1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:06,479 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern. 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,320 Speaker 2: On Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg 4 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 2: Business app, or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 5 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 3: It is a newsy Friday. This is not really easing 6 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 3: out of the workweek. We've also got to discuss the 7 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:26,360 Speaker 3: ramifications of the fast moving and very destructive wildfires in 8 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:29,600 Speaker 3: Hawaii that the latest count here on the Bloomberg terminal. 9 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,520 Speaker 3: According to officials in Hawaii, they have confirmed at least 10 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 3: fifty five deaths, and the police chief locally has said 11 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 3: it's likely there are another one thousand people unaccounted for. Still, 12 00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:45,880 Speaker 3: of course, big news yesterday the request for forty billion 13 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:49,960 Speaker 3: dollars in aid from the President to Congress, including twelve 14 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:53,479 Speaker 3: billion dollars for FEMA, that was needed even before the 15 00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 3: Hawaiian wildfires and all of that destruction. We are joined 16 00:00:56,880 --> 00:01:00,360 Speaker 3: now by Brock Long. He is currently executive chairman of 17 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,959 Speaker 3: Haggarty Consulting, and of course he's the former administrator of 18 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 3: FEMA under the Trump administration. Thank you so much for 19 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:12,480 Speaker 3: joining us. I have to sort of delineate what happens 20 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 3: when and from what agency Brock, what is the initial 21 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:22,119 Speaker 3: response at this stage of a disaster, uh, so early 22 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 3: on from FEMA in particular, what does FEMA do on 23 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 3: the ground at a time like this. 24 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 4: Well, as I've always said, disaster response and the type 25 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 4: of situation as a partnership between not only the local 26 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:37,200 Speaker 4: and state level of government and in conjunction with FEMA. 27 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 4: But you know, an event like this, a devastating wildfire 28 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:43,679 Speaker 4: on a tropical island thousands of miles from the mainland, 29 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 4: is also going to take neighbor helping neighbor in this situation, 30 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 4: you know, initially FEMA. You know, when I was in 31 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 4: office back in twenty eighteen, I actually did a lot 32 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:58,080 Speaker 4: of work to increase logistical capabilities of the federal government's 33 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 4: logistical capabilities to respond to the devastating disasters in Hawaii, 34 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 4: particularly around how you do life sustaining missions, uh for 35 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:12,079 Speaker 4: big events. Unfortunately, with the Lahaina fires and the fires 36 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:14,400 Speaker 4: that are still going on, these are what we call 37 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 4: load to no notice disasters, which you know, it takes 38 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 4: time for the federal government to be able to mobilize. 39 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 4: But hopefully you know, we've already seen FEMA with the 40 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:29,080 Speaker 4: great ability to be able to get incident management teams 41 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 4: on you know, on Maui. Uh, they're continuing to send 42 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 4: I know Dan Criswell, administrator. Dan Chriswell, who I spoke 43 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 4: had contact with this morning, is headed to the island today. 44 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 4: It's my understanding she will be on on site today. 45 00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:47,000 Speaker 4: So again it's a lot of working parts, particularly because 46 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 4: of the distance from the mainland. But then also when 47 00:02:50,360 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 4: a wildfire pushes through a community like Lehina and burns 48 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,959 Speaker 4: everything up, a lot of the infrastructure is just totally gone. 49 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 4: So you know, the wildfires are incredibly devastating and it 50 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 4: doesn't leave you much to work with. So this is 51 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:07,800 Speaker 4: going to be a very long disaster recovery process, painful 52 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:09,880 Speaker 4: one for the citizens of Hawaii. 53 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 3: And can you tell us a little more as you 54 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 3: mentioned the challenges of responding to a disaster very far 55 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:21,960 Speaker 3: from the contiguous states. What resources are they short on? 56 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:25,919 Speaker 3: If any, how does that all work. It's one thing 57 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 3: to respond to severe wildfires maybe in the southwestern States, 58 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 3: but Hawaii, what are the particular challenges there? 59 00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 4: Well, the challenge nationwide, whether it's Hawaii or Puerto Rico 60 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:40,080 Speaker 4: or the United States mainland. You know, the goal should 61 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 4: be of any community to build a baseline capability that's 62 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 4: pretty strong, right, And when the local capability to respond 63 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 4: to disasters is strong and the state ability to respond 64 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 4: to disasters is strong, then the federal government should be 65 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 4: able to support the gaps. But in this situation, everything 66 00:03:57,040 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 4: in the municipality of Lahaina has wiped out. You know, 67 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 4: obviously they need all the help that they can get 68 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 4: from the state federal government. And Hawaii's done a good 69 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 4: job again of being able to pack supplies and teams 70 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 4: to be able to come over from other islands very quickly. 71 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 4: And in this case, other municipalities within Maui's will be 72 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 4: sending mutual aid, you know, most likely to Lahina to 73 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:27,320 Speaker 4: or accepting citizens that have been displaced into their communities 74 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 4: to help with sheltering and temporary housing, those types of things. 75 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:34,400 Speaker 4: And you know what it looks like for FEMA in 76 00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 4: the community is it's very tough to set the expectations 77 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 4: at this point. Because a wildfire wipes out all the infrastructure, 78 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 4: there is nothing left. There is nothing really to go 79 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:46,360 Speaker 4: back to. And if you look at the infrastructure on 80 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 4: Lahina that's been impacted, the ports are gone, the commons, 81 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 4: the communications are down, the power is off, the water 82 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 4: systems are not working, and you know you're still in 83 00:04:57,400 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 4: search mode, search and rescue mode. You're trying to do 84 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 4: life sustainment missions. But the long term recovery of this, 85 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:07,239 Speaker 4: you know, there's going to be a lot of debris 86 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:09,560 Speaker 4: that they have to remove, a lot of hazards, materials 87 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 4: that they have to remove. They've got to figure out 88 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:15,720 Speaker 4: how to put back basic infrastructure before life can begin 89 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 4: again in that area. 90 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 3: And very brit in maybe thirty seconds. What there was 91 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 3: a request for another twelve billion dollars for FEMA, and 92 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 3: I know the Disaster Relief Fund is set to run 93 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:30,480 Speaker 3: out of money before September thirtieth. What does this do 94 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 3: what we're seeing in Hawaii to the negotiation on further 95 00:05:34,200 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 3: funding for FEMA. 96 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,560 Speaker 4: Well, I don't think right now. You know, the emergency 97 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 4: funding that FEMA has it should not impact the disaster 98 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:44,080 Speaker 4: response at all, and I think Congress will wake up 99 00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:47,720 Speaker 4: and do the right thing to you know, always keep 100 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 4: the Disaster Relief Fund fully funded. You know, we do 101 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,360 Speaker 4: have to have an honest discussion in the future about 102 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,359 Speaker 4: disastro mitigation and attacking things on the forefront. 103 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 3: Rather than the back End brock Long, former FEMA administrator 104 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 3: at Haggarty Consulting. Thanks so much for your insights, a 105 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:05,160 Speaker 3: lot of news to discuss. 106 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 5: You're listening to. 107 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: The Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch the program live weekdays 108 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, 109 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:15,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot Com, and. 110 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:16,919 Speaker 5: The Bloomberg Business App. 111 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 112 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 113 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 3: We've got so much news to talk about today the 114 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:33,039 Speaker 3: former president's legal challenges. Former President Donald Trump his attorneys 115 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,919 Speaker 3: were in court and were joined now by Zoe Tillman 116 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:41,440 Speaker 3: at Bloomberg Legal to discuss this order from a federal 117 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 3: judge in Washington who said she will place some limits 118 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 3: on what the former president can discuss regarding his case 119 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:51,679 Speaker 3: and the accusations that he tried to obstruct the twenty 120 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 3: twenty election. Zoe, thank you so much for joining us. 121 00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:58,359 Speaker 3: I understand the former president is not supposed to discuss 122 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:02,160 Speaker 3: sensitive detail on this case. Can you walk us through 123 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:03,960 Speaker 3: what counts as sensitive? 124 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 5: That's right. 125 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:08,479 Speaker 6: You know, typically in a criminal case, the government will 126 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:11,600 Speaker 6: ask for what's known as a protective order, and this 127 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 6: is a pretty standard part of cases. It just means, 128 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 6: you know, the parties and the lawyers can't take a 129 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 6: lot of the evidence ahead of trial and share it 130 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 6: with the public, you know, make sure that witnesses aren't 131 00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 6: placed in jeopardy, and sort of the integrity of the 132 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 6: trial is maintained. And the fight here had been over, 133 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 6: you know, how much of the evidence in this case 134 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 6: would be covered by those kinds of restrictions. And Trump 135 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:38,560 Speaker 6: and his lawyers had already agreed, for instance, that information 136 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 6: about you know, secret grand jury proceedings, you know, things 137 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 6: that were obviously sensitive quote unquote, that was not an issue, 138 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 6: but they did want to have the government, you know, 139 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 6: clearly state what it believed was sensitive in for instance, 140 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 6: witness interviews, and then everything else could potentially be discussed 141 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 6: on air, on the campaign trail wherever by the former 142 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 6: president and his attorneys. So you know, it wasn't any 143 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 6: specific category of evidence that's specified in court, but it's 144 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 6: more sort of broad strokes whether or not, you know, 145 00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 6: all of it is considered off limits, or whether you know, 146 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 6: he has some leeway to talk about what he's getting 147 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 6: from the government. 148 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 7: Well, and of course Zoe Trump on True Social for example, 149 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 7: had said that a protective order would violate his right 150 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 7: to free speech, which is the same indication we've gotten 151 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:34,280 Speaker 7: from his defense attorneys that they're going to argue in 152 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:36,280 Speaker 7: this actual case when it goes to trial, is that 153 00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 7: the president, the former president, had a right to say 154 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:41,000 Speaker 7: the things he was saying, et cetera. It's noteworthy to 155 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 7: me that Judge Chudkin in this hearing said that while 156 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:46,040 Speaker 7: the former president does have a First Amendment right to 157 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 7: free speech, that right is quote not absolute, and I 158 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 7: just wonder if that also has implications ultimately for his 159 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 7: wider defense. 160 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:58,559 Speaker 6: You know, it's not unexpected that a judge would say, 161 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 6: in the context of a criminal case case, you know, 162 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 6: whatever else is happening out in the world, my job 163 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,320 Speaker 6: is to protect the integrity of these proceedings. And that's 164 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:09,680 Speaker 6: really what we heard from her today is she said, 165 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 6: whatever the implications are in the political realm for you, 166 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 6: for anyone else, you know, she has to make sure 167 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:19,240 Speaker 6: that witnesses are secure, she has to make sure that 168 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:23,040 Speaker 6: a jury can be seated in the case. And so, 169 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 6: you know, she said that she was mindful of the 170 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 6: First Amendment implications and did have to take those into consideration. 171 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 6: That was sort of pushing back on the government a bit, 172 00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 6: but ultimately, you know, her job is not to worry 173 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 6: about you know, what it means for Trump's campaign is 174 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 6: what she said. 175 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:46,480 Speaker 3: To them, Zoe, I'm curious, can they hold the former 176 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,000 Speaker 3: president to this or what happens if he decides he 177 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 3: doesn't want to cooperate and he just starts posting everything 178 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 3: on truth social. 179 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:57,280 Speaker 6: Sure, so separate from this protective order. As a condition 180 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:01,680 Speaker 6: of being allowed to remain free ahead of trial, he 181 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 6: already had to agree that he wouldn't do anything that 182 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:09,479 Speaker 6: would jeopardize witness security or you know, the the integrity 183 00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:11,240 Speaker 6: of the case. And that the judge noted that was 184 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:14,680 Speaker 6: even broader than any restrictions that she would place on 185 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 6: what evidence he could or could not talk about. You know, 186 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 6: what we've seen in other high profile cases is judges 187 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 6: starting out with you know, warnings, sort of informal admonitions 188 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 6: to parties to say, listen, you know, I'm not going 189 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 6: to tell you can't say X, Y and Z right now, 190 00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:35,440 Speaker 6: but if it's crossing a line, I may have to 191 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 6: call you back. And that's what she's done here. So 192 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,559 Speaker 6: in the future if she feels that he is well 193 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:43,960 Speaker 6: for us to be violates the protective order, that is 194 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:47,199 Speaker 6: a clear problem in the government. Can you ask for 195 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:52,760 Speaker 6: additional restrictions. But if the judge, you know, sees things 196 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:55,679 Speaker 6: happening out in public, and if the government brings them 197 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:57,960 Speaker 6: to her attention, she can bring him back in and 198 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 6: potentially say I'm considering a more restrictive limit on what 199 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:04,199 Speaker 6: we can talk about, and then they would argue over that. 200 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:06,600 Speaker 7: And of course, Zoe, this is just as it pertains 201 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 7: to this particular case, this particular indictment of which there's 202 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,959 Speaker 7: already been three for the former president, and now next 203 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 7: week we're expecting there could be a fourth in Fulton County, Georgia, 204 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 7: in District Attorney Fannie Willis also potentially could bring charges 205 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:23,240 Speaker 7: in relation to overturning the twenty twenty election result in 206 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:26,280 Speaker 7: that state. What should we be looking for, what should 207 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 7: we be expecting next week? 208 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 6: You know, we are are you know, waiting to see 209 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 6: how many people will be charged in Georgia, whether it 210 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,320 Speaker 6: will just be the former president, if it will be 211 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 6: you know, local and state officials and actors who signed off, 212 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:48,400 Speaker 6: for instance, on the false certification saying that Trump had 213 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 6: won the state, Whether it'll involve any of his allies 214 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,440 Speaker 6: in efforts to overturn the twenty twenty election, people like 215 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 6: Rudy Giuliani, you know. And then we're looking to see how, 216 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:02,800 Speaker 6: if there is an indictment, how it's crafted. Is it 217 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 6: going to be a sprawling racketeering case. Is it going 218 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 6: to be a more limited set of charges under state law. 219 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:12,800 Speaker 6: There are really a lot of open questions right now 220 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 6: about what that could look like. 221 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 5: Zoe. 222 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 3: While we've got you are our legal reporter here on 223 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,440 Speaker 3: the phone with us, I have to ask you your 224 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 3: takeaway on the importance of the announcement that David Weiss 225 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:29,640 Speaker 3: will be a special counsel investigating Hunter Biden. What do 226 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:33,280 Speaker 3: you see as the practical difference and the impact of 227 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 3: that designation as a special counsel? 228 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:39,920 Speaker 6: Sure? So, practically, what it means is that David Weiss 229 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 6: is no longer subject to the normal chain of command 230 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 6: that would have him answering to political appointees at the 231 00:12:46,280 --> 00:12:49,520 Speaker 6: Justice Department. This is a step that's normally done in 232 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:54,840 Speaker 6: situations where the Attorney General has to be concerned about, 233 00:12:55,360 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 6: you know, perceptions, perception or reality of political influence in 234 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 6: an investigation that just has political implications. So we had 235 00:13:03,640 --> 00:13:07,120 Speaker 6: a special counsel for Trump after Trump announced he was 236 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 6: running against Biden for the White House in twenty twenty four, 237 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 6: a special council to investigate President Biden, you know, Mark 238 00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 6: Garland's boss. The reason for that is, you know, it's 239 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:25,199 Speaker 6: I think clear. And now we've had Republicans really probing 240 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:29,959 Speaker 6: the Hunter Biden case and demanding there be more steps 241 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:34,479 Speaker 6: to insulate whatever happens to Hunter Biden from his father's administration. 242 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 6: And you know, this appointment seems to be responding to that, 243 00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 6: or at least taking it into account and trying to 244 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:46,959 Speaker 6: head off accusations of bias or influence in whatever ends 245 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 6: up happening with Hunter Biden in or out of court. 246 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 3: Well, that'll be really important to follow. And thank you 247 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 3: so much Zoe Tillman, Bloomberg Legal reporter, for joining us 248 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 3: on the variety of legal cases we've got to follow 249 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 3: regarding president and sons and former presidents. 250 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,959 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch us 251 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern. 252 00:14:07,720 --> 00:14:10,920 Speaker 2: On Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg 253 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 2: Business app. 254 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: Or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 255 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:22,479 Speaker 3: Well, you've heard the response so far from congressional Republicans 256 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 3: to this announcement by Attorney General Merrick Garland that he's 257 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 3: naming David Weiss as special counsel to investigate Hunter Biden, 258 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 3: and it's not a friendly response from Republicans on Capitol Hill. 259 00:14:35,880 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 3: I'll read you part of the statement from Speaker Kevin McCarthy, 260 00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 3: who said that this quote cannot be used to obstruct 261 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 3: congressional investigations or whitewash the Biden family corruption. He also 262 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 3: notes that Weiss was the one who negotiated the plea 263 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 3: deal that fell apart last month, asking how can he 264 00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:00,760 Speaker 3: be trusted as a special counsel? So some negative feelings 265 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:04,640 Speaker 3: in response to today's announcement on a special council to 266 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 3: investigate Hunter Biden. I'm Jack Fitzpatrick here from Bloomberg Government, 267 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 3: filling in for Joe Matthew with our politics panel, our 268 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:17,880 Speaker 3: Bloomberg Politics contributors Jeanie she and Zano and Rick Davis. Jeanie, 269 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 3: let's start with you. Should we be surprised at all 270 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 3: that Republicans are all seemingly against this? There's another comment 271 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,680 Speaker 3: from James Comer. The Oversight Share is very negative about this, 272 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:32,400 Speaker 3: and what does that mean? It seems like they're much 273 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,160 Speaker 3: more interested in their own congressional investigations. 274 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 8: They are, and the statement you just read from Kevin McCarthy, 275 00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 8: you know, they are repeating these talking points. You know, 276 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 8: whitewashing is a term they're using. A sweetheart deal is 277 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 8: another one, and so I think that they are going 278 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 8: to continue to make this case. They do feel that 279 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 8: Merrick Garland, by taking this step, something that some people 280 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 8: may think they would welcome, is actually an attempt to 281 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,600 Speaker 8: rob them of their power to investigate, which is not true. 282 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 8: They can still investigate, but also is an attempt to 283 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 8: say this is independent of the White House, We've got 284 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 8: this under control and move on. And of course Republicans 285 00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 8: don't want to do that. So they are going to 286 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:17,520 Speaker 8: keep driving this home and they are not going to 287 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,560 Speaker 8: be happy with Weiss, who they see or they thought 288 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 8: gave the Hunter Biden or was willing to give Hunter 289 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 8: Biden this sweetheart deal after five years of investigation, Rick, what. 290 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 3: Do you make of the emphasis from Speaker McCarthy from 291 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 3: James Commer on the Oversight Committee of prioritizing their own 292 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:41,720 Speaker 3: congressional investigations. I'm wondering in particular, if this is sort 293 00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 3: of an impeachment or bust campaign by Republicans. 294 00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:49,000 Speaker 9: Yeah, obviously Comer wants to sort of have this all 295 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:54,480 Speaker 9: result in an impeachment inquiry, the direct line going to 296 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 9: Biden himself, the president, and this muddy's that water, right, 297 00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:02,040 Speaker 9: This takes it out out of some of his hands. 298 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 9: It will freeze up potentially in his mind. Some witnesses 299 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 9: who you know, will have jeopardy if it if they 300 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:11,760 Speaker 9: don't get some kind of immunity, and of course they 301 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:14,399 Speaker 9: can't do that in Congress. So yeah, I mean, it 302 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 9: definitely muddies the water for a clean cut investigation. But 303 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,439 Speaker 9: I really actually think it has more to do with 304 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 9: just the pr nature this whole thing. I'm not sure that, 305 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:26,399 Speaker 9: you know, the investigators in the House have actually found anything, 306 00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:28,880 Speaker 9: and they've been at it for some time, and there's 307 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:30,879 Speaker 9: a real dispute as to whether or not any of 308 00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 9: this has anything to do with Joe Biden. And so 309 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:37,880 Speaker 9: the question is does this take away from their sort 310 00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:43,399 Speaker 9: of megaphone right, their ability to demagogue this politically is 311 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:45,160 Speaker 9: going to be harmed by this, And I think That's 312 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 9: what we're really seeing a reaction to, is that it's 313 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:50,280 Speaker 9: just going to take some of the attention away from 314 00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 9: this and people will check the box and say, Okay, 315 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,159 Speaker 9: we'll wait and see what Justice Department comes up with. 316 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:57,560 Speaker 3: It's a good point, Rick, and it makes me wonder 317 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 3: about the timing. If you were are entirely looking at 318 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 3: this as a way to cut the legs out from 319 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 3: under President Biden politically, I don't know if you would 320 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:10,920 Speaker 3: make announcements about this in August of twenty twenty three, 321 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 3: maybe you'd want it to be a little later. Now 322 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:15,119 Speaker 3: we don't know when this report will come out. We 323 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,439 Speaker 3: know that there will eventually be a report from the 324 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:21,240 Speaker 3: Special Council. Genie, what are your expectations for the timing 325 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:25,880 Speaker 3: and especially what that timing means for how this does 326 00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:27,280 Speaker 3: or doesn't get politicized. 327 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:30,159 Speaker 8: You know it's going to be politicized either way. I 328 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:32,359 Speaker 8: don't have a good estimate on what the timing of 329 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,360 Speaker 8: something like that will be, but we are in the 330 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,880 Speaker 8: heart of election season, particularly as we get to Labor Day. 331 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:41,000 Speaker 8: I don't suspect we'll see anything before that, and so 332 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 8: it is going to muddy the waters for both the 333 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:47,240 Speaker 8: Biden administration. It's going to be in a what aboutism 334 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:50,120 Speaker 8: that the Trump campaign will be able to use. House 335 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:52,840 Speaker 8: Republicans are going to come back September twelfth. It's going 336 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 8: to be all Hunter Biden all the time. And so 337 00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:59,639 Speaker 8: it is going to be an ongoing issue. If the 338 00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 8: the report somehow clears the president and again there's been 339 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 8: no evidence connecting him heretofore to date, it's still going 340 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:10,919 Speaker 8: to be an attempt by Republicans in the House in 341 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:14,120 Speaker 8: particular to try to connect him to what they see 342 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:18,120 Speaker 8: as a problematic activities by Hunter Biden. And I think 343 00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:20,639 Speaker 8: they are problematic. And Elizabeth Warren was one of the 344 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:23,560 Speaker 8: most recent Senators to make that case, and she is right. 345 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 8: What Hunter Biden has done, what we've seen family members 346 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:29,920 Speaker 8: like Jared Kushner do, it is incredibly problematic. And if 347 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,639 Speaker 8: it is legal, that's something that Congress can address to 348 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 8: try to make sure we have better ethics and government. 349 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:38,880 Speaker 3: Well, I guess we are at the point where everything 350 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:42,719 Speaker 3: is at least a little politicized through the lens of 351 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 3: twenty twenty four. It's not twenty twenty four yet, but 352 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 3: it almost feels like it, and there are candidates in 353 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 3: Iowa at the Iowa State Fair. We've got a clip 354 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 3: from the former Vice president Mike Pence, who's on the 355 00:19:55,440 --> 00:20:00,640 Speaker 3: trail talking about entitlements, about Social Security and Medicare. I'm 356 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:04,080 Speaker 3: curious how smart it is for any strategy for a 357 00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:07,120 Speaker 3: Republican to bring this up. Let's play Mike Pence's comments 358 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:08,439 Speaker 3: on those programs. 359 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:11,639 Speaker 10: Look, social Security and medicare a promise we've made to 360 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:15,040 Speaker 10: the American people, Right, We're gonna keep that promise. You'll 361 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,159 Speaker 10: hear the demagogues again, you know, saying that Republicans are 362 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:20,560 Speaker 10: gonna cut benefits to Grahama. 363 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 5: It's common. 364 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:27,879 Speaker 3: So I haven't heard anybody specifically propose cutting benefits to 365 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 3: your grandmother, although there are some proposals to raise the 366 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 3: age of eligibility. I am very curious after the age 367 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 3: of Donald Trump, moving the party away from looking at 368 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:43,680 Speaker 3: the solvency of those programs. Rick, do you see any 369 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 3: kind of special or smart approach from somebody like Mike 370 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 3: Pence who's trying to I guess, acknowledge those even though 371 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:51,959 Speaker 3: it's a dicey topic. 372 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,320 Speaker 9: Yeah, it is a dicey topic. It's not something that 373 00:20:56,400 --> 00:21:00,480 Speaker 9: other Republicans are anxious to weigh in on. You really 374 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:03,440 Speaker 9: wonder in the pulling data whether or not people are 375 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,920 Speaker 9: worried about this. I just recall in two thousand and eight, 376 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 9: people were frantic about the fact that Social Security was 377 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 9: going under and they were going to, you know, lose 378 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 9: their benefits because of the financial problems associated with it. 379 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:21,119 Speaker 9: In campaigns, including the McCain campaign, we're talking about social 380 00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:25,640 Speaker 9: security reform as a positive. This is clearly something that 381 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 9: Vice President Pence thinks will differentiate him from the field, 382 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 9: including Donald Trump, who has said, you know, very directly 383 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,600 Speaker 9: that you know he's not going to touch social Security. 384 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 9: So I think it's more a political ploy right now. 385 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 9: But the problem is you start then saying what you're 386 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 9: going to do about it, and you start dividing the country. 387 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:46,119 Speaker 5: Right. 388 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 3: Certainly a different approach from Pence compared to Trump on 389 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:52,680 Speaker 3: social Security and Medicare. There'll be an interesting angle for 390 00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 3: the rest of this cycle. 391 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:59,120 Speaker 1: If you're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast, catch 392 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 1: the program law I have week days at one Eastern 393 00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:05,400 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com. 394 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 5: And the Bloomberg Business app. 395 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,560 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 396 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:14,400 Speaker 1: flagship New York station Just Say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 397 00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:19,520 Speaker 3: Plenty of China news and analysis to discuss today. I'm 398 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:23,280 Speaker 3: Jack Fitzpatrick from Bloomberg Government, sitting in for Joe Matthew 399 00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:27,000 Speaker 3: here co hosting with Kaylee Lines and Kaylee I am 400 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,679 Speaker 3: struck by the back and forth what appears to be 401 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:34,880 Speaker 3: a careful approach yesterday towards China with a seemingly sort 402 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:39,639 Speaker 3: of scaled back executive order on investment issues, but also 403 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 3: some kind of glib comments about China's economy referring to 404 00:22:44,359 --> 00:22:47,680 Speaker 3: it as a ticking time bomb by President Biden, sort 405 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 3: of shooting from the hip recently. And we are joined 406 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:55,479 Speaker 3: now by David Weston, host of Wall Street Week, who 407 00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 3: I understand also spoke to Deborah Lair at the Paulson Institute. David, 408 00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 3: how do you make sense of the back and forth 409 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,800 Speaker 3: between hot and cold with regard to the president's stance 410 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 3: on China. 411 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:08,680 Speaker 11: Well, it's great to be with you. You know, as 412 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 11: one I heard once that fauxpa in Washington is when 413 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:15,119 Speaker 11: you speak the truth by accident, and you have to 414 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 11: wonder about comments like this. You have to bear in mind, 415 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:20,320 Speaker 11: of course, he was appearing before fundraisers, right. He was 416 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,159 Speaker 11: trying to raise money out there in Utah, and I 417 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:25,800 Speaker 11: wonder whether it's positioning him for the election. We did 418 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:27,400 Speaker 11: talk to Debora Lair, who spent a lot of time 419 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:29,240 Speaker 11: in China with Hank Paulson. She's the vice chair of 420 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:32,639 Speaker 11: his foundation as well as working at Edelbin Global Advisory, 421 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:35,920 Speaker 11: and I asked her, among other things, about what she 422 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:38,919 Speaker 11: made of these comments and what it said, very specifically 423 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:42,160 Speaker 11: about where the respective parties may well be on China 424 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:44,359 Speaker 11: coming up to the next election. This is what she said. 425 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 12: China has always been a focus in election campaigns, and 426 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:50,880 Speaker 12: it will be again this year in a very heated way. 427 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 12: I'm sure both sides are looking to see how tough 428 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,119 Speaker 12: they can be when it comes to China. What we 429 00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:00,320 Speaker 12: hope is, in the context of looking at being tough 430 00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 12: on China, we remain laser focused on what we need 431 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:06,800 Speaker 12: to be doing to ensure that the United States remains competitive, 432 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,480 Speaker 12: and that we're doing things that don't isolate our companies 433 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,680 Speaker 12: but instead ensure that they remain competitive, because after all, 434 00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 12: our economic security is what underpins our national security. 435 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 11: Yeah, that's Deborah Lairs of the Edelman global advisory and 436 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:23,960 Speaker 11: the thing that actually when I heard about this first 437 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 11: thing this morning, Jack and Kaylee, I thought about and 438 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,880 Speaker 11: you won't remember this, I barely do. When John Kennedy 439 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 11: was running for Presidents Nixon, he came out early to 440 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,400 Speaker 11: make sure he was to the right of Nixon on Russia, 441 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 11: on the Soviet Union. And I wonder whether this was 442 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 11: actually President Biden making sure he was to the right 443 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 11: if I can use that expression of whoever runs for 444 00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:43,960 Speaker 11: the Republicans on China. 445 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm very curious, especially David, because you mentioned earlier 446 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:52,320 Speaker 3: he did make these comments on the Chinese economy at 447 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:57,240 Speaker 3: a fundraiser where you often, I guess, get less scripted comments. 448 00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:00,119 Speaker 3: But I'm curious if we can chalk this up to 449 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 3: sort of a Joe Biden accidental gaff kind of thing, 450 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 3: or is this a natural outgrowth of a political pressure 451 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,680 Speaker 3: that is multiple administrations deep? I mean, do we have 452 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 3: a clear answer on the motivations there in your view? 453 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,359 Speaker 11: Well, certainly I can't get him inside the president's mind 454 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:20,400 Speaker 11: at all, and I don't know that he ever wanted 455 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:22,800 Speaker 11: this to come out in this way, But I think 456 00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:25,199 Speaker 11: at the very least what it does indicate is his 457 00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:27,639 Speaker 11: state of mind in where he wants to communicate to 458 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 11: the people who are giving him money. Where he is 459 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:31,920 Speaker 11: on China, and that is, I'm going to be really 460 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:33,639 Speaker 11: tough on China. That's the wayt least I read it. 461 00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:35,600 Speaker 11: He doesn't want the Republicans to come in and say 462 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 11: you're soft on China. 463 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:41,040 Speaker 7: Well, it's so interesting to me, David that words are words. 464 00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 7: Obviously action is action, and maybe he's being a little 465 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:46,359 Speaker 7: less careful with some of the specific wording than the 466 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 7: administration is being very intentional with the specific action, like 467 00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:53,600 Speaker 7: this executive order, which was quite narrow in scope. High 468 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 7: fence for small yards is what they're calling it. And 469 00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:01,200 Speaker 7: maybe that's a good thing for me. I wonder how 470 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 7: Wall Street should be looking at this very careful strategy 471 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:05,280 Speaker 7: when it comes to China. 472 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,080 Speaker 11: Well, I think that's a great point, Kaylee. I'm sure 473 00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:10,320 Speaker 11: investors want to look at what he's doing much more 474 00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,040 Speaker 11: than what he's saying. At the same time, this was 475 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:18,880 Speaker 11: again going back to John Kennedy. You remember he got 476 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,919 Speaker 11: really to the right of Nixon on Soviet Union, and 477 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:23,439 Speaker 11: then what did he do once he got in office. 478 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 11: He did the Bay of Pigs, And the question is 479 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 11: is it possible for a candidate to some extent to 480 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,680 Speaker 11: pay themselves in a corner on policy, so they have 481 00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:34,119 Speaker 11: to be tough once they get re elected, and it 482 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:36,400 Speaker 11: really affects policy in that respect. I mean, some people 483 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:40,400 Speaker 11: might suggest that happened with Saudi Arabia with candidate Joe Biden. 484 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:42,399 Speaker 11: When he got an office, he had taken such a 485 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,120 Speaker 11: strong position in Saudi Arabia, he almost had no choice. 486 00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:48,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm curious the degree to which the politics drive 487 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:52,199 Speaker 3: the policy and maybe policy mistakes. I spoke earlier with 488 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:56,280 Speaker 3: Tom Orlick, Bloomberg chief economist, who made a case in 489 00:26:56,320 --> 00:27:00,560 Speaker 3: a piece this morning that there seems to be, I guess, 490 00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:04,879 Speaker 3: a false idea that there's this binary choice between China 491 00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,240 Speaker 3: either collapsing or taking over the world, that a lot 492 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 3: of the political rhetoric is almost cartoonishly binary. David, I mean, 493 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:16,480 Speaker 3: is this a case in which the politics have led 494 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,160 Speaker 3: policy makers to oversimplify the issues there? 495 00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:20,960 Speaker 5: Well, we all do. 496 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:22,639 Speaker 11: I'm going to say, I think we in the media 497 00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,040 Speaker 11: sometimes overslimplified too. So I'm not going to point too 498 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:27,920 Speaker 11: many fingers at people. I'm sure that you're right, Jack, 499 00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 11: but I also want to take a half step back. 500 00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 11: China has its own struggles right now, without regard to 501 00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:35,600 Speaker 11: the United States, whatever our position is, whatever our policies is, 502 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 11: they're facing President She is facing a lot of challenges 503 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 11: that we went over with debrel air, and he's got 504 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 11: a long way to go to really get his economy 505 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,280 Speaker 11: going again, and it's not clear exactly how quickly or 506 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:49,040 Speaker 11: effectively he can do that. I think that may be 507 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:52,960 Speaker 11: in some ways the larger issue for investors, because obviously 508 00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:54,800 Speaker 11: a China that isn't growing is not good for the 509 00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 11: global economy. 510 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,720 Speaker 7: Yeah, and so China's economy obviously is a very sensitive 511 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 7: issue for Beijing. Speaking of sensitive issues, some like the 512 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 7: economy of China, President Biden speaks on other sensitive issues 513 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:10,480 Speaker 7: he is more reluctant to do so. One of those, 514 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,040 Speaker 7: David being his son. I know, I feel like every 515 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 7: Friday you come on sound On and we ask you 516 00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:18,520 Speaker 7: to put on your lawyer hat. I'd like to do 517 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,800 Speaker 7: so again. Just given the news of today a special 518 00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 7: counsel being appointed in the investigation into his son Hunter Biden. 519 00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:29,880 Speaker 7: This is actually just the US attorney in Delaware who 520 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:34,360 Speaker 7: already was investigating him now being given this designation as 521 00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:37,040 Speaker 7: an attorney. How consequential is this. Jack was asking one 522 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,280 Speaker 7: of our legal reporters about this earlier, but do you 523 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,360 Speaker 7: think it's going to be enough to be satisfactory for 524 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 7: some of the critics of the Justice Department in this matter? 525 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:45,800 Speaker 11: Well, you should tell you with the legal reporters, say, 526 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:47,920 Speaker 11: because I want to get crosswise of our legal reporters. 527 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 11: But I was watching Merrek Garland, with whom I clerk 528 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 11: you know for a couple of years. I've known him 529 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 11: quite well in the past as he made that announcement, 530 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:58,239 Speaker 11: and I thought two things right away. One is this 531 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 11: is really proof positive what he and to be Frank 532 00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:04,440 Speaker 11: President Biden been saying, which is he is independent of 533 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:06,520 Speaker 11: the White House. This can't be something that the White 534 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 11: House was urging or wanted or wanted to tolerate. But 535 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:12,160 Speaker 11: he was proving he is independent of the White House. 536 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,640 Speaker 11: And now the special Counsel Jack Smith is gonna be 537 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 11: even more independent because he's really out from under to 538 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 11: a large degree Merrick Garland himself, and I am afraid 539 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 11: for the President because it will not be fun for him. 540 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 11: I think this means it's not going away anytime soon. 541 00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:30,560 Speaker 11: The one thing we have experienced with special counsels is 542 00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:32,000 Speaker 11: once you appoint him, they keep. 543 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,239 Speaker 3: Going right, even if it's not a massive expansion of 544 00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 3: the investigation. This is not a scaling back of the investigation. 545 00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 3: David Weston, thank you so much for joining us, host 546 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 3: of Wall Street Week. Great insights on China policy, Merrit 547 00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,680 Speaker 3: Garland being very careful. You know who hasn't been careful 548 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:52,800 Speaker 3: lately is Paul Krugman with his predictions of the Alien 549 00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:56,040 Speaker 3: war and the inflation that apparently will come out. We're 550 00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:58,800 Speaker 3: going to wrap up with some weird stuff on that, 551 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:03,360 Speaker 3: but for now, I'm Jack Fitzpatrick. This is Bloomberg here 552 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:04,280 Speaker 3: with Kaylee Lines. 553 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,960 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch the 554 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,880 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 555 00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com. 556 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 5: And the Bloomberg Business App. 557 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,239 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 558 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:25,200 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 559 00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:28,720 Speaker 3: So the Nobel Prize winner Paul Krugman was on the 560 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:32,400 Speaker 3: latest episode of the odd Locks podcast. Of course, you 561 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,680 Speaker 3: can download that anywhere you get your podcasts, and he 562 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:39,760 Speaker 3: seemed very confident in his prediction of what economically would 563 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 3: happen if there is an alien invasion. We bring you 564 00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 3: the freshest analysis here. Let's play Kruman's comments. 565 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 13: And I'm contested alien invasion. I guess it kind of 566 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 13: depends on how they run the occupation. But the actual 567 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 13: wars are always inflationary. I can't think of one that wasn't. 568 00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 3: Kayley is quite confident that if they, if they arrive, 569 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,120 Speaker 3: we are going to war with the aliens. 570 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,640 Speaker 7: I have so much to say about this. This is 571 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 7: a Nobel laureate, so we should take his words seriously. 572 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:11,800 Speaker 7: But I guess my question is what kind of aliens 573 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 7: are we talking about? Why would we have to go 574 00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 7: to war with them? What if we could be friends? 575 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:19,600 Speaker 3: I have to disagree with him. I think we'd be friends. 576 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 3: We'd establish trade. Whatever brought them all the way here. 577 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 3: They must have a lot of minerals or electricity generations generation, 578 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 3: and I think it would be disinflationary. I think we'd 579 00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:33,360 Speaker 3: have a big supply boost. It could be copper or 580 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:37,400 Speaker 3: lightweight metal. Whatever happens, I want a full debate with 581 00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:40,800 Speaker 3: Paul Krugman about the inflationary or disinflationary effects. 582 00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:42,080 Speaker 7: I would buy a ticket. 583 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,719 Speaker 3: Yes, I'll go on for a full hour on that topic. 584 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:50,840 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Sound On podcast. 585 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 11: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 586 00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:54,120 Speaker 11: and 587 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,720 Speaker 9: Anywhere else you get your podcasts, and you can find 588 00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,840 Speaker 9: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at one pm 589 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:05,520 Speaker 9: Eastern Time at Bloomberg dot com.