it.

544
00:27:28,196 --> 00:27:31,076
Speaker 1: It's like, what's the point, right, But it's also easy

545
00:27:31,116 --> 00:27:33,116
Speaker 1: to say in a place where you have a dynamic

546
00:27:33,156 --> 00:27:37,076
Speaker 1: eque like EQS and the plugins have made it so

547
00:27:37,156 --> 00:27:40,396
Speaker 1: I can compensate for that crappy micing very fairly easy.

548
00:27:40,916 --> 00:27:42,676
Speaker 1: It is a new thing that you could have that

549
00:27:42,716 --> 00:27:43,756
Speaker 1: flexibility to this.

550
00:27:43,796 --> 00:27:46,716
Speaker 7: Extent, so you can do it all in post. You're not, yeah, but.

551
00:27:46,636 --> 00:27:48,956
Speaker 1: My post would be like, you know, there's this thing

552
00:27:49,036 --> 00:27:52,436
Speaker 1: called fab filter, and it's just like the difference being

553
00:27:52,516 --> 00:27:54,756
Speaker 1: is a dynamic eque. They've existed for a long time,

554
00:27:54,796 --> 00:27:57,516
Speaker 1: but that one is so useful that you know, if

555
00:27:57,556 --> 00:27:59,116
Speaker 1: I'm missing a bit of kick and I see the pig,

556
00:27:59,196 --> 00:28:01,596
Speaker 1: and I put every time that thing moves, jump that

557
00:28:01,676 --> 00:28:03,156
Speaker 1: up five to bees. I can make it sound like

558
00:28:03,196 --> 00:28:05,076
Speaker 1: an eight oh eight if I wanted to, But it's

559
00:28:05,076 --> 00:28:07,676
Speaker 1: still a live take with the live room attached to it.

560
00:28:08,036 --> 00:28:09,876
Speaker 1: So it's quite lovely, very surreal.

561
00:28:09,996 --> 00:28:11,956
Speaker 7: You know, did you ever feel when you were producing

562
00:28:12,756 --> 00:28:15,676
Speaker 7: that you were changing the room in a sense, or

563
00:28:15,716 --> 00:28:18,996
Speaker 7: we're always trying to preserve what you were hearing at

564
00:28:18,996 --> 00:28:19,396
Speaker 7: the time.

565
00:28:19,596 --> 00:28:21,876
Speaker 1: I think what I do is both I want the

566
00:28:21,876 --> 00:28:24,556
Speaker 1: things sound real and then super sereal at the same

567
00:28:24,596 --> 00:28:26,596
Speaker 1: time that you can't believe it's real. You know, like

568
00:28:26,636 --> 00:28:29,916
Speaker 1: if you look at Peter and the Wolf, it's completely

569
00:28:29,956 --> 00:28:32,356
Speaker 1: surreal kind of mixing, but yet you still have the

570
00:28:32,476 --> 00:28:35,916
Speaker 1: room tone. I think Cilenio, it's the way that drums

571
00:28:35,916 --> 00:28:37,276
Speaker 1: and the guitar in I rack in that room and

572
00:28:37,316 --> 00:28:39,596
Speaker 1: you hear the room. I really love the sound of

573
00:28:39,596 --> 00:28:41,396
Speaker 1: that recording. I think it's one of the best mixes

574
00:28:41,396 --> 00:28:43,956
Speaker 1: I've ever made. You know, the cool thing about modern

575
00:28:43,996 --> 00:28:46,556
Speaker 1: music is that when you record like a piano, you're

576
00:28:46,556 --> 00:28:49,196
Speaker 1: recording a room. When you record an electronic instrument, you

577
00:28:49,236 --> 00:28:51,556
Speaker 1: were moving the room and now the room you're listening

578
00:28:51,556 --> 00:28:54,476
Speaker 1: into it becomes the room. So it was like vacuum effect.

579
00:28:54,836 --> 00:28:58,676
Speaker 1: A great example of like that vacuum effect hitting pop

580
00:28:58,756 --> 00:29:02,236
Speaker 1: music with Billy Elis's first record, It's a Vacuum, which

581
00:29:02,236 --> 00:29:04,516
Speaker 1: is coming from obviously a hip hop tradition and electronics.

582
00:29:05,036 --> 00:29:07,276
Speaker 1: So when she did like folk songs inside that tradition

583
00:29:07,316 --> 00:29:10,116
Speaker 1: of mixing, it was like, holy Moly, and her voice.

584
00:29:10,156 --> 00:29:12,636
Speaker 1: It's in this vacuum where you just you and the narrator,

585
00:29:12,716 --> 00:29:15,116
Speaker 1: all by yourselves. It is a lovely thing, you know.

586
00:29:15,996 --> 00:29:19,196
Speaker 1: So I think you know the evolution of missing and proximity.

587
00:29:19,236 --> 00:29:21,036
Speaker 1: I like, I like to play with all the different

588
00:29:21,356 --> 00:29:23,236
Speaker 1: you know, just like the depth of feels. So some

589
00:29:23,276 --> 00:29:26,796
Speaker 1: moments are incredibly electronic. Someone's a very room. I don't

590
00:29:26,796 --> 00:29:28,796
Speaker 1: think I have a I just follow the story, you know.

591
00:29:29,036 --> 00:29:35,996
Speaker 7: The album to me felt very cinematic. So often the

592
00:29:35,996 --> 00:29:40,196
Speaker 7: the mix between say, your voice and any of your

593
00:29:40,516 --> 00:29:45,236
Speaker 7: wonderful collaborators. Sometimes you were singing together, sometimes you were

594
00:29:45,276 --> 00:29:48,236
Speaker 7: singing you were arguing, as you do in your song

595
00:29:48,316 --> 00:29:51,756
Speaker 7: with with Martha Waynwright. But there are times it sounded

596
00:29:52,156 --> 00:29:55,956
Speaker 7: as though one person was in a different room in

597
00:29:56,036 --> 00:29:58,716
Speaker 7: a house. That's what it felt like to me. It

598
00:29:58,716 --> 00:30:01,476
Speaker 7: felt like it wasn't just one's in the background. It

599
00:30:01,516 --> 00:30:04,596
Speaker 7: was like ones somewhere else, someone's around a corner.

600
00:30:04,636 --> 00:30:06,596
Speaker 1: Doesn't make any sense, Yeah, I mean like you look

601
00:30:06,596 --> 00:30:09,836
Speaker 1: at like solantin like Clan, which is seven that French song.

602
00:30:10,196 --> 00:30:12,716
Speaker 1: I wanted to record the first first on a telephone.

603
00:30:13,076 --> 00:30:15,716
Speaker 1: I think it's probably when microphones are the most research

604
00:30:15,796 --> 00:30:17,756
Speaker 1: ever been put into it. But there's this thing that

605
00:30:17,796 --> 00:30:20,676
Speaker 1: when you hear that microphone, it feels like someone's talking

606
00:30:20,676 --> 00:30:22,756
Speaker 1: to you. So the first the first part of that,

607
00:30:23,036 --> 00:30:24,876
Speaker 1: the first verse, and that's recorder on telephone on a

608
00:30:24,916 --> 00:30:28,796
Speaker 1: mic stand and not an offense he mic. So guys

609
00:30:28,836 --> 00:30:30,716
Speaker 1: like so imagine you have two mics and you know,

610
00:30:31,596 --> 00:30:33,076
Speaker 1: the mics are in the room and picking up a

611
00:30:33,076 --> 00:30:35,196
Speaker 1: bit of a Mishki's guitar, a bit of my piano,

612
00:30:35,276 --> 00:30:37,716
Speaker 1: and I put a telephone recording kind of synced to

613
00:30:37,796 --> 00:30:40,196
Speaker 1: my pro tools, and I use my telephone for the

614
00:30:40,236 --> 00:30:43,396
Speaker 1: vocal because it's like, it's not about you know, I

615
00:30:43,396 --> 00:30:45,436
Speaker 1: don't mix to make a song sound good. I mix

616
00:30:45,516 --> 00:30:47,396
Speaker 1: it to make it tell story, you know what I mean?

617
00:30:47,436 --> 00:30:49,796
Speaker 1: And I come from the tradition of like a good

618
00:30:49,796 --> 00:30:52,916
Speaker 1: example of that historically speaking would be like you know.

619
00:30:52,996 --> 00:30:55,916
Speaker 1: Debus is a classical guy, you know, and he probably

620
00:30:55,916 --> 00:30:58,636
Speaker 1: broke more rules than since Bach, you know, up to up,

621
00:30:58,716 --> 00:31:02,116
Speaker 1: Like from back to Debus, everybody kind of expanded on block.

622
00:31:02,716 --> 00:31:05,796
Speaker 1: But when Debs comes, he breaks like crazy new rules,

623
00:31:05,796 --> 00:31:08,676
Speaker 1: like new voicings, new harmonic structures, new ideas of arranging,

624
00:31:09,196 --> 00:31:12,716
Speaker 1: and partly because he's like, oh I wish the music,

625
00:31:12,916 --> 00:31:15,596
Speaker 1: like did what those waves are doing? Stop thinking about

626
00:31:15,676 --> 00:31:17,756
Speaker 1: music and thought about the narration or whatever, like the

627
00:31:17,796 --> 00:31:21,156
Speaker 1: physical effect of it, and drop like, well, what chord

628
00:31:21,236 --> 00:31:23,276
Speaker 1: is it? And then he broke all these rules by accident,

629
00:31:23,316 --> 00:31:24,716
Speaker 1: and then when you listen to it, it sounds like

630
00:31:24,756 --> 00:31:28,076
Speaker 1: pop music. It sounds very lovely. It's breaking all the

631
00:31:28,156 --> 00:31:30,276
Speaker 1: rules at the same time and you don't even know that,

632
00:31:30,316 --> 00:31:32,476
Speaker 1: but it's changed. You changed music.

633
00:31:32,836 --> 00:31:34,236
Speaker 7: What kind of rules are you talking about?

634
00:31:34,516 --> 00:31:36,236
Speaker 1: Well, like, you know, like usually when you do a

635
00:31:36,276 --> 00:31:38,756
Speaker 1: symphonic structure, you have like you have your theme, it

636
00:31:38,756 --> 00:31:42,116
Speaker 1: develops like much like a pop song or like you know,

637
00:31:42,516 --> 00:31:45,756
Speaker 1: quarterly speaking, uh like when I said that, so what

638
00:31:45,956 --> 00:31:49,556
Speaker 1: those voicings enforced? He like modulates in try tones. He's

639
00:31:49,596 --> 00:31:52,196
Speaker 1: breaking all these like he invented a scale the you know,

640
00:31:52,276 --> 00:31:57,036
Speaker 1: the which is from the Gamalan inspiration.

641
00:31:57,556 --> 00:31:59,596
Speaker 7: So E meant to like always tell me what that

642
00:31:59,676 --> 00:32:00,116
Speaker 7: scale is.

643
00:32:00,316 --> 00:32:05,676
Speaker 1: That's a whole tone scale. It's very open, right, So

644
00:32:05,756 --> 00:32:08,476
Speaker 1: I mean what he's doing is like traditionally in music

645
00:32:08,516 --> 00:32:14,436
Speaker 1: you have like like all the chords make you want

646
00:32:14,476 --> 00:32:17,356
Speaker 1: to go back to that chord. So he's making structures

647
00:32:17,356 --> 00:32:20,676
Speaker 1: that are like the home is now not important. You

648
00:32:20,676 --> 00:32:23,276
Speaker 1: have no pull to the home. You're just being led

649
00:32:23,316 --> 00:32:26,516
Speaker 1: to these new homes, you know. And that is a

650
00:32:26,836 --> 00:32:29,396
Speaker 1: that is a dramatic distance from bach. You know.

651
00:32:30,116 --> 00:32:32,676
Speaker 7: Also, the whole tone scale. You hear that a lot

652
00:32:32,676 --> 00:32:33,156
Speaker 7: in jazz.

653
00:32:33,476 --> 00:32:35,436
Speaker 1: Yeah, they use it. I mean they use all sorts

654
00:32:35,436 --> 00:32:38,156
Speaker 1: of tricks. They do half whole, whole half. Jazz is

655
00:32:38,196 --> 00:32:40,876
Speaker 1: lovely because I mean it's the greatest language to learn

656
00:32:41,116 --> 00:32:43,476
Speaker 1: to learn, like a like a language whre you can

657
00:32:43,596 --> 00:32:45,396
Speaker 1: communicate with others playing music, you know what I mean.

658
00:32:45,436 --> 00:32:47,956
Speaker 1: It's the fastest language to learn and be like hey dude,

659
00:32:47,996 --> 00:32:51,876
Speaker 1: let's jam. Later in my older years, I had to

660
00:32:51,916 --> 00:32:53,996
Speaker 1: go back and learn a lot of classical rules to

661
00:32:54,116 --> 00:32:57,396
Speaker 1: unlearn some of the jazz rules for certain things. Where

662
00:32:57,596 --> 00:32:59,996
Speaker 1: I find jazz, you look really look at a vertical,

663
00:33:00,436 --> 00:33:02,076
Speaker 1: you get a chord, you're like, how am I vertical?

664
00:33:02,116 --> 00:33:04,196
Speaker 1: You're going to decorate this to get to the next chord?

665
00:33:04,676 --> 00:33:07,596
Speaker 1: Were classical? You like, you're looking at it like a

666
00:33:07,836 --> 00:33:10,236
Speaker 1: like six bars from now, the note you played will

667
00:33:10,276 --> 00:33:12,436
Speaker 1: matter as a suspension. You know, it's a much more

668
00:33:12,596 --> 00:33:13,236
Speaker 1: longer play.

669
00:33:13,556 --> 00:33:14,196
Speaker 7: It's a linear.

670
00:33:14,316 --> 00:33:16,396
Speaker 1: But I'll give you an example why that's interesting. So

671
00:33:16,516 --> 00:33:18,476
Speaker 1: if you take like a dashio for strings, like they're

672
00:33:18,596 --> 00:33:21,516
Speaker 1: the saddest string George head Sea string pieces in the world,

673
00:33:21,836 --> 00:33:24,836
Speaker 1: the cord you cry on is B major, which is

674
00:33:24,956 --> 00:33:29,236
Speaker 1: like pretty bright. It's like the brightest chord in music

675
00:33:29,276 --> 00:33:31,916
Speaker 1: you can do, like even worse than C major. And

676
00:33:31,956 --> 00:33:34,036
Speaker 1: that's where you cry. But that's because when you play

677
00:33:34,036 --> 00:33:37,876
Speaker 1: this score, you're kind you're hearing E flat minor. And

678
00:33:37,956 --> 00:33:41,436
Speaker 1: that's because he's setting up a long structure so that

679
00:33:41,516 --> 00:33:46,596
Speaker 1: when you play this, you're really hearing this. And that's

680
00:33:46,636 --> 00:33:49,316
Speaker 1: where the long playing classical music can do something in

681
00:33:49,396 --> 00:33:52,076
Speaker 1: jazz can't, and jazz can do something in classical can't.

682
00:33:52,076 --> 00:33:53,196
Speaker 1: There are two different languages, you.

683
00:33:53,196 --> 00:33:57,436
Speaker 7: Know, now, explain what you mean in jazz how you're

684
00:33:57,476 --> 00:33:58,956
Speaker 7: decorating the chord up top?

685
00:33:59,036 --> 00:34:00,436
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I mean, I'm not like I'm a

686
00:34:00,476 --> 00:34:02,756
Speaker 1: jazz expert. I studied roots kids. So like, usually like

687
00:34:02,876 --> 00:34:05,076
Speaker 1: let's say you're like, let's say you're here here, like

688
00:34:05,076 --> 00:34:06,716
Speaker 1: you're in C minor, right, and you're gonna go you

689
00:34:06,716 --> 00:34:08,156
Speaker 1: want to go to you want to get to there.

690
00:34:09,156 --> 00:34:10,876
Speaker 1: So what you would do traditionally is like a two

691
00:34:10,956 --> 00:34:13,076
Speaker 1: five to one, so i'mn't see minor. I'm like, okay,

692
00:34:13,076 --> 00:34:18,836
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do this chord. So it makes you really

693
00:34:18,836 --> 00:34:23,636
Speaker 1: want to hear that, which sets up the next chord

694
00:34:23,716 --> 00:34:25,596
Speaker 1: and why that's important in jazz. So if I'm in

695
00:34:25,636 --> 00:34:29,476
Speaker 1: one here, I'm going like I could to get to

696
00:34:29,516 --> 00:34:36,236
Speaker 1: the F minor, I could do like, so it gives

697
00:34:36,236 --> 00:34:38,956
Speaker 1: you these like acrobatic ways of sow and around notes

698
00:34:38,956 --> 00:34:41,916
Speaker 1: to make these really lovely improvisations. But it's very vertical.

699
00:34:42,796 --> 00:34:44,236
Speaker 1: I see, there's a much more vertical.

700
00:34:44,036 --> 00:34:45,836
Speaker 7: Structure, and they're not chord tones there.

701
00:34:46,396 --> 00:34:48,076
Speaker 1: There are chord tones, but they're helping you get to

702
00:34:48,076 --> 00:34:50,436
Speaker 1: the F minor. But they're all little short battles, where

703
00:34:50,516 --> 00:34:53,596
Speaker 1: classical is like over the longer battles for a different

704
00:34:53,676 --> 00:34:54,636
Speaker 1: kind of results.

705
00:34:55,036 --> 00:34:59,716
Speaker 7: Right, and so, but in jazz it's using an eleventh

706
00:34:59,796 --> 00:35:01,156
Speaker 7: or thirteenth.

707
00:35:00,716 --> 00:35:03,276
Speaker 1: Well, it's it's you're using it just to like to

708
00:35:03,356 --> 00:35:05,516
Speaker 1: find the most interesting way to get there, Like you

709
00:35:05,596 --> 00:35:07,036
Speaker 1: know what I mean, You're like, hey, I'm here and

710
00:35:07,076 --> 00:35:09,356
Speaker 1: I gotta go there. What is the funnest par also

711
00:35:09,436 --> 00:35:11,836
Speaker 1: way I can get there? And then then that's why

712
00:35:11,876 --> 00:35:13,956
Speaker 1: these subsidue chords are these two five ones are there.

713
00:35:13,996 --> 00:35:18,956
Speaker 1: So if you're playing, if you're just going like it's

714
00:35:19,036 --> 00:35:25,796
Speaker 1: kind of boring. But if I'm like, yeah, this is

715
00:35:25,836 --> 00:35:27,836
Speaker 1: a nice long way to get there, it's quite lovely,

716
00:35:27,876 --> 00:35:29,756
Speaker 1: you know. So that's that's what's lovely about you.

717
00:35:30,076 --> 00:35:32,036
Speaker 7: And the tension is always like what if he doesn't

718
00:35:32,076 --> 00:35:34,556
Speaker 7: get home? And Jay, what if it doesn't come back?

719
00:35:34,956 --> 00:35:38,316
Speaker 1: It's amazing. It's an incredible language, like it's it's magical,

720
00:35:38,756 --> 00:35:41,316
Speaker 1: and it's a great language to learn. I think first,

721
00:35:41,556 --> 00:35:44,316
Speaker 1: because I think it's a good communication basis for playing

722
00:35:44,356 --> 00:35:46,596
Speaker 1: with other people, and you know what I mean, And

723
00:35:46,636 --> 00:35:48,796
Speaker 1: I think that that's a really good thing to have.

724
00:35:48,836 --> 00:35:51,036
Speaker 1: I think both are really good. But you know, I

725
00:35:51,156 --> 00:35:54,356
Speaker 1: tell you one thing recently, during COVID, I went back

726
00:35:54,396 --> 00:35:56,956
Speaker 1: to a block because a lot of the classical music

727
00:35:56,996 --> 00:35:59,796
Speaker 1: that I do really like really depends on this very

728
00:35:59,836 --> 00:36:03,516
Speaker 1: subtle voice leading, you know, and not to be too

729
00:36:03,556 --> 00:36:06,116
Speaker 1: nerdy or nothing. But you know, voice leading just means

730
00:36:06,116 --> 00:36:08,356
Speaker 1: like when you have like chords, your top note and

731
00:36:08,356 --> 00:36:10,716
Speaker 1: your bottom note high, he gets the next chord. They

732
00:36:10,756 --> 00:36:14,156
Speaker 1: made these rules that if you follow them, the music

733
00:36:14,236 --> 00:36:17,116
Speaker 1: just feels like it moves better, where like instead of

734
00:36:17,196 --> 00:36:21,436
Speaker 1: just jumping to like you would have to be like

735
00:36:21,436 --> 00:36:24,756
Speaker 1: like closer. And when you follow those rules, it's just

736
00:36:24,956 --> 00:36:27,436
Speaker 1: music sounds like it has more depth. And if I

737
00:36:27,476 --> 00:36:32,516
Speaker 1: take like modern neoclassical music that is really lovely, it

738
00:36:32,556 --> 00:36:35,156
Speaker 1: sounds a bit more pop And then I listen to

739
00:36:35,196 --> 00:36:38,116
Speaker 1: the same amount of notes, but it's ava part. Ava

740
00:36:38,116 --> 00:36:40,076
Speaker 1: part makes me feel like in my church in a

741
00:36:40,116 --> 00:36:42,836
Speaker 1: way that's the other ones don't. It's mainly because he

742
00:36:42,876 --> 00:36:45,276
Speaker 1: has a deep knowledge of voice leading. Another great example

743
00:36:45,356 --> 00:36:48,516
Speaker 1: is rich You Sakamoto. Reach Your Sakamoto solo piano work

744
00:36:48,596 --> 00:36:52,876
Speaker 1: is outstanding because his voice leading is outstanding. It's very

745
00:36:52,916 --> 00:36:54,996
Speaker 1: difficult to do well. To do well, it's the most

746
00:36:55,036 --> 00:36:58,076
Speaker 1: difficult thing to do. You know. A good example of

747
00:36:58,076 --> 00:37:00,076
Speaker 1: someone who I think has great voice leading and does

748
00:37:00,116 --> 00:37:04,236
Speaker 1: contemporary classical is Carolyn Shaw. She does She's one of

749
00:37:04,276 --> 00:37:06,676
Speaker 1: my favorite arrangers in the modern day. She does her

750
00:37:06,756 --> 00:37:09,596
Speaker 1: voice leading and the string courotests are magical listen to.

751
00:37:10,156 --> 00:37:13,276
Speaker 7: Part of pop music though, is making those big jumps

752
00:37:13,676 --> 00:37:14,276
Speaker 7: right now.

753
00:37:14,516 --> 00:37:17,276
Speaker 1: The Beatles voice leading is outstanding there. George Martin does

754
00:37:17,316 --> 00:37:19,796
Speaker 1: the reason why you remember all the songs that right? Yeah,

755
00:37:19,796 --> 00:37:21,996
Speaker 1: because like they're they're constantly conscious of they have a

756
00:37:22,036 --> 00:37:23,436
Speaker 1: third in the base or the fifth and the bass.

757
00:37:23,516 --> 00:37:26,196
Speaker 1: And I think the Beatles are the greatest example because

758
00:37:26,516 --> 00:37:27,956
Speaker 1: as you get older and you see that and you

759
00:37:28,036 --> 00:37:29,596
Speaker 1: actually read the charts and you see what's at the

760
00:37:29,596 --> 00:37:31,476
Speaker 1: bottom and the voice leading going on, you realize that

761
00:37:31,516 --> 00:37:34,196
Speaker 1: Paul McCarney and George Martin really knew what they were doing.

762
00:37:34,676 --> 00:37:36,796
Speaker 1: Nickame the voice leading, and it's it's actually a great

763
00:37:36,796 --> 00:37:38,756
Speaker 1: example of like how important it is.

764
00:37:39,556 --> 00:37:42,076
Speaker 7: How do you because if you know that you know

765
00:37:42,116 --> 00:37:45,356
Speaker 7: these languages, yeah, you know classical theory, where is your

766
00:37:45,436 --> 00:37:48,516
Speaker 7: music fit in? Where how much jazz is in what

767
00:37:48,556 --> 00:37:50,996
Speaker 7: you're doing? How much classical? How much pop?

768
00:37:51,836 --> 00:37:53,676
Speaker 1: I don't know where that line starts it begins. I

769
00:37:53,716 --> 00:37:56,236
Speaker 1: know that if I'm doing research and I want to

770
00:37:56,236 --> 00:37:59,836
Speaker 1: introduce elements into my music, I'll do like like, for example,

771
00:37:59,876 --> 00:38:01,676
Speaker 1: there's like the way I make so the way that

772
00:38:01,716 --> 00:38:04,756
Speaker 1: my vocal sits I was very inspired by people like

773
00:38:04,796 --> 00:38:06,996
Speaker 1: Little Sims and Kendrick Lamar. But I obviously I don't

774
00:38:07,036 --> 00:38:09,116
Speaker 1: do hip hop, but that would mean that I would

775
00:38:09,276 --> 00:38:12,996
Speaker 1: have done, like secretly, like you know, twenty five demos

776
00:38:12,996 --> 00:38:14,756
Speaker 1: of that style of music to learn when they need

777
00:38:14,756 --> 00:38:17,436
Speaker 1: to learn. So only two to four percent would show

778
00:38:17,516 --> 00:38:20,676
Speaker 1: up in my naturally inside me for real, and you

779
00:38:20,716 --> 00:38:22,796
Speaker 1: wouldn't hear me like immolating them. You would just hear

780
00:38:22,836 --> 00:38:27,436
Speaker 1: that they had an intrinsic internal, structurally different. So when

781
00:38:27,476 --> 00:38:30,156
Speaker 1: I do it, you don't hear it. I constantly once

782
00:38:30,196 --> 00:38:32,636
Speaker 1: a month take a classical piece apart. I had a

783
00:38:32,636 --> 00:38:35,276
Speaker 1: great piano piano teacher. He just said, like, improvise a

784
00:38:35,276 --> 00:38:37,996
Speaker 1: lot like talking. So if anything I remember for my

785
00:38:38,076 --> 00:38:42,236
Speaker 1: jazz lessons, it's like have a conversation, have like commas,

786
00:38:42,316 --> 00:38:45,236
Speaker 1: have a sentence, leave space for the person to respond.

787
00:38:45,316 --> 00:38:48,836
Speaker 1: It's an organization of like how you communicate. So where

788
00:38:49,076 --> 00:38:52,036
Speaker 1: the jazz line ends and begins is that tradition of communication.

789
00:38:52,196 --> 00:38:54,796
Speaker 1: So when the drummer says something, I listen to what

790
00:38:54,836 --> 00:38:57,236
Speaker 1: he said, and I answer him and respond to him

791
00:38:57,396 --> 00:39:00,236
Speaker 1: as a communication. And when you watch us on stage,

792
00:39:00,676 --> 00:39:03,036
Speaker 1: the one talent we have as a bands were great listeners.

793
00:39:03,076 --> 00:39:05,636
Speaker 1: You know, great musicians, great listeners. I'm constantly responding to

794
00:39:05,636 --> 00:39:08,276
Speaker 1: my bass player, Mishka, constantly responding to my drummer. So

795
00:39:08,836 --> 00:39:11,236
Speaker 1: that part of the tradition of jazz is very, very

796
00:39:11,236 --> 00:39:13,716
Speaker 1: evident in our live shows. But that doesn't mean me

797
00:39:13,756 --> 00:39:16,276
Speaker 1: swing or play sevenths on everything. It just means that

798
00:39:16,676 --> 00:39:19,276
Speaker 1: we found a way to be influenced without trying to

799
00:39:19,316 --> 00:39:20,116
Speaker 1: immolate something.

800
00:39:21,756 --> 00:39:24,156
Speaker 2: After a break, we'll be back with Patrick Watson.

801
00:39:28,276 --> 00:39:30,116
Speaker 7: This is gonna sound like an odd question. Let's hear

802
00:39:30,156 --> 00:39:34,836
Speaker 7: it just playing a pop song at that point, because

803
00:39:34,836 --> 00:39:37,436
Speaker 7: you've done stuff that's closer to straight ahead pop. Yeah,

804
00:39:37,476 --> 00:39:40,476
Speaker 7: of course, does it feel a little too simple?

805
00:39:41,916 --> 00:39:46,756
Speaker 1: No, I look at music like food. Sometimes you need broccoli,

806
00:39:46,956 --> 00:39:50,276
Speaker 1: sometimes you need dessert. Sometimes you need like cheeseburger, sometimes

807
00:39:50,316 --> 00:39:53,276
Speaker 1: you need French fries. It's what you need in that moment.

808
00:39:53,436 --> 00:39:57,236
Speaker 1: So sometimes you need a pop song and just piano

809
00:39:57,276 --> 00:40:00,156
Speaker 1: and voice, no fancy colors. If you put a seventh

810
00:40:00,276 --> 00:40:03,716
Speaker 1: or an eleventh, it totally kills it. It totally kills

811
00:40:03,876 --> 00:40:06,876
Speaker 1: tension of just a simple chord. And sometimes you need

812
00:40:06,916 --> 00:40:09,716
Speaker 1: those colors, and sometimes you need you push yourself with

813
00:40:09,756 --> 00:40:11,516
Speaker 1: a depth that you need the the eleventh and sevens

814
00:40:11,516 --> 00:40:13,476
Speaker 1: to kind of say what you need to say, and

815
00:40:14,156 --> 00:40:17,316
Speaker 1: they're not nothing's right or wrong. It's just what do

816
00:40:17,316 --> 00:40:18,036
Speaker 1: you want to eat today?

817
00:40:18,076 --> 00:40:18,276
Speaker 4: You know.

818
00:40:18,476 --> 00:40:20,396
Speaker 1: I think it's really important to have like pop music,

819
00:40:20,836 --> 00:40:23,156
Speaker 1: super pop. I think like people like Tyler Swift are

820
00:40:23,196 --> 00:40:26,596
Speaker 1: incredibly important music, and sometimes you need that. It's really important,

821
00:40:27,116 --> 00:40:29,236
Speaker 1: and I think it's amazing that people do that, you know,

822
00:40:29,276 --> 00:40:32,436
Speaker 1: And I'm really happy to exist and then equally happy

823
00:40:32,476 --> 00:40:34,796
Speaker 1: that when I listened to like Reagi Sakamotose Weird Noise

824
00:40:34,836 --> 00:40:38,236
Speaker 1: electronic records, sometimes I need, you know, sometimes people need that.

825
00:40:38,996 --> 00:40:41,396
Speaker 1: And when people listen to heavy metal, it's because they

826
00:40:41,436 --> 00:40:44,236
Speaker 1: need that to feel something. They need that piercing volume

827
00:40:44,276 --> 00:40:46,036
Speaker 1: to get to where they need to get to. It's

828
00:40:46,036 --> 00:40:49,116
Speaker 1: not a style of music or a taste. It's like, dude,

829
00:40:49,156 --> 00:40:50,516
Speaker 1: you just listen to what you need to get through

830
00:40:50,556 --> 00:40:54,636
Speaker 1: the day. It's not a competition, you know, Like you.

831
00:40:54,596 --> 00:40:57,756
Speaker 7: Know, one of the songs, Choir and the Wires, I

832
00:40:57,836 --> 00:41:01,196
Speaker 7: did think that was your most Leonard Cohen sounding.

833
00:41:01,436 --> 00:41:03,636
Speaker 1: Oh, I know, it's so funny. I realized that after,

834
00:41:03,836 --> 00:41:05,796
Speaker 1: I mean, I had worked a lot with I'd worked

835
00:41:05,796 --> 00:41:07,756
Speaker 1: on a Leonard record, on top of I produced a

836
00:41:07,796 --> 00:41:12,436
Speaker 1: song for Make It Darker called the Hills and he

837
00:41:12,596 --> 00:41:16,036
Speaker 1: as constantly floats in my life from Montreal and I

838
00:41:16,076 --> 00:41:18,596
Speaker 1: and I had been the last eight years reading a

839
00:41:18,596 --> 00:41:21,356
Speaker 1: lot more than I used to, so my lyrics dramatically

840
00:41:21,356 --> 00:41:23,076
Speaker 1: got better in the last eight years because of that.

841
00:41:23,876 --> 00:41:26,356
Speaker 1: And it's uh and I don't It didn't cross my

842
00:41:26,436 --> 00:41:28,636
Speaker 1: mind until much later, and so I'm like, I'm like,

843
00:41:28,676 --> 00:41:30,156
Speaker 1: oh my god, that sounds so much like.

844
00:41:31,716 --> 00:41:33,516
Speaker 7: How was it to work on that song with him?

845
00:41:34,196 --> 00:41:36,716
Speaker 1: Well, I was far away and it was interesting. My

846
00:41:36,796 --> 00:41:39,076
Speaker 1: mom was like a huge Leonard Cohen fan, like she

847
00:41:39,276 --> 00:41:41,476
Speaker 1: loved Leonard, Like, you know, she would have left my dad.

848
00:41:41,716 --> 00:41:43,716
Speaker 1: Probably would be a good idea even but at that

849
00:41:43,756 --> 00:41:47,276
Speaker 1: point the date Leonard and I grew up from a

850
00:41:47,356 --> 00:41:50,236
Speaker 1: sonic more of a sonic place when I was a kid, right, So,

851
00:41:50,316 --> 00:41:52,796
Speaker 1: Leonard Cohen I didn't really understand when I was younger.

852
00:41:53,396 --> 00:41:55,436
Speaker 1: And here's a coincidence. The first time I heard my

853
00:41:55,516 --> 00:41:58,276
Speaker 1: voice was right before I produced that song. And when

854
00:41:58,276 --> 00:41:59,916
Speaker 1: I did that song, I wanted to do that song

855
00:41:59,916 --> 00:42:02,476
Speaker 1: for my mom more than for Leonard to do this

856
00:42:02,516 --> 00:42:05,276
Speaker 1: thing for her, to make her, you know, And she

857
00:42:05,316 --> 00:42:07,836
Speaker 1: had passed away already. Yeah, so I'd heard my voice

858
00:42:07,836 --> 00:42:11,356
Speaker 1: and then I had his vocals isolated. I don't know

859
00:42:11,356 --> 00:42:13,236
Speaker 1: how much how much fun it is to have, like

860
00:42:13,396 --> 00:42:15,476
Speaker 1: to have Leonard's voice all by itself is a very

861
00:42:15,516 --> 00:42:18,196
Speaker 1: special moment. And then when you listen to that, you're like,

862
00:42:18,236 --> 00:42:19,956
Speaker 1: the only thing I can do is kind of ruin this.

863
00:42:21,916 --> 00:42:24,036
Speaker 1: And then underneath I had his like midi saxophones on

864
00:42:24,076 --> 00:42:26,476
Speaker 1: the Casio arrangement that was originally intended for the song,

865
00:42:27,036 --> 00:42:29,196
Speaker 1: which was the reason why I could never connect with him.

866
00:42:29,636 --> 00:42:32,596
Speaker 7: But then before he loved he loved that like cheap cassio.

867
00:42:32,636 --> 00:42:34,836
Speaker 1: So yeah, well then I understood why. And you know

868
00:42:34,916 --> 00:42:37,596
Speaker 1: it's in hindsight, you know, I have mixed feelings about

869
00:42:37,636 --> 00:42:39,516
Speaker 1: how I think about it. But so he was like,

870
00:42:39,716 --> 00:42:41,796
Speaker 1: I don't want to ruin my words. If I put

871
00:42:41,836 --> 00:42:44,036
Speaker 1: like good music. It makes me think of the Saint

872
00:42:44,036 --> 00:42:46,636
Speaker 1: Augustine quote. You know what that is? So right in

873
00:42:46,636 --> 00:42:49,476
Speaker 1: the church when they invented polyphony, this monk lost their

874
00:42:49,516 --> 00:42:52,116
Speaker 1: mind because like everybody's coming to church because the polyphony

875
00:42:52,196 --> 00:42:54,116
Speaker 1: is stronger than what we're talking about and we need

876
00:42:54,156 --> 00:42:56,356
Speaker 1: to ban it. And inside the Council of Trent, when

877
00:42:56,356 --> 00:42:59,076
Speaker 1: the Protestants and the councils were separating the church. There

878
00:42:59,156 --> 00:43:02,356
Speaker 1: was two composers on that panel that saved Polyphany because

879
00:43:02,396 --> 00:43:04,636
Speaker 1: one of the arguments was that singing two notes at

880
00:43:04,636 --> 00:43:07,236
Speaker 1: once make it makes Jesus seem small, like it was.

881
00:43:07,316 --> 00:43:10,636
Speaker 1: People were only going for that, and Leonard Cohen's argument

882
00:43:10,716 --> 00:43:12,996
Speaker 1: for the casio was the same argument. He's like, if

883
00:43:12,996 --> 00:43:15,236
Speaker 1: I make the music any more powerful, you're just not

884
00:43:15,276 --> 00:43:17,916
Speaker 1: going to hear my words. And so when I arrange

885
00:43:17,916 --> 00:43:20,036
Speaker 1: your hills, I decided not to pay attention to that

886
00:43:20,196 --> 00:43:22,676
Speaker 1: as to run the experiment of like to try to

887
00:43:22,756 --> 00:43:26,196
Speaker 1: let the music be as powerful as words, just for

888
00:43:26,316 --> 00:43:28,996
Speaker 1: the experiment at all. I don't know if I would

889
00:43:28,996 --> 00:43:30,916
Speaker 1: do it the same way now in my in my

890
00:43:31,076 --> 00:43:34,116
Speaker 1: in my wiser years, but I did try for fun,

891
00:43:34,276 --> 00:43:36,036
Speaker 1: and it probably drove him crazy, because I know when

892
00:43:36,036 --> 00:43:37,516
Speaker 1: Adam brought it to him, he's like, I was a

893
00:43:37,636 --> 00:43:39,076
Speaker 1: very strong lots of.

894
00:43:40,996 --> 00:43:41,796
Speaker 7: Where's the cassi.

895
00:43:42,036 --> 00:43:43,916
Speaker 1: He's like, he's like, I'm sure drove him a bit crazy,

896
00:43:44,196 --> 00:43:46,756
Speaker 1: But I mean I was running an experiment, you know,

897
00:43:46,796 --> 00:43:48,876
Speaker 1: That's what music for me. I don't get too crazy

898
00:43:48,876 --> 00:43:51,476
Speaker 1: about it. You just run an experiment. Sometimes it works

899
00:43:51,476 --> 00:43:52,396
Speaker 1: and sometimes it doesn't.

900
00:43:53,356 --> 00:43:58,196
Speaker 7: I've always thought one of the great missed opportunities. You know,

901
00:43:58,236 --> 00:44:02,156
Speaker 7: there are all these Leonard Cohen tribute albums country music

902
00:44:02,276 --> 00:44:04,956
Speaker 7: should do a letter Gone. Yeah, And he lived in

903
00:44:05,036 --> 00:44:07,916
Speaker 7: Nashville for a while. He was very conscious of how

904
00:44:07,956 --> 00:44:10,236
Speaker 7: the lyrics were pushing it for at the same time.

905
00:44:10,876 --> 00:44:13,996
Speaker 7: And you know, one of the best covers of Leonyard

906
00:44:13,996 --> 00:44:17,156
Speaker 7: Cohen is Trisha Year would cover well coming Back to You,

907
00:44:17,196 --> 00:44:17,956
Speaker 7: which is fabulous.

908
00:44:17,956 --> 00:44:19,876
Speaker 1: I think the country would be. Yeah, that's a great idea.

909
00:44:20,036 --> 00:44:22,596
Speaker 1: I mean I tried to even like put, I tried

910
00:44:22,636 --> 00:44:26,316
Speaker 1: to shift the pocket to be in somewhat of modern

911
00:44:26,436 --> 00:44:29,316
Speaker 1: R and B, slightly mor and B on the hills.

912
00:44:29,596 --> 00:44:30,876
Speaker 1: That's what I was kind of trying to do, to

913
00:44:31,356 --> 00:44:32,716
Speaker 1: see if I could make it feel like it kind

914
00:44:32,716 --> 00:44:35,116
Speaker 1: of hit like on that modern edge of the where

915
00:44:35,156 --> 00:44:37,036
Speaker 1: the snare sits and the kicks and it was running

916
00:44:37,036 --> 00:44:39,396
Speaker 1: an experiment. I'll tell you a funny one that I

917
00:44:39,436 --> 00:44:41,556
Speaker 1: did that with. You know, you know last thoughts on

918
00:44:41,556 --> 00:44:43,956
Speaker 1: Woitty Guthrie by Bob Dylan, You ever listen to that?

919
00:44:43,996 --> 00:44:46,076
Speaker 1: I mean, I was not a Bob Dylan fan until

920
00:44:46,076 --> 00:44:48,556
Speaker 1: I heard that once again because of music, and then

921
00:44:48,556 --> 00:44:51,196
Speaker 1: when I heard last Thoughts on Woody Guthrie. It blew

922
00:44:51,236 --> 00:44:53,316
Speaker 1: my mind and I ran it. When I was like

923
00:44:53,396 --> 00:44:55,956
Speaker 1: studying how to mix hip hop as a as an

924
00:44:56,036 --> 00:44:57,836
Speaker 1: educational thing and just to learn what I could learn,

925
00:44:57,876 --> 00:45:00,156
Speaker 1: I did like this strange hip hop version of Lassaus

926
00:45:00,156 --> 00:45:02,556
Speaker 1: on Woody Guthrie, just to run the course and in

927
00:45:02,596 --> 00:45:04,876
Speaker 1: a kind of a double time, you know, like when

928
00:45:05,156 --> 00:45:06,396
Speaker 1: gets stopped and you really fast.

929
00:45:06,676 --> 00:45:10,356
Speaker 7: It worked like effortlessly, I was going to say, with

930
00:45:10,476 --> 00:45:12,436
Speaker 7: in choir in the wires. So it does have this

931
00:45:12,756 --> 00:45:16,236
Speaker 7: uh slight Leonard Cone vibe, if I can say that.

932
00:45:16,276 --> 00:45:17,916
Speaker 7: But then it's got that. I mean, that's got this

933
00:45:17,956 --> 00:45:22,396
Speaker 7: beautiful brass. You you take the brass figure that's that's

934
00:45:22,436 --> 00:45:26,876
Speaker 7: behind theco lyrics, and then and then you you bring

935
00:45:26,916 --> 00:45:28,636
Speaker 7: it out, so it's actual interlude in the.

936
00:45:28,596 --> 00:45:30,996
Speaker 1: Piece that that trumpet player is one of the best

937
00:45:31,036 --> 00:45:32,956
Speaker 1: trump players in Mexico. He's one of plays in all

938
00:45:32,956 --> 00:45:34,716
Speaker 1: the Pixar films. He's a maria he's one of the

939
00:45:34,716 --> 00:45:38,356
Speaker 1: best mariachi players in Mexico, and which I always forear

940
00:45:38,396 --> 00:45:41,116
Speaker 1: his name, and I gotta strut to memorize it. And

941
00:45:41,156 --> 00:45:44,316
Speaker 1: that choir had showed up by accident because I was

942
00:45:44,396 --> 00:45:46,516
Speaker 1: running an audition because I didn't know if the false

943
00:45:46,516 --> 00:45:47,836
Speaker 1: would be able to join us on the next tour.

944
00:45:47,916 --> 00:45:49,236
Speaker 1: So I was going to audition a couple of singers

945
00:45:49,236 --> 00:45:51,236
Speaker 1: to see if anybody want to come sing, and they

946
00:45:51,276 --> 00:45:52,476
Speaker 1: all showed up at the same time. So it was

947
00:45:52,516 --> 00:45:55,716
Speaker 1: incredibly uncomfortable. So I just told Miska. I was like, dude,

948
00:45:55,756 --> 00:45:57,996
Speaker 1: you go in the other room with Aliva write something

949
00:45:58,076 --> 00:46:00,436
Speaker 1: like this. I'm gonna work on lyrics with them. And

950
00:46:00,476 --> 00:46:02,636
Speaker 1: we wrote that on the spot. So we started off

951
00:46:02,636 --> 00:46:04,756
Speaker 1: with all the Spanish words, and we had conversations about

952
00:46:05,316 --> 00:46:06,996
Speaker 1: I always felt when I was in Mexico City, when

953
00:46:07,036 --> 00:46:09,476
Speaker 1: you look at the wires and all the infra structure

954
00:46:09,476 --> 00:46:11,636
Speaker 1: that's in the sky, you just see so much life.

955
00:46:11,876 --> 00:46:14,676
Speaker 1: It looks like this. You just see every millions of

956
00:46:14,716 --> 00:46:16,756
Speaker 1: life just hanging in this like the weight of all

957
00:46:16,796 --> 00:46:20,316
Speaker 1: the wires around the city. So I had presented that

958
00:46:20,356 --> 00:46:23,236
Speaker 1: impression to them and then I let them answer that's

959
00:46:23,236 --> 00:46:26,236
Speaker 1: impression in their own way, and then we wrote. We

960
00:46:26,276 --> 00:46:29,796
Speaker 1: recorded that thing in like two hours, written recorded, and

961
00:46:29,836 --> 00:46:31,476
Speaker 1: then then we brought the Then we brought in the

962
00:46:31,476 --> 00:46:33,396
Speaker 1: next day the horn players just like and then they

963
00:46:33,396 --> 00:46:35,636
Speaker 1: blew our minds on that, you know. So it was

964
00:46:35,676 --> 00:46:38,276
Speaker 1: one of my favorite moments of this record because like

965
00:46:38,276 --> 00:46:41,116
Speaker 1: you're translating different languages and there's like trump playing. I

966
00:46:41,196 --> 00:46:42,436
Speaker 1: just like the whole chaos of it.

967
00:46:42,476 --> 00:46:46,476
Speaker 7: You know, mm hm, tell me about the wandering the wandering.

968
00:46:46,756 --> 00:46:49,196
Speaker 1: We This is one of the houses we rented, so

969
00:46:49,236 --> 00:46:51,436
Speaker 1: we decided to be really funny to rent like a

970
00:46:51,476 --> 00:46:54,836
Speaker 1: really obnoxious mansion in the hills of Hollywood as just

971
00:46:54,836 --> 00:46:56,996
Speaker 1: like the Paris Department. Because we had a show. We

972
00:46:57,036 --> 00:46:59,596
Speaker 1: had two days off, like let's rent once again, use

973
00:46:59,636 --> 00:47:01,956
Speaker 1: our studio budget, rent like something has a pool, like

974
00:47:02,476 --> 00:47:05,356
Speaker 1: totally ridiculous kind of So we were sitting there just

975
00:47:05,396 --> 00:47:08,676
Speaker 1: hanging out and Olive started to play that guitar part,

976
00:47:08,716 --> 00:47:10,516
Speaker 1: who's the drummers, I mean the top player, and I

977
00:47:10,556 --> 00:47:12,996
Speaker 1: was like, that's a really and then we just started

978
00:47:13,116 --> 00:47:16,396
Speaker 1: it just started coming together. So we wrote the music

979
00:47:16,476 --> 00:47:19,996
Speaker 1: part I had the melody, not the words, Like within

980
00:47:20,116 --> 00:47:22,396
Speaker 1: like six hours we had written and kind of recorded that.

981
00:47:22,996 --> 00:47:25,676
Speaker 1: The basis of that the chord structure with Mishka and

982
00:47:25,676 --> 00:47:29,116
Speaker 1: Oliva and the lyrics were like I was, we were

983
00:47:29,116 --> 00:47:32,516
Speaker 1: sitting in this absurdity of this silly mansion in the

984
00:47:32,596 --> 00:47:34,956
Speaker 1: hills of Hollywood. And I've been touring since I was

985
00:47:34,996 --> 00:47:37,716
Speaker 1: sixteen years old. You know, it's a it's a long

986
00:47:37,756 --> 00:47:40,116
Speaker 1: time to tour, and you're always just like this ghost,

987
00:47:40,636 --> 00:47:42,956
Speaker 1: and you're always this wandering kind of observer in all

988
00:47:42,956 --> 00:47:45,556
Speaker 1: these places. And here we are sitting in this ridiculous

989
00:47:45,876 --> 00:47:49,636
Speaker 1: place again as as the observer. And even my earliest

990
00:47:49,636 --> 00:47:52,916
Speaker 1: memories as a kid, I just I just remembered always

991
00:47:52,956 --> 00:47:55,116
Speaker 1: feeling like a ghost in a lovely way, wandering through

992
00:47:55,156 --> 00:47:57,596
Speaker 1: strangers and just being the observer and capturing this thing.

993
00:47:57,676 --> 00:48:00,556
Speaker 1: And so I felt like when that song kind of

994
00:48:00,556 --> 00:48:02,196
Speaker 1: came to fruit, I thought that would be really fun.

995
00:48:02,236 --> 00:48:04,196
Speaker 1: So I just tell stories of being the want, the great,

996
00:48:04,236 --> 00:48:06,796
Speaker 1: you know, the wandering. And then what was fun is

997
00:48:06,796 --> 00:48:08,836
Speaker 1: that they had a Brazilian undertone, and I thought of

998
00:48:08,876 --> 00:48:11,076
Speaker 1: my who's a Portuguese singer, not Brazilian, but singers in

999
00:48:11,076 --> 00:48:16,396
Speaker 1: Portuguese immediately, and she comes from like generations of fado singers,

1000
00:48:16,396 --> 00:48:18,356
Speaker 1: so you know, those are some of the best singers

1001
00:48:18,356 --> 00:48:20,316
Speaker 1: of all time. So she I think she's like a

1002
00:48:20,356 --> 00:48:25,356
Speaker 1: modern iteration of generations of fado, you know. And so

1003
00:48:25,476 --> 00:48:28,036
Speaker 1: I thought about her immediately because to kind of celebrate

1004
00:48:28,036 --> 00:48:30,316
Speaker 1: the bazilion and the Portuguese kind of undertones of the song,

1005
00:48:30,516 --> 00:48:33,396
Speaker 1: and that naturally it had. It's just since I was

1006
00:48:33,436 --> 00:48:35,076
Speaker 1: a kid, it just felt like a ghost. And the

1007
00:48:35,156 --> 00:48:38,236
Speaker 1: two people that one the two people is not two people.

1008
00:48:38,436 --> 00:48:41,076
Speaker 1: Is that when you travel a part of you separated.

1009
00:48:41,116 --> 00:48:43,236
Speaker 1: You become two different things, a traveling version of you

1010
00:48:43,276 --> 00:48:45,716
Speaker 1: in the home version of you, and that traveling version

1011
00:48:45,716 --> 00:48:48,556
Speaker 1: of you becomes your companion. You travel with that, you know,

1012
00:48:48,636 --> 00:48:51,116
Speaker 1: like you're high fiving because you're always in crazy places together.

1013
00:48:51,956 --> 00:48:55,396
Speaker 1: And I think that song is about being your best

1014
00:48:55,516 --> 00:48:58,036
Speaker 1: travel companion as all the different people you need to

1015
00:48:58,036 --> 00:49:00,636
Speaker 1: be to walk through all these different landscapes of people.

1016
00:49:01,356 --> 00:49:03,196
Speaker 1: Will be in the Deep South in places that people

1017
00:49:03,236 --> 00:49:06,036
Speaker 1: have really different radically politically different ideas, will be in

1018
00:49:06,116 --> 00:49:09,396
Speaker 1: Asia with different radical and you know, I find that

1019
00:49:09,396 --> 00:49:12,196
Speaker 1: as a musician you have this multi pass this passport

1020
00:49:12,676 --> 00:49:17,676
Speaker 1: you're welcome through everybody's door, and with that it doesn't

1021
00:49:17,716 --> 00:49:20,996
Speaker 1: mean that you need to agree or validate, but you

1022
00:49:21,036 --> 00:49:23,676
Speaker 1: are kind of the observer and of these different things.

1023
00:49:23,756 --> 00:49:27,196
Speaker 1: So when I sing, I'm singing about all these people

1024
00:49:27,236 --> 00:49:30,276
Speaker 1: that have pushed and pulled my imagination me as myself.

1025
00:49:30,316 --> 00:49:33,636
Speaker 1: It's not very interesting. But I've had the fortunate life

1026
00:49:33,636 --> 00:49:36,556
Speaker 1: to meet very very interesting people, like throughout my history

1027
00:49:36,556 --> 00:49:40,356
Speaker 1: of traveling in remarkable ways that money can't buy, and

1028
00:49:40,396 --> 00:49:43,796
Speaker 1: not because the famous. Like I remember this soldier if

1029
00:49:43,916 --> 00:49:46,236
Speaker 1: I was in Vietnam with these painters, invited me there.

1030
00:49:47,236 --> 00:49:49,036
Speaker 1: I go up to this gentleman's house. It's a middle

1031
00:49:49,036 --> 00:49:51,396
Speaker 1: of the ized twelve. He's like you a musician, He's

1032
00:49:51,436 --> 00:49:54,036
Speaker 1: like yes. On his wall he had this like a

1033
00:49:54,236 --> 00:49:56,716
Speaker 1: blanket over the wall, and we pulled the blanket. There

1034
00:49:56,796 --> 00:49:59,316
Speaker 1: was like thousands of vinyls on the wall, and each

1035
00:49:59,356 --> 00:50:01,156
Speaker 1: one of those vinyls he had taken from an American

1036
00:50:01,156 --> 00:50:02,036
Speaker 1: soldier during the war.

1037
00:50:02,676 --> 00:50:03,796
Speaker 7: Oh vinyl, every.

1038
00:50:03,636 --> 00:50:05,516
Speaker 1: Vinyls so CCR. It's like he was just from the

1039
00:50:05,556 --> 00:50:07,436
Speaker 1: Vietnam War. So what he would do is rate the

1040
00:50:07,476 --> 00:50:11,836
Speaker 1: bases or they would play. Yeah. So this guy in

1041
00:50:11,916 --> 00:50:14,316
Speaker 1: his wall was a collection of records that he had

1042
00:50:14,356 --> 00:50:17,676
Speaker 1: stolen from other soldiers that they had killed in the

1043
00:50:17,716 --> 00:50:19,396
Speaker 1: in the meantime our basis they had raided.

1044
00:50:19,516 --> 00:50:22,876
Speaker 7: An incredible story. Yeah, and what was the stolen music

1045
00:50:22,996 --> 00:50:23,916
Speaker 7: of the Vietnam War.

1046
00:50:23,956 --> 00:50:26,076
Speaker 1: Why that was really interesting is that I was there

1047
00:50:26,076 --> 00:50:28,836
Speaker 1: a week after September eleventh and why that was interesting

1048
00:50:28,916 --> 00:50:30,396
Speaker 1: is that a lot of old ladies would come up

1049
00:50:30,436 --> 00:50:32,756
Speaker 1: to me saying, that's so sad, because they just assume

1050
00:50:32,796 --> 00:50:36,596
Speaker 1: I'm American. It's so sad what happened, and knowing anything

1051
00:50:36,596 --> 00:50:38,596
Speaker 1: about that war, I just didn't believe them at first.

1052
00:50:38,676 --> 00:50:40,796
Speaker 1: And so when I was with that gentleman with this wall,

1053
00:50:41,796 --> 00:50:43,876
Speaker 1: I felt comfortable enough to be like, Hey, I want

1054
00:50:43,876 --> 00:50:46,276
Speaker 1: to know for real, do you really feel that empathy

1055
00:50:46,356 --> 00:50:48,316
Speaker 1: or is that like just for money? Like what is?

1056
00:50:48,516 --> 00:50:50,876
Speaker 1: I just want to know, you know, And he's like

1057
00:50:51,916 --> 00:50:56,196
Speaker 1: every time, like, if I carry any anger whatsoever about that,

1058
00:50:56,316 --> 00:50:58,676
Speaker 1: it means the war is still happening, and that war

1059
00:50:58,756 --> 00:51:01,396
Speaker 1: is finished, and I don't want to ever go back there.

1060
00:51:01,436 --> 00:51:04,116
Speaker 1: So it's when the lady feels empathy and she feels sad,

1061
00:51:04,196 --> 00:51:07,156
Speaker 1: it's because she has no interest in carrying that war

1062
00:51:07,196 --> 00:51:10,356
Speaker 1: another day. And what he was these things, they legitimately

1063
00:51:10,356 --> 00:51:13,196
Speaker 1: felt bad, and as you know, it's a very complicated place.

1064
00:51:13,236 --> 00:51:17,196
Speaker 1: So it was a very inspiring moment that like, you know,

1065
00:51:17,236 --> 00:51:19,516
Speaker 1: it's that's nothing to do with me. I'm a Canadian

1066
00:51:19,556 --> 00:51:22,276
Speaker 1: small town boy, but I am a receiver of these

1067
00:51:22,396 --> 00:51:25,716
Speaker 1: incredible scenarios like this that become when I open my

1068
00:51:25,756 --> 00:51:29,076
Speaker 1: mouth and sing. I carry the weight of these interactions

1069
00:51:29,076 --> 00:51:31,716
Speaker 1: in people, you know, I carry the responsibility of carrying

1070
00:51:31,716 --> 00:51:33,036
Speaker 1: the depth of these interactions.

1071
00:51:33,996 --> 00:51:37,676
Speaker 7: Now, is there a particular song that addresses that incident?

1072
00:51:37,796 --> 00:51:39,596
Speaker 1: I mean yes, in a way that I never saw

1073
00:51:39,636 --> 00:51:42,036
Speaker 1: the world the same. I can tell you that much

1074
00:51:42,676 --> 00:51:44,796
Speaker 1: Big Bird and Small Cage was some same trip and

1075
00:51:44,836 --> 00:51:46,716
Speaker 1: that we was a real story, like we went to

1076
00:51:46,756 --> 00:51:49,676
Speaker 1: the musician's house. There was six generation musicians and they

1077
00:51:49,676 --> 00:51:51,676
Speaker 1: literally had a collection of birds in the back, like

1078
00:51:51,676 --> 00:51:54,596
Speaker 1: a hundred songbirds, and literally there was this like really

1079
00:51:54,676 --> 00:51:58,236
Speaker 1: tiny cage in the back of the room that had

1080
00:51:58,276 --> 00:52:00,596
Speaker 1: the biggest bird all stuck in it. And he's like,

1081
00:52:00,636 --> 00:52:02,036
Speaker 1: why would you do that? It's like, if you put

1082
00:52:02,076 --> 00:52:04,156
Speaker 1: a big bird in small cage, he sings all the time.

1083
00:52:04,156 --> 00:52:08,156
Speaker 1: And I'm like, yes, he's going around. Sorry, he's crying

1084
00:52:08,156 --> 00:52:10,396
Speaker 1: for help, you know, obviously see. But it was I

1085
00:52:10,396 --> 00:52:12,676
Speaker 1: thought that was like a really lovely idea for music,

1086
00:52:12,716 --> 00:52:14,716
Speaker 1: and yeah, so I put that in my pocket. And

1087
00:52:14,756 --> 00:52:17,636
Speaker 1: then funny enough, I was traveling in New Orleans after

1088
00:52:17,676 --> 00:52:21,636
Speaker 1: that in the collision of those two places. Maybe really

1089
00:52:21,676 --> 00:52:24,076
Speaker 1: like that really allowed me to give birth to that song.

1090
00:52:24,116 --> 00:52:26,516
Speaker 1: I don't I don't usually write right away. I let

1091
00:52:26,516 --> 00:52:28,316
Speaker 1: it like sit in my pocket for five six years

1092
00:52:28,316 --> 00:52:30,396
Speaker 1: when it's an idea like that big, and let it

1093
00:52:30,436 --> 00:52:32,156
Speaker 1: collide with life a bit before I write.

1094
00:52:32,756 --> 00:52:37,636
Speaker 7: The heaviest emotional song on this album I think would

1095
00:52:37,676 --> 00:52:41,076
Speaker 7: be House on Fire, Yes, or at least that's it's

1096
00:52:41,596 --> 00:52:44,516
Speaker 7: hit the highest sort of pitch. Tell me about that song.

1097
00:52:44,476 --> 00:52:47,276
Speaker 1: How's the fire? It's complex because I co wrote it

1098
00:52:47,276 --> 00:52:51,116
Speaker 1: with Martha, and initially I had that chorus and a

1099
00:52:51,116 --> 00:52:52,876
Speaker 1: lot of the ideas of the song before a months

1100
00:52:52,876 --> 00:52:54,916
Speaker 1: I showed up and I was hiring her because she

1101
00:52:55,036 --> 00:52:57,356
Speaker 1: has like fire and she like fights and I don't

1102
00:52:57,436 --> 00:52:59,996
Speaker 1: have that. And then my biggest mistake in the album

1103
00:53:00,076 --> 00:53:02,196
Speaker 1: was having too much of an idea to bring to her,

1104
00:53:02,796 --> 00:53:04,956
Speaker 1: which in fact was a bit rude in my way,

1105
00:53:05,076 --> 00:53:07,676
Speaker 1: especially because the nature of the song was complex. The

1106
00:53:07,756 --> 00:53:10,676
Speaker 1: nature of the song, the original intent was, you know,

1107
00:53:10,796 --> 00:53:12,756
Speaker 1: sometimes you have two truths, you know, if you've been

1108
00:53:12,756 --> 00:53:15,796
Speaker 1: through divorce or different different parts or different complicated moments

1109
00:53:15,836 --> 00:53:18,236
Speaker 1: in your life. And then at one point to those

1110
00:53:18,276 --> 00:53:20,916
Speaker 1: two truths matter if it means the whole house is

1111
00:53:20,956 --> 00:53:23,996
Speaker 1: going to burn down, you know. And I thought and

1112
00:53:24,076 --> 00:53:26,876
Speaker 1: during like COVID and all these like really important conversations

1113
00:53:26,916 --> 00:53:28,756
Speaker 1: that we've been have in the last six years. It

1114
00:53:28,836 --> 00:53:31,196
Speaker 1: keeps on making me think a bit of my childhood home,

1115
00:53:31,196 --> 00:53:33,036
Speaker 1: where you have these like these colliding truths and at

1116
00:53:33,036 --> 00:53:35,276
Speaker 1: one point do you want the whole house to burn

1117
00:53:35,676 --> 00:53:37,916
Speaker 1: for one to be right? And at what point is

1118
00:53:37,916 --> 00:53:39,996
Speaker 1: it better to let two truths exist and not burn

1119
00:53:40,036 --> 00:53:40,756
Speaker 1: the whole house down?

1120
00:53:41,556 --> 00:53:43,716
Speaker 7: Which was that a feature of your upbringing?

1121
00:53:44,036 --> 00:53:46,356
Speaker 1: Yeah, to some extent, I mean I watched them burn

1122
00:53:46,396 --> 00:53:48,796
Speaker 1: down the house and in certain ways for certain truths

1123
00:53:48,836 --> 00:53:51,596
Speaker 1: to exist, and I don't know if they were they

1124
00:53:51,636 --> 00:53:53,876
Speaker 1: were a fight that was worth losing that battle, you know.

1125
00:53:54,436 --> 00:53:57,276
Speaker 1: But then that's a very obnoxious subject to bring to

1126
00:53:57,316 --> 00:54:00,076
Speaker 1: a woman's perspective because often those two truths had like

1127
00:54:00,396 --> 00:54:02,676
Speaker 1: is the way they've been silenced, and like it's in

1128
00:54:02,716 --> 00:54:06,156
Speaker 1: fact worse than you. But I was not referring to

1129
00:54:06,156 --> 00:54:08,916
Speaker 1: those situations. But she was coming from a totally different perspective.

1130
00:54:09,356 --> 00:54:12,116
Speaker 1: So she's like, no, I'm not singing that idea like

1131
00:54:12,156 --> 00:54:14,156
Speaker 1: that because I don't have that same experience as you.

1132
00:54:14,996 --> 00:54:16,716
Speaker 1: So then we try to find a way for the

1133
00:54:16,756 --> 00:54:19,116
Speaker 1: two realities that co exists in the song where we

1134
00:54:19,156 --> 00:54:21,676
Speaker 1: can still sing together and she could still have her

1135
00:54:21,716 --> 00:54:24,636
Speaker 1: perspective as clear as day, and I have my experience.

1136
00:54:24,756 --> 00:54:26,396
Speaker 1: So in the end, it kind of worked out great

1137
00:54:26,396 --> 00:54:29,836
Speaker 1: for the song being what it was, you know, but

1138
00:54:29,876 --> 00:54:31,756
Speaker 1: it was a learning experience. I mean I felt a

1139
00:54:31,756 --> 00:54:34,436
Speaker 1: bit silly after that. I would have tried to bring

1140
00:54:34,836 --> 00:54:37,356
Speaker 1: that to Martha. I did it because that melody. I

1141
00:54:37,356 --> 00:54:39,716
Speaker 1: was like, no one will sing that melody like Martha.

1142
00:54:39,116 --> 00:54:41,156
Speaker 7: There's amazing performance.

1143
00:54:41,276 --> 00:54:43,716
Speaker 1: Yeah, It's just like that's what That's the only person

1144
00:54:43,756 --> 00:54:45,276
Speaker 1: could sing the song for me, you know, in the

1145
00:54:45,276 --> 00:54:46,036
Speaker 1: way it was written.

1146
00:54:46,636 --> 00:54:49,876
Speaker 7: But you know, she does come from a family that

1147
00:54:50,156 --> 00:54:54,676
Speaker 7: literally works out their problems in songs. So I think

1148
00:54:55,116 --> 00:54:57,876
Speaker 7: she's actually the ideal person, isn't she Because she's the

1149
00:54:57,876 --> 00:55:00,476
Speaker 7: person who can sing this song and then her brother

1150
00:55:00,556 --> 00:55:03,996
Speaker 7: sings this, you know famously. You can tell the whole

1151
00:55:04,076 --> 00:55:06,756
Speaker 7: You could tell the whole family's relationship just jumping from

1152
00:55:06,756 --> 00:55:08,636
Speaker 7: one song to another.

1153
00:55:09,876 --> 00:55:12,316
Speaker 1: Well that's an amazing Well they're amazing. They're all amazing.

1154
00:55:12,356 --> 00:55:15,156
Speaker 1: Rufus isn't a very talented I mean I was young

1155
00:55:15,196 --> 00:55:17,636
Speaker 1: in Montreal looking up to these people like I would

1156
00:55:17,636 --> 00:55:20,276
Speaker 1: look up to Martha, you know, I'd see her on

1157
00:55:20,316 --> 00:55:22,276
Speaker 1: stage and dream that I'd be on stage fly curs,

1158
00:55:22,316 --> 00:55:24,316
Speaker 1: you know. So to sing with her is quite a

1159
00:55:24,356 --> 00:55:26,196
Speaker 1: lovely experience for me, you know what I mean, and

1160
00:55:26,316 --> 00:55:29,356
Speaker 1: very humbling experience clearly. And Rufus I mean, I played

1161
00:55:29,356 --> 00:55:31,436
Speaker 1: piano and sing. I thought I'd never have a career

1162
00:55:31,436 --> 00:55:33,476
Speaker 1: because he because he did it first, and I was like, well,

1163
00:55:33,476 --> 00:55:34,996
Speaker 1: I'm on, there's no point of media in this anymore.

1164
00:55:35,076 --> 00:55:35,636
Speaker 7: Yeah, he's done it.

1165
00:55:35,716 --> 00:55:37,156
Speaker 1: Yeah I gotta quit, you know.

1166
00:55:37,236 --> 00:55:39,756
Speaker 7: So, Yeah, thank god he went to write operas.

1167
00:55:39,436 --> 00:55:40,396
Speaker 1: Thank God to save me.

1168
00:55:40,596 --> 00:55:40,796
Speaker 7: Yeah.

1169
00:55:40,796 --> 00:55:43,556
Speaker 1: Well, I think I went much more towards experimental music

1170
00:55:44,036 --> 00:55:46,516
Speaker 1: at that same drift, probably probably because of Rufus quick,

1171
00:55:46,516 --> 00:55:48,236
Speaker 1: probably because I was like, what's the point He's got

1172
00:55:48,236 --> 00:55:49,796
Speaker 1: that gig already. I better do something different.

1173
00:55:51,396 --> 00:55:52,356
Speaker 7: It's just been delightful.

1174
00:55:52,396 --> 00:55:53,716
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's super fun conversation.

1175
00:55:56,476 --> 00:55:58,796
Speaker 2: An episode description, you'll find a link to a playlist

1176
00:55:58,876 --> 00:56:02,356
Speaker 2: featuring our favorite songs from Patrick Watson, including this new album.

1177
00:56:03,356 --> 00:56:05,636
Speaker 2: Be sure to check out YouTube dot com slash Broken

1178
00:56:05,676 --> 00:56:08,596
Speaker 2: Record Podcast to see all of our interviews, and be

1179
00:56:08,636 --> 00:56:11,316
Speaker 2: sure to follow us on Instagram at the Broken Record pot.

1180
00:56:11,676 --> 00:56:13,956
Speaker 2: Broken Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose with

1181
00:56:14,036 --> 00:56:16,716
Speaker 2: marketing and help from Eric Sandler and Jordana McMillan. Our

1182
00:56:16,796 --> 00:56:20,236
Speaker 2: engineer is Ben Holliday. Broken Record is a production of

1183
00:56:20,236 --> 00:56:23,396
Speaker 2: Pushkin Industries. If you love this show and others from Pushkin,

1184
00:56:23,516 --> 00:56:26,956
Speaker 2: consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a podcast

1185
00:56:26,956 --> 00:56:30,076
Speaker 2: subscription that offers bonus content and ad free listening for

1186
00:56:30,116 --> 00:56:32,396
Speaker 2: four ninety nine a month. Look for Pushkin Plus on

1187
00:56:32,436 --> 00:56:35,876
Speaker 2: Apple podcast subscriptions. And if you like this show, please

1188
00:56:35,916 --> 00:56:38,316
Speaker 2: remember to share, rate, and review us on your podcast app.

1189
00:56:38,636 --> 00:56:41,196
Speaker 2: Our theme music's by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond.