Speaker 1: Hig and everybody.
Speaker 2: I'm Dan Hord and thanks for downloading The Bengals Booth
Speaker 2: Podcast the Watch Me RIU.
Speaker 1: Edition.
Speaker 2: As we spend most of this episode focusing on the
Speaker 2: NFL Draft, Charles Davis from CBS Sports came out with
Speaker 2: his latest mock draft on Thursday. He'll discuss who he
Speaker 2: has the Bengals taking in Round one, along with some
Speaker 2: other players who have been frequently mentioned as possible Cincinnati targets. Then,
Speaker 2: for the second year in a row, former Bengals scout
Speaker 2: Greg Seaman joins the podcast to share insider stories from
Speaker 2: the fourteen drafts he was involved with in Cincinnati. And
Speaker 2: then it's the seventh edition of our three round mock
Speaker 2: draft with an NFL expert. The Bengals Booth Podcast is
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Speaker 2: Now time for our first guest. We're less than two
Speaker 2: weeks away from the NFL Draft, and one of my
Speaker 2: favorite experts is Charles Davis, who calls games for CBS
Speaker 2: but also serves as an analyst for the NFL networks
Speaker 2: coverage of the Senior Bowl, the Combine, and all seven
Speaker 2: rounds of the draft. On Friday, we discussed the draft
Speaker 2: as well as the Bengals moves in free agency. Charles,
Speaker 2: this is great timing because you just came out with
Speaker 2: your second mock draft yesterday for NFL dot Com. You
Speaker 2: have the Bengals selecting cornerback of Manual Forbes from Mississippi State.
Speaker 2: He's getting a top thirty visit from the Bengals, so
Speaker 2: the team is definitely interested in him. He had incredible
Speaker 2: stats fourteen interceptions at NCAA record, six pick sixes. He's tall,
Speaker 2: he's six to one, He's got long arms more than
Speaker 2: thirty two inches. He's fast, he runs a four to
Speaker 2: three to five forty. But there's a butt one hundred
Speaker 2: and sixty six pounds, which makes him something of a
Speaker 2: polarizing draft pick or potential draft pick. Share your thoughts
Speaker 2: on a manual Forbes, Dan, you.
Speaker 3: Laid it out perfectly. Everything that I like about him.
Speaker 3: You talked about the butt is the biggest thing going,
Speaker 3: because I will I can imagine in draft rooms across
Speaker 3: the NFL when his name comes up, the positives just
Speaker 3: pile up and then the fistfight starts. About one hundred
Speaker 3: and sixty six pound corner, Now that's what he weighed
Speaker 3: at the combine. He did get it up to one
Speaker 3: seventy at his pro day. Damn all right, right direction,
Speaker 3: that would be the lightest corner that we could think
Speaker 3: of in recent times, and we've talked about small players
Speaker 3: coming into the league. Nikel Roby Coleman, right, the diminutive
Speaker 3: slot cornerback that has played fairly well in this league.
Speaker 3: He weighed more than that. Jason Farrett coming out of TCU,
Speaker 3: a small corner but an outstanding talent. And to worry
Speaker 3: about him was could he hold up. He hasn't had
Speaker 3: very many seasons where he's been able to hold up,
Speaker 3: but when he has, he's been terrific. Kevin Johnson coming
Speaker 3: out of Wake Forest weighed more than that, and the
Speaker 3: number one concern was his slight frame. Can he hold up?
Speaker 3: Devon Witherspoon Illinois coming out this one hundred and eighty
Speaker 3: one pounds at the corner. One of the most fiercest,
Speaker 3: fierce hitters that we have coming into the league. But
Speaker 3: again one eighty one. So yeah, when you start talking
Speaker 3: about one sixty six to one seventy, the scratching of
Speaker 3: the head, the you know, the handover the face going on, right,
Speaker 3: the agony that goes into that. But the thing about
Speaker 3: him is you would figure he would be one of
Speaker 3: those cut tacklers, an ankle biter. He's not. He throws
Speaker 3: his body in with abandon now sometimes the boom doesn't
Speaker 3: meet what you need coming at her, he brings it
Speaker 3: as the best he can, and he tackles pretty darn
Speaker 3: well overall. The reason I put him there, of course,
Speaker 3: corner to me is a need with Cincinnati. His ability
Speaker 3: to ball hawk seems to fit quite well with a
Speaker 3: man that runs your defense, lou Anarumo, And I just
Speaker 3: think the fit there, the personality, the way Cincinnati goes
Speaker 3: about its business, I think it matches pretty well in
Speaker 3: terms of this mock draft, although I think there's some
Speaker 3: other places they could easily go.
Speaker 2: Do we have any context for the one hundred and
Speaker 2: sixty six to one hundred and seventy pounds? Do we
Speaker 2: know if he tries to put on weight and it's
Speaker 2: just one of these people who can't. Is he somebody
Speaker 2: who really hasn't tried to do it up until this
Speaker 2: point and now will do you know anything along those lines?
Speaker 3: No, but my eyes and just educated guessing and a
Speaker 3: little bit of chatter. You know, we all have that
Speaker 3: where we're lucky enough to run in circles Dan where
Speaker 3: you can pick up a phone and call someone and
Speaker 3: see if there's something I can do the same. We're
Speaker 3: lucky that way, right, No one has a definitive answer.
Speaker 3: When you look at his frame, you wonder just how
Speaker 3: much he can actually put on, Like some frames are
Speaker 3: built where you go, oh, he can put it on
Speaker 3: twenty five pounds, that'd be a piece of cake and
Speaker 3: carry it easily. He doesn't look to me like he
Speaker 3: has the type of frame. He's so wiry, all right.
Speaker 3: I feel like Gene Hackman and the Replacements talking about
Speaker 3: their kicker. He's wiring that. I don't know how much
Speaker 3: can actually pack on. He looks like one big, one
Speaker 3: hundred and sixty six pounds long muscle. How much of
Speaker 3: that can pack on? And how much do you want
Speaker 3: before he actually slows down? So that's where we run
Speaker 3: into that with Emmanuel Forbes, and that's a big reason
Speaker 3: why a lot of people would push him to the
Speaker 3: second round. But the ballhawking ability taking it away. It's
Speaker 3: the name of the game. You know that as well
Speaker 3: as I do. Is the name of the game. It's
Speaker 3: in the NFL like it has everywhere else. When you
Speaker 3: can limit possessions and create an extra one for your offense,
Speaker 3: that's huge in today's NFL, when how many games last
Speaker 3: year were decided by one touchdown or less.
Speaker 2: We're visiting with Charles Davis from CBS Sports and the
Speaker 2: NFL Network. So this was your second mock draft for
Speaker 2: NFL dot Com, and the first you had the Bengals
Speaker 2: taking Notre Dame tight end Michael Mayer, the local kid
Speaker 2: from Covington Catholic High School just across the river. In
Speaker 2: your second mock draft, he's not there anymore. You have
Speaker 2: him going twenty sixth to Dallas. If he is there,
Speaker 2: would he be your pick?
Speaker 3: He would be one that I would have in heavy
Speaker 3: consideration because obviously we have to see the rest of
Speaker 3: the board and what happens. I know in my mind,
Speaker 3: I keep thinking to myself and maybe you can help
Speaker 3: me with this. I know Jonah Williams hasn't exactly jumped
Speaker 3: up and down and greeted the idea of right tackle
Speaker 3: with open arms. But we're a long way from training camp,
Speaker 3: We're a long way from the season. I've heard players
Speaker 3: not be excited about certain assignments. By the time we
Speaker 3: get there, they're ready, you know, they lock in and go.
Speaker 3: I feel like, ultimately Jonah Williams will make that move
Speaker 3: to right tackle. So I've not focused as much there
Speaker 3: but don't think for a second offensive lineman couldn't still
Speaker 3: be in consideration. I think running back is a big one,
Speaker 3: and if somehow Vjon Robinson got within range, I would
Speaker 3: think Duke Tobin and staff might have a little conversation
Speaker 3: in a huddle because if he gets in range, Dallas
Speaker 3: is gonna have that same conversation. And with the way
Speaker 3: Joe Mixon's offseason has been no more, Sama, JP Ryn,
Speaker 3: I you know we've covered the Bengals enough. My crew,
Speaker 3: we are a strong believer that Zach Taylor isn't just
Speaker 3: paying lip service because we've seen it. When he can
Speaker 3: run the football, he will run the football. So Vjon
Speaker 3: Robbinson fits that bill as well. But mayor look, I
Speaker 3: said it in my first mock draft. Joe Burrow is
Speaker 3: gonna find you if you're open, and he likes tight
Speaker 3: ends that can get open and play. They're any quarterback's
Speaker 3: best friend. Great site lines, dan right in front of you,
Speaker 3: easy pitch and catch yardage, chains, move all those things.
Speaker 3: Michael Mayer fits that one. Plus he'll block really well
Speaker 3: in the run game.
Speaker 2: So this is supposedly a great tight end draft. You
Speaker 2: have Dalton Kincaid from Utah going fifteenth to the Green
Speaker 2: Bay Packers in your most recent mock draft. I think
Speaker 2: the Bengals are going to take at least one in
Speaker 2: this draft after Dalton Kincaid and Michael Mayer. Who do
Speaker 2: you like if the Bengals were to take one in
Speaker 2: the second, third, or fourth round.
Speaker 3: Well, they got so many options. You know, there's one
Speaker 3: out of Miami named Will Mallory that if you think
Speaker 3: the Mallory name in football circles, Bill Mallory, former hit coach,
Speaker 3: Mike Mallory. We go right down the line you say Mallory,
Speaker 3: everybody's oh Mallory one of those kids, and I think
Speaker 3: he's tested well and probably was underutilized the University of
Speaker 3: Miami right right there in the city. Josh Wiley, tight
Speaker 3: end from Cincinnati, had a really good Senior Bowl week.
Speaker 3: He's a guy to keep an eye on. Not terribly
Speaker 3: far away. If you go to Purdue, there's a kid
Speaker 3: by name of Payne Durham who got better every day
Speaker 3: at the Senior Bowl and capped it off with a
Speaker 3: terrific game. He is a monster of a tight end.
Speaker 3: He's a big, big guy. Dan and I had a
Speaker 3: great chance to chat with him a little bit, and
Speaker 3: I said, hey, I noticed in your background lacrosse. I
Speaker 3: said what position? He said, I was an attack, which
Speaker 3: meant he was bearing down on goalies and scoring goals.
Speaker 3: I said, how big were you when you played lacrosse?
Speaker 3: He said pretty much where I am, he said, you know,
Speaker 3: give or take. But I was tall and big then.
Speaker 3: And I just thought to myself, can you imagine those
Speaker 3: poor lacrosse goalies with that monster pumping at him. He's
Speaker 3: gotten better as he's gone along. Okay, there's a kid
Speaker 3: named Tucker Kraft a San Diego, I mean South Dakota State,
Speaker 3: who can play. Is he Dallas Goddard? That's the easy comparison,
Speaker 3: same school. I don't think so, But that doesn't mean
Speaker 3: he's not a good football player. And then there's one
Speaker 3: that is starting that is starting to hit Brenton Strange
Speaker 3: from Penn State. Lately. Do you hear more and more
Speaker 3: chatter his ability to catch the football? You know, he
Speaker 3: might be a better pro than a college player. We
Speaker 3: go on forever. There are a bunch of guys in
Speaker 3: that once you start taking them off, it seems like
Speaker 3: there's no shortage of those guys that are available that
Speaker 3: you can go.
Speaker 2: Get Sam Hubbard, by the way, was one of those
Speaker 2: high school giants bearing down on the lacrosse goalie back
Speaker 2: in the day. We're chatting with Charles Davis from CBS.
Speaker 2: Let's circle back to right tackle for now. Jonah Williams
Speaker 2: is likely to be the guy who knows. Maybe they'll
Speaker 2: trade him after the draft. Anything's possible. Let's assume that
Speaker 2: Paris Johnson has gone, Peter Skeronsky has gone, I know,
Speaker 2: right is gone, Froderick Jones is gone. That would be
Speaker 2: my expectation prior to pick number twenty eight. After that,
Speaker 2: Are you a Dewan Jones guy? Are you an Anton
Speaker 2: Harrison guy? How do you like the crop of potential
Speaker 2: right tackles that could play right away?
Speaker 3: Yeah, the top is gonna be Anton Harrison for me.
Speaker 3: You know, once you get past that crop. You mentioned Dan,
Speaker 3: I think that he's a guy who also is a
Speaker 3: consideration that if the run, if the run really hits,
Speaker 3: and someone wants someone And I called the Dwayne Brown example.
Speaker 3: Remember the draft when Houston and people, you know, I
Speaker 3: keep telling you know, I tell people, you know, Houston
Speaker 3: used to run the AFC South and people look at
Speaker 3: me like what I say, It wasn't that long ago,
Speaker 3: was it? You see how quickly times change? Right, They
Speaker 3: actually traded back into the first round, took Dwayne Brown
Speaker 3: somewhere in the late twenties, I believe, and people are like,
Speaker 3: WHOA had a third round? Great on him? How'd that
Speaker 3: work out? I think pretty well. Dwayne Brown's had a career.
Speaker 3: He's not a tackle. But remember when Travis Frederick went
Speaker 3: to Dallas in the first round and everyone in the league,
Speaker 3: what second round, third round, fourth round? Grade Travis fad
Speaker 3: and get him later guy became an all pro, not
Speaker 3: just a pro bowler and all pro before he had
Speaker 3: to retire early with Giambari syndrome and just didn't have
Speaker 3: the strength to play, but he was a terrific player.
Speaker 3: So Anton Harrison is that type of a guy to
Speaker 3: me that if that run happens, and it really happens
Speaker 3: early and people's like, I got to have a tackle,
Speaker 3: he becomes that guy from me. Dwan Jones for Ohio State,
Speaker 3: I'm just going to tell you that is buyer beware,
Speaker 3: buyer beware, buyer beware, but never stepped on a scale
Speaker 3: for us. And when I say I'm talking about all
Speaker 3: of us who were interested in it. Never stepped on
Speaker 3: a scale at the Combine, didn't step on a scale
Speaker 3: at his pro day, didn't go through his drills and
Speaker 3: things at his pro day. Was at the Senior Bowl.
Speaker 3: Had one good day the first day of practice when
Speaker 3: every pass rusher lost his mind and decided, I'm gonna
Speaker 3: run over the three hundred and sixty pounds man, and
Speaker 3: he just enveloped them all. None of them threw a
Speaker 3: second move, none of them through speed, none of them
Speaker 3: did anything. They just all got ego driven and rushed horribly,
Speaker 3: and he just ate them alive. And then he never
Speaker 3: showed up the rest of the week. Didn't see him Wednesday,
Speaker 3: didn't see him Thursday, didn't see him on game Deby.
Speaker 3: I'm not saying people don't have their reasons, Okay. I
Speaker 3: didn't sit with the young man and say why didn't
Speaker 3: you do this? So he may have something perfectly good,
Speaker 3: but I'm gonna play string it all together for you. Dan.
Speaker 3: He did that in mobile. He didn't work out at
Speaker 3: the combine, He didn't work at his pro debt. What
Speaker 3: am I getting? And if you're not getting on that
Speaker 3: scale and I'm looking at you and I'm thinking four
Speaker 3: bills could ring up there somewhere. That's gonna worry me.
Speaker 3: And Dion Sanders said something that I've kept in my
Speaker 3: head years ago. He's like, hey, man, you don't eat
Speaker 3: less when you have more money in your pocket. And
Speaker 3: I realize the discipline people handle it right. I don't
Speaker 3: know what I'm getting there. So that's a buyer beware.
Speaker 3: Because he has talent, that's well, I'll question, but does
Speaker 3: he have the talent to discipline himself be on the field.
Speaker 3: That's what teams are asking themselves in my mind.
Speaker 2: Let's get back to running back. Historically, the second round
Speaker 2: has been the sweet spot for the Bengals. Joe Mixon
Speaker 2: second round, Jeremy Hill's second round, Gievonni Bernard second round.
Speaker 2: If you go to the wayback machine, Corey Dellon second round,
Speaker 2: Ikey would second round. How do you like the crop
Speaker 2: of running backs? We'll say second round, but maybe even third.
Speaker 3: I think it's a good one. It's a very good
Speaker 3: running back crop. Jamar Gibbs from Alabama. He could be
Speaker 3: my Clente Edwards Dlaire where he snuck into the bottom
Speaker 3: of the first round. I'm looking at Philadelphia. If they
Speaker 3: don't take Jon Robinson at ten, right, he could be
Speaker 3: that guy. He's out of Alabama, Georgia Tech Transfer, run it,
Speaker 3: catch it. He's not Jhon Robinson because he's not as
Speaker 3: thick and as strong, but he's built well, he's compact
Speaker 3: and he's really good in the open field. Devon a
Speaker 3: chain and these aren't necessarily an order. Dan Devon a
Speaker 3: chain from Texas A and m ran A four to
Speaker 3: three eight. He's a dart. Okay, mind you of a
Speaker 3: spiller coming out of school. Remember CJ still can flat
Speaker 3: out go and you have a Texas A and M guy.
Speaker 3: Believe who's on the roster now, Travon Williams a chain
Speaker 3: even more sudden in my mind. Plus he catches the
Speaker 3: ball on the backfield quite well. Zach Sharbonnet. Now that
Speaker 3: is more to me what the Bengals would look for,
Speaker 3: a more of a powerful type of a runner out
Speaker 3: of UCLA. That as the game went on, I always
Speaker 3: talk about guys who can run people into submission. Joe
Speaker 3: Mixon has that ability, right, those guys talked about Corey
Speaker 3: Dillon certainly ran people into submission. You know by the
Speaker 3: fourth quarter, Okay, I had enough of hitting on this
Speaker 3: big man. That's what Zach Sharbonnay gives you is a
Speaker 3: little bit more of a power guy come out of UCLA.
Speaker 3: There's one that didn't really work out at all in
Speaker 3: the offseason, and it's a little bit different than Dwan Jones.
Speaker 3: His was a true injury with a hamstring, but we've
Speaker 3: got plenty of tape on him. And that's Dwayne McBride
Speaker 3: out of UA B. And what was his name, Jordan Howard?
Speaker 3: Remember he came out Indiana a few years ago and
Speaker 3: actually had a few good years in Chicago. Very similar
Speaker 3: type of player in terms of college production. And Jordan
Speaker 3: Howard began his create UA B before transferring to Indiana,
Speaker 3: So there's a little bit of comparison there. But there
Speaker 3: are a lot of good running backs. They're gonna come
Speaker 3: out in the second round, in the third round, and
Speaker 3: that's why again I think b Jon Robinson is still
Speaker 3: going to go in the first round, but maybe not
Speaker 3: as high. And if he doesn't go into first round,
Speaker 3: it's simply because everybody goes I can get a running
Speaker 3: back all the way through and that's kind of where
Speaker 3: we've seen it along the way too.
Speaker 2: We're chatting with Charles Davis from CBS. Let's get away
Speaker 2: from the draft and touch on free agency for a
Speaker 2: few minutes before I let you go. The big news,
Speaker 2: obviously for the Bengals was signing Orlando Brown Junior to
Speaker 2: a four year, sixty four million dollar deal. That's pretty
Speaker 2: darn reasonable for a four time Pro Bowl left tackle.
Speaker 2: He's only the fifteenth highest paid tackle now in the NFL.
Speaker 2: What'd you think of that signing?
Speaker 3: I has a big time signing for Cincinnati because they
Speaker 3: obviously were comfortable with him standing on the left side,
Speaker 3: and he doesn't make that move if he doesn't stand
Speaker 3: the left side. Remember, he was a perennial Pro Bowl
Speaker 3: right tackle, which I thought fit him to a t.
Speaker 3: But he always talked about I want to play a
Speaker 3: position where my dad played. Orlando Zeus Brown, God rest
Speaker 3: his soul, and he wanted to be a left tackle,
Speaker 3: and Kansas City was willing to make him a left tackle.
Speaker 3: I think he's better at right, what is he good
Speaker 3: enough at left? Absolutely? And look, he just won a
Speaker 3: Super Bowl and helped shut out some pretty good pass
Speaker 3: rushers right against Philadelphia, so he understands how to play
Speaker 3: the game. And then you're talking about getting him into
Speaker 3: fifteenth salary for tackles. That's a huge win for Cincinnati.
Speaker 3: Jordan Williams may not be thrilled about the whole thing,
Speaker 3: but if you're Cincinnati, how do you say no to that?
Speaker 3: He understands how to play, he understands positioning, and he
Speaker 3: helps make up for his lack of foot speed when
Speaker 3: you have those super elite pass rushers. He knows where
Speaker 3: his weakness is and he tries to eliminate that right
Speaker 3: off the top and make you play to his strength.
Speaker 3: And when he's able to do that and get his
Speaker 3: hands on you, look out because that's a big, massive
Speaker 3: man who's got some strength.
Speaker 2: You are a great safety and you're playing days at Tennessee.
Speaker 2: You had thirteen interceptions in your college career. That's highly impressive.
Speaker 2: The Bengals lost a great tandem at that position in
Speaker 2: Jesse Bates and Von Bell. They've signed Nick Scott. They've
Speaker 2: got last year's first round draft pick Dax Hill waiting
Speaker 2: in the wings. How concern should we be about losing
Speaker 2: Bates and Bell when you now have Scott and Hill?
Speaker 3: Yeah? I think losing losing both of them are terrific.
Speaker 3: And you know, my coaches to tell you my thirteen interceptions.
Speaker 3: They don't know what the quarterbacks were thinking, right, this
Speaker 3: is how it happened, Davis. But Jesse Bates was one
Speaker 3: of those great center field roamers. And in a sense, Dan,
Speaker 3: there's times I would watch Jesse play and see numbers
Speaker 3: and thought that they would have been higher. And that's
Speaker 3: that's not a ding on him. I like Jesse Bates
Speaker 3: a lot. I thought there was a potential at some
Speaker 3: point that Jesse Bates might, you know, really bust out eight, nine,
Speaker 3: ten interceptions because of that style of play. To me,
Speaker 3: von Bell is the big loss. Not that Bates isn't.
Speaker 3: He's a really good player and them is a tandem terrific.
Speaker 3: But the last two years have just been fraught with contract.
Speaker 3: Jesse was worried about. He almost lost a year getting
Speaker 3: his head right on that one on the Super Bowl run,
Speaker 3: and last year knew he was going to be leaving.
Speaker 3: So it's it's just an uneasy deal. Von Bell holds
Speaker 3: it down for everyone. You know how excited they are
Speaker 3: in Carolina. Okay, you know that they are ecstatic in
Speaker 3: Carolina because from the moment he hits town, he takes over.
Speaker 3: Guys are gonna work harder, Guys are gonna be more accountable,
Speaker 3: Guys are gonna be ready to play. That's just who
Speaker 3: he is and they are fortunate to have it. So
Speaker 3: I worry about that a little bit. But the beauty is,
Speaker 3: these youngsters got a chance to work their way in.
Speaker 3: Dax Hill got plenty of playing time preseason, and everybody
Speaker 3: says that preseason, Well, guess what it pays dividends that
Speaker 3: the kid gets his feet wet and got to work
Speaker 3: his way into what lou wanted. And of course Lou's knocker,
Speaker 3: lou An Room is not gonna want to play you
Speaker 3: during the regular season. He wants his regular guys playing
Speaker 3: because he likes the continuity. Dax can go ahead and
Speaker 3: jump in and get going right away on that. I
Speaker 3: don't think adding someone from the secondary in the draft
Speaker 3: it is out of line that could easily happen. That
Speaker 3: witness I've got forbes at corner safety can could easily
Speaker 3: jump in there, and they're few of them that are
Speaker 3: pretty darn good and would fit. I think what lou
Speaker 3: Anrumo does, So yeah, I see that happening, But I
Speaker 3: do think it's a loss. You know, It's what Buffalo
Speaker 3: did they're going with the Hide and Poyer show one
Speaker 3: more time. If that doesn't tell you how valuable these
Speaker 3: guys are, I don't know what is, because I'll leave
Speaker 3: you with this on this one, Dan, I'm getting ready
Speaker 3: for a Buffalo game last year, and you remember Hiding
Speaker 3: Poyer went through their injury issues last year? Okay, And
Speaker 3: I talked with an offensive coordinator and I said, what
Speaker 3: did you learn from the last game? I said, you
Speaker 3: talked to anyone from the other team? He said, yeah,
Speaker 3: I talked with the team that they just played. And
Speaker 3: I said, okay, tell me one thing I really need
Speaker 3: to know about Buffalo's defense that I don't know, and
Speaker 3: obviously had a relationship with him, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 3: And the person said to him, the backup safeties are
Speaker 3: better than you think now. At the time, the backup
Speaker 3: safeties were Jakwan Johnson and Tamar Hamlin. We know what's
Speaker 3: happened now. Unfortunately for Damarrow, Jaquan Johnson is no longer
Speaker 3: in Buffalo. They've got a restock as well. You lose Baits,
Speaker 3: you lose Von Bell, You're in a restock position. I
Speaker 3: don't care who who else is sitting there right now.
Speaker 3: You've got to bring some more people in because those
Speaker 3: two are pretty darn good.
Speaker 2: They lost cj Uzama a couple of years ago. Hayden
Speaker 2: Hurst basically gave them the same production. Now they've lost
Speaker 2: hayden Hurst and they've signed IRV Smith Junior, Ken IRV
Speaker 2: Smith Junior give them similar production from what they got
Speaker 2: out of C. J Uzama and hayden Hurst.
Speaker 3: When you take his scouting report out Dan coming out
Speaker 3: of college, that's exactly what you would see. That's what
Speaker 3: you were going to get from IRV Smith. Explosive, productive,
Speaker 3: good hands, route runner, shred you down the middle, create
Speaker 3: big plays. That's what you were That's what the scouting
Speaker 3: report said on him. He's had a lot of dings
Speaker 3: in Minnesota. Let's see if he can stay healthy and
Speaker 3: hit that scouting report. Because it's not like he's ancient
Speaker 3: like me. He's still a young kid. He can run
Speaker 3: around and do things. That's what we're going to want
Speaker 3: to see because that's what this scattering report was coming out.
Speaker 3: Can he hit that and match up with it, because
Speaker 3: if so, it lessens your burden on the tight end
Speaker 3: position in the draft.
Speaker 2: If you're ancient I must be fossilized or paleozoic or something.
Speaker 3: I do not at all, look only as young as yag.
Speaker 3: Did you help me, on the other hand, assistence just
Speaker 3: getting up in the morning?
Speaker 2: All right, final question for Charles Davis, and I appreciate
Speaker 2: your time as always. The Chiefs are the reigning NFL champs.
Speaker 2: The Bills have won the AFC East for three years
Speaker 2: in a row. Looks like the Jets are going to
Speaker 2: add Aaron Rodgers. The Browns will have to Shaun Watson
Speaker 2: all year. Jacksonville is ascending. Sean Paton is now the
Speaker 2: head coach in Denver. I look at this AFC and
Speaker 2: I think the Bengals are great. They're gonna be even
Speaker 2: better than they've been. And yet I don't know how
Speaker 2: you get through this gauntlet. What do you think of
Speaker 2: the AFC right now?
Speaker 3: It is a gauntlet, isn't it? And every year we
Speaker 3: talk about teams. Okay, if you want to make the playoffs,
Speaker 3: what's your easiest path to the playoffs? Win your division?
Speaker 3: So you know, anyone who follows the NFL knows every
Speaker 3: coach is gonna tell you, every scouting department is going
Speaker 3: to tell you. We build our team to win our
Speaker 3: division first, because if we do that, then we know
Speaker 3: we're in the playoffs. We'll deal with the rest of
Speaker 3: it later. But to me, there are certain few teams
Speaker 3: every year that have earned the right to not just
Speaker 3: build to win their division, but build to win in
Speaker 3: the playoffs. Cincinnati is one of those teams. Okay, nothing's
Speaker 3: a given, nothing's guaranteed, but they have built this roster
Speaker 3: and this team and how they play, and they understand
Speaker 3: being the hunted now and they carry through on that
Speaker 3: quite well. I don't worry about Cincinnati unless something just
Speaker 3: catastrophic happens, right So, to me, Cincinnati, Kansas City, Buffalo, Okay, great,
Speaker 3: it's not just adding for your division. Think about who
Speaker 3: you might have to play in the playoffs. Remember the
Speaker 3: old days when okay, I got to deal with New
Speaker 3: England in the playoffs, do I have to anyone who
Speaker 3: can run with Gronk? You had to have that extra
Speaker 3: So if you're dealing with Cincinnati in the playoffs, and
Speaker 3: you're Kansas City, and you're Buffalo and whoever else we
Speaker 3: want to put in there, Okay, how am I dealing
Speaker 3: with Jamar Chase? How am I dealing with those Routie Higgins.
Speaker 3: How am I dealing with those receivers and Joe Burrow operating?
Speaker 3: That's your first thought. You flip it over to Buffalo
Speaker 3: Josh Allen not just throwing it, but when Josh Allen
Speaker 3: breaks out and runs it, is he gonna shred me?
Speaker 3: Do I have those people who can spy him and
Speaker 3: go get him? Right? In Kansas City, we always talked
Speaker 3: about them being a track meet, but last year, Dan,
Speaker 3: it wasn't just a track meet. They were running a
Speaker 3: lot more, a lot of the shorter sprints. They played
Speaker 3: small ball, and Patrick Mahomes was the MVP of the league.
Speaker 3: It wasn't just flicking it and turn it into sixty
Speaker 3: seventy yard plays. There were a lot of ten fifteen
Speaker 3: to twenty yard plays, more than you would ef back
Speaker 3: from Kansas City. They adjusted and became champions again. So now,
Speaker 3: how do you adjust to Patrick Mahomes and his ability
Speaker 3: to adjust to you. I used to talk about it
Speaker 3: with Drew Brees. I used to call Drew Brees AI
Speaker 3: artificial intelligence. Everything you threw at him, he took the input,
Speaker 3: took the input to the input, and by the end
Speaker 3: of the game, everything you threw at him. He was
Speaker 3: running back against you and beating you. That's what Mahomes
Speaker 3: does for you. So what's your counter, what's your change up?
Speaker 3: What do you have for him? Because we all talk
Speaker 3: about taking away Kelsey, I don't know that we really have.
Speaker 3: And people have tried everything you possibly can. Are there
Speaker 3: other ways to get to them? That's what those teams
Speaker 3: are plotting in the offseason without talking about it.
Speaker 2: The draft is right around the corner. You are going
Speaker 2: to be a very busy man. I really appreciate your time,
Speaker 2: great stuff as always, Thank you so much, my friend.
Speaker 3: Thank you Dan. Always great to talk with you. You take
Speaker 3: care of yourself. Hope to see you soon.
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Speaker 2: Last year, right around this time, we gave you an
Speaker 2: idea of what it's like to be inside the Bengals
Speaker 2: war room during the draft with Greg Seaman, who was
Speaker 2: a Bengals scout for more than a decade. This year
Speaker 2: I decided to try something a little bit different with Greg.
Speaker 2: I picked out one player from each of the fourteen
Speaker 2: drafts he was involved with and asked him to share
Speaker 2: some memories about those draft picks. Greg. He joined the
Speaker 2: Bengals organization in two thousand and three. Marvin had just
Speaker 2: been hired as the head coach. The team was coming
Speaker 2: off a two and fourteen season the year before, so
Speaker 2: the Bengals had the number one overall pick. It was
Speaker 2: widely assumed that the choice was going to be Heisman
Speaker 2: Trophy winning quarterback Carson Palmer. That's the way, obviously that
Speaker 2: it turned out. But was there much debate in that situation.
Speaker 1: I came in at the same time Marvin did. I
Speaker 1: had been in Dallas coaching the tight ends, and so
Speaker 1: I got there a little late in the process. When
Speaker 1: I arrived, there was no doubt that Carson was the
Speaker 1: cream of the crop in that draft, and also Marvin
Speaker 1: was adamant about how we should begin his career, that
Speaker 1: he did not want to rush him into the breach
Speaker 1: and damage his progress. In some way and we stood
Speaker 1: by that. And Carson is a you know, the ultimate
Speaker 1: oh what might have been? You know, his second year,
Speaker 1: we win. His first year as a starter, we win
Speaker 1: eight games. The next year we win eleven games. We
Speaker 1: had beaten Pittsburgh and I will forever believe that that
Speaker 1: team could have won the Super Bowl. Carson gets hurt
Speaker 1: the steel in the game as a wild card and
Speaker 1: go on to win the Super Bowl, and I believe
Speaker 1: we were better than them. And the hit by Keemo
Speaker 1: van Ohoffen led to a rule change about the low
Speaker 1: hit on the quarterback because of Carson's injury. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: Carson was just a terrific, terrific player.
Speaker 2: Mike Brown played quarterback. He loves watching quarterbacks, studying quarterbacks.
Speaker 2: He said to me that he believes Carson Palmer had
Speaker 2: the best arm of any quarterback in Bengal's history.
Speaker 1: That's a big statement and Mike has said that. And
Speaker 1: you have to take into account that a guy like
Speaker 1: Bill Walsh said that Greg Cook was the most talented
Speaker 1: passer he ever worked with, and think about that. That
Speaker 1: includes Dan Fouts, Joe Montana, and Steve Young. Mike has
Speaker 1: likened Carson's ability to throw the ball to the great
Speaker 1: Auto Grams, who was a wonderful passer in a different era.
Speaker 1: So yeah, Carson had the size he had touched. He
Speaker 1: was an intelligent guy. He grew up in the West
Speaker 1: Coast offense. His offensive coordinator at USC was Hugh Jackson,
Speaker 1: and they were running much the same kind of system
Speaker 1: he would eventually run in the NFL.
Speaker 2: There were thirteen quarterbacks taken in that two thousand and
Speaker 2: three draft. None of the other ones drafted other than
Speaker 2: Carson Palmer ever made a Pro Bowl. But one undrafted
Speaker 2: quarterback went to four Tony Romo.
Speaker 1: I'll be durned. Eastern Illinois. Yeah, the pride of the
Speaker 1: Eastern Illinois Panthers. And Sean Payton is the one that
Speaker 1: brought him to Dallas. And Sean was an Eastern Illinois quarterback.
Speaker 2: So we moved to the two thousand and four draft.
Speaker 2: This was a great quarterback draft, Eli Manning, Philip Rivers,
Speaker 2: Big Ben. The Bengals were set at that position. They
Speaker 2: were not looking for a quarterback. They had eleven picks.
Speaker 2: Their most successful wasn't first rounder Chris Perry, the running
Speaker 2: back out of Michigan. It was fourth rounder Robert Gathers.
Speaker 2: From Georgia. The Bengals had the seventeenth pick that year.
Speaker 2: You traded back twice, seventeen to twenty four, then twenty
Speaker 2: four to twenty six. You got a couple of extra
Speaker 2: fourth rounders out of that, and Robert Gathers is one
Speaker 2: of them.
Speaker 1: If you're one of the thirty two teams in the
Speaker 1: NFL and you draft for enough years, there's a pretty
Speaker 1: good chance you're going to draft it. Gathers. His dad
Speaker 1: was drafted, though injured. His uncle Jumpy was a great player.
Speaker 1: His brothers, his cousins, everyone in the family, it seems,
Speaker 1: at some point becomes an NFL player. Robert. That was
Speaker 1: a great deal to get Robert and game picks. Robert
Speaker 1: was a good player, a good person and a good
Speaker 1: professional and played for a long time. That was a
Speaker 1: very solid pick, a good guy, good in the locker room,
Speaker 1: productive on the field. And I think we joke about
Speaker 1: how many Gathers there are, but I think part of
Speaker 1: who he was was the fact that he was rounded
Speaker 1: by professionals and he knew how to be a professional
Speaker 1: and just a good person, good player.
Speaker 2: Is there anybody on the Bengals totem pole, whether it's
Speaker 2: Mike or Duke Tobin or Mike's late brother Pete, who
Speaker 2: is especially of a proponent of trading back.
Speaker 1: You might not think this, but Mike isn't really a
Speaker 1: risk taker, and so Mike is for kind of staying
Speaker 1: where you are and letting the draft come to you,
Speaker 1: unless you're looking ahead and saying, you know, the guys
Speaker 1: that we want are not going to be there, and
Speaker 1: so we're going it's going to be necessary to move.
Speaker 1: I think probably Marvin and Duke brought more of the
Speaker 1: thinking of it's okay to move around here in a
Speaker 1: little bit. We'll be thoughtful about it and will be
Speaker 1: informed in our decision making, but sometimes we can force
Speaker 1: the issue a bit. And that was an example of
Speaker 1: a really good deal.
Speaker 2: We're chatting the former Bengals scout Greg Seaman. We moved
Speaker 2: to two thousand and five. This is one of the
Speaker 2: great what IFFs in Bengals history. You have the seventeenth
Speaker 2: over pick. He took David Pollock, the All American boy,
Speaker 2: won all of the major defensive awards in college football
Speaker 2: when he was at Georgia, and then in the second
Speaker 2: game of his second year, he broke a vertebrae in
Speaker 2: his neck and never played again.
Speaker 1: Yeah, just tragic. And David was appealing to us at
Speaker 1: two different positions. He had proven at Georgia that he
Speaker 1: could play with his hand on the ground and rush
Speaker 1: the quarterback and chase the ball in the run game.
Speaker 1: But he also had the athletic ability and the intelligence
Speaker 1: to also be able to stand up play some outside
Speaker 1: linebacker and wouldn't have been involved in coverage a lot,
Speaker 1: but brought some flexibility that we were really at that
Speaker 1: point looking for defensively. And I admire David because as
Speaker 1: a young player whose dream it is to play in
Speaker 1: the NFL, oftentimes they don't make the best decision for themselves,
Speaker 1: and he listened to what the doctors told him, and
Speaker 1: he's a great example of why if a young man
Speaker 1: gets an education and prepares himself for life after football,
Speaker 1: you can move to that seamlessly. And he's become a
Speaker 1: star on the Saturday college football broadcast. So good for David,
Speaker 1: But yeah, a real what if had he not been injured,
Speaker 1: he would have had a very good career with the Bengals.
Speaker 2: So unfortunately the first pick in two thousand and five
Speaker 2: didn't have a long Bengals career. But Cincinnati did eventually
Speaker 2: wind up with two of the first six picks from
Speaker 2: that draft, Cedric Benson and Adam pac Van Jones. We
Speaker 2: moved to two thousand and six. This is really one
Speaker 2: of the most productive drafts in teen history. Jonathan Joseph
Speaker 2: round one had a great career. Frosty Rucker round three
Speaker 2: had a solid career. Domatab Peco round four had a
Speaker 2: great career. Let's focus on the second round pick, number
Speaker 2: fifty five. Overall, he's likely going to the Hall of
Speaker 2: Fame someday. Andrew Whitworth. I remember there were teams that said,
Speaker 2: this guy's a guard, not tackle. The Bengals obviously felt differently.
Speaker 1: Yes, Witt, the story has been told many times. It
Speaker 1: just briefly besides being a stellar player. When we interviewed
Speaker 1: him at the combine, he sounded like a ten year
Speaker 1: veteran when we talked about technique and footwork and how
Speaker 1: you play the game of football, to the point that
Speaker 1: Marvin turned to Paul Alexander, o line coach and said,
Speaker 1: if we draft this guy, I won't need you, the
Speaker 1: line coach. WIT's remarkable. Witt has always been underestimated as
Speaker 1: an athlete. You know, he was a three time state
Speaker 1: champion in high school, he was a state champion at
Speaker 1: national champion at LSU, and now he won a Super
Speaker 1: Bowl ring at the end of his career. Not many
Speaker 1: can say that, but think about Wit at six seven
Speaker 1: and in high school, I'm guessing two hundred and ninety
Speaker 1: pounds coming to the net as an outstanding high school
Speaker 1: tennis player. And if you've seen him around Cincinnati in
Speaker 1: his years, he is a low handicapped golfer with a
Speaker 1: deft touch. So here's a six foot seven three and
Speaker 1: thirty five pound NFL tackle with those kinds of athletic
Speaker 1: skills and a good brain, a good heart, and a
Speaker 1: good soul to go with all of that. One of
Speaker 1: the all time great Bengals, one of the all time
Speaker 1: great NFL left tackles, and I think certainly a Hall
Speaker 1: of Famer.
Speaker 2: All kidding, aside from your scouting days, when you learned
Speaker 2: that a player was a great tennis player or golfer
Speaker 2: or something like that, was that a factor?
Speaker 1: Absolutely? You know a lot of times when you're looking
Speaker 1: at offensive and defensive linemen, you'd love to know that
Speaker 1: they were also an outstanding heavyweight wrestler. Because of work
Speaker 1: ethic and balance. But when you've got a man of
Speaker 1: his size that has that kind of fine motor skills
Speaker 1: and you could see him run and change direction and
Speaker 1: move in a way that a much smaller man did.
Speaker 1: In the Bengals facility, we had a gymnasium and between
Speaker 1: meetings oftentimes the players would go down and they would
Speaker 1: have three point shooting contests and Carson Palmer generally would
Speaker 1: be one that would win that. But right there with
Speaker 1: him was Andrew Whitworth, who had the silky left handed shot.
Speaker 1: So yeah, a multi sport athlete who has had success
Speaker 1: in various endeavors is very appealing.
Speaker 2: Andrew Whitworth one of two players from the two thousand
Speaker 2: and six draft to last sixteen NFL seasons, the other
Speaker 2: punter Sam Cook and the Baltimore Ravens we moved to
Speaker 2: two thousand and seven. This is interesting because you had
Speaker 2: taken a cornerback in the first round the year before
Speaker 2: Jonathan Joseph. You did again Leon Hall number eighteen. Overall,
Speaker 2: was there any hesitation in going cornerback in the first
Speaker 2: round in back to back years?
Speaker 1: I think that there was discussion, and sometimes you try
Speaker 1: to find a reason not to take somebody. In Leon's case,
Speaker 1: he just was so solid. He was smart, his technique
Speaker 1: was good, his footwork was good. He would tackle, which
Speaker 1: a lot of corners would not do. He was mature.
Speaker 1: And we were building a defense that was going to
Speaker 1: have good pass rushers on the outside, solid players on
Speaker 1: the inside, a pretty good linebacking corps, and someone to
Speaker 1: book in with Jonathan Joseph, who you thought the two
Speaker 1: of them might be long term starting corners in what
Speaker 1: was becoming Mike Zimmer's defense. And so he really just
Speaker 1: fit the bill. And you know, not that Leon was
Speaker 1: ever a superstar. He was a really good player who
Speaker 1: ended up playing I think ten or twelve years as
Speaker 1: a corner in the NFL, and that's rare. So a
Speaker 1: very very good player and a good pick at that
Speaker 1: point in the draft.
Speaker 2: Your memory is good, a twelve year NFL career. The
Speaker 2: first nine in Cincinnati were chatting with Greg Seaman, the
Speaker 2: former Bengals scout. We moved to two thousand and eight.
Speaker 2: I want to focus on team's second round pick that year.
Speaker 2: The Bengals don't typically take small school players in the
Speaker 2: early rounds of the draft. That year, you did wide
Speaker 2: receiver Jerome Simpson out of Coastal Carolina. Unfortunately, Deshaun Jackson
Speaker 2: went three picks later and wound up having the better
Speaker 2: NFL career. But tell us a little bit about selecting
Speaker 2: Jerome Simpson.
Speaker 1: At that point. Well, Jerome was able to leap tall
Speaker 1: defenders in a single bound and land on his feet
Speaker 1: in the end zone, the iconic play I still see
Speaker 1: from time to time. Jerome was a state champion basketball
Speaker 1: player and the leading scorer on the team. Jerome was
Speaker 1: a state finalist in North Carolina in the sprints. He
Speaker 1: could also believe he was either a triple jumper or
Speaker 1: a long jumper. So he was an under recruited kid,
Speaker 1: A raw athletic kind of guy ends up at Coastal Carolina,
Speaker 1: does not set the world on fire starting out, but
Speaker 1: a good kid and remarkably, I mean, he did have
Speaker 1: springs for legs. There were things he could do that
Speaker 1: you couldn't coach him to do. And we were developing,
Speaker 1: you know, we had Chad and TJ. And we're kind
Speaker 1: of in that transition to AJ and Marvin and Mow
Speaker 1: and Slim, and he fit in that category of these
Speaker 1: kind of long athletic guys that could go out and
Speaker 1: get the ball. So he was a little raw, probably
Speaker 1: not real mature in the game yet, but had the
Speaker 1: athletic ability to make that a worthwhile endeavor.
Speaker 2: Am I correct in saying in the early rounds the
Speaker 2: Bengals would prefer major conference guy over small conference guy.
Speaker 1: I think everyone would. I think you in the early rounds,
Speaker 1: your investment is more and you want to have the
Speaker 1: highest level of confidence that you can have. This guy
Speaker 1: can transition to the NFL smoothly and successfully, and sometimes,
Speaker 1: you know, when you can't see them against top competition
Speaker 1: in college, it becomes a little riskier.
Speaker 2: We moved to two thousand and nine. This is a
Speaker 2: very strong draft. Andre Smith had a long career. Ray
Speaker 2: maul Luga had a solid career. Michael Johnson had a
Speaker 2: good career. I'm going to focus in on your fifth
Speaker 2: round pick that year. Don't draft a kicker, don't take
Speaker 2: a punter. Well, the Bengals took one. Kevin Huber wound
Speaker 2: up playing fourteen seasons in a Bengals uniform. Was there
Speaker 2: any reluctance to take a punter in round five?
Speaker 1: No? You know you've got three things in Cincinnati. You
Speaker 1: have Skyline, Chile, you have Greater's ice Cream, and you
Speaker 1: got Kevin Huber, you know, the Cincinnati High School McNicholas
Speaker 1: and then at you See. And I think that our
Speaker 1: familiarity with him from uce that was a school that
Speaker 1: I had coached at, and I also did the scouting
Speaker 1: for you See, and so I was around there a lot,
Speaker 1: and I felt very confident in recommending him. Darren Simmons,
Speaker 1: who's one of the best special teams coaches in the NFL,
Speaker 1: was able to be around him a lot also because
Speaker 1: he was right there in town. And what struck you
Speaker 1: about Kevin was his ability to perform situationally. If you
Speaker 1: were in plus territory late in a game and you
Speaker 1: really didn't need your punter to kick the ball out
Speaker 1: the back of the end zone, Kevin would leave the
Speaker 1: ball inside the ten. And if it were late in
Speaker 1: the game and you were backed up and you needed
Speaker 1: a big kick, Kevin could kick the ball fifty five
Speaker 1: yards and change the field position. And he responded to
Speaker 1: those things. So he was mature beyond his years. Darren
Speaker 1: would be able to talk to his technique more than me,
Speaker 1: but he was certainly sound. You didn't see a lot
Speaker 1: of mishits out of Kevin and a hard worker and
Speaker 1: just a really good guy. And I'm so happy that
Speaker 1: he was able to stay with the Bes throughout his career.
Speaker 1: It's just been a terrific story.
Speaker 2: He became the greatest punter in franchise history, and that
Speaker 2: was a good punter draft. There were three selected that year.
Speaker 2: All three became Pro Bowlers, Thomas Moristead and Pat McAfee.
Speaker 2: For the other two, Pat mcavie obviously making a bundle
Speaker 2: now as a broadcaster. He moved to twenty ten. The
Speaker 2: Bengals drafted three Pro Bowlers in twenty ten, Jermaine Gresham,
Speaker 2: Carlos Dunlap, and a fourth round pick who went to
Speaker 2: eight Pro Bowls. That is a record for a Bengals
Speaker 2: defensive player, the great Geno Atkins. Why were one hundred
Speaker 2: and nineteen players selected before Geno Atkins in twenty.
Speaker 1: Ten because they did not have Bill Tobin fighting for
Speaker 1: Geno Atkins as his advocate. I remember those meetings, and
Speaker 1: you know, Gino was short by defensive tackle standards, and
Speaker 1: Bill was just adamant that this guy is a rock,
Speaker 1: that he's going to be able to not only hold
Speaker 1: up against the double teams, but he's going to be
Speaker 1: able to rush the passer. Marvin got on board with that,
Speaker 1: obviously everybody did. We went for the pick, and then,
Speaker 1: you know, I said, recently, your great players for where
Speaker 1: you would take them, but you also have to have
Speaker 1: a sense of where the league values them. And I
Speaker 1: think that we had a good feel that people weren't
Speaker 1: clamoring to take Gino early in that draft, and we
Speaker 1: were patient and got one of the all time great
Speaker 1: Bengal defensive linemen in the fourth round of just a steal.
Speaker 1: That was a wonderful pick. And Gino came in and
Speaker 1: he was hard as a rock and strong and played hard,
Speaker 1: and you couldn't get him to talk his position. Coach said,
Speaker 1: I'm with the guy every day. Never says anything I've
Speaker 1: asked him a question. He's just a quiet, hardworking, humble,
Speaker 1: sincere guy who was a joy to be around.
Speaker 2: Bill Tobin is Duke's dad. Bill famously built the great
Speaker 2: Chicago Bears team that won the Super Bowl in the
Speaker 2: mid eighties. Tell us a little bit about what was
Speaker 2: like to be in a draft room with Bill Tobin.
Speaker 1: Bill had literally spent his life. He played running back
Speaker 1: at Missouri and then played in the original AFL for
Speaker 1: a bit and then a little bit of coaching, and
Speaker 1: then pretty early in his life just devoted it to
Speaker 1: the personnel side. How do you put together a good roster,
Speaker 1: how do you put together a good team? Those are
Speaker 1: sometimes different things. And so he was, along with Pete
Speaker 1: and Mike, you had three guys that had grown up
Speaker 1: in the NFL and they could really be valuable as
Speaker 1: mentors and resources. So he was a great guy to
Speaker 1: be around, and I'm sure he's still around.
Speaker 2: We moved to twenty eleven. Dan Horr joined the organization
Speaker 2: in May of that year, but the Bengals made a
Speaker 2: lot more significant additions than that. Aj Green was the
Speaker 2: fourth overall pick in the draft, and in the second round,
Speaker 2: number thirty five overall, Cincinnati selected Andy Dalton. My recollection
Speaker 2: is that Jay Gruden, who had been hired as the
Speaker 2: offensive coordinator that offseason, really pushed for Andy Dalton.
Speaker 1: Was that the case that is exactly right. We were
Speaker 1: at that point where it was pretty clear that Carson
Speaker 1: wasn't going to return and we had a good football team,
Speaker 1: a team that was becoming a very good football team,
Speaker 1: and so this was key and Jay loved several things
Speaker 1: about Andy not the least of which was he had
Speaker 1: started close to fifty games already. If you talk to
Speaker 1: the TCU guys, they will say that Andy and his teammates,
Speaker 1: his classmates changed TCU football when they went there. You know,
Speaker 1: it was a midland program. They got better and better
Speaker 1: and better. And in Andy's last game, the TCU plays
Speaker 1: in the Rose Bowl and beats number four Wisconsin on
Speaker 1: national TV. And after that they built onto the stadium
Speaker 1: at TCU. They have the money to redo their facilities.
Speaker 1: So Andy had been a part of, an integral part
Speaker 1: of something really important, with a lot of pressure placed
Speaker 1: on him, and he had handled that so beyond his
Speaker 1: physical abilities, I think Jay and all of us came
Speaker 1: to really appreciate the fact that Andy was mature, that
Speaker 1: he was stable, that he was wise, and he was dependable,
Speaker 1: and he went out and played really, really well for
Speaker 1: a long time.
Speaker 2: These decisions aren't always unanimous. There's debate in the room.
Speaker 2: I remember one Bengals front office person I'm not going
Speaker 2: to say him by name, that thought that Andy was
Speaker 2: too much like John Kitna, didn't have the big arm,
Speaker 2: didn't have some of the physical traits that ideally you
Speaker 2: would love to have. That's the way it is, right.
Speaker 1: There are always differing opinions, always differing opinions, and there's
Speaker 1: a temptation and sometimes it's a good thing to to
Speaker 1: compare a collegiate player to an NFL player. He might
Speaker 1: be this person. The problem with that approach is that
Speaker 1: as soon as you name the NFL player, all the
Speaker 1: connotations that come with that guy, whether they be negative
Speaker 1: or positive, are immediately attached to this kid who has
Speaker 1: never yet played in the NFL. So I'm very reluctant
Speaker 1: when we do that kind of thing, and we do
Speaker 1: it does happen as a way of placing a value
Speaker 1: on a prospect. But Andy was his own man, and
Speaker 1: not only was he a really good player for the
Speaker 1: Cincinnati Bengals, he was a great person in the city
Speaker 1: of Cincinnati and in the community. He and his wife.
Speaker 2: We're chatting with Greg Sieman, the former Bengals scout. In
Speaker 2: twenty twelve, the Bengals drafted two wide receivers and they
Speaker 2: both worked out well. Marvin Jones is a great fifth
Speaker 2: round pick. Mohammed sinu As your third round pick, went
Speaker 2: on to spend ten years in the NFL.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was a guy that I scouted, I had
Speaker 1: the East Coast at that time. Moe always struck me
Speaker 1: as just a really good all around athlete. I went
Speaker 1: to their practice, I saw him in games. He could obviously,
Speaker 1: he can throw a ball shockingly well. His first he
Speaker 1: threw a seventy three yard touchdown pass against the Washington
Speaker 1: Redskins at that time to AJ Green. So Moe had
Speaker 1: a touchdown pass thrown before he ever caught a pass
Speaker 1: in the NFL, which is unusual, and ended up with
Speaker 1: I think an almost perfect passer rating over the course
Speaker 1: of his career. But Moe could go out and kick
Speaker 1: a field goal for you if you needed to. He
Speaker 1: could punk the ball if you needed him to. He
Speaker 1: was big, and physically he wasn't the fastest guy, but
Speaker 1: he was an incredibly hard worker. His senior year at Rutgers,
Speaker 1: he was having a good career at Rutgers, and then
Speaker 1: his senior year he caught one hundred and fifteen passes
Speaker 1: for I think a little over twelve hundred yards, and
Speaker 1: they just in every situation where they needed something, they
Speaker 1: threw the ball to Mo. And so when he came
Speaker 1: to the Bengals, we were blessed that we had a
Speaker 1: good group of receivers. And you know, there are different
Speaker 1: kinds of slot receivers. There are small, quick guys, and
Speaker 1: then there are guys that are physical and big, and
Speaker 1: Moe could do that. And Moe could play the Z
Speaker 1: position and come in and crack on a linebacker and
Speaker 1: make a catch on third down. He was with US
Speaker 1: I think for four years and then had a great
Speaker 1: run with the Atlanta Falcons, played in a Super Bowl.
Speaker 1: And his family's from Sierra Leone. Mo grew up mostly
Speaker 1: in New Jersey, but he's been involved in charity work
Speaker 1: everywhere that he's been and just a very mature young man.
Speaker 1: I've always been a fan of Mohammed Sanu.
Speaker 2: And people may recall he got pranked in the second
Speaker 2: round that year. Somebody called up said the Bengals were
Speaker 2: about to select him. It wasn't the case. It was difficult,
Speaker 2: frustrating and somewhat embarrassing situation for him, and then it
Speaker 2: all worked out in the end because in the next
Speaker 2: round he got that call from Cincinnati.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we felt so terrible, and then our turn comes
Speaker 1: and we're going to take him. So Marvin's gonna call him,
Speaker 1: and Marvin's worried. Is he gonna think this is the
Speaker 1: prank again, or you know what's going to happen here?
Speaker 1: When I call this guy, you know is he going
Speaker 1: to respond? And so he had to kind of convince
Speaker 1: Mo that yes, it really is the Bengals this time,
Speaker 1: and we are thrilled to be able to pick you
Speaker 1: in the draft.
Speaker 2: The twenty thirteen draft was an interesting one because the
Speaker 2: player that she selected in the first round was not
Speaker 2: on any of the mock drafts that I recall that year.
Speaker 2: It seemed like safety matt Elam was the guy that
Speaker 2: everybody thought was coming to Cincinnati was the first round
Speaker 2: picked by Baltimore. Later in that draft, several defensive linemen
Speaker 2: were mocked to Cincinnati. You wound up taking tight end
Speaker 2: Tyler Eifert, even though you had selected Jermaine Gresham in
Speaker 2: the first round just a few years before.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we thought that Tyler was just such a unique athlete.
Speaker 1: He's six foot five or six. He was a great
Speaker 1: high school basketball player. Ironically, my first job coaching in
Speaker 1: college football was in the early eighties at Purdue University.
Speaker 1: His father, Greg was a role player on some good
Speaker 1: teams for Gene Katie at Purdue. At his mother was
Speaker 1: also a Big ten athlete, and I want to say
Speaker 1: either basketball or volleyball, but I'm not certain. Maybe track.
Speaker 1: But he's a Fort Wayne kid, Bishop Dwinger High School,
Speaker 1: just a tremendous athlete. He's one of those guys we
Speaker 1: mentioned Andrew Whitworth earlier. Witt was a low handicapped golfer.
Speaker 1: When Iffort came on to the team, Witt generally had
Speaker 1: some of the offensive rookies come and stay at his
Speaker 1: house and introduce them. So he takes him over to
Speaker 1: Hyde Park Country Club to play golf, and Eifort really
Speaker 1: didn't play that much golf. And he goes out and
Speaker 1: shoots scratch, shoots seventy two on whim and he said,
Speaker 1: you know, it really makes me mad because this kid
Speaker 1: just can do anything. He is another one and this
Speaker 1: is just part of the game. Tyler Eifert could have
Speaker 1: been an all time great tight end and got hurt
Speaker 1: early and often in his career, kept coming back from them.
Speaker 1: What Tyler could do was play anywhere on the field.
Speaker 1: You could have him attached to the tackle, but he
Speaker 1: could be a single receiver to the short side of
Speaker 1: the field and see if you get a matchup. He
Speaker 1: could play in the slot because he was a route runner.
Speaker 1: Two could you know he could Ronie could jump, he
Speaker 1: could catch, and a good guy. Just the injuries prevented him.
Speaker 1: He had a good career, but the injuries prevented him
Speaker 1: from maybe being one of the really great tight.
Speaker 2: Ends, including an injury in the Pro Bowl, which is
Speaker 2: really frustrating. I'm to twenty fourteen. You chose cornerback dark
Speaker 2: Wees Dinard in the first round. That was a big
Speaker 2: cornerback draft. I think three corners were taken before dark Wees.
Speaker 2: Some good ones were still on the board. Bradley Roby
Speaker 2: went seven picks later. The very next pick after dark
Speaker 2: Wes Denard was Jason Barrett, another cornerback. Was that a
Speaker 2: year where you were really focused on this cornerback group.
Speaker 1: Well, I thought we thought it was a deep group
Speaker 1: and that there were players to be had there. And
Speaker 1: when you're looking early in the draft, quarterback, corner, pass rusher,
Speaker 1: left tackles, those guys are appealing to you because all
Speaker 1: of those spots, guys can play for a pretty long
Speaker 1: time and have a real impact on the game. We
Speaker 1: had had success with Leon and Jonathan Joseph and Leon Hall.
Speaker 1: I think that. I think our view of Darquez was
Speaker 1: that he was going to be very similar to Leon,
Speaker 1: a complete player that could play inside, play outside, would tackle,
Speaker 1: was smart, and that would come on and then surpass
Speaker 1: those guys. We had a good team and we were
Speaker 1: able to kind of draft not for depth, but for
Speaker 1: the next guy, because contracts being what they are, you
Speaker 1: kind of think ahead. You're trying to prepare for, well,
Speaker 1: if this guy graduates, as we would say, who's the
Speaker 1: next one in line? And Darkquz did well, had some
Speaker 1: injuries and it never all came together for him in
Speaker 1: the way that it did for Leon, But he was
Speaker 1: very much the same kind of player coming out of college.
Speaker 2: As we have run through the drafts that you were
Speaker 2: involved with with the Bengals, we've had a lot of
Speaker 2: success stories. Twenty fifteen was simply a draft that didn't
Speaker 2: work out. Every team has them. Your first round pick,
Speaker 2: number twenty one overall was Cedric Obwayhe the Bengals weren't
Speaker 2: really drafting for need, at least immediate need. You're trying
Speaker 2: to get offensive linemen in the pipeline. Jake Fisher was
Speaker 2: the second round pick where there red flags with Cedric
Speaker 2: tell Us a little bit about that selection.
Speaker 1: Well, Cedric had injured his knee in their bowl game,
Speaker 1: so we knew that he wasn't going to be available
Speaker 1: potentially available to start the season. His film prior to
Speaker 1: that was exceptional. He was a big athletic guy with length,
Speaker 1: He was intelligent, remember that. Paul Alexander, after spending time
Speaker 1: with him and studying his film, felt very confident that
Speaker 1: he could be eventually the guy that would place, would
Speaker 1: replace Witt if Witt moved on. And it's a bit
Speaker 1: of a mystery. We weren't the only team certainly that
Speaker 1: viewed him as an outstanding prospect, and he's been now
Speaker 1: with numerous teams and it just has never come together
Speaker 1: for him. And I don't know why, but certainly he
Speaker 1: never got established. He was I think a starter for
Speaker 1: one year and then lost that position and it turns
Speaker 1: out that he was a miss.
Speaker 2: So onto twenty sixteen, you left to become the tight
Speaker 2: end coach with the Cleveland Browns under Hugh Jackson. But
Speaker 2: before taking that job, you had worked all year preparing
Speaker 2: the Bengals for the twenty sixteen draft, and you had
Speaker 2: a lot to do with their second round selection that year.
Speaker 2: Guy that's still doing a great job for the Bengals.
Speaker 2: Wide receiver Tyler Boyd.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I don't even know Tyler because I was gone
Speaker 1: before he came. But I knew him because I saw
Speaker 1: him in practice a lot at Pitt and in games.
Speaker 1: And when I watched Tyler, it was so reminiscent of
Speaker 1: Mosunew a number of years before at Rutgers. Pitt at
Speaker 1: that time had James Connor, and they were not immenseally
Speaker 1: talented at quarterback or at some other positions. So in
Speaker 1: a lot of games, they would run James Connor on
Speaker 1: first down, they would run James Connor on second down,
Speaker 1: and then they would throw the ball to Tyler Boyd
Speaker 1: to get the first down and then start it all again.
Speaker 1: And Tyler has toughness, he had agility, He was obviously
Speaker 1: an intelligent player like MO. I think that if you
Speaker 1: wanted to stick him at tailback for a couple of plays,
Speaker 1: he would run the ball aggressively and physically. So I
Speaker 1: just saw guy make lots again like he reminded me
Speaker 1: of Mo, because on third down or in key situations,
Speaker 1: you knew they were going to throw the ball to him,
Speaker 1: and you knew that if he got his hands on it,
Speaker 1: he was going to catch it. So I had written
Speaker 1: a really strong recommendation about Tyler prior to taking the
Speaker 1: job in Cleveland, left that with them, and when I
Speaker 1: got to Cleveland. Quite honestly, I pushed for Tyler Boyd
Speaker 1: as far as I could, but at that point I
Speaker 1: wasn't on the personnel side, so my voice didn't count
Speaker 1: for much. And I was pleased that the Bengals drafted
Speaker 1: Tyler and he's been a terrific player for them and
Speaker 1: continues to be. I think he's right in the midst
Speaker 1: of what's going to be a very, very good and
Speaker 1: productive career.
Speaker 2: This has been a real treat. I could go down
Speaker 2: memory lane about the draft with you for hours, but
Speaker 2: we'll keep it to about half an hour. I really
Speaker 2: appreciate your time. Thank you so much, Greg, Thank you Dan.
Speaker 1: This is always fun and Go Bengals.
Speaker 2: The Bengals Booth podcast is brought to you by Alta Fiber,
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Speaker 2: heard from former Bengal Scout Greg Seaman, who is currently
Speaker 2: doing some work for Pro Football Focus, and that's the
Speaker 2: perfect segue for what's next, our seventh edition of a
Speaker 2: three round mock draft with an NFL expert. Here's the concept.
Speaker 2: When I attended the NFL Combine this year, I had
Speaker 2: the Pro Football Focus mock Draft simulator set up on
Speaker 2: my laptop and I invited several NFL experts to make
Speaker 2: the Bengals picks in the first three rounds while discussing
Speaker 2: their options. If you've never tried a draft simulator before,
Speaker 2: what are you waiting for? It allows you to play
Speaker 2: Bengals GM for as many rounds of the draft as
Speaker 2: you want. The simulator begins making picks in order, and
Speaker 2: then when it's your turn, you can make trades or
Speaker 2: go ahead and pick. It's a great way to get
Speaker 2: to know the players who might be available when the
Speaker 2: Bengals around the clock in a couple of weeks. So far,
Speaker 2: our experts have chosen the following players in the first round.
Speaker 2: Three have selected Utah tight end Dalton Kincaid, two have
Speaker 2: picked Maryland cornerback Deontay Banks, and one chose Oregon State
Speaker 2: tight end Luke Musgrave. In the second round, two experts
Speaker 2: picked Northwestern defensive linemen at A Tommy wa at a bare.
Speaker 2: The other picks were Washington State linebacker Dayon Henley, Syracuse
Speaker 2: offensive tackle Matthew Bergeron, Illinois safety Sydney Brown, and Kansas
Speaker 2: State cornerback Julius Brentz. In the third round, there have
Speaker 2: been six different picks Iowa tight end Sam Laporta, BYU
Speaker 2: offensive tackle Blake Freeland, Maryland cornerback Jacory and Bennett, UAB
Speaker 2: running back Dwayne McBride, Texas A and M running back
Speaker 2: Devon a Chain, and Missouri edge rusher Isaiah McGuire. After
Speaker 2: you make your picks on the simulator, PFF gives you
Speaker 2: a grade, and the highest mark so far have been
Speaker 2: an A for Sam Monson from Pro Football Focus and
Speaker 2: a pair of A minuses for Dame Brugler of The
Speaker 2: Athletic and Austin Gaale from The Ringer. Now time for
Speaker 2: contestant number seven. Time for our latest three round Bengals
Speaker 2: mock draft on the PFF simulator with a PFF employee.
Speaker 2: Great to be joined by Anthony Tresh, who's been on
Speaker 2: this podcast before. We're going to do three rounds. No
Speaker 2: trades allowed. Are you ready.
Speaker 4: I'm very ready.
Speaker 5: I have one player in mind for this first round
Speaker 5: pick that I'm hoping is available in the PFF mock
Speaker 5: Draft simulator by the time pick twenty eight rolls around.
Speaker 4: But we'll see what happens.
Speaker 2: Do you want to share who in advance?
Speaker 4: Now, we'll see, We'll okay.
Speaker 2: We'll find out, all right. I have just hit enter
Speaker 2: draft and the names are about to start flying off
Speaker 2: the board. Bryce Young going number one overall, the quarterback
Speaker 2: out of Alabama to the Carolina Panthers. We're seeing corners
Speaker 2: and tackles and wide receivers flying off the board. We're
Speaker 2: up to pick number twenty five. Elijah Chanty was just
Speaker 2: selected twenty seventh by the Buffalo Bills, the speedy defensive
Speaker 2: lineman out of pit And now the Cincinnati Bengals are
Speaker 2: on the clock.
Speaker 5: All right, so the person I wanted to take with
Speaker 5: this Bengals pick is available.
Speaker 4: I think this player is extremely underrated.
Speaker 5: I would probably consider him in the top half of
Speaker 5: the first round, but our lead draft analyst, Mike Rinner
Speaker 5: has him as the second best player's position. You know,
Speaker 5: I respect that, but I'm gonna go with Michael Mayer.
Speaker 4: Tied in at a Notre Dame.
Speaker 5: I think getting him at the back half of the
Speaker 5: first round at picked twenty eight, again, I think that
Speaker 5: incredible value. It's very hard to find any flaws within
Speaker 5: his game. I mean, he really can do it all,
Speaker 5: especially from a blocking perspective. That's what I think separates
Speaker 5: him from Dalton Kincaid, the Utah product who is tied
Speaker 5: in one on the PFF draft board. And you know,
Speaker 5: I could see why they're interchangeable, but I'm gonna lean Mayor.
Speaker 5: I think the blocking ability is some of the best
Speaker 5: you're going to see at the position. I think he
Speaker 5: developed that this past year. He wanted to make it
Speaker 5: an emphasis, you know, developing that all throughout the year,
Speaker 5: and you see him with some of those double teams too,
Speaker 5: and then that do of blocking scheme of Notre Dame.
Speaker 4: It was, it was delightful.
Speaker 5: I loved it again as a receiver, just a technician,
Speaker 5: I mean, he gets everything down to a point.
Speaker 4: I mean it's just it's just perfect work.
Speaker 5: So Michael Mayor, I think that would be an awesome
Speaker 5: addition to an already dangerous passing attack.
Speaker 2: Has Mayor ranked as the second best tight end in
Speaker 2: this draft, behind Utah's Dalton Kincaid. Dane Brugler from The
Speaker 2: Athletic has them ranked the other way around. Mayor went
Speaker 2: to Covington Catholic High School in northern Kentucky and then
Speaker 2: spent three years at Notre Dame. He's six four, two
Speaker 2: hundred and forty nine pounds, and while he didn't show
Speaker 2: blazing speed at the combine by running a four seven forty,
Speaker 2: teams had a hard time covering him at Notre Dame,
Speaker 2: as he was the team's leading receiver in each of
Speaker 2: the last two years, topping eight hundred yards each season.
Speaker 2: If he's still on the board when the Bengals are
Speaker 2: on the clock, you can bet there will be serious
Speaker 2: consideration given to selecting Michael Mayer. Now, let's see who
Speaker 2: PFF's Anthony Tresh selected in round two. Onto the second
Speaker 2: round with Anthony Tresh from Pro Football Focus, Julius Brentz,
Speaker 2: the cornerback from Kansas State, was selected at number fifty six.
Speaker 2: That was your colleague Sam Monson's second round pick. When
Speaker 2: he did the simulator, Matthew Berger on Tackle from Syracuse
Speaker 2: wanted pick fifty seven. That's the name we've seen mock
Speaker 2: to Cincinnati in the second round dayon Henley lineback from
Speaker 2: one Washington State was the player selected immediately before the
Speaker 2: Bengals at number fifty nine. So now you are on
Speaker 2: the clock, would pick number sixty.
Speaker 4: Yeah, this is tough.
Speaker 5: I think I think Cincinnati is kind of in a
Speaker 5: luxury territory. I'm probably leaning defensive back here. I have
Speaker 5: won name in mind. If he's on the board, I
Speaker 5: would take him there he is, I'm gonna go Antonio Johnson,
Speaker 5: safety from Texas A and M. You know, from the
Speaker 5: day one he was on the field for Texas A
Speaker 5: and M slot corner completely impressed me. I thought he
Speaker 5: was one of the best defensive backs in America as underclassman.
Speaker 5: Kind of moved to more of a traditional safety role
Speaker 5: this past year. Didn't think he skipped a beat, didn't
Speaker 5: really have some of those highlight reel plays that you
Speaker 5: saw previously. But you know, I think he can be,
Speaker 5: you know, a movable chess piece in any secondary I
Speaker 5: think the instincts pop off the tape.
Speaker 4: Again.
Speaker 5: Just a very smart player from early on in his career.
Speaker 5: And I think that's the biggest thing with some of
Speaker 5: these guys. You know, if they're not you know, he's
Speaker 5: got the experience, but you really want to see just
Speaker 5: the football IQ developed.
Speaker 4: At this point in their career.
Speaker 5: I know a lot of people say, you know, potential,
Speaker 5: you know, just scratching the surface. You know, he can,
Speaker 5: you know, be great with good coaching. But Antonio Johnson,
Speaker 5: he knows how to play football at a high level already.
Speaker 5: So that's why I'd be very very comfortable with this
Speaker 5: pick in the second round.
Speaker 2: So in the second round, Anthony Trash from Pro Football
Speaker 2: Focus selects Texas A and M defensive back Antonio Johnson.
Speaker 2: Antonio Johnson is the number two safety in the draft
Speaker 2: according to Dane Brugler, behind Alabama's Brian Branch and PFF
Speaker 2: has him graded number sixty four overall. He's six to
Speaker 2: two hundred pounds and ran a four five forty at
Speaker 2: the combine. We know that lou Anromo values versatility, and
Speaker 2: Johnson lined up deep, played in the box, and also
Speaker 2: lined up in the slot in his two years as
Speaker 2: a starter at A and M. Now let's get to
Speaker 2: Anthony's third and final pick, and now we move on
Speaker 2: to round three. The Bengals have pick number ninety two.
Speaker 2: Names are flying off the board in the high eighties.
Speaker 2: The Buffalo Bills have just selected a defensive player out
Speaker 2: of LSU, Jacqueline Roy, and now the Bengals are on
Speaker 2: the clock for their third round pick.
Speaker 5: Oh man, I almost took this guy with the the
Speaker 5: second round pick, and he's available in the third round.
Speaker 5: I might go defensive back again. I think it's an
Speaker 5: important position. Yeah, I think I'm going to I think
Speaker 5: I'm gonna go with Trevius Hodges Thomlins in the cornerback
Speaker 5: out of TCU. I will say the physicality is undersize.
Speaker 5: He does try to overcompensate at times. I'll just over needlessly,
Speaker 5: just grabby along the route, and you know, that's just
Speaker 5: kind of the way he does play. But I think
Speaker 5: just the year athleticism that he does have, you know,
Speaker 5: I think he could make an impact, you know, even
Speaker 5: if it's in the slot at the NFL level. Again,
Speaker 5: you hunt guys that know how to play at a
Speaker 5: high level. You know, I see that, you know the
Speaker 5: football I q pop off, especially at defensive back.
Speaker 4: You know, from day one. I think he can kind
Speaker 4: of handle that.
Speaker 5: So I think with Cincinnati, maybe you don't need to
Speaker 5: put him out there on the field. They have a
Speaker 5: lot of good defensive backs for already, and know, I
Speaker 5: like what we've seen from Cam Taylor Britt and Dexton Hill,
Speaker 5: and then I just added Antonio Johnson. But you know,
Speaker 5: I think he just got to keep adding, you adding
Speaker 5: at the most important positions because this is the Bengals team.
Speaker 4: That's one of the best rosters in the NFL.
Speaker 5: So that's what I would do here with Trevis Hodges Thomlinson,
Speaker 5: the cornerback from TCU. Now I think he wants to
Speaker 5: go by Trey Tomlinson, a nephew of Danny and Tomlinson,
Speaker 5: former Chargers running back, so you.
Speaker 4: Know he's got NFL bloodlines.
Speaker 5: I think he could make an impact down the road
Speaker 5: for this team.
Speaker 2: Trey Hodges Tomlinson is undersized. He's five to seven and
Speaker 2: one hundred and eighty pounds, but he's fast, running a
Speaker 2: four four forty at the combine and productive. He won
Speaker 2: the Jim Thorpe Award last year as the best defensive
Speaker 2: back in college football, as opponents had a completion percentage
Speaker 2: of just thirty four point six when they target Hidjus Tomlinson.
Speaker 2: Now time to find out how PFF graded Anthony's picks.
Speaker 2: A tight end and two defensive backs selected in the
Speaker 2: first three rounds by Anthony Trash a Pro Football Focus.
Speaker 2: And now we find out how PFF has graded your draft.
Speaker 4: What do we got here? A minus? All right, I'll
Speaker 4: take it. What did Sam have?
Speaker 2: Sam had an A? Sam has the only A so far.
Speaker 2: You are the third person to get an A minus.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's probably because he's on the consumer division. I'm
Speaker 5: on the B to B products, so he's sitting there
Speaker 5: fixing the grades. I would be ecstatic if we came
Speaker 5: if the Bengals came away with this whole. But really,
Speaker 5: that first round pick, I'd be really rooting for Michael
Speaker 5: Maher if I were a Bengals fan, I think he's
Speaker 5: gonna be that good of a player. And from the
Speaker 5: Cincinnati Bengals, I think that's probably what they're rooting for.
Speaker 5: And given what we know about mister Mayor, I'm sure
Speaker 5: he's probably rooting for that as well.
Speaker 2: Every grade came out well, A minus B plus A
Speaker 2: for the for all as you did, well, Anthony, appreciate
Speaker 2: your time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, thank you for having me.
Speaker 2: That's going to do it for this episode of the
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Speaker 2: the Bengals Booth podcast