1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:16,840 Speaker 1: Brought to you by the all new Toyota Corolla. Welcome 2 00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:20,160 Speaker 1: to Stuff you should know from House Stuff, Work Stops 3 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: dot Com. Hey, welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 4 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant Um so Chuck. Yeah, I 5 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 1: have a story. All right, it's here. It come back 6 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: with me way back machine. Sure, okay, a couple of 7 00:00:54,800 --> 00:01:01,680 Speaker 1: hours ago. So here we are. It's December. Something really 8 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:03,520 Speaker 1: bad is about to happen. And sit down in front 9 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 1: of this TVA, our good friend and hero, Peter Brady, 10 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 1: is trying out for the school play. It's a story 11 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:15,240 Speaker 1: of the American Revolution. He tries out for George Washington, 12 00:01:15,280 --> 00:01:17,959 Speaker 1: but he doesn't get it. And in fact, the name 13 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:20,080 Speaker 1: of this episode that we're sitting here watching on this 14 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: nice brown and orange shag carpeting is called Everybody Can't 15 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:28,160 Speaker 1: Be George Washington. Peter doesn't get the part of George Washington, 16 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 1: but he does get another very important part, the part 17 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: of Benedict Donald. Well, at first he's like, hey, it's 18 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 1: a part, it's a speaking part. I'm pretty happy. I'm 19 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: gonna do my best. That was a tree in my 20 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,479 Speaker 1: last six place, right, This is a huge step up 21 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:48,040 Speaker 1: for him, um, until his classmates point out that Benediccdonald 22 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 1: was a trader, and since Peter's playing a trader, he 23 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: must be some sort of trader too. So basically the 24 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: whole school turns on him because he's playing Benedictdonald. It's 25 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 1: really kind of silly. It is silly. And of course 26 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: Peter tries to get out of the play again and again, um, 27 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 1: affecting laryngitis, pretending as a limp um all of this stuff, 28 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 1: first saying he forgets his lines, Yeah, I think I 29 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,400 Speaker 1: remember that, and finally successful, and then his dad points 30 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,720 Speaker 1: out that he has turned into a trader. Now Peter 31 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:23,440 Speaker 1: against the whole class of the whole cast, don't tell me. 32 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: He had a lesson for him, and he sat him 33 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:27,240 Speaker 1: down and had a talking to. It was a good one. 34 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 1: It was a good one, um. And so Peter goes 35 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: in and plays Bennedictdonald and knocks it out of the 36 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:35,279 Speaker 1: park and learned a lesson in the process. But the 37 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:39,240 Speaker 1: the the whole premise of this episode of Brady Bunch 38 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: is that Peter was suffering from a smear campaign started 39 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: two years before by George Washington, and it was so 40 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 1: successful that even today, you can get a rise out 41 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 1: of somebody by calling on Benedict Donald if they've done 42 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: something traitorous. Yeah, and we've learned there are quite a 43 00:02:56,000 --> 00:03:00,320 Speaker 1: few uh synonyms with trader that were in fact notorious traders, 44 00:03:00,320 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 1: like if you call someone to Judas or McDonald or what. Yeah, 45 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:08,280 Speaker 1: that might be popular in some parts of the world. 46 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: But right, but this is the USA. Sure, so we 47 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:15,799 Speaker 1: called people Benned McDonald's. That's right. Um, well, let's talk 48 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:19,119 Speaker 1: about this. Let's talk about benediccdonald to start. Okay, Well, 49 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: you know, first of all, we should point out that 50 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: this is a curated show from our buddy Sam tea Garden. 51 00:03:26,120 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 1: This is the Summer of Sam. Then, yeah, we're continuing 52 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 1: into our second summer of Sam. And for those of 53 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 1: these don't know, Sam is a local fan of ours 54 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: and uh a good kid and he's he's actually on 55 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 1: our TV show. He was in an episode to make 56 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:43,119 Speaker 1: an episode. Yah is one of our softball teammates. And uh, 57 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:45,120 Speaker 1: Sam's a good guy and he sends in great ideas, 58 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 1: so we like to highlight them when we uh do them. Yeah, 59 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: all right, the summer Sam, Hey Sam, hope you're doing well, buddy. Um, 60 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 1: where we about Benned Iccdonald and why there was such 61 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 1: a smear campaign against him, and turns out rightfully so, 62 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: although possibly I think a lot of Arnold's side of 63 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: the story has been lost to history. Well. Yeah, and 64 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 1: coincidentally or not coincidentally, some of these traders that we're 65 00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:14,560 Speaker 1: going to mention today, history is born out that they 66 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:17,520 Speaker 1: may not have been traders, but been an eternal definitely was. 67 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 1: So he was a documented trader and as traitorous and 68 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 1: treasonous as you can get, as as far as in 69 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 1: the context of war. Yeah. So, early on in life 70 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 1: things started out pretty well. He was born into some 71 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:35,479 Speaker 1: wealth um, but his family um, specifically his father squandered 72 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: their fortune with some bad business dealings. Apparently he was 73 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:41,119 Speaker 1: quite a drinker. He turned into the town drunk. Yeah, well, 74 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 1: that'll do it. They lost their family estate because they 75 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 1: lost their dough. Three of his sisters are sorry siblings 76 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 1: died from yellow fever. He had to drop out of school. 77 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:54,680 Speaker 1: He became an apothecary. Yeah, so things weren't like Rosie 78 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: for the guy, although he did quite well later on 79 00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 1: in the military. Well, he did quite well even before 80 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:02,599 Speaker 1: or that as a merchant and actually by the age 81 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:05,239 Speaker 1: of twenty two, was able to buy back his family's estate, 82 00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: which he then turned around and sold it a profit. 83 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 1: Well good for him. So I guess he wasn't the 84 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 1: sentimental type for this the state. Yeah, I think it 85 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,159 Speaker 1: wasn't that he wanted his his family's a state back. 86 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 1: He just didn't want to lose out on the potential 87 00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 1: profit from it, I guess. Yeah. And he seemed like 88 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:23,840 Speaker 1: he may have been like a d D before there 89 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 1: was a d D. Yeah. Yeah, from the sounds of 90 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:28,680 Speaker 1: reading his thing, I was just like, man, he this 91 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:30,839 Speaker 1: kid had a d D. He was always in trouble. 92 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: He's getting kicked out of school, but it was just 93 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:37,279 Speaker 1: because he was like busy. Yeah, he wasn't like a 94 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 1: bad kid. It seemed like he was just always had 95 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:42,640 Speaker 1: something going on. He finally, I guess, found his niche 96 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 1: and it did become quite a businessman, um and fabulously wealthy. 97 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 1: But he wasn't wealthy enough in his opinion, and in 98 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:53,479 Speaker 1: fact joined the Sons of Liberty, the revolutionary group in 99 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:58,040 Speaker 1: New England. Um because he was mad that his riches 100 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 1: were being taxed by England. Yeah, he liked the dough 101 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:05,280 Speaker 1: he did, and uh, he did have a pretty remarkable 102 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 1: military career, and Jefferson and in Washington were big supporters 103 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:13,200 Speaker 1: of him for a while. Yeah, but he also suffered um. 104 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:15,480 Speaker 1: Apparently there are a lot of petty jealousies that they 105 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 1: don't talk about among the founding fathers in the second 106 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,600 Speaker 1: and third echelons. Of all these guys, um, and apparently 107 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:27,479 Speaker 1: Bennedicdonald frequently suffered um. Yes, he slighted a lot, a lot. Yeah, 108 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: he missed out on honors and stuff like that, and 109 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 1: he doesn't seem like the type to let things go, 110 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 1: nor was he the type to air his his feelings, 111 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 1: so he just kind of sat there and stewed. Right. Yeah, 112 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: I saw most of the times he was slighted, he 113 00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:43,920 Speaker 1: like fought really hard to get either reassigned or reappointed 114 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:46,880 Speaker 1: to the position he was going for. And so you're right, 115 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 1: he couldn't let it go. He needed therapy. But instead 116 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 1: he was appointed to run West Point, not the military academy, 117 00:06:55,279 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 1: the four right. Yeah, this is pretty I guess they 118 00:06:57,640 --> 00:06:59,200 Speaker 1: probably named it for that, didn't they. I think it 119 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:01,760 Speaker 1: turned into the Middle Terry Catty, but I think this 120 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:06,040 Speaker 1: was before it was an academy. Yeah, it was definitely um, 121 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: and so he, you know, went Benedict Donald on everyone, 122 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 1: and little did he know he was being a Benedict Donald. 123 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:16,480 Speaker 1: But he sold secrets to uh, to the British um 124 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: like plans, war secrets, armament locations for about three million bucks. 125 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 1: I think it was ten thousand pounds at the time. Yeah, 126 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: so he um. He. The reason he did this ostensibly 127 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 1: was a because he'd been slided, but also, and this 128 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 1: is what it's been lost to history, is that he 129 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 1: he came to believe that the revolution had lost steam, 130 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 1: that people running the show didn't really know what they 131 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 1: were doing and probably wouldn't form a very good post 132 00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 1: revolutionary government if successful. So did he genuinely think the 133 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 1: Brits were going to do a better job. Supposedly that's 134 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 1: what historians say, but again he didn't really. He may 135 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:57,360 Speaker 1: have been the type to just kind of say that's 136 00:07:57,440 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 1: what he was thinking too, and that's what what what 137 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: somebody wrote down at some point, But he ultimately said this, 138 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 1: the colonies are better back in the hands of England again. 139 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: So not only am I gonna try to sell the 140 00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: map to West Point, I'm gonna join the British Army, 141 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 1: which he did and led at least two raids against 142 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 1: the American Revolutionary forces, so he really switched side. Yeah, 143 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: in in seventeen eighty. I can't believe whoever wrote this 144 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 1: article put that. Uh, when the plot was intercepted, he 145 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:33,839 Speaker 1: went from zero he wrote a zero. I know, I know, 146 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: I was all of a sudden, I was in like 147 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,720 Speaker 1: US magazine ers or like a Springer show. But that's 148 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 1: what happened. Uh. He was convicted of treason and um 149 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 1: his name was a race from the record books. And 150 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 1: England promised him. They're like, hey, if you defect over here, 151 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 1: we're gonna give you land in Canada. We're not gonna 152 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 1: give you land here. We'll give you land in Canada 153 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 1: some money, and we'll promise your family pensions and you're 154 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 1: gonna be a British provincial to your general. And he's 155 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 1: like that sounds pretty great. But um, as it turned out, 156 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 1: he didn't get that many great assignments in the military 157 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 1: in in England. He was even sort of I don't 158 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:16,120 Speaker 1: think anyone likes a trader's yeah, yeah, that comes up 159 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:20,079 Speaker 1: again and again, like even the side that you're to 160 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:24,679 Speaker 1: or whatever. Um, they yeah, they're like, you're a trader. Well, 161 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 1: I think it's because basically you're just a big liar, 162 00:09:27,720 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: You're treacherous. Yeah, and so people are like, how can 163 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:31,959 Speaker 1: I trust you? Thanks for doing that, but can you 164 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:33,920 Speaker 1: go with in Canada? But it does pop up again 165 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:38,080 Speaker 1: and again. Anybody who's ever turned trader and expected some 166 00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 1: sort of glory has been sorely disappointed. Yeah. So in 167 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:43,080 Speaker 1: England he was sort of poop pooed. Then he moved 168 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 1: to Canada, they didn't like him, and then he moved 169 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 1: back to England and died there without ever like making 170 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,640 Speaker 1: a whole lot of money or getting any important military action. 171 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:55,959 Speaker 1: Sort of a sad ending, it really is. And today, 172 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:58,760 Speaker 1: if you go to West Point, there's I guess twelve 173 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:03,760 Speaker 1: plaques of some of like the head revolutionary generals, and 174 00:10:03,880 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: his name is literally wiped from the record. It has 175 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:10,760 Speaker 1: the year of his birth and um, I think the 176 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 1: town of his birth. His name is not on the 177 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 1: plaque any longer, just says it's a smeared or there's 178 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 1: a sharpie through it. Um. All right, So that's been 179 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 1: at journald. Let's go a little further back. Okay, let's 180 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:32,760 Speaker 1: go way back. I'm talking like maybe forty four BC. 181 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: Cassius and Brutus. Yeah. Uh, Marcus Junius Brutus the younger, 182 00:10:44,400 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: I'm glad do you look that up? Yeah, I'm sure 183 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:50,319 Speaker 1: he had a fuller name. Yeah, Brutus. It's like it's 184 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:54,080 Speaker 1: like a whole country of share or something. Uh. And 185 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:56,160 Speaker 1: here's the thing with these guys. They were definitely traders 186 00:10:56,160 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 1: as well, but they're also singled out clearly killed Caesar 187 00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:03,560 Speaker 1: we all know in the oddes of March, which is 188 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: Caesar the Senator and dfl dictator for life, which self 189 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 1: declared um. But they're like sixty dudes that took part 190 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 1: in this. Yeah. And see, Caesar was self declared Caesar 191 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:20,280 Speaker 1: for a civil war one informed a triumvirate with the 192 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:26,400 Speaker 1: people that he vanquished, so he wasn't entirely dictatorial, although 193 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 1: as like popular opinion started to swell around him, he's like, 194 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: maybe I will just be leader for life. Let's let's 195 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 1: save all those voting days and I'll just be leader 196 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 1: for the rest of the time. I'm alive. And Cassius 197 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 1: and Brutus had both fought against Caesar in the civil war, 198 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:49,720 Speaker 1: and despite that, Caesar um pardon both of them and 199 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: gave them positions of power in his new government and 200 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:57,559 Speaker 1: brand new knives. And they said right, and they said 201 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 1: still not enough. Well, Cassius especially apparently he was very 202 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: envious of Caesar and his power. He was the rebel 203 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,679 Speaker 1: rouser and that that was ultimately his motive. Although he 204 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:10,079 Speaker 1: used the concept of the Republic of Rome turning into 205 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:15,440 Speaker 1: a dictatorship to lead them the assassination against Caesar. Yeah, 206 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 1: and even cooked up evidence and like letters of support 207 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 1: to show Brutus because Brutus was much friendlier with Caesar. 208 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: They were buds and uh, but he was swayed by 209 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: Cassius and said, you know what, this is gonna be 210 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,560 Speaker 1: good for our country or our kingdom or whatever they 211 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:34,320 Speaker 1: were calling at the time. And um took part. But 212 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: they weren't like that the lead. I mean, maybe they 213 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 1: cooked it up, but they weren't the initial aggressors. Um. 214 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,880 Speaker 1: I thought Brutus was the first one to stab Caesar. No, 215 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 1: this dude, Tillius Simber came out and like pulled down 216 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:53,960 Speaker 1: his tunic first of all. Yeah, I guess he said 217 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: pulled it down, But I don't know what that means 218 00:12:55,679 --> 00:12:59,679 Speaker 1: if he imagined he was pulling it either pantst him 219 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 1: or no, tunics like a shirt thing, so I thought 220 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 1: he pulled it over his head like a hockey player 221 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:06,920 Speaker 1: might not fight. It's like reverse pants, the reverse pants him, 222 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 1: and Caesar was like, you know, what is this violence 223 00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:14,839 Speaker 1: going on? And then another dude, um Casca, he came 224 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 1: at him with a knife and Caesar blocked him away 225 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 1: and defended himself and was like, basically, what's going on here? 226 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:26,959 Speaker 1: And then that's when everyone sixty guys descended upon him. 227 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 1: Among you know, Brutus might have been the lead of 228 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: that pack though yeah, okay, okay, well they stabbed the 229 00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 1: crap out of him, so I knew I thought Brutus 230 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 1: was the first one to stab him. I knew that 231 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 1: some other guy was the first one to strike him, 232 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:41,839 Speaker 1: and it may have been the guy who reversed pants 233 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: to him. Yeah, you, me and I were at Pompeii. 234 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: Who actually walked around Pompeii and there's a table there 235 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 1: and it belonged to that guy. And I guess somebody 236 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 1: in Pompeii like bought the table of the first guy 237 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 1: to strike Caesar and had it in their via and 238 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 1: it's still there today, and did you eat at it now? 239 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,199 Speaker 1: We stared at it Okay, we looked at it from 240 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 1: like three meters away. You have the same meters because 241 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:10,160 Speaker 1: it's in Italy. That's obnoxious. Um. And apparently only one 242 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 1: of the stabs. He was stabbed twenty three times and 243 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:15,400 Speaker 1: might continue to be stabbed even after he was on 244 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:17,840 Speaker 1: the floor dead, but only one of them was a 245 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 1: fatal blow. Um. He was a like the second stab 246 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:23,600 Speaker 1: I think went through his heart and the rest were 247 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 1: just you know. But before that, when Brutus stabbed him, 248 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 1: Caesar very famously said a to brute, which literally means 249 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:38,280 Speaker 1: and you Brutus or what the hell Brutus? Yeah, you too, 250 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: And supposedly you kind of gave up at that point, 251 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 1: like it killed his spirit when he saw Brutus was involved. 252 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 1: But yeah, supposedly he didn't want to live in a 253 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:54,320 Speaker 1: less world, in a world where even Brutus could assassinate him, 254 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: so he resigned himself to dying and hence became a hero. 255 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 1: It's very sad. It was on my birthday, is it fifteenth? 256 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: But not of Mark that's right? Uh so? Oh also too, 257 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 1: apparently that was the first autopsy report, first postmortem death 258 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 1: report was made on Caesar. The Greeks man if that's 259 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: true the Romans. Whatever. I'm really glad I caught that one. Yeah, 260 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:35,840 Speaker 1: probably anything else on these two traders. Um no, oh, yes, 261 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 1: Dante had a special hatred for um Brutus and Cassius, 262 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 1: and in his Inferno he says that, uh, they are 263 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 1: being perpetually eaten by two of Lucifer's three months, and 264 00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:54,680 Speaker 1: the third mouth is reserved for the next guy we'll 265 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 1: talk about, a little guy named Judas is carrying Oh really, yeah, 266 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 1: Satan's third month, So lucy first three months or eating Cassius, 267 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 1: Brutus and Judas. All right, Judas is one of these that. Um. 268 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: Recent evidence has emerged where he may not have been 269 00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:15,320 Speaker 1: such a traitor, but we'll get into that. But but 270 00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 1: then that was refuted as well. Um. Everyone obviously knows 271 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 1: the Judas kiss very famously. Judas betrayed Jesus his uh, 272 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 1: he was one of the disciples. He'd betrayed Jesus with 273 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: a kiss, and it was actually a signal to the 274 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: guards to come and grab him. I guess he was 275 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 1: identifying him. Yeah, apparently the the Romans didn't know who 276 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 1: this Jesus was, at least by sight, and Judas went 277 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:43,760 Speaker 1: and said, hey, you guys want this Jesus, what do 278 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 1: you give me? And the signal was like, well, you 279 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:49,520 Speaker 1: kissed the guy that's Jesus, and we'll come get him 280 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:51,840 Speaker 1: and we'll give you thirty pieces of silver. Thirty pieces 281 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 1: of silver. I mean the west Egg inflation calculator doesn't 282 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 1: go back you know that that date. But I can 283 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:03,280 Speaker 1: imagine it's still probably wasn't that much thirty pieces of silver. 284 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:06,359 Speaker 1: I have no idea. Well, apparently it was used later 285 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 1: on to buy a field to turn into a potter's 286 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:14,639 Speaker 1: field to bury unclaimed dead, but I mean it's field. 287 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 1: How much it couldn't have been that much. How much 288 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:20,159 Speaker 1: was land going for back then in Middle East? They 289 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 1: had tons of land? Um? Okay, So Judas betrays Jesus. 290 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 1: He was um. We didn't know much about his life 291 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:32,480 Speaker 1: at the time, But recently there has been I think 292 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:36,080 Speaker 1: in two thousand one of the gospel, a new gospel 293 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:43,359 Speaker 1: was was revealed, the Gospel of Judas colon my story, 294 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:47,520 Speaker 1: my side of things, uh. And it was of course 295 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:51,119 Speaker 1: the Papyrus document dating to the second century a d. 296 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:53,879 Speaker 1: And it was written about in a book called the 297 00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 1: Lost Gospel, and it portrays this Judas is more of 298 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 1: a facilitator of what Jesus wanted. Basically, Jesus was like, hey, 299 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 1: turn me in because this is my destiny. UM, like, 300 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 1: sacrifice yourself. I sacrifice myself and we all go on 301 00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:14,640 Speaker 1: to live in heaven and you know, fulfill our destinies. Yeah, 302 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: which a lot of people were like, Okay, I kind 303 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,120 Speaker 1: of like this different view of Judas, you know, and 304 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:22,199 Speaker 1: it makes Jesus even more prescient than he appears in 305 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:26,239 Speaker 1: the Bible, because you know, he's betrayed by someone he 306 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:31,600 Speaker 1: thought was his friend. In this he Um is commanding Judas, 307 00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:35,119 Speaker 1: he's asking him to to do this. So it's just 308 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:38,280 Speaker 1: an all around like great view of the story. When 309 00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:42,719 Speaker 1: when But unfortunately, Um apparently there's some problems that a 310 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 1: lot of scholars, um Gnostic scholars have with the translation, 311 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:50,560 Speaker 1: and that if you just tweak a few things to 312 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,040 Speaker 1: the way that the Gnostic scholars think it should be translated, 313 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 1: that all just goes right out the window. And actually 314 00:18:57,240 --> 00:19:01,200 Speaker 1: Judas is not only a horrible treacher traitor, he's actually 315 00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 1: a demon from the level of being. Yeah, So quite 316 00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:10,199 Speaker 1: two different stories all by changing a few words in 317 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:14,200 Speaker 1: this uh Coptic text, which isn't the easy stuff to translate, 318 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 1: like it's tough, you know, it's not like and even 319 00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 1: the person that poo pooed the original translation was like, 320 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:23,000 Speaker 1: this is a very hard job. You know. I'm not 321 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:27,120 Speaker 1: saying they necessarily did it on purpose, but um, that's 322 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 1: not what I think it says. And so and that 323 00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:34,399 Speaker 1: was April Deconic, a professor of biblical studies at Rice University. 324 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 1: And I don't know did other people come out and 325 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:40,440 Speaker 1: support that. I can really find much. I don't know. 326 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:44,400 Speaker 1: And apparently actually in the Bible it's hinted at that 327 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: Jesus could have known about it, but um, well doesn't 328 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,199 Speaker 1: he say like one of you will betray me? I 329 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 1: mean at least definitely said that the Last Temptation of Christ. 330 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 1: Who Harvey Kite tell those a pretty good Jesus or 331 00:19:56,520 --> 00:20:00,399 Speaker 1: a Judas? Yeah, yeah, yeah that was Yeah, that was 332 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 1: a good movie. But um yeah that was how I 333 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 1: when I, like every anything I'd ever heard, I was 334 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:09,959 Speaker 1: thought like Jesus knew. It was just never as explicit 335 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:14,639 Speaker 1: as this Gospel of Judas, right, and then Gospel of 336 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:18,200 Speaker 1: Judas say even claimed that Jesus even asked Judas like, hey, 337 00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:21,560 Speaker 1: will you do this for me a solid, so UM 338 00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:24,360 Speaker 1: kiss me and put one right here. Right. So Judas 339 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:27,800 Speaker 1: realize is what he's done. It feels horribly guilty, tries 340 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 1: to give the silver back the high priests that he's 341 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 1: sold Jesus out to UM won't take the money. UM, 342 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:38,399 Speaker 1: and so he throws it on the temple floor. They 343 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:40,159 Speaker 1: end up figuring out that it can be used for 344 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:42,200 Speaker 1: a potter spiel, and they used that thirty pieces is 345 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 1: over for that UM. And then Judas goes off and 346 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 1: hangs himself. Yeah. And I don't think we said Jesus 347 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:51,120 Speaker 1: was crucified. I thought that went without saying. But in case, 348 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 1: there's like one person out there was like, what happened 349 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,879 Speaker 1: to Jesus? Right, whatever became a Jesus, that's what happened. Um. 350 00:20:56,160 --> 00:21:01,640 Speaker 1: And then Judas supposedly fell headlong and his body opened up. 351 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: And there, if you go back and read some scholarly translations, 352 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:10,960 Speaker 1: they think that, um, his body opened up means that 353 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:14,040 Speaker 1: he was left at his body was left hanging for 354 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:18,520 Speaker 1: a while out in the heat, and when it finally fell, uh, 355 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:20,879 Speaker 1: like a branch broker or whatever, and it fell, it 356 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:25,360 Speaker 1: kind of ruptured. Where'd you find that out? I don't 357 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:29,480 Speaker 1: remember somewhere online. Yeah it was. Yeah, they were talking 358 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:33,719 Speaker 1: about how he went headlong, he became headlong, and they 359 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 1: were saying, like, if you just switch out like a 360 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 1: couple of letters, headlong becomes swollen, and then that would 361 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: explain why his body opened up. Uh. And now Judas 362 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:46,280 Speaker 1: and Judas Kiss are both part of the lexicon. And 363 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 1: you know, in terms of betrayals, you know, treacherous. I know, 364 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,440 Speaker 1: thanks Sam, how about Chuck? I know you've seen this movie. 365 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: I love this movie. Uh, the assassination of Jesse James 366 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 1: by the cow Cow Robert Ford. Yeah, we've talked about it. 367 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 1: Is a good movie, very good movie, written and directed 368 00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:10,639 Speaker 1: by Andrew Dominic and has Paul Schneider and my buddy 369 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 1: Paul Schnyder. Schneid's right, he listens, Oh, hey, was he 370 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,000 Speaker 1: he's in it? Yeah, he's he's one of the gang. 371 00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:24,680 Speaker 1: And uh, he's he's a great actor. He's We've since 372 00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 1: become like email pals. So, uh, that was an excellent movie. 373 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 1: I'm sure Snyder did fantastic in it. Great Schneids Schneid um. 374 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 1: And it seems to me I don't know a lot 375 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:42,160 Speaker 1: about the whole saga of Jesse James, especially his demise. 376 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:44,960 Speaker 1: But it seemed to be pretty true to everything I've 377 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:46,639 Speaker 1: ever heard about it. Yeah, I think the movie was 378 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,480 Speaker 1: pretty accurate and it was great, like gorgeous to look 379 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 1: at beautifully film. Uh, and not just because Brad Pitt 380 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:56,760 Speaker 1: was in it, but Casey A. Fleck as Robert Ford 381 00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:00,240 Speaker 1: was amazing. He really so. Anyway, if you haven't see them, 382 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: if we go out and see it in the meantime, 383 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 1: we'll spoil it for you. I think he was nominated 384 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,959 Speaker 1: for an Academy. I can't imagine how he wasn't. And 385 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:10,520 Speaker 1: he was so creepy. So what's the deal with Jesse James. Well, 386 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 1: Jesse James was a member of the James Gang, a 387 00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: full partner. Well, I think he and his brother Frank 388 00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,119 Speaker 1: were kind of co leader. That's the impression I have 389 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:25,720 Speaker 1: like Frank still Yeah, and um, they were very successful 390 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: at robbing trains, robbing people, robbing banks, robbing everything, and 391 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 1: they became outlaw folk heroes everybody loved to hate. But 392 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:36,800 Speaker 1: he also still loved. Well, they didn't kill people, no, 393 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 1: not until the second to last robbery by Jesse James. Uh, 394 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,840 Speaker 1: they botched it and a couple of people died, most 395 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 1: of the James gang was caught, and Jesse and Frank 396 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 1: went off and assembled a new gang that included Robert Ford. Yeah, 397 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,760 Speaker 1: he was pretty new. Um, he had long tried to 398 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:59,919 Speaker 1: get into James gang. And um, we'll sort of shun 399 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 1: is uh a little weird and like not the most 400 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,399 Speaker 1: skilled robber and gunman, and it wasn't taken very seriously, 401 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 1: which always bothered him. So, Um, Jesse James pulls off 402 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:14,399 Speaker 1: one last train robbery in eighteen seventy and decides to retire. 403 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: Frank James retires and Robert Ford kind of tangs along 404 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:22,000 Speaker 1: with Jesse James the rest of his life. And um, 405 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 1: the Governor of Missouri put a bounty on Jesse James 406 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 1: head of I believe ten thousand dollars, which is pretty 407 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 1: substantial for eighteen seventy. And in eighteen eighty two, Robert 408 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: Ford took the Governor of Missouri up on this, apparently 409 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:43,240 Speaker 1: met with him and not only said I'm gonna do this. 410 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 1: I want this reward, I'm gonna split it with my 411 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:49,160 Speaker 1: brother here, but I also want to be I want 412 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:51,719 Speaker 1: immunity from my crimes. Yeah, well, he was supposedly just 413 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:56,280 Speaker 1: supposed to capture him, and Um did the shooting on 414 00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: his own volition. And and there's a wood cutting in 415 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 1: this article coal of Jesse James dropping a feather duster 416 00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:07,440 Speaker 1: just like he does in the UM movie. Oh yeah, 417 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:09,440 Speaker 1: he's He stands on a chair in his own home 418 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 1: to dust a picture and Probert Ford shoots him in 419 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,239 Speaker 1: the back of the head. Yeah, and kills him just 420 00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:20,080 Speaker 1: right there, very like low key and anticlimactic with his 421 00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: wife home and everything. And then they leave. And so 422 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:27,240 Speaker 1: Robert Ford kind of like I think Bennedictdonald, expected to 423 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:31,840 Speaker 1: be considered something of a hero, and he was considered 424 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:36,960 Speaker 1: a zero. Yeah, yeah, he was. Actually he and his 425 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,679 Speaker 1: brother were both indicted, found guilty, sentenced to hang, and 426 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 1: pardoned in a single day. Well that's a heck of 427 00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 1: a day. Yeah, pretty like emotional roller coaster going on there. 428 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: And they became an ostracized socially. Um, Robert Ford just 429 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: became the butt of many jokes. And then finally, Um, 430 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 1: one day he was confronted by a man who sought 431 00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:00,119 Speaker 1: him out because he wanted to kill Robert Ford for 432 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 1: to gain his own acclaim. Yeah, Edward O'Kelly brought a 433 00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:07,120 Speaker 1: shotgun into it. He was a bar owner I think 434 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:10,200 Speaker 1: at the time Robert Ford was. And after by the way, 435 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 1: they toured in a touring production like recreating the Murders. Yeah, 436 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:18,080 Speaker 1: Sam Rockwell Yeah, and um so Edward O'Kelly goes in 437 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: the bar with a shotgun, says hello, Bob. He turns 438 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 1: around and shoots him in the throat, and he gets 439 00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:28,000 Speaker 1: a sentence commuted after a petition in his pardoned for 440 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: killing Robert Ford. Yeah. Back then the prairiebu definitely had 441 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: like a ground hold. Yeah. I don't know what that is, 442 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:41,679 Speaker 1: but I think I got my point across. Yeah. They 443 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 1: were like, he was a coward and you shot him, 444 00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: so that makes you a good guy. Thanks. Uh so 445 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 1: that's Robert Ford. You got anything else? Should we move 446 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:55,399 Speaker 1: on to Mata Hatti? Yeah, I knew next to nothing 447 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,919 Speaker 1: about Mata Hary. Yeah. Same here. She turned out to 448 00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:03,040 Speaker 1: be a pretty fascinating woman. Possibly not a trader at all. Yeah, actually, 449 00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:06,080 Speaker 1: probably not a trader at all. Yeah, let's let's talk 450 00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:10,760 Speaker 1: about her. Well, um, she was a very sexual being. 451 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:13,720 Speaker 1: She was very close to her father apparently, who doted 452 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 1: on her, and she has been described as um sex 453 00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:20,199 Speaker 1: as being her driving force, and she was said to 454 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:24,280 Speaker 1: have an insatiable longing for male attention her entire life 455 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:29,120 Speaker 1: and for the time period early nineteen hundreds, she really 456 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:31,679 Speaker 1: really slept around. Yeah, and she didn't just like you, 457 00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 1: the sex with the men. She liked them to buy 458 00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,680 Speaker 1: her stuff. Oh yeah, well she used as a means 459 00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,840 Speaker 1: for sure. Yeah. She Um. She flew through a lot 460 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:44,320 Speaker 1: of guy's money, right, and Um, I just love to 461 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:49,360 Speaker 1: live lavishly, racked up tons of debt and um became 462 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:54,240 Speaker 1: something of a toast among Parisian society, European society. Actually 463 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:56,560 Speaker 1: she was Dutch, we should point out. Yeah, her real 464 00:27:56,680 --> 00:28:01,879 Speaker 1: name was Um Margarita Zelli. Yeah, but she looked like 465 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,920 Speaker 1: Indian and she tried to remake herself as this Indian 466 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:09,160 Speaker 1: exotic Indian dancer. I read Indonesian Indonesian. Yeah, because Mata 467 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:14,399 Speaker 1: Hari is Um Malaysian I of the dawn, which means sunrise. 468 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: So her name was Sunrise, the stripping dancer. Well, and 469 00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,919 Speaker 1: she she didn't just dance like. This was at a 470 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,639 Speaker 1: time when the Mulan rouge was like they were like 471 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:28,359 Speaker 1: pulling their skirts up a little bit and showing some 472 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,879 Speaker 1: ankle and some knickers, and she was like taking it 473 00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:37,359 Speaker 1: to you know, another level. Apparently in people's living rooms, 474 00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: private dances like traveling dancing, um, like really erotic and 475 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 1: exotic stuff for the time. So from what I understand, 476 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:49,440 Speaker 1: she was also a sometime prostitute. Um when things were 477 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:54,040 Speaker 1: really bad, sure, um and then she but ultimately she 478 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 1: just kind of went through succession of of lovers around Europe. 479 00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,320 Speaker 1: And at one point she found her self in um 480 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:08,680 Speaker 1: in Amsterdam and was approached by a German officer and said, hey, 481 00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: we want you to spy for us. Here's twenty thousand 482 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:15,240 Speaker 1: francs and some invisible ink, and um, you're now a 483 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:19,720 Speaker 1: German spy. And she's like, whatever mine air, thanks for 484 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 1: the money, sucker, and threw away the invisible ink. Supposedly 485 00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 1: and never spied for Germany, but she still had a 486 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 1: code name H one, and as far as Germany was concerned, 487 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,040 Speaker 1: she was a spy for them, even though she didn't 488 00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:37,240 Speaker 1: take it seriously. Apparently never carried out any spying activities. 489 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 1: So she had a reputation as a German spy, yeah, 490 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:45,680 Speaker 1: without actually spying yet. And uh she was as uh, 491 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: this one writer puts it, she was traveling alone, she 492 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: was wealthy, she was an excellent linguist and very foreign 493 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 1: and very educated and admitted to having lovers and like 494 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,160 Speaker 1: all of this stuff for the time just meant we 495 00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:00,760 Speaker 1: don't trust you, even if we don't have evidence. This 496 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:04,520 Speaker 1: makes you untrustworthy, right so um, At some point the 497 00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: French decided that they were going to recruit her to 498 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: become a French spy. This is during World War One, 499 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,360 Speaker 1: even though they already suspected she was a German spy. 500 00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:17,320 Speaker 1: She was sent around um to try to get to 501 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,280 Speaker 1: I don't remember what country they were trying to get 502 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 1: her into. Of hotel oh, she went to Russia. She 503 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 1: ended up going there for a little while in exchange 504 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 1: for becoming a French spy. Agreeing to spy for the French. 505 00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 1: She ended up in Spain and came across this German 506 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: officer and apparently he suspected her of being a spy. 507 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:44,080 Speaker 1: So when she started asking him questions, he gave her 508 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 1: old information. Well they went to bed together as well. 509 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 1: Sure we should mention this thing is just right with 510 00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 1: sex and um, he gave her some old information. This 511 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: the frenchman who the French intelligence officer who recruited her 512 00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 1: as a spy, but still suspect her as a German 513 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 1: spy finally said, know what, I think that what you 514 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:04,040 Speaker 1: were really doing was giving French secrets to the German. 515 00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:07,760 Speaker 1: You're a double agent, and we're going to arrest you. 516 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,600 Speaker 1: And she was arrested in France again no evidence, no 517 00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:16,080 Speaker 1: evidence whatsoever, and tried for treason and convicted. Yeah, and 518 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 1: um basically Thunder knows that the whole experience, and was like, 519 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:23,760 Speaker 1: I'm gonna hold my head high, I'm gonna blow you 520 00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:25,800 Speaker 1: a kiss right before you shoot me in the firing squad. 521 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 1: Well supposedly it wasn't the firing squad. It was two 522 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,880 Speaker 1: nuns that she became friends with and her lawyer who 523 00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,320 Speaker 1: also she had slept with. That's who she blew kisses too. 524 00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: But she refused to O that's what it said in 525 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,440 Speaker 1: this article that I saw elsewhere. It was like to 526 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: the nuns, she JUSTO slept with her headmaster when she 527 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: was sixteen, Yeah, and got kicked out of school for it. 528 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:49,479 Speaker 1: So she refuses a blindfold. In the end, she's all 529 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:53,120 Speaker 1: dressed up and everything for her execution. She's standing ankle 530 00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,560 Speaker 1: deep in mud on a coal October day in nineteen seventeen. 531 00:31:57,040 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: She refuses to be tied to the pole behind her, 532 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 1: She refuses a blindfold and is executed by firing squad. 533 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:07,000 Speaker 1: So the weird thing is about thirty years later, one 534 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:11,959 Speaker 1: of the prosecutors in France admitted, quote they didn't have sorry, 535 00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:16,840 Speaker 1: here's the quote. There was quote not enough evidence to 536 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:21,520 Speaker 1: flog a cat that she very very likely did not 537 00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:27,480 Speaker 1: ever spy for Germany, made that one half hearted attempt 538 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:32,520 Speaker 1: in France for France to make some money and was 539 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:36,479 Speaker 1: executed and still didn't protest. I wonder if there's been 540 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,880 Speaker 1: a good movie on her, surely there, I don't know 541 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:40,680 Speaker 1: if there's been a recent one. She was tall too, 542 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:43,400 Speaker 1: she was like almost six ft tall. Yes, she looks 543 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,120 Speaker 1: very long. Yeah, look at her. It's hard to like. 544 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: Sometimes it's tough to look at pictures from back then 545 00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:52,480 Speaker 1: and see the attraction, you know. Yeah, it's just a 546 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:56,360 Speaker 1: different time period. I think it was the fact that 547 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:59,200 Speaker 1: she took off her clothes and was real sexy and 548 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:06,560 Speaker 1: tall with everybody. So Mata Hary probably was not a trader, 549 00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:11,280 Speaker 1: and they really had a lot of trouble trying to 550 00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:15,840 Speaker 1: prove that another famous trader was actually a trader and 551 00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 1: that woman was I have a togury. Yeah, yeah, she was. 552 00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 1: In fact, I'm just gonna go ahead and say it. 553 00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,120 Speaker 1: She was not a spy and she was not a 554 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:35,360 Speaker 1: treasonous trader um because it was proven so, and she 555 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:38,480 Speaker 1: was pardoned by Gerald Ford. Right, so she was born. 556 00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:40,600 Speaker 1: So I'm just gonna take her off the list. Okay, 557 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:43,560 Speaker 1: we'll finish the story though. Yeah, so it's a worthwhile story. Yeah, 558 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 1: I have a toegury. She was born in America in 559 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,719 Speaker 1: Los Angeles, UM and had a degree in zoology from 560 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 1: u c l A. And in one she traveled to 561 00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 1: Tokyo to take care of an ailing aunt her family 562 00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:59,640 Speaker 1: center over there. Despite the fact that she didn't really 563 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,840 Speaker 1: speak Japanese, Jim been raised in Japanese culture. Apparently there 564 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 1: was a lot of culture shock, but she still went 565 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:08,239 Speaker 1: over to take care of her aunt nonetheless, And while 566 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,279 Speaker 1: she was there she got two jobs. Once she was 567 00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,600 Speaker 1: typing for one new service, and she got a second 568 00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:18,160 Speaker 1: job as a typist for UM, the one of the 569 00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:23,360 Speaker 1: radio stations. Yeah, and they're like, hey, you're American, Japanese American, 570 00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:27,239 Speaker 1: and you have a great voice, and you're perfect for 571 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:30,800 Speaker 1: this new thing that we're gonna do. It's UM American 572 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,200 Speaker 1: rock and roll music and we're gonna play it for 573 00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:38,960 Speaker 1: the morale of the troops, and well to deteriorate the morale. Well, 574 00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,200 Speaker 1: but she they told her a different story at first though. 575 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:44,160 Speaker 1: They told her it was to boost the morale. Yeah, Like, 576 00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:45,600 Speaker 1: I don't think she knew what she was getting into. 577 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,040 Speaker 1: That's crazy. Why would the Japanese boost the morale of 578 00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:53,000 Speaker 1: the American troops in the Pacific. Well, it was later 579 00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:55,680 Speaker 1: said that it did, in fact boost the morale. They 580 00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:58,680 Speaker 1: said Americans love the music and thought the Tokyo Rose 581 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:01,560 Speaker 1: banter was funny and it looked at her spirits. Yeah, 582 00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:03,840 Speaker 1: so if they were really trying to do that, it 583 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 1: did a pretty poor job of it. Okay. But nonetheless, 584 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 1: she was reporting on things like um ships being sunk. 585 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:12,719 Speaker 1: Is that correct? Yeah, she called that. Well that's what 586 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:16,120 Speaker 1: she was eventually the one thing that they pinned on her. Okay, Well, 587 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:20,480 Speaker 1: then that didn't actually happen. Yeah, okay, So well let's 588 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:22,920 Speaker 1: let's get back to the story. World War two goes along, 589 00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:27,520 Speaker 1: she um right, it ends and she tries to get 590 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,440 Speaker 1: back to America, and as she's doing that, apparently the 591 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:35,160 Speaker 1: Japanese government identified her as Tokyo Rose. Yeah, she was 592 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:37,719 Speaker 1: Orphan and was her radio name in Tokyo Rose was 593 00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:40,319 Speaker 1: just sort of the name of the operation as a 594 00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:43,320 Speaker 1: whole and not a single person, even though they tied 595 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 1: her to that name, which led to some great confusion 596 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,520 Speaker 1: apparently because they were trying to get her as Tokyo Rose, 597 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,080 Speaker 1: even though her she called herself Orphan Aan and there 598 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:55,120 Speaker 1: were like twelve women including her that we're all Tokyo 599 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:58,919 Speaker 1: Rose collectively. Yeah, okay um. So the Japanese government says, 600 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:02,040 Speaker 1: that's Tokyo Rose, and uh, she said, I'm morph An Ann. 601 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:06,680 Speaker 1: The American Intelligence Services of the Army investigated her and 602 00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:09,279 Speaker 1: could find no evidence that she had committed any form 603 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,799 Speaker 1: of treason, and they were going to let her in 604 00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:16,200 Speaker 1: the country, back in their place of birth. Um, because 605 00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:18,879 Speaker 1: she traveled without a passport and now that she's trying 606 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 1: to get back in she needed a passport. Um. Apparently 607 00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:24,240 Speaker 1: a lot of veterans groupture like you can't let Tokyo 608 00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,560 Speaker 1: Rose into the US. It was just one guy kind 609 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:32,600 Speaker 1: of started the charge and was successful. The reporter had Bundridge. Yeah, well, 610 00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:36,720 Speaker 1: apparently he got a couple of Japanese guys to commit 611 00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:42,359 Speaker 1: perjury and and present false evidence against Um Tokyo Rose. Yeah, 612 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,960 Speaker 1: the two most damaging witnesses actually like just completely lied, right. 613 00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:48,799 Speaker 1: The FBI put him up to it, coached them and 614 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,160 Speaker 1: said you're gonna get tried for treason if you don't 615 00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:54,359 Speaker 1: do this. So she ended up being tried and convicted 616 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:57,719 Speaker 1: for treason UM and sentenced to ten years. And she 617 00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:00,680 Speaker 1: got out in ninety six, and they tried to deport 618 00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:07,960 Speaker 1: her and Um. She successfully battled deportation and moved to Chicago. 619 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:10,719 Speaker 1: She worked at a retail store until two thousand six. 620 00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:14,200 Speaker 1: Two thousand six, she was working in a retail store 621 00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:18,000 Speaker 1: at ninety years old, and nobody even people didn't like 622 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,000 Speaker 1: come in there to see Tokyo Rose, like she was 623 00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:24,359 Speaker 1: just a worker. Yeah, isn't that weird, Like such a 624 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:28,680 Speaker 1: prominent figure in history. It just bringing people up, like 625 00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 1: you said, Ford Pardner, Yeah, Gerald Ford. Then he fell down. 626 00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:40,200 Speaker 1: Let's talk about the quizzling briefly. Yeah. The quizzling is 627 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,120 Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier, is another name. If you live in 628 00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:47,719 Speaker 1: perhaps Norway or maybe other parts of Europe, you might 629 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:50,120 Speaker 1: be called a quizzling if you're a trader because of 630 00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 1: Vidkan Quisling. Yeah, he was. He basically tried to seize 631 00:37:56,440 --> 00:38:01,959 Speaker 1: power after buddying up with Hitler in nine and said, 632 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:04,000 Speaker 1: you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna use this as 633 00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:08,360 Speaker 1: an opportunity two make Norway my own. Yeah, and he 634 00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:10,360 Speaker 1: did so for a very very short time. Yeah, he 635 00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:13,399 Speaker 1: invited the Nazis to come invade Norway. They did. He 636 00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:16,680 Speaker 1: Um made a power grab and said I'm now the 637 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: ruler of Norway, and the Nazis let that slide for 638 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:22,080 Speaker 1: about a week. They're like, sure, sure, here ruler, and 639 00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:25,200 Speaker 1: then they installed their own guy as the head of 640 00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:32,000 Speaker 1: Norway and demoted Quizzling to uh president minister president and 641 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:36,840 Speaker 1: uh apparently he went to work sentencing Norwegian Jews to 642 00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:41,520 Speaker 1: concentration camps. Uh. He really bad guy. Yeah. He was 643 00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:44,799 Speaker 1: very much anti union. He was a fascist, and he 644 00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:46,960 Speaker 1: was trying to make Norway fastest and he did so. 645 00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,880 Speaker 1: He became the first person to ever announce a kudata 646 00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:55,360 Speaker 1: on television. That's how he made his power grab. Yeah, 647 00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:58,279 Speaker 1: I think I was television, it seems early, so maybe 648 00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:01,040 Speaker 1: he was radio. By guess he became the first one 649 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:05,320 Speaker 1: to announce it over him podcast, right, So Um, after 650 00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,640 Speaker 1: the Nazis were defeated. He was like, oh no, yeah 651 00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:10,879 Speaker 1: the film this is gonna end up bad for me. Yeah. 652 00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:14,759 Speaker 1: And he was convicted of treason, sentenced to death, and 653 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:18,600 Speaker 1: executed by firing squad. And you are a quizzler, I'm sorry, 654 00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:23,200 Speaker 1: quizzling if you collude. Yeah, if you're in Norway and 655 00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:26,640 Speaker 1: your trader, you're a quizzling. Yeah. It's like the Benedict 656 00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:30,400 Speaker 1: Donald of Norway. So Chuck, you got anything else? No, 657 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,359 Speaker 1: And it's per usual. This is a top ten that 658 00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:36,560 Speaker 1: we do about six of and encourage people to go 659 00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,399 Speaker 1: read the rest, including uh Robert Hansen, who we talked about. Yeah, 660 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:42,880 Speaker 1: um as were pound as we talked about in the 661 00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:48,040 Speaker 1: Insanity defense and the Cambridge five, not the Seattle seven 662 00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:51,200 Speaker 1: or the Jackson five or the Jackson five. And did 663 00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,920 Speaker 1: we skip another one was at it? I don't remember. 664 00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:58,879 Speaker 1: Oh the intro we didn't mention, um the Cleveland Cavaliers 665 00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:03,400 Speaker 1: ire Braun against Lebron, which I just think that's weird. Well, 666 00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,440 Speaker 1: I think I went berserk. That's sort of has passed, 667 00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:08,760 Speaker 1: and there's rumors of him going back to Cleveland anyway 668 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:12,279 Speaker 1: next really maybe his contracts up, and they think that 669 00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:14,160 Speaker 1: he might love nothing more than to go back there 670 00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:16,880 Speaker 1: and win a championship. Huh. Well, we'll see, Yeah, we'll 671 00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:19,600 Speaker 1: see what happens. Uh. If you want to learn more 672 00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:22,720 Speaker 1: about traders, you can type that word into the search 673 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:24,520 Speaker 1: bar at house to works dot com and will bring 674 00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:27,759 Speaker 1: up this article. And since I said search part, it 675 00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:36,440 Speaker 1: means it's time for message break. Uh. Now, Chuck, it's 676 00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:41,160 Speaker 1: time for listener mail. Uh. This is cap Grass. Hey, guys, 677 00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:44,200 Speaker 1: thanks so much for doing the cap Grass syndrome episode. 678 00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:46,920 Speaker 1: It was amazing. Timing came out right around Father's Day 679 00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:50,120 Speaker 1: and my father suffers from the syndrome. It's been very 680 00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:53,759 Speaker 1: painful to watch. Yeah. During my marriage, we have never 681 00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:55,719 Speaker 1: lived very close to my parents, but just under three 682 00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:57,960 Speaker 1: years ago we moved close enough for day trips. About 683 00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:00,799 Speaker 1: the same time, my dad had a fairly significant stroke 684 00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:04,880 Speaker 1: and it made the slow progress of vascular dementia Alzheimer's 685 00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:08,360 Speaker 1: that he also suffers from significantly. Works started visiting my 686 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:10,160 Speaker 1: dad on a weekly basis. I would spend the day 687 00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:12,319 Speaker 1: with him while my mom and brother would get the 688 00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:16,959 Speaker 1: Monday rush orders out. Apparently Dad ran a mail order business. 689 00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:20,000 Speaker 1: When I first started these visits, Dad knew who I was. 690 00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:22,640 Speaker 1: We talked and I shared photos and stories of my kids. 691 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,840 Speaker 1: But within just six months the cap grass really took effect. 692 00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:27,880 Speaker 1: We had to work our way through who this strange 693 00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 1: lady was, who lived there now my mom? And why 694 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:34,840 Speaker 1: did Linda my mom leave him? And watched his absolute 695 00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:37,239 Speaker 1: fear when she would walk into the room. Uh. He 696 00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:39,280 Speaker 1: eventually forgot who my brother and I were, as well 697 00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:42,239 Speaker 1: as well as our spouses and kids. Although I had 698 00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:44,239 Speaker 1: to giggle a little bit during the small amount of 699 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:46,600 Speaker 1: time when my husband was only one of us, he 700 00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,920 Speaker 1: knew because cap grass affects those closest to you and 701 00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:52,920 Speaker 1: then works his way out so the husband wouldn't around 702 00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,279 Speaker 1: him as much. So one point he was the only 703 00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:57,440 Speaker 1: person that he recognized, and the white thought that was 704 00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:00,520 Speaker 1: kind of funny. Now, the dementia and alzheimer to progress 705 00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:02,160 Speaker 1: to a point of living in the past and not 706 00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:04,839 Speaker 1: even remembering moment to moment, let alone day to day. 707 00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:07,239 Speaker 1: He still doesn't know why his family has abandoned him, 708 00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:10,080 Speaker 1: even though we're all around him all the time. Uh, 709 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,359 Speaker 1: I know he lives a very fearfilled and lonely life 710 00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:16,040 Speaker 1: among strangers. I liken it to living in a nightmare 711 00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:19,439 Speaker 1: every moment of the day. Um, and it sounds really sad, 712 00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:22,480 Speaker 1: but she's she was fairly upbeat in the email like that. 713 00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:25,799 Speaker 1: We corresponded, but just still like people are up there 714 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,839 Speaker 1: and crying and stuff. Thanks for doing the podcast. When 715 00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:30,560 Speaker 1: I talk about how dad is doing, it's tough to 716 00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:32,840 Speaker 1: explain what he's going through. And now I can just 717 00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:35,040 Speaker 1: send people to the podcast to learn more about it. 718 00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:39,200 Speaker 1: So who's really helped that is Jill Overturf in Republic, Missouri. 719 00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:42,640 Speaker 1: Well thanks a lot, Joe. We appreciate you sharing that. Yeah, 720 00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:45,200 Speaker 1: and I you know, I hope things can prove for 721 00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:49,200 Speaker 1: your father. Yeah, for sure. Um, if you have a 722 00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:56,320 Speaker 1: story about something we've talked about ever, we want to 723 00:42:56,360 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: hear it, especially if we've helped you explain that to 724 00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:02,520 Speaker 1: other people. We like that kind of thing. Um. You 725 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,160 Speaker 1: can tweet to us at s y ESK podcast. You 726 00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:07,320 Speaker 1: can join us on Facebook dot com, slash Stuff you 727 00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:11,240 Speaker 1: Should Know. You can send us an email to Stuff 728 00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:14,080 Speaker 1: Podcast at Discovery dot com, and you can always check 729 00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:22,080 Speaker 1: out our website Stuff you Should Know dot com for 730 00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:24,520 Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics. Is It 731 00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:33,239 Speaker 1: how Stuff Works dot com